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Steph Claire Smith’s Sleep Consultant Controversy · Outspoken the Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Outspoken. It's your dose of the
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: hottest influencer and pop culture news twice a week.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: I'm Kate Torver.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: And I'm Amy Torver. And coming up on today's show,
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Steph Claire Smith is accused of misleading her audience after
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: failing to disclose her partnership with a sleep consultant and
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: Ruby Tuesday Matthews 12-carat marketing masterclass. But first, DoorDash's Mother's
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Day campaign featuring some of Australia's biggest influencers has gone viral.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: The campaign aimed at addressing the mental load mothers carry,
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: even on days like Mother's Day, has already notched up
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: over a million views. Now, in the clip, Indy Clinton
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: is seen hosting a Mother's Day support group with Bec Judd,
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: Ash Pollard and Rhonda Birchmore all in attendance. Let's have
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: a listen. Hello, mothers. This is your safe space. Everything
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: from last Mother's Day, we are leaving in this room.
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: Me?
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: No gift.
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: Nada.
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  Speaker 2: I didn't even get to sleep in on my first
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: Mother's Day.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: And after that, there were no new babies for a
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: very long time, if you know.
• 1:09
  Speaker 3: What I mean.
• 1:10
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, hit her where it hurts. Ash, you look
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: like you've got something to share.
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: I spent six lunar cycles playing a gift-giving manifestation tape
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: to my daughters while they slept.
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: I ended up snapping the f * * * ing
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: thing and buying my own f.
• 1:24
  Speaker 4: * * * ing flowers.
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: Mmm, I feel you.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: I can see how this notched up a million views
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: because it instantly sucked me in It was such an
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: interesting collection of influences as well.
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: They really hit the nail on the head. I think
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: it appealed to a wide audience.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: And they were so good at acting, like especially Bec Judd.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: Like I know they were playing themselves, but geez, she
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: deserves a low key for her performance. Yeah, I've noticed
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: in a couple of clips recently what a good actor
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: she is. And I honestly think if Neighbours were still around,
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: they probably would have signed her up by now. Do
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: you think they were actually taking real life inspo for
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: this clip? Like did Chris Judd actually get her nothing
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: on her first Mother's Day? I actually think that was
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: probably the one that was true. I felt like there
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: was a bit of method acting in that. I mean,
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: I hope Rhonda Birchmore isn't catfishing her daughter on Wednesday.
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: How good was Indy Clinton?
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: There were a few people in the comments saying, oh
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: my God, I didn't realize it was you at the
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: start because your voice is so different.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: And she's like, well, duh, I was acting.
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: She's playing a role. She's the counselor, guys. The only
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: person I feel like that was missing from this clip
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: was Steph Clare Smith. I feel like she could have
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: added a bit of value. Yes, she would have been
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: a great inclusion. Ash Pollard was bloody funny as well.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: I just think it was just an all-star performance. And
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: I would love to know how much they got paid
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: to do that ad. Who do you think got paid
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: the most? I'm guessing Indie because she was the star
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: of the clip. But the reason I think that this
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: video went so viral was because the marketing team at
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: DoorDash hit the nail on the head by asking other
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: mums to talk about the disappointing Mother's Day they had.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: So in the comments, they said, share with us the
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: worst thing that you received on Mother's Day. And that
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: comment section was full.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: Yes, it was.
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: It's funny, we spoke a lot about Mother's Day on
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: our podcast, The Mums Group. So we did a bit
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: of a deep dive into the whole topic. We spoke
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: about expectations because I think they've really shifted in the
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: last couple of years with TikTok.
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: I think there's a lot of pressure. on mums to
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: have a good Mother's Day.
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: And we spoke about how G Bungalow had come out
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: with a reel listing everything that most mums would actually
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: like on Mother's Day. And controversially, it included spending some
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: time away from your children and not visiting your in-laws.
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: I keep getting these videos popping up on my For
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: You page of these mum influencers who they're like, I
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: can't believe these women who are saying that they don't
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: want to see their kids on Mother's Day. It's such
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: poor form. where are we heading? Where are we going?
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: On that, how was your Mother's Day? Did you see
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: your child?
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: I did. I saw Harry the majority of the day.
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: I did get a little bit of a shopping trip
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: in the afternoon with Sophie, which was really lovely. But
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: Dale outdid himself. I think all the boys were a
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: bit scared after listening to that Mother's Day episode that
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: we did on the Mums group. And we're like, shit,
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: we better pull out some good presents. Because All of
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: the husbands did an amazing job. So Dale got me
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: a teddy bear, which was made out of Harry's old
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: sleep suits. And the bear weighs exactly what Harry weighed
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: at birth.
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: I can't believe it.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: I picked up that bear and I was like, surely
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: he didn't weigh this. I suppose because it's distributed differently. Yeah,
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: it's very much in the bear's bum. So it's very disproportionate,
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: but it was so lovely. I didn't even know it
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: was a thing. I've heard of people getting blankets made
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: with the sleep suits, but not a bear. I have
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: to say my husband also excelled. He got me this
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: really cute thing off Etsy. It was like a wooden
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: flower and you get your child.
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: To do the handprint for the flower.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: And it was so cute because when I unwrapped it,
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: Jack was excitedly, oh my God, like he was telling
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: me about how he had done it at his nan
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: and pa's. And then he also got me this jigsaw puzzle.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: It was sort of like three little pieces and they're
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: giraffes because Jack loves giraffes. And then he got me
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: some jumpers. So Very spoiled. I just love the sentimental gifts.
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: I feel like Brandon needs a shout out too. The
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: only disappointing thing is that none of the husbands actually
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: listened to Outspoken. So they're not even going to hear
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: us praising them. But Brandon got Sophie this beautiful watch.
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: I think he tried to find one that looked like
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: a watch that Molly Mae has because he knows how
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: much Sophie loves Molly Mae. When she opened it, it
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: was set to the exact time that Luca was born.
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: And there was this beautiful note attached to it. Anyway,
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: it was beautiful. So the boys really outdid themselves. We
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: didn't have any ammo to go on the DoorDash campaign
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: and add ship presents to the list. No, but I
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: think that is just a sign that if you haven't
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: subscribed to the Mums group, make sure you are subscribed
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: and also make sure your husbands subscribe and listen to
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: that episode because all our husbands had a cheeky listen
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: and they nailed Mother's Day.
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: It's educational.
• 5:46
  Speaker 4: And it just really goes to show that you can
• 5:49
  Speaker 4: upgrade and you can change and you can add.
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: Ruby Tuesday Matthews is the latest influencer to upgrade her
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: engagement ring. Late last week, the 32-year-old wowed her followers
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: by sharing a photo of her new 12-carat rock. While
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: she passed the newest bling off as an early Mother's
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: Day present, there is more to this story than meets
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: the eye, Kate. I mean, talk about putting our sentimental
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: gifts to shame right off the bat. Now, as you
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: can imagine, Ruby's post went viral. And at the time
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  Speaker 1: of recording, it's attracted over 10,000 likes, 130 comments, and
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: over 7,500 shares. Now, alongside a photo of the eye-watering rock,
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: she wrote, Happy Mother's Day to me. Came home from
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: China to an early surprise from Shannon and the kids.
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  Speaker 1: A 12.59 carat diamond I'd been quietly obsessed with. Swiped
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: to the end for the full upgrade timeline. Same man,
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: three engagement rings, still no wedding.
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: But I'm not mad about it. Love you, Dodsey.
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  Speaker 1: Ruby then shared a carousel of images showing off the
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: new ring alongside her two other engagement rings. Now, the
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: majority of commenters were in awe of the rock, with
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: many questioning how much it actually cost. One said, oh my,
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  Speaker 1: is it true it's worth over $ 3 million? If your
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: man bought you a $ 3 million ring, dang, you're doing
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: something right. Another follower begged Ruby for her fiance to
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: have a word with hers, to which Ruby replied, Tell
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: them to contact Dodsey at Tajours. Ha ha. Now, at first,
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  Speaker 1: I was so confused because the post was in complete
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: contradiction to that really relatable wedding update Ruby shared back
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: in February. So just for some background, Ruby has been
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: engaged for five years and she often receives a lot
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: of comments from followers asking, when are you getting married?
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: And in response to that constant questioning, she told her
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  Speaker 1: followers at the start of this year that she would
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: love to have a wedding, but she's currently saving for
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: home renovations and a pool. So it didn't really make
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: sense that she suddenly got this 12-carat rock on her hand.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: And another thing that threw me was the fact that
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: she was so specific about the carrots because normally when
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: influencers show off their ring, they're a bit, you know,
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: coy about how much it is. You have to go
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: digging for that type of information. However, it all makes
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: sense when you discover the missing piece of the puzzle.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: So it turns out that Ruby and her fiancé are
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  Speaker 1: founders of a lab diamond jewelry brand called Taduas, the
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  Speaker 1: very brand tagged in Ruby's post. So it turns out
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  Speaker 1: the very impressive 12 carat upgrade on her finger is
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: also an ad for her business. Yeah. So Tejua's Instagram account,
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: of course, followed suit and they posted their own promotion
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  Speaker 1: of Ruby's ring with the caption, 12.59 carat Oshaka custom cut.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: I hope I'm pronouncing the name of that diamond right.
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: Very hard to hand back once you've tried it on.
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  Speaker 2: Upgrade.
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: Now, I, of course, had a bit of a sticky
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: beak of Chidua's website to.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: See if I could find out how much this ring
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: actually cost.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: And while I couldn't find Ruby's exact ring because it
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: was custom made, I was actually quite taken aback about
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: how inexpensive lab diamonds are. So back when I was
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: looking at wedding bands in 2022, I was told lab
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: diamonds were around a fourth of the price of a
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: real diamond. However, what I've discovered is over the last
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: couple of years, lab diamonds have become dramatically cheaper, especially
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: if they're sold directly to consumers online like to do
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: as do. And the reason why is because there's been
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: this massive increase in production capacity, particularly in India and China.
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: So it's actually estimated prices have dropped between 65% to 80%
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: since 2020. which means lab diamonds are around 75% to 90%
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: cheaper than natural diamonds of the same size and quality.
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: Isn't that insane?
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: Does that make you want them less though? I know
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: that sounds crazy, but the appeal of a diamond is
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: that it's an expensive rock. It's a forever rock. I
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: know these lab diamonds are basically the same thing, but
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: knowing that your ring, if it's a lab diamond, is
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: worth like 90% less than a real diamond is I
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: don't know, does that come into play for people?
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, you've hit the nail on the head.
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: There has been a massive shift in engagement ring culture
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: since lab diamonds have become more readily available because now
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: it's the norm to go onto Instagram and see a
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: post of your friends who you assume earn the same
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: amount of money as you flashing this incredible diamond that
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: you would only ever have seen on an heiress's finger.
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: And you're like, hang on.
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: How are you affording that? But the irony is now
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: when you see someone flashing a massive rock as an
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: engagement ring, you're like, oh, it must be a lab diamond. Oh,
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: it's not actually a real diamond. And I'm wondering now
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: if the trend is going to be smaller engagement rings
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: because it kind of proves that they're actual real diamonds.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: Like it's so interesting because I did a bit of
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: a price comparison. So a well-cut round natural one carat
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: diamond will cost you around.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: $ 5, 000 to $ 8, 000 and.
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: While a lab diamond of the same size is $ 800
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: to $ 1, 500. And then when you're looking at a three-carat
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: natural diamond, that would cost around $ 45, 000 to $ 75, 000. Now,
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: if you get a lab diamond the same, it would
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: be around $ 3, 000 to $ 8, 000. Wait a sec. So how
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: much is Ruby's Ring meant to have cost if it
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: was a real diamond v a lab? So if it
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: was real, my research says it would have cost around
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: $ 500, 000 to $ 2 million.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: Oh my God.
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: Now- Based on Tadua's pricing, it most likely cost around
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: $ 20, 000 to $ 40, 000. So still a very expensive ring, but
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: because she is a founder of the business, it's likely
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: it didn't have any retail marking, obviously.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: So she probably got it for a bit cheaper.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: I think it comes down to now what type of
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: person you are. Like if you like a big ring,
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: then lab diamonds are an amazing fit. But if you're
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: a bit more modest or you don't want a big
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: ring restricting your day-to-day life, Obviously, a smaller ring is
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: the way to go. What I find particularly interesting about
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: this shift is it's really challenging the marketing pillars that
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: the diamond industry was actually historically built on. It always
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: reminds me of the movie How to Lose a Guy
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: in 10 Days. Trust yourself. Because back in 1947, there
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: was this slogan, a diamond is forever. And that is
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: still the most famous advertising campaign in history. And it
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: was so genius because it discouraged people reselling diamonds because
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: And at that time, the diamond industry really used Hollywood
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: celebrities to glamorize diamonds because diamonds actually weren't the done
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: engagement ring. Like you could have other gemstones, but it
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: was only after that campaign that it was like, you
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: must have a diamond. And also to put it in perspective,
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: in 1947, not many people were getting divorced. So there
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: wasn't a big resale market for wedding and engagement rings.
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: No, exactly.
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: But the interesting thing is it's now shifted from, you know,
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: you had Hollywood celebrities glamorizing diamonds. Now we've got influencers
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: like Ruby Tuesday Matthews who are pushing a completely opposite
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: marketing message being that big diamonds now are accessible and
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: upgrades are the norms. And it makes a lot of
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: sense why we're seeing so many influencers upgrade their engagement rings.
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: I assumed it was because they had more money now
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: and they're like, oh, actually I'm going to, you know,
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: get this diamond that I want. But I think it's
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: now a sense of, keeping up with what you're seeing online.
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: So now everyday people are getting these massive rocks and
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: some influencers are like, hang on, I've got to, you know,
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: I've got to compete.
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: I want a big rock.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: It makes a lot of sense because people's taste changes
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: over time as well. So something you might've loved when
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: you were 25, suddenly you're like, and now these beautiful
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: rings are so easily accessible.
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: Well, Ruby really played into this messaging on her Instagram story.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: So a couple of days after she revealed her ring upgrade,
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: She then went on this 10-minute spiel about how Tejua
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: sourced her diamond. And hats off to Ruby because she
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: nailed the marketing messaging. She said, it really goes to
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: show how you can upgrade, change, and add. She then
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: said this.
• 13:38
  Speaker 4: I think there's such huge stigma around, I.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: Wouldn't call it like upgrading.
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: I would call it just like updating your engagement ring.
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: Like we all grow, we all change.
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: Relationships literally grow and change. But What I do love
• 13:55
  Speaker 4: is that every single one has a different story, a
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: different memory attached to it, a different meaning. Like this
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: is obviously the beginning of our relationship. You know, the
• 14:05
  Speaker 4: most special ring to me. Well, this is also the
• 14:08
  Speaker 4: most special ring. I don't know.
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: They're all freaking special.
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: But I just think if you are in the market
• 14:14
  Speaker 4: or you wanting to change your ring, don't change the original.
• 14:18
  Speaker 4: I suggest just getting something different. And in this day
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: and market, if you find the right jeweler, tissues um
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: or the right supplier you can definitely do that at
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: a really reasonable price and it still hold you know
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: everything that you want it to hold aka fat diamond
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: i was so torn after watching ruby's stories because her
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: rings were absolutely stunning and it made me think like
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: oh this is a really cool idea.
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: Like it makes sense to, if you have the means
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: to upgrade your ring and add to them. So it's
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: not like you're getting rid of your original one. You're
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: just getting extra rings.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: But there was a part of me that was like,
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: doesn't this cheapen the whole thing?
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: Because the way she was showing off the rings, they
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: kind of reminded me of, remember when Kim Kardashian got
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: engaged to Chris Humphries and she had that massive rock
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: and then Diva did rip offs of it. It kind
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: of reminded me of that. And I'm thinking, I actually
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: don't really like the look of a, a diamond that big.
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: Like to me, it kind of looks tacky. And I do.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: Think that this potentially could spark, as we mentioned earlier,
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: a move for smaller rings being more sheep. I actually
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: think we might see people turning to different types of
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: stones as well.
• 15:34
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: Because I think so too.
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: You know, there's, There are so many other beautiful rings
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: that people could get like emeralds, that kind of thing,
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: because there's so many question marks now over diamonds. Like, oh,
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: is that real or is that lab or is that,
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: you know? I do want to point out to the
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: women who are listening who have natural diamond engagement rings,
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: please don't despair because the boom in lab diamonds means
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: natural diamonds are actually holding more perceived rarity. So their
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: prices haven't actually collapsed in the same way that lab
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: diamonds have and And I think it's fair to say
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: that natural diamonds are now being viewed more like a
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: rare luxury collectible while lab diamonds are kind of like
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: your high quality luxury tech. So that's a trick if
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: you're listening and you're wanting to propose and you want
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: a lab diamond, don't go too obscene. Just do.
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really good point. Just do a one carat.
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: I'd go two if you're doing lab diamonds or like
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: one and a half. Yeah, I think one and a
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: half is a beautiful size.
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: You've had a sleep consultant in your home for three weeks.
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: Are you done now?
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: Yep. Yep.
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: She's gone home.
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: Steph Claire Smith has been accused of misleading her audience
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: after not disclosing her partnership with a sleep consultant. The
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: fitness mogul aired a 12-minute segment on her Kickbump podcast
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: about her experience with the consultant but failed to disclose
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: the service was gifted.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: A pretty crucial element of this segment. don't you think?
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: I mean, it still baffles me that it was omitted
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: from the original podcast episode, particularly when you consider how
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: sensitive the topic of baby sleep and sleep training is.
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: I just don't get it. Yeah, I don't get it either.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: I listened to this podcast and I thoroughly enjoyed it.
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: And when I heard that this service was gifted, I
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: was like, what the hell? Why didn't you just mention
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: at the start? It's not like it's that big of
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: a deal to say, by the way, guys, I just
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: want to let you know, this was a gifted service.
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: It's been really beneficial for me.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: It would have just been so simple. It would have
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: flowed in conversation.
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: It wouldn't have been that startling considering that she is
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: an influencer.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: She's got over a million followers.
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: And I think, you know, this topic was always going
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: to elicit a strong response from parents because sleep training
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: is quite controversial. But the lack of transparency was literally
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: like waving a red rag to a bull. I mean,
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: it was only after Steph shared a reel promoting the
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: segment in collaboration with the Kickbump podcast, that the nature
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: of the partnership was actually revealed. So a follower commented
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: under the video, can you confirm whether this was a
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: gifted service or not? I've seen numerous influencers promoting the
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: same sleep consultant. Obviously, there are ethical implications if this
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: is undisclosed promotion, especially when it comes to something as
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: sensitive as sleep training. Now, Steph replied saying, of course,
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: Sarah's support was gifted, but there is absolutely no way
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: I would share or recommend it if it's not something
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: I would have paid for or didn't enjoy. Anything I
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: recommend on here is something I would recommend to my
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: closest friends offline. I'd never platform anything I didn't genuinely
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: stand by. Now, another follower replied, writing, It is concerning
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: that not once was this mentioned in the podcast.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: No doubt this breached ACCC regulations.
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: Now, in terms of the regulations, the ACCC has explicitly
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: said influencers need to disclose when they receive free products, tickets,
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: or any other gifts or incentives in exchange for promotion.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: So this includes podcast advertising as well as social media.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: And it's interesting because the whole premise of the kickbump
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: episode was that Steph and Laura were providing a very
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: personal update to their audience about their children's sleep. I mean,
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: it was literally called Steph and Laura unpack their nighttime routines.
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: And at the start of the segment, it sounded really
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: legit because Steph mentioned that this sleep consultant was recommended
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: by her friend, who happens to be fellow influencer Jade Tunchi. Yeah,
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: and she went on this spiel about how she wanted
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: to share her experience because originally she thought it was
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: a bit of a weird concept to have someone come
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: into your home and stay there, but she was so
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: glad that she did it because her daughter, Billie, now
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: sleeps 12 hours overnight.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: And the review was absolutely glowing.
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: She also went into depth about other services that the
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: sleep service consultant offers so you can do an in-home thing,
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: you can do an over-the-phone consult. Maybe that should have
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: been a red flag when we heard that another influencer
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: had recommended it. Like I love Jade Tunchi, but the
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: fact that someone like that had recommended it makes you think, oh, well,
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: she obviously got that gifted too. Well, the sleep consultant
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: in question is Swoop Baby. And I am very familiar
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: with them because literally every influencer talks about them. So
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: it was only fairly recently that Sarah's Day had Sarah
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: from Swoop Baby stay at her house. Lauren Simpson has
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: also spoken about her. And it was a couple of
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: years ago that Indy Clinton spoke about using Swoop Baby
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: for her daughter Bambi. And at the time, she had
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: to come out and say, actually, no, I paid for
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: the service. But there's a few question marks over the
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: other influencers and what their relationship was. I can see
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: why there was a lot of confusion because In my opinion,
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: this endorsement, and that's what it was, an endorsement, was
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: really cleverly weaved into an editorial style conversation. So it
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: came across as this very authentic and personal opinion from
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: Steph rather than advertising. And that's why people are upset
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: because this type of conduct is considered particularly problematic by
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: the ACCC because it is very misleading. And when determining
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: a breach, the ACCC consider whether a reasonable listener would
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: assume the endorsement was completely independent and unpaid. Now, Amy,
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: I would consider us to be quite savvy in the
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: influencer and marketing space.
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: And I didn't even think... this must be gifted. I
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: just assumed that she paid for it herself.
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: No, as you said, it came across as just, she
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: was telling a story about everyday life. You would never
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: have assumed that she was gifted the service.
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: And if the ACCC were to investigate this, another thing
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: that they would try and determine is whether the sleep
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: consultant service was provided with the expectation of publicity or promotion.
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: So that's something that we can't determine ourselves. But if
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: the answer to both of those questions is yes, then
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: Steph's conduct could be considered misleading or deceptive under Australian
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: consumer law. It's important to note though, the ACCC act
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: only as watchdogs. So they can investigate someone's conduct and
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: they can issue warnings and infringements and take someone to court,
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: but they don't actually have the power from a legal
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: sense to determine whether someone broke the law. That determination
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: is normally made by a court. So recently we spoke
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: on the podcast about how the ACCC had issued this
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: unprecedented fine against a photo book company. Now, that actually
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: didn't go to court. That was just an infringement that
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: the ACCC passed on to the advertiser. So if Steph
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: does get investigated, she potentially could be fined as well
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: as Swoop Baby. That's what's crazy about this whole story
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: is that the ACCC has been in the headlines recently.
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: It's a front and centre of people's minds that influence
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: this are running the risk of being fined large amounts
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: of money and also these different companies. So while I'd
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: love to give Steph the benefit of the doubt because
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: I know she's a hardworking mum, I don't know if
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: she specifically went out there to manipulate people or pull
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: the wool over their eyes. I don't know if she
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: went out there purposely to mislead people, but surely there
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: are members of the Kik team that would have known
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: about this story. There's producers that oversee this. At no
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: stage did anyone think, wait a sec, Maybe we should
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: mention that this was gifted. Were the team aware that
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: this was gifted?
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: I mean, there's also an onus on the brand.
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: They also need to operate under the ACCC's guidelines. It
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: was interesting because Steph responded to the follower who accused
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: her of breaching the ACCC's regulations. And she wrote, hello,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: appreciate you reminding me of this. And I'd like to
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: apologize to anyone who may have felt misled in any way.
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: There was a line in the podcast description that upon
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: reflection was not clear enough. We have updated this now.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: then she put in brackets, may take time to update
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: across all apps. And I've also recorded a paragraph to
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: be embedded in the episode audio itself, which our producer
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: is updating now. Thank you again. I, of course, will
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: be much more conscious of this moving forward. Now, the
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: podcast episode blurb was updated to include the following disclosure,
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: which read, disclosure, Steph worked with Sarah from Sweet Baby.
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: This service was gifted, but all opinions are her own.
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: And then this audio was inserted into the episode.
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: Hey guys, just a heads up from me, full disclosure,
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: Sarah's service was gifted and whilst there was no requirement
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: for me to post in return for the service, I
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: wanted to be transparent about that. All opinions I share
• 24:16
  Speaker 3: are of course my own and I would never recommend
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: or share anything, regardless of whether it was paid for
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: or not, that I wouldn't recommend to my closest friends
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: offline or pay for myself.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: I just wanted to make that really clear.
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: Look, I think it's good that they tried to correct
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: the issue once concerns were raised, but from a podcasting perspective,
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: most of the downloads happen the first day the podcast
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: is aired. And once an episode is downloaded, you have
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: to manually update it in order to get the refreshed version.
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: I mean, we've had that issue where we've had an
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: error in the podcast and we're like, damn it, most
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: people are going to hear it with the error, even
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: if you've re-uploaded a new version. So I think a
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: lot of the damage would have already been done, It'll
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: be interesting to see if they address it in their
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: new kick-bump episode. Now, that might be out by the
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: time this episode drops. I'm guessing maybe they will. Or
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: if they do, it shows you how panicked they are
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: about it.
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: I don't think they will because they pre-record episodes.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: I mean, I suppose they could jump in and, you know,
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: insert something into it, but it will be interesting. I mean,
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: the thing is, even though they've tried to correct it,
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: it doesn't actually necessarily erase the original issue. I think
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: the ACCC will probably still investigate it. I personally thought
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: the response from Steph was quite poor, being like, oh,
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: thank you for bringing it to my attention. I was like,
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: you've been an influencer for 10 years. The recent ACCC
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: ruling has been in the headlines. It's your job as
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: an influencer to know what the guidelines are that you
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: need to follow. I actually don't think it was that
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: bad because I think a lot of influencers, and Kate,
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: I'm sure you can think of a few, they just
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: wouldn't have responded to the comment and would have just
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: left it how it was. At least she's gone and said, look,
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: I did the wrong thing. I'm sorry. She apologized. And
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: then it's gone to rectify the issue. Look, I agree
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: that I think her response since the issue was pointed
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: out was good, but I'm sorry, it's a complete cop-out
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: to say, oh, well, you know, at least she apologized
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: over it. Well, at least she apologized for potentially being deceptive.
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's quite unethical when you consider
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: that the target audience is new parents who will literally.
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: Do anything to get sleep.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: So you You're promoting this service that might I add
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: costs thousands of dollars. So when I looked into it,
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: a remote package from this sleep consultant costs $ 1, 200. Now,
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: if you do the in-home package that Steph was gifted,
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: it's $ 1, 650 a.
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: Night, $ 4, 500 for.
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: Three nights and $ 6, 750 for five nights. So that is
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: a lot of financial gain that Steph is getting from
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: that sleep consultant. In the scheme of things, Steph's a multimillionaire.
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: Like that's nothing for her. Like she could afford to
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: do that herself. The person that's actually gaining is the
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: sleep consultant. That's the person who has probably got a
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: lot of value out of this podcast episode. That's why
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: I'm so confused by it. Like why wouldn't Steph just
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: disclose it? Is this like she's just dropped the ball?
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: But doesn't that make it worse?
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: If you're a multimillionaire who could just afford to pay
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: for this service, then why have you slipped it into
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: your podcast and potentially been misleading to a vulnerable audience?
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: I mean, also the fact is, Most of the people
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: listening wouldn't be able to afford this service. I just
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: think it shows the lack of care from influencers in
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: regards to the ACCC's rules. Like, I don't think that
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: they even take it on board, some of them. I
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: just think it's this, I don't think that they think
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: anything serious will happen. But that's not true. As we've
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: seen in recent times, there are going to be a
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: lot of influencers who are copping huge fines for careless
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: errors like this.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: Well, that is where we're going to leave things today.
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: But if you want to hear more from us, we
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: drop a subscriber-only episode every every Thursday for our Outspoken
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: Plus subscribers. If you want to sign up, it's just
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: $ 5. 99 a month. All the details to sign up are
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: in our show notes. We also have a second podcast
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: called The Mums Group. So if you want to listen
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: to that, that drops on a Wednesday. Just search The
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: Mums Group on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: to podcasts. This podcast was recorded on the traditional land
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: of the Kaurna people of the Adelaide Plains. We pay
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: respect to elders past and present.