Latest / When Killers Get Caught with Brittany Ransom / The Myth of Ted Bundy Part I & The Dover Demon

Transcript

The Myth of Ted Bundy Part I & The Dover Demon · When Killers Get Caught with Brittany Ransom

• 0:30
  Hey everybody. It's your killer country.
• 0:32
  My name is Freddy, Ransom, my name is Brian jr.
• 0:35
  And this isn't Killers, get caught a podcast of, of the
• 0:37
  deep, dives into the lives of killers.
• 0:40
  And if you're new here, when Killers get caught as a
• 0:43
  three-part podcast, where we discuss true crime stories that
• 0:45
  resonated with us, I'll lead you down the path of a well-known or
• 0:48
  lesser known killer discuss their childhood lives
• 0:51
  methodology and, of course, how they got caught and then Brian
• 0:54
  finishes us our episode off with a paranormal palate, cleanser
• 0:59
  Before we start, I just want to remind everybody listening that
• 1:02
  the thick dudes merch. Drop ends on January 31st 2022.
• 1:07
  And this will be the only time that you could get yourself a
• 1:10
  hoodie, or a t-shirt like this one, with our big booty Mothman
• 1:15
  on it. And please, once you get your
• 1:17
  marriage, please tag us Tick Tock, Instagram Twitter, I want
• 1:21
  to see your picks. One of my friends who bought a
• 1:24
  mug posted on her IG and it was really cute.
• 1:27
  So it's so nice to see you guys. Bring it.
• 1:29
  And this is just a reminder that just like in 1967.
• 1:33
  Once the Mothman is gone, he's going to be gone for good and so
• 1:37
  you can get that at when Killers get caught.
• 1:40
  Shot, good. Listen, I found myself thinking
• 1:46
  of that was a very clever. It is weird.
• 1:51
  I'm wearing my mom's measure today, but was so, am I?
• 1:55
  I have mine in Gray. So do I imagine like show on the
• 2:00
  camera, but I have my iPad in front of it.
• 2:03
  There we go. I like my little muffin, it's
• 2:06
  fun because people are like, a moth man shirt, I didn't realize
• 2:10
  that the Mothman has as many groupies.
• 2:13
  Oh yes. As he does.
• 2:15
  Yeah, you know what's funny actually?
• 2:17
  Before we start? I'm sorry.
• 2:18
  It's going off a little thing. So as I practice Monday night,
• 2:21
  right? And my coat I'm wearing my mom's
• 2:24
  measure for practice today so it was my maroon one, I think.
• 2:30
  And I coach you know her daughter drew the Mothman
• 2:33
  picture for us and she's like I see you where it is, what she
• 2:39
  Drew, I'm like, hell, yeah, this is awesome.
• 2:41
  And she's like, oh miles away. She might message you later
• 2:44
  about some things and I'm like, oh, that's awesome.
• 2:48
  So I might have some things to talk about in the future like
• 2:53
  some creepy stuff. Some creepy stuff, not, you
• 2:56
  know, your dirt be friends. Are always giving you messages
• 3:00
  about creepy stuff. I know I love.
• 3:02
  Yo, did you hear about this place about?
• 3:06
  About 40 minutes away up with Pennsylvania but regardless this
• 3:11
  week in True Crime. So this is a story that didn't
• 3:17
  just happen but what they just found is pretty wild.
• 3:21
  This all goes with this pastor in Akron Ohio, And so at the end
• 3:29
  of last year, he was arrested and his church was shut down for
• 3:36
  because he was an unlicensed funeral director.
• 3:41
  Oh, and the church has been shut down for about four months.
• 3:45
  And so, here's where things get crazy.
• 3:48
  Apparently. A couple of weeks ago, a woman
• 3:53
  who is only referring to herself as a Urban Explorer like within
• 3:58
  the church because it's pretty much abandoned now.
• 4:03
  She was in the basement and she discovered boxes of cremated
• 4:10
  remains. In the church.
• 4:16
  Dating back to 2010. This happened at the greater
• 4:22
  Faith Missionary Baptist Church and Akron Ohio, and the Ohio
• 4:28
  Bureau of Investigations actually have opened an
• 4:30
  investigation into this as of January 11th.
• 4:33
  And so, now on top of the fact that he was not a license
• 4:39
  license. Funeral home director.
• 4:43
  He also now has to do with the fact that there were 89 Sets of
• 4:49
  cremated remains that go back to 2010 that he never he didn't get
• 4:55
  to the family, didn't know. And here's the thing, you're
• 4:59
  actually not allowed to deny people, their cremated remains
• 5:03
  just because they can't pay, right?
• 5:06
  So when someone does that, it's actually illegal, like people
• 5:10
  can make payment plans and things of that nature.
• 5:12
  But in all situations, like, like, last year, when I talked
• 5:16
  about, a lot of the like Funeral Home fail, And take talk a bunch
• 5:19
  of people who work in the industry like messaged me and
• 5:22
  they were just like, yeah, that's really illegal.
• 5:25
  You give people their families remains, you don't hold them
• 5:29
  over their head, like you don't extort them.
• 5:32
  So now like and here's the thing is, we don't know if he was
• 5:36
  following the rules. Normally, when you get cremated
• 5:40
  to make sure that that you can always be found, they put a
• 5:44
  little tag with your body before it grows in the Yep.
• 5:48
  Machine. Yep and that will tag goes with
• 5:52
  you from the time you enter the facility to the time you leave
• 5:55
  and that way if for some reason they get misplaced, And 20 years
• 6:02
  from now, somebody finds these learn in their attic they can
• 6:06
  take it to the local funeral home.
• 6:08
  Check the number on it and get it to the right family.
• 6:12
  But if since he wasn't doing this correctly, I don't know if
• 6:15
  those tags are there. Okay, so no, see, we went down
• 6:24
  two different lines of thought when you use, when you said
• 6:29
  about, he had remained in his basement because no, no, because
• 6:34
  he had cremated remains his basement right, and you went
• 6:37
  down the path of like, oh no, he's just family members that he
• 6:40
  didn't return to Ashes to I'm like, what are these are kill
• 6:43
  people? Yes, what are.
• 6:44
  These are like victims of his that are just sitting in his
• 6:47
  pocket in the bay. The church so far.
• 6:50
  His only crime is just taking advantage of people who are
• 6:55
  grieving but we'll see how that continues to go on since they're
• 7:01
  bringing in the big dogs here. Apparently the churches in
• 7:06
  Columbus but he's from Akron. Okay, he was also charged with
• 7:13
  racketeering tampering with records identity fraud, abuse of
• 7:18
  a corpse. in multiple counties because I guess the families are
• 7:25
  for multiple areas, Lucas County, Koya, hoga Summit,
• 7:32
  Franklin, And cuz apparently he was operating multiple funeral
• 7:37
  homes across the state. Oh wow.
• 7:40
  So here it is. They've been finding this stuff
• 7:44
  since 2019 as crazy. He also did get in trouble at
• 7:49
  one of the homes for failing to refrigerator human body.
• 7:53
  That is a law they have in Akron.
• 7:55
  Probably a lot, Ohio, probably not a bad idea, considering what
• 7:58
  we learned about in the last year.
• 8:02
  Multiple counts for all of these things.
• 8:05
  And I guess this all started because this another funeral
• 8:10
  director. Talk to him and was like hey we
• 8:17
  don't have space at our facility.
• 8:19
  Can we hold a person at yours? Hmm.
• 8:28
  Well, that man. Like that body.
• 8:32
  That was supposed to be held there.
• 8:34
  He was supposed to have been buried next to someone.
• 8:37
  One of his relatives in 2004 and they found his remain, his
• 8:43
  cremated remains two weeks ago. So he was accepting burial money
• 8:53
  for bodies and then cremating them probably because it's
• 8:57
  cheaper. And pocketing the difference.
• 9:02
  But, wait, so that's what started it.
• 9:07
  But, wait did, what did he buries in?
• 9:09
  What was buried, who knows they're going to have to exhume
• 9:15
  the, I mean, they're probably not a body in there.
• 9:18
  Yeah. Sorry.
• 9:19
  Feel somebody else. Yeah.
• 9:20
  Exactly. Somebody else's body.
• 9:22
  Yeah. So they're going to have to like
• 9:24
  this is going to be a total nightmare.
• 9:27
  I feel bad if You're from any of these counties in Ohio, and you
• 9:31
  work through this man who knows and also like they're probably
• 9:35
  going to have to test the cremated remains now, to make
• 9:38
  sure that they're more, not more than one person or that they are
• 9:42
  actually a person because he could have been filling bags
• 9:47
  with dust that's happened before.
• 9:50
  Like, we don't know. I hope this dude goes to jail
• 9:52
  for a while. This is just absolutely
• 9:54
  ridiculous. Yeah, that's my God.
• 9:57
  Not here, too. Shantay Harden.
• 10:04
  You suck, you're pretty bad. Personally that's mine total
• 10:11
  like craziness going on over in Ohio.
• 10:13
  But what about you? Well there's some craziness
• 10:17
  going on in Pennsylvania as well.
• 10:19
  Of course that's funny because you said what's going on in
• 10:25
  Pennsylvania. Well, I was like let me tell
• 10:27
  you. Oh goodness.
• 10:29
  Okay, so I don't know if you heard but Sunday morning there
• 10:33
  was There's a floating car found in the Susquehanna River.
• 10:38
  Have you heard of this? No.
• 10:40
  Okay. Nobody told me.
• 10:43
  Okay, where was it? Like closer to, where I used to
• 10:45
  live or goodness? I'm going to say little a little
• 10:51
  further up or wow. Yeah.
• 10:56
  But okay, so apparently this car.
• 10:59
  No one was how I got into the river, but people were cold on
• 11:07
  Sunday morning to investigate this courtesan River because
• 11:10
  there was a man, a woman and a two-year-old child ever on top
• 11:15
  of this car. Oh my God.
• 11:17
  Oh my God. Yeah, so at least it was
• 11:21
  floating Yeah, um, so just gets worse after that.
• 11:26
  So not only so. So, okay.
• 11:29
  So the man woman child. The man is holding a knife and
• 11:37
  he's threatening this woman. Okay.
• 11:40
  Well she's a child. Yeah it got got real bad real
• 11:43
  fast so yeah, he's threatening her.
• 11:46
  Well, he's on top like when you're on top of the car, I
• 11:50
  think he does is after what he says for.
• 11:53
  So I guess police were there and, you know, they're trying to
• 11:56
  figure out how we're going to see these people, and this guy
• 11:58
  he's just yelling at the police. He's like, shoot me, shoot me,
• 12:01
  and And then he turns the knife on the woman and he starts
• 12:04
  threatening her. And police are just like, okay,
• 12:06
  well we came let him hurt her so they shot him.
• 12:13
  What he wanted. You got what you want it.
• 12:19
  She got shot and then he fell into the river and know, like I
• 12:26
  said, it's happened Sunday. Okay.
• 12:28
  Current Sort of Susquehanna River.
• 12:32
  I don't know if anybody has looked at it recently, but it's
• 12:35
  really icy. There are like, a lot of moving,
• 12:39
  he's moving fast. There's a current only for
• 12:41
  their. It's like, it's very, very
• 12:43
  active. So, he fell into the river and
• 12:51
  The wife. Okay.
• 12:52
  So it turns out that this is his wife that's on top of the car
• 12:56
  and it's child and they are rescued.
• 13:02
  Hmm, and it read a quote, I forget where it's at but I was
• 13:13
  reading all this on pin light but one of the, you know, the
• 13:17
  search people, they were searching, they were going to
• 13:20
  first send out a boat to rescue these people.
• 13:22
  They're on top of card in the boat that they were going to use
• 13:26
  was wait. This is like the same day as the
• 13:31
  snowstorm. Yeah, the snow sorted later that
• 13:39
  day. But yes, yeah, but I mean, that
• 13:41
  means they would have had to stop search, right?
• 13:44
  Yeah, yeah, yeah cuz I mean I don't I know that area got it
• 13:48
  worse than we did. Where I am in Pennsylvania but
• 13:51
  yes, pretty bad. It wasn't bad here but like I'm
• 13:54
  hearing from my other friends in the state that it was not good
• 13:57
  where they were yeah it's not so the boat they tried to use I
• 14:03
  guess. The waters were just too rough
• 14:06
  for that one from these about. So they used I guess the cherry
• 14:09
  picker to get them like you know they do when they're saving
• 14:12
  people from like burning buildings, helicopter thing and
• 14:16
  you sit in the little nest and they pull you up Now I know that
• 14:21
  use a helicopter but they didn't use that to you it was like some
• 14:25
  like acceptable ladder to use on you know the fire trucks and
• 14:27
  stuff like that. I could never stuff like that
• 14:31
  the extendable ladder. Um like is this like a cherry
• 14:35
  picker type of thing? I forget what they call only
• 14:38
  have a good record but so the wife and child were rescued but
• 14:44
  they were going to search for like the husband but the waters
• 14:49
  to ice. I see, they're too fast, it's to
• 14:53
  code. So they like it would be
• 14:59
  preserved when they do get to him, keep equally cold his crap
• 15:04
  outside right now. So, yeah, I'll be here.
• 15:08
  Okay, I'm not taking anything away from the people of the
• 15:10
  Midwest. I'm sure it's like three degrees
• 15:13
  where y'all are right now. But it's cold for us so that
• 15:17
  windchill that when she was crazy, right?
• 15:20
  Now, so the windchill is ridiculous.
• 15:24
  Okay, so I found a quote that was looking for and it goes if
• 15:29
  you end up in the river, you're probably not going to survive
• 15:33
  the position of the car with in the river.
• 15:36
  And that the fact that it got stuck on some rocks, is what
• 15:40
  saves a mom and a child. So, I probably would have sank.
• 15:44
  Yeah, it probably wouldn't. Something else would have
• 15:46
  happened there? They, they're lucky.
• 15:48
  They got saved. but, They lie. We don't know how the car got
• 15:55
  into. Like we can speculate how the
• 15:56
  car got into a river like he was probably trying to kill all
• 16:00
  three of them have failed. Yep.
• 16:02
  That's probably, that's, that's the thought that I was doing
• 16:05
  this to. Oh yeah.
• 16:06
  This was going to be a murder-suicide.
• 16:07
  Yeah. Absolutely.
• 16:10
  And so at least it didn't happen.
• 16:13
  No it's just a suicide by cop, I guess.
• 16:17
  Yeah. And then it became suicide by
• 16:19
  cop. Yep.
• 16:20
  Yeah but yeah. Yeah, like this happened like
• 16:25
  this was reported. I think it came out in one day.
• 16:28
  So nothing new like I was looking at was looking looking
• 16:33
  like is there any new do we have any other backgrounds?
• 16:36
  Nothing yet. So maybe we'll find some other
• 16:38
  information about you know what happened between?
• 16:42
  Yeah. Yeah, that's right.
• 16:45
  I got well what I have for you.
• 17:01
  This week is the beginning of what's going to end up being a
• 17:05
  two-part episode. And I've been putting this off
• 17:09
  for a long time. Mainly because I have a lot of
• 17:12
  angry feelings about this particular killer and you're
• 17:16
  going to get to hear them as so funny people.
• 17:18
  And Tick-Tock were like, I can't wait to hear your perspective.
• 17:22
  Y'all ready to hear my perspective?
• 17:24
  So what am I Tick? Tock followers and I'm sure you
• 17:28
  can guess who it is. Hey, I'm hams.
• 17:32
  It is who is he's been with us since the beginning?
• 17:35
  So like that's why would hams is like just do something.
• 17:39
  He's like you talk about this person.
• 17:41
  A lot of times I'll do it because you know what?
• 17:44
  He's been here since the beginning and you know, yeah,
• 17:47
  that's pretty dope but he has been asking me to talk about
• 17:51
  this particular killer for a while.
• 17:53
  Pretty much ever since I made a video on Tick-Tock where I said,
• 17:58
  it's your boy Ted Bundy because everybody seems to love him so
• 18:06
  much. It's your boy.
• 18:09
  So I've often expressed a lot of frustration with With with him
• 18:13
  because I feel like he's been romanticized in modern media.
• 18:16
  And a lot of his story is now like Mythos and because of the
• 18:20
  way, the media has portrayed him, he's some kind of like,
• 18:22
  Boogeyman or Phantom but in reality Theodore Robert Bundy
• 18:27
  was a man. One of my favorite quotes from
• 18:30
  Ann Rule, who we're going to talk about her a lot because she
• 18:32
  was his friend, she wasn't actually like the big book.
• 18:38
  True Crime book writer when this was going on.
• 18:41
  She worked at a crisis Suicide, Hotline alongside of him and
• 18:45
  they were friends and that's why, but one of the quotes she
• 18:49
  said is Ted was never handsome brilliant or charismatic as
• 18:54
  crime, folklore deemed him. But as I said before, infamy
• 18:58
  became him. He was a man, nothing more,
• 19:03
  nothing less, and I will admit ahead of time.
• 19:07
  There's some bias. He's here.
• 19:08
  I'm a proud member of the Ted Bundy hate Club.
• 19:12
  But I have promised a lot of you that I gave you a fair in-depth
• 19:18
  analysis of him. And so today, we're going to
• 19:23
  talk about one of America's most infamous killers and we will
• 19:26
  start as we always do. So he was born Theodore Robert
• 19:34
  Cowell on November 24th, 1946 at the Elizabeth Lund home for
• 19:40
  unwed mothers in Burlington Vermont.
• 19:44
  And like I said, who was his Friday?
• 19:46
  And Rule says that he didn't know his mother's real identity
• 19:50
  until he was about 24 years old. He more than likely suspected
• 19:54
  that the woman who was raising him was his grandmother and his
• 19:58
  but his actual mother. Other was Louise cow.
• 20:01
  She was raised. He, they were raised as brother
• 20:04
  and sister and that his grandparents Samuel and Eleanor
• 20:09
  Cal were his parents. They all lived in Philadelphia,
• 20:12
  Pennsylvania along with two aunts who he believed to be his
• 20:17
  sister's, Audrey and Julia. Interestingly enough, I found
• 20:22
  some interviews with Louise and she talked about regretting,
• 20:27
  this decision. It was with an interview with a
• 20:29
  doctor, Dorothy, Louis, but it was the 40s and being an unwed.
• 20:33
  Mother was still a very big deal.
• 20:38
  And not only did she have a baby out of wedlock Willy's, but she
• 20:41
  refused to say, who the father was, and it's possible that she
• 20:44
  never knew. She was 22 years old and up
• 20:48
  until that point like she was the Golden Girl like of the
• 20:52
  siblings. Everyone.
• 20:54
  You know, loved her and all of a sudden she has a baby out of
• 20:56
  wedlock and well, not so cold anymore, right?
• 20:59
  Yeah. This was such a closely held
• 21:04
  Family, secret that other like, Aunts Uncles cousins didn't
• 21:11
  know, or it was only like whispered about like it was a
• 21:14
  suspicion but like they no one ever confirmed it, which is
• 21:18
  really wild like family secrets, tend to get told.
• 21:24
  True. So Ted's young boy and he
• 21:33
  doesn't have the best upbringing.
• 21:36
  I know I'm really under like knows what's going on in the Cal
• 21:38
  household. In fact, bunny didn't talk about
• 21:41
  it until he was in prison. He began to paint this story of
• 21:46
  how dysfunctional this family was and it all centers around
• 21:50
  Samuel. Cow his grandfather, who was a
• 21:54
  bully a bigot openly racist Sis and very violent.
• 22:01
  And of course, when serial killers talk about things, when
• 22:07
  they're on death row, there's though suspicion or the worry
• 22:11
  that they're just lying, right? Yeah.
• 22:14
  But some of other Ted's, family members did confirm this and
• 22:17
  like when I say this guy was racist.
• 22:19
  I mean, he hated anybody that wasn't white, it was really
• 22:23
  common for him to launch into these like Thai reads about
• 22:32
  Italian people. Anybody that wasn't Catholic
• 22:38
  black people, obviously, of course, and they it would just
• 22:43
  happen. He would just get mad and go off
• 22:45
  on a tangent. It was he would also get violent
• 22:49
  if you like didn't sit there and agree with him, And he also got
• 22:54
  angry and very violent. If anyone asked any questions
• 23:01
  about, who Ted's father was. In fact, it was so weird to Ted
• 23:06
  and like the the sisters that they believed for a long time
• 23:12
  that Samuel cow might have raped his oldest daughter.
• 23:20
  That because he was like, so defensive about it.
• 23:24
  I was think I was thinking something else truck.
• 23:27
  He's, that's another way to look at it.
• 23:29
  What were you thinking? I was thinking, like, maybe, I
• 23:31
  don't know, some Italian person, like gotta go mom pregnant or
• 23:35
  something. I mean, he might just been
• 23:37
  racist. It's true.
• 23:39
  I mean, for a Time Italian people for like, the lowest of
• 23:46
  the white people in America. So, Is that weird?
• 23:50
  There was like a white people hierarchy?
• 23:52
  Yeah. Well yeah.
• 23:53
  Because you think you had like Irish that were like hate it.
• 23:56
  They were also like on that ranking.
• 24:00
  I'm just like yo look this like y'all bow from Europe.
• 24:05
  What's that on here? Are we talking about?
• 24:08
  Why you hate each other now? But yeah, so then we have that.
• 24:13
  So there's the the potential that perhaps Ted Bundy incest
• 24:18
  will never know. We also have another issue going
• 24:23
  on simultaneously Eleanor Cowell.
• 24:25
  His grandmother absolutely miserable.
• 24:30
  Eleanor gets hospitalized. And they put her through
• 24:34
  electroconvulsive therapy because they're like this will
• 24:37
  fix your depression. Instead what it does is making
• 24:40
  her almost agoraphobic refuses to leave the house which is
• 24:44
  generally like terrified to leave the house.
• 24:49
  Samuel also has some mental health issues, but he's not
• 24:51
  going to admit it instead, he would just be walking around the
• 24:55
  house talking to nobody, in particular.
• 25:02
  He also abused animals that crossed his path.
• 25:04
  He would kick like a dog. If it got in his way, like if I
• 25:09
  can neighbors like cat was somewhere, he would just like
• 25:12
  pick it up by its tail and throw it.
• 25:16
  And the son's grandfather, right?
• 25:17
  That's the grandfather. Yeah.
• 25:19
  Okay. And then we're talking about,
• 25:21
  Ted is like a toddler at this point apparently, like a Ted's.
• 25:28
  Aunt. Julia said he would get angry
• 25:30
  and jump up and down like, in a rage and like none of them
• 25:35
  looked forward to their dad coming home from work.
• 25:39
  He never abused the kids. It was more like physically, it
• 25:43
  was more emotional and verbal like I said that contributed to
• 25:47
  Eleanor's mental health she like could never speak.
• 25:51
  Do you wish is always and he did physically hit her.
• 25:55
  Does it after too many shock treatments Eleanor which is was
• 25:58
  like, I'm done with life. I'm just gonna stay here in my
• 26:02
  room and do nothing else. So this is all happening.
• 26:07
  While Ted still a toddler. And this is also when he begins
• 26:12
  to exhibit some bizarre and strange Behavior.
• 26:17
  More than once his aunts would wake up and they'd find little
• 26:24
  baby Ted. Carrying knives in the middle of
• 26:28
  the night. Placing said knives next to them
• 26:32
  on their beds. And the, the sisters were
• 26:38
  worried, but the like the way that one of the one that was
• 26:45
  just like no one acted like, this was weird, but it's very
• 26:49
  weird that this child is like prospecting stabbing us, like
• 26:54
  get like a child playing lives. Next to my bed.
• 27:01
  No, thank you. Like I get creeped out with my
• 27:03
  kids, just walk around at night. It's exactly, he's going down to
• 27:08
  the kitchen, pulling out the knives and then taking them
• 27:11
  upstairs and thinking about things and what it's wild that
• 27:17
  it's like a baby would be doing this, okay?
• 27:25
  When Ted was only about three years.
• 27:27
  Old, he discovered Pornography, he and his cousin's went into
• 27:36
  Samuel cows Greenhouse where he had his little garden and they
• 27:41
  found loads of magazines. And so that was the first time
• 27:45
  that Ted saw porn and he would continue to seek it out all
• 27:48
  through his childhood. That's that's that had made a
• 27:54
  big impression on him that Wow. Oh yeah.
• 27:58
  Did I mention that Samuel Cal was also a deacon at the local
• 28:01
  church? Know you do.
• 28:05
  What the hell? Why are they always at the
• 28:09
  church? Either way, this is getting
• 28:13
  traumatic for everybody involved.
• 28:14
  So Louise actually take Ted and she moves Tacoma Washington.
• 28:20
  He's about four years old. It's 1950 at this point, he only
• 28:24
  knows the instability of a his very unwell father and equally
• 28:29
  unwell mom, they move in with their cousins, Alice Alan and
• 28:33
  Jane Scott. And at this point, both Louise
• 28:37
  and Ted went by the name Nelson, so that Louise could pretend And
• 28:41
  that she was a young Widow and no one would question.
• 28:43
  Why she had this four-year-old boy?
• 28:47
  1951, Louise meets Johnny, Culpepper Bundy.
• 28:52
  At a church single's night and the to fall in love, they get
• 28:57
  married in 1952 when Ted is 6 years old, Ted took his
• 29:01
  stepfathers name and that is how we know him to this day Bundy
• 29:07
  Louisa going to have four more children with Johnny but from
• 29:12
  the beginning Ted never felt like he was a member of the
• 29:14
  family because he didn't really know.
• 29:16
  He was Louise's son so like he was just these kids.
• 29:22
  Cousin, right? Not his brothers and sisters.
• 29:26
  So he felt like he was just kind of hanging on.
• 29:29
  They live in a very small house, they had very little money.
• 29:34
  The relationship between Johnny and Ted was never very great
• 29:40
  that was shy and socially awkward.
• 29:43
  And he thought the key to people liking him was him having better
• 29:47
  clothes. And as a child he had these like
• 29:52
  fantasies. They were pretty significant
• 29:55
  because he would talk about it with people that he was going to
• 29:58
  be adopted by Roy Rogers and Dale Evans and he was going to
• 30:01
  get to live in a mansion and it was he really deserved better
• 30:06
  things. But Johnny was a working-class
• 30:10
  guy five foot four, and he worked in a hospital as a cook.
• 30:17
  And interestingly enough when Dad was like six, he
• 30:19
  legitimately told like we're talking about his like
• 30:21
  kindergarten friends that he purposefully staged a public
• 30:26
  tantrum and peed himself in an attempt to embarrass his new
• 30:31
  father. Oh my God.
• 30:35
  Now, Louise Bundy has insisted even after bunnies execution,
• 30:41
  that his lack of a father, and his early years didn't affect
• 30:44
  him. She said he never asked about
• 30:46
  his dad because there were no other young kids in the
• 30:48
  neighborhood and she never mentioned him and he she said he
• 30:52
  never asked both dr. Judith Lewis.
• 30:55
  And I agree that a lot of the things Louise has said in
• 30:58
  interviews, sounds like she's hiding a lot of stuff and even
• 31:03
  yeah, even in the 80s when she was an older.
• 31:05
  And at this point she was still kind of Saving Face for her
• 31:09
  family. I don't see why I like you're
• 31:14
  already that would like just spill the beans we need.
• 31:18
  Yeah, I still wonder. Yeah, but uh, since Louise was
• 31:22
  so secretive about his father, Ted begin to make up his own
• 31:28
  story and it wasn't good, because that's kind of what kids
• 31:32
  do. He filled in the blanks since
• 31:35
  his mother wouldn't he assumed? He was unwanted, he had been
• 31:39
  abandoned, he told a Utah, State Prison psychologist after he was
• 31:44
  caught later on. That when he was 13 years old,
• 31:47
  he found his birth certificate and it said, father, unknown.
• 31:52
  Ted told the doctor that it didn't matter to him, but I
• 31:57
  think from some of the other interviews that I've read that
• 31:59
  this created a kind of a separation between Ted and his
• 32:02
  mom. Like, so, this always happens a
• 32:06
  lot when they pull a serial killer in, they make them do
• 32:11
  little tester. Member I told you that Anthony
• 32:13
  Sal had to answer questions when he was in prison.
• 32:16
  Yes, yes. Anthony Sal would say things
• 32:21
  like, I love my mom and he was deeply abused by his mother.
• 32:28
  Ted never said I love my mom. He would say things like she
• 32:32
  paid the bills. I had a roof over my head.
• 32:35
  She never yelled at me as a child.
• 32:39
  That's a disconnect. Even if it's not like a
• 32:42
  aggressive or violent disconnect, but it's just a very
• 32:46
  it's a line there between him believing what that she loved
• 32:50
  him or not. You're right?
• 32:52
  Yeah. He also told one of his
• 32:55
  girlfriends later in life that when he was about 10 or 12
• 32:59
  cousin told him, he was a bastard and that was when he
• 33:03
  became distinctly angry with Louise for making him a
• 33:08
  vulnerable to humiliation. Didn't care about the actual
• 33:12
  state of his father of his father.
• 33:15
  Just that people knowing that. Or thinking that made him meant,
• 33:23
  they could humiliate him. So he said whether it was 13 or
• 33:27
  24 like he told animal, it's a moment of his life that I would
• 33:31
  consider to be upsetting and the beginning of a downward spiral.
• 33:36
  It's probably a big surprise to people listening that he was not
• 33:40
  a Charming child. The media has pushed really hard
• 33:44
  at the idea that Ted Bundy was charming and charismatic and he
• 33:47
  might have been in his, like, personal life as an adult, but
• 33:50
  he wasn't with strangers, and he wasn't when he was little It was
• 33:57
  he had heard he was very awkward.
• 33:59
  Had a speech impediment. He wasn't very athletic.
• 34:02
  He failed to make the high school, basketball team and
• 34:05
  baseball teams. Every time he applied, he was
• 34:09
  this loner who had these grandiose plans for himself and
• 34:12
  even a minor failure. Failure was considered
• 34:14
  unacceptable to him. He was completely oblivious on
• 34:18
  how to talk to girls at all. And only went on one date in
• 34:20
  high school. Like I said, so we're going to
• 34:28
  give a pause here, one of. So we have what we know are
• 34:35
  Ted's original attacks and murders but there's one that
• 34:42
  people have suspected for a little while and it's the rumor
• 34:47
  or the concept that he killed a child in his neighborhood when
• 34:50
  he was 14 years old. This is something that police in
• 34:54
  Tacoma have been looking at in Washington as recently as 2019.
• 35:01
  A little girl by the name of Anne-Marie bird went missing
• 35:04
  from her home and Acoma on August 31st, 1961 Bundy and his
• 35:08
  family lived literally like three blocks away.
• 35:12
  Her mother woke up checked on each of the kids in the morning
• 35:15
  and an wasn't in her bed. Her room showed no sign of
• 35:18
  struggle, their living room window was open.
• 35:21
  And when the police arrived, they noticed, one of the garden
• 35:23
  benches had been pulled up to the window and there was a shoe
• 35:27
  Prime. They went door-to-door in the
• 35:30
  community looking for her, but one of the issues that happened
• 35:34
  here was that they all lived next to like within blocks of
• 35:39
  the University of Puget Sound and the University was under
• 35:43
  heavy construction at this time. So there was a lot of traffic in
• 35:47
  the area with a lot of strangers coming in and out of the region
• 35:50
  and older siblings went to the construction site and saw that
• 35:53
  there were all these ditches. And so, they went to the police
• 35:57
  and were like, She's probably there, like, she's probably in
• 36:01
  one of those construction ditches.
• 36:04
  And then by the time, the police came like only a couple days
• 36:07
  later they had paved over the entire area.
• 36:09
  Oh, what the hell? Police work wasn't as fast.
• 36:17
  Back then. But yeah, so I mean the the
• 36:21
  prevailing belief is that a man's body is under the
• 36:24
  university, which is sad. But the question is, why do
• 36:28
  people believe that he did this? Well, 14 year old, Ted was a
• 36:33
  terror in Tacoma and his little area.
• 36:36
  He was known for killing animals in pretty grotesque ways.
• 36:39
  He was stealing people's pets, so they want fire pulling them
• 36:42
  apart while they're still alive, he was also a well-known
• 36:46
  peeping, Tom. Tom, he would walk by people's
• 36:51
  windows and look inside. He was specifically looking for
• 36:54
  women. He would also walk into people's
• 36:58
  backyards. And touch their underwear.
• 37:04
  Specifically, women's underwear a Woman by the name of Sandy.
• 37:08
  Holt says that when they were teenagers he attacked her, he's
• 37:12
  straight-up walked up to her. Grabbed her t-shirt and was
• 37:15
  like, come on little sister. I want to show you something and
• 37:19
  Sandy was like, no, and he straight up like was like, no,
• 37:23
  you're going with me and he tried to drag her away, Sadie's,
• 37:26
  brother was like coming up the block and saw this.
• 37:30
  Took off chasing him, jumped on his back, knocked him on the
• 37:34
  ground and just started whooping his ass as you should as he
• 37:38
  deserved a brother was like, listen, don't you ever put your
• 37:41
  hands on my sister ever again I'll fuck you up again.
• 37:47
  Unfortunately, on top of the gross Behavior as a teenager.
• 37:50
  Once he was caught and convicted and on death row, he started
• 37:54
  talking to the media and in 1986 he began talking hypothetically
• 37:59
  about his first murder. ER, and how it happened when he
• 38:01
  was a teen, and how he took a child out of her home, took her
• 38:05
  into the orchard near her home, molested her, and then left her
• 38:08
  in a ditch. Come on.
• 38:10
  So of course Ann's mother saw this her name was Bev and she
• 38:16
  wrote to him and the article, the letter is something she just
• 38:23
  straight-up was like, I feel like your first murder was my
• 38:26
  Anne-Marie, burn the bench from the backyard was used to climb
• 38:29
  into living room, the orchard next door.
• 38:30
  Was a dark setting for murder. What did you do with her tiny
• 38:33
  body? And she said, like, I figure Viv
• 38:35
  you Bev's. Letter is pretty much.
• 38:38
  At this point like I know you're talking about stuff because you
• 38:41
  want the appeals to go through the appeals, aren't going to
• 38:44
  happen, you're gonna die, you've got nothing left to lose,
• 38:48
  confess your sins to me. And God Of course, face was
• 38:53
  being honest, he denies it. And he sends her a letter
• 38:57
  saying. At the time I was a normal 14
• 39:00
  year. Old boy, I did not wander the
• 39:02
  streets late at night and I did not steal cars.
• 39:04
  I had absolutely no desire to harm.
• 39:07
  Anyone, I was just an average kid and he signed it piece.
• 39:10
  Ted! That is absolutely a lie.
• 39:13
  He did wander the streets during the day and night and he did
• 39:17
  steal cars. And that's confirmed details and
• 39:22
  then just a fucking dismissiveness.
• 39:24
  Goddamn, I hate you so much. Yeah, the piece.
• 39:27
  Ted fuck. So, unfortunately, there wasn't
• 39:31
  a whole lot of DNA taken at the time.
• 39:35
  They're trying to like the police are still trying to see
• 39:38
  if anything could be connected to him and Marie burst case is
• 39:42
  still cold but people like Rebecca Morris who wrote the
• 39:46
  book Tad and an the mystery of a missing child and her neighbor,
• 39:49
  Ted Bundy. They think he was telling the
• 39:51
  truth. He told a lot of Truth before he
• 39:54
  died. So while we don't know, if this
• 39:59
  was his first murder, like I said, we do know that he told
• 40:02
  his biographers in prison that this was also the time that he
• 40:05
  got interested in sexual violence just as quickly as he
• 40:11
  admitted this to one writer though, he would then turn
• 40:14
  around and it completely deny it to another.
• 40:20
  And one thing that we know about power and control serial
• 40:22
  killers, is that these thoughts and feelings?
• 40:25
  Don't arrive randomly, he didn't just become like 25 and decide
• 40:30
  to start sexually assaulting people.
• 40:32
  They start fairly young and they build over time.
• 40:35
  I'm sure it wasn't lost on anyone listening to Bundy that
• 40:40
  he was harming animals. At a young age that hits the
• 40:45
  psychopath Triad that we've talked about many other times.
• 40:49
  And I'm referencing the the psychological breakdown of
• 40:53
  serial killers created by John Douglas and Robert wrestler.
• 40:56
  In 1972 Bundy falls into what's called a power and control.
• 41:00
  Killer these like these kind of killers like to exert power and
• 41:06
  dominance over their victims and the sexual attacks are a means
• 41:10
  of doing that and it's safe to say that Ted felt very helpless
• 41:18
  in regards to has life. He didn't have the life he
• 41:21
  wanted, he felt he deserved more in terms of financial success
• 41:25
  and things. So, some of these depictions of
• 41:29
  sexual violence were ways that he might have been finding too.
• 41:35
  Feel powerful, even while he feels like he has no power like
• 41:40
  other things. He also denies but also admitted
• 41:43
  to was when he was in high school hunting through garbage
• 41:47
  cans for pictures and videos of pornography that people
• 41:50
  throughout Also, when I mention he was a Peeping Tom and women,
• 41:56
  the community were already freaked out about him.
• 41:59
  He also broke into a couple pieces people's houses and he
• 42:03
  got caught and he also like he got caught stealing a car when
• 42:09
  he was in high school, but it got expunged from his record
• 42:13
  when he turned 18. Didn't he write in a letter to?
• 42:16
  He didn't do any cars. Yes, indeed, he did.
• 42:18
  I told you he was just straight up lying, okay?
• 42:21
  Good to bad burn. Dude, come on.
• 42:25
  Okay, whatever area. And then the breaking into
• 42:28
  houses? Would you break into houses for
• 42:29
  just to peep closer? I think he's trying to steal
• 42:32
  porn and anything else you can find, just go to a store and
• 42:35
  still it. God you weren't allowed to,
• 42:39
  well, I got here, okay. Either way, graduate from high
• 42:46
  school, he ends up at the University of Puget, Sound just
• 42:49
  around the corner of his house for undergrad.
• 42:51
  He was only there for two semesters.
• 42:53
  He transferred to the University of Washington for a sophomore
• 42:56
  year. He didn't like the students at
• 42:59
  Puget and he didn't like them because it was a it's actually
• 43:02
  like a small liberal arts college.
• 43:04
  And you know what that means? It's expensive and a lot of the
• 43:09
  kids who went to that college, have more money than him.
• 43:14
  So he transfers to Washington is studying Chinese studies.
• 43:21
  He might he meets, he's got his, his first dorm is McMahon Hall
• 43:27
  and that's where he meets his first girlfriend.
• 43:31
  His first girlfriend has spoken to people but she has no
• 43:37
  interest in being known. So, for our purposes, we'll use
• 43:44
  the same name that and roll used, which is Stephanie Brooks,
• 43:47
  but that's not actually her real name.
• 43:51
  She wants not, she wanted nothing to do with the memory of
• 43:53
  Ted Bundy. The to bond over our love of
• 43:57
  skiing and despite him not liking the wealthy kids of Puget
• 44:00
  Sound. He didn't mind the very smart
• 44:04
  wealthy and pretty Stephanie. During this time to kind of Keep
• 44:10
  Up Appearances. He works two jobs.
• 44:12
  He volunteers with the Republican Party, he ended up
• 44:15
  working for the office. That was trying to get Nelson
• 44:17
  Rockefeller elected president. In fact, Stephanie and Todd went
• 44:22
  to the 1968, Republican National Convention and then Stephanie
• 44:25
  broke up with him. she told an rule that it was because of his
• 44:30
  lack of ambition bad grades and immaturity, hey, He responded to
• 44:38
  the loss of his first love by dropping out of college and
• 44:41
  leaving Washington. He stopped in Colorado, visited
• 44:45
  family in Arkansas to. Then he went back to
• 44:48
  Philadelphia and rolled in Temple University for a semester
• 44:52
  and then moved back to Washington in 1969.
• 44:59
  Many of the psychologist who evaluated Ted once he was
• 45:03
  captured say that this breakup was the Catalyst in his life.
• 45:06
  The thing that caused him to kill, they relate this to the
• 45:10
  fact that Stephanie had long dark straight hair that she
• 45:13
  always were parted in the middle and several of his victims.
• 45:16
  Look like this. Ted has denied this, he denied
• 45:20
  it sit until his death. Saying that the only thing his
• 45:24
  victims need to be for him to grab them was Active and half of
• 45:30
  his victims are blond. It.
• 45:32
  What did you find attractive? What did you find attractive,
• 45:34
  sir? These blocks.
• 45:36
  Okay, that looked like your first low so yes, obviously I
• 45:40
  don't know, I kind of agree with that.
• 45:42
  I'm I agree with that too. I think because a couple of them
• 45:45
  fit the bill but like he wasn't always He hits organized, he
• 45:53
  gets organized and disorganized but like the first kill was a
• 45:58
  blonde girl and if it matters that much in the beginning they
• 46:03
  would have all been brunettes. Hmm.
• 46:08
  So my just been a coincidence. Yeah I think it was a good event
• 46:11
  a coincidence that we've created this connection here. but, Back
• 46:17
  in Washington, 1969, he's 23. He gets into a relationship with
• 46:22
  a lady by the name of Liz klopfer.
• 46:25
  She works as a secretary at the University of Washington School
• 46:28
  of Medicine. She was divorced, she had a
• 46:30
  daughter. They met at a bar and Liz
• 46:32
  originally rejected him when he asked her to dance, but
• 46:35
  eventually they had a conversation and she realized
• 46:38
  she liked him even if he was a bad dancer.
• 46:43
  The relationship was hot and heavy from the start.
• 46:46
  She said she loved him right away.
• 46:48
  And just like Stephanie she encouraged him to do better for
• 46:51
  himself only this time. He actually tried he re-enrolled
• 46:56
  in college in 1970 this time majoring in Psychology and by
• 47:01
  all accounts he was a very good student.
• 47:04
  This is when he also began volunteering at the Seattle
• 47:07
  Suicide Hotline Crisis Center on Capitol Hill.
• 47:10
  This gave him credits toward his degree and If we're honest, it
• 47:14
  also allowed him to feel like he was in control of people's
• 47:16
  lives. So it gave him a little bit of
• 47:20
  that boost that he wanted. At least for a time.
• 47:24
  It was a safe Outlet, not the crisis center, that's where he
• 47:28
  met and became friends with an rule.
• 47:31
  She was a former police officer turned crime reporter and of
• 47:34
  course. And it know that her new friend
• 47:36
  was going to start killing people pretty soon and getting a
• 47:40
  little bit ahead of myself. Tech graduates with his degree
• 47:45
  in Psychology in 1972. He starts working for the
• 47:48
  Washington governor, Daniel Evans during his re-election
• 47:52
  campaign. Do you know how he made himself
• 47:58
  useful? Wow.
• 48:02
  He would pretend to be a college student and then go and
• 48:06
  volunteer at the opponent's office, learn like the talking
• 48:10
  points and secrets and then turn those over to the governor.
• 48:15
  So, he was a mole. Highly unethical mmm-hmm, but
• 48:22
  the chairman of the Republican party in Washington thought,
• 48:25
  this was impressive and hired a Ted to become his assistant, of
• 48:30
  course, of course. They would, of course not.
• 48:33
  Well, he had goals of being a lawyer, but he had awful test
• 48:37
  scores. But with his very new and
• 48:41
  Powerful friends who sent recommendation letters to him,
• 48:45
  he entered the Puget Sound law program and he starts Law School
• 48:49
  in 1973. Now, back in Tacoma, he hooks up
• 48:54
  with Stephanie again. Stephanie had graduated and
• 48:58
  moved to California. So he's maintaining these two
• 49:00
  long distance relationships. Stephen he's like, well, dang,
• 49:05
  you actually made something out of yourself.
• 49:07
  We can date. He doesn't break up with Liz.
• 49:12
  He leaves Liz in and he even introduces people that Stephanie
• 49:23
  as his fiancee. Oh my God everything's going
• 49:27
  great. And then he goes to her and the
• 49:30
  fall of 1974. She said she called him for a
• 49:34
  month and he picked up one time to Gaslight the ever living crap
• 49:40
  out of her. By saying, what are you talking
• 49:42
  about? We haven't dated since 6 1968,
• 49:49
  Stephanie just chalked it up to him, trying to get revenge from
• 49:53
  undergrad and moved on with her life.
• 49:55
  Okay? I would.
• 49:56
  Yeah. Yeah, but I did 74.
• 50:00
  He's working for the Washington State Department of Emergency
• 50:03
  Services. He becomes friends with a lady
• 50:05
  named Carol and Bun which was platonic at first, but Carol
• 50:10
  would become his wife eventually, but that comes a lot
• 50:14
  later. 1974 is when everything changes he's Ultra Moody
• 50:23
  erratic. First time, he's violent toward
• 50:26
  his girlfriend Liz and Washington.
• 50:28
  Their relationship had always been Rocky like they would break
• 50:33
  up and then he would be like no, no, no, I was wrong.
• 50:36
  In fact, once they even got a marriage license at the
• 50:39
  courthouse in 1970, but she hadn't told her parents that the
• 50:43
  two of them were living together yet.
• 50:44
  And so her family came to visit. Visit one time and she was like,
• 50:47
  Hey, can you move all your stuff back to your apartment while
• 50:49
  they're here? And he got really mad and he
• 50:51
  tore up the marriage license because back then you know
• 50:56
  you're not supposed to live together until you're actually
• 50:58
  married. Okay.
• 51:02
  Okay. Things like that happen all the
• 51:04
  time, he wasn't violent with her until 1974 and later that year
• 51:10
  would be when she began to think that he was the man killing the
• 51:17
  college girls. He would get really weird when
• 51:21
  she'd asked him. Why is there a meat cleaver in
• 51:24
  your desk? Why are you carrying surgical
• 51:26
  gloves in your code every day? These aren't these aren't signs
• 51:31
  to let me know. She she she she did she did.
• 51:35
  Yeah, yeah she would go on to report him in July of 1974 and
• 51:39
  again in 75 but um well it all start the, the starts in January
• 51:46
  and I'm going to let you know, her people, listening there is a
• 51:49
  murder a month. For the next solid year.
• 51:55
  Sometimes more than once in a day.
• 51:59
  We're going to go through those now, this is probably the
• 52:02
  lengthy is section of here. This is just 1974 and it's real
• 52:06
  long. So Ted did his best to lie and
• 52:11
  Confused cops about when his first murders began.
• 52:14
  You know, he was always trying to like really pissed them off
• 52:19
  and just not be honest about what he was doing.
• 52:20
  But one thing we do know is January, 4th, 1974 and
• 52:24
  Washington. Oregon Karen Sparks who
• 52:27
  sometimes goes by the name, Johnny Lee.
• 52:29
  Ends now was attacked in her bed.
• 52:31
  She was 18 years old. She was a student at the
• 52:33
  University of Washington. She lived in a basement bedroom
• 52:38
  and she had three male roommates who lived upstairs?
• 52:42
  And Ted Bundy climbed into her bedroom and be her with a metal
• 52:48
  rod and then use that Rod to sexually assault her.
• 52:54
  It was a very violent and traumatic sexual assault it.
• 53:00
  Ruptured her bladder, she believes that the only reason he
• 53:03
  didn't kill her is because Her roommate started moving around
• 53:08
  upstairs, and he got spooked. And he ran away, she was left
• 53:13
  unconscious and bleeding and her roommates checked in on her, in
• 53:20
  the morning, and found her. Karen remembers that at like
• 53:26
  1:00 in the morning. She remembers like, you know,
• 53:29
  you kind of look at a window and you see something real fast and
• 53:32
  then you look again and it's gone?
• 53:34
  Yeah, yeah. She thought she saw somebody
• 53:36
  looking her window at about 1 a.m.
• 53:40
  She was just like, no, I imagined it, that was him.
• 53:43
  And in fact he had been watching her for days.
• 53:46
  He had he saw her at a laundromat.
• 53:50
  And more than likely followed her, her her bedroom in the
• 53:55
  basement was convenient for him. and again, like I said, Karen
• 54:02
  was a blonde girl. Now, his first murder.
• 54:05
  We know came a month later in February, her name was Linda and
• 54:08
  Healy. She was studying psychology at
• 54:10
  the University of Washington. Her goal was to work with
• 54:13
  students with disabilities. And she worked for the school's
• 54:15
  whether like the radio station as the weather reporter in 1974.
• 54:20
  She was a senior and she moved into a house with her friends.
• 54:23
  And she usually woke up before everybody else, because she had
• 54:26
  to go to the radio job. The last time she was seen, Was
• 54:32
  on January 31st when she stopped by one of her roommates rooms at
• 54:36
  about 11:30 p.m. just to talk the next morning, she wasn't in
• 54:40
  her room. When her alarm went off at 5:30,
• 54:44
  that's when her roommates went to turn the alarm off.
• 54:47
  And saw she wasn't there, and then Linda's boss called shortly
• 54:51
  after. And was like, she never showed
• 54:53
  up for work. And she also missed a family
• 54:57
  dinner and her mom from Seattle called looking for her.
• 55:03
  That was the point when her roommates went like into her
• 55:06
  room to look because before they were just like, oh we're not
• 55:09
  going to mess with it. Like the only thing somebody did
• 55:11
  was just walk in, turn the alarm off and leave.
• 55:16
  This time when they went in, they saw that some of her sheets
• 55:19
  were missing and the ones that were on the bed still like some
• 55:24
  of them had little specks of blood on them.
• 55:26
  It appears that he tried to remove most of it though.
• 55:31
  They called the police. There was no evidence.
• 55:36
  In 1978, Ted admitted that he lie was his first victim.
• 55:41
  Her skull was found at the Taylor Mountain dump site.
• 55:45
  She was more than likely bludgeoned to death.
• 55:50
  Now, his next victim was Donna Gil, Manson.
• 55:54
  She was 19 and he didn't admit this murder until days before he
• 55:58
  was executed in 89. She went to Evergreen State
• 56:03
  College. She lived in Olympia Washington,
• 56:06
  she left her home for a jazz concert on March 12.
• 56:09
  Never seen again, Ted admitted that it was in March that he
• 56:15
  perfected his ruse. He was working at a medical
• 56:18
  supply company and he'd steal supplies and pretend to be
• 56:21
  injured. He would wear a cast who had
• 56:24
  walk on crutches, he had an arm sling.
• 56:28
  He asked someone walking home to help him to his car and once you
• 56:32
  got close enough to his car he would abduct you.
• 56:34
  Hmm. Ted told reporters that he left
• 56:37
  Donna at the Taylor Mountain dump site but her remains were
• 56:40
  never recovered. It's believed that the Pierce
• 56:44
  County Sheriff's Office, actually had those remains in
• 56:47
  1978 when two fishermen found a human skull and bones hair and a
• 56:53
  shirt and the foothills of Mount Rainer, But 19th, they were
• 56:58
  never tested and those remains were lost.
• 57:05
  It's believed the police didn't take this missing persons report
• 57:09
  seriously because Donna is, what was what police wanted to refer
• 57:14
  to as high risk? I don't like this terminology
• 57:19
  but I'll explain to you what it is.
• 57:20
  Okay? So high-risk victims are people
• 57:24
  that the police think are more at risk for violence because
• 57:31
  they hang out around criminals or crib the criminal element.
• 57:35
  Sometimes that means that you're doing drugs in the 70s, Donna
• 57:40
  might have been the kind of girl to stay out late.
• 57:42
  She wasn't a good girl. I see what you mean.
• 57:45
  Yeah. So then we have the opposite of
• 57:47
  that which are low-risk victims. I'm sure you can imagine that.
• 57:53
  People didn't start making connections until a couple of
• 57:56
  low-risk victims were murdered by 10.
• 58:02
  April brings The Disappearance of Susan Elaine Rancourt on
• 58:05
  April 17th. 1974 she was 18. College student Central,
• 58:10
  Washington State College, in Ellensburg, that night, she had
• 58:13
  gone to a meeting for students who are interested in being dorm
• 58:16
  counselors. Next semester and somewhere
• 58:19
  between that meeting room on campus and going back to her
• 58:23
  dorm room disappeared. People knew something was wrong
• 58:27
  because Susan was never late. She never missed appointments
• 58:31
  the night of the meeting. She had put laundry in the dorm
• 58:33
  washing machine with the intention that when she got back
• 58:37
  from her meeting, she was going to finish it.
• 58:40
  So the fact that her laundry was still, there was also assigned
• 58:43
  to people that something was off.
• 58:49
  Sorry, it's okay. Shortly after her disappearance,
• 58:55
  other girls on campus reported, there was an older man with his
• 58:59
  arm in a sling who kept asking them to help.
• 59:02
  Carry his books. Back to his car.
• 59:04
  That car was at an Volkswagen Beetle.
• 59:07
  Same car that Ted Bundy drove was this like an everyday thing
• 59:12
  that he would ask these seven girls know.
• 59:14
  This was this day. Oh okay.
• 59:17
  Oh another student named Kathleen.
• 59:19
  Da Laveau told the police that she had helped the man Same
• 59:23
  night that Susan disappeared but he gave her a weird vibe and he
• 59:27
  was kind of disheveled. So like legitimately as soon as
• 59:30
  she they got to the car, she like dumped his book goes on the
• 59:33
  hood and like walked off. So she didn't get close enough
• 59:36
  to the the passenger or the the doors essentially for him to be
• 59:41
  able to grab her and pull her in, right?
• 59:43
  There's another woman named Jane Curtis.
• 59:45
  She reported that the same thing happened to her three days
• 59:48
  earlier. Only he had opened the car door
• 59:51
  and told her to get inside and she just ran away.
• 59:53
  From him, smart. Just like, with Donna, he
• 59:57
  admitted this killing days before he was executed, her
• 1:00:00
  skull was recovered at the Taylor Mountain dump site.
• 1:00:04
  Now, like I said, police were aware of the disappearances on
• 1:00:06
  campus, there was no physical evidence, and if you're
• 1:00:10
  listening, these locations are like, 50, 60 miles apart.
• 1:00:17
  This is a very like this is him being an organized killer, very
• 1:00:21
  calculated specifically going to different locations because it
• 1:00:25
  puts him in different police jurisdictions.
• 1:00:28
  And even in 2022, cops don't always like working with each
• 1:00:33
  other. Now, Liz club for was like, he's
• 1:00:41
  spent a lot of time out at night and he keeps coming home later
• 1:00:45
  and later and the News begins running information on how
• 1:00:49
  collagen college girls can protect themselves.
• 1:00:51
  If they have to be out at night, a lot of people are cautious.
• 1:00:56
  Another girl goes missing, May 6, 1974 Roberta Kathleen Parks,
• 1:01:00
  she's a student at Oregon State University and she leaves her
• 1:01:02
  dorm just to get a drink from the Union just after eleven like
• 1:01:07
  it's, we're talking a couple minute, walk a friend.
• 1:01:11
  Even saw her walking toward the cafeteria and they like stopped
• 1:01:15
  for a second, you know, had a little chitchat and then she
• 1:01:19
  went into the building, she never made it back to her dorm
• 1:01:23
  This was 250 miles away from the other crimes.
• 1:01:30
  Her skull was also found at Taylor mountain and he admitted
• 1:01:35
  this murder the night before his execution.
• 1:01:40
  May 31st Brenda Carol bell is out drinking at the flame.
• 1:01:45
  Tavern in Burien Washington she goes missing.
• 1:01:48
  Brenda was actually unenrolled from college and kind of lost on
• 1:01:51
  her path. You know, she's taking some time
• 1:01:53
  off to figure out where she wanted to be.
• 1:01:56
  When she grew up, you know, she ended up ask like telling her
• 1:02:00
  friend. She wanted to go home and her
• 1:02:02
  friends were like, no, we're staying.
• 1:02:06
  So she decided she was probably going to hitchhike home.
• 1:02:10
  Witnesses saw her talking to a man in a parking lot.
• 1:02:12
  At two am, his arm was in a sling.
• 1:02:16
  Similarly to Donna before the police didn't really see her
• 1:02:19
  cases. Very urgent because she was a
• 1:02:22
  College Dropout who like to drink late at night.
• 1:02:25
  She in fact, wasn't officially reported missing until June
• 1:02:28
  17th. Two weeks after she was already
• 1:02:31
  long gone and just love how they categorize these.
• 1:02:36
  These women are going this and now it's really annoying awful.
• 1:02:42
  It's really hmm. Well, he speed things up a
• 1:02:47
  little bit. There's not a month in between
• 1:02:49
  this, there's like two weeks Georgian Hawkins, she was 18
• 1:02:53
  years old and that was the end of her first year at the
• 1:02:55
  University of Washington. She left a fraternity party.
• 1:02:59
  So, she could go study for a Spanish test.
• 1:03:01
  One of her friends, saw her walking on the street from her
• 1:03:04
  dorm room, and he was like, Hey, and so, she stopped and they
• 1:03:08
  kind of talked to the window for a little bit.
• 1:03:10
  Dwayne remembered hearing a man, laughing from a nearby alley
• 1:03:13
  way. He just assumed it was was a
• 1:03:15
  drunk person. Ted would confirm days before
• 1:03:19
  his execution that he was the man in the alley.
• 1:03:21
  He coerced Georgian into the alley by pretending.
• 1:03:24
  He had a broken leg and was hobbling on crutches as soon as
• 1:03:27
  she got close to him, he hit her over the head with a crowbar.
• 1:03:30
  Dragged her into his car. Her remains were found at what
• 1:03:34
  is referred to as the Issaquah site and 1975.
• 1:03:37
  Which is not that far from Taylor Mountain.
• 1:03:38
  But the Seattle PD actually did try and do a thorough
• 1:03:43
  investigation they went through. The entire area, where Duane it
• 1:03:47
  last seen her checking that alley, but they got no evidence
• 1:03:50
  Witnesses. Remember a man with crutches
• 1:03:52
  asking for help and of course he was seen.
• 1:03:56
  And the tan Volkswagen was seen to July is a big month.
• 1:04:03
  This is the month that Liz realizes something's very wrong.
• 1:04:07
  It's also the money the same time that he abducted two women
• 1:04:09
  on the same day. This is what psychiatrist and
• 1:04:13
  others who study cereals called serial killers, or call an
• 1:04:16
  escalation. And generally when there's an
• 1:04:18
  escalation, it means that the Killer's losing control.
• 1:04:21
  I'm not sure that we can say that he was losing control, but
• 1:04:24
  he definitely is fine. Tuning, his his Mo finding more
• 1:04:29
  efficient lies to get women to come with him.
• 1:04:32
  So, he's kind of like, pushing his, I'd say he's not losing
• 1:04:36
  control but he's like, pushing. He knows what he's doing now.
• 1:04:38
  So he's like, maybe I can do more this time in.
• 1:04:41
  See how he would get away with this time.
• 1:04:44
  Okay, okay, Essie Essie Essie. Unfortunately, when the actual
• 1:04:47
  Diva Lucien happens, that'll be it.
• 1:04:49
  That's already, I already wrote part of that.
• 1:04:51
  That's in Mexico. Comcast, it's real bad.
• 1:04:56
  Like Ted Bundy in control. Pretty bad out of control,
• 1:05:03
  awful. But he would, you like you said
• 1:05:08
  he was more, he was getting more Bolder.
• 1:05:10
  This is the first time he kidnaps anybody during the
• 1:05:11
  daytime, this day is July, July 14.
• 1:05:15
  Both of these disappearance happened at the Lake Sammamish
• 1:05:18
  State Park. His first victim, was 23,
• 1:05:21
  year-old Janice Ott. The state park is in Issaquah,
• 1:05:25
  and it's about 20 miles east of Seattle.
• 1:05:27
  There's a beach by the lake, and it was like a nice bright Sunday
• 1:05:31
  at the beach. He was there wearing an
• 1:05:34
  all-white tennis outfit with his arm in a sling.
• 1:05:38
  That day, at least five women reported This creepy guy,
• 1:05:42
  approaching them with his arm in a sling and asking for help
• 1:05:45
  unhitching, his boat. Now, one of those women was a
• 1:05:50
  woman named, Janice Graham, and she actually walked with him to
• 1:05:53
  the parking lot, and then she saw that his boat wasn't there
• 1:05:58
  and she turned around and walked away from him as you should.
• 1:06:02
  I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
• 1:06:04
  I got it. I'm sorry.
• 1:06:05
  Hold on, hold on. You have your arm in a sling.
• 1:06:09
  How are you going to use your boat sir?
• 1:06:11
  I know, I thought that too. I was like, buddy.
• 1:06:14
  That's a really weird Ruth. But unfortunately for Janice Ott
• 1:06:19
  She's a probation officer had just gotten married.
• 1:06:22
  She was at the lake lying down reading a book and a witness
• 1:06:27
  named Sylvia can't who is 15? Told the police that she heard
• 1:06:32
  the conversation between Ted and and Janice, she's still as
• 1:06:38
  Sylvia said that she heard him introduce himself is Ted and
• 1:06:42
  then he need help attaching his sailboat to his car, which was
• 1:06:45
  at his parents house just down the road.
• 1:06:49
  Janice agreed to help him, she was never seen again.
• 1:06:54
  Four hours later he returns to the lake, which is now even
• 1:06:57
  busier there. He zeroes in on 19 year old
• 1:06:59
  computer programmer, Denise Rich Marine asselin, she's there with
• 1:07:03
  her boyfriend and a couple of her friends.
• 1:07:05
  The group's all sitting around drinking having a good time.
• 1:07:08
  Everyone got a little buzzed and kind of fell asleep at that
• 1:07:12
  point, Denise walked off probably to use the bathroom,
• 1:07:15
  but she never came back. No one saw her, leave the area
• 1:07:18
  and no one saw her. Again, the group woke up and
• 1:07:22
  they looked for her, they couldn't and find her.
• 1:07:23
  Her car was in the parking lot. Her purse was still there.
• 1:07:26
  Her wallet was still inside of it.
• 1:07:29
  Denise's. Boyfriend bless his heart calls
• 1:07:31
  her parents before he calls the cops.
• 1:07:35
  In fact, he calls like her mom and it's like, oh my God, Denise
• 1:07:38
  is missing and Denise's parents call the police mhm, both Janice
• 1:07:44
  and Denise were found a year later at the Issaquah dump site
• 1:07:48
  but this was the first time the police had any kind of elite.
• 1:07:51
  He used his real name. Someone heard, you know, Saul
• 1:07:55
  you heard that the car was using And now the police were pretty
• 1:07:59
  sure that these disappearances were linked to the mysterious
• 1:08:02
  and Ted in the tan Volkswagen. She got a car named nice.
• 1:08:08
  Well, and now there's enough Witnesses who were able to give
• 1:08:10
  King County Police more evidence for a comp a composite because
• 1:08:13
  normally people were only seeing him at night time.
• 1:08:19
  This, this sketch was put everywhere and Regional news
• 1:08:22
  every newspaper. Now this case falls on the lap
• 1:08:25
  of Robert capital and if you are a dutiful listener to the
• 1:08:29
  podcast, you're going to remember that.
• 1:08:32
  Robert couple one, he's kind of a serial killer Rockstar.
• 1:08:34
  He's considered at this point, but he also was one of the
• 1:08:37
  Consultants on the Green River. Killer task force But in 74,
• 1:08:43
  capitals of rookie investigator. and actually, he makes a You
• 1:08:51
  know, he decides with this is a serial killer and we need to let
• 1:08:56
  King County know that there's a serial killer around.
• 1:09:00
  That was a personally, I think that was a very smart decision.
• 1:09:05
  So the problem is, when he informed King County that
• 1:09:10
  there's a serial killer in their midst, they were getting
• 1:09:13
  roughly. 200 tips a day Wow, those tips.
• 1:09:20
  Liz, klopfer called in. I think my boyfriend is the
• 1:09:24
  person you're showing on the TV and Rule calls in.
• 1:09:30
  I think the man you're looking for is someone, I used to work
• 1:09:33
  with one of Ted's professors like psychology professors calls
• 1:09:39
  it. All of those tips were lost in
• 1:09:43
  the gigantic flow of information coming in.
• 1:09:47
  Eventually, the police would end up using an old payroll computer
• 1:09:51
  which allowed them to input data, and they weren't able to
• 1:09:55
  see eventually that multiple people reported him.
• 1:10:00
  But there was still no physical evidence linking him to the
• 1:10:02
  crimes. He slows down after his face is
• 1:10:07
  all over, Seattle moves to Olympia in August of 1974.
• 1:10:11
  He and Liz are on the Rocks. He continues to write her
• 1:10:14
  letters telling her that he loves her.
• 1:10:16
  So this kind of keeps a torch for her years later when he was
• 1:10:21
  on death row, he called please and he admitted to trying to
• 1:10:24
  kill her one night before he moved to Olympia.
• 1:10:27
  Oh my God. Started a fire in the fireplace
• 1:10:31
  and I guess they had been having some drinks and He put a like,
• 1:10:38
  you put a rag, like, a wet rag under the door and he closed the
• 1:10:44
  fireplace flue. And let's just says he remembers
• 1:10:47
  waking up, and she couldn't breathe.
• 1:10:49
  She opened a window and she put the fire out.
• 1:10:52
  She thought it was a mistake. But Ted said that he felt the
• 1:10:58
  need to kill overwhelmingly and he tried really hard not to hurt
• 1:11:01
  her. Liz dad.
• 1:11:03
  That was probably the only time that happened.
• 1:11:06
  Strangely enough Ted said that he really loved her and the love
• 1:11:10
  that he had for her was destabilizing.
• 1:11:14
  That was his exact word, which I think is really interesting
• 1:11:17
  because perhaps, if he had may be focused on the love thing and
• 1:11:21
  not, you know, those feelings instead of the homicidal
• 1:11:25
  feelings, maybe things would have ended differently for a lot
• 1:11:28
  of people, but instead he ran away to Utah.
• 1:11:32
  Now, he told everyone that knew him through work.
• 1:11:35
  He was leaving because he didn't enjoy studying law at the
• 1:11:38
  University of Puget Sound. He told Lance he was going to
• 1:11:41
  finish his program at the University of Utah and he drove
• 1:11:45
  there on September 2nd just before his execution.
• 1:11:48
  He told the police he was driving through Boise, Idaho, he
• 1:11:52
  picked up a th haircut hitchhiker.
• 1:11:54
  She said she was like 16 or 18. He said he raped and dumped her
• 1:11:59
  but investigators don't believe this.
• 1:12:01
  Is true. Because that doesn't line up
• 1:12:06
  with missing women, in the area at the time and he knew details
• 1:12:13
  when he would tell them about other crimes.
• 1:12:15
  So this one where he's just like, yeah, picked up some
• 1:12:18
  random, girl. I remember what she looks like
• 1:12:19
  and I dropped her in some random place.
• 1:12:21
  I don't remember where like that doesn't fit anything.
• 1:12:24
  Because so far, all of his victims were two different dump
• 1:12:27
  sites, they were special to him. He didn't he didn't stop back
• 1:12:32
  to, Assault them like Ridgeway did but he did go back.
• 1:12:40
  It was could be near them, always go back.
• 1:12:45
  These kinds, yeah. So the police decided that he
• 1:12:52
  made this up to try and push back his execution, he started
• 1:12:55
  dropping lots of names and information to try and push the
• 1:13:00
  execution back, but he pretended to work on his law degree.
• 1:13:04
  But instead he embarked on a six-week killing spring,
• 1:13:08
  starting in October 16th of 1974 in Utah, his first victim is
• 1:13:14
  Nancy Wilcox. It's October 2nd, she's a high
• 1:13:17
  school cheerleader, who lived in Holiday, Day, which is a small
• 1:13:20
  like Suburban town outside of Salt Lake City.
• 1:13:24
  He didn't even use a ruse this time, he just straight up pulls
• 1:13:27
  a knife on her walks and he drags her into an orchard.
• 1:13:33
  He told the police that he actually didn't intend to kill
• 1:13:35
  her just rape her but Nancy fought back, real hard and he
• 1:13:41
  said that he had to choke her to death and this was the first
• 1:13:45
  time that he had to rape her rape someone after they were
• 1:13:49
  dead. You see happy.
• 1:13:53
  So he he very much in this situation, he wanted to exert
• 1:13:58
  his control by sexually assaulting someone.
• 1:14:02
  He told the police, he did need to kill Nancy.
• 1:14:06
  There were other times in his Call it a serial killer career
• 1:14:11
  that he needed to kill and this is something that also Ed camper
• 1:14:16
  discussed when he was in prison. That it's a compulsion.
• 1:14:20
  So when Ted says, I didn't need to kill Nancy, what he means is
• 1:14:25
  he doesn't feel compelled to kill her but instead because she
• 1:14:28
  was screaming and fighting him, he killed her, but he still
• 1:14:33
  wanted to sexually assault her. That was the one that was the
• 1:14:36
  desire there. So he did it after she was dead.
• 1:14:41
  He also didn't drive her to one of the dumpsites, he tells the
• 1:14:45
  police, he disposed of her remains at the Capitol Reef
• 1:14:48
  National Park. The police respond to her
• 1:14:52
  parents, very worried reports by assuming she's a runaway.
• 1:14:57
  They don't investigate her death until 1998, 3, 1989.
• 1:15:04
  I put that in 89. Ok, well still so bad.
• 1:15:08
  Same year that he's executed. Yes, no behead.
• 1:15:11
  Yeah, anyway, is that victim is 17 year-old Melissa?
• 1:15:16
  Ann Smith. The daughter of Louis Smith.
• 1:15:20
  The The police chief and medieval Midvale medieval was a
• 1:15:24
  lot like holiday and that it's a small community where everybody
• 1:15:27
  knew each other another suburb of Salt Lake City, October 18th,
• 1:15:32
  Melissa's walking home from dinner with her friends at about
• 1:15:35
  10 p.m., she actually called her parents from the pizza parlor
• 1:15:40
  and said, hey, we're all leaving.
• 1:15:43
  I'm heading home. Never arrives, just like Nancy,
• 1:15:49
  he Blitz. Attacked her beat her raped.
• 1:15:51
  Her killed her laughter on a hillside in Summit County Utah,
• 1:15:55
  she was discovered Two Weeks Later by some deer hunters on
• 1:15:59
  October 27th. This is where things.
• 1:16:03
  Get real weird. When she is found on October
• 1:16:07
  27th, forensics alert. The Police that she has only
• 1:16:11
  been dead for two days. Which means that Ted Bundy kept
• 1:16:15
  her for nine days, total or more about 70.
• 1:16:20
  During that time, he washed her hair put makeup on her painted
• 1:16:25
  her nails. Her cause of death was
• 1:16:30
  blunt-force trauma to the Head. This is a complete deviation
• 1:16:34
  from the other crimes. Yeah.
• 1:16:37
  Still the October murders aren't over Halloween, 1974, 17,
• 1:16:42
  year-old Laura and aim goes missing.
• 1:16:45
  She was the from the city of Lehigh, which is about 25
• 1:16:47
  minutes outside of Seattle. Walking home from a cafe, a
• 1:16:50
  little after midnight. She also Blitz attacks her, he
• 1:16:54
  admitted to also doing his bizarre ritual with Lara to She
• 1:17:01
  was found in the American Fork Canyon by some hikers.
• 1:17:06
  November comes in Ted drops out of college.
• 1:17:09
  He'd only been to a couple classes.
• 1:17:11
  He was obviously very busy holding women in his home.
• 1:17:18
  One week after kidnapping Laura aim, he attacks 18 year old
• 1:17:23
  carril DE Ranch, she was at the Fashion, Police shopping mall,
• 1:17:26
  and Murray Utah on November 8th. When she says, a man dressed
• 1:17:30
  like a police officer walked up to her, told her her car had
• 1:17:33
  been broken into Carol, gets into the car with him and she's
• 1:17:37
  like he's like we're going to go file some paperwork at the
• 1:17:39
  police station but she realizes that he is not taking her to
• 1:17:44
  police station. She tells him this and he tries
• 1:17:48
  to handcuff her but while he's driving and she ended up
• 1:17:53
  struggling with him and he hooked both of them on the same
• 1:17:56
  arm, she opens the car door and just leaps out.
• 1:18:01
  Smart smart. Little smart one.
• 1:18:03
  Yeah, he's not trying to deal with the struggle, so he just
• 1:18:06
  drives on my God. Now, Carol actually goes to the
• 1:18:10
  real police. Tell us about this encounter.
• 1:18:12
  She gives a perfect description of him and his car.
• 1:18:15
  And she said, while they were struggling, he even got some of
• 1:18:17
  his blood on her jacket, which she gives over to the police, as
• 1:18:20
  well as is, he saw driving a Volkswagen, I just I'm
• 1:18:24
  absolutely is hmm. Unfortunately, while the police
• 1:18:28
  are taking Carol statement and processing this Evidence.
• 1:18:31
  He heads on over to Bountiful Utah which isn't that far away
• 1:18:36
  and he kidnaps seventeen-year-old, Debbie Kent.
• 1:18:42
  It's about 19 miles away from Marie, which is where Carol
• 1:18:45
  Durant was. So I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
• 1:18:50
  Is it is, is it like, normal for, like serial killers, like
• 1:18:55
  to switch up their MO like that? Like this start kidnapping and
• 1:18:59
  so they just like, like, no murdering.
• 1:19:03
  So it's not normal, it's interesting here because like I
• 1:19:06
  said he says he doesn't feel the need to kill as much.
• 1:19:10
  He wants to assault. He wants us off them, okay?
• 1:19:16
  Huh, I do. I think this was calculated.
• 1:19:21
  I think this was a way to confuse police.
• 1:19:29
  But so you think it's somebody else and I write so that they
• 1:19:34
  would think it was a different kind of killer.
• 1:19:35
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:19:38
  All right, I mean, at this point profiling was in its infancy.
• 1:19:45
  But regardless Debbie left her parent of the her parents at the
• 1:19:49
  school. Play to go pick up her brother
• 1:19:51
  from the local ice rink. She told her parents, she'd be
• 1:19:54
  back with her brother, Debbie never came back.
• 1:19:57
  Her parents thought she forgot and walk to their friend's house
• 1:20:00
  and there they saw her car. It was locked.
• 1:20:03
  Her purse was still inside. It was like where they have
• 1:20:05
  parked it like a real couple blocks away.
• 1:20:09
  Debbie never made it to the ice rink.
• 1:20:10
  The Bountiful Police insisted that she was a runaway and they
• 1:20:15
  wouldn't follow the police report until 24 hours have
• 1:20:17
  passed. So, the community does their own
• 1:20:21
  search around the school and they find a key.
• 1:20:25
  It's very tiny key the kind of key that you would use to lock
• 1:20:30
  handcuffs. Hmm.
• 1:20:32
  In fact, the same key that was able to unlock Carol dorantes,
• 1:20:35
  handcuffs that she had given in the police and Marie.
• 1:20:38
  So the police are now like crap, same guy.
• 1:20:43
  It wouldn't be another 14 years before he admitted that he
• 1:20:46
  killed her and he actually said he took her body. 100 miles
• 1:20:50
  south of Bountiful to Fairview Utah.
• 1:20:54
  They only ever found her patella and that wasn't they were able
• 1:20:59
  to DNA sequence that in 2015 2015 Yeah, they don't have
• 1:21:08
  confirmation of the her identity, until 2015.
• 1:21:12
  Wow. 1975 starts with the press in a frenzy for murders and
• 1:21:19
  attempted abduction, just outside of Salt Lake City, Liz
• 1:21:23
  somehow hears about these murders.
• 1:21:25
  And so she submits another tip to King County Police Department
• 1:21:30
  saying, she's convinced your boyfriend is a serial killer.
• 1:21:34
  In fact, she sends these messages to King King County and
• 1:21:37
  Salt Lake City Police. So Ted's now on both police
• 1:21:43
  precincts list of potential killers, they still don't do
• 1:21:47
  anything they say lack of evidence.
• 1:21:50
  Yeah, but he tapped. I'm sorry, I'm glad keep
• 1:21:54
  thinking no know what you're upset.
• 1:21:56
  I know you're gonna get you're getting emotional about this.
• 1:22:09
  Steaks with cara de Ranch. So he leaves.
• 1:22:11
  Utah satisfy ton, Colorado. Instead January, 12th 1975.
• 1:22:16
  He abducts 23 year old Karen Campbell from Wildwood Inn in
• 1:22:20
  Aspen Colorado. Karen was there with her fiancé
• 1:22:23
  and his children to children, they were all hanging out in the
• 1:22:26
  lobby of the hotel. Karen went upstairs to get a
• 1:22:28
  magazine somewhere between the lobby and their hotel room.
• 1:22:33
  He grabs her, she was raped and killed and found a month later
• 1:22:38
  nude in a snowbank. Not Far from the hotel next
• 1:22:42
  murder. March fifteenth twenty
• 1:22:43
  six-year-old Julie Cunningham she's a ski instructor in Vail
• 1:22:47
  Colorado. I don't know if maybe the
• 1:22:50
  passing time made people feel safer or the fact that it was
• 1:22:53
  100 miles away from Aspen, but Julie was on her way to meet
• 1:22:58
  friends at a Tavern and she just never arrived.
• 1:23:01
  Ted went back to his old Mo of pretending to be hurt to get
• 1:23:05
  women to feel bad for him. He was carrying crutches and he
• 1:23:08
  was asking women to help carry his ski items back to his car.
• 1:23:13
  Julie was beaten. And he later on mentioned that
• 1:23:18
  this time, he he he After first, so that he wouldn't make the
• 1:23:22
  same mistake as with Carol, then he drove.
• 1:23:25
  Julie, 90 miles away to Rifle, Colorado, and raped and
• 1:23:29
  strangled her. He has admitted to, he admitted
• 1:23:32
  to killing her, but they have never found her remains.
• 1:23:37
  April 6, he abducts 25 year-old Denise Lind, Oliver said she was
• 1:23:42
  riding her bike to her parents house and Grand Junction
• 1:23:45
  Colorado, she never arrived her body has never been found.
• 1:23:49
  He told the police that he dumped her remains in the
• 1:23:51
  Colorado River about five miles away from her, he abducted her.
• 1:23:55
  But again, no evidence. May 6 May 6 he deviates again
• 1:24:02
  this time abducting twelve-year-old Lynette Dawn,
• 1:24:05
  Culver from Pocatello in the Idaho pocket l0 is 160 miles
• 1:24:10
  north of Salt Lake City. And this is his one of his
• 1:24:15
  youngest victims. He abducted her.
• 1:24:17
  As she was leaving. School, took her to a hotel,
• 1:24:20
  where he raped her and drowned her in the bathroom.
• 1:24:23
  He told the police later that he dumped her body in the Snake
• 1:24:26
  River as a diversion, so that the police would stop looking
• 1:24:29
  for him and other areas and he said, he changed his methodology
• 1:24:34
  to throw off the police. June 28th.
• 1:24:38
  He picked he looks he takes 15 year-old Susan cross.
• 1:24:41
  She's at a youth conference at Brigham Young University.
• 1:24:46
  She was from Bountiful actually which is very like coincidental.
• 1:24:54
  Last she was last seen at a formal banquet, wearing a yellow
• 1:24:57
  gown on the first night of the two-day conference.
• 1:25:00
  She left in the middle of the event to brush her teeth.
• 1:25:04
  Maybe she has some garlic and she just felt like I couldn't do
• 1:25:07
  any kissing, right? Yeah. 82.
• 1:25:09
  Garlic food. Right?
• 1:25:10
  Right. Okay.
• 1:25:12
  He kidnapped her on her way. Back to the dorm.
• 1:25:15
  He admitted before his execution that he buried her near Price
• 1:25:19
  Utah. Her remains have never been
• 1:25:21
  found throughout. All of this Bundy is managed to
• 1:25:25
  frustrate dozens of police departments because he's
• 1:25:28
  kidnapping each young girl on a different jurisdiction but also
• 1:25:32
  dumping them in a different jurisdiction.
• 1:25:33
  Shinto. So after the Lake Sammamish,
• 1:25:38
  murders in July of 74 police actually put out a request to
• 1:25:44
  everyone who was there that day. If you had a camera, we need a
• 1:25:48
  copy of your film. They were sure that somebody had
• 1:25:54
  seen the killer, he was in the background of somebody's
• 1:25:57
  picture. They wanted to compare it to the
• 1:25:59
  sketches. They already had right now,
• 1:26:01
  September 7, 1974, hikers ended up finding remains scattered
• 1:26:05
  over a huge area. This is the Issaquah site.
• 1:26:10
  They discover the remains of three women who were later id'd,
• 1:26:13
  as Janice Ott, Denise naslund, and Georgian Hawkins There were
• 1:26:18
  over 400 pieces of evidence collected from Escuela.
• 1:26:25
  This confirmed for the parents of these young women, no one ran
• 1:26:29
  away. They were definitely murdered.
• 1:26:34
  so, Everything goes poorly for. Ted, what?
• 1:26:40
  He's arrested for speeding through the residential area of
• 1:26:44
  Granger Utah on August, 16th 1975.
• 1:26:48
  Can I just? Can I just, I just think it's
• 1:26:51
  always a smallest thing they could call on it is what as
• 1:26:54
  hell? Honestly, it's only the Green
• 1:26:59
  River Killer, who got caught because they were like We're
• 1:27:02
  doing the hard science here. What was it?
• 1:27:09
  The Yorkshire Ripper. Same thing.
• 1:27:13
  Yep, it's just it's just it's it's funny to me, it's well
• 1:27:21
  here's what happens. This is purely his fault, 100%.
• 1:27:26
  So it's really early in the morning and arresting officer
• 1:27:29
  Sergeant Bob Hayward sees this guy and he's like going a little
• 1:27:34
  fast and it's a residential district.
• 1:27:36
  So he just wants to stop him and be like, yo, buddy kids live
• 1:27:39
  here, hmm. Instead tell precedes to hit the
• 1:27:45
  gas and lead him, this becomes a high-speed chase on the highway.
• 1:27:52
  When they finally catch em, they just want to grab them for being
• 1:27:55
  Reckless, like, reckless driving.
• 1:27:59
  And then they see that his passenger seat as missing.
• 1:28:02
  And there's a mask made from pantyhose and a crowbar in a set
• 1:28:08
  of handcuffs and an ice pick and and some rope.
• 1:28:13
  And hey words like we're gonna bring them in for the speeding
• 1:28:16
  but this is very suspicious. You're very amongst us.
• 1:28:23
  So then based on the fact that he had all these tools, a murder
• 1:28:28
  kit Heyward applies for a search warrant, and he gets it.
• 1:28:35
  And honestly it was just it was also that he he was murder kit.
• 1:28:39
  He looked kind of like the composite sketch and he also was
• 1:28:43
  driving a tan VW Bug. But either way they get he gets
• 1:28:47
  a search warrant. They go into his apartment and
• 1:28:50
  they find proof of him being at the locations where women
• 1:28:54
  disappeared this isn't necessarily enough to arrest
• 1:28:57
  him. They also find handcuffs just
• 1:29:00
  like the ones used on Carol. The ranch and this is the
• 1:29:03
  beginning of them building a Ace.
• 1:29:07
  I love Carole to Ranch. I have read her.
• 1:29:10
  I read her story long before I research buddy, I loved her.
• 1:29:13
  Carol was ready. Okay, she's like I got you, I'll
• 1:29:17
  come in, he pulls it, calls him out of a police lineup, other
• 1:29:21
  Witnesses from Bountiful Utah. Identify him as the man creeping
• 1:29:25
  around campus, they charged him with aggravated kidnapping and
• 1:29:28
  attempted criminal assault for Carol.
• 1:29:31
  Unfortunately, he's able to make his comically low bail of 15.
• 1:29:35
  Thousand dollars. Which means the only had to pay
• 1:29:39
  1,500. Okay?
• 1:29:48
  Why so low? Something like for dangerous
• 1:29:55
  stuff though. Here's the next part for me
• 1:29:59
  which is really cool. So the detective on the case in
• 1:30:02
  Utah is Jerry Thompson and he's just like the only way we're
• 1:30:06
  going to get this guy on anything, I have to talk to
• 1:30:09
  other cops so he calls up detective.
• 1:30:11
  Robert Capa from Washington detective.
• 1:30:14
  Michael Fisher from Colorado and he's just like let's meet up.
• 1:30:19
  Share evidence and they all agree.
• 1:30:25
  It takes about six months but he goes to trial for kidnapping
• 1:30:29
  Carroll d'orange on February 23rd 1976.
• 1:30:32
  He waives the right to a jury trial and he hires a lawyer.
• 1:30:37
  But during this case, he's a total asshole.
• 1:30:44
  He fires the guy, tries to interview Carol on the stand.
• 1:30:49
  Talking about this was a long time ago.
• 1:30:52
  This was like a year ago. How do you know it was me?
• 1:30:55
  Yeah. Carol.
• 1:30:55
  Like the cool customer that she is.
• 1:30:58
  It's just like, I could never forget your face God.
• 1:31:04
  I just remember that part when he fired his lawyer and he
• 1:31:07
  wanted to question her himself of like you just I'll be
• 1:31:10
  absolutely did and he showed off.
• 1:31:13
  He's like Screaming and Swinging his arms, totally acting like an
• 1:31:18
  ass, right? Because he went to law school,
• 1:31:20
  right? He did go to law school for a
• 1:31:22
  year in like a week. Okay.
• 1:31:24
  So he knew enough even we know he sure felt like he did.
• 1:31:31
  Well. after being a total jerk while he like, Talk to Carol.
• 1:31:39
  He's a total cool and collected guy in the courtroom judge,
• 1:31:43
  finds him guilty gives him one to 15 years in prison.
• 1:31:48
  Everyone involved is pleased. But it's not enough.
• 1:31:54
  It's definitely not enough for the cops who had faced the
• 1:31:56
  families of 18. Girls between 12 and 26 years
• 1:32:03
  old. So, Colorado begins looking into
• 1:32:06
  Karen Campbell's, murder and Aspen and Colorado, files
• 1:32:10
  charges for Karen's murder on October 22nd 1976.
• 1:32:17
  Ted was extradited in April of 1977 and unbeknownst to everyone
• 1:32:23
  involved. This is Ben, he begins planning
• 1:32:26
  his Escape. And that is where we will end
• 1:32:31
  this week. Well, well.
• 1:32:39
  You talked about your boy. I don't like your boy.
• 1:32:42
  I'm not a fan of everybody's boy.
• 1:32:44
  It's your boy not my glasses. Your boys.
• 1:32:48
  And this is, this is America. Is this your boy America?
• 1:32:51
  It's your boy. Oh my God.
• 1:32:54
  Y'all like this guy side note, I left to remind women that has
• 1:32:58
  youngest victim was 12. Yeah.
• 1:33:00
  And there are two of them, which means it wasn't an accident.
• 1:33:05
  I mean, that's just like the same as Richard Ramirez.
• 1:33:07
  Like his he had young victims as well and people were just up.
• 1:33:13
  I'm like y'all see one? Semi decent photo of them in
• 1:33:17
  court. Art.
• 1:33:18
  And now, all of a sudden these guys are attractive.
• 1:33:22
  I'm like, yeah, the lawyers do clean them up for court so that
• 1:33:27
  they can play on y'all emotions. That's exactly what they do.
• 1:33:32
  It was what they did. They make the guys look better
• 1:33:34
  and they downplay the girls if they look too cute.
• 1:33:39
  Yeah, if anyone wants to example of this lookup Jodi Arias, as
• 1:33:43
  what to say her online, pictures versus what she looked like in
• 1:33:47
  court. I was about to say and then they
• 1:33:49
  did the opposite for Casey Anthony.
• 1:33:52
  Uh-huh. Well, no, because they also
• 1:33:55
  Casey Anthony was also an issue, too.
• 1:33:57
  Because remember Casey Anthony went out like party, and yeah.
• 1:34:00
  And then when she went to court, then she was just like a homely,
• 1:34:03
  looking the papers. Look regular.
• 1:34:05
  Yeah, same thing with Jodi Arias.
• 1:34:07
  Jodi Arias was like they put her in like a beggar.
• 1:34:08
  Sweater and they like had her like they had her go back to her
• 1:34:13
  natural hair color, which was brown.
• 1:34:15
  Yep. And they had her wear glasses,
• 1:34:19
  so it's interesting. But for the guys, they want you
• 1:34:22
  to be as attractive as possible for the women drawers.
• 1:34:28
  Weird free. Anyway, Brian.
• 1:34:30
  What's your portion of the day? Going to be about I don't know
• 1:34:36
  if my can like it and I hope hopefully mine brings enough
• 1:34:43
  levity to this damn podcast today.
• 1:34:48
  That was frustrating. They listened to, I swear to God
• 1:34:50
  Bernie. All right, it's always
• 1:34:53
  frustrating. I know always, it's always
• 1:34:56
  fresh. Excuse me.
• 1:35:01
  See because this video, you cut that out.
• 1:35:08
  This is just audio. You can just go flip.
• 1:35:10
  It's okay. Okay.
• 1:35:13
  Let's cleanse the palate, something.
• 1:35:15
  Less depressing. Yes, and the continued failures
• 1:35:19
  of our justice system. Let's so today I will be talking
• 1:35:23
  about one of your favorite things.
• 1:35:26
  Oh, what's that? Aliens, I don't hate you aliens.
• 1:35:33
  I just don't believe everything is alien.
• 1:35:35
  That's what messes me up. That was, it makes me angry.
• 1:35:40
  People are like, oh, this everything aliens and like, it's
• 1:35:42
  not, it's not, everything's not aliens.
• 1:35:45
  This is true. Everything is not the only ones
• 1:35:47
  in this story. May not be aliens actually.
• 1:35:51
  Thank goodness. Oh, it may really be Alice.
• 1:35:56
  So this is like with the Flatwoods Monster, okay?
• 1:35:59
  I'm kind of talking about talking about, of course
• 1:36:16
  it does. Look, it's the Cryptid wearing a
• 1:36:18
  little dress. Yeah.
• 1:36:20
  And that Speedway Flatwoods t-shirt.
• 1:36:24
  I mean maybe later this year, as much as he could probably do
• 1:36:27
  that. Listen, I could be the one that
• 1:36:29
  I told you. I want.
• 1:36:30
  I know. We're going to get when I get
• 1:36:31
  that. I'm gonna get that.
• 1:36:33
  I want the a Squatch. Okay, so we got the big but Mom.
• 1:36:46
  But donk a donk. Now we will have an a spot.
• 1:36:49
  Is this team just going to be booties Azure?
• 1:36:52
  Maybe it could be, just what? So, we'll talk about that later.
• 1:36:57
  All right, we will spoilers later.
• 1:36:59
  Yes. But yeah, just like the fight
• 1:37:01
  was monitored is this creature is an alien-type Cryptid?
• 1:37:06
  This is coming from Dover Massachusetts and for anybody
• 1:37:12
  from Massachusetts. This is the tale of the Dover
• 1:37:15
  Demon. Oh, no, never heard of this one.
• 1:37:20
  So let me give you a little description of this guy.
• 1:37:24
  So it's whole body characteristics, description of
• 1:37:28
  of whatever you want to get. There are they look like a grey
• 1:37:32
  alien? So yeah, as you know, small body
• 1:37:36
  big head, big eyes but it's not great.
• 1:37:40
  He is more of like a blood art. Like I seen pictures of him and
• 1:37:44
  like blood orange looking Okay, yeah, that's like his color
• 1:37:50
  because whole skin color, pick up my phone and begin searching
• 1:37:55
  for pictures of the Dover devil. Dover Demon cowl, sorry to say,
• 1:38:01
  Jersey Devil. Dover Demon.
• 1:38:04
  There you go images. She has a watermelon shaped head
• 1:38:10
  and we're not sighs had like a big ol size.
• 1:38:13
  Bigger, water Metalhead, a very thin small body.
• 1:38:17
  Oh, I like it. So, what I saw was like, when I
• 1:38:21
  first saw the picture like, like Independence, Day aliens, their
• 1:38:24
  heads. However, big in the back, like
• 1:38:28
  those type of aliens, but their hand on like a small Gray's body
• 1:38:34
  like, that's why that's why I don't picture.
• 1:38:45
  There he is. That's the Dover.
• 1:38:48
  Demon is kind of gross looking just a little bit.
• 1:38:54
  He has a large glowing eyes, and spindly long fingers.
• 1:39:00
  Yeah, I didn't I didn't miss that.
• 1:39:03
  It reminds me very much of Salad.
• 1:39:04
  Fingers. Yes.
• 1:39:07
  Which I found deeply unsettling as a child.
• 1:39:10
  Everybody did everybody, do you still watched it?
• 1:39:16
  And also the voice. Hmm.
• 1:39:22
  We got a big old big headed, baby alien.
• 1:39:25
  Yep, basically that's kind of when he's was described as to
• 1:39:29
  get, he's a, he's a be Bellotti, got more head and he got body
• 1:39:34
  anyway. Um, so yeah, these fingers are
• 1:39:38
  just long and he just wrapped her on anything that he touched,
• 1:39:41
  like they're just spied her fingers, basically.
• 1:39:47
  And can I just say that? The people of the Cryptid
• 1:39:52
  sightings period, like of the. So this happened in 1977.
• 1:39:55
  So, like in the 70s, like whenever it is area, this era of
• 1:39:59
  like, citing Cryptids, like these people have a lot of
• 1:40:02
  imagination, either like their imagination.
• 1:40:05
  Like you know, it's the area of the serial killer, the area of
• 1:40:08
  the Cryptid, like is it comes folks were born.
• 1:40:13
  That's see, that's what I was thinking to either their
• 1:40:15
  imaginations one and running wild.
• 1:40:17
  They were bored as fuck or they were Poking.
• 1:40:20
  Some of that. Very good stuff, like his stuff.
• 1:40:29
  Because these creatures they came up with I swear they're
• 1:40:33
  just like damn okay I see weird stuff in my dreams but this is
• 1:40:40
  the real life is what you're trying to say was that is real
• 1:40:42
  life. Oh goodness.
• 1:40:46
  Yeah. So I'm going to I'm going to
• 1:40:51
  give you some of this item. So there were technically I
• 1:40:53
  think before sightings recitals Three.
• 1:40:59
  Sightings that. What?
• 1:41:00
  I have. Yes, three sightings of this
• 1:41:04
  Dover Demon and a 33. Sightings there.
• 1:41:07
  Technically was there. Any other ones after this?
• 1:41:10
  So okay, interesting. Interesting, yeah, okay.
• 1:41:16
  So sightings of this creature to span across two nights.
• 1:41:22
  And like I said, never again after that.
• 1:41:24
  So the first sighting was done by a Eighteen-year-old his name
• 1:41:29
  was William Bart Bartlett. And this is on April 21st 1997.
• 1:41:37
  So it was a little past 10 p.m. so it was dark out.
• 1:41:43
  William in two of his friends, Mike mizuka.
• 1:41:48
  Yes, that's why I'm going with n Andy, Brody, they're driving
• 1:41:53
  down. It's a street is called Farm
• 1:41:56
  Street and this is when William he spots something it's like
• 1:42:02
  it's like working crawling, sort of alone like a bottom of this
• 1:42:08
  wall and starts climbing up the wall.
• 1:42:11
  Like it's the stone wall. That's just like on like on the
• 1:42:15
  corner of the street or something like that and So, at
• 1:42:19
  first, you know, he sees it like crawling across the ground.
• 1:42:23
  Seems like it's probably a cat or dog.
• 1:42:26
  But you know, as he turns in his headlights, like light up this
• 1:42:31
  creature, he tricked, he realizes.
• 1:42:36
  It's not an animal or not a creature that he's seen before.
• 1:42:43
  So it had its two large eyes that were glowing a time.
• 1:42:46
  So I'm pretty sure they were just reflecting his his
• 1:42:49
  headlights. They were like a crown lidless
• 1:42:53
  eyes and just looking back at him and With that watermelon
• 1:43:00
  size head on top of that tiny body and he says it looks, it it
• 1:43:06
  has a peach color to the skin and it's fingers just curled
• 1:43:10
  around some rocks, human ask. Sort of.
• 1:43:18
  Quite the right complexion, but yeah, yeah. he describes it as
• 1:43:28
  Having like you said a baby's Bobby baby's body?
• 1:43:32
  They go big-headed baby little body.
• 1:43:37
  No one else in the car is sees this thing and William drives
• 1:43:40
  away. He drops his friends off at home
• 1:43:43
  and then he hits home and he draws up a sketch or of what
• 1:43:46
  he's seen. Is that, that little hand drawn
• 1:43:50
  one. So there are two different ones,
• 1:43:53
  but, yeah, I'm pretty sure his is the.
• 1:43:56
  Let me see if I can Is it the one in black?
• 1:44:00
  And I think it's as if I can pull open stupid.
• 1:44:10
  The one from Wikipedia is that this is that one?
• 1:44:13
  Hold on. Wikipedia When I search it was
• 1:44:17
  the first picture. It's goddamn it.
• 1:44:20
  This is no mouth. It has a tiny.
• 1:44:25
  I don't think he drew it with her mouth, but let me see.
• 1:44:27
  Nope, there's no math on this pick.
• 1:44:28
  Oh, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah. This is a picture.
• 1:44:30
  Yes, that picture. Okay.
• 1:44:32
  So the one that I originally showed the people, okay.
• 1:44:34
  Yes. That's the one.
• 1:44:39
  That's the one that bill Drew. Yes, have no mouth.
• 1:44:42
  So I cannot scream. That's terrible.
• 1:44:49
  Okay, so there's another one. Let me see.
• 1:44:54
  Where's it at? Okay, so two hours later.
• 1:44:59
  Fifteen-year-old name is John Dame.
• 1:45:01
  Nice, same night, same night, two hours later, this lens to
• 1:45:05
  credibility. Yep. 15 year, old John Baxter,
• 1:45:09
  he leaves his girlfriend, Kathy her, he leaves her house and
• 1:45:14
  that's at the says it's the south end of Miller High Road.
• 1:45:20
  Okay then you know you start sweating.
• 1:45:23
  Walking, he starts walking home to his house and half an hour
• 1:45:27
  later. He, he sees someone that's like
• 1:45:32
  walking towards him. And so this is like he's close
• 1:45:37
  to his house and he thinks it's like somebody he knows from a
• 1:45:39
  neighborhood. So he like calls out to them.
• 1:45:43
  And no answers back. So he was like, okay it is so
• 1:45:49
  you keep walking. Okay.
• 1:45:52
  Side note, it does he think the alien is his friend?
• 1:45:55
  He thinks that he's somebody in the neighborhood that he knows.
• 1:45:59
  So it was walking upright with it's big.
• 1:46:01
  Ol bobblehead. Uh-huh.
• 1:46:03
  Uh-huh. Well because, oh, so far when
• 1:46:05
  I've looked at these pictures just now I only see it depicted
• 1:46:08
  on, like all fours, there's a there are is a picture.
• 1:46:12
  I think it's one that John Mr. Baxter here has grown, I think
• 1:46:18
  he drew a picture of it too and that's the one that's like, it's
• 1:46:21
  standing up. But it's like leaning on a tree.
• 1:46:23
  I think that's him or somebody else.
• 1:46:24
  I did that. Okay.
• 1:46:27
  Okay. It's like darker.
• 1:46:28
  Hmm. Okay, I see that.
• 1:46:30
  Well, yeah, I see a John Baxter is drawing, ok.
• 1:46:32
  I shall also show the people. Yes, yes.
• 1:46:37
  But but so, you know, they get closer, you know, it's like who
• 1:46:43
  is like, you know, you're like like it, so you're not who I
• 1:46:46
  think you are, but who is that? Like who are you?
• 1:46:49
  Like and then that is a peep and little OPP.
• 1:46:57
  So the the reminds me of like the beginning of Shaun of the
• 1:47:03
  Dead when they think that guy is just like singing with them.
• 1:47:06
  Oh yeah. Dead.
• 1:47:08
  This is like hey dude. Yeah that one.
• 1:47:17
  That's not reminds me of jobs like really thinking like that's
• 1:47:22
  somebody in this community grow. If you don't get your ass home,
• 1:47:26
  China. So there are clouds right at the
• 1:47:32
  sky is overcast and then suddenly like just one Ray of
• 1:47:36
  moonlight, just comes out and it hits this creature.
• 1:47:39
  And he sees that it's not a person, and it's really, really
• 1:47:42
  close to him. And so, he freaks out, the
• 1:47:47
  creature freaks out, and the creature like, runs off to like
• 1:47:51
  wooded area. Thank goodness.
• 1:47:54
  And you can close and see the point.
• 1:47:58
  Only is mr. Baxter.
• 1:48:00
  He chases after this creature. He chases.
• 1:48:04
  If he chases after it and this is where he gets that picture
• 1:48:07
  from that. You drew.
• 1:48:09
  These is sexy ending next to a tree, like, hiding from him.
• 1:48:12
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is what happens.
• 1:48:15
  He sees it, like saying, like, it's holding up like a tree and
• 1:48:20
  it has his toes, like, wrapped around some rocks, on the
• 1:48:22
  ground, and stuff like that. And he's like the same day.
• 1:48:28
  These two kids see the same thing, and they both draw
• 1:48:33
  similar pictures. Yeah.
• 1:48:35
  Okay this is okay. See, I'm less inclined to think
• 1:48:39
  that this is made up Hmm. Okay.
• 1:48:44
  Okay. Like that, like that because
• 1:48:46
  it's two independent experiences.
• 1:48:49
  This is true. So I have one more.
• 1:48:57
  Okay. So this is this.
• 1:48:59
  What happened the same day or after people learned about the
• 1:49:01
  first one? Because, see, that's how I feel
• 1:49:03
  like, with Bigfoot. Like some, a couple people were,
• 1:49:06
  like, yo, we saw this big hairy guy, and the other people was
• 1:49:09
  like, yeah, we saw it to us too, and then it became this thing,
• 1:49:15
  but I feel like if independently people saw something or
• 1:49:17
  experienced a paranormal thing, and it can be independently,
• 1:49:24
  Confirmed that has much more standing as being potentially
• 1:49:30
  true. This is true.
• 1:49:32
  This is true. So this one is actually the next
• 1:49:36
  day. Okay, so I'm not sure if like
• 1:49:40
  news got around at this point. Yeah.
• 1:49:44
  See. That's the the worried there.
• 1:49:45
  Yeah. The people want to be a part of
• 1:49:48
  something. So They they want to be a part
• 1:49:53
  of the story but let's see. The third one.
• 1:49:54
  Okay, didn't deviate from the original story or not?
• 1:49:58
  No, I did not. Okay little.
• 1:50:00
  So the certain one this is me by a 15 year old girl.
• 1:50:05
  Her name is Abby. Listen Bart brabham.
• 1:50:10
  Okay grab him. I'm not good with names.
• 1:50:13
  I'm sorry. Especially last name.
• 1:50:14
  Sorry anyway, she sold the Dover Demon and it was standing up
• 1:50:20
  right next to a tree. Three.
• 1:50:22
  And she said it was much like the sighting night before.
• 1:50:25
  It was just like, how was it John Baxter?
• 1:50:29
  Saw the demon just watching. Yeah, basically why they call it
• 1:50:34
  a demon. This is obviously the Dover
• 1:50:36
  alien as they just chilling living his life.
• 1:50:42
  I think Bill was the one that called it an alien.
• 1:50:45
  I'm not sure where he got the demon from.
• 1:50:46
  I mean, I'm pretty sure it was like the newspapers, a start.
• 1:50:49
  That's the only reason why, Yeah.
• 1:50:53
  But yeah, she said she saw it in your like it was holding.
• 1:50:56
  It was up against a tree and it was near some water.
• 1:50:59
  Same as charm Baxter's is when he proof that everybody needs
• 1:51:04
  water to survive. Hmm.
• 1:51:07
  But yeah, those are like the three stories.
• 1:51:11
  I think John Baxter is the one that is, he's like, still
• 1:51:14
  shaking. He's like, I know I saw
• 1:51:16
  something that night cover of the book is awful.
• 1:51:21
  Okay, it's just like an alien. Looks like alien that book it
• 1:51:24
  looks worse. That's horrific.
• 1:51:29
  If it looked like that, I'd be terrified.
• 1:51:33
  Also, apparently there's a book, a movie or know.
• 1:51:36
  It's a short film. Yeah, I want to watch it.
• 1:51:40
  Okay, what do you want to know? What?
• 1:51:44
  Some people think that this thing is?
• 1:51:48
  Oh sure. Okay.
• 1:51:52
  So, since a lot of people seen it on like all fours, they place
• 1:51:56
  out that it was maybe like a baby foul or baby moose, baby
• 1:52:02
  moose are very spindling but This dude over demon was spotted
• 1:52:10
  in April and apparently you from what I read baby moose or moose
• 1:52:17
  moose has moo C's. However moose mises they heard
• 1:52:23
  not like in the area of Massachusetts at this time of
• 1:52:27
  spring so it may may have been a lost baby moose who knows?
• 1:52:37
  But I'm just saying it's it wasn't like seasonally.
• 1:52:42
  Ethical for that baby. Yeah, but their heads aren't
• 1:52:44
  that big, they're proportional only could have been the
• 1:52:48
  antlers. You call those?
• 1:52:52
  Yes, I like this one. Who knows?
• 1:52:58
  So there's another, those thing that I think it's a I think it's
• 1:53:06
  it's the right one is what it actually is.
• 1:53:09
  Okay, okay. So you know what a gibbon is?
• 1:53:16
  A monkey. Yeah, it's a cute little we're
• 1:53:21
  looking monkey. Which spindly fingers.
• 1:53:23
  That, like, wrap around things and big eyes.
• 1:53:27
  Somebody had a pet, they weren't supposed to.
• 1:53:29
  Yeah. And it got loose in 1977.
• 1:53:35
  That's that's like the most the most plausible thing I could
• 1:53:41
  think of because is there a picture of a gibbon walking?
• 1:53:46
  All they're so cute, but they're furry, why wasn't this one
• 1:53:52
  Ferrari? It may have been for you just
• 1:53:55
  turkey, don't know. They walk like people.
• 1:54:01
  I'm showing a picture of that as well.
• 1:54:02
  It walks like a person that's kind of hunched over.
• 1:54:06
  Oh no. I was like, I thought it was
• 1:54:09
  walking, it would be okay. And then here's a picture of It
• 1:54:11
  kind of leaned over. It does have crazy, long arms,
• 1:54:16
  that's a gibbon. Look at those cute little fuzzy
• 1:54:24
  boys. Yeah, so their proportions are
• 1:54:29
  so weird. Monkeys.
• 1:54:34
  Monkeys are just giving these particular Gibbs.
• 1:54:37
  Okay I'm gonna send you the picture.
• 1:54:46
  God. Okay, so I guess a demonologist.
• 1:54:53
  I'm not even on my God I'm taking the demonologist.
• 1:54:56
  I think the team is right now. Cryptozoologist there you go.
• 1:55:01
  Her name is Loren Coleman and she's like she's local to the
• 1:55:04
  area and sheathing said you know, all three of the sightings
• 1:55:08
  before were credible. And like she believes them but
• 1:55:15
  like she believes that they saw something.
• 1:55:17
  Oh, okay. Something they, she doesn't
• 1:55:19
  believe it's that, it doesn't I don't know.
• 1:55:24
  She's like it could have been like I think there was like a
• 1:55:29
  YouTube video interview of her in it and she's like, it might
• 1:55:32
  have been like a given so. Okay.
• 1:55:38
  And like the more I saw like the video and I've sold get in the
• 1:55:42
  walking I'm like yeah that thing is pretty weird and I could see
• 1:55:46
  like because you know how some animals.
• 1:55:49
  Do you see how it might? Like my glasses are reflecting
• 1:55:52
  the light from my My my my screen animals.
• 1:55:56
  They are their eyes reflect lights at night there, like some
• 1:56:00
  like cats dogs, they have eyes that shoot you.
• 1:56:03
  Yeah. So there are also some other
• 1:56:10
  strange incidents that happened in this area.
• 1:56:14
  Okay. Not, I guess not like Dover
• 1:56:19
  Demon. This, I mean, there's another
• 1:56:21
  one that happened and 1972. So this is like five years
• 1:56:26
  before at least three kids solve this, okay?
• 1:56:30
  And this guy his name is Mark Senate and he said he swore he
• 1:56:37
  saw a creature in the woods and it had something that glowing
• 1:56:41
  red and glowing eyes. And like he turned his
• 1:56:45
  headlights on of course to see it in the the he saw the eyes
• 1:56:50
  and it was a small figure that was moving through the woods at
• 1:56:52
  the edge of the pond and He's like, maybe I saw a listing that
• 1:56:59
  these kids are seeing hmm. Who knows.
• 1:57:03
  Okay. Um but I read that there was
• 1:57:07
  like some type of like buried treasure or something there and
• 1:57:12
  Dover, I'm trying to load a geez.
• 1:57:15
  Oh so no. Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay.
• 1:57:18
  So this is from the 1600s, okay? And there were sightings of the
• 1:57:23
  devil on Horseback in this house.
• 1:57:28
  Yes. Yeah.
• 1:57:31
  Isn't that one of the like Heart Like harbingers of the
• 1:57:34
  Apocalypse? People be seeing that all the
• 1:57:38
  time. People do see the whole time?
• 1:57:40
  No 60 countries. I'm just saying people seem to
• 1:57:45
  see the devil constantly. Oh yeah.
• 1:57:48
  Always taken photo. I mean that was always route us
• 1:57:52
  hmm But I'm sure like I'm sure I read it somewhere that there's
• 1:57:56
  like some type of like buried treasure or some treasure that
• 1:58:00
  was in this area as well. That people were like looking
• 1:58:06
  for something. Something like That I don't
• 1:58:07
  know. Correct me if I'm wrong if
• 1:58:09
  you're from this area or if you do more research than I do.
• 1:58:12
  Yeah. But yeah, that's that's kind of
• 1:58:17
  what I got for interesting. Yeah.
• 1:58:20
  Like yeah. I got a little alien Cryptid.
• 1:58:26
  For today, you know, Ted Bundy, in Aliens, they go help.
• 1:58:30
  You are happy with the first half of that.
• 1:58:32
  Part of mine will be back with the second half of it next week.
• 1:58:37
  I was not happy with that. Actually, I was really happy.
• 1:58:41
  Neither was I it took me a long time.
• 1:58:43
  I had to keep like, forcing myself to come back and work on
• 1:58:46
  it. Yeah, I remember how you told me
• 1:58:47
  to stop. That times that times.
• 1:58:52
  Well, I already got the jump on the next one.
• 1:58:54
  So I've been working on that one already, so there you go.
• 1:59:00
  All right. Yeah.
• 1:59:02
  See next week is what I'm probably going to be more mad.
• 1:59:08
  That means I'm gonna be more mad.
• 1:59:09
  Got it. They hate you hate flows through
• 1:59:11
  me. Oh, that kind of mad, got it.
• 1:59:17
  Ted Bundy had called, that's gonna be a shirt.
• 1:59:20
  I'm gonna make it. I wish I had thought to make it
• 1:59:26
  ahead of time so I can have it on during this podcast, will get
• 1:59:32
  it made okay their faith. But anyway, thank you so much
• 1:59:37
  for listening watching only like 100 people on YouTube want to
• 1:59:41
  see it but that's okay. Watch this on YouTube.
• 1:59:44
  Like this, your face. As you can see my reactions.
• 1:59:46
  You see my face like how my face was twitching today.
• 1:59:49
  It was really fun. Oh God, thank you so much for
• 1:59:55
  supporting us. Like I said, it's a shirt stuff.
• 1:59:59
  We have beanies cute, little mugs, there's my face.
• 2:00:06
  There's Brian's face. You all have a good night.
• 2:00:12
  Yes, good night.