Latest / Leaders In Payments / Ben Haguel, CEO of TCB Pay | Episode 362

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Ben Haguel, CEO of TCB Pay | Episode 362 · Leaders In Payments

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Leaders in Payments podcast, where we talk to C-level leaders from across the payments landscape.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: We'll be discussing the products and services that impact the payment space today, as well as trends and predictions for the future of payments.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: We will also hear stories from our guests about their journeys to the top.
• 0:18
  Greg Myers: Hello everyone and welcome to the Leaders in Payments podcast.
• 0:20
  Greg Myers: I'm your host, greg Myers, and on today's show we have a very special guest, ben Hagel, the CEO of TCB Pay.
• 0:27
  Greg Myers: So, ben, thank you for being here and welcome to the show.
• 0:30
  Ben Haguel: Hi, thank you for having me.
• 0:35
  Greg Myers: If you don't mind, let's start out talking a little bit about you.
• 0:37
  Greg Myers: Maybe tell us where you're from, where you grew up, where you went to school, where you currently live just a few things like that.
• 0:40
  Ben Haguel: As you can get it from my southern accent, I am from France originally.
• 0:45
  Ben Haguel: I grew up in Paris and I immigrated to the US in 2000, a little bit over 24 years ago and I've lived in various places, from Los Angeles, originally, to Las Vegas, texas, actually.
• 0:59
  Ben Haguel: Now I reside in Boca Raton, florida.
• 1:02
  Ben Haguel: Okay, great, so let's talk about TCB Pay, so tell the audience what you do so in a nutshell, tcb Pay is a full merchant service provider, we're a credit card issuer and we're a full fintech.
• 1:13
  Ben Haguel: We were founded about 10 years ago and we just got our 10-year anniversary.
• 1:18
  Ben Haguel: We do have about 30 people working for us right now worldwide and we're very proud of being a small team, and our core product is technology for the payment industry.
• 1:31
  Greg Myers: Do you have a certain type of merchant or vertical that you focus on?
• 1:36
  Greg Myers: Absolutely.
• 1:37
  Ben Haguel: So as a payment provider, we specialize in high risk or high volume, and as a credit card issuer, so we issue prepaid credit cards.
• 1:47
  Ben Haguel: We focus on corporate cards for mid and large businesses.
• 1:50
  Ben Haguel: What is great also about our issuing business it's 100% free to any merchants.
• 1:55
  Ben Haguel: But as a fintech, we're very unique.
• 1:57
  Ben Haguel: We do not resell any other company's product or services.
• 2:01
  Ben Haguel: We create and manage our own gateway, our own CRM, our own issuing platform and we have many custom integrations.
• 2:09
  Greg Myers: So how much of your business is the card issuing side versus the payment processing side?
• 2:14
  Ben Haguel: So we recently released the issuing earlier this year and we're still learning a lot.
• 2:19
  Ben Haguel: So I would say right now we're about 90-10, and we hope eventually that we're going to pick up and have a more equitable share of the market, maybe a 50-50.
• 2:32
  Greg Myers: And when you mention high risk, can you give us maybe some examples of different types of businesses you work with?
• 2:38
  Ben Haguel: Yes, absolutely so.
• 2:39
  Ben Haguel: Originally, when I said high risk, I wanted to be very clear about what we do, because we're actually registered as a high risk and high integrity ISO.
• 2:49
  Ben Haguel: We do not deal with businesses that are unregulated.
• 2:53
  Ben Haguel: We're not societal either, so when I say high risk, I mean either business that have a very high volume and that can pose a financial issue onto a processor, or a business that has a certain regulation that other processor doesn't want to touch, such as originally it was telemedicine, which now is a little easier to get.
• 3:14
  Ben Haguel: We do a money service business, money transmitter.
• 3:18
  Ben Haguel: We have done crypto exchanges.
• 3:20
  Ben Haguel: We do an extensive compliance on all those businesses and we reduce the risk by actually controlling the compliance.
• 3:29
  Greg Myers: So you must have a pretty powerful compliance team.
• 3:32
  Ben Haguel: Yeah, we do, and on top of everything, because we're a small team, we focus on the legal aspect, not on any other aspect.
• 3:41
  Ben Haguel: If it's legal, if it's authorized by a card association, let's find a way to reduce the risk.
• 3:46
  Ben Haguel: So how do we reduce the risk?
• 3:48
  Ben Haguel: Is there a technological tool we can use?
• 3:50
  Ben Haguel: Is there legal tools we can use If a business has no license?
• 3:54
  Ben Haguel: Do you have a legal opinion that can help us understand why we should consider and tell our banks why you're a good candidate?
• 4:01
  Greg Myers: And you're focusing today just on the US, or outside the US as well?
• 4:05
  Ben Haguel: Right now we are an ISO in the US and in Europe.
• 4:10
  Ben Haguel: We just started to apply for a money license in Europe, which will give us a little more power to be able to issue a credit card.
• 4:20
  Ben Haguel: We're a FinCEN registered MSB in the US as well.
• 4:24
  Greg Myers: Maybe talk a little bit about your go-to-market strategy.
• 4:27
  Greg Myers: Do you have an internal sales team?
• 4:29
  Greg Myers: Do you work with partners outside of the company?
• 4:32
  Greg Myers: How do you go to market?
• 4:33
  Ben Haguel: The whole industry is dominated by agents.
• 4:36
  Ben Haguel: We have a very small sales team in-house.
• 4:40
  Ben Haguel: They do great jobs and I'm very proud of what they deliver.
• 4:43
  Ben Haguel: But the majority of our large merchants are relationship-based from our agents and those same agents have a relationship-based contractual agreement with the merchants.
• 4:55
  Ben Haguel: So everything is agent-related.
• 4:58
  Ben Haguel: Same with the issuing.
• 4:59
  Greg Myers: And one more question on the issuing.
• 5:01
  Greg Myers: What made you decide to get into that part of the business?
• 5:04
  Ben Haguel: Yes, the second.
• 5:05
  Ben Haguel: I stepped in the business and I'm going to give you this answer.
• 5:08
  Ben Haguel: I said I'm in the wrong business.
• 5:10
  Ben Haguel: I'm in processing, I'm in acquiring, issuing.
• 5:13
  Ben Haguel: Well, we don't have as much regulatory issue.
• 5:16
  Ben Haguel: We don't have as much bank issue, we don't have as many financial risks.
• 5:22
  Ben Haguel: It's prepaid you either pay us or you either don't.
• 5:25
  Ben Haguel: It's very simple.
• 5:26
  Ben Haguel: We have a list of qualified, unqualified and prohibited business we cannot bring and if we stay within our lines, the payment schemes are paying us.
• 5:35
  Ben Haguel: It's, in my opinion, a very profitable business compared to the acquiring in the long run requires more and more compliance.
• 5:44
  Greg Myers: Well, what would you say differentiates you from your competitors out there?
• 5:48
  Ben Haguel: I would like to say that, first of all, we have the high-risk, high-volume.
• 5:52
  Ben Haguel: I would like to say that, as a fintech, we take every job.
• 5:55
  Ben Haguel: That means we have merchants that come to us and ask us a very specific integration and we'll do it.
• 6:00
  Ben Haguel: We have a money transmitter that recently told us I would like to have ANI services.
• 6:05
  Ben Haguel: And I look at it and say ANI, what is this?
• 6:07
  Ben Haguel: And it's a name verification service from Visa directly.
• 6:11
  Ben Haguel: And we reached out to Visa, we did an integration and now everyone is happy.
• 6:17
  Ben Haguel: We have reduced, on top of everything, the risk on that merchant.
• 6:20
  Ben Haguel: Now we have launched our new portal with a great new design.
• 6:25
  Ben Haguel: Our art of marketing is absolutely fabulous.
• 6:27
  Ben Haguel: So there's an upgraded version of our original gateway with a ton of new features.
• 6:31
  Ben Haguel: We do now also process ACH payment.
• 6:34
  Ben Haguel: We have a load balancer.
• 6:36
  Ben Haguel: We can batch transaction, transaction routing, manage multiple needs under the same account.
• 6:43
  Ben Haguel: But one of our biggest differences compared to the industry leader is our customer support, where we offer personal follow-up.
• 6:49
  Ben Haguel: Our customer support where we offer personal follow-up to our merchant and we always find a solution to meet their needs, whether they are for consulting or tech.
• 6:57
  Ben Haguel: So whoever our merchants are, we're going to find a way.
• 7:00
  Ben Haguel: Our job before everything is not only to process, but it's also to train and educate our merchants.
• 7:07
  Greg Myers: You've been in the industry for a while.
• 7:09
  Greg Myers: Obviously the company's been around 10 years.
• 7:11
  Greg Myers: Where do you think the industry's headed, maybe in the next, say, three to five years?
• 7:16
  Ben Haguel: In the next three to five years.
• 7:18
  Ben Haguel: I often get this question, but I think we're going to see more payments toward digital wallets and mobile payments.
• 7:25
  Ben Haguel: There's going to be tons of regulatory enhancements, for sure.
• 7:26
  Ben Haguel: We're going to see development of real-time payments.
• 7:27
  Ben Haguel: There's going to be tons of regulatory announcements, for sure.
• 7:29
  Ben Haguel: We're going to see development of real-time payments.
• 7:31
  Ben Haguel: Definitely, the AI is going to be a big part of the risk management.
• 7:35
  Ben Haguel: If you want me to develop a little more, we'll see it.
• 7:38
  Ben Haguel: In Asia, they use a ton of mobile wallets.
• 7:41
  Ben Haguel: It's convenience At the end of the day, it's all about convenience and they offer technology and FCQR code, biometric and education.
• 7:49
  Ben Haguel: They offer things that their banks won't offer.
• 7:52
  Ben Haguel: Now the regulatory announcement there's always the governments that try to regulate a little more our bodies and they will continue to evolve, but this time I think they will address issues like consumer protection, fraud and data privacy.
• 8:08
  Ben Haguel: For instance, in Japan, they have revised already the Payment Service Act of 2022.
• 8:14
  Ben Haguel: We see that everything is going to that direction.
• 8:18
  Ben Haguel: Now, on the real-time payment we are not there yet.
• 8:22
  Ben Haguel: Europe is there already.
• 8:24
  Ben Haguel: So if you go to a country that is in the SEPA zone, you'll get real-time wire and for no fee.
• 8:30
  Ben Haguel: The demand is there.
• 8:31
  Ben Haguel: You already have real-time ACH in the US and this trend is going to develop even more.
• 8:36
  Ben Haguel: Di automation actually, I'm very excited about this part because it will leverage the mid-risk to high-risk industries for us with a better risk management, better fraud detection and a lot more fraud.
• 8:50
  Ben Haguel: Personal services At TCBP.
• 8:52
  Ben Haguel: Believe it or not, we have 158 velocity controls.
• 8:56
  Ben Haguel: We have 158 ways of controlling your transactions.
• 9:00
  Greg Myers: Do you foresee crypto gaining strength again?
• 9:04
  Greg Myers: I mean, every conversation was about it, then it kind of fell off the cliff and now I'm starting to hear a little bit more about it, and I think you mentioned it earlier.
• 9:11
  Greg Myers: So just curious your thoughts on the crypto side.
• 9:14
  Ben Haguel: Whether you like crypto or not, at the end it's there and it's not going anywhere.
• 9:18
  Ben Haguel: I think that in the five to 10 years actually, we're going to see more stable coin and definitely blockchain.
• 9:24
  Ben Haguel: I mean, there's a growing consensus about it.
• 9:26
  Ben Haguel: It's very clear, especially around the stable coins.
• 9:43
  Greg Myers: The stable coins are developing really fast.
• 9:44
  Greg Myers: Will it replace, eventually, fiat currency?
• 9:45
  Greg Myers: I don't think so, but it will be another form of payment for a specific target audience.
• 9:47
  Greg Myers: What a lot of people are talking about right is eventually you'll be able to pay with it relatively easily, but it's going to have specific use cases.
• 9:53
  Greg Myers: So I think that's the consensus and your timing is what a lot of people are saying as well.
• 9:58
  Greg Myers: You know that's more five to 10 years out there.
• 10:00
  Greg Myers: I appreciate you sharing those trends and your thoughts on that.
• 10:03
  Greg Myers: So let's switch gears a little bit.
• 10:04
  Greg Myers: Talk about you, Maybe.
• 10:05
  Greg Myers: Talk a little bit about your professional journey, maybe what you did before TCB Pay and what kind of led up to the company and to where you are today.
• 10:13
  Ben Haguel: First of all, I've always been into sort of a finance industry Before I was doing mortgages, doing my own mortgages.
• 10:22
  Ben Haguel: I was introduced to payments about 20 years ago, which I liked right away.
• 10:28
  Ben Haguel: The very important thing is that I understood very quick that the technology would be important, and when I say technology, from owning your own payment gateway to actually having your own chargeback management system.
• 10:40
  Ben Haguel: I saw it very early.
• 10:42
  Ben Haguel: About 17 years ago I was lucky to meet one of the most talented in the world developers from India.
• 10:49
  Ben Haguel: He's actually our CTO right now.
• 10:51
  Ben Haguel: He finally switched to be our CTO about a year and a half ago.
• 10:55
  Ben Haguel: I used to always have him develop small applications for payment or non-payments.
• 11:00
  Ben Haguel: I've done also a lot of real estate in my spare time.
• 11:03
  Greg Myers: Let's talk about things you're passionate about.
• 11:05
  Greg Myers: So maybe one work-related passion and one personal passion.
• 11:09
  Ben Haguel: At work.
• 11:09
  Ben Haguel: I like to push people.
• 11:11
  Ben Haguel: If there's a red button, I like to push it.
• 11:13
  Ben Haguel: I like to push people to help them grow, reach goals and hires.
• 11:17
  Ben Haguel: I have a very close team of executives and I'm very proud of them, of where they're from and where they've been and where they are now and where they're going At work.
• 11:27
  Ben Haguel: I mean, I'm going to sound corny, but that's the truth.
• 11:29
  Ben Haguel: It's family.
• 11:30
  Ben Haguel: Everything is family.
• 11:31
  Ben Haguel: Being with the family is the most important thing.
• 11:34
  Greg Myers: Does the family have a favorite thing to do While we travel?
• 11:39
  Ben Haguel: we love history, cooking together everything that a traditional family would do.
• 11:45
  Greg Myers: Okay, so you've been in the industry for a while.
• 11:47
  Greg Myers: So if someone came to you and they said, ben I'm interested in getting into the payments industry.
• 11:53
  Greg Myers: Maybe they just graduated from college, maybe they want to move into this industry and they look at payments and fintech and sort of like you did hey, I want to get into this industry they came to you and said, ben, what do I need to do to be successful in payments?
• 12:04
  Greg Myers: What would you tell them?
• 12:05
  Ben Haguel: Well, first I will tell them before you get into any industries and what I'm going to say is almost applicable to any industries.
• 12:13
  Ben Haguel: But for payment especially, understand the fundamentals of payments, understand the rules, understand what is a credit card, what is debit card processing?
• 12:23
  Ben Haguel: What is a fintech?
• 12:24
  Ben Haguel: What is ACH Card issuing?
• 12:27
  Ben Haguel: What is it?
• 12:27
  Ben Haguel: How does that work?
• 12:28
  Ben Haguel: How do I make money from it?
• 12:30
  Ben Haguel: Then there's going to be changes, so continuous learning is extremely important.
• 12:36
  Ben Haguel: You've got to continue to evolve with the industry.
• 12:39
  Ben Haguel: Then networking is very important.
• 12:42
  Ben Haguel: Then choose a specialization.
• 12:44
  Ben Haguel: You cannot do everything.
• 12:45
  Ben Haguel: It's not possible.
• 12:46
  Ben Haguel: You got to specialize.
• 12:48
  Ben Haguel: Payment is broad, covering technology, compliance, sales, strategy.
• 12:52
  Ben Haguel: There's people that only specialize in strategy, in compliance, and that's great Areas like fraud prevention, jail, wider compliance with standards that are not only national but international.
• 13:04
  Ben Haguel: That will live in a more global society.
• 13:06
  Ben Haguel: And then skills.
• 13:08
  Ben Haguel: I mean you got to develop skills like sales, customer service, product management within the payment, communication, negotiations with merchants.
• 13:17
  Ben Haguel: Those are going to be part of your daily routine and the skills you're going to develop.
• 13:21
  Ben Haguel: But the most important is, if you're a CEO, your job is to evolve.
• 13:26
  Ben Haguel: Your job on day one won't be the same job as 10 years later.
• 13:30
  Ben Haguel: My job today is absolutely not the same job as it was originally.
• 13:33
  Ben Haguel: I have an amazing team now that can take care of the daily management and crisis, while I work exclusively on developing the business on a higher scale.
• 13:45
  Greg Myers: I think all that was great advice and very important advice.
• 13:48
  Greg Myers: I appreciate you sharing that.
• 13:50
  Greg Myers: Ben, we've covered a lot of ground already about you and your background and obviously about the company and what you do there, so is there anything else you'd like to add before we wrap up the show?
• 13:59
  Ben Haguel: No, it's been great meeting you and talking with you.
• 14:02
  Ben Haguel: It was a great experience.
• 14:04
  Ben Haguel: Thank you very much.
• 14:05
  Greg Myers: Thank you and Ben, I appreciate you being here.
• 14:06
  Greg Myers: You, it was a great experience.
• 14:07
  Greg Myers: Thank you very much.
• 14:07
  Greg Myers: Thank you, and Ben, I appreciate you being here.
• 14:08
  Greg Myers: I know your time's very valuable.
• 14:09
  Greg Myers: Again, thank you so much for being on the show today.
• 14:10
  Greg Myers: Thank you, you have a good rest of your week.
• 14:13
  Greg Myers: And to all you listeners out there, I thank you for your time as well, and until the next story.
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: Thank you for joining us this week on the Leaders in Payments podcast.
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: Make sure you visit our website at leadersinpaymentscom, where you can subscribe to the show and where you'll find our show notes.
• 14:28
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