Latest / Stuff Mom Never Told You / Making Space for Being Ace

Transcript

Making Space for Being Ace · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I'm not kind of stuff.
0:07
Speaker 1: I never told you production of iHeartRadio, and today we
0:20
Speaker 1: are going to be doing kind of an update on
0:23
Speaker 1: my experience of being a sexual and being out as
0:27
Speaker 1: being a sexual or ace because I always forget October
0:32
Speaker 1: is LGBTQ plus history month. So I knew June was
0:36
Speaker 1: Pride month. But when I was in college, I was
0:39
Speaker 1: in Atlanta. This was still when I was communiting from
0:42
Speaker 1: de Lanaga, which is like an hour away, and I
0:45
Speaker 1: ended up accidentally in the pride parade in October and
0:50
Speaker 1: I didn't know what was going on because I thought
0:52
Speaker 1: June was Pride month and that's when that happens. And
0:54
Speaker 1: I got all of this glitter on my car and
0:56
Speaker 1: all of these feathers on my car, and it was
0:58
Speaker 1: actually a lovely experience, but I was soused. I've learned
1:01
Speaker 1: a lot since then. I've come a long way.
1:05
Speaker 2: Oh man, I'm with you, because again, not growing up
1:07
Speaker 2: in like very queer community understanding is in fact, I
1:12
Speaker 2: was in a pretty anti queer community until I was
1:15
Speaker 2: out of college. But like, I didn't realize it either,
1:18
Speaker 2: and I thought it was always October because when I
1:21
Speaker 2: was like when I finally like understood what's going on.
1:24
Speaker 2: All the celebrations that I went to was in October,
1:27
Speaker 2: including the Priparade, and I was like oh, And then
1:30
Speaker 2: learning that I was like, wait, no, this is not actually
1:31
Speaker 2: Pride Month? What's that? What what's happening?
1:34
Speaker 1: So I had the opposite, Oh, that's fun. Well we've
1:38
Speaker 1: both come a long way. Then come a long way, baby,
1:41
Speaker 1: we have. So this money is going to be a
1:46
Speaker 1: lot of me talking, which is good because Samantha is
1:48
Speaker 1: still recovering from COVID so you get to hear me
1:52
Speaker 1: talk a lot. I might cry a little, I don't know.
1:55
Speaker 1: Speaking of content warning for discussions of rape, sexual assault, ableism,
2:01
Speaker 1: and suicidality. We're not going to go too in depth
2:04
Speaker 1: into anything, but some of it's pretty I would say
2:08
Speaker 1: it was pretty triggering. And I do want to put
2:11
Speaker 1: this at the top. I sort of hate that this happens,
2:14
Speaker 1: but it does. We're talking about ace stuff in here,
2:18
Speaker 1: but all queer people face similar things. This is not
2:21
Speaker 1: to detract attention from or say that it doesn't happen
2:26
Speaker 1: to other people. It's it does. It absolutely doesn't. We
2:30
Speaker 1: should talk about that, but for this I am talking
2:33
Speaker 1: about my kind of personal experience. So yes, it is
2:40
Speaker 1: LGBTQ plus History month, and October also has National Coming
2:44
Speaker 1: Out Day and ACE Awareness Week, which is the last
2:47
Speaker 1: week of October. It was first started in October twenty ten,
2:51
Speaker 1: and I wanted to do a bit of an update
2:53
Speaker 1: on my experience since coming out on this podcast. Honestly,
2:57
Speaker 1: that's where I happened. But because the book has come
3:02
Speaker 1: out and I came out and there, I sort of
3:05
Speaker 1: feel like I came out again and it's been a
3:08
Speaker 1: lot difficult for me. I have gotten a lot of support,
3:15
Speaker 1: I will say that, but I've definitely gotten a lot
3:17
Speaker 1: of what I talked about in the book, which is
3:19
Speaker 1: a lot of like mocking and dismissing, And I've also
3:22
Speaker 1: gotten a lot of questions about it people who are
3:23
Speaker 1: legitimately curious. So I thought I would just go over
3:27
Speaker 1: some basics here first of all, like we're gonna go
3:31
Speaker 1: over this, but I identify as asexual, bi romantic. There
3:38
Speaker 1: are you have your sexual orientation and then there's the
3:40
Speaker 1: romantic orientation. I think a lot of people don't know that,
3:43
Speaker 1: so they get confused. Recently, Lauren and I did Lauren
3:48
Speaker 1: stepped in and did an episode while Samantha was on
3:51
Speaker 1: vacation and Lauren and I were in a box and
3:53
Speaker 1: lost Bicus interesting box talking about the X Files when
4:00
Speaker 1: people write in and they were confused because they're like,
4:02
Speaker 1: you were attracted to Scullum Holder, but you're asexual. I
4:06
Speaker 1: can feel attraction. It doesn't have to be sexual, especially
4:10
Speaker 1: for fictional characters, especially if I like have an emotional
4:16
Speaker 1: if there's something about them that I emotionally relate to
4:19
Speaker 1: or connect to, then I feel the attraction. It's usually
4:22
Speaker 1: not sexual most of the time. Like if in my
4:24
Speaker 1: fantasies of fantasies, I would like hug Luke Skywalker, like
4:28
Speaker 1: that is what happens. It's not sex, but she.
4:31
Speaker 2: Just wants to cuddle them.
4:32
Speaker 1: Okay, I want to cuddle and maybe kiss. That's it.
4:35
Speaker 1: That's that's all. I'm blushing just thinking about it. So
4:41
Speaker 1: I get that. It's I'm not like trying to make
4:44
Speaker 1: anybody feel bad because I didn't know this until I
4:47
Speaker 1: was on the show. I've told that story several times,
4:49
Speaker 1: so I get I totally get it. So let us
4:53
Speaker 1: go over some basics. So from see you and why
4:58
Speaker 1: I'm assuming that you say the letters, I don't know.
5:01
Speaker 1: Here's a quote. Asexuality has been defined as a sexual
5:05
Speaker 1: orientation characterized by persistent lack of sexual attraction to any gender.
5:11
Speaker 1: It is often called the invisible orientation, and while the
5:15
Speaker 1: current estimate is that about one percent of the population
5:17
Speaker 1: is ACE, some think that's on the low end because
5:20
Speaker 1: people either don't know about it or they don't feel
5:22
Speaker 1: comfortable labeling themselves that way for one reason or another.
5:27
Speaker 1: From the James Madison University, The asexuality spectrum, or ACE
5:31
Speaker 1: umbrella is also complicated. The ACE umbrella covers many different
5:36
Speaker 1: types and degrees of sexuality. There are three most common
5:39
Speaker 1: subsections of asexuality demisexual, gray sexual, and asexual. The simplest
5:45
Speaker 1: of the three is asexual, which means that one is
5:47
Speaker 1: not sexually attracted to people. Demisexual is similar to asexual,
5:52
Speaker 1: and that demisexuals are not sexually attracted to people until
5:55
Speaker 1: a deep emotional connection is formed. Gray asexuals, on the
5:59
Speaker 1: other hand, experience sexual attraction very irregularly, sometimes with years
6:03
Speaker 1: in between occurrences. It's also worth mentioning that some asexuals
6:07
Speaker 1: are willing to have sex in order to please or
6:09
Speaker 1: become closer to their partners and These individuals are referred
6:12
Speaker 1: to as sex favorable. Others are unwilling to have sex
6:16
Speaker 1: or are disturbed by it and are referred to as
6:19
Speaker 1: sex repulsed. And I know we've talked about this before
6:23
Speaker 1: in other episodes about asexuality, alloseexuals or aloes or people
6:27
Speaker 1: who experience sexual attraction. So I think this is important
6:31
Speaker 1: here where people get confused, and I've probably not communicated
6:34
Speaker 1: it well. When I say I'm attracted to people, usually
6:36
Speaker 1: what I do mean is the cuddling and kissing part.
6:38
Speaker 1: I don't mean like the the sex part. Some people
6:42
Speaker 1: have written and so it sounds like you're dimisexual, but
6:46
Speaker 1: it's not. I wouldn't call it a sexual attraction. It
6:48
Speaker 1: is a physical attraction. I'm like, oh, pretty, I would
6:51
Speaker 1: like to hold close now please, But it's not like
6:56
Speaker 1: a sexual.
6:58
Speaker 2: You're like an alien argy you speak, So we're gonna
7:02
Speaker 2: I would like to touch that, please, We're.
7:04
Speaker 1: Gonna talk about that. I'm playing into the stereotype. Oto.
7:09
Speaker 1: So here's a quote from Growth think Tank. Asexuality is
7:14
Speaker 1: a spectrum, which means that all asexual people and their
7:16
Speaker 1: experience of asexuality are different, and that it affects people
7:19
Speaker 1: of all ages, genders, and backgrounds. For example, some asexual people,
7:23
Speaker 1: the sex positives, may have sex without it necessarily giving
7:26
Speaker 1: them pleasure or constituting a need to have a child
7:29
Speaker 1: out of curiosity to please the partner, a bit like
7:32
Speaker 1: eating without being hungry. Some asexual people consider themselves to
7:36
Speaker 1: have a libido but is not directed towards a particular partner.
7:40
Speaker 1: They are called sex positive. Others reject sex, identifying themselves
7:44
Speaker 1: as sex repulsed. Finally, some people feel only indifferent to sex,
7:48
Speaker 1: the sex neutral or sex and different. Most asexuals experience
7:52
Speaker 1: romantic attraction to others and may therefore be in a relationship.
7:56
Speaker 1: A romantic asexuals, on the other hand, have no desire
7:59
Speaker 1: to sex and no desire to be in a relationship. Finally,
8:03
Speaker 1: some asexuals have never had sexual desire or relationships, while
8:07
Speaker 1: others have had sexual desire and then identified themselves as
8:10
Speaker 1: a sexual later in life. Asexual people are often referred
8:14
Speaker 1: to as ace and a romantic people as arrow. The
8:18
Speaker 1: ace of spades has thus become one of the symbols
8:21
Speaker 1: of the asexual community, as has cake, in reference to
8:24
Speaker 1: the phrase cake is better than sex.
8:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, I knew that one.
8:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought about getting that flag putting it up,
8:35
Speaker 1: but I don't like cake that much, so it's sort
8:37
Speaker 1: of like if it was, like why you.
8:41
Speaker 2: Don't even like that?
8:43
Speaker 1: No, there's sure, I guess. But oysters. Oh my gosh,
8:52
Speaker 1: Samantha and I are going to get oysters later. I'm
8:54
Speaker 1: so excited. So going back to the James Madison universe,
9:00
Speaker 1: here's another quote. Two major misconceptions are that asexuals are
9:06
Speaker 1: celibate and that asexuality is a choice. This is equivalent
9:09
Speaker 1: to saying being straight are gay as decisions someone makes.
9:12
Speaker 1: The misconception that asexuality is a choice belittles those who
9:15
Speaker 1: identify on the asexuality spectrum. Another common misconception is that
9:19
Speaker 1: asexuals cannot fall in love. This misconception is a result
9:23
Speaker 1: of people confusing or failing to understand the difference between
9:26
Speaker 1: romantic orientation insexual orientation. Lastly, one of the most damaging
9:31
Speaker 1: and harmful misconceptions about asexuality is that asexual people are
9:35
Speaker 1: simply confused and inexperienced, and they will change their minds
9:39
Speaker 1: once they've had sexual experiences. Not only does this viewpoint
9:43
Speaker 1: dismiss asexuality, but it also perpetuates rape culture and corrective
9:47
Speaker 1: rape yes misconceptions. Aside, there is even more active and
9:52
Speaker 1: voluntary discrimination against those who identify on the asexual spectrum.
9:56
Speaker 1: Many people do not see asexual people as humans because
9:59
Speaker 1: peop beve that sexual desire is a fundamental part of
10:02
Speaker 1: human nature. In actuality, asexual people are judged, insulted, and
10:06
Speaker 1: in some cases, assaulted because of their sexual identity. Heartbreakingly,
10:10
Speaker 1: a marriage can legally be terminated if a perfectly happy
10:13
Speaker 1: and loving couple does not have sex, and, as surprising
10:16
Speaker 1: as it seems, couples in which one or both partners
10:18
Speaker 1: are asexual can be denied adoption rights even if they
10:21
Speaker 1: are not a same sex couple. Asexuals can also be
10:24
Speaker 1: denied housing and jobs because of their sexual orientation. Much
10:27
Speaker 1: like the rest of the LGBTQ plus community, the asexual
10:30
Speaker 1: community is also subject to mockery for their sexual identity.
10:36
Speaker 1: And then here's something specific to the medical community. Quote.
10:42
Speaker 1: All of this is heart wrenching, but there are still
10:44
Speaker 1: worse forms of discrimination that asexuals face. Discrimination by healthcare
10:48
Speaker 1: professionals is not uncommon. Many professionals believe that asexuality is
10:52
Speaker 1: a mental disorder or a symptom of an illness, mental
10:55
Speaker 1: or physical. Others have been prescribed corrective therapies such as
10:59
Speaker 1: hormone supplement. Its instructed quote to have sex until they
11:03
Speaker 1: like it. One example a lot of people pointed out
11:06
Speaker 1: was the case of Julie Decker. So here's a quote
11:09
Speaker 1: about that. Julie Decker was subjected to this fate by
11:13
Speaker 1: a friend of hers and her statement to huf Posts
11:15
Speaker 1: she disclosed that her friend knew she identified as asexual,
11:19
Speaker 1: even so he looked her face and said, I just
11:21
Speaker 1: want to help you. Decker went on to receive comments
11:24
Speaker 1: to her story like I could turn sexual, just give
11:27
Speaker 1: me an hour, and you are autistic. You are broken.
11:31
Speaker 1: She has even received rape and death threats such as, man,
11:34
Speaker 1: I want this chick to get raped, please die of aids. Thanks,
11:37
Speaker 1: I'm going to rape this one day and show her
11:39
Speaker 1: the joys of orgasm. Just kill yourself, please in a
11:42
Speaker 1: very painful way. And asexuals are just people who haven't
11:46
Speaker 1: been raped hard are often enough these anonymous comments and
11:49
Speaker 1: a powerful message about what is valued in terms of
11:52
Speaker 1: sex and sexuality. And then here's another quote from that
11:55
Speaker 1: huff Post article. Asexuality is not a thing. You're just
11:59
Speaker 1: ugly and no one wanted to date you, so you
12:02
Speaker 1: made up a thing to cuddle your lonely self off
12:04
Speaker 1: to you cry into your pillow. Also, I hope you
12:06
Speaker 1: get raped. It has a dual benefit. You'll get laid
12:08
Speaker 1: finally and put into your place as well. So so
12:14
Speaker 1: there are some I laugh because I want to cry.
12:18
Speaker 1: There are some specific types of abuse that were outlined. Again,
12:23
Speaker 1: these are not specifically unique to asexual people, but they
12:26
Speaker 1: are in this case things that a sexual people face
12:30
Speaker 1: a lot. This is trum Women's Law dot org. Saying
12:33
Speaker 1: there is something wrong with a victim, or that the
12:35
Speaker 1: victim is broken because they are asexual. Telling a victim
12:38
Speaker 1: that something is wrong with their body and that is
12:40
Speaker 1: why they are a sexual. Oh and I should have
12:42
Speaker 1: specified these are all about sexual assault victims who are
12:45
Speaker 1: asexual Mocking the victim's body or making the victim feel
12:48
Speaker 1: bad about their body, responding or not responding to sexual acts,
12:52
Speaker 1: touching the victim's body without permission or in the way
12:55
Speaker 1: or in a way the abuser knows makes the victim uncomfortable,
12:58
Speaker 1: threatening the victim with rape or sexual assault to cure
13:01
Speaker 1: the victims asexuality, telling the victim that they are a
13:04
Speaker 1: sexual or are confused about being a sexual because no
13:07
Speaker 1: one wants to have a relationship or sex with them,
13:10
Speaker 1: threatening to tell the victims friends, family, or coworkers about
13:12
Speaker 1: their a sexuality without their permission, and stopping ore forbidding
13:16
Speaker 1: the victim from speaking to other asexual people talking about asexuality,
13:20
Speaker 1: are attending in person or online support groups for asexual people.
13:25
Speaker 1: And then here's a quote from Gallop. The little but
13:29
Speaker 1: growing research that there is in this area has uncovered
13:32
Speaker 1: strong bias against ace people relative to cis gender and
13:35
Speaker 1: heterosexual people, and even to cis gender, lesbian, gay, and
13:38
Speaker 1: bisexual people. Asexual people were found to be the target
13:41
Speaker 1: of more prejudice, avoidance, and discrimination if all the sexual
13:45
Speaker 1: minorities studied, as people were the most dehumanized, viewed as
13:49
Speaker 1: machine like, cold and emotionless. This demonstrates the need to
13:53
Speaker 1: address anti asexual bias and that ase people are at
13:56
Speaker 1: the risk of experiencing violence, abuse, discrimination. And then they
14:01
Speaker 1: went on to say here's some things they found that
14:04
Speaker 1: people thought about asexual people. They are less than human
14:09
Speaker 1: or against human nature, they are deficient or broken, that
14:12
Speaker 1: it is a result of mental illness or sexual abuse,
14:15
Speaker 1: have not just met the right person yet, are confused
14:19
Speaker 1: or going through a phase, cannot experience love and I
14:22
Speaker 1: have relationships. Are just proves that asexuality is a choice
14:27
Speaker 1: rather than an orientation, don't face oppression, and are just
14:31
Speaker 1: damaging the LGBT plus cause. And I did want to
14:35
Speaker 1: point out too, we're not really talking about it here,
14:39
Speaker 1: but many people get discriminated against in one way or another,
14:44
Speaker 1: and the romantic spectrum and especially arrow people a romantic people.
14:49
Speaker 1: So just something to keep in mind.
14:52
Speaker 2: Actually, that's something that I've heard dismissed by people that
14:55
Speaker 2: I know. I was kind of surprised and they're like
14:58
Speaker 2: really open minded mind is like they are, they would
15:01
Speaker 2: call themselves allies. And then having that whole rhetoric which
15:05
Speaker 2: we had twenty years ago about bisexuality that it's just uh,
15:10
Speaker 2: it's made up or that they can't decide so they're
15:14
Speaker 2: just putting a label on it, which is interesting in itself,
15:17
Speaker 2: Like I'm like, wow, so this is that new form
15:19
Speaker 2: where now bisexuality is getting more acceptance, still not completely accepted.
15:23
Speaker 2: We know that there's a lot of discriminations bisexuality, but
15:26
Speaker 2: it's a whole new kind of like, Oh, it's just
15:28
Speaker 2: one more thing they're adding to that spectrum, which I
15:33
Speaker 2: found interesting. I was like, why does that bother you?
15:35
Speaker 2: Has nothing to do with you?
15:36
Speaker 1: That's kind of my whole sigm this. I'm like, I'm
15:39
Speaker 1: essentially I stay in and read my friend section, Like
15:43
Speaker 1: what am I doing?
15:44
Speaker 2: Like she is a lovely person to be around all
15:47
Speaker 2: the time, Like there's no like I don't understand.
15:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have seen I've seen a lot against arrow
15:54
Speaker 1: people prejudice because people are like that doesn't that's again
15:59
Speaker 1: like as human nature.
16:01
Speaker 2: It's such a weird vibe, Like it's not like I know,
16:04
Speaker 2: it seems like there's a less of a problem when
16:06
Speaker 2: you call it, like for people to call out their
16:08
Speaker 2: friends who are rapist or like misogynists, Like I've seen that,
16:13
Speaker 2: like when we have that conversation where people don't want
16:15
Speaker 2: to believe that so many people could be someone who
16:18
Speaker 2: would assault someone because I mean that the likelihood of
16:21
Speaker 2: them knowing somebody is so high that they don't want
16:24
Speaker 2: to believe that. But like and so they're therefore they
16:28
Speaker 2: accept that as a thing and being like, oh no,
16:30
Speaker 2: we're gonna pretend like that doesn't think even though it
16:32
Speaker 2: violates people they're gonna they're gonna like not see that
16:36
Speaker 2: and being like, oh, no, it's not a problem, and
16:39
Speaker 2: then see this as a problem when it really is
16:42
Speaker 2: the opposite of that, like they're living their happy goal,
16:45
Speaker 2: looky lives. I don't understand right why that's affecting you.
16:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we did talk about this in our one
16:54
Speaker 1: of our Ace or past Ace episodes. But I do
16:58
Speaker 1: get especially with the like men kind of being douchebags
17:04
Speaker 1: in a lot of dating situations for women not I
17:08
Speaker 1: don't know, but there is there has been a history
17:11
Speaker 1: of men being like, oh, I don't want the emotional part.
17:16
Speaker 1: So I think that's getting twisted up with people who
17:18
Speaker 1: are truly arrow and I get that in terms of
17:24
Speaker 1: people who have been burned by that before. But I
17:27
Speaker 1: think that's part of the issue is there's no visibility
17:31
Speaker 1: and when people say that, they are immediately dismissed. I'm
17:34
Speaker 1: not saying there aren't bad players, because there absolutely are
17:36
Speaker 1: in asexuals, a romantics, there are everywhere.
17:40
Speaker 2: But for people to dismiss a whole group of people
17:43
Speaker 2: in the communities just because you don't like it or
17:46
Speaker 2: it confuses you, and it's not confusing it's confusing when
17:49
Speaker 2: you think you have one assumption of it and then
17:51
Speaker 2: you get corrected and it's no longer confusing, Like you
17:54
Speaker 2: learn your things. That's great. Like for me, I definitely
17:57
Speaker 2: had a misunderstanding, and coming through I was like, oh,
17:59
Speaker 2: because I think I called up I said something to
18:01
Speaker 2: you like oh, you're this right, and you're like, no, oh.
18:05
Speaker 1: Okay, I did I did.
18:07
Speaker 2: It took you a myth to be like no, that's
18:08
Speaker 2: not quite what that is.
18:09
Speaker 1: Like, let's see, that's the thing is Like, like I said,
18:13
Speaker 1: I didn't know either. It's fine to not.
18:15
Speaker 2: Know, but I didn't get offended by that. There's exactly
18:19
Speaker 2: being wrong doesn't mean that you have to fight it,
18:21
Speaker 2: like no, I can't be wrong, but this doesn't exist
18:23
Speaker 2: what right?
18:24
Speaker 1: And I feel like a lot of this does go
18:26
Speaker 1: back to what we've been talking about, what we have
18:29
Speaker 1: talked about of the like if someone's upfront with you
18:33
Speaker 1: and they say they're whatever orientation romantic or sexual, and
18:37
Speaker 1: then later you're like, oh, really, Like if they were
18:41
Speaker 1: upfront with you, then I don't I don't feel like
18:45
Speaker 1: you should feel that you are going to change them
18:48
Speaker 1: or that they have betrayed you in some way, or
18:50
Speaker 1: that they're lying, Like I don't, that's not I I
18:54
Speaker 1: was somebody who didn't know for a while and I
18:56
Speaker 1: was in relationships and I didn't know. That's a different thing.
18:58
Speaker 1: But like if somebody tells you, you know, if we're
19:01
Speaker 1: going to be in this relationship, this is this is
19:03
Speaker 1: who I am, this is how I feel, this is
19:05
Speaker 1: what and then later you're like, oh, really you you what?
19:11
Speaker 1: Don't do that?
19:13
Speaker 2: I mean that's good for anything. And like you said
19:16
Speaker 2: about the relationship, because including like I don't want children
19:19
Speaker 2: believe them.
19:20
Speaker 1: Yes, you can come back and have that conversation later.
19:23
Speaker 1: People can change. But if somebody says something that you
19:27
Speaker 1: shouldn't just be like, oh I will change you. Right,
19:30
Speaker 1: they can change on their own. Maybe you can change
19:33
Speaker 1: on your own maybe, and then you have that conversation again,
19:36
Speaker 1: but you don't try to change them or not believe
19:40
Speaker 1: what they said.
19:40
Speaker 2: Right, So it's not you when it doesn't fall when
19:43
Speaker 2: it falls.
19:43
Speaker 1: Apart exactly exactly. So we are going to go into
20:01
Speaker 1: some disturbing comments right here because we're going to talk
20:03
Speaker 1: about some aphobia stuff, which I learned. There's like four
20:05
Speaker 1: words for asphobia, but most people know is phobia. So
20:08
Speaker 1: this is what we're going with. So one of the
20:09
Speaker 1: big misconceptions is an asexual person can never really be raped.
20:14
Speaker 1: That's not true. Here's a quote that BuzzFeed had an
20:18
Speaker 1: article about this. In the twenty fifteen a Sexual Community Census,
20:22
Speaker 1: a volunteer run project, forty three point five percent of
20:24
Speaker 1: nearly eight thousand aces surveyed reported having experienced some form
20:28
Speaker 1: of sexual violence, including rape, assault, and corrosion, and we
20:32
Speaker 1: know those are usually under reported. Here's another quote from that.
20:39
Speaker 1: Coming out to strangers as a sexual or even friends, family,
20:41
Speaker 1: and partners is no small thing. People wrongly take it
20:44
Speaker 1: as an invitation to suggest you haven't found the right
20:47
Speaker 1: person yet, ask invasive questions about whether you're you've orgasmed
20:51
Speaker 1: an assert that they're the one who can fix you
20:54
Speaker 1: if only you'd wizen up and let them try. One
20:57
Speaker 1: question in particular comes up often, especially for the those
21:00
Speaker 1: who have survived sexual violence. Are you asexual because you
21:03
Speaker 1: were assaulted? Aces also fight the misconception that they can't
21:08
Speaker 1: be assaulted because they're never in sexual scenarios to begin with.
21:12
Speaker 1: If you're not sexually attracted to people, you're not in
21:14
Speaker 1: those situations to be sexually assaulted. So you know, are
21:17
Speaker 1: there even a sexual victims? Devin said, parroting a generalization
21:21
Speaker 1: she's heard, which obviously there are. You don't need to
21:25
Speaker 1: be in a sexual situation to be a victim or
21:27
Speaker 1: a survivor. Plus many aces do sometimes pursue romance and sex.
21:32
Speaker 2: I feel like people don't understand what sexual assault, or
21:35
Speaker 2: well what that is in general, to think that you
21:38
Speaker 2: have to be in a situation that's right, pursued to
21:41
Speaker 2: be sexy, like to be.
21:45
Speaker 1: What it's bizarre. It feels like a very is this
21:50
Speaker 1: all men?
21:50
Speaker 2: Is this what men say? Because I can't imagine.
21:54
Speaker 1: I mean, I would guess, but I don't have the
21:56
Speaker 1: numbers in front of me. It feels a very A
22:00
Speaker 1: lot of this is so hypocritical, And I'm going to
22:01
Speaker 1: talk about that in a second, because it's like we've
22:06
Speaker 1: heard the other side too, though, Like you can't have
22:09
Speaker 1: been raped because you were in a sexual situation.
22:12
Speaker 2: Like right, none of does makes sense? Yeah, it's basically
22:16
Speaker 2: just like you can only be raped if you forcebly
22:19
Speaker 2: said no and they're like kidnapped you.
22:21
Speaker 1: Essentially, Yes, that's right, exactly Does that makes sense? It doesn't.
22:28
Speaker 1: Here's here's a quote. I found this pretty upsetting. This
22:30
Speaker 1: is for a medium. In twenty twelve, I met my rapist,
22:34
Speaker 1: mister Epperson name is for context later at an anime
22:37
Speaker 1: con sort of event. He was a bisys gender allosexual man.
22:41
Speaker 1: He knew I was asexual and promised that we could
22:43
Speaker 1: go slow if I agreed to date him. Seeing as
22:46
Speaker 1: this was my first ever experience with a relationship and
22:49
Speaker 1: being autistic and easily manipulated, I naively agreed to date him.
22:54
Speaker 1: He predictably did not hold true to his promise and
22:57
Speaker 1: forced me to become sexual with him early on in
22:59
Speaker 1: the relationship, saying well, how will I know you really
23:02
Speaker 1: love me if you're not willing to make love to me.
23:04
Speaker 1: He was very effective at discreetly threatening me with abandonment
23:07
Speaker 1: and ostracism from the community and more later were I
23:11
Speaker 1: to ever say no to his advances. Some months into
23:15
Speaker 1: the abusive relationship, I finally persuaded him to watch a
23:18
Speaker 1: documentary on a sexuality in the hopes that he would
23:20
Speaker 1: learn how uncomfortable I was with sex. He made multiple
23:24
Speaker 1: comments on how effectively raping the male star would make
23:27
Speaker 1: him give up a sexuality. He was a feminist, though,
23:31
Speaker 1: so He never called what he did rape. He referred
23:34
Speaker 1: to a sexuals featured as creepy freaks. He boasted about
23:38
Speaker 1: how he had cured me and turned me into a
23:40
Speaker 1: normal person by threatening me and guilting me into allowing
23:43
Speaker 1: him to do what he wanted to me. He commented
23:46
Speaker 1: on what a sad, empty life the male star must have,
23:49
Speaker 1: not knowing the joy of having an epson dick inside
23:52
Speaker 1: of him. He and his mother assist gender bisexual woman
23:55
Speaker 1: were laughing by the end of the documentary about the
23:58
Speaker 1: freaks who need help. He later admitted that he targeted
24:01
Speaker 1: me specifically because he was interested in curing a weirdo
24:05
Speaker 1: like me. Yep, yep. And I've heard this stuff too.
24:12
Speaker 1: It is very there's something broken with you. I can
24:17
Speaker 1: fix it. And it's strange because and we're not going
24:21
Speaker 1: to go into it too and depth in here, but
24:23
Speaker 1: it's all wrapped up in this idea that you must
24:28
Speaker 1: in some way because our society is so strange around sex, right,
24:32
Speaker 1: especially gay sex, that it's like you must be in
24:36
Speaker 1: some way messed up. And for some people that can
24:41
Speaker 1: be true, but that's a thing to assume and also
24:43
Speaker 1: not something you should get. It's not your business, and
24:49
Speaker 1: maybe it's not true at all, But in either case,
24:54
Speaker 1: just know that's messed up. That's messed up. There's another
25:06
Speaker 1: A common thing that comes up is kind of asexual
25:09
Speaker 1: person ever be discriminated against. Here is a quote. Aces
25:14
Speaker 1: often talk about the idea of the unassailable asexual, which
25:17
Speaker 1: is someone whose asexuality is begrudgingly accepted by the mainstream
25:21
Speaker 1: because there's no other plausible reason for their disinterest in sex.
25:24
Speaker 1: Someone who's white, cis neurotypical, not too old or not
25:28
Speaker 1: too young, and with no disabilities and no history of
25:31
Speaker 1: sexual trauma. If someone who could seemingly have their pick
25:34
Speaker 1: of sexual partners abstains from sex, then they must not
25:37
Speaker 1: have chosen this identity. After all, aces for more marginalized
25:42
Speaker 1: backgrounds often have more difficulty finding acceptance, let alone becoming
25:46
Speaker 1: public faces for the community and then from swaddle. Asexuality
25:51
Speaker 1: shares a particular tumultuous relationship with queerness. Where queerness has
25:55
Speaker 1: been defined by sex, expressing it, having it, and most importantly,
25:58
Speaker 1: taking pride in it. Asexual he dissenters the primacy of
26:01
Speaker 1: sex and our culture. So again, I think this is
26:05
Speaker 1: we've talked about this in our past episodes. And I've
26:06
Speaker 1: talked about this a lot with like feminism, because I
26:09
Speaker 1: want women to not be shamed for having sex and
26:12
Speaker 1: having as much sex as they want is healthy, consensual sex.
26:17
Speaker 1: But I also feel like there should be a space
26:18
Speaker 1: for you know what, I don't want that, and it's
26:23
Speaker 1: nothing being wrong with either. And then here's another one.
26:27
Speaker 1: I've heard this one a lot. Isn't an asexual person
26:29
Speaker 1: just someone no one wants to have sex with. I've
26:32
Speaker 1: heard people say this about me.
26:34
Speaker 2: You Yeah, well you also prove that point wrong where
26:39
Speaker 2: the weird advances that happen, They're like, why are you
26:41
Speaker 2: doing this?
26:42
Speaker 1: Well, it's so funny because they say that and they
26:44
Speaker 1: immediately are like, I'll have sex with you.
26:46
Speaker 2: What immediately like disproving those Well, I also like, I
26:52
Speaker 2: don't think we should be proving worth this way. Yeah,
26:56
Speaker 2: well mean that was the other part of this is
26:57
Speaker 2: like when we talked about people say, you know, asexuals
27:00
Speaker 2: because they have too much trauma of that. First of all,
27:03
Speaker 2: it's not just asexuals. Is everyone who has trauma and
27:05
Speaker 2: they react to it differently. Everybody reacts to it differently.
27:08
Speaker 2: Someone becomes overly sexual, hypersexual is what we call it,
27:12
Speaker 2: and we've seen that. I've seen that with a lot
27:14
Speaker 2: of child uh sex abuse cases, like and that's a
27:18
Speaker 2: big sign. Like all these different things are signs everywhere
27:21
Speaker 2: that trauma affects sexuality in general, whether it goes for
27:25
Speaker 2: one's part of the spectrum to the other. And it's
27:27
Speaker 2: kind of like, even if it is based on trauma,
27:30
Speaker 2: if that's one part of their healing is then let
27:33
Speaker 2: it be Like because I've said, you're right, I've heard
27:37
Speaker 2: it for not only for asexuals, but I've heard it
27:39
Speaker 2: for like gay men again and then promiscuous women and
27:43
Speaker 2: all these things, Like there's so many things. It's because
27:45
Speaker 2: you've been traumatized me, Like, you're probably not wrong, but
27:48
Speaker 2: I'm also cisgender like sexual heterosexual person who was also traumatized.
27:56
Speaker 2: It's the thing for everyone, it just is. And I
28:00
Speaker 2: and you accept me the way I am, even though
28:02
Speaker 2: I had trauma based on that as well, Like there's
28:04
Speaker 2: so many things to that conversation. It's like, well, if
28:08
Speaker 2: this is the reaction to trauma, which is not the
28:10
Speaker 2: case because obviously we all handle it differently, Like you
28:13
Speaker 2: and I are very much on different parts of the spectrum,
28:15
Speaker 2: going through civil trauma, right, so it's not necessarily a
28:20
Speaker 2: reaction to trauma. Trauma just happens to be there.
28:23
Speaker 1: Right point blank. That's yes. And that was a big
28:26
Speaker 1: realization for me because I did and listeners you have
28:30
Speaker 1: heard me talk about this, because I really struggled with that.
28:32
Speaker 1: I was like, maybe it could be this or this
28:34
Speaker 1: or this, because I've been fed that like my whole life,
28:38
Speaker 1: like here's your drugs you can take to improve your libido,
28:42
Speaker 1: here's like all these things you can do because this
28:44
Speaker 1: is wrong with you. And this it was a real
28:48
Speaker 1: revelation I had on this show where people were like,
28:50
Speaker 1: you know what kind of at the end of the day,
28:51
Speaker 1: does it matter that's how you identify, you feel comfortable
28:54
Speaker 1: with it, you feel good, then that's it, and that's
28:57
Speaker 1: how that's how I feel exactly.
29:00
Speaker 2: And maybe coming to that realization is part of that
29:02
Speaker 2: healing of like, oh.
29:04
Speaker 1: Honestly, yeah, because for a while I was I got
29:07
Speaker 1: this so in my head like this is yeah, something
29:09
Speaker 1: must be wrong with me. But when I was finally
29:12
Speaker 1: just like you know what, I feel comfortable, Like this
29:15
Speaker 1: feels right, then it was it was a very settling
29:19
Speaker 1: in myself moment and here's a quote that kind of
29:22
Speaker 1: relates to that from Victims Service Center of Central Florida.
29:26
Speaker 1: Sometimes when someone experience the sexual violence, the construct of
29:30
Speaker 1: sexual orientation is questioned. This is because society's norm is heterosexual.
29:34
Speaker 1: When someone identifies as heterosexual, no one asks, how do
29:37
Speaker 1: you really know if you are heterosexual? Or are you
29:40
Speaker 1: heterosexual because you are sexually assaulted. I like to say
29:43
Speaker 1: that for whatever reason you identify as ACE as valid,
29:46
Speaker 1: you can still identify as ACE, even if you think
29:48
Speaker 1: something caused your lack of attraction. Reality is, we will
29:52
Speaker 1: never know. I believe I was born ACE, and I
29:54
Speaker 1: am okay with that.
29:56
Speaker 2: You know. Thinking about that quote in itself is like,
29:58
Speaker 2: we know a lot of of who people who are
30:02
Speaker 2: queer but were afraid to come out was because of
30:05
Speaker 2: the trauma of being told that they can't.
30:06
Speaker 1: Be queer exactly.
30:09
Speaker 2: So they tried to identify as heterosexual. But you're like, wait,
30:11
Speaker 2: but are you It's because it's a trauma, It's really
30:14
Speaker 2: you know, like, let's see of it all.
30:17
Speaker 1: It's true. And I talked about that in the book.
30:20
Speaker 1: I was so afraid to do it, I would like
30:22
Speaker 1: have nightmares. When I was in seventh grade, like I will,
30:25
Speaker 1: Please don't let me be gay. God, I can't handle it,
30:28
Speaker 1: like it's heartbreaking. And speaking of here's another quote. Fifty
30:36
Speaker 1: percent of asexual people have already seriously thought about suicide,
30:39
Speaker 1: and fourteen percent have made an attempt, according to a
30:42
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen study. And here's something that kind of resonated
30:46
Speaker 1: with me. This is a quote from Ace in the Hole.
30:49
Speaker 1: My asexuality became dangerous while trying to navigate my first
30:53
Speaker 1: adult relationship. One of the first few people I came
30:56
Speaker 1: out to was my then partner, and after his first
30:58
Speaker 1: reaction of dismissing me entirely, he became angry. He said
31:02
Speaker 1: I had lied, that it was akin to cheating. It
31:05
Speaker 1: was the only time in our relationship that I was
31:06
Speaker 1: afraid he would hit me. This anger from men became
31:09
Speaker 1: an alarmingly common theme when I was single. I struggled
31:13
Speaker 1: with disclosing in the early stages of meeting someone. It
31:16
Speaker 1: was a deal breaker for a lot of men, and
31:17
Speaker 1: I didn't want to waste their time. But I also
31:20
Speaker 1: didn't know these men well. I didn't have the confidence
31:23
Speaker 1: that they wouldn't attack me personally or physically for a
31:25
Speaker 1: perceived challenge to their masculinity. Women are taught from an
31:29
Speaker 1: early age to manage the egos of the men in
31:31
Speaker 1: their lives, from fathers and husbands to coworkers and bosses.
31:35
Speaker 1: We are to keep the peace and avoid rocking the boat.
31:38
Speaker 1: Asexuality disrupts that. Saying that you aren't sexually attracted to
31:41
Speaker 1: anyone becomes a personal slight and it reinforces fears that
31:44
Speaker 1: they aren't desirable, undermines the self worth of a self
31:47
Speaker 1: conscious man, and ultimately challenges the status and power in
31:51
Speaker 1: the society as a woman. This is a risky thing
31:54
Speaker 1: to do, so, yeah, I mean it's like we've talked
31:57
Speaker 1: about that too, where you know, we have to manage
32:00
Speaker 1: You can't just say no because then men get mad.
32:03
Speaker 1: But then they are mad at you because you didn't
32:05
Speaker 1: just say no, because you like let them along, you
32:07
Speaker 1: tease them, You tease them. It's a similar thing. Yeah,
32:10
Speaker 1: it's like unless I trust you enough, and it's hard
32:14
Speaker 1: to tell people like, oh, hey, I'm asexual, and they're
32:17
Speaker 1: probably not gonna tell you the first time I meet you.
32:22
Speaker 2: Right, there was a whole incident with a woman saying
32:26
Speaker 2: no to a person and then them getting mad and
32:29
Speaker 2: then him hitting her with a brick that just happened,
32:33
Speaker 2: and people blamed her, saying that she's always going after
32:35
Speaker 2: people anyway, so she probably deserved it, and like there
32:38
Speaker 2: was evidence, clear evidence, and the dude came out and
32:41
Speaker 2: was like, yeah, I didn't like our attitude telling me no, wow,
32:45
Speaker 2: they still don't believe her.
32:47
Speaker 1: It's like your attitude, who what? Wow? Yeah, so you
32:53
Speaker 1: wonder why we are right?
32:57
Speaker 2: We play along and we give you a fake, and
33:00
Speaker 2: the fake a boyfriend or husband, which.
33:02
Speaker 1: Often they're like I'm better than that guy, Oh my gosh.
33:07
Speaker 1: Or they don't let you have a friend, Nope, nope,
33:09
Speaker 1: they let you out.
33:11
Speaker 3: Well you yeah, okay, kind of ran away.
33:27
Speaker 1: Another thing that we've been talking about throughout this is
33:30
Speaker 1: this whole idea like yes, you have to change, you
33:32
Speaker 1: have to change the drugs I talked about, Like you
33:36
Speaker 1: have the magazines that say you have to have sex
33:39
Speaker 1: two or three times to be fulfilled. It's just like
33:42
Speaker 1: kind of constant barrage of this is what it is.
33:46
Speaker 1: This is if that's not what's going on for you.
33:48
Speaker 1: And that's even for people who might not be a sexual,
33:51
Speaker 1: just not have much of a libido, Like still telling
33:54
Speaker 1: you something's wrong trying to sell you this medication. How
33:57
Speaker 1: do you know if you've never tried. And I kinda
34:01
Speaker 1: hate this because this. I have had sex I didn't want.
34:07
Speaker 1: I've never had sex I enjoyed, but I did it
34:09
Speaker 1: because of this, and I also like, I hate that.
34:14
Speaker 1: But I also a lot of times I don't think
34:16
Speaker 1: it ever clarified this because I've said I've done it
34:19
Speaker 1: out of fear. Sometimes it's not fear of like abuse.
34:23
Speaker 1: Sometimes it is, but sometimes it's a fear that if
34:26
Speaker 1: I do it once, I'm such a people pleaser, I'll
34:30
Speaker 1: be tracked in this and they'll expect it and I
34:33
Speaker 1: know that I'll do it. So it's almost like, even
34:38
Speaker 1: if I'm not necessarily afraid of like some kind of
34:41
Speaker 1: physical abuse, I'm afraid that I will just do what
34:46
Speaker 1: they want because that is more important than anything I
34:49
Speaker 1: wouldn't eat or want.
34:52
Speaker 2: I mean, we've talked about it many times where we
34:54
Speaker 2: just try to get it over with quickly so that
34:57
Speaker 2: we can get moved on and hope for the best
34:59
Speaker 2: and then just never talk to them again.
35:02
Speaker 1: Again. I laugh because it's sad and true, but yeah,
35:05
Speaker 1: I mean, essentially, and I just I've been in several
35:09
Speaker 1: situations where I feel like I communicated that and I
35:13
Speaker 1: wasn't really believed, and then it did turn into resentment
35:17
Speaker 1: because I was like, if this happens once, I'm afraid
35:19
Speaker 1: it'll just be expected and then I I'll just do it.
35:24
Speaker 1: So that's definitely something that resonated with me when I
35:26
Speaker 1: was reading about it. I do as I said, I
35:28
Speaker 1: think people get confused about the by romantic bit. They
35:31
Speaker 1: hear that I'm attracted to somebody, although they're almost always
35:34
Speaker 1: fictional characters, and they're like, so you do want sex?
35:39
Speaker 2: Like, no, attraction is not the same thing we're trying
35:43
Speaker 2: to do many people doesn't mean I want to have
35:45
Speaker 2: sex with them exactly.
35:47
Speaker 1: I can be like, look it looks so good and
35:50
Speaker 1: that's it. That's it.
35:51
Speaker 2: I just want to pet their face exactly.
35:55
Speaker 1: The head, Oh, give them a cookie. That's literal yes.
36:02
Speaker 1: And like, like I said, this is there's so much
36:05
Speaker 1: double standards in this because I keep going back to
36:09
Speaker 1: this point of like, especially with women, you can't be
36:12
Speaker 1: too sexual, but you better want to have sex with
36:15
Speaker 1: a man when he wants it, when you're married. And
36:18
Speaker 1: all of that's being said to a lot of us
36:20
Speaker 1: who have been raised believing sexist taboo and you don't
36:23
Speaker 1: talk about it and it's bad, and then it's like yeah,
36:29
Speaker 1: but when you get married to a man and then
36:31
Speaker 1: when he wants it to say okay, but then I'm
36:33
Speaker 1: like I just don't want it, and they're like no, wait,
36:39
Speaker 1: that's rocky too. Have you heard that to consummate a
36:42
Speaker 1: marriage and most religions you have to have.
36:44
Speaker 2: Sex as well as that's your purpose.
36:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you have to have kids or else what
36:49
Speaker 1: are you even doing here? What you're not You're racing our.
36:51
Speaker 2: Time, not traveling all over the world and just enjoying
36:55
Speaker 2: your life.
36:55
Speaker 1: Right, And to be clear, like that hurts that meritive
37:00
Speaker 1: hurts like people who can have kids and want them,
37:02
Speaker 1: but also plenty of people who can have kids and
37:05
Speaker 1: don't want them of all types. Another thing, being asexual
37:12
Speaker 1: is not against the law most places, mostly because people
37:15
Speaker 1: don't know what it is. But that means that as
37:18
Speaker 1: people who are seeking asylum are not included under the
37:22
Speaker 1: LGBTT plus applicants for the status of course, saying that
37:26
Speaker 1: it is worth recognizing the other side too, because being
37:28
Speaker 1: trans or homosexual is punishable and against the law in
37:30
Speaker 1: several places, so just to keep that in mind. In
37:35
Speaker 1: the UK, it is still recognized as a medical disorder,
37:39
Speaker 1: meaning ACE people are ten percent more likely to get
37:42
Speaker 1: pushed to get conversion therapy, and it is not recognized
37:46
Speaker 1: under the twenty ten Sexual Orientation Equality Act. New York's
37:49
Speaker 1: Sexual Orientation Non Discrimination Act of two thousand and three
37:52
Speaker 1: is one of the only pieces of legislation that mentions
37:55
Speaker 1: asexual people. The American Psychiatric Association recognize a sexuality as
37:59
Speaker 1: a sexual orientation in twenty thirteen. Here's another quote I
38:03
Speaker 1: want to include from Growth think Tank because I've heard
38:06
Speaker 1: this a lot too. It should be remembered that asexuality
38:09
Speaker 1: is not a puritanical or religious movement seeking to advocate abstinence.
38:14
Speaker 1: It has nothing to do with morals or ethics. Since
38:16
Speaker 1: it is neither a choice nor an opinion. Asexual people
38:18
Speaker 1: are not against sex, nor do they want to prevent
38:20
Speaker 1: anyone from having sex. Yeah, save consensual sex.
38:26
Speaker 2: Go for it.
38:27
Speaker 1: I'm all about it. Also, a lot of comments people
38:29
Speaker 1: will say are if you're talking about it, means you're
38:32
Speaker 1: uncomfortable with it, which I think is ridiculous. And then
38:35
Speaker 1: here's my final quote. Asexuality is a sexual orientation. That
38:39
Speaker 1: is different from heterosexuality. Heteros are both heterosexual and heteromantic.
38:44
Speaker 1: Asexuals can be cysgender, hetero romantic, and asexual, as well
38:47
Speaker 1: as transgender, homo romantic and asexual. The inclusion of the
38:51
Speaker 1: asexual persons in the lgbtqiplus community therefore does not mean
38:54
Speaker 1: the inclusion of cis gender and heterosexual persons. There is
38:58
Speaker 1: also a myth of the cis gender and hetero asexuals
39:00
Speaker 1: claiming to be a sexual in order to infiltrate an
39:03
Speaker 1: LGBTQI plus community. This reminds us of the terf discourse
39:07
Speaker 1: asserting that transgender women or men disguised as women to
39:11
Speaker 1: integrate feminist movements. So this was in kind of going
39:14
Speaker 1: back to something you said earlier, but this was in
39:16
Speaker 1: relation to a lot of kind of conspiracy theories that
39:21
Speaker 1: asexuality was just invented by straight people to get into
39:25
Speaker 1: queer spaces. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, And that's the thing,
39:34
Speaker 1: as you said that, like bisexual people did and still
39:37
Speaker 1: face that in the queer community, trans people didn't still
39:40
Speaker 1: face that too, So I feel like there's been progress,
39:48
Speaker 1: And like I said, this isn't about comparing hardships because
39:53
Speaker 1: we already know that pitting marginalized people against each other
39:56
Speaker 1: only helps those that are pressing us. I think it
39:59
Speaker 1: is important to recognize intersections. I think it's important to
40:03
Speaker 1: keep context in mind. But I feel like a lot
40:06
Speaker 1: of times it kind of breaks my heart because this conversation,
40:09
Speaker 1: A lot of conversations like this devolve into well you're
40:15
Speaker 1: not really queer, or well you're taking up space, or well,
40:19
Speaker 1: why are we talking about this? One should be talking
40:21
Speaker 1: about this, So I'm not about that. I feel like
40:27
Speaker 1: there's room to talk about all of this, and we
40:28
Speaker 1: should talk about all.
40:29
Speaker 2: Of this, right. I think that's the thing is like
40:32
Speaker 2: I hate that you even have to acknowledge or put
40:35
Speaker 2: that as a caveat, because you should be able to
40:38
Speaker 2: talk about your identity and what you are going through
40:41
Speaker 2: and understanding the differences and why it's important to talk
40:44
Speaker 2: about these precise labels and or identifications. And I don't
40:50
Speaker 2: think it's a bad thing, Like it's odd if someone
40:53
Speaker 2: who is in the marginalized communities like, but but it
40:56
Speaker 2: doesn't obtain the me so I don't it's not important. Again,
41:00
Speaker 2: this is kind of that narrative of we're like, hmm,
41:04
Speaker 2: this is why intersectionality is important, and that when we
41:06
Speaker 2: say intersectional, we mean room for everyone, and that we
41:09
Speaker 2: should help hold space for everyone and to look at
41:12
Speaker 2: the bigger picture.
41:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we've talked about that a lot, Like this
41:15
Speaker 1: idea of like there's not enough space, that's such a
41:19
Speaker 1: that's just maintaining the status quo of like keeping marginalized
41:23
Speaker 1: people in the margins, like there's space to talk about
41:26
Speaker 1: this and everything else. So yeah, and I do think
41:32
Speaker 1: it affects everyone in the queer community and not all
41:35
Speaker 1: of this stuff. So thank you. Going on my crash course,
41:40
Speaker 1: I'm still learning to thank.
41:41
Speaker 2: You for sharing yeah things today I'm like, wow.
41:45
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, I'm still learning too. I'm still learning too. Honestly,
41:49
Speaker 1: a lot of the like questions I've gotten have legitimately
41:51
Speaker 1: been really genuinely curious, like they want to know, and
41:56
Speaker 1: I appreciate that. So hopefully this helps. Hopefully this helps,
42:00
Speaker 1: And I really appreciate all of the support I've gotten
42:02
Speaker 1: from you, Samantha and from Listeners's all a lot. So yeah,
42:07
Speaker 1: if you have any thoughts about this, I know some
42:09
Speaker 1: of you have reached out about resources. If you want
42:11
Speaker 1: any resources, I can send those to you or If
42:13
Speaker 1: you have resources, you can send those to me. You
42:17
Speaker 1: can email us a stuff Can you have mom Stuff
42:19
Speaker 1: at iHeartMedia dot com. You can find us on Twitter
42:21
Speaker 1: at mom Stuff podcast, or on Instagram and TikTok at
42:24
Speaker 1: stuff I Never told you. We have a tea public
42:26
Speaker 1: store and a book where, yes, I do talk about this.
42:29
Speaker 1: You can get it at stuff You should read books
42:31
Speaker 1: dot com or wherever you get your books. Thanks as
42:33
Speaker 1: always to our super producer Christina, our executive producer Maya,
42:36
Speaker 1: and our contributor Joey. Thank you, I love the accent,
42:41
Speaker 1: and thanks to you for listening Stuff I Never told
42:44
Speaker 1: you the protection of my Heart Radio. For more podcasts
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Speaker 1: from my Heart Radio, you can check out the Heart
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