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S2 Ep. 1 - Becoming the Dungeon Master · Bards and Barrels

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to Bars and Barrels, the podcast for Dungeons and Dragons players, new and old.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_02: I'm Brett Miller, and I'm joined by my friends and co-hosts Phil Boone and Ross Cruz.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: We'll be exploring the world of Dungeons and Dragons in each episode, sharing our experiences, offering tips and advice for those who play and run this classic game.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: So whether you're a new player just starting out, or a seasoned veteran looking to get a new perspective on things, cards and barrels has something for everyone.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: So sit back, grab a drink, and join us as we rubble for initiative and embark on this epic adventure.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: There it is, the opening crack.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome, welcome, guys! Season two.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: Season two.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_02: It's real.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_02: We made it.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_01: We survived.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Who would have ever thought we would have been at this point?
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we were gonna be lucky if we got through like five episodes.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_02: And you crazy fools are still listening to us.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: So, yes, we are kicking off season two tonight.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, this is gonna be fun.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: We've got so much stuff to cover in season two.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_02: We are not short on topics, but we're always looking for more.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: So if you have suggestions, suggestions, send us some, send them our way.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but tonight we are jumping into something that we've uh maybe dabbled in at best, uh, but really haven't die had a deep dive into, which is the main seat at the table, the dungeon master.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no kidding.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_01: How many collective groans were there as you're listening to this episode?
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, no, I I think you're absolutely right.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: I think we intentionally did that a little bit because in the in the first season we wanted to focus on the player and uh particularly the new player, but now we're getting to the point where if you want to have a game and you want to put all the pieces together, you still need a dungeon master.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: We haven't talked about that.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: You need somebody to tell the story and then include the group in that and then kind of guide you.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and then you know, sometimes Phil screw you over, right?
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what you're talking about.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: Why did you even suggest my name?
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: So, as the the veteran in the group, Phil, why don't you kick us off on what is your experience being the DM?
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: Uh we'll call it limited experience, even though it might be a little bit more than your guys's, but uh my experience DMing um is probably 75% with the people in this room right now, and maybe 25% with some of the people in this room and some other people.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: So uh really I've only uh DM'd one full published campaign from start to finish in its entirety, and that was the descent into a Vernus campaign that we've all played in.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: Before that, um I started running uh a different published adventure, Storm King's Thunder, um, which Brett was a part of as well, uh, that we ran with another group of people.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that one scheduling conflict-wise, people living in different time zone wise.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I wasn't even living here right now, where all of us together just kind of fizzled out over time, unfortunately, as some groups do.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: And um before that, I really hadn't done any DMing, but I wanted to play and didn't necessarily have a consistent group.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: And so you can you basically kickstarted uh us playing DD on the regular by being like, hey, I want to play, so I'm just gonna take over as DM.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, kind of.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because I wanted to a bunch of people.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_01: It would be interesting to see like how many people get their start that way.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's like you have to have one.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: So somebody's gotta be able to just do it.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: And then like you know, I've started doing some other um I don't know, small DMing things here and there.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um just kind of helping out locally with some stuff too, just to like helping at the game store or not game store, bookstore.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: I always want to say game store because I go to play games, but uh the bookstore here in town and some other areas, just to to try to get people into the game.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: That's why I do it.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: And those other experiences are mostly new players, right?
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, a lot of new players, uh, especially to fifth edition.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: So most of the people have never played fifth edition, and a lot of them have never played DD at all, just are interested to learn what it's about.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_01: So, what what would you say uh before we talk about Brett and I's experience, what what would you say is your favorite part of being the DM?
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: Ooh, uh my favorite part of about being the DM is watching the excitement in a player's face or general, generally in their body, like watching their body language when they have a great idea or a terribly wonderful idea.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: It may not be great, but it's always epic because you can just see like that that thought kind of take form, uh, and then watching that play out amongst the rest of the parties are like, oh my god, this is amazing, and seeing how that plays out.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's my favorite part about it.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: That is a great one.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: So, Ross, uh, what about you?
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: DM experience.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: So I got started.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh, this has been several years ago now, but my first my very first time DMing was at the end of the the Rick and Morty box campaign.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I I didn't actually run most of it, but there was like when we got to the last couple rooms in the dungeon, um, the person who was DMing at the time was like, Hey, do you want to try running a couple rooms in the dungeon?
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and so I was like, Yeah, sure, why not?
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'll I'll give it a whack.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's that's where I started at.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_01: And then that led into the first attempt at running Curse of Strahd, where I was not the DM, and then I became the DM.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and then that campaign kind of fell off.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_01: It was that was life in COVID, was basically what happened.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: So it was like everybody had kids, which made it hard to get together.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: And Brett was in that campaign.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_01: And then and then COVID kind of killed it in a way because we all had kids.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: Well, at least I had a kid during COVID.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: So it was like then then it just made it really hard, and we kind of just fell off at that point.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and then I got involved with you guys playing, and Phil being the DM for me.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: So that's how I've been like consistently involved in DMing, or not DMing, but playing.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_01: And then DMing, I got you guys involved um with some family of mine, uh, and we're trying Curse of Straud again, which I have much higher hopes for this one to complete, even though we don't play quite as often because we're dealing with school schedules, which is very different than just scheduling around your kids and playing late at night.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_01: So trying to get around there.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: You're doing practice for what?
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: You can't come play D you can't come play D D?
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: That's dumb, but but anyway, so it's fine.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like I I I would consider myself like definitely still a new DM, but but not super green at this point.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_01: How about you, Brett?
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I'm pretty still green.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I've done a bunch of one-shots and short-term um like starter campaign stuff that I've done multiple times for different groups.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but not a lot, I haven't done a long-standing campaign by any means yet.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_01: So I so some one of my favorite things, I should I should back this up back up slightly because I didn't say this, is I I agree 100%.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like seeing the excitement in people's faces when you hit certain moments in a story is totally worth knowing what's gonna happen because it's like you know what's coming, but you don't know how they're going to react to it, which is a ton of fun.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and I love that.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Brett, what would you say is like, since you haven't done it a ton, what's the hardest thing for you?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: Uh oh, uh fairly easy question.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_02: Um, with a lot of the starter packs, it gives you paper sheets.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: And having somebody jump in and use that paper sheet without a lot of experience on who that character is, what their backstory is, all the different abilities, and having them just jump in and run with it, and you don't have visibility on what that character is and can't really help them out without just like passing the sheet over, that's tricky.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_02: I much rather prefer, much would prefer having somebody have it on digital version.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that does make sense.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: Shared access is big.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's also harder to like so you having the shared access, but it's also harder to like help them when they don't have that.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's like, I don't know what damage dice you need to roll.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: So A, I gotta get you to tell me what it is, and you have to know what it is.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I probably have to help you do that.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: And then when you're doing it on paper, you still have to roll all of the dice, calculate everything on your own.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: And when it's some with when it's a brand new player, yeah, it's challenging.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it takes longer.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's always hard.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: Then it's like you gotta add this or this or this, and if you're having a few libations while you're playing, it gets even harder.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, DD Beyond, for for the help.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: Just us, not the children.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: True, true.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_01: Helps the s helps with the storytelling, you know.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's a get loser, tell better stories.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: Flavor.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: Flavor flavor.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: So what if you look to somebody who's just looking at dabbling in becoming the dungeon master, what do they need?
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_02: What do you need to be the DM?
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: I I th I think that's a tough question because I I I think immediately when you when you think of being a DM, the first thing you want to say is, well, you you need probably want to go with a published campaign of some sort, even if it's the starter set, because it's gonna help you not have to build a world or build a story.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: Other things are gonna be like, hey, you need dice, you need a dungeon master screen, depends on how you're playing, of course.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh or or if you're like me, you had a dungeon master screen even though you were playing online and you still set that bad boy up because it didn't matter that you sold the DM and you needed your screen with you.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um well, a lot of those Dungeon Master screens have a lot of notes and cheat cheat stuff.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_02: If you get one that's like pre-made, it's got a lot of handy stuff already on there for you.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: Totally.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I think you hit it on the head.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: The reality is what do you need?
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: You need a way to take notes.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: Know your story and a means to take notes.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I would say, you know, the one book if you have to go out and purchase one is the Dungeon Master's Guide.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: And arguably the monster manual or something that has stat blocks in it.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: So that way you don't just have to create creatures from scratch.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: You at least have something to base them off of.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I and I think I think that's overlooked sometimes because a lot of the campaigns will have the creatures in them.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_01: The interesting thing is when you get to some of the higher level campaigns, they tell you this is the creature, but they don't have the stat block.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: It's the stat blocks that'll be in the book are specific to the story, maybe.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: But if it's just a you know, a a uh uh uh challenge rating for Wolf, that's not going to be included in that.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: You have to go to the Dungeons Master, or not the Dungeon Master book, but you have to go to the monster manual to find that and actually use that, or you look it up, have a computer.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: That's also very helpful.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: It expands your resources a lot really quickly.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_02: Totally.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I that's a hundred percent true.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, uh, I think it and on you know, monster manual side, that makes sense for all of that.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_00: Dungeon Master's guide side is more rules-based, right?
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like, how do you adjudicate the game?
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: How do you run the game?
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: What is world building look like if you're interested in that?
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: If you're not looking to run a published adventure, how do you build a combat encounter?
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: What is balance?
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, how do you create those things?
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: So all of that is kind of stored in the dungeon master's guide.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_01: And and I want to pause there really quick because I think with everything that we're saying, this is already very intimidating for somebody that wants to get into this.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Because you're like, because basically what we're saying is, well, you need you need this, so you know this, and you need this so you know this.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that's true, but it's also not true because it's like get your feet wet, especially if you're playing with new players, if you're a first-time DM and you're playing with people who have played one or two times, they're not gonna know the difference.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: So so it's like play your game, it's gonna it's gonna be fine.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: Start with what you got.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: So that kind of leads us to our next kind of question or point is how much do you need to know the rules and when can you break those rules?
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_02: That was a big thing for me of a hesitation in order to jump into the world of DMing, is I never felt like I knew enough of the rules to be able to DM.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'll take that one first.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_00: So that's a good question.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so the way that I approach this, right, is you need to know some, which I know is super vague, but you need you need to know enough to tell the story and realistically kind of keep the story moving forward.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: Now, if you're with brand new players, you may actually need to read a little bit into let's say you're running um a starter kit, because I actually think that's a if you're looking to get into DMing, the starter kit a lot of times has the rules written into it that you need.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: There's typically a section in those booklets that's specifically for the DM that has most of the rules that you will need to run just that encounter or to run that small adventure.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_00: If you're the DM and you're running one of those, I would read that to try to be as prepped as you can.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: But from there, if you've got new players, really it's just kind of guiding them at that point, they're not gonna know that you're wrong.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_00: The rules are there as a guideline, and the moment that they start interfering with the storytelling or players doing incredible things, are there limitations?
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: But are you ever gonna say hard?
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: No, uh I I don't do that very often, and maybe that's a flaw of mine, but I'd much rather them try.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like, sure, make them roll and make it hard.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, if you really don't want it to happen, you can say no.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: If it's really against the rules, yeah, you can say no.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time, if it adds to the story or it's just gonna be fun, don't live in the rules.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's much better to encourage your players to be creative than to slap their hand and be like, no, you can't do that.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: It should be a group storytelling experience.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_00: Don't get caught up in the rules.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: I I agree 100% with you.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: I think the one thing I would I would add to that, and and it's entirely possible that if you're in a group with new players that you may not have the leisure of playing before you DM.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's entirely possible.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: But if you can play before you DM, that will help you a lot.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like being in a group and just playing the game, you'll learn some of those things.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I will say having somebody at your table that has also played helps immensely.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_02: Being able to rely on somebody else to be like, hey, cross-check me on this.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: Is this what we're supposed to do next?
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: Or is this how you make that check, that role, whatever?
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_02: Having somebody there that's a little bit more comfortable in the rules based off based of things, um, frees you up to focus on the story.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_02: So one thing I think we have picked up on our experience DMing is that we each kind of have our own strengths on your play style, your style of DMing, just you as a person, what you're better at than others.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I think uh one of the big things that you can help on is leaning into your strengths as a DM and using those to your advantage.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I agree with that a hundred percent.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: So uh I'm gonna speak to one of Ross's strengths.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_00: So Ross is a very good storyteller, and that's an area that I feel like I am not as strong in.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: But even you know, as a player, I think that you bring that to the table in you know, your fun facts about your character, or you know, we've met collaboratively to start building out the future of the campaign, right?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like creating that storytelling, what's that gonna look like?
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: And that's definitely you know one of your biggest strengths.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: The background of the world-building part of it.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that was kind of one of the funnest parts.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: And our listeners don't know this, but it's like continuing on from that descent into a Vernus campaign.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like we we had an idea because like Phil had had done like visions and things as part of that.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_01: So so you're you are a decent storyteller too.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it the funnest, I think one of the funnest things was that night, I think I don't remember where Brett was, but you came over and we just spent the whole night like basically laying out the path, like things we would know.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't know like the details and where how things are gonna work out or anything like that, but just laying out some of the big picture things was so much fun because like we would sit here and I'd like toss an idea out, and you're like, Well, what if we did this?
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: And then you type, I'd see you type it, type it out, and then be like, now wait a minute, what if we do this?
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_01: And then you type some more.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, God, this is awesome.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: I love this.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so anxious to learn.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it's gonna be so much fun.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_01: Wait to find out so much fun.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: You someday when we get to the review of the second half of this campaign, oh my god, it's gonna be amazing.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_01: I just sent you something last night.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, somebody, somebody kind of had the idea we were thinking of and did a really cool like twist of it.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: And it's yeah, yeah.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, so yeah, so one of one of my biggest strengths is is my storytelling, and and I do really enjoy that.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: And and I think one of the things that like I had fun doing for you guys, like at the beginning of the the curse of Strahd thing, is I had to figure out a way to get you guys into the campaign.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I wrote like essentially it was a short little one-shot where it was like the murder mystery, and you two had known each other already, and that that was a ton of fun for me coming up with that, and it's like it was a different way of storytelling, right?
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's like I came up with like the guideline of the story, and then it was fun presenting that to you, and then you guys like playing it out was a ton of fun.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: Because I I remember Brett's character, um, JP, was like puking because it was like they had to go to a crime scene at one at one point.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's like I was like, there's blood everywhere, and I'll like give me a constitution check, and then JP failed, and he's like barfing everywhere, and it was great.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but but the other key aspect of becoming a DM is knowing the gameplay and like running a game with consistency and doing it really well, Phil.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_01: And that and that's one of the things you really do an amazing job at.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I think some of that just comes with time too, honestly.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: I don't I don't know.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the parts that stick, like as I'm thinking through things of hey, you need to make this check, right?
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like the skills, the the skills tree or whatever.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_00: I for whatever reason that just sticks for me, and it's like, okay, well, this should be like this kind of check.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: Or yeah, what's the difference between a saving throw and a skill check or ability check and an attack?
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't know.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the parts I guess that stick for me.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: But so so I do wonder a little bit, like when you look at like what we do in the real world, like you you work a lot with data, and I think I think that makes a lot of sense for you because it's very detail-oriented, and what's the next step, and how do you do that?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_01: And and I work in the marketing world and and Brett does too, and and we'll get to Brett's strength in here in a minute, but but I think both of our strengths flow into that storytelling because that's what we have to do on a daily basis.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like that didn't occur to me until just now, but it almost fits exactly, really.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: Also, like you guys typically play charisma-based characters, and Phil never plays a charisma-based character.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: That's also just my personality.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_02: You know, Phil, I would say your comfort comfortability with the rules and like how the gameplay works um also helps keep the pace really well.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, like you don't stop and have to go check a book, and that keeps everything moving.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: I also will point that back to our last topic that sometimes I don't know, but you get to a point where it's like we don't want to disrupt where we're at.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: Story over rules.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: We're just gonna make it up, and half the time I do, and you know, you guys can call me on it later if you want to, and I can go check.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: But half the time, uh, we just go for it.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and so and so that that comes to uh something that I was thinking of earlier, and and this is a good point just for incoming DMs to think about, and that's ambiguity in the game.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_01: So we talk a lot about knowing the rules, but even the book itself says that the rules are a guideline.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I think that is honestly at the beginning of the Dungeon Masters Guide, that is the biggest thing of everything that I've ever read in any of the dun the DD books, any of them, is that we present this to you.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: This is the structure of the game that we've come up with, but at the end of the day, you do what you need to do for your party.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I think to your point, Brett, that you were making about Phil, that is exactly what you do well, Phil.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: And that's you fit whatever you need to in at the moment, and you know the rules well enough that you keep it moving, and the gameplay just flows extremely well, and you're very, very good at it.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_00: I'm pretty sure it's in the first chapter, if not even like I guess the first page.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm pretty sure it is too, that it tells you like, hey, these are a guideline, and that's literally what it is.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: So I I want to move on to Brett's strength as well, because one of the things that I think Brett does extremely well, and I've only been able to sit at Brett's DM table once.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but even as a even as a player, it it's very obvious that Brett is very good at improvisation like across the board, whether that's coming up with being a slick used auto salesman or whatever he's gotta do.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but I think that that is one of the things that you bring to the table, both as a player and as a DM.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_02: It's like don't BS a BSer.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like I I'm gonna spin something and talk my way out of anything, whether that's uh on the player side or the DM side, I'm going to freewheel my way around.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, one thing that uh I have learned I have to work on that's not one of my strengths, but I'm learning I need to focus on more as both a player and as a DM.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_02: That Phil, you do this really well to go back to you.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_02: Uh writing notes.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_02: Holy moly.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_02: Uh both as a player and as a DM, the power of note-taking is really, really key.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: And having a shorthand that you know you can follow, uh, and you write down the key information is vital.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_02: I struggle with that.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think that has a lot.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: There's a lot going on, but having notes is really important.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_00: I I think so the three of us are playing in this other campaign right now that our buddy Matt is DMing for us, and I think he would agree based on our most recent session that uh taking notes is hard.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_00: So but you don't want to sacrifice the story.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: So you do have to get to a point where honestly most of them I write after.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I will say, as a improv slash BSer, uh, that's one of my biggest downfalls is I'm gonna BS my way through something, and then it's gonna bite me later on.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_02: So that might be a little hesitation for doing a wrong long-running campaign is uh some of those things are gonna come back and haunt me, but time will tell.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_02: Good news is it's a skill you can you can pick up.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I have faith in you.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: You BS your way into it, you'll BS your way out.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_02: You know, uh one of the things though that one of our last points that we're gonna touch on is one of the biggest hiccups that new DMs do is for the good and the bad is watching Critical Roll.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's a wonderful show, but you are not Matt Mercer, and that's okay.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I mean it's just like anything else.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's like if you if you're ever trying to write a book for yourself and you've read Harry Potter, you've read any of those things, and you're trying to lit like the bar is mile high, right?
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so Matt Mercer sets that bar a mile high, not not just with his storytelling and his note-taking, but it's also his minis and his sets, and then the people he has around him, too.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's like you learn really quick if you're a critical role fan and you want to get into DD that your table is probably not gonna be the same as the critical role table.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's hard to get people into role-playing.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: Remember, these are voice actors that he has surrounding him, they're used to playing other people.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_02: You can tell when somebody's watched an episode of Critical Role for the first time and they're trying to uh lean into that, you can pick up on some traits that they try and assume.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's great.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: I I think critical, I should say, okay, so we need to back up.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: I I think critical role has been great for DD though.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah, because it because it gets people interested, and and if you watch them, they they are legit sit at a table, roll the dice, have fun playing this game.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: So if you if you ever need, you know, to see some people just having fun playing DD and not like struggling through figuring out the rules and stuff, this it's a great way, and they'll get you excited to play.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: But at the end of the day, you're again, your table is not gonna be that table, and that's okay.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_02: They're professional, it's their full-time job.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: Like they're at a different tier, and that that's okay.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: So, looking ahead towards next week, we have a bonus episode coming out for you.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it is our first episode of a special bonus thing called The Opening Crack.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_02: We're pretty excited about it.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, Ross, give us a little breakdown of what we're gonna be in for.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: So, I as as you guys may have heard in the the preview episode that we we posted a little while ago, that we we would have beers and talk about DMing, and we want to get back into the barrels part of Bards and Barrels.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so what we're doing is is you you have definitely heard the opening crack, literally the opening crack at the beginning of a lot of our episodes, pretty much every episode anymore.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but what we want to do now is we want to tell you about that opening crack.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: So, so we're gonna have a beer, essentially a beer of the night, that we're going to review for you and talk about and tell you a little bit about uh and not just like our opinions.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_01: We'll tell you about the beer, we'll tell you where it comes from in the hopes that then you can go out and get that, try it, uh, and support these breweries across the country as well.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: We're hoping to add a little uh DD flare to it as well.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: So Yeah.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're not a D if you're not a beer drinker, that's all right.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, and if you have ideas for other things other than beer, we'd we'd try different types of barrels too.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_02: We'll review anything.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's fine.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: I I do think No seltzers.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: No shots fired.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: Hard line hard line, hard line.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I I I do think it's gonna be kind of fun because one of the things we did a pilot episode to see like if we felt like this was gonna be a thing that we could do and and sustain.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um and part of like we knew we needed to figure out a way to connect DD back to this.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I think one of the things that we'll do, at least to start, we'll probably tweak this as we go, is like, where in Faroon do you find this beer?
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what is the name of the tavern?
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: Where is it at?
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_01: Why do you find it there?
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: Style of the tavern.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: So I I I think we'll we'll have some fun connecting it back to DD.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like it's not just for the beer drinkers out there necessarily, but it's it's gonna have the DD flair to it.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: So it's still gonna fit in with everything else we do.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be a lot of fun.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_02: That's gonna do it for this episode of Bards and Barrels.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, you can listen to any of our old episodes at Bards and Barrels, anywhere podscast can be found.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_02: And hey, if you want to follow us, give us a like and a follow on Facebook and now and on Instagram.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_02: We'll catch you all in the next episode.