Latest / Reality Writes / Taylor Swift vs Star Wars—It's On!

Transcript

Taylor Swift vs Star Wars—It's On! · Reality Writes

• 0:05
  SPEAKER_04: Hello, hello.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_04: Welcome back to a new episode of Reality Rights.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_04: This is the podcast where I, Ellie Alexander and my tech husband Hello, hello peel back the curtain on all things writing and bookish.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and this week we're gonna do something slightly different, yeah?
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Uh well, I don't know how much we're talking about writing this week, right?
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_04: Well, I think both of these topics lend themselves to writing because certainly uh they have inspired my writing.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_04: Both of them, actually.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, yeah.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I know one of them has for sure.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe one more than the other, but yeah.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, so this week, leaving no mystery out there, we are gonna go head to head on um our favorites.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_04: We're gonna go Taylor Swift versus Star Wars.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: Star Wars.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_04: I should have worn my Airs to her.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you should have.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: Shoot.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: Not repping your side of the argument.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: I see who goes.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: No good.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_04: No good.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_04: Um, all right.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_04: Well, let's start off with uh just a little background into our own personal fandom.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_04: When did you first become a Star Wars fan?
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh 1977.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: I went, I saw it, I saw the original in the theater.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I was hooked.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: And then that that Christmas, uh, so that was that was uh May 25th, 1977.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and and then I like started collecting the toys because George Lucas was a genius when it comes to merchandising and understood how big the movie was going to be and how much kids were gonna love these, you know, action figures and the ships and everything.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: But that Christmas, Santa knew enough about Star Wars to bring me every action figure that I didn't have at the time.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: And then he knew he knew enough about uh the movie and the story to include multiple stormtroopers because there was more than one in the movie, so it was pretty cool.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: I was I I was hey, I was firmly hooked on Star Wars and definitely a solid believer in Santa Claus.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_04: Solid, solid.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_04: Well, I saw it as a kid too, and then um my brother was equally obsessed.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_04: He is three years younger than I am, and he had, like you, many of the action figures in the ships.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_04: My favorite was he had the Ewok Village.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_04: But we would spend hours and hours and hours playing with his action figures and like reenacting all these scenes.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_04: And honestly, like I really do think that um I was learning storytelling from a very young age in that, because sometimes we would reenact scenes from the movies, but a lot of times I would make things up.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_04: He didn't always love that, actually.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_04: He wanted me to stay on script, but I would go way off script and you know have Leia do something out of the ordinary, which was always fun.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: So you're saying that all your readers should email George Lucas or DM him on social media and thank him for the big shop mystery and the Solid Cross mysteries and all that?
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_04: I think probably.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_04: It makes sense.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: I like it.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_04: Um, my fandom for Taylor obviously started later because she was not born uh during the Star Wars era, like we are as Gen Xers.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_04: But for me, I've always been a fan of music.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_04: I would devour, we were just talking about this last week with Sky Guy, uh, Casey Caseum's top 40, where you would listen on Saturday mornings and I would count down my favorite songs.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_04: I was a huge wham fam, aha, like Madonna.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_04: Why are you laughing?
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I just all of those, yeah.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: I I agree.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_04: No shade, no shade and George and Andrew.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but for me, from a music perspective, I love lyrics.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, and always have.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_04: You know, Indigo girls are probably my number one favorite, uh, and always have been.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_04: But once I discovered Taylor in her early years, I really loved her lyrics.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_04: I like her musical style.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_04: Like I can go a touch, I don't want to say country, but like indie folksy in a way that you would probably steer clear from.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: No, I don't do the country.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um a couple of Taylor's more country songs are okay.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Beyonce's new country song is pretty cool.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: Ooh, it's a bottom.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: But uh I yeah, the rest and hey, if that's your thing out there, great.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I don't want to hear it in the comments.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um darling.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like country.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's good.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_04: Hit him up, hit him up with all of your country.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, don't don't because uh I've got I because I can't respond in kind.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I'm remember I'm partially censored here, so yeah.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_04: So um I think Taylor from a lyrical and songwriting perspective just really spoke to me.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_04: And when I first started writing the Bake Shop Mysteries, I I'm someone who always writes to music, as you all know.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_04: So I have, thanks to you, early on, you were like, oh, well, you should just do a Spotify playlist for your characters.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_04: And so I will create Spotify playlists for my characters, which is amazing because there's so much sensory input on that.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I'm not even paying attention to the music at this stage because I've been listening to the same playlist for what, 14 years now.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_04: I've added some songs to it, but it's like cellular memory where I sit down and I'm like, okay, I'm in I'm in Jules's world here.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, but Love Story was the theme song for the entire series.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: And you know me, that's that's one of my favorite Taylor songs.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: I I love it.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I love I love Love Story.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_04: You love Love Story.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, what's not to love about it?
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, I mean, you as you can attest, I'm terrible with song lyrics.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, you know, oh, the chair is green and it's against the wall, you know.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know, like what?
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: But that song I know all the lyrics too.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_04: So you do, you do know all the lyrics.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_04: Well, and I think that's interesting too, because you come from a musical background.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and so I think for you, you like the musical aspect more probably than lyrics.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_04: And because I'm a word girl, I just latch on to lyrics.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_04: Um and for me, she she really is a modern-day Shakespeare in terms of her poetry.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, but you played saxophone all growing up and all through college.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_04: So I think you're probably more musically inclined in that way.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I like the I like the tunes.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_04: I like the tunes.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_04: Um all right, so that's a little background in terms of well, actually, before we go into like, you know, our head-to-head questions that we put together for this, you also took your fandom to a new level this year for the Star Wars universe.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I did.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: I did.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: You did.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I wouldn't say I took it to a new level.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: I just I'm I'm like showing it on in more ways than just my extensive Star Wars t-shirt collection.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, because I added to my body now.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: Whoops.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: So you can't really I gotta do this again.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_04: Oh for any of those girlings out there, yes.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: He's showing tattoo.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I got a big tattoo of uh Boba Fett on my right forearm.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um Boba Fett, Boba Fett, where uh he's on my forearm now.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_04: But not just Boba Fett, what version of Boba Fett?
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: Uh the Kinner action figure.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, like uh a stylized version of the Kinner action figure.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: So the the same color scheme, uh, but a uh Danny's son, the tattoo artist that I worked with, his artistic rendition of it.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_04: And this is your first tattoo?
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: It was.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_04: And how long have you wanted a Star Wars tattoo?
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: I well, I I mean, I'm betraying my age here, but uh probably, probably like decades.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'll just say decades.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_04: Decades, decades.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and what if you regret it, regret it now?
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_04: What if you turn you know 60 in another decade and you're like, oh it'll never happen.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_00: It'll never happen.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's too, it's too would you stop liking Taylor Swift?
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: Probably.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_00: That's such a lie.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_00: Lie lies.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: No, definitely not.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: We're losing listeners by the minute because everybody loses your love.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: Sorry, darlings, that's a lie.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_04: Um, all right.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_04: Well, let's get into some questions.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_04: So I think one of the very cool things about um what Taylor does is she plants all of these Easter eggs.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_04: And sometimes fans take it to an entirely different level that I'm sure she's like, no, I definitely did not mean that if the hand of the clock strikes two at this time, right?
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, but I too love a good Easter egg.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_04: And um, one of the things that I've really enjoyed with um my Patreon account this last year is that I send character letters out each month.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_04: And all of those character letters, not all the patrons even know this, but they have a little teaser of things.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, of things to come in future books.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_04: Um, so I can't wait then for them to see these future books.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_04: And I I I love that little idea, and maybe it's the mystery writer in me, but you know, peppering in these little hints or clues that might portend to something in the future.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, that's I I didn't even know that.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: I've helped mail out some of those culture letters.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_04: Yep, it's true.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_04: They're gonna get like a little tiny, tiny teaser.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_04: So um if we have to go head to head on our first question, we're gonna talk about lightsaber battles versus song drops.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_04: Which one is cooler?
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_04: Song drops, obviously.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: I have to go with uh with lightsaber battles.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_00: Ah, this is uh this is a Sky Guy Customs original.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm I I have my lightsaber handy.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, the one that turns on is over there against uh on the wall, so I couldn't go I couldn't walk away and grab it, but um no, I gotta go with I gotta go with lightsaber battles.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean they're it's they're lightsaber battles.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like I don't know that's just that that just makes them cooler right there.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean nothing against Taylor because you know I I love Taylor, but um I mean now if Taylor would do a song drop with a lightsaber, oh, that would be just perfect.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_04: That was gonna be that was gonna be one of my questions.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_04: Like if we gave Taylor a lightsaber, or if we gave, let's say, pick a character from Star Wars, pick your favorite character.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_00: Boba Fett.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, we and we gave Boba Fett a guitar, what would happen?
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, I think those might be equally popular.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: You know, one of my favorite posters, I unfortunately it's over there on the wall.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'll have to show it sometime, but it's like the greatest rock concert ever.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it's got like Luke is shredding on the bass, and Han is like jumping in the air singing, and uh Leia's down, like just screaming into the microphone, and then of course, Chewy is like rocking the drum kit.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: So that concert would I mean it might rival the arrows tour.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, there's no chance.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_04: No, I mean it might it might come out.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_04: No, she could make a special guest appearance then.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um sure.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, but that's that that would be different, yeah.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_04: But I'm just we're talking set design, backup dancers, lighting, pyrotechnics, like come on.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, this would have all that and more.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not probably the the Millennium Falcon and probably do a flyover.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: It would be it would just be amazing.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_04: I think if uh we gave Taylor a lightsaber in some sort of Star Wars battle, she would kick some serious ass.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_04: Like the new album Fortnite is all about just modern female rage.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_04: I would think that she would take that out with a lightsaber really well.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_04: And I would love to see that happen.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I mean, you know, the the the Star Wars universe could always use another really strong female character, uh, especially with the passing of Carrie Fisher.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's you know, there's there's definitely room there.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: So that would be great.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: I would I would love to see Taylor Swift in something Star Wars.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: But then all the Star Wars fans are gonna freak out on me and the comments because they're like, oh, it's not believing, you know.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just like, no, it's my opinion.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's my podcast.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_04: Your opinion's wrong and your podcast is wrong.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's okay.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: There's a there's a great uh there's a great um question right there.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: Like whose fans can get a bit more ridiculous?
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Swifties or Star Warsies?
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever the Star Wars.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_04: I shouldn't call them Star Wars fans.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_04: Star Wars fans.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_04: That's boring.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, so Swifties already win there.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_00: Well, no, but but I'm saying who can be more ridiculous?
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, when it when it comes to either arguing about the well, let's start with whose fans could be more ridiculous when arguing about the content itself.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: So arguing over Taylor's song lyrics and their meanings, and arguing over like how bad people thought the prequels were for Star Wars.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, well, yeah, let's tackle Taylor first in terms of the fandom.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_04: I am I am solidly a Swifty like I know the lore, I know the things.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and also I guess maybe this is because it it's nowhere near her level or even like remotely, remotely, remotely close to it.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_04: But um, I do know what it's like to show up in the world and have people judge what you're doing, right?
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_04: I have some people who will tell me to my face, like I really hated your book.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_04: Like, wow, thanks.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, thanks for sharing.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_04: Appreciate that.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, so I think there is um, like I I feel like a mama bear for her sometimes, where you're like, oh, but she can also handle it.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_04: Like she's she's a brown woman and she seems like she has good, strong, solid boundaries.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_04: But um, the Swifties can also go real hard on um her former love interests, you know, like if you've dated her, yeah.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: So dumb.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_04: That's ridiculous.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I and also I think this is this ties back to writing too.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_04: There's something about um, you know, the very first book that I wrote was a memoir about losing my mom to young unset Alzheimer's, and we had just had Luke and that whole experience.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_04: And there's something about when you write about something hard that you've gone through, you transform it, right?
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_04: You you turn it into art, you take your life experience, you put it on the page, even everything in all of my series, like the bake shop, like jewels and her love.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_04: There, there's all this theme of loss and every and grief that I was working out, especially in those early years, because I wrote that also shortly after my mom had died.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_04: Um, or you know, the idea of being vulnerable, any of those things.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_04: You write that and you change it into art and it becomes something else.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_04: For me, it becomes a book.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_04: For her, it's a song.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_04: So she wrote about a breakup 10, 15 years earlier.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_04: And then there is this piece of the fan base that goes out and like wants to attack somebody on her behalf.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_04: Like, oh no, that's like, no, that's gross.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_04: I don't think that's the intent of her storytelling.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and I don't, I just don't think there's any need for that.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_04: But that's that's sort of the con, I guess, of putting yourself out there and being really open about your storytelling.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I it it is disappointing to see people attacking just over like music and everything.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: Star Wars fans don't really attack other people because it's it's a little bit different.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: They they go after the people that make the content.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like so it'd be like Swifties going after Taylor.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, yeah, you know, they go after George Lucas, they go after Dave Faloney.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know, it is it's it's just like it's not good.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, yeah, and it's disappointing too.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it was disappointing when um uh you know the Force Awakens came out, and there were some characters, you know, there was racial diversity in the characters and like a very racist segment of Star Wars.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_04: I'm not doing thumbs up to that.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_04: I did thumbs up to the racial darkness.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, okay.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: No, but you know, a very racist segment of Star Wars fans like reared their ugly head and and suddenly thought that they should let everybody know that you know there aren't black people in space.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_00: I I don't it just it was ridiculous.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: It was just ridiculous.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_04: Um so that was just and then some of the actors they're like left social media because they were getting so much hate.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I can't fathom that.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_04: You you land something like Star Wars and you think this is gonna be, you know, the biggest break of my life.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and then that's the reception that you get.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_04: And the sad thing is that always feels like it's from a small percentage of the fandom in both cases, I feel like.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: It is, it is for sure, for sure.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: But it's just it's sad that that exists in in something that is just made to bring entertainment and fun into people's lives.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh, you know, it's just it's really sad.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I it's the same thing with Swifties, though, going after um X, you know, love interests and stuff.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: I don't because I don't think that's I don't think that's what Taylor's asking for either.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um man, there's a big army of them.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, right.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_04: Or going after um, you know, nobody liked the fact that she was dating Matty Healy, and so there's a whole song on her new album, basically, which is like a solid back off fans.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_04: Like this is my life.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_04: I get to decide what I want.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_04: Like, and that has to be so hard to be in um showing up in the public in such a big way, and then having to like gauge your own personal love responses on a fandom.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_04: Like, that's that's nuts.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, that's that's too bad.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_04: Um but both of the fandoms also have amazing positive things about them, too.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_04: So for me, we all went to the Ares tour this last summer.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, that was fun.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_04: Thanks in part to you getting in the key for tickets before me.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, who was uh of the two of us who was a verified fan?
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: You were a verified fan.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: I was a verified fan.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: Who was not a verified fan?
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: I was not yes.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, brutal.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I could have I could have like held that ticket for anything, like even I couldn't I couldn't have extorted you though, because all that my that money came out of our share all her accounts.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I know just like blackmailing myself.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_04: I remember the day that it came through because um my editor, who is a dear friend, we are both, she started the bake shop mysteries with me, and we have remained friends for many years and also are both giant Swifties.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_04: So we had a whole text thread going, and she's like, Okay, I just got my verification.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_04: Like, make sure you go check your email.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm refreshing, I'm refreshing, I'm refreshing.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_04: And then a text comes in from you, and you're like, Hey, I just got verified.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_04: What?
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: I use the force.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, yeah, the force is strong with this one.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_04: That's right.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, but that concert will live in my memory forever for so many reasons.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, and we've been to a lot of incredible concerts over the years.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, some standouts, right?
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_04: Cold plays up there, uh, Amos Lee.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_04: Like, love a lot of I always I love an Indigo Girls concert, especially outside in the summer at the zoo in Portland.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_04: Those are some of my favorite memories.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_04: But errors to it.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they all put on great shows.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: But but nothing compares.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, sorry to everyone that we just listed, but you got beat.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_04: I know, because it was every level of it, right?
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_04: It was it was the music, it was the dancing, it was the show.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_04: I said that a a little bit before, but as somebody who loves stories, like she told a story of each era as she went.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_04: And that's so inspiring to me.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_04: But I think uh the most incredible thing, and it still gives me goosebumps, darlings.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_04: I'm looking at my arms, not that that matters to you at the moment, but um, I have never been in a space where there was so much joy, where you saw women and girls and people of all ages lifting one another up, like the bathroom line was this giant like hype line.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_04: Like there was just it just radiated joy.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_04: Like every interaction was beautiful.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and having gone to many sporting events together over the years, usually in a stadium like that, we saw Taylor at Levi Stadium.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_04: Here in Santa Clara.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_04: And it's it's it's sometimes a little overwhelming.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_04: Like there's some big energy in the air.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_04: And this energy was big and just beautiful.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_04: And I don't know if I'll ever have another experience like that.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: No, it was really great.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think the difference with sporting events is it's always a competition.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: So you're going, there's there are fans and players that you hate, even though you don't know them.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but you hate them because they're wearing the other team's colors.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: And and so there is negative energy associated with that.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, there wasn't any of that there.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: And I will tell you, oh my God, that when that when she showed up, when she came rising up out of the stage, yeah, um, that was the loudest sound I've ever heard in my entire life.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think I blacked out for a second because it was so loud.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_00: I have I've never heard, I mean, there are probably 75,000 people there.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um I've never heard that loud, and I've been to some huge sporting events, you know, with easily over 100,000 people in attendance, and they pale in comparison to this.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: But I do have a complaint with you because I thought one of the things that you say you'd always remember most is that during love story, yes, when the lyric says, you know, he got down on one knee and pulled out a ring, I actually did that during the concert.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: I have it right here.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: I even coaxed my niece, who came with us to the concert, to film the whole thing.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: So we have it on we have it on tape.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, or on yeah, digital recording, I guess.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_04: We have a digital recording.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_04: Here's the I'm showing, oops, I gotta go this way.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: No, you gotta go like that.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and here's the beautiful ring from Red, which is actually, I I gotta say, it's still like it holds up to me.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_04: This album is one of my favorites.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_04: And you did, but I was so completely captivated by the concert.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_04: I was like, oh yeah, great, thanks.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I'm still listening.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_04: Love you.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was just it was the biggest.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: I wish I I I wish it rolled video now, but uh, I don't I don't have it with me, but just the like it was the biggest non-reaction.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_00: I was terrible.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, whatever.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_04: It was lovely in hindsight.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_04: Um, in the moment, I was a little too caught up in the concert too.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_04: We're dancing away.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_04: That's yeah.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, it is like you started this podcast off by saying that that was like that's one of the I mean, it is the song for the Bake Shop Mysteries, right?
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: So you you were waiting for that one.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_04: Um, okay, well, let's talk about the pros of the Star Wars fandom.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_04: There are there are some amazingly cool experiences that you and Sky Guy have gotten to have over the years.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, totally.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think it's it's uh for the most part, it's so supportive.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_00: And especially with Luke and um uh like all his artistic abilities and and the stuff that he's been making with Sky Guy Customs and and everything, and just seeing the people like their reactions and and lifting him up and and everything has been has been really cool.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, we've been to Star Wars Celebration, we got to go to it at Anaheim, and that was awesome.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, to see Star Wars fans of you know all shapes, sizes, colors, persuasions, whatever, you know, it was it was just it was amazing.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and everybody was this was there to have a good time.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I can't wait.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: We're going next year to celebration when it's in Japan.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I'm really looking forward to that.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it is it's great because um, you know, it it's it's a sci-fi movie.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: And um to be a an adult and be this into it, um uh is you know, some people are like, oh, well, you know, aren't you a little embarrassed?
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, no, I'm definitely not embarrassed because there are millions of us, and it is amazing.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: So um it is it is a really cool community.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and you know, there are organizations like the 501st uh um that get together, do movie replica uh costumes, and they go they visit children's hospitals and they do all sorts of fundraising and and you know, and just like helping people out.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: And and that's just really, really cool to see.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because these are people that spend thousands of dollars on these costumes, and then they use them to, you know, go out and do good in the world.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_00: And and I love that.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_04: I love that too.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_04: And um, you know, I think your point is so valid in terms of the idea that just because now we are both in our 50s, like at any age, you should embrace whatever fandom you want to embrace, right?
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_04: I I feel like that very passionately about the cozy, and and we've touched on this a little bit, and I think we'll do an entire podcast um on a lot of the hate that the cozy's gotten, even within the industry for many, many years.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_04: And fortunately, like the tides are slowly but surely starting to change.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_04: But a lot of times um something that is light and fun and cozy in the book world, or you know, romance, anything that's escapism, often um you you get sort of belittled, like as a writer and as a reader of the genre, like, oh, you know, that's that's for a younger generation, or that's just fluff, or you shouldn't be into Star Wars, or I can't like Taylor at 50.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_04: Like, no, absolutely not.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_04: Like, love what you love and embrace it.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for sure.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: For sure.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, you know, I you can tell just by the mess uh behind me in in my uh my creative space, uh 99% of it is Star Wars.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: So I have embraced it.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_04: And now it's embraced on your body.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_04: Fully, completely, forever.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_04: Uh I want to talk a little bit about sort of speaking of the book industry, uh, the industry piece of things, uh, because obviously both of these brands, Star Wars and Taylor Swift, have dramatically changed both of their industries.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_04: And one thing for me as a writer that I have been just in awe of and really inspired by, even though Taylor's a younger generation than me, is that she has just really gone after fiercely protecting her creative rights, getting her albums back, re-recording them, re-releasing Taylor's version.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, that is a game changer on every level.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_04: And readers might not know that as writers, we're in the same position.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_04: So when a publishing house buys a series, they hold on to those rights.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_04: So for my first series, the Pacific Northwest Mysteries, they've been out there for many, many years and they've just been dying this slow, painful death.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and it was really Taylor who inspired me to try to fight to get them back because I want to re-release them and I want the Ellie's version of these books with the covers I envisioned.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_04: And even though as a creative you're you're creating the content, you don't fully own it.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_04: Um, which I think is something people might not understand.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I I I I think that's totally true.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, people get confused about that all the time.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um when uh you know, I've heard readers talking to you and and everything about it.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I just don't think like it's it's not something that people quite understand in in terms of ownership and everything.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I I remember like the um the I it wasn't that long ago, but the day that you got the rights back to the the um Meg series, the Pacific Northwest Mysteries, um that was a good day.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you you celebrated, uh you listened to a little tailor uh after that happened.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_04: I did.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, because that that's huge.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_04: And um, it's gonna be interesting to see how other musicians follow it, you know, it with her kind of paving the way.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_04: And I know um for me with a lot of my writers' friends, writer friends, we're we're often in the same position where it's like, oh, you've you've invested in a series, you love it.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_04: It goes a few books and the publishing house cancels it.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_04: And then you're sort of in this limbo, like, oh, I would love to write more, but readers can't get the first books because they're out of print and there's no interest in a reprint.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_04: And um yeah, I just I I love that piece.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, and I I suspect that we're gonna see a bigger trend in that way.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_04: We'll see.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: No, it would be good.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um it it like it's always you know, the the traditional realm of you know, whether it's publishers or uh music groups, the like that is um it's all changing.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: And and you know, artists are they have more uh options and opportunities um than they did, you know, even five, ten years ago.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: And and so I think um, you know, distribution used to be the big uh limiter for anybody, like whether you were an author, a singer, or a filmmaker for that matter.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: And and now that's not such a a barrier as it used to be.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: So I think um we all win with that because we're getting more content um all the time.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: And we are, as a society, definitely consumers of content.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um But it's good creative content, right?
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_04: Uh what do you how do you think Star Wars is shaping the film industry like?
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_04: And what do you think about, you know, the sort of rush to get multiple series out, out, out, out, out?
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_04: Are are you getting to a point where you feel like you're you're over it?
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_04: Is it too much?
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: It'll never be too much for me.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_00: I know there there is a there is a segment of the fan base that thinks that, you know, well, now post-Disney acquisition that they've just been cranking out shows and movies and stuff, and and not everything's gonna be a hit like the original trilogy uh, you know, were.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: But that for me, it's just it's so exciting.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um well, two things.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: One, I love to see how they're still they're connecting all the narratives.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: So even with the new stuff, because they there's you know, they're doing a great job of like really looking at the canon and seeing where stories fall, and then being able to connect the dots and see things from when I was a kid that are now like connected in these newer shows and be like, oh, you know, just like getting really excited.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but for me, it's it's even um it's even more exciting, I think, to see the reaction of our son with him seeing some of this stuff for the first time.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know, and and I mean he's he's 20 now, so he's like the the uh uh the apprentice has definitely become the master.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: Like he's he's definitely graduated from Padawanda full-blown Jedi because um he his knowledge level far surpasses mine, but um, but it's still really cool to get to see him uh react to stuff and and get excited about things because I it transports me back to you know when I was his age and and things were still you know relatively new.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um but I think like how it changed the movie industry, like it it completely changed special effects as we know them today.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, industrial light and magic.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh in fact, for anybody out there, this is a shameless plug.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: We're not getting any kickback or anything.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_00: But if you have Disney Plus, watch Light and Magic.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um just go watch it.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's just the story of how industrial light and magic came to be and the people who worked there at the time and how they accomplished some of the things that they've done, not just for Star Wars, but for all sorts of movies that that you wouldn't even you wouldn't even really um think that they were involved in.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: But um, it's it's pretty incredible.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think seeing that and seeing you know, the just talking uh just we were we were just talking about this uh a couple of weeks ago, how like you know 1977 is not that long ago, and they were they did all of that stuff practically, so all of the ships were modeled, like scale models, and they found ways to you know using painted backdrops and everything and and camera techniques and stuff to to pull all that off.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_00: And now everything is digital, um mixed with some of the practical effects, and and but they're you know, ILM is still leading the charge.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_00: So um definitely without Star Wars, um, I'm not sure how far along special effects would have gotten, uh, you know, if they would have gotten to where they're at as fast as they have.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that's interesting.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_04: I I think it's also like it'll be fascinating to see if people, moviegoers, kind of as we go deeper into the world of digital and AI, if there's this resurgence in wanting more practical effects, kind of like the paperback in the book world, you know, where ebooks and audio outsell paperbacks by like 70, 80 percent.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_04: But then there's still this base that wants to hold a book.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_04: Where is there gonna be this space that's like, no, I I still want somebody to build a model?
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, yeah, I think so.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think, you know, as as as as much as I love technology and and like to see the uh advancement and the rate of advancement and everything, I think there'll always be a market for actual human-created stuff.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, oh, I I just I thought one other way that I feel like Star Wars changed things was um merchandising.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: Uh because the toys related to the movie have not only, you know, Saturday Night Live has done some awesome skits about this, but um not only as a kid did you get to play with them.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_00: And yes, I did unbox and play with all of my toys.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: I did not keep them in the box, pristine and the coin, you know, in the closet and everything.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I I just like I think that changed things um because it was really an untapped market, and it is still to this day, is still just incredible to see the stuff being made.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um I used to have such a great time comparing my my old stuff, my original figures with Luke and and his, even at the time back in the you know, early to mid-2000s, and just seeing like the ridiculous level of detail and how it had changed from you know my like molded slug-like looking Chewbacca to his that looked like it had real hair and it was still all plastic.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you know, it was just incredible.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I love that.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_04: Didn't we have a something we were gonna show?
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_00: Good point.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_00: I forgot that uh we have to take a break for a word from our sponsor.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_04: We have a sponsor, yeah.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't I I know I told you that we were gonna do this, and then I I totally forgot.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_00: So thanks for reminding me.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_04: Um, it is uh yeah I hadn't heard about this because you are the advertising guy.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_04: So when you were like, we have a sponsor, I'm like, we've only put out three or four podcasts.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_04: How do we already have someone who wants to advertise on it?
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_04: That's not possible, but you won't tell me any details about it.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's possible.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: So we're gonna we're gonna take a short break.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna listen to a word from our sponsor, and then we'll be right back to talk a little bit more about Taylor Swift and Star Wars.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_00: So here we go.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_00: Find yourself dreaming of Ashland, Oregon.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let Ellie Alexander take you there with her Bake Shop Mystery series.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: Picture this cozy little town, delicious pastries, and oh yeah, a sprinkle of murder.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_00: But wait, there's more.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_00: Fancy a trip to Livenworth, Washington?
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_00: Dive into the Sloan Krause mysteries where beer meets sleuth in prost to that.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_00: And now, drumwell pleased, Ellie's got a brand new series set in the charming Redwood Grove, California.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_00: Get ready for the secret bookcase mysteries.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_00: The first two books, The Body in the Bookstore and A Murder at the Movies, are dropping on June 19th.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: Trust me, you don't want to miss these page turners.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: So grab a comfy seat, maybe a snack and a drink, and let Ellie Alexander transport you to these mystery-filled locales.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_00: Happy reading.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_01: That you keep me going.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, what?
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_01: Oh no.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: Oh no, we had to make it.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's a this is what episode four, right?
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_00: So we had to we had to make it kind of official, like the you know, like the big, the, the big podcast, right?
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_00: So there you go.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'll send you a bill for that.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, great.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_04: Every time it gets mentioned, I get a little okay.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_04: Oh no, that's great.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_04: That's pretty funny.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_04: I'm not familiar with this Ellie Alexander, so it's very funny to me.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_00: She sounds like a pretty good author, I think.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_04: Oh no.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna check her out though.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_00: That was a lot of books.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_04: That is a lot of books.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_04: I know.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_04: It's funny seeing them all.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_04: Wow.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_04: Impressive.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_04: Um, we should talk about some personal picks before we round out this episode, right?
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think so.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_04: So I would like to start.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_04: We kind of touched on this, but um, let's start with Star Wars.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_04: So let's start with Star Wars first, and then we'll end with the other favorite Star Wars of all time for you or moment.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_00: Whoa, that's tough.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um favorite?
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I think it'd probably have to be the well within the movie or within the universe.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_04: No, within the entire universe.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_04: Because mine is within the entire the my Star Wars.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_04: You want me to go first?
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_04: So you can think about it?
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, okay.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: Well, no, I mean I I have two answers, but Okay.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, I'll go first, just so you, you know, because it you are the true fan.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_04: So I I'm a I'm I've been an adjacent fan my entire life.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_04: No, I I really am a fan.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_04: I'm just not quite as hardcore or as well versed in all of the nuances.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_04: I would say, you know, it's pretty parallel for you and Luke with Taylor, too.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_04: You are Taylor fans, whether you wanted to be or not, at this point.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_04: Um okay.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_04: Mine is Rogue One.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_04: Loved everything about that movie.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_04: Love the cast, love the tone, love the vibe.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_04: This is a spoiler.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_04: So if you haven't seen Rogue One, it came out what, like 10 years ago?
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_02: And you're in a while.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and you're gonna go see it, like then just skip this part.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_04: But I had no idea they were all gonna die at the end.
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_04: I leaned over to you at the movie theater because they're on the island or whatever.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm like, how are they getting off?
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, Yeah, they're not.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, this is why I'm not as well versed.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I should have known that, but uh, but I it's still my favorite.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, that it was a great movie, but yes, they that was I felt I felt bad.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_00: We Luke and I were both laughing, but we we did feel bad that you didn't know that ahead of time.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um no clue.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's you know, there's gotta be sacrifice to to beat the bad guys.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_04: So fair enough.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I was waiting for the special ship that was gonna come in.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_04: It wasn't coming.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, that's also just great storytelling.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_04: Like everyone dies at the end.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_04: I was emotional, but okay, there's there's they're setting the path for future, yeah, future Jedi.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, there's hope.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_03: There's still yeah.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, uh wait, so now I have to pick a favorite moment from Taylor Swift.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_04: No, no, we're still on Star Wars for you.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_04: And then we're gonna do Taylor Swift for both of us.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_04: I I I gave you a pass so you could think about it because you were struggling.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: No, I wasn't.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: I I just I didn't know what you wanted me to to uh the the format you wanted me to say.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_00: I so first I think the first thing would be um just watching watching Luke's reaction the first time he saw the Clone Wars animated series, because that was really one of his first the first things we let him actually watch, you know.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_02: Right, yeah.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_00: And it it was just that took me back because it was like the whole you know awe and wonder of you know the this this story.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_00: And he was hooked, you could tell from the like from that minute.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, he was just hooked.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_00: So that that was really cool.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I will actually I'll pick another moment which was um from the same movie that that you were just talking about and and that was um what they did with uh the um uh like the the timing of it uh around Rogue One and the with the first appearance of Darth Vader, the the new yeah the new intro where you actually see him coming in and that was kind of and it's it you know because seeing it back in the 70s it was like huge it was like oh my what they're like holy crap who is this guy it's really scary but this one was like just jaw dropping yeah it was yeah that was that was really cool it was very cool it's a good one yeah um okay so favorite Taylor Swift song moment etc uh moment would be the Ares tour just the that whole thing but like the initial opening scream was was for me like because that was that that just um that kind of I mean uh I obviously heard a lot of Taylor Swift's songs and I know a lot about Taylor Swift like through just through you know you and and everything but that was like just a an absolute indicator of how much her fans love her when when she came out um but yeah that tour is just I've never seen anything like that.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if I'll ever see anything like that again.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like that was that was from start to finish one of the coolest things I've ever seen um just from a musical standpoint from a technical standpoint like just everything it was awesome.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah and favorite song are you sticking with Love Story?
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_04: Of hers yeah uh yeah yeah oh easy okay I um I feel like every time I'm on TikTok or Instagram reels there's like some Taylor Swift moment because of course the algorithm knows now that this is what I like where um you know like a fan is interacting like they're bringing their mom they're bringing their sister like whatever and they're just like in tears and then I I cry every single time.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_04: So that that is like my ongoing favorite moment up there of course with AirStur nothing else we'll probably ever compare.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_04: Picking a song is really impossible.
• 46:28
  SPEAKER_04: This is like for you trying to pick a movie right I could pick four or five on every album um but there are some standouts.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_04: So like I love Long Live.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_04: I love Long Live in concept Long Live is a good one.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_00: I like I really like that one too.
• 46:43
  SPEAKER_04: But she just took it off I know she just took it off the tour to make room for Tortured Poets Department.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_00: Invisible String has some of my favorite lyrics of all time sure I know that one you would know it I mean I would know it but I don't like like I said I'm I'm terrible with the lyrics and the names of the songs.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_04: So you've heard it like a zillion times.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah that I have no doubt.
• 47:06
  SPEAKER_04: You can't go wrong with all too well the 10 minute version because that's a that's a story arc you know from a writing perspective that you're just gonna follow all the way through I love anything she does with Ed Sheeran at everything has changed.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_04: I love a lot of stuff on the new the new album and um I love you weren't sure about it at first I wasn't it's it's an album that it takes a few listens but now I have a lot of favorites uh that I keep coming back to and really what I love more than anything is we're talking about poetry in just modern times.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_04: Like that's amazing that poetry's like entered the chat at this stage.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_04: So yeah.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah well um I feel like I've solidly proved my case that if we had to pick Taylor's the clear winner oh wait we were arguing to see who was the better like what no I didn't know that I thought it was just like hey we're gonna have some questions we're gonna talk about no no's better yeah they're not even the same thing it doesn't matter there's a there's a clear winner a clear winner today and it's about that today today I don't know about that what what are we basing that like are we say should we talk about money like oh we could talk about money no I know Taylor's a billionaire but you know George Lucas sold the Disney like property to uh or sold the Star Wars property to Disney for four billion dollars we don't want to which he then donated to education so has Taylor donated four billion dollars to education um she's given all of her truck drivers a hundred thousand dollar bonuses she treats her staff well she's had all of her backup dancers have had health insurance from day one which does not happen in the industry but we don't we don't want to sully this discussion with money like no we're just talking like in the zeitgeist who's the winner and it's Taylor we I don't know if I can I I don't know if I can I I love Taylor but I don't know if I can get on board with that I'm calling it a tie.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_04: Okay you're calling it a tie.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_04: We could ask the darlings to weigh in in the comments and let us know what they think because right well that sucks because I know I'm gonna lose so I don't know I don't know I'm not sure I'm not sure about that we'll have to see I feel like I was set up from the beginning on this one.
• 49:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah you were yeah your your your ad fee just doubled all right well um on that note until next time I'm gonna go listen taylor I'm gonna go watch it start with me okay all right bye bye