Latest / The iAlign Podcast with Flint Mitchell / #38 - Living an Engaged Life w/ Ben Bernstein

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#38 - Living an Engaged Life w/ Ben Bernstein · The iAlign Podcast with Flint Mitchell

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_02: And we think we're not we're not engaged in the world, but we need we do think that's what we do as human beings.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: The key of that thinking, if it comes from action, would be just what you're saying that you had that experience writing letters.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: It would be to feed back into your action.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_02: You know, an education policy or and practice that was built on that understanding would be immensely engaging, meaningful, and purposeful?
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_00: What's up, y'all?
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: What are your most important values?
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: Can you name them, define them, see how you act them out in real life?
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: Do you spend your time well?
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: Are you honest?
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: Are you responsible?
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Are you healthy?
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have strong connections with the loved ones in your life?
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: What do these ideas have to do with authenticity?
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: If these questions provoke you to reflect or feel a certain way, you're in the right place.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: My name is Flint Mitchell, and this is the Seeking Authenticity Podcast.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: Before we jump into this episode, I want to keep you posted about my book, also named Seeking Authenticity.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's coming out later this month, October 2021.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: I'll have exact dates in the coming week.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: I've been receiving some remarkable feedback about it so far, and I'm excited to share it with you.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: You can find out more at my website, FlintMichell.com.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm also always looking for honest feedback, so if you leave a review on this podcast and then reach out to SeekingAuthenticitypodcast at gmail.com, I'll respond with some information on how to set up a call with me.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: One-on-one we can talk over the phone.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: Now, in this episode, I talk with Dr.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: Ben Bernstein, who also goes by Dr.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: B or the Stress Doctor.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: Ben uses his own personal experiences and formal training in performance psychology to help people overcome stress and performance anxiety and perform at their best.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe you have unproductive habits you'd like to kick, or suffer from an inability to perform when the spotlight is on or the test is put in front of you.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: Dr.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: B knows how to handle that.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: I've known Ben for about two years now and value him in my life not only as a friend, but also as an impeccably honest person.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: When you find people that give you legitimately honest feedback about your work and ideas, you should keep them around.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to check out more about Dr.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: B at any point, check out the information in the podcast description.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: Now, without further ado, let's get into it.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for doing this with me, Dr.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: B.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: I really appreciate it.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: My pleasure, Flynn.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_02: Took us a while to get it together, but here we are.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: Before this podcast about a week ago, you sent me a blog post and another uh podcast interview you were on where the topic of discussion uh was about education and the education system.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: And it seemed to revolve around uh a passion of yours, which is a desire to help inspire the youth.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and there are a couple different concepts or topics, points that you had uh in mind.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: There was uh learning by doing, trying to create a more inclusive environment, one that, if I had to summarize, was about kind of creating this fire within uh each individual person that they can drive into their future with.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: While I was thinking about this, there were a lot of great points in that in that podcast in the block blog, and I'll link to those in this podcast description for listeners who are interested.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: I was wondering if you could just tell me a bit about uh your interest in the education system.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: What when did it start and and why did you become so driven about it?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's such a great question.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, when you're asking it, when did it become when do how did I get interested or when?
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_02: I think I got interested in kindergarten.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because um it was there was something really off about school.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what it was, but it was like you had to do this, you had to do that.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: It was a little like a military camp.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, this was also um my first by the time I was in first grade, it was the Korean War.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: And we had these bomb drills that um when the siren went off, you had to climb under your desk.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_02: And I refused to climb under my desk.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_02: And the teacher came over to me and she said, she was really mad, and she said, stand up, young man.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I stood up and she said, if the if a bomb hits this school and you get killed, I am not going to feel sorry for you.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_02: So um I think you get the idea here that you know, I I I mean, I didn't have the wherewithal to say, you know, honey, if we bomb drops at this school, it doesn't matter if I'm over my dad.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_02: We're all going, you know.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um but but you know, jokes aside, um, there was something I really just didn't get into school or like school.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: I did well, you know, I worked hard, but it it there was never really a connection, I mean, in a certain way.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I didn't uh really understand what was going on.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, this was a time 50s that you just did what you're supposed to do.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but that continued on and on through all the years I was in school.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, jumping uh way ahead, when I was in my final year of college in 1969, I volunteered for the first Head Start program, preschool program.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I have an affinity for children, and uh I had been a camp counselor in a Caskell hotel for years, and so I got into the Head Start and I loved it, it was great.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_02: And when I graduated, I was um a prime uh candidate for going into the army into Vietnam.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and though I am a total supporter of national service, I was not supporting that war.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_02: And at that time, there was a program for guys my age.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: If you wanted to teach in what were then called ghetto areas of major metropolitan centers, and you had no education courses in college, put this together, you could get a deferment if you entered these programs, and they would put you right in schools in the ghetto areas.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_02: So I chose that option, and I was placed in a school in Bedford Syveson.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm from Brooklyn, New York, and but Bedford Syveson was an unknown area to me, even though it was like 20 minutes from where we lived.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and I grew up in a middle class, privileged, certainly privileged comparison with what I then got my eyes open to.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_02: And it was horrible.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_02: The kids were poor coming to school and these party dresses and thin shoes that were soaked from the snow and not eating, and um, and the teachers, you know, there were some teachers who were very engaged and inspiring them, but most weren't.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: It was just like a one said this is a means to an end, whatever that was.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I um I something was really off about the whole thing.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: I happened to hear about a a woman who headed a school in London, England, uh headmistress of a school in London, England.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_02: And I went to hear her lecture up at City College, and I was completely mesmerized.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: She showed slides of the school.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_02: This is in a really poor area of London, little kids, four to seven years old, and they were you could see the light and the color and the joy emanating off the slides.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: And this woman, she was like this inspired educator.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_02: So, long story short, I got my way over to England and went to that school.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I actually was trained as a teacher in that school.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: Interesting.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, and and that's when it kind of came full circle.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_02: Like this is what school should be like.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_02: The kids would clamor at the gate in the morning to get into the school.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: They couldn't wait to get in.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: And when they got in, let me just finish here.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_02: When they got in, they when they got in, kids couldn't wait to get into school.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_02: And when they got in, what the day was, it was all activities.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: It was cooking and making, you know, constructions and um having a little restaurant and sewing and dressing up.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_02: And we had to teach the children.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: The best way it was explained was that we teach children what is in their interest in a way that is interesting to them.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: So the kids were engaged all day, and and it was a community.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_02: The classroom was a true community.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone was contributing.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: And you had to really get into what's in this kid's interest.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well, nobody ever asked me in gazillion years of school what I was interested in.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_02: It was like you learned this, you know.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_02: And if you didn't get it, you know, you if you were lucky as I had parents who could afford a tutor and suffer through, you know, my angst about not being able to get something, it was it was completely different.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: So that's when I that's when I got clear about this is what education should be like.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_02: This should be, it should be, it should be engaging, it should be oriented toward cultivating the individual within a community.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: I think there are two points to that that uh speak to me.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: The first is is more of a um it's it's interesting to me to think about kids at a young age and how they're taught over the experiences they have.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because I I mean, if if I'm to really look back, there isn't a lot that I remember education-wise from four to seven.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: It the majority of the experience was most likely derived from, or the positive side of the experience was most likely derived from the friendships that I made, uh, the teachers I look back on really fondly.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's about uh kind of the social aspects of me like becoming, honestly, a person, right?
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: Becoming a social human being at that kind of age.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and I think that is something that makes sense, right?
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: You want to you want your kid to become social so that they can interact with the world.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: Eventually, that's what it's all about, is how you contribute to the people around you.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but at the same time, I guess my second point is a bit of a pushback of don't you also need to learn some things that you aren't necessarily interested in?
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: Well, um the answer is yes, but not, I don't think the way I don't think the way you're framing it.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_02: So what I mean by that is that um you might not be interested in learning you know um mathematical operations.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like simple ones, you know, addition, subtraction, division, multiplication.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_02: However, if you are wanting to build a boat and you need a piece of wood that's you know 11 inches long, then you start to learn about what 11 inches means.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_02: So it has meaning.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: So so I would could expand this to any subject that it has meaning to you.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, most of what I was pushed into didn't really have meaning for me.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: Meaning means I think a couple of things, practical application, yeah.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um, the usefulness, which is some similar thing, usefulness in the world, uh me um usefulness to me, you know, all of that.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I mean, we have to learn a whole bunch of things that we may not be interested, but I think that has to do with what door you enter to those things.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, how you enter it.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: I can, I can uh I see what you're saying.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: When I uh, for example, when I was in electrical engineering in college, the first two years is in general just math and physics, and I mean it's very uh abstract.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and it wasn't until junior, senior year when you start to finally get applying those things, uh, where I really became passionate about what I was learning.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, the first two years were were a little bit more or much more menial uh until I finally found that these theories that I understood could be applied in the real world in novel ways.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_02: Well, but uh what I would say about that, without you know being ultra critical of your experience with what you were taught, is that if somebody had really thought about how to teach you that menial stuff in a way that made more sense to you while you were learning it, this this takes a lot of work to teach in this way.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: It takes a lot of work, it takes a lot of thought, and it takes a lot of um sensitivity to how people learn.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, the Chinese proverb, Chinese proverb is I hear and I forget, I see and I remember, I do and I understand.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_02: So learning should proceed from doing and then incorporate hearing and seeing.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: So I I hear you, but the but the your experience is typical of what how we educate people.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: We're gonna give you the fundamentals, even though you don't really have an idea what they're fundamental to.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I I agree.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: I think that it would have been very helpful for me to have a under at least a better perspective of what was possible with what I was learning.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I do think that it is, and maybe this this agrees with your point.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe the point should be uh first to understand the applications before trying to understand the theory.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um my only comment was that it wasn't until I understood the theory that I truly understood what was really possible with it.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_02: Sure, I I get that.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_02: I I I think that what we're what we're talking about or around is how do you integrate these two things in a way that is that is a growing experience, really.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_02: And that requires a lot more attention to the process of learning, but learning in that deepest sense of incorp incorporating in your body, in your being.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um, and that that our education system is built on a model that comes out of the industrial revolution, an assembly line.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: And that's not that's not what we that's not really how people learn.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's one thing.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_02: The other thing I would say too, that I think bears speaking to you, you touched on it before about when you said contributing, is what are we educating people for?
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_02: So we we have created a um, I have to say, a terrible system of competition rather than a uh uh an environment for cooperation.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_02: And what what are we educating for?
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_02: Are we educating people really to compete in the world?
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I would say yes, but should we be educating people to cooperate in the world?
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_02: I would say better, yes.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_02: So that's yeah, so I think that's also um, you know, that's something else um that's really essential uh to consider.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: I, you know, this is all getting kicked up in me because we're entering.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: This is I'm saying this with a hope and a prayer, we're entering into a hope and prayer, new era where we've come out of a very severe time, we're coming out slowly of a very severe time of living in an I world rather than a we world.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, what do I mean by that?
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we've just um elected uh a president who's vastly different from the previous one, and the previous one I would characterize as a person who lived in an I world.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: It's about this is not how the world is built or meant to be.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_02: It is a we world, it's one unit, and we're all part of that.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: The more that we can educate people, children from childhood to uh appreciate the the the oneness of us, what a world this could be, right?
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_02: So education, let me finish because there's two things I want to say here.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_02: I I like looking up words in the dictionary, so I and particularly their etymology.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_02: So I looked up the word education and it has two Latin roots.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_02: One is educere and one is educare.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_02: Educare means to train or mold, and educere means to draw forth.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, our system is built on the educare, train or mold model, sure, not on the draw forth.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: So when you think of drawing forth, what does that mean?
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well, draw forth what's already inherent in the individual, her or his unique interests, unique talents, unique stability, unique possibility to contribute to the greater good, draw that forth.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: Think of education that could be done in that way, that then you shape mold however you need to to really fulfill the function of serving the greater good.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: We don't do that.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: I wonder if after this experience of going to London on this topic uh or of learning at the school in London, did you see a difference in the in the students 10 years later or however long later of the ones who were maybe taught through these experiences versus the ones that were just kind of forced into this system?
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's such a great question for a whole bunch of reasons.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, no, I didn't.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: There are studies that uh I can't quote for you right now, and sure, it makes me think I need to get up on them, and I will.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: But I have a picture on my wall of me with the 30 kids in my class who are all four, five, and six years old.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_02: And um, what am I?
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm not 30, I guess, or something.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: And um, you know, dude, that was 50 years ago.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_02: So, what do they remember of this tall Jewish bearded new jufro New Yorker who teaching them when they were four years old?
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_02: So it's, I mean, I'm now I haven't done it yet, but I'm I'm getting into it.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_02: Like Facebook is the real deal, you know, and I'm gonna see what I can do about um getting a group together.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_02: My headmistress, who's this totally beloved figure in my life, is still in London.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_02: I think she's in her, I'm gonna say late 80s or early 90s, and she's still kicking.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_02: She goes to school and reads to kids, and um it so it's a such a great question.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: What's the lasting effect?
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, right.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because it it is uh it those years are the shaping or the molding years, and I would love to see more children have those kinds of experiences.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's a it's a tough subject to talk about because when you think about the education system at a young age, you know, you can talk about all these different ways of teaching or having the kids experience education, but then you know, kids go, they spread out over the entire nation, the entire world.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: How do you really categorize how these kids were impacted by this system?
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's it's a wonderful question.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_02: And and and actually it uh it really inspires me to look and to look for the kids that I taught 50 years ago.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_02: No, I mean it, but I'm really glad we're talking about this because I am going to look into that so I can actually ask them those questions.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um, one of the things that happened at that time was this the school system is divide in England was divided into infant school and junior school.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_02: Infant school is four to seven year old, junior school was like eight to twelve, something like that.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_02: So, what happened for a lot of kids uh was that they went from this kind of infant school, bright, lively, open, colorful, yeah, um, full of full of energy, into a very disciplined junior school.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_02: And that was hard.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_02: That was hard for them, right?
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_02: So uh your question is great, but the real deal to me is that this is what should be the process of education all the way through.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's like planting a seed.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: You want to cultivate the seed, but then when it starts to grow, you don't want to put a rock on top of it.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: It it I I mean I agree, but I at the same time, going back to something you said, is it's very difficult to teach this way.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's very difficult to create an institution that that it's a lot of work to do that.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, well, excuse me, Flynn.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_02: So, like it's a lot of work, so like we shouldn't do it.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: Is that what you're saying?
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: No, not necessarily, but um it will most likely require a much larger contribution.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not saying it's not worth it, but it'll most likely require a policy uh in every government that will create more uh funding and and resources for these schools.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: I absolutely agree with you.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's very you put it very sensitively and and re.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Which is that it will.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the my mission, if you will, or part of it is to look at the whole education experience from a 50-year perspective of teaching.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, a much longer period of being in the education system from the time I was five.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_02: And look at really top-down.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's good, it's great to look at something top down, but you also got to look at it from bottom up, which is what you're saying, right?
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: And the policies and the funding and the intercoordination between, you know, in our country, US, between federal and state and local governments is very complicated.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: There's no question about this is not going to happen overnight.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_02: And it needs a concerted effort.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: This is hard.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's hard for us because we change administrations.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_02: We just went from Betsy DeVos to Miguel Cardona, right?
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, the names themselves tell the story, right?
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, that can happen every four or eight years.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's, but what one of the things that I that I want to get across is that the more parents can understand this, the more they can provide experiences for their children out of school.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: And now with the pandemic, one of the one of the gifts and challenges of the pandemic are kids are with their parents much more than they were.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_02: So the more parents understand the process of learning, how kids learn and all of that, um, the the the better.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_02: You referenced something earlier, I just want to come back to about the social aspect of education, which for many kids, most kids right now is absent, you know, sitting in front of a Zoom screen.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's a terrible loss for a child.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's a terrible loss for everybody.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_02: I I coach a bunch of high school seniors.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_02: This has to be the worst time in history to be a high school senior.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_02: They're not having a senior year.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's terrible.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_02: So the social part is critical.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_02: But what also is the point of the social part?
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_02: And you actually touched on this, which is to learn about each other and to contribute to each other.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_02: Now that you can still do in a Zoom room.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: That would take some work, but diversity and inclusion are such huge topics in our country now for good reason.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_02: That this whole Zoom environment could actually be a greenhouse for those two, I don't want to call them subjects, those two experiences of diversity and inclusion.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's and this touches a lot on what you're saying about creating a we culture versus an I culture.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's this uh a large majority of this conversation uh our experiences are is over experiences garnered with other people, with the people around you.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: Because at the end of the day, once you grow up and you're out of out of the education system, it's your value, I would say, uh that might be a very definite way of putting it, but part of the value that you provide in this world is how you interact with the the people around you, whether it's in personal relationships or in work relationships.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and it is an interesting um thing to talk about because education is so personal.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's all about you, all about every individual student.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: You learn this, you learn this, you do well on this test, you graduate here, you go here.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, how to mix that with uh a system that teaches the value, like the actual worth of working with your peers.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I I have I think a good answer to that.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_02: When I was um a teenager, a young teenager, I got really interested, passionately interested in having pen pals.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_02: So that meant um these were the days.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_02: Have you ever heard of a letter?
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_02: I write lots of letters.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I'm just joking.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry to pull you over here.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: This is like boomer.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I have my own personal wax seal, man.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I love it, dude.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: That's great.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: That's I love it.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so glad to hear that.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_02: No, you know, so I had 15 pen pals all over the world.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_02: Rad.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: And it was it was rad.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_02: It was like, you know, those letters came, these colorful envelopes, airmail, you know, birthdays, Christmas, we exchanged presents.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_02: There was no Zoom, there was no, we couldn't make phone calls, but it was it what we learned, you know, people sent books, cut picture books of their country.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_02: You know, the learning was so personal and it was, it was, had an intimacy to it that you got to know those people.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_02: Well, check this out.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_02: You know, 2021, you can do that in a minute.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_02: You could, you could, I could, I could connect with a teacher in Zimbabwe who could show me her classroom and we could talk about what their challenges are.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_02: Microsoft had a very wonderful program, Microsoft Classroom or in the classroom, they disbanded.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not sure why.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: But I was getting invitations from all over the world to talk to classes of kids.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_02: It was fabulous.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_02: It was wonderful.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_02: So, so what I'm trying to say to you is that there's so many opportunities to learn about other people and to learn about other cultures, to appreciate other cultures, to find ways to interact with other cultures that weren't even available to us before.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: And they're so immediate now.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's it makes me think of something, and I'd love to hear your perspective on this, uh, maybe especially as a psychologist, which is something that I started writing letters mostly as thank yous, and then they turned into more of personal commentaries and questions, and it kind of spiraled out of control until I was just when I read something interesting, I'd write it down and send to a friend.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and so I would just be sending passages of books to friends.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: Something that I didn't realize until years after I had started writing them was how much they were impacting me.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so when I look back on this catalog of letters I have, because I'll take pictures of them before I uh send them, is they I had this realization they might have more influence on me than they do on the person receiving them because it takes me back to the moments where I thought what I should be writing, or the moments of how much should I divulge to this person?
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_00: What's my real connection to this person?
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: What will they think?
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so there's this aspect of uh of of receiving that I got from really giving to other people.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_00: That's beautifully put.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_02: That's wonderful.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and we before we started talking today, we had a little conversation about reflection, right?
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_02: That reflection is one aspect of action.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_02: But and what you're talking about touches on that reflective moment about what you're doing, you know, what it means to you, what it means to them, how you grow from it.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_02: Um we don't really nourish that kind of reflection.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_02: We encourage a whole bunch of different kinds of thinking, but not that kind of reflection that you're talking about.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, that's um, you know, you're really thinking about reflecting on your your own life, your impact on others, why so many different things.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's great.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: I guess my and I appreciate that.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: My my uh the reason I brought it up was I think it relates to what you were talking about of having these pen pals or of of uh Zoom interviews across the world in Zimbabwe, is that you know, I think it does touch on this topic of of action versus reflection or action versus thinking, which is you don't necessarily have things to reflect on until you have acted.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: Beautiful.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: That's true.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's true.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's the problem, that's the the Cartesian um dilemma.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_02: I think therefore I am.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I act, therefore I am, and I think because I act, right?
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_02: So so um uh there was a philosopher in um Scotland, very, very well known, uh, gave um broadcasts during World War II over the BBC, John McMurray.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_02: And he spoke his two books, one was uh The Self as Agent, and the other one was Persons in Relation.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_02: And he's conceived, he perceived the world as community, persons in relation.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_02: That's our fabric, and that within that were the self as agent, that the self is an active, active being.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: And then within activity, there was this activity of thinking.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_02: And the way he characterized it was action is the positive, it's constituted by its own negative, which is thinking.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_02: Now, he didn't mean negative bad, negative, you know, put down.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_02: He meant just negative in the sense of almost mathematical, taking away from, withdrawing.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_02: When we think we're not we're not engaged in the world, but we need we do think that's what we do as human beings.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_02: The key of that thinking, if it comes from action, would be just what you're saying that you had that experience writing letters.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_02: It would be to feed back into your action.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_02: You know, an education policy or and practice that was built on that understanding would be immensely engaging, meaningful, and purposeful.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: I this leads into something that uh I've actually thought about quite a bit, which is in our conversations over the past couple months since we've met, you are incredibly intentional with your time, or at least that's the way it seems from my perspective.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you value your time and the way that you get to spend it.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that leads from this idea of actions being the way that you integrate into the world and associate and the way that you kind of lead a legacy.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_00: Why is it important for you as a person to spend your time so wisely, to spend it uh so intentionally?
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_02: Because I'm married to a woman for 27 years who who got me clear on like, what are you doing, you know, when you're jumping from this to that, to this to that.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_02: So um God bless my wife.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, because uh she helped me to see that I needed to be more intentional.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm not there yet.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_02: I mean my wife is the most intentional person with the phone.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_02: Well, she's a writer, she she was a very uh prominent screenwriter in Hong Kong, and now she's writing a novel.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_02: And she um, I mean, we're talking about the the personification of discipline in terms of how, you know, so so living together for 27 years and and seeing, you know, going through my period of rebellion, like, no, I don't need to do that, I do it the way I want, you know, I'm spontaneous and blah, blah, blah.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: And it was like, you know, she'd roll her eyes, like, okay, Mr.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_02: Spontaneity, you know.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but and of course, it's, you know, I am who I am, she is who she is.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_02: But in this, in this amazing marriage that we have, really learning from each other, um, that I want the time to be purposeful.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_02: I want to be able to contribute at my best.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm still working at every day.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_02: You know, every day I'm I'm working at like doing the things that are essential for my health, exercising, right?
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_02: Sure, watching my diet.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um, my wife announced a couple months ago she's living to the age of 120.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_00: Good for her.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, good for her, but I better get with the program.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_02: That's a good point, right?
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_02: So, so like let's up the intentionality factor here.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so but what was your question about that?
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry if I lost it.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: No, it was just well, this actually leads into another question or kind of point following that.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_00: The original question was just why is it important to you to to to spend your time intentionally?
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_00: What do you gain from it?
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_00: But what I hear from that is really something that kind of I wouldn't say summarizes the conversation we've been having so far, but one of the the philosophies behind it or commentaries, which is you gain so much from interacting with the world around you.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_00: And when I ask you what is important about spending your time intentionally, you say, Well, I learned this from my wife, right?
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: It was from acting and creating a strong relationship with someone that I love, that I learned something more important about how to spend my time.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_02: Well, so now that that you're and you're helping me by by reiterating that, because I want to go further with it.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I didn't learn it, even though my wife is this one, yes, I learned some of it from her.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_02: What I learned from her was that she was a very effective, if not a mirror that I wanted to gravitate toward, okay?
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_02: But she was a very effective mirror.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_02: Now, let's go a little further with this business of intentionality.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_02: Why is it important?
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, you know enough about my work that I've created a model, a training model for people to perform at their best.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_02: And my work with clients, athletes, professional amateur dentists, uh, lawyers, uh, parents, uh, test takers of every age to uh work with people to reach their potential, to improve their performance so that they can actually actualize their potential.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_02: What I found in creating this model over the last 40 years is that there are three states that are optimal states for optimal performance.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_02: And the three states are being calm and confident and focused.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_02: Those relate to body, mind, and spirit.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_02: Calm in the body, confidence in the mind, what you're telling yourself about yourself is positive, and focus, which is focused in the spirit.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_02: This is really good that we're talking about this because it connects so much into what we saw talking about earlier.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_02: Intentionality relates to focus.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_02: Focus relates to the spirit.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_02: So this is this is tough to talk about because we have so uh marginalized, if not pushed off the map, spirit from education because we so conflated it with religion.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_02: Nothing wrong with religion.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_02: But but what is spirit?
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_02: Spirit is that fire within us.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_02: But how how does that then relate to focus?
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_02: Well, if body wants to be calm, so you can deal with any challenge.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_02: If mind wants to be confident, so you can deal with any challenge.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_02: How, what about dealing with all the daily challenges?
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_02: You want to be focused.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_02: What does focus mean?
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_02: It means it's an act, it's a noun and a verb.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_02: The noun is the goal.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_02: Think of basketball, the net, getting the ball in the net.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_02: The verb of focus is the actions that you take to the goal.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_02: Now, why is this related to spirit?
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_02: Because our spirit, you wanna you want to create a great podcast.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_02: I want to be the best husband and best you know, brother and best psychologist I can be.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_02: That's from your spirit.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_02: That's where that's coming from.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_02: Spirit wants to need to be focused, it needs to have a goal and take actions that get to the goal.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_02: Where fo the word focus comes from the Latin, which means hearth or fireplace.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_02: Check this out.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_02: Hearth or fireplace.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_02: So think of hearth.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_02: So, okay, here I love that.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_02: This is not a test, Flint.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_02: When you think of hearth or fireplace, what comes up in your mind?
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I just imagine a couple of the fireplaces in my life that I've spent the most time gravitating towards.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and what about them?
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_00: What were the quality?
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_00: What were their qualities?
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_00: Generally, they were places uh where I was surrounded by family.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_02: Beautiful.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_02: So it's so hearth or fireplace, go way back to ancient times, was the center of the home, right?
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_02: Which brought the community together.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: It was also the place of light and heat.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_02: Let's go all the way back, right?
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_02: Of cooking, of nourishment.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_02: So, so think of that as the of all the qualities of the spirit.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_02: When you get focused, that's it's giving off that light, that heat, that community, all of that, that's happening as you get focused.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_02: So we go back to the conversation about intentionality.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_02: That's what intentionality is is springing out of.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_00: I love that analogy because it's so accurate.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_00: The uh the experience of being incredibly focused is one of passion, I would say.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the times that I look back on moments where I was unbelievably focused, whether it was for a two-hour period of studying or as a six-hour or a six-month period on a project, is an intense passion, which is fire, right?
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_00: Associated with a desire to create something.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, uh we've known each other from before you started this podcast.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_02: Look what you've done with the podcast.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_02: That's your that's been your focus and you love it clearly, right?
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_02: You're really engaging it.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_02: You love it.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it's also an offering to the world.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's something where you are contributing to other people.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_02: Whoever listens to this will get something, you know, from it.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_02: They'll either learn something or they'll they'll pass it on to a friend, or they'll say, I don't want to listen to that guy anymore.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: Whatever it is, you know.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_02: But but but you know what I'm saying is that yes, that's exactly what it is.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's the spirit, we the spirit is moving through us.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_02: So another way to put this, which is going to sound religious, but it is not exactly, is that it's God, it's it's God speaking through you.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_02: It's your spirit speaking through it, your God, your goddess, your higher power, whatever it is, each of us has that coming through us.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_02: We've all given it different names, and I'm not attached to any one name, but but I am very much in the ballpark of everyone, everyone is getting direction from their spirit 24-7-365.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_02: And the key to to really optimal living is how much you listen and how much you follow through.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_02: What makes great Olympic athletes Olympic athletes is because they are tuned to that place on their dial.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they are following that place.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_02: What's that?
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_02: And they act, and they act, yeah.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so here's the this is for you and also for everyone who's listening.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, Flint, what are your initials?
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_02: Ftm.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_02: Beautiful.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so put a big K in front of those.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_02: What do you get?
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_02: K F T M.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: F T M.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: Great.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so we're on we're west of the Mississippi, KFTM.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_02: I would be KBBB, KQE D.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_02: What does that sound like to you?
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_02: Radio station.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_02: Dude, that's your radio station.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_02: That is broadcasting to you 247-365.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_02: You get this?
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_02: So, what's our human thing about not about being distracted is that we hear that, you know, you're on a diet, have the apple, not the cookie.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, no, well, wait a minute.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_02: I'll start the diet tomorrow.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: We're flipping the dial.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_02: But if you want to put that in another term, excuse me.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_02: If you want to put that in another term, it's like saying, God, I hear you, excuse me, I have another call coming through.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_02: I'll call you back.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_02: Put God on hold.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_02: Try it.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't work.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_00: No, I and I love that you use uh I God as the the the noun here.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I don't think that you have to be religious to understand the importance of the this the symbolism behind it, right?
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's more, I would say, I want to say it's more than the symbolism.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_02: I would call it the force.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_02: So the rabbi that I've been you know studying with over years and has a wonderful definition of God, which is God is the force of healing and transformation from what is to what ought to be.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_02: God is the force of healing and transformation from what is to what ought to be.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: And that ought to be is already embedded in you.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_02: In other words, that ought to be has been growing from the time of your conception to the time of your death.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think that that puts us actually in a really cool place that circles back on a lot of the conversation, which is a way I was trying to deliver a summary of the points you had made in the podcast I listened to of you and of your blog posts, was this is what you believe that the education system should serve the purpose of, which is which is showing kids, showing the youth, showing anyone really as they grow up that there is a force within you that is leading you places that you believe you really should go, and and inspiring people to listen to that and then to gain experiences and to act and and live in a world with people around you so that you can contribute to this world.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's all about this this spirit within you and garnering that in a positive light.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_02: So everything you said is great and accurate.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just going to turn it upside down a little bit.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: Because it really proceeds from this part about we're all born into a community.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_02: So the first thing we learn is that we're part of a whole.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_02: And all what we call primitive cultures, how primitive are they?
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_02: Because they Got this.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_02: The family, the community, of course, there are issues and all of those things.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_02: There's going to be issues about everything.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_02: We're human beings.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_02: But but if as we as we learn about our connection, our responsibility to each other, and all of the rest of what you said comes into that, comes through that, you know, what a world this could be.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: There is a way that uh I've been doing some writing actually, as you know, and there's a a passage that I wrote that the analogy I used was you start off as kind of a thread in the world.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_00: And the more you act with the community around you, and the more you integrate your message and your expression into the world, the more you weave yourself into the tapestry or the blanket that is.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_02: That's wonderful.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's I think it's powerful.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think that's a pretty great place to wrap up.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_00: I think we've touched on a lot of uh really inspiring topics.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_00: This is a conversation we talked briefly about this podcast before.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_00: Why am I doing it?
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's to have conversations like the like this, where I think that not only people listening will be inspired to to think about this topic of the force of the fire within you, but also that I know that I will after this.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll go, I'll leave this this podcast uh discussion and be inspired to chase my own dreams, my own goals.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I really want to appreciate you.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I want to appreciate you coming on the show.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: I just have one last question, which is, and this might be a tough one, really, is looking back over this conversation.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_00: Is there one topic, is there one uh comment or message you would want a listener to take out of it?
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_02: Well, uh that bears a little reflection.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_02: So let me give let me um you can tick tock, tick tock.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_02: And um, I'm thinking if there's the one message is is that each of us is here to serve.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_02: Each of us is here to give.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_02: I heard a philosopher speak uh on the radio about a year ago.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_02: We're we're built to be givers, not takers.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_02: And that there is enough for everyone, for everyone.
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_02: And the more that we realize as and make real ourselves as members of a very, very large, diverse, rich world community, the more we have that we can really give each other and the more we will receive.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_02: Love it.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_02: That's wonderful.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_00: What would be a way for the listeners to find out more about you or or resources that you have?
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_02: So, website to start with, which is D-R-B, Y-O-U-R-Best, Dr.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_02: B, just the letter B your best dot com.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_02: That's the website.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_02: I am shedding my dinosaur technosur status, and I'm getting on all social media.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so excited.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_02: I have these fabulous interns.
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_02: I had a whole group last summer, and now I have some more, and we are just getting out there Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, the work, Dr.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_02: B, some form of Dr.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_02: B, your best.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_02: No, I'm I'm it's just like I'm learning about all this stuff, and it's wonderful.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's really great, you know, to get out there and to to do it.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I spent 40 years basically in an office, you know, cultivating this work and myself and working with people.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_02: And now I see, you know, I just view it like my life as a tree, you know, that it took years to really grow and get strong and big.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_02: And now I'm bearing fruit.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's what it feels like.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_02: And all my experiences, which a lot were very hard for years and years, with all kinds of you know, psychological issues that I had to come through, um, is all purposeful.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I don't regret any of it, it's purposeful.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_02: So um, yeah, my website is great, social media is great.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: I'm writing a book now.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_02: Tentative title is The Three Steps to Optimal Living Accept, Grow, and Contribute.
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe you'll invite me back and I can talk about that sometime.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'd love to.
• 48:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah, so but you better get me a Hawaiian shirt next time.
• 48:18
  SPEAKER_02: I call it Aloha shirts, my friend.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, well, excuse me, pardon me.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_02: Aloha.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_02: So, yeah, so that that would be a precursor to the next um next podcast.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_02: But I'm delighted to be here.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I have to say that, you know, uh talking to you originally and just hearing about your writing first and and how reflective you are, and that how that has really developed into this podcast that you can share more of your your enthusiasm and your curiosity and all the things that are really great qualities.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm I'm not flattering here to flatter you, but I am here to say I appreciate what you're doing.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you very much.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_00: If you like this episode of Seeking Authenticity, that's freaking awesome.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_00: All I want to ask of you, the listener, in return for the time and effort I put into making it, is that you take a deep breath.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean really breathe.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_00: Breathe so that it stretches out your shoulders and your back and your chest and pushes out your stomach.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_00: No more of these shallow, bullshit breaths.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_00: They're barely keeping you alive, my friend.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_00: And after you exhale, go out and soak up today.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_00: Because in the end, your actions and the way they interact with the world and the people around you right now are all you have in this life.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_00: So be authentic with them.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_00: Peace.