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Better every day with Dr. Bryan Clarke · My Veterinary Life

• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Welcome to this week's episode of the My Veterinary Life podcast.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: I'm your host, doctor Annie Schavant, and my pronouns are
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: she her, and our guest today is doctor Brian Clark.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: Doctor Clark is the President elect of the American Animal
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Hospital Association, a co owner of a small Animal hospital,
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: a diplomat of the American Board, a veterinary Practitioners and
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Vice chair of the abma's Veterinary Economic Strategy Committee, and
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: a member of the Task Force for Emerging Technologies and Innovations.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: I am so excited to share doctor Clark's story, but
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: before we do, I want to give a special thank
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: you to our podcast partner, NVA General Practice. NBA helps
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: great vets become even greater with multiple paths to build
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: a career that's uniquely yours. Lead a team, explore a specialty,
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: own a practice, or shape care across our network of
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: over nine hundred neighborhood clinics. Wherever you want to go next,
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: NBA has a path to help you get there. Visit
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: careers dot NBA dot com to find your next role.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: And with that, Welcome to the show.
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: Doctor Clark.
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: Thanks Annie, it's great to be here, and happy to
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: spend some time together today.
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: Yes, really looking forward to our conversation.
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: We have lots to cover and we will begin like
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: we usually do, at the very beginning, with how you
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: first became interested in VetMed.
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: You know, I feel like this is one of those
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: questions that I'm supposed to be able to tell you
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: that aha moment that just happened where I knew it
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: at three years old when I got my first puppy,
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: and you know, my parents had it as we walked
• 1:38
  Speaker 3: in the door. No that I didn't have that one moment.
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: So growing up I knew that I wanted to work
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: not behind a desk. I'm a little too fidgety and
• 1:48
  Speaker 3: always in motion to sit still all day long, So
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: I naturally gravitated towards the sciences and love spending time
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: outside with nature in particular, so helping animals seem like
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: a natural way forward. I ended up doing my undergraduate
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: studies at the University of Florida and wildlife ecology as
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: a testament to kind of where I was looking at
• 2:08
  Speaker 3: career paths, and ended up working in a veterary hospital
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: for my first job in high school and loved, obviously
• 2:15
  Speaker 3: the aspect of being able to help animals, but as
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: time went on, I also found that what was so
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: unique about Bettery medicine was the ability to help people
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: as well, And so it naturally started to fall in
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: place that I couldn't find another profession that was so
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: uniquely positioned to help not just the cute, furry, scaly,
• 2:33
  Speaker 3: feathery things that we all love so much, but to
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: also make a real difference in people's lives. And that
• 2:39
  Speaker 3: met has just been the perfect fit. So it kind
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: of happened organically over a long period of time.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you for sharing that, because I do feel like, well,
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: we do hear the I've known I've wanted to be a.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: Vet since I was five years old. Origin story.
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: That's not everybody's situation, and there really shouldn't be pressure
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: to feel the call that early. Sometimes the pieces of
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: the puzzle fall into place as you have different experiences.
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: And it sounds like it just made sense and that
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: was the sort of an organic process over time it did.
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: I totally agree, and nobody should feel lesser than if
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: they don't have that singular moment of epiphany. You know, Honestly,
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: I was keeping doors open even as I was filling
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: on applications to veterinary school. But as soon as that
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: year went on and towards the end of undergrad it
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: became very obvious I was, you know, knocking on the
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: right doors and that that was the road forward. So
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: obviously making that decision to go forward with it was
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: the best decision I ever made.
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: Amazing, amazing.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: So let's jump into that VET school experience a little
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: bit in terms of your plans and your reality. So
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: what did you think you were going to do as
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: a veterinarian and then what did you end up doing
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: after graduation?
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so there's a coup ways to look at that.
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: So going through school, I loved the puzzle aspect of
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: medicine and the intrigue of trying to figure out a mystery.
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: Right every case I feel like is a bit of
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: a who done it? And I love that aspect. I
• 4:15
  Speaker 3: gravitated naturally towards some fairly complex things. I found myself
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: loving my internal medicine rotations and really tried to absorb
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: every bit I could from some key mentors within the
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: University of Florida's VET school that helped me along that path.
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: And as I got towards the end of the DVM curriculum. I,
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: like so many of us, face the choice of do
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: I go to practice now or do I continue my education.
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: My wife and I had been married for several years
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: at that point, and we were ready to go ahead
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: and start thinking about having a family and settling down,
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: and so it made more sense for me to go
• 4:49
  Speaker 3: ahead and enter practice. But I wanted to end up
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: in a place that could really reinvest in the road
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: forward for me to continually develop my skill set. NA
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: see general practice as an area that I couldn't do
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: whatever I wanted to in medicine, right, there's so much
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: cool stuff that we get to do, And so I
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: ended up in structuring my externships looking for that. And
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: so I came out and was getting ready for graduation,
• 5:14
  Speaker 3: thinking awesome, I'll go pick from any of these practices
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: that seem like the best fit. But I graduated in
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: twenty ten, So then the reality hit of the economy
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: was just a bit different than normal in twenty ten,
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: and so instead I got to learn the value of
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: networking and connecting with people and building relationships as I
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: desperately fought to find anybody that was looking to hire
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: another veterinarian in twenty ten. So I ended up at
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: a hospital that provided both general practice and emergency care
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: in Jacksonville, Florida, and it was a really good learning
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: opportunity because the types of cases that I was managing
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: were all over the place and that type of a setting.
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: And then did eventually end up in one of the
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: practices that I had externed with that provided me that
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: sort of wide open go do what you want to
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: do with medicine. We'll make sure to put the road
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: in front of you.
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: I love hearing about that story because I think it
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: helps folks understand that there are some internal factors that
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: go into the career decision making process. There's some external factors,
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: predictable and unpredictable, that go in, and there's also the
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: time horizon component that you talked about. You didn't go
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: to the practice from your externship right after graduation, but
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: you ended up there and you found a good fit
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: for you after graduation, even though the economy wasn't in
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: an ideal place. So being confident in what you were
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: looking for but flexible with the options enabled you to
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: accomplish those goals, although it might have looked a little
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: different from the outset.
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: How does that sound perfect?
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: It certainly did, And I think that's such an important
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: thing for all people in anything the profession to keep
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: sight of There's always going to be things that change
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: that we're not in control of. And just because it
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: may not be what you thought it was going to be,
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: or the position of the hours, the type of practice,
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: the location, any of that stuff, you know that flexibility
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: is to the betterment of all of us, right but
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: especially the individual, because you.
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: Never know what you're going to learn.
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: Had I not been essentially forced by those circumstances to
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: go into a practice that I probably wouldn't have looked
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: to do some overnight shifts every week right out of school.
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: But if I had not essentially had no option but
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: to go into that with such so few opportunities available,
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: I would be a totally different person. I learned a
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: tremendous amount that year, and I think that year of
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: my life, in those couple of years of my life
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: tremendously for a lot of what I gained through it amazing.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: Thank you for sharing that perspective. So then you built
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: on those associate experiences and ultimately pursued practice ownership. What
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: did that path look like next.
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I actually ended up with an associate position
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: at a hospital that I had externed at in school,
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: and so when I took that position, I was just
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: very transparent from the front that I'd grown up in
• 8:08
  Speaker 3: a small animal family, non veterinarya but loved the idea
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: of building not just a patient out of that one
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: on one interaction, but also building a team, providing a
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: work home for other people around you. So I knew
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: I always wanted to do that at some point and
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: found a position that not only gave me the road
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: forward I wanted for my medical development, but also provide
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: those opportunities for ownership. So moved from being the employee
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: of my boss at the time to now being partnered
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: with them, and very happily, almost ten years later, we're
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: so proud of the hospital that we built, in the
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: team that's around us, that is meeting our patients and
• 8:45
  Speaker 3: clients every single day.
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: Very cool, what wonderful story of the relationships that can
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: develop from those externship experiences. So you were able to
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: get a window into that practice early then you were
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: in it as an associate, but transparent about your ambitions
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: that aligned with the practice, which is great, and then
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: we're able to work in that setting before becoming a partner,
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: so you knew it, intimately knew the ownership, and then
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: were able to make that transition into practice ownership.
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: So I love talking about the many different ways we
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: can pursue practice ownership, and I love hearing that that
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: way was a great fit for you.
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely, it gave me.
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  Speaker 3: You know, it gave me a road that I wasn't
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: just familiar with the practice, but I was familiar with
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: who was in the practice, and I don't mean individual
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: team members necessarily, but familiar with the philosophy of the practice,
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: the goals of the practice, where they were headed, and
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: what their value set was. You know, I knew my
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: partners from working for them, knew what was important for
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: them and what they were trying to do with the
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: hospitals that they had built, and so I knew that
• 9:53
  Speaker 3: their value set aligned with my own, which is the
• 9:56
  Speaker 3: makings of a good partnership and a good future.
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: Right.
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  Speaker 3: Some of the some of the other variables can be
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: lined up for somebody and make it look like a
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: great opportunity. But if you don't value the same things
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: as who you're building, that hospital with it, you know
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: it may not go as well as you're hoping.
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: So oh, such a good point, and what a great
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: way to set yourself up for success by being able
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: to observe that and kind of experience it firsthand.
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: So I love that absolutely.
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: Now, practice ownership is not your only passion in VET med.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: As I was reviewing your resume and preparation for our
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: conversation today, it struck me the number of additional advanced
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: education opportunities that you have pursued. And I can already
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: tell from our conversation how much you love learning in
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: that sort of professional development process, and so I have
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: to ask.
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: How did you prioritize?
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: What is your experience with pursuing education after VET school?
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: How did that go?
• 10:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: Well, part of that, Annie, to be honest, is, as
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: my team would tell you, is that I'm old, so
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: I've had time to do it right. None of these
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: things happen overnight. But I think it's a reflection of
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: as you said, I love doing what we do and
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: I love learning new ways to do it. Not a
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: single day should go by in our careers in this
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: field where we feel like we've done it and we're
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: there right and that there's nothing more to learn, or
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: that if we don't learn anything else will be in
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: good shape. The reality is, tomorrow I hope to be
• 11:25
  Speaker 3: a better veterinarian, a better owner, a better colleague, a
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: better resource to my clients and my patients than I
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: am today. And if I can go through my entire
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: career thinking that way, then I think I'm doing a
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: good job in that case. So how to choose, Because
• 11:43
  Speaker 3: there's so many fantastic organizations that are deservative time and
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: energy and thought leadership in our industry, how to choose
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: for me was not really a sit down, And you know,
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: I'm not evaluating these things over time. It's a matter
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: of what organizations did I come across now? Naturally that
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: just like in choosing partnerships or in choosing teammates, you
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: want to make sure that your value sets align. Find
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: those organizations that value what's most important to you. So
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: when I made the choice to go straight into general practice,
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: I made a promise to myself that I wanted to
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: kind of put a feather in my hat and prove
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: to myself through an objective measurement that I was providing
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: really top level care and really challenging my medical acumen
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: to be the best and I'm not there yet, but
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: I'll tell you when I get there. But that led
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: me to discovering the American port of enterity practitioners, learning
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: that no like leaving school, going through internship and residency
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: and pursuing a system specialty college is not the only
• 12:47
  Speaker 3: path to being a boarded specialist and demonstrating that to
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: the people around you and yourself, and so that was
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: the first thing that I wanted to accomplish. You have
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: to be out in practice for a little bit. But
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: I crossed that bridge in twenty twenty three and I'm
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: still very proud, and honestly, I think what reinforced that
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: that was the right decision for me is that going
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: through the process of specializing in canine and feline practice
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: through ABVP made me a better clinician than I was
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: when I started that process. It's not that you're sitting
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: down and typing up these arduous case reports as a
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: formality or to show off. I learned a tremendous amount
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: about cases that I thought I had done a really
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: good job on, but they're never perfect, and so I
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: was better on the backside of that part of the process.
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: And then I mean, holy cow, how much I learned
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: by having to study for Yes, it's a pretty arduous
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: boards exam, right it should be, but it made me
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: better on the backside. So I think that's to me,
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: the mark of a good affiliation and a good process
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: is when it's not just a demonstration but also a
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: process that leads to improvement for us. So AHA became
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: the second one. I mean, most of my professional career
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: I've been in AHA credited practices, and so I'm very,
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: very proud of the fact that when we bought All
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: Creatures Animal Hospital just a year later, we made it
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: through AHA certification.
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: And same thing that process.
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: Every time we reaccredit, we become a better hospital, we
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: learn more about what we can be doing better, and
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: so that's kind of the same process, but on a
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: team level, and it reinforces that that's the you know
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: that I'm getting involved in the right things.
• 14:30
  Speaker 5: So yeah, I really appreciate you sharing that perspective on
• 14:37
  Speaker 5: additional education, and honestly, I think it applies to VET
• 14:40
  Speaker 5: school as well.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: I think it's so easy to get caught up in
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: the next test and getting it done and moving on
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: and you were able to take a step back, both
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: with the ABBP and with AHA accreditation and think about
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: what is the purpose behind this, what is the opportunity
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: in the process in addition to the opportunity with what
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: the result is.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: And I just think that.
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: Posture towards education is going to open you up to
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: a much more fulfilling process and results ultimately. And I'm
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: also glad that you're able to talk about that ABBP
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: certification because, as you said, it's an additional path to
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: specialization that I don't think it's talked about as much
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: as some of the other ones, at least early on
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: in our career. But it's absolutely something to consider.
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's so amazing, and it's you know, it's not
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: a substitute. It's not a replacement for a traditional systems
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: based specialization process. I think they're incredibly complementary. Right. Our
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: whole industry is better if we've got more and more
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: diplomas of ABVP as well as more and more systems
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: based experts. Right. I mean shout out to my opto
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: friends out there, because I literally couldn't live without the
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: ability to have an ophthalmologist helped me through the day
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: to day so yeah, it's they're all complimentary to each other.
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: But you're right, you know, ABVP, we know well that
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: we're not talked about as much, we're not known as much.
• 16:09
  Speaker 3: A lot of people see the extra initials and are
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: not real sure what that means. But we're out there
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: and you'll find that most of us are pretty passionate
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: about talking about it. A lot of us are really
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: eager to go ahead and start our career and get
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: out into practice and that that doesn't result in a
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: door closing to specialization.
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: So well said, and thank you for adding the point
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: about complimentary and the ways there are many paths and
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: we're all working together for our core values and the
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: pursuit of better name medicine.
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: So you mentioned AHA accreditation, so we know that you
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: are familiar with that organization, but then you became involved
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: in leadership there as well. So what led you to
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: take that next step and then ultimately commit to the
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: present elect role that you're currently in.
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: So I blame my wife and I tell her that regularly, right,
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: But the way that we led there, it was a
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: lot of encouragement from her because I wasn't sure if
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: I really had a whole lot to offer, but what
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: I did have to offer was when I finished my
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: ABVP certification journey, all of a sudden I had more
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: time on my hands, and I, as you can see,
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: I don't like saying no.
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: I like being busy.
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: I like doing things, and frankly, it's exciting to feel
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: like you can be involved in to whatever degree the
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: world feels like it's beneficial. I want to try to
• 17:27
  Speaker 3: leave a mark on things, not because I think I'm
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: the best person, but because that's my contribution what I
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: can bring. And AHA has long been an organization that
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: I mean for ninety four years now. They've been committed
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: to elevating the standard of care and practice, and that's
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: what led me to ABVP certification. That's how I wanted
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: to structure where I worked in the hospital that I
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: built and that I was involved in. So AHA felt
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: like a natural fit. It was always an organization that
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: I turned to for clinical guidance or guidance on protocols
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: within our hospital. And so when I all of a
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: sudden had time and have the choice of where professionally,
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: can I give back to a profession that's meant so
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: much to me and brought so much to me, happened
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: to stumble onto AHA posting that they had positions available
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: on the board of Directors. So this is where I
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: blame my wife because I was not necessarily going to submit,
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: and she said, no, it's one of the most important
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: things that you have in your career. I think you
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: should what better place to go. So from there, in
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: terms of moving into leadership positions, that was just plain
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: and simply being available and saying yes. And I didn't
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: go and volunteer for one particular thing or another. I
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: went and said I'm here. If I'm the right person
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: that you feel there's something I can add, I'd love
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: to help. And so they asked me if I would
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: move into the vice presidency role, and now we're moving up.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: So I actually, I do want to go back to
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: the blaming the white pard for a second.
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: I'll tell her.
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: I think it touches on an important factor that these
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: career decisions are often not being made in isolation. You
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: have a partner, you have a family, you have a practice,
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: and now you're considering an additional role in a volunteer.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Capacity with AHA.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: So if you wouldn't mind sharing a little bit about
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: thought process as a.
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: Family for making those decisions or considerations that might be
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: helpful to share.
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: No, absolutely, because that's at the heart of making those
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: decisions successfully for me. I mean, Kim and I have
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: been married for twenty years as of this summer. Hudson,
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: our one son, is fourteen years old, and they are
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: my two best friends day in and day out. And
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: so when I'm doing something through my career, it's a
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: whole family decision, right because everything says zero sum game,
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: and so if there's going to be more energy or
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: time applied to something else, it's got to be something
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: that the whole family feels is right for us. And
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: the same thing holds true for all of our obligations,
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: right her through her career, Hudson through his studies and
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: his hobby and passions.
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: So yeah, No, that's at the heart.
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: Of a successful decision, I think, is that every stakeholder
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: in that decision has got to be a part of it.
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: And so that's how the AD decision was made, and
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: it was a very good one. I Mean, it's such
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: an incredible community. The people that are giving of their
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: time I just stand in awe of and the leadership
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: team within AHA, the other members of the board of
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: directors or people who are just committing so much time
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: and energy and invaluable thought leadership to continue to make
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: that organization what it is and continue to grow it
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: into the next stage of its existence. But those decisions
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: have to be made by everybody who's involved in it,
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: and everybody who's got skin in the game.
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: Essentially, absolutely, Yeah, thanks for sharing some of that, because
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: I think it really helps draw attention to the fact
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: that volunteering is really a passion project for folks. I
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: think the zero sum is a really great way to
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: put it.
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: Rarely a case.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: Where you're volunteering without something else that has to get
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: shifted around, or something else that either you or somebody
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: else is giving up. And so that's why I'm so
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: appreciative of our volunteers, because they're there for a reason.
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: You are there for a reason.
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: You talked about really enjoying the company of the other
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: folks that you're working with, and I think that's got
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: to be part of it. Is like you've made the
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: conscious decision to spend your time, your most valuable resource
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: here with this particular organization.
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: It's you know, that's not even just you know, you
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: don't even need to just consider the relationships at home
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: for that that's the you know, the key part of
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: hopefully all of our lives. But you've got work families
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: as well, and I think you can use the same
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: decision making criteria. And none of us are perfect at it,
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: me least of all. Right, my team would be glad
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: to tell you about times that they felt like I'd
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: been plugged in in two many ways. And you've got
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: to make sure that everybody who's going to be impacted
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: by a decision that you consider that right and consider
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: the impact of it, make sure that you're borrowing time
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: from the appropriate places. So yeah, I think it's just
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: something you always got to remember that. It's you know,
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: we don't make we don't make decisions in a vacuum,
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: for sure. So but volunteering is so valuable and so
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: important I think for the development of everybody, each of us.
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: You know, it's so easy to get stuck in your
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: own little microcosm and forget that we're part of a big,
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: beautiful industry that gets to help a lot of clients
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: and a lot of patients, and there's so much that's
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: rewarding about finding ways to do that that maybe you
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: didn't know exist because you weren't even aware of them
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: as an arm of the industry, or finding ways to
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: help spread what you've learned in the day to day, right,
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: I mean there are lessons that have taken me years
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: to learn going in and out of the exam room
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: and with my clients and patients that through mentorship within
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: my hospital and the relationships that I've got with with
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: the rest of our veterinary team and all of our
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: colleagues within our hospital team, I get to share that
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: with them.
• 22:59
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: Volunteering is how you do that when you don't have
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: a natural relationship.
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: So, through AHA, our leadership and our board of directors
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: can take their life experience in and out of practice
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: and put it into an association that can then disseminate
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: it to thousands of members and we all get to
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: learn from that. So it's really a beautiful thing, and
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: it's just one more conduit to help knowledge share and
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: improve the connectivity within our profession.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: It's a beautiful picture.
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: It's a beautiful visual of the way that we can
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: be giving of both our time and expertise. And you
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: do that through AHA and also through ABMA. So I'm
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: going to move us down into talking about some of
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: that experience complimentary do your work at AHA.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: So you're volunteering with.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: The Veterinary Economics Strategy Committee and then also serving on
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: a task for so what did those experiences look like?
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: Absolutely, So the Veterinary Economic Strategy Committee has been a
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: standing committee for some time with the ABMA, and our
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: charge is to essentially keep an ear to the ground
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: for all things that could have an economic impact on
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: the profession. You know, our goal is to make sure
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: that we serve as a conduit to other entities within
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: the AVMA, be it the Board of Directors or other
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: committees or decision making bodies. They'll ask us to weigh
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: in on specific topics, or we can bring specific topics
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: that kind of hit our radar and add some volume
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: to it. The goal being to make sure that if
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: there are things happening that are likely to have an
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: impact on the economic stability of the industry, that we
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: raise awareness about that, whether that's good or bad. So
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: it's such an incredible entity. We've got some great volunteers
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: on there that are leading that the Economics division of
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: the AVMA. They're all just fantastic and what we get
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: to do there is I think invaluable because I've become
• 24:53
  Speaker 3: passionate about the economics of the veterinary profession. We obviously
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: have a lot of changes going on there. I think
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: at the end of the day, we all share in
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: the effort of making sure that no matter what veterinary
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: hospitals look like, no matter what the teams look like,
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: no matter what the exam room looks like, that ultimately
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: we want to make sure that our profession as a
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: whole is economically stable and able to carry on into tomorrow.
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: Because if we're not, then our patients don't get helped
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: and our clients don't get helped.
• 25:23
  Speaker 4: So that's what the VEES does.
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: One of our biggest ways is the Veny Business and
• 25:28
  Speaker 3: Economic Forum.
• 25:30
  Speaker 4: So we're virtual this year, very easy to attend.
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: The VESESE helps provide a lot of guidance in structuring
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: that event, and so so excited about the slate of presenters.
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: We get to roll out the annual economic data and
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: survey data about the state of the profession, so really
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: really huge wealth of information about what's going on within
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: the profession right now, so that practice owners can help
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: adapt and react to that, so that individual providers know
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: what the mindset of their pet owners are and can
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: help meet them. What they're at is they deliver care
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: to the individual patient level. So much that can be
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: gained from that. So very excited to see this year's version.
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: Yes, I love hearing you talking about your involvement, and
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: I think your choice of committee with an ABMA is
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: so fascinating because your early career was shaped by a
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: signipiant economic event, and the committee keeping an ear to
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: the ground is really helping others go into economic conditions
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: more informed. We don't know what's going to happen, it's
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: not in our control, but we can gather the information
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: that we can. We can support each other, and so
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: I just I love that you're giving back in a
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: way that has some personal significance as well.
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: Thank you for that absolutely so. As we sadly come
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: to the close of our conversation here today, Brian, I've
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: enjoyed learning about the different twists and turns and the
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: thought processes behind them. I just want to ask a
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: simple wrap up question for you today. It there's any
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: parting thoughts that you would like to leave with our
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: listeners as you reflect back on your career so far.
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think as kind of hokey as it can sound,
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: have fun with what we do, right, I mean, how
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: exciting and how unique is our profession that every morning
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: you wake up, you get out of bed and get
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: ready for work, and you have no idea what the
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: day is going to bring you, right, you have no
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: idea what that case it's going to walk through the door, is,
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: what that patient's going to be dealing with, what that
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: client's going to be dealing with, that team member, And
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: how cool that we get to play a role in
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: making life better for so many different stakeholders within our profession.
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: And I guess on that note is that at the
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: heart of entery medicine our relationships and to remember that
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: every patient interaction is a relationship builder or a detractor,
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: Every client interaction the same, every teammate and colleague interaction
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: is the same. So you know, you really have to
• 27:54
  Speaker 3: know who's on the other side of whatever that interaction
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: is and understand where they're coming from, their values are,
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: and what their goals are.
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: And that's what.
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: Makes us successful. Even if it's down to the medicine
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: for the patient, you know, the success is determined by
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: what the expectations and goals are in addition to what
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: the challenge we're facing is or whatever the diagnosis is.
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: So yeah, get to know that patient, get to know
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: that client, and get to know that colleague, and everybody
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: will win.
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: AH the formula for success where everybody wins.
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: I love that.
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: I cannot think of a better thing to leave our
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: listeners with. I love that that advice applies regardless of
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: what sector of the profession you're in and to the
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: profession as a whole. So whether you're thinking about it
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: at a big picture of view, with some of these
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: overseeing organizations like AHA, like ABMA, having that value based
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: assessment and clearly defining the goals and what success looks like,
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: we'll get you far regardless of the scenario. And so
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: thank you so much Brian for coming on today sharing
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: your wisdom inspiring us. I can't wait to see what
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: happens next for you and see you at the Business
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: and Economic Forum coming up.
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: Well, thanks for having Menie, it's been a pleasure.
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: And thank you to each of you for joining us
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: on this episode of the My Veterinary Life podcast. We
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: love sharing this journey with you, and remember we want
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: to hear from you, so be sure to leave us
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: a rating and review on Apple Podcasts or whatever platform
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: you listen to, and you can also email me at
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: MVL podcast at AVMA dot org. And if you would
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: like to join us at the Veterinary Business and Economic
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: Forum taking place virtually October seventh and eighth, please visit
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: avmay dot org and head to the events section and
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: registration is open. Take care and we'll see you next time.