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Miami Vice · The Director's Chair Network

• 0:00 [Music] One of these mornings [Music] 0:06 it won't be very long. [Music] 0:11 They will look for me and I be gone. 0:22 I be gone. and I'll be gone. 0:32 I'll be gone. Good day and welcome to another episode 0:38 of the Direct Director's Chair Network. Boy, I I combined chair and director. I I could almost do it. Director 0:45 Director's Chair Network. Uh I'm your host, Ryan, and this is the season where we're covering the filmography of the 0:51 great Michael Man. And I have with me today a very special guest, co-host, Kevin. How you doing? 0:56 Hey everybody. Hey Ryan. Well, thanks for coming on. I really appreciate you uh joining uh this season 1:03 and joining the discussion. We of course know each other peripherilally through our podcasting journeys. Uh you've been 1:09 on uh Katie who's covering John Hughes on this network on her Retromate podcast and you've been with her and she's been 1:15 with you guys. But tell the listeners and the viewers where they can find you and what it is you do. Yeah. So, I do a 1:22 podcast called Six Degrees of Schwarzenegger, uh, with my co-host, Eric. Um, and we sort of go through like 1:30 the the 80s and 90s, the heyday of like the hard Rated action movie, your 1:37 Stallone, Schwarzenegger, Vanam, you know, Die Hards and Point Breaks and 1:42 things of that nature. And we we really pick through them with a fine tooth comb. We break them down to the smallest 1:49 possible little particles and uh you know we have fun. We laugh at the movies 1:54 when it's appropriate. Um but we also really appreciate them. I feel like a 1:59 lot of guys and girls who are in our age bracket all grew up watching the exact 2:04 same movies probably on basic cable television. And so you know you find that everyone's seen Over the Top or 2:12 everyone's watched Commando like a hundred times. So, uh, we take a nostalgic look back at some of those 2:18 movies from our childhood, uh, and re-examine them and and rediscover our love for them. And you've been on before 2:24 when we talked about Rocky 4. Yes. Um, was this awesome conversation. So, yeah, happy to to chat movies with you 2:31 anytime. Oh, well, great. Well, I'm probably going to use you again. Uh, I don't know if you've heard, but this Director's 2:37 Chair Network, it's kind of my new sort of project. I started it on my own. Uh, and it was just literally the Edward 2:44 Zwick filmography and it was originally called the Edwick or Zix sorry Zwix 2:49 Flicks and that was the original title of the podcast. What happened after I covered Zwick's films, I was like, man, 2:55 I had a fun time doing his filmography like I enjoyed talking about a variety of different films that a director will 3:01 do because that's the thing is I love movies. So, of course, I love Rocky Rambo action films, but I found myself 3:06 like I enjoy dramas and this or romantic comedies and all these other films. So directors they have this often they'll 3:12 do different genres as a director. So this is kind of a cheat code. I get to talk about directors that I enjoy finish 3:19 their filmography and then I'm in in addition to that I'm talking about genres of films that are different uh 3:24 than I'm usually talking about. So I continued with uh now Michael man and my next season will be Terrence Malik. So 3:30 I'll be covering Oh yeah. Big Terrence Malik guy. Yeah. Oh you I'm a movie guy. So, I love like I love 3:37 everything and I think that the the director's chair network's a great idea because as you say 3:42 one one filmmaker can have such a variety of different things. I have to ask are you going to 3:48 dive into Stallone's directorial effort? No. Okay. Stone or 3:55 No, for the record I've uh I've in a good way, but I've exhausted this the pretty much the stolen filmography. I've 4:01 covered the standalone films, the Rocky franchise, the Rambo franchise. So, I've definitely have made my mark for better 4:07 for worse on covering Stallone and his illustrious career. Uh, it'll probably never quite always be done because he's 4:13 always doing something, but at the end of the day, I'm sort of covering just directors that don't get their due or 4:20 maybe they don't get as much as they as the Christopher Nolans or the Quentyn Tarantino or the Steven Spielbergs. These are the the sort of Yeah, they're 4:27 just lesser known or the ones who like, oh, he directed that or she directed that as well. And that's kind of who I'm covering. So, Terrence, you say you're 4:34 Terrence Malai. I will then Yeah, I I'll call upon you and we'll figure that out, of course, off the air. We'll 4:39 figure out what what film you'd like to cover for that. Okay. Sure. Well, let's let's get into it. Thanks 4:44 for covering Miami Vice. So, when I sent you the list, I can't remember what films were available at the time, but 4:50 you I think you pounced on Miami Vice right away. Do you mind saying why? Uh, 4:55 so I have a a long history with the movie going back to when it was theatrically released, but uh over the 5:02 whatever it's been almost 20 years since it came out. And now I kind of look at Miami Vice is like the the overlooked 5:08 movie that Michael Man did. I think of it as like his his forgotten masterpiece, 5:14 honestly. Oh, wow. Nice. I um I feel like it's the closest thing he ever did to like making a sort of a spiritual sequel to 5:21 Heat. like something that was similar like very proficient like cops and robbers 5:27 like kind of or cops and criminals in a chess match sort of thing and I think 5:32 it's awesome movie. Um it's just awesome but a lot of people have not uh seen it or aren't familiar with it. I critically 5:39 it wasn't very wellreceived and I don't quite understand why because the more I watch it the more I I like it. 5:46 No, that's great that I love hearing that. And I meant to say when you're talking about your podcast, the six 5:51 degrees of source, which will be plugged in the show notes, so uh people look for that. That what I like what you guys do 5:56 cuz you mentioned heat. What I like what you guys do is you'll take the film that you're covering and it's basically a 6:01 Monday to Friday. You record it in five parts is sort of your formula, which I like. It's like Monday to Friday, you 6:07 cover and you take chunks within that fil like you divide the film up into five parts. You go in chronological 6:13 order. And I totally stole your idea when I covered heat. So when I did the heat when I did the heat film, so I I 6:20 invite you to to listen to that if you'd like. And to your listeners, if they're listening to this episode, check out the 6:25 heat coverage we did because I I took with five different co-hosts. I divided up the heat film into 34minute 6:32 parts of film. So me and the co-host, we only talked about whatever happened in that 35 minute of film. And when of 6:38 course their overall feelings of the film, but when it came to the, you know, the fine tooth comb discussion, it was just their their part of the film. And 6:45 so, uh, I really like how you guys do that with the films. I think five episodes is almost a great, uh, a great 6:50 number, but today is just one episode for Miami Vice. And I agree with you what you're saying, too, about that spiritual successor to the Heat. totally 6:57 agree with the aesthetics, the looks, and and I agree as well with the idea that we're seeing both the the criminals 7:03 or the bad guys side of the story as well as the of course the the good guys, the cops. And that's what Michael Man 7:09 did so well in Heat as we're seeing it here, the two worlds together. And not that you not that you're not rooting for 7:16 one or the other, per se. Of course, I think in this movie more than Heat, I think we are kind kind of rooting for 7:21 for the cops played by Colin Frell and Jamie Fox. I think we're rooting for them a little bit more cuz this movie is 7:26 a little bit more than he like there really are some bad characters that we're not that crazy about but we do see 7:33 that side of the world equally. So I I really appreciate that as a spiritual successor. I agree totally. Okay. My 7:38 Vice did come out like you said 19 years ago. I I I I honestly can't believe this. It's a crime action thriller. It's 7:45 directed, written, and produced by Michael Man. It's adapted from his iconic 1980s television series with the 7:51 same name which he co-produced and created. I have to ask, did you watch Miami Vice when you were younger? I 7:57 think we're probably about the same age. You must have watched it. It was a little bit ahead of my time, I 8:02 guess. Okay. I've literally I don't think I've ever seen an episode of the show. Oh, okay. 8:08 My appreciation for the for the movie. I don't know how much research you I don't know how deep you dug on Miami Vice. I 8:14 don't know if you found the Michael Man like commentary track. No, I don't do on it. No, that's not this kind of podcast. No, 8:21 those deep nothing wrong with that. It's just this kind of podcast doesn't really dive that deep. And I wish I had that 8:27 kind of time. I think part of it is if I had if this was like my full-time job, so to speak, or like I could just sit there 8:34 listen to commentary tracks of all these movies and so the deep dive. No, I watched the movie and of course I'm 8:40 aware of Miami Vice, the TV show. Don Johnson uh was the coolest thing on television and uh that was a mo sorry 8:47 movie a TV show that was sort of ahead of his time. I did watch it as a as a young lad. Even then it was still kind 8:53 of highbrow for me. So I was I don't think I was as engrossed with the story lines or I had a hard time understanding 8:59 everything as a young viewer. But it just ironically might be what this film a lot of the critics say about this 9:05 film. I think the Mayan advice TV show as a young person it was really cool to watch and I didn't really know what was 9:11 going on and I think some of the criticism this film faced which is an odd criticism a lot of people were 9:16 saying maybe narratively it's not the greatest film in the world but it's really cool to watch and maybe that's 9:22 what man was going for. Well, so on on the commentary track that I mentioned, he sort of talked about how making a 9:30 movie of Miami Vice was like to him a double-edged sword because on one hand, people were familiar with the brand name 9:36 and everything like that, but on the other hand, you could ask 10 different people what they thought about Miami Vice, and they might have 10 different 9:42 opinions and 10 different things that of what they liked about it. Yeah. The music. Some people would like the music and some people would like the 9:48 the crazy colors and the pastels and the flamingos and some people would like the story lines and some people would like 9:54 the fashion. And so he had said he wasn't sure how quite to approach it 10:00 cuz you know do I lean into the nostalgia of the series or do I try to make something completely 10:06 its own thing? and he went the later way and made a like a really dark kind of 10:12 brooding thing that I think a lot of people didn't know how to respond to. 10:18 I think that's totally both its blessing and curse. I I thought to myself as as I 10:24 was watching this, hm, I wonder how this film would have been received had the TV show never existed. 10:30 Yeah. Yeah. Like let's just pretend for whatever reason Miami Vice never existed. We 10:35 never knew Don Johnson and Tubs or whatever. We never saw them. And Michael Man still directs us. Goes, "Oh, this is 10:41 a TV idea that I had kind of like what he was is, you know, he was a failed TV pilot." And but let's pretend this was 10:47 never even filmed because I had another TV pilot that I wanted to do, but I never saw it to fruition. So, here's the movie version of it that I don't know if 10:54 the box office would more or less because I think a lot of people saw it because of their fandom of My Vice TV show, but I suspect there would be 11:01 nothing to compare it to and people would have thought, "Oh, this is kind of cool." Yeah, I think Yeah, I think people would 11:07 have probably walked away saying it's not as good as heat, right? But compared to it was a nice replace. 11:14 It was a nice substitute for something Heatlike in my life, you know. But yeah, 11:19 I remember so I remember when the movie was coming out, I was super hyped about it cuz I was a big Michael Man fan. I was 11:26 very very excited and like looking forward to the release date and I went to go see it in the theaters and it it came out at a similar time 11:34 where there was like a lot of old TV series that were getting made into movies but like Star and Hutch these movies 11:40 that were being done more of like in a comic sort of way like leaning into the comedy of it 11:47 and I think I thought that Miami Vice was going to be more of like a light-hearted 11:52 comedy sort of thing because Jamie Fox was kind of still a comedy guy at that point in his career before he got really 11:59 into the serious acting. And I think I came away very confused about what I had seen and not really a fan after my first 12:06 time seeing it. And then on repeated viewings at home, I really came to 12:11 appreciate it that it is its own thing and that it's a really like well-made 12:16 crime thriller. What is your overall fandom of Michael Man and when did you first get into him and start to recognize him as a director 12:23 and because you said, "Hey, I was a Michael man fan. I saw the film. So, what what brought you to his uh or his 12:28 his films to your fandom? I feel like I'm sure the first Michael man movie that I probably saw was Last 12:35 of the Moheakans, of course. Yeah. Yeah. Um and then probably Heat and then I think sometime after that I 12:42 put two and two together that the same guy made both of these movies, right? Because they're very those are very 12:47 different. Yeah. He's more like the prototype Michael Man movie and Last of Moheakans 12:52 is very not Michael Mannike. Um, but then I I'm sure I saw I watched 12:58 uh, you know, I was a Hannibal Lectar guy, so I know I watched Manhunter. Yeah. And I was like, well, that's interesting 13:04 because that that went with the Miami Vice TV route with like a lot of neons and stuff like that. Um, 13:10 but yeah, stuff like the Insider amazing. Collateral is amazing. I mean, 13:16 the guy's just got a very uh unique storytelling 13:21 uh way about him. Yeah. Doesn't try to dumb it down for the viewers. He like tells It's Yeah, you don't get a 13:28 lot of movies that are made strictly for adults. And I think probably another downfall of Miami Vice was I'm sure it 13:35 was one that a lot of like you know it it has appeal to a younger audience, but then if you if I was a 15year-old 13:42 going to see Miami Vice, I'm sure I would have like really hated it. When I can I'll have my kids watch these 13:49 films. They're they're film nerds like their old man. And of course the youngest are 11-year-old twins and then 13:56 my next one is a 13-year-old boy. Then I have older older kids. But uh I always enjoy watching movies with the with the 14:02 young ones and they're they're big on to the adult movies. Like they're like me when I was 11. I I can't be a hypocritical parent. I So I can't be I 14:08 when I was 11 I was watching Look, I was watching Halloween when I was eight, right? Like there's no I'm I'm sort of 14:14 like I admit I I survived my childhood watching movies. I I let my kids watch 14:19 uh certain movies with me with parental guidance. That's why it's for parental guidance. So it depends on the film. And I talked them through some stuff. But so 14:26 we watched Collaterals. We did that together. We watched Collateral and they loved it. Of course, my my one 14:32 11-year-old son is a huge Tom Cruz fan. He's legit. He just loves everything. Yeah. He loves Tom Cruz so much. So, 14:38 when it came time to watch Miami Vice, I was like, "Oh, I should say I hadn't seen this film before." Yeah. For 14:44 whatever reason, this film, it came out, went to theaters, went on DVD, and I 14:50 just never And I'm a huge Michael Man fan, and I like Miami Vice. Uh the only 14:55 thing I can think of is maybe my life at the time in ' 06 07 well I kind of know what I was going through in my life. So 15:00 I always say there's certain things my there's films that kind of happened between 06 and 8 my life was such uh 15:07 with my first marriage where I probably wasn't thinking too much certain so which is fine just normal things that 15:13 can happen in people's life. So I I didn't see movies the way I I do now and did before. And this movie fell through 15:19 the cracks and as you know when time kind of goes on like yeah a year goes by, 5 years go by, 10 years 15:24 go by and like I just never saw it. So I saw it for the first time just this week. I watched it first by myself to 15:31 see if my kids would enjoy because I didn't know because I always preview films first if I'm not too sure. And I 15:36 agree with basically that's my long way of saying they would have been bored. Yeah. They they like I wasn't bored, but 15:44 I recognized the young version of myself watching My In Vice, the TV show. They would have been bored of this movie the 15:50 same way that even though I thought My Vice was a cool show, it wasn't fun and corny like the A Team was, if that makes 15:56 sense, right? No, it wasn't Magnum PI. I I I remember, you know, obviously, like I 16:01 just said, my thoughts when it was brand new and what my expectations were, but I think if you see it 20 years later, you 16:07 probably have no expectations. So, I had zero expectations. Coming in with a completely blank slate 16:13 is maybe the best way to watch it. I I I knew periphilally that it was mixed. I understood enough to know it 16:20 wasn't a box office phenomenon, that it didn't warrant any sequels, that it didn't didn't get the the accolades at 16:27 Heat and the Insider or whatever got. So, I knew there was some troubled waters. As people should know, it did 16:32 star Colin Frell as James Sunny Crockett and Jamie Fox as Ricardo Rico Tubs. The film follows Miami date police 16:39 detectives as they go undercover to dismantle sophisticated drug trafficking ring had a budget of 135 to about 150 16:45 million. It grossed only 164 million worldwide. So it did not recoup its losses. Is now the I think the insider 16:51 didn't recoup its losses either unfortunately. That's tough. Yeah, it is tough. And Collateral did 16:57 though, of course. Collateral did well because of Tom Cruz of course and it's a fun film. How was the film? 17:02 That would have been accessible to to anyone. It was more dense movie than the 17:08 Insider or Heat or Miami Vice. Uh it says here that uh it did have a 17:14 polarized reception of course we talked about at the time that it was released, but it has cultivated a cult following 17:21 since then in the last 1920 years. It and I think you're part of that passionate fan base, which I loved 17:27 hearing. I love that you are. Okay, so let's talk about some of the cast. I I 17:32 Michael Man I'm at the point now with Michael Man films. I'm not surprised about the cast that he draws. It's It shouldn't be surprising the names and he 17:38 has a lot of repeat people that come for multiple films. Before we talk about the 17:43 two main leads, of course, we'll talk about them last. Are there any names that kind of stuck out to you uh that 17:49 you recognize from other films? Well, I'm a I'm a movie head like you are, so this movie the cast was deep, 17:56 right? There was a lot of familiar faces. Yeah. The couple of actors that I thought were really like standout amazing 18:02 performances, John Ruiz as Jose like the 18:07 I guess he wasn't the main he wasn't the big bad guy, but he was the main antagonist. Right. The big bad guy we didn't get to see 18:13 him. He didn't probably have more than five minutes of screen time. Right. Right. But Jose, I thought was an awesome like 18:19 villain character. And John and John uh is it John Ortiz or Ruiz? I think it's Ruiz. 18:26 Uh, John or John John or Ortiz. It is John Ortiz. Okay. 18:32 Yes. Well, then you can chop my Oh, no. My having it right. No, I had it 18:37 right the first time. I just Yeah. Second guessing myself. But I thought I thought he's just 18:43 he's an awesome actor in general. Like Americanb born. He, you know, he's a New York guy. So, this is a fake accent he 18:49 was putting on. But man, what a what a creepy, chilling, sort of nonchalantly 18:55 evil villain he was. I loved his character. So when you look in the movie, 19:05 never cuz how you dropped lows I don't like. So maybe this don't work. 19:10 Then it don't work. Red light, green light. Jose, 19:15 they also call me coil loco. That means crazy pig 19:22 cuz I run security and counter intel. I get people to tell me what they don't ever want to say. 19:29 And I have eyes everywhere. That part of what I do, you never want 19:35 to find out about. Other people negotiate money and go. No. 19:42 Go. Yes. No. Maybe. So, 19:48 not me. So, what the hell are we talking to you for? I had to lay my eyes on you. 19:54 Why is that? To see if you go meet the man. Yeah, he was great. I agree. Did a great 20:00 job playing Joseé Euro. I say Euro or something like that. Yeah, he did a great job. Again, he's one of those 20:06 actors where he can walk through Walmart, no one's going to stop him. It's it's a it's it's a it's a great way 20:12 to be when you could have a job in Hollywood, but you could still go to Disneyland with your family. That's you're a chameleon. 20:18 Yeah. He was um he was Bradley Cooper's best friend in Silver Linings Playbook. Oh, I still haven't seen that movie. 20:24 You haven't seen that's an excellent movie. Yeah. Check that one out. Yeah, I do. And David O. Russell is honestly a director that I would love to 20:29 cover because again on the Come on. Three Kings. Are you a Three Kings? I love Three Kings. I love his movies. 20:35 It's funny. Again, some of these directors that I love, he just some films just slip through the the vortex 20:41 and then time goes on. Did you recognize John Hawk? He was the individual at the beginning the film. Okay. 20:46 John fans as well. Yeah. This was early in his career though, I take it a little bit. No, this was after 20:52 Deadwood, wasn't it, though? Right. I think he was uh simultaneously like the movie came out, I think, while 20:59 Deadwood was still on the air. Deadwood was 04 to06 and this came out in 06. So, yeah, I guess it was Yeah. during the same time as Deadwood, who 21:05 was in this film. Deadwood, boy, that series was too shortlived. I don't know why it didn't. Yeah, it's my one of my top two or three 21:12 like TV shows. Incredible. Writing, the best acting. Yeah, I freaking love that show. So, John 21:18 Hawks played that uh guy at the beginning who What' you do? 21:24 I fronted their undercover team to these guys like usual. You know, feds, Russian speakers. I was the middleman. 21:32 What? 15%. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. To set up the meat, they grabbed Leonetta. 21:39 Took Leonetta. I gave him up, man. 21:46 Gave up the fence. Everything. Everything. I knew. Rico, I got to go 21:53 home. How do they get on to you? How the hell do I know? They knew one rush was FBI from the get-go. So 22:01 they knew I knew. Rico, I got to go. Lazo. Lonzo. 22:07 Now, when he was uh saying that he screwed up, that they he gave away this the information that caused a lot of 22:13 this drama at the beginning of the film. When they were on the bridge talking to uh Sunny and Tubs, when he was on the 22:19 bridge, his character, I thought he was going to jump off the bridge. Mhm. I I thought for sure he's going to 22:25 jump off the because he but he I I kind of wish he jumped off the bridge because I thought standing in front of the rig 22:31 has been done so many times because that could be Oh yeah. Every time you see someone unalivvening 22:36 themselves in a TV show or movie often it's more times than not it's it's a vehicle. The the offscreen vehicle comes 22:42 on screen and makes you into spaghetti. I I thought for sure he was going to jump off the bridge. Anyways, he didn't 22:48 but it tricked me. I guess that was a very That was a memorable scene though, wasn't it? He was he was 22:54 great in it. Super like chaotic and and the information is flying at you and 23:00 it's hard to even track, you know, what he's trying to tell them or what's what exactly is 23:06 going on. Yeah, it's a little bit of a convoluted plot and I will admit this is one of the 23:11 negatives. I don't mind bring up some of the negatives. So, the nar the narrator or the narration or the story line uh 23:18 was a little it was a combination of rushed and dumbed down at the same time, 23:23 but then too smart for its own good. It's hard to explain. That's fair. That's fair. It felt like it maybe should have been 23:29 again Michael Man, I think he wants to be an HBO 8 episode director. That's his 23:35 problem. He he does these great stylized looking films and stories and 23:41 characters and shots and he's so good at making everything look so cool, but I sometimes feel like he wishes he had 23:48 more time. Yeah, I could see that. Did you you probably haven't gotten to it. I don't know if you're going chronologically, 23:53 but you may not have Ferrari yet. It was supposed to be a miniseries and Oh, see there you go. I 23:58 it got turned into I think they sort of decided, no, we don't want to do the whole thing, so let's turn it into a 24:03 movie. you'll do all that research when you get to that one. But, um, long format I think suits him well, 24:09 you know, and that's the thing that I think on repeated viewings of the movie when you really start to understand all the story because it's hard to follow 24:16 the first time through. It is a little bit Heat was a little bit like that too, though. There's so much story there. 24:22 Yes. When you you can't process it all the first time you watch it. I love that film. It's not a perfect 24:27 film, and part of it not perfection is there's so much story going on. It would have benefited from an eight-part series 24:33 on on HBO. That's why Collateral might have been perfect because it was just the right 24:40 amount of story for a movie. Yeah, that one didn't need to be longer. That's the funny thing. He didn't write 24:45 that one. Written by the guy who brought you a G.I. Joe Rise of Cobra. Oh boy. 24:52 So, little bit of trivia there for for you. So, yeah, he he did that film as well. Okay. So, yeah, John Hawk did a 24:58 great job. some other names that stuck out. There was, now this is me showing that I don't know Miami Vice very well. 25:04 I know Sunny Crockett and Rico Tubs, that's about it. Uh, they drove Fancy Cars and Girls in bikinis and there's 25:10 always cocaine and all that good stuff. But these other actors and actresses, they actually covered or they characters 25:17 from the TV show. So, if you were a Miami Vice Yeah. If you were a Miami Vice fan, like you're like the way I'm a 25:23 Star Trek fan, for example, like you give me, you give me a Star Trek movie, I can tell you that's Spock, that's Bones, that's, you know, I can tell you 25:29 all these characters. So, if you're a Miami Vice fan, you had your detective Gina Calibris, you had your detective 25:35 Stan Switite, you had your detective Larry Zto, and the Lieutenant Martin Castillo. So, these are all characters, 25:41 okay? That was the crew. Those are the side characters that played the cops in My Vice were played by Justin Thorough, 25:48 Dominic Lombardozi, Elizabeth Rodriguez, Syrian Hines, and uh Barry Shabbaka 25:55 Hemley. Syrian Hines, he played the agent John Fujimia. Was he from the TV show? 26:01 No, his wasn't. Sorry. His was. Okay. Okay. I don't know anything about the show, so you could have definitely told me. I 26:07 would have been like, "Oh, sure." Yeah. I I don't want the Miami Vice fans sending me an email. Actually, no. I get 26:14 one email. That'd be great. Even if you hate the show, that'd be great. No, you don't want to piss off the Miami Vice community. 26:20 That's right. They're brutal. Their fan base is brutal. They're worse than Star Wars fans. So, Syrian Hines, I recognize 26:26 him, of course, from another short-lived great HBO show, Rome. Of course, Caesar. 26:31 Yes, he was great in that and great. He's just another guy who he's going to if he's in a show or a movie, whatever, 26:37 you know, he's going to deliver like a killer performance. 26:42 They discovered my guys were undercover and we don't know how. 26:48 This was an inter agency task force, DEA, ATF, US Customs. The leak could 26:54 have come from any one unit. I got to assume my operational security is compromised. 27:00 He's always going to deliver the goods. Yeah. And he did a great job. Robin, boy, it made me think. I watched this, I was like, I got to watch Deadwood again and 27:06 I got to watch Rome again. That's what this movie did for me. It's like I got to watch those TV shows again. Okay, 27:12 then we had the lovely uh Elizabeth Rodriguez playing Detective Gina Calibris and she had a face like I'm 27:18 like, "Oh, I've seen this face before. I know her." And I then I look at her filmography and I'm like, "Where did I 27:24 know her from?" Where did you know her from anything without looking her up? No. Okay. No, but she was she was beautiful and 27:30 Yeah, she was like a badass. Oh, that's where she's from. I just see it now. Dy, 27:35 of course, that's the show. Orange is the New Black. Yes, she was. She was the main role in 27:41 that. One of the older like Latina. Yes, that's coming back. I see. I think I had seen that she was 27:47 in Logan, but I don't remember who she would have been. The Wolverine, the R. Oh, really? She was in that. What was 27:52 she doing in that one? I think she she might have The only one I can think she might have been was like the mother character to the young girl 27:58 who sort of handed the girl off to Logan. Yeah, orange is the new black. That's where Okay, now it's all coming 28:04 back to me. Okay, I can picture it now that you say that. Yeah, but she was great in this, wasn't she? Yeah, she was great. The scene she had the um the shootout 28:11 like in the the standoff in the trailer park. Yeah, remember when she was sort of lecturing the the white supremacist dude and then 28:16 just put the bullet through his brain. Show me. Go ahead. 28:22 [ __ ] it. We can all go ask. That's not what happens. What will happen is what will happen is I will put 28:29 a round at 2700 ft per second into the medulla at the base of your brain and you will be dead from the neck down 28:36 before your body knows it. Your finger won't even twitch. Only you get dead. So 28:41 tell me sport, do you believe that? Hey, 28:46 I love it. That was good stuff. Yeah. Then we had just Justin Throw. 28:53 Do I Why do I He's one of these guys like is he an actor? Who is he? I feel like I hear his name all the time, but I 29:00 don't know if I've ever really He was in I think he was in a long-term relationship with Jennifer Aniston. 29:06 That's That's how I know him. I feel like I feel like he had an HBO show as well, though, but I can't remember the name of it. I 29:11 didn't watch it. It was like The Leftovers is what I'm seeing. And apparently, it's a very good show. 29:16 Apparently, he was a co- he might have co-written Zoolander with Ben Stiller. like he's he's all over the place the stuff that 29:23 he does. Or no, he might have he might have co-written Tropic Thunder with Ben. 29:28 Um but he's like he's a man of many talents, I guess. Well, he got dude. He didn't do a lot in 29:35 this movie. He didn't do a lot. No, he didn't do a lot. No, he got to bed Jennifer. So, I mean, he can that could literally be on his tombstone. 29:42 That's like that's not that's imagine you live you're born. You you have a 29:48 childhood. You have a teenage hood, then you're a young adult, then you're you're dating Jennifer Anderson. That's not a 29:54 bad go. And then on top of that, you get to work in movies every now and then. So anyway, yeah. So Justin had a very small role in this, but uh good for him. Okay. 30:02 Uh let's get up to um the main cast. Naomi Harris. I didn't recognize her. She played Trudeau Joplin, but I don't 30:08 Oh, no. She was um Money Penny in the Daniel Craig Bond movies. Oh, right. That's right. 30:15 She was. And she was the the female lead in 28 Days Later like way back when. Yeah. I 30:21 No, 28 Days Later the original. Okay. From way back when. She was She's very British though, so she's like amazing in 30:28 this movie that she's like killing this New Yorker accent. She was the other standout performance in the movie for 30:34 me. It was she was great. She did a great job. Her and Jose were just like destroying worlds in their scenes. They were 30:40 awesome. Yes. So, she plays Detective Trudy Joplin and the girlfriend to Jamie Fox's 30:46 character. I do have a criticism though about her one scene. So, that she gets kidnapped, of course. Kind of. You're a 30:52 classic bad guys got the girl. We got distress. Damsel distress. Yes. Classic. Uh 30:58 Michael Man, love him or hate him. He He writes movies for men. He's not giving 31:03 you a romantic comedy. Uh he's not giving you a love story. He writes movies for men. I could be wrong. The 31:09 closest he got was last Moheakans, but still the men saved the day. It was 31:15 always the damsel distress, right? It was never, you know, not that he writes weak women. I'm not saying that at all, 31:21 but he definitely writes men driven films where the men are the action sort 31:27 of the the the men are men and then the women are manly. That's 31:34 that's fair. I I mean that with all due respect, right? But that being said, her she gets 31:40 uh I will give some credit. She gets saved and then she gets blown up almost 31:46 when they s like the guy played by John Ortiz blows up the trailer. Great great 31:52 rescue sequence all around. And she doesn't die overall, but 31:57 I thought that's I guess that was sort of the weakest part and the weakest part meaning like why they didn't clear the 32:04 area. She's like hanging around. She's always Yeah. Okay. Yeah. 32:10 To be fair, it was it was Jamie Fox's character. It was It was Tubs who was telling her like, "Stay in here until it 32:17 until it's cleared outside." But I don't know why you would possibly ask her to stay in there when you know there's a 32:22 bomb in the You know there's a bomb in the Yes. They literally took off. She had a 32:28 uh a sawlike device around her neck. you know, for the film franchise saw. She 32:34 has this trap bomb booby trap around her neck. They take it off and you're right, there's still a live C4 bomb in this 32:42 little meth lab trailer and they're like, "Okay, just stay here. Stay in 32:48 this trailer with dead bodies and the bomb that was around your neck and we're going to make sure outside is safe." It 32:54 did not. And she kind of saunters to the door in a haze because she's been kidnapped and beaten and tortured. Why 33:00 they didn't take her out? let her sit down with some water and like it it just to have the trailer blow up and it was a 33:07 really bad kind of explosion. I will say the explosion wasn't very good. The effect Yeah, the effect was a little bad there. 33:12 It was a little bit bad. They should have done a conventional explosion. I don't know why they didn't. And but then then they didn't kill her. So what was 33:19 the po That's what I mean. So all in all, she didn't die anyway. So why do 33:24 that? What was your reasoning for that? Can't honestly I can't think of a of a good reason. There's no reason they 33:30 would have asked her to stay behind in the trailer. Like, if it's safe enough for everyone else to walk out, then it's safe enough for her to walk out, too, 33:37 right? Yeah. Yeah, I So, I don't know why they would have asked her to stay behind. It didn't make any sense. And then, yeah, you're right. 33:43 It kind of doesn't serve much of a purpose unless they just sort of wanted to have to show the dangers of the job 33:49 like that people do get hurt. I don't know. That's me sort of trying to explain it away. Well, speaking of 33:55 people getting hurt, at the beginning of the film, there was that great sequence where from John Hawk's character, Alonzo 34:01 Stevens, he's the guy that Yeah. betrayed the undercover FBI agents or whatever it was that Yeah. he gave intel that exposed their 34:08 undercoverness. And there's a great assassination shot where the FBI agents 34:13 are in the car. They're about to drive away, but they get sniped through with a heavy machinery type. 34:19 Yeah. A 50 caliber like sniper rifle. Yeah. It's like and the the shot inside 34:24 the was so cool. They showed them being like blown to smitherreens inside the 34:30 vehicle. The effect the practical effect of that shot was amazing. The dude's like arm came off. 34:37 Yeah. You got hit with your arm and like it just which I think is fairly realistic for getting home like that. I mean, do 34:44 you remember the sniper sequence in uh Hurt Locker when they were like having the standoff, 34:49 right? It's been a while. I think that's what he was shooting. Something similar to that with just these enormous like 34:54 rounds of ammunition or whatever. But um yeah, that was a great sequence when that happened at the beginning. I was 35:00 like, "Okay, okay, we got some cuz now I'm thinking this is not this is not your mother's TV show." 35:06 That was insane that damage that that gun was doing. I'll give you some 35:12 information from the director's commentary. He said they sort of that was like an effect shot that was assembled together from 35:18 one level was like they shot up a real car with that real gun. Okay. And then another level was yeah like 35:25 sort of almost like mannequin like a mannequins being sort of blown to bits or whatever that they 35:30 you know assembled in or whatever. And I can't even remember what the third level was to the effect shot buddy. But it was 35:37 pretty seamless wasn't it? compared to like the trailer exploding which did look kind of bad. 35:42 Yeah. Yeah. We had that great aesthetic kill shot in the car and then we have 35:48 this really like I think they could have done a better explosion on the 80s TV show. I don't know. 35:53 A little miniature a little model trailer blowing up. Yeah. With fake flame over behind the 36:00 girl being blown. Yeah. That's funny how they had the two in the same film. the fact that you listen to the com. That's fact. I I'm glad. In fact, there have 36:07 been a few releases of this film. Let me go down to that. I have it written down here and you let me know which of the whole media you own. So, the film was 36:13 released on DVD December 12th, 2006. It including a 140minute director's cut 36:19 with additional scenes such as the new opening go fast race sequence and extended character moments. The version I own is the director's cut. 36:26 So, I don't think I've seen the theatrical version since I saw it in the theater. Okay. So, the Blu-ray that was released 36:31 in '08 is the unrated director's edition. I think it's that unrated director's edition. Yeah, it's it's like seven 36:37 minutes longer or something like that. Okay. And now, apparently this month, as we're recording this right now, near the 36:43 end of August 2025, this will come out maybe in September 2025. But in August of 2025, apparently there's a 4K ultra 36:50 high depth Blu-ray that that's coming out. It was announced, actually, it was just announced. So, it's coming up. So, I think I'm 36:57 going to pick up the uh 4K uh for his film. And it was a it might have might have 37:02 done a bad job at the box office, but it grossed nearly 40 million in DVD sales at the time of its release in 07. So, 07 37:09 had another 40 million in DVD release. They got my 10 bucks or whatever. Well, that's what I mean. Maybe that's 37:14 the that cult following continued. It'll probably grow on you if you if you choose to watch it again. 37:21 Yeah, I'm going to watch it again. I I'm going to buy the 4K for sure. Did you know that the another Miami Vice film 37:27 has been announced? No. Is it Michael Man's involvement? 37:33 I don't know. It It must be. He's the creator co-producer of the TV. He must have the license, right? Like I I can't 37:38 imagine. Or does he not? Maybe does the network have the license? No, I feel like he would. I feel like he 37:43 probably would, but I don't uh I could see them doing one though that he might get a producer credit, but he doesn't 37:49 actually have a creative input, you know, and they'll end up doing it with like Channing Tatum and and uh some 37:55 other dude and make it like that slapstick comedy version. Well, I don't think so. And I when I tell you the name first, I'm going to 38:01 tell you the name of the director and then I've got some good hopes for this. I think h by saying this I when I say 38:08 the name of the director, you tell me if you know the name of the director, you'll definitely know the films he's done. He's one of those guys. And again, 38:14 he's another director that I wouldn't mind adding to our director's chair network because he hasn't done a lot of 38:19 films, but he's a he's one of these guys who seems to be making good films lately. Have you ever heard of Joseph 38:24 Kasinski? Oh, yeah. See, F1 Top Gun Maverick. Yeah. Yes. So, this guy can make a film that's 38:32 very popular. So he seems to have the ability to make a film that is smart and 38:41 good to look at and is also a audience pleaser. F1 apparently very high rated 38:46 very in fact my 13-year-old son and my 18-year-old son saw F1 in the theaters and I like I like you saw I asked my 38:53 13-year-old you saw F1 because I'm thinking did you like it? He goes I loved it. So a 13-year-old likes a 38:59 racing car movie. Yeah, it was good. Did you see? No, I was excellent. 39:04 It's excellent. It's just it's really really fun to watch. Okay, so this dude who made Maverick, 39:09 which of course, you know, did what it did in the box office, and it's incredible film. I don't even like Top Gun, the film, 39:16 the original take. I don't like it. I think it's I think it's kind of garbage. I I grew up on it for sure, so I have 39:22 nostalgia for it, but I also do think it's I mean, I'm I like Tony Scott as well. I like Tony Scott, too. I love Tony, but 39:28 but Maverick is objectively like maybe arguably a better movie. I don't know. It's way better. That's what I mean. 39:34 It's way better to watch. Like the effects I just can't believe they were allowed to make that movie. 39:39 That's what I find when I'm watching it. I'm like, how did they get someone to let them put real actors in F-18s? 39:46 That's awesome. That's insane to me. Yeah. So, this guy is doing the Miami Vice 39:51 films. Okay. Bring it on. Exactly. Bring it on. And so I think what he's going to do is the things that 39:58 Michael Man missed on. And it's not because Michael Man's a bad director or I think I think the criticisms that I 40:06 have with this film are the same ones that Colin Frell has for this film is that Colin wishes and I do too that it 40:12 was a little bit more levity to the film. That's what makes Top Gone Maverick so good. for example, I haven't 40:18 seen F1, but I suspect it probably happens at F1 where you can have some serious dramatic moments where the where 40:23 the uh the stakes are on the line. Absolutely. But in Top Gun Maverick, you know, you have both pilots crashing on 40:30 that country and they're both kind of mad at each other saying, "You're I told you, but it's kind of comedic even 40:35 though they're in a very tense situation and but it's not slapstick. It's not silly, but there's 40:42 that levity." And that's my biggest criticism about my advice. the movie is it it just it never 40:50 let up. It was like holy like everything's depressing. Why is it so everything felt 40:56 very dark and dreary and you guys are living in Miami? You're cool as f. You 41:02 look awesome. You're you got these fast, bold, beautiful woman. There wasn't one like 41:08 You're right. There wasn't a laugh. I don't know if there was like a laugh in the whole movie. There might there there 41:14 might have been um there might have been when they were talking to that one like cooperating like informant guy who set 41:20 them up with the Colombians, the one who they sort of pressured into doing it where he was up in his condo and he's 41:26 like why is this happening to me? Like might the one laugh in the whole movie. But you're right. 41:31 That might have been a little bit of a light lighter moment. That's when the whole gang from the TV show was in that 41:36 apartment. So that was kind of pressuring that strong arming that guy. He's like another very British actor who's like Shakespeareian and all this 41:43 stuff, but playing like sort of this weird cinjun guy or something like that. But um definitely like a complaint about 41:49 the movie that's valid is I think if Michael man did anything, he's maybe steered too hard away from trying to 41:55 make the movie light and and fun and just went as dark as possible. 42:01 And I get that's what my See, this is the thing. So to be fair to Michael, 42:06 that's the TV show. That's what set it apart. even the 80s. So even though it had this stuff, it wasn't the A team, 42:13 right? It wasn't uh these other it was it was for adults. This was your this was your mom and dad's cop show. This 42:20 was as gritty as it could get. We we're dealing with hookers, cocaine. These are kind of R-rated topics done on NBC or 42:28 whatever the channel was. And yeah, so this was as R-rated as TV could be before uh NYPD 42:35 Blue, right? This was this was NYPD Blue before Blue. and it pushed the 42:40 boundaries back then. So, I get it. So, now he's like, "Hey, I've got a I've got a film now, R-rated. The assassination 42:46 scene at the beginning set the tone. We get it." So, I I understand that, but should I go back and watch the show or 42:53 was it will it have aged poorly? You know what's funny? I haven't gone back to I've seen many scenes from 42:58 YouTube, of course. I think Don Johnson is one of the coolest guys ever to come out of that uh out of that decade. He 43:06 really just made wearing pink cool, right? You know what I mean? Like, so we're gonna get to, of course, Colin 43:13 and Jamie's, of course, portrayal of those characters. I do have some stuff to say, but before we do, let's get to 43:18 Gong Lee, who played Isabella. Um, okay. Okay. So, what are your thoughts on Gong 43:23 Lee? She's, I think, a a weak link in the cast. I I mean, I haven't seen any of 43:30 her other work. I know she's a Chinese actress. She does not speak English. She does not understand English. 43:37 What do you want to do? I like the diminished risk. I like 43:42 businessmen who are competent because you can predict the behavior. 43:47 On the other hand, if what you wish is El Pommo, the lad, then do that. After 43:54 the load is received, we will close the race forever. So all of her lines, she learned them. 44:00 someone would tell her what they meant and she would learn just the phonetic 44:06 way to deliver the lines. She knew someone told her what they meant, but she wouldn't like know which word to 44:11 emphasize things like that, you know, which but it raises the question, why did you cast her then? 44:17 You just took the words out of my mouth because I didn't I didn't know that piece of uh intel you just gave me there. So, that was going to be my next 44:23 question. Why bother? I hate to say no. And no offense. Hey, look. I'm not starring in a Chinese film any day soon. 44:30 So, it it goes both ways. Like, you're not hiring me or else I'm going to be doing the same thing. They'll say, 44:35 "Okay, Ryan, right now you're saying, "Hi, how are you doing?" I'm not going to do a Chinese, but I'm saying so now 44:42 don't do it, right? But what I'm But essentially, that's what she did. That's what I mean. It's like you would now 44:48 have to say it this way, Ryan. Right. That's what she did. That blows my mind. I can't I don't understand the logic to 44:54 casting her unless she was a big star overseas or something and it was gonna help with maybe maybe it helps with 45:00 international box office but she is that's just you look at her filmography she's done tons of Chinese 45:06 films and uh I just don't know why I just don't know why you would cast her unless I don't know what was happening behind the 45:12 scenes that they were like this is the best choice but that's part of the problem. You're right but un it's not her fault because 45:18 it's not her native tongue she did better than I could do. Yeah, but how do you enunciate or emote when 45:24 you're when you're just almost spending half the time like making sure you get the words right? That's what we said about Bridget 45:30 Neielsson in she's Danish trying to speak English in a Russian accent. It's 45:36 like if you told me to try to to speak Chinese in an Australian accent, I'd be 45:41 like lost. I don't know why they Yeah, it's a lot to ask of any actor. I think 45:47 like again this is no offense to because it in the movie the it doesn't say like 45:54 hi I'm I'm a I'm the Chinese representative of the drug trade or did 45:59 I miss that? No, I don't think she's just she was supposed to actually have been like born and raised in Cuba but of from Chinese 46:07 from Chinese like her mother was Chinese which apparently there is a large Chinese population in Cuba. 46:13 Sure. Sure. Okay. Makes sense. Maybe if it was like communism, you know, right? Like trying to spread communism and all 46:19 that. Of course, she plays the moment uh Sunny, played by Colin, sees this woman, 46:25 we know, okay, I have to bang her before the end of the film. So, uh, mission accomplished. Um, they fall in love and 46:33 she finds out who he is. She punches him a few times, but they still share a moment at the end of the film. And 46:39 name Frank is going to come in a boat. He will run you into Kyiosaur Veno and from there you can find your way to Vana 46:47 and nobody will follow you, including me. 46:55 Remember I said time is luck. 47:01 Yeah, luck running out. [Music] 47:09 There you go. There's Michael Man's love story. What do you think? Yeah, they didn't develop that one very 47:16 well. I'll tell you one scene I did like between the two of them though was Yeah, please. Yeah, 47:21 it was probably like twothirds of the way through the movie maybe when Colin Frell was trying to or when Sunny was 47:29 trying to tell her like, you know, do you have a plan? Do you have like an exit strategy? You should get out of 47:34 this. It's this you got assets somewhere. 47:41 Insurance. Why? 47:47 Things go wrong, the odds catch up. 47:57 Probability is like gravity. 48:03 You cannot negotiate with gravity. [Music] 48:09 One day, one day you should just cash out, you 48:14 know. Just cash out and get out. Yeah. 48:20 Yeah. As far and as fast as you can. Would you fund me? Yes, I would. I feel like that's the 48:27 closest he could come to revealing who he telling her that he's a cop and she should get out now, you know, because he 48:34 couldn't actually say that. But I feel like he was trying to doing as much as he could to try to tell her to get out 48:40 of danger, you know, before this goes bad soon. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, 48:47 and it's just because I saw for the first time, and I know that Sunny and Tubs, 48:52 did they refer to themselves as Sunny and Tubs while they were undercover? Did I get like was I like 48:58 they kept their first names and they had new last names? That's what threw me off. He became He became Sunny Bernett and I 49:05 can't remember what Ricardo what tub what Rico's la new last name was. 49:10 Okay. kept their first names and they So, it probably helps to not accidentally call somebody by the wrong 49:17 name. Maybe that's their under See, maybe that's the TV show. Maybe that's their undercover names. 49:24 It says even the credits is Detective James Crockett. It's Detective Ricardo Tub. 49:30 So, maybe they go by Sunny and Rico when they're undercover. That's just Well, Sunny definitely had a different 49:36 undercover last name. He was Sunny Bernett. No, but what I mean is the Sunny part. the Sunny where they were calling each 49:42 other Sunny because he mentions himself that all the time though, didn't and I was like didn't he blow isn't he blowing his cover if I say like that's 49:50 his name in the show. Why is he saying who he is? Can't they just Google Sunny as a as a cop? 49:55 A lot of headlines a lot of newspaper headlines. Oh, okay. That's funny. Anyways, maybe they just did that so we could still 50:01 call him Sunny even when he's undercover. Might just probably helps cuz maybe you're in a shootout and or whatever a high stress 50:07 situation and you actually call him by his real name. Let's keep the first names the same. 50:12 Oh, sorry. My Siri just spoke to me and it scared the [ __ ] out of me 50:20 cuz I said Sunny and I thought it was a woman in my room cuz she cuz Siri went 50:25 hm holy heart attack. Okay, I I said sunny, not the other word. I don't want 50:31 to trigger it again. That scared the crap out of me. Legit, I thought it was a ghost in my room cuz I'm alone in my 50:36 room and I heard this. I thought it was my wife. I'm like, how did I I've seen people passing by though outside your your class. 50:42 Yes. No, I'm not alone in the house. So, there's people in my house, but that door hasn't opened. So, because that 50:47 door didn't open, I heard him. Anyway, sorry. It scared the crap out of me. I'm not going to been in there the whole time. 50:52 Yeah, no kidding. The call is coming from inside the house. Okay, so let's get to it. Let's get to the two main 50:58 dudes here. Uh, okay. Okay. So, now this is Jamie Fox's third 51:04 collaboration with Michael Man and I believe his last and I have this came after this movie was after 51:09 Collateral. Yeah, this was Ali. He did Ali Collateral then Miami Vice. In fact, it 51:16 was Jamie Fox who brought this up to Michael Man saying, "Hey dude, you 51:22 should reboot your TV show and make me tubs. It is a good idea." Uh, what is your 51:27 overall feelings on Jamie Fox and his role in this film? Well, okay. So, Jamie Fox, I feel like 51:33 is clearly like history has shown he's a great actor. Um, and just like an 51:38 insanely talented human being. Like the music, he's he's hilarious. He's 51:43 good-looking. He's can do drama. Um, I feel like this was probably like on the earlier end of his getting into doing 51:51 drama and less comedy because I'm sure I was introduced to him on In Living Color, like the sketch comedy show. 51:57 Yeah. Back in the day, and then he started his movie career doing comedies. I think he did a a fine job in this 52:04 movie. uh he doesn't really blow you away, but I think that's also the nature of his of 52:09 the character of Tubs is that he's like this the strong, silent, stoic member of 52:16 the partnership, right? You know, he's supposed to be the the the stable one, not the loose cannon. 52:22 So, yeah, Sunny's Captain Kirk and Tubs is Spock or something like 52:28 something like that. Yeah. Or he's uh he's Myrtto. Yeah, right. There you go. Sunny is Rig. 52:33 That's Well, yeah, sure. There's that, too. Which I think Lethal Weapon just probably borrowed from Miami Vice a 52:38 little bit. I I think I had the timeline right. I think Lethal Weapon came out after, but uh I got a bit of a hot take 52:44 here, and it's taken me, ironically, it's taken me to three films that Jaime has been in that have all been dramatic 52:50 films with Michael Man. I watched, uh Jamie Fox go toe-to-toe with Will Smith, 52:56 then I watched him go toe-to-toe with Tom Cruz, and then I've watched him go toe-to-toe with Colin Frell. Uh, I admit 53:02 I'm a Will Smith fan despite the slap. You know, we all make mistakes. Some are some are in front of millions of people 53:09 on live TV, but I've enjoyed his films throughout the years. Uh, though that did leave a bad taste in my mouth. I I 53:15 expressed all that when I talked about Ali. Uh, second, I I've always loved Tom Cruz. That goes without saying. I've 53:20 expressed that a lot on the show and I've now this is the f we have we're not talking about Colin yet, but I've always liked Colin Frell. I've always enjoyed 53:26 him. So, this might be a hot take. I'm not sure. I don't think Jamie Fox is 53:33 that great of an actor. I think he's very talented. I think he's a good 53:38 singer. I loved him in Living Color and maybe maybe he's just not Jim Carrey. Meaning 53:45 Jim Carrey could do the can do the drama and the comedy like he's proven that with the Truman Show and other such 53:50 movies. I just just to compare it to another Living Color member. I'm just saying I I think he's fine. Like you 53:58 said, I think he's fine, but now that I've seen him in three movies in a row, like boom boom boom. I'm like there's 54:04 something about his acting where it's I like Oh, you're acting. Yeah, he's trying hard. 54:10 Yeah, I'm I'm catching that. You're Look, I'm more than uh you know, whatever the characters that he plays 54:16 and that's he's hilarious that way. But I think I don't know. I think he's okay. I don't think he's as great as we 54:23 thought he was because he did Ray. You know what I mean? I don't know. Maybe I'm I don't know. I feel weird about those bio movies in 54:30 general. Like Sure. Walk in Phoenix. Did he win a best actor for the Johnny Cash movie? 54:35 I think he did. I think I don't know that doing a good impression of someone means you're a 54:41 good actor. Sure. Yeah. He might nail a Ray Charles impression. I don't know that that means 54:46 like you were really acting very well or that you can just do a really great impression of that person. Yeah. I 54:52 wouldn't say I mean he's not the best actor that's ever lived or anything but I thought he he's probably a better actor than I 54:59 would be. Um but I think comedy is his should be his bread and butter. 55:04 I don't blame him. What about Django? Did you like Jen him and Django on chain? Yeah. Well, here's the thing. Um you 55:12 have to be horrible to not Quinton. This is why we don't cover Quenton on this 55:17 because he's he's one probably one of my favorite directors of all time, but ironically I'll never cover him uh on 55:23 this network. Um though I'd have a lot to say. He would probably listen to the podcast as well. Like he's out there consuming 55:29 all media. Well Well, he'll never listen to me. I don't I think there's been enough great 55:34 coverage on Quenton Tarantino, though. I just But he is my favorite top three director of all time. I I think what I 55:41 was going to say was you have to be horrible to be I think I could be service. Well, that's what he's such a 55:47 good director and writer that I think I could even pull out something because he's done things with actors where like 55:53 what you have that in you because he is able to mold anybody. So, I thought he was 55:59 great. Again, he was fine in Jango and Chain, but his counterpart I forget his name escapes me already. Oh, the German. 56:04 Yeah. Yeah. He's and Leo and DiCaprio is like Yeah. Yeah. That's what I mean. You watch Yeah. You watch Leo and I'm I'm 56:11 such a Leo Mark. I love Leo. He is amazing. I would run a Leo podcast because I love his his filmography and 56:18 his acting. Wait, what about Blood Diamond? You already I talked about Yeah, I talked about it and I talked about and I 56:23 fanboyed on Leo. He was amazing in that film. I think that was the first movie that I saw where I really appreciated how good 56:29 of an actor Leo was in Blood Diamond. Yeah, he is good. He's as good as they come. 56:35 Um, but uh he supposedly isn't he circling the heat uh part two? Yes. 56:40 Movie Leo. Was he play would he play young Dairo? I don't know what they're doing with 56:45 that. I'm a little confused. I think he would play uh I think he played Val Kilmer's character. Honestly, I see him 56:51 putting on the old Kilmer was probably. Well, I know, but I don't know what I I don't know what they're doing. I don't know if they're going to deage him. It's 56:57 all kind of weird. Don't get me started on the casting. As much as I Leo because Well, yeah, because the character in Heat Bel Kilmel's character is like 35. 57:05 Yeah. Like I know 45, doesn't he got to be? Oh, no. He's my age. He's He's 50. Okay. Yeah. He doesn't need to do that, 57:11 but that's a whole other podcast. Well, yeah. Well, I would love to talk. Yeah. So, he too will cover Hey, put this way. 57:17 When it comes out, I'm covering it, of course. Michael Man. Yeah. Um and Michael Man's not getting any younger either. He's like 82 to five or 57:23 something like that. Like, good for him. Yeah. I know. I know. Jamie Fox, my hot take is, yeah, he's fine. Don't get me 57:29 wrong, he's fine in this film, but the charisma, the That's what I like about Will Smith. Say what you want. He has 57:36 charisma on screen. Will Smith has charisma. It oozes, right? There's just some Denzel Washington. There's another 57:42 one. Danzel Washington like when he like he Yeah, he one of my favorite actors of all time is Denzel. I got to talk about 57:47 him three times covering Eduk films. He oozes charisma on screen. You just like 57:52 you're enamored by when he talks. You're like, you're listening to Denzel talk, right? Well, Jamie Fox, I just feel 57:58 like, oh, I got a good gig here. I'm lucky to have this. And it turns out, Kevin, that on this film, 58:04 it turns out that him winning the Ray Academy war just before this film got to his ego. And apparently as well, like he 58:12 wouldn't do um he guns went off in whatever part of South America. He's like, "That's it. I'm out of here. I 58:18 don't feel safe." So, they had to change the big shootout. It was supposed to be like a Paraguay jungle shootout. And it 58:24 turned out that it was the Miami shootout. The the original script at the very end. Yes. It was supposed to be like a jungle 58:30 ramble style battle, but it got changed because Jamie Fox is like, "I don't feel safe here. I'm out of here." And they 58:36 had to do like a Miami shoot out some freight yard or whatever. Did you um I don't know. Do you know the 58:41 movie The Rundown? You know the one? Oh, I love it. Love it. And they were filming somewhere in South 58:46 America. I don't know where, but um the guy Peter Berg who's like the Did he he directed that one? I think 58:52 he did. Yeah. Yeah. So, I saw him on some talk show at some point. He said at some point they had like a run in with like gorillas in 58:58 the jungle or whatever, like gun, you know, and he said something about you could always tell how like how cool 59:05 somebody was by how high over their head that they raised their hands when they were like at gunpoint. You know, some 59:10 people are like this and some people are like and that you know if you like have your 59:16 hands low that means you're cool under pressure. It sounds like Jamie Fox would have been like a get me get me out of here. 59:22 Sure. Sure. Hey, don't get me wrong. I don't want to say I wouldn't be nervous, but I guess, 59:27 but he also refused to ride on boats or planes or helicopters. Dude, you're in Miami Vice. I'm sorry. I 59:34 don't I thought they were really on those boats and stuff. He didn't He didn't like it or refuse to do more shots or so. He was He gave it a 59:41 hard time at the very least. Dude, you're literally on a movie about fast boats and cars. I feel like I would have 59:47 loved like so if he was doing Top Gun he would have refused to be in the plane. Basically, you're saying that to me that 59:53 would have been the main selling point about being in it is I get to like ride in these planes. Tom Cruz flew his own plane to the set, 1:00:00 man. That's how that's so amazing. The Mustang or whatever. The Yeah, he flew it to the set. Yeah, that's amazing. 1:00:06 Oh, he's insane. Okay, so anyways, again, Jamie Fox, this is my third film 1:00:11 with him and I've spoke briefly on the other films. I would just say he's not bad, but he's of the two build actors. I 1:00:20 found I was watching Jamie Fox act and be cool where I felt Colin wasn't acting 1:00:26 and was cool. I I know it sounds terrible. Yeah, my my take is like almost the complete 1:00:32 opposite. I talked about Jamie Fox. I don't think he he didn't blow me away in this movie, but I thought he was good. But I to me 1:00:39 sadly I think Colin Ferrell and who I'm a fan of I I feel like to me he was like another he and Gong Lee were kind of 1:00:45 like the weak links. So it's also a shame they had so many scenes together because interesting 1:00:51 I it almost seemed like he was trying too hard to me to be smooth and cool 1:00:57 and I feel it it just felt false in some way. I feel like trying too hard is like the 1:01:03 last thing you want to do when you're trying to come off as cool. I feel like history 1:01:08 will agree with me on this that the thing about Colin Frell is I feel like he's a weird quirky guy and and playing 1:01:16 weird quirky characters. That's his like bread and butter. like stuff like the lobster uh and in Bruge 1:01:26 and even the Penguin like the Penguin you know the Batman movie and the Penguin miniseries like 1:01:32 he dude's clearly an awesome actor. Oh yeah. He does his best work when I think he's 1:01:37 playing a little bit of a oddball character, a weird guy. I would almost I would almost compare him like in a 1:01:44 complimentary way to Val Kilmer who I think was another guy who was like a sort of an odd guy, a strange guy but 1:01:51 like packaged in a very like beautiful leading man, you know, good looks. 1:01:57 Yeah. Sort of package. You know, he's like the type of guy you would cast to play Batman, but he might be better suited to 1:02:04 being one of the weird villains or something like that. So, I don't think this was like a great role for him cuz 1:02:11 it he just I just it it always struck me as like this guy is trying really hard to be charming and cool and suave and 1:02:19 all that, but it it seemed false for me personally. Interesting. No, I I I see it. I guess I 1:02:25 guess I got I guess I got suckered into that mullet and hair and uh I just 1:02:31 The mullet and the mustache were a strange choice for 2006. Well, here's 1:02:36 the thing. When did this take place in the timeline of our world? I was confused by some of the gadgets and 1:02:42 phones. Like, wait a minute. Is that a is that an 80s satellite phone or is it what are we doing? Like, I got So, it it was meant to take place in 1:02:50 And I know this because on the commentary track because Michael Man's a 1:02:55 total like his obsession with like like attention to detail, 1:03:00 Yeah. is incredible. So, when they when they had um Trudy kidnapped, right, and they 1:03:07 held the phone up to the to the news so that they could prove what day it was or whatever, what like that, you know, the 1:03:13 proof of life scene, they had the guy on TV was saying like, "Hurricane Ernesto is bearing down." 1:03:20 Oh. Or something like that. And Michael Man had looked at the list of hurricanes for the year 2006. 1:03:27 Yeah. and tried to guess at the time that the movie released what would be the current hurricane. 1:03:33 Wow. At the time the movie came out. So, it was meant to be summer of 2006 or or 1:03:38 hurricane season 2006. All right. Fair enough. Fair enough. Okay. They did have the big satellite phones 1:03:44 that were real big with the big antenna. That's what threw me off. And I'm Look, I'm not I'm not a tech nerd, so I would 1:03:50 have built maybe people would say, "Well, yeah, right. It might have been the state-of-the-art satellite phone in 2006." I don't know. It might have been. It was 19 years ago. 1:03:56 As you know, in technology years, that's 500 years, so who knows? Yeah, I I guess 1:04:02 I got suckered in to Colin's coolness. I feel like the mullet and the mustache 1:04:07 look is kind of in now. I thought he looked great. I thought it was hilariously great. I thought, hey, 1:04:12 you remember that guy who had long blonde hair from the TV show? That was like the one thing I guess that was the one thing they carried over. It's like 1:04:18 they took the hair piece from Don Johnson and put it on Colin's head. I don't know. Did you have in the show? 1:04:25 He did have long hair. It was actually It was actually less offensive in the 80s than what Colin was wearing in 2006. 1:04:32 It was It was horrible, but I loved it at the same time. He looked like a cop who's playing undercover cop, which 1:04:38 should have given him away when it's like, wait a minute, that's a hair that's a haircut that a cop would have 1:04:44 try to look like an undercover. You know what I mean? It was like he would have been better off just having short hair. I'm a Colin Mark. I do enjoy him despite 1:04:52 his own flaws as a human, but uh he he was he was good in this film, but again, I don't think I've ever 1:04:57 watched a Colin Ferrell performance where I'm I'm not enamored by his charisma. That's what I'm getting at. He 1:05:03 has charisma. He's weird. He's crazy. Johnny Depp charisma. You know, some of these actors despite their whateverness, 1:05:10 that's what makes them stars on screen is you're drawn to that personality of just whatever, right? And he's one of 1:05:16 those actors that Colin u he was great in True Detective. So if you want to see 1:05:21 uh a what do you want sort of a tone not tone but a a measured performance in a 1:05:27 real world type situation where he's not playing a zany character but it just yeah true detective showcased that. So 1:05:33 he was awesome in that banshees as well like he's just he's an allaround he's an awesome actor 1:05:40 history has proven that he's I feel like he's capable of better than what he did and if if he had another crack at doing 1:05:45 this movie he probably would have done a better job. I feel like he was still in that like early in my career, I'm trying to prove myself 1:05:52 sort of mode. Um with Michael Man. I'm working with Academy Award winner Jamie Fox. 1:05:58 Turn it up. He hit it out of the park right away. And that's the thing is he I I've been following his career for 25 years. I I 1:06:05 You saw him in Tiger Land. Like who is this guy? And I've been a fan since. So 1:06:11 uh I just I because I like war movies. So I I ranted the movie on a whim not knowing him from Adam. And then I just 1:06:17 started following his career. I was like, I I kind of like this guy. And I was in college. I was in college when Tigerland came out and I was trying to 1:06:23 watch like every movie at that point because I love movies and Tigerland was awesome. Yeah. It's a great film. Again, Joel 1:06:29 Schumacher is somebody we could cover on the boy. There's Yeah, he there's a lot of great director. That's what mean a lot of 1:06:35 great directors at this plethora of films that Oh, he did that. Joel Schumacher did Batman and Robin and 1:06:41 Tigerland. Yeah, same guy. Speaking of Colin and uh his filmography, we we'll cover him again next season, folks, when 1:06:48 we cover Terrence Mel because he stars in New World. That's a great film. Well, I have a little bit of trivia. We 1:06:54 already kind of mentioned some of the trivia regarding Jamie Fox, you know, high off his Oscar 1:06:59 win. I get it. He's won an Oscar. He's best actor out the set, so he's feeling kind of high about what he wants to do 1:07:04 in the movie. Uh we talked about the box office. The initial critical response we did mention, but it overall it was 47% 1:07:12 rating at the time. Oof. That's that's Yeah, that's exceptionally bad for like a Michael Man movie. 1:07:17 It is bad. It was divisive. And I think that rating was low because of the TV show. I think if the TV show didn't exist, we're looking at 65. I need to go 1:07:25 back and maybe study the trailers for the movie again because I feel like I was expecting something very different when I went to the theater that day. And 1:07:32 I came away thinking I didn't like it. And then I saw it again and I was like, you know, that's not so bad. And then I saw it again after that and I was like, 1:07:38 this is pretty good. And now I've seen it probably 10 times and I'm like, this movie is actually great. It just wasn't maybe what it was 1:07:44 advertised as. They might have leaned into the it's Miami Vice, Miami Vice is back and it was something very, you 1:07:50 know, it wasn't the the Universal Studios like the the stunt spectacular, whatever, you know, big explosions on 1:07:57 the water and stuff like that. It was like a really dense cop drama. Yeah. Yeah. I think one of my biggest 1:08:04 critiques of the film is also I I know they have to go undercover, but the crossount stuff I kind of wish we just 1:08:11 saw Miami uncover. I kind of wish we stayed in Miami more that it was just a 1:08:16 Miami. Granted, the the shoot out at the end was in Miami. Ironically, that wasn't the original. It was supposed to 1:08:21 happen in Paraguay, but so I I kind of wish Michael Man focused on a just like 1:08:28 more stuff in the precinct, that kind of stuff. Uh just a little Yeah, we never one time saw them in a 1:08:33 police station, did we? No, not really. No. And I felt like this was like the series finale of a TV show 1:08:40 we never watched. I think about uh Dark Knight and when 1:08:45 Batman goes to China, I'm like, "Well, this is weird. I don't know that I want to see Batman 1:08:51 going to other countries." Yeah. Yeah. What What's he doing in China? He's looking for Gong Lee. 1:08:59 I'm like, "What? What's happening here? Why he wants to see Gong Le's latest release in China? How it's doing over there?" Uh 1:09:05 were you bothered by the fact that the video that the movie was shot on video? Oh, good good point to bring that up. 1:09:10 So, Michael Matt, bless his heart, he's like, "Hey, I really like this digital thing." He started doing digital uh he 1:09:16 um collab digital, right? CL was largely digital. The one part that wasn't was the club scene was film 1:09:23 before that. Oh, yeah. Ali. Ali was the first film where he started dabbling a little bit. There's some shots that were 1:09:29 clearly digital, but the majority of the film was okay. Film, but then he does collateral. And Collateral is like, I 1:09:36 want to reverse it. I did the majority in digital and a part of it in film. And here again, he uh he loves that 1:09:42 aesthetic. And I I admit there were some scenes where I kind of dug it because we don't do digital anymore in 2025 the way 1:09:49 we did back in the early Looks like film now. We figured out the technology. There you go. Sure. Yeah. There you go. 1:09:55 What I mean is I kind of liked that I there was times especially with Colin's character walking around in his uh alone 1:10:02 scenes where I was like, "Oh, I feel like I'm watching a whole movie." And I kind of like that. It felt very raw. I 1:10:07 kind of like the rawness of it. What did you think of some of the digital senses? I think it's like you said in technology 1:10:14 terms 19 years ago is like an eternity. Like you could probably shoot something on an iPhone now that might look better 1:10:20 than this movie looked at some moments. Um, a lot of the stuff, especially the 1:10:25 stuff that was shot in the dark and that I could nighttime scenes just looked really vid videoy 1:10:32 grainy like grainy and blurry motion, you know, and right I was just like I feel like that might 1:10:38 have also hurt the reception to the movie when it came out because I think when I saw it I was like 1:10:44 this movie looks like kind of on the cheap. Yeah, you can tell they spent a fortune on it. Like you said, the budget 1:10:49 was something insane, over $und00 million. But yeah, but then certain scenes you would see 1:10:54 and you'd be like, "Wow, that does look like something you could shoot like almost on a camcorder." Yeah, I think 1:11:00 odd an odd choice. The high budget was related to delays and filming because of Hurricane 1:11:05 Katrina, things like that. So that was they talked like a lot on the commentary track about that they were always there 1:11:10 was like just a steady stream of tropical storms and hurricanes the entire like production schedule. But I 1:11:17 did think a lot of the stuff like the stuff of the boats on the water and like the planes flying through the air and a lot of that stuff the stuff broad 1:11:23 daylight looked amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I love the long boat scene like hey we're going to go get a 1:11:29 drink. It's like oh we're just going to watch the literally just travel for a while on the water. Okay. So definitely 1:11:35 loves his vehicles and his uh be just to see a Michael man directed Fast and Furious movie. That'd be kind of fun. 1:11:40 Well or like a Michael Man music video because he's like a master of using music as well. 1:11:46 the stuff with like the Moby songs or the the Audio Slave songs he's a fan of like his his his regular go-to artists. 1:11:54 I love that about him. I love that he uses these because he's older than us by 30 odd years. And I love that he's 1:12:00 using, you know, Moby and Audio Slave. He's an Audio Slave fan. Two films in a 1:12:05 row he's used Audio Slave, but Oh, he's doing it again. I think he used Moby and Heat as well. Like he's just Yeah, he's into it. But, 1:12:11 um, I liked the Jay-Z song at the at the opening. Yeah. The Jay-Z Lincoln Park uh, the 1:12:17 mashup. The song, at least on my version at the end, the end montage of the movie was 1:12:22 this song called Auto Rock by Mwai. It was also awesome. It was like a piano heavy song. But, so I think my movie 1:12:30 used in the air tonight, but a cover version, but like right before the Mine was the right before the big shootout. 1:12:36 Okay. At the end. And I think the theatrical version maybe had it playing over the end credits or something like that. 1:12:42 And it was weird. I think they should have used the Genesis version. Yeah. Or not used it at all because the cover 1:12:48 was kind of whack. I don't know. It was just weird. I feel like maybe he felt like he had to use it. Maybe Genesis 1:12:53 wanted all the money in the world. Or was that a Phil Collins solo? It's a Phil Collins song, but I'll 1:12:59 forgive you. It's okay. Okay. Phil Collins solo. Yeah. Let's just say he probably wanted like he probably wanted $20 million for like the rights 1:13:05 to the song for the movie. Let's just say the last four to five albums of Genesis and Phil's solo work 1:13:11 are almost interchangeable at that point. That's when I came on the Genesis train was probably like early 90s. So, 1:13:19 don't get me started. I'm a huge Genesis fan and I love Peter Gabriel soul stuff and I love Phil Collins soul stuff too. 1:13:25 In fact, I I love them both. He's actually he's he's a great artist, man. I can't knock the guy. Yeah. Only other thing I would mention 1:13:31 that was awesome to me about the movie was like the locations were awesome. Miami stuff is awesome. That stuff in 1:13:37 South America like the the waterfalls. Suda del Estee the like the where 1:13:42 Paraguay Brazil and Argentina like all meet. Oh, is like this Wild West type area in real 1:13:49 life apparently. It's like a hub for black market like smuggling and like bootleg electronics and whatever like is 1:13:56 all being brought in there and and those scenes where they were like sweeping up just like styrofoam everywhere in the 1:14:02 streets is apparently like what is going on down there. Yeah. In fact, they used real criminals 1:14:09 for security while they were there. Like real real gangs. Real gangs were used for film security. And Michael Man 1:14:16 bought the black market. He bought a black market DVD of Collateral while he was there for fun. Oh, that's awesome. They didn't film in 1:14:23 Cuba cuz it's probably was probably illegal, but like he and Colin Frell and Gongi went to Cuba like on like a 1:14:30 research trip. Sure. Just like in and I'm like that seems excessive for like the five minutes of 1:14:36 the movie that were in Cuba. But, you know, speaking of uh the music now, I saw that 1:14:43 they were saying, oh, you know, some people were upset that the great theme song, of course, from the My Vice TV 1:14:48 show, which you know the theme song. I'm sure you've heard that theme song. I would I would know it if I heard it. Yeah. But I was Oh, dude. I thought there was a couple 1:14:55 moments where it was TV theme adjacent. There was a couple 1:15:02 don't drums in the movie. I thought they did sample the it and that wasn't the 1:15:07 exact theme song music, but it was like a good Wish.com version of the themes. 1:15:14 You know what I'm saying? Like I could hear the essence of the theme in the movie. So they they might not have used 1:15:20 the actual theme, but there's a couple scen I think it was an aerial scene, too, but is Oh, there it is. They're 1:15:25 they're doing it. I I recognize the theme without it being the theme. Did you catch what I'm talking about or no? 1:15:31 I think I think Michael Man was walking on a tight rope. I think he probably had the studio was telling him like, "We 1:15:36 want more references to the TV show." Sure. So, he might have been like trying to sort of have it both ways. He didn't 1:15:43 want to reference the TV show too heavily is the way he put it on on his commentary, but then, you know, 1:15:49 but then you drop In the Air Tonight on there, but like a cover version of it, and I feel like, well, now you're inviting comparison. 1:15:55 The 80s. In the 80s in general. Yeah. The one of the biggest songs in the 80s, you put a cover version of it. Yeah. 1:16:00 Maybe you should either go all you should go all in or you should steer clear of it but not try to find some 1:16:06 middle ground. Well, this movie is a cover it's a it's a cover version of of the TV show. Maybe 1:16:12 that's the I guess so. Yeah. Over time, Kevin. Miami Vice has gained a cult following, particularly among 1:16:18 younger critics and filmmakers. In 2016, Steven Hayen called it quote one of the 1:16:24 most expensive art films ever made, praising his atmospheric focus over conventional storytelling. John Baptist 1:16:30 threat uh in senses of cinema described it as a radical work blending impressionism and 1:16:36 hyper realism laying the foundation for modern action films. Director Harmony 1:16:42 Corine cited as a major influence on the his film Spring Breakers for its vivid 1:16:48 sense of place and the film ranked 95th in a 2014 Timeout poll of the best 1:16:53 action films of all time and the New York Times 2020 2025 reader choice list 1:16:59 of the 100 best uh 21st century movies. So I made a top 100 this year. 1:17:05 Oh wow. I I'd studied that list, but like the one not the not the reader voter list, you know, the other one. But 1:17:11 that's awesome. Yeah. I I'd have to really think about my list of the top hundred movies from this century. 1:17:17 Sure. Sure. That's a But I do think this movie is like Yeah. It was like overlooked when it came out and then word of mouth. So a guy like 1:17:25 you I overlooked it. Yeah. You didn't see it because people out there telling you you got to see 1:17:30 this movie. That's right. And it was overlooked. And I didn't I didn't go to myself, I'm never going to see this film. Forget 1:17:36 that film. No, it just it got over it literally got overlooked. I missed it. Didn't hear anyone talking about it and 1:17:42 I never went back to it and I I'm glad I saw it. So, to answer your question, the very beginning, what's my thoughts on on 1:17:48 this film? I kind of agree with Colin. I think it's there's some missed opportunities. Uh I 1:17:54 I felt like the style was over substance and there's nothing wrong with style. 1:18:00 Michael Man is style. That's what makes him such an incredible direct director. That's why I love him. But I think in 1:18:06 this situation, we just didn't have enough substance. There wasn't enough like their 1:18:12 partnership felt lacking. I felt like we have two hour like are you guys even partners? Like that's what I mean. I 1:18:17 felt this was the season or sorry the series finale of a TV show. We were 1:18:23 supposed to feel I felt no connection with the characters or their connection with each other. I mean, we got a 1:18:29 10-minute love scene in the shower. That's cool. You know, like we got two we got two shower sex scenes 1:18:35 in the movie, didn't we? And look, I love I love naked, beautiful bodies like anyone else, don't get me wrong, but I was like, "Okay, we get it. 1:18:42 You're in love. This is what adults do, but this is a waste of time. I want to know more about your partnership." So, I 1:18:48 felt like I almost felt like they were, you know, when a couple goes to a party and they just had a fight, but they're 1:18:53 at the party and they're trying to pretend they're a loving couple and they go back home and fight again. I felt that was their partnership. I was like, 1:18:59 "Are you guys friends even? Do you guys even like each other?" And I don't There was definitely there was drama between the characters, right? Cuz you 1:19:05 could tell that Tubs did not approve of what Crockett was doing with Isabelle. 1:19:12 But then when they would get in front of their bosses, he'd be like, "No, I have his back." They had Yeah. Sure, sure, 1:19:19 sure. Yeah. Yeah. In front of the parents. Yeah. The siblings had each other's back in front of mommy and 1:19:24 daddy, but when they were alone, they punched each other. I Yeah. I don't know. It's just, you know, so, uh, I 1:19:31 guess I have mixed feelings on this and, uh, but I love Michael Mann and I love Colin 1:19:37 Frell. Um, I felt like the movie I I guess I kind of agree it was a very expensive art film in that it looked 1:19:43 really good and it was very engaging that way and it was a very interesting film to watch and think 19 years later. 1:19:49 What is I I think it feels better in 2025 than it probably would have in 2009. So, I'm kind of glad I saw it now 1:19:54 with the eyes that I'm seeing it and I'm seeing this film in the chronological order of Michael Man film. So, now I'm 1:20:00 at the point with his filmography where like, oh, this is a Michael Man film. The way he does the shots of the people, 1:20:05 the guy in the front, the guy in the back, all these other, you know, over-the-shoulder shots, the scenery. 1:20:10 So, it's like I'm becoming a bit of a Michael man like visual aur where like now I just know what a Michael man film 1:20:16 looks like. So, it's going to be interesting to see these later films I haven't seen. Like I haven't seen Ferrari yet. I'm wondering 1:20:22 does he continue that look throughout his films but because boy he just does not get away from that look which I like. That's his Michael Mannism. 1:20:29 Well, I'm not going to give you any Ferrari spoilers, but Okay, please. Thank you. Which version which version of Miami Vice did you watch? Which one? 1:20:35 I think just the standard I saw it on u Param what streaming service was it? Paramount Plus or Prime? I saw it on 1:20:41 Prime. So, it's probably open Did it open with like a boat a scene like a speedboat race or did it open right in the nightclub? 1:20:47 Oh, right at the nightclub. Okay. Yeah. So, you watched the theatrical version. Okay. Yeah. So, I missed the race at the 1:20:53 beginning that was not included in the theatrical version is looks like by itself it probably cost $50 million. So, 1:21:00 it's crazy that they cut it. It's crazy that they cut it out. Um, you can probably find Well, I was going to say I'm going to 1:21:06 buy the 4K. See, I'm still going to support Michael Man. I'm going to buy the 4K Blu-ray or that's coming out uh 1:21:11 this uh 2025 and it's going to have that. So, end the commentary. Look, I 1:21:17 Michael Man, I thank you. Well, of course, I'm not I'm not going to say I don't like it. At the end of 1:21:22 each season, like I did for Ed Edward Zuk, I will have a ranking. I will I rank the films at the end. Yeah. 1:21:28 Okay. So, if you if you're interested, dear listener, if you don't want to listen to all my reviews of every Zwick film, I 1:21:33 did do an episode where I recapped and ranked the Zwick film. So, I'll be doing the same for Michael Man. This will be 1:21:39 interesting. I I'm interested to see where this lands. I I think I don't think this is top tier 1:21:45 Michael man. I think this is like second tier Michael. I think that's fair. Uh will it beat 1:21:52 will it beat uh the keep? That's the question. Okay, that's a good question. You have my my 1:21:59 my you have my attention so I'll be tuning in. Oh yeah. Will it beat the Stay tuned, folks. Which is a better film, The Keep 1:22:05 or Miami Vice? Stay tuned. I I don't even know. I got to give that one some thought. Okay. Uh well, thank you so 1:22:12 much uh Kevin for coming on. I really appreciate your time. Again, let folks know where they can uh get a hold of you. 1:22:17 Yeah, check us out um on our six degrees of Schwarzenegger feed. I think we're on all the major podcast platforms. We're 1:22:25 also trying to be on social media at 6OS 1:22:30 podcast on like Instagram, Facebook, wherever you like to consume that sort of stuff. Um, but yeah, I would say if 1:22:39 you like action movies, if you grew up a child of like Vanam and Schwarzenegger 1:22:44 and all those guys, um, or you like listening to just dudes 1:22:51 shoot the breeze and talk about the movies that they grew up watching and love, explosions and babes and stuff 1:22:57 like that. Check out 60 degrees of Schwarzenegger. There's probably something there that'll keep your interest and we hope to have Ryan back 1:23:03 on podcast soon for sure. Yes, please. Anytime you want me to crackwise, any 1:23:09 film. And I don't have to see the film. In fact, I like talking about films I haven't seen like I did today with my advice. I love uh I love first time 1:23:15 discussions, too. So, thank you so much for coming on, Kevin. Thank you for having me. I'll be 1:23:26 I [Music] 1:23:36 [Music] 1:23:42 go I 1:23:51 And I'll be gone. 1:23:57 I'll be gone. And I be gone. 1:24:05 [Music]