Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Mom and Tot Go Missing on Family Camping Trip

Transcript

Mom and Tot Go Missing on Family Camping Trip · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A young mom and her
0:16
Speaker 1: two year old baby girl both missing. Now that's very rare.
0:22
Speaker 1: You may hear of a child missing or a mom missing,
0:26
Speaker 1: a guy missing, a single individual, but for both of
0:30
Speaker 1: them to be missing very unusual. Where is Jill and
0:37
Speaker 1: where is two year old Lydia? I'm Nancy Grace. This
0:41
Speaker 1: is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here
0:43
Speaker 1: at Fox Nation and series XM one eleven. First of all,
0:46
Speaker 1: take a listen to our friends at wgm E. Sanford
0:50
Speaker 1: police say they're looking for help finding a family that
0:52
Speaker 1: it believes to be missing. They were lasting in the
0:55
Speaker 1: Rumford area Wednesday, June twenty nine and a silver two
0:58
Speaker 1: thousand and five VW Jetta. Their play number on the
1:01
Speaker 1: screen rate here. Police say they could possibly be in
1:04
Speaker 1: the Phillips area camping, but they were due back in
1:07
Speaker 1: the area Thursday. Friends and families say they have not
1:09
Speaker 1: heard from them. If you information have information, police are
1:12
Speaker 1: asking you, they give them a call. We all go
1:15
Speaker 1: on camping trips, or at least I do. I love
1:18
Speaker 1: taking the twins. We either go camping in a tent,
1:21
Speaker 1: we go in an RV. They're avid scouts that sleep
1:27
Speaker 1: under the stars. My son even camps out and a
1:30
Speaker 1: hammock with a little covering over the top of it.
1:34
Speaker 1: The thought of being out in the woods and then
1:37
Speaker 1: suddenly disappearing almost seems like it's out a horror movie again.
1:43
Speaker 1: Thanks for being with us here at Fox Stations Series
1:45
Speaker 1: six one eleven. We've got an all star panel to
1:47
Speaker 1: make sense of what we know right now. Joining me
1:50
Speaker 1: James shell Nutt, twenty seven years Metro major case now
1:54
Speaker 1: lawyer at shell Nutt Law Firm. Doctor Jeff Gardere, longtime colleague.
1:59
Speaker 1: We're now on psychologists joining us, Professor Behavioral Medicine Turo College.
2:05
Speaker 1: And Greg Smith, special Deputy Sheriff joining us out of
2:09
Speaker 1: the Johnson County Sheriffs and he is the executive director
2:13
Speaker 1: of the Kelsey Smith Foundation. But first to Alexis Torschut,
2:17
Speaker 1: Crime Online dot Com investigative reporter. Alexis, tell me first
2:23
Speaker 1: of all about where this mom and daughter live and
2:26
Speaker 1: where they were going camping, because she gets from Sanford, Connecticut.
2:30
Speaker 1: She was going camping in Shillips, which is about two
2:34
Speaker 1: hours away, So a bit of a drive to go
2:36
Speaker 1: camping two and a half hours away. You know, I'm curious.
2:41
Speaker 1: Greg Smith joining me, Special Deputy Sheriff and director of
2:45
Speaker 1: the Kelsey Smith Foundation. Greg, when you take a child anywhere,
2:53
Speaker 1: there's a lot of accoutrement. I remember when the children
2:57
Speaker 1: were little and we would just pack them up to
2:59
Speaker 1: go visit my parents two hours away. The entire back
3:04
Speaker 1: of the minivan would be full. You've got sleeping stuff, bottles, formula,
3:13
Speaker 1: bottel heaters, bottle cleaners, I mean everything. To take a
3:18
Speaker 1: two year old camping, now, let's just say that's courageous. Right. Well, yeah,
3:23
Speaker 1: you're gonna have a lot of stuff. I mean I
3:25
Speaker 1: can I can speak from experience. Just a couple of
3:27
Speaker 1: weekends ago, I took four of my grandchildren camping in
3:30
Speaker 1: our camper. The youngest one was three, and it's a
3:34
Speaker 1: twenty two foot camper and it was stuff full of
3:36
Speaker 1: all kinds of things. So, yeah, you're gonna have a
3:38
Speaker 1: whole lot of stuff. And the reason I'm asking that is,
3:42
Speaker 1: I mean maybe in the past, Jeff Gardier, you've got
3:47
Speaker 1: six children. Okay, that's a handful. Jeff Gardier on when
3:54
Speaker 1: you go camping to start with, you know, you've got
3:57
Speaker 1: to be ready for every contingency. But before you have children,
4:02
Speaker 1: I mean you knew me before I had the twins.
4:06
Speaker 1: If I got an offer to go on a diving
4:08
Speaker 1: trip halfway around the world, I'm gone that weekend. Buy.
4:11
Speaker 1: But when you have children, it's a whole another ball game.
4:16
Speaker 1: The planning. It takes a lot to take a kid anywhere,
4:19
Speaker 1: much less camping, right, Absolutely, and there has to be
4:23
Speaker 1: full responsibility. You have to train the children, you have
4:26
Speaker 1: to have a plan in place, you have to have contingencies,
4:30
Speaker 1: and certainly you have to know each and every person
4:33
Speaker 1: coming in and out of contact with you or wherever
4:36
Speaker 1: you may be on that camping trip. You know where
4:39
Speaker 1: I'm going with this, James Shelnup. You leave a trail
4:42
Speaker 1: when you've got a child with you. You're going to
4:45
Speaker 1: leave a trail if you're a responsible parent. And she,
4:48
Speaker 1: by all accounts very very loving mom, very responsible. She's
4:54
Speaker 1: got another child that's ten years old. All about her children.
4:58
Speaker 1: So when you he disappear with a child, you leave
5:04
Speaker 1: a trail. You have to stop at a gas station,
5:08
Speaker 1: you have to run into the Mini mark, You've got
5:11
Speaker 1: to drive through a McDonald's and get a happy meal.
5:13
Speaker 1: I mean something. There's gotta be a trail. That's what
5:17
Speaker 1: I'm getting at James Shell not for Pete's sake, twenty
5:20
Speaker 1: seven years on Metro major case from or Swat and
5:24
Speaker 1: James helped me out here. Why can't we find this woman?
5:27
Speaker 1: I think they can't find this woman because I believe
5:29
Speaker 1: that she is involuntarily missing right now. That's why I
5:32
Speaker 1: believe they can't find her. You're right, We've got five kids,
5:36
Speaker 1: all of them at some point we're two years old.
5:38
Speaker 1: When you go camping with a two year old, that's
5:40
Speaker 1: a pretty brave experience. They need clothes, they need possibly
5:44
Speaker 1: diapers if they're not potty trained, and at some point
5:47
Speaker 1: you run out of supplies and you can need to
5:49
Speaker 1: go restock. You need to wash those clothes, you need
5:52
Speaker 1: to go get more food. You know, this is something
5:55
Speaker 1: where there should be a trail of them popping back
5:58
Speaker 1: up on the radar some where somewhere. Alexa's Tureschuk Crime
6:04
Speaker 1: Online dot Com investigative reporter. I think you will recall
6:07
Speaker 1: the case and maybe you doctor Jeff Gardier. We covered
6:11
Speaker 1: of Catherine Hoggle, she had her children and okay, they've
6:17
Speaker 1: disappeared and they've never been seen since. My point is
6:21
Speaker 1: they were spotted on video at a Chick fil A.
6:25
Speaker 1: That's exactly what shell Nutt is saying. You've got to stop,
6:28
Speaker 1: You've gotta a restock. So you just can't go on
6:32
Speaker 1: a trip with a child and not stop for a
6:35
Speaker 1: potty break at the very least. I mean, we can't
6:38
Speaker 1: get fifteen minutes before my son wants a milkshake. So
6:43
Speaker 1: that's the way that unfolds. That's why I find this
6:46
Speaker 1: so unusual. They go to it's Philip's Main the White
6:51
Speaker 1: Mountain National Forest. They're leaving from Sanford. It's about a
6:56
Speaker 1: two and a half hour drive, and there's no occasion
7:00
Speaker 1: of them stopping the whole way. Now two and a
7:03
Speaker 1: half hours, I can imagine making it that far, but
7:05
Speaker 1: at some point you're gonna leave a trail check list
7:09
Speaker 1: and our friends at wc SH. I'm not sure if
7:14
Speaker 1: maybe like we misunderstood something when she said she'd be
7:18
Speaker 1: back at that time, but I don't. I don't think
7:22
Speaker 1: that she would shoot pull this. Rita Lyman is the
7:25
Speaker 1: oldest of three siblings. Her youngest sister, Jill sideboff Him
7:29
Speaker 1: from Sanford, is missing. Rita says her family hasn't spoken
7:32
Speaker 1: to her in seven days, and I'm supposed to be
7:35
Speaker 1: the oldest. You know, I'm supposed to be the one
7:37
Speaker 1: that's that looks out for them, and I can't. I don't,
7:46
Speaker 1: I don't know where to go. Can we talk one
7:48
Speaker 1: moment about behavioral evidence. It's called routine evidence. It's not
7:54
Speaker 1: routine or ordinary. It's evidence of your daily routine. Because
7:59
Speaker 1: you know grey Smith's special deputy share of Johnson County, Greg,
8:04
Speaker 1: Let's talk about your daughter, Kelsey. For Kelsey, when she
8:09
Speaker 1: went to the I think it was a Target. When
8:12
Speaker 1: she went to buy a gift at Target, she was
8:17
Speaker 1: on the phone with your wife, her mother, trying to
8:21
Speaker 1: pick out the gift. They were in constant contact. I'm
8:25
Speaker 1: in constant contact with my twins, and when you suddenly
8:29
Speaker 1: break that chain, it's unusual. My husband travels a lot,
8:35
Speaker 1: he works really hard. His day is bam bam, bam,
8:38
Speaker 1: bam bam, and I don't expect to talk on the
8:41
Speaker 1: phone and have a big, long conversation. But if we
8:44
Speaker 1: went a whole let's just say day without texting, I
8:49
Speaker 1: would think something was really wrong. That's what routine evidence is.
8:57
Speaker 1: Behavioral evidence. And hear you hear her sister in anguish
9:02
Speaker 1: because she knows something is really wrong. She hasn't heard
9:06
Speaker 1: from her sister. Yeah, I mean, those those patterns of
9:09
Speaker 1: life are extremely important in a case like this when
9:12
Speaker 1: you expect contact and you're not getting it. I mean,
9:14
Speaker 1: that was really the key thing that started the whole
9:17
Speaker 1: search for Kelsey is she was such a responsible person
9:20
Speaker 1: and always kept in touch with us, and if she
9:23
Speaker 1: was going to be late, she let us know, and
9:24
Speaker 1: none of that happened. So you've got a similar situation here.
9:28
Speaker 1: So yeah, those are indicators for that family that hey,
9:30
Speaker 1: something something's gone wrong here, you know, and is it serious?
9:37
Speaker 1: You know, we hope not. But they're overdue, if by
9:41
Speaker 1: quite a bit of time now, so it would definitely
9:44
Speaker 1: be something I'd be worried about. Time stories with me.
9:58
Speaker 1: It's a grace to doctor Jeff Gardier, renowned psychologist, professor
10:05
Speaker 1: behavioral medicine, and author of the Causes of Autism. Doctor
10:10
Speaker 1: Jeff Hugh and I covered the Nicole Brown murder, the
10:16
Speaker 1: Ron Godman murders at the hands of Simpson, and many
10:21
Speaker 1: people started that timeline with the sound of their dog,
10:26
Speaker 1: Nicole's dog wailing in the background, and that was good
10:31
Speaker 1: enough for the prosecutors. And I agree with them because
10:34
Speaker 1: the neighbors had never heard that before. I think that
10:38
Speaker 1: in this case, when the family says this has never
10:42
Speaker 1: happened before, that that should not be discounted and that
10:46
Speaker 1: should be the beginning of the timeline. Absolutely, And as
10:49
Speaker 1: I was thinking about this, I'm also wondering when was
10:53
Speaker 1: the absolute last time they had heard from Jill while
10:58
Speaker 1: she was on that trip. Did she call to say
11:01
Speaker 1: we arrived wherever we were supposed to go that you know,
11:08
Speaker 1: Lydia is doing okay, you know this is what's happening here,
11:13
Speaker 1: because the family was concerned about her leaving. So yes, absolutely,
11:17
Speaker 1: we have to pay a lot of attention to something
11:20
Speaker 1: that is different from her usual psychological functioning, sociological functioning,
11:27
Speaker 1: or at least send picks because you've got your two
11:29
Speaker 1: year old girl with you and as she's doing all
11:32
Speaker 1: sorts of cute things, I would believe that the mom
11:34
Speaker 1: would be taking picks and sending them, texting them. And
11:38
Speaker 1: then we get a break in the case. Take listen
11:42
Speaker 1: to our seven our friends at WABI. The search for
11:45
Speaker 1: a missing Sandford family continues after authorities say they were
11:49
Speaker 1: spotted over the weekend. The Sandford Police Department has been
11:52
Speaker 1: searching for Jill Sidebottom, Nicholas Hanson, and their two year
11:56
Speaker 1: old Lydia Hanson since late June. Authorities say the family,
11:59
Speaker 1: who was going camping in the Phillips area, was lasting
12:03
Speaker 1: by additional family on June twenty seventh. Authorities say they
12:06
Speaker 1: have not been heard from since. Officials say the family
12:09
Speaker 1: was spotted in a state on Saturday evening at a
12:11
Speaker 1: Walmart in Mexico. Sanford Officials say they are still working
12:15
Speaker 1: through tips and sightings and ask for the public's help
12:18
Speaker 1: locating them. So they're actually spotted at a Walmart in Mexico, Maine.
12:24
Speaker 1: Let's take a look at what that means. Number one,
12:29
Speaker 1: we know they're still alive. July two. Okay, so we've
12:33
Speaker 1: had June twenty seven, eight, twenty nine, thirty. Now we're
12:38
Speaker 1: on July two. They're alive. Then they've made it that far.
12:42
Speaker 1: They're at a Walmart. You know what's interesting. It even
12:46
Speaker 1: matters what they were buying. It matters if they're restocking
12:52
Speaker 1: for more camping, or if they're getting snacks and gas
12:55
Speaker 1: to hit the road and go back home. All of
12:58
Speaker 1: that matters. What about it, shall night, I agree with
13:00
Speaker 1: you one hundred percent. Matter of fact, that's one of
13:02
Speaker 1: the things that came to buy when us making some
13:03
Speaker 1: notes on this this morning, is that it would be
13:05
Speaker 1: nice to know, you know, did they buy those diapers?
13:08
Speaker 1: Did they buy additional two to continue this camping trip,
13:11
Speaker 1: because if they didn't, then that's even more concerning. You know,
13:15
Speaker 1: let's talk about Phillip's Main The population at the time
13:20
Speaker 1: right now is only eight hundred and ninety eight people.
13:25
Speaker 1: Eight hundred and ninety eight people. Now, this is in
13:29
Speaker 1: the White Mountain National Forest. Alexis Terreschuk joining US Crime
13:34
Speaker 1: online dot Com investigative reporter alexis, what can you tell
13:38
Speaker 1: me about the White Mountain National Forest? How big is it?
13:44
Speaker 1: And the reason I ask we have just come off
13:47
Speaker 1: the Gabby Potito Brian laundry case. They were camping to
13:53
Speaker 1: start with, and dispersed camping, which means you're not near
13:56
Speaker 1: an electrical hookup, a water hookup. You're really out in
14:00
Speaker 1: the middle of the wild with the wild animals. You've
14:03
Speaker 1: got to be a really good camper to do something
14:05
Speaker 1: like that. And then we dealt with the Carlton Reserve.
14:09
Speaker 1: The Carlton Reserve in Florida twenty five thousand acres of
14:14
Speaker 1: national Natural forests and swamp land, and that is where
14:18
Speaker 1: laundry hold up and we think shot himself out of guilt,
14:23
Speaker 1: I'm murdering Gabby Petito. The terrain and all the facts
14:30
Speaker 1: surrounding that reserve, as well as where they were camping,
14:35
Speaker 1: became big factors in the search and the possibilities as
14:38
Speaker 1: to what happened. So now we're talking about the White
14:41
Speaker 1: Mountain National Forest. What do we know about that? Alexis, Well,
14:45
Speaker 1: here's something I think that's really important. The White Mountain
14:47
Speaker 1: National Forest has a rule that you may not stay
14:51
Speaker 1: overnight in your car. So the thing is they were seeing,
14:55
Speaker 1: you know, in the car. There was silar car that
14:58
Speaker 1: they put out, you know, an alert if you see
15:00
Speaker 1: this car, but you cannot stay in your car and
15:03
Speaker 1: this park. So if their car was somewhere in this
15:06
Speaker 1: park overnight, and since they've been gone for somebody today,
15:09
Speaker 1: somebody would have noticed it. Wait a minute. It says
15:11
Speaker 1: you can't stay in your car, But can you park
15:14
Speaker 1: your car and go and stay in the tent. Yes,
15:18
Speaker 1: but you can't stay in the park. So that could
15:20
Speaker 1: be one thing that would be something right, Well wait, wait, wait, wait,
15:23
Speaker 1: you're saying you can't stay overnight camping in the park.
15:27
Speaker 1: You can't drive your car and like sleep in your car.
15:30
Speaker 1: You have to have a tent. There was no mention.
15:33
Speaker 1: Nobody ever said, you know, they packed up their camping
15:35
Speaker 1: gear or anything like that. They just drove away in
15:37
Speaker 1: a car. Okay, this place is huge. It's seven hundred
15:41
Speaker 1: and fifty thousand, eight hundred and fifty two acres. It's
15:46
Speaker 1: wildly popular, and we know that they are very tall
15:50
Speaker 1: mountain peaks there. Now, do I think they took the
15:53
Speaker 1: baby up a mountain peak? No, I'm just curious if
15:56
Speaker 1: we can figure out, Greg Smith, did they ever actually
16:00
Speaker 1: go camping? Let me just put this in your mind. Everybody,
16:04
Speaker 1: we all remember the story and we're waiting on the
16:08
Speaker 1: trial of Cultmam Laurie Valo. Remember that last faithful photo
16:13
Speaker 1: of them at Yellowstone. Now, they were just apparently going
16:18
Speaker 1: for a day trip, but I would expect there to
16:23
Speaker 1: be some indication of what their plan was that changes
16:27
Speaker 1: the whole search. Were they camping, Was it a day trip?
16:30
Speaker 1: Were they staying in a nearby a hotel or a
16:33
Speaker 1: motel and just going there during the day. We have
16:37
Speaker 1: no indication they actually ever went camping, or do we
16:40
Speaker 1: Alexis rus Chuck, No, we don't. We don't have any
16:43
Speaker 1: proof about at all. None. And she haven't spoken to
16:46
Speaker 1: her family in days. So she left on the twenty seventh.
16:51
Speaker 1: The last time they heard from her was the twenty
16:53
Speaker 1: eighth of June, just the very next day. So Betty,
16:57
Speaker 1: she forgot her phone charger or a car charger wasn't working.
17:01
Speaker 1: But they were in a Walmart. They could have bought
17:03
Speaker 1: a new phone charger. They could have sat down. I
17:06
Speaker 1: think Walmart will let you do Walmart anything. You can
17:08
Speaker 1: sit down and plug in your phone. But nothing, no
17:11
Speaker 1: communication whatsoever. That's where her sister is saying, maybe I
17:15
Speaker 1: misunderstood what she said, but I talked to her and
17:18
Speaker 1: then she's just done, and so they have no communication
17:22
Speaker 1: and no way to even paying the phone. It's interesting
17:25
Speaker 1: on that count. To doctor Jeff Gardier, if I suggest
17:30
Speaker 1: the twins ago anywhere without their phones, it's like all
17:35
Speaker 1: hell broke loose. This woman's phone has been turned off
17:41
Speaker 1: since June twenty eight. Now they were spotted at that
17:46
Speaker 1: Walmart in Mexico, Maine. And again, Alexis, how far we
17:52
Speaker 1: know she comes from Sandford two and a half hours
17:54
Speaker 1: to Phillips, Maine, the White Mountain National Forest. Then they're
17:58
Speaker 1: spotted day or too later at this walmart and Mexico, Maine.
18:03
Speaker 1: How far is Mexico, Maine from Phillips, Maine where they
18:07
Speaker 1: were camping. It's about thirty miles north Okay. And I
18:12
Speaker 1: have confirmed doctor Jeff Garder that they were buying food,
18:15
Speaker 1: although I don't know what kind of food. If it's
18:18
Speaker 1: food to cook over a camp fire versus snacks to
18:22
Speaker 1: go back home, we don't know the answer to that.
18:25
Speaker 1: But what do you make it for? Phoneming cut off?
18:29
Speaker 1: Isn't that odd to you? That's very alarming and so interesting.
18:32
Speaker 1: You should say that I'm scheduling patients this morning to
18:36
Speaker 1: be seen, and one of those people her phone just
18:40
Speaker 1: stops working. Now, of course, I'm not considering any solid play,
18:44
Speaker 1: but it's concerning to me because the person knows that
18:47
Speaker 1: they have a therapy session. They have not reached out
18:50
Speaker 1: to me. They haven't said anything, so I'm thinking maybe
18:52
Speaker 1: their phone is cut off, but it may mean that
18:55
Speaker 1: they may not have the money. Again, I'm not concerned
18:58
Speaker 1: about foul play. I'm concerned so in this particular situation
19:03
Speaker 1: with what we're talking about, with Jill and the rest
19:06
Speaker 1: of the family. For her phone to be cut off
19:08
Speaker 1: in that way on a trip with her daughters, no
19:12
Speaker 1: one is communicating and now you add on that the
19:16
Speaker 1: phone is cut off to me is very very concerning.
19:19
Speaker 1: And one last thing, Nancy, I would also be very
19:23
Speaker 1: interested as to what they look like physically when they
19:26
Speaker 1: were spotted and what kind of behavior they were exhibiting.
19:30
Speaker 1: Oh good thought, has anybody thought that there's not a
19:34
Speaker 1: signal up in White Mountain National Forest? Has that dawned
19:39
Speaker 1: on anybody that maybe that's why you can't get in
19:42
Speaker 1: touch with them, which could indicate that's where they had
19:46
Speaker 1: gone missing or met with foul play, or was the
19:49
Speaker 1: phone intentionally cut off? Take a listen now to our
19:53
Speaker 1: friend mal Meyer at WGNA. The Sandford Police have been
19:57
Speaker 1: looking far and wide for this family, which includes a
20:01
Speaker 1: two year old child. Authorities now say that the family
20:04
Speaker 1: was spotted buying food at a Walmart on Friday. Where
20:08
Speaker 1: they went after that is still unknown. Police are trying
20:12
Speaker 1: to find Jill Sidebotham, two year old Lydia Hanson, and
20:16
Speaker 1: Nicholas Hanson. The group was last known to be headed
20:19
Speaker 1: to the Phillips area for camping, which is about two
20:22
Speaker 1: and a half hours north of Sandford. They were due
20:26
Speaker 1: back in southern Maine last Thursday, but police say family
20:30
Speaker 1: members grew worried after not hearing from them, which is
20:33
Speaker 1: how law enforcement got involved. After a few days without
20:36
Speaker 1: any confirmed sightings, the group was last seen on surveillance
20:40
Speaker 1: video at an undisclosed Walmart. Now, let's throw a wrench
20:45
Speaker 1: in the works. Take a listen to our friends at
20:49
Speaker 1: crime online dot com rkat to. This is Dave Mack.
20:52
Speaker 1: Corey Alexander says he and Jill sidebotham have been in
20:55
Speaker 1: a relationship for three years and are engaged to be married.
20:59
Speaker 1: Alexander said, as Jill's devoted mom, she was supposed to
21:02
Speaker 1: see her son on June thirtieth, the day she was
21:04
Speaker 1: due back from her camping trip with her x. Her
21:07
Speaker 1: son was planning to stay for the weekend. Jill's father,
21:10
Speaker 1: Ron says, Jill worships her son and it's not like
21:13
Speaker 1: her to not show up, especially without mentioning anything to anyone.
21:17
Speaker 1: Corey Alexander says, we had planned for the weekend. We
21:20
Speaker 1: were going to do stuff with the kids for the
21:22
Speaker 1: fourth July and we were just going to have a
21:24
Speaker 1: nice long weekend together, and then Friday came around and
21:27
Speaker 1: I realized she wasn't answering me. I knew something was wrong.
21:30
Speaker 1: Something in my gut was just telling me that this
21:32
Speaker 1: isn't right. He said. He's never before known Sidebotham not
21:36
Speaker 1: to respond to a text or a voicemail. When Jill
21:39
Speaker 1: and Lydia did not return from camping on June thirtieth,
21:41
Speaker 1: the family grew concerned. On July second, two days after
21:45
Speaker 1: they were expected home, Sidebotham's family reported them missing to
21:48
Speaker 1: the Sanford Police. Okay, let me understand something. So twenty
21:52
Speaker 1: eight year old Jill is engaged to be married to
21:58
Speaker 1: Corey Alexander. They've got a wedding date, everything's set, but
22:02
Speaker 1: she goes camping with her ex and their daughter. She
22:07
Speaker 1: has baby Lydia with the ex, right, Nicholas Hanson, So
22:14
Speaker 1: she and the bio dad take their daughter camping. Do
22:20
Speaker 1: I have that right, Alexis Treschuk, Yes, you do. Nicholas
22:24
Speaker 1: Hansen is her ex and he is the father of
22:27
Speaker 1: her daughter, Lydia, so he came over to the house.
22:30
Speaker 1: She actually Lydia. I'm sorry, not Lydia. Jill. Well, Jill
22:33
Speaker 1: and Lydia live with Jill's parents, and Nicholas came over
22:37
Speaker 1: to the house and said, let's go camping together, and
22:41
Speaker 1: she agreed to go with him. Okay, to take the baby.
22:45
Speaker 1: Okay too, Doctor Jeff Gardier, I'm all about co parenting
22:49
Speaker 1: and this is their bio child, baby Lydia. They have together, fine,
22:54
Speaker 1: But what do you make of it? Well, you know
22:58
Speaker 1: she is engaged to Corey Alexander, but yet she goes
23:02
Speaker 1: on a camping trip with Nicholas Hans and her supposed
23:07
Speaker 1: x So to me, that is very disturbing as to
23:11
Speaker 1: why there is that sort of situation going on. Number
23:15
Speaker 1: one and number two her ten year old son. I mean, this,
23:20
Speaker 1: from what we know, is a devoted mother to her
23:22
Speaker 1: two year old. I don't see any reason why she
23:25
Speaker 1: wouldn't be just as devoted to the child who's been
23:27
Speaker 1: around even longer, her ten year old son. And so
23:31
Speaker 1: she hasn't reached out to them, from what we know,
23:34
Speaker 1: reached out to that boy. So all of that just
23:38
Speaker 1: makes it just a very very disconcerting situation and tells
23:44
Speaker 1: me and I'm just guessing here, but I think everyone
23:47
Speaker 1: agrees that there there is something going on, and it
23:51
Speaker 1: is not good. Take a listen our nine from our
23:54
Speaker 1: friends at w g NA. At this point, it's not
23:58
Speaker 1: considered necessarily suspicious. It's just unusual. It's unusual and yeah,
24:03
Speaker 1: and it's just you know, concerning for the family, and
24:06
Speaker 1: if they're concerned, then we want to pay attention to that.
24:09
Speaker 1: Also adding to this that a child is involved. But
24:12
Speaker 1: at this point authorities still have no reason to believe
24:16
Speaker 1: foul play is involved or that this is a criminal matter.
24:19
Speaker 1: There's a lot of unknowns, including if the group is
24:23
Speaker 1: intentionally or unintentionally avoiding contact. Greg Smith, you're the special
24:29
Speaker 1: Deputy sheriff. Why does law enforcement always say that they
24:32
Speaker 1: don't expect foul play? The woman has crapped out on
24:37
Speaker 1: her son, her fiance, her family. If she's doing this
24:40
Speaker 1: on purpose, and I don't believe that she is, why
24:43
Speaker 1: do they always say we don't suspect foul play. Everybody
24:47
Speaker 1: knows she's in constant touch with her family. Law enforcement
24:50
Speaker 1: is limited, Nancy, because of the environment today. All they
24:54
Speaker 1: can go on is what they see. Apparently from that video,
24:57
Speaker 1: it looked like nobody was under duress in the store,
25:00
Speaker 1: went in, they bought food. According to the stories that
25:02
Speaker 1: we have. Yes, it's unusual that there hasn't been any
25:06
Speaker 1: cell phone contact, there haven't been any texts, those types
25:09
Speaker 1: of things, But they can't definitively say that there's been
25:13
Speaker 1: some kind of foul play. And in today's society where
25:17
Speaker 1: everybody sues everybody for saying anything, law enforcement has become
25:21
Speaker 1: somewhat cautious in what they're going to put out there policy.
25:25
Speaker 1: See this is James jump in, say, look, at what
25:28
Speaker 1: point do you become concerned? Listen, let's size this up
25:31
Speaker 1: for just a second. This lady and her two year
25:35
Speaker 1: old daughter went camping with an X who Jill had
25:39
Speaker 1: a toxic relationship with. They have not been seen or
25:43
Speaker 1: heard of in ten days. She has a ten year
25:46
Speaker 1: old son at home wondering where his mother is at.
25:50
Speaker 1: Is completely out of character for her to not contact
25:53
Speaker 1: this family. At what point does a Stanford police department
25:56
Speaker 1: get concerned? To me? This is outrageous that they have
26:00
Speaker 1: not taken a more aggressive approach and saying, hey, we
26:03
Speaker 1: are worried about this lady. We hope she turns up
26:05
Speaker 1: safe tomorrow, but for right now, there's absolutely calls for concern.
26:10
Speaker 1: Let me go to doctor Jeff Guarder jumping off of
26:13
Speaker 1: what shell Nutt and Smith just said. Doctor Jeff Garder
26:17
Speaker 1: not just a renowned clinical psychologist and professor, also author
26:21
Speaker 1: of I believe one of your books is called Love Prescription.
26:25
Speaker 1: Remember that because I haven't forgotten it. What hold does
26:30
Speaker 1: certain guys have over certain women and vice versa? Okay,
26:35
Speaker 1: wait before you answer that, take a listen to our
26:38
Speaker 1: cut one. This is Dave matt our friend at crime
26:42
Speaker 1: online dot com. Joll's father, Ron says, I'm June twenty seven,
26:46
Speaker 1: Nicholas Hanson showed up unexpectedly at their house and asked
26:49
Speaker 1: Jill to go on a camping trip with him and
26:51
Speaker 1: to bring lydia. Jill's mother urged her not to go,
26:54
Speaker 1: but Jill said it would be fine. Jill's father, Ron
26:57
Speaker 1: says he was concerned as soon as he heard about
26:59
Speaker 1: them from two camping trips, saying he doesn't trust Nicholas Hanson,
27:02
Speaker 1: claiming there have been issues. They went camping in Phillips,
27:06
Speaker 1: about two and a half hours north of Stanford, and
27:07
Speaker 1: we're expected to return home on June thirtieth. Jill Sidebotham's
27:11
Speaker 1: phone stopped working on June twenty eighth, and Hanson's on
27:15
Speaker 1: June twenty ninth. They did not return on June thirtieth. Okay,
27:19
Speaker 1: doctor Jeff Gardier. Can you imagine if an old boyfriend
27:23
Speaker 1: showed up on my steps and said, hey, let's go camping,
27:29
Speaker 1: but get the hay gone. There's a reason we broke up. Okay, No,
27:36
Speaker 1: I would not go camping with an X. That not
27:41
Speaker 1: that I think that he would go berserk, but that
27:43
Speaker 1: would totally hurt my husband's feelings. I'm not going to
27:47
Speaker 1: leave my son behind and take my daughter. That's not
27:53
Speaker 1: going to happen. But what is that pull that men,
27:58
Speaker 1: certain men have over certain women. Advice Earth. Too often
28:02
Speaker 1: what we see in couples and relationships, specifically committed relationships
28:07
Speaker 1: or good relationships that were at some point very significant,
28:11
Speaker 1: is that old behavior patterns come in. Someone may say
28:15
Speaker 1: something that sounds alluring, someone may say something that sounds
28:20
Speaker 1: like it was significant in the past, and then it
28:24
Speaker 1: reignites something in that person's mind. So let's go camping. Okay.
28:29
Speaker 1: I know that something I shouldn't do. I shouldn't bring
28:32
Speaker 1: my daughter, but it brings about a sense of excitement
28:35
Speaker 1: I once had. Maybe I'm having an issue with my
28:39
Speaker 1: present relationship with someone else, So then I make perhaps
28:44
Speaker 1: a decision that may not be the safest. But Nancy,
28:47
Speaker 1: one of the things that I've learned for a very
28:49
Speaker 1: long time is when your family says, hold up, wait
28:55
Speaker 1: a minute, alarm bells, don't do this. We have to
28:59
Speaker 1: listen to the family, because the family always seems well
29:03
Speaker 1: for the most part, may be much more clear eyed
29:07
Speaker 1: about a situation because they may not be directly involved
29:11
Speaker 1: with an individual, but they're able to see it much
29:14
Speaker 1: more objectively as family. And therefore, when they give a warning,
29:20
Speaker 1: we should listen to that family. We should listen to
29:23
Speaker 1: the parents. We should listen to the siblings. You know
29:27
Speaker 1: that thing that we all do. We do something through
29:32
Speaker 1: caution to the wind, and do something, go somewhere on
29:37
Speaker 1: an impulse. We've all done it. Why do we do that,
29:42
Speaker 1: doctor Jeff Gardeer, knowing it's going to be nothing of
29:45
Speaker 1: trouble again, it's going back to those old behavior patterns
29:48
Speaker 1: that we still I don't know what you mean by that.
29:51
Speaker 1: You better dummy down for me and give me an example.
29:54
Speaker 1: If we're involved in a particular interaction with someone, we
29:58
Speaker 1: still have unresolved feelings, unresolved emotions. We tell ourselves well
30:04
Speaker 1: it's over. We say that in a manifest sort of way,
30:08
Speaker 1: a peripheral way, but deep down inside we've never resolved
30:13
Speaker 1: that psychodynamic or those feelings. Then you know, all we're
30:17
Speaker 1: doing is putting a band aid on something that hasn't
30:20
Speaker 1: completely healed. I figure out what you're saying. Are you
30:23
Speaker 1: trying to say, maybe she still had feelings for this guy,
30:26
Speaker 1: Maybe she still loved him even though she's engaged to
30:29
Speaker 1: somebody else, and he shows up and goes, hey, let's
30:32
Speaker 1: take our baby girl and go camping. Okay, let's just
30:35
Speaker 1: give it a try. I could see a lot of
30:38
Speaker 1: women falling for that. You said it much better than I.
30:41
Speaker 1: You broke it down, and thank you, Nancy. Absolutely that
30:44
Speaker 1: is a possibility. But let's look at another possibility. Could
30:48
Speaker 1: it be the individual knows exactly what buttons to push,
30:53
Speaker 1: exactly how to manipulate, which is part of that, And
30:57
Speaker 1: whether there was a fear factor that ball that the
31:01
Speaker 1: parents don't know about. Greg Smith, I got a bad feeling.
31:04
Speaker 1: I've got a bad feeling. I mean, look, women and
31:09
Speaker 1: men all the time will go off on. Let me
31:12
Speaker 1: just say, in a nice way, I'll walk about I
31:14
Speaker 1: could see this guy showing up and going, look, we've
31:17
Speaker 1: got a long history, we've got this baby girl between us.
31:20
Speaker 1: Let's just go away for the weekend, have a good time,
31:24
Speaker 1: just be together as a family. I could see her going, Okay,
31:31
Speaker 1: can you just see that. It's a strange it's a
31:35
Speaker 1: strange situation. I mean, as I've read through different stories
31:38
Speaker 1: about this, and I look at some of the dynamics
31:42
Speaker 1: of it. I mean, he's ten years older than her,
31:45
Speaker 1: which is kind of a strange relationship in and of itself.
31:49
Speaker 1: And then you look at the cell phone data that
31:51
Speaker 1: we've talked about, the fact that the phones were offered,
31:54
Speaker 1: they're no longer activated. I mean, cell phones are my thing,
31:58
Speaker 1: that's my specialty. I'm concerned why I don't understand why
32:02
Speaker 1: there hasn't been more emphasis put on the cell phone.
32:04
Speaker 1: There's a lot of information that can be got from
32:07
Speaker 1: cell phone records, from CSLI, from cell site location information.
32:12
Speaker 1: Granted that's going to take a warrant to pull that
32:14
Speaker 1: information out, but you can actually figure out where they've
32:16
Speaker 1: been where you know, where were they on June twenty eighth,
32:20
Speaker 1: Where were they on June twenty nine, Where were they
32:23
Speaker 1: after they were past time that they should have been back.
32:26
Speaker 1: Those are things that can be that can be looked at,
32:30
Speaker 1: and I don't see any of that going on, which
32:33
Speaker 1: goes back I think to your original question on you
32:35
Speaker 1: know the police are treating this is like, well, we
32:37
Speaker 1: don't think, we don't have any reason for concern. Okay,
32:40
Speaker 1: we're overdue now by a couple of weeks. I think
32:43
Speaker 1: there's a reason to be concerned, and that they could
32:45
Speaker 1: start looking at that information. I think you're right. I
32:48
Speaker 1: think they need to quit focusing on her phone, which
32:51
Speaker 1: is obviously turned off, and start focusing on he is.
32:53
Speaker 1: Take a list of our cut six our friends at
32:55
Speaker 1: WCSH police say Jill and her young daughter Lydia, along
33:00
Speaker 1: with a man named Nicholas Hanson. We're camping in the
33:02
Speaker 1: town of Phillips in Franklin County. Jill's father, Ron says
33:06
Speaker 1: they were expecting her home on Thursday. We hadn't heard
33:09
Speaker 1: Hide nor hairever. We can't get through to our phone.
33:12
Speaker 1: Nobody's being able to get through to her phone since Tuesday.
33:15
Speaker 1: Ron says this is not normal for her to be
33:17
Speaker 1: gone without contacting family. Ron also says the man his
33:21
Speaker 1: daughter was with, Nicholas Hansen, is the father of Lydia
33:24
Speaker 1: and the ex boyfriend of Jill Oh. I was worried
33:27
Speaker 1: as soon as our wife told me what they were doing.
33:30
Speaker 1: But I didn't think this would happen. I mean, I
33:32
Speaker 1: just I hate to say it, but I don't trust
33:34
Speaker 1: the guy. There have been past issues with him. Sandford
33:37
Speaker 1: Police say they are not considering their disappearance and suspicious
33:40
Speaker 1: at this time. For now, Ron and Jill's sisters are
33:43
Speaker 1: spreading the word of their disappearance on Facebook posts. It's
33:46
Speaker 1: the not knowing what's going on. It is eating away
33:50
Speaker 1: and eating away at my head and my stomach and
33:53
Speaker 1: my wife's stomach and her head. Crime stories with Nancy
34:09
Speaker 1: grace ale sister Rustchuk. So she goes off with the
34:18
Speaker 1: father of her child. She's been painted as a scarlet
34:22
Speaker 1: woman for basically having two boyfriends. She's not married. She
34:27
Speaker 1: can do as she pleases and there's nothing wrong with it.
34:31
Speaker 1: And I don't like the fact that she has been
34:33
Speaker 1: judged exactly she is not married. And they do share
34:36
Speaker 1: a child together. And you know, I know people that
34:40
Speaker 1: are divorced or that maybe had never been married, that
34:42
Speaker 1: they have children together, that do things together. They take
34:44
Speaker 1: their kids to Disneyland, or they do go camping, or
34:47
Speaker 1: they go to them all they go to dinner. So
34:48
Speaker 1: maybe she was trying to do something nice for her
34:51
Speaker 1: daughter where the daughter could see that mommy and daddy
34:53
Speaker 1: can get along fine. And she obviously wasn't afraid to
34:57
Speaker 1: go on the trip, even though her mother were who
35:00
Speaker 1: she lives to believes don't go. But she made a decision.
35:03
Speaker 1: Maybe that was the right thing for what she thought
35:05
Speaker 1: was for her family and for her daughter. You know,
35:07
Speaker 1: even the sister didn't like the X. The sister Rita
35:12
Speaker 1: warned her on Facebook quote, be careful of Hanson. It
35:18
Speaker 1: seems like the whole family was suspicious of him, but
35:23
Speaker 1: she went anyway. What do we know about where they
35:27
Speaker 1: may be now or how can we possibly find them?
35:31
Speaker 1: Shell Nutt and Greg Smith have both pointed out the
35:35
Speaker 1: focus on not just her phone, but Nicholas Hanson's phone
35:39
Speaker 1: the X. What about their vehicle? Take a listen to
35:41
Speaker 1: our cut ten our friends at WGMA. The family was
35:45
Speaker 1: last seen driving a silver two thousand VW Jetta with
35:48
Speaker 1: a main registration plate one five six three VJ. It
35:53
Speaker 1: has a black rear bumper. Please say if you can
35:56
Speaker 1: snap a photo or video of a potential sighting that
35:59
Speaker 1: could help with their investigation. A sighting is great, but
36:03
Speaker 1: until we can actually validate that it is them or
36:06
Speaker 1: it is that vehicle, you know, that's where we can
36:09
Speaker 1: have another jump off point to maybe check, you know,
36:13
Speaker 1: more detailed area, maybe in those areas. Now, the Sanford
36:17
Speaker 1: Police Department is working with a number of other agencies
36:20
Speaker 1: to follow up on tips. But again, that last confirmed
36:24
Speaker 1: sighting was now nearly a week ago. And as to
36:28
Speaker 1: that signing, we were talking about their behavior, doctor Gardier was,
36:32
Speaker 1: we know that according to police who have looked at
36:34
Speaker 1: the video, they were buying food on hims end. Quote
36:37
Speaker 1: didn't there did not appear to be anything nefarious or criminal,
36:42
Speaker 1: according to the Sanford Police Lieutenant Matthew Gagny. So they
36:47
Speaker 1: see normal on the twenty seven, and now they've dropped
36:50
Speaker 1: off the face of the earth. The family is sick.
36:53
Speaker 1: We know that they were last seen in that two
36:56
Speaker 1: thousand and five VW Jetta. It's silver tag number main
37:02
Speaker 1: tag number one five sixty three V Victor. You know,
37:07
Speaker 1: I just keep thinking, as I always tell my girlfriends,
37:13
Speaker 1: there's a reason you're broke up to dactor. Jeff Gardier
37:20
Speaker 1: joining US author and professor, Board certified clinical psychologist. There's
37:26
Speaker 1: a reason they broke up, and that reason is giving
37:32
Speaker 1: me a very bad feeling inside. She broke up with
37:36
Speaker 1: this guy. The whole family says, be careful she goes
37:40
Speaker 1: on this camping trip. What is it about these toxic
37:44
Speaker 1: relationships that pull people back in? There is what we
37:49
Speaker 1: know a manipulation that goes in when there may be
37:54
Speaker 1: a situation of some sort of perhaps emotional abuse use.
38:00
Speaker 1: It's not just someone acting out and imposing their will
38:05
Speaker 1: on them, but psychologically manipulating them and making them feel
38:11
Speaker 1: guilty and engaging in activities that they don't want to,
38:17
Speaker 1: lowering their self esteem so that they may make decisions
38:21
Speaker 1: that puts them in a compromising situation. But, as a
38:25
Speaker 1: very famous person once said, who's a dear friend of mine,
38:31
Speaker 1: let's be careful and not victimize the victim here and
38:35
Speaker 1: look at this as a cautionary tale as to what
38:39
Speaker 1: can happen in a situation where someone is being manipulated.
38:44
Speaker 1: That person, by the way, who said that was Nancy Grace.
38:48
Speaker 1: Thanks Donna, Jeff. As always, guys, I got a bad
38:51
Speaker 1: feeling about this woman and her two year old little
38:54
Speaker 1: girl Idia. If you have any information or think you
38:59
Speaker 1: have information, dial two zero seven three two four nine
39:03
Speaker 1: one seven zero repeat two zero seven three two four
39:09
Speaker 1: nine one seven zero. Goodbye friend,