Latest / Cardinal Territory: A St. Louis Cardinals Podcast / No Retaliation for Uribe? Cards, May Lose Heartbreaker to Brewers

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No Retaliation for Uribe? Cards, May Lose Heartbreaker to Brewers · Cardinal Territory: A St. Louis Cardinals Podcast

• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome to another edition of Cardinal Territory.
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: Jim Hayes alongside Kyle Gibson. Lance Lenham told is in
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: an important meeting. He may join us, he may not.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: And Kyle Gibson is at his kids basketball camp today.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: How are you, Kyle. Nice to see you, Jim.
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: I'm doing great. You know. One of my favorite comments
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: that I saw about one of our shows was when
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: Lance was in his truck at the top of the
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: hill and had bad service and somebody said, don't you
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: guys plan these shows and have a schedule. Well, yeah,
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: we have a scheduled, but when you have so many
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: kids who are doing so many things like we do,
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: need to schedule it at six am or ten pm.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: Those are when things start and stop for us. So, yeah,
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: I'm sitting here at basketball camp. They're doing a dribbling
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: competition right now the local high school here, so Mills
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: is out there are nine year old's out there getting
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: some basketball work out. So I'll make sure to mute
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: my microphone when I'm not talking. And if I need
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: to just give you a thumbs up or thumbs down
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: on one of your yes or no questions, I will
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: are you.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: Were you a good basketball player, like in high school?
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Did you play high school ball?
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: Didn't play high school in Indiana, obviously basketball is king,
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: And after seventh grade, I was still about, oh, I
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: don't know, probably eighty two pounds oaken wet and I
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: don't know, maybe five six short for Indiana basketball. And
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: I kind of just said, all right, well, I guess
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to be a basketball player, so I
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: can still be a short and super skinny shortstopper, second
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: basement whatever I need to be. So eight through a year,
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: decided to focus on baseball and then hit a gross
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: s burt in between freshman and sophomore year of high school. Naturally,
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: and basketball might have been an okay sport for me,
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: but I had a little bit of fun. I was
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: as streaky of a shooter as it came, so you
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: had to figure out when the ball was going to
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: at least hit the rim, let alone go in, or
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: you really just didn't want me touching the ball. I
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: was kind of the pick I was the pick player
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: a lot, you know, set the screen, get in the
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: way of the defense, and let somebody else shoot the ball.
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: Those kind of guys, I think for basketball are the glue.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: Let's talk about the Cardinals. They are off today. They
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: will welcome in the Cubs for a weekend set starting tomorrow,
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: and it's going to be a long string of home games,
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: which is good for the Cardinals because they could use it.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: They have found a little turmoil right now. And yesterday
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: they lost to the Brewers in the finale of that set,
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: And I want to ask you about this. We'll get
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: to the to the histrionics soon, but I want to
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: ask you about Dustin Bank. So this guy was on
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: point ninth strikeout out, carried a no hitter into the eighth,
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: He was sniffing it and gives up a double, a
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: bunt base hit, then a yellowish single, and not only
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: did he lose the no hitter, but the Cardinals end
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: up losing the game. But as a pitcher, I don't
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: know how close you've gotten in your career to a
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: no hitter. But how heartbreaking is that for a picture?
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: When you're that close. You still pitched a great game,
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: He pitched the gym right, he was outstanding, But you
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: got close and didn't get it. How tough is that
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: for a pitcher?
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's tough. I mean I think one time in
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: Yankee Stadium. It was either the sixth or the seventh inning.
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: It was my first either hit or runner. Don't remember
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: fills a no hitter or perfect game at that point.
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: But I wouldn't say that I was necessary sniff in
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: the end line of the finish line just yet. But
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: I also, from like the fourth inning on, if I
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: hadn't given up a hit third any one, probably I
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: was thinking about it. So I was doing my best
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: and I give up a hit or runner. But man,
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: he he's really kind of settled in and has really
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: been throwing the ball really well. I think he's this
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: is the version of him that the Cardinals were, you know,
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: saw in the tank, and Saw could be somebody who
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: could really help the staff and help this team win. So,
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: you know, I think it's it's a good sign that
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: he's out there and and he's feeling really good and
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: his stuff is really progressing. So yes, frustrating that you
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: throw so well. Uh, and then you not only give
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: up the hit, you lose a shutout. You know that
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: was kind of the old chirp that would happen, Uh
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: if I was sitting out there. You know, you lose
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: the no hitter in the shutout and everybody in the
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: opposing dugouts yelling, well, there goes the shutout as well,
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: So you know, it's it's something that you just want
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: to keep playing good baseball games, right, And I don't
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: want to gloss over a sweep, because nobody wants to
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: get swept. But you know, they played pretty good baseball
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: for most of the series. Offense didn't show up quite
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: as well obviously, but I think we know Milwaukee can pitch. That's,
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: you know, a big strenth to their team. You know,
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: we gave up a couple of big innings in the series.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: Other than that, the series was pretty darn close most
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: of the time offensively and defensively so. But Dustin May
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: yesterday did a really good job of giving the team
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: a chance to win. And there was an old saying
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: that one of my trip A pitching coaches, I think
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: it was double A pitching coach, Stu Clyburn, he'd say,
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: sometimes you got to throw a shut out to win,
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: And that seemed like what it was going to be
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: in Milwaukee for the Cardinals.
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: When you have a really good one goal okay, And
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: I guess it varies from team to team. But if
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: you have a really good one going between innings, you're
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: sitting in the dugout. It's been my experience no one
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: comes near you if you have something going because they
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: don't want to jinx. It is that the cakes.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: That's normally the case. That's not really how I approached it. Necessarily.
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: I tried to be the same guy whether I had
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: a no hitter or giving up seven runs. Now granted,
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: after I give up seven runs or six runs, I
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: probably had to ask for a few seconds to myself
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: before I talk to people, But no, I was I
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: was always a talker. I was always somebody that wanted
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: to meet with the catcher, wanted to meet with the
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: pitching coach, you know, wanted to have that open line
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: of communication because I didn't want to be tense overthinking
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: what was going on.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: And then there's the aftermath, where do you relive it?
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: Do you think if I would have just thrown this
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: pitch or landed this breaking pitch, I would have had
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: that moment that made a career. I mean, does that
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: even cross your mind?
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: I mean you I think anytime, unless it's unless it's
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: just a really good outing that doesn't flirt with a
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: no no. Say you go seven innings, five hits, one run.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: You know, you get some strikeouts, and you win the
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: game five to one. You're probably not overthinking any part
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: of that game. If you have a bad one, you're
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: thinking about those pitches you could do different. If you
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: have this one where you're flirting with something pretty special,
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: you're like, oh, man, I could have done that, I
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: could have done this. So yeah, I mean, I'm sure
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: you're Dustin's thinking about that. But you know what was cool.
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: I heard a little bit of the broadcast in those
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: middle innings. I want to say it was like fifth
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: and sixth and man, Ricky Horton, he'd said something really interesting.
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: He's like, this is how I knew. I had only
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: turned on the radio, right, This is how I knew
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: that Dustin May was flirting with something special. He goes, Wow,
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: what a play by Mason. Win put a star by
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: that play. So I mean, you know, even even when
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: you give up the hits, you look back and you're like, man,
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: had Mason not been able to make that play, it's
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: not a no hitter. So there's a lot of things
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: in the game that you can look back on and
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: be able to reflect on.
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: I'm just curious. Did the radio guys not say he
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: had a no hitter going, because sometimes broadcasters don't want
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: to jinx it so they don't say it.
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: Nope, they did not. They did not say it. I
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: want to say it was the he closed out the
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: fit and then maybe closed out the sixth with the
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: good play, and that's where he said put a star
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: by that play. And I really opened up my phone
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: and went to the boxer. I was like, yep, I
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: figured that's what was going on.
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: Now I'm gonna I'm gonna out my own company on
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: the television broadcast because I don't think the broadcasters have
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: any impact with what goes on on the field. So
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: I don't care if a broadcaster says a no hit
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: or not. But they put up a graphic no hitter alert,
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: and they put a graphic on the screen. I just
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: wonder if we're gonna do that again. I'm gonna take
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: a break to the MLB. Does it.
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: MLB does it you know quite a bit. You know,
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: fifth sixth inning, they'll give you a no hitter alert.
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: So I don't know. I don't think really, I think
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: Major League Baseball doesn't want anymore no hitters, you know,
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: So they're gonna do everything they can to jinx every
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: no hitter.
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: Everybody wants a no hitter. It's good for ratings. Work
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: gets around that there's a no hitter. Then people tune
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: in that might not have been tuned in because they
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: want to be part of history.
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: Yep, no doubt.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: Okay, all right, I'm gonna take a break here. When
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: we come back, I want to ask you about where
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: the Cardinals are and get more thoughts on the Brewers,
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: and eventually we're gonna get to that whole deal with
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: the with the groinal chop. You're watching Cardinal Territory on
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: the Foul Territory Network.
• 9:20
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• 10:22
  Speaker 1: Kyle Gibson is at his son's basketball camp. And that's
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: the beauty of Cardinal Tarra Tory because it's a slife,
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: a slice of real life. People have things to do
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: and the show goes on, but sometimes it goes on
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: from location. There's a little in.
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: The middle of it. You know, we still talk a
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: little bit of baseball talk Carden. So but I mean,
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: I can't just I can't just put basketball camp on hold,
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: you know, just got to be here. They're doing a
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: little three on three droll right now, moving the ball
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: around the court. You know, he's nine. They're teaching some
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: basics here.
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: It's fun. Okay, Just so you know, I've coached youth basketball.
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: Kids don't listen. They only listen when you say we've
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: got juice boxes and you hand them out, and the
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: parents are gonna get mad at you that their kid
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: doesn't get to shoot enough or whatever. All your job
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: is is heard the cats and hand out juice boxes. Okay.
• 11:10
  Speaker 5: Uh.
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: So you know what what happened with the Cardinals? Uh,
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: your Rebay Avener, your Rebay the night before after uh,
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: after getting a called third strike and after uh we
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: had the situation where where Alec Burrowison uh uh contested
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: a pitch and was wrong and it was a strikeout.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: So it was it was, you know, tapped his helmet,
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: didn't go his way, and your Rebay does the gyration
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: D generation X thing and it was a big to do.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: So everyone thought yesterday we would see some fireworks. Okay,
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: and because look, nobody likes that. It was a little
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: too much. Everyone knew what he did was wrong. Pat
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: Murphy said after the game. It was unacceptable. Blah blah blah.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: Ali said they had talked, but everyone thought a message
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: would be sent at some point. Now, let me set this.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: I've been around a long time. I know how these
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: things work. You baseball players are like elephants. You have
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: long memories. So sometimes the retribution doesn't come when you
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: think it's about to come. You know why, because you
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: need that win and you have a pitcher who's dominant.
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: You're not going to rock the boat in that situation.
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: I think at some point the Brewers will realize that
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: there's retaliation coming. It just didn't happen yesterday, but some
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: fans are mad about it. Kyle Gibson, you're an old
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: school guy. How would you How do you think that
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: should have been handled?
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: I think about like they did. Really, I don't think.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: I don't think that's really the situation to penalize because
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: what you're doing, you're you're kind of taking it out
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: on a hitter in that instance, when clearly Pat Murphy
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: understood that it wasn't how he wants his players act.
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing players from that team from the Brewers also,
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: if they knew anybody on the Cardinals probably reached out
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: I don't think that that was really the situation where
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: you hit somebody. I think the best situation could be
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: Dustin May goes out and throws him no hitter and
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: you shut him out and then you move on, you know.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: But the thing about those situations is he's gonna be
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: on the mound again and he's gonna give it up
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: against the Cardinals, and he's just put a target on
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: his back for the Cardinals to be just over the
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: top celebrating with however they do it now, knowing Ali,
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: like I know Alie, he's not also going to tolerate
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: those type of actions, you know, outwardly on the on
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: the field. You know, maybe it'll be a little bit
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: extra loud when they get a hit, when they score
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: a run, but it's not going to be you know,
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: gestures like that. So I think A'LLI handled it well.
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: I think, you know, he said something about we'll handle
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: our players, they handle theirs. Uh knowing Pat or I
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: don't know Pat Murphy, but hearing about him, it sounds
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: like he probably reached out or somebody reached out and
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: let Olie know like that, Hey, we apologize, this is
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: not how we act and this isn't how we want
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: our players act, and that's another good way to get
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: it handled, right. I've been in a situation where a
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: player on the other team did something and we basically
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: kind of heard from the other players on the other
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: team like, hey, this is not how we act. If
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: you guys hit this player, we understand, uh, and and
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: not that they gave us our their blessing, right, but
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: they're like, we're not going to be mad if you
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: guys take it out on them the next day, because
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: we've tried and he hasn't made the adjustment. So but
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: it sounds like in this situation, the emotion's got the
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: best of your eBay, and you know, I think it's
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: probably been handled internally, and that's really what you're looking for.
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: If the other team doesn't handle it and they just
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: go along with it, they're okay with it, well, then
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: you're like, Okay, what's going on here? But when the
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: other team handles it and the other team shows you
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: outwardly that this is not how we expect our players act,
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: what else are you gonna do? Hit somebody and then
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: fire the team up on the other side even more,
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing there was enough emotions and enough fire going
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: into yesterday's game. The Cardinals played a really good game
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: and it didn't work out. So I'm guessing they already
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: had enough emotions going forward and they wanted to prove
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: a point to him by playing a good game, and
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: they did it just didn't go their way.
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: Be honest with your answer here. If say the Cardinals
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: were up five to nothing, there wasn't a no hitter
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: anything like that in the picture, or maybe the other side,
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: Brewers are up five to nothing, nothing big in play.
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: Are you telling me you don't think that someone in
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: a Milwaukee uniform would have worn something?
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: Honestly, I'm probably saying no, I don't think they do.
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: I think if Pat Murphy doesn't get ahead of it
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: and we don't hear so much from the Brewers on
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: essentially like disavowing what he did and saying like that's
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: not how we act and really apologizing for the most part,
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: then yeah, I think somebody probably does. And I old
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: school Pat Murphy uh probably is okay with it. So
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: I'll go ahead and tell him myself here. I don't know.
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: I probably told the story before, but it's been a while,
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: so at Miszoo, right, Pat Murphy is the head coach
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: at Arizona State, and we are facing off in ASU
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: on their field. Jason Kipness is kind of their start.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: At the time, I was on the mound. I can't
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: remember the kid's name that it was. A freshman, took
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: a huge hack and basically turned to our catcher and said,
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: if he throws that again, I'm you know, please throw
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: it again.
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: I kind of hear from our catcher the kid. I
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: can't remember what ends up happening. I think he gets out.
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: I yell at him as he's going down the first baseline. Well,
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: Jason Kidness is next, and I get three on Jason
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Kipness and I drill him on purpose. And Pat Murphy
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: obviously he kind of knew that that was probably had
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: to do with the kid before, and I somewhat hurt
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: through the grayvine. Whether it's true or not, he was
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: not happy with that freshman forgetting Jason Kipner's hit. So
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: I tell that story because Pat Murphy is going to
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: get ahead of that and he doesn't want his players
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: to get retribution for a mistake of another player. So
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: I think the Cardinals would, right, I don't think I
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: don't think even if it's five nothing, I don't think
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: he hit somebody because I think Pat Murphy got out
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: of it.
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: That's a great story. That's a great story. Now here's
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: the there's the optics of it. Now, if you're Onlie Marmel,
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: you're the Cardinals, you try not to worry about that.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: But the Cardinals have been hit by a lot of pitches.
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: Like last time I looked, they were uh Weather, Holt
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: and Herrera. I think we're one and two in all
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: of baseball hit by pitches. And I think fans at
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: some point wonder. Now, wait a minute. Oli must not
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: be old school, and I don't want to be here
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: defending Oli Marvell. He can defend himself. But I know Ali.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: You know Ali, he is as old school as you
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: can be for a guy his age, and I know
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: he wants to take care of his players. But there's
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: the optics there. So talk me through that. How you
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: would handle the optics getting hit a lot? You just
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: had a guy doing you know, the crops thrust, you know,
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: in your team's face, and are you worried about the
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: optics at this point?
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: So this is my thought on hitting people on purpose? Okay, one,
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: if it's justified, and if it's if it's to send
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: a message and your team is unified in it, understanding
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: that somebody from your team could get hit, then yeah,
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: you do it. I don't think Olie is worried about
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: or afraid to do that at all. You know, he
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: is old school enough to go and understand when and
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: how to do it. The other thing is is like,
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: if you're willing to do it, then you can't be
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: worried about the optics. When you get asked about it,
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: you just have to say, yeah, I hit him, this
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: is why I did it, And you've got to be
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: willing to take your suspension and move on. Everybody knows
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: when you hit someone on purpose. Everybody knows what happens.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: The manager is going to get suspended and the player
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: is gonna get suspended. And I don't know that there's
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: much worse than that. There is a lot worse. Let me,
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: that was exaggeratory. I always find it interesting when it's
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: clear you did it on purpose, and you're not willing
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: to say you did it on purpose, worrying about optics.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: You're gonna get suspended anyways, might as well just come
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: out and say yeah, we hit William Contreras because their
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: picture showed us up and acted like an idiot, and
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: we decided to go ahead and take matters into our
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: hands because nobody on their side wanted two. So we're
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: not gonna stand for that. That's not how you that's
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: not how you play the game, and we're gonna let
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: him know that we didn't like it. Yeah, I mean,
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: I just I think there's definitely optics to it. But
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: if you're willing to go so far to hit somebody
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: on purpose, then you think you're right on the optics
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: and you shouldn't worry about it.
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: So Tony LaRussa Hall of Famer, brilliant manager, used to
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: have guys plunked all the time and would never admit it. Now,
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: Tony was very very specific anything up here he said,
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: you know he was he would fly off the handle
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: if that happened. He wanted you to send a message
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: low And I know the pictures, I know the players.
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: They would say, yeah, Tony told me to do it.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: Tony Larusa would never admit that there was a retaliatory
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: element when a guy was hit by a pitch. Would
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: never admit it.
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: And I hear I hear you. I mean, I can't
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: sit here and criticize Tony LaRussa for how he managed.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: Obviously he was all manager. So I just I don't know.
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: I I think in most situations, everybody knows what's when
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: it's on purpose, and I think it's trying to just
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: sidestep a little bit of the penalty that goes with it.
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: And I don't know what you're talking about. Well, both
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: sides know what you're talking about. I mean, there's gonna
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: be Honestly, I think it's more like not handling it
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: like Pat Murphy did, right, like if he goes, I says,
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: I don't know what you're talking about. I thought the
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: U rebate thing was fine. I mean, I'm not not
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: too worried about it. No, I don't think he was
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: gonna say that, you know, I think, uh, I don't know.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: It's just then interesting part to me is like if
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: everybody knows you did it on purpose, then you might
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: as well just say did it on purpose? Get suspended anyways,
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: You're gonna get suspended six games, you're gonna appeal, it's
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: gonna go down to four, and you're gonna be back
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: out there in four games. I don't know that's there's
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: just no other way to say it.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: I want to say one other thing about Ali Marmel,
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: because I believe this to be true. He considers a
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: lot of different things before he has his team do
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: a certain thing or act a certain way. But I
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: guarantee that if there were times where tempers flare, since
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: I always been to manager and the other manager wanted
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: to settle it with a fist fight right by home plate,
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: Ali would be it. Okay, Olly is as old school
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: as he gets and he's got a fiery temper. So please,
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: when I see people on social media saying that he's
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: a whimp or you know, he's new school not old school,
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: I don't think that's the case. We're going to take
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: a break here, a final break of the show. When
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: we come back, we'll talk about where the Cardinals are.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: They've hit some choppy water. This is a Cardinal Territory
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: on the Foul Territory Network.
• 22:32
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• 23:31
  Speaker 1: All right, So Kyle Gibson is Edison's basketball camp, and
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: we've been talking quite a bit about the Cardinals situation
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: with not responding to Abner Uriba. But let's talk about
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: where they are on the field right now. So the
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: Cardinals have lost four straight. They just got swept by
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: the Brewers in Milwaukee. I think they've dropped six of seven.
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: So this is really the first choppy water that the
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: Cardinals have hit since I think back in April when
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: they got swept by Seattle and that team back then
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: responded by going to Pittsburgh and sweeping a four game
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: set from the Bucks. In Pittsburgh. The Cardinals are still
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: four games over five hundred, I would say, still probably
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: surpassing expectations where they'd be at this point in the season.
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: So my question to you, Kyle Gibson is the Cardinals
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: get set to open a series with the Cubs, who
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: had recently lost ten in a row. What do you
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: think we're going to see from the Cardinals at this juncture.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think obviously they're gonna come out
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: and they're going to do their best to respond like
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: they did in Pittsburgh. Nobody wants to get swept, especially
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: a divisional plumber on the road. You know, you felt
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: like that last game, you really won most of the
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: game until you got to the eighth inning and unfortunately
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: didn't go your way. But you know, obviously that hit
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: a little bit rougher patch where they just haven't gotten
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: the wins. I still think they're playing a baseball just
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: hasn't gone their way. So you know, facing the Cubs here,
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: who have really been struggling at home, Bush Stadium is
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: going to be packed. So I think you'll see the
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: Cardinals come out and hopefully have a fire a few
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: games here. Not saying they're gonna come out and sweep them, obviously,
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: but I mean I think you you got to just
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: take this one game, one series at a time. So
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: if they can come out win tonight's game, excuse me,
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: win tomorrow's game, and when the first game of the series,
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: you know, you set yourself up to to take a
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: three game series against a Cubs team that everybody thought
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: was going to be the best team in the division. Obviously,
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: they hit a really rough patch and they're trying to
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: scramble through it. So Cardinals are kind of at a
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: not quite the opposite end, because like you said, they've
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: lost six to seven, but Cardinals are kind of on
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: the opposite side. They're over exceeding expectations and you know,
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: they're a team that's hungry and and you know, looking
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: to kind of write the ship here. So you know,
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: I think, you know, I hear you say rough patch,
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: and I get it. You know, they've lost a couple
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: of series in a row. But the reality here is
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: they're not gonna win every series and they're gonna get
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: swept again at some point. So it's really about how
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: you respond here going to the Cup series and see
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: if they can keep playing good baseball. So if you
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: keep playing good baseball, keep throwing the ball well, keep
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: playing good defense, you're gonna win a lot of games.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: When I look at the Cardinals, I thought, if this
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: team falters, it's gonna be because the starting rotation falls apart.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: We haven't seen that. What we've seen is the offense
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: kind of the bats getting a little quiet, And to me,
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: that's the thing that happens. Right. So if I had
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: to rate my sense of concern over and it is
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: a rough patch, this little rough patch, it wouldn't be
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: high because it's not like the starting rotation fell apart,
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: because there's no fix for that. I think the bats
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: come around because there's ebbs and flows to pachball.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: You ran into a team that pitches the ball really well.
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: I mean, we've talked about this just the last episode,
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: about how well the NLCA control throws the ball and
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: how well they play defense. You know, you're gonna have
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: a lot of games. In essential, I think they're going
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: to be under six runs total scored, and you're gonna
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: have some defensive pitching battles. And not that these teams
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: can't score, because I think all these teams can score.
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: They've got good offenses as well. I just think when
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: a team gets going pitching wise, they're tough to beat.
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: And I think that's that's where the Brewers were this weekend.
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: Last thing, it's the Cubs, whether I think it's supposed
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: to be nice. I think the fans are starting to
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: slowly get back on board with the Cardinals and that's
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: a great thing to see. Cap tip to the the
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: tarps Off guys for helping them that. But what do
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: you think the atmosphere is going to be? Because it's
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: always fact when the Cubs are in down, they bring
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: some fans. Cardinal fans love the rivalry, and the Cardinals
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: overall are playing better baseball than most people expected. What
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: are you expecting in terms of the atmosphere here.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: I expect it to be warm and lots of tarps
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: off and uh fans getting routy.
• 28:06
  Speaker 5: You know.
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: I think there's a there's a certain atmosphere that rowdy
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: fans bring to a baseball game. And I think Cardinals
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: fans kind of enjoy the endearing atmosphere and the respectful
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: atmosphere to the game. But I don't think Tarp's off
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: is disrespectful. I just think there's it's fun when it
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: gets rowdy. Players enjoy it and and I think the
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: fans enjoy it as well. So it's gonna be a
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: pretty good atmosphere. I think, you know, as it gets
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: hotter and as more tarps come off, I think you're
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: gonna find a rowdy atmosphere is gonna be pretty fun
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: in a bush.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: I think the Cardinals did the right thing by embracing
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: it and then putting them in a specific section where
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: they can be as rabvy as they want to impact
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: the game. Kyle, enjoy your son's basketball camp. Thanks for
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: toughen it out. And that is gonna do what drove
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: to the hoop.
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: He just drove to the hoop and the three on
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: three got a little layup, so he was pumped about it.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: So right handed, right handed layup, yep, right handed yep,
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: go to the strong hand. That's gonna do it for
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: this edition of Cardinal Territory, we'll see you next time.
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: Hopefully that episode won't suck.