Latest / WOC and Allies: Business and Career Realtalk with Elaine Lou Cartas / 89: How to Work with Gen Z with Keely Antonio

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89: How to Work with Gen Z with Keely Antonio · WOC and Allies: Business and Career Realtalk with Elaine Lou Cartas

0:00
SPEAKER_01: Lazy and entitled.
0:02
SPEAKER_01: That's what we millennials used to be called.
0:06
SPEAKER_01: And now, guess who stole that?
0:09
SPEAKER_01: Gen Z.
0:10
SPEAKER_01: I'm a bit jealous because now us millennials are the more seasoned, older ones.
0:17
SPEAKER_01: You know, with a bit of white hair.
0:18
SPEAKER_01: I only have a tad bit.
0:19
SPEAKER_01: And confession, fun fact, I have virgin hair.
0:22
SPEAKER_01: Yep, I have never dyed my hair.
0:25
SPEAKER_01: All right, I am digressing.
0:27
SPEAKER_01: Let's go back.
0:28
SPEAKER_01: But I remember when I started my business in 2017.
0:33
SPEAKER_01: And I remember saying to myself, I am not gonna be doing career coaching with a Gen Z.
0:40
SPEAKER_01: They just don't get it.
0:42
SPEAKER_01: But now that I'm older, I've learned to empathize.
0:45
SPEAKER_01: And I've also come to a better understanding.
0:48
SPEAKER_01: They were the first generation born into digital screens.
0:54
SPEAKER_01: And not by choice.
0:56
SPEAKER_01: And think of it, not just them, but even for us.
0:58
SPEAKER_01: Whenever a negative emotion or feeling like anxiety comes up, they'll bring their phone out to deal with it like a drug.
1:07
SPEAKER_01: We do it too.
1:08
SPEAKER_01: Rather than the adult thing to do, where let's have conversations.
1:13
SPEAKER_01: Help me understand your perspective.
1:15
SPEAKER_01: Also, because of COVID, they had a couple of years where they didn't develop these social skills, whether it's in school developing the social skills or even in-person office interactions that a lot of us, whether millennials, gen X, and baby boomers, had the privilege to experience.
1:39
SPEAKER_01: And yes, I am using the word privilege because it is a privilege to experience social interactions.
1:44
SPEAKER_01: We are social human beings.
1:47
SPEAKER_01: So don't worry, I am not going to be critiquing Gen Z.
1:51
SPEAKER_01: In fact, I am joined today with my friend who I met at a conference.
1:57
SPEAKER_01: We were both speakers, Keely Antonio.
2:00
SPEAKER_01: She's the co-founder of Feel Swell Experiences.
2:03
SPEAKER_01: She's a Gen Z herself and an expert in the Gen Z workforce integration.
2:08
SPEAKER_01: So before we drop the beat, it would mean so much if you can leave a rating and review.
2:14
SPEAKER_01: This helps other fellow women of color and allies like you to find out about this free accessible resource.
2:23
SPEAKER_01: And now let's drop the beat.
2:25
SPEAKER_01: Hey, I'm Elaine Lucartas.
2:28
SPEAKER_01: I'm a business and career coach for women of color and allies.
2:32
SPEAKER_01: Elaine Weekly awarded me the number one thought leader, and Apple News named me one of the top five business coaches.
2:40
SPEAKER_01: Done doing the most as a woman of color or ally, and you want to create your own definition of success and happiness?
2:48
SPEAKER_01: Well, grab your coffee tea or boba and let's do some business and career real talk.
2:57
SPEAKER_01: Hey legacy leaders, I'm excited to have a new friend.
3:01
SPEAKER_01: We met a month ago, right, Keely?
3:04
SPEAKER_01: I think so.
3:05
SPEAKER_01: Is it's been a month?
3:06
SPEAKER_01: It's been a month.
3:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, a month ago.
3:08
SPEAKER_01: And we were just like checking each other out at the HR retail conference.
3:12
SPEAKER_01: I just did a talk on psychological safety, and then it was one of those coffee breaks, and Keely came up to me, and then Keely had a wonderful talk on Gen Z, and we're like, we need to do a podcast episode.
3:24
SPEAKER_01: Like, I was like, let me be the big sister millennial with like the little sis Gen Z here.
3:30
SPEAKER_01: So I'm kind of teasing a bit, but let me brag about Keely for a bit.
3:33
SPEAKER_01: So Keely is the co-founder for Field Swell Experiences, an expert in the Gen Z workforce integration and future of work innovation.
3:42
SPEAKER_01: I remember the thing I told you during Coffee Keely.
3:44
SPEAKER_01: It was like, it's so nice to meet a Gen Z specialist who's actually a Gen Z specialist, like who is a Gen Z, as opposed to a lot of people saying, I'm a specialist.
3:54
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, actually, but you're not.
3:56
SPEAKER_01: It's anyways, that's another topic for another day.
3:58
SPEAKER_01: But what I really love about Keely, it's not just the strategy and the integration, but also having a background in somatic therapy and EFT and Keely being so young.
4:08
SPEAKER_01: Look at her.
4:08
SPEAKER_01: I'm so proud of her.
4:09
SPEAKER_01: She's already been in CS CNBC and the Today Show and more shows in the future.
4:15
SPEAKER_02: Keely, welcome.
4:17
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for having me.
4:18
SPEAKER_02: I'm excited because what I love doing is sharing that real experience.
4:23
SPEAKER_02: And like you said before, there's so many people that will talk about Gen Z, but they may not have that lived experience of being someone that grew up as Gen Z.
4:31
SPEAKER_02: And I can really speak to what it's been like in the workplace and what I've seen in other organizations.
4:37
SPEAKER_02: So I can't wait to dive into all of it today.
4:39
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for having me.
4:41
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I remember this was early, this was like in the 2010s when I was working for a company and there was a DI workshop on how to work with minorities.
4:51
SPEAKER_01: And the two people that led it were a white man and a white woman.
4:55
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, I am more qualified because I am a person of color.
4:59
SPEAKER_01: I don't understand.
5:01
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's what's happening for these Gen Z experts.
5:06
SPEAKER_01: But I just want to say, I feel like I've dated myself having this podcast episode.
5:10
SPEAKER_01: I remember when millennials were so cool.
5:14
SPEAKER_01: And we were the ones like, oh my gosh, millennials are so entitled and lazy.
5:21
SPEAKER_01: And I'll be honest, even when I started off as my coaching business, I was like, I don't want to work with Gen Z.
5:26
SPEAKER_01: They just don't get it.
5:28
SPEAKER_01: And now it's your generation being entitled, lazy, the quiet quitters.
5:33
SPEAKER_01: And like I said, as a millennial, I remember having this perception 10 years ago.
5:37
SPEAKER_01: So I would love for you to debunk that.
5:40
SPEAKER_01: And I think explain to people how it's different.
5:45
SPEAKER_01: Because I think what we can learn from different generations is that we question the way things work.
5:49
SPEAKER_01: And it should be questioned and it should be changed.
5:52
SPEAKER_01: So tell us why those stereotypes are horrible.
5:55
SPEAKER_02: You know what?
5:56
SPEAKER_02: Let's get it.
5:57
SPEAKER_02: Because it's just, it's true.
5:58
SPEAKER_02: And you know, I think one of the things that I want to call out here is why I've positioned myself and brought up the aspect of Gen Z is because in our society, if I come and I'm really talking about leadership and human skills, people do look at me and they say, What do you know?
6:15
SPEAKER_02: Like you're 25, what do you know?
6:18
SPEAKER_02: And so we've almost had to use that angle to get this point across that we're all actually very similar in a lot of our values.
6:25
SPEAKER_02: But we did grow up in different eras.
6:27
SPEAKER_02: And I think when we talk about generations, right, we look at Gen Z, and that's anybody who's listening right now that wants to know anybody at this point in time that's 12 years old to 27 years old.
6:40
SPEAKER_02: And when we look at how we grew up in some of the recent events of COVID, right?
6:45
SPEAKER_02: Many Gen Zers who were entering the workforce, they were graduating college at this point in time where COVID had put us in isolation and we have more technology and social media than ever.
6:58
SPEAKER_02: And so looking at these different aspects of Gen Z specifically, people have seen us as lazy and entitled.
7:06
SPEAKER_02: You kind of called that out already.
7:08
SPEAKER_02: And many of the challenges that happen when those stereotypes occur is that they create an action and how people treat Gen Z, right?
7:19
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, all about stereotypes.
7:22
SPEAKER_02: If there's a belief that leads to an action, it's going to create this behavior.
7:26
SPEAKER_02: And we see this time and time again with managers who think that Gen Z is lazy and maybe feels like they have to micromanage, right?
7:33
SPEAKER_02: This can manifest in so many different ways.
7:35
SPEAKER_02: And so we really want to break it down and help people see that we all are very different, regardless of our generation.
7:44
SPEAKER_02: And it's more about giving people the human skills to meet people where they are and to understand them as humans and having the ability to really ask those hard questions of, you know, what is it that you need?
7:57
SPEAKER_02: We say hard questions because not a lot of people ask that these days.
8:02
SPEAKER_02: It can be really challenging to have those conversations bring us together because it's intimate.
8:09
SPEAKER_01: I like those questions.
8:10
SPEAKER_01: What do you need?
8:11
SPEAKER_01: How do you process information?
8:14
SPEAKER_01: I have to remind myself and put myself in check.
8:16
SPEAKER_01: I mean, when screens and social media came in for me, I was like in my teenage years, but you're the first generation that was born into screens.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: And that's not your fault.
8:27
SPEAKER_01: Like you were born into it, right?
8:30
SPEAKER_01: And not just your generation, but even our generation, like any negative feeling or anxiety, we pick up our phones to numb ourselves out.
8:39
SPEAKER_01: Like it's a horrible drug to go into.
8:42
SPEAKER_01: And what I've noticed with Gen Z, and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, like it's learning those communication skills because, like you said, COVID happened.
8:51
SPEAKER_01: So that's what, probably two or three years, depending on where you're living, where you don't have that social interaction.
8:56
SPEAKER_01: So that sped up working remote, where then you don't have those water cooler talks, those conversations that you naturally learn when you're in office.
9:07
SPEAKER_01: So, how do you learn that communication when majority of companies are expecting you to respond to emails, respond to Slack or Teams messages, always beyond?
9:17
SPEAKER_01: And then there's no time to integrate and do work and to get to know people.
9:21
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, definitely.
9:22
SPEAKER_02: That is one of the biggest challenges that we see is that you're right, we're not having those natural conversations on the way to a meeting, right?
9:30
SPEAKER_02: Walking together, whatever it may be, getting lunch.
9:33
SPEAKER_02: It's just not happening the same.
9:35
SPEAKER_02: And I mean, tell me if you believe this too.
9:38
SPEAKER_02: If you get on a Zoom, there's an agenda, right?
9:40
SPEAKER_02: There's something to talk about.
9:41
SPEAKER_02: A lot of people are Zoom fatigued.
9:43
SPEAKER_02: They don't want to just be chatting about everything under the sun.
9:47
SPEAKER_02: You know, they want to talk about whatever they're meeting about, and then they're moving on.
9:51
SPEAKER_02: But we lose that natural learning, that experiential part where you get to pick up when you're in person.
9:59
SPEAKER_02: And so it is something that we're looking at and trying to provide solutions for for different companies that want to take a new approach, that want to be more intentional about the ways that they gather.
10:12
SPEAKER_02: You know, we're in such a dispersed workforce.
10:15
SPEAKER_02: Many teams are hybrid.
10:17
SPEAKER_02: They may even say, hey, you can come in, you know, two days a week and people don't come at all.
10:22
SPEAKER_02: Right.
10:23
SPEAKER_02: And we and I've heard this many times working with different organizations.
10:26
SPEAKER_02: So how do you create?
10:28
SPEAKER_02: And we have to go back to basics.
10:30
SPEAKER_02: This is what we're looking at.
10:31
SPEAKER_02: Because if you look at anything about Gen Z, we're actually the loneliest generation.
10:35
SPEAKER_02: And that leads me back to the connection, right?
10:38
SPEAKER_02: We've got to have that intentional human connection.
10:41
SPEAKER_02: So what we're really looking at is how do we go back to bringing people and teams together intentionally in person and creating those spaces that are really meaningful, maybe over two days, three days, giving them that experience to be together, to learn from each other, and then go back out into their dispersed teams but those experiences where they actually got to be together, you're gonna feel so much closer.
11:08
SPEAKER_02: You're going to feel like you can ask the questions that maybe you were afraid to ask before and you can understand people a bit more.
11:15
SPEAKER_02: Let's just talk about even making friends as an adult.
11:19
SPEAKER_02: How much time do we have to like go out and hang out with friends and get to know people?
11:24
SPEAKER_02: Probably not a lot, right?
11:25
SPEAKER_02: We maybe have like one to two hours that we'll dedicate per week that we'll like make friend plans.
11:31
SPEAKER_02: And they say that it takes about a year span to call someone even your friend.
11:37
SPEAKER_02: So it's the same thing.
11:38
SPEAKER_02: Imagine if we're just talking to people at work about work things and we don't actually ever get to know people, it's gonna take a long time for us to feel really comfortable for us to start working together in a really productive way and have that growth.
11:51
SPEAKER_02: And so I want to consider all of that as we move forward that things have changed and we have to be a lot more intentional in order to have that human connection that we really need.
12:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think a couple things.
12:05
SPEAKER_01: I know one comp one of my clients' companies does it right where every year they have a conference where people could connect.
12:12
SPEAKER_01: So that's when.
12:14
SPEAKER_01: And then within the different departments, there's like an in-person meeting.
12:18
SPEAKER_01: So those connections are really big.
12:20
SPEAKER_01: This company has tried to like do coffee virtual chats, but what has happened is that there's it's not mandatory.
12:29
SPEAKER_01: It's people who choose to, but it's the same people and it's kind of people are canceling on it.
12:33
SPEAKER_01: So there's one piece.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: What you're talking about, like getting to know people, something that we had millennials, gen X boomers, is that third space.
12:43
SPEAKER_01: I remember that, and what that means is after work, like let me go grab a drink or let's play ball after and let's just talk about stuff.
12:52
SPEAKER_01: But because companies are a lot more, it's not so localized, it's globalized, different states, different countries, it's like, what can we do?
13:01
SPEAKER_01: But then what can you do locally?
13:03
SPEAKER_01: So I know some can companies have like a local coffee meetup, right?
13:07
SPEAKER_01: It takes away time.
13:09
SPEAKER_01: So finding that at the same time, I get it.
13:12
SPEAKER_01: Companies are always thinking about the bottom line.
13:15
SPEAKER_01: So I'm curious what you've shared with companies of like, I know it's gonna cost money to meet in person, but this is the ROI that you get.
13:23
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
13:23
SPEAKER_02: I mean, we can just look at some of the stats, and I don't want to have them off the top of my head, but when people will meet in person and then what their levels of confidence, trust, I mean, impact with their teams is, you know, even months to come after that, it's huge.
13:38
SPEAKER_02: I mean, think about any kind of experience that you've ever gone on, and this ties into a little bit of what I've learned about Gen Z is that we're craving an experience.
13:47
SPEAKER_02: We're craving something that gives us a new perspective, that gives us a new opportunity to travel, to have fun, to enjoy time.
13:58
SPEAKER_02: And I think there was an article that maybe you sent over to me, Elaine, that I looked at that talked a little bit about how Gen Z wants to be rewarded.
14:06
SPEAKER_02: And one of the things that was on there was they want time off, right?
14:10
SPEAKER_02: They want time.
14:11
SPEAKER_02: And we really value this aspect of time.
14:14
SPEAKER_02: And I think COVID has played a really huge part into that because we realized what do we have, right?
14:21
SPEAKER_02: When you have all this isolation, you know, these are the things that start to matter.
14:25
SPEAKER_02: You start to look at your life a little bit differently.
14:27
SPEAKER_02: So when I talk to companies about the impact of, let's just say we create a team connection experience for them, whether they're bringing, you know, certain members on their team, managers, they're bringing, you know, their whole entire team, if it's a small team, whatever it may be, it's like, let's look at the impact, let's measure it.
14:46
SPEAKER_02: How do people feel before they come on an experience like this?
14:51
SPEAKER_02: What are they, and can we make it intentional?
14:53
SPEAKER_02: Right.
14:53
SPEAKER_02: The coffee chats may be great, but is there something about it that really brings people together and they feel like, how am I gonna get value out of this for myself?
15:03
SPEAKER_02: Because everyone's thinking about it.
15:04
SPEAKER_02: They want to know what does it benefit me?
15:06
SPEAKER_02: And how do we bring those?
15:08
SPEAKER_02: And I talk about this a lot, how do we operationalize those company values and talk about each individual's personal values and help them connect to why they're doing what they're doing?
15:19
SPEAKER_02: There's gotta be some sort of connection, especially as people become more thoughtful about how they're living their life and how they want to participate in different activities and even work in general.
15:32
SPEAKER_01: I want to ask, because I know long leaders get frustrated.
15:36
SPEAKER_01: How do I lead Gen Z?
15:38
SPEAKER_01: I don't get it.
15:38
SPEAKER_01: So I'll give you kind of two different situations from different clients.
15:41
SPEAKER_01: I had one client where they were sharing, Elaine, there's like a social gathering and I don't understand why I should go.
15:49
SPEAKER_01: Like this is a waste of my time.
15:50
SPEAKER_01: I have work to do.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: And it's no one from their department, it's from different departments at the same time.
15:57
SPEAKER_01: They need to work with them cross-functionally to get work done.
16:00
SPEAKER_01: But I was fascinated as this person's coach to explain why.
16:05
SPEAKER_01: Like going to social gathering actually helps with camaraderie, getting to know your coworkers.
16:12
SPEAKER_01: I was also mindful that because of COVID, you know, not so much social interaction learning.
16:18
SPEAKER_01: So that's one situation scenario.
16:21
SPEAKER_01: And the second piece is I remember talking to another client who's a millennial and they were sharing with me.
16:28
SPEAKER_01: I have like two to three Gen Z workers.
16:31
SPEAKER_01: They want to raise, they want a promotion, but they're not thinking.
16:37
SPEAKER_01: Like they're just doing their work, they're not critically thinking, they're making mistakes.
16:43
SPEAKER_01: So sharing those situations because they're very real.
16:46
SPEAKER_01: I'm sure other people could relate listening to it.
16:49
SPEAKER_01: What would you like to share with our audience, who's probably primarily millennials or Gen X, of what we need to do to help lead, to communicate, to explain things?
16:59
SPEAKER_01: Because I know it's really easy for older generations, like I think about boomers, for example.
17:04
SPEAKER_01: Oh, you just do it this way.
17:06
SPEAKER_01: Like, okay, well, that does not help me.
17:08
SPEAKER_01: Like, explain why, or the bigger meaning behind it.
17:12
SPEAKER_01: So, how would you explain Gen Z wanting to be led, to be communicated, to be mentored?
17:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I love it.
17:18
SPEAKER_02: Let's go back to your two situations.
17:21
SPEAKER_02: And speaking of the first one, you know, if we look at this, this person didn't know why they needed to go to the social gathering.
17:28
SPEAKER_02: I'm assuming Gen Z.
17:30
SPEAKER_01: Yes, correct.
17:31
SPEAKER_01: Okay, this person's Gen Z.
17:32
SPEAKER_01: They had no idea and had to explain it to them.
17:34
SPEAKER_01: And then they got it.
17:36
SPEAKER_02: Right.
17:36
SPEAKER_02: So, and and once they got it, you explained it.
17:39
SPEAKER_02: So I think that awareness piece of why certain gatherings or why certain activities or events are important.
17:45
SPEAKER_02: You kind of mentioned that there, but I think that's a really big part of how do we actually create the education piece and awareness.
17:52
SPEAKER_02: Education piece.
17:53
SPEAKER_02: Why, why we do what we do.
17:55
SPEAKER_02: Because no one wants to just be like, oh, if you have to go to this, but but why?
17:59
SPEAKER_02: And that goes back to again, and I want to know how does it connect to me?
18:04
SPEAKER_02: Why is it valuable?
18:05
SPEAKER_02: And maybe what you know as a leader, if you're my leader about my values, why that would be important.
18:11
SPEAKER_02: Oh, Keely, we know that you want to grow here.
18:13
SPEAKER_02: We know that you want to do this, whatever it may be, X, Y, Z.
18:16
SPEAKER_02: Here's who you're gonna meet.
18:17
SPEAKER_02: Here's what you can get out of it, and here's how it can support everything that you're doing on a day-to-day, whatever it may be, right?
18:24
SPEAKER_02: I need that mentorship, that guidance to understand, and maybe a lot of other Gen Z as well, because we may not know why something like that would be important.
18:33
SPEAKER_02: Maybe even two, it's uncomfortable to socialize in that capacity.
18:39
SPEAKER_02: And it's working with people and meeting with them where they are and understanding what it is that they need in order to be successful in those situations.
18:48
SPEAKER_02: Into the situation number two, I've heard that so much.
18:52
SPEAKER_02: Gen Z is like, what do you mean?
18:53
SPEAKER_02: I can't make 250,000 per year right off the bat.
18:57
SPEAKER_02: Like, come on.
18:58
SPEAKER_02: And it's this conversation of how do we co-create together?
19:04
SPEAKER_02: And it's on both sides, right?
19:06
SPEAKER_02: If the leader, manager is speaking and Gen Z person is speaking, can we rephrase our questions?
19:12
SPEAKER_02: Hey, here's some of my goals.
19:14
SPEAKER_02: How can we get there together?
19:17
SPEAKER_02: And then manager leadership speaking and saying, How can I support you?
19:22
SPEAKER_02: You know, how can we work together to co-create something that works for you?
19:27
SPEAKER_02: And we find that middle ground because we may not be able to get to that 250 gay, right, in the first year, but we may be able to set up some milestones and goals to work towards whatever it may be so that we both feel like we're moving forward.
19:42
SPEAKER_02: We both feel supported.
19:43
SPEAKER_02: And it's that co-creation, bringing that back to the minnow.
19:48
SPEAKER_01: Legacy leader.
19:49
SPEAKER_01: I know what you're thinking.
19:50
SPEAKER_01: Elaine, you have such good stuff here.
19:53
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19:54
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21:05
SPEAKER_01: That's J-O-I-N.
21:07
SPEAKER_01: All right, let's get back to the episode.
21:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I want to add to the first situation because I'm mindful.
21:16
SPEAKER_01: I mean, here's the compliment I will throw flowers at for Gen Z your amazing boundaries, right?
21:22
SPEAKER_01: So I understood in her perspective of I this is extra.
21:26
SPEAKER_01: Like I could be running because she loves running, or I could be napping, like napping.
21:32
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't have to be a doing, it could just be a being activity, right?
21:36
SPEAKER_01: So to honor that, I explained exactly what I discussed earlier, why it's important.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: And I also told her, you don't have to stay for the whole thing.
21:44
SPEAKER_01: Like come for an hour.
21:46
SPEAKER_01: What I've also realized with my Gen Z clients, I probably need to create something with this, but even prompts or scripts on how to socialize and do small talk.
21:59
SPEAKER_01: And I'm gonna let my fellow millennials and above know you're like, I don't understand.
22:05
SPEAKER_01: Like they should know how to do it.
22:07
SPEAKER_01: Gen Z didn't have the same exposure and experience as us.
22:11
SPEAKER_01: And I don't know, correct me if I'm wrong, but I was reading up on this too, even for parents, because I know probably your parents are maybe Gen X early boomers, is going to school and high school.
22:24
SPEAKER_01: I know that generation, not blaming them, it's just society and culture, capitalism of encouraging like this new generation to not have to work, like focus on school.
22:36
SPEAKER_01: Okay, do sports, but there's not a lot of like human interaction as much as well.
22:42
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
22:42
SPEAKER_01: I might be wrong with that.
22:43
SPEAKER_01: I'm curious your perspective on that.
22:45
SPEAKER_01: So you don't have it as much.
22:46
SPEAKER_01: That's what I've heard.
22:47
SPEAKER_01: I could be wrong.
22:48
SPEAKER_01: Please correct me.
22:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think it's different for everybody, right?
22:51
SPEAKER_02: But I do think there's a human interaction piece.
22:55
SPEAKER_02: There's a gap because I know most people around me, like this is just the truth.
23:00
SPEAKER_02: They don't really want to socialize or interact, you know, in in these ways.
23:04
SPEAKER_02: They're like, okay, let me just like do whatever and close off.
23:08
SPEAKER_02: And it's a lot of it, it's not having the tools.
23:12
SPEAKER_02: That's just the truth.
23:13
SPEAKER_02: It's not having the tools to be able to communicate or be in those situations.
23:17
SPEAKER_02: It's uncomfortable.
23:18
SPEAKER_02: And of course, our brain is always trying to protect us.
23:21
SPEAKER_02: So anything that maybe feels a little uncomfortable, we'll try to do anything we can to get out of it.
23:26
SPEAKER_02: And I think that just comes with having great mentors, having people that will guide you, lead you, and support you in feeling more comfortable.
23:36
SPEAKER_02: Because when you look at Gen Z being the loneliest generation, over 70% of them are saying they're lonely all or most of the time.
23:43
SPEAKER_02: We have to look at that and say, what is it that would help bring that back?
23:49
SPEAKER_02: And what could help people ease into that more comfortably or make them feel more open or like they can connect in these ways?
23:57
SPEAKER_02: Because we need that in order to keep growing.
24:01
SPEAKER_02: We need that in order to, I believe, utilize our full potential to bounce ideas off other people, to, you know, get feedback and continue to change and challenge ourselves.
24:15
SPEAKER_02: And if there's anything that COVID taught me personally, it's that my relationships are the most important thing in my life.
24:22
SPEAKER_02: And understanding people and knowing people and just trying to take care of the people around me, that's all I want to do, you know.
24:31
SPEAKER_02: And I think that's why I do what I do, because I want to teach people how to take care of other people and have these conversations of growth and inspiration and ways that we can make an impact together.
24:43
SPEAKER_02: But that doesn't happen when the bridge isn't there, right?
24:46
SPEAKER_02: When there's that wall and there's no bridge to meet people where they are, it's it, we all we all fail, you know, it doesn't benefit anyone.
24:56
SPEAKER_02: So we we have to continue to educate on the tools that give people the ability to communicate and give them practice.
25:04
SPEAKER_02: Like you said, I'm gonna come up with something for prompts.
25:07
SPEAKER_02: Great.
25:07
SPEAKER_02: That's a great tool.
25:09
SPEAKER_02: You know, most of my day, I'm using AI, and that's prompting me all day, right?
25:14
SPEAKER_02: So it's a practice of like really being able to bring in these different aspects of how we learn and how we're used to learning and and incorporating these different styles so that we can grasp and pick up the different ways to connect on every level.
25:31
SPEAKER_01: A prompt or a tool I even want to share in this episode, not just for Gen C, I've been noticing it a lot more for even my millennial clients as well and Gen X, is when you're working in teams, whether you're managing or even working cross-functionally in different departments.
25:47
SPEAKER_01: Having a table, or it could be like a messy Google Doc of each individual you work with, how they best communicate, what's their motivation, inspiration, what are their goals?
25:57
SPEAKER_01: Based off observations from you communicating with them or other people, how do they like best being talked with?
26:04
SPEAKER_01: Or based off your observation from how you've communicated with them or other people, what what should you try to avoid or not say?
26:12
SPEAKER_01: You know, for example, maybe you realize with certain leaders, I'm stereotyping, like C-suite leaders, when you're connecting with them, you need to be confident sharing numbers and data.
26:20
SPEAKER_01: Maybe when you're working with like someone who is more feminine, it's hey, how was your son's soccer practice?
26:28
SPEAKER_01: I remember it was last week.
26:29
SPEAKER_01: Like having those notes and data is actually really helpful.
26:33
SPEAKER_01: So that's an example of a prompt.
26:36
SPEAKER_01: You went back of like what Gen Z needs.
26:38
SPEAKER_01: I think the reality is what the whole workforce, these four different generations, Gen Z millennials, Gen X, boomers, all need to work together.
26:49
SPEAKER_01: I also want to remind the boomers who probably are not listening to this episode, but I'll share it anyways.
26:55
SPEAKER_01: And also to resonate with those.
26:57
SPEAKER_01: I know because boomers were my parents, right?
27:01
SPEAKER_01: And for them, it's like you should stay at a job because you'll be rewarded.
27:05
SPEAKER_01: Like the reality is we're not gonna have the same benefits of a pension or social security.
27:10
SPEAKER_01: That's just it.
27:11
SPEAKER_01: For our generation, for your generation, Gen Z, like our careers are gonna change five to seven times minimum, and that's how we'll increase our salary.
27:19
SPEAKER_01: What do you feel or know that Gen Z and all these generations need in a workplace?
27:25
SPEAKER_02: I feel like this has been the theme of our conversation, but it's that human connection aspect.
27:30
SPEAKER_02: It's that getting back to meeting people where we where they are, regardless of who how they identify, regardless of what generation they're a part of.
27:39
SPEAKER_02: It's all of us trying to come together to just see that there's so many people hurting, there's so many people that feel alone, there's so many people that are going through so many different life challenges.
27:50
SPEAKER_02: And we've all just gone through COVID.
27:53
SPEAKER_02: And it has changed us and impacted us in ways that we may not even fully recognize yet if we haven't seen it.
28:00
SPEAKER_02: And to be able to look at that and say, how can each day I show up in a space and just ask somebody how they are?
28:08
SPEAKER_02: Right.
28:09
SPEAKER_02: Just to have a little bit more empathy to put yourself in someone else's shoes and give, you know, this connection piece of conversation that can go a long way and carry into someone's day, especially for the people that live alone, work remote, don't see anybody all day, all week, maybe you don't live close to their family, like whatever it may be, just going that extra couple of steps to meet people where they are.
28:37
SPEAKER_02: That I believe then that is what will change a lot of things in this world.
28:42
SPEAKER_02: I love human connection and I I think it's really powerful.
28:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
28:46
SPEAKER_01: I think what I'm hearing from you, it's the turning the how are you?
28:50
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I'm good, good, how about you?
28:52
SPEAKER_01: To how are you really?
28:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
28:56
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: And I want to give like another tip when I think about when I was in my 20s, what helped me was having friends and mentors from other different generations.
29:08
SPEAKER_01: That was so healing.
29:09
SPEAKER_01: Like my ex-boss, who's still a good friend and mentor, who's a boomer, great friend.
29:14
SPEAKER_01: I still keep in touch because we go through life situations.
29:17
SPEAKER_01: And I'll be honest, I don't want to talk to my friends about other big life decisions or choices.
29:22
SPEAKER_01: I want to talk to someone that's been through it, like really been through it.
29:25
SPEAKER_01: Because sometimes your friends in the same generation, you're all going through it.
29:29
SPEAKER_01: And sometimes it could just be like a pity party of things, or I'm like, actually, I want to talk to someone who survived it.
29:34
SPEAKER_01: And I was just at a family party where I was talking, you know, it was my boyfriend's cousin who's Gen X, and it was just nice talking to her.
29:42
SPEAKER_01: I think try working on having friendships beyond your generation helps heal and comes to an understanding of different people.
29:50
SPEAKER_01: I also, I don't know if you experienced this, Keely, but I remember when I was working in person in my 20s, and I obviously I met people with different beliefs, like political beliefs, and they would share.
30:02
SPEAKER_01: But despite them having different beliefs from mine, there was still a respect with one another.
30:09
SPEAKER_01: And I think that was that's the beauty that we're kind of missing from in-person because we had that respect, and sure I might think that other person's wrong, but there is still like a respect and understanding we were able to work through it together.
30:21
SPEAKER_01: And I feel like now with being siloed and digital, yeah, it's hard to understand someone else.
30:28
SPEAKER_01: And social media algorithms play into that too.
30:31
SPEAKER_01: So I'll say that.
30:32
SPEAKER_02: No, definitely, right?
30:33
SPEAKER_02: There's so many different layers, but I think it is about just having that empathy, regardless of what generation, regardless of how someone identifies, because we really don't know the whole story.
30:44
SPEAKER_02: You know, I'm someone that's a part of the LGBTQ plus community, and people assume I'm straight all the time, but they don't know, right?
30:52
SPEAKER_02: And they may not fully be around people that are part of the community.
30:55
SPEAKER_02: They may not fully understand.
30:58
SPEAKER_02: You know, there's people that are trying to understand how to speak to certain people in the community, whatever it may be, right?
31:04
SPEAKER_02: And it's this aspect of just trying to like be there together and having that shared respect and not, you know, freaking out if someone, you know, doesn't understand, but like being able to like help them so that they can do it the next time and not feel like they don't even want to, they want to completely distance themselves from anyone that's part of the community.
31:28
SPEAKER_02: Right.
31:28
SPEAKER_02: Like my goal and job of anything that I do is to just be really understanding and try my best to see where someone's coming from from every aspect, because it goes a long way.
31:41
SPEAKER_02: And then I don't have to carry the anger every day with me.
31:45
SPEAKER_02: And I think that frees you to be able to live your life and make more meaningful relationships.
31:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
31:52
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's what you've been saying the whole episode is being a human and connecting.
31:58
SPEAKER_01: And even when, let's say you're in those conversations and someone says something offensive, at the same time.
32:06
SPEAKER_01: They probably didn't do it, hopefully, you have people around you that they probably didn't do it to be malicious.
32:12
SPEAKER_01: That wasn't probably their intention.
32:14
SPEAKER_01: But being able to have that conscious conversation on the side, not in front of a group, like, hey, when you said this, I just want to let you know that it's inappropriate and this is why.
32:23
SPEAKER_02: I'd prefer to call people in than out.
32:25
SPEAKER_02: And it's, you know, stepping aside.
32:28
SPEAKER_02: And it means giving somebody the opportunity to go, oh my gosh, I totally didn't know.
32:34
SPEAKER_02: I won't do that next time.
32:35
SPEAKER_02: Or here's how, you know, could I could I have said it like this?
32:38
SPEAKER_02: Whatever it may be, it can be a learning moment rather than a scolding and shaming because no one wants to feel like they're bad.
32:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love that.
32:48
SPEAKER_01: Keely, I always like ending podcast episodes with what is a big takeaway and reflective question you want to leave our listeners.
32:57
SPEAKER_02: I think a lot of what we've talked about is how we connect with other people, but I don't believe we are able to fully connect with other people unless we look at who we are and where we are.
33:09
SPEAKER_02: And so the question that I would ask for you to reflect on, think about, and maybe even take back to other people that you, you know, want to bring this podcast up to is what is something that you can do today for yourself that can support you and creating more meaningful relationships?
33:28
SPEAKER_02: So taking that question fully around and bringing it back to you to understand how you can take care of yourself in order to have those meaningful relationships.
33:37
SPEAKER_01: So that might include, we were just talking before we hit record, going to the mountains and walking, or if you can't, grounding your feet and mother nature.
33:48
SPEAKER_01: I love that because the most important relationship is the relationship we have with ourselves before we could do that with anyone else.
33:55
SPEAKER_01: And then because people are in love with you now and they finally have met a Gen Z expert who is a Gen Z, how can people find you or connect with you?
34:06
SPEAKER_01: And also, side note, I just want to let people know Killy's not on like social media.
34:11
SPEAKER_01: Well, I know on LinkedIn, but just not on Instagram.
34:14
SPEAKER_01: So don't stereotype that Gen Z is always on all the social media platforms.
34:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know what?
34:19
SPEAKER_02: It's so funny.
34:20
SPEAKER_02: I'll I'll share this really quick story, real quick.
34:23
SPEAKER_02: I actually, for the last four years, I built an entire business on social media, and we had like over 200,000 people always watching, following, and it was a lot.
34:34
SPEAKER_02: And so for the last six months, I've completely removed myself.
34:38
SPEAKER_02: And I'm just using LinkedIn, which I don't really consider.
34:40
SPEAKER_02: It is social media, but it's more like work focused.
34:43
SPEAKER_02: So, yes, I'm taking a break from social media, and you can find me on LinkedIn if you look up Keely Antonio, and you can also go to our website, swellexperiences.com.
34:55
SPEAKER_02: Um, I'd love to chat with you.
34:56
SPEAKER_02: I'd love to answer any questions you may have about Gen Z or any of the ways that anything that we talked about today.
35:04
SPEAKER_01: I feel like that could be a different episode, but when you're saying you had like 200,000 followers, I mean, did not have that much as you, but I'm in my almost seven years in business and I used to be online so much, and then I just got burnt out of performing consistently.
35:19
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I was making probably 10 videos every single day, going live every week.
35:25
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's how I ran my business, connecting with individuals, you know, all over.
35:30
SPEAKER_02: And it was something that took a complete toll on me, and now it's just really nice to to focus more on quality, I think what it is, and and the people that you know want to have those meaningful conversations, they're more one-to-one.
35:48
SPEAKER_02: I think we totally can have a separate conversation about this, but I don't know if it's necessarily so healthy to see a million people's lives.
35:55
SPEAKER_01: Oh I it ruined my psyche because I realized, you know, even my day-to-day, like, okay, I'm having a coffee and bagel, let me take a picture and let me share it.
36:04
SPEAKER_01: And then everything I do throughout my day-to-day life was like performing as if I was part of this reality television show.
36:12
SPEAKER_01: And then my dopamine hits were the number of followers, likes, and comments.
36:17
SPEAKER_01: And what I practice now, personally, not professionally, it's wait, let me just be like, let me take pictures just for myself.
36:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
36:26
SPEAKER_01: I don't need to post it right away, be present.
36:29
SPEAKER_01: And it's improved my relationships because I was realizing it was ruining my relationships with my family and loved ones and my boyfriend.
36:36
SPEAKER_02: I know.
36:36
SPEAKER_02: And when you're feeling that disconnection, I just look in like the top 10 people in my phone in my text messages, and I will reach out to them because that is whoever's in my text message box, that's usually the most important.
36:50
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna laugh because I know you said top 10, but for my millennials, you'll remember the top eight on MySpace.
36:56
SPEAKER_01: Do you know what that is, Keely?
36:58
SPEAKER_02: I don't mean I've heard of it, but I never had it.
37:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
37:01
SPEAKER_01: So, like for my millennials listening, it's like the top eight was you would list your top eight on MySpace.
37:06
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, you're a teenager back then.
37:09
SPEAKER_00: It's like, why am I number two?
37:10
SPEAKER_00: I thought I was your best friend.
37:12
SPEAKER_00: I understand why number one's your boyfriend, but why am I number two?
37:14
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
37:15
SPEAKER_02: They do that on I think what I grew up with was Snapchat.
37:18
SPEAKER_02: Same thing.
37:18
SPEAKER_02: You can see your score, and if your score or level is certain like a height, I don't know, it's it's the same thing.
37:25
SPEAKER_01: See, I I will say that.
37:27
SPEAKER_01: I will say, I mean, unfortunately, capitalism knows to when you gamify things, you're gonna attract Gen Z millennials.
37:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's always competitive.
37:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but it doesn't have to be.
37:40
SPEAKER_01: It's always to be.
37:42
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
37:42
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it can be more meaningful and way more focused on quality.
37:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: And then I guess I'll leave it with this, but it's like, what do you want to think about in your last breath in this planet and this lifetime?
37:54
SPEAKER_01: It's a great question.
37:55
SPEAKER_02: Ooh, I like that.
37:57
SPEAKER_02: I would like to think about the most meaningful moments that like really touched me and changed my soul.
38:05
SPEAKER_02: Like just being able to like be at complete.
38:08
SPEAKER_02: I always say, like, I like being blissed out because I live in California and I surf and just being in the ocean, like any moment that has been so blissful for me, I would like to completely just like surrender in that and be in that.
38:23
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, just feel like everything in my life had led me to all the moments that it did.
38:30
SPEAKER_02: And it feels really peaceful.
38:32
SPEAKER_01: As a dated millennial, because I think it's your generation that made up this term.
38:36
SPEAKER_01: What I heard is creating core memories.
38:39
SPEAKER_02: That's true.
38:40
SPEAKER_02: I created a core memory in the ocean, and I hope that's how I remember.
38:45
SPEAKER_01: So for our listeners, you know, think about the core memories that you're creating, and then ask yourself the hard question.
38:51
SPEAKER_01: Am I creating that for myself?
38:53
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
38:54
SPEAKER_01: Keely, thank you so much.
38:55
SPEAKER_01: If you want to connect with Keely, I will put all the information in the show notes.
38:59
SPEAKER_01: But thank you.
39:00
SPEAKER_01: And thanks for taking a break from surfing.
39:03
SPEAKER_02: I love it.
39:04
SPEAKER_02: Thanks so much for having me.
39:06
SPEAKER_02: And I I love everything that you're doing, Elaine.
39:08
SPEAKER_02: You're crushing it.
39:09
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
39:12
SPEAKER_01: There's always going to be a new generation coming in, whether it's Gen Z or even Gen Alpha.
39:21
SPEAKER_01: And here's the beauty that each new generation's going to do that helps move society, hopefully, in a better and positive direction.
39:32
SPEAKER_01: Each generation, just like my generation, millennials, and all the generations before us, we will constantly be questioning the way we live and work.
39:42
SPEAKER_01: And that's a beautiful thing.
39:45
SPEAKER_01: If you found this episode helpful, here are four things you can do if you feel called to do them.
39:52
SPEAKER_01: Number one, if you could leave a five-star rating in review, that would mean so much to my team and I.
40:00
SPEAKER_01: We created this podcast for accessible education for women of color and allies.
40:05
SPEAKER_01: Each episode takes about four hours to create, one hour for me to prep, another 30 minutes to an hour to record.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: Then my team spends another two hours to edit and market.
40:16
SPEAKER_01: And number two, because we care about accessible education, share this with a friend who maybe they are for the Gen Z generation.
40:26
SPEAKER_01: Or maybe they're a leader who's having challenges working with the Gen Z and these different generations of the workforce.
40:35
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40:39
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40:48
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41:01
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41:04
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41:12
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41:20
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