Latest / Drawn of History / Mark Zuckerberg _ This Past Weekend w_ Theo Von _579(M4A_128K)

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Mark Zuckerberg _ This Past Weekend w_ Theo Von _579(M4A_128K) · Drawn of History

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I have some tour dates to tell you about. Miami,
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  Speaker 1: Florida on May 10th. Cedar Rapids, Iowa on June 19th.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: St.
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• 0:13
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• 0:17
  Speaker 1: in the Canada. All tickets at theovon.com slash T-O-U-R. Please
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: go through those links so you get accurate pricing. And
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: I appreciate your support for the return of the rat tour.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Today's guest is an entrepreneur. He's an inventor. He's a philanthropist.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: He is one of the richest men in the world.
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: And a consensus of wealth and power exists in only
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: so few people. He co-founded Facebook in 2004 when he
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: was 19 years old. The company that turned into Meta.
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: which is where we are today in their headquarters. I'm
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: thankful to spend time and get to know Mr. Mark Zuckerberg.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: You drink coffee, man, or no?
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: Nah.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: Really? Yeah. I mean, you've had it. I have.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Sometimes on vacation, I'll drink it recreationally. It's like every
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: once in a while.
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: Just like a celebration.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Really? Yeah, no. I just hate anything that messes with it.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: I don't like any kind of chemicals or anything like that. Oh, really?
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: So you just like to keep everything the equilibrium? Yeah.
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, my sister gives me such a hard time about this.
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: She's like, you're just sitting there raw-dogging reality.
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: Wow. It's kind of true. But you've had it before, yeah,
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: but you just don't like it.
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't like it.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: So when you get up in the morning, that's not
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: your thing? Is there something you do?
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: No, no, no, yeah. I mean, I wake up and
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: I fight people. Yeah. Yeah, no, I mean, I wake
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: up in the morning. Are we going, by the way?
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: I mean, we should get this.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're going.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: What's up?
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: Oh, you mean you wake up and do jiu-jitsu, you mean?
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah. So I probably wake up like, I don't know, seven,
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: seven 30, whenever like the kids start making noise around
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: the house, it's like, all right, sleep is done. Yeah. And,
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: and then like, it's like, I look at my phone
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: and I'm just like, all these things that these people
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: are doing, like you did what? Are you fucking kidding me?
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: It's like, I have to go fucking deal with this.
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: It's like, like, it's like this partner, are you really?
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: God damn it. All right. So, and then it's like,
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: I compose myself and, go fight for two hours, like
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: recenter myself. Then it's like, now I can go deal
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: with the stuff, but no, it's, um.
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: So that helps. It's almost like your coffee in the
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: morning sometimes like rolling, like rolling jujitsu kind of.
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I mean, right now I'm, I'm doing more striking. So,
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's really fun. I just, I think it's
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: like the greatest sport. I mean, it's, um, it's like
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: neurologically stimulating. It's, uh, you know, it's good cardio, good strength.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah.
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: Um, a little bit of a threat, right? So it
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: keeps you on, you know, it's not, not like just
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: like running. I used to like run around the neighborhood,
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: but running is not that thrilling.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: Running compared to jujitsu is for, running is a, running
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: is not really neat once you can do jujitsu.
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: Because I think.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: One cool thing about jujitsu is just like, you can
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: lose a match with somebody, right? You can lose like,
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: like they can submit you, but you'll learn something along
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: the way, right? And they, they, A lot of times
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: the guy submitting you also wants to help you learn, too.
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: So it's like you can lose and win at the
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: same time. I think that's what's kind of masterful about it.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. Do you do it?
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: I don't do it as much as I would like to,
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: you know?
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I used to do it a lot.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: No, I never got into striking, but I would just
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: kind of like, but I would just do jujitsu on
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: the mats, you know?
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's so fun. It's just like fun to
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: do with friends.
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, and some guy chokes you so hard. And
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: then you're just like, God, you're like, ugh.
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: It's a good day.
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah. It's a cup of coffee.
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: If a big fella just squeezes you until you can't
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: handle it, it's a cup of coffee.
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: Better than caffeine for me.
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I'm just not into that stuff.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: Is there like a vitamin or some staple that you
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: kind of keep in your diet? If it's not caffeine,
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: is there some like... I mean, I drink a very.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: Large amount of protein. I mean, creatine. Do you count that?
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Vitamin D, like all that stuff. Yeah.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: Vitamin's good, but... But like, yeah.
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: It's not your thing.
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: No.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: No, never been my thing. I, um, you know, we're not,
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: we saw each other at the UFC and you and
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: your wife were there, right?
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: Uh, yeah. Which one was that?
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to think. It wasn't 312.
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: It was that, that was Alex fighting Magomed.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I was sad about that, man.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: Did your wife, I could see she could like really, it,
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: it like, she was like head in her hand sometimes. Yeah.
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: No, I think, um, she, uh, I think she would
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: say she enjoys it, but I think she mostly goes to, uh,
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: to support me. Um, yeah, she's into it. I think, um,
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: you know, it's tough. I mean, we've gotten to know
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: a bunch of the fighters and it's just like when
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: you see someone who, you know, and like get hit
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: or go down, that's like, that's tough.
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's like, I've gotten to, uh, like train
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: with Volk a few times and, um, We were there
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: at 2.98 when he fought Ilya.
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: And that was really tough. Didn't you get to walk
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: out with him or no?
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, he asked me to walk out with him.
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: And I was like, all right, yeah, this will be
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: a cool experience. And then I'm just standing there while
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: they're walking. Did you see that whole meme where he's
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: passing off all his clothes? And I'm just sitting there useless. Yeah, no,
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: there you go. That was a fun one.
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: Was that scary? Because I guess you feel like, yeah,
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: what do I do now?
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: No, I mean, this was a fun moment, but, but
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: I mean, but watching him, um, get hit by Ilya. So,
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: I mean, it was like right cage shot. It was
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: like three feet from us. And I mean, he's like
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: a big, he's like a tough guy. Right. And, uh,
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: so that, that was, that was tough. Um, but something
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: after that Priscilla was like, oh man, I don't know
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: if I can go watch Vulcan in person again, but,
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: but we, I mean, you know, I mean, we just
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: have friends over. It was fun watching him fight Diego.
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: It was good.
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: It was a great fight. Great.
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: Um, was awesome, tough, tough moments and round two and four,
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: but he's his heart, man. Like, I mean the way
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: he described it after of like, did you see the
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: shot in round four where Diego grazed his eyelid with
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: his glove?
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: And he lost his vision and, and he like, and
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: you could see it was kind of like, like just
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: the head movement and everything trying to stay in a
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: good place, watching an.
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: Animal, try to survive on one of those animal planet
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: shows or something. When you're cheering for the, you know,
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: you're like, oh, it's not going to go well, but.
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: Then he does good. Yeah, no. He's an amazing guy.
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: He's really cool. Very talented, a lot of heart.
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. And you get to know some of the fighters.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: I think that's one thing that is great about social
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: media these days, is that you get to know the
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: fighters a little bit more, some of their regular life. Like,
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: you can get involved in who they are.
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, totally.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: So that gives you so much more of a person
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: to cheer for. Is it tough to take your wife,
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: since you're a, and I'm just going to say this.
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: Go for it.
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: Go for it. I'm going to say the word really
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: fast just so it's like she won't dwell on it,
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: but since you're a billionaire, is it tough to take
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: your wife on a date? Do you have to live
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: up to a standard? Or what's a nice date night?
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: What is that like?
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: I don't know. No, I think she's pretty chill.
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: She's a chillionaire, huh?
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: Sorry. There you go.
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: My niece will like it.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there you go. No, I mean, I think the
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: main thing for me is like, like life is busy.
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: There's like a million things that I could be doing
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: at any given point in time. I just think it's
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: important to like take time, you know, each week, like,
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: you know, Wednesday night, we really try to have a
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: date night, you know, try to hang out with the
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: kids and put them to bed every night. It's like,
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: that's just like an important part of my routine. I
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: think that's important stuff to do. But no, I mean,
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: we try to like go out somewhere, but every once
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: in a while we'll just cook or eat at home
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: and that's all good. The UFC stuff, I think, is
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: probably more for me than for her. But she's a
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: good sport about it.
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: Is there something you'll do for her? Or is there
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: like a fancy date? Because you can afford to take
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: your wife on like a date that a lot of
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: us could only dream of, right? That most people could
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: only dream of. Is there something that you're like a...
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: Is there some magical date that you took her on
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: one time? I don't know. That is a good question.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: Let's see.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: She's pretty simple on this stuff. I think most of the...
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: you know, I, I like doing, I like making things, right?
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: So I don't know if you saw this thing. I like, I,
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: I like working with like great artists and stuff. So
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: I did this project where I've always admired Daniel Arsham and, and, um, he's,
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: he's this like great sculptor and we, and I, I
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: worked with him to make this sculpture of Priscilla because
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: I thought it was cool. And, um, yeah, you're pulling
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: this up and the, and like, first of all, I
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: think it's like, you know, make a sculpture of Priscilla
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: partially because that's cool, partially because I'm like, I'm not
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: going to make a sculpture of myself. It's like, that's crazy, right?
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: It's like, who the fuck does that? So it's like,
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: she's kind of the target of my creative energy.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: In a lot of places.
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: Like the muse, in a way. So there's all these
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: memes online after, yeah, there you go, where people are like, wow,
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: I wonder what Zuckerberg did wrong that he had to
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: make a sculpture of his wife. And I'm like, no,
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: you guys are totally missing this this is the thing
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: i did wrong it's like you can't like you're gonna
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: have to wait to see what i have to do
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: to make up for having made a sculpture and putting
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: it on our front lawn it's like she didn't want
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: a sculpture of her in the front lawn it's like
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: that's that's weird right it's like you know it's but
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: um No, but she's a good sport about it.
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: And at least you can tell the doordash guy, like,
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: just set it by the sculpture.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, just by the sculpture. Yeah, yeah.
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: That's kind of nice. It becomes like a.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: I think having, like, a woman as your lookout in
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: your yard is kind of nice, you know?
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's got, like, a good angelic form factor thing.
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: It's a good vibe.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: Did she make you make any adjustments to it, or
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: was she like, okay, I'll accept it as is?
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: No, I mean, I don't think she was that happy
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: with it. Because, again, I mean, like, who wants a...
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: sculpture of themselves and in the, in the, in the
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: front yard. But, um, but you know, I think she
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: thinks it's sweet and I think she appreciates that. Um,
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: I mean, there's a lot of like more destructive things
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: I could be doing with my creative energy. Yeah.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: You made an effort too.
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, and so it's like, I
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: designed her this, um, this, uh, Porsche minivan thing. It's like,
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: we took like a cayenne and extended it to be bigger.
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: And it's like, I do that. Cause it's like, all right,
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: I like cars, but I'm not gonna design a super
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: car for myself. Let's like just design a sweet minivan
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: for my wife.
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, it was just fun. Yeah.
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: So I guess creative stuff like that, trying to be
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: creative and show her some creativity. Oh, that's nice.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: There you go. I mean, look at that. And where
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: did you meet your wife at? Um, I met her
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: in school. So we were in college and I had
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: just done this prank. and all my friends and everyone
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: was convinced, we were all convinced I was going to
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: get thrown out of school.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: Okay, and where were you in school at, Mark?
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: Harvard.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: And so I was a sophomore. She was a freshman.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: My friends were convinced I was about to get kicked
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: out of school. I was like going in front of
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: this like trial for the kind of like school discipline committee.
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: My friends threw a going away party for me, and
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: it was in the bathroom line at the end of
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: the party where I was just like, next to Priscilla
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: and we were talking.
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: He had nothing to lose. It was your last meal.
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: I was just like, look, man, like it's, you know,
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: have pride and say man, but it's, um, it was not,
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: not very romantic situation. It's like, we're waiting in line
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: for the bathroom. She's just funny. She, she, she's cute.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: And it's like, I was like, all right, Hey, you know,
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: if we're going to go out, we better go do
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: this quickly because I'm probably going to get kicked out
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: of school in like two or three days. It's like,
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: that's a good pickup line, right? It's like, yeah, that's
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: how you really show that you have potential in the world, right? Well,
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: it's a limited time offer. Yeah, but it's not like
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: very aspirational. It's like, hey, that's true. It's like, I'm
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: going nowhere in life and I'm about to get kicked
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: out of school. So you're going to want to, you know,
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: You're going to want to go out with me really quickly. Right.
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess another way to look at it is
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: very sail rack in a way, you know?
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: Very sail rack, yeah. But everyone I knew thought that
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: this whole thing was over. I mean, my parents drove up.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: We lived in New York. They drove up to help
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: me pack up my dorm room because they were like,
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: it's over. You're coming home. Yeah. But....
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: It didn't.
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: Then of course I made Facebook and a few months
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: later I dropped out anyway. So jokes on them. But
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: that's how, yeah, no, that's how it went.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: Did you have to go to the trial at school
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: or you didn't?
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: Oh no, I did. Oh, you did? And it was like,
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: the questions that they asked were even worse than the
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: questions that I get at like the congressional hearings. It
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: was like, don't you know that once you put this
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: terrible prank website online, it is there forever. And it's like, No, actually,
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: that's not how it works. The site's already down. They're like,
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: you're a smartass. And I'm like, yeah, that's probably true.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: That's probably true. But half of a smartass also is smart.
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: So that's good.
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: I'll take that.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: It's better than being a dumbass.
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, it's like maybe smart and a
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: little bit of an ass. Yeah. It works.
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd rather be a smartass, I think. Do you
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: know about, what was a prank site?
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: What was it?
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: That wasn't Facebook, though.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: No, no. It was this thing called FaceMash, which... You know,
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: in the whole lore of the thing, there's this whole
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: movie that got made about all this stuff. They made
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: it seem like FaceMash was a predecessor to Facebook. It wasn't.
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: When I was in college, I just liked making things.
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: So whether it's statues or minivans or internets or glasses,
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: like whatever, you know, I just like making stuff.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: You like being creative.
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so like I... So it was.
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: It was, it was, it was very mean spirited. It
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: was very mean spirited. I basically, I downloaded everyone's ID photos, um,
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: from their ID cards. And I made the site where
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: it showed two photos and you clicked on the person
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: you thought was more attractive. And then it used, and
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: it basically looked, took all the matchups and ranked everyone
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: in the school based on, um, who everyone thought was
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: the most attractive, very mean spirited in retrospect. Um, Not
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: connected to Facebook in any way. Right, but just like a...
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: Just like a college kid kind of being a jerk.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: But, you know, it's like, okay, so that was not
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: my best move.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: But you got to take, you know, it's baby steps.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: I mean, yeah.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: And also pretty cool to make something.
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: Some of the things I did were useful and fun.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: That one, I put it together in a weekend.
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: Not my best work as, um, yeah, no, not my
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: best work, but that's fair.
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: Not your best work, you know?
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: We've all had things that we made that weren't, you know,
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: that weren't the best. Probably. Did you, um, let me
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: think what I'm gonna ask you. Oh, did you, um,
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: what kind of car do you drive? What kind of
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: car do you drive?
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: Uh, right now, black wings, CT, CT five. Um, I mean,
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: it's a Cadillac. It's nice. It's, um, it's, uh, here,
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: pull it up. It's, uh, I really like driving manual
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: transmission cars.
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: I like that type of thing, baby. It's a good one.
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: Oh, God, that's nice.
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: That thing will just shift. That thing just gets shifty
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: out there.
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: No, it's good. It's good.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: It's got a nice little ass on it.
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: I feel like you want your car to have almost
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: as much horsepower as your helicopter. I feel like it's
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: a rule of thumb.
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: It's probably a rule of a very rich thumb.
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: So for a while, okay, so my security team kind
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: of convinced me for like 10 years that I should
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: just let them drive me places. Which, I mean, realistically,
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: I probably should. But then eventually I was just like,
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: I can't do this. It's like I need the freedom.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: I need to be able to drive myself. So I
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: started learning how to fly helicopters. And Then it's like,
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: all right, well, this is just ridiculous. It's like we
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: have the security team driving me to my helicopter that
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: I then go fly away. It's like, that makes no sense.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: It's like, I'll just, let's just go, let's get a car.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: It's kind of Batman. It's almost as a Batman vibe,
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: but I guess it is true because then you're just
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: by yourself out there.
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: What do you mean?
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: Or you take somebody with you in the car. Oh, no, no, no.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: In the car or the helicopter?
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: In the helicopter.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: Helicopter, yeah, definitely have like a real professional pilot fly
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: with me.
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's wild though.
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: But I guess a chopper would get you somewhere pretty quick, right? Yeah.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's a good tool to have in the arsenal. Unreal.
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: You're like a damn emperor, dude. Does that feel like
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: that ever?
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: No, no, no. Man, it's like I feel like I
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: wish that people did what I wanted them to do.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: It's like that would be fun. But in the meantime,
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: you can have some fun.
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: I would have a chopper. I don't even know what
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: I would have. I would have an underground tunnel, even
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: though it came right back up next to where it started.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: I do have an underground tunnel.
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: Do you really?
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah. In USA?
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: Well, there's this ranch in Kauai, yeah, where there's this
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: whole thing where people are like, there's this whole meme
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: about how people are saying I built this bunker underground.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: It's more of underground storage type situation. Bring it up.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: But yeah, no, it's a.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow. Zucky got that bunkie. What's under the ground?
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: There's more water, right?
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: It's basically what you just said. It's sort of a
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: tunnel that just goes to another building. Yeah.
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: It's a good place to hide a little bit of
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: dope though. That's what I would say, dude. Those are
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: the good, that's what I would do anyway.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: But, um, you and I defer there.
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: So you don't use, you've never used drugs or, I mean,
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Dare really worked on me when I
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: was in third grade. It's like, I don't know. There's
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: all this stuff about how it like, how it backfired
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: and like it just kind of taught people how to
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: use drugs. For me, it like really scared me. It
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: was like, I don't know. I don't like any of
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: that stuff. It's like a friend will show up and
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: be like, oh, I was like getting an IV to
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: feel better. It's like, I don't even want people to
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: like extend their arm and show me their vein. Like
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: it's like that shit, like no. Not me, not me.
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true, dude.
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: No, I'm raw-dogging reality, as my sister says. God! Yeah, no, it's...
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: There's kind of a.
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: That's kind of insane, really, these days. It used to
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: be kind of that somebody who was, like, really straight-edge
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: and sober, that that was a nerdy thing, I think.
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: But now, I never even thought about it before. Now
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: that's almost the most insane thing you can do. It's like, wait,
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: you're under the influence of nothing.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: Nothing, nothing.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: From sunup to sundown.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: You're a fucking animal.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: You know, it's kind of crazy that it's that, that
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: things have gone. That's that, uh, that, that the perspective
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: of that has kind of changed. How big is that tunnel?
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: Is your tunnel pretty big or what's it like?
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: Uh, it's not that big of a tunnel. It's, uh,
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: I made a, I put a reel on Instagram one
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: day of, um, of, of Priscilla kind of making fun
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: of me playing video games with some friends down there,
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: but it's, uh, uh, uh yeah no it's it's it's
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: it's all good.
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: Um yes definitely but this is a crazy area i
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: haven't spent a lot of time you know.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: How the internet is the internet will will always make
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: things seem like they're crazier than they are but you
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: know what's an under i mean and in hawaii it's
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: like having a having a little storm shelter underground tunnels that's.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: The thing right there No, I don't think so. That's insane.
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: Is that Roblox? He built it for you.
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: It looks closer to Roblox than what the thing is.
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: Dude, the future is, things are definitely getting weird with cars. Dude,
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: I saw four Waymos meeting up behind the Ikea over here.
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: Having a meeting?
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: Huh?
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: Deciding what they're going to do next? It's just like,
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: what's your next move? Kind of like, where are you going?
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: Who are you?
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it was.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: Have you seen Hot Tub Time Machine?
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: I haven't seen it.
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: You would like that.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: That's good. Yeah, no, I think that there's the self-driving
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: car that's like hunting down the guy who is mean
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: to it. And it's good.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what it seemed like. I don't know if
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: they were smoking a blunt or whatever, but there was
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: four Waymos all meeting. Yeah, I don't know. They were
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: meeting up. I'm like, who are they? What are they doing?
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: And then my buddy said he was in one, and
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: it was crying to him.
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: The Waymo was crying?
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the Waymo was complaining about his spouse or whatever.
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: What form does that take?
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: Is it like speaking English or is it like R2-D2?
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: No, I think he had set it on a British setting.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: So it was like, oh, me missus is really getting
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: at me, no? So I think because you can change
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: the voice to like Indian guy or British guy or
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: whatever or like female or semi-female or whatever. Semi-female. But like, yeah,
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: I just think like, yeah, just some of that Waymo
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: stuff is just getting out of line. I never thought like, oh,
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: what are these cars doing until I saw four of
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: them meeting up. And I was like, this seems like
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: a lot to me. You know? That's where the future
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: starts to get a little bit scary is moments like
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: that where you're like, well, what are they doing?
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: What were they doing? Probably just waiting to pick people up.
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: But they'd have to do it in a group behind
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: an Ikea?
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. That does seem like an unlikely
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: place to pick people up.
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: That's true. And will it just seem.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to defend them.
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: Okay, okay, okay. It just seemed like an interesting place
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: to meet up, you know? Um... Yeah, and then I
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: was in one Waymo, and it was like, do you
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: want to gamble? What? I think it was sponsored by
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: DraftKings or something, and it was like, do you want
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: to gamble with me?
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: In the Waymo?
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, I bet you $ 40 you'll never get
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: where you're going. And it was like, this is insane.
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: As the doors lock.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: It's like, picks up speed.
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. And why are all the Waymos white, too?
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: I'm like, this is, I don't know. I just think
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: we've got to start to diversify the portfolio, I feel like,
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: a little. You know? Yeah. Yeah. But what do I know? You... So,
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: let me switch topics. Sorry, sometimes I get a little
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: bit nervous. Is that all right? Yeah.
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: Okay. I mean, there's no way that you're less nervous
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: than me.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: Let me think about how you said that.
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let me think about that, too. Did I... More nervous,
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: more nervous. Yeah, see, I didn't even say it correctly.
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: Really? Oh, but I think that's a trap. I think
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: that I am... I think I'm more nervous than you.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: You think?
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, man. I wake up... I am a... an alarm clock.
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: That's how I feel all the time. I feel like,
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: what does that mean? I just feel like I'm always,
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: you know, why no, I don't know. I just think
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: I've always felt like that. I've always felt like kind
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: of frenetic, you know, it's like, how do I get
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: things to calm down more than how do I get
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: things to amp up? You know, um, like I'll even
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: wear earplugs a lot of the day now and it
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: makes things a lot easier for me to kind of navigate. Interesting. Yeah,
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: it just makes everything easier to focus on. It makes
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: it easier if I'm doing sauna, steam bath, ice bath,
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: working out, any of those things. It makes it everything.
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: You wear earbuds?
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: I wear earplugs.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: Oh, I see.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: And I wear them all night long. It just makes
• 23:42
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• 25:01
  Speaker 1: to be responsible. Hi everyone, so I've been telling you
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  Speaker 1: guys about MoonPay for a while now, right? And honestly,
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• 25:35
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• 26:19
  Speaker 1: not a source of financial advice. Trade responsibly. Um, you,
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: you dropped out of college, right?
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: And, um, Alexander Wang, he came on one time. We
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: were talking about him earlier. But he had dropped out
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: of college also. Do you think people need college still?
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: Because you have these creative guys who are having success
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: and they didn't go through college. Do you feel like
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: people still need college? What do you feel like that
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: looks like for now and the future?
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: Well, I mean, college... There's a question of how much
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: of it is about the learning and how much of
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: it is about the kind of like learning how to
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: be a grownup before you kind of go out into
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: the world. Um, I mean, for me, it's like the,
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: the classes were fine. I mean, that was fun, sort
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: of entertaining part of, of college, but I mean, I
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: met a lot of people who are really important in
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: my life, right? It's like, I mean, Priscilla, my co-founders at, um,
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: at the company, um, a bunch of people who are
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: still friends, close friends to, to this day. Um, so
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: I think that's almost more of it than, um, than
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: like whatever class you took. Right. Um, but yeah. Yeah.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: That's just, that's social. It's learning to be around others,
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: learning to not be at your parents' house.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I mean, and I went to boarding school
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: for two years. Um, and then before I went to
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: college for two years. So I feel like even though
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: I dropped out of college, I kind of got a
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: full experience in a way, um, on that, but it
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: was good. I feel like you just like, you know,
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: you need some time to, kind of away from home
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: a bit before you like fully go out but um
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: so i don't know i think that'll be a thing
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: um but i do think like a lot of people
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: i'm not sure that college is preparing people for like
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: the jobs that they need to have today i mean
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: i think that's like there's a big issue on that
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: and like all the student debt issues are like really
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: big issues i mean the fact that college is it's
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: just so expensive for so many people and then like
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: you graduate and you're in debt um.
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: Well, you're not even guaranteed a job either. You would
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: think at a certain rate you're paying, you'd be guaranteed
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: some sort of beginner employment. Yeah.
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: And I think that's probably the biggest issue with it
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: is it would be one thing if it were just
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: kind of like a social experience, but you started off neutral.
• 28:40
  Speaker 2: The fact, if it's not preparing you for the jobs
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: that you need and you're kind of starting off in
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: this big hole, then I think that's not good. I mean,
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: that I think there's going to have to be a
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: reckoning with. It's a good point. People are going to
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: have to kind of figure out whether that makes sense.
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: But I don't know, people, it's sort of been this
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: taboo thing to say of like, like maybe not everyone
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: needs to go to college and cause there's like a
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: lot of jobs that don't require that. And, um, but
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: I think people are probably coming around to that opinion
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: a little more now than, than, um, than maybe like
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: 10 years ago. Yeah.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: Do you think, I was just talking earlier, um, with Colin,
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: I think one of your assistants, one of your coworkers, sorry,
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: I didn't want to say assistants, but, um, and we're
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: kind of saying that, um, yeah, like, What classes do
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: you think like kids should be learning now? Because like
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: with AI coming along and with technology starting to like
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: really multiply itself pretty quickly, like our ability to advance
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: is is going to only grow faster. It seems like,
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: would you feel like that's true overall statement?
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, totally. I think it's accelerating. Yeah.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: Accelerating.
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: That's the word I'm looking for. Sorry. So with that happening,
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: what are like, I feel like they should be teaching
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: how to like kind of use AI to children right
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: now in elementary and middle schools. Does that, that sounds
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: very real to me. Do you feel like that that's,
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: Like not how to code or anything, but just how
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: to do it.
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: So, I mean, it's interesting because the technology changes a lot, right?
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: And it's obviously, it's a lot different now than it
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: was 20 years ago when I got started with the
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: company or when I started coding when I was a kid.
• 30:12
  Speaker 2: So it's not like the specific things I learned to
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: code when I was 15 are the skills I'm using today.
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: But you, I don't know, I think that there is
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: something about kind of understanding the technology and understanding how
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: to use it and getting on that train that I
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: think is valuable.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: But the other thing is I just think like having
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: good mentors or teachers, no matter what the actual class is.
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: Like when I was in boarding school, um, I really
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: liked studying Latin and Greek and that's like not useful
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: for any practical thing, but it's like, uh, but it's,
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: it's fun. And like, It's fun. It's fun. It's fun.
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: I think there are parts of it that are fun
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: for sure.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: And the tests that I had to take were, you know, it's,
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: they would, you know, you'd be reading these kind of
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: great works. And the test would be, they'd pull out
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: any word in like whatever the third of a book
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: was that was kind of that, that kind of section
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: of the class. And they'd like show you a sentence
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: and then they'd say, okay, this word, like, give us
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: the full kind of grammatical and, and like poetic significance of,
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: of kind of how this word is used by this
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: author in this piece. So, okay. I'm not like, I'm
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: not that good at language. So the way that I
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: did that class was I basically just sat and studied
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: word by word, the like historical significance of, of each
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: word over like, tens of pages, um, you know, preparing
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: for these exams. And okay. I don't remember that much
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: of that at this point. Right. I mean, there were
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: a few quotes that I think are pretty good from
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: some of those books, but, um, and I put them
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: on shirts, but, um.
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: Have you heard that?
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that's a good one.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: What does that one mean? Let's fall out or whatever.
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: From, from many one. I think it's talking about how
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: we come together as, as a, as a people or
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: as States into one union.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's nice. Um, but no, I, um, But so
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: you did it word by word, but it still helped you.
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: But I just think like the lesson from that is,
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: you know, it kind of gave me this confidence that
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: it's like, okay, that was like a crazy thing to do, right?
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: To have to like go learn what every word's significance,
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: like poetic significance and grammatical structure and all that is.
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: And after I took that class, I was basically like,
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: I can work hard enough to do anything that I want, right?
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: Because- like I just like fucking learned all these words
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: that don't matter in order to like nail this thing.
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: And like, and I won and kind of did that
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: and got that to, to kind of, and kind of,
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: you know, had some fun doing it.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: So, well, it's like you, like you found a, a
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: model kind of, yeah, exactly. And it was hard. It
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: was a, yeah, it was a tough model. Yeah.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: So, I mean, there's like, there's that, I mean, there's
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: like the math version of that. I mean, you're talking
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: about Alexander Wang on here. It's like, I mean, I
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: did a bunch of, um, the same kind of math
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: competitions that, that he did. I had this like super
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: hardcore math instructor in high school. His name was zooming fung.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: And he, um, and Chinese guy, Oh, yeah. And I
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: think at some point he had worked with.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: Zooming Fung. Bring him up, baby.
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: Zooming Fung. Now, he is.
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: We want the Fung. You ever hear that song? They
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: used to play that.
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: Well, this guy is just like a badass. And he
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: basically was involved in training the U.S. Math Olympiad team
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: for a long period of time. And he made a
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: huge impact on me kind of growing up.
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: And....
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: And he kind of taught me a little bit about
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: like how I approach problems. He's like, look, you actually, um,
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: it's like, he's like, you kind of have this, it's like, look,
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: you're not that good at math. I'm like, no, but, um,
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: I'm kidding. Um, he, he, he kind of taught me
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: that I, I had this sort of like intuitive ability
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: to have a sense of like what zone the right
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: answer was in. So he's like, I look at your
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: work and you, um, do a bunch of stuff that
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: like doesn't really make sense. But then at the end
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: you come to a conclusion and you realize that that
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: conclusion doesn't make sense. And then you kind of check
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: yourself and go back and do it. And you keep
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: on doing it until you get the right answer is like,
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: I don't understand how you like have this intuitive sense
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: for like what the shape of the right answer is,
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: but like, that's really good. As long as you like
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: couple that with working really hard, you're going to be
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: able to kind of succeed and get a lot, um,
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: and get a lot done. Um, but So.
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: That give you a map of how to navigate yourself,
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: like your intuition with your hard work. Yeah.
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: So, so I don't know. So, okay. Like does the specific, like,
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: you know, high dimensional geometry or whatever the thing is
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: that we were working on together. Like, do I do
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: any of that today? No, I don't remember any of
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: that stuff, but like, but I think it's like, like
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: you have some good teachers who teach you how to
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: think and how to work hard. And like that stays
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: with you forever. And I think that that's like some
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: of the stuff that, Um, I mean, I, I think it,
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: it builds confidence. It like teaches you how you approach problems.
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: Then you just get better and better at some things
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: and you, you build confidence.
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: And so that's the value you're saying and seeing in college.
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: Like those are some of the other values you might
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: not see, like, oh yeah, might be not be able
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: to be seen on paper, but the, but the value
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: of that.
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: That's a good point, man. It's like, yeah, I remember
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: like some of my favorite people still to this day
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: in my life have been some of my teachers that
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: challenged me. or that believed in me, or that said
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: a certain, like, man, I admire the way you do
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: this or this, you know, and it really encourages you
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: and kind of plants a lot of seeds to make
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: you want to do those things so much more.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and they don't have to be teachers, although obviously,
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: you know, that's... Or mentors.
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of these days, a lot of
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: people get their mentorship probably, I would guess, from teachers
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: unless they play a sport, you know?
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, the main way
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: that you learn those from colleagues, right? It's like people
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: you work with. You know, and I remember... Growing up,
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: I was really into computers.
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: Like when did you get your first computer, you think?
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: So my family had a computer probably when I was
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: like eight or nine. And then I think I probably
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: got one.
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: And would you be in there on that thing all
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: the time? Just riding the keys?
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: So my dad's a dentist. Oh, yeah.
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: He just got a tooth yesterday.
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, how's that? There you go.
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: I just got a half of a.
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: Got to see Dr. Zuckerberg.
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's... He'll take.
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: Care of you. Did your parents give you love or
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: just sonic care? That's just an old dentist joke.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: Glad you got that taken care of.
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel a lot better about it. But what
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: were we talking about?
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: I was just talking about how my dad was the
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: type of dentist who was really into technology. So whenever
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: a new laser thing came out to drill your teeth better,
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: he was on that first. And that was kind of
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: cool to be around and kind of see... Like he,
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: he clearly, he loved technology. Um, and I think I
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: sort of got introduced to a bunch of stuff through that.
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: So like he had like in his dental office, there
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: were like a bunch of different, um, you know, operate
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: operatory rooms, I guess. And, and they each had computers
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: and I was like, all right, you know, like, Oh yeah.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: Future in there. Yeah.
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: It's like, it's like, but it was still, you know,
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: he'd still like go between them to talk to the
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: different people. I was like, you need, like a chat app.
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: So you can just like send messages to everyone across the,
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: the dental office. So I like wrote that for him
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: and it's like, all right, that's cool.
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: Um, so you were codes, you would drop, you were
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: putting coding into like dental work. You were, you were
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: already thinking of how to connect.
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: I just like making stuff. Yeah. So yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's sort of been the theme for me
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: is the intersection between like computing technology on the one
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: hand and like people and connecting people. Um, you know,
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: when I was in college, I wasn't there for long,
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: but I mean, I was technically a psychology major. I mean,
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: I took a bunch of computer science and math classes too, but.
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: Dude, if somebody even went to Harvard for four days, dude,
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: I would hire him to be my therapist or whatever.
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't. Really? I mean, I don't know. I
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: think I'd rather have someone who, I definitely subscribe to
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: the theory of like, you want people who did well
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: at whatever they did, not just like who have some
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: random credential.
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: So, um, Yeah, I guess where I'm from, if you
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: heard Harvard, it was like somebody had gone to, like,
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: Mars or something. It was very, you know.
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I get it.
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: So it kind of differs from place to place. Whenever
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: you drop... Did you have to tell your parents you
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: were dropping out of college? Was that a crazy day?
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: Did you DM them, or what did you do?
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: So, I mean, I'd already started Facebook, and Harvard had
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: this nice policy where you didn't have to make a
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: hard decision to drop out. You could just postpone. So
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: I just didn't go back for the next term. But later...
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: My mom told me that she always knew I wasn't
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: going to finish college. I was like, mom, what the
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: hell does that mean? But no, but actually. But that's
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: got to be the worst.
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: Imagine this, okay? Say your son or child or daughter
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: are mixed. or mixed child or whatever imagine it's a
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: big test at school right you have to hug your
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: kid goodbye you know your kid is not gonna do
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: good on that test right but you still have to
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: stay in there in the kitchen and give him a
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: little bit of chocolate milk and be like you're gonna
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: do good out there today benny or whatever his name
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: is right But then the second he leaves, you're just like,
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: that kid doesn't have a shirt. Benny's screwed.
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Benny's screwed. No, I don't know. I don't know
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: what we're talking about. I don't know what it's like. No,
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: but my younger sister... Is our conversation going okay? I
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: feel like it's cool with you.
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's less random than I expected it to be.
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: It is?
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: I'm just kidding. Yeah, I think it's just hard to
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: talk sometimes with people.
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: No, before I went to college, my mom... I think
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: told me that she thought I was going to drop out.
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: My younger sister bet me that she was going to
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: finish college before me. Ooh, I like that attitude. And,
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: and I was like, now I'm going to get a degree.
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: And they all came true. I dropped out. My younger
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: sister finished college and then I got an honorary degree. So,
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: you know, bonus.
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: Oh, you got a free, they gave you that.
• 40:33
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Oh dang. Do you even get your GED at
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: all either?
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: Uh, no, I did finish. I did finish high school.
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: You did?
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: GED is high school, right? Is that? I don't know.
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: I think they make a GED premier now.
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know. Anyone?
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: No.
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: No. No? Gigi's high school equivalent. All right. Thank you.
• 40:51
  Speaker 2: I got a real, I got a high school diploma.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: You got a high school diploma. That's my education. Dude,
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: that's 94% of our country. So you're in good hands, brother.
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: You're right there with some of the greats. So when
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: you started, when you first started, let me think if
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: I want to think. Oh, where was your first date
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: that you took Priscilla to?
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: Do you remember? Yeah, for Priscilla, we went to this place, Burdick's.
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: Burdick's?
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: Burdick's, L.A. Burdick's, this chocolate place, hot chocolate. That was
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: pretty good.
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: And was it just like y'all went and sat down?
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: Is it like a restaurant or just a place to
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: get like that?
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like a little coffee place, a little like
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: hot chocolate type coffee place. Yeah, no, it's nice. They
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: make good chocolates. They make these little mice things. Ooh, yeah. Yeah,
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: chocolate mice. So now every year on our anniversary, we...
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: Get some mice.
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: Good deal.
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: Nothing like a couple of tech emperors enjoying a couple
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: of mice. You feel me? I think that's very normal.
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: That's very normal to me, dude. Sorry, that just made
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: me laugh. I'm sorry, Mark. That just made me freaking laugh.
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: It's just crazy to think. Oh.
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: Chocolate mice.
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: Yes, chocolate mice. Yeah, and we'll put that in the notes.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's not. I feel like when you go
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: like full Roman Empire, it's like, give me the live mice.
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: Give me the live mice.
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: And then one mouse shows up and he has like
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: a bad leg. You're like, all of them fully live. Dude,
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: if somebody sees a mouse with a bad leg, nobody
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: even cares. That's the saddest thing about some mice. But actually,
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: I used to sell hamsters. My first job was selling
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: hamsters growing up. And a lot of that market, they
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: brought in these Russian hamsters, right? And it took away
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: a lot of the American market. And the Russian ones,
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: they're called like the Roborovskis. Bring up a couple of Roborovskis, man.
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: They were, they took away like the fluffy kind of
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: American ham. And they.
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: I mean, they're pretty cute.
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: They are cute. But the ones that we were getting,
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: a lot of them were from Russia. Put from Russia.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: Put Roborovsky hamsters from Russia with a small white ones
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: with kind of the red eyes. Yeah, they really I
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: think they they put some visual effects on some of
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: their eyes. There you go. These were really not helping
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: people feel good. Yeah, no, that's like that's like a vampire.
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: It was a little bit much. It was a lot
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: for some of the children.
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: You know, so one of my daughters is really into hedgehogs.
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: So we, we found, um, we were in like, we
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: took them to Japan and there's this hedgehog cafe that
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: you can just go in and they can just like
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: play with the hedgehogs.
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: I've never seen a hedgehog.
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's, it's, uh, they're, they're pretty cute. It's
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: kind of looks like that, but less red eyes, but.
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: Um, yeah, no, shorty Bay.
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: She's out there. Those are beautiful.
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: Now, the idea of cafes where you can hang out
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: with animals. Priscilla was telling me that she took the
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: kids to this cat cafe. And my daughter was hanging
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: out with the cats. And couldn't find a cat that
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: she liked. And then finally found a cat that she
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: was into. And just as she was sitting down, hanging
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: out with the cat, someone came in and was like, oh,
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: this cat has been adopted. And came and did this.
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow. Just like that issue that's going on with
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: that guy that deported El Salvador right now. It sounds
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: like very, I don't know if it's similar to that,
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: but it sounds like there's like a lot of- That
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: seems completely different. Yeah, you're right.
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: Absolutely a completely different thing. You're right. That's- Yeah, you're right.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: It's not the same fairy tale. I don't know how
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: either one of those fairy tale ends, but that's so
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: sad that- Well, the cat at least got a home. Yeah,
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: the cat got a home. And this, I think that
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: guy will get home. I don't know a lot about it.
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: It just like spawned me on that. That could be
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: something like that. Do you, you have how many daughters,
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: you have a.
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: Three daughters.
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: Three daughters.
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: You had three sisters. I did.
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: So you're.
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: Kind of surrounded by girls. God. Yeah.
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: And did you, what's it like, like bedtime with your
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: daughters at night? Like, what is that like at, at
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: the Zuckerberg's home?
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: Um, yeah, I mean, it's just, it's like, so because
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: I'm so busy during the day, I try to make
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: it so that. like the time that I know I'm
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: going to hang out with the kids at night, I
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: try to spend like half an hour with each of
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: them at night and, and they're different ages. So we
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: got like a nine, a seven year old, a two
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: year old. Oh wow. Yeah. Um, yeah. So bedtime, I
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: don't know. I mean, the kids are all crazy in
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: different ways and, and just kind of like try to
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: connect with them on, on whatever they want.
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: Um, like what do they like to, or if it's not,
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: the two year.
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: Old is just like starting to learn how to speak.
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: And, I thought you were going to say code, which
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: would have been crazy.
• 45:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, well, she's like, yeah, no, the two-year-old has
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: very strong opinions and I think it's going to be
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: very interesting.
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. But it's like, let me think about what,
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: I mean, she's, I don't know, I need to, let
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: me think about something funny that she's doing. But while
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: I'm thinking about that, the seven-year-old is just like, Purely generative,
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: constantly just creating things. You know, she's the one who's like,
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: we'll do like 3D printing. She'll create like 3D worlds
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: in this like horizon metaverse system that we're building. She codes,
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: she writes books. She basically like makes music. She is-
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: And she's seven years old? She's seven, yeah. Seeing her
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: has really- like I think helped me understand myself in
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: a way because it's like, it's kind of like, okay, like,
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: why do I just keep like building stuff? Like, why
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: do I care so much about creating stuff? And it's like,
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I think some people just like have
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: a thing in them where it's like, they have to
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: create stuff. Like the stuff just like comes out of them.
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: They're constantly generating things and like, and, and kind of
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: producing stuff.
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: And, and you notice that in her.
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: She's like that. Yeah. Yeah. I think, yeah. I mean,
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: I think before, before kind of she started growing up
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: and doing that, Priscilla was in, in, was just like,
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: why don't you just like relax, right? It's like, you've done,
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: you've built enough things, right? It's like, your company is good.
• 47:09
  Speaker 2: Like you can just chill. And, and now, now I
• 47:11
  Speaker 2: think after seeing, um, this one, she's just like, okay, no,
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: I get it.
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: You, yeah, you got, you have the same thing. You
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: have what she has, right? It's like, you're just constantly
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: creating stuff.
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: He's like, dude, you're Thomas medicine.
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: There you go. There you go. I like that. Yeah, no, it's, uh, yeah.
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: Thank you, dude. Um, and then, you know, our oldest
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: daughter is just like, And the oldest one is nine,
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: you said?
• 47:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, she's nine.
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: Okay, so that's getting up there a little bit.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: She is. So she's getting into the zone where she competes.
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: She's doing history B and competing in math and really
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: wants to understand the world. So my activities with her
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: is we'll usually go through the news and she'll find
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: one thing, we'll pick out a story, and then we'll
• 47:59
  Speaker 2: just talk about it. It's really interesting because it hadn't
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: occurred to me before how much, in order to understand technology,
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: you need to really understand government and civics and politics
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: and law and all of these different things. So trying
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: to explain to a child who hasn't thought much about
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: these things, it's both very fascinating for me, Um, but
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: it's just been like a cool bonding experience of like,
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: and you, you start off and it's like a really
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: basic understanding, but then after you've done it for like
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: a year or two that like, okay, she has like
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: a very good understanding of like the tech industry and
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: the world and all this stuff. And it's, it's, um,
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: it's pretty interesting to talk through.
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: Well, I think it's inspiring just to even parents to hear, like,
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: what can you talk to your kid about? You know
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: what I'm saying? Like, if your kid's 13 and you're
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: still reading and bearing the same bears or whatever, some
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: of that's on you. Like, you got to evolve some
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: of the curriculum for your child, you know? Because, yeah,
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: a lot of parents think you probably can't kind of
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: build these worlds in a child's head. But if you
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: start with the basic blocks, then you kind of can,
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: you know, and help them get bigger ideas about things.
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: I think that's cool. I think there's nothing more important
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: than how a parent communicates with their child, you know,
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: and what they communicate to them because so often we
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: just expect like teachers and different curriculum out in the
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: world or just the world to do that for our children.
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: But man, I think the biggest faucet for a child
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: is the parent, you know. That's pretty cool. And the
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: little one is just a little... It's just two.
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: We got a bonus. Yeah, so it's No, she's good.
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: But I mean, obviously very, she's just obsessed with her
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: older sisters. Oh, yeah. So one day she just decided, like,
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: I am not a baby. And we're like, oh, you're
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: the family baby. I'm a big girl. It's like, that's
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: like a core part of her identity is she's a
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: big girl.
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: She's like, email me now.
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's like, yeah, email me now.
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: Email me at suckerbabyatmeta.
• 50:03
  Speaker 2: Meanwhile, she can't even like fully pronounce it. She goes,
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: I'm a bit girl. It's like, okay. It's like, well,
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: maybe you learn how to pronounce it first, and then
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: I'll believe you.
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: She's like, I weigh six terabytes. She's like, calm down,
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: you know? That's so funny, being like a little grid baby.
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: When you're two, you're trying to teach them basic stuff.
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: So we have this book. It's like, how do I feel?
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: It's just pictures of other kids and like their facial expressions.
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: And it's like the only emotion that she identifies with
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: is happy. And so she'll be having like a terrible
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: meltdown and like sobbing. And I'm like, Oreo, how are
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: you feeling? She goes, happy. And it's like, no, you
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: don't have to say happy all the time. It's like,
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: it's normal. Like in life, it's like we have all
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: these different emotions. Like it's important to understand when you're
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: sad or... or like angry or frustrated or something.
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: But that's hilarious.
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: So we're still working on that. We're working on, we're
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: still in the remedial emotional emotions phase.
• 51:15
  Speaker 1: She'll be like crying. You're like, how do you, but
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: she knows that's the one. She's like.
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: She knows. Yeah, no, it's like.
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: Oreo's her name?
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: Aurelia. But we call her Oreo, which I'm sure we're
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: going to regret when she's older.
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: Well.
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: It's cute. I think Oreo's a cute name.
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: She'll probably marry a basketball player. I'm guessing. Who knows, Mark?
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: Who knows what'll happen? It could go, you know. Oreo Zuckerberg? Dude,
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: that's when you take... That's when you get into the
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: food industry. Oreo Zuckerberg?
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: I don't know. She, I think, could be.
• 51:46
  Speaker 3: The.
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: Sugar Empress of Menlo Park?
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: Kids love... You know kids love... They go through a
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: phase where they love cleaning, and they love playing cooking.
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: It's like, oh, just give me some... Like a pan.
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: I don't know if that's... Yeah, Red wants a cheeseburger.
• 52:03
  Speaker 2: I think a lot of kids are like that. She's
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: just like, give me a desk. Like, I want to
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: work like Dad does. Like, give me a desk and, like,
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: I don't want to do this, like, cooking shit. Like,
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: it's like, yeah.
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: He's like, we want to own a Popeye's. And she's like,
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: but at least she has. But I like that, though.
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: She has, like, a plate, you know?
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: No, she's a bit girl. Yeah, I like that.
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: I love that idea that some child somewhere, this is
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: going to make my day so much better just knowing
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: that a child is.
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: Just- There's a child behind a desk just like demanding.
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: It's like, yeah.
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah. There's not enough bandwidth in this crib, father.
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: There's not enough bandwidth to the crib. Yeah.
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: To pull off what I need to pull off. I
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: know the kids, you know, I don't- Is it fun
• 52:49
  Speaker 1: being a dad? Do you feel like you enjoy it?
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: Does it feel kind of, is it tough to connect
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: with your children? Does that ever feel like a thing
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: as a dad with girl daughters or with? Yeah.
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I think it's like, there's probably some
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: things that they connect better with, with mother about, but like,
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: I feel like there's also like, I don't know. There's
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: all these weird dynamics. I think that there are some
• 53:09
  Speaker 2: things that they like probably just connect with me better
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: about where it's, you know, it's, it's just a different
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: dynamic with, with, um, father. Right. So.
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: And what do they call you? Do they call y'all dad, father, mother? Dad.
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: Although sometimes they're, they're being disobedient, Mark. And it's like, no,
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: dad is a, Dad is a title, an honorific title
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: that I've earned. Mark. They're like, what is going on?
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: It's like Oreo that is bullshit. Get back in your crib.
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: I'll see you in court.
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: These diapers are too tight. Tell my lawyer that's hilarious.
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: That's crazy. I think it's just good for them to
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: have good role models. Part of the way that I.
• 53:58
  Speaker 2: I feel like when kids grow up, they either end
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: up wanting to like marry people who are the opposite
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: of their parents if it was a bad experience or
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: people who they like think of as sort of like, oh,
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: this was a good role model, right? And so I
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: feel like as long as they look up to us,
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: that's like, that's kind of the, you want to like
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: set a good example, right? So, but I don't know.
• 54:23
  Speaker 2: I kind of, for me, we talked about this a
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: little bit with, with, the fighting stuff early on. But
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: for me, it's always just been important that it's like,
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: I don't just want to like be a person who
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: like sits and works all the time. I think like,
• 54:38
  Speaker 2: you know, it's, we're not like meant to just sit
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: at a desk all day long and one day Oreo
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: will learn that. Um, but, um, and I think like
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: a lot of life is like, you move around, you like,
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: you know, it's like, we're like meant to be active
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: and do stuff. And I think that that's a big
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: part of it. I try to like, it's important to
• 54:56
  Speaker 2: me that, that the kids get that too. And the
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: kids are very active.
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: Do your kids have a lot of screen time? How
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: much screen time do you allow your kids?
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's different for the different ones. We don't just
• 55:12
  Speaker 2: let them do whatever, but I actually want them to
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: be fluent with this stuff, kind of like we talked
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: about earlier. I want them to learn how to code,
• 55:23
  Speaker 2: how to use technology. I think it's important to... because
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: a lot of socialization, you know, obviously like happens online
• 55:30
  Speaker 2: at this point, like people need to get used to
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: the norms and stuff around that. So, I mean, they're
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: not on, they're still too young to be using like
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: social media, but they have messenger kids. You know, we
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: make it so that they can video chat and chat
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: with their friends. And, you know, we'll obviously monitor to
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: make sure that they're just connecting with the people who
• 55:52
  Speaker 2: we think that they should. But like, I think it's
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: actually good. I think people need to kind of grow
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: up Um, I don't need to as strong, but I,
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: I think is, um, I think it's good if you
• 56:03
  Speaker 2: have an engaged parent and, and they, um, and, and
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: as a child, you learn up, you, you, you kind
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: of grow up, um, learning how to use a bunch
• 56:11
  Speaker 2: of this stuff. So I think that that's, I think
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: that's all good. I want the kids, um, to the
• 56:15
  Speaker 2: extent that they're interested in it to learn how to code,
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: learn how to create stuff, whether it's in like horizon
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: or VR tools, or they play, uh, you know, Roblox
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: and Minecraft and stuff like that. I think that's good.
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: And then, you know, there's a lot of educational study
• 56:30
  Speaker 2: type tools that, you know, when our daughter's studying for
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: her competitions or whatever, she can kind of make a
• 56:38
  Speaker 2: lot of progress on that. So I think that that
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: stuff is good, but we're not just like letting them
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: just kind of sit and watch stuff all day long.
• 56:48
  Speaker 2: Unless you're on a plane, then you do whatever you
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: need to do to get through that flight.
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Thank you, dude. Somebody else needs to say that.
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no.
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: When do we come out with that pacifier that really
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: shuts these kids down for a couple hours? I'm not
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: saying it has to be anything crazy, nothing illegal, but
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: we need a high-voltage pacifier back in society, Mark.
• 57:14
  Speaker 2: Oh, man.
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: Give us something, brother.
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: These kids are screaming.
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: They sometimes do.
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah. The craziest thing happened to me. One time I'm
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: on a plane, I'm dreaming, right? And I'm like, man,
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: I'm really having some nice dreams because I never have
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: good sleep or anything. So every now and then I
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: come to the surface of my dreams and I'm like, wow,
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: I'm still dreaming. And I go back underwater. But I
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: heard a ukulele playing, right? Ukulele. And at some point
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: I wake up and there is a effing child or child,
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: as some people call them, playing a ukulele with his
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: parents on this plane i walked up and i put
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: my hand on in front of the parents i think
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: i was still groggy from being asleep and i was
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: like we can't do this today.
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: It's like the ukulele is it's uh it's uh it's
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: a lot it's time out for you.
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: We're shutting down this little hand hawaii you got going
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: on right here.
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: I mean it probably took a lot of restraint to
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: not just pick up the ukulele and smash it oh.
• 58:13
  Speaker 1: It really did yeah i mean it's It really did.
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: So I just said, we're not doing this today. In
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: a tone that was.
• 58:20
  Speaker 2: That seems stern for a child. It was. Especially for
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: a child who is not your child, who you don't know.
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: Very fair.
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: That's the type of thing that you could cause a scene.
• 58:31
  Speaker 1: Very fair. I got lucky. The parents were.
• 58:34
  Speaker 2: They agreed. They were probably pissed about the ukulele too.
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: But they were afraid to tell their kids something.
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like, so you did them a favor.
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, hey, Oreo sometimes, business is closed. Yeah, no,
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: it's like, Working hours are over for today, okay? You'll
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: be back in the office tomorrow. Some of you just
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: have to, you know. So I agree. Please do whatever
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: you can to stop these kids from being on planes
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: or screaming on planes because we are looking. That's one
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: thing we are all looking to you for.
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: Well, maybe one day we'll deliver that.
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: Nobody needs help spending their money. Sometimes it feels like
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: the whole world is just trying to spend your money.
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: We're going to spend your money. But people don't need
• 59:18
  Speaker 1: help spending their money. People need help growing their money.
• 59:22
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• 59:26
  Speaker 1: spend your money, acorns exist. hopes to grow your money
• 59:29
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• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: I do think a future version of the glasses will
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 2: get there. I think you had a chance to play
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: around with this a bit. Yeah, I did. Are those
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: the ones you have on right now or no? No,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: this is sort of, I mean, these are the ones
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 2: that are available today. And these are like REI glasses.
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 2: So I mean, it's, you know, they're glasses. They can,
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 2: you know, the main thing is they can, you can
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: take photos or videos with them. I love just using
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: them for listening to music and taking phone calls on
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: them because your ears are open, right? So it doesn't like,
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: it doesn't obscure your ability to hear anything else. the
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: audio quality is really good, right? Because it is a microphone,
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: like it's a contact mic that's like basically in the
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 2: nose pad.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: Audio quality is great.
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so when I'm like, you can be on a
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 2: plane and take a phone call and like the other
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: person on the other side can't even hear that you're
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: on a plane. You can be in a wind tunnel
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: and it's just like whatever. The sound quality is amazing.
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 2: But then the main thing is they're AI glasses. So
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 2: you can... Glasses, I think, are the perfect form factor
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 2: for a device where if you want to have an
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: AI that you let see what you see, hear what
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: you hear, it can talk to you. You can talk
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 2: to it throughout the day. And glasses, that's like, yeah,
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: if you want to have something that has the same
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: context of the world that you do, it's going to
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: be glasses. And there's like a billion or two billion
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 2: people in the world who wear glasses already. So to me,
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: the chance that we look back like a decade from
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: now and like all those glasses aren't AI glasses by
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 2: that period. It's kind of like, like obviously all the
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 2: flip phones were going to become smartphones, right? I mean that,
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: like that was clearly a thing that was going to happen.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 2: I think that's going to happen with, um, with glasses too.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 2: But the, um, the other piece of this is that
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 2: you're going to get the ability to kind of put
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 2: holograms in the world, right? So our, our experience with
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: technology today is, um, I know it's kind of funny
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 2: in a way how it's divided where it's like you,
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 2: you know, we have the physical world all around us.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 2: And then if you want to interact with something digital,
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 2: you need to like put a screen up, right? So
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: maybe it's like this, you know, you have your, your
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 2: small glowing rectangle, your phone with you, you know, you,
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: you have like, you know, your screen, if you want
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 2: to like project something, but I think in the not
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 2: too distant future, this should be blended together, right? You'll
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: have like the physical world, but all this digital stuff,
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: should just basically be holograms. You shouldn't need a physical screen.
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 2: There's no reason why, in the future, you want to
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 2: have a screen there. You'll just have glasses, and that
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 2: screen will be a hologram. Right, and that's what you
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: put me in. Yeah.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: Somebody put me in it.
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 1: In the final season of Stranger Things back there. I
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: got put in whatever they put on me. It was
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: like LensCrafters makes LensCrafters look pretty good. you know lame
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: well it's um it's different it's it was well it
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: was crazy i'll say it was like can i say
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: what happened yeah yeah yeah it was so they put
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: it you put the glasses on and they're they're it's
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 1: like an advancement of the pair that you have on
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: now right so it's like years down the line how
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 1: many years down the line you realistically think that those could.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 2: Um i'm hoping that we'll have a version of that
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: as a product in a few years but it's going
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 2: four years or eight years hopefully closer to four or
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 2: even less, but, but it's, I think that there will
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 2: still be simpler glasses like this and then there will
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: be more complex glasses. Those will be more expensive.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: Right. What do you want?
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah. But so some people will want like more tech.
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: They'll want the holograms. Some people just want a simple
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: experience where it's like, all right, I got the AI.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 2: I got the ability to listen to music and phone
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 2: calls and do all that. And then obviously the less
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: tech that you put into them, the thinner they can,
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 2: be which i mean some people like bulky glasses some
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: people want thin glasses and.
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah it was fascinating yeah yeah they had a thing
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: on my wrist right.
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: Uh-huh uh neural interface a neural interface yeah i mean
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 2: you could basically control the glasses with your mind through
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 2: signals that you're sending from your brain to your.
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: Hand yes it was fascinating it was like i could
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: like um touch different nodules that I needed to and
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: stuff or different nodes, whatever it's called. I could look
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: at certain things and that would highlight what it was.
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 1: And it was like a, it was just a screen
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: in midair and I could walk around the side of
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: the room and then come back and the screen would
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: still be there, but it wasn't really there in real life.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: It was just there with the glasses on. Yeah.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 2: It's a hologram. Yes.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: And it was, it was crazy, man. I don't know.
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 1: And then I was like, well, my first thought was like, well,
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: how do you just get people to adapt to this?
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 1: Because people aren't just going to go from where we
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 1: are right now to adapt. And then I realized, okay,
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 1: there's different stair steps. There's like almost like when you
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: got the first smartphone, like you're saying, and then in
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 1: advance or the first mobile phone, and then you have
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 1: the first meta glasses and then it advances and stuff
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 1: like that. So it was fascinating. There was a part
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 1: where me and another man who I just met him
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 1: and we played ping pong and I believe it was
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 1: an Asian guy. And I don't know if they did
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 1: it on purpose or not. And I don't know if
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: ping pong is Asian. But people think it is. And
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: I started playing with this man back there, you know?
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: Did you win? Huh?
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 2: Did you win?
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: Dude, who knows? We're in the future. I don't know
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 1: if they keep score. I think everybody gets a medal.
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 2: No, you definitely keep score. Oh, you do? Yeah, yeah.
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: And in our future, not everyone gets a medal. Yeah,
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 2: I like that. No, it's... Are you not entertained? Yeah, no,
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 2: it's like... Yeah, no, that's more... Oreo, fire up the grill! Yeah, no, it's...
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 2: Loser burns!
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: But no, um... the uh but we could play a
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: game of and it was not real it was a
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: ping pong table in front of us that was not.
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 2: Real like 3d ping pong yes so.
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 1: It wasn't that it wasn't there uh-huh someone could ride
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: their bike or like your dumb brother could ride his
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 1: freaking bike like dang it yeah ricky bro you freaking
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 1: rode right through our net.
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 2: So i mean i think it's an interesting thought experiment
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: how many of the things that we physically have aren't
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 2: going to need to be there in the future.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 2: So pretty much every screen doesn't need to be there, right?
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 2: It'll just be a hologram. Um, any media, any book
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 2: that you're playing, any board game, any cards, those.
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: Are, That'd be nice. Because one thing I hate is
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: at the airport, all these TVs are on. It's like
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 1: everything is so loud now. It's like, can you just
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: make it for you?
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 2: Just turn it down. Yeah, personalize it.
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: Why do we all have to experience this painful noise sometimes?
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like you're driving through a city and there's
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 2: billboards and nothing is personalized. It's like how TV used
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 2: to be, right? I mean, in the future, now all
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 2: the stuff that you use on your phone, it's like
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 2: you get exactly what you're interested in and it's just
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 2: a much higher quality experience. Yeah. There's all this physical
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 2: stuff that just stuck, right? And is static. Yeah, I mean,
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 2: everything I think is going to be able to... Sorry,
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: not everything. But I think it's an interesting thought experiment
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 2: how much of the stuff that we physically have today
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 2: that just doesn't actually need to exist in the future.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: Do you think... Is social media bad?
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't think so.
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Maybe that's not the right term. Um, like at
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 1: a certain point does. Yeah. Like how much, you know,
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 1: there's been like studies on where it's like doom scrolling
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: and stuff like that can lead to depression, that sort
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: of thing.
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: Like.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: What do you think about that? Yeah, so look, I mean.
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 2: We obviously study this stuff pretty carefully.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 1: You guys do?
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, we study it. We work with academics
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 2: to study it. As you can imagine, there's a lot
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: of media coverage of this stuff that's very sensationalist, that
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 2: tries to have a skewed point of view. My understanding
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 2: of the current state of the research is that there
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: isn't kind of a conclusive... um, finding that this is
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: negative for people's wellbeing. So I think that that's, and
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 2: in general, you know, some of the stuff that ends
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 2: up being positive for people is, is building relationships. So
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 2: there's sort of the media part of social media and
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 2: there's the social part of social media. I think the,
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: the interacting with people, um, to the extent that that's
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 2: helping you build good relationships, I mean, friendships and good
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 2: relationships is one of the things that correlates the most
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 2: strongly with positive wellbeing and like feeling good about your
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 2: life and all that. The media stuff, I mean, I
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 2: think that's more entertaining. You know, I think you can,
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 2: you know, people want things that are fun, right?
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, people want to be entertained, for sure.
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 2: It doesn't necessarily like correlate with good wellbeing or bad wellbeing.
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 2: But I guess like the way that I think about
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: this stuff is that it's, our modern online environment is, it,
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 2: It's just an environment in which we live in a
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 2: way that has pros and cons, like whether you live
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 2: in a city or a rural place, right? It's like, okay,
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 2: like some people may prefer living in a city. There's
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: like things that are good about a city. There are
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 2: things that are bad about a city. Okay. Like the
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 2: fact that we went from being primarily offline as a
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: society to now like this kind of hybrid kind of
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: physical and digital reality. There's some things that are better
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 2: about that. Some things that are, that are maybe less good.
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 2: It's not that every single thing improves at each step
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 2: along the way, but I think overall it's kind of
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: the overall effect is significant improvement. And I just don't
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 2: see a way that people would want to like go
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 2: back to not having services where they can get the
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: content that they're interested in and where stuff is personalized
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 2: to them and where they can communicate with the people
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 2: who they want and don't need to like be constrained
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 2: to just the people who are physically around them. It's just,
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 2: I mean, like we're just, you know, we're not going
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 2: back to that. and if you look throughout history it's
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 2: like when people like first built cities you know there
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 2: were all these um there's a lot of kind of
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 2: nostalgia for the the simpler life and things like that
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 2: it's like okay yeah and and yeah sure maybe maybe
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: cities aren't better in every single way and some people
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 2: might prefer to kind of only go sometimes or whatever
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 2: but but i i just think it's like we're we're
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: building more and more capabilities as a society. And I
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 2: think that that's sort of, I just think about this
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 2: stuff more as like an environment in which we live.
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: So then it's more like if, yeah, like sometimes I
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 1: think like, because I've been thinking a lot about this.
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of people have. It's like, well,
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 1: we're moving into such a, like technology is advancing so
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 1: much faster, right? It's accelerating the advancement speed. And then
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: we're just humans and we're in this space now where
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 1: there's like one generation to the next where one generation
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 1: was completely grown up online and one hasn't really. Yeah.
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 1: So I wonder, and I think the older generation probably
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 1: sees it as like, man, this is so negative. Everybody's stuck.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: But I wonder if the younger generation, do they even
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 1: know any different, right? You know, like just, I start
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 1: to wonder what is the value of being human? Like,
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 1: like what is the, does that start to dissipate as
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 1: we become more technologically advanced or does that alter? Like,
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 1: do you think about that sometimes? Yeah.
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, look, I think it's going to give
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 2: people the freedom to focus more on the things that
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 2: they want. I think if you look at the arc
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 2: of history, go back, like, I mean, before, you know,
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 2: in ancient times, life was, like, pretty brutal, right? It's like, okay,
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 2: so then you go to, like, maybe right before the
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 2: Industrial Revolution, where.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: They had team toilet paper at one time. They had, like,
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: group toilet paper, and it was like... Yeah, I mean,
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 1: that's not good. That's not good.
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: That's not good. Yeah, and I don't think, I mean,
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 2: you don't want to... Yeah, no, I think anyone who
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 2: has nostalgia for the past really is not taking into
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 2: account the disease and the lack of hygiene that existed
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 2: in the past. So I think that there's... So anyway,
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 2: but pre-industrial revolution, I think some huge percent of the
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 2: population was farmers because basically everyone needed to be focused
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 2: on growing things in order to have enough food. Then
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 2: we basically got to the point where okay, now we
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: can start to produce food much more efficiently. So that
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: actually frees up a lot of people to not have
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 2: to be farmers. Now maybe like 2% of people can
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 2: be farmers and 98% of people can do other stuff.
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: So now people start doing more kind of other creative
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: stuff and inventing new things. And at each step along
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: the way, kind of like being a farmer is a
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 2: really hard job. It's like, you're working a lot of hours.
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 2: And now, as people got more options, they took other jobs.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 2: But then we've also seen this mix where the percent
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 2: of people's time that has gone towards leisure and entertainment
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 2: has just steadily increased over time. And I just think
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 2: that that's going to continue to be the case with technology.
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 2: We'll have more stuff that will make it so that
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 2: the basic needs... are taken care of, which will free
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 2: people up to do some combination of more creative jobs
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 2: and not have to work as hard if they don't
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 2: want to. But I think some people are going to
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: like working all the time, like me, and you'll be
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 2: able to do that too and get more done than
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 2: you could have ever possibly done in the past. But
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 2: that'll be sort of a choice.
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 1: Well, since you're kind of like a leader in innovation
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 1: and technology in our world, you know, do you, how
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 1: do you know that what your convictions are, how do
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 1: you gauge if what your convictions are are the best
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 1: for everybody, kind of? Like, how do you kind of
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 1: figure that out, you know? It seems like such a challenge. Yeah, well.
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 1: Does that make sense of the question or no?
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I think I get what you're asking. I mean, look,
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: at the end of the day, there are still a
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 2: lot of options of things that people can do. Just
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 2: because I build something doesn't mean that people are going
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 2: to use it. Actually, a lot of the things that
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 2: I build, some of them work, some of them don't.
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 2: And I think part of the reason why the company
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: has been successful is because maybe we have a slightly
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 2: higher hit rate of things working than others. But it's
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 2: kind of like, I don't know, in baseball, it's like
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 2: most people don't get on base most of the time, right?
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 2: So it's like... running one of these companies, more of
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: the stuff doesn't work than does. And if we do
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: something that doesn't work, then in general, people aren't going
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 2: to use it. And then the future doesn't go in
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 2: that direction. I see.
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 1: So you're saying it's up to the user more.
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, look, I kind of think one way
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 2: to look at the world is that there's a version
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: of history that says that like individual people are very
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 2: powerful and have a lot of kind of autonomy and
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 2: ability to, to kind of go in the direction that
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 2: they think is right. And then there's like all these
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 2: other narratives where people try to kind of diminish people's
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 2: autonomy and authority. And I'm just like, I've always been
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 2: a person who really kind of believes that people understand
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 2: people are smarter than people think.
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 2: And, and I think in general are able to make
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 2: good decisions for their lives. And when they do things
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 2: that like the media or whatever thinks don't make sense,
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 2: it's generally because the media doesn't understand their life, not
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 2: because the people are stupid. Like if people are saying
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 2: something that seems wrong, it's not usually misinformation, it's usually
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 2: that you don't understand what's going on in that person's life.
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 2: And I just think that there's like a certain kind
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 2: of paternalism in some of the mainstream narratives and some
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 2: of the media narratives.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 1: Like a know-it-allism almost?
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 1: There has been for sure for years. I think it's
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 1: starting to change more.
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's a little more receptive as maybe
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 2: some of those cultural or media elite people are having
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 2: a harder time predicting what's going to happen in the world.
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 2: maybe there's a little more humility of like, okay, maybe
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 2: we don't understand all of this. But, but to me,
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 2: the best predicting thing has always been like, all right,
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 2: if you build something, do people actually think it's good?
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 2: Because like at some level, you know, it's like, I
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 2: just believe that people are actually very smart and understand
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 2: their lives very well. And if you're building something that
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 2: is useful for them, then they will use it. And
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 2: if you're using something, if you're building something that is
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 2: not useful for them, then they have other options. They will,
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 2: they will do something else. Um, And so, I don't know,
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 2: it's always served me well to generally have faith in
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: people and believe that people are smart and can make
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 2: good decisions for themselves. And whenever we try to like
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 2: adopt some sort of like attitude of, oh, we must
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 2: know better than them. It's like, we're like, we're the
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: people building technology. That's when you lose. Right. And if
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 2: you do, and if you have that attitude for long enough,
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 2: then you just like become a shitty company and you
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 2: lose and you lose and you lose. and then you're irrelevant.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: So I tend to just think that at the end
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 2: of the day, yeah, I mean, I think people are
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 2: smarter than a lot of people think, and I think
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 2: ultimately drive the direction that society goes in.
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: You, um, so, like, people a lot of times, like,
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 1: there's guys who are, like, kind of, you know, Elon
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: Musk is probably, like, a socially awkward guy, and I
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 1: would say that, I mean, I think it's... Yeah, yeah.
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 2: We all are. Right.
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 1: We all are.
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 1: I think we all are. And it's interesting that there's like,
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 1: probably people have, I mean, have you ever felt socially
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 1: awkward over your years?
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: No, I'm, I'm, I'm really smooth. Obviously.
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 1: Yes. Yeah.
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 2: I'm like the most awkward person. People have been calling
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 2: me a robot online for 20 years. It does wonders
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 2: for my confidence.
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 1: No, your confidence cannot be impaled. I don't think that's
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 1: one thing you have. That's probably a, a sheer North
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: star inside of you. It's gotta be, you've got to
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 1: become bulletproof. I think there's times where, yeah, you seem
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 1: like a guy who probably like, like watched a video
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 1: of how to be a guy on YouTube or something,
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 1: you know? But I think we all, we all go through, like,
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 1: we're all like awkward in different ways. You know, you
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 1: put you in certain environments and you're not at all.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 1: But I think it's interesting that there's... I.
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 2: Haven't found those environments yet, but maybe, you know, it's.
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 1: Dude, even being here today, bro, is nice of you.
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 1: It's nice of you to be here today.
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 2: No, I think the podcasts are awesome because you're just like,
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 2: you get to explore something.
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 1: Right, for sure. But here's my question. Sorry, Mark, I
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 1: didn't mean to interrupt you.
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 2: No, go for it.
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 1: But I'm not going to get another chance to. So
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 1: my question is, is it interesting that they have kind
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: of people who have, would probably self-describe as socially awkward
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 1: at times, kind of creating technology... that socially connects people.
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 1: That's the thing. Do you ever find that kind of fascinating?
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 1: Because I've always had a belief that sometimes socially awkward
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 1: people are almost a mix between human and the future
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 1: or something. Does that make any sense to you?
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, it's an interesting question. I just think
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 2: that there are a bunch of factors here that you
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 2: need to peel apart. I think someone can be socially
• 1:22:20
  Speaker 2: perceptive and understand kind of what is going on in
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 2: social dynamics and have a lot of empathy and care
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 2: about other people while still being quite awkward in how
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 2: they communicate. And, um, and so I, I don't think
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 2: you can build a great.
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I'm trying to build too broad of a bridge. No.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 2: Well, I think it's a fair point, right? I mean,
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 2: it's like, all right, a lot of social media is
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 2: like people creating great content and, um, and kind of
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 2: communicating really well. And those are not my biggest strengths, right?
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 2: It's like, I'm, I'm, I don't think I'm the best
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 2: communicator by a long shot. I mean, I think I
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 2: kind of got to where I am because I, I
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 2: think I kind of understand what people like, and I
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 2: have the ability to build it, but I don't think
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 2: my strength is like, oh, I can really like communicate
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 2: about why what I'm building is awesome. I generally like
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 2: to make it so that my work speaks for itself.
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 2: And I try to explain it so I can kind
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 2: of explain how I'm thinking about it. But I don't
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 2: think people primarily like using our stuff because they saw
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 2: me talk about it and they're like, oh yeah, this
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 2: seems super exciting now. But I think the ability to
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 2: kind of communicate in a way that is not awkward
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 2: is a different skill than the ability to kind of
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 2: understand and have empathy for, for kind of people and, and,
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 2: and social interactions. And it's, you know, there's an interesting
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 2: thing where I actually think sometimes a lot of the
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 2: people who can communicate in the smoothest way sometimes have
• 1:24:02
  Speaker 2: a lot less empathy and understanding of social dynamics than
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 2: the kind of nerdy guy who may not be able
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 2: to express himself quite as well, but sort of understands
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 2: a And I don't know, the world's complicated and there's
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 2: like multiple dimensions to all this stuff and no one's
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 2: good at all of them. So you just try to
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 2: do the things that you're like, hone the things that
• 1:24:26
  Speaker 2: you're good at and try to put it to service to,
• 1:24:29
  Speaker 2: you know, do as good of work as you can. Yeah.
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 1: I think we're in this unique place where I believe
• 1:24:34
  Speaker 1: it's like one or two generations think that one, something
• 1:24:37
  Speaker 1: isn't social. And then the younger generation thinks that it
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 1: is social. And so I feel like in some senses
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 1: we're at this crossroads kind of of like how we
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 1: communicate as humans a little bit and this advancement. And
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 1: sometimes those steps are kind of tricky to take. This
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 1: is my last question because I know you have to go.
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 1: So I feel like Elon Musk has like a– like
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 1: he wants to get on Mars and he wants to
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 1: like impregnate different planets or whatever, you know, or whatever
• 1:25:03
  Speaker 1: he's doing, dude. Yeah. just blasting his seat out into
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 1: the different rockets, whatever, you know, he's just out there,
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 1: you know, he's like the Johnny Apple solar system, you know,
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 1: but God bless, but no, God bless a hundred percent, dude.
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 1: And yeah, a hundred percent. Um, and I'm just joking. He, uh,
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 1: I think he probably would know that, but, um, I
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 1: just think it's interesting. Like you get his, you get
• 1:25:25
  Speaker 1: what his ideas are. He wants to like, we want
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 1: to be on Mars and we want to send the
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 1: rockets and we want to make everything solar powered and stuff.
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 1: And you're such an innovator and a leader. Like what is,
• 1:25:34
  Speaker 1: what do you feel like is your kind of, it's
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 1: not a goal, but kind of where do you, what
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 1: do you, what draw, like, what is the thing where
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 1: you see us, you know, like where you're at a
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 1: point where like, man, this is what I'm really proud of.
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 1: And this is where I see us going because, you know,
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 1: we're all on this bus together going somewhere and we
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 1: don't exactly know where we're going. Cause it's the future,
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 1: but you're kind of, you're kind of one of the
• 1:25:58
  Speaker 1: guys driving the bus, you know, or at least riding shotgun.
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 1: So it's like, where are we going? I mean, I
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 1: think different people just care about different parts of the future, right?
• 1:26:10
  Speaker 1: So the space thing, I think it's cool. I'm glad
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 1: that people are working on it. It's never really been
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 1: my main thing. For me, it's all, it's kind of
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 1: been about the intersection of how do you build technology
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 1: that helps people connect with each other and understand the
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 1: world better and just taking different formats over time, right?
• 1:26:32
  Speaker 1: So- you know, when we got started, people, you know,
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 1: were mostly like, you know, writing text. Then, you know,
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 1: then we got smartphones and we got cameras with the smartphones.
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 2: We started taking a lot of photos and sharing that.
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 2: And now most of what we do is video, right?
• 1:26:48
  Speaker 2: The mobile networks are good enough that you can like
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 2: share great video. It used to be like 10 years ago,
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 2: you try watching a video, it's like buffering, buffering. It's like, okay,
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 2: this is terrible. But now it's good. People always want to,
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 2: both kind of express their ideas and experience other people's
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 2: ideas in whatever the richest format is that they can.
• 1:27:11
  Speaker 2: So if that was gonna be text, then if that
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 2: was the best that they had, great. Photos, visual, great.
• 1:27:16
  Speaker 2: A picture's worth a thousand words. Video, better than photo
• 1:27:19
  Speaker 2: for most things. But I don't think that's the end
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 2: of the line, right? I just think we're gonna be here,
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 2: whether it's five years or 10 years, and I think
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 2: the ability to like fully capture moments, to really be
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 2: able to experience them. I think that's sort of the
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 2: hologram thing that we're talking about. I think that that's
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 2: just gonna be the next level of people being able
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 2: to express ideas and moments in their life. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 2: So I think that's one thing. And then there's the
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 2: whole AI thing, which we haven't spent as much time on.
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 2: But we should, we should. Which, that is really going to...
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 2: give people a lot of new tools to, to kind of, um,
• 1:28:07
  Speaker 2: both just get smarter at everything they do. And, um,
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 2: and if you look at the world, like I do
• 1:28:13
  Speaker 2: through this lens of how do we express ourselves and
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 2: how do we kind of take in an understanding of
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 2: what's going on, AI is just going to be super
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 2: powerful for, for both of those. It's, um, um, you
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 2: can already see some of the with people creating images
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 2: or editing images.
• 1:28:29
  Speaker 1: It's crazy how fast it's happening too. That's what I'm
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 1: amazed at is just how fast it's happening. Yeah.
• 1:28:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:28:33
  Speaker 1: But do you think like, do you envision this? Like,
• 1:28:37
  Speaker 1: are you just like, like, what do you envision that
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 1: will be on these like surf? Do you have like a,
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 1: like kind of like a utopian idea or do like,
• 1:28:45
  Speaker 1: I just wonder how do you see things? Cause you're
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 1: the only, like, you're probably one of the smartest people
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 1: to ever use thought.
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know.
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 1: Well, that we, you know, you're one of the most
• 1:28:57
  Speaker 1: unique people to ever use thought that we have in
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 1: our time. So it's like, how do you, what is
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 1: it like out there?
• 1:29:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think that we're going to get general intelligence.
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 2: We're going to have systems that are smarter than any individual.
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 2: And I think it's mostly going to be very empowering
• 1:29:16
  Speaker 2: for people. First of all, look, I mean, there are
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 2: already systems that are smarter than any one individual today, right?
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 2: If you take like a company, right? It's like, okay,
• 1:29:24
  Speaker 2: you got like a thousand people or 10,000 people who
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 2: are all kind of like working towards, you know, ostensibly
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 2: working towards a goal together. Like I, you know, if
• 1:29:32
  Speaker 2: the intelligence of a 10,000 person company is not greater
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 2: than the intelligence of a single person, then like, what
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 2: are we doing here?
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:29:40
  Speaker 2: So there are already these systems in the world that
• 1:29:43
  Speaker 2: have this sort of super intelligence that is far exceeds
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 2: what any one person can do. And I just think like,
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 2: instead of having relatively few people be able to kind
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 2: of harness the power of like, you have the ability
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 2: of you know, you have a 10,000 person organization that
• 1:30:02
  Speaker 2: can help you build the things that you think are good.
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 2: I just think in the future, almost everyone is going
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 2: to have that. And that's cool. What does that mean?
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 2: It means that more ideas are going to get tried out.
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 1: So it might be like leveling up in an overall
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 1: idea of creativity in the universe with AI.
• 1:30:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it's going to be every field, right? So, like,
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 2: science will get more advanced. Like, we'll get more productive. But, like,
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 2: I think a big part of the internet is stuff
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 2: just gets more fun and funnier. And, like, the memes
• 1:30:29
  Speaker 2: get weirder and more specific. And, like, that is advancement, too.
• 1:30:34
  Speaker 1: It's almost going to be like universal basic technology, kind of,
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 1: in a way.
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just the ability to kind of express these, like,
• 1:30:40
  Speaker 2: very complicated ideas in, like, a very simple piece of
• 1:30:45
  Speaker 2: media is... I think we're going to get better and
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 2: better at that. And that advances our kind of understanding
• 1:30:49
  Speaker 2: of ourselves as a society. So yeah, I don't know.
• 1:30:54
  Speaker 2: I think we'll get super intelligence and I would guess
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 2: that it will be a continuation of this trend that
• 1:31:01
  Speaker 2: humanity has been on for a hundred plus years of
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 2: basically getting more time to do creative things, less time
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 2: having to do drudgery, not having to spend as much
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 2: time working if you don't want, but if you want to,
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 2: dedicate your life towards that, you're going to have more
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 2: powerful tools than you could ever have possibly imagined.
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: So it's not as much a conviction as much as
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 1: it is a space of choice is how you see that.
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 1: Like just kind of that sort of thing.
• 1:31:25
  Speaker 2: What do you mean?
• 1:31:25
  Speaker 1: It's not like you're like convicted to this sort of
• 1:31:28
  Speaker 1: like future as we advance. Like it's just a space
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 1: of choice. If you still want to be able to
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 1: do these things, you can do those. And if you
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 1: want to be able to do these things, you can
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 1: do those. There you are on the bus right there.
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 2: There you go. I mean, that's a little weird of
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 2: a photo. I do not think that is good.
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 1: I do not think that is good.
• 1:31:43
  Speaker 2: I don't like that at all.
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 1: Thank you for telling us that, though. It's horrible AI. Yeah,
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 1: I think that was open AI, dude. So sorry about that.
• 1:31:52
  Speaker 1: Do you think you will live forever, Mark? Is that
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 1: a thought coming to your head?
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 2: That is an interesting question. I think.
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 1: You have two minutes to answer.
• 1:32:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know.
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 1: Live forever.
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 2: Gosh, I think at some point we will, like a
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 2: lot of, well, let me come at it this way. Our,
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 2: outside of Meta, the philanthropy that I do with Priscilla,
• 1:32:21
  Speaker 2: the Chan Zuckerberg Initiative is primarily focused on curing diseases.
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 2: And the way we're doing that is not by focusing
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: on any single disease. It's by focused on kind of
• 1:32:29
  Speaker 2: basic technology at the intersection of AI and biology. to
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 2: accelerate the pace of science. And we originally thought that
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 2: kind of a hundred years from when we started was
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 2: sort of around the timeframe to be able to cure
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 2: and prevent and like deal with all diseases. I know
• 1:32:50
  Speaker 2: there's a chance that that happens sooner than, um, you know,
• 1:32:53
  Speaker 2: because of, because of all the work with, with AI,
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 2: I guess I'm a more optimistic about that now. Um,
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 2: whether that means that like we are going to live
• 1:33:01
  Speaker 2: forever or we just have healthier lives for the period
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 2: that we're supposed to be living. And then at some point,
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 2: like your human body is done. Um, I don't, I
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 2: don't think we understand that yet enough, but, um, but
• 1:33:15
  Speaker 2: a lot of curing diseases is not just about living forever.
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 2: It's about having better lives. And, and it's like, and
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 2: it's like, while you're alive, like you don't want to
• 1:33:25
  Speaker 2: have to, deal with shit, right? It's like where you
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 2: feel terrible because you're sick or you're injured. Do you
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 2: think it's possible?
• 1:33:35
  Speaker 1: Because you have an understanding of science and being human
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 1: that is way supersedes a lot of people's. Do you
• 1:33:44
  Speaker 1: think it's possible that we could figure that out?
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 2: Curing all diseases?
• 1:33:47
  Speaker 1: To be able to live, to keep life. Do you
• 1:33:50
  Speaker 1: think it's possible that we could.
• 1:33:51
  Speaker 2: Figure out how to do it? I think it's possible.
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Honestly, it's not an area that I've
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 2: studied that much. You didn't know because we don't know.
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 2: We don't know what's going on, Mark, and we just
• 1:34:00
  Speaker 2: want you to tell us. Yeah. I mean, no, I
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 2: don't know. I don't know. Let's check back in in
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 2: 10 years on that. I think as the AI stuff
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 2: makes more progress, I think we'll kind of get a
• 1:34:12
  Speaker 2: sense of the trajectory for that. But I think it's
• 1:34:15
  Speaker 2: just going to unlock a lot of creativity and productivity
• 1:34:17
  Speaker 2: and fun. And I think people, the technology industry misses
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 2: fun a lot. I think that that's like one observation
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: that I've had building stuff out here is, um, people
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 2: are very focused on like, all right, we're going to
• 1:34:30
  Speaker 2: make like a better word processor. We're going to like
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 2: process information better. Cool. Um, but I know a lot
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 2: of what people care about is just like, all right,
• 1:34:40
  Speaker 2: I want to like be entertained. I want like, I
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 2: want my life to be fun. Right. I want, I
• 1:34:45
  Speaker 2: want something that's funny that I can then go show
• 1:34:47
  Speaker 2: to my friends and then we can talk about that.
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 2: And like, and then just hang out and have a
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 2: good time, like showing each other funny things and like
• 1:34:54
  Speaker 2: talking about what the world is. And I think AI
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 2: is going to make this stuff all great. So I
• 1:35:01
  Speaker 2: don't know. I mean, it's, I do think this is,
• 1:35:03
  Speaker 2: this is a big, a big focus for us and
• 1:35:05
  Speaker 2: we're building this meta AI. It's our, we call it
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 2: personal AI. I mean, our goal on this is not
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 2: just to build something that's like I mean, yeah, it's
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 2: going to be super smart, right? It's like, yeah, we're
• 1:35:19
  Speaker 2: trying to solve full general intelligence and super intelligence and
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 2: all that. But I think in order to build a
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 2: product that people are going to want to use, you're
• 1:35:27
  Speaker 2: going to want to build something that's fun to use.
• 1:35:28
  Speaker 2: That means like, you're not just going to want to
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 2: like type to it. You want to like have a conversation, right?
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 2: And it's not just about having it be like only
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 2: able to answer hard questions. It should like get to
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 2: know you and like what you think is funny and,
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 2: you like what you ate, right? So that way, you know,
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 2: it can like, or, you know, what your hobbies are.
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 2: So that way it can kind of relate to you.
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 1: And I think people don't know that AI can do that.
• 1:35:50
  Speaker 1: I think that we need, we're missing quickly. I think
• 1:35:53
  Speaker 1: in education, educating people, how to, what AI is and
• 1:35:57
  Speaker 1: how to use it. I think I noticed even in
• 1:35:59
  Speaker 1: my own life and I spent a lot of time
• 1:36:01
  Speaker 1: online involved in stuff, but I think people are not
• 1:36:04
  Speaker 1: understanding what's going on. So I don't know how we
• 1:36:06
  Speaker 1: get people educated quickly so that they can I think
• 1:36:09
  Speaker 1: whoever can also serve people the best way to educate
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 1: themselves is going to be able to best exert, um, or, um,
• 1:36:16
  Speaker 1: be able to best, uh, coagulate people to their AI, um,
• 1:36:22
  Speaker 1: model or whatever.
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 2: I've never heard coagulate used that way.
• 1:36:24
  Speaker 1: Or, yeah, or something like that.
• 1:36:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:36:27
  Speaker 1: Because that's the big thing. A lot of people are like,
• 1:36:29
  Speaker 1: we have the best AI, but most people are like,
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 1: what the hell is, what are we doing?
• 1:36:31
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying? Yeah.
• 1:36:33
  Speaker 1: So, anyway, sorry. I think I kept you longer than
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 1: we were supposed to, but, um, Yeah, sorry we got
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 1: into a lot of technological stuff. I think it's just
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 1: kind of like, you know, we don't know what's happening,
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 1: and sometimes we get to talk to somebody like you,
• 1:36:45
  Speaker 1: and it's important, you know?
• 1:36:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's good. This is a fun conversation.
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, man, I enjoyed it too, man. Yeah, thanks for
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 1: sharing just some of what your life is like with us,
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 1: and just I hope that, yeah, just keep, make sure
• 1:36:58
  Speaker 1: we stay alive or whatever we're supposed to, and just
• 1:37:01
  Speaker 1: keep taking... Working on it. Okay, that's all we can
• 1:37:03
  Speaker 1: ask for now, sir.
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 2: All right, awesome. Mark, thanks, dude. Thanks, man.
• 1:37:06
  Speaker 1: Appreciate it, brother.
• 1:37:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 1: Now I'm just floating on the breeze, and I feel
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 1: I'm falling like these leaves. I must be cornerstone. Oh,
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 1: but when I reach that ground.
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 2: I'll share this peace of mind I found.
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 1: I can feel it in my bones, but.
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 2: It's going to take a little longer.
• 1:37:30
  Speaker 1: I also want to say a thank you to the
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 1: people at Grace Dental. It's Grace Dental in Palo Alto, California.
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 1: They glued, my tooth was broken and they glued it
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 1: back together before the interview today. So I'm thankful that
• 1:37:50
  Speaker 1: they helped and I'm grateful that I got to meet them. Thanks.