Latest / Skin Anarchy / E.345: Skin Consultation W/Jan Marini

Transcript

E.345: Skin Consultation W/Jan Marini · Skin Anarchy

• 0:00
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• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: And today's episode is actually very special because we are going to be walking through, or rather, Jan is going to be walking me through a proper scientific-based approach toward like with her consultation.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, have a seat, have a listen, and just follow along.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm really excited to do this with you, Jan.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: This is going to be so fun.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, Ecta.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: Hi.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome, Jan.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sorry.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't, I probably didn't properly uh this is this is going to be so fun.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: This is I it's always really exciting to do this.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, um one of the things that your audience can think about as I go through the steps with you, you know, put yourself in Ecta's place and you can kind of answer the same questions because this process is about finding solutions.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, um, I always say I don't need another product, I want a solution.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_02: And it's it's about what it is that concerns you about your skin.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_02: And I have to tell you, you're gonna kind of resonate with this when we go through the process, but you know, when I talk to oftentimes medi spas and physician offices, and I say, say, so tell me, how do you start the conversation when you want to talk about product?
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: And nine times out of ten, they'll say, Well, I asked them what don't you like about your products?
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_02: Well, what if somebody says, I don't know, I like my product just fine.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_02: Where do you go from there?
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: So then they avoid the whole conversation.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, you never start out, you shouldn't see a practitioner that starts a conversation about product.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_02: It should always be about what you're concerned about.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: So, you want to get started?
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, let's do it.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so excited about it.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so number one question I'm gonna ask you literally the most important question.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I always ask it exactly like this, and that is if there was something you could change or improve about your skin, what would it be?
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: If I could change, um, I think it would be definitely my pore size because it's always changing and it's always fluctuating, and it impacts how my makeup looks, it impacts how my skin looks, even if I'm not wearing makeup, like with even with SPF on, um, or and also like that is also for me associated with um dullness, I guess you could say.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: And in the days where I noticed that, I noticed my skin is also looking more dull.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: So that would be my biggest concern.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so pore size and dullness.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: Where do you and where do you think you have larger pores?
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's right around my um right underneath my eye area, um, right by the on the cheeks, right by your nose, you know.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so sort of that inner cheek area.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and so dullness.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_02: And then um anything else you'd like to change or improve?
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, it's like I've noticed that when I like with aging, right?
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: We talk about aging and how your skin changes, and I've definitely gone through that.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I notice my skin um on certain days is like very, very, very balanced, but then on other days it's going to be super oily, and then on some days it's just gonna be dry patches everywhere.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_01: So that balance and that homeostasis, I can never achieve that, like ever.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like I it doesn't matter what I do, I just always have this this you know constant back and forth.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: And it's I've noticed it for many years now, and I'm always thinking, you know, maybe it's age, maybe it's but yeah, that's I think something um I definitely struggle with every single day, you know.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's like I wake up to a new face every day.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and anything else?
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_02: Like, for example, uh, do you have any discoloration, brown spots?
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: Do you have any um uh acne breakouts at all?
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I did have acne growing up, and one of my biggest concerns, I'm glad you mentioned that because one of my biggest concerns has always been the um more indentation scars, like the pick scarring.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't have pick scarring really like the picks anymore, but they're still a little bit there, and nothing I do really gets rid of them.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: And some days they're actually worse, like in terms of like just the texture is just it, it's worse than other days.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: So that's something I think I've been concerned about pretty much my whole life, you know.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: Now that if I think about it, yeah.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: So let me ask you, I are they actually ice pick scars, or do you just have some some compromised like indentations, etc.?
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think they're it's the latter.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_01: The the compromised indentations and they're just on my outer cheek areas.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like I can tell this is where I used to break out when I was a teenager, and you know, it used to be much worse, but then you know, with time it's gotten, I guess, better, but it's still there, and it's always been such a concern for me, you know, in terms of everything like makeup and you don't you don't break out at all currently?
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: No, I rarely break out.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, I'll have my you know usual menstrual cycle associated, you know, breakouts here and there, but it's nothing like it used to be.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: I used to have actually cystic acne when I was a teenager, and it I it just it you know, it was fixed, and I have had it since then.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: So when you break out during your menstrual cycle, is it kind of on the chin and jawline area?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: It is actually, yeah, especially on the chin area.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and it's not even like um, you know, just when you think about your chin, like the the front of it, it's the side, like the jaw and underneath the chin.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_01: That's the most common area for me to break out, or other places gonna be right on that cheek area where I told you about my pores.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: That's the other place.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: Those two places are the only places I break out.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, yeah.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: And are you a smoker?
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: No, but I did smoke in of the past, I'm not gonna lie.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, but not now.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: Not now, no.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, how about were you ever a sunbather?
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, no, I never did sunbathing ever.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_02: And um another question about when you had cystic acne as a teenager, um, when did it really start to kind of dissipate or improve?
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: So when I had cystic acne, basically I went through the whole process.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I know we had spoken earlier about you, I had, you know, tried Accutane and it hadn't worked for you.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_01: And that like for me, it was similar in the sense of I never went on accutane, but it was I went to a dermatologist, they put me on doxycycline, you know, the antibiotic therapy for just I guess standard for acne.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I was on that for about five years, you know, it was like throughout high school I was on it.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, I it just it's something I I think for me, I just stopped going down that route.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it was something I I started to realize like, okay, my acne is getting to a point where I'm controlling it now in the sense of, you know, I'm I'm cleansing my face better or whatever I was doing at the time.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_01: And so I just kind of told my dermatologist, I was like, you know, I'm just I'm gonna stop taking this medication.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I don't want to always be pumping my body with antibiotics.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: So around that time is when I noticed that, you know, the antibiotics stopped and the acne did get better.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_02: So it was actually high school, after high school?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: After high school, yep, right before college started.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so like 18, like 17, 18 years old.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just writing seven, uh okay.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, no, I I think it's a it's interesting that you asked that because you know, such an interesting, like I remember the dermatologist even saying, you know, when you turn 18, it starts to subside.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, well, I don't know, we'll see.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we'll see.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's very interesting because you know, you've heard me say before, there are people that didn't have acne as a teenager and all of a sudden they get it in their 20s or 30s, and other people who were their acne kind of went away, and then later on, and maybe they're in their 20s, 30s, 40s, or beyond, and all of a sudden it's it's back again.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, let's talk about what you use currently.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_02: So, what do you wash with in the morning?
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: In the morning, I am right now loving um Dr.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_01: Koo, her uh her it's an exfoliating cleanser.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's very gentle, so I just use that in the mornings, or sometimes on again, I'll just use water in the mornings because my skin is not, it doesn't feel like there's too much, you know, anything on it.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: So I'll cleanse with just water and then I'll wipe it away with a toner, you know, just to like fix it.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: But that's pretty much my cleansing routine every morning is either that cleanser or just water.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_02: And by the way, so listeners, notice that what we just went through, where I was really asking her, focusing on nothing but concerns and asking her questions about those concerns.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: And um, so there's a reason, and I'll get to you in a minute why I'm asking her about what she uses currently.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so, what do you what do you do after you cleanse?
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: So, after I cleanse, I'm a huge fan of like I guess they're the new spray form of toners, you could call them.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason I really love those products because after I cleanse, no matter what it is, whether it's even if it's just water, and after I pat my skin dry with a towel, I always feel like it's it's dry, you know, like it needs something, like some some moisture immediately.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I usually just mist my face with um my favorite toner mist.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, right now I love the um Irene Forte mist.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I've been using Diaz mist, so something like that, you know, and I'll mist my face and I'll just let it dry naturally.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um is there something in there?
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_02: Does it have any alpahydroxy acids or is it strictly just hydrating?
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's just hydrating.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, there's no acid at all in there, no.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: And what do you do after the spray toner?
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: So after the toner, after it dries down, I'll uh use one serum.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_01: So I'll use a hydrating serum.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: Usually it's the hyaluronic acid um or something that contains um a good amount of hyaluronic acid in it.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_01: Because um, for me, you know, I don't know, I guess for me, serums are kind of like just a one and done.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I use one serum, and that's you know, I'll pat it into my skin, uh, and then I'll apply my moisturizer and then obviously my SPF on top of that.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and then so you're SPF and you're doing an SPF.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: What's the SPF number?
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: SPF 50.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and any particular brand on the SPF?
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, Raviv.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: I've been using Riviv's SPF for a while now, actually.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so that's that's pretty much your daytime routine.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: Now at night, do you do the same cleanser?
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, nighttime, yes.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I use the same cleanser.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um and nighttime is actually a much more in-depth routine for me.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm sorry, say it again.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: What?
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: I my nighttime routine is actually way more in-depth.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's just what it's just more, you know, because I have more time and I have, you know.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_02: So what do you do after the cleanser at night?
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, at night, um, I'll do, you know, I'll do a toner.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um at night, a lot of times I'll use like a glycolic um acid toner.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, for example, Ren skincare has one that I really enjoy.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I'll use that and I'll, you know, use a face uh cotton swab and I'll just kind of pat it on my skin and just kind of clear everything off and then let that dry.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: And then I really go in at night with serum.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm I'm a huge night.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_01: Serum that you do during the day?
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, so I definitely do the hyaluronic um at night as well.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: But then at night, I'm also using things like um, for example, uh, there's a serum I really love uh that's called it, it's basically for evening out your skin tone by Dr.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: Koo.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: And I've been using that um in terms of just pigmentation overall, because what I've noticed that with my skin is that although I'm a woman of color and we are prone to hyperpigmentation, is um yeah, I mean you know more than I do, is I don't have hyperpigmentation, but what I do have is this like I always feel like my skin is not even, you know, like it's not an even canvas.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: So I've been using that serum and also I'll put on my retinol at night.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: So that's usually like always, you know, kind of combined together, like mashed together and just put it on.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and then um tell me what retinol you're using.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: So the retinol I'm using is the one by Dr.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_01: Ku.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's uh 5,000 international units, I believe, is on the bottle.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_02: Now is it actually retinol, or when they say 5,000 units, you're usually talking about vitamin A, but not a retinoid.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's a it's a retinol, uh like vitamin A.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_01: Let me see exactly what it says on the bottle.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm not might be vitamin A palmitate, which is very different.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so it says uh pH optimal uh retinol, 8,000 international units, um, level four.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: So this is for level four, and the actives are buffered retinol uh B3, uh Hexel.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my god, I can't even pronounce this one.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: Hexel Russocrinol.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, that's okay.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and then anything after that?
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and then I add a lotion or is that a cream?
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's a cream, it's a cream-based uh serum.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: So I want to mention something, I want to go back to concerns because um I had asked you if you have any you know discoloration or anything like that.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: And then you mentioned about your skin never feels even.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_02: So one thing I want to let you know is that every single person on the face of the earth by the age of 35 will have abnormal pigment.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: And if you don't have obvious areas where you see contrasting, you know, discoloration where there's like brown spots and and then there's sort of normal skin tone, there's something called background pigment.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: And background pigment, if you take a little picture of somebody when they're 20, and then look take another picture when they're 30 or 35 or etc., it's where the skin doesn't have that crisp clarity like you're talking about, where it just looks very uniform.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_02: And it's also known as a tinic bronzing, and that's just cumulative sun exposure.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: So that's something else that it's that's really good that we can address as well.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_02: So I just want to kind of make an aside about that.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so everyone, one of the reasons why I asked the question about what somebody uses is not because I want to criticize their choice of products, but because number one, you know, when you somebody says to you, what are your concerns, and you list your concerns, well, then how's this working for you?
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: And the second thing is that it gives us an idea of how much time someone spends on their skin.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_02: You know, if if you had said, Well, I wake up and you know, I I asked you what you use in your face, and you said, Well, soap.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_02: What kind of soap?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_02: Whatever I steal from the hotel.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: And then what else do you do?
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: That's it.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_02: Well, we kind of have to consider how much time you're willing to put into your skin, but you obviously care about your skin and you're spending some time on it, and you also have you you want to do something that's really going to make a difference.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so let's go back and let's talk about your concerns.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_02: And let's talk first of all.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_02: I want to start off with the pore size.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so pore size is influenced by a couple of different things.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: Now, one has to do with retentive matter.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_02: So even though you don't break out or you break out rarely, there's no cure for acne.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: So the tendency to acne is still there.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_02: And the beginning of the acne process is where the cells lining the inside of the follicle, and they're very much like the cells on the outside of your skin, they stick together instead of being pushed to the top.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: So normally, oil, the these cells go into the follicle and the oil pushes them to the top and they sit there and they fall off.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_02: That's a normal process.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: Well, in individuals that have acne, we don't exactly understand why these cells stick together.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_02: And a very mild form of acne, very mild, it's still acne, but it's a very mild form of acne, is where they stick together, stick together, stick together, causes your follicle to dilate.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's it's really kind of like a clogged follicle in a way.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: And it doesn't mean that you're gonna see like an obvious lesion or you're gonna see a red spot or a nodule or anything like that.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: Now, the second thing that influences follicles is that your follicle has collagen around it.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_02: So your dermis is about 80% collagen, and your dermis gives the skin its firm foundation.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_02: And so the dermis kind of acts like spanks around your follicle.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: It gives it this rigid structure and it keeps that follicle nice and tight.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_02: Now, what happens starting pretty much at the age of 20, we start to lose collagen and we lose around one to two percent a year, but lifestyle, diet, stress, all of the things that we encounter every day, sun exposure, even incidental sun exposure, causes that collagen to lessen even faster.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_02: You know, when somebody gets into their 50s, 60s, 70s, and beyond, they can have lost as much as 60 to 70 percent of their collagen.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_02: That looks pretty bad.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_02: But what happens is it's kind of like your spanks giving out.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: So your follicle doesn't have that rigid, same rigid structure.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_02: So you've got those two things going on.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: Now, let's get and I and I'll and I'll get kind of to the the solution shortly, but let's talk a little bit about the dullness.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: Now, so what on the outside of your skin, the stratum corneum, as we get older, it uh thickens.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_02: Your dermis thins, so you want a really thin, compact stratum corneum.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_02: You know, when you look at a teenager's skin, when you look at a baby skin, and you marvel at how just incredibly refined and radiant it looks, and you don't even see the pores.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_02: And so those cells that are lying on the outside of your skin, they're supposed to lie like shingles on a roof in a very uniform manner.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_02: And in between those cells, you have substances, hyaluronic acid and mucopolysaccharides and ceramides and phospholipids, and that's what gives the skin volume and it gives it barrier function, so it's protective, but it also again makes it look plump and radiant and just really uh beautifully reflective and refined.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_02: And so as we age, that stratum corneum begins to build up and it starts to look dull.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_02: Now it can actually also emphasize your follicle openings, your pores.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_02: So it kind of highlights the fact that maybe they're a little larger than you want them to be.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: And depending on, you know, again, lifestyle and how much sleep you've had, some days it's better and some days it's worse.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_02: But the primary reason for that is this buildup of dead cells, and it's even medically known as increased corneocyte cohesion, and those cells actually harden and they cornify.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_02: So there are times where your skin can feel really dry because you're actually sensing or you're seeing those that hard, that dead, dry outer layer.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: And there's other times where you can have more oil breakthrough.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_02: And so, in a sense, you can be kind of oily and dry at the same time, but you're really not dry, it's that dead cell buildup.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_02: And um so we what again, what we want is we want a very thin compact stratum corneum, and we want a really um nice robust dermis.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: Now, the other thing when you talk about your scarring from acne, so when people have acne, there's essentially kind of three types of breakouts if we sort of oversimplify it.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: So think about this in your follicle, you've got these dead cells building up, right?
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_02: They build up and they build up, and you start to see an enlarged follicle.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_02: But when you get into inflammatory acne, what happens is there is C acne bacteria, which essentially is harmless, it's part of your body, it's not an infection, you can't catch it, you don't spread it.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_02: But in the follicle where it gets trapped in those dead cells and the oil gets trapped, it eats the oil, it excretes a fatty acid byproduct.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_02: Now, that fatty acid byproduct actually wears down your follicle walls, causes your follicles to leak or rupture or blow out.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: If everything's stayed in your follicle, you never break out.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_02: So if you get a leak near the top of the follicle, you're gonna have a little like a red bump of papillole, it maybe turns into a pustulal, nothing too serious.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: If you get a blowout, Or I should say, if you get a yeah, kind of a rupture, that's more in the middle of the follicle.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's lower, more inflammation goes outside, it's a larger opening.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_02: You're going to have more of a nodule or a mini cyst, the hard underground lesions.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_02: Now, if the literally the whole side of your follicle blows up like it did when you were a teenager, then you're going to have more material outside and it's going to be deeper and it's going to actually hit the dermis.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: And a scar is an injury to the dermis.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: So as it makes its way to the surface, it destroys collagen elastin, and that's why you scar.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I want for the audience, a lot of times people will say, I want to get rid of my scars.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: And it's not scars, it's discoloration.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: I see.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_02: Post-inflammatory hyper pigmentation.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_02: So a scar is an injury to the dermis, a little harder to deal with.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_02: Post-inflammatory hyper pigmentation, we can get rid of it, it just takes longer.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_02: Now, when you have this injury to the dermis, a scar, one of the ways in which you can minimize the appearance, and we may not be able to, you know, completely eradicate them, and they're older scars, so they've they've had a while to sit in, to set in, is that we stimulate collagen.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_02: The more collagen you stimulate, the more that you're going to see a difference in terms of evening out that superficial scarring.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, of course, there's this things that you can do from an aesthetic standpoint with lasers and things like that, but there's a lot that you can do topically that's absolutely pretty, really amazing.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, really amazing.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, I just want to I just want to say one thing is it's interesting you said that because this uh this concern specifically about the scarring that I told you about Jan is something I spoke to so many you know dermatologists about.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: And every time I would hear things like, well, yeah, you're gonna have to do something, you know, invasive.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: And and that's to me, I think that's really interesting that you say that there's a lot of things we can do topically, and then the idea of this being a hyperpigmentation thing, you know, or or you know, post-inflammatory post-inflammatory pigmentation.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's I've never really uh you know heard that perspective before.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: So that's definitely something to catch on to for everyone listening because I, you know, that this is something I've struggled with my whole life.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_02: So a lot of times if you've got a little bit more pigment in your skin, anytime you have an injury to the skin, you know, like an acne lesion or anything like that, what happens is, excuse me, the inflammation as it's making its way to the surface actually kind of compromises little blood vessels, makes them leak.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well, what are your blood vessels made of?
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_02: Coloration, bilirubin, vertirubin, etc.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_02: And so what happens, depending on your pigmentation, it leaves a reddish mark, it leaves a purplish mark, a brownish, even blackish.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_02: And it's a matter of how getting that out of the skin and how quickly we can do that.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_02: It oftentimes dissipates on its own, but it can just take a really long time.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_02: Now, the reason I asked you also if you have ice pick scarring, ice pick scarring is something that while we can improve the texture of the skin with ice pick scarring, it's very difficult to get an improvement in the scar itself.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: And the reason is because an ice pick scar gets its name because the surface of it looks like a little round hole.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_02: But underneath that, it actually goes deeper almost in a triangular fashion, like an ice pick.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: So what happens is let's say that somebody with ice pick scarring goes to a derm and says, Hey, can you laser my skin?
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: If you laser the skin and you kind of go down some layers, what you do is you actually make the scarring worse because you're going down where it's the scarring has actually gotten wider.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_02: So ice pick scarring is something where typically you excise it.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_02: And what you do is you do like a punch excision, and you're literally removing the scar, and then the doctor stitches it back, and once it heals and the skin is even, then you can go back and resurface it and really get a wonderful result.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um there's other things, there's even you know a lot of newer modalities that are coming around.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: But the other type of scarring, which we call rolling kill, sort of rolling scars, boxcar scars, just divots like little divots in the skin, we can improve them a lot texturally, a lot.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_02: And part of it is when your skin is really reflective, the light comes off the skin instead of going into those areas where it just literally draws the eye to them and makes them more noticeable.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm going to talk a little bit about kind of what we what we want to do as far as solutions.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_02: So, one of the things that I focus on a lot is something that I call resurfacing.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_02: And resurfacing is a terminology I use because it's about taking the skin to a level where it's just really polished and radiant, and it looks so refined and reflective and younger looking.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_02: And it all at the same time, it should address a lot of common skin concerns.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_02: So maybe somebody has, again, acne, or they have rosacea, or they have discoloration, or any number of common skin concerns, because we want to address all of that at the same time.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_02: So again, it's getting that skin to a level where it has that just wonderful, healthy glow, and it just looks younger.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_02: And at the same time, you know, we're gonna make the scars and everything look better as well, pigmentation, all of that.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so how we're gonna do that is the main resurfacing tool, and this is something that you we want to do on a consistent basis, is we're gonna start you off, first of all, with the skincare management system.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and so the Jammerini skincare management system um is really heavily on resurfacing.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_02: And there's two things that I want to focus on for just a moment.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_02: One is you can use the best cleanser in the world.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it can be me-cellular water, it can be, you know, essential oils, it can be the best cleanser in the world, and it can't get into your follicle, the molecules are too large.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_02: And so, acne and everything we talk about with pore size and all that, it starts in the follicle.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_02: Theoretically, if you were born with perfect skin and you never got acne, you could throw dirt on your face all the time and not break out because poverty starts in the follicle.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_02: And when you have a lesion, that's the end of the process.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_02: So, what we want to do is we want to prevent that.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_02: And we again we want to keep those follicles, that retentive matter, so that if the retentive matter doesn't cause that follicle to dilate.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_02: And so, one of the things in the system is a glycolic cleanser, and you need to do this twice a day.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_02: So there's a tendency for people to think, well, you know, what did I do at night?
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: I was just sleeping, I wasn't out in the environment, etc.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_02: So why do I need to wash my face?
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_02: But it's important because what we're doing is we're really addressing that increased cornea cyclohesion and we're addressing the retentive issues in the follicle.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_02: So um, so that's the glycolic cleanser.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_02: Now, there's another product that I want to talk about for just a second that's in the system that also has to do with some of these issues, and that's a product called BioClear.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_02: One of my favorites.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_02: Now, bioclear is glycolic, salicylic, and azlaic acid.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_02: Azlaic acid is sold by prescription for acne.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's sold by prescription for rosacea.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: It's also one of the best resurfacing agents we've ever seen for the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles, and it's a pigment lifting agent, so it evens out skin tone.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_02: And it's just this is bioclear is amazing because it is one of the primary products that really has this effect on just resurfacing the skin.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_02: And then we have glycolic.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I could spend two hours talking about glycolic, but hectov, all the skincare ingredients in the entire world that have been studied medically, and we're talking about histological studies and biopsies and medical conferences.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_02: There are two that have been studied more than any other.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: One are retinoids, and the other one is glycolic acid.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_02: Now, at the very simplest level, glycolic acid dissolves and dislodges the glue-like substance or cellular cement between cells, but it's not abrasive and it's not inflammatory.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's actually an anti-inflammatory.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_02: And it does this on the outside of the skin.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_02: So, again, in terms of that increased cornea cyclehesion, it completely normalizes the epidermis.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it's interesting, glycolic acid, for example, if you had mild psoriasis, which is an autoimmune disease where cells turn over every four to six days instead of every you know 28 days, so they're actually premature cells, it would normalize that.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, wow.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_02: If you had ichthyosis, a dry skin disease, you could put all the lotion in the world on it and it it won't touch it, but I could completely normalize it with glycolic.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_02: And on the other hand, if you have oily skin, uh stops, it helps interrupt this process in the follicle.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_02: And technically, chemically, glycolic acid, despite its name, is actually a moisturizer because it stimulates muco polysaccharides and ceramides and phospholips and hyaluronic acid in your skin.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_02: And not that, if we looked at all the thousands of studies where they have done biopsies and really studied this in depth, you would see where it stimulates substantial collagen.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_02: So you see how I can address your the appearance of your acne scarring, the resurfacing, your skin's going to look so much brighter.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's going to have that, it's that it also helps with that dullness.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_02: Now, that's that's those two products in there focus on that specifically.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_02: But then everything in the system is designed to support the kinds of issues that you have addressed, and even others that you really haven't.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I always say to people, when you look in the mirror and you start to see certain aging changes, oh, my follicles are looking larger.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_02: Um, my complexion is is duller, or I it's not as um even toned.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um what we what we see when we look in the mirror is 90 to 95 percent of that is sun exposure, most of which was programmed on our skin before the age of 10.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_02: It takes 10, 20, 30 years to show up, at least 50% before the age of 20.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_02: And that's even if it's just incidental sun exposure.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_02: You weren't a sunbather, thank goodness.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_02: But uh, or would it would be worse?
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_02: So, um, what we also want to do with the system, and with something else that I'm going to provide to you, is that we want to address a lot of that and hopefully even be able to reverse a good deal of that.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's the system supports that.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_02: Now I want to talk about something specific because this is going to actually go to the um issue of your kind of wanting your skin to be more even toned, but also having to do even more also with the acne scarring.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and one of the things that the system does, by the way, is it's gonna make a huge difference in sort of the sporadic breakout.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: If your breakout doesn't kind of completely coincide because there's no cure for acne, but we can manage it so you have complete total clearing, then there's something else that I would want to add into your system called duality.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_02: But for right now, I want to talk for a moment about the um sort of the uneven skin tones.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I said to you that everybody by the age of 35 has that issue, right?
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: Right, right, yeah.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well, why is and so it's just what it is, it's just that it's it's it's the sun damage has been programmed into the skin.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_02: Now, think about this, everyone.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_02: In order for you to have pigment, you have to have something called active tyrosinase, which is in the epidermis.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_02: If you didn't have active tyrosinase, you'd be an albino.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_02: So you go out in the sun, and what happens is the minute you go out in the sun, UV radiation stimulates pigment.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the ways, reasons it does that is because it's an immediate reaction.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_02: Your it your skin is trying to protect itself.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_02: So for some individuals, depending on your ethnicity, depending on how much sun damage you've had, depending on your age, you could go outside for 10 minutes and all of a sudden you've got brown spots.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: Now, are you sitting a hot car?
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_02: Some people sit in a hot car and they start to get discolored.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_02: But think about this: how many times would you see a 10-year-old with melasma, clasma, or solar litigenies?
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_02: Would never happen.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe that 10-year-old has a swimming pool in the backyard and they're out there constantly, or a 15-year-old.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: So, what it is, it's it's the way that your skin deals with it over time and the fact that it doesn't have the same ability to repair it as it did when you were younger.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_02: So, one of the things that I'm going to give you to go with your system is something called luminate.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_02: Now, luminate is something that not only has tyrosinase inhibitors, which help to keep that tyrosinase from kind of being over, you know, overreactive when you go out in the sun.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_02: But also we have something called a melanocyte stimulating hormone.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_02: And everybody has it, and we pretty much have the same amount, whether you have really a lot of pigment or whether you're really fair skin.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_02: Now you may produce more when you're pregnant or on birth control pills.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_02: But what it does, it plays a role in genetically how do you react to the sun differently than someone else?
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_02: And for the first time, we've got something that actually downregulates this melanocyte stimulating hormone.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow, this product, by the way, was actually the study was actually presented, written up in the Journal of Drugs and Dermatology, which is a peer-reviewed medical journal.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_02: It can take weeks, months, years to get into this journal because it's not something where you typically see skincare products, you see some very serious medical issues.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_02: And um, it actually went head-to-head comparison with prescription hydrokinone.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_02: It actually outperformed prescription hydrokinone.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um and the other thing that this has in it, it has uh turmeric.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_02: Now, turmeric is an incredible tyrosinase inhibitor for centuries.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_02: Put it on the skin in India, even in a matter of days, you could get some nice even-looking skin tone.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_02: But the thing is, when they're wearing it, they're bright yellow.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, exactly.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_02: So even if you take turmeric root, you don't get really get the active chemical.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_02: So we were able to take the active chemical and make it colorless.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_02: And it's also anti-aging, anti-inflammatory.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_02: And finally, I'm getting to the good part.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_02: Finally, we have the retinoid.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I have to really look at this retinal you're using when they talk about 800 8,000 units.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I'm a little skeptical on that because in in general, you talk about retinoids like a prescription retino, you talk about it, the weakest one would be 0.025, the middle one would be 0.05, you know, 0.1, um, and you basically even the strongest is one-tenth of one percent.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um, the way that retinol works is you have an enzyme in your skin, you put retinol on it, and immediately that enzyme changes it into retinoic acid or tretinoin, which is the active ingredient in the prescription, retinoid.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_02: Now, the reason, if I ask people, and I'll say, well, so what do you think is the difference between retinol and prescription, you know, retin A or whatever?
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_02: Nine times out of ten, they're gonna say, Well, retin A is stronger.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_02: And that's true, and it's not true.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_02: Now, when you have a conversion, and I'm gonna, I'm, I'm actually getting to an important point here, so bear with me.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_02: When you have a conversion and you put um something on the skin and it has to convert, you know, sometimes it takes it's you lose something.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_02: It could be two to one, it could be three to one, five to one.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_02: You maybe you need six times as much to get to the same endpoint.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_02: Well, in this case, it's 10 to 1.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_02: I need 10 times as much retinol to equal what you would see in the prescription.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_02: Now you'd say, okay, well, that's not rocket science, just use 10 times as much.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_02: Well, Dr.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_02: Kligman, who is arguably the most famous derman in the world, he's been dead a number of years now, he invented Retin A.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_02: University of Pennsylvania, and then licensed it out to various companies.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_02: Now, he said through the years, in his career over and over again, and he was a prolific inventor, he said, retinol is actually more bioavailable and works better.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_02: So, why didn't he go out the gate with retinol?
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the reason is because when you make it equal, when you do that 10 to 1, you actually, if you do 10 times more retinol to equal it, you actually it's more difficult to acclimate to.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_02: I used to joke and say it's like you could take paint off walls with it, it's really difficult to use.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_02: So consequently, you find very small amounts in your over-the-counter products because that way people don't get all peely and red and and have some kind of a skin reaction.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_02: And so while it's still a good product, you don't get the same type of efficacy you get with the prescription.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_02: But then people don't want to acclimate to the prescription.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: So one of our claims to fame is that we actually were able to take that 10 to 1, 10 times, and get it to equal or even go beyond a prescription.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_02: And in the study, 78% of patients have no acclimation.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_02: The other 22% have maybe a slight bit of mild redness, or maybe a little bit of flaking, and then you just use it every other night in the beginning in order to acclimate.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_02: And not only that, but it has peptides and anti-inflammatories and other things that are really supportive and um help with all of your various issues.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_02: Because one of the things that certain peptides do, now peptides we barely scratch the surface because there are a lot of peptides that aren't just for aging, but what they do is they kind of fool your skin into thinking they're wounded.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's wounded.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_02: And what does it do?
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_02: It produces a lot more collagen, produces all the factors that go into healing, and so it helps with fine lines and wrinkles, it helps with the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles and appearance of acne scars, things like that.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_02: So actually, in the study, we had the Derman the study that we did actually said, I will no longer prescribe a prescription retinoid to my patients unless they beg for it because this works so much better.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_02: So you're gonna get that incorporated with that whole lightning issue as well.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's one that you're only gonna be, you only have to use that one at night.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_02: Now, there are other things that we can do along the way.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_02: So, one of the things I always say to people is I always say, you know, what we're doing today is we're kind of giving you an overall program to address your general concerns and also to your specific concern, like poor size and maybe even as a skin tone.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_02: But I always say you have to continue to work with people because lifestyle changes, seasons change, you modify programs.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: And the last thing I always say is that if Hector were to tell me a month from now, Jan, my skin is the best it's ever been, my answer to her would be, well, good, great, because I can get it a whole lot better.
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_02: And there are so many things that we haven't even talked about that can take you to a greater and greater, greater, greater, greater level of skin rejuvenation.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, unlike our hair, which is dead, you know, skin has this remarkable ability to respond and to be able to regenerate on so many levels.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: And today, um, and that's what I'm kind of devoted to, is researching and finding these technologies that really are solutions.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, no, I can I can definitely tell that, you know, that I mean, that's phenomenal.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_01: I've just been I've been very quiet for everyone listening.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_01: I've been very quiet because this is really breakthrough stuff here, Jen.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, this is phenomenal.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what you just explained, because I'm not gonna lie to you, you know, when it comes to things like retinol, when it comes to that idea of peeling and you know, the acclimation process which you explained, but you know, those are things that I have never understood.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like yeah, it's like, you know, you use a product, you start peeling, and then you're like, well, is this even good for me or not?
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_01: And that's something that actually for with me, with retinol, I'll tell you honestly, I struggled with that for a long time when I wasn't using it because every time I would use retinol, it wasn't just the peeling, it would make my acne come back.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, you know what?
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: This is this the right thing for me to be doing, you know?
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I mean, that's very interesting.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, everything that you explained.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you know, it's interesting that you said that about the about your prescription um retinoid.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: So what happens when you have retentive material in the follicle, which either is going to give you a dilated follicle or you're gonna have breakouts, is that that retentive material, when you start to clear it, it has to go somewhere.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_02: Now, for a lot of people, it just kind of like maybe.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: They get a little a few little breakouts, and but they notice their skin looks much better overall and it's clearing a lot faster, um, or it it's a little bit more intense, and so one of the reasons that I talked about the duality product um and possibly adding that in, and for people that maybe have where their acne is a little bit more active, is that there is something in there that actually goes after C acne bacteria, and so it literally almost stops the breakout cold.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_02: But most people, um, and they don't have to go through that transition period, most people don't, with a prescription retinoid, oftentimes they will go through that, and so it's difficult when somebody says to you, Oh, yeah, this is great for your acne.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_02: By the way, your skin's gonna look a whole lot worse before it looks better.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_02: That that doesn't that doesn't seduce me, that doesn't entice me at all.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_02: So, um, and that's why it's really good for somebody to monitor because these are little modifications that can make a huge difference.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_02: And um, one of the things I'm also gonna send you, talk to you we're gonna kind of keep for the future.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_02: So when acta says to me, yeah, Jen, my skin is really great and it's you know it's glowing and all of that, then there are things we can fine-tune because you you have more time to spend on your skin at night.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_02: Well, one of the things that we have is the merini multi-acid, I can get the name wrong, it's clear corrected pads.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_02: What they what it is, it's a jar that these pads are pre-soaked with a certain combination of acids.
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_02: And also there's an ingredient in there that makes this huge difference in discoloration in terms of the leftover discoloration from when somebody breaks out, and also helps probably with the appearance of acne scarring as well, and just everything, texture and everything.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_02: And it's such a fun product because all you do is after you clean your skin, you wipe it on, you leave it on for about 10 minutes, and then you rinse it off and go with the rest of your program.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_02: But it completely resurfaces and it gets better and better progressively over time.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's something somebody can use two or three times a week.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_02: So there's things like this that we add into your program that as we determine, you know, where your skin is at, what we need to do next.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why I always say that list, that's your runway, that list you gave me.
• 46:28
  SPEAKER_02: Think about how you feel about your skin.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_02: If somebody can address every one of your concerns and either resolve them or greatly resolve them, right?
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and explain the science of it.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_01: You know, for me, it just this is so so cool for me to be doing this with you right now because I have never had anyone that could explain to me why the things that are happening in my skin, whether it was when I was a teenager or like in college or now, that why is it that they're all tied together and what is the process?
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_01: Because that was one of my biggest questions, Jen.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_01: Honestly, like it's like you you've just answered a lifelong question for me that I've had is this idea of well, why is it that when I break out, you know, I I notice this and my pore size is bigger, but I'm not breaking out?
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_01: And then when you said the oil thing, one thing I wanted to ask you is you mentioned um, you know, uh cutie bacteria mechne, and I wanted to ask you about um people out there with oily skin, should there be something that we're doing to help, you know, I guess reduce that exposure or that availability of that bacteria to the oil that it's well, that's where duality comes in, but also here's the thing about oily skin: it's not going to keep you young longer, really.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's oil is designed to push those cells to the surface.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_02: And oftentimes people with with even really oily skin have more transepidermal moisture loss than people with dry skin because they have more inflammation.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: So, just to talk about oil for a moment.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_02: First of all, the amount of oil you have on the outside of your skin is a representation of what gets out, not how much you produce.
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_02: So some days maybe more oil gets to the surface of your skin, some days less oil because maybe there is more oil trapped in the follicle.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_02: And so you can't really address um unless you're going to disable the oil glands or maybe through some some lasers will lessen the oil production.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_02: But what you whatever oil you produce, that's what you produce.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_02: But what you can do is when you completely when you clear that follicle and you also resurface the skin, your skin looks dewy, not oily.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, it looks reflective, not shiny.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_02: There's a difference.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_02: So um, and everything is just much more evenly distributed and it has a completely different look about it.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_02: And so you kind of use that to your advantage.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and it just makes the skin look so reflective.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_02: And sometimes people actually will say in the beginning, when we completely clear their skin, they'll say, Well, you know, my skin is actually a little more oily on the surface than it was, but it looks so different and it looks good.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_02: And people are constantly telling me, Oh my gosh, your skin looks so dewy and so fresh.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_02: So that's what we want to do.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_02: And there's other another thing that I'm going to throw out, which is kind of a just you can guide you guys can keep in your back pocket.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_02: There are a certain percentage of individuals, that's a very small percentage, uh, that are not responsive, that their acne is recalcitrant.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_02: And it's it's it's very, it's very rare that I come across this, or we don't get them to that point.
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe they respond, but you know, you want to get to complete, I want people to get to complete total clearing.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_02: I want to manage it and keep them completely clear.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so um here's what happens inside your follicle, you have certain enzymes, isozyme type two, isozyme type, um, iso type one, and isozyme type two, known collectivity is 5A reductase.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_02: You have them up here in your scalp follicles, and then outside of your follicle, you have hormones, hopefully.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_02: You have estrogen, progesterone, you have testosterone.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_02: We women have almost as much testosterone as men, except our testosterone is bound by proteins, like having a sack around it.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_02: Don't get a, you know, we don't get a deep voice and a hairy chest and a beard.
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_02: But what we find with women, probably as much as maybe even as much as 95, 98% of females that have adult female acne, is that they're producing a little bit of free testosterone or they have a testosterone sensitivity.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's not going to show up in a blood test, it's not like having polycystic ovary.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's so there's a wide range of normal.
• 50:49
  SPEAKER_02: So it's not something that's gonna show up as being abnormal, but it's enough that it gets together with the enzymes in the follicle, they shake hands and produce dihydroth, and it's that acne that is persistent underneath the chin, the jawline on the chin.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_02: Now, most of the time we can deal with that because guess what?
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_02: We even have a blocker in duality.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: But in the rare cases where this is just it's just a real issue, then what I tell people, I say, talk to your physician.
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_02: And so actor you're your own physician.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_02: And what you want to do is there's something called spironolactone.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_02: You've heard of that.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's very low dose, it's like 50 to 150 milligrams a day.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_02: And what it does is it does one thing and one thing only in this case.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_02: It keeps those two from shaking hands, it puts a wallet between them.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_02: I'll tell you what else it does.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: It actually cuts oil production about 60 to 80 percent.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't make the skin dry, it just normalizes the oil production.
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_02: Um there's been some studies over the years when I first started talking about this, you know, the only time people thought about it was polycystic ovary, and I was lecturing on it at a lot of conferences.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_02: And um, there was a study, I think I don't think it came out of the UK that talked about how it also helps to cut cravings for salt, sugar, and chocolate.
• 52:15
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_02: The other thing that it does is that when we get into our 20s, 30s, and beyond, what do we notice?
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_02: Well, a lot of women say, you know what, it's really interesting, but I'm growing more hair on my face and eventually less hair on your head.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_02: And so what it does is because it interacts in the follicles everywhere, it also lessens facial hair and it helps to stop female pattern baldness, which happens about 50% of the time.
• 52:46
  SPEAKER_02: And um, and so it actually can increase um the the the the amount of hair.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_01: Now, I mean that's very interesting to me because this idea of, and and this is I feel like we could do an entire series just on this is this androgen uh aspect is that you know, androgen like just how they are impacting women in terms of just you know, premenopause, perimenopause, um, throughout your life, because that's something that I think we all deal with is this hair growth around, you know, certain areas of our face as we age, like you said, and also the um the idea that you know, with PCOS, I think that's such an interesting thing that you brought up because that's a topic I'm very, very uh passionate about.
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_01: I actually um you know had PCOS and now it's completely controlled and I'm I'm managing it.
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_01: But the problem that I noticed is that, you know, it it was the hair, but then it was also the acne that was around where the hair is growing.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't like the acne is popping up randomly, right?
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_01: It was like the acne and the hair are in the same place.
• 53:55
  SPEAKER_01: So it was very, very interesting.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that really ties into what you said and makes sense now for me.
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um when I'm thinking, well, PCO, as you know, polycystic ovary is where you produce vinysis in the ovary.
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_02: But what happens is, and oftentimes people will go to their doctor because not because they think they have polystystic, but they'll say, Doctor, why am I getting this horrible acne?
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_02: Because it can be really bad acne.
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_02: But what happens is it causes the uh insulin levels to go up.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the things that happens it with this in the body to get those levels back down to more normal is you produce testosterone.
• 54:32
  SPEAKER_02: So um so it's it's um it's just kind of a vicious cycle.
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_02: And spiron lactone can be a real miracle for the kind of cosmetic elements of that because it keeps the testosterone from being an issue having to do with the facial acne.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_02: And um and as you know, diet is really important.
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_02: Also, diet, the diet that you would, the very low-carb diet that individuals go on, also is wonderful for the skin and just very healthy in general.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_01: No, I absolutely I think the low carb diet is is very, very interesting to me because it's it's definitely that insulin uh issue that you addressed.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_01: Because, you know, what what I noticed is that, you know, because I was dealing with PCOS, I mean, this is for ever for everyone listening, you know, you might not at all relate with this, but for those of you who have dealt with it, you know, it's you notice a night and day difference, you know, and this really goes back to one of our earlier episodes in the in this series, Jan, when you were explaining to us about the the role of sugar and the role of you know, just the how much load, you know, like your glycemic load, like what your body has throughout the day.
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I think this topic is, I mean, this is where it gets so interesting to me, right?
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_01: With skin, because all of these factors tie in.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_01: It's not a one fix, you know, solution for anything.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that this is this is remarkable, you know, the way you're explaining it.
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I um, you know, there are just there's so many things that we can do.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_02: And unfortunately, we all get inundated with huge numbers, an enormous numbers of things that really don't work are are just pseudoscience.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_02: But what you can really do for the skin is remarkable.
• 56:25
  SPEAKER_02: And again, you know, I always say I don't need another product, I want a solution.
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_01: And the solution is so, and you know what's interesting is that everything you've explained to me here today, it even further evaluates for me this notion that I've always had, you know, studying medicine.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_01: I always like it's like I realized by the end of my medical training, Jan, I was genuinely convinced that everything has to do with hormones.
• 56:51
  SPEAKER_01: I was convinced, like nobody could convince me otherwise because I was like, you know what?
• 56:55
  SPEAKER_01: Your body is not doing this like targeted, you know, like target therapies.
• 57:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's a entire system that's working.
• 57:03
  SPEAKER_01: And so when you're talking to me, you know, about everything that, you know, I explained to you about my own concerns, I'm sitting here thinking about just how our body regulates our normal hormones and circulates them and uses them and you know, pushes them to where they need to go.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_01: And all of this has to be looked at in a more holistic way.
• 57:21
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there are so many companies now, which you know, I know you and I have discussed before, and there's so many people out there that are saying, well, this is a spot treatment or this is a targeted treatment for just this.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, you know what?
• 57:33
  SPEAKER_01: That is completely like opposite and contradictory to how the human body functions.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_01: That's just not how it works inside of the body.
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_02: So true.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, it used to be a number of years ago, uh, when I'm I'm a member of the American Account of Anti-Aging Medicine, and um, and I've spoken at the conference several times, but uh there was a period we went through where, you know, one of the ways that we look at females is females are really challenged because literally, once a female stops menstruating, literally nature says, You're done, we don't need you anymore.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like a lot of those receptor sites that are that that the hormones, it's like they're keys to open those receptor sites and to sort of keep us young and vital and energetic.
• 58:20
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we have to find other ways, we have to find workarounds.
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_02: And it's so it's it and it all works together because when you are vital and when you are functioning in a way in which um I'm and one of the things I'm gonna say is that aging is actually a disease, it's an inflammatory process, and you know, we haven't figured out that you know how to not die, but you really don't have to age in terms of being incapacitated for many years before you do die.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's it's about that whole internal working and the skin and the body and all of that just goes together.
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_01: No, that's absolutely, and I think you know, it's it's really, really refreshing for me.
• 59:08
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I can't tell you to be able to to to hear you say this because you know, aging it I kid you not, you know, when I first got into skincare and I guess skin health in general, that was my biggest thing was people are like, oh, anti-aging, anti-aging.
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you can't stop it, it's a literal process of decay of the human body, which is something that you notice in electronics.
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_01: Everything decays, everything deteriorates over time.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's our job to figure out where is this starting and where are the axes, right?
• 59:40
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, in the human body, we talk about the hormonal axes and we talk about the neuro, uh, you know, the neuronal axes and all of these things and what that means, you know, nobody is discussing this stuff.
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody's sitting down and saying, listen, it's not going to be fixed by that one dietary supplement that you take every day, or that one medicine that you take, like metformin, for example.
• 1:00:03
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'm not going to go on a tangent, but you know, you know, metformin is prescribed like freaking, you know, candy these days.
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_01: And they're saying that, you know, the metformin fixes everything, it fixes insulin resistance, fixes PCOS, it fixes this, that.
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it doesn't.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: And and the that's the problem, I think, that consumers and for everyone listening, I think one thing really take away from the amount of knowledge that that Jan is has been sharing with us is that the approach that she's taking is so novel and it's so breakthrough because it's a whole like full approach.
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 1:00:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's not a it's not that, you know, fix this part and band-aid this up and do the no, it's about re like kind of, I guess, resetting your system, right?
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I I think that's the best way I can uh explain it is resetting your system.
• 1:00:52
  SPEAKER_02: So you know, I talk about netformin a lot, and I think there's definitely um a role and it's a breakthrough in many ways because again, it causes us to look at aging as more of a disease.
• 1:01:07
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, one of the things too, you mentioned hormones, but it's also about sirtuins.
• 1:01:12
  SPEAKER_02: We have about 24 sirtuins, anti-aging genes, and metformin, I think, uh addresses two of them only two, um, addresses it in an interesting way, supposedly because what it does is it creates a little bit of it, lets off a little free radicals into cells.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_02: Now, you know, we hear free radicals are really horrible.
• 1:01:32
  SPEAKER_02: Well, nothing's all bad, nothing's all good.
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_02: The body likes a little bit of stress.
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_02: Now, too much stress, like if I step on a snail, that's too much stress.
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_02: That snail is not going to recover.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_02: If I take it to the emergency room, it's not gonna, you're not gonna be able to do anything.
• 1:01:46
  SPEAKER_02: But if a little bit of stress sometimes is good, and so one of the ways it works is that it actually provides enough of a stress that apparently turns on a couple of sertoons, but that's just a piece of the puzzle.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's a good piece of the puzzle, but this puzzle, and unfortunately at this point, we've only been able to put together one tiny little corner of this 25,000-piece puzzle.
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_02: But that's what's so exciting because um there's so much going on in in these areas of of research, and um that that you know we're gonna see more and more things uncovered.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I absolutely agree.
• 1:02:20
  SPEAKER_01: And you know what?
• 1:02:21
  SPEAKER_01: This has been amazing, Jan.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for this.
• 1:02:24
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I hope everyone listening, you guys uh have learned because I've learned a lot about my own skin.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I have the idea that this is what I was dealing with for pretty much my whole life.
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, honestly, I mean, and that's not me just saying that.
• 1:02:37
  SPEAKER_01: I I swear to you guys, because I've gone to many dermatologists, I've talked to many of my colleagues, and the way that you explain things to me, Jen, I've never heard anyone address it that way.
• 1:02:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I just I thank you so much for doing this.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_01: This has been You know what?
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_02: So fun, it's such a pleasure.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_02: I can't wait to get your feedback, and also we're you know, we'll we'll we're we're gonna be talking again soon.
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, we are we are, and everyone listening, I really urge you.
• 1:03:06
  SPEAKER_01: If this has not convinced you, please go check out Jan's website and book a consultation for your skin health.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_01: Do that for yourself, give yourself a treat.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, put down Sephora, put down the the magazine and the the latest hype and the go and figure out what's really going on with your skin.
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not because, you know, I love Jan because I do love Jan, I love you, but it's because she knows what she's doing and her approach.
• 1:03:35
  SPEAKER_01: I can honestly tell you as a physician to hear someone um as knowledgeable as her speak the way she does about it and understand it the way she does.
• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_01: This is something that you're not going to see really anywhere else.
• 1:03:47
  SPEAKER_01: This is very, very unique for someone to understand skin help like this.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_01: So I really urge all of you out there, go book a consultation, let us know what you think.
• 1:03:55
  SPEAKER_01: And um, if you have any questions for Jan's team, leave them in the comments as always.
• 1:03:59
  SPEAKER_01: And Jan, thank you so much.
• 1:04:01
  SPEAKER_01: I can't wait for part five.
• 1:04:03
  SPEAKER_02: Well, again, my pleasure and thank you everyone that's been listening because I wouldn't be here without you.
• 1:04:11
  SPEAKER_02: And we'll talk again soon.
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely.
• 1:04:14
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 1:04:15
  SPEAKER_02: Bye.
• 1:04:17
  SPEAKER_01: So hey guys, so I hope you love that episode.
• 1:04:20
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• 1:04:25
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• 1:04:42
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• 1:05:03
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• 1:05:13
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• 1:05:19
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• 1:05:24
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