Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Cannibal Killer Joseph Oberhansley jig-saws girlfriend's body open to eat heart, brain and lung. WHY TARGET TAMMY JO BLANTON?

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Cannibal Killer Joseph Oberhansley jig-saws girlfriend's body open to eat heart, brain and lung. WHY TARGET TAMMY JO BLANTON? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. Well, what possessed her to
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: post his bond? I don't understand, Tanya h. Nancy, I
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: think she really believed in him at this point. Though
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: we have talked about it, we really think at this
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: point she was afraid not to really thank Yeah, we
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: think that she did that out of fear of if
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: he did get out, because we really know her well
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: and she changed and she wasn't allowed to you know,
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: see her friends or talk to her friends. He even
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: forced himself on her Facebook page to monitor that. Well,
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: how did he wait, wait, how did he do that
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: from Jill? How did he get forced himself onto her
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: Facebook page? And how was that? Trolling her from behind
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: prison walls? Now that was all that happened to controlling
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Before he went to jail, he already had her in
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: his control. A so called cannibal killer? Does he stab
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: his ex girlfriend to death? Wait for it? Then saw
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: her open to eat her brain, heart and lung. Now
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: wait for it, wait for it while on parole for
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: shooting dead a different lover. Why was he on parole?
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: This guy, Joseph Oberhansley just thirty eight years old. Why
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: is he already out on parole for shooting dead another lover.
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: He gets out him claiming he's innocent, reportedly eating parts
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: of his girlfriend, Timmy Joe Blanton's heart and love after
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: sawing her open. Oh I, Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories.
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us, with me an all
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: star panel to break it down and put it back
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: together again. Joining me. A professor at the University of
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: Memphis Law School, Stephen Mulroy, former federal prosecutor, former NYPD
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: John Cardillo, renowned forensics psychologist, doctor Daniel Bober and expert
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: in forensics, Professor of Forensics Jackson State University. Author of
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon. Joseph Scott Morgan, but
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: first to leave ipagecrime online dot Com investigative reporter. You
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: just heard me speaking to one of Timmy j Blanton's
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: best friends. I don't understand why in the world she
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: would help him get out of jail, but hold it.
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to one of her best friends, Tanya
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: Doublas that he changed. She really really believed because he
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: was young. He gave the story that he was on
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: drugs back then, and he was a changed man. And
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: at first he appeared that way, even though we were
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: all uncomfortable with it. He really gave that you know, appearance.
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: But you know she of course, by the time she
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: had doing for him, I think she would seeing the signs,
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: but she was very afraid. And so we just feel
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: like the system and failed her so many things. I mean,
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: it could have been so different if they hadn't lowered
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: that bond. You know, we wouldn't even be talking about
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: this right now. Okay, everybody's pointing the finger at everybody else.
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: How many times have we heard in I prosecuted for
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: ten years in intercity Atlanta at night I volunteered at
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: the Battered Women's Center. How many times have I heard
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: the words he changed? I thought he changed, He did change,
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: He said he changed, He didn't change. When you shoot
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: dead one lover, don't bond him out. I don't know
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: who I'm even preaching too, because Tammy Joe Blanton is
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: dead right. She had her body, saw it open, her brain,
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: heart and lung were eaten. So I don't know who
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: I'm screaming in the wind year to doctor Daniel Bober,
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: forensic psychologist, please help me. Why do people always women
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: in particular think the violent male in their life has changed,
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: so they want to believe it. Nancy, you know, it's
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: a reflection of their own lack of self esteem, and
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: so in some way, there's a phenomenon called trauma bonding
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: where they actually feel connected to the person and that
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: they cannot function without them. So there's a sick, twisted
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: bond to their abuser and they feel like they can't
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: live without that person. Okay, that's one thing, But the theory,
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: the thought that they believe the PP has changed to
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: professor at University Memphis Law School. Former federal prosecutor Stephen mulroy. Stephen,
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: how many times have you heard that he changed? He didn't. Yeah, well,
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: you're absolutely right about that. I mean, it's a it's
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: a pattern that you see all the time in abuse cases.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: You already heard about that trauma bond, and there is
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: this notion that you know this time is going to
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: be different to Hope Springs Eternal. I also thought it
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: was interesting when you did the interview with the friend
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: her theory that she felt like he had no choice.
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: I think I'm thinking maybe that she might have thought
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: that he's going to anyway and he would be mad
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: at her if she hadn't bonded her out, and so
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: just get another form of control that he had over
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: her and victimization. Well put because you're absolutely right. You
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: know I've heard that many times and I'm sure many
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: of you have as well. A woman thinks the purp
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: is going to get out of jail, which, guess what,
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: she's right because judges it's a revolving door. Judges let
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: him put up out on own recognisance r O R
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: released on own recognisance. In other words, you just walk out.
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: Low bond, no bond in domestic violence cases. So, following
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: up on what Stephen said, she thought he was going
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: to get out anyway, and we mad at her if
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: she didn't postpond or help him get out. So she
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: did straight out to Levi Page, clam online dot Com,
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: investigat every reporter. You know what, Timmy Joe Blanton is
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: dead and she has been cannibalized. This guy, Joseph Oberhansley,
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: aka also known as the cannibal killer. Let's start not
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: with her case, but the first lover he shot. Tell
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: me about that. That was in nineteen ninety eight, Nancy,
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: and he shot her when she was a teenager. He
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: was also a teenager. She had given birth to his child.
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: His child was a newborn, and apparently he denied it
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: and said that it was not his child, and he
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: was angry about that, so he shot her and killed her.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: And not only did he shoot her nancy, but he
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: shot his own mother in the back. His motive, he
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: says that he was angry that she gave the child,
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: the baby, his child, more attention than him. He was jealous,
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: so he shot his own mother. And his sister grabbed
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: the newborn when all this was going down and tried
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: to flee, and he shot at them. He missed, fortunately,
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: And this shows you that he was violent when he
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: was a teenager. And he pled guilty to manslaughter. And
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: he was released from prison in twenty twelve, and this
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: was in Utah, and he was released when his mother
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: testified on his behalf at a probation hearing, and she
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: vouched for him, said he had changed, she had forgiven him,
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: and he moved in with her in Indiana. And that's
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: how all of this started. And this guy as not insane.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: He Oberhansley calls these allegations against him, quote all bull
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: crap lies, insisting he's innocent, and you know, just looking
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: at him, Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, Jackson State University.
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: You can mock me if you wish, But when I
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: look at him, he looks like an animal, A wild animal,
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: a fierce, angry animal that will attack you as soon
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: as you open the cage door. Yeah, and that's that's
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: even more striking when you consider that this young lady
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: posted bond for him. Uh, you know, and you sit
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: there and you think, you know, how in the world
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: could she could she be aware of his past and
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: still want to literally release him on the general public,
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: and of course releasing him on herself as well in
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: the end. Well, it's just like all these women that
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: are friends is married to him, a Nindez brother, or
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: want to sleep with Charles Mansoner have his baby. Yeah, Jackie,
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: please quit gagging yourself over there. I feel the same way,
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: but I'm holding it in. I'm keeping it in a deep,
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: dark knot inside of me. Okay, I don't even want
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: to think about it. I'm looking at this guy, Joseph Abrahmsley. Now,
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: according to prosecutors, he's got two murderers under his belt.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to this, you know, Targia. I'm sick
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  Speaker 1: about it because our justice system is set up to
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: protect those that are weaker than we are, less cunning,
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: less powerful than everybody else. And Tammy Joe fits directly
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: into that category, trusting, naive, afraid. And you know what,
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: she should have been afraid, because he got a plea
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: on manslaughter to start with when he killed his first victim,
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: had a dui led police on a chase for Pete's sake?
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: Can you even imagine that? And yet prosecutors and judges
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: alike kept letting him off the hook, and she was right,
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: she was right. This guy leaves police on a chase,
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  Speaker 1: attacks a judge, has already killed one woman, a new mother,
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: tries to kill his own mother, and then he meets
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: Tammy Joe Blanton Crime Stories with Nancy Greece. Our justice
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: system is set up to protect those that are weaker
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  Speaker 1: than we are, less cunning, less powerful than everybody else,
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: And Tammy Joe fits directly into that category, trusting, naive, afraid.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: And you know what, she should have been afraid, because
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: he got a plea on manslaughter to start with when
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: he killed his first victim, had a dui led police
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: on a chase for Pete's sake? Can you even imagine that?
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: And yet prosecutors and judges alike kept letting him off
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: the hook. And she was right, She was right. This
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: guy leaves police on a chase, attacks a judge, has
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: already killed one woman, a new mother, tries to kill
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: his own mother, and then he meets Timmy Joe Blanton. Now,
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: let me understand something I'm not sure about what I'm hearing.
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: Leavipage Crime online dot Com invest he had a reporter.
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: So he goes on trial for the cannibalism, where he
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: reportedly used an electric jigsaw to open Timmy Joe Blanton's
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: skull and scoff off parts of her brain. Okay, he
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: allegedly ate part of her heart and lung. Wait, excuse me,
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: part of her heart and a whole lung. Timmy Joe
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: had alleged he raped her the weekend before her murder.
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: He again eloquently says those are bullcrap. Wise, but in
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: a ten minute rant at a pre trial hearing, he
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: claimed the X was getting high and drunk and texting
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: a bunch of bull crap. He goes to trial, where
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: an alleged confession comes in leave I page. What happened
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: at trial? So one of Timmy Joe Blaton's friends was
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: testifying for the prosecution, and she had mentioned his prior
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: drug use, and the judge had said that his prior
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: drug use and bad acts would not be admissible into trial,
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: and she mentioned it anyway when she was testifying, So
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: the judge declared a mistrial. Oh, Dear Lord in Heaven.
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: John Cardillo, former NYPD, how does that make a cop
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: feel when you go to all this effort you catch
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: a cannibal killer, a double killer. Go I've read everything
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: on this story, and it's why cops and prosecutors bang
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: their heads against walls. He killed a seventeen year old girl,
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: shot his mother in the back, fired a gun at
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: his own sister, shot himself in the head. Israel East
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: gets arrested two times after that. His parole isn't revoked.
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: They let this guy walk around. He lives a life
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: of crime. I don't know who the judge was who
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: thought it was a good idea, Dear, to give this
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: guy bond. I'd love to know who the parole board
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: was or the judges on the original offenses that didn't
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: put this guy back in jail, and now we have
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: a mistrial because a witness appropriately pointed out this guy's
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: criminal history. Now the prosecutor in the current case seems proactive,
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: and he said, look, I'm not going to put the
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: family through another four to five years waiting for justice.
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: If I've got to get on the calendar two weeks
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: laid and wait in line, I'm gonna do it. He
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: wants resolution by the end of September. I feel his frustration.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: If I was an investigator on this case, I would
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: be beside myself, beside yourself. All the hours, all the work,
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: hundreds thousands of hours of legal research, investigation. I'm speaking
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: from the heart right now, because that's what you put
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: into a case like this to take it to trial.
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: And then because of one witness who has already been
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: instructed do not bring up his criminal history, already been instructed.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: She does it anyway, She does it anyway. And Stephen Mulroy,
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: former federal prosecutor, professor at the University of Memphis Law School,
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: the judge had to grant a mistrial, no way about.
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: I'd like to blame the judge, but the judge had
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: to grant the mistrial. I would agree I don't really
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: think there's any way around it. I mean, I understand
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: the frustration about the prior criminal incidents, and then he's
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: let out on drolls that he can kill again. I mean, obviously,
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: obviously that's concerning to say the least, But this propensity
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: evidence that you know, well, he had committed some crime
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: in the pass, so therefore people left today committed again,
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: or he had been on drugs, so we're gonna you know,
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: I have all kinds of speculative, negative theories about him.
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: That's not proper evidence. The judge ruled that the judge
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: specifically instructed the witnesses not to testify to it, and
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: as you pointed out, uh, you know, the witness did it. Anyway,
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: I don't really see what the judge could have done
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: except to declare a mistrial and try to start over again.
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: Except go back to his chambers or herd chambers and
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: kick the trash can. That's all they can do. But
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: let me ask you this, Steven Mulroy, what impact will
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: this mistrial, if any, have, on the prosecution's case against
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: Overhandley the cannibal killer. Well, you know, typically a miss
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: trial can heart the prosecution in a couple of ways.
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: If if there's a long delay and you know, witnesses
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: memories get stale, other witness other evidence might get stale
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: or you know, be difficult to reproduce. That's not the case.
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: Find a minute, Steve, can I tell you a little story,
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: and I promise it's going to be little. Sure, I'll
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: never forget Jackie just turned the other way, because you've
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: heard it before. I'd be just been named a special prosecutor.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: I've been prosecuting about four years. The elected district attorney
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: called me down, gave me case to retry. It happened
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: fourteen years before, before I was even in law school,
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: and it was a murder of an Atlanta police officer's brother.
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: It had a reversible error. There were interlocking confessions or statements,
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: and the guys have been tried together. Okay, that's no. No.
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: It went all the way up to the eleventh Circuit
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: Court of Appeals. Took fourteen years to retry it. I
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: had two pieces of evidence in the evidence dream left,
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: one an X ray of the victim and two, you
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: want to say it, a cap that said kiss my bass. Okay,
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: that was it. That's what happens when fourteen years passed. Right,
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: that's a true life story about what happens when time passes. Okay,
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: number one, time can pass, the case gets weak. What
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: else well? And then the other would be that the
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: defense would be kipped off as to a certain type
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: of execution strategy and therefore be better prepared the next
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: time around. I don't really that hurts me. That hurts me.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: That hurts me because they already have full they have
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: full discovery. They get your whole case file in a
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: case like this, except your work product. But once you
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: lay out your plan your trial, it's like going to
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: war and they've got your battle plan. You're screwed. Like,
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: who's your first witness? What are you going to ask them?
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: I mean, I mean they know everything. Crime stories with
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. She was a daughter, She was a sister,
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: She was at dance, She was a friend. She was
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: loved by many contagious laps head. She was a happy person,
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: and she tried to help this fool And this is
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: what happened. Just is it right that this person, this evil, evil,
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: evil monster did then that he did. We was just
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: getting close again, and I didn't want to say nothing.
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: She was forty seven years old. She'll always be my
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: little girl that she was growing. You know what, could
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: you say? He doesn't deserve to be breathing air right now?
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: This guy, Joseph Abrahamsley, just thirty eight years old, reportedly
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: eating parts of his girlfriend, Timmy J. Blanton's heart and
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: lung after sawing her open. Question, do you leave a page?
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: This guy is not out walking around. I'm not going
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: to see his foot through my kitchen window. Is he
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: Isn't he valued bars waiting on him? He is behind bars,
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: so he's behind bars for now. But that's what I
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: thought after his first murder question. Abrahmsley allegedly confessed to
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: killing the victim and eating parts of her body, but
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: claims he's not insane. I believe that. I believe you
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: can be evil and not insane. What about it to
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: doctor Daniel Bober forensic psychologists. Okay, here he comes. I
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: can hear him tuning up right now. How anybody they
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: would eat another humans brains has got to be insane?
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: How about just evil? Doctor Daniel Bober? I bet Satan
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: has brains for dinner every night, I'm sure, and probably
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: goes back for seconds. But you know what Nancy, I
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: actually agree with you. I actually don't think that someone
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: who necessarily eats someone's brains, you know, does not know
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: the difference between right and wrong. And I think that
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: that is something that the public gets wrong all the time.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: They think that, how could someone who eats someone's brains
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: not be insane? But that's a legal definition, so it's
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: very different. And this is how I know he knows
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: right for wrong. John Cardillo, form An NYPD. You've seen
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: it all, plus some as have I things I wish
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: I hadn't sane. When you have a defendant that starts
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: saying everything she said was quote bullcrap, lies and then
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: he recants the confession, says it didn't it wasn't true
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: that blah blah blah, you can say he's lying, he
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: wants out of jail, and he knows what he did
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: was wrong, because now he's fabricating a whole new story
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: that shows he knows what happened was wrong. Yeah. Look,
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: I mean I agree, just because somebody does something that
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: the general public thinks looks quote unquote insane, sometimes these
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: suspects are incredibly rational. We arrested a guy that was
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: a hit man for drug gangs and we couldn't prove it,
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: but we knew we had about twenty six murders under
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: his belt. It was probably the easiest arrest I ever made.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: We went to his door with a swat team. We
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: didn't need it. He opened the door, he said, I
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: know why you guys are here. Let me just say
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: goodbye to my kids and cuff me around the corner.
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: We did. He didn't resist. He was lucid, he was chatty.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: He was bragging about his career right as a drug
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: hitman in the car. But then when he lawyered up
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: with a very expensive lawyer, he didn't do it. We
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: coerced him. I mean, the guy was a sociopathic serial
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: killer by all means, but charismatic and if you met
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: him at a bar or a restaurant, you would say, oh,
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: this is a nice, engaging guy. So these people are
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: oftentimes deceptively normal. Well why why stop? Right? There is
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: this John Cardillo speaking the form at you. This is
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: Nancy Grace here with two eleven year old twins, a cat,
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: a dog, two guinea pigs, and an eighty seven year
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: old mother plus a husband. I am not out at
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: a bar or a restaurant, it's not gonna have you
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: met him. If you met him in the university library,
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: you would find him. If you could say the pile
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: of laundry on my floor outside the washing machine. You know.
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: The only way I'm going to meet him is if
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: he comes over an officers to clean the house. But
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: long story short, for people that are out having a
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: good time, you never know. Because this and other killers
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: are charismatic, their charming. Bottom line, he knows right from wrong.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: To Joseph Scott, Morgan, forensics expert author Blood Beneath My
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: Feet on Amazon, if it did, how do you believe
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: the system failed Timmy J. Blanton, Well, they failed her
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: simply because this guy's crimes are so e gregious. I
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: think that the court did a horrible job making watch
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: care over this person that went in and made the
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: spontaneous statement that created this mistrial. I think that this
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: could have been foreseen in some way. So I think
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: that that's that's number one. Number two is the fact
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: that he's still well, yeah, actually, you're right, Joe Scott,
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: because they had already warned the witnesses don't bring it up,
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: so they had an inkling of what was going to
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: happen because guy is a danger and the fact that
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: he's already killed before is I don't know in my
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: mind at least it doesn't take a forensic scientist to
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: figure that out. That's a pretty big red flag. And
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: so now you know this case is thrown away. Well,
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: let me remind you, mister too big for his britches
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: doesn't take a forensic scientist to figure it out. And
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: you are a forensic scientist to Stephen mulroy. It's people
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: just like this guy Oberhansley that Joe Scott analyzes and
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: tries to figure out every single day of his life.
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: What I'm saying is, you know where I think the
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: system failed Joe Scott and Stephen by letting him out
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: to start with at the get go when he only
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: when he got out on voluntary wasn't it voluntary manslaughter?
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: Levi Page? When he killed his seventeen year old girlfriend,
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: the mother of his child, Sabrina Elder, shot his mom
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: in the back, tried to shoot the baby and his sister.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: Did he get voluntary on that? Yes? And then Nancy.
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: A year after he was released into thirteen, he was
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: arrested for being inside a woman's apartment and fighting with
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: her boyfriend, and he was naked and choking the guy
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: and he's was charging. Wait wait wait wait wait Levi, Levi, Levi,
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: why I would like to have heard that at the
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: get go? Please just say that very slowly, because I'm
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: sure Stephen mulroy wants to write that down for his
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: law school class. So the guy has shot his seventeen
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: year old girlfriend, Sabrina Elder, the mother of his child.
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: He shot his mom in the bat because he was
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: jealous the baby was getting his attention. Shot at his
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: sister and the baby. And then did you tell me
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: he gets a voluntary Was that a play or a trial?
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: He played guilty? Oh? Who letting him do that? You
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: shoot somebody in the back. That is not voluntary? Okay,
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: that is not voluntary. He got a voluntary play. That's
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: the first film. Then he gets out in what how
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: many years? He gets out in two twelve and moves
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: to Indiana with his mother. And then in twenty thirteen
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: he is at a bar and this woman invites him
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: to her apartment and he claims that this guy, her boyfriend,
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: tried to steal from him, that it was a concoction
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: to get him up there and they got into a fight.
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: Police were called, and he's naked in this apartment fighting
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: with this young woman's boyfriend, and he's charged with strangulation.
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: The charges were dropped because police couldn't figure out who
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: was the aggressor in the situation. I picked the naked man.
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's just you know me. But those are
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: a few ways the system fails. He can't believe they
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: dropped those charges. He was always in troubles. Oh now
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: somebody's trying to clear their reputation. Go ahead, Joe Scott.
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: My reputation was running a long time ago. At any rate. Yeah, listen,
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: this guy is particularly dangerous. And this is why you know,
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: we've we've kind of skirted around this issue of cannibalism.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: But I gotta tell you there's there's three tiers that
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: are going on here, and kind of let me run
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: them down because your audience is so bright, they're they're
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: gonna get the full depth and breadth of this guy.
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: This guy's already killed before. But when you think about
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: what he did to this woman as far as the
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: sexual assault goes, and then it escalated to homicide first,
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: and then he makes a decision that he is going
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: to dismember her or desecrate her remains in some way.
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: And then not only did he do this, Nancy, he
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: didn't just you know, take a knife and like slice
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: off a part of her body in order to ingest it.
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: He literally, he literally took a jigsaw and cut into
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: her skull, which is very difficult to do, and he
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: opened her chest to get access. There's multiple layers to
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: this thing, and that's what's so scary. And in a
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: lot of cases that we see where cannibalism, so called
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: campbellism is involved, it's it's not about the nutrition. That
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: means that he has taken a body and sexualized it,
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: just like Albert Fish did, just like Dahmer did, and
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: there's any number of people out there that have been
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: into this sexualization. My question is has he done this before?
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: There are there other cases that are out there, because
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: this is a progression toward this horrific end. And I
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: can tell you when they traps all of this evidence
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: into that courtroom, they bring that jicks all out, and
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: they bring those images out from the autopsy, They're going
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: to nail this guy of the wall. I can only
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: pray Stephen mulroy, how do you believe the system failed,
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: Tammy J. Blanton. Well, I mean, I think we've gone
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: over some of it. Given his criminal history, the idea
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: that they let him out and that he was able
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: to kill again is obviously something that we need to
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: be concerned about. You know, I'm not I ronestly don't
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: know enough to know what was going on in the
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: judge's mind when he of the parole Board's mind when
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: they made their respective decisions. You know, it's obvious now
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: with the benefit of hindsight that this was a bed.
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: This is a bad call on their part. Well, that
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: is certainly putting perfume on the pig. Stephen Mulroy, We
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: wait as justice unfalls. Nancy Grace Crime Story signing off
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: Goodbye friend,