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Star Wars Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy · The Long and Short of It

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Thanks for checking out the Long and Short of It podcast.
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We hope you enjoy the show. Hello and welcome to the long
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and short of it, the podcast where we discuss each of the
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games on the Metacritic Top 100 list.
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My name is Lawrence and I'm joined by.
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This is Dan. Welcome to the podcast.
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We had a little had a little chat before we just started
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recording about how we how we intro this now because we're
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we're of course no longer talking about the games that are
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on the top 100 list on Metacritic.
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It's more of a a personal choice of games.
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Now we've we've finished the original and now we're on to the
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next stage, so we're we're kind of in uncharted territory,
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aren't we? Yeah, it's it's all very new,
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but we've had a few weeks off, finished the Metacritic Top 100,
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took a few weeks and now here we are, bar one being Half Life
1:05
Alex. But yeah, now here we are with
1:06
something, as Monty Python would say.
1:09
Now for something completely different, but not completely
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different. Just a bit now for something a
1:14
little bit different. The triumphant return?
1:16
Yes. The second album of us.
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That's right. The difficult second album.
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Yes, yes, quite. How are you?
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Are you well today? I'm all right.
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Yeah. Yeah.
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So our measuring stick will still be Metacritic for the time
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being. That will change in the future
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as we move to the Open Critic list, but for now we're sticking
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with that. There's also another potential
1:42
list in the distant future, which is an old list, actually,
1:47
that goes back a lot further. It's not Schindler's List.
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No, it's. Can't think what it's called off
1:54
the top of my head, but it's basically it's an older list
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that goes back further and could potentially have a few older
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games on there. So we'll have a look at that at
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some point we will. And before we, before we dive
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into this new project, I suppose today just wanted to say thank
2:14
you to everyone that's rated and reviewed our podcast in the
2:18
past. For the past like year or so
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Apple podcast has been under like a little bit of
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construction. I think it's been quite hard to
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find the analytics to our podcast.
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But when having a little look I think it was last week, I found
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that quite a lot of people have left us very supportive and kind
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reviews on particularly on Apple.
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So just wanted to say a thank you to everyone that has rated
2:44
and reviewed us in the past. It's much appreciated and it's
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it's it's very nice to read your kind words so thank you.
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But alas, we marched forward, so to kick off just as a.
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Quick one, so Games rankings is the additional list that I was
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referring to, so we may have a look at that in the distant
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future. Not a games rankings list.
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Very good. But yeah, this is, this is now
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something new. Anyone that's listened to the
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podcast for the past maybe year when we start kind of mentioning
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the plans after the top 100, we'll know that me and Dan are
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now talking about 15 games each that we think either maybe
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deserve to be on the top 100 lists or would be in our
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personal top 100 lists. So.
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We just want to play, yeah, or or.
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We just want to play or want the other to play.
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So we're now kind of on to personal preference of choices.
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So we kick off that new project with one of my games to start
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with. So today we're going to be
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talking about Star Wars Jedi Knights, Jedi Academy.
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Now, Jedi Academy was originally released in 2003 on the PC and
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then a little bit later the Xbox, and was developed by Raven
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Software. So yeah, I suppose.
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Did you know much about this game before you played it?
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No, not really. I think I had a cursory
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awareness of some of the sort of offshoot Star Wars games that
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were going around at the time on PS2 and also the following
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generation and now. It feels like fewer Star Wars
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games are released, so I'm kind of more aware of what's going
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on. But there are a lot of Star Wars
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games releasing at this time, and this was one of them.
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And you also got a bit of differentiation between
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consoles. So what you got on the Xbox was
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different to what you got on the GameCube, for example, where you
4:58
had the Rose Squadron Series. So yeah, it's a bit of a.
5:04
An interesting time for Star Wars games, really.
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Back then it was, and I mean there there's there's a big
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element in this game that I I find that games that came out
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kind of up to and around 1999 I think had quite a large emphasis
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on the way that the the original trilogy ran, which was wasn't a
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load of light Saber combat. It was primarily like an actual
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war game, a lot of first person shooter games.
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A lot of you know, blaster games, Whereas when Star Wars
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The Phantom Menace came out in 1999 that started the prequel
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trilogy and what George Lucas did with the prequels was he
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really put a big focus and emphasis.
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And it really started with Episode 2, which I think came
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out the year before this game of loads of lightsabers, loads of
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Jedi, lots of lightsaber centric stuff, Jedi stuff.
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Yeah, Jedi things. And you kind of see that in this
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game. And I mean, like you say, there
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was a big differentiation between what was on the GameCube
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and the Xbox at the time. There wasn't too much on the
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PlayStation. Interesting.
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I mean, what one of the games that I remember from that time,
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I didn't play it back then, but was a game called Star Wars Obi
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One, which I'm pretty sure took place just before the start of
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The Phantom Menace and then run the the film through.
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But there were, there were a few PlayStation games at the time
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that came out in line with, you know, the the prequels and
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stuff. Star Wars Episode One of The
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Phantom Menace on the PS1 being incredibly.
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Certainly for the game Cube, the reason that that the Rogue
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Squadron games, which are very critically acclaimed, came out
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there was because I think they're developed by Level 5
6:54
games and they had a history of developing with Nintendo, so
6:58
they were very used to that hardware.
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So the N64 had Rogue Squadron One, and then you had Rogue
7:05
Squadron 2 Shadows of the Empire as well.
7:08
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.
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And Rogue Squadron 3 as well. So yeah, that was all Level 5
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games and they're they're really good collection of of Star Wars
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games actually, yeah. And I mean the the Jedi Knight
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series, it goes back quite far, to be honest, although it was
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originally under a different, different name, I suppose, but
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kind of going into what the critics said or thought at the
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time. So looking on Met critic when
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this came out in, when this came out in 2003 for PC, it had a
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meta score of 81. So not not too bad, you know,
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there's nowhere near the areas where we were kind of ranking
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the top 100 games. But it's, you know, I think
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that's a pretty disrespectful. Yeah, 100%.
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And you know, a lot of people were saying that the game play
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of this was what sets it apart, and particularly the if you've
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ever dreamed of being a Jedi Knight, then you know this is
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the game for you. You've got things calling it a
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quality action game. Although a lot of the feedback
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was that Jedi Academy wasn't quite as strong as its
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predecessor, which was Jedi Knights Jedi Outcast, which was
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the the direct predecessor to this game.
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And you've not played Outcast, have you?
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No, from what I hear, it's a bit more story heavy and focused.
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Yes, I think that's fair. And I think one of the reasons
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for my selecting this game in the list is primarily nostalgia.
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And I think a lot of the games that are in my top 15 will be
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nostalgia based, whereas yours are somewhat nostalgia, but
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they're also games that you genuinely think are.
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My the trend with mine, I've said to you already, is, is
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games that may not traditionally fit into the the best games ever
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because there's usually a bit of a glaring flaw with them.
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But they've either got what I would describe as a lot of heart
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or a lot of personality that really to me transcends.
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And there's something about them that I think really elevates
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them. In some cases above what we see
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on some of the games on the top 100 list, yeah, where is mine?
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Mine are weird to be honest with you and I struggled to go up
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with 15, but we we will get to those.
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So you've you've said you don't really have any history with
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this game, do you? So my my history, I think I
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mentioned it in a few episodes here and there, but back, you
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know, back when we were doing the original list games like
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Vice City, I think probably games on Halo two.
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I remember watching my my stepbrother at the time playing
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and I think this was one of them.
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And I got a little bit obsessed with it because I think he had
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it on the original Xbox and I didn't have an Xbox.
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So it wasn't a game that I could easily access.
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But I really, really wanted to play this game and I think the
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main reason for that is a the lightsaber combat.
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Because for me a lot of people think that Star Wars games it's
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difficult because some people will look at different Star Wars
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games and want different things from them.
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For me, I love a Star Wars game with good light Saber combat and
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a decent story, whereas some people prefer the vehicular
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based Star Wars games or the first person shoot to Star Wars
10:41
games or you know whatever. Where is Jedi Academy or?
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The RPG's or, yeah, you know, Pod Race is a great game and
10:50
Codes all came out the same year as this.
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Yeah. And I think that there are quite
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a lot of elements in this game that differentiate it from
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Codesor. And so different.
11:00
They're different games, but I think there are things that Jedi
11:03
Academy does that are more. Similarities for RPG than
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Codesor is like the customization and stuff, you
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know? Yeah, it's yeah, it's very much
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a product of its time. Like I said, this this film,
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this game came out just after Attack of the Clones, but it was
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just before the Revenge of the Sith.
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And we'll get on to the narrative in the story in a
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moment. But it's important to note that
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when this game came out, a lot of the stuff that this game
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brought up was in somewhat Canon because the the original Star
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Wars stories that were brought out between the films and of the
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games and the books and everything else.
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Lucasfilm basically made all of it Canon.
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It was called the Expanded Universe.
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But when George Lucas sold the rights to Star Wars to Disney in
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2012, they basically just fired off all of the the Expanded
11:57
Universe stuff, which is a shame because there is so much of it.
12:01
But where did you play this game?
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Because we we noted that it came out in a few different places,
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at a few different times. Yeah, so there is a remastered
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version of this game. Which was put together by
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Aspire. Aspire have been doing a lot of
12:15
remasters of Star Wars games and they were doing, I think they
12:19
were doing the Code Tour remake at one point, but now they are
12:25
defunct I think and they had some difficulties.
12:31
So they released Code Tour 2 on the Nintendo Switch, and they
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said they were going to release the really quite important DLC.
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Which ties up the story and they never got around to releasing
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it, which is a bit of a shame. See, I played this on the
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Switch. I know it's also available on
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the PS4 and probably Xbox as well.
12:54
Yeah, so I thought this would probably be a good game for you
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on Switch. I had to kind of flit around a
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few areas because I've got this game on Steam from years ago.
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I've also got the original Xbox release, and I also have it as a
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digital download because it's also on Xbox Game Pass, but I
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primarily played it on the PS4. However, I'm not sure if it was
13:18
the install of it that I had or if it was just a bit buggy when
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I first installed it. But I had to restart this game
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about three times and ended up deleting it and reinstalling it
13:27
because it was quite broken and I don't know if that is just the
13:32
build and the port of the game or if I just got unlucky and it
13:37
was frustrating. And it does go to show that
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these older games, no matter if you port them, they can
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sometimes still go quite wrong if they're not like, yeah, you
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know, tinkered with properly, but also.
13:47
Some of the so the switch version was generally pretty
13:52
stable. I think I had it crashed once in
13:56
the entire time I played it and I was doing the thing that you
13:59
recommended me do, which was. Deleting saved games as I go
14:04
along, but there were funny flaws in it.
14:10
So on the briefing screen, for the life of me, I didn't know
14:13
how to view the full briefing. So I only could see like page
14:19
one of the briefing and I pressed all the buttons and I
14:22
couldn't get to any of that extended briefing.
14:24
So it's just little things like that.
14:26
And I know the other thing is the aspect ratio of this game.
14:29
Obviously it's an old game presented on.
14:32
New hardware and it chops off some of the faces at times.
14:37
And yeah, it's just little things that a really high
14:43
quality remaster wouldn't would probably fix but weren't fixed
14:47
here. Yes, yeah, it it, I mean it.
14:52
Like we say, this is a 20 year old game and as well as that,
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this is a 20 year old game that was developed for the PC.
14:59
So it being ported onto console, even though it's 20 years after,
15:04
it's never going to run perfectly I suppose because it
15:07
isn't. It isn't made for consoles,
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particularly for the Switch and the PlayStation.
15:12
Xbox is probably an argument, but yeah, so next to areas,
15:17
narrative and kind of what what this game is.
15:20
So before we get onto the narrative, what what do you do
15:23
in this game? What kind of game is this?
15:25
Where you've kind of hit the nail on the head already by
15:28
saying it's a lightsaber combat game, which also has first
15:35
person shooting, so it can be third person or first person.
15:39
There are also, as they did it at this time, there are random
15:45
vehicular levels and which I'm sure we'll discuss.
15:53
But basically, you're running through levels, you're
15:55
completing quite broad objectives, and you're
15:59
decimating countless foes with a light Saber.
16:03
That's really the long and short of it, isn't it?
16:05
Pretty much. So what's the story?
16:08
What's the narrative in this game?
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It's like, before we get on to that, actually, this game does
16:13
have RPG elements about it as well.
16:16
At the end of every level you've completed your objectives, your
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four your core force powers will grow stronger, which is like
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Force Jump, Push, Pull, and Sense.
16:26
And then you can also put points into Light side Force powers,
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which are things like Force Heal.
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I can't remember any of the other light light side force
16:38
powers because they're just not very useful.
16:41
But then the dark side powers. You can put points up to three
16:44
points per power. And things like shield on the
16:47
light side, shield as well. And you've got things like
16:52
forced lightning, forced grip, forced drain on the dark side
16:57
side of things, which yeah, And also in line with RPG elements.
17:02
At the start of the game, you create your character.
17:04
There's a few basic choices you can make in terms of look,
17:07
gender, race, etcetera, what they wear.
17:09
And then the the best part in my opinion is you get to create
17:13
your own light Saber from the hilts to the color and you can
17:17
choose from blue-green, purple, yellow, orange and orange.
17:23
So yes, what's the story of this game, please?
17:26
So as it says in the title, Jedi Academy, you're not playing as
17:31
the, I'll call it a series because they really are.
17:35
The Jedi Knight games really are a series of games.
17:38
So there's a series protagonist who is Carl Katan and.
17:43
He is in the game, but he's not the protagonist this time.
17:49
Important character, but not the protagonist.
17:51
You're playing as Jaden core, Crank is, and as you say, you
17:57
can customize that character to a degree as to how you want
18:00
them. And you have built your own
18:05
lightsaber. You're going to the Jedi
18:07
Academy, you meet a very lovely character.
18:10
It's called Rosh. One knows your favorite
18:12
character. He's everyone's favourite
18:14
character. He's not annoying at all.
18:16
No, no. And basically, you're training
18:20
up, you witness an event where someone's using some power.
18:27
Excellent. And you say the story here
18:32
really is quite simple and there's a lot of kind of filler
18:36
in between the story missions. And then you go to Hearth and
18:40
you, you fight a Laura who comes back later.
18:43
And at some point Rush is like your sort of friendly nemesis.
18:52
Yeah, it's like you've got a friendly rivalry with.
18:56
Him, I mean, you've. Yeah.
18:59
So he's your rival and he's constantly trying to undermine
19:03
you. And then at one point he turns
19:05
to the dark side and. You set out to save him.
19:10
So. So the grand story of this game
19:13
is a character called Tavion who's trying to resurrect one of
19:20
the old Sith Lords on Coriband. I can't remember Ragnos.
19:25
That's it. And your your goal is to prevent
19:29
that from happening pretty much. I wouldn't say there's much
19:34
character development along the way.
19:36
Or. It's really that cuts and dry
19:41
and then there may be some odd story beats here and there in
19:44
between. But yeah, yeah, the the the
19:47
story takes place about 10 years or so after Return of the Jedi's
19:51
finished. Luke Skywalker is creating a new
19:54
Jedi Academy alongside Kyle Katan, and like you say, you
19:58
attend the Academy with a new cohort of students with Rush
20:02
Pennant, who is the most irritating rival character in
20:05
video game history and has a very annoying voice.
20:09
As you proceed that the game is set up into, there are four or
20:13
five missions you can undertake and then once you've done those
20:17
there is a story based mission which helps you know move the
20:22
story along. So you've got the first set of
20:24
missions and then from there you have exploration of Echo Base
20:30
from Hoff, which is obviously a throwback to The Empire Strikes
20:33
Back, then the next set of missions.
20:35
And then from there you have to go to a place called Vijun,
20:39
which is where Darth Vader had a castle, which is where you find
20:43
Rosh and find out that he's he's been turned to the dark side and
20:46
fight him. You then gets promoted to a Jedi
20:50
Knight. You do a few more missions and
20:51
then from there is the case you have to go to a planet called
20:57
Taspere to try and find Rosh because he's reached out saying
21:00
that he's made a mistake and wants to turn back to the light
21:02
side. At that point, you then have a
21:04
choice of whether or not you want to continue on the light
21:08
side, or you can make a choice and turn to the dark side.
21:12
And that's your binary choice, which dictates the outcome of
21:16
the game. As with most Star Wars games at
21:19
this time, including Code Tour, really it's whether you want to
21:24
be. Light side or dark side?
21:26
And that would affect the outcome, Yeah.
21:28
So effectively there's two stories running through this
21:33
game that the story of Roche and Jaden, I suppose, and then the
21:38
wider story of Octavian and these Sith cultists bringing
21:43
back the spirit of Ragnos. So I would take the Galaxy.
21:48
It's a pretty basic story and all of the characters were
21:51
basically written. You know, Luke Skywalker's got a
21:54
fair bit of input in the game as well, although he just stands
21:58
like he's put his. He's got a bit of input, but he
22:01
is, in a way, completely nonessential to the story.
22:06
Pretty much, yeah. It is the story of Kyle, Jaden
22:11
and Roche. There's a few cameos in there as
22:13
well. Yeah, Bob Effect's in it for one
22:15
level, Chewbacca's in it, the Millennium Falcon.
22:18
And it's the same in Jedi Outcast.
22:19
You know, there's a level where Lando shows up.
22:23
So there is fanservice in these games and particularly some of
22:27
the levels, you know, like going back to Echo Base on Hearth or
22:30
going to Darth Vader's castle on the June.
22:33
There are like there are levels as well where you help out Wedge
22:37
Antilles from Rogue Squadron, which is quite a nice little
22:42
throw in. But yeah, it's a very basic
22:44
story. So the main emphasis of this
22:49
game is really the game play. The story is very bare bones and
22:53
we've noted that this is, it's an action RPG with lightsaber
22:57
combat and force powers. So gameplay is king.
23:01
It stays in our new format, but do you think this game is fun to
23:04
play? It's all right depending on the
23:09
level. Some levels I wanted to throw
23:14
the switch at the wall, some levels are okay and yeah, it
23:20
really does range depending on the level that you're playing.
23:24
For me, some levels I found fine, and then other levels
23:26
really, really aggravating, particularly since the end.
23:32
The middle for me was the most tedious part.
23:35
But yeah, towards the end when you're fighting. 1001 Dark Jedi,
23:40
one after the other. That gets a bit annoying as
23:43
well. Yeah, so sort of in the middle
23:47
for me. It can be fun, but also not
23:51
yeah, mixed, varied. I wouldn't use the word varied,
23:57
but yeah, let's say varied. I I I think this is one of those
24:02
games where if you've got like if you same as what we mentioned
24:06
with Metal Gear Solid originally, that if you've got
24:09
history with this game and if you've got background with this
24:12
game, it's quite easy to jump in and out of.
24:13
But going into it blind 20 years after its release, I can imagine
24:18
it is quite a clunky and quite frustrating experience.
24:21
Well, I get lost quite a lot and because you you you said
24:24
obviously you've played it extensively in the past a lot.
24:28
You knew what to do a lot of the time, but there were times when
24:31
I was just running around, not sure what to do next and it
24:35
doesn't really steer you in any direction, so it's a lot of
24:39
trial and error. I'm not going to say yeah, and
24:42
it's not. It's not as bad as some games,
24:44
certainly, but it's there. Yes, that's fair enough.
24:50
I think this game is fun. There are.
24:54
I think when it's good it's very good and when it's bad it's
24:58
quite poor. Some absolutely, shockingly bad
25:03
levels in there. Oh, there are.
25:04
And this. This game lives and dies by its
25:06
levels. And really the highlight levels
25:09
are the ones that are kind of like the end of chapter levels.
25:12
So Hoff, yeah, the June task Bear and Caraban, and there are
25:18
a few decent levels thrown in here and there with like the
25:20
different missions. But I think it's fun to play and
25:23
I think the light Saber combat is what makes this game.
25:27
But what What was your favorite move, or what was your favorite
25:29
thing to do? A quiet light, so when you jump
25:37
in the air, so, so jumping actually, once you've got to the
25:40
the third lots of missions and you've reached your full
25:45
capacity for jumping, that's quite fun to do because you can
25:49
just jump ridiculous distances. You can also do this, sort of.
25:55
Side flip off walls. You can also do a back flip off
25:59
walls if you're jumping straight at them, which led to a few
26:02
deaths for me, but the side flip is quite a cool little movie you
26:05
can do. Obviously the the bread and
26:07
butter of this game is the light Saber combat, which is solid.
26:13
But yeah, some cool moves in there as well.
26:15
Yeah, for me, my favorite move will always be the light Saber
26:18
combat in this game. I think that it isn't perfect.
26:23
In fact, it's far from perfect. But personally, I think that the
26:26
light Saber combat in this game should be the foundation for all
26:33
light Saber combat in Star Wars games.
26:36
And I do realize that this is a 20 year old game now, so you
26:39
know it's not going to be the same as games coming out now
26:42
like Jedi Survivor. So what do you think the light
26:45
Saber combat does? Well, I think that the fact that
26:49
it's free flowing is what makes it good, because a lot of games
26:54
like Saber battles will be very scripted or it will feel like
26:58
you're just swinging a sword around and there's no skill to
27:03
it. Whereas in this game it is very
27:06
much a case of you will lock sabers with enemies at some at
27:11
some points. You know you will get into
27:14
points where you need to be a bit more strategic about how
27:17
you're going to fight, whether that is with a fast style or a
27:20
strong style, whether or not you're going to throw your Sabre
27:24
to cause damage that way. I think I thought the Jedi
27:31
Fallen Order was a really good game, but the the Sabre combat
27:36
was good, but it felt like it was too scripted, if that makes
27:41
sense. Whereas the Sabre combat in this
27:42
game doesn't feel scripted. It feels like there's a bit of
27:45
skill to using it and it also feels like you are wielding a
27:49
light Saber. You can't really get it on the
27:51
consoles, but there is like an option on the original PC port,
27:56
and I think on the original Xbox ports as well, that you can turn
28:00
a setting on that basically gives you realistic Saber
28:04
settings. Yeah, I saw that.
28:06
That's quite cool. Where basically, even if you're
28:08
not swinging your lightsaber, but you just.
28:10
Walk into people and kill them because of that.
28:12
Because it's a. Lightsaber And you know, it is
28:16
very satisfying when you are in like a Sabre, jewel or whatever,
28:21
to just slice someone and then their arm comes off and you're
28:23
like, all right, okay, well. That Yeah, that's cool.
28:27
And at around the halfway point in the game, after your fight
28:30
with Ross at Vegas Castle, Jaden's lightsaber gets
28:34
destroyed. And when you get promoted to
28:37
Jedi Knights, you have the option of creating a new
28:41
lightsaber and you can either just keep it as one single
28:44
lightsaber. You can get a doubleended
28:48
lightsaber very much like Darth Maul from Episode One.
28:51
Or like I said, this game came out not long after Attack of the
28:54
Clones, which in that film you see Anakin Skywalker wielding 2
28:58
savers. So you have the choice of 1/2 or
29:01
doubleended lightsaber for the rest of the game, and depending
29:06
how you choose it will very much depend.
29:08
It will very much change the the saver combat that you run with.
29:13
Yeah, what did you go for? You went double, didn't you?
29:16
Yeah, double ended. Yeah.
29:17
And what color did you go for? So I changed it.
29:20
So originally I started with orange and I changed it to
29:23
purple for when I upgraded my light Saber.
29:27
You want it to be a little bit closer to a nice window.
29:30
Yes, a purple Saber. That's fair.
29:32
I mean, I've played through this game quite a few times.
29:35
At this time I started off with a blue single Saber and then I
29:39
did what I usually do and I've got jewel sabers halfway through
29:42
and went for a blue and a green. But yeah, the the lightsaber
29:47
combat in this game is the highlight for me.
29:49
So we mentioned that this is a 20 year old game.
29:53
So it isn't, you know, it isn't perfect with today's standards
29:59
and I'm very aware that it's a flawed game, but let's talk a
30:02
little bit about the visuals in the audio.
30:05
So what? What do you think of the look of
30:07
this game and the sound of this game?
30:12
I think the visuals are probably the area where you can really
30:16
see that it's aged. It's not even for the time.
30:22
I don't think it stood out as being an attractive game, and
30:25
there were some games that were really pushing boundaries back
30:28
then. I mean, around that time you
30:30
probably had the original Splinter Cell and stuff like
30:32
that the the lightsaber combat looks.
30:40
Nice. I think the animation of it
30:43
looks nice and if you're watching it on a screen, it
30:46
looks nice and it just flows nicely.
30:49
But yeah, the faces, the hair, it all just looks a bit drab.
30:56
And I think it looks actually similar to maybe a little bit
31:02
worse than Cotour. I don't know if they're running
31:05
on the same engine, but yeah, they do.
31:07
There is a similarity between them.
31:10
I I think this game looks better than Kotol.
31:15
The the aesthetic of Kotol was my biggest problem with it, I
31:18
think. And again that's because it's a
31:21
20 year old game. But I think that this game
31:25
doesn't look great for his age, particularly the faces and the
31:29
hair. I think some of the environments
31:32
are pretty decent, yeah. And you know there are some
31:36
really standout levels that very included in this game.
31:40
Like I said, the June Castle, it's fantastic.
31:43
Task Bearer I thought was really good.
31:45
There are a couple of good levels where you're on like a
31:47
tram at the start running through a planet like trying to
31:51
stop this train. But then there are some very
31:55
drab, very dull like tatooing like tatooing's been done to
32:00
death. And yeah, it's it's 5050 to look
32:05
at this game, and I think when you're in the areas where the
32:08
visuals pop, it looks fantastic. So before we get there, let's
32:25
the sound of the game generally pretty solid.
32:11
But the drab kind of Browns, Grays, Tatooines or whatever,
32:15
they just look a bit dull, particularly these days.
32:19
So how would you describe this game in a single?
32:28
Star Wars and the voice acting. Voice acting is good.
32:32
Obviously, they've got the Star Wars license soundtrack.
32:36
In terms of licensed soundtracks, I always prefer it
32:42
when licensed games do their own thing with the soundtrack and
32:47
present something different. That's why I loved Goldeneye
32:50
soundtrack, because it wasn't typical Bond Fair.
32:54
It didn't. It had cues of the Bond theme in
32:57
there, but it didn't have the entire Bond theme at all in
33:00
there. But there were references to it
33:03
throughout. And I prefer it when licensed
33:08
games do that rather than just ripping the soundtrack
33:12
wholesale, which they do here, and they do in many, many other
33:16
licensed games. So yeah, it's a good
33:19
soundtracking. That is the Star Wars soundtrack
33:21
base. It could have maybe moved away
33:24
from that bit. I think the voice acting isn't
33:27
fantastic. The guy that voices Luke
33:29
Skywalker is a relatively decent Mark Hamill impressionist, and
33:34
the guy that voices Kyle Katan as well is decent.
33:41
I didn't use the male version. I think the male version of
33:38
Jaden is quite poor, but the female?
33:43
I used the female version, which was Jennifer Hale, and she's
33:45
pretty solid. Well, yeah, she she, she did.
33:48
She was a Metal Gear Solid. Was she?
33:49
She's now me hunting. Yeah, she's done Mass Effect and
33:53
stuff. Yeah.
33:54
So yeah, the voice acting for the male Jaden isn't great.
33:57
And I think the voice acting for Rosh is quite poor as well.
34:00
Oh yeah, that struck me bad. But then chose the character.
34:04
But wow, no one likes Rush. Let's face it, he's got a he's
34:09
got a bit of a tinge of Quentin Flynn about him, which is riding
34:14
from the MG S2. But worse, but worse.
34:17
Significantly worse. Frustrating and annoying and
34:20
irritating. But yeah, so describe the game
34:23
in one word. I was thinking about this
34:27
earlier on and. Sometimes when you're thinking
34:32
about one word to describe a game, a word just leaps out to
34:35
you. For me, the operative word that
34:39
I keep coming back to with this game is dated.
34:45
I just think a lot of this game is dated and that is the big
34:50
hurdle for a new player that had never played it before.
34:53
And I find when people discuss this game, they fall into one of
34:58
two camps. There are the camps that played
35:01
the game before and still very much enjoy it.
35:05
I mean, I saw hyperbole on YouTube calling it the perfect
35:11
game and things like that. And then there are the sorts of
35:16
new camp, I'd say, that are probably viewing it with a bit
35:25
more of a critical lens and. And and I would say, yeah, to me
35:31
the biggest hang up that I have with this game is that it's
35:34
dated. That's not to say that it wasn't
35:37
a decent game at the time, at the time or even a good game at
35:39
the time. It probably was.
35:40
But in 2023, it's just it's a hard sell if you haven't played
35:46
it before. Yeah, but yeah, I get that.
35:50
And I think one of the reasons that Jedi Outcast is a lot more
35:55
liked than Jedi Academy is because Jedi Outcasts, it kind
35:59
of isn't sure what it is to begin with.
36:02
The the first half of the game, it's the first person shooter.
36:06
You don't get your lightsaber until midpoint and then the game
36:09
style changes. And I think that's what people
36:12
like about it because it's very much a more varied game and the
36:19
story is a lot tighter because it is just telling one story
36:23
rather than, you know, giving. I would be intrigued to play
36:26
that one. And I know you talked about
36:28
we're going to do the second lot of choice games that we're going
36:31
to get to eventually. So if you do do that, yeah, I
36:35
would be interested to play it. Yeah, it's a potential and to be
36:40
fair, it's maybe you want to go back and play it because I've
36:42
not played outcasts for years. But the word that I'd use for
36:47
this game? It doesn't really make much
36:49
sense, but it's just lightsabers.
36:53
Yeah, it's fair enough. I get it.
36:54
And that kind of runs quite well into the question of the week
36:59
that I want to ask. So I know you're not as much of
37:03
A Star Wars person as I am. You know you don't mind it.
37:06
You quite like it, but. Yeah, describe yourself as a
37:09
casual fan. Yeah, So for you, you've played
37:13
quite a few Star Wars games anyway.
37:15
Yeah, What would make a great Star Wars game in your opinion?
37:19
And what is your favorite Star Wars game?
37:21
So two questions there I suppose.
37:23
I find that as you kind of alluded to earlier, a lot of the
37:27
Star Wars games have a strength and then they try and do other
37:34
things and it deviates from that strength.
37:37
So obviously with the Row Squadron games, the vehicular
37:41
combat is the strength. And in in the third game they do
37:45
have on foot sections which were criticized by critics at the
37:51
time as being not as good as the vehicle stuff.
37:56
And and the same here. I mean one of the worst levels
37:59
in this game is is the speed of bike level does not control.
38:06
I thought it was awful, really found it terrible bouncing all
38:11
over the place and just really. So I don't think the vehicles
38:14
are the strong suit here. So they tend to do certain
38:19
things well and then the other stuff they don't.
38:22
So it would be nice to see a game come along and manage to
38:27
get all that stuff in. But that's that's a big ask
38:30
because obviously if you've got a vehicle combat Star Wars game,
38:32
you're basically looking at a Star Fox Engine or a Star Fox
38:38
like game combined with on foot stuff.
38:42
Combined with good combat, probably combined with first
38:45
person shooting. I personally prefer the RPG Star
38:49
Wars games. I think I like the word Rose
38:54
Squadron games, but I think probably Cotor is my favorite of
38:59
the Star Wars games that I've played.
39:01
I quite like the Lego ones as well, actually.
39:03
I think they do something right. Yeah, I'd be interested to see
39:10
your thoughts if you played the new the two newer ones.
39:16
So Jedi Fallen Order and then the newest one that came out a
39:20
few months ago, Jedi Survivor. I've not played that one.
39:22
Yet I've started playing Fallen Order.
39:24
Is that the one where you start off on like a big ship?
39:26
Yeah, Yeah. And.
39:27
It's yeah. And I started playing it and I
39:33
own it and I really thought from what I saw, it was good.
39:39
So yeah, I would like to play that properly.
39:41
It's a decent game. And the other one that I'd
39:43
suggest is Cuz you mentioned the Lego games there.
39:46
I'm guessing you haven't played the newest one.
39:48
They bought out a year or so ago the Skywalker Saga, which is all
39:51
nine films. I actually, again, I own it and
39:55
I'll probably get around to playing it with my girlfriend.
39:57
Yeah, she's a big fan of the Lego games, isn't she?
40:00
Yeah, well, it's just they're just funds playing Co-op, aren't
40:03
they? Yes.
40:04
That that. That's quite a fun game, and
40:06
it's a bit different from the original Lego games, but it is
40:09
fun. I mean, for me to answer that
40:11
question, what makes the Star Wars game good for me is the
40:14
lightsaber combat, and I think that's good In Fallen Order.
40:17
It's okay. I think in the Skywalk saga,
40:19
it's all right, but I think this is where the foundations were
40:23
best for Saber combat, and this would probably be my favorite
40:28
Star Wars game. Other than maybe.
40:33
Star Wars Battlefronts, but not Battlefront 2 and not out of the
40:38
the remake cohort. So the original Star Wars
40:41
Battlefront? Yeah, I know you mean.
40:42
Came out I think in like 2004 maybe by Yeah, I think it was
40:46
Pandemic Studios. Yeah, that's that's quite
40:49
critically claimed Star Wars game generally.
40:51
Yeah, I mean, people prefer Battlefront 2, which I get
40:54
because there were more maps, you play as heroes and stuff.
40:56
But yeah, I love the original Battlefront.
40:58
I thought it was fantastic. But yeah, so.
41:03
As we approach the end of the episode, we've got a slightly
41:06
new format here because obviously this game isn't in the
41:09
top 100 list for Metacritic. So the first question I believe
41:16
has to be asked by you Or is it? Yeah, so I know that the answer
41:23
to this is going to be probably not a straightforward 1.
41:25
So why have you selected it? And why do you think this
41:33
deserves to be on the Metro Critic Top 100 if you do?
41:36
Yeah, I mean, a lot of the games that are going to be in my list
41:40
I don't really think should be on the top 100 list, and there's
41:44
probably an argument that I could have in my own head where
41:46
I'd say this one doesn't deserve to be there.
41:50
I wanted to play this game because, as with a lot of the
41:53
games that are going to be on my list, they're just games that I
41:56
love more than I think that they're.
41:59
Fantastic or amazing or critically acclaimed?
42:01
It's just games that I really love that I have a bit of a soft
42:06
spot in my heart for, and this is definitely one of them.
42:10
I played this game a lot when I was a teenager when, you know, I
42:15
spent a lot more of my time gaming and it's like there's a
42:21
few games that I've played in my life that not.
42:27
It's not a huge, huge amount of people have played a lot on the
42:29
levels of like Rockstar games and stuff like that, but they've
42:32
got a bit of a bit of a following and some people think
42:37
they're great and some people don't.
42:38
Whereas for me, for one point in my life I was utterly obsessed
42:42
with this game because I loved Star Wars so much.
42:46
So I don't think I could make an argument for saying this game
42:49
deserves to be in the Metacritic top 100 list, because I don't
42:51
think that it does. But it is.
42:54
If you've got the patience for it, a fun game to to play
42:58
regardless. Although you know from your
43:01
experience slightly frustrating in some areas, just adjust your
43:05
expectations accordingly. And I think you, I think if
43:11
you've not played it before, you probably have to be quite a big
43:13
Star Wars fan, so to get along with this game.
43:16
Yeah, quite possibly. But I mean the next new question
43:21
that we have is. To the person that was playing
43:24
it for the first time or or not, the host is Do you think it
43:28
deserves to be there? I already know what your answer
43:31
is going to be for this. Yeah.
43:34
Yes. No, I don't.
43:39
I'm not. Based on my commentary
43:42
throughout the episode. I think that's clear.
43:46
It was certainly wasn't a bad game.
43:48
It was. It was inoffensive.
43:50
And I think there are games on your list, on your side of the
43:54
list, which we're not going to reveal yet, that I'm looking
43:58
forward to less than this one. Generally speaking, I quite like
44:03
Star Wars games, so I'm always happy to jump into one.
44:06
And there are some Star Wars games that I do want to play and
44:10
full and Order is one of them. So yeah, I think probably there
44:16
are other Star Wars games that I would nominate over this.
44:19
We already do have Code Tour in the top 100.
44:23
But yeah, I think to me, I haven't played them for a bit,
44:29
but I feel like Rogue Squadron might have aged a bit better
44:34
than this. But I don't know.
44:35
I haven't played it for a while. Rogue Squadron 2 particularly.
44:39
Yeah, and you know there are. The, the, the vehicular Star
44:44
Wars games usually review pretty well, like Rogue Squadron.
44:48
You've got Star Wars Episode One Racer, which is obviously a
44:50
classic Star Wars starfighter and Jedi starfighter.
44:55
But then you've also got games. What was it called?
44:59
There was a game where, you know, Twisted Metal on the
45:05
PlayStation. There's a Star Wars game of that
45:08
that I Star Wars Demolition. I don't know it.
45:12
It it wasn't great and I've spent a lot of my life playing
45:17
not great Star Wars games. And another one that I would
45:20
probably put it there is Star Wars Episode One Jedi Power
45:23
battles. Just there were just a lot at
45:25
this time right there. There were huge amount.
45:27
There was a flood of them, really.
45:29
And you know this, this goes back even further.
45:31
Like, I think the first Star Wars game I ever played was Star
45:37
Wars A New Hope on the Game Boy. And then as well as that, I had
45:41
Superstar Wars Return to the Jedi, and there's just so much
45:44
out there. And the Superstar Wars games,
45:46
our class is quite, quite good. But then you've got games like
45:50
Yoda stories, and yeah, there's a big catalog of games out
45:54
there. Some are great and some aren't.
45:57
But yeah, that pretty much concludes this first episode of
46:01
our new formats. So what do we have coming up
46:04
next time, as it is one of your games, we're taking interns.
46:08
So what you got? So we're going to be playing.
46:11
This was the final audition to my list, and it was a bit of a
46:15
controversial. It was a bit of a spur of the
46:19
moment one in terms of it's a game that I've really enjoyed in
46:22
the past, but it has some caveats to it and they'll make
46:30
it into those in a second. But yeah, so the game that I've
46:33
chosen is Alpha Protocol, which is the spy RPG from Obsidian,
46:40
released in the year 2010. And the big caveat with this
46:45
game is that it's very messy, but it does something so right
46:52
And if you can get past the jank, and there is a lot of
46:56
jank, I feel like it's a really enjoyable game.
47:02
I mean, I've just finished it again a couple of days ago and
47:05
thoroughly enjoyed my playthrough of it and I feel
47:10
like I can forgive the jankiness of it because again, the stuff
47:14
that it does well, it does very, very well and it's there's
47:17
nothing quite like it. So I do feel, I feel quite happy
47:20
having replayed it, to have put this up for the list.
47:26
But yeah, my, I've already given you a bit of a briefing as to
47:33
what to prepare for. Be prepared for the worst
47:36
crouching animation in the history of games I.
47:39
Already experienced that awful and similar jank?
47:45
Other points as well, and be prepared that the RPG stuff is
47:50
completely imbalanced and you'll go from probably struggling
47:54
quite a lot to being a massive overpowered beast towards the
47:57
end of the game depending where you sink your points into, which
48:02
is entertaining as well. And how do you think that I'd
48:04
find the game? I think if you can get past
48:10
those flaws I think you'll because I think you quite like
48:15
spy games as well as I do and I think this is one of the reasons
48:20
I picked it. Really this is the best non
48:24
James Bond James Bond game there is.
48:27
More so than Hitman? Yeah, I'd say so.
48:31
Because what Hitman doesn't do quite so well.
48:35
Hitman's about disguise is and Hitman's his only thing to me.
48:40
Whereas this has the conversation, this has the
48:43
smooth talking, this has going to bars.
48:46
And yeah, this is the whole side of James Bond that the James
48:50
Bond games don't really do very well.
48:54
Yeah, it's it's the globe trotting, exotic stuff that the
48:59
films so heavily have but games have never really delved into.
49:03
And yeah, it really ticks that box for me.
49:06
So I think if you can get past that, you'll enjoy it.
49:08
But it all depends whether you can get past it.
49:10
I would say funnel your points wisely and you could probably,
49:17
you'll probably start enjoying it, especially when you get to
49:20
some of the more interesting locales, which there are.
49:23
It doesn't start off strong, starts off quite poorly,
49:27
frankly. But yeah, I'm interested to see,
49:30
and I can. It's one of those games where
49:34
it's divisive and I can completely understand why some
49:38
people would not get past that stuff.
49:40
And at the same time, you will see a lot of people online that
49:43
have got past that stuff. So you'll fall into one or two
49:46
camps with it, and I'm interested to see where.
49:49
I guess we shall see, yes. But yes, that episode should be
49:53
next week. So yes, that will be next week.
49:56
Yes, thank you for joining us on this new project.
50:00
I suppose we hope you've enjoyed it.
50:02
As we as we move forward week on week, the the the running of it
50:08
will get smoother. We're just kind of working out
50:10
how to do this new format I suppose at the moment.
50:13
But yeah, we hope you've enjoyed it.
50:16
As always we're on social media. We're also on threads now.
50:19
However, I don't know how much of A an alive social media app
50:22
that is it at the moment. But yeah, as always, long and
50:26
short of it. Podcast.
50:27
We're on Twitter. Facebook.
50:29
You can e-mail us at long and short of It
50:31
podcasts@hotmail.com. And yeah, if you've enjoyed this
50:35
episode, please give us a rating.
50:37
Like we said at the start, we eventually do see the ratings
50:41
and they are greatly appreciated.
50:44
Years later. Yes, years later.
50:46
And we do appreciate your feedback.
50:48
So yeah. But until next time, that is all
50:52
we've got. So we'll see you next week for
50:54
Alpha Protocol. Anything else from you for
50:56
today? No, that's it.
50:59
Well, here is the the, the, the required mention of Mr. Blobby,
51:04
right, Yeah, we haven't had a dying embers.
51:08
Yes, that's going to continue. So be happy about that.
51:12
And we will see you next week for Alpha Protocol.
51:15
Cheerio. See you on the next one, SMS
51:20
Khan.