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BPS 487: The Brutal Truth About Making Horror Movies with Harrison Smith · Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast

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  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bulletproof screen Writing Podcast, Episode number four
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  Speaker 1: eighty seven.
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  Speaker 3: Assumptions allow the best in life to pass you by?
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  Speaker 2: that next draft. It's the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you
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  Speaker 2: the craft and business of screenwriting while teaching you how
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  Speaker 2: to make your screenplay bulletproof. And here's your host, Alex Ferrari.
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  Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast.
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  Speaker 4: I am your humble host Alex Ferrari.
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  Speaker 3: Now, today's show is sponsored by Bulletproof script Coverage.
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  Speaker 3: Enjoy today's episode with guest host Dave Bullis.
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  Speaker 4: Joining me today is Harrison Smith. Harrison is actually the
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  Speaker 4: second person from Philly that I've actually had on my podcast,
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  Speaker 4: the other being David Greenberg. There's aren't a lot of
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  Speaker 4: filmmakers in Philly who've been on the podcast yet, but
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  Speaker 4: Harrison's the second one. Harrison is the writer producer for
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  Speaker 4: The Fields and Six Degrees of Hell starring Corey Feldman.
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  Speaker 4: Harrison made his directorial debut with the feature Camp Dread,
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  Speaker 4: which then Harrison followed up with Zombie Killers Elephant Graveyard.
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  Speaker 4: His upcoming film Death House is being called the expendables
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  Speaker 4: for the horror genre. Harrison, thank you very much coming
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  Speaker 4: on the show.
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  Speaker 5: Thanks you, OK, it's really nice to be here and
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  Speaker 5: thanks for taking the time to want to talk to me.
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  Speaker 4: Oh my, my pleasure. Harrison you know, Harrison, you know,
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  Speaker 4: just to get started, you know, with everything.
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  Speaker 5: You know.
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  Speaker 4: I wanted to ask, you know, growing up, did you always,
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  Speaker 4: you know, have an affinity for film or did you
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  Speaker 4: know from a young age that you wanted to go
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  Speaker 4: into the film industry?
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  Speaker 5: Yeah? Absolutely, In the Fields. If anybody has watched my
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  Speaker 5: film In the Fields, this shows a lot that I'd
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  Speaker 5: spent a lot of time with my grandparents growing up.
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  Speaker 5: My grandmother loved movies, especially horror films, so I spent
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  Speaker 5: a lot of time on Saturday afternoons with Creature Feature
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  Speaker 5: and Doctor Shock from Philadelphia and Creature Double Feature, all
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  Speaker 5: those things. And so by the time I was like
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  Speaker 5: eight years old, I knew the names of Vincent, Prise, Peter, Lorie, Boris, Karlov, Bello, Legosi,
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  Speaker 5: all of them. And so when my mom took me
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  Speaker 5: to see Jaws at the age of eight, I was
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  Speaker 5: in nineteen seventy five. I saw it in theaters. I
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  Speaker 5: knew when I walked out of that theater, It's like,
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  Speaker 5: this is what I want to do. Jaws is the
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  Speaker 5: movie that made me want to make movies.
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  Speaker 4: You know, that's very cool, you know, it's always interesting
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  Speaker 4: to hear everyone's background, because some people really take to
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  Speaker 4: horror at a young age, Like I remember myself, Harrison,
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  Speaker 4: you know, watching horror movies at a very young age,
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  Speaker 4: and you just be like, Wow, this is just absolutely amazing,
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  Speaker 4: you know, and you know it's just it's really just
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  Speaker 4: really cool how we can just sort of take that
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  Speaker 4: and you know, make a career out of it. So
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  Speaker 4: you know, I was just taking all that, Harrison, did
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  Speaker 4: you decide to go to film school or did you
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  Speaker 4: go another route to get to actually do it? For
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  Speaker 4: a link?
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  Speaker 5: I wanted to make movies. Like I said, I was
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  Speaker 5: making movies as a boy growing up. I did it
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  Speaker 5: all through school, middle school, high school, the whole thing.
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  Speaker 5: I had a local cable TV show, a comedy show
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  Speaker 5: with my brother in it, and I decided, well, you know,
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  Speaker 5: I guess when you're in high school the thing you
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  Speaker 5: want to do is one of them. I wanted to
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  Speaker 5: do was backpack through Europe. And my mom was like
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  Speaker 5: absolutely not, like you're going to you don't go. You'll
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  Speaker 5: never go that kind of thing. And so I ended
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  Speaker 5: up going to Penn State, where I didn't even last
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  Speaker 5: a semester and a half. I mean, I just partied
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  Speaker 5: my way right out of Penn State. So you know,
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  Speaker 5: I went to LA I ended up getting a job
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  Speaker 5: at Universal Studios at Los Angeles where I worked out there,
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  Speaker 5: made a lot of connections, a lot of you know,
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  Speaker 5: got a lot of knowledge. I think I learned more
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  Speaker 5: working on the set of Universal than I did, you know,
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  Speaker 5: going to school. But I really didn't give it the
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  Speaker 5: old college try either, however, I don't. I'm I'm still
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  Speaker 5: on the fence about film school. I'm not one to
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  Speaker 5: ever discount education. I mean, I have, you know, my
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  Speaker 5: master's degrees and all of that stuff. However, to go
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  Speaker 5: to school for film not quite so sure about that.
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  Speaker 5: I mean, I know it can teach you certain things,
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  Speaker 5: especially in the way of you know, like let's say,
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  Speaker 5: even computer design, you know, animation. You have to learn
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  Speaker 5: those things, and I get it. I'm still not sure
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  Speaker 5: about where I stand on where if you can teach talent,
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  Speaker 5: you either have that creative ability and most of all
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  Speaker 5: that gumption to get up and do it. I mean,
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  Speaker 5: the number one thing that any good film production class
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  Speaker 5: should teach is you go out and you do it.
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  Speaker 5: That's it. You can't teach how to produce. You only
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  Speaker 5: know by doing it. John Carpenter will say that, I mean,
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  Speaker 5: you grab a camera and you go out and you shoot.
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  Speaker 5: Dean Kundy will back me up on that. You know,
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  Speaker 5: to sit in a class in front of a textbook
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  Speaker 5: and watch movies or whatever, you can learn things. Yes,
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  Speaker 5: I'm never discounting that, but what I am saying is
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  Speaker 5: that you got to get out there and do it.
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  Speaker 5: It's as simple as that. If you want to make movies,
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  Speaker 5: go make movies. That's the best advice that I have.
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  Speaker 4: And you know that's actually similar advice to aarison from
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  Speaker 4: from some of the other guests. So I'm always interested
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  Speaker 4: to know, you know, if the guests went to film
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  Speaker 4: school or not. And it's always you know, interesting to see,
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  Speaker 4: you know what, if they did, do they feel they
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  Speaker 4: gained anything from it, And if they didn't, do they
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  Speaker 4: do they kind of wish they did. And it's just
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  Speaker 4: interesting because you know, and you mentioned it yourself, you know,
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  Speaker 4: you don't want to, you know, discount education, but it's
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  Speaker 4: just interesting to see everyone's sort of path to in
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  Speaker 4: this industry.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, we're in a society now, Dave, where
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  Speaker 5: most filmmakers will tell you that we're we're in a
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  Speaker 5: spectator's society. We're in a society where everybody can get
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  Speaker 5: online and be a critic. But my answer always back
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  Speaker 5: is very simple, and that is, and what film did
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  Speaker 5: you make?
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  Speaker 4: Oh?
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  Speaker 5: You've made nothing, but you snark on the internet and
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  Speaker 5: put anonymous comments on and uh, we've now confused the
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  Speaker 5: line between true criticism, which is great, and reviews, which
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  Speaker 5: are not reviews. They're they're not they're they're just they're
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  Speaker 5: they're just posts their comments on on IMDb or Amazon
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  Speaker 5: or YouTube. Uh, you know, like like for example, look,
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  Speaker 5: I don't know where I stand on the new Ghostbusters movie.
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  Speaker 5: I mean quite frankly, I just really don't care. If
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  Speaker 5: it's good great, and if it isn't, oh well, But
• 7:04
  Speaker 5: you know the amount of piss and vinegar that came
• 7:08
  Speaker 5: out for that trailer, mostly from people that have never
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  Speaker 5: made a film. They don't know what goes into it,
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  Speaker 5: They have no idea what it happened, and most of
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  Speaker 5: them they're judging something based on a thirty second trailer
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  Speaker 5: sixty second trailer. So I mean, look, you and I
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  Speaker 5: both know we've seen trailers where something looks awesome and
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  Speaker 5: then you get there and you found out you saw
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  Speaker 5: the best parts in the trailer and the movie is
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  Speaker 5: nothing like that. So we're in a very spectator society,
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  Speaker 5: I guess is my point where we're losing the ability,
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  Speaker 5: not all of us, but people lose the ability to
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  Speaker 5: understand what really goes into something like film is not
• 7:43
  Speaker 5: a product, and the moment that film becomes product, it
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  Speaker 5: loses its intent and its magic. Film is a laborious process.
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  Speaker 5: Any independent filmmaker listening to me now knows that whether
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  Speaker 5: your budget is five thousand bucks or five million bucks,
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  Speaker 5: the same amount of effort goes into it. You're it's
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  Speaker 5: all relative. And for the critics, they just go, oh,
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  Speaker 5: it didn't have those great special effects, so it doesn't
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  Speaker 5: have this, it doesn't have a star in it. Well, yeah,
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  Speaker 5: that's because you're sitting somewhere on a laptop, a computer,
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  Speaker 5: your cell phone, and you don't do it. You're not
• 8:14
  Speaker 5: out there doing it. You're not out there dealing with
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  Speaker 5: how do you feed a crew, how do you where
• 8:17
  Speaker 5: do you lodge people, dealing with permits from cities or
• 8:21
  Speaker 5: or any of that. So we've become a very comment
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  Speaker 5: based society, and and that's that's tough for anybody listening
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  Speaker 5: to me that's out there, and they're putting their neck
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  Speaker 5: on the line, and they're they're, you know, taking someone's
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  Speaker 5: money that has been invested into them and trusted into
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  Speaker 5: them to make the best possible product for a return
• 8:39
  Speaker 5: on investment.
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: You know, there's an account on Twitter called Amazon Movie Reviews,
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  Speaker 4: and it actually it harvests all of the most weird,
• 8:48
  Speaker 4: craziest movie reviews, and some of the time you'll see
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: like a one star review Wolf of Wall Streets as
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: one of the most rememorable ones. It was one star review.
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  Speaker 4: There were no wolves in this movie.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, and that's what you're up against, right This is
• 9:04
  Speaker 5: this is definitely what we're up against. There's one guy
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  Speaker 5: on YouTube and I have a post. I publish a
• 9:10
  Speaker 5: series of film articles called Cinema cyn e m A
• 9:14
  Speaker 5: and it's on horror fuel dot com. It's hosted over there,
• 9:17
  Speaker 5: and you know, I talk about cynicism and filmmaking and
• 9:21
  Speaker 5: how dangerous it is. And I did a swipe at
• 9:25
  Speaker 5: these supposed online movie bloggers and reviewers. Look, I have
• 9:29
  Speaker 5: no problem with somebody qualified watching one of my films
• 9:33
  Speaker 5: and going, well, I didn't care for it. And here's
• 9:35
  Speaker 5: the empirical data as to why that's fine. What I
• 9:39
  Speaker 5: don't like is, you know, I've had people, for example,
• 9:42
  Speaker 5: here's one in a review where they absolutely love Camp Drett.
• 9:47
  Speaker 5: I mean, they did nothing but praise this movie, Dave.
• 9:50
  Speaker 5: And then then at the end they go, it's it's
• 9:53
  Speaker 5: probably the best sequel to sleep Away Camp that they've made.
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: and now back to the show.
• 10:06
  Speaker 5: Well, you just blew the entire review. My Camp Dread
• 10:09
  Speaker 5: is not a sequel, and it is not affiliated with
• 10:12
  Speaker 5: Sleepaway Camp in any way other than that FeliCa Rose
• 10:15
  Speaker 5: stars in the film, but she is not Angela Baker,
• 10:17
  Speaker 5: and it has nothing to do with that original storyline.
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  Speaker 5: So all the praise that they heaped on my film
• 10:22
  Speaker 5: tells me nothing, because you didn't watch it properly, you
• 10:26
  Speaker 5: did not even look at it. And then you have
• 10:28
  Speaker 5: others that claim the reviewers. And one guy in Camp
• 10:31
  Speaker 5: Dread said, well, you know, Smith thinks it's creative to
• 10:34
  Speaker 5: kill somebody at the end with a watermelon shot at
• 10:36
  Speaker 5: their head. It's pretty damn clear that that's not a
• 10:39
  Speaker 5: watermelon that's in that slang. So and then when I
• 10:42
  Speaker 5: contacted the guy and I said, look, I understand you
• 10:45
  Speaker 5: may not have liked all of Camp Dread or that
• 10:47
  Speaker 5: the ending put you off, but your information is incorrect.
• 10:51
  Speaker 5: There is no watermelon at the end, and anybody who's
• 10:54
  Speaker 5: seen the film and listening to me right now knows
• 10:56
  Speaker 5: that is not the case at all. And then the
• 10:58
  Speaker 5: guy said, oh, yeah, I guess you know I didn't
• 11:01
  Speaker 5: write this review until a couple of weeks after it.
• 11:03
  Speaker 5: I guess I didn't look at my notes. You don't
• 11:05
  Speaker 5: need notes for that. That's like saying at the end
• 11:07
  Speaker 5: of Jaws, you know it's a shame that they launched
• 11:10
  Speaker 5: a shark into space. No, they blew it up with
• 11:13
  Speaker 5: a tank in its mouth. Oh well, I didn't have
• 11:15
  Speaker 5: my notes. How do you forget something like that? So
• 11:19
  Speaker 5: that's that's the issue. I think that's out there now,
• 11:21
  Speaker 5: that films are being looked upon as just product and
• 11:24
  Speaker 5: they're not being looked upon as you know, something special
• 11:28
  Speaker 5: or the people are working very hard on. And not
• 11:31
  Speaker 5: all films people are working very hard on. I mean,
• 11:33
  Speaker 5: there's truly some bad films out there that people have
• 11:36
  Speaker 5: that American idol attitude that they think theirs is the greatest.
• 11:39
  Speaker 5: But I don't think we have a very well educated
• 11:42
  Speaker 5: audience out there. I really don't so with horror, like
• 11:45
  Speaker 5: you said, there were no wolves in this film. Now,
• 11:47
  Speaker 5: if that's a legitimate post and somebody was really expecting
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: a wolf or a were wolf or whatever it may be,
• 11:55
  Speaker 5: that's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Like I said,
• 11:57
  Speaker 5: there's a guy on YouTube that does his review under
• 12:01
  Speaker 5: a sheet like as I guess, he's like the unknown reviewer,
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: and and it's just a shtick. There's there's no film
• 12:07
  Speaker 5: analysis there, there's no criticism, there's there's nothing there other
• 12:11
  Speaker 5: than that this guy thinks it's just really funny to
• 12:13
  Speaker 5: have a stupid gimmick like being under a sheet and
• 12:16
  Speaker 5: making fun of movies. I guess, yeah, maybe there's an
• 12:19
  Speaker 5: audience for that. But then you have somebody as brilliant
• 12:22
  Speaker 5: as a Red Letter Media with you know, mister Plinkett's reviews,
• 12:26
  Speaker 5: where I think his Star Wars critique should be studied
• 12:29
  Speaker 5: in film school. I think he's brilliant.
• 12:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Red Letter Media. I've actually seen all all of
• 12:34
  Speaker 4: their videos and yeah, I concur that there. Their Star
• 12:38
  Speaker 4: Wars analysis is absolutely phenomenal. I actually had a professor
• 12:42
  Speaker 4: when I was in college actually bring that up and
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: he said, he actually showed a few minutes of it,
• 12:46
  Speaker 4: and he goes, Guys, when you go home, make sure
• 12:48
  Speaker 4: you check this out. It is absolutely well, so well
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: done because it's funny, but it's also insightful to say,
• 12:53
  Speaker 4: see it's brilliant.
• 12:54
  Speaker 5: I mean, you know, and he and he assesses so
• 12:56
  Speaker 5: much more than just film criticism. He's he's looking at
• 12:59
  Speaker 5: the entire scope of the picture that allowed these movies
• 13:02
  Speaker 5: to be made. And what I loved is is they
• 13:04
  Speaker 5: have a recent post now where he's he's like, instead
• 13:08
  Speaker 5: of the Force awakens, plank And awakens like he's been
• 13:11
  Speaker 5: asleep for so long. And you know this this retro
• 13:15
  Speaker 5: view now that oh, maybe the prequels weren't as bad
• 13:19
  Speaker 5: as we said, and oh the Internet drove poor George
• 13:21
  Speaker 5: Lucas away from the Star Wars franchise, and now there's
• 13:24
  Speaker 5: this ridiculous thing that you know, we want him back
• 13:26
  Speaker 5: to direct episode nine, No no, And Plankett adamantly supports
• 13:32
  Speaker 5: why this this should not be and and all of
• 13:36
  Speaker 5: the like I said, the overall general big picture stuff
• 13:40
  Speaker 5: that that contributed to a series of films that were
• 13:43
  Speaker 5: not very good at all and and really flew in
• 13:46
  Speaker 5: the face of of what drove the original and its
• 13:49
  Speaker 5: subsequent sequels, and and that's that's what I'm talking about.
• 13:53
  Speaker 5: We there's too much information out there now, Dave and
• 13:56
  Speaker 5: and a lot of people just you know, they think, well,
• 13:58
  Speaker 5: my opinion is the only one that should be heard.
• 14:00
  Speaker 5: So we have now this my technology, Trump's experience kind
• 14:05
  Speaker 5: of thing. That's how I feel.
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: You know, there was a documentary about episode one and
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: when they were actually watching the cut of The Phantom Menace,
• 14:14
  Speaker 4: and George said something like, see, Jorge jar is the
• 14:17
  Speaker 4: key to all this. If we can get him working,
• 14:19
  Speaker 4: it makes everything else work, or something along those lines.
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: And it was just very interesting to see how that
• 14:24
  Speaker 4: all sort of came together because I think in that process,
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: I think, you know, obviously there was a reliance on
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: CGI and special effects and you know, putting on the
• 14:33
  Speaker 4: actors in a complete green screen and a green screen room.
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: You know, it's just very interesting to see, you know,
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: how those movies were shot. And the only real defense
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: I've ever seen of those movies for like, you know,
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: people who like the old Star Wars episodes, you know, four, five,
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: and six, they always say about episodes one, two, and three,
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: they were mainly for kids, and I don't really know
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: if that's true or not.
• 14:53
  Speaker 5: If you know what I mean, I agree, I don't
• 14:57
  Speaker 5: know what. Look, I'm not George Lucas and I could
• 14:59
  Speaker 5: only wish to rack up his type of failures. Okay,
• 15:04
  Speaker 5: so it's hard to say on that. I mean, I
• 15:08
  Speaker 5: wrote a two part essay on it when George was
• 15:11
  Speaker 5: out there belly aching about how unfairly he was treated
• 15:15
  Speaker 5: or alienated from the process this time around of making
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: the new Star Wars film, The Force Awakens. And my answer,
• 15:24
  Speaker 5: quite frankly, is Disney. I'm not a big Disney champion
• 15:28
  Speaker 5: nor fan, and yet I felt Disney did the absolute
• 15:31
  Speaker 5: right thing, and that is they gave him a check
• 15:32
  Speaker 5: for four billion dollars and told him to be happy
• 15:34
  Speaker 5: to be on his way. And I think that was
• 15:36
  Speaker 5: the smartest thing that Disney could have done. They made
• 15:39
  Speaker 5: it very clear, we're not interested in your ideas, we're
• 15:41
  Speaker 5: not interested in your outlines. Thanks for all you've done
• 15:45
  Speaker 5: and contributed to this genre and this film series, and
• 15:48
  Speaker 5: we wish you well. And I think that was a
• 15:51
  Speaker 5: very smart business move. And obviously the box office performance
• 15:54
  Speaker 5: and overall reception to the Force Awakens I think reflects that.
• 16:00
  Speaker 5: I think The Force Awakens was the proper way to
• 16:03
  Speaker 5: do things, to kind of like reset the franchise. Yes,
• 16:07
  Speaker 5: it relied incredibly on nostalgia. Yeah, you could argue that
• 16:11
  Speaker 5: it's a remake of a New Hope. I get all
• 16:14
  Speaker 5: of that, but there was really almost no other way
• 16:16
  Speaker 5: that it could be done because of the damage that
• 16:18
  Speaker 5: had been inflicted by those three prequels, and so saying
• 16:22
  Speaker 5: that the excuses while they worrying for children, my question is, well,
• 16:26
  Speaker 5: who the hell asked you to do that? Since when
• 16:28
  Speaker 5: did Star Wars become predominantly just for children? And why
• 16:31
  Speaker 5: would you alienate an entire generation that grew up on
• 16:35
  Speaker 5: those films and shut them out of the picture to
• 16:37
  Speaker 5: make movies for that generation's kids. No one asked you
• 16:40
  Speaker 5: to do that, There was no demand for any of that.
• 16:44
  Speaker 5: It's almost arrogance if that was Lucas's intent. My question
• 16:48
  Speaker 5: is is who the hell asked you to do that?
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah? And also the reason I don't believe that either
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: is because you know, the storyline in episode one, for instance,
• 16:56
  Speaker 4: is very very convoluted, and also the you know at
• 17:01
  Speaker 4: the end, you know Darth Maul gets chopped into two
• 17:03
  Speaker 4: and QUI gon Jindie and I was like that that
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: wouldn't be a kid's movie.
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: And that's what I mean.
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: It is.
• 17:09
  Speaker 5: You're right, it is. It's a very poor excuse. What
• 17:12
  Speaker 5: it comes down to is in my opinion, and it's
• 17:15
  Speaker 5: nothing I wouldn't say to George Lucas to his face,
• 17:17
  Speaker 5: because apparently people have said, I know, Frank Darabant has
• 17:20
  Speaker 5: pretty much said worse to him, and Lucas just stares
• 17:22
  Speaker 5: back at you, like George Lucas, so I don't think
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: he really cares. I think the issue really comes down
• 17:30
  Speaker 5: to is you have the Elvis principle, and that is,
• 17:33
  Speaker 5: you know, he became so big, no one's going to
• 17:36
  Speaker 5: tell him no, so you have an Emperor's new clothes
• 17:39
  Speaker 5: kind of situation. Once that first draft of The Phantom
• 17:42
  Speaker 5: Menace was done, it really needed to go through a
• 17:44
  Speaker 5: team and have people go George now that the dialogue
• 17:48
  Speaker 5: is horrendous. And by the way, George is the first
• 17:50
  Speaker 5: one to admit in many of his interviews he hates
• 17:53
  Speaker 5: the writing process and he knows his dialogue as wooden,
• 17:56
  Speaker 5: instilted and not good. He's very much aware of that,
• 17:59
  Speaker 5: and he even admits so much to say that he
• 18:01
  Speaker 5: really doesn't care for directing all that much. So why
• 18:05
  Speaker 5: is he allowed to do this? That was the question. Well,
• 18:08
  Speaker 5: the answer is simple. He financed all those prequels out
• 18:11
  Speaker 5: of his own pockets. So when you do that, you
• 18:12
  Speaker 5: can do whatever the hell you want. I mean, there's
• 18:15
  Speaker 5: a video I saw somewhere of one of the assistant
• 18:20
  Speaker 5: producers sitting with him in a room going, oh okay, George.
• 18:23
  Speaker 5: So I assume on set you'll be the one to
• 18:27
  Speaker 5: yell action and cut. Could we suck up to this
• 18:29
  Speaker 5: guy anymore?
• 18:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 18:33
  Speaker 5: Guess who yells action and cut? The director unless you
• 18:36
  Speaker 5: want to be the first a d and do it,
• 18:37
  Speaker 5: because they do that as well too. What kind of
• 18:41
  Speaker 5: a stupid conversation is that? Anyway? You know, somebody needed
• 18:45
  Speaker 5: to tell him this is not a good script. When
• 18:49
  Speaker 5: the opening crawl, that title crawl comes out and it
• 18:52
  Speaker 5: says the Phantom Menace, and at about one paragraph into
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: a three sentences or so, five sentences or so into
• 18:57
  Speaker 5: this thing we're talking about, you know, block caids, planetary
• 19:01
  Speaker 5: blockades and trade federations and tariffs and all, I'm like,
• 19:05
  Speaker 5: oh my god, can my eyes glaze over? I mean
• 19:07
  Speaker 5: I knew within the first thirty seconds of that crawl
• 19:11
  Speaker 5: we're in trouble, and we were you know that, And
• 19:15
  Speaker 5: you just kind of approach those films as if you know, well,
• 19:19
  Speaker 5: I'll go see Attack of the Clones because it really
• 19:21
  Speaker 5: couldn't be any worse than the Phantom Menace. We'll guess
• 19:23
  Speaker 5: what it was. And then even with Revenge of the Sith, well,
• 19:27
  Speaker 5: i mean, everybody's saying this is the darkest one. Oh,
• 19:29
  Speaker 5: this is it? No? That really that Darth Vader ending
• 19:34
  Speaker 5: that No, that was something you'd see on the Simpsons,
• 19:37
  Speaker 5: you know, and when people are sitting in that theater
• 19:40
  Speaker 5: laughing and it's unintentional laughter. I mean it was.
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: It was bad.
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: It was just bad, you know. And and it's one
• 19:47
  Speaker 5: of those again, it's the Emperor's new clothes. Nobody wants
• 19:50
  Speaker 5: to say it's bad because it's Star Wars.
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 19:59
  Speaker 5: And now the show, well guess what they were back
• 20:04
  Speaker 5: from a production sense, No, they're beautifully made, they're richly textured.
• 20:08
  Speaker 5: You know, you have top of the line stars in them. Look,
• 20:11
  Speaker 5: there's the reason why, there's a reason why this guy
• 20:14
  Speaker 5: isn't out there being proud and talking about his contribution
• 20:17
  Speaker 5: to the Star Wars franchise. You know, the story is
• 20:21
  Speaker 5: is that he signed on without a script. He wanted
• 20:24
  Speaker 5: to be in Star Wars. Well you got it, and
• 20:27
  Speaker 5: he wasn't the only one who got taken. We all
• 20:29
  Speaker 5: got taken, you know. I mean we waited twenty years
• 20:33
  Speaker 5: for that, to explain Midichlorian, you know, to explain the
• 20:37
  Speaker 5: Force as almost a genetic kind of of situation. Why
• 20:41
  Speaker 5: do we need that? Nobody asked for that. We didn't
• 20:44
  Speaker 5: ask for any of this. It's like now with this
• 20:46
  Speaker 5: whole remake thing, Oh, we're gonna go back and give
• 20:49
  Speaker 5: Jason Voorhees a backstory? Do we really need that? Do
• 20:53
  Speaker 5: we really need a backstory to Michael Myers and Jason Vorhees?
• 20:56
  Speaker 5: Oh so, in Rob Zombi's Halloween, Michael Myers is the
• 20:59
  Speaker 5: way that he is because his mom was a stripper
• 21:02
  Speaker 5: and his dad was, you know, a wife beater, and
• 21:04
  Speaker 5: oh that's why he's Why do we need that? Do
• 21:07
  Speaker 5: we need to explain a tornado? Sometimes bad shit just happens.
• 21:11
  Speaker 5: Sometimes bad things happen to good people and there is
• 21:14
  Speaker 5: no explanation Michael Myers I always compared to in the
• 21:18
  Speaker 5: original seventy film is a tornado. He touches down in Haddenfield.
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: This is before the subplot of Jennie Lee Curtis is
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: his sister and all that soap opera garbage. But he
• 21:28
  Speaker 5: touched down in a town. He's evil, he was born evil.
• 21:32
  Speaker 5: Doctor Loomis said it best, like this kid is just evil.
• 21:35
  Speaker 5: That's it. We don't need any other explanation. We don't
• 21:38
  Speaker 5: need that. You know, he tortured animals, and he was
• 21:41
  Speaker 5: picked on, and he loved his mom, but his mom
• 21:43
  Speaker 5: was beaten. And why do we need any of that?
• 21:45
  Speaker 5: I mean, it's just fluff to make people feel like
• 21:48
  Speaker 5: they're getting something more.
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: In my opinion, I wasn't a big fan of the
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: remake of The Halloweens, nor did I like the remake
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: of Friday the Thirteenth, because that when I you know,
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: I I remember watching that was and I thought to myself, Wow,
• 22:03
  Speaker 4: I don't know what I just saw there. I remember
• 22:06
  Speaker 4: like two things from that movie right now, because usually
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: most movies I can remember pretty well, that one not
• 22:12
  Speaker 4: so much. I remember something about a bus and Jason
• 22:14
  Speaker 4: popping out of it.
• 22:15
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you know. That's what I mean, Like, that's cynicism
• 22:19
  Speaker 5: and filmmaking, and that's what I write about a lot,
• 22:22
  Speaker 5: and that is was this trip even necessary? Why not
• 22:26
  Speaker 5: go back?
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: Then?
• 22:27
  Speaker 5: If you're gonna remake stuff, remake the bad movies, why
• 22:30
  Speaker 5: are we remaking the good ones? There's no need to
• 22:33
  Speaker 5: remake John Carpenter's Halloween. There's no needs, there's no need,
• 22:38
  Speaker 5: there's no reason whatsoever to do this none. And you know,
• 22:43
  Speaker 5: people can say, well, it's to update it? What's there
• 22:45
  Speaker 5: to update? Do we need to update Gone with the Wind?
• 22:48
  Speaker 5: Do we need to take it out of the Civil
• 22:50
  Speaker 5: War and update it to I don't know, Iraq, Do
• 22:52
  Speaker 5: we need to do this? I don't see the need
• 22:55
  Speaker 5: for any of this. Everybody falls on that, Well, we're
• 22:58
  Speaker 5: updating the movie. Story is a good story? Do we
• 23:01
  Speaker 5: do we need to update you know anything? You know,
• 23:04
  Speaker 5: like the legend is sleepy hollow? Do we need to
• 23:05
  Speaker 5: rewrite that? Should we be rewriting Stephen King's carry in
• 23:09
  Speaker 5: the future? And people go, oh, that's ridiculous, Well, why
• 23:11
  Speaker 5: is it any different with remaking a movie? Does Jaws
• 23:14
  Speaker 5: really need to be updated? What because some of the
• 23:16
  Speaker 5: cars look old? Because they don't have cell phones in them.
• 23:20
  Speaker 5: That this is stupid, It's just dumb.
• 23:23
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I concur you know, whenever I hear about somebody's
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: moves being remade. I mean, we you mentioned Ghostbusters earlier
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: when they when they were gonna you know, I know
• 23:32
  Speaker 4: there's a female version of Ghostbusters, and I heard them
• 23:34
  Speaker 4: there's gonna be a male version of Ghostbusters. I don't
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: know if they're if they're necessarily a remake or a
• 23:41
  Speaker 4: SEQL prequel type deal. But I'm always wondering, you know,
• 23:45
  Speaker 4: is you know what's the intent behind this?
• 23:48
  Speaker 5: I don't know, you know, I I it would be
• 23:51
  Speaker 5: like like I don't care that it's in all female Ghostbusters.
• 23:54
  Speaker 5: Like it's almost like that's a deliberate distraction to get
• 23:57
  Speaker 5: people talking, Like you're almost doing it deliberate to stir
• 24:00
  Speaker 5: things up. Why is that even an issue? I don't care.
• 24:03
  Speaker 5: I mean, what if they were all black? What if
• 24:05
  Speaker 5: they were all Asian? Is it an all Asian Ghostbusters?
• 24:08
  Speaker 5: Is it in all black Ghostbusters? Who cares? If the
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: movie's funny, go see them, Go see the movie? Who cares?
• 24:15
  Speaker 5: Who cares if it's all women? Who cares if it's
• 24:17
  Speaker 5: all animated? I don't care. Just make a good movie.
• 24:21
  Speaker 5: But we create these things now to generate the buzz
• 24:25
  Speaker 5: on the internet, to get people talking and fighting and
• 24:28
  Speaker 5: bickering back and forth. Because in the end, it's the
• 24:31
  Speaker 5: old theory that you know, there is no such thing
• 24:33
  Speaker 5: as bad publicity. So I'm sure that Apatou and everybody
• 24:37
  Speaker 5: were really upset that, you know, there was such hatred
• 24:39
  Speaker 5: for the Ghostbusters trailer that came out because they're sitting back,
• 24:43
  Speaker 5: going but you're talking about it. Yeah, now it's trending.
• 24:46
  Speaker 5: It's everybody's the pre awareness on the project is amazing.
• 24:50
  Speaker 5: And let's just say it is a terrible film. It's
• 24:53
  Speaker 5: not gonna matter because people a lot of people will
• 24:55
  Speaker 5: go just to see if it is that terrible.
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and that is very true when you know, and
• 25:01
  Speaker 4: you know, as we were talking earlier about, you know,
• 25:02
  Speaker 4: everyone sort of has a blog. You know, reminded me
• 25:04
  Speaker 4: of this, you know of a couple of different filmmaking blogs,
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: and I would stumble upon, you know, maybe you know,
• 25:09
  Speaker 4: a year or so ago, and it would be people
• 25:11
  Speaker 4: you know who went to film school who never really
• 25:14
  Speaker 4: made a film, just like you know, like you were saying, Harrison,
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: and they were they it seems like they wanted to,
• 25:20
  Speaker 4: but it was just a rather an easier way just
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: to sort of watch movies and then just make these
• 25:27
  Speaker 4: like real snarky comments about them.
• 25:30
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's a different when you go to a football
• 25:32
  Speaker 5: game and some big fat load is sitting behind you
• 25:35
  Speaker 5: talking about how the coach made a bad move here
• 25:38
  Speaker 5: and that player can't run. Really fat ass, get down
• 25:40
  Speaker 5: on the field and go run.
• 25:43
  Speaker 4: You know that.
• 25:44
  Speaker 5: That's how I feel, you know, And it's it's no
• 25:46
  Speaker 5: different than a musician, anybody out there who's working. It's
• 25:50
  Speaker 5: like teachers, you know, you get everybody. Oh, teachers get
• 25:53
  Speaker 5: you know, three months off and they're overpaid. Really go
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: in and do their job. Okay, go in and do it. Look,
• 26:00
  Speaker 5: I was a teacher, and I can tell you the
• 26:02
  Speaker 5: people that complain, I'll give you five days. You won't
• 26:05
  Speaker 5: make it three, but I'll give you five. And it's
• 26:08
  Speaker 5: no different than construction. It's no different than anything that
• 26:12
  Speaker 5: you're out there in your work and your butt off,
• 26:14
  Speaker 5: and there's always somebody to comment. So it doesn't just
• 26:17
  Speaker 5: apply to filmmaking. You know. Yeah, maybe I'm not in
• 26:20
  Speaker 5: George Lucas's shoes. It's very easy for me to sit
• 26:22
  Speaker 5: back and critique, because you know, I'm not making one
• 26:25
  Speaker 5: hundred and fifty million dollar motion picture. But when you see, look,
• 26:29
  Speaker 5: all good films start in one place, and that is
• 26:32
  Speaker 5: with a script. You don't need a giant staff and
• 26:35
  Speaker 5: you don't need a mega empire to write a good story.
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: And the issue with all of the prequels comes down
• 26:41
  Speaker 5: to one thing. It's on that page. That's it. You know,
• 26:46
  Speaker 5: you can once you if you don't have, you're not
• 26:48
  Speaker 5: improving on a bad script. That's all. And believe it
• 26:51
  Speaker 5: or not, the computers still can't take that writing job over.
• 26:54
  Speaker 5: They still can't write a good movie yet. So it
• 26:58
  Speaker 5: still comes down to telling a good story. And those
• 27:01
  Speaker 5: three films did not have good stories. And it's that simple,
• 27:06
  Speaker 5: you know.
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: Harrison's funny you mentioned that because I was actually talking
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: to a past guest about that just recently, because she
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: posted an article about a new screenwriting algorithm software and
• 27:17
  Speaker 4: they and she said to me, you know, one day,
• 27:20
  Speaker 4: she was like, are they just you know, are studio
• 27:22
  Speaker 4: execs just going to literally try to bang out a
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: script by hitting a button saying like, okay, I want
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: a superhero movie with this and this and this enter
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: and you know, and you know, it'll go through a
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: million computations and all of a sudden, you know, outcomes
• 27:39
  Speaker 4: a hundred, one hundred and twenty page screenplay and they go, oh,
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: this is our next block bus.
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: And in some ways, didn't we have that with Jurassic World.
• 27:48
  Speaker 5: Jurassic World is not a screenplay. I love when they
• 27:50
  Speaker 5: say written by it's it's a to do list, that's
• 27:54
  Speaker 5: all it is. I mean, they basically remade all the
• 27:57
  Speaker 5: best scenes out of Jurassic Park and they stitched it
• 28:00
  Speaker 5: together with some threadbare story. So it's an algorithm, that's
• 28:03
  Speaker 5: all it is. Right, Introduce the kids, get the kids
• 28:06
  Speaker 5: in trouble, rescue the kids, and in between, intersperse it
• 28:09
  Speaker 5: with some dinosaur action and give us a Godzilla ending,
• 28:12
  Speaker 5: because that's basically what we got. The Tyrannosaurus walks off,
• 28:16
  Speaker 5: you know, as the embattled hero like Godzilla walked off
• 28:19
  Speaker 5: into the sunset in the twenty fourteen film. And then
• 28:22
  Speaker 5: it's up on some type of helicopter helipad and roars
• 28:25
  Speaker 5: off into the sunset, just like Godzilla does before he
• 28:28
  Speaker 5: drops down into the water. I mean, that's an algorithm,
• 28:30
  Speaker 5: is it not?
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah? And because that ending, I was kind of like, oh, okay,
• 28:36
  Speaker 4: everyone sort of teamed up. It reminded me of a
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: of another movie I saw, which I actually think, actually
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: I think that was one of the sequels, the Jurassic Park,
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: where it comes some of the dinosaurs all teamed up
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: at the end, and I was like, I think it
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: was like wow, I think I was like, it did
• 28:50
  Speaker 4: seem You're right, it does seem like a toudolo it's all.
• 28:53
  Speaker 5: I mean, you can see what they did. They probably
• 28:56
  Speaker 5: brought a Colin Trevoro on his director and said, you're
• 28:58
  Speaker 5: you're really not a director, you're a man. Just get
• 29:01
  Speaker 5: us from here to here, start us here, get that in,
• 29:03
  Speaker 5: make sure you get that end it Like that's all
• 29:06
  Speaker 5: there is to it, right, I mean I was. I
• 29:09
  Speaker 5: told this story to another interview. I was standing in
• 29:12
  Speaker 5: line to see Jurassic World and the three D version
• 29:16
  Speaker 5: I did not want to see. I'm sorry, the three
• 29:18
  Speaker 5: D version I was going to see, and it sold
• 29:21
  Speaker 5: out and all that was left was a two D version.
• 29:23
  Speaker 5: But it already started like the first I think the
• 29:26
  Speaker 5: previews were on or something like that. So these guys,
• 29:28
  Speaker 5: these college guys were in front of me, and they
• 29:31
  Speaker 5: were fretting like, oh man, we're going to miss the
• 29:32
  Speaker 5: first ten minutes, and so I stopped him and I said, gentlemen,
• 29:36
  Speaker 5: let's really look at this pretty clearly here. What do
• 29:39
  Speaker 5: you think we're gonna miss? I said, I'll bet you
• 29:41
  Speaker 5: it'll start with some kids and they go to the
• 29:43
  Speaker 5: island and we hear John Williams's Jurassic Parks score with
• 29:47
  Speaker 5: lots of aerial sweeping shots of the island, and then
• 29:49
  Speaker 5: we'll go down onto the island and see lots of
• 29:52
  Speaker 5: dinosaurs and everybody's standing in wide eyed wonder with their
• 29:54
  Speaker 5: mouths open in a gape. That's what we're going to have.
• 29:57
  Speaker 5: And son of a bitch, if that wasn't the first
• 29:59
  Speaker 5: ten minute, it's a Jurassic world.
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: and now back to the show.
• 30:11
  Speaker 5: And when I walked out, those guys said, dude, did
• 30:13
  Speaker 5: you see that already? Yeah, technically we all did. We
• 30:16
  Speaker 5: all did see this already. We saw this before in
• 30:19
  Speaker 5: three other motion pictures, especially the first one. Yeah, we
• 30:22
  Speaker 5: did see it already. This is not a movie, This
• 30:25
  Speaker 5: is an algorithm. So your previous guest is not off
• 30:30
  Speaker 5: the mark whatsoever. You know, now, will it be any good?
• 30:33
  Speaker 5: I don't know how Jurassic World made the money that
• 30:36
  Speaker 5: it did, but it did. And I think it's just
• 30:39
  Speaker 5: because people. I wanted to stand up at one point
• 30:42
  Speaker 5: in the theater and just turn around to the audience
• 30:44
  Speaker 5: and say, don't you people see this is the same
• 30:46
  Speaker 5: damn thing all over again. I mean, you can do
• 30:48
  Speaker 5: a split screen, and I think some people on YouTube
• 30:50
  Speaker 5: have done it. You can do a split screen and
• 30:53
  Speaker 5: see scenes from Jurassic World and they show you right
• 30:56
  Speaker 5: where they copied them from Jurassic Park. They're side by side, identical,
• 31:01
  Speaker 5: and that's all it is. Terminator Genesis did the same thing,
• 31:03
  Speaker 5: went back, took the best scenes out of Terminator one
• 31:06
  Speaker 5: and two. Notice they don't do three, And they took
• 31:09
  Speaker 5: the best scenes out of Terminator one and two and
• 31:11
  Speaker 5: they remade them and they stitched them into some threadbare story.
• 31:16
  Speaker 5: And really all it is is moving on. We start here,
• 31:19
  Speaker 5: get us to the middle, get us to the end.
• 31:21
  Speaker 5: That's not directing, that's managing it. It's not directing a movie.
• 31:24
  Speaker 5: There's no feeling there, there's no emotion, there's there's nothing original,
• 31:28
  Speaker 5: and all we're doing is sitting there being reminded for
• 31:30
  Speaker 5: another ten dollars of how much better the previous movies were.
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you're right, they didn't take from the third one.
• 31:36
  Speaker 4: And and you know, I hear, by the way, I
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: just read yesterday that there's another one coming up, a
• 31:43
  Speaker 4: new Terminator.
• 31:44
  Speaker 5: Why, you know, I have no doubt about it. You know,
• 31:49
  Speaker 5: I have no doubt about it. They said there wasn't
• 31:52
  Speaker 5: but that Look, it's a franchise that I think Annapurnas
• 31:56
  Speaker 5: still owns the rights to. They need to make some
• 31:58
  Speaker 5: money now, as far as I know, Genesis made money,
• 32:02
  Speaker 5: you know, thanks to the foreign market. I think the
• 32:04
  Speaker 5: Chinese market that the film at least broke even in
• 32:07
  Speaker 5: his generated probably some some type of profit. They wouldn't
• 32:11
  Speaker 5: be talking about. I guess if it didn't. But I
• 32:13
  Speaker 5: don't know. I mean, there's all kinds of rumors about that.
• 32:15
  Speaker 5: Is it going, isn't it going? I don't know. I mean,
• 32:18
  Speaker 5: quite frankly, at this point, I don't even know if
• 32:20
  Speaker 5: Terminator is even relevant anymore. That's the whole issue. Do
• 32:24
  Speaker 5: we are These were these things that were pretty much
• 32:27
  Speaker 5: eighties and early nineties escapist entertainment, and do they really
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: apply to this world now? I mean, I saw where
• 32:33
  Speaker 5: Genesis was trying to go with, you know, the eye
• 32:35
  Speaker 5: and the sky kind of thing. You know, everybody being watched,
• 32:38
  Speaker 5: everybody becoming a piece of information. I guess, uh, but
• 32:43
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: You know, I would have I hate to be this
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: guy Harrison, but I would have a pitch to how
• 32:49
  Speaker 4: they could actually make the next one work. But you know,
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: I don't want to be one of those kind of
• 32:54
  Speaker 4: like quote unquote fanboys. There's there's there's a lot of
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: different avenues they could take by because I mean the
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: technology that you know I see almost daily now, you know,
• 33:03
  Speaker 4: it's almost like we're almost at the point where Terminator's
• 33:07
  Speaker 4: supposed to take over anyway, right, I mean you have
• 33:10
  Speaker 4: security drones now out out in San fran You have
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: fast foods gonna be taken over by automation. You know,
• 33:16
  Speaker 4: you have a robot Bartenders on cruises now. So it's
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: almost like this film's almost writing itself.
• 33:22
  Speaker 5: Yeah, well that's that's what I'm saying, Like, you know,
• 33:26
  Speaker 5: does our imitate life? We go through that whole thing.
• 33:29
  Speaker 5: The real issue that comes down to is you're saying
• 33:32
  Speaker 5: it right there. You think you have a good story, right,
• 33:35
  Speaker 5: that's all it is. It just comes down to I
• 33:37
  Speaker 5: think I have a good story. So if there's a
• 33:40
  Speaker 5: good I mean, Terminator Genesis wasn't a story. It was
• 33:43
  Speaker 5: a laundry list, that's all it was. It was a
• 33:46
  Speaker 5: to do list. There was no story. And the same
• 33:49
  Speaker 5: with Jurassic World, well yeah there was. People would to say, oh, well,
• 33:52
  Speaker 5: where have we seen that before? I mean, what more
• 33:55
  Speaker 5: can we do? I mean, we bring back dinosaurs? Dinosaurs
• 33:59
  Speaker 5: e people? What Jeff Goldblum said right that there it is,
• 34:03
  Speaker 5: so you know, I mean, at least I don't know
• 34:06
  Speaker 5: where they being at least upfront and honest, you got me.
• 34:09
  Speaker 5: I mean you know I paid money, They got my
• 34:11
  Speaker 5: ten dollars to see it. But I do believe that,
• 34:15
  Speaker 5: you know, studios will look for that algorithm. I think
• 34:17
  Speaker 5: they already are. They're they're trying to cover their their
• 34:20
  Speaker 5: bases now by making sure their demographics are all properly covered.
• 34:24
  Speaker 5: Do they do they have something for foreign appeal? Do
• 34:26
  Speaker 5: they have something for this? And and in the meantime,
• 34:29
  Speaker 5: we're also worried about offending people. We got to make
• 34:31
  Speaker 5: sure that things are sanitized. And you know, the people
• 34:35
  Speaker 5: talk about now the the uniqueness of a summertime R
• 34:39
  Speaker 5: rated comedy that that might be a little quote unquote raunchy.
• 34:43
  Speaker 5: We're in a world now where everybody drops the word
• 34:46
  Speaker 5: inappropriate and awkward like they're they're part of our lexicon now,
• 34:50
  Speaker 5: and I don't even know what they mean. Everything's inappropriate,
• 34:53
  Speaker 5: everything is awkward. You hear kids say it all the time, awkward.
• 34:57
  Speaker 5: What does that mean? You know? Was would Caddy Shack
• 35:01
  Speaker 5: if it was released today be awkward? I mean, is
• 35:04
  Speaker 5: Blazing Saddles inappropriate? And if there's anybody listening to me
• 35:08
  Speaker 5: right now saying yes they are, then you don't know
• 35:11
  Speaker 5: movies and go get a sense of humor because you're
• 35:13
  Speaker 5: a jackass.
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: You know. I've I've actually joked around with friends that
• 35:18
  Speaker 4: I could like if they were to remake Caddy Shack.
• 35:20
  Speaker 4: I said, I could see exactly how they would do
• 35:22
  Speaker 4: it and who the hell they would cast. You know,
• 35:24
  Speaker 4: I imagine they would put Paris Hilton in the in
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: the role of of that one. I forget the girl's name,
• 35:31
  Speaker 4: but uh, she was the the girl who came in
• 35:33
  Speaker 4: Ted back Ted Knight's character. Yeah, yeah, she would have
• 35:37
  Speaker 4: you know, she'd be paid by Paris Hilton. Uh, you know,
• 35:40
  Speaker 4: and I and and I would I just kind of
• 35:42
  Speaker 4: went down a cast list, but I said, you know,
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: and and that's sort of when you touched on that
• 35:46
  Speaker 4: where they would probably say, you know, should they even
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: be in a golf course? Does anybody play golf anymore?
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: Uh?
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: You know what I mean? Should we make it at
• 35:53
  Speaker 4: it sort of a drone racing seminar? I don't know,
• 35:56
  Speaker 4: but it's just it's just, you know, with all the
• 35:58
  Speaker 4: remakes nowadays, I'm I'm anytime they're going to remake a movie,
• 36:02
  Speaker 4: I'm not really that shocked anymore because it just seems
• 36:04
  Speaker 4: like that's like the latest sort of you know, hey,
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: you know this original movie bombed, so let's just go
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: remake Ben Hurt. You know what I mean, Monny, They
• 36:12
  Speaker 4: kind of forget like what made Caddy Shock funny, And
• 36:14
  Speaker 4: most people don't realize unless they've watched like those A
• 36:17
  Speaker 4: and E biographies on it, is that the movie.
• 36:20
  Speaker 5: Never came out the way that they intended. That the
• 36:23
  Speaker 5: film was scripted to be about the Caddies and instead
• 36:27
  Speaker 5: basically Rodney Dangerfield and Bill Murray and the boys, they
• 36:29
  Speaker 5: all hijacked it. And you know, Harold Ramis said it best,
• 36:33
  Speaker 5: we went to Florida to shoot it because at that
• 36:35
  Speaker 5: time there really was no film industry in Florida, and
• 36:38
  Speaker 5: we went out there to get the hell away from
• 36:40
  Speaker 5: the executives, and we had really one big drug and
• 36:42
  Speaker 5: alcohol party, is what they did. And it shows on screen,
• 36:45
  Speaker 5: like you can see when Rodney Dangerfield farts at that
• 36:48
  Speaker 5: table and does his round around the dining room hall.
• 36:52
  Speaker 5: I mean, you can tell the director was just probably,
• 36:54
  Speaker 5: go ahead, Rodney, go do your thing. And that's what
• 36:56
  Speaker 5: made the movie funny. Bill Murray was on set what
• 36:59
  Speaker 5: a week and he had lived everything pretty much. His
• 37:02
  Speaker 5: whole Carl character is, you know, Carl Spackler is ad libbed.
• 37:07
  Speaker 5: That's what made the movie funny. Now we have you know,
• 37:10
  Speaker 5: everything's got to be properly scripted, and everybody's worried, like,
• 37:13
  Speaker 5: why are we worried about an R rated comedy anymore
• 37:16
  Speaker 5: in the summertime? How many growing up? I mean, I'm
• 37:20
  Speaker 5: how old you are, Dave, But growing up that's pretty
• 37:22
  Speaker 5: much all they're freaking was. You know, in the eighties,
• 37:25
  Speaker 5: it was all our rated Porky's and all that stuff.
• 37:28
  Speaker 5: Now everything's inappropriate and offensive and we've got to be
• 37:31
  Speaker 5: careful and you know, now colleges have safe rooms for
• 37:34
  Speaker 5: kids to go to if they feel unsafe. This is nuts.
• 37:38
  Speaker 5: This is absolutely crazy. This is beyond brave New World.
• 37:42
  Speaker 5: We have become so sanitized that even now we're afraid
• 37:45
  Speaker 5: of our own culture. This is stupid. You know, everybody
• 37:48
  Speaker 5: goes well blazing saddles is offensive. It's supposed to be,
• 37:51
  Speaker 5: you dumbass. It's supposed to show the stupidity of racism.
• 37:55
  Speaker 5: That's the point of it. Yes, it's supposed to be offensive.
• 37:59
  Speaker 4: Yes, I know exactly what you're count here where you're
• 38:01
  Speaker 4: coming from, Harrison. I mean, I'm thirty, but I've seen
• 38:04
  Speaker 4: all those movies, you know, Porky's uh you know. I mean,
• 38:08
  Speaker 4: we can go on and all, but you know, I've
• 38:09
  Speaker 4: seen all those movies. And I agree, you know the
• 38:12
  Speaker 4: movies and even you know, and it's something I was
• 38:15
  Speaker 4: talking about too, is the Slashers from the eighties. You know,
• 38:18
  Speaker 4: even the worst ones had some heart that a lot
• 38:21
  Speaker 4: you know, when I see like new Slashers, a lot
• 38:24
  Speaker 4: of them, I don't know if they've they've ever seen
• 38:26
  Speaker 4: the old ones, or if they just sort of maybe
• 38:28
  Speaker 4: don't have the experience yet behind you know, to behind
• 38:31
  Speaker 4: the camera or if it's even that.
• 38:33
  Speaker 5: I think a lot of them are just trying to
• 38:34
  Speaker 5: be so slick now, like even low budget I mean, look,
• 38:38
  Speaker 5: low budget filmmakers have access to equipment that you know,
• 38:41
  Speaker 5: let's face it, thirty years ago you didn't have did
• 38:44
  Speaker 5: the digital revolution has changed things so even bad movies
• 38:47
  Speaker 5: can look great. And now you see this horror has
• 38:49
  Speaker 5: become like this overt overproduced kind of look to it
• 38:53
  Speaker 5: that has no heart, as you just said. And you
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: know what you didn't have in technology or what you
• 38:58
  Speaker 5: didn't have in shortcuts thirty years ago, well you made
• 39:03
  Speaker 5: up for in heart. So you're right, not all of them,
• 39:06
  Speaker 5: but many of them that were bad, they did have
• 39:07
  Speaker 5: an element of heart to them where people are, damn it,
• 39:09
  Speaker 5: they're trying now. It's like all these horror films, they
• 39:13
  Speaker 5: all have that blue or green filter on them, and
• 39:15
  Speaker 5: they all look you know, they're overlt, they're very bright.
• 39:18
  Speaker 5: Everybody's trying to look slick. Everybody's trying to look not
• 39:22
  Speaker 5: low budget, and I think that's a problem. John Carpenter
• 39:25
  Speaker 5: embraced that with Halloween and a lot of his films.
• 39:28
  Speaker 5: I mean, yeah, they used panavision on Halloween and that
• 39:30
  Speaker 5: was important. But yet Halloween doesn't have an overproduced look
• 39:33
  Speaker 5: to it. It does look like it was a low
• 39:36
  Speaker 5: budget film, but they used it smartly. John was a
• 39:40
  Speaker 5: brilliant director and he used it correctly, and he made
• 39:43
  Speaker 5: it work to his advantage. He was telling a good
• 39:45
  Speaker 5: story and he didn't try to slick it up. That's
• 39:47
  Speaker 5: where I mean Halloween h two oh is not a
• 39:51
  Speaker 5: scary film. I don't even really think it counts as
• 39:54
  Speaker 5: even a good sequel.
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: and now back to the show.
• 40:06
  Speaker 5: It gets love from the fan base simply because Jamie
• 40:09
  Speaker 5: Lee Curtis returned, and there's some legitimacy there, I guess.
• 40:12
  Speaker 5: But I mean it looks good. I mean it's beautifully shot,
• 40:15
  Speaker 5: it's beautifully lit. I just it doesn't have any heart.
• 40:19
  Speaker 5: There's nothing to it. I mean, it's a very forgettable
• 40:21
  Speaker 5: entry into the pretty much all of them are forgettable
• 40:24
  Speaker 5: entries except for one that I always champion, and that's
• 40:27
  Speaker 5: Halloween three. I think Halloween three, if it had not
• 40:30
  Speaker 5: been called Halloween three, would have done far better. And
• 40:33
  Speaker 5: I think it's a great comment on the commercialism of
• 40:36
  Speaker 5: the holiday and is a fun horror film with some heart.
• 40:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah. I actually just showed Halloween three to some friends
• 40:41
  Speaker 4: of mine last Halloween, and I said to them before
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: I showed it to him, I said, listen, this is
• 40:45
  Speaker 4: just Halloween in name. I said, Michael Myers is not
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: a part of this, even in the slightest sense. And
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: one of my friends you watched and he said, you know,
• 40:54
  Speaker 4: I think I actually enjoyed that one sort of more
• 40:56
  Speaker 4: than any other, because he's like it was just so different.
• 40:59
  Speaker 4: He's like, it's actually different than a lot of the
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: horror movies I've ever receeved. Oh yes, I.
• 41:03
  Speaker 5: Mean, Dave, You're right. Your friend is correct. I mean,
• 41:05
  Speaker 5: look at Halloween two, all I mean picks up the
• 41:09
  Speaker 5: same night. That is a dreadfully mediocre bad film. I mean,
• 41:14
  Speaker 5: Halloween two was just a contractual agreement to make some
• 41:19
  Speaker 5: more money. It had nothing. I mean, the first Halloween
• 41:22
  Speaker 5: movie was made by a bunch of artists who tried
• 41:25
  Speaker 5: to make the best damn horror film that they could.
• 41:27
  Speaker 5: The second one was just a complete knockoff, is all
• 41:30
  Speaker 5: it was. And they could have made Halloween two about
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: the phone Book and people would have come to see
• 41:35
  Speaker 5: it just because it was the sequel to Halloween. So
• 41:39
  Speaker 5: you know, then you've got Halloween four. I mean, Danielle
• 41:41
  Speaker 5: Harris is great in it, and Danielle is a friend
• 41:43
  Speaker 5: of mine. But let's face it was Halloween four a classic.
• 41:47
  Speaker 5: It's the same damn story all over again. And then
• 41:49
  Speaker 5: Halloween five, Halloween six, and then we've got Halloween h two. Oh,
• 41:53
  Speaker 5: and then we've got Resurrection, and then we what's different
• 41:56
  Speaker 5: about any of these things? Nothing? You know, at least
• 41:59
  Speaker 5: Halloween three, which it should have never been called, Like
• 42:01
  Speaker 5: you said, it's only Halloween and name only tried to
• 42:04
  Speaker 5: branch out and do something cool. And you have to admit,
• 42:08
  Speaker 5: Man Cochrane is a wonderful villain in Halloween three is terrific.
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Uh, you know it was just such an interesting
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: idea too, because you know, I mean, and they all
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: liked the idea too, you know, the whole masks the
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: song and that song in that movie, by the way,
• 42:21
  Speaker 4: does get in your head, you know, uh, you know,
• 42:26
  Speaker 4: you know, as we talked about horror movies, you know,
• 42:27
  Speaker 4: I actually did want to actually talk about you know,
• 42:29
  Speaker 4: your films. Uh, can you actually have some impressive films
• 42:32
  Speaker 4: that you've actually you know, wrote, directed and produced, you know,
• 42:35
  Speaker 4: So if you don't mind, I really would like to
• 42:38
  Speaker 4: sort of talk in depth about so much about your process.
• 42:41
  Speaker 4: Uh really, you know, I guess you know, might as
• 42:43
  Speaker 4: well start at the beginning, right, So if we could
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: talk about The Fields. You know, you wrote and you
• 42:48
  Speaker 4: produced the Field. So I wanted to ask, you know,
• 42:51
  Speaker 4: was The Fields one of the first things that you've
• 42:53
  Speaker 4: you've written and you know, if so, you know, what
• 42:56
  Speaker 4: was your process? Well, actually, even if it wasn't, you know,
• 42:59
  Speaker 4: what was your process about on roctually writing the Field?
• 43:02
  Speaker 5: Well, the Fields is based on the true story of
• 43:04
  Speaker 5: what happened to me as a boy growing up on
• 43:05
  Speaker 5: my grandparents' farm. So it was written totally from memory,
• 43:10
  Speaker 5: is really what it was. I mean, Chlaurus Leachman plays
• 43:12
  Speaker 5: my grandmother in the film. And I always say this
• 43:16
  Speaker 5: almost in every interview. She didn't play my grandmother. She
• 43:18
  Speaker 5: channeled my grandmother. Chlorus became my grandmother, and seeing her
• 43:23
  Speaker 5: on set and watching her in that movie, that's the
• 43:26
  Speaker 5: closest I'm ever going to get to see in my
• 43:27
  Speaker 5: grandmother again. So it was written based on memory, and
• 43:32
  Speaker 5: it was not hard to write because it was a
• 43:35
  Speaker 5: true story and you know, you get people going, oh yeah,
• 43:37
  Speaker 5: they always say that, no, this it happened to me,
• 43:41
  Speaker 5: Like I know it is based on true events because
• 43:43
  Speaker 5: I lived them. So the little boy in the film
• 43:45
  Speaker 5: is based on me. Tara Rep played my mother and
• 43:50
  Speaker 5: The Fields was not the first script I've written, but
• 43:53
  Speaker 5: it was the first one to get produced. And it
• 43:56
  Speaker 5: was a very grueling process. I mean, as I said,
• 43:59
  Speaker 5: you want to learn about producing, get on a film
• 44:02
  Speaker 5: set and just go produce. You'll find out real fast
• 44:05
  Speaker 5: you know how to do this. You'll either sink or swim.
• 44:08
  Speaker 5: The Fields was a baptism by fire. It really was.
• 44:11
  Speaker 5: I will have to say, of all my filmmaking experiences,
• 44:15
  Speaker 5: the Fields was the most unpleasant. It was extremely rough.
• 44:19
  Speaker 5: It was one of those that by the end I
• 44:21
  Speaker 5: was asking myself, is this what I really want to do?
• 44:24
  Speaker 5: And I felt kind of cheated because all my life
• 44:26
  Speaker 5: I've wanted to make movies and then you finally get
• 44:29
  Speaker 5: to make your movie and it was not the sunshine
• 44:32
  Speaker 5: and puppy dogs that you hoped it would be.
• 44:35
  Speaker 4: Was it a lot through with like location issues or
• 44:38
  Speaker 4: because I mean I know how you know hard producing
• 44:40
  Speaker 4: a film can be. I've produced things myself, and you
• 44:44
  Speaker 4: know how you know on Harris, you know, and you've
• 44:46
  Speaker 4: experiences too where you look at it on paper and
• 44:49
  Speaker 4: it looks like, Okay, you know, this should be a gimme.
• 44:52
  Speaker 4: This is a gimme, And then all of a sudden,
• 44:53
  Speaker 4: everything just sort of turns on its head and what
• 44:56
  Speaker 4: you thought was going to be easy became hard. We
• 44:58
  Speaker 4: thought it was hard became and it's just sort of
• 45:01
  Speaker 4: you're just like, Wow, what the hell did I get myself?
• 45:04
  Speaker 5: I think it's like, you know, if you produce something,
• 45:07
  Speaker 5: then you know, I think a lot of it had
• 45:10
  Speaker 5: to do with that. You you're kind of thrown naked
• 45:13
  Speaker 5: out on the stage, is really what it is. And
• 45:16
  Speaker 5: you know there there were a lot of things from
• 45:18
  Speaker 5: SAG paperwork, and I don't care who's listening, SAG is
• 45:21
  Speaker 5: a nightmare to work with. It is just and I
• 45:24
  Speaker 5: think most independent filmmakers out there will agree and are
• 45:26
  Speaker 5: probably nodding their heads. And if they're listening to this driving,
• 45:29
  Speaker 5: they're going, oh, yeah, you're you're thrown into all of
• 45:33
  Speaker 5: this and dealing with you know, pension and health and
• 45:35
  Speaker 5: taxes and and how your taxes are broken down, and
• 45:38
  Speaker 5: then agent fees and you know, the salary plus ten,
• 45:41
  Speaker 5: and then line item budget issues, and then feeding people
• 45:44
  Speaker 5: and making sure that your caterers all work out, because look,
• 45:48
  Speaker 5: I know someone who worked on a House of Cards,
• 45:51
  Speaker 5: but I think they had close to a four million
• 45:53
  Speaker 5: dollar budget for catering and he told me, he said,
• 45:56
  Speaker 5: people still complained. You know, they had chocolate found tins
• 46:01
  Speaker 5: on set and people are still like, oh, this food sucks. So,
• 46:03
  Speaker 5: you know, you quickly realize you're never going to please
• 46:06
  Speaker 5: everyone on the set of a film. And then you
• 46:10
  Speaker 5: go into like you said, location issues, weather, all of
• 46:13
  Speaker 5: the stuff that goes into it, and most of all,
• 46:15
  Speaker 5: watching your screenplay in the hands of other people, to
• 46:19
  Speaker 5: directors that sometimes put their own spin on things, where
• 46:22
  Speaker 5: you're kind of feeling, oh, you're kind of diverting from
• 46:24
  Speaker 5: the source material. I wasn't. I've been very vocal about
• 46:28
  Speaker 5: this before. Nothing I haven't said to them. I wasn't
• 46:30
  Speaker 5: always one hundred percent supportive of the changes that they
• 46:33
  Speaker 5: made to the screenplay, but it was their choice because
• 46:36
  Speaker 5: they're directors. In the end, I feel I was pretty
• 46:39
  Speaker 5: fairly treated as a first time writer, but as a producer,
• 46:43
  Speaker 5: I walked away pretty bruised from it, and not to
• 46:46
  Speaker 5: be over dramatic, but just it was tough, and as
• 46:50
  Speaker 5: going into any type of career like that is you
• 46:52
  Speaker 5: known anyone can say that, well, you know, I started
• 46:54
  Speaker 5: out in this and this is how you learn. So
• 46:57
  Speaker 5: I made my bones, I guess is the best way
• 46:59
  Speaker 5: to some up the fields.
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: You know, that's an excellent way to put it, Harrison,
• 47:03
  Speaker 4: I made my bones. I actually, you know, I've had
• 47:05
  Speaker 4: other people come on who've also written you know, uh,
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: screenplays or you know, it was a first movie that
• 47:10
  Speaker 4: you know, got actually have produced, and they said, you know,
• 47:13
  Speaker 4: for the for the better or for the worst, or
• 47:16
  Speaker 4: however it turned out. They were like, I'm just happy
• 47:18
  Speaker 4: it happens. And you know, you know, sometimes you know,
• 47:22
  Speaker 4: like you said, things go beyond your control and you
• 47:24
  Speaker 4: just sort of have to make peace with that because
• 47:26
  Speaker 4: you can't control it, you know.
• 47:27
  Speaker 5: Yea make peace is a good word for you. Just
• 47:29
  Speaker 5: make peace with it.
• 47:31
  Speaker 4: So your next film with Six Degrees of Hell, and
• 47:34
  Speaker 4: I actually had you know, Corey Felman in it, and
• 47:36
  Speaker 4: you know, it was actually funny. I actually got invited
• 47:39
  Speaker 4: to the screening of this. I forget who invited me,
• 47:43
  Speaker 4: but I actually couldn't make it. We actually would have
• 47:45
  Speaker 4: met each other if I had attended this screening because
• 47:47
  Speaker 4: it was in Philly. So you were You wrote and
• 47:49
  Speaker 4: produced Six Degrees of Hell. So you know, how did
• 47:52
  Speaker 4: you go about writing this? About writing this film Six
• 47:54
  Speaker 4: Screeds of Hell?
• 47:55
  Speaker 5: Well, it came from I went through a haunted establishment
• 47:59
  Speaker 5: at Halloween time with my ex wife and we went
• 48:03
  Speaker 5: through and she hated those things, and we went through
• 48:05
  Speaker 5: this one room and there was a guy tied to
• 48:09
  Speaker 5: a table and I'll never forget as I walked by him,
• 48:13
  Speaker 5: he reached out and he grabbed me and he said,
• 48:16
  Speaker 5: you don't get it. They're really killing people in here,
• 48:19
  Speaker 5: like they're going to kill me. Please, when you get
• 48:21
  Speaker 5: out of here, call the police. And as I walked
• 48:24
  Speaker 5: out of the room, I said to my ex wife,
• 48:27
  Speaker 5: I said, well, you know, how do we really know
• 48:30
  Speaker 5: that he's not telling the truth? Like what if they
• 48:32
  Speaker 5: really are going to kill this dude? Like we won't know,
• 48:35
  Speaker 5: you know, I mean, this is all part of the game, right,
• 48:37
  Speaker 5: this is all part of the illusion. And so I
• 48:39
  Speaker 5: thought I would build on that for a film, and
• 48:42
  Speaker 5: then I added a supernatural element to it, and we
• 48:46
  Speaker 5: we got what we had with six Degrees.
• 48:48
  Speaker 4: So what if that guy really goes with the bubblefel.
• 48:54
  Speaker 5: I hope he's alive.
• 48:58
  Speaker 4: That's what I thought you were going to say, Like,
• 49:00
  Speaker 4: you know, later on you're like, wow, I never found out.
• 49:02
  Speaker 5: What happened to him. I'm kind of assuming he was okay.
• 49:05
  Speaker 4: So you know when you went about writing this film,
• 49:07
  Speaker 4: you know, actually you know your process of writing. I
• 49:09
  Speaker 4: wanted to ask, you know, do you subscribe to any method?
• 49:12
  Speaker 4: I always ask this to screenwriters, you know, meaning like,
• 49:14
  Speaker 4: you know there's Save the Cat and there's a Sidfield method.
• 49:17
  Speaker 4: Sohould you write like a heavy outline or treatment though
• 49:19
  Speaker 4: before you begin?
• 49:19
  Speaker 5: I mean sometimes I outline it. My business partner Mark
• 49:23
  Speaker 5: is always like, outline it, outline it. Look. Sometimes the
• 49:27
  Speaker 5: best advice for any writer is right, that's it, And
• 49:31
  Speaker 5: nobody can teach you the best way. Everybody's got their way.
• 49:35
  Speaker 5: So you want to write right. So sometimes something hits
• 49:39
  Speaker 5: me and I'm like, oh my god, and I'll I'll
• 49:41
  Speaker 5: plow into the first act. I'll get through the first
• 49:43
  Speaker 5: stack in the second act. Yeah, an outline, you know
• 49:47
  Speaker 5: sid Field way. Sometimes you make sure your beats all hit. Yeah,
• 49:50
  Speaker 5: I get all of that, and sometimes I do a
• 49:53
  Speaker 5: beat sheep but.
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: and now back to the show.
• 50:04
  Speaker 5: It depends on the project, and sometimes it depends on
• 50:06
  Speaker 5: the mood I'm in. If I'm really passionate and I've
• 50:08
  Speaker 5: been taken over by the moment, I just write and
• 50:12
  Speaker 5: then I go back and I constantly correct. I mean
• 50:14
  Speaker 5: writing is writing, and then it's pretty much eighty percent
• 50:17
  Speaker 5: rewriting is really what it is. I mean, you got
• 50:20
  Speaker 5: to be smart enough to know to go back and rewrite.
• 50:22
  Speaker 5: And I don't know who gets the credit with this phrase,
• 50:25
  Speaker 5: but I think it was Stephen King who said, you
• 50:26
  Speaker 5: go back and you kill your babies. What you think
• 50:29
  Speaker 5: may be brilliant on that page you might have to
• 50:31
  Speaker 5: get rid of. And that's something George Lucas could have learned.
• 50:35
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, I've also learned too in just writing myself.
• 50:38
  Speaker 4: You'll drive yourself crazy if you sort of try to
• 50:41
  Speaker 4: do like the outline that so the quote unquote script
• 50:44
  Speaker 4: writing gurus always talk about like it has to be
• 50:47
  Speaker 4: this by page seventeen, We has to see this and
• 50:50
  Speaker 4: what about this? And I think that sort of I know,
• 50:53
  Speaker 4: at least my my own experience, it's been very it
• 50:56
  Speaker 4: almost makes a difficult task damn near and possible.
• 51:00
  Speaker 5: Oh yeah, because you're not right. I mean, it's that balance.
• 51:03
  Speaker 5: You can't write just for you, and you have to
• 51:06
  Speaker 5: keep an audience in mind. But if you start trying
• 51:08
  Speaker 5: to write to the algorithm, as your former guests had
• 51:12
  Speaker 5: talked about, you're defeating yourself. It's a self defeating process,
• 51:16
  Speaker 5: and then it becomes unpleasant and you no longer want
• 51:18
  Speaker 5: to write. You should write it first, almost like a
• 51:20
  Speaker 5: mental vomit in my opinion, and that is get it
• 51:22
  Speaker 5: all out. There's plenty of time to go back and
• 51:25
  Speaker 5: organize and make sure it hits the proper beats, and
• 51:27
  Speaker 5: by like you said page twenty five, all the major
• 51:29
  Speaker 5: characters should be introduced, and by the end of act one,
• 51:31
  Speaker 5: something's really important should have happened to close act one.
• 51:34
  Speaker 5: And I get all of that because in the end,
• 51:36
  Speaker 5: we are making movies that I've seen movies which go
• 51:39
  Speaker 5: on way too long, and you're like, ah, man, they
• 51:41
  Speaker 5: should have just ended it here, they should have done
• 51:43
  Speaker 5: this here, and they didn't do that. So but I
• 51:47
  Speaker 5: think in the end the final analysis is just right.
• 51:52
  Speaker 5: That's it.
• 51:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I concur you know something. I mean, even now,
• 51:56
  Speaker 4: when I'm you know, in line somewhere. I sometimes pull
• 51:59
  Speaker 4: up my phone and I'll pull out like every note
• 52:01
  Speaker 4: and I'm like, oh, that's a good piece of dialogue, right,
• 52:03
  Speaker 4: you know what I mean, Like that's a good idea
• 52:05
  Speaker 4: because you know, I don't really have a penalty anymore.
• 52:07
  Speaker 4: So it's like now with my phone, I can at least,
• 52:08
  Speaker 4: you know, write on every note, you know, so I
• 52:10
  Speaker 4: so I at least have it. Yeah, did you do
• 52:12
  Speaker 4: you do that too? Do you can.
• 52:14
  Speaker 5: Tell people I'll hear a great line of dialogue and
• 52:16
  Speaker 5: say I'm gonna steal that just you know, that's going
• 52:17
  Speaker 5: to make it into a film someday, because that was
• 52:20
  Speaker 5: just really classic what somebody said.
• 52:22
  Speaker 4: That's something I think a lot of writers do. I
• 52:24
  Speaker 4: had like jum Michael Hoffan, who he knows he's not
• 52:26
  Speaker 4: a screenwriter, but he but he's trying to get into
• 52:28
  Speaker 4: it or he's getting into it. And that's something he
• 52:31
  Speaker 4: always was saying that He'll be in the line for
• 52:32
  Speaker 4: a Starbucks You'll be like, oh my god, I'll we
• 52:34
  Speaker 4: just listening to people talk behind him, and he's like, oh,
• 52:36
  Speaker 4: that's a that's pretty good. I gotta get that kind
• 52:38
  Speaker 4: of write that down.
• 52:39
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that's the best stuff. I mean Mark Twain said
• 52:42
  Speaker 5: it best write what you know.
• 52:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, very very true. You know Stephen King's on writing,
• 52:47
  Speaker 4: by the way, I think that is the best book
• 52:50
  Speaker 4: already here.
• 52:51
  Speaker 5: I own it, yeah, absolutely, and I I follow it,
• 52:54
  Speaker 5: you know, especially about you know, adverbs and things like that,
• 52:58
  Speaker 5: get rid of them. So I mean I've I've listened,
• 53:01
  Speaker 5: and it does improve your writing, It really does.
• 53:04
  Speaker 4: And I don't think you know, it's just to you
• 53:07
  Speaker 4: know what. He usually writes novels, but I think you
• 53:09
  Speaker 4: know anything, screenwriting, you know, whatever you're writing. I mean,
• 53:11
  Speaker 4: it's just everything he was talking about hit home, and
• 53:14
  Speaker 4: I mean obviously he's a man who walks the walk
• 53:17
  Speaker 4: because I mean, how many number one best sellers as
• 53:19
  Speaker 4: he had.
• 53:19
  Speaker 5: Well, and that's the point, because King does what is best.
• 53:23
  Speaker 5: He just tells good stories. Yeah, you know, and people go, well,
• 53:27
  Speaker 5: wait a minute, you know the movies. No, no, no, you
• 53:29
  Speaker 5: don't go buy the movies. You just go buy his books.
• 53:32
  Speaker 5: And I mean he's he's just there won't be another
• 53:36
  Speaker 5: Stephen King for for generations to come. I mean, these
• 53:39
  Speaker 5: these kind of people emerge every so often, and you know,
• 53:43
  Speaker 5: you don't want to be the next Stephen King. What
• 53:45
  Speaker 5: you want is to be your own next thing instead
• 53:49
  Speaker 5: of trying to ape or mimic Stephen King. Stephen King
• 53:51
  Speaker 5: is successful because Stephen King came forward as Stephen King,
• 53:56
  Speaker 5: and you you read his writing and listening to or
• 53:59
  Speaker 5: reading I should say King's books and his pros, you
• 54:03
  Speaker 5: just kind of just settle back and it's a very
• 54:05
  Speaker 5: comfortable world because he's such a master storyteller.
• 54:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, he really is. To everyone listening. If you
• 54:11
  Speaker 4: ever checked that on writing, it is you know, obviously
• 54:14
  Speaker 4: I just said the best book on writing that I've
• 54:16
  Speaker 4: ever come across, by far and away.
• 54:18
  Speaker 5: It's terrific.
• 54:19
  Speaker 4: So you know, Harrison, you followed up Six Degrees of
• 54:22
  Speaker 4: Hell with your directorial debut, which was Camp Dread. How
• 54:26
  Speaker 4: did that come about? You know, did you write the
• 54:27
  Speaker 4: screenplay and then did you did you pitch it to
• 54:29
  Speaker 4: anybody in particular, and how did you get about, you know,
• 54:32
  Speaker 4: actually getting the director to the director's job.
• 54:34
  Speaker 5: Well, I had an investor who said I want to
• 54:37
  Speaker 5: make this kind of slasher movie and I want you
• 54:41
  Speaker 5: to do it, and he said, I only want you
• 54:43
  Speaker 5: to direct it. So it was like, I guess I'm
• 54:45
  Speaker 5: going to direct it, and he said, basically, I want tits,
• 54:49
  Speaker 5: blood and ass. Make sure it has that. And I said, well,
• 54:52
  Speaker 5: can I also write a good story and he goes,
• 54:53
  Speaker 5: you can do whatever you want, but make sure it
• 54:55
  Speaker 5: has those three things. So that's what I did. And
• 54:59
  Speaker 5: I love Dread. I think Camp Dread is a lot
• 55:02
  Speaker 5: of fun. And we got a great cast in that.
• 55:05
  Speaker 5: We have Daniel Harris, we have Eric Roberts, we have
• 55:07
  Speaker 5: Felicia Rose. And that's how it all kind of started
• 55:10
  Speaker 5: with Felicia Rose because I did not know her at
• 55:13
  Speaker 5: the time, but in making this, I wanted her in
• 55:17
  Speaker 5: the film to be a camp counselor, to be the
• 55:20
  Speaker 5: big camp counselor in the film. And a guy was
• 55:25
  Speaker 5: interviewing me for Fangoria and he said, you want Felsica
• 55:28
  Speaker 5: Rose and I said yea. He goes, well, I know
• 55:30
  Speaker 5: Felicia Rose, and I said you do. He goes, yeah,
• 55:32
  Speaker 5: you want her cell phone number? I'm like, no, but
• 55:35
  Speaker 5: you could send her an email because I don't want
• 55:37
  Speaker 5: her to think I'm some crazy stalker who's just calling
• 55:39
  Speaker 5: her up. And he did an email introduction. Felisa Rose
• 55:43
  Speaker 5: and I talked and we became friends and now we're
• 55:46
  Speaker 5: business partners and we've been ever since. She lives in
• 55:50
  Speaker 5: la I live on the East Coast. She's been wonderful
• 55:54
  Speaker 5: and she's great in Camp Dread and most of them.
• 55:56
  Speaker 5: I wanted Camp Dread to be fun. It's got a
• 55:59
  Speaker 5: great message. Think at the end when you find out
• 56:01
  Speaker 5: who the real villains really are in this movie, and
• 56:06
  Speaker 5: I just had We had a great time making it.
• 56:09
  Speaker 5: It was a lot of fun and I'm very I'm
• 56:12
  Speaker 5: very pleased with all the performances. And I think Eric Roberts.
• 56:15
  Speaker 5: I don't know if you've seen the film, but Eric
• 56:17
  Speaker 5: Roberts just makes such a great Hollywood scumbag.
• 56:21
  Speaker 4: You know, Ashley Harrison. That is the only movie of
• 56:23
  Speaker 4: yours I haven't seen. We'll see it, okay.
• 56:28
  Speaker 5: It's a lot of fun, it really is. And it's
• 56:31
  Speaker 5: just one of those you put it on at night,
• 56:35
  Speaker 5: especially like a summer night, and you just sit down
• 56:38
  Speaker 5: and let it seep into you. That's what I wanted.
• 56:41
  Speaker 5: We did not want just a lot of naked girls
• 56:44
  Speaker 5: being killed. And I'm an equal opportunity offender. There's plenty
• 56:48
  Speaker 5: of male skin as well as female skin in the movie.
• 56:51
  Speaker 5: Because chicks love a good horror film. And you know,
• 56:55
  Speaker 5: whether you're heterosexual or homosexual, it doesn't matter. Just enjoy
• 56:58
  Speaker 5: what we put on the screen for Eye Candy. And
• 57:01
  Speaker 5: we knew we were playing to a wide horror audience,
• 57:04
  Speaker 5: and we gave them what they required, you know, and
• 57:07
  Speaker 5: and most of all, we gave a good story. And uh,
• 57:09
  Speaker 5: it makes a big comment on the search for fame
• 57:13
  Speaker 5: and the extent that people will go, uh to be
• 57:16
  Speaker 5: on TV or win a little bit of money, and
• 57:19
  Speaker 5: what they will do to sell out.
• 57:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I will check that out. Actually sued them off
• 57:24
  Speaker 4: this podcast episode with you. I'm actually go to check
• 57:26
  Speaker 4: it out. I'm probably gonna order it off Amazon or
• 57:28
  Speaker 4: or wherever because I actually have Yeah, I was saying,
• 57:31
  Speaker 4: and you know, it's funny. I actually Brian Gallagher is
• 57:35
  Speaker 4: in the movie camp Tread and he's I'm actually a
• 57:37
  Speaker 4: friend of his and he's a terrific guy. And I'm
• 57:40
  Speaker 4: not sure what role he plays in Camp Tred, but
• 57:42
  Speaker 4: I remember he he actually shared a photo on set
• 57:45
  Speaker 4: and it was of Eric Roberts with a butterfly yes,
• 57:51
  Speaker 4: And I was like, Brian, what do you what movie
• 57:53
  Speaker 4: is this? And He's like, I don't want to talk
• 57:55
  Speaker 4: too much about it. But he's like, this is just
• 57:56
  Speaker 4: you know Eric Roberts, you know, with this butterfly. I said, okay.
• 58:00
  Speaker 5: Brian plays John Hill in the film, who is a
• 58:03
  Speaker 5: former slasher star who's now on the convention circuit kind
• 58:08
  Speaker 5: of thing. And he's been called back by his former
• 58:10
  Speaker 5: director where they were always at loggerheads while they were
• 58:14
  Speaker 5: shooting this franchise in the nineteen eighties. So Brian is
• 58:18
  Speaker 5: now older and wiser and comes back and kind of
• 58:21
  Speaker 5: sees through what this guy wants to do. Like, Brian
• 58:25
  Speaker 5: is not very supportive of what's of what's going on
• 58:29
  Speaker 5: at this camp, and it's pretty cool. I don't want
• 58:32
  Speaker 5: to give away too many of the secrets because the
• 58:34
  Speaker 5: ending is is a really good ending.
• 58:36
  Speaker 4: Very cool. So I won't won't pressure on that one
• 58:39
  Speaker 4: because I want to see m myself.
• 58:41
  Speaker 5: They'll be like it, please let me know what you think,
• 58:43
  Speaker 5: and please be honest.
• 58:44
  Speaker 4: Oh, I will will do We'll do Harrison, you know,
• 58:47
  Speaker 4: and you know you follow that up with Zombie Killer's
• 58:50
  Speaker 4: Elephant Graveyard. Yeah, so you know again, I you know
• 58:53
  Speaker 4: when you were writing this, you know, I did you
• 58:56
  Speaker 4: want to do something completely different or you know? Because
• 58:59
  Speaker 4: I mean, you know this is probably. I mean again,
• 59:01
  Speaker 4: I haven't seen camp Tread yet, but I mean it
• 59:02
  Speaker 4: seems different than everything else you've done to that.
• 59:04
  Speaker 5: Is yeah, it's it's pretty deaf different. It's look to
• 59:10
  Speaker 5: be really, you know, quite frank. When I was brought
• 59:13
  Speaker 5: the project, I tried to talk the investor for an
• 59:16
  Speaker 5: hour out of doing it. He came to me and
• 59:19
  Speaker 5: he said, I want to make a horror film. I'm like, okay.
• 59:22
  Speaker 5: He goes, I think you're the guy to do it,
• 59:24
  Speaker 5: or that's what I'm told. I'm like, okay, and we'll
• 59:26
  Speaker 5: make you a good one.
• 59:27
  Speaker 4: What is it?
• 59:27
  Speaker 5: And he said, well, I want to make a zombie movie.
• 59:30
  Speaker 5: I'm like, no, you don't. He's like, yes, I do.
• 59:32
  Speaker 5: And I said, no, you do not. I said, you
• 59:34
  Speaker 5: wanted to make a zombie film about five years ago.
• 59:37
  Speaker 5: I not want to do it now because the market
• 59:38
  Speaker 5: is saturated. He's like, well, Harrison, you know I want
• 59:42
  Speaker 5: you to do it. If you don't want to do it,
• 59:43
  Speaker 5: I'm going to find somebody to do it. So look,
• 59:46
  Speaker 5: we all have bills to pay and lights to keep on.
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: and now back to the show.
• 59:59
  Speaker 5: So I did it. I wrote a script for him
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 5: that had to incorporate the sport of paintball. How you
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 5: do that without being laughed off the screen? Zombies and paintball?
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 5: I think we managed that. We used it very organically
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 5: as a training mechanism for these young orphans that were
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 5: left behind, and we gave a film that had a
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 5: very new and fresh origin story for why these zombies
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 5: are returning. And so good that z Nation copied us
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 5: because my zombies are generated from the results and the
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 5: side effects of fracking from the natural gas and shale industry,
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 5: and Z Nations stole that right from us. And I
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 5: know they did because we had this way before it
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 5: and the copyright proves it. And not only that, but
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 5: I was in a pitch session with some people that
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 5: went on to make z Nation and that's what they used.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 4: So they basically just said, hey, you know, we have
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 4: a similar idea, or do they say, hey, do you ever.
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 5: See zombies done anything? I never said anything, And all
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 5: of a sudden, somebody sends me an episode of z
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 5: Nation where they say, look, the fracking industry has caused zombies.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 5: I'm like, yeah, I wonder where the hell they got that.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 4: You know, did you ever bump into somebody from z
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 4: Nation and say, hey, no.
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 5: I'll be bumping into them, I'm sure, you know in
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 5: LA probably after April. Yeah, and I'll be like, yeah,
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 5: you fairly stole it, you know what I mean, Like
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 5: that's fine, you know, I mean, it's not like we
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 5: copyrighted the issue that they can't use it, you know.
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 5: But it just shows that we were on the right
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 5: track because they took it and we were the first.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 4: So when you said you found the producer, you know
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 4: he approached you with this project. Was that because of
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 4: all your past you know, past success or was that
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 4: because your people from your network were the ones recommending.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 5: He had done his research on me as a filmmaker,
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 5: and he also knew that I wasn't going to rob
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 5: him blind. You know, a lot of these guys that
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 5: want to get these movies made, they take them to
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 5: people that have like two or three producers, and instantly
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 5: the producers pad the budget with their producer. So we
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 5: made Zombie Killers for just around a million bucks to
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 5: make this movie. The legitimate LA way would have been
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 5: three to five million.
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 4: No, I don't know.
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 5: I mean, I think the best thing is is that
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 5: you just have your reputation, and that is you're making
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 5: movies like that's it. You can go on to IMDb
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 5: and a lot of these people, you know, I call
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 5: IMDb whores because they have like, you know, five pages
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 5: of IMDb stuff and a lot of it is just bogus,
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 5: you know, filler that they post on there. If you
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 5: go on my IMDb, it's very simple. What I've produced
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 5: is there. You don't see twenty things in pre production
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 5: or in development. What I've done is there, and what
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 5: I have in pre production is actively being worked on
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 5: in pre production. So I think when people see that
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 5: and they go, okay, you're not trying to blow smoke
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 5: up our ass. That helps. So, you know, we get
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 5: movies made. That's that's the difference. Come to me with
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 5: a million bucks or under a million, we will get
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 5: the movie made and we will make a good movie.
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 5: It will look good, it will get great distribution. All
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 5: my films have solid distribution with great titles anchor bay
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 5: RJL Entertainment, you know image, We've done well and that's
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 5: really what it comes down to. Well done is better
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 5: than well said. And that's the way you have to
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 5: operate in this business. Anybody can talk. And I've taught
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 5: people that don't go to an investor and tell them, oh,
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 5: this is going to make five hundred million dollars and
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 5: it's going to be the next this. Don't tell them that.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 5: Just tell them the straight up, and that is filmmaking
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 5: is a very volatile business and it's probably the worst
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 5: investment that anybody with expendable cash can put into. You
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 5: have a better chance of making your money back by
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 5: going to Atlantic City and putting your money on the
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 5: roulette wheel and getting something back then you do making
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 5: a profit on a film. And although many people say, well,
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 5: I would never tell them that, that is the honest answer.
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 5: The real answer, or the fluffed up answer that people
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 5: give is oh, it's going to do this. We're going
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 5: to make this. You don't know. You have no idea
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 5: what a film is going to do. You know, look
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 5: at what happened when that guy shot up the theater
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 5: with the Dark Knight Rises. That costs that picture money. Now,
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 5: a lesser film wouldn't have survived something like that. But
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 5: because you know it's the Dark Knight Rises. Yeah, it
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 5: took a hit, but it's going to still make its money.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 5: You don't know what's going to happen, or how the
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 5: political or economic climate of the country is going to
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 5: change by the time your film is ready for release.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 5: Anything can happen. You never guarantee an investor their money back.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 5: You tell them it's a risk. Then that's why it's
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 5: called an investment. Otherwise it would be a guarantee. It's
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 5: not a guarantee. Nothing is guaranteed in this industry. You
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 5: could have your star die halfway through the film. How
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 5: do you know what's going to happen? A tornado could
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 5: wreck your set. You don't know. So if you're honest
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 5: with them, they respect that. I mean, my first investor
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 5: he told me, he said, kid, you're talking yourself right
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 5: out of a film. I said, no, I'm just being
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 5: upfront with you. You should know that I'm telling you the truth.
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 5: That you can trust me on this, you know, And
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 5: that's that's the best way I operate. I mean, I
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 5: never tell them this is going to make five hundred million,
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 5: two undred million, twenty million. How the hell do I
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 5: know that? I don't know anything about that.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and that is true, Arison. You know, you know
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 4: Jason Brubaker who works with the stripper, You know he
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 4: often says that. He says, you know, you can't guarantee
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 4: this is going to get into sun Dance. You can't
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 4: guarantee it's gonna go into slam Dance.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 5: No, So you know you could have the greatest star
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 5: in the world. I mean I could get Brad Pitt
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 5: to I mean I can't. But if I did get
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 5: Brad Pitt to even do something for free for me,
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 5: how do I know that movie is going to make money?
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 5: You know? How do I know that? You know people
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 5: aren't tired of Brad Pitt. I mean, look Zombie Killers.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 5: You know, I tried to tell my my investor, you're
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 5: going to deal with zombie fatigue that Red Box, all
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 5: of them are. They're going to be tired of this
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 5: by the time this film is out. Now we've done
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 5: well with Zombie Killers, but if this were made five
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 5: six years ago, I think we would have done even better.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 5: But you have to try to know your market. I
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 5: mean zombie movies. I've written a piece on it why
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 5: I made a zombie film, and that is I wanted
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 5: to try to do something legitimate and different and most
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 5: of all good, which we did do. We made a
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 5: good film. But the real problem with the zombie film
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 5: is is. I still stand by it today. It's lazy filmmaking.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 5: Everybody makes a damn zombie movie because they think it's easy,
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 5: you know, and really the plot doesn't change. I mean,
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 5: it's always about people surviving. That's all it is, you know,
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 5: and people like that. It's a comfortable routine. I mean,
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 5: no matter how good The Walking Dead is, which I
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 5: believe it is, I think it's well made and it's
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 5: well produced. And I've said this a number of times
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 5: in interviews, it's still the same damn thing every week.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 5: People argue in Zombie's attack, that's it. That's all it is,
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 5: and that's fine, and that's what you want from your horror.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 4: You know, you mentioned zombie fatigue. I actually remember what
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 4: I was going to say to you. Now. A friend
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 4: of mine, she's actually been on the show as well.
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 4: She actually had a zombie film. It was just a
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 4: screenplay a couple of years ago, and she went out
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 4: to one of these pitch fests out in LA and
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 4: before she was about to pitch, they the one person
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 4: put up their hand, you know, stop and just said,
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 4: now before you begin, we don't want to hear any
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 4: zombie pitches. And she said, she goes that that's what
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 4: I'm about to pitch you. And she said, and the
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 4: person said, well, we're gonna you know, we're very sorry,
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 4: but we're we're She's like, we're we're not gonna hear
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 4: any more zombie pitches because you know, we're we're hearing
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 4: them left, right and center. Sure, and that.
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 5: Because everybody thinks, you know, look, get it, get a
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 5: red camera and get twenty five of your friends to
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 5: stick goop out of their mouth and run around a
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 5: ripped shirts and you got a zombie movie. That's not
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 5: how it works. And it gives off the illusion that
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 5: they're just really easy to make, and they're not. But
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 5: you know, and I got flack because I wrote in
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 5: one piece I said that the zombie movie is kind
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 5: of like the Nascar of horror. And you know, somebody's like, oh,
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 5: so he thinks anybody goes a Nascar stupid. No, I'm
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 5: not saying that. What I'm saying is, though it goes
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 5: around in a circle, you know where it begins, you
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 5: know where it ends, and you face it. You hope
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 5: for a couple interesting crashes in between. That's it. You know,
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 5: what more can we do? With zombies, Dave, what more
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 5: can we do other than stick them in space? What
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 5: more can we do? How many spin offs of The
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 5: Walking Dead do we need? I mean, when you see
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 5: these people on Twitter, oh my god, it's Sunday's coming,
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 5: I wonder what's gonna happen? I don't know. What do
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 5: you think is gonna happen? You think some zombies are
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 5: gonna bite some people? You think somebody might die? I
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 5: mean the only thing that that show really does is
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 5: who's gonna be the next big cast member to die? Like?
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 5: That's it, right, That's all it is. Who's good? Will
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 5: will you know, Darryl be killed off? Will Norman redus
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 5: make it till next season? I mean, that's all it is.
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 5: It's it's kind of like a constant who shot Jr?
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 5: Kind of thing that it just keeps you going to
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 5: the next one, you know. So I don't know. I mean,
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 5: if that's what people like, then what's wrong with that?
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 5: They like it great? I mean, the movie's making far
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 5: more money than Zombie Killers is, so I mean the
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 5: show is so good luck to him, you know. I mean,
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 5: if that's what people want, good for them.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 4: Well, my next idea Harrison is zombies in space, so
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 4: they put they put Jason in space, they put Jason
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 4: in space. I'm gonna put I'm gonna have zombies in space, right.
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 5: No.
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 4: You know, a friend of mine a podcast with said
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 4: he thinks zombies will have jumped the shark when they
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 4: can fall in love, and then out came a yeah,
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 4: that's right, warm bodies, yeah, and he was like, there
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 4: you go, We're officially done.
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 5: It is. It jumped the shark a long time ago.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 5: But I don't know, if you know again, other than
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 5: The Night of the Living Dead and those films, what
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 5: more can you do? It's you know, I mean, everybody says,
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 5: well I love the Walking Dude because it's a soap opera. Well,
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 5: why does horror have to be a soap? I don't
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 5: know if I want my herror to be a soap opera.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 5: But if that's what you like, good for you.
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 4: Man.
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 5: It's making money and it makes people happy.
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 1: and now back to the show.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 5: So if they love it, good for them.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 4: I still don't think that anybody any you know, zombie
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 4: films or even zombie TV shows. I mean, I I
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 4: still love the original. Dawn of the Dead is my
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 4: absolute favorite zombie film that I've ever seen, by far
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 4: and away, and it's just it's just because it's just
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 4: it feels like it just hit every important uh you
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 4: know issue at the time. And also it's just entertaining
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 4: as hell.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and there's nothing wrong with that, you know, It's
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 5: it's just great and.
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 4: Uh, you know, I'm a huge AMRA fan anyway, but
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 4: I don't I'm sorry, I don't want to get sidetracked.
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 4: I've been talking about, uh but of a marrow, but
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 4: but you know, I actually do want to talk to you,
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 4: you know, your upcoming film, Death House. Now. I know
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 4: you probably can't talk too much about it because you know,
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 4: it's it's it's obviously it's still in the uh whole
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 4: preproduction process. But you know, I saw the IMDb and
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 4: so far you have casted, you know, Danny Trejoe, Robert England,
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 4: Michael Berryman, Kane Hotter, Bill Moseley. You know, I just imagine,
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 4: if a producing standpoint, that it must be damn near
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 4: impossible to get that accomplished because those guys are always working,
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 4: you know what I mean, and just to get them
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 4: all in the same time. It must be like one
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 4: of those things where like all the stars have to
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 4: align and the planets are coming in the in the
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 4: you know.
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 5: It's yeah, I'll be able to give you a little
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 5: I have to go in about like five minutes. Okay,
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 5: sorry about that. We've been on like an hour.
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah, we've actually been talking for an hour and fifteen many.
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 5: I love it, but I do have a commitment that
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 5: I have to get to in a second. However, Uh yeah,
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 5: I mean you you said it best about the stars aligning.
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 5: You got to be getting these people at the right time.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 5: And the hardest part, Dave, with all of that is
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 5: is ensemble casting. You know, it's it's it's one of
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 5: those where Gunner Hanson really wanted to get as many
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 5: of these names in as he could, and a lot
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 5: of people in this industry new Gunner. So it's it's hard,
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 5: you know, to get them all to the table and
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 5: you know, make sure that everybody is feeling treated fairly
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 5: if that makes any sense, that they all feel that
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 5: they're being approached for the right reasons and not just
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 5: for stunt casting or things like that. And believe me,
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 5: none of that was the case at all. We want
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 5: to include as many of these luminaries as we can
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 5: because I look at it as more than just the
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 5: media dubbed it the expendables of horror. I look at
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 5: it as more of it's a mad, mad, mad mad
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 5: world where you're taking some of these really great names
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 5: who are not going to be around forever. I love
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 5: Death House, like thirty years from now, to have people
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 5: you know come back and look at it again and go, wow,
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 5: these were, you know, some of the crown jewels of
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 5: the genre at the time, and so you know, we're
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 5: trying to make it out of respect to the names.
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 5: But I can tell you this, we have a damn
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 5: good script. And the reason why I know that is
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 5: I sent this script out to a number of film critics,
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 5: respected and established horror trade magazines that I told them,
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 5: I said, listen, if you hate it, all I ask
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 5: is you wait until the film is out and then
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 5: you can trash it all you want, but I'm giving
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 5: you a scoop. Not a single one of them came
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 5: back and said, oh my god, this is not good.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 5: They said, if you make this script the way that
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 5: you've written it, you got a winner. And that's how
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 5: we're gonna make it. So that's how confident I was
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 5: in the script. And one of them was a prominent
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 5: horror critic as well too, and I said, I once,
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 5: you'd be honest with me if it's not good or
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 5: you feel that this has problems, I need to know.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 5: And that's how confident I was.
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 4: That's amazing that you're able to you know, uh, you know,
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 4: not have any feedback. I guess you know what I mean, Like,
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 4: it's so good, yo, okay, tell me and you hear
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 4: nothing right, so that I guess you know, that has
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 4: to you know, that has to fill you with such
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 4: confidence going forward that you're like, you know, I know
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 4: it's a damn good script. And now I have somebody else,
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 4: you know, other people tell me it's a damn good script.
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 4: Sounds like all engines forward.
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 5: Yes, and you know it's it's not even just confidence,
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 5: it's just simply we're doing the right thing here. We're
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 5: not making a gimmick movie. We're not making like some
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 5: people think. If you can make this clear on your podcast,
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 5: this isn't Michael Myers fighting Jason or Freddy Krueger. That's
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 5: not what this is. These those are copyrighted characters. These
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 5: are the actors who happen to play these people, but
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 5: they're all in different roles. So it's not like you know,
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 5: Avid and Costello me Frankenstein, where we're going to mash
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 5: up all the monsters. That's not what we're doing here.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 5: So that's that's something I want clear. And then on
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 5: the second end of it, we're treating this as you know,
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 5: a really good commentary, you know, on this story, okay,
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 5: And and most of all, the genre. We're treating the
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 5: genre with respect. And that's important because it's not just
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 5: about throwing in a bunch of hard names and killing
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 5: them off one by one. And Gunner never wanted that.
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 5: Gunner wanted something that was substantial, and that it was
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 5: a definite tip of the hat and a tip of
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 5: a sspecful tip of the hat to the genre, to
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 5: the horror genre.
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm glad you said it, Harrison, because I remember
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 4: reading when when when news of this broke on some
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 4: of the sites. Remember some of the comments were like,
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 4: oh my god, it's gonna be leather face fighting Jason
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 4: and and I and I, I mean I knew because
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 4: you know, like you said, they're all different coperated characters
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 4: and getting getting all of the trademarks for those names
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 4: and likenesses and all that that would be a legal nightmare.
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 5: Didn't do it, so you couldn't do it.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 4: So I know you have to go. Somebody actually walked
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 4: into your room there, I could see. It's but it's
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 4: like a horror movie itself, like oh my god, there's
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 4: somebody behind you.
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 5: Like unfriended or something like that.
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, they had unfriended And there was also a
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 4: scream on one of the screams too they had the
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 4: people were behind them you couldn't see.
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 5: And and Halloween Resurrection they did that too or something.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 4: But yeah, I remember it was with uh when h
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 4: oh bust the Rhymes and tire banks right, the Jaws.
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 5: The Revenge of Slasher films.
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 4: Harrison, I know you have to go. But before you go,
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 4: where people find you out online?
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 5: Oh, you can find me online at my company site
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 5: which is www dot Class eighty five dot com. And
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 5: you can find me on Twitter Harrison Smith eighty five
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 5: on Twitter. I think that's my handle. I'm pretty sure
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 5: I should look.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, and I think that is it is.
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 5: Okay. Yeah, I'm not really good with self promotion in
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 5: that way. And yeah, I mean you can find all
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 5: my films. They're everywhere. They're on Amazon, they're on iTunes, Hulu,
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 5: pretty much everywhere you can find them. And I've had
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 5: plenty of people tell me that they're torrented like crazy.
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 4: So, oh, I actually have a Hula accounts. I'll check out.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 4: I'll check out camp Dread on Hulu.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 5: I think camp Dreads on who I know The Fields
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 5: and six Degrees are definitely on Hulu as well. But yeah,
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 5: and if not, I know that you can stream camp
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 5: Dread right off of Amazon.
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 4: Oh right, cool, awesome. I usually before the physical copys,
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 4: I actually started going back and forth in digital media
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 4: and physical media.
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 5: Now big physical media person I like it on DVD.
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's what I I've come back to now. I'm like,
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 4: I'm making sure I get everything Criterion like Blu Ray
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 4: if I can, or you know now, because I'm you know,
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 4: I'm always a little leery now about digital media. But
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 4: that's a whole nother story.
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 5: Right, Yes it is. I share your wariness.
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 4: Harrison Smith. I want to say thank you very much
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 4: for coming on and I wish you best with Deathhouse.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 5: Thank you, and we'll give you some updates as we
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 5: get moving on that. We start shooting April fourth.
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 4: Oh wow, so you're like you're you're like feeling the
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 4: pressure right now. Yeah, Harrison again, I want to wish
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 4: you the best of luck and I look forward to
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 4: hearing how hell well it turns out.
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 5: Thank you, and thanks for having me on the show.
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 4: Oh my pleasure, Harrison, Take care, but I have a
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 4: good weekend you too. Bye bye.
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 1: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 1: a great job on this episode. If you want to
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 1: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: head over to the show notes at Bulletproof Screenwriting dot
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 1: tv for it slash for eighty seven. Thank you so
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: much for listening, guys, as always, keep on writing no
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: matter what. I'll talk to you soon
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 2: For listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at Bulletproof Screenwriting
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 2: dot tv.