Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Did GLAM 'RUSSIAN' SWINGER take out HIT ON HUBBY?

Transcript

Did GLAM 'RUSSIAN' SWINGER take out HIT ON HUBBY? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece.
0:14
Speaker 2: Did a glamorous Russian equestrian.
0:19
Speaker 3: Take out a two million dollar hit?
0:24
Speaker 2: According to the press, And you can take that with
0:27
Speaker 2: a box assault.
0:28
Speaker 3: She is a sex craze bisexual.
0:31
Speaker 2: Who loved doing naughty things and being an icy bitch
0:36
Speaker 2: to mail lovers. You know what, I don't care about
0:39
Speaker 2: any of that. I care about the alleged hit and
0:42
Speaker 2: is this guy still alive? I'm Nancy Grace. This is
0:47
Speaker 2: Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at
0:49
Speaker 2: Fox Nation in serious XEM one eleven. You know it's
0:52
Speaker 2: not every day you hear these words in one sentence.
0:55
Speaker 2: Glamorous Russian equestrian accused of taking out a two.
1:00
Speaker 3: Million dollar hit. You know what?
1:03
Speaker 2: She obviously has not been listening to Crime Stories with
1:06
Speaker 2: Nancy Grace on Fox Nation in series six M one eleven,
1:09
Speaker 2: or she would know. You can get a hit man
1:12
Speaker 2: for what, Jackie, what was the last one? For two
1:14
Speaker 2: thousand bucks five hundred dollars?
1:16
Speaker 3: Wow? A two million dollar hit. Okay.
1:20
Speaker 2: I know a lot of you, especially our behavior expert
1:24
Speaker 2: and our licensed counselor, are going to be interested in
1:27
Speaker 2: their men.
1:27
Speaker 3: Of course, so they're probably gonna want to talk.
1:29
Speaker 2: To you about the sex crazed by sexual aspect of this,
1:32
Speaker 2: if that's even true. But I want to talk about
1:35
Speaker 2: the hit.
1:36
Speaker 4: And Remiley had lived a life of luxury in del Mar,
1:39
Speaker 4: filled with multimillion dollar homes, price horses, and sports cars.
1:43
Speaker 3: I've always wanted to start a show.
1:45
Speaker 4: Forty two year old Tatiana Ramley captured the spotlight back
1:48
Speaker 4: in twenty twelve for her involvement in a filled, multimillion
1:52
Speaker 4: dollar horse show at the Delmar Fairgrounds, and tonight she's
1:57
Speaker 4: behind bars now facing far more serious allegations of trying
2:01
Speaker 4: to have her husband, fifty seven year old Mark Remley
2:04
Speaker 4: killed for two million dollars.
2:06
Speaker 3: They share are throwing around a lot of money.
2:09
Speaker 2: And did you hear her voice? I always wanted to
2:12
Speaker 2: put on a show. It sounds like John David and
2:14
Speaker 2: Lucy when they would put on a magic show at
2:16
Speaker 2: the Christmas gathering or the Thanksgiving gathering or the summer
2:21
Speaker 2: gathering with all the Lynches and the Graces all together.
2:24
Speaker 3: They want to quote put on a show, and then we.
2:27
Speaker 2: Find out it's a very very expensive horse show.
2:33
Speaker 3: Who has that kind of money to throw around?
2:35
Speaker 2: Well, I think I might know the answer to that
2:38
Speaker 2: take a listen to more from our friends at CBS eight.
2:40
Speaker 4: According to the Sheriff's Department, Remley tried to hire a
2:44
Speaker 4: hitman sometime between July first and August second, right around
2:48
Speaker 4: the time she had filed for divorce. On July third,
2:51
Speaker 4: investigators save they received a tip that Remley was trying
2:55
Speaker 4: to have her husband killed one day after a suspicious
2:58
Speaker 4: fire at their home run random repost so the Sheriff's
3:01
Speaker 4: Department then launched a sting operation. An undercover detective met
3:05
Speaker 4: with Tatiana at a Starbucks in Solana Beach, where she
3:08
Speaker 4: allegedly provided detailed information on how she wanted her husband
3:12
Speaker 4: killed and his body disposed of. She also allegedly brought
3:16
Speaker 4: with her three additional firearms, as well as cash to
3:19
Speaker 4: place a down payment for the murder, leading to her arrest.
3:23
Speaker 2: I've got an all star panel, but before I go
3:25
Speaker 2: to chief investigative reporter for Dailymail dot Comjensmith, Kathleen Murphy
3:30
Speaker 2: is with me, high profile divorce lawyer. You can find
3:35
Speaker 2: her at Ncdomestic Law dot com.
3:38
Speaker 3: Kathleen Murphy.
3:39
Speaker 2: I know you've handled so many divorces you can hardly
3:41
Speaker 2: keep them all straight. But what is wrong with rich people.
3:45
Speaker 2: I mean, there are people in this world aching out
3:48
Speaker 2: a living. They don't have enough to eat. They have
3:52
Speaker 2: what we call food and security. They don't know where
3:54
Speaker 2: their next meal is coming from. They've got children that
4:00
Speaker 2: don't have enough to eat, they barely have a roof
4:03
Speaker 2: over their head. They go paycheck to paycheck. Hey, I've
4:06
Speaker 2: been there, that whole paycheck to paycheck thing.
4:08
Speaker 3: I've worked the three Johns. I get it.
4:10
Speaker 2: So it seems to me, the more money people get,
4:14
Speaker 2: the more miserable they are.
4:16
Speaker 5: Nancy, I have a policy in my office that if
4:19
Speaker 5: crazy walks through the door, they're going to walk right
4:22
Speaker 5: back out.
4:23
Speaker 6: I just don't have the time to deal with that
4:24
Speaker 6: when we have children who really have needs, and this
4:27
Speaker 6: couple didn't even have any children between them, and they're
4:31
Speaker 6: acting like pure schools in North Carolina. You don't even
4:36
Speaker 6: get to bring any of this shazazzle into an equitable discricca.
4:41
Speaker 2: Is that a technical legal term? They did not teach
4:43
Speaker 2: me either at Mercer Law School, the Walter of George
4:46
Speaker 2: School's law or NYU Shazazzle is that.
4:51
Speaker 3: One of your what that is a legal term North Carolina?
4:54
Speaker 6: That is a legal term, And what may I ask?
4:56
Speaker 3: Does shazazzle mean?
4:58
Speaker 7: Well?
4:58
Speaker 3: Okay, got it, that's what that is. Okay, yeah, that
5:01
Speaker 3: is a technical legal term. Thank you. I've got a
5:04
Speaker 3: new word. Guys.
5:05
Speaker 2: We are talking about a so called glamorous Russian equestion.
5:09
Speaker 3: Boy, do I've got a surprise for you?
5:12
Speaker 2: Who is accused of taking out a two million dollar
5:16
Speaker 2: hit on her husband? And with me right now? Doctor
5:19
Speaker 2: Angela Arnold renounced psychiatrist joining us out of the Atlanta
5:21
Speaker 2: jurisdiction at Angela Arnold md dot com.
5:25
Speaker 3: What is wrong with rich people?
5:27
Speaker 2: I didn't really get a good answer from Kathleen Murphy.
5:30
Speaker 3: I learned a new legal term, chits azzle.
5:32
Speaker 2: But what is wrong with them? A two million dollar hit?
5:37
Speaker 2: I mean they've got money coming out of their rare ends.
5:41
Speaker 7: So, Nancy, I believe that when people become so wealthy
5:44
Speaker 7: that they lose their purpose in life. They have no
5:47
Speaker 7: purpose in life. They can have whatever they want, they
5:50
Speaker 7: don't have to wait for anything, and it changes your mindset.
5:55
Speaker 7: When you don't have a purpose, you don't have to work,
5:58
Speaker 7: you don't have to have delayed gratification, and it makes
6:03
Speaker 7: people unhappy.
6:05
Speaker 2: You know what, My grandmother said doctor Angie Arnold. Idle
6:08
Speaker 2: hands are the devil's workshop. I mean, it's all wait
6:12
Speaker 2: out right there in Genesis. And I'm certainly not a
6:14
Speaker 2: Bible scholar, but I was very shocked when I learned
6:17
Speaker 2: it says in Genesis that we are here to glorify
6:21
Speaker 2: and to work, to toil toil.
6:25
Speaker 3: I think there's a.
6:25
Speaker 2: Reason for that, because apparently he was getting too much
6:28
Speaker 2: trouble when they don't have a job.
6:30
Speaker 3: So how did the whole thing go down?
6:32
Speaker 2: Jim Smith joining me, Chief investigative reporter dailymail dot com.
6:36
Speaker 3: First of all, is the husband still alive?
6:40
Speaker 8: As far as we know, he is absolutely alive, Nancy.
6:43
Speaker 8: But he can't be signed. We don't know where he is.
6:47
Speaker 2: Wait, Jen Smith, haven't you been in my world long
6:51
Speaker 2: enough to know when somebody goes missing there's a really
6:54
Speaker 2: good chance they're dead. This woman's already allegedly taken out
6:58
Speaker 2: a two million dollar hit on the and now we
7:01
Speaker 2: can't find him. Why do you think he's alive?
7:03
Speaker 3: Jen Smith? And I'd like to point out Jackie is furiously.
7:06
Speaker 2: Waving a note at me put it back up, please
7:08
Speaker 2: unless youve erace it that he and she's angry she's
7:12
Speaker 2: angry this morning because this guy that we can't find,
7:16
Speaker 2: Mark Rimley, inherited all of his money.
7:19
Speaker 3: He didn't earn it. And I have to agree with you, Jackie.
7:23
Speaker 2: There's a big difference when you are born into money
7:26
Speaker 2: and when you have to work for it.
7:28
Speaker 3: Well, you're right.
7:28
Speaker 8: I mean, normally, when we have attempted murder for higher
7:33
Speaker 8: plout we have a missing independent victim, you would think
7:35
Speaker 8: that they're in real trouble. The reason I say he
7:37
Speaker 8: is missing is because before any of us learned to
7:41
Speaker 8: grow this plawtntacy. Mark Bramley roared up in his ferrari
7:46
Speaker 8: to his neighbor's host said, I'm having a seizure.
7:49
Speaker 9: I need to go to the hospital. You need to
7:51
Speaker 9: help me.
7:51
Speaker 3: Wait.
7:51
Speaker 2: He could drive his ferrari to his neighbor's house, but
7:54
Speaker 2: he couldn't call nine to one one. I'm having a seizure,
7:57
Speaker 2: is that what he said?
7:58
Speaker 8: Many many quest students around the behavior of this couple.
8:02
Speaker 8: Obviously he was taken to the hospital for medical care.
8:07
Speaker 8: We know that he made it there, and we know
8:08
Speaker 8: that he seemingly made it after that. It looks like
8:12
Speaker 8: he's high tailed it. And I can't say that many
8:15
Speaker 8: people would blame him given what his wife, Tasiata had
8:20
Speaker 8: in store for him.
8:21
Speaker 2: Okay, so we know he was at the hospital. We
8:24
Speaker 2: know he was discharged from the hospital from his seizure.
8:29
Speaker 2: I still don't understand why he drove to his neighbors.
8:32
Speaker 2: Let me guess, is it a red Ferrari. I'm just wild, guess.
8:35
Speaker 8: It's actually a black Ferrari.
8:37
Speaker 2: Oh okay, that was my second choice. That was going
8:39
Speaker 2: to be my second choice, then neon yellow. So he
8:42
Speaker 2: drives to a neighbor's house in his black Ferrari. He
8:47
Speaker 2: tells the neighbor he's fully in charge of his faculties.
8:51
Speaker 2: I'm having a seizure.
8:53
Speaker 3: You know. I've got a friend, a very dear friend
8:56
Speaker 3: who went to.
8:56
Speaker 2: High school with and she has boys and they're all
9:01
Speaker 2: brilliant Jackie, like chemical and scientific or issues.
9:06
Speaker 3: It's not epilepsy, it's something else. One of her.
9:11
Speaker 2: Sons is not allowed to drive, and as they're getting older,
9:15
Speaker 2: that is really hard for him. They can fall at work,
9:19
Speaker 2: they wake up, they don't know what happened. So if
9:23
Speaker 2: you're having a seizure, you do not get in your
9:25
Speaker 2: black Ferrari and drive to a neighbor's house and say
9:27
Speaker 2: I'm having a seizure. That's not how that goes down.
9:30
Speaker 2: So I don't believe anything he's saying either. Guys, I
9:34
Speaker 2: want to bring in the rest of the panel, but
9:36
Speaker 2: first take a listen to our friends at kg TV.
9:39
Speaker 4: In her divorce filing, Remley accused her husband of being
9:42
Speaker 4: physically and verbally abusive, allegedly putting a gun to her
9:46
Speaker 4: head in one incident, as well as chasing her with
9:48
Speaker 4: a knife and another. In that same filing, she claims
9:52
Speaker 4: she is under extreme financial strain, adding quote she's unable
9:56
Speaker 4: to maintain her realistic monthly expenses of just well thousand dollars,
10:01
Speaker 4: much less than what she was accustomed to at fifty
10:04
Speaker 4: thousand dollars, and her estranged husband, Mark Remley, has denied
10:09
Speaker 4: his wife's allegations of abuse. As for Tasiana Remley, she
10:13
Speaker 4: is being held behind bars with no bail.
10:15
Speaker 10: The documents say she's accustomed to a luxurious lifestyle that
10:19
Speaker 10: includes having bodyguardens, drivers, and a personal assistant.
10:22
Speaker 3: Okay, hold on just a moment.
10:24
Speaker 2: This woman does not have a job, but she has
10:27
Speaker 2: a fifty thousand dollars a month lifestyle, with quote luxurious lifestyle, bodyguards, drivers,
10:34
Speaker 2: and personal assistant.
10:35
Speaker 3: Why does this woman need a bodyguard?
10:37
Speaker 2: But that said again, the husband has does not denied
10:40
Speaker 2: all of these claims of physical abuse and threats.
10:45
Speaker 3: I'm just trying to figure out how the whole thing
10:47
Speaker 3: went down.
10:59
Speaker 1: Time Stories with Nancy Grace.
11:03
Speaker 2: Jenn Smith joining me, Chief reporter at dailymail dot com.
11:06
Speaker 2: So she tries to hire a hitman. How does she
11:09
Speaker 2: end up getting found out by police?
11:12
Speaker 8: Well, not very clever moved by Tassi Aana Rambley. The
11:17
Speaker 8: person that she confessed her plan to was a mutual
11:21
Speaker 8: friend of the couple, who, upon hearing her intention to
11:25
Speaker 8: have her husband murdered, he called the police. Then from
11:28
Speaker 8: there the police initiated a sting operation and the intended
11:32
Speaker 8: hitman nan see the person she thought she was going
11:34
Speaker 8: to pay two million dollars to kill her husband, even
11:37
Speaker 8: an undercover cop. That's how it's all unraveled.
11:41
Speaker 2: Robin Driike joining me, behavior expert, former FBI Special Agent,
11:45
Speaker 2: chief of the FBI Counter Intelligence Behavioral Analysis Program and
11:50
Speaker 2: author of Sizing People Up. This is an incredible book,
11:54
Speaker 2: by the way, Sizing People Up a veteran FBI agent's
11:57
Speaker 2: manual for behavior prediction. Hey, are you single, ladies, read
12:02
Speaker 2: this book before you go on your next date. You
12:05
Speaker 2: can find them at peopleformula dot com. Sizing People Up
12:09
Speaker 2: a veteran FBI A just manual for behavior prediction.
12:13
Speaker 3: I usually put it in a nutshell, Robin Drake.
12:16
Speaker 2: If you don't know what somebody's gonna do, look at
12:18
Speaker 2: what they've already done. That's just my general formula, Robin Drake,
12:22
Speaker 2: What is wrong with these two people?
12:24
Speaker 11: Well you hit it right there, and we'll riff on
12:28
Speaker 11: what your other guests just said. And this is she's got.
12:30
Speaker 2: A life arc of shizazzle mispronunciation place I believe she
12:34
Speaker 2: says shiz azzle.
12:36
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, this is dazzle.
12:39
Speaker 9: But it's these people.
12:41
Speaker 11: You know, we're genetically and biologically coded to survive and
12:45
Speaker 11: thrive in deprivation, believe or not, as biological organisms on
12:48
Speaker 11: its planning. So when you have a when you have
12:50
Speaker 11: abundance like they have, you get ultimately caught up in
12:53
Speaker 11: the cult of more, and you're constantly wanting and craving more.
12:58
Speaker 11: And my question throughout this thing, she's got a life
13:01
Speaker 11: arc of really abnormal, unhealthy behavior of all these things
13:06
Speaker 11: and violence and sex and drugs and rock and roll
13:08
Speaker 11: and all that. But I'm really curious as to what
13:11
Speaker 11: she was going to gain by killing her husband, because
13:15
Speaker 11: she's using financial gains from child support and all these
13:19
Speaker 11: other things. But always there's a motive behind Keilly's. A
13:22
Speaker 11: lot of times it's life insurance policies and things like that.
13:25
Speaker 9: But what I'm.
13:25
Speaker 11: Really curious about is every other husband has a pre
13:29
Speaker 11: nup that's been really rock solid against her, and so
13:31
Speaker 11: she's really struggled at hers. I really want to know
13:34
Speaker 11: why she wanted to have them killed. What was she
13:36
Speaker 11: going to get? All her behavior throughout her entire life
13:38
Speaker 11: has been self serving for herself, and I'm not getting
13:41
Speaker 11: it yet.
13:42
Speaker 2: I think I've started that by asking what is wrong
13:45
Speaker 2: with these people? And frankly, that's not my concern. I'm
13:49
Speaker 2: not a shrink. I don't need to know what's wrong
13:52
Speaker 2: with them. I don't need to know why. The reality
13:55
Speaker 2: is that when you are in court and you're trying
13:57
Speaker 2: to prove a case why motive doesn't matter. Out of
14:00
Speaker 2: the state never has to prove motive realistically, practically speaking,
14:04
Speaker 2: a jury would like to find out why, because you
14:07
Speaker 2: see these two come into court and you think, why
14:08
Speaker 2: would she risk it all by hiring a hitman? So
14:13
Speaker 2: you may want to know motive so you can tell
14:16
Speaker 2: that to a jury, so that final piece of the
14:18
Speaker 2: puzzle isn't missing. But I want to find out more
14:23
Speaker 2: about these people and about the alleged hit. Now a
14:26
Speaker 2: lot started falling apart after a failed horse show. A
14:33
Speaker 2: failed horse show. Now, I grew up in farmland. My
14:38
Speaker 2: grandparents had horses, and they were workhorses, not show horses.
14:42
Speaker 3: So all of this is very alien to me.
14:45
Speaker 2: I remember when I worked with Larry King, who helped
14:50
Speaker 2: me a great deal. He was all about what was
14:53
Speaker 2: the name of it, guys, you gotta look this up, Cindy.
14:56
Speaker 2: It was like a certain dislay, but it was horses.
15:02
Speaker 2: I think it started with.
15:02
Speaker 3: A sea and it was amazing.
15:06
Speaker 2: I recall I think we were living out in California
15:09
Speaker 2: during Dancing with the Stars and we took the twins
15:13
Speaker 2: to see this horse, certain disulay type show and I've
15:18
Speaker 2: never seen anything. Yeah, Cavalia, that's it, thank you. And
15:22
Speaker 2: guess I've got with me an equestrian specialists. But what
15:27
Speaker 2: does that have to do with these two who were
15:29
Speaker 2: in a whole heap of trouble. It's like two wet
15:31
Speaker 2: cats and a barrel. Take listen our cut seventeen, ABC ten.
15:35
Speaker 12: More than a month after the Valatar Show was abruptly canceled,
15:38
Speaker 12: the Big Red Tent is still here at the del
15:40
Speaker 12: Mar Fairgrounds parking lot, and tonight the show's producers are
15:43
Speaker 12: facing a second lawsuit. Elite Show Services, a company you
15:47
Speaker 12: might know from Chargers Games, where they provide security, says
15:50
Speaker 12: Valatar producer Mark Rimley and his wife Tatiana, owe them
15:53
Speaker 12: more than sixty five thousand dollars.
15:56
Speaker 6: Elites.
15:56
Speaker 12: Beef with the Rimleys actually goes back about four years,
16:00
Speaker 12: but he says the Rimley's not only stiffed them on Valotar.
16:03
Speaker 12: Elite says the couple has done the same thing to
16:05
Speaker 12: them before.
16:06
Speaker 3: Jasmth what is Valatar?
16:08
Speaker 8: So Valatar would have been and was briefly the Ramleys
16:12
Speaker 8: sort of per man version of the show that you
16:15
Speaker 8: mentioned that you had seen yourself, Nancy.
16:17
Speaker 6: Oh.
16:17
Speaker 8: They decided that they wanted to create a sort of
16:21
Speaker 8: version similar versions, but they wanted it to be raunchier.
16:25
Speaker 8: So their idea was that they would gather horses, they
16:29
Speaker 8: would gather kind of sexy acrobats and they would put
16:33
Speaker 8: on this horror show that would rival what you saw,
16:36
Speaker 8: which was actually created by one of the founders of
16:39
Speaker 8: Sarcus Delay, so pretty lost the ambitions there that was Valatar.
16:44
Speaker 8: It didn't last very long, I think maybe four or
16:47
Speaker 8: five shows. And really the problem was that while Tatiana
16:52
Speaker 8: might have been a horse enthusiast, she certainly bought some
16:55
Speaker 8: or her husband's thought them for her. She knew nothing
16:59
Speaker 8: about what it requires to run not just a show,
17:02
Speaker 8: but a show involving animals. There were accidents on set.
17:06
Speaker 8: Some of the horses ended up with broken legs, getting
17:09
Speaker 8: tangled in carriages that she was trying to use in thralls.
17:13
Speaker 8: You had experts warning her you don't know anything about this,
17:17
Speaker 8: and her husband was the same. So the show didn't
17:20
Speaker 8: last very long. But it might not come as a
17:22
Speaker 8: surprise to you to learn she was the face of it.
17:25
Speaker 8: She was the face that you saw on all the
17:27
Speaker 8: posters advertising this horse show, and she.
17:30
Speaker 9: Was the one who came out at the end of.
17:32
Speaker 8: The show took a buy for the audience, even though
17:36
Speaker 8: she really had no involvement in any of the stunt.
17:39
Speaker 2: I could hear doctor Angela Arnold chopping at the bit
17:41
Speaker 2: to scream out narcissism. But hold on, I want you
17:45
Speaker 2: ought to know more facts about the I mean, what
17:48
Speaker 2: a boondoggle. Just just think about how much college tuition
17:54
Speaker 2: was Everything I think about? I think about, Okay, would
17:57
Speaker 2: this be the twins college tuition? Would this be the
17:59
Speaker 2: hilth and insurance? Do I really want it that much
18:02
Speaker 2: that I have to pay this amount for it? When
18:04
Speaker 2: I hear seventy thousand dollars and this amount and that amount,
18:08
Speaker 2: that's how I look at it. I want you to
18:10
Speaker 2: hear more about this so called horse show. I think
18:13
Speaker 2: it's a lot more than that. Take a listen to
18:15
Speaker 2: our friends at ABC ten.
18:16
Speaker 12: Vallatar went dark in late November after just a few performances.
18:20
Speaker 2: They did strand the performers, and they stranded the horses
18:23
Speaker 2: as well.
18:24
Speaker 12: A benefit show held in December raised enough money to
18:27
Speaker 12: send all the performers and horses home.
18:29
Speaker 10: During the show, she showed up one day with a
18:31
Speaker 10: horse and was like, oh, look, I just got this horse.
18:34
Speaker 10: I only spent seventy thousand dollars on him. The asking
18:37
Speaker 10: price for the horse at the time had been thirty K,
18:40
Speaker 10: so she managed to spend forty thousand dollars more than
18:43
Speaker 10: the asking price, just because she decided she wanted that horse,
18:46
Speaker 10: and someone saw a sucker written on her face.
18:49
Speaker 2: I guess seventy thousand dollars for a thirty thousand dollars horse.
18:54
Speaker 2: You were hearing Eric Martanovich with our friends at News Nation.
18:58
Speaker 2: But now take a listen to Eric Martanovitch speaking to
19:03
Speaker 2: that billboard Jen Smith was telling you about and she.
19:07
Speaker 10: Wanted to She had a billboard for Velatar, the show
19:12
Speaker 10: made with her standing there looking as sexy as she
19:15
Speaker 10: could holding a pole, kind of looked like an ad
19:17
Speaker 10: for a strip club. And she put it on I
19:20
Speaker 10: five where he had to drive every day, so that
19:23
Speaker 10: he would have to see it. So she definitely had
19:25
Speaker 10: a little vendetta going. She obviously didn't like him, and
19:29
Speaker 10: she wanted to show him how wonderful she was.
19:31
Speaker 13: Doing without him.
19:32
Speaker 2: Okay, with that in mind, I want to introduce you
19:35
Speaker 2: to a very special guest, Bridget Brandon, joining us out
19:38
Speaker 2: of Texas Horse Specialist. She is the president of the
19:42
Speaker 2: Equine Expert. You can find her at the Equine expert
19:47
Speaker 2: dot com. Bridget Brandon, thank you for being with us.
19:50
Speaker 2: When I heard that some of the horses fell with,
19:56
Speaker 2: tangled up in carriages, and so forth. I mean, isn't
20:01
Speaker 2: a broken leg essentially the kiss of death for a horse,
20:04
Speaker 2: a show horse?
20:05
Speaker 5: Well, it can be.
20:07
Speaker 13: I'm not a vet, and there's been a lot of
20:10
Speaker 13: new technology as far as medicine goes, but certainly with
20:14
Speaker 13: the broken leg it can end a horses' athletic performance.
20:21
Speaker 13: For sure, most of these horses were either stallions or geltings,
20:26
Speaker 13: but certainly with the broken leg it could ruin that
20:31
Speaker 13: horse's particular career and devalue the horse as well.
20:36
Speaker 2: I was listening to what various guests and experts have
20:40
Speaker 2: said that while she knew how to ride a horse,
20:44
Speaker 2: putting on a horse show to the extent of something
20:48
Speaker 2: comparable to Cavalia, that's a big deal.
20:51
Speaker 9: That's a very big deal.
20:52
Speaker 13: You've got to consider the betting, the footing, the feed,
20:58
Speaker 13: the water, where going to practice, the conditions for the horses,
21:04
Speaker 13: heat and air. There's a lot of planning circumstances you've
21:12
Speaker 13: got to have that's available on hand. And you know,
21:15
Speaker 13: in case an accident happens, like broken leg or an
21:20
Speaker 13: injury of some sort horse colleges, there's just numerous things
21:26
Speaker 13: that you've got to be prepared for. And it's one
21:29
Speaker 13: of those industry you just don't If you don't if
21:32
Speaker 13: you're not experienced in it, you just don't know what
21:34
Speaker 13: you don't know. Many things could happen another thing.
21:37
Speaker 2: Bridget Brandon with US Horse Specialists, the president of the
21:40
Speaker 2: Equine Expert Bridget I am always fascinated by want well
21:47
Speaker 2: many events in the Olympics, but I remember seeing I
21:50
Speaker 2: think it was one of the royals competing in a
21:54
Speaker 2: horse drawn carriage race. I mean we're used to, for instance,
21:58
Speaker 2: the Kentucky Derby or various races we see on American TV.
22:03
Speaker 2: We don't see a lot of carriage races. It's a
22:07
Speaker 2: very very specialized sport.
22:10
Speaker 13: It is a specialized sport and it involves a lot
22:13
Speaker 13: of twist and turns and going around obstacles, and you
22:19
Speaker 13: have to have very highly trained horses to do that
22:23
Speaker 13: type of event, and you yourself need to be trained
22:25
Speaker 13: as well.
22:26
Speaker 2: Weren't there carriage horses in this show? To you, Jenn Smith,
22:32
Speaker 2: there were.
22:32
Speaker 8: I mean, whether or not they actually ended up using
22:35
Speaker 8: them in the show, I'm not sure, but we know
22:38
Speaker 8: that there was some sort of accident in the rehearsal
22:41
Speaker 8: involving at least one horse, and that horse ended up
22:44
Speaker 8: breaking its legs because they got caught in the contrapment
22:48
Speaker 8: that they were trying to you.
22:49
Speaker 3: So, what happened.
22:50
Speaker 2: Did they just pull out leaks everybody hind right without
22:52
Speaker 2: paying them.
22:53
Speaker 8: Yeah, that's exactly what's alleged. And then what happened afterwards
22:56
Speaker 8: were you know, a mon in of lawsuits. You have
22:58
Speaker 8: these people who give up their time to do this,
23:02
Speaker 8: they say no to other jobs, and then they end
23:05
Speaker 8: up kind of high and dry. We know that Mark
23:08
Speaker 8: and Tatiana and now they had tumultuous marriage. They ended
23:13
Speaker 8: up staying together for you know, legally married around ten years,
23:18
Speaker 8: but there were on again, off again there were separations.
23:21
Speaker 8: There were you know, real gaps where they were not
23:24
Speaker 8: a united front, and at least during one of those,
23:27
Speaker 8: Mark said that he wanted to carry on with the
23:30
Speaker 8: show and was going to deal with the experts himself,
23:33
Speaker 8: putting Tatiana out of it. They then ended up back
23:36
Speaker 8: together and Tatiana's back in the frame.
23:39
Speaker 9: It was just a whole mess.
23:40
Speaker 8: These were two people who did not know what they
23:42
Speaker 8: were doing and clearly weren't prepared to listen to the
23:45
Speaker 8: experts were telling.
23:47
Speaker 3: Them all that money though Jim Smith, well.
23:50
Speaker 8: Apparently it wasn't enough to put on what they wanted
23:53
Speaker 8: to do. The experts that we've all heard from and said, yeah,
23:57
Speaker 8: they had some money, but it wasn't enough to achieve
23:59
Speaker 8: or pool off the level of theatrics and performance that
24:03
Speaker 8: they were trying to achieve.
24:05
Speaker 2: He had the money, millions and millions of dollars. I
24:08
Speaker 2: don't know how much more he wanted to sink into
24:11
Speaker 2: a horse show, but guys, they had more problems than
24:15
Speaker 2: just money problems and horse problems.
24:18
Speaker 3: Take a listen to our cut twenty four.
24:20
Speaker 10: So in a seventeen I got a phone call from Mark.
24:23
Speaker 10: This was after our business deals had failed miserably and
24:26
Speaker 10: I didn't want anything to do with him, and he
24:27
Speaker 10: was trying to get me to come down to San
24:29
Speaker 10: Diego and hang out, and I couldn't figure out what
24:32
Speaker 10: he wanted. Friend of ours was at my place and
24:34
Speaker 10: we were talking about it, and I just brought it
24:35
Speaker 10: up as a weird thing, that why was Mark bothering me?
24:38
Speaker 9: And he immediately knew the.
24:40
Speaker 10: Answer, and he said, oh, Tatiana wants to sleep with
24:42
Speaker 10: you while he watches so Apparently they were trying to
24:45
Speaker 10: get me to come down there and have sex with Tatiana.
24:47
Speaker 14: Well Mark watched for install. The New York Post that
24:50
Speaker 14: Mark and Tatiana Rimley were featured in the twenty seventeen
24:54
Speaker 14: Showtime docu series Naked Sanctum, where the pair was seen
24:58
Speaker 14: hanging out with fellow swingers. Appearing on the Showtime series
25:01
Speaker 14: Naked Sanctum, where members of an elite sex club share partners,
25:05
Speaker 14: Mark Rimley went under the pseudonym Vladimir and identified himself
25:09
Speaker 14: as an entrepreneur. Rimley using the name Vladimir shocked many
25:13
Speaker 14: people close to the couple. Tatiana has a brother named Vladimir,
25:17
Speaker 14: the same brother she accused of sexually assaulting her when
25:21
Speaker 14: she was a child.
25:22
Speaker 2: You know, Kathleen Murphy, trial lawyer joining me out of
25:26
Speaker 2: North Carolina. When you start a prosecution, you have to
25:30
Speaker 2: go to some very dark places. I've been in every
25:33
Speaker 2: strip club, male and female, in town, drug houses, flop houses,
25:39
Speaker 2: houses for everybody is high on something and people are
25:43
Speaker 2: over in the corner chasing the dragon. I mean, you
25:46
Speaker 2: name it, been there. Some of it I wish I
25:50
Speaker 2: couldn't remember.
25:51
Speaker 11: Some of it.
25:51
Speaker 3: I've tried to forget a lot of it. I've tried to.
25:53
Speaker 2: Forget, but I'm trying to get in my head wrapped
25:56
Speaker 2: around what I just heard from News Nation and Crime Online.
26:01
Speaker 3: Did I hear Jen Smith that.
26:05
Speaker 2: They wanted their friend Eric Martanovich to come down and
26:09
Speaker 2: have sex with the wife while the husband watched?
26:12
Speaker 3: Did I hear that that's what you heard? You know,
26:15
Speaker 3: say much you're worried about it at all? Girl?
26:18
Speaker 2: Did I also hear they were on Naked SNCTM. I
26:23
Speaker 2: guess that's her sanctum on Showtime Naked Sanctum.
26:27
Speaker 9: That's right.
26:28
Speaker 8: They appeared very willingly on this pretty CD show that
26:32
Speaker 8: all of the life of wealthy swingers that attended these
26:36
Speaker 8: kind of more or meant to be exclusive sex parties.
26:39
Speaker 8: Tatiana in this episode at least sporting dark hair. She's
26:44
Speaker 8: sitting at a table, she's being caressed by women, and
26:48
Speaker 8: Mark As watching with a kind of.
26:51
Speaker 9: Excitive look in his eye.
26:53
Speaker 8: They then give this on camera interview where he refers
26:56
Speaker 8: to himself as Vladimir. Now, as you heard there in
27:00
Speaker 8: the clincher's place. That's a very sick reference, given we've
27:04
Speaker 8: heard a prior allegation against a brother of Tatiana's cold Vladimir,
27:10
Speaker 8: who is said to have sectually abused her when she
27:13
Speaker 8: was a child.
27:14
Speaker 3: So she claims her brother sex abused her as a child.
27:18
Speaker 2: And then when they're play acting at what was it
27:22
Speaker 2: called naked sanctum.
27:23
Speaker 9: Naked sanctom, he takes the.
27:26
Speaker 2: Moniker Vladimir, knowing full well that she claims her brother
27:31
Speaker 2: sex abused her. You know, Kathleen Murphy speaking of swingers
27:36
Speaker 2: and rich people that don't have anything to fill their
27:38
Speaker 2: time with, and what is this naked sanctum? I made
27:41
Speaker 2: it very clear to my husband on day one, open marriage,
27:46
Speaker 2: open casket done that said at all four words over.
27:51
Speaker 5: I cannot get out of my head the case that
27:53
Speaker 5: I had where the dad of the child was on
27:58
Speaker 5: the opposite table for me, and I was representing the mother,
28:02
Speaker 5: and the father said to the judge, and I had
28:05
Speaker 5: no idea. He goes, well, she's my sister and our child,
28:10
Speaker 5: blah blah blah, And I almost.
28:14
Speaker 2: Well, no, mody asked you that, Kathleen. We've got our
28:17
Speaker 2: own problems dealing with this woman.
28:20
Speaker 3: She's a Russian. Thank you for throwing that.
28:25
Speaker 2: Into the pot to stee joining me right now, is
28:27
Speaker 2: Brad Watts. Guys, the reason we're kind of a little
28:31
Speaker 2: bit happy today is we don't think that the husband,
28:34
Speaker 2: Mark Rimley is dead yet. Jen Smith is holding out hope.
28:39
Speaker 2: Then he has just dropped off the radar, probably to
28:43
Speaker 2: hide from his wife. Uh the Russian talk to Gianna Rimley.
29:02
Speaker 1: Time Stories with Nancy Grace.
29:07
Speaker 2: Brad Wats is with me and this is where he
29:09
Speaker 2: fits into this puzzle. Licensed Professional Counselor and certified sex
29:14
Speaker 2: offender treatment provider who specializes in sibling sex abuse, sibling
29:20
Speaker 2: sex abuse. This is book Sibling sex Abuse, America's Silent Epidemic.
29:24
Speaker 2: Brad Watts, LPC, Licensed Professional Counselor dot com Brad.
29:31
Speaker 3: This woman lies so much.
29:33
Speaker 2: I don't know whether to believe her that she had
29:37
Speaker 2: a brother named Vladimir that molested her.
29:40
Speaker 15: Yeah, Nancy, Yeah, it's tough to believe anything that she
29:43
Speaker 15: says that. My experience is that for a survivor of
29:47
Speaker 15: sibling sexual abuse, for her husband to go into the
29:50
Speaker 15: Moniker's Vladimir, the name of the brother who sexually abused her,
29:55
Speaker 15: that would be highly triggering. I mean, that would be
29:59
Speaker 15: like I think about the show on the set, her
30:01
Speaker 15: being finding that out, becoming incredibly upset, not able to
30:05
Speaker 15: move forward with it, and so there's just a lot here. Obviously,
30:09
Speaker 15: you know, I don't know. You know, perhaps she was
30:12
Speaker 15: sexual abuse put by Vladimir, but.
30:13
Speaker 2: Why would she go along with her husband using his
30:17
Speaker 2: name in some crazy sex game for a showtime production.
30:24
Speaker 15: It makes no sense to me. Like I said, in
30:27
Speaker 15: my experience, most survivors would be severely triggered even by
30:31
Speaker 15: hearing the name, you know, particularly with the description that
30:34
Speaker 15: the mother gave about her the sibling sexual abuse being
30:38
Speaker 15: because you know, Vladimir was jealous of her and you know,
30:42
Speaker 15: keeping her isolated for ten years and all these other things.
30:45
Speaker 3: But the brother kept her isolated? What about her parents?
30:48
Speaker 2: And we found out about this and one of their
30:51
Speaker 2: divorce dramas.
30:52
Speaker 3: Where it came out.
30:53
Speaker 2: It was in her mother's testimony back in two thousand
30:56
Speaker 2: and six.
30:57
Speaker 3: So did the parents know? Are they unaware?
31:01
Speaker 2: I find it hard to believe her brother kept her
31:04
Speaker 2: isolated for ten years without the parents say so. I
31:07
Speaker 2: just have a lot of issues with that, and then
31:10
Speaker 2: going along with her husband using her sex abuser's name
31:16
Speaker 2: in this charade. You know, doctor Angie Arnold, We've discussed
31:20
Speaker 2: many times when someone even says the name Keith. It's
31:24
Speaker 2: like somebody poured cold water on me out of the blue,
31:27
Speaker 2: the name of my fiance that was murdered, or if
31:31
Speaker 2: someone just asked me about it, good well intentioned it
31:34
Speaker 2: just you know, I can be having a perfectly fine
31:37
Speaker 2: day and they bring that up, and then I have
31:39
Speaker 2: to remember everything. So I'm very surprised that she would
31:44
Speaker 2: go along with him using the name Vladimir if in
31:47
Speaker 2: fact she was molested by brother Vladimir for so long.
31:51
Speaker 7: I know that that seems surprising to a lot of people,
31:54
Speaker 7: But I know that you're not going to like what
31:58
Speaker 7: I have to say about this. But how do we
32:01
Speaker 7: know that this woman wasn't somehow being abused by this husband.
32:06
Speaker 7: I know that it all looks very flashy on the outside,
32:10
Speaker 7: but Nat Nancy, there are not a lot of people
32:13
Speaker 7: who want to have sex with other people while their
32:17
Speaker 7: husband watches, but the husband makes them do it. They're
32:22
Speaker 7: punished if they don't do it, they're punished in all
32:25
Speaker 7: kinds of ways. And so we don't know what kind
32:28
Speaker 7: of punishment she was suffering from him, so that it
32:32
Speaker 7: looks strange to us that she didn't have a reaction
32:35
Speaker 7: that one of us would have to do. But she's
32:37
Speaker 7: got a story in a background that's very different than
32:40
Speaker 7: any of us.
32:41
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what, you're right about that. Take a
32:44
Speaker 3: listen to this.
32:45
Speaker 10: She had a character that she played all the time,
32:48
Speaker 10: and it was this Russian barbie doll princess equestrian. And
32:52
Speaker 10: I don't think any of it was true. It was
32:54
Speaker 10: all something she made up. I'm pretty sure her real
32:56
Speaker 10: name is Tanya. I don't think it's actually Tatiana. It's
32:58
Speaker 10: all this persona that she's made up. And maybe it's
33:01
Speaker 10: a you know, came from the childhood trauma and she
33:05
Speaker 10: needed a character that she could become that wasn't tortured.
33:09
Speaker 9: I don't know.
33:09
Speaker 10: But if there's none of it's real, it's all her
33:12
Speaker 10: character that she plays.
33:13
Speaker 2: From our friends at News Nation now, listen to crime
33:16
Speaker 2: online dot Com.
33:17
Speaker 14: Former friends who have known Tatiana Rimley say she said
33:21
Speaker 14: she was Russian and had a background in dressage, a
33:24
Speaker 14: highly specialized form of horse riding and equidisplay. However, a
33:28
Speaker 14: former business partner, Eric Martanovich, says Rimley made up the
33:32
Speaker 14: backstory of her life and that her real name is Tanya.
33:35
Speaker 14: The Daily Mail reports that Rimley was born in Arizona,
33:38
Speaker 14: raised in Bend, Oregon. Her last name is Clark. She's
33:41
Speaker 14: not Russian. While working at a San Diego animal park
33:44
Speaker 14: and doing some modeling, Tatiana Rimley began a relationship with
33:48
Speaker 14: Ken Wolcott. Wilcott is a former Southern California attorney and
33:52
Speaker 14: biotech tycoon who was part owner of the NBA Seattle SuperSonics.
33:56
Speaker 14: Tatiana was twenty three years old and six months pregnant
33:59
Speaker 14: with their son, Spencer, when she and forty three year
34:02
Speaker 14: old Woolcott got married. The marriage only lasted eleven months,
34:06
Speaker 14: but the battle for money would rage on for years,
34:08
Speaker 14: even though a prenuptial agreement was signed by Tatiana Rimley.
34:12
Speaker 3: Okay, so everything she's told us.
34:17
Speaker 2: About her background, her name, where she's from. Was raised
34:21
Speaker 2: in ben To, Oregon, not Russia. Her name is Tanya,
34:25
Speaker 2: not Tatiana. I assume she was an experty question because
34:29
Speaker 2: she was seen riding by many to Richard Brandon, the
34:34
Speaker 2: president of the Equine Expert. Isn't it dressage? Is that
34:39
Speaker 2: the name for that very complicated type of horse competition.
34:43
Speaker 13: A yes, pressage. It basically means training on horseback. It's
34:49
Speaker 13: a bit like ballet, but on horseback.
34:51
Speaker 2: And the horse actually learns like stepping backwards into the
34:55
Speaker 2: side and very very complicated moves. What more do we
35:00
Speaker 2: know about Tatiana aka Tanya from Bend, Oregon. Take a
35:07
Speaker 2: listen to our cut seven from Crime Online.
35:11
Speaker 14: While Tatiana Rimley was fighting her ex husband in court,
35:14
Speaker 14: her former friends tell The New York Post that Rimley
35:17
Speaker 14: was the life of the party and was targeting rich
35:20
Speaker 14: men who could mangrol her lifestyle. Mark Grimley did just
35:23
Speaker 14: that after they met at a local Starbucks and married
35:26
Speaker 14: in March of twenty eleven. Pals of the couple told
35:29
Speaker 14: the Post the two shared a passion for money, riding horses, drugs,
35:35
Speaker 14: and participating in orgies.
35:37
Speaker 2: Okay, a passion for money, riding horses, drugs and orgies,
35:42
Speaker 2: Is that right, Tim Smith?
35:45
Speaker 5: That's right.
35:45
Speaker 9: A pretty unique set of interest there.
35:47
Speaker 8: But you know, it definitely seems as though this was
35:51
Speaker 8: a mutually complicit arrangement. Tatiana we know or Tanya, She
35:57
Speaker 8: also enjoyed having secs with other people, whether or not
36:00
Speaker 8: her husband was there.
36:02
Speaker 9: Sometimes he was, sometimes he wasn't we know that they
36:04
Speaker 9: both were buried.
36:05
Speaker 8: They had a you know, open and fluid marriage to
36:09
Speaker 8: say the least. There were drugs, there were orgies. There
36:14
Speaker 8: were some occasions where he brought home apparently entire strip
36:19
Speaker 8: clubs full of people back to their house. And they
36:22
Speaker 8: did have many children between them. They might not have
36:25
Speaker 8: any kids together, but they were responsible for at least
36:28
Speaker 8: five or six children out and they were living this
36:31
Speaker 8: really X rated and at times, you know, darknight CD lifestyle.
36:38
Speaker 3: You know what, I'm not the church lady.
36:41
Speaker 2: I don't care who they sleep with or if they
36:43
Speaker 2: have orgies or don't have orgies, or have an open
36:46
Speaker 2: marriage or don't have an open marriage. But what it
36:49
Speaker 2: is telling me to Robin Drake formerly the FBI, is
36:53
Speaker 2: that there is a lot of motive for murder. The
36:57
Speaker 2: first husband wasn't the first husband Jasamith s rich as well,
37:01
Speaker 2: like rolling in money.
37:02
Speaker 8: Yeah, he was super rich. He had the foresight to
37:06
Speaker 8: protect himself with what is described as an iron cloud prenup.
37:10
Speaker 8: It didn't stop her from being able to gleet him
37:14
Speaker 8: from some money.
37:15
Speaker 9: And the way that she accomplished it was.
37:17
Speaker 8: By demanding very large child support payments for the sun
37:21
Speaker 8: that they shared.
37:22
Speaker 2: So Robin Drake behavior expert, all of this talk about
37:26
Speaker 2: orgies and open marriages and a showtime special and money,
37:33
Speaker 2: just money, hemorrhaging money.
37:36
Speaker 3: For me. In my world, it's all evidence. Do I
37:41
Speaker 3: have motive for murder?
37:42
Speaker 2: And there is no way as it stands right now
37:45
Speaker 2: that I do not believe the undercover agent with whom she,
37:50
Speaker 2: according to him, contracted to kill her husband.
37:55
Speaker 11: Yeah, this is a great example of people living beyond
37:58
Speaker 11: their intellect and she is definitely do it. Combine that
38:01
Speaker 11: with total addiction of dopamine, hits from every single aspect
38:05
Speaker 11: of life because they aren't struggling except to get more
38:08
Speaker 11: money and learn behavior of how to acquire resources in
38:12
Speaker 11: their lives unhealthy. Yeah, you're right, it's following that life arc.
38:16
Speaker 15: Of complete chaos.
38:17
Speaker 11: And I'd be really interested to see what her plan
38:20
Speaker 11: was that she gave the cop of the detailed plan,
38:23
Speaker 11: because I have a hard time imagining she can give
38:25
Speaker 11: a detailed plan for anything. So it's fascinating.
38:28
Speaker 2: You know, and as is not according to reports her
38:34
Speaker 2: first time at the rodeo.
38:35
Speaker 3: Take a listen to Hour cut five from Crime Online.
38:38
Speaker 14: At one court hearing concerning financials, Wilcott's attorney said he
38:42
Speaker 14: was concerned about how Rimley was spending the two thousand
38:45
Speaker 14: dollars a month he was giving her. Wilcott found out
38:48
Speaker 14: that during the marriage, Remley would go to Costco, Nordstrum
38:51
Speaker 14: and other stores, make purchases using credit cards, and then
38:54
Speaker 14: would turn right around and take the items back for
38:57
Speaker 14: a cash rEFInd. After they were separated, Wolcott discovered Rimley
39:01
Speaker 14: used this mess that does stockpile money.
39:03
Speaker 3: Well, and that's all the way back in the Woolcott.
39:05
Speaker 2: Marriage that monthly support demand goes up to fifty grand
39:10
Speaker 2: a month. Right now, there is no sight nor sound
39:18
Speaker 2: of Mark Rimley, the husband. Remember they have multiple children
39:25
Speaker 2: between them. How is this affecting them? Dad is hiding out,
39:32
Speaker 2: Mom is in jail. We wait as justice unfolds. Goodbye friend,