Latest / Nutrition Connection by Dr. Kristen Hicks-Roof / 46: Lauren Couchois RD, LD, SNS - SCHOOL NUTRITION
Transcript
- Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Welcome back to the Nutrition Connection Podcast, the show where science meets storytelling. I'm your host, Dr. Kristin Hicks-Roof, dietitian, researcher, and lifelong advocate of the role of nutrition, health, and wellness. Each episode, I sit down with dietitians and nutrition experts all across the food and healthcare landscape, leaders whose work touches nearly every aspect of our lives. So whether you're a student, a seasoned professional, or someone simply curious about food, nutrition, and health, this podcast is just for you. The views, thoughts and comments on this podcast do not reflect those of my employer nor the employers of my guests. So let's go ahead and get connected. Y'all. I'm excited to bring on Lauren Kuchwa. She is the director of K-12 operations at School Food Rocks. Welcome to show Lauren. Lauren- SFR: Thanks, I'm so happy to be here today and talk all things nutrition. Well, all things me and nutrition. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: And we are going to go, I was going to say, we're going to go all the things and really learn about your story. You know, I got connected with you through Joe Urban, who if you're in the school nutrition space and you don't know Joe, you need to know Joe. I always talk to him, allude to him of the Taylor Swift of the K-12 space. Like everyone kind of knows him. Lauren- SFR: ⁓ good God, don't put that on recording. His head is going to explode. ⁓ Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: And that's perfectly okay. I've been following him for like 10 years, like when I wasn't even in the roles that I am now. So it's been really cool to just see this journey and how you are at school, Food Rocks and everything you do. let's get started from the beginning. Lauren, what inspired you and made you want to become a nutrition professional? Lauren- SFR: Well, first I have to say huge shout out to Joe. I give him a hard time, but truly he is the best, like all around love, love Joe. So little caveat there in case he hears this and he's like, excuse me. ⁓ love Joe, he's absolutely wonderful. And everybody that meets him totally agrees. But okay. So what got me in to my journey? ⁓ I think, especially school nutrition, whenever I ask people about like, how did you get here? feel like school nutrition dieticians always have like a weird story and mine is definitely up there. I'm aware. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yes. Lauren- SFR: But my first like spark of like, ooh, I'm into this was when I was in school for zoology. So my first degree is in zoology and I did an intensive program on a zoo and we had to like rotate to all the different areas of the zoo. And one of the rotations you had to do was medical and kitchen. And so they were very much linked together and it was the health and care of our animals and the way we fed them and certain nutrients and vitamins that we provide to them was like my first. like ⁓ wow because honestly like leading up to all of that nutrition had honestly you know I'm a 90s baby I'm an 80s baby brought up in the 90s let's be clear about that no shame but 90s was heavy on like dieting and diet culture. So my experience with nutrition prior to that spark was all the ways food can be bad for you. And so now I'm in the zoology world and learning about we are really treating our animals through the way we feed them was like my first like, ⁓ this is cool and very different from what I was ever taught growing up. So that was my first initial little spark into it. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: That is crazy. What a fascinating story. My husband, so like side fact, he manages MRIs and CT installations and he's doing one at the Phoenix Zoo. And I'm like, how cool is that? Like, can we go, like me and all the kids, like, I want to watch this. I mean, it's just really cool. But you're right in the sense of like, animal nutrition is very similar to human nutrition in that it's nutrients to optimize health of the animals or optimize health of the... of the human, but I was also 80s, grew up in the 90s and I remember like the snack walls, like everything low fat, right? And I remember everything like, yeah, it was a fear and it was like a constant physique to look skinny, but also avoid certain foods, you know? And so I had this very unique position, I think with nutrition as well. So. Lauren- SFR: Great. Yes. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: That's a really interesting kickstart. You're my first zoologist on the show. So let's discuss your journey. You decided to go into human nutrition. How did you make that pivot? And then talk about your journey up until where you are today at School Food Rock. Lauren- SFR: Yeah. It is like a long story, so I hope everybody buckle up. ⁓ We're going for it. Because it is, it's also, I'm so fortunate. I am so fortunate in how I got to where I am and I am one of those people. I love what I do. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: I'm buckled in. Lauren- SFR: But I've always been somebody who is like, I love my job, like my very first job at 15, right? And then later on, working at an ice cream store situation, like I've always loved what I've been doing. Um, and so I think like these little opportunities got me to where I am. So to like back up, like a hundred years ago, I had this weird opportunity to go work at Universal Studios in Orlando, Florida as an animal trainer. And I say animal trainer, like back up. I was 15 years old. My mom had a giant. me for my first couple of weeks of work. I was not training a single animal but I was for sure cleaning up their poop. That's what I was doing for like the first year. Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yeah, there's the reality versus the title. Lauren- SFR: Yeah, yeah animal caretaker. I was like pooper scooper like that's what my title just should have said on my tag But um, so I really got into like working with animals That's how got into zoology was working with animals working with the trainers there and they were like what do want to do? know because I was this kid in high school and um, I was like I love animals, but I don't think I want to be a vet and one of the trainers with me was like I went to school for zoology in Gainesville like you should look into that so I made that that Right? So trainer, zoologist. I went back to Universal Studios and I started when I was 15. I left 17. I was one of those like I didn't skip a grade. I'm just an August baby. So I was like, you know, the youngest in my class. So I go to school and it opened my eyes to what animal caretaking should be. And we weren't doing that at Universal. And so at that time, you know, disclaimer, I have no idea what they're doing now. I've been out of that business almost 20 years. but at the time not great. And so I was like, you know, I want to get out of here. I don't agree with our treatment. I was in Orlando, like Orlando is fun to visit growing up being raised in Orlando. It's a hot concrete, you know, it's not my vibe. And so my grandparents lived in Western North Carolina and I was like, that's where I want to be. I want to be in the mountains. I want to be outside hiking, you know, seasons would be nice. And so made my way up to Western Carolina and the long story short of that, I was going back to school for education thinking I would do animal outreach. And then I quickly learned like, ⁓ education, you know, track was not for me. I'm very science math minded. And so there's a longer story, which I won't bore everybody with today, but long story short, an amazing opportunity came up when I was 21 years old to buy a cafe. So I did. And it was right on the campus of where I went to school when it is Western Carolina University. Shout out. amounts and so I was able to run this cafe and go to my classes. So I had this cafe in the same time that I was trying to go back to school for education. Wasn't really feeling it. And one of my customers asked me like what I was studying. I told him and he's like, if you don't like that, you probably like food and nutrition. While I'm running a restaurant, like it was a cafe. We turned it into like a mom and pop Panera type of a thing. And so was like, what does that have to do with anything? What does me having this cafe have anything to do with the dietetic world? And so he's like, just take a class. So I took a food science class and my second week, I changed my major immediately. I was like, ⁓ this is for me. This took me right back to the medical kitchen of the zoo. It got me like understanding where my cafe side of things came in and graduated from there with dietetics. And so going off for our ⁓ internship, as most RDs do, I had a rotation in school nutrition. I was at, ⁓ we used to call it ooey pooey, but I've been told recently, they don't call it that anymore, but Indiana University and Purdue University of Indianapolis. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yeah, I-U-P-Y. Lauren- SFR: Yeah, yeah. So ⁓ I went to Indianapolis for my internship. Loved Indy, met wonderful people there. One of my dearest friends still to this day. I came from out of that internship and I also was the Florida girl coming from the North Carolina mountains where it doesn't snow. into Indianapolis and I went through the ice storm of 2011. Anybody from Indiana like the ice storm of 2011 is like a thing and so this ice storm comes and I had always just thought like to say ice storm was like a catchphrase. I didn't realize it was an actual weather event. I never gone through anything like that in Florida. So we had this huge winter, this huge ice storm, and I was like, oh, I don't think this is for me. I think I am way too much of a wuss for the actual winter and cold. Like I can't do this. And so I was able to do my capstone rotation, which for those of you that may not know about your capstone is you get to pick your specialty of nutrition. It's very intensive. It's weeks long and you don't do any like schooling in the meantime, like you're focused solely at that location and where I went, they let us do anything in the United States, anywhere we wanted, as long as we had a preceptor. And so I had a girlfriend back in Florida that was like, please for the love of God, come back here. She was pregnant with her third kid at the time, I think. And her and her husband, I just moved to this area and she was like, come hang out with me, try to get a job down there. So I ended up doing my capstone rotation in school nutrition because I didn't feel like I got a lot of it in my internship. And so that's how I got back to Florida and ⁓ really liked school nutrition. really, ⁓ again, I always have to shout out one of the biggest mentors in my life, Terri Whitaker. She was the director for Charlotte Public County Schools in Charlotte County, Florida, took me on. She was like, look, I'm not an RD, but I'll be your preceptor. I'm like, great, thank you. Because I tried to get in with Lee County where my friend was living in Fort Myers, but they already had an intern and couldn't take me. So go to Charlotte, loved them, got to know the area. And then I won't like, I keep saying them for you with long stories and then I don't shut up. But I won't bore you with the story of how I met my husband, but the long and short of it is the day before I... Now, let me back up. You got to know some details. So Charlotte County, doing my thing. I still have to go back to Indiana and graduate, right? And I still had my cafe in Western North Carolina. So Western North Carolina is absolutely gorgeous. But in the classroom where I think a lot of dieticians can relate, I excelled anatomy and physiology. Like clinical medical in the classroom was 100 % my thing. In my internship and being in the clinical world, like shout out to the clinical dieticians because I think it's a very like particular or I shouldn't say that because I'm particular, but like I think all these RDs that end up in their specialties, you're meant to be there. And the clinical world just wasn't for me. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: 100%. Lauren- SFR: And so, get into school nutrition and I loved it because no day was the same. And that was one of the things I had a hard time with in clinical was I had a lot of patients who didn't want some, you know, brand new at a school already coming in there and being like, you know, you don't feel good, but like, can you cut back on your salt? Like, no, you know, that was, they were like, get out of my face. They were like, can you not right now? Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yeah, I struggle with that too. remember like I was like, these people feel the worst. They're getting conditions that they don't even really know. And here I am trying to educate them about nutrition. think there's clinical people do have this like superpower that is their jam. But I also think you're starting to see more diversification of the careers because people, maybe that's not really where they want to see themselves and they find this niche. Lauren- SFR: Yes. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: So that's really interesting and that would bring you back. Let's go back to this cafe really fast. How did you know how to run a cafe? Like you're coming from zoology. So I'm like, wait, how did you buy a cafe and run a cafe? Do you have like food service experience in your family or did you have training? Lauren- SFR: I didn't. No. Well, you know, I say no. My dad was a food broker my whole life. And what was funny is that growing up, listening to him talk to people about like, pounds and cases and blah, blah, blah, like that sounds like the worst job in the world. And I'm in food service now, like ordering pounds and cases and diversing, you know, doing commodity diversions and things. I'm like, darn it. ended up right where I said I didn't want to be. ⁓ but no, I had no experience. So I had, I said the ice cream store, right? Like I loved that. That was the only experience I had. So animal trainer knew nothing but the animal world. I got a part-time job at the ice cream shop when I went back to school, because I was like, well, I need to make some money while I was working at ice cream store. If anybody's ever been to western North Carolina, there's a cute, darling little town called Dillsboro, North Carolina, and it's really close. It's like 45 minutes outside of Asheville. People typically know Asheville. So there was a couple that owned the Dillsboro chocolate shop, and they met me in the ice cream store, and they had a satellite of their chocolate shop on campus, and they were like, you know, we're looking to sell and think you'd be great at it. And I was, I am confident right like let's be clear but 21 year old Lauren was a little cocky and like I should do that I have no experience I knew nothing but thank God I did it Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: That's crazy. But you know, I think there's a thread there of like, you're open to opportunities. You knew like where your passions were. And so it was kind of like you were trying to figure out the exact direction, but you knew like, this is what I like, and this is what I like. You just hadn't put in the pieces together all the way, which I think is normal, right? When you're in school and you're like, I kind of like this, but I don't really know what career paths. Like I think there's a lot of people who come on my podcast who are the same thing. They were like, I wanted to be a doctor or I hit someone the other day, they say they wanted to be an artist, you know, and then all of sudden they realized that they wanted to be a nutrition. So I do think that is a path. So let's dive a little bit deeper. OK, so you come back to Florida. Let's talk about a couple of roles. Did you have any roles before you ended up at School of Food Rocks? And can you give us a little oversight into what those were? Lauren- SFR: Yes. Yes. So I know you're like, girl, we don't want to hear about your husband, but I'm going to back up to that as well because it plays into this. So I was doing the Charlotte County thing, right? As an intern, had to go back to Indiana and graduate. Couldn't get into Lee County, Florida because they had a dietician already. So Charlotte is where I landed and so grateful to them. Two days when I left them to go back to Indiana and do my thesis and do my graduation and all of that. Terry, the director there called me and she was like, hey, Lee County's dietician just left. Like, do you want it? Or you should apply or something like that. And I was like, yeah. But again, I was so like, I'm going to make this happen for me. I want to get back to Florida. The girlfriend I mentioned is one of my best friends from high school. I loved the area and ⁓ I was playing soccer with her, which that's the long story short of it. Come back from Indiana, get this interview with Lee County, playing soccer with Megan, met my husband the day before I got offered the job for Lee County. So we went on like our first date two days before I actually started working for Lee County. And so I got into nutrition with them, but I was so confident I was moving back to Florida. I was going to make something happen that I even made a portfolio for myself to go to the grocery stores because I thought supermarket dietitians was where it's at and I think it is like that super cool role. But I was like if I can't get in with Lee County, I'm going to go see the the grocery stores. Like I'm going to make something happen. Luckily I got in with Lee County. So I started off as a non-RD. I hadn't taken my exam and like there was a contingency of you need to get this these credentials by October. or we're going to have to fire you." And I was like, okay. So I started the job. The day I started, the previous dietician had already been gone for a week. So I had nobody to train me. And I went to the assistant director and I was like, hey, what would you like me to do? And he goes, I honestly don't know. And we just started laughing and I was like, okay, thank God. Cause I didn't know how to even ask that question, right? Like, hey, I'm new here and I don't know what I'm supposed to be doing, but I had no idea. fresh out of my dietetic internship, no experience except the internship. ⁓ And so we figured it out, but I got in right as the Healthy Hunger Free Kids Act kicked off. And so all of our school nutrition USDA regulations changed, which really could not have been better timing for me because nobody knew what they were doing. So we were all like figuring it out, being retrained. trained for the first time on what those rules and regulations actually were. then, like I said, who's my now husband, I did not know at the time. It wasn't like, ⁓ this is my life. This is what it's going to be. Not quite. But ⁓ I was like, wait, my best friend is here. I've got this great guy. I like this job. I'm going to do whatever it takes to make it work. And I was really, really grateful. Again, what a shout out to this podcast, but shout out to all my Florida people who helped me along the way, because I couldn't have done it without all these veteran dieticians and directors of school nutrition and food service brokers that helped me figure out what it was I was supposed to be doing. Like one of my favorite things about school nutrition is we're this small little wonderful world. where we try our best to constantly help each other because we can't steal or steal each other's customers, right? Like the students are in your county. It's not like if I'm doing a bang up job, they're going to like, ⁓ let's go over there. Right. So a lot of best practices are shared in our industry and I really appreciate that. So ⁓ dietitian, menu planner, procurement specialist. mean, I was doing a lot, but I was young, I didn't have any kids, I wasn't married. I was like free to do these 12 to 14 hour days loving life while doing it and learning so much along the way. But through that other opportunities came up where I got a promotion as a coordinator because my passion was in nutrition education and farm to school. And so grateful that the director there, Sonny Stalmackey saw like, hey, we could do more with this if you had free time. It's like yes 100 percent. So he promoted me to coordinator, hired another dietician under me, and I was able to really take off and help Lee County grow this amazing traveling health nutrition program that they had called the Healthy Living Lab and do more with school gardens and teaching about farm to school and building school gardens and just loved it. Like that that is still one of my passions to this day but Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yeah, well, I mean, that's still what you do. So let's talk about what do you do at School Food Rocks? Like, what is your day to day as director of K-12 operations? Right? Like, talk to us about what that looks like. Lauren- SFR: I keep Joe over in Urban Inline, like that's what I do. As great as he is. No, he keeps me in line. So I do, I still do a lot of farm to school stuff with school food rocks, but I know I'm taking forever to talk about like how I got to school food rocks, but I was also director in Lee County after I was coordinator. Sonny left. It is a long story, so we won't do that, but I became director and I really ended up loving it because I really liked helping our people. Like that was a whole new world I didn't know about. And then I was tired of Florida heat, hurricanes, the humidity and all of that and we couldn't go out on the water. We lived very close to the ocean and we couldn't because hurricanes had come through and caused like these horrible red tides and algae blooms and so like I think I really want to get back to the mountains at some point and my husband who's never left Southwest Florida in his life was like yeah let's do that and I was like wonderful. So I just put it out there in a conversation with a mutual um ended up being a mutual friend of Joe and I didn't even know Joe or wasn't even aware of Joe. at the time, but Marlin had, Gordon had said to me like, if you like what you're doing, but you want to get to the mountains, there's this job in Greenville, South Carolina that just opened, I think you should apply for. And I was like, again, like back to my cafe days, I was like, I should do that. Yes. And so I applied. I knew I was leading behind a director's job that I truly did love, but I wanted to get back to the mountains. Marlin spoke so highly of Greenville County and Joe and the team and what they were doing there that I was like, I at least have to give it a shot. and see like what's up. So go up to Greenville for the first time ever to even know where Greenville County was in South Carolina. Like I said, I didn't know Joe and have this wonderful interview conversation, talk about all about my farm to school passions. And the minute I walked out of there, it's like, that was the best interview of my life. It was supposed to be like 30 to 45 minutes. It was like two and a half hours long. Joe and our HR guy in Greenville, Chris, we just talked forever as you can imagine because I can talk But... Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Well, tell us a little bit about Greenville, South Carolina. There's a lot of uniqueness. It's a massive school district. give us like why, why was that a big deal leaving Lee County and going over there beyond just the mountains? Lauren- SFR: It is. Well, I mean it was it wasn't anything we took lightly. We had two kids by this point and I loved my time in Fort Myers but getting back to the mountains, getting back to the ability to have seasons and weather and then like hitting it off with Joe and Chris so well, it was also an easier jump for me because Lee County and Greenville almost mirror each other like even the way the county is laid out. So I had 96 schools in Fort Myers and 92,000 kids at the time. Greenville had 101 schools and like 78,000 kids so they had more schools but less kids kind of a thing but we really truly like almost married each other so Joe and I in the interview realized like we think so much alike this is going to be amazing and at the end of the interview he said to me like hey any hesitation I was like my only hesitation is you and I are incredibly alike like Part of me feels I should stay in Florida, conquer and divide, and like change school nutrition that way. And he said, if that's how you truly feel, people come to Greenville to visit us to learn about our practices. So you'll be helping to teach more school districts what we're doing than just doing your one thing in Lee County. And it sold me. And I was like, that's amazing. And he said, OK, well, any other questions for us? was like, you know, the one thing we didn't talk about was farm to school. So we got deep into that, like, again, an hour later kind of a thing. And he said, it's just an amazing interview. And I walked out. was like, I'm not getting this job. They've got an inside guy. There's no doubt in my mind. Like director to director. The way he was asking some things, I was like, something is up. Well, he called me, Joe called me the very next morning and he was like, hey, we're gonna go with somebody on our team already, but I wanna offer you a job. So I didn't get the job I actually applied for. And Joe rewrote a position for me where I could focus on nutrition education and farm to school. And it was amazing. And so I was like, I mean, I can't, I can't, this is what I want to do. My passion, you know, director was amazing. That's my passion. Seems like an amazing place to live. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: It's so cool. Lauren- SFR: let's figure this out. And in like late February of 2020, I officially accepted with Greenville County and announced to my Lee County team, March 12th of 2020, hey, I'm going, I'm leaving and going to Greenville. And two days later, the whole world shut down because of COVID. And it was like, am I still going to Greenville County? Is there a Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: ⁓ I mean, I was, we had, we both had very similar, well, crazy life changes. I had a baby on Friday, March 13th, 2020. And it was like, I remember getting a call when I was in the hospital and they're like, you need to pick up your other daughter from daycare. like, I literally just had a baby, like just had it, right? Like, and then you're just like, what does this look like? I mean, that it's so crazy to think that that was six years ago. I still am shocked. Okay, keep going. So. Lauren- SFR: ⁓ yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: So you ended up taking this job and that's how you bridged and became, when Joe went separately with School Food Rocks, that's how you moved over there. So let's dive a little bit into that, okay? What do you do in your day to day beyond maybe farm to school? So tell us a day to day at School Food Rocks. Lauren- SFR: And that's how we move. Yeah. ⁓ I'm really fortunate. I get to put a lot of my RD skills to work with School Food Rocks, which I also appreciate because a lot of what I do here is I work with school districts to help them be in compliance with USDA rules and regulations. So that can look in a variety of ways, but it's typically helping them create recipes that are compliant, creating menus that are compliant. ⁓ You know, we also do some work where we try to help them with the community eligibility provisions program, which is called CEP. A lot of our school districts across the nation operate off of that, where they provide meals to children at no cost. So we help them do that at a school nutrition is a business like everything like we're all working. All of that is a business. So we're an amazing community that is doing so much for our children. And at the same time, we have to be aware, like we can't do that if these entities aren't running as well as they should be. So okay, it's a business on top of it. So we do a lot with helping our school districts and I say our because like they're my that they're mine now. ⁓ But like across the nation that need help with either getting in compliance, developing new recipes, training of staff, helping with hazard critical control points, you know, and understanding where there might be food safety sanitation issues within their operation. I also work a lot with vendors, which is a lot of fun. I like that a lot. We help vendors who aren't in the K-12 world yet try to break into it because there's a Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: They're your babies. Lauren- SFR: of great products out there, but it's kind of like we're this world that nobody knows about either, right? So these big name guys are out there doing their thing and they don't even think like, hey, we could hit this school nutrition world. So we try to help them merge into the market. And with that, the part that I do is I help with product formulation sheets and making sure that they are credited for all the components that USDA requires. ⁓ And then Joe's chef mind helps them create recipes. And then my RD, like, you know type A mind steps in and is like too much salt buddy like put me right back in the cardiac ward where I go and talk to somebody who doesn't want to talk to me about low salt that's me in the kitchen with all of our chefs um but it's yeah so it's a lot of just helping like bridge the gap between manufacturers and vendors and school districts to do the best that they possibly can for the students we're put it in a nutshell Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: That is so cool. mean, I love it. Like I said, so you maybe you're a mini Taylor Swift. If Joe is a Taylor Swift and you guys are, you guys are so similar, maybe you're a mini one. No, I think it's so important because right. I, what I've had, I had Ashley Robbins on the show. She's a school nutrition director and she was talking about, you know, there's day to day struggles with allergies and cultural and religious exemptions and just how do they cook fresh food on site? Is it, you know, personnel? Lauren- SFR: I'm not. you Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: language, right? English and bilingual recipes. So there's so many layers that I think school nutrition need resources and support, yet they don't necessarily have the financial resourcing to be able to do all of the things that they want to do on site for their kids. So it's cool that School Food Rocks really helps with this like bridging to, you know, bring new products, bring new recipes, bring new food technologies, whether that's equipment or Lauren- SFR: 100%. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: I know Joe and your team do a lot of, ⁓ you know, like just redesigns of the cafeteria and stuff. Like it's just cool how you can take nutrition is so cross integrated, not only in the kitchen, but then like how they eat their meals together, right? Like that's all nutrition of like bonding and you get people to eat meals together and all of sudden they eat their whole meal versus like if they're by themselves on a table, there's a lot of food waste. So there's a lot down there, but let's talk about Lauren- SFR: Right. ⁓ yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: science. So I love doing, I talk everything science and your zoology background. I'm sure you loved the science as you move from zoology into nutrition. how does science impact what you do in your day to day at School Food Rock? Lauren- SFR: I love science. I mean, I'm a big fan of science. think it is. So I always say I'm type A and I feel like in my work I'm type A and then outside of work, maybe not so much, but the type A in me loves good data. And so that's where the science for me kicks in, right? ⁓ It always cracks me up because there's science in our face all the time, even though we're not calling it that. And so my best example for school nutrition is schools that don't have a great relationship or should say, cafeteria managers that may not have a great relationship with their principal because the principal just treats them as like very secondary until testing time comes around and then they're like we need to feed our kids we want breakfast in the classroom can you make hot breakfast every morning for them do you think you could add something to the lunch and it's we've been doing this all year long like why is it feeding the children not a priority all year long because the principals know when the kids are better fed they're going to perform better and that's reflective of the school and science shows that like they're so many studies out there about kids who eat better and perform better behaviorally and for academic purpose as well. ⁓ science for us is a big driver in how we make that any efficiency within a kitchen, whether it's from a recipe, equipment placement, looking at, again, I love good data, like what meals are most popular with our kids, whilst trying to maintain that USDA regulation of we have subcategories of vegetables we have to eat every week. range requirements, sodium, whole grain, blah blah blah blah blah. It's a lot. And at the same time, trying to do it in a way that the kids want to eat. It is one of my biggest gripes as a dietitian, as a mom, when people are like, but this plate is healthy. And I'm like, nobody's going to eat that. I don't care how healthy it is. That's not nutrition at that point. That's nutrients on a plate. It's only until the child consumes it, then we're actually providing nutrition to them. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: ⁓ yeah. Lauren- SFR: Really, and again, one of the reasons I love Joe and the work we do with School Food Rocks is that's what we're aiming to do is to make school meals the best that they possibly can be nutritionally, but also in taste so that the kids eat them. Like that's the point, that's what we're in the business of. But yeah, so a lot of data. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yeah, when it sounds like there's going to be so many changes to you talked about, you know, the different subcategories of vegetables, which I knew new dietary guidelines omits the subcategories. So it'd be really interesting to see some of the new school meal rulings and how that's going to then impact all the things that you and all school school food service directors are doing, right? Whether that means new recipes to be compliant with the new standards. So. Lauren- SFR: Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: We'll just wait to see what that looks like. But I imagine your role is only going to get bigger and more responsibility as there's a new deployment. Just like when you first started, right? When you have these massive changes, everyone's starting from scratch. And so everyone needs resourcing. So Lauren, you've had a ⁓ fun career as you've kind of delved into little tidbits of what you've done throughout your career so far. But what's been your favorite or something that you're most proud of? Lauren- SFR: Yes, for sure. I mean... Like I said, farm to school is my jam. Again, I go back to what I'm most passionate about is getting that child to eat. And I have never seen a kid more excited to eat. We did bok choy with second graders. And the way those kids destroyed some bok choy was just like, this is the science I need people to see, right? Like, this is science. This is what's happening. I need everybody to see what this is because teaching a child how to grow their food, making them feel responsible. I love gardening, but I didn't always and then like know what I was doing. But when you watch that little seed and then it gets its first sprout and you're like, I'm a magician, like look what I've created. The kids have that same feeling and care and they're way more likely to try the food that they are growing rather than just the food we're putting out there. So I'm incredibly proud of the school gardens that I have helped create and keep going. ⁓ The nutrition education that comes along with school gardens to help teach our kids about food. and why all the foods are important and not just one food. Like I'm a big advocate for not talking about anything in the words of diet, the way that society perceives a diet with our kids. We talk about all food is food. No food is good food or bad food. Food is food. And I'm a big like everything in, you know, moderation keeps everything in moderation. ⁓ So I love that opportunity to talk to kids about nutrition in a way that I wasn't talked to, you know, spoken to about it when I was a kid. Like again, that 90s stuck with me, those diatres have damaged me and I will not let that happen to today's generation. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yeah. You know, I kind of have a lot of similarities. It's like, well, let's get out of the food stigmatization and just say like food is food. Everything can fit. Just depends how much you're having and what are you complementing it with? Right. So I talk about a lot with my kids, but I also love gardening and we I bought I have a hydroponic one of those gardens with the Y in it's like the indoor hydroponic gardens. And I bought one for my kids school. And because I saw how much my kids love gardening, like we grow tomatoes and okra. Lauren- SFR: Nice. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Sure, a lot of things die. mean, I live in Phoenix, so things die pretty fast if it gets hot. But it's also like they now have the garden at school and I'm asking them, you know, it just the beginning of the year that I gave them the garden and they're really they're like, yeah, we're picking lettuce off and we got our first flowers and we're growing cucumbers and tomatoes. And it's just like they want to eat it. They want to know how it's grown. I think that's something that I'm so passionate working on behalf of agriculture, because I think the more kids know how food is grown, whether it's a Lauren- SFR: Great. Mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: fruit, a vegetable, a meat, an egg, whatever type of food it is, the more they appreciate the farmers too, right? And all the work that goes behind it to be able to have that food. But in the end, it's gotta taste good. I have written so many articles of like, great, nutrition can be awesome. And every time we go for like work events, people are like, ⁓ I got you guys a veggie tray. And it's like, Lauren- SFR: Yes. Right. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: A veggie tray is not like this delicious, like, ⁓ my God, I'm like savoring it. Now you cook me up some like really delicious vegetables, like a bok choy stir fry or something. I'm like, that's delicious, right? Because you make it taste good, but it can also be good for you. There is. I think maybe it's the 90s that road does like if it is good for you, it's not doesn't taste good. Lauren- SFR: Yeah. Right? But you know, it is one of my least favorite things about being a dietitian is the title. And people find out you're a dietitian and at social events they're like, don't look at my plate. I don't care. Don't look at my plate. Or assume because I'm a dietitian, people will be like, ⁓ so you just must eat all organic. They prevent it for organic. No, it's not sustainable. I can't do that for a number of reasons. And they're like, ⁓ are you a vegetarian? Because I'm a dietitian. No. All the foods, all the nutrients, I don't. And you can do it. before any vegetarian or vegan comes at me. You can 100 % get all of your nutrients by following that type of lifestyle. 100%. It's not for me. So yeah, it kills me when people find out I'm a dietitian and then they're like, ⁓ you must like the broccoli. I'm like, girl, do you see that little mane over there? Like, that's what I want. That tastes good. It's what our kids want. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: So funny, I'm in the same boat. And so for those of you who are not watching a video, I'm wearing a K-pop Demon Hunter shirt because I was telling my kids this morning that I have to record a podcast and they're like, well, who are you recording it with? And I was like, she's in school nutrition. They're like, well, of course she likes K-pop Demon Hunters. Like she's in the schools, you know? And so I think sometimes we judge a book by its cover or we generalize these associations where it's like. Lauren- SFR: Yeah. 100 % Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Yeah, I see what you're saying, but like there's nuance to everything we're talking about, especially when it comes to nutrition. Okay, Lauren, rapid fire here. What suggestions or tips you have for someone who's interested in the role in school food service or maybe being a contractor or consultant to support school feeding programs? Lauren- SFR: Yeah, for sure. I mean, I know I couldn't do it without the people that support me. That's 100%. Like when I think about being a consultant, working, you know, with Joe with School Food Rocks, that is our own company. is your, you got to be ready to like put in the work for that. But I'm also incredibly fortunate to have a partner in Joe that is so supportive and as hardworking as I am, a partner in my husband who's so supportive for me to be traveling like I do. so like in that world, like you, if you don't have a good support system, it can be incredibly difficult. But in the RD world of things and the school nutrition world of things, like I cannot recommend it highly enough for any RDs that are out there that are school nutrition dieticians take interns. I learn of RDs that don't take interns, like how do you expect the next generation to learn what we do? Like somebody had to do it for you, why are you not doing it for others? So ⁓ get experience, talk to your elders, we know a good amount, we don't know everything, we're still learning just like you and the world is constantly changing, especially the world of nutrition. So, ⁓ but lean on other people. I guess that's like great when I'm thinking about both things I just said, you've got to have good people around you to do it. But if you're passionate about it, one of my favorite pieces of advice I was ever given was by my dad and he said when you're going for work Don't chase the money because you'll be unhappy if you're chasing the money You're not doing it for the right reasons if you find a job you really like and love you're gonna put more into it and you're more likely to be good at it and the money will then follow and I was very fortunate somebody to say that to me early on and also place of privilege where I was able to do that as well, but Yeah, if you're if nutrition is for you, it's such a cool vast world that there's so many opportunities out there. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: When I think you said in the beginning of the call too, that school nutrition is such a tight knit community. So if you don't have someone in the school district, maybe that you're in or the city that you're in, you can always maybe find other connection points and other school districts to build that bridge, right? That would help you build the bridge into Lee County, right? Just knowing people and people know other people, right? And you slowly build this network. ⁓ And I love a good fatherly advice. My dad, Lauren- SFR: Absolutely. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: He always said, if it was easy, everyone would do it. And I was like, you're right. Like, I don't want to do what everyone wanted to do. Right. So like sometimes you got to take the hard road to be able to not only be successful, but also to open doors that if it was easy to open the door, everyone would push through it. And so you have to push through it. Maybe not in the easiest way. So, okay. Favorite question of mine, Lauren, if you had a crystal ball, what do you think is coming next in nutrition? Lauren- SFR: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. ⁓ God, another fad, right? it's probably what it's like the one staple of nutrition is that there's the next newest best way to be eating and then everybody like gets their opinion on it and it's either gospel or it's the worst thing I've ever heard of. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: So many fans. Lauren- SFR: But probably another fad. I don't know. I think in the world of nutrition Truly one of the things we really need to be thinking about outside of fads because like guys screw fads. Don't don't do that guys Be healthy. But is thinking about the future of food and for me that definitely means sustainability and I'm a big proponent We've just recently have done some work with healthy kids collaborative. We work with an amazing company called cut and it's all about plant forward kind of mindset not plant-based dieting but and I say dieting in the terms of like what your diet consists of it's not that we're trying to lose weight to be clear but sustainability because there's gonna come a time like you know you're talking about you're in Phoenix and things die easily nothing will make you more aware that you'll never survive an apocalypse as much as trying to grow a garden well you'd be like ⁓ I'm dead I will never survive Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: Immediately. Oh yeah. Oh, I have, and now I just like, I just kind of throw seeds everywhere. Just like, come on, something's gotta grow. And then my husband would be like, well, what are you growing up? Like, I don't even know. My kids just threw seeds everywhere. Lauren- SFR: Yes. Yeah. But that's that's been a nice piece of advice for people who want to do gardening. Like, what are you saying? Like, let nature do its thing. If you can back off and let nature do its thing, it will do its thing. yeah, as we look around the world and we're seeing, know, gosh, where was I? Georgia, of all places, I just saw somebody post that there's a warning of a drought coming from Florida. It's either like feast or famine there with our rain, right? Like there's constant droughts. ⁓ But growing food is not easy. And so being aware of how our like how we can help support the environment to make sure that we don't run out or that we have viable land to grow food on, I don't think enough is being said about that and that can be a whole nother four-hour conversation so we won't do that today but it's definitely something that needs to be thought of for sure. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: I love that when sustainability can come across in so many different ways. I know when I was an academic, one of my projects was on how could you build an at home food for us to help with other sustainable behaviors? Because everyone thinks about sustainability in different ways. Like you can be sustainable by turning off lights when you're not using them. You can be sustainable by adding more plants to your diet. You can be sustainable by, you know, taking shorter showers, right? So there's like a lot of like diet and lifestyle ways. But it doesn't mean you have to do them all. I think it's same with nutrition, right? When we think about getting healthier, you don't have to have like 50 to-do list items. It can be like one step at a time. And I think with sustainability, when we're thinking about sustainable food systems, it's one step at a time, right? It doesn't mean you need to go and buy everything at the local farmers market today. It's maybe they're just going to a farmer's market or maybe understanding where local food comes from and can you help with local procurement if you're at a school. Lauren- SFR: Right. Right. Great. Right. Mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: food service or maybe even at home. So I love sustainability, I think, and it's also an opportunity to share farmer stories of how they have generations of farms, whether it's, you know, plants or animals or whatever it might be. They are sustainable in their own way. Otherwise their farm would have closed because trust me, if I had a sustainable garden, this would never make it one more generation. Let me tell you, I've built so many garden beds. So Lauren, thank you so much for being on the show and telling Lauren- SFR: Mm-hmm. right Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RD: your whole story and really giving us a lot of depth and breadth about how the journey is not always linear, but follow your passions, say yes to things, build connections, and the doors will continue to open. So if you like the show, make sure you like, subscribe, leave a review. But most importantly, check out the next episode because every episode I bring on a different dietician and nutrition expert to share their story and give you tips on advice on how to be successful.