Latest / Love Conquers Fear / #46: (Part 1) What Near-Death Experiences Say About Consciousness and the Afterlife — Eben Alexander

Transcript

#46: (Part 1) What Near-Death Experiences Say About Consciousness and the Afterlife — Eben Alexander · Love Conquers Fear

• 0:00
  You can do no wrong means we have the choice and we can
• 0:03
  choose, you know, the highest pathway of love, connection,
• 0:06
  compassion, taking care of others or we can be egotistical
• 0:11
  and and selfish and greedy and try and grab it all for
• 0:13
  ourselves. The beauty is when you have this
• 0:15
  larger perspective and especially a perspective that
• 0:18
  acknowledges the reality of the afterlife and of reincarnation.
• 0:22
  The Life reviews all these beautiful, rich pieces of kind
• 0:26
  of sentient existence that come to light with this kind of
• 0:28
  evidence and scientific study. All is well.
• 0:31
  I mean, all is truly well. Our responsibility is to grow as
• 0:35
  souls, to contribute to the higher good, ultimately to
• 0:38
  awaken. Welcome back everybody to the
• 0:44
  Love Conquers Fear podcast. As I mentioned at the beginning
• 0:48
  of this year, my theme for the year is Embodiment and the guest
• 0:53
  I have on today. We did a meditation this morning
• 0:56
  with Mark Gober, who you saw on episode 2, as well as Niraj
• 1:01
  Mehta, who you're going to see on the following episode.
• 1:04
  An amazingly spiritual person who is an incredible capitalist
• 1:09
  and one of the one of the most soulful people I know.
• 1:13
  And that was extremely powerful to do together, created a real
• 1:17
  energy field where we all had a very transcendent experience
• 1:21
  together rooted deeply in love. So I'm continuing to practice
• 1:25
  embodiment. Feel free to join with me and
• 1:29
  really practice what we're learning here in reading all of
• 1:33
  these books. Also, this is a two-part episode
• 1:39
  that you're watching and Part 1 is here in the movie room, in
• 1:44
  the podcast room and Part 2 is on stage.
• 1:48
  So I'm so excited that we're going to be recording that
• 1:50
  tonight and you'll get to see both parts.
• 1:55
  This is a this is a real special day for me because at the
• 2:00
  beginning of what I called my soul quest, which happened in
• 2:04
  Kerala, India, where I watch the documentary inner worlds, Outer
• 2:08
  Worlds, which I've recommended many times on this podcast.
• 2:11
  You can get that for free on YouTube.
• 2:13
  It's a great documentary that brings together science and
• 2:16
  spirituality. I also in Kerala, that was the
• 2:19
  first time I read Proof of Heaven by Evan Alexander.
• 2:24
  And I loved it so much and it moved me so much that I
• 2:28
  immediately downloaded on Audible his second book, The Map
• 2:33
  of Heaven, and read that also in Kerala.
• 2:37
  And I am just so honored that today I have Evan Alexander in
• 2:43
  our home. And wow, this is going to be a
• 2:47
  great episode. So let's dive in, Evan.
• 2:50
  Yeah, it's so good to have you here.
• 2:51
  Well, it's such a treat and such an honor and privilege to be
• 2:53
  with you. Looking forward to this for a
• 2:55
  long time. Well, glad we're together.
• 2:57
  Likewise, I mean. This is a this is dream come
• 3:00
  true for me. You.
• 3:01
  You really, you really shifted my heart in a beautiful way.
• 3:06
  I had had a number of experiences growing up with,
• 3:12
  with source God, with, you know, consciousness where, you know,
• 3:16
  in prayer, I could really feel that presence of God, you know,
• 3:22
  very deeply and knew that that was real.
• 3:28
  And then through psychedelic experiences, I had deeper
• 3:32
  experiences with that. It led to this project I'm
• 3:35
  working on with Love Conquers Fear, which I'm self funding.
• 3:39
  I'm really just focused on getting humanity to have a heart
• 3:42
  shift. But it was your book, Proof of
• 3:45
  Heaven, which really just opened me up even more.
• 3:49
  It made me realize, you know, those experiences I had growing
• 3:53
  up, the psychedelic experiences, there was a lot more to it.
• 3:56
  And it seems like the most transcendent experiences of all
• 4:00
  with Source are a near death experience.
• 4:03
  And your book, I think, is the most well known on near death
• 4:08
  experiences at this point. And the thing that I love about
• 4:12
  your book, outside of just the, the complete arc of it and, and
• 4:17
  the beauty and the the awe and humility in your voice when you
• 4:20
  read it. I always recommend to people
• 4:22
  that they get it on Audible is that, you know, here you are as
• 4:26
  this harbor trained neurosurgeon who's clearly, you know, very
• 4:32
  intelligent. You grew up, you know, kind of,
• 4:35
  you know, I'd say losing your faith a bit, you know, more,
• 4:38
  more agnostic. And you had patients coming back
• 4:42
  saying, Evan, you know, I've seen the light and you're like,
• 4:45
  really, you know, until it happened to you.
• 4:50
  So maybe we start there and just take people through what
• 4:54
  happened to you. And one thing that I would like
• 4:59
  to try to do in this episode, which is hard to do, is there's
• 5:05
  a big reveal in the book itself that really makes it all snap
• 5:09
  into focus for you. And I'd like to not disclose
• 5:13
  that on this episode because because when that happened in
• 5:17
  the book, I just started crying, you know, tears of joy when I
• 5:21
  was in Kerala, India. And I think that we should save
• 5:25
  that surprise for the guest. We should, I'll, I'll just
• 5:27
  comment briefly though that you mentioned the audio book and
• 5:30
  people told me many time that they've read the book and many
• 5:34
  of them didn't listen to the audiobook and they say they got
• 5:36
  so much more out of the audiobook.
• 5:38
  It's the same words, identical. No, no, no change.
• 5:41
  But there were parts of that you can hear in the voice, the
• 5:45
  emotion and especially the part you're referring to towards the
• 5:48
  end of the book, the kind of climactic realization.
• 5:51
  I had to record that about six or seven times.
• 5:53
  I would just, I get so emotional and justice breakdown.
• 5:57
  Another take, another take, another take, until finally we
• 5:59
  had one that we thought would work.
• 6:00
  But the emotion is still there. Yeah, you know, you can hear it
• 6:03
  in in these books. I mean, you know, my, my
• 6:06
  publisher, the executive director of the publishers, JD
• 6:09
  Messenger, who wrote 11 days in May amazing, amazing book.
• 6:13
  And he also reads it and you can hear parts where he's in tears.
• 6:17
  And you know, I've recommended to people on this podcast Into
• 6:21
  the Magic Shop by James Doty, incredible book.
• 6:25
  That one on Audible again, you can hear him in tears in moments
• 6:30
  in that book. So it's just.
• 6:31
  The beauty of the of the voice and, and audio books carry that
• 6:34
  so perfectly. I mean, I couldn't imagine
• 6:37
  asking someone else to read it. And I was so grateful when Simon
• 6:41
  and Schuster Audio said, sure, we like your voice, why don't
• 6:44
  you do it? And that that was, to me, a
• 6:47
  tremendous relief. I wouldn't want anybody else
• 6:49
  reading it because I think then that would be inauthentic to
• 6:52
  people. Well, it's your soul song.
• 6:53
  Yeah. Absolutely.
• 6:54
  Yeah. So to get to your question, it's
• 6:57
  important to point out who I was before my father, my adoptive
• 7:01
  father, because adoption is a very important part of my story.
• 7:05
  But I was very fortunate to be adopted in a wonderful, loving
• 7:08
  family. And my father had been a combat
• 7:10
  surge in the Second World War. I still have it, my bedside, his
• 7:14
  little pocket Bible, New Testament Psalms that he had
• 7:17
  with him on the battlefields of New Guinea, Philippines, and
• 7:21
  then up into Japan. And he had been his his own
• 7:25
  grandfather was a general surgeon who would take him to
• 7:27
  Presbyterian Church in Eastern Tennessee his whole life.
• 7:31
  And my dad got through World War Two, 2 1/2 years overseas with a
• 7:35
  lot of battle, a lot of hardship, a lot of death.
• 7:37
  He almost died of hepatitis. And then on the ships headed to
• 7:42
  Japan at the end, you know, and then boom, the end of that war
• 7:49
  through, you know, the, the bombings.
• 7:51
  Anyway, the bottom line is he came back to this world a very
• 7:55
  kind of intact. And I think it was his strong
• 7:57
  belief in God. And he also was very scientific.
• 8:01
  He was fully up to speed on Big Bang cosmology, the fine tuning
• 8:05
  of physical consonance. He knew all of that and, and
• 8:08
  neuroscience. And yet he was very comfortable
• 8:11
  with this infinitely loving God force that he had sensed his
• 8:15
  whole life. So to me, he instilled that in
• 8:17
  me to some degree. But I remember having this
• 8:20
  debate with my 6th grade conference information church,
• 8:23
  Methodist, church teacher, and she was teaching me about
• 8:27
  Genesis and I was trying to teach her about Big Bang
• 8:29
  cosmology and all that kind of thing.
• 8:31
  So I always knew science was a pathway to truth.
• 8:34
  But like so many in our society, I made the mistake of thinking
• 8:37
  Newtonian deterministic science is a pathway to truth.
• 8:41
  And I missed how important quantum physics was in being the
• 8:46
  pathway to truth and why it's so mysterious.
• 8:48
  And that has everything to do with the brain mind connection.
• 8:51
  So I didn't really acknowledge all that before my coma, but my
• 8:54
  coma forced me by giving me very solid proof because of the
• 9:01
  severe meningitis that was well documented to have taken down my
• 9:04
  entire neocortex. And you know, from a
• 9:07
  neuroscientific point of view, one of the most beautiful models
• 9:11
  for human death is to get meningitis, have bacteria
• 9:16
  destroying the cortex. They they attack the brain stem
• 9:19
  and other things too. But the cortex, the outer
• 9:22
  surface is what neuroscience kind of attributes with all the
• 9:25
  main details of conscious awareness.
• 9:27
  Everything we see here, smell, touch, body awareness, our
• 9:32
  awareness of our surround, memories of past events,
• 9:35
  executive function to future events, you know, motor control,
• 9:39
  planning, every bit of it is in that six layer 6 cell layer
• 9:45
  neocortex that has profound kind of calculation abilities and
• 9:52
  disable that. And this astonishing thing most
• 9:55
  people would think, oh, you take down the neocortex with
• 9:58
  meningitis, there goes conscious awareness.
• 10:01
  It's the exact opposite. It's like the blinders come off
• 10:05
  and the awareness was just at, you know, ultra reality, this
• 10:09
  incredible experience. And it's what so many others,
• 10:13
  millions have been to a similar place.
• 10:15
  They get that. And yet it, it, it's so contrary
• 10:19
  to what our culture teaches us about the brain, mind and
• 10:22
  consciousness. And, you know, we have a very
• 10:25
  strongly materialistic culture. In other words, that the brain,
• 10:29
  you know, physical stuff is all that exists.
• 10:31
  And so things like thoughts, beliefs, attitudes are, you
• 10:34
  know, vaporware, They're not, they're not real.
• 10:36
  And yet they, what you discover in this this, this journey is
• 10:44
  that they are what does exist. And the material actually
• 10:47
  emerges from the mental, from the spiritual.
• 10:49
  And spiritual is a word that to me, it doesn't have to be
• 10:52
  anything religious, but the spiritual is about the
• 10:55
  connectedness of mind and how we're connected really with the
• 10:57
  mind of the universe. And we're all in this together.
• 11:00
  But the beauty is free will is still a very active core
• 11:05
  principle of our existence. And that free will in the
• 11:07
  interplay of sentient beings is what is the real gift.
• 11:12
  And yet this was all stuff that to me, you know, I wouldn't have
• 11:16
  been saying these words 18 years ago before my, my coma.
• 11:20
  So, and then what I went through in those seven days absolutely
• 11:26
  shocked me into reality. I will say upfront that it took
• 11:29
  me a good two months after my coma up and down and up and down
• 11:34
  about how to interpret it, you know, this rich spiritual
• 11:38
  evidence and then my materialistic kind of training
• 11:41
  and teaching and assumptions that were just false.
• 11:44
  And so it was really the conflict between those two and
• 11:47
  especially about personal elements of the NDE related to
• 11:52
  my, you know, family and kind of soul journey that allowed me to
• 11:57
  come to some of the absolutely wonderful, hopeful, optimistic
• 12:02
  kind of conclusions about the nature of our existence as human
• 12:06
  beings. So to me that, you know, going
• 12:09
  through that weakened coma is really about the best gift in my
• 12:13
  whole life, other than I would say my adoption, abandonment
• 12:16
  wound. That was very important, and
• 12:18
  that was something that was resolved beautifully in the near
• 12:21
  death experience and in the 18 years of, you know, assimilating
• 12:25
  that since the events occurred in 2008.
• 12:27
  Yeah. Take take us through his part of
• 12:31
  the book. That's just absolutely magical.
• 12:34
  And I think it's fine to discuss here.
• 12:37
  I just don't want to give away the the the big reveal at the
• 12:40
  end. That's a, that's a huge surprise
• 12:43
  is the what, what did you think heaven would be?
• 12:48
  If you still even believed in heaven when you went into it?
• 12:52
  And then what was heaven actually that when you saw it?
• 12:56
  Because that's, that's just, I mean, that part of the book
• 13:00
  I've, I've listened to multiple times and, and it's, it's just,
• 13:05
  it's transcendent. It really is transcendent.
• 13:07
  Well, I, I think, you know, I, I discussed how with under my
• 13:12
  father's influence, I, I wanted to believe in what he, what he
• 13:17
  taught me and what I learned in church about God and an
• 13:20
  afterlife and the beauty of love and all those teachings of
• 13:23
  Christ. I mean, I wanted to believe a
• 13:25
  review bit of it. And yet I spent 15 years
• 13:29
  teaching neurosurgery and as as associate professor at Harvard
• 13:32
  Medical School. And over those years, I found it
• 13:36
  more and more challenging. The more I learned about the
• 13:37
  brain and and mind and consciousness, the more I found
• 13:41
  it challenging. How does consciousness come into
• 13:44
  existence related to the brain? Now, of course, most of
• 13:47
  neuroscience were taught the brain creates consciousness kind
• 13:51
  of de Novo out of physical matter.
• 13:53
  But that never really made much sense to me either.
• 13:55
  So I wasn't really sure. But I would say over those, you
• 13:59
  know, kind of 20 years or so that I spent in academic
• 14:01
  neurosurgery, it was a big mystery how conscious awareness
• 14:06
  could exist beyond the death of the brain and body.
• 14:09
  And I guess that's why I needed to have my own little
• 14:12
  instructional course. And so it was part of my soul
• 14:16
  journey. But you asked me what my vision
• 14:18
  of heaven would be. Before my NDE, I had really kind
• 14:22
  of gotten myself to the point of just saying, I guess those
• 14:26
  spiritual beliefs are false. You know, that's what I'd come
• 14:29
  to is that kind of place. And I'll also mention something
• 14:33
  very important that is certainly there in proof of heaven, and
• 14:36
  that is I had this adoption abandonment wound.
• 14:40
  My birth mother was 16 years old, unwed, and she wanted to
• 14:45
  keep me. But when I was 11 days old, I
• 14:48
  was failing to thrive. And I think that's, you know,
• 14:51
  not eating and and I think that's because I sense there was
• 14:53
  a lot of tension in the home. Her father had trouble keeping a
• 14:58
  job. He was alcoholic.
• 15:00
  So there were lots of troubles in the at home.
• 15:03
  And so when I was hospitalized, she thought she'd get me back
• 15:07
  after Christmas, but it didn't happen.
• 15:10
  You know, social service wasn't about to send me back in that
• 15:12
  environment, but she was unwilling to sign the papers to
• 15:15
  let me go. So I spent four months in a baby
• 15:18
  dorm, and that's where my abandonment wound came from.
• 15:21
  And I'm not asking for any kind of pity or anything because I
• 15:24
  was adopted into a wonderful, loving family.
• 15:26
  But I can tell you that that abandonment wound was a smoking
• 15:29
  crater deep at the for my psyche.
• 15:32
  And in a very unconscious level, I had doubts as to whether I was
• 15:36
  even worthy of love or existence, you know, if my own
• 15:39
  mother had abandoned me. And that was a struggle through
• 15:42
  life, and I think it affected a lot of my relationships and
• 15:46
  understandings about things. But I'd, I'd come into kind of a
• 15:48
  peaceful coexistence with it all over the years.
• 15:51
  In my teens and 20s, I would reach out to the children's home
• 15:54
  in North Carolina. Any sign of my birth mother out
• 15:56
  there, I'd like to connect with her.
• 15:57
  And they'd say, she's not looking for you.
• 15:59
  Forget it. And so I got used to that, you
• 16:01
  know, way back in the 70s that I accepted it.
• 16:04
  And it turns out in 2000, my older son, Evan the 4th was
• 16:09
  doing a school project in family genealogy.
• 16:12
  And he said, Dad, we need to know more about your birth
• 16:14
  family. OK, fine.
• 16:15
  I'll write another letter of Children's Home so I get the
• 16:18
  very same answer as I'd always gotten.
• 16:20
  And that's not what happened. And as I tell in Proof of
• 16:24
  Heaven, we were driving to go skiing about two weeks after I
• 16:27
  inquired from Children's Home. And they had said, call on that
• 16:29
  Friday and they might have some news.
• 16:31
  And we're driving through a Blizzard and my son, Evan the
• 16:34
  4th is in the back seat. We're headed up to go skiing in
• 16:37
  Maine. Beautiful Blizzard weekend.
• 16:40
  And I said, oh, yeah, I got to call Betty.
• 16:43
  She said she might have some news.
• 16:45
  Called her up. And she said, why, yes, I do
• 16:47
  have some news. Are you sitting down?
• 16:49
  Well, I was driving, but I was sitting.
• 16:51
  Oh, yes, I am. She said, your birth parents got
• 16:54
  married. And I cannot tell you what a
• 16:57
  shock that was, right? And to realize that they had
• 17:02
  gotten married and yet I still had never connected with them.
• 17:05
  And they had three children. So I had a full family out
• 17:08
  there, full biological family that I'd never known.
• 17:11
  And the, the laws in North Carolina then we're very strict
• 17:15
  to prevent reunions. And so the social worker knew
• 17:18
  she couldn't divulge too much. And so she kind of made-up, she
• 17:22
  extrapolated from what she knew and said they're still grieving
• 17:26
  the loss of your youngest sister who passed, you know, two years
• 17:30
  ago. That would have been 1998.
• 17:32
  And because of that grief there, it's not a good time to come
• 17:34
  back in their lives. All right.
• 17:36
  That was very bad. If you read adoption literature,
• 17:39
  you find a second adoption as an adult can be devastating.
• 17:44
  And that sent me into a dark night of the soul.
• 17:46
  I had been taking my two sons to church, saying prayers of them
• 17:51
  at night. That all came to a stop.
• 17:53
  And for the next 7 years, that's the way it was.
• 17:57
  And finally, walking on a beach in South Carolina, two of my
• 18:01
  adopted sisters in 2007 said, don't you think it's time you
• 18:04
  reached out to your birth family again because they realized, you
• 18:07
  know, there was this hole in my psyche and that was really the
• 18:10
  only chance at giving major healing.
• 18:12
  I said, OK, I will. And I wrote a letter.
• 18:15
  And this time I got a positive response.
• 18:17
  And it came back from a birth sister, the other sister, and
• 18:23
  absolutely amazing because that led to a reunion.
• 18:26
  October 5th of 2007, I walked down a sidewalk in Chapel Hill,
• 18:31
  NC, where I'd gone to college. And I thought, you know, it's
• 18:34
  the southern part of heaven. Who really lives there?
• 18:36
  Well, it turns out my birth parents actually live there.
• 18:39
  And I, I hugged my birth father for the first time in 54 years
• 18:43
  and minutes later hugged my birth father.
• 18:45
  The next day I met the brother and sister.
• 18:48
  Over many months, we had reunions with aunts and uncles.
• 18:51
  Incredibly beautiful and also amazing because that family was
• 18:56
  a family of, of pilots and astronauts or people who had
• 19:01
  been in NASA and things like that.
• 19:03
  And to me, wow, wow, that answered so many questions about
• 19:07
  my own kind of a path because I'd I'd had such a fascination
• 19:12
  with flight. I flew sailplanes when I was 14
• 19:15
  in soloed. I made 348 parachute jumps in
• 19:19
  college at UNC. Just loved being up there.
• 19:23
  You know, something about being up and the big view.
• 19:26
  And so at any rate, bottom line is meeting the birth family was
• 19:32
  a absolute precondition for the coma journey.
• 19:35
  Yeah. Because it was a year after I
• 19:37
  met them that I went deep into coma.
• 19:38
  And of course, as you know, yeah, that was a huge part of
• 19:41
  the kind of unfolding of my awareness afterwards.
• 19:44
  Yeah, it's a. Beautiful part of the book that
• 19:46
  the reconnection with them and the healing that that gave you
• 19:51
  was just. I think the important thing to
• 19:53
  point out, though, is that dark night of the soul.
• 19:55
  Yeah, from 2000 to 2008. And to me, open minded
• 20:00
  skepticism and doubt are important ingredients to help
• 20:04
  strengthen our kind of spiritual views.
• 20:08
  And that's why a dark night of the soul to me can be a gift.
• 20:12
  And in my own case, it certainly was a beautiful gift because I
• 20:15
  really had to go back to, you know, square 1.
• 20:18
  And and that was in many ways spiritual, square one, but also
• 20:22
  in my scientific beliefs, I had to go back to square one after
• 20:25
  my coma to then start rebuilding.
• 20:27
  How I could view the world? Yeah.
• 20:29
  You know, in JD Mester's book 11 Days in May, he's talking to a
• 20:32
  divine spirit and he asked, you know, why do atheist exist?
• 20:39
  And the spirit responds. And I'm paraphrasing because I
• 20:43
  can't remember the exact quote, but something to the extent of
• 20:48
  so that there is an exploration with God.
• 20:51
  Oh, absolutely. If it's, it's not worth anything
• 20:54
  if we don't have to work our way there.
• 20:56
  Yeah. You know, and that's why I, I
• 20:59
  love the the fact that I'm part of the near death experience
• 21:02
  community and all of its broader kind of manifestations.
• 21:06
  Yeah. Because a lot of that is a deep
• 21:09
  challenge to many of the core beliefs that we're taught in our
• 21:12
  culture. Yeah.
• 21:14
  And it's important that we ask questions about it all.
• 21:17
  I I know there's a quote I've used.
• 21:19
  I think it's in proof of Heaven from Rene Descartes where, and
• 21:22
  I'm paraphrasing here, but it was something like, if one
• 21:25
  claims to be a true seeker at some time in their life, they
• 21:29
  have to truly doubt everything they've ever believed before,
• 21:32
  right? And and that's basically what an
• 21:34
  NDE did to me. I had to go back to the
• 21:37
  beginning because all my assumptions that I've been
• 21:40
  taught in material science and all of my work as a neurosurgeon
• 21:44
  was false. There were there were deeper
• 21:47
  truths that could reveal and, and, and show how all this could
• 21:51
  really work. And it's actually a beautiful
• 21:54
  kind of sense of connection that we have with the universe at
• 21:58
  large and with each other. And that, I think, is the big
• 22:02
  gift of this kind of revolution, in which near death experiences
• 22:06
  are the tip of the spear. So in, in the book, you know,
• 22:09
  you're, you go into this coma and one of the things that
• 22:13
  happens when you're just in that intense pain and you know that
• 22:16
  this is really bad is in the hospital.
• 22:21
  You, you say that they said, because I don't think you, you
• 22:25
  remember this, you know, please, God help me.
• 22:30
  And then boom, it's, it's lights out essentially right here.
• 22:33
  You know, I mean, in terms of the, the doctor view would be
• 22:37
  OK, it's lights out, he's in a coma.
• 22:41
  But then you have this experience, you know, which is
• 22:45
  the opposite what anybody would think and the the doctor
• 22:50
  community, I guess at the time. All right now there's a lot more
• 22:53
  evidence and we're gonna get into that in quantum physics and
• 22:57
  some of the subjects we've been talking about on our walks and
• 23:01
  last night at dinner. But I would love if you are
• 23:06
  willing to just share like what, what the actual experience of
• 23:09
  heaven was like, you know, once, once you went in there, you
• 23:13
  know, from, from the, from from the worm's eye view, you're
• 23:17
  going through the dark tunnel. Absolutely.
• 23:19
  You know, I, I, I don't want to recap the whole book because
• 23:22
  there's so much richness in there, but just that there it's,
• 23:26
  it's incredible. Like the number I, you know,
• 23:29
  I've read over 55 books at this point in the last in the last
• 23:33
  year on everything from quantum physics to AI to consciousness
• 23:37
  to a lot of books on spirituality too.
• 23:39
  And I'm seeing a lot of synchronicities in them.
• 23:42
  And So what you experienced as heaven I've seen in lots and
• 23:47
  lots of of books and lots of ancient spiritual texts.
• 23:51
  Grasp at the different levels and everything else.
• 23:53
  Well, I think important to start.
• 23:56
  One unusual ingredient of my dear death experience that I
• 23:59
  really haven't seen in such strong degree anywhere else is
• 24:03
  amnesia. I had no memory of AB and
• 24:06
  Alexander's life. I had no knowledge of humans,
• 24:08
  Earth, this universe. It really was an empty slate.
• 24:12
  Now, my, when I came out of coma in the first month or two before
• 24:17
  I really had learned enough about my own medical records and
• 24:20
  how badly my cortex was damaged, I just, I assumed that maybe
• 24:26
  that loss of memory was because of the neocortical damage.
• 24:29
  I still subscribe to my old conventional belief.
• 24:33
  It's not true that memories are stored in the brain.
• 24:35
  So that was a reasonable way to kind of interpret it at a first
• 24:38
  level. But the amnesia is very
• 24:39
  important because it, it demanded a much deeper dive in
• 24:43
  many ways. And for a neuroscientist and,
• 24:46
  you know, Ndes are always tailored for the individual who
• 24:48
  has them. They have no other reason for
• 24:51
  existence. And yet when you, you know,
• 24:54
  study hundreds, thousands of Ndes, you find these beautiful
• 24:57
  patterns and they show this rich evidence of a, of another, of a
• 25:01
  realm that's much more real than this one.
• 25:03
  So they're very valuable in that sense.
• 25:07
  But with this amnesia, it all started in what I call the
• 25:11
  earthworms. Eye view, very primitive course
• 25:13
  on responsive realm. I was like being in dirty jello,
• 25:16
  this pounding monotonous sound in the background.
• 25:21
  And it went for a long time. I don't know how long because I
• 25:23
  had no measurement of time. One other point I need to make
• 25:26
  before I go in deeper is there's a myth out there that's false
• 25:31
  about my story that claims I had a medically induced coma and
• 25:35
  that was introduced by irresponsible writers who were
• 25:37
  trying to, you know, destroy my credibility and destroy the
• 25:41
  story. Because the scientific community
• 25:43
  takes it very seriously because of meningitis, you know, and a
• 25:48
  severe case. The medical case report that
• 25:50
  published in September 2018 makes very clear my brain was in
• 25:54
  no shape to have any kind of dream or hallucination, much
• 25:57
  less than most profound experience I'd ever had.
• 26:00
  And it was E coli. It was E coli.
• 26:01
  Which means it's eating you from the inside.
• 26:04
  It, well, it's not really that E coli meningitis, pretty much
• 26:08
  every case in the literature happens in newborns.
• 26:11
  It's very rare beyond the age of three months.
• 26:14
  So my doctors were greatly mystified by that.
• 26:17
  And also they were mystified because I had a recent trip to
• 26:20
  Israel. This all described in proof of
• 26:22
  heaven where I was. It was part of my work for the
• 26:25
  Focused Ultrasound Surgery Foundation going up to Haifa to
• 26:29
  coordinate a Research Center there.
• 26:31
  But while I was there, there'd been a a plasmid transfer among
• 26:36
  a gram negative bacteria in a hospital in Tel Aviv.
• 26:39
  That was, you know, earth shattering news for the
• 26:42
  microbiology community because it showed us a horrific
• 26:46
  possibility for a new kind of plague.
• 26:48
  And they were worried I might have brought that E coli back.
• 26:51
  So they didn't know where it came from, but it was a a big
• 26:54
  mystery that I had E coli. To me, it's a beautiful kind of
• 26:58
  nudge wink from the universe. Yeah.
• 27:00
  That I was being reborn in many ways.
• 27:03
  Yeah. This is coming in as a newborn
• 27:06
  into a new understanding. So began in that earthworm I
• 27:09
  view primitive course unresponsive.
• 27:11
  But to me, given my amnesia, I accepted it.
• 27:15
  This is reality. I had no real complaints.
• 27:17
  I know when I've described it in talks early on, people say that
• 27:21
  sounds a lot like hell or purgatory.
• 27:22
  But to me, it was just what is. And luckily I was rescued from
• 27:27
  that by this slowly spinning white light.
• 27:30
  It came out of the murky darkness.
• 27:32
  There were these fine silvery and golden tendrils slowly
• 27:35
  spinning. And one of the most beautiful
• 27:37
  parts about it was it was associated with music, with a
• 27:40
  melody. And it's important to stress
• 27:43
  here that people need to get that are our primary kind of
• 27:50
  sensations and perceptions do not absolutely depend on intact
• 27:55
  nervous systems and sensory pathways.
• 27:58
  In fact, some of the richest kind of experience can happen,
• 28:03
  you know, independent of those. And that's what I was seeing
• 28:06
  this incredible richness and ultra reality as this fine light
• 28:12
  came towards me. And when it did, it opened up
• 28:13
  like a RIP in the fabric of that ugly earthworm I view realm and
• 28:17
  LED me up into this brilliant ultra real gateway valley.
• 28:22
  And that's that's where people, I think, make a very kind of
• 28:26
  wrong kind of assumption about all this, that the, the these
• 28:32
  near death experiences would be vague and murky and dreamlike.
• 28:36
  This is vague and murky and dreamlike.
• 28:39
  That world is crisp, sharp, clear, detailed, absolutely rich
• 28:44
  with meaning. That entire realm is beyond
• 28:48
  time. So that, you know, birth, death,
• 28:51
  everything in between can be simultaneously witnessed in ways
• 28:55
  that have never been seen before.
• 28:56
  That's why life reviews are such an important part of this, and
• 29:00
  it's one of the reasons why they're in the ES are called
• 29:02
  ineffable, indescribable. Beyond our language.
• 29:06
  Our language is very good for describing a trip to Disney
• 29:08
  World, but not necessarily so suited to these kinds of
• 29:11
  journeys. In fact, we need a new spiritual
• 29:14
  language to really kind of share these kind of things.
• 29:17
  But anyway, up into this beautiful gateway valley, and in
• 29:22
  that valley, I had no body awareness at all.
• 29:24
  In fact, I had no body awareness during any part of this journey,
• 29:28
  but I was a speck of awareness that was witnessing all the
• 29:31
  events around me. And it turns out I was a speck
• 29:35
  of awareness on a butterfly wing.
• 29:37
  And there were millions of other butterflies looping and
• 29:40
  spiraling in vast formations. Colors beyond the rainbow.
• 29:43
  Rivers of color. Just absolutely indescribable
• 29:46
  beauty. Below us, a Meadow surrounded by
• 29:49
  rich forest, sparkling waterfalls into crystal blue
• 29:53
  pools. Just this incredible sense of
• 29:56
  beauty and majesty and awe and and natural beauty just built
• 30:00
  into it, but no sign of death or decay.
• 30:03
  In many ways it was like Plato's world of ideals, but for the
• 30:06
  individual soul. That's the realm where we would
• 30:09
  reunite with souls of departed loved ones, go through life
• 30:12
  reviews, plan next incarnations, all those kinds of beautiful
• 30:15
  things that that occur in these spiritual journeys.
• 30:18
  And for me of you know, then what I'm I'm witnessing is in
• 30:24
  this Meadow below us are thousands of beings dancing,
• 30:28
  joy, merriment, music, all being fueled because U above are these
• 30:32
  swooping orbs of angelic choirs. They, they appeared kind of like
• 30:37
  Oval spiritual beings, each one with an individual sentience.
• 30:41
  And yet they were working together as this beautiful kind
• 30:45
  of angelic choir, emanating chants, anthems, hymns,
• 30:48
  thundering through my awareness and energizing all of that
• 30:52
  beauty and happiness and joy below in this Meadow.
• 30:56
  And the best part about it was I wasn't alone.
• 30:59
  There was a beautiful woman beside me on the butterfly wing,
• 31:02
  sparkling blue eyes, high forehead, high cheekbone, broad
• 31:05
  smile. She never said a word to me, she
• 31:08
  never had to. But our minds melded in this
• 31:11
  beautiful sense. And her message to me, which
• 31:13
  came in as a pure conceptual flow, emotional flow when I put
• 31:19
  it into words. A few weeks later, writing all
• 31:21
  this down, I translated. And that message to me was, you
• 31:24
  were deeply loved and cherished forever.
• 31:26
  You have nothing to fear. You are richly cared for.
• 31:29
  You can do no wrong now I wish I that last piece you can do no
• 31:35
  wrong. I wish I'd explained a little
• 31:36
  better in proof of heaven. Some people take that the wrong
• 31:38
  way. They don't realize that in the
• 31:41
  light and love of this brilliant kind of perfect world of ideals
• 31:46
  that I'm talking about that in going through a life review
• 31:49
  there. If you've handed out pain and
• 31:50
  suffering to others showed greed or selfishness.
• 31:54
  Those have an especially kind of distasteful look to you in that
• 31:59
  in that moment. So you can do no wrong means we
• 32:01
  have the choice and we can choose, you know, the highest
• 32:05
  pathway of love, connection, compassion, taking care of
• 32:08
  others, or we can be egotistical and and selfish and greedy and
• 32:14
  try and grab it all for ourselves.
• 32:16
  The problem is in your life review all that's going to be
• 32:19
  reflected back on you. So if if you've been handing out
• 32:22
  all the pain and suffering, you're going to end up facing
• 32:26
  that. In fact, I think that's where
• 32:27
  our notions of hell have come from is people who had such an
• 32:31
  unfavorable life review that it, it seemed like a challenge.
• 32:34
  And yet the good news about even those negative Ndes is they have
• 32:38
  the same effect of bringing you into alignment and much more
• 32:42
  towards the love, compassion, kindness route and realizing
• 32:45
  that the narcissism and egotistical greed and
• 32:48
  selfishness is just a pathway of pain for you and your soul and
• 32:53
  going through all this. So it was a beautiful lesson in
• 32:57
  the kind of simplicity that it's all about love.
• 33:00
  I mean, this is something we've heard for thousands of years
• 33:02
  from various spiritual teachers in the ES.
• 33:06
  That whole community is richly involved in this notion of, of,
• 33:10
  of that power of love. And so for me, unfolding in that
• 33:14
  beautiful gateway valley with this guardian Angel spiritual
• 33:17
  guide kind of helping me along to get this was a tremendous
• 33:21
  gift. But it didn't end there.
• 33:23
  And this is for me in many ways, kind of the best part.
• 33:27
  You often hear in near death experiences a description of a
• 33:29
  boundary. And the sense is that you
• 33:31
  approach the boundary and then you have to make a decision to
• 33:35
  go back or to move forward into the spiritual realm.
• 33:38
  And I think I was able to see a bit beyond that boundary because
• 33:42
  I sensed it there, but I was able to go up through yet
• 33:46
  another light portal so that I, I, and I could vaguely sense,
• 33:50
  you know, the material realm and it's kind of plotted earth time
• 33:53
  versus this incredible richness of a timeless existence.
• 33:57
  And I saw, you know, in this valley on this butterfly wing
• 34:00
  with this beautiful spiritual guide in her message, I saw all
• 34:04
  of that material world collapsing down.
• 34:06
  And then I saw all of that rich gateway valley and it's
• 34:10
  spiritual witness and, and kind of eternity, all of that
• 34:15
  collapsing down as I ascended through yet another light
• 34:19
  portal. This portal came from the music
• 34:20
  of the angelic choirs. Beautiful how the music is such
• 34:24
  a big part of it. And of course this is not music
• 34:26
  limited by 4 dimensional space-time and what we could
• 34:29
  hear with our ears. This is, you know, that rich
• 34:32
  kind of ideal form of, of phenomenal experience.
• 34:35
  And probably music we can't even imagine in in in this earth
• 34:40
  school. I think that's true, but I would
• 34:42
  also say I believe that that is where some of the best
• 34:45
  musicians, composers, yeah, have got their best stuff.
• 34:49
  They have a way of connecting to that.
• 34:50
  So I think that there is a way that that music comes to us, but
• 34:54
  of course it's not. It's full ideal richness.
• 34:56
  That's a really good point. I mean, Rick Rubin and the
• 34:58
  creative app talks a lot about the downloads that musicians.
• 35:02
  Get, I think that's a huge part of understanding all this is
• 35:05
  they have source material that's from that spiritual realm.
• 35:08
  And that's what all of us can kind of identify with in the in
• 35:11
  the greatest, most emotive music we listen to.
• 35:15
  But for me, all of that collapsing down and that's when
• 35:19
  I entered what I call the core. The core was a complete
• 35:23
  resolution of all dualities. You know, in our world we have
• 35:26
  dualism and we have, you know, good, bad, dark, light,
• 35:31
  masculine, feminine, all these kind of scales of possibility of
• 35:34
  description of of of the kind of entities of this world.
• 35:39
  And yet there all of that resolves into pure oneness.
• 35:43
  And one of the most beautiful gifts is you realize there's no
• 35:46
  sense of any battle between good and evil.
• 35:49
  There's no apparent, you know, Satan or diabolical force.
• 35:53
  Those appearances emerge as you come way out towards where we
• 35:58
  are in the material realm. And they're part of the dynamic
• 36:01
  that drives our evolution. You know, what we see is good
• 36:04
  and evil in this world is a very powerful tool to shift us into
• 36:08
  this mode of good love, kindness, compassion, because
• 36:12
  that's the the ultimate lesson of the life reviews.
• 36:15
  And in that core realm, I often describe it as a dazzling
• 36:19
  darkness. It was filled with kind of
• 36:21
  paradox in a sense, but all of it resolves through that notion
• 36:25
  of pure oneness. And another gift of that my
• 36:28
  experience in the core realm was coming into full blown kind of
• 36:36
  immersion in the love of that God force, the infinitely,
• 36:41
  unconditionally loving creative God force.
• 36:44
  And God is our Co creator. So that's why he gifts us that
• 36:48
  God gifts us with free will, but we're Co creating with that God
• 36:53
  force. And not only that, but I came to
• 36:55
  see that my very conscious awareness as it is for all of us
• 36:58
  was directly sourced in that God force.
• 37:01
  So we're never distant from it. We can always connect with it as
• 37:05
  long as we're aware of that, of, you know, it's something people
• 37:09
  can test in their own meditations and centering
• 37:11
  prayer, what have you. But in that core realm, I was
• 37:16
  aware of this brilliant orb of light and that orb of light of
• 37:20
  some people in conversation, it suggested maybe that was a
• 37:23
  Christ consciousness, maybe I don't know.
• 37:25
  To me, it was a brilliant or brighter than a million stars.
• 37:29
  And it served as a translator interpreter that allowed me to
• 37:33
  communicate directly with that God force.
• 37:35
  And then there was no need for the interpreter.
• 37:38
  You know that that's kind of the beauty of it, that very deep
• 37:41
  dive in this and it's not, you know, some crazy ego version of
• 37:46
  I am God, but a beautiful sense of human connection with the
• 37:50
  very source of our conscious awareness that is made out of
• 37:54
  pure love. And and that is where the force
• 37:57
  of healing comes in. The power of prayer,
• 38:00
  manifestation of the of the world of our dreams is through
• 38:03
  this acknowledgement that we're never separate from the God
• 38:07
  force. And for me, the word
• 38:09
  spirituality doesn't require any kind of religious ideology and
• 38:14
  it has three major ingredients. One is an acknowledgement of the
• 38:18
  oneness we all share through mind through that mental or
• 38:21
  spiritual realm, which is the origin of all of the emergent
• 38:25
  physical realm. And, and, and that whole sense
• 38:32
  is something that is very liberating and refreshing in
• 38:35
  terms of showing the power we have with our will to bring that
• 38:40
  love, compassion and kindness into this world.
• 38:43
  Recognize that the universe in many ways is a mirror.
• 38:46
  And so the more we can serve as a conduit for this beautiful
• 38:49
  loving force that many can find in meditation, centering prayer,
• 38:54
  going within, walking in nature. I mean, there are many ways that
• 38:57
  we connect with that beautiful sense of oneness with the
• 39:01
  universe at large and all of its kind of gift of beauty, gift of,
• 39:06
  of joy and satisfaction and bliss.
• 39:08
  And this is something we can share with our fellow beings.
• 39:11
  And the only requirement is conscious awareness and, and an
• 39:15
  awakening beyond the kind of toxicity of the ego.
• 39:19
  And that's such an important thing to talk about in our
• 39:23
  modern culture because the ego of, you know, kind of trained by
• 39:27
  many of these kind of conventional assumptions,
• 39:29
  materialism. That ain't necessarily so are
• 39:32
  what have led us into this kind of challenging moment in human
• 39:35
  history. But for me, in that core realm,
• 39:39
  it was just an absolute purity. And that's where I had several
• 39:43
  visions that I often talk about. One that I think is most
• 39:46
  relevant in this discussion was one that I've often referred to
• 39:51
  as Indra's Net. I named it after a Hindu concept
• 39:54
  that I discovered a few months in reading after my coma, but
• 39:58
  it's not identical to hinders net.
• 40:00
  So I now Karen and I, my my partner and all this work, my
• 40:04
  wife and co-author of our book living in mind for universe.
• 40:08
  Karen and I like to promote it as the living tapestry.
• 40:11
  And that's a a beautiful way of kind of sharing the richness of
• 40:15
  this vision that I had in the core.
• 40:17
  But it was really of this higher dimensional tapestry of of
• 40:21
  golden and silvery threads, all interwoven and this beautiful
• 40:25
  interweaving showed. Showed me in that process,
• 40:29
  showed me life reviews and how life reviews are a course
• 40:32
  correction, but also showed me reincarnation.
• 40:36
  There's no way to make sense of this if you don't understand
• 40:39
  that our souls come back again and again.
• 40:41
  Now most of us would say there's no such thing as reincarnation
• 40:43
  because we don't remember it. But the scientists who study
• 40:46
  reincarnation will tell you you have to harvest those memories
• 40:49
  before age 6 or 7. After that, natural processes
• 40:54
  cover them over. So people have skin in the game
• 40:56
  for this life, and they're not so concerned with past lives or
• 40:59
  between lives. So there's a reason for all
• 41:01
  that. But this has to do with a bigger
• 41:03
  understanding of soul growth. And in this vision of the living
• 41:07
  tapestry, the most beautiful part of it was this golden
• 41:10
  center that all of these threads of of sentient beings throughout
• 41:14
  the cosmos with all kinds of different civilizations and
• 41:18
  species involved, all of that, they're all contributing to this
• 41:23
  process of basically the universe coming in this kind of
• 41:28
  love with itself into a deeper understanding of itself.
• 41:31
  And it does that through this kind of interplay, this
• 41:34
  interweave through the sentient beings and their interactions.
• 41:38
  We often use the analogy of a diamond.
• 41:39
  So the diamond is the one mined. All the facets are the different
• 41:43
  scenting beings. And so the diamond, in the
• 41:46
  experience of the diamond, depends tremendously on these
• 41:49
  facets and how they all contribute to it.
• 41:51
  But ultimately they're all connected.
• 41:53
  It kind of reminds me of that beautiful roomy poem where he
• 41:56
  says we're not a drop in the ocean, you know, in terms of our
• 41:59
  consciousness and the cosmic mind, but the ocean in a drop,
• 42:04
  which basically shows that that mind of the universe, that God
• 42:08
  mind is in all of us and vice versa.
• 42:12
  It brings up in kind of scientific discussion, the
• 42:14
  notion of holographic theory, You know, that the the whole and
• 42:18
  the parts have this deep relationship that's more than
• 42:20
  one might assume and that things happen in the whole of things
• 42:25
  happen in the parts. And you can best understand them
• 42:27
  by understanding the difference between the two.
• 42:29
  And in many ways, the mind and the universe are kind of
• 42:32
  holographic and structure, right?
• 42:34
  But this God mind is something that is through all of us.
• 42:38
  We all have acts, full access to it and it connects us together.
• 42:42
  So the spirituality, the notion is just that ingredient of a
• 42:45
  connectedness through mind and then a shared sense of of
• 42:49
  meaning, you know, the meaning of these events.
• 42:51
  We all in our humanity share kind of how we can interpret all
• 42:56
  that. And then also a sense of purpose
• 42:59
  that ultimately it's going somewhere.
• 43:01
  And the and the vision of the living tapestry was of this
• 43:05
  beautiful golden center. And it's kind of like seeing the
• 43:08
  sun on the horizon and saying I'm going there, you know?
• 43:11
  And it's not. The beauty of the journey is not
• 43:15
  about getting to the destination.
• 43:17
  The beauty is in the journey itself.
• 43:20
  Is in the journey. Itself, And that's what we're
• 43:22
  all doing and that's what these Ndes reveal.
• 43:24
  But getting back to the NDE, and I can close this fairly quickly.
• 43:28
  So we can then focus on points you want to focus on.
• 43:31
  But what would happen is from that lofty sanctum, sanctorum of
• 43:35
  the core, I would tumble back down to the earth or my view.
• 43:40
  Why? I don't know, but I learned a
• 43:42
  lot by cycling through these levels.
• 43:45
  It taught me a tremendous amount about consciousness, brain,
• 43:48
  mind, spirituality, time flow. And so I had several journeys
• 43:53
  and and many visions and teachings.
• 43:56
  But there came a point every time I entered the core, there
• 43:59
  was the guidance, there was you're not here to stay.
• 44:04
  We'll teach you many things. You'll be going back.
• 44:07
  I'd even come to believe that going back meant going back to
• 44:10
  the Earth were my view because I learned very early on that by
• 44:13
  remembering the musical notes, that melody that I'd first
• 44:17
  encountered going from the earthworm, I view up into the
• 44:20
  gateway valley by just remembering the music in the
• 44:23
  cadence. That's what would bring that
• 44:25
  light portal back into existence and enabled me to go up.
• 44:28
  So music became a very powerful theme, or what we would describe
• 44:32
  as music. Vibration, frequency and all of
• 44:35
  its relationships, resonance. You know, that's the whole way I
• 44:39
  could even connect with that beautiful spiritual guide was
• 44:42
  who a deep sense of resonance at that spiritual level that
• 44:45
  allowed us to kind of have that that resonant, you know,
• 44:51
  constructive interference and a recognition of our common soul
• 44:56
  connection. Anyway.
• 44:58
  So that's so cool. There came a point at the end of
• 45:01
  all this where I could no longer conjure up the melody.
• 45:05
  And there I am in this earth where my view.
• 45:07
  But now I was surrounded by beings going off in the
• 45:10
  distance, heads bowed, someone holding candles, and there was
• 45:14
  this beautiful energy coming from them.
• 45:16
  It was this murmuring and it was coming into me and it was
• 45:18
  drawing me in. And it brought back the same
• 45:21
  bliss and joy that I'd already experienced up in the Gateway
• 45:25
  Valley in the core. And yet this was back in that
• 45:27
  early primitive state. And then the, and, and what I
• 45:31
  called that in my writings weeks later, I said that was the power
• 45:33
  of prayer, that I could sense I was being drawn back through
• 45:38
  kind of a common kind of humanity that we share in that
• 45:41
  spiritual realm. That's access to prayer and
• 45:43
  meditation. That's what was bringing me back
• 45:45
  to this world. And the final thing I saw in the
• 45:47
  near death experience were six faces that would bubble up out
• 45:51
  of the muck. And I can remember them as
• 45:52
  clearly today as if the whole thing happened yesterday, just
• 45:55
  like I can remember all that spiritual journey richly.
• 45:58
  It hasn't faded from memory at all.
• 46:01
  And the faces were important because five of them were
• 46:05
  physically present in the ICU room the the 4th and 5th and 6th
• 46:10
  day of coma. And I was totally unaware of
• 46:13
  many people who had been there earlier during the coma.
• 46:16
  And what this showed me was those faces helped me to realize
• 46:19
  that the rich part of the spiritual journey had to happen
• 46:22
  in those early days of the coma, which was very important.
• 46:25
  When you then look at my medical records and realize that was
• 46:28
  when my brain was most damaged and most threatened.
• 46:31
  And that's when I was having the richest, most profound
• 46:33
  experience. And one of those faces was of
• 46:37
  Susan Wrenches. She was the only one who was
• 46:40
  never physically present. And when I woke up within, you
• 46:43
  know, hours and a day or so, I was asking, well, you were there
• 46:46
  and you were there, but where was Susan?
• 46:48
  And they said, well, Susan was never here.
• 46:50
  But it turns out, and I'd known Susan ever since 1972.
• 46:54
  We were in the same freshman English class at UNC Chapel Hill
• 46:57
  now to be good friends, but then we lost contact then became good
• 47:00
  friends again when she Co taught at a high school in Raleigh with
• 47:04
  my former spouse. And and so our family knew that
• 47:09
  she had done work with channeling to people in coma and
• 47:11
  very sick. And so they contacted Susan and
• 47:15
  on nights four and five, my coma, she came to me by
• 47:18
  channeling from her home in Chapel Hill, 120 miles away.
• 47:21
  And she was as real to me as the people were physically present
• 47:25
  in the ICU room. So when they told me, well,
• 47:27
  Susan wasn't here, she channeled to you, but she was still in
• 47:30
  Chapel Hill. Of course, you know, I knew
• 47:33
  there that this consciousness is completely non local.
• 47:35
  It's not limited at all by space and time.
• 47:39
  So for her to be present for me it made perfect sense.
• 47:43
  But it was the last face that made the biggest difference.
• 47:47
  And that it was Sunday morning, Day 7 of coma the doctors had
• 47:52
  early in the week. They said I had a 10% chance of
• 47:54
  survival but things had not worked.
• 47:56
  Three powerful antibiotics on a ventilator the whole week.
• 47:59
  And finally, on Day 7, they're saying, you know, it's time to
• 48:02
  throw in the towel because it's not working out.
• 48:04
  And we're worried if we keep him alive, we might just end up with
• 48:07
  a vegetable, you know, in a nursing home for a long time.
• 48:10
  And that's not what you want. And so they said it was time to
• 48:13
  take me off the antibiotic, stop the ventilator.
• 48:16
  Well, it was a few hours after that I saw it coming back to
• 48:18
  this world. But Bond was there for that
• 48:21
  meeting. And they protected him from the
• 48:22
  worst news. He was 10 years old at the time.
• 48:24
  You know, Daddy's sick. And then he sees me on a
• 48:26
  ventilator, completely comatose. So we knew something was much
• 48:29
  worse than he was told. Anyway, when he heard that from
• 48:34
  the doctor, he's came running down the hallway into my room,
• 48:38
  pulled up in my eyelids. I'm on the ventilator, one eye
• 48:40
  over there, one eye looking there.
• 48:41
  And I promise you, I didn't see him with my eyes.
• 48:43
  I'm hearing with my ears. Anybody in medicine knows when
• 48:46
  your eyes are diverged like that, it's a horrible sign for
• 48:49
  your brain stem damage. But it got through.
• 48:52
  He was pleading with me, Daddy, you're going to be OK.
• 48:54
  Daddy, you're going to be OK. Daddy, you're going to be OK.
• 48:57
  As if somehow that would make it so.
• 48:59
  And it got through. And because of the amnesia, I'd
• 49:02
  gone through this entire journey thinking, this can continue, it
• 49:05
  can cease, it doesn't matter. I didn't have any sense of
• 49:07
  responsibility to another soul. But now all of that changed.
• 49:12
  I had a tremendous responsibility.
• 49:14
  I didn't know who he was, but I sensed this incredible soul
• 49:18
  connection between his. I couldn't understand his words
• 49:20
  and I certainly didn't know what a dad and a son were, but I knew
• 49:24
  I had to do my very best to come back and be there for him.
• 49:28
  And in retrospect, it's to me, it's wonderful.
• 49:31
  That we tears on. We named it Bond and it just, I
• 49:37
  cannot tell you how powerful that is just to revisit all
• 49:41
  that. But he was the reason.
• 49:43
  And you often hear this in an NDE, you know, it's such a
• 49:46
  beautiful realm, very attractive.
• 49:50
  You know, why not just stay there?
• 49:52
  Well, the reason is we, this is where we get the work done,
• 49:55
  right. This is where we get soul growth
• 49:57
  done. You know, it's, it's not so much
• 49:59
  there, although the life reviews and our spiritual experiences
• 50:02
  are very important at illuminating and awakening us to
• 50:06
  all of this. But the reality is it's how we
• 50:08
  live these lives that's important, how we treat each
• 50:11
  other, where we put our energy, how we, you know, in my world,
• 50:16
  the best thing is to take care of the least, the last.
• 50:20
  The lost be caring and loving for all fellow beings.
• 50:23
  Acknowledge this is not just about humans, but involves our
• 50:27
  rich connection with the spiritual world that includes
• 50:30
  animals and plants and a much bigger recognition of our
• 50:35
  responsibility as souls to take care of each other.
• 50:40
  And it's one of the most beautiful things that comes out
• 50:42
  of all of this discussion. And it's certainly a common
• 50:44
  ingredient in near death experience emergence.
• 50:48
  And I think the only other thing I'd like to point out here is
• 50:51
  that more than 90% of people who've had near death
• 50:55
  experiences over thousands of years across all cultures, and
• 50:58
  this certainly includes people who've been very atheistic or
• 51:02
  agnostic before. More than 90% of them come back
• 51:05
  not just believing, but knowing in the reality of this
• 51:09
  incredibly powerful, loving Co creative force at the core of
• 51:12
  the universe. And it doesn't matter if you
• 51:14
  want to call it God, Allah, Brahman, Vishnu, Jehovah,
• 51:18
  Yahweh, Great Spirit, Dao, all the many words humans have used
• 51:23
  for that sense of deep, loving intelligence, but we're all take
• 51:28
  up talking about the same thing. Yeah.
• 51:30
  And so essentially, I then, you know, started waking up within
• 51:36
  30 minutes. My I remember my younger sister
• 51:38
  Phyllis arrived there and she was shocked to see me sitting up
• 51:41
  on the bed when they thought I was dying.
• 51:44
  And she said it was the most amazing thing.
• 51:46
  They'd spent the whole week all worried about me leaving this
• 51:49
  world and just terrible, you know, angst in the family.
• 51:52
  And there I was sitting on the bed 30 minutes after extubation,
• 51:56
  looking at each and everyone around me and saying, don't
• 52:00
  worry, all is well. Don't worry, all is well,
• 52:06
  explaining that, you know, with this great assurance.
• 52:09
  And it was such a beautiful gift.
• 52:10
  But important to point out, the meningitis in many ways was
• 52:14
  still, you know, on the retreat, but active.
• 52:17
  And I spent 36 hours in and out of a paranoid, delusional,
• 52:20
  psychotic nightmare. And I described a lot of that
• 52:22
  proof of heaven. It was kind of a wild thing to
• 52:25
  go through, but I knew the whole thing was a delusion and those
• 52:28
  memories faded within weeks. I'm glad I wrote it all down,
• 52:32
  because the rich spiritual memories from days one through 4
• 52:36
  in deep coma are as sharp and crisp and alive today as they
• 52:40
  were right when I woke up from coma.
• 52:42
  Yeah, yeah. Which is incredible.
• 52:44
  And you know, we're, we're recording this 18 years from the
• 52:48
  day that this happened, not necessarily to the day.
• 52:52
  I don't want to make that claim. But a little over 14 years.
• 52:55
  And 18 is a very special number in, in Judaism, you know, I'm
• 52:59
  Jewish and and that number means how high it means to life means
• 53:04
  life. And after the Holocaust, the
• 53:08
  Jews were all shouting high, high, high, like we're live,
• 53:12
  we're live, we're live. And tonight, you know, we'll be
• 53:15
  recording at the Jewish Austin Men's forum also includes women,
• 53:20
  but it's the largest gathering of Jewish men in town.
• 53:23
  So beautiful. It's special that that you know,
• 53:27
  you're this is really a celebration of life.
• 53:30
  And, and one of the things that was asked last night we had this
• 53:34
  beautiful dinner at the home is one of the attendees ask you,
• 53:40
  what would you tell yourself if you could go back 18 years in
• 53:46
  terms of reflections on the ND And what you said was just
• 53:51
  awesome. Well, I think that the best
• 53:53
  answer to that and the way he put the question was if you
• 53:59
  could talk to yourself before that coma, right before and also
• 54:02
  after the coma, right? And of course, before the coma,
• 54:05
  it was just about excitement about discovery and where this
• 54:09
  was all headed. But I didn't know where it was
• 54:11
  all going, right? And I would have just told
• 54:14
  myself to buckle up and get ready to have an incredibly
• 54:19
  enlivening and awakening adventure.
• 54:22
  Yeah. If you even knew that was
• 54:23
  coming. I mean, you know, you fell into
• 54:25
  this and yeah, you, I mean, it seemed like that was it.
• 54:28
  It did and it seemed like it was going to be the end of my
• 54:31
  physical life. But also, I think very important
• 54:34
  to stress that my answer of the bee after coma would be to
• 54:39
  assure myself all is well, not to worry.
• 54:46
  And, and that to me is a beautiful kind of deep spiritual
• 54:49
  truth. And it doesn't deny that there
• 54:51
  are problems in this world and things that don't need a lot of
• 54:54
  fixing and work and effort and soul growth of course be applied
• 54:57
  to it. But the beauty is when you have
• 54:59
  this larger perspective, and especially a perspective that
• 55:03
  acknowledges the reality of the afterlife and of reincarnation,
• 55:07
  the life reviews all these beautiful, rich pieces of kind
• 55:12
  of sentient existence that come to light with this kind of
• 55:15
  evidence and scientific study. All is well.
• 55:18
  Mm hmm. I mean, all is truly well.
• 55:21
  It all our responsibility is to grow as souls, to contribute to
• 55:26
  the higher good, ultimately to awaken because so much of our
• 55:31
  society is still in a very deep slumber.
• 55:34
  And of course, the me before Coma used to think that, you
• 55:37
  know, the materialist age, the rise of science in the 19th,
• 55:41
  20th, early 21st century was this incredible demonstration of
• 55:44
  the power of human spirit and knowledge and where we could go
• 55:49
  go in this, you know, when investigating this beautiful
• 55:53
  world and kind of gaining some kind of mastery over it.
• 55:57
  And that was kind of the sense. And my journey has shown me a
• 56:01
  very showed me a very kind of different way of looking at all
• 56:05
  this, that it's much more something focused on soul
• 56:09
  connections. I mean, that's one of the most
• 56:11
  clear aspects of near death experiences.
• 56:14
  It's something, for example, Gregory Shushan, who's an author
• 56:18
  who's written extensively about anthropologic studies of near
• 56:22
  death experiences in ancient primitive cultures.
• 56:25
  And the most common feature he finds is that the souls of
• 56:30
  departed loved ones appear to escort us over when we leave
• 56:34
  this world. And that is a common ingredient
• 56:36
  with Karen. And I often say no one ever dies
• 56:39
  alone. And that should be a reassurance
• 56:41
  to anybody who lost somebody, for example, during COVID when
• 56:44
  we couldn't be with our loved ones and there was all of that
• 56:46
  death going on, that all of them were being welcomed into this
• 56:50
  beautiful spiritual richness by souls that had already passed.
• 56:54
  I mean, it happened to my own mother, my adoptive mother, who
• 56:57
  passed in April 2019 at age 99, where her mother appeared to her
• 57:02
  two nights before she passed in the midst of a four day coma
• 57:06
  that she was in. But her mother's appearance to
• 57:09
  her was so real. She woke up, got out of bed,
• 57:12
  told her nurse call my children and my mother's here.
• 57:15
  She's really here now. Of course, the me before coma
• 57:17
  would have said it was a delusion, It was a
• 57:19
  hallucination. She's seeing what she wants to
• 57:21
  see. I now know with what I consider
• 57:25
  perfect certainty that that was real her her mother's soul came
• 57:29
  to escort her over. And I have a story like that in
• 57:31
  the book Proof of Heaven, you know, of, of Terminal Lucidity
• 57:35
  and in, in proof of having the stories about a friend of mine
• 57:38
  who is the head of one of the top academic neurosurgical
• 57:41
  programs on earth. And he was with his own father
• 57:44
  when his father was dying. The father had been with his
• 57:49
  mother, the grandmother of my friend during the Holocaust.
• 57:52
  They were in a concentration camp.
• 57:53
  She died. This father had never talked
• 57:56
  about her and never talked about that experience.
• 57:59
  Here on his deathbed, after several weeks in coma, he wakes
• 58:03
  up. My friend is at the bedside.
• 58:05
  He sees the spirit of his mother greeting him at the foot of his
• 58:10
  bed. My friend didn't see her, but he
• 58:12
  was absolutely convinced that the father knew the reality and,
• 58:16
  and this wasn't, you know, imagination.
• 58:18
  This was a deep, rich connection reuniting for the first time in,
• 58:23
  you know, 60 some years with her soul and spirit.
• 58:26
  And 5 minutes later he passed away with his beautiful smile in
• 58:29
  his face. And my friend didn't know how to
• 58:31
  interpret all that until I met up with him about a year and a
• 58:35
  half after my coma and we just had this friendly conversation.
• 58:38
  I share with him my experience. And then it all fell together to
• 58:41
  him how that could be so that her soul was right there in
• 58:45
  reality, connecting to help welcome him over.
• 58:48
  But it's a beautiful thing to share with all that our loved
• 58:53
  ones are there after death of the physical body.
• 58:56
  It's one of the reasons why Karen and I call that a living
• 58:59
  tapestry, because our souls are always alive and the death of a
• 59:03
  body does not mean the end of the soul and those
• 59:05
  relationships. That tapestry is alive, dynamic,
• 59:10
  it's evolving, it's growing, It actually is the evolution of
• 59:13
  consciousness itself. That is all being accomplished
• 59:17
  through our free will and through our spiritual awareness
• 59:20
  in this awakening is a very important step.
• 59:23
  So I'd like to dive deep on the common root of spirituality.
• 59:29
  You know, we've, we've talked about you can have spirituality
• 59:34
  without religion. And I agree with that in in many
• 59:40
  ways. But this common spiritual root
• 59:44
  that exists between religions and I think religions, you know,
• 59:48
  then kind of had this man made primarily man made scaffolding
• 59:53
  that got grafted on top of this common spiritual root.
• 59:58
  And I know after you came out of your coma and you're back alive
• 1:00:04
  and you know, it's this miracle that you have, you even have
• 1:00:07
  memories intact and you recognize the people in the room
• 1:00:11
  and, and, you know, have a full recovery.
• 1:00:15
  That you then went on the same type of soul quest that I've
• 1:00:19
  been on, which is you were reading a tremendous amount of
• 1:00:24
  literature. Try to process, you know, this.
• 1:00:26
  I mean, once I once I had a deep experience with God in a
• 1:00:31
  psychedelic session. It, it's transformational
• 1:00:37
  because it's, it is, it was already transformational to
• 1:00:40
  have, you know, those experiences with prayer growing
• 1:00:44
  up, but it wasn't as deep as a psychedelic experience.
• 1:00:49
  And, and, and I doubt that my psychedelic experience or
• 1:00:52
  anywhere close to as deep as a near death experience, but I've
• 1:00:56
  never had a near death experience.
• 1:00:57
  And I'm not, I'm not going out there wishing for a near death
• 1:01:00
  experience, you know, but once you, once you kind of pass
• 1:01:05
  through that doorway and you see through the veil, it really gets
• 1:01:10
  you to, to do a lot of reading because, because, because it's
• 1:01:13
  like, it's, it's, it's, it's incredible.
• 1:01:15
  You're like, Oh my gosh, like this is real.
• 1:01:20
  But it's different than some of the reality that's portrayed.
• 1:01:26
  It is because of all the, because of all the, the, the
• 1:01:29
  scaffolding that's built, been built on top.
• 1:01:33
  And, and that's where religion gets a bad name is the
• 1:01:35
  especially the scaffolding that is, is divisive, you know, meant
• 1:01:41
  to kind of like tribalize us, you know, and, and, and and
• 1:01:45
  separate us, which you saw in your near death experience that
• 1:01:49
  we're all one, we're all connected.
• 1:01:51
  Everything in the spiritual realm is deeply rooted in love.
• 1:01:57
  We have this free will. We're in this earth school and
• 1:02:01
  the earth school is a teacher to us.
• 1:02:03
  You know, Gary Zukov talks about that quite a bit in the Seat of
• 1:02:06
  the Soul and one of the really transcendent books that I know
• 1:02:11
  we we both like because we talked about it a bit over
• 1:02:14
  dinner last night, his journey of souls, Michael Newton.
• 1:02:17
  It's incredible. Yeah, amazing work.
• 1:02:20
  He tremendous amount of synchronicity between that book
• 1:02:22
  and proof of Heaven, right. But, but let's just talk about
• 1:02:26
  the common spiritual root because I, I really tried to
• 1:02:29
  distill it down for people to say, look, this is what I've
• 1:02:35
  learned in reading all these books where it's the Dauda
• 1:02:37
  Ching, where this Bhagavad Gita, whether it's the Bible, it's the
• 1:02:40
  Torah, you know, Kabbalah, you know, the Kabbalah text,
• 1:02:43
  Buddhism, you know, and on and on and on.
• 1:02:47
  Is that a, we're in a actual reality which is deeply rooted
• 1:02:54
  in love. One of the biggest challenges
• 1:02:57
  here in this Earth school is to allow love to conquer our fear,
• 1:03:03
  like operate with the vibratory field.
• 1:03:06
  That's that's the most important field in the universe in terms
• 1:03:09
  of love has the highest vibratory relationship.
• 1:03:13
  And then there's a there's a really cool, there's really cool
• 1:03:16
  examples of that in the documentary.
• 1:03:18
  I was talking about earlier, inner world's outer worlds,
• 1:03:21
  which people can just get for free on, on YouTube.
• 1:03:25
  And then once we've done that hard work, which is awakening,
• 1:03:30
  then at that point, we can help others do that work.
• 1:03:35
  You know, we can be, we can be a conduit for it because now
• 1:03:39
  we're, we're vibrating at a much higher frequency of love.
• 1:03:44
  And if everybody does that, then heaven and earth, you know,
• 1:03:49
  whether you look at that as metaphorical or mystical, will
• 1:03:53
  come together. And the coming together, I think
• 1:03:58
  is the biggest kind of purpose of why we're here.
• 1:04:04
  And you know, the way I look at I know we're going to dive deep
• 1:04:08
  on on AI and in this acceleration, which is really
• 1:04:12
  the whole, the whole, you know, foundation of the book I'm
• 1:04:16
  writing Love Conquers fear with the subtitle Humanity, AI and
• 1:04:20
  the age of abundance of for all. Is that this, this acceleration,
• 1:04:26
  It's never been more possible to get to this point of abundance
• 1:04:30
  for everybody on the planet. We just have to choose it and
• 1:04:35
  the choice to choose it. Having the free will is the most
• 1:04:39
  beautiful act of love that we could have.
• 1:04:41
  Because then we're recognizing, hey, we're 99.9% genetically
• 1:04:46
  identical. We all have a soul.
• 1:04:48
  We're all connected to, you know, as one and the that would
• 1:04:55
  feel like heaven on earth, even if you just are a hardcore
• 1:04:59
  atheist. Because if we could create
• 1:05:01
  abundance in a country like Chad, which has AGDP of $660 a
• 1:05:06
  person versus our 86,000 here, think about what the rest of the
• 1:05:11
  world would be like. Yes, well, I, I agree
• 1:05:14
  completely. I, I think this is part of human
• 1:05:17
  destiny. It is part of that.
• 1:05:19
  I would say that also includes the challenge.
• 1:05:21
  I mean, I mentioned my own dark night of the soul.
• 1:05:24
  And I believe that the world likewise, you know, to properly
• 1:05:30
  drive this kind of energy, you go through a phase where there's
• 1:05:34
  kind of a dark night of the soul.
• 1:05:35
  And in many ways, I would say the last few decades we've
• 1:05:39
  witnessed that because there was so much progress made, the 20th
• 1:05:42
  century, progress in longevity and progress in getting, you
• 1:05:48
  know, rid of violent crime, warfare, battlefield deaths, all
• 1:05:52
  those things. We're getting better and better
• 1:05:54
  and better. And then in the last, you know,
• 1:05:56
  decade plus, we've taken some backslide.
• 1:06:01
  And to me, I'm not thrown off by that.
• 1:06:05
  I believe it's an important part of the whole growth process.
• 1:06:09
  And I would point out, getting back to your earlier points
• 1:06:13
  about religion, from my perspective, every religion has
• 1:06:17
  evolved from someone, a human being having extraordinary
• 1:06:22
  experience for sure, you know, through, you know, physical
• 1:06:25
  challenge, through incarceration, through all kinds
• 1:06:29
  of different things that that people have to go through that
• 1:06:32
  are real challenge in their life.
• 1:06:34
  And that hardship is what then enable them to see a much richer
• 1:06:38
  vision of reality that connected them with sense of purpose and,
• 1:06:42
  and other things. So I'd say all religions start
• 1:06:45
  there, but the problem is that religions then get there's a
• 1:06:49
  tendency towards a kind of manipulation and kind of
• 1:06:53
  twisting of those deep, pure, rich spiritual truths from the
• 1:06:58
  experiencer to then try and turn it into a system of control of
• 1:07:03
  other humans. And and you know, it's, it's
• 1:07:05
  kind of a human thing to want to have control over 1's life.
• 1:07:09
  And then that can extend to maybe through these spiritual
• 1:07:13
  teachings to kind of influencing other people's lives.
• 1:07:18
  And that's where I think the problem comes in.
• 1:07:21
  The richness of personal experience cannot be kind of
• 1:07:26
  overstated in this. And This is why I encourage
• 1:07:29
  people. And I know this because of our
• 1:07:32
  work with many workshops of meditation workshops using
• 1:07:35
  sacred acoustics that and I have offered that people through
• 1:07:39
  meditation who have never had a near death experience or any
• 1:07:43
  such, you know, deep kind of challenge to their psyche can
• 1:07:47
  still come into a very rich knowing of connection with loved
• 1:07:52
  ones who have lost with kind of guides and spiritual wisdom that
• 1:07:56
  they can find within. So just suggesting meditation
• 1:08:00
  and centering prayer as beautiful techniques that anyone
• 1:08:04
  can use to kind of get to this level, but never forgetting, of
• 1:08:08
  course, that the physical world and our interactions with our
• 1:08:12
  fellow beings is where the rubber meets the road.
• 1:08:15
  That is where we get the soul work done.
• 1:08:18
  So meditation's an important step.
• 1:08:20
  It helps us to connect with the universe, to sense this deep
• 1:08:24
  kind of reality of our connectedness of, of soul
• 1:08:27
  spirit, of shared meaning and purpose to where we acknowledge
• 1:08:32
  that to hurt another is to hurt ourselves.
• 1:08:35
  And that is the the purest lesson that comes out of life
• 1:08:39
  reviews when you study them scientifically in the NDE
• 1:08:41
  experience. Because something like 3/4 or so
• 1:08:47
  people have life reviews and Ndes, and about half of Ndes
• 1:08:51
  involve a life review, but about 3/4 of those experience the
• 1:08:55
  review not just from their own perspective, but the perspective
• 1:08:58
  of everyone involved. So in other words, if you've
• 1:09:01
  handed out a lot of pain and suffering in your life, review,
• 1:09:04
  you're those others that are receiving the pain and suffering
• 1:09:08
  that you're handing out. And it gently nudges all of
• 1:09:11
  sentience and humanity and consciousness throughout the
• 1:09:14
  universe towards this notion of love, but by learning through
• 1:09:19
  our free will and our interactions in this world.
• 1:09:22
  And that's what I think is so important to understand is this
• 1:09:26
  is where we get the work done. And so it's so important to
• 1:09:29
  focus on this world. I in fact, I think that's one of
• 1:09:31
  the reasons why that program forgetting as I call it, is
• 1:09:34
  there in these reincarnation cases where after age 6 or 7,
• 1:09:38
  the kids don't remember it anymore.
• 1:09:39
  But that gives us skin in the game for this life.
• 1:09:42
  And the spiritual awakening is very important.
• 1:09:46
  As I said earlier, in the ES are the tip of the spear, as I see
• 1:09:49
  it, But there are many related phenomena.
• 1:09:52
  They go beyond that. For example, there's shared
• 1:09:55
  death experiences. I know a lot of people would
• 1:09:57
  come up to me after I first gave talks, you know, about my proof
• 1:10:01
  of heaven experience. And they would say I've never
• 1:10:04
  told anybody this before, But and then they'd share a story of
• 1:10:07
  an after death communication or a deathbed vision or a near
• 1:10:10
  death experience of their own. But every now and then I'd hear
• 1:10:13
  something a little different. And here's an example.
• 1:10:16
  You could have a man in North Carolina who's gardening and all
• 1:10:20
  of a sudden he's aware of his mother's spirit.
• 1:10:23
  She lives in Massachusetts, but and she's been ill for a while.
• 1:10:27
  He's been expecting her to go and all of a sudden her
• 1:10:31
  awareness comes into his awareness and they go off
• 1:10:33
  together. So he's he leaves this gardening
• 1:10:37
  and he and his mother's soul go off even to the point of
• 1:10:40
  witnessing a full blown life review for her.
• 1:10:44
  And then the bystander soul comes back to this world.
• 1:10:46
  It's called a shared death experience.
• 1:10:48
  And in my experience there about 110th as common as a near death
• 1:10:52
  experience. But Raymond Moody, who wrote the
• 1:10:56
  book Life Afterlife in 1975 that popularized the near death
• 1:10:59
  experience. He also wrote a book, I think it
• 1:11:03
  was around 2011, Glimpses of Eternity, that he did with Paul
• 1:11:06
  Perry. And it's all about shared death.
• 1:11:09
  That's the whole book of shared. Book recommendation?
• 1:11:12
  Yeah, I haven't read it yet. Oh, it's, it's excellent.
• 1:11:14
  And and I'll also recommend a good friend, William Peters, who
• 1:11:18
  was a a social worker in the during the age crisis back in
• 1:11:22
  the 70s and 80s in the Bay Area. He had an experience of, of by
• 1:11:28
  location when he was reading to a patient who was dying and all
• 1:11:34
  of a sudden they realized that both of them were, their souls
• 1:11:38
  were up looking down at their physical bodies going through
• 1:11:40
  this reading and sharing. And they kind of looked at each
• 1:11:43
  other like get a load of this. I mean, what a shocker to go
• 1:11:46
  through that. And so he had a shared death
• 1:11:49
  experience then and there as a healthcare worker working with
• 1:11:52
  someone. He started the Shared Crossing
• 1:11:54
  project in Santa Barbara, CA Highly recommend people check
• 1:11:58
  out Shared Crossing because what he's doing.
• 1:12:01
  Put a link in the. Yeah, the Shared Crossing
• 1:12:03
  project is very important because he's actually working
• 1:12:07
  with people, family members, who want to engender their best
• 1:12:11
  chance of having a shared death experience with a loved one who
• 1:12:14
  is in the process of dying. And he's had quite a bit of
• 1:12:18
  success with that. I think he tells me about 50% of
• 1:12:21
  people are having quite powerful senses of connection.
• 1:12:23
  So there are ways that we can all participate in that.
• 1:12:27
  And I have been fortunate and blessed to participate in the
• 1:12:33
  transition of several family members in the last few years,
• 1:12:37
  especially in my birth family. And that has been a rich kind
• 1:12:42
  of, you cannot describe how important that is in kind of
• 1:12:47
  discovering the deep rich reality of our spiritual
• 1:12:50
  connections that transcend the death of the of the brain and
• 1:12:53
  body. You're you're meaning being with
• 1:12:56
  them when they're when they're sent away.
• 1:12:59
  When they're passing. But not not you haven't had a
• 1:13:02
  shared the. Well, with my mother, I think I
• 1:13:05
  had a it it the only thing I was lacking was a full blown life
• 1:13:10
  review for her, right. But with my adoptive mother who
• 1:13:14
  passed away April 2019 at age 99.
• 1:13:19
  And she spent the last four days of her life kind of in coma
• 1:13:22
  because she, you know, was 99 years old.
• 1:13:25
  She had a bad pulmonary infection of temp of one O 3,
• 1:13:29
  you know, and she was unresponsive.
• 1:13:31
  And we got a call that was for four days going up to her death.
• 1:13:37
  We got a call 2 days before she died that the night before, 2:30
• 1:13:43
  in the morning, she'd awakened and got out of bed, which the
• 1:13:46
  nurse said should have been impossible.
• 1:13:47
  But she went to the nurse and said, my mother's here, my
• 1:13:49
  mother's here, call my children, She's really here.
• 1:13:52
  And and then she went back to bed, back into her unresponsive
• 1:13:56
  state. And by the time we got there the
• 1:13:57
  next day, she was no longer responsive.
• 1:14:00
  And I spent the night beside her, sleeping on the floor on a
• 1:14:04
  little mattress and had the most incredible, rich, vivid dreams.
• 1:14:09
  And in those dreams, I was seeing her back in her 20s and
• 1:14:14
  30s, you know, back in her early, early life.
• 1:14:18
  I was seeing a lot of her friends, a lot of the friends
• 1:14:20
  I'd heard about, some friends I knew from, you know, their
• 1:14:25
  adulthood and having kids that I was friends with.
• 1:14:28
  But I got to live that in these dreams.
• 1:14:32
  But the things that I didn't see in those dreams that, you know,
• 1:14:37
  I would have scripted, for one, I wanted to see my birth of my
• 1:14:42
  adoptive father, Evan Junior. And there was this great sense
• 1:14:47
  of kind of party and anticipation of his arrival.
• 1:14:50
  But in my dreams, I was not gifted with that.
• 1:14:53
  And the other thing that happened was I woke up, you
• 1:14:56
  know, like, 6:00 in the morning after these incredibly vivid
• 1:14:59
  dreams. And she was still still alive.
• 1:15:01
  She was comatose. But it took her about two more
• 1:15:03
  hours before she passed from this world.
• 1:15:05
  And we were all with her, my sisters and I, holding her hand.
• 1:15:08
  Just this incredibly rich and beautiful sense of communion and
• 1:15:11
  connection and of ongoing, you know, eternity of, of spiritual
• 1:15:17
  soul. Yeah.
• 1:15:17
  I think we all had a kind of a sense of that from that
• 1:15:21
  experience. So it wasn't the ultimate form
• 1:15:25
  of, you know, being able to see her shared, you know, a life
• 1:15:29
  review. But I saw a lot of things that
• 1:15:31
  to me were far beyond my just my normal dream state.
• 1:15:35
  But of course, she wasn't gone yet.
• 1:15:37
  She was still about two hours from that when I woke up.
• 1:15:40
  Right. What a gift.
• 1:15:41
  So yeah, that was beautiful. Yeah, that's amazing.
• 1:15:45
  You know, the 11 story that I haven't, haven't told that often
• 1:15:50
  is when my mom was passing away from cancer.
• 1:15:55
  She had lung cancer. She never smoked.
• 1:15:58
  I had just taken bizarre voice public, had a / a billion dollar
• 1:16:03
  IPO and here I'm at the office, even though I know she's in, you
• 1:16:10
  know, bad shape. But I, I thought she had time
• 1:16:14
  and I'm at the office meeting with the bankers to talk about
• 1:16:17
  doing what's called a secondary IPO.
• 1:16:19
  It's when the, you take the company public, the stock trades
• 1:16:21
  up, you can raise more money for the company so you can make
• 1:16:25
  acquisitions, you know, etcetera.
• 1:16:28
  And I'm, I, I had to meet with the bankers that day.
• 1:16:32
  You know, it's really, really important for the company.
• 1:16:34
  I'm the CEO of this, the company.
• 1:16:36
  You know, it's Mike at the time, the 5th company I'd founded and
• 1:16:42
  I really just an entrepreneurial dream come true and popularized
• 1:16:46
  customer reviews all over the world.
• 1:16:47
  You know, it's used, it's used by over 14,000 companies today.
• 1:16:53
  Wow, all these international languages, it means the voice of
• 1:16:56
  the marketplace, right? And it's bizarre.
• 1:16:59
  Yeah, the, the bizarre meaning the rich marketplace.
• 1:17:03
  And and I'm driving, I'm driving back, you know, rushing to the
• 1:17:08
  hospital. And my wife is there, Deborah.
• 1:17:14
  And she, she calls me and she says she's dying right now.
• 1:17:19
  And she puts me on speaker and I'm saying my goodbyes.
• 1:17:22
  Tears just absolutely streaming down my face.
• 1:17:25
  Just like, Oh my gosh, I can't believe, you know, my mom was
• 1:17:29
  just embodiment of love. She she's, she believed in me
• 1:17:35
  since the very beginning, you know, taught me well, learned
• 1:17:38
  how to program with me when I was age 7, you know, and then
• 1:17:41
  kept everybody out of out of my way.
• 1:17:46
  He thought that I was ruining my life by that by only doing that.
• 1:17:51
  Why is he not playing football? Why is he not doing this and
• 1:17:53
  that? And she would always say just
• 1:17:55
  leave him alone. He's, he's doing, he's meant to
• 1:17:58
  do. He's on the right path.
• 1:17:59
  He's found his passion and and I think that's it.
• 1:18:05
  This is it. It's that's, that's in.
• 1:18:09
  And Deborah calls me back 5 minutes later and she says it's
• 1:18:14
  a miracle that she's back alive. And I got there and she passed
• 1:18:21
  away with me. Deborah, Brandy Chantelle, you
• 1:18:25
  got to meet Brandon Chantelle last night.
• 1:18:28
  My my sister and niece holding her hand, that is so beautiful.
• 1:18:33
  The doctors in the room, they said if you don't believe in
• 1:18:36
  God, like you might wanna believe in God now.
• 1:18:40
  Absolutely. Cuz they were like, see.
• 1:18:41
  It whatever happened there was and it was just a spiritual
• 1:18:46
  experience. Now, I didn't have a shared
• 1:18:47
  death experience, which would have been incredible that just
• 1:18:52
  just being there. With her, it is so.
• 1:18:54
  Important and I have I have I have re experienced her soul
• 1:18:58
  very deeply in meditation as well as as well as.
• 1:19:05
  Psychedelic journeys, but but like meditation, she's she's
• 1:19:08
  really profoundly shown up right.
• 1:19:10
  As well as well as my dad. So beautiful, that internal
• 1:19:13
  connection. That's that's the living
• 1:19:15
  tapestry at work. Yeah.
• 1:19:17
  You know that our loved ones are never gone, even though the
• 1:19:20
  physical body has left this planet.
• 1:19:22
  Yeah. But when you experience
• 1:19:23
  something like that, it's, it is transcendent.
• 1:19:26
  It is absolutely. Is that that just that that
• 1:19:28
  alone was kind of breaking down the materialist paradigm.
• 1:19:31
  Like she shouldn't even be been able to come back.
• 1:19:34
  Exactly. And she and she came back
• 1:19:36
  because that's how much she loves.
• 1:19:41
  She was completely selfless about her children and she she
• 1:19:47
  needed me to be there. She needed me to be there
• 1:19:50
  physically with her. Well, the medical terminology
• 1:19:53
  for that kind of thing, the coming back, the reawakening,
• 1:19:56
  you know, or somebody's been in coma for days or weeks as they
• 1:20:00
  approach the end, but then wake up.
• 1:20:03
  I've heard of that kind of thing happening in people whose brains
• 1:20:05
  have been half replaced with metastatic cancer, who'd been in
• 1:20:08
  coma for months and yet as they approach.
• 1:20:12
  Yeah. And there's no way you can
• 1:20:14
  explain that from a materialist perspective.
• 1:20:16
  It just. There's no explanation, but
• 1:20:19
  there's a beautiful explanation when you acknowledge this kind
• 1:20:22
  of spiritual witness with richness and acknowledge that
• 1:20:27
  our soul has tremendous power. And so, yes, even a body that's
• 1:20:31
  riddled with cancer and been comatose for a while, right
• 1:20:34
  before passing from this world, they can bring life and soul
• 1:20:38
  back into that body, just like you, your mother.
• 1:20:42
  And like so many other cases that I'm aware of and, and
• 1:20:46
  certainly in my own mother, etcetera, these beautiful
• 1:20:48
  stories demonstrate to us the living tapestry at work, how
• 1:20:52
  we're connected forever with these loving souls.
• 1:20:56
  And they're with us. They're here to support us.
• 1:20:59
  And as Gregory Shushan points out, with all those ancient
• 1:21:02
  cultures and they're in the ES, the most prominent feature is
• 1:21:06
  the loved one who appears to escort over when we're leaving
• 1:21:10
  the physical body. And it's a real spirit
• 1:21:13
  experience. It's not imaginary, it's not
• 1:21:15
  hallucination. It's one of the most readily
• 1:21:19
  documented aspects of this whole thing.
• 1:21:21
  And it's very, very reassuring because that living tapestry
• 1:21:25
  means that we never lose our connection with our loved ones.
• 1:21:29
  You told me this story about Morocco, and I just want to make
• 1:21:31
  sure you retell that because we were talking about it earlier
• 1:21:35
  and it was just a beautiful example of the the unification,
• 1:21:39
  right? And, and really where we need to
• 1:21:41
  get is humanity. Absolutely.
• 1:21:44
  And, and that story happened back in, it was December of
• 1:21:48
  2024, very good friend of ours in Paris, John Stone, who is
• 1:21:53
  trained in philosophy and in quantum physics, who's deeply
• 1:21:56
  into consciousness. And he's had me speak in Paris
• 1:21:59
  many times. And he invited us to Morocco.
• 1:22:02
  And part of this was an appeal to kind of connect with the king
• 1:22:05
  of Morocco and other things. I won't go into all that, but
• 1:22:09
  the things that impressed me, we were there for about 11 or 12
• 1:22:12
  days in early December 2024 and gave talks at several
• 1:22:17
  universities, at an engineering school.
• 1:22:19
  And I love the engineering students, these hardcore
• 1:22:23
  scientific minds who were very interested in spirituality and
• 1:22:27
  connection, you know, and to me, to see that kind of powerful
• 1:22:31
  coming together of science and spirituality in our youth is an
• 1:22:35
  important ingredient of, of the awakening of humanity.
• 1:22:39
  But we got a beautiful view of it there in Morocco.
• 1:22:42
  But the thing that we noticed in all these tours, and I was
• 1:22:46
  there, there were there was a Nobel laureate in physics who'd
• 1:22:50
  done his work in laser physics, but had a very strong belief in
• 1:22:52
  God, who I got to know very well, Bill Phillips and his wife
• 1:22:56
  Jan. But the thing that impressed us,
• 1:23:00
  Karen and I were both on this trip is we learned that all the,
• 1:23:05
  the minarets, the prayer towers that put out the call for
• 1:23:09
  prayers all through Morocco, they have on the type of spike.
• 1:23:13
  And the spike has three balls on it, a big ball at the bottom,
• 1:23:15
  middle sized ball, and then a, a smaller ball at the top.
• 1:23:18
  And the balls, and that's been there for centuries.
• 1:23:22
  And they represent the bottom ball is Islam, the middle ball,
• 1:23:27
  Judaism, the top ball, Christianity.
• 1:23:29
  So when they're very call for prayers all through this country
• 1:23:33
  of Morocco, a Muslim country for all these centuries is an
• 1:23:36
  acknowledgement of the one God that they share that it's all
• 1:23:41
  about that one God. And they may have different
• 1:23:43
  ideologies and different kind of stories and scripture, but
• 1:23:47
  ultimately that worship is of the one God that unites us all
• 1:23:51
  and to us. And and we saw that in living
• 1:23:54
  proof. There's these beautiful Moroccan
• 1:23:56
  people, a very advanced culture. And the other thing that I, I
• 1:24:00
  know we discussed that I love to point out something I learned
• 1:24:03
  around that trip is the fact that the oldest agreement of
• 1:24:07
  mutual cooperation that the United States has with any other
• 1:24:11
  country is an agreement we signed with Morocco in the late
• 1:24:15
  1700s in the king of Morocco acknowledged the beauty of this
• 1:24:19
  revolution of democracy going on in the United States.
• 1:24:23
  And they came up with a mutual agreement that is still in
• 1:24:27
  effect today. It's the oldest one we have, you
• 1:24:30
  know, with in the United States with cooperation with another
• 1:24:34
  country. And I highly recommend if people
• 1:24:37
  haven't visited Morocco, it's a beautiful example of the oneness
• 1:24:42
  of religious ideologies and how they're all ultimately sourced
• 1:24:47
  in the same infinitely loving God force at the core.
• 1:24:51
  And it was just an incredibly rewarding experience to meet
• 1:24:56
  those people. And we look forward to going
• 1:24:58
  back to Morocco and learning much more.
• 1:25:03
  But but really just that that whole acknowledgement of the of
• 1:25:07
  the connection of religious systems and to help us move
• 1:25:10
  beyond the the kind of manufactured conflict of
• 1:25:14
  ideologies because there's really no conflict at the
• 1:25:17
  deepest level of what we share in prayer and meditation.
• 1:25:21
  That's when we can all come into the sense of oneness, connection
• 1:25:24
  with the God force and ability to see ourselves as advanced
• 1:25:29
  souls, much more than just a physical body limited to a birth
• 1:25:32
  to death existence. But we're souls with a soul line
• 1:25:36
  in that living tapestry, all interwoven together, all leading
• 1:25:40
  towards this brilliant golden core of awakening and of God
• 1:25:45
  consciousness. And that's where I think we're
• 1:25:46
  headed. And, and it's not a resolution
• 1:25:49
  of a few decades or a few centuries of kind of science,
• 1:25:53
  spirituality, religion, trying to figure ourselves out.
• 1:25:56
  I'd say it's a resolution of more than 5000 years of human
• 1:26:00
  activity trying to come to an understanding of the nature of
• 1:26:04
  reality. And as you pointed out earlier,
• 1:26:07
  one of the most beautiful discoveries in this kind of
• 1:26:10
  journey is we come to see that some of this great wisdom that
• 1:26:15
  for us today emerges from understanding quantum physics,
• 1:26:19
  neuroscience and the hard problem of consciousness.
• 1:26:22
  Philosophy minded, the binding problem, parapsychology, all the
• 1:26:26
  evidence for non local consciousness, telepathy, remote
• 1:26:29
  viewing, you know, Gansfeld telepathy, etcetera.
• 1:26:33
  Every bit of that assembles. And this is kind of what we do
• 1:26:37
  in our book Living in a Mindful Universe is we take all of that
• 1:26:40
  rich material and start to assemble it in a way that
• 1:26:44
  demonstrates that consciousness is fundamental in the universe,
• 1:26:48
  right? And so now we had this great.
• 1:26:50
  And, and it's actually astonishing when you look at
• 1:26:53
  quantum physics and what it's been teaching us for the last
• 1:26:55
  100 years about this, the primacy of consciousness, and
• 1:26:59
  also about how all of this physical world that we assume,
• 1:27:04
  you know, is a independent of us.
• 1:27:06
  You know, that's the kind of realism part of it, that there's
• 1:27:09
  an objective reality out there. But quantum physics tells us no.
• 1:27:12
  When you get right down, you scrub deep into the atoms and
• 1:27:16
  the electrons and the the quantum particles.
• 1:27:19
  What you find is the observing mind plays a big role in
• 1:27:24
  determining what those experiments show in the behavior
• 1:27:27
  of those particles. As Pasquale Jordan said, our
• 1:27:30
  observations not only reveal reality, but they actually
• 1:27:34
  create it. And that is, you know, kind of a
• 1:27:38
  deep mystery. And but and yet when you start
• 1:27:40
  to acknowledge the primacy of consciousness and understand
• 1:27:44
  that it's a natural flow, what kind of a top down causality
• 1:27:47
  from that God mind into this world?
• 1:27:50
  Because I think the mistake that materialist scientists have made
• 1:27:55
  for many decades now is this assumption that if you study the
• 1:27:59
  electrons and quartz and the protons and neutrons and atoms
• 1:28:02
  and molecules and cells of the brain and all that stuff, but
• 1:28:05
  you get right at the particle level that understand all those
• 1:28:09
  laws and then you'll understand how this world emerges.
• 1:28:12
  But that doesn't acknowledge that there's a tremendous role
• 1:28:15
  of free will of sentient beings in what that observation is.
• 1:28:20
  And it's because the theater that we're witnessing is the the
• 1:28:23
  theater of consciousness, the objective physical reality is
• 1:28:28
  not there as such. And this is especially revealed
• 1:28:32
  when you, you know, if you study life reviews in, in near death
• 1:28:37
  experiences, you start to realize the universe seems to
• 1:28:42
  have this, this incredibly powerful interest in our lives,
• 1:28:47
  our thoughts, our actions, to the point where when we leave
• 1:28:51
  this world of, you know, half of people who have Ndes have these
• 1:28:56
  profound life reviews that are a reliving of events.
• 1:29:01
  It's not a remembering, it's a reliving as if the events are
• 1:29:05
  still ongoing, something like 33%.
• 1:29:08
  In a study from University of Virginia by Bruce Grayson, 33%
• 1:29:12
  of life reviews evolve the entire life.
• 1:29:15
  And you say, wait a minute, how can you go through your whole
• 1:29:17
  life during, say, a 10 minute cardiac arrest?
• 1:29:20
  And the reason is we're under an illusion here in the physical
• 1:29:24
  realm of time pass, right? But ultimately, no, there's a
• 1:29:28
  much bigger theater of operations in which all of that
• 1:29:32
  is available for review and for modification, right?
• 1:29:36
  And that's why life reviews are so important.
• 1:29:39
  But ultimately, they also teach us as individual souls and over
• 1:29:43
  time, nudging all of humanity towards this acknowledgement of
• 1:29:47
  our connectedness. If I heard another, I'm hurting
• 1:29:49
  myself. It's all about that beautiful
• 1:29:53
  sense of spiritual connection that we share.
• 1:29:56
  That is, in fact, I would say, richly involved with quantum
• 1:30:00
  physics. In fact, I would say the
• 1:30:01
  entanglement field that was the you know what a gay yielded the
• 1:30:06
  Nobel Prize in physics in 2022 for spooky accident at a
• 1:30:10
  distance, as as Einstein called it.
• 1:30:13
  And the three investigators who were right at the heart of
• 1:30:16
  proving that Einstein was wrong and that in fact, you know,
• 1:30:22
  these particles show a connection that transcends space
• 1:30:25
  and time. And what what Einstein was
• 1:30:29
  trying to preserve with this kind of general concept of
• 1:30:33
  what's called local realism. And local just means that all
• 1:30:37
  physics involves particles touching other particles.
• 1:30:40
  So if I look at a star in the night sky, that photon coming
• 1:30:43
  from the star has to touch my retina.
• 1:30:45
  So there's always contact particles that enables these
• 1:30:49
  interactions and what we see in the in the world at large.
• 1:30:53
  And yet what you find is that entanglement is a demonstration
• 1:30:58
  that and realism, the other part of local realism is the notion
• 1:31:03
  of that objective physical world that exists independently of the
• 1:31:06
  observation and entanglement is basically says local realism is
• 1:31:12
  false. One part or both parts.
• 1:31:14
  And I think if you look at life reviews and the ability for the
• 1:31:16
  universe to allow us to relive all these events, that is an
• 1:31:22
  indicator that I think all of the local realism is false.
• 1:31:25
  And we just don't understand yet well enough how this apparent
• 1:31:30
  consensus reality, you know, that we call the objective
• 1:31:33
  physical world emerges. And to me, that kind of the Holy
• 1:31:37
  Grail of coming to a deeper understanding of this because
• 1:31:40
  the the quantum interpretation is that each of us is walking
• 1:31:43
  around with our own physical universe and they don't
• 1:31:46
  necessarily overlap. That's why of quantum
• 1:31:49
  experiments can be so reflective of the choices of the the
• 1:31:53
  scientists doing the investigation, the observer and
• 1:31:56
  the observer effect. Exactly.
• 1:31:58
  And yet we have this kind of sense of a shared reality.
• 1:32:02
  But in that discussion, I often find it valuable to get back to
• 1:32:06
  the notion of subjective and objective.
• 1:32:09
  And of course, subjective is what we experience as as
• 1:32:11
  subjects. Objective is, you know, the
• 1:32:14
  objects that we, the we are witnessing.
• 1:32:17
  But the important thing to get is that no human being has ever
• 1:32:21
  experienced anything other than the inside of their own
• 1:32:24
  consciousness. That is the subjective is the
• 1:32:26
  only thing we've experienced. And that subjective includes not
• 1:32:29
  only my experience in this 4 dimensional space-time, but it
• 1:32:32
  includes my experience in the spiritual realm, in life reviews
• 1:32:36
  and in going through all of that richness of spiritual
• 1:32:39
  connection. And when you start to
• 1:32:41
  acknowledge the power of all that, we start to really put
• 1:32:45
  consciousness where it belongs, right in the front seat.
• 1:32:47
  Acknowledgement of our free will and of this incredible awakening
• 1:32:52
  of humanity to these deep truths that in many ways we're known to
• 1:32:57
  Mystics. 2 and three 5000 years ago, right?
• 1:33:01
  So, you know, like that TS Eliot poem where you get back to the
• 1:33:05
  beginning and find out, you know, you never left.
• 1:33:08
  I mean, this is the point of the lattice.
• 1:33:11
  The science fiction novella I wrote is, you know this, the
• 1:33:15
  protagonist has this audacious idea.
• 1:33:17
  Let's hook up people that bring computer interfaces, see the
• 1:33:21
  commonality of their experience finds the the lattice, the
• 1:33:26
  connectedness of all things, the the the unity, you know,
• 1:33:29
  consciousness and it unites science and spirituality because
• 1:33:34
  it proves that that that the 2 two things can be true at the
• 1:33:39
  same time. And you know, one of the one of
• 1:33:43
  the things that I'm on a real mission, It's been my whole life
• 1:33:47
  has been on this mission is about how two things can be true
• 1:33:53
  at the same time. And and kind of the end of
• 1:33:56
  dogma, like dogma is very fear based.
• 1:33:59
  It's like nothing to see here, right?
• 1:34:01
  Stop, stop doing your quantum calculator.
• 1:34:04
  Just do your calculate, right? Shut up and calculate.
• 1:34:08
  And you know, 11 if we're losing people at this point.
• 1:34:13
  Yeah, I just want to point out on the time front, time being an
• 1:34:16
  illusion, read The Order of Time by Carlo Ravelli on Audible.
• 1:34:22
  It's read by Benedict Cumberbatch, which makes it
• 1:34:24
  smooth as silk. Great voice for that.
• 1:34:28
  One, Oh my gosh, it's such a good book.
• 1:34:30
  And it's, you know, it's a book that's deeply rooted in science,
• 1:34:34
  but it, it's, it's interesting because it veers into
• 1:34:37
  spirituality and then it has just a beautiful, beautiful wrap
• 1:34:40
  up. And I've seen that too.
• 1:34:43
  I mean, I've seen through through journeys.
• 1:34:45
  I've seen that time is an illusion.
• 1:34:47
  I mean, I've had things happen in journeys that are
• 1:34:51
  inexplicable. They're just inexplicable.
• 1:34:55
  Like I've seen things that happen in the future and then
• 1:34:57
  they happen, right. I've seen, I've seen, you know,
• 1:35:02
  other souls like reaching out, you know, and, and then reaching
• 1:35:07
  out to them, having a deep, beautiful recap absolutely with
• 1:35:11
  them. And these, these, these, these
• 1:35:16
  illusions of time. I think it's a really, it's a
• 1:35:19
  really fun exploration cuz it's just, it's another construct
• 1:35:22
  we've we've made to make sense of interaction between things.
• 1:35:27
  Yes, I do want to make sure cuz you have, you know, it's, it's
• 1:35:33
  such a beautiful journey that, that, that you've been on
• 1:35:36
  because I, I really think, and you know, you would, I know you
• 1:35:40
  would agree with this through, through what you've written, but
• 1:35:43
  I just want to emphasize it for, for the people watching this,
• 1:35:46
  that you were chosen to go through this experience to be
• 1:35:52
  able to come back and tell humanity, it's all going to be
• 1:35:57
  OK. Here's what's on the other side.
• 1:35:59
  I mean, obviously we have free will and there's a lot of, lot
• 1:36:01
  of work to do and you know, there's constant problems, but
• 1:36:06
  you have this knowledge of the brain, which is the hard problem
• 1:36:10
  of consciousness is, hey, you know, the, the, The Big Bang
• 1:36:13
  happened 13.8 billion years ago. There's been lots of random
• 1:36:17
  collisions that eventually, you know, form chemistry and then
• 1:36:21
  simple life and complex life and then consciousness.
• 1:36:25
  You know, even though it wasn't a property of this dead
• 1:36:28
  universe, this is a materialist view just magically popped out
• 1:36:33
  of it. And it's, it's the hard problem
• 1:36:35
  is like, why did that happen? And you, you have this, this
• 1:36:41
  real, this real deep understanding of the brain.
• 1:36:43
  I want to set this up because I did AI did a deep dive on this
• 1:36:47
  recently and which is kind of blew my mind because I don't, I
• 1:36:50
  don't think a lot of people know this.
• 1:36:54
  So I had a guest on JP Newman and he was talking about the
• 1:36:58
  number of cells we have in our body and, and, and, and you
• 1:37:02
  know, it just reminded me of just how, how, how much is here,
• 1:37:07
  right? And you know, it's around
• 1:37:10
  somewhere between 30 and 40 trillion cells.
• 1:37:13
  We also have around 30 to 40 trillion organisms that also Co
• 1:37:20
  live with us contribute right, a lot of them in our gut that, you
• 1:37:23
  know, on our skin, everything else.
• 1:37:25
  And then the death rate of those, you know, kind of the the
• 1:37:28
  the the death and rebirth rate is around every day.
• 1:37:33
  There's around 30 trillion dying and being reborn.
• 1:37:37
  OK, so so we're about 80 trillion things of which around
• 1:37:41
  30 trillion are being reborn every day.
• 1:37:45
  And you know it on the quantum level, we are also 99.9.
• 1:37:53
  I think there's 12 nines after that percent empty space, right?
• 1:37:58
  You know, because of atoms are mostly empty space.
• 1:38:01
  But yet, you know, if if you're if you're going to cling on to,
• 1:38:06
  you know, kind of nothing to see here.
• 1:38:08
  The materialist view. We have durable memory since the
• 1:38:14
  time we were born somehow with constant death and rebirth going
• 1:38:20
  on in our bodies, our brain, everything else.
• 1:38:24
  And one of the things that you were talking about last night,
• 1:38:27
  which I really wanna double click on is look is is is, you
• 1:38:31
  know, neuro search and we already know that memories
• 1:38:34
  aren't stored in the brain. And I'd love to I'd love to just
• 1:38:38
  unpack. Like what would you say to the
• 1:38:42
  person that's really clinging on to the dogma of nothing to see
• 1:38:46
  here? Like like thinking like, Hey,
• 1:38:48
  you know, great, you had a near death experience.
• 1:38:50
  I'm sure you believe that you know, great.
• 1:38:52
  You know, Brett, you, you met, you met God in a psychedelic
• 1:38:55
  experience. I'm sure you believe that you've
• 1:38:57
  had you've had prayer, you know, the just all of the things, you
• 1:39:02
  know, to let the like all the things there's like, OK, fine.
• 1:39:05
  But still, that's just their experience.
• 1:39:08
  It's not really real. How would you decode it for the
• 1:39:12
  materialist to say, look, this what we know about the brain.
• 1:39:15
  This is what we know about how it intersects with quantum.
• 1:39:17
  And This is why you should be more curious, you know, instead
• 1:39:21
  of dogmatic. And and I do think that there's
• 1:39:25
  this beautiful consciousness awakening going on.
• 1:39:28
  You know, we talked about this secret of secrets last night.
• 1:39:31
  I finished that book at the end of last year.
• 1:39:33
  Dan Brown's new book, It's all about Non local consciousness.
• 1:39:38
  It quotes the studies that are in your 2017 book and Living in
• 1:39:43
  a Mindful Universe. That's a 1 to 1 overlap of
• 1:39:47
  secrets in the science we brought up and living in a
• 1:39:49
  mindful universe. Which is actually beautiful
• 1:39:51
  because you know, all of the work, including the book, I'm,
• 1:39:54
  I'm, you know, writing right now, it's, it's, it's great that
• 1:39:58
  if there's derivative pieces built on top of that and he's
• 1:40:01
  done that. He's done a huge service for
• 1:40:03
  humanity because his audience is massive.
• 1:40:06
  I mean, it's been. About 8 years writing that book.
• 1:40:08
  So I mean a tremendous amount of effort into it.
• 1:40:11
  And also I want to credit his wife.
• 1:40:13
  Blythe is the one who does all the research.
• 1:40:15
  Yeah, I met Dan Brown because we both went to the same high
• 1:40:18
  school. I was at a high school kind of
• 1:40:21
  reunion. He was 10 years, you know,
• 1:40:23
  younger than me. Yeah, but I gave him a copy of
• 1:40:25
  Proof of Heaven and I had Blythe and Dan Brown sign my copy of
• 1:40:29
  Davinci code. That's so cool.
• 1:40:31
  So I'm hoping he he was aware of living in a mindful universe
• 1:40:35
  too, because I think that would have helped him kind of flesh
• 1:40:37
  out so much of what he did in Secretive Secrets.
• 1:40:40
  Yeah, I really believe that. 2025 was a watershed year on
• 1:40:44
  this. You know, we've had the
• 1:40:45
  Telepathy Tapes, which is now super popular.
• 1:40:48
  Season 2 is amazing and I've shouted out on that on this
• 1:40:50
  podcast multiple times. We had Anika Harris, who's
• 1:40:54
  married to Sam Harris come out with lights on where she
• 1:40:57
  concludes at the book, hey, didn't expect to do this, but I
• 1:41:00
  now believe consciousness is fundamental.
• 1:41:03
  Go ahead making progress right right.
• 1:41:05
  So we've just there's, there's a lot and I think it's coinciding
• 1:41:12
  with AI. I'll get to that in a moment.
• 1:41:14
  But just to stick with, what would you say to the?
• 1:41:16
  Material. Well, I think the important
• 1:41:18
  thing to. Give bring us up to date on
• 1:41:19
  brain science and. We'll certainly about the of
• 1:41:22
  quantum, yeah, people often wonder what's this connection
• 1:41:26
  between quantum and brain. Well, and we've already
• 1:41:28
  mentioned that an interesting feature of studying, breaking
• 1:41:32
  down the reality of any part of the physical world, you realize
• 1:41:36
  that these particles, as Niels Bohr put it, I said, this entire
• 1:41:40
  world that we call real is made-up of little particles that
• 1:41:44
  are decidedly unreal. They experience entanglement,
• 1:41:47
  superposition, tunneling, all these kinds of unusual features
• 1:41:51
  that have nothing to do with our big macro reality.
• 1:41:55
  And they also show this incredible kind of connection to
• 1:41:58
  mind and decision. In fact, John Archibald Wheeler,
• 1:42:02
  who was on the Manhattan Project, a renowned physicist,
• 1:42:05
  he spent a little time at UNC Chapel Hill, my alma mater, but
• 1:42:08
  he was also head of physics at Princeton.
• 1:42:11
  And he came up with what he called a participatory anthropic
• 1:42:14
  principle. And that was the best way he
• 1:42:16
  could start to make sense of quantum experiments.
• 1:42:19
  But by having the word anthropic in there, what he's pointing out
• 1:42:22
  is that the mind of the human is deeply involved in that physical
• 1:42:29
  world, as Pascual Jordan said, to the point of even creating
• 1:42:33
  it. And so that's a very important
• 1:42:35
  kind of starting point to acknowledge, you know, the kind
• 1:42:38
  of wrestling match between scientists trying to understand
• 1:42:41
  the measurement paradox, which is that act the the intersection
• 1:42:45
  of mind and choice and free will with these particles.
• 1:42:49
  And the particles seem to behave as if they're being observed.
• 1:42:52
  They know, you know, that's the whole thing about the 2 double
• 1:42:56
  slit experiment and some of the work where you just put one
• 1:43:00
  particle, you know, photon or electron through a double slit
• 1:43:02
  at a time and they still give you wave pattern unless you put
• 1:43:06
  detectors at the slits. They give you information about
• 1:43:09
  which path they go through and then boom, it instantly converts
• 1:43:12
  into a particle description. So it's very odd that they they
• 1:43:16
  behave in this kind of fashion to even acknowledge observation
• 1:43:20
  or not, but that's because our mind is observing and that's
• 1:43:24
  what makes the difference. I know there was a big
• 1:43:27
  discussion in. This biblical phrase pop in my
• 1:43:31
  head. Let there be light.
• 1:43:33
  Let there be light is exactly right, and especially when you
• 1:43:36
  demonstrate it's wave and particle of.
• 1:43:39
  But it can't be both at once and observation is what kind of
• 1:43:42
  creates that particulate nature and takes you away from the wave
• 1:43:47
  equation of Schrodinger into a concrete observation of of, you
• 1:43:52
  know, position or momentum or what have you, right.
• 1:43:55
  But to kind of get back to the the basics and how you unpack
• 1:44:00
  it, I would point out, first of all, John C Echols, he won a
• 1:44:04
  Nobel Prize in Physiology medicine.
• 1:44:06
  He did a lot of work on neurotransmitters and ionic
• 1:44:10
  channels and neurons and how they function.
• 1:44:12
  He won the prize in 63 and he, there's a beautiful quote from
• 1:44:18
  him that I can't do off the top of my head, but it basically was
• 1:44:21
  how he thought it was incredibly demeaning and diminishing to
• 1:44:25
  pretend that what he called promissory materialism, that is
• 1:44:29
  if we keep studying the brain, sooner or later we'll understand
• 1:44:31
  all this. We don't need spirituality or
• 1:44:34
  soul or any of that stuff. And he said to explain all of
• 1:44:38
  the kind of spiritual things that people have experienced,
• 1:44:41
  you know, through brain alone is folly.
• 1:44:44
  And and so indeed, you, you must invoke as a scientist this sense
• 1:44:49
  of spirituality. And at the time there was a big
• 1:44:54
  discussion about conservation of energy, the notion being that if
• 1:44:59
  the brain is simply physical matter, you know, electrons,
• 1:45:02
  protons, atoms, molecules, etcetera, following all the laws
• 1:45:05
  of physics, chemistry, biology, then they assume that it's
• 1:45:10
  giving you an illusion of conscious awareness, but that
• 1:45:13
  it's actually just chemical reactions.
• 1:45:15
  And electron flux is nothing more.
• 1:45:17
  So there could be no free will anywhere.
• 1:45:19
  In fact, there's still materialist scientists who would
• 1:45:22
  scoff at you for claiming to have free will because they
• 1:45:24
  think it's all just those chemical reactions.
• 1:45:27
  And what Echols pointed out was that the energy requirements of
• 1:45:32
  the neuron, when you look at the operating system of the neuron,
• 1:45:36
  it's a quantum computer. I mean, there's everything about
• 1:45:38
  whether it fires or fire has to do with ions and and atoms and
• 1:45:42
  molecules that all follow quantum principles.
• 1:45:46
  And the tight confinement in an ion channel is a measurement.
• 1:45:51
  It's a very powerful constriction of the positional
• 1:45:55
  accuracy of location of that particle, which means the
• 1:45:58
  momentum vector is much more widely opened.
• 1:46:02
  And so the fire, no fire decisions are not made locally,
• 1:46:06
  but have to do with a quantum field.
• 1:46:08
  And the quantum field, I would say is the entanglement field is
• 1:46:12
  identical to the mental field, the spiritual field.
• 1:46:15
  Now, of course, a lot of quantum physicists might kind of jump
• 1:46:19
  back at that and say, wait a minute.
• 1:46:20
  But I, I think that the best way to look at this is really is
• 1:46:23
  kind of a top down causality as opposed to that bottom up that I
• 1:46:27
  discussed a little while ago. There's South African
• 1:46:31
  mathematician George Fr Ellis, who's written extensively on top
• 1:46:36
  down causality and organization in quantum systems.
• 1:46:39
  And I think that's exactly what we're witnessing is this kind of
• 1:46:43
  top down from that kind of God mind.
• 1:46:45
  The the same anthropic principle that Wheeler was appealing to is
• 1:46:50
  basically the the mental spiritual influencing this world
• 1:46:54
  and it does. So the brain is not the creator
• 1:46:57
  of consciousness, but the brain serves as a basically a
• 1:47:03
  dissociation mechanism so that a little Eddy current of that God
• 1:47:07
  mind comes into us and we usually think of it.
• 1:47:11
  You know, my mind is my own. Nobody else has access to it.
• 1:47:14
  But Gillion Playfair wrote a beautiful book called Twin
• 1:47:16
  Telepathy where he makes it very clear in his scientific studies
• 1:47:20
  that 35% of identical twins have powerful telepathic experiences
• 1:47:26
  and. I don't know if you know, but
• 1:47:27
  Deborah's identical twin. Oh, really?
• 1:47:29
  Yeah. We've had we've had these
• 1:47:31
  experiences where where it's, it's.
• 1:47:34
  Oh, it's, it's amazing. I mean, 1 twin can touch a hot
• 1:47:37
  stove and the other twin, you know, 200 miles away can develop
• 1:47:41
  a blister and feel pain. And in fact, a very good friend
• 1:47:44
  of mine, Doctor Larry Dossey, I highly recommend all of his
• 1:47:49
  books and work. Just an incredibly rich
• 1:47:51
  scientist. He's a doctor, but also very
• 1:47:54
  spiritually aware. And he wrote a book called One
• 1:47:57
  Mind. That book came out I think
• 1:48:00
  around 20/11/2012. And he's an identical twin and
• 1:48:08
  he and his twin married identical twins.
• 1:48:11
  And so you talk about telepathy and right, right.
• 1:48:13
  They had to go all over the place.
• 1:48:15
  And that's what inspired him to write this beautiful book.
• 1:48:18
  One Mind where he gives many examples of kind of how we share
• 1:48:25
  one mind and these telepathic experiences, a lot of healing,
• 1:48:29
  power of prayer over distance. I mean, incredible ways you can
• 1:48:32
  kind of unwrap this and show this incredible sense of
• 1:48:36
  connectedness through mind. And, and I think he he extends
• 1:48:43
  it into the, the animal world too.
• 1:48:46
  So we, we shouldn't think that animals are not deeply and
• 1:48:49
  richly involved in many ways. They don't have a linguistic ego
• 1:48:52
  telling them, you know, this is nonsense.
• 1:48:54
  So they have a pure sense of kind of spiritual connection,
• 1:48:57
  right. And so we shouldn't dismiss
• 1:49:00
  animals in their wisdom. But I think this, this whole
• 1:49:05
  notion of the connectedness of mind is something that can be
• 1:49:08
  very revolutionary. And of course, it doesn't just
• 1:49:11
  involve identical twins. They have, you know, the same
• 1:49:14
  basically the same genome genome.
• 1:49:17
  And so their nervous systems have a tremendous amount of
• 1:49:19
  resonance because the genome is so important at the exact design
• 1:49:24
  of the nervous system. And that's why they can serve as
• 1:49:27
  these antennas or transceivers to receive consciousness from
• 1:49:32
  each other. And the interesting thing is
• 1:49:34
  it's not, it doesn't follow an inverse square law.
• 1:49:36
  It's not an electromagnetic connection.
• 1:49:39
  But I would say it more is dependent on that quantum field,
• 1:49:42
  the entanglement field, which is instantaneous throughout the
• 1:49:45
  universe and involves, you know, our mental and spiritual
• 1:49:50
  connection. Now, it doesn't.
• 1:49:52
  What it mean is many quantum physicists would detest that you
• 1:49:55
  cannot pass information with this instantaneous trick.
• 1:49:59
  But what I would argue is the universe does it.
• 1:50:01
  That's how these particles know how to behave like that.
• 1:50:04
  So just because humans cannot pass information using the
• 1:50:08
  entanglement field, you know, in our current technology, that
• 1:50:12
  doesn't mean that we're not taking advantage of this.
• 1:50:17
  And the and the world is taking advantage of this connection.
• 1:50:20
  You know, the transcend space and time.
• 1:50:22
  That's the important thing. The entanglement field is the
• 1:50:25
  way that these particles know to interact.
• 1:50:27
  And the John Bell experiments, you know, that ended up giving
• 1:50:32
  that Nobel Prize in 2022 to the three investigators, have been a
• 1:50:38
  very powerful way to show that this is truly entanglement and
• 1:50:42
  not hidden variables. That's what Einstein thought
• 1:50:45
  would be the answer. He thought he could preserve
• 1:50:47
  local realism. If you could somehow demonstrate
• 1:50:51
  something we weren't measuring, that would explain the behavior
• 1:50:53
  of the particles. And John Bell's the one who came
• 1:50:56
  up in 1964 with a way to assess that whole thing.
• 1:51:00
  And this is 30 years after Einstein, Podolski and Rosen had
• 1:51:04
  said that quantum physics is incomplete.
• 1:51:06
  That was their word for it. And then of course, Bell and
• 1:51:11
  Klauser, then Alan Aspect and Anton Zeilinger, all the winners
• 1:51:17
  of that prize, originally thought that Einstein would be
• 1:51:22
  right, as he was about so many other things.
• 1:51:25
  And then the experiments are done and they realize no,
• 1:51:28
  Einstein was wrong. And every one of those
• 1:51:30
  experiments showed that you truly have this spooky action in
• 1:51:35
  an instance entanglement between these particles that doesn't
• 1:51:40
  require our normal notions of causality in A4 dimensional
• 1:51:44
  space-time, but somehow transcends all that.
• 1:51:46
  And I would say that's the kind of mechanism that's involved in
• 1:51:49
  these life reviews. And our ability to relive the
• 1:51:52
  events as if they're still ongoing is because of that
• 1:51:56
  entanglement field. And it's much richer and more
• 1:51:58
  powerful. That's what we can explore
• 1:52:01
  through, you know, meditation and centering prayer.
• 1:52:05
  But getting back to that connection of that Echols
• 1:52:08
  pointed out, he made it clear and he wrote a book.
• 1:52:11
  I think the book came out the late age or early 90s book is
• 1:52:14
  how how the mind controls the brain.
• 1:52:16
  That's that's kind of, I think that's more of the title.
• 1:52:19
  But in that book, he has a very eloquent article, you know,
• 1:52:23
  argument that there is no violation of Heisenberg's
• 1:52:28
  uncertainty principle in these quantum activities of neurons
• 1:52:32
  and ions that determine whether or not a neuron fires.
• 1:52:35
  Much more is from the top down control of that quantum field.
• 1:52:39
  And that's where I think we're starting to come into a deeper
• 1:52:42
  understanding of this relationship between quantum
• 1:52:45
  physics and, and consciousness and entanglement and how our
• 1:52:51
  telepathy and how our reliving of events and life, life reviews
• 1:52:56
  and all that kind of thing shows a much richer universe, much
• 1:53:01
  more kind of fascinating and mysterious universe.
• 1:53:04
  And one that's much more easily explained by ideas of
• 1:53:08
  unification of the oneness of mind that we all share.
• 1:53:12
  And then we're truly in this together and to hurt another's
• 1:53:14
  to hurt ourselves. And I think quantum physics just
• 1:53:17
  contributes to that. But it's only part of the
• 1:53:19
  picture is we go into in our book living in a mindful
• 1:53:22
  universe. And I would also point out to
• 1:53:24
  people, they don't even have to buy that book to Start learning
• 1:53:29
  all this. If you go to evanalexander.com,
• 1:53:32
  33 day journey into the heart of consciousness right there on the
• 1:53:35
  welcome page and you're off and running on a 33 day e-mail drip
• 1:53:39
  campaign that's had more than 14,000 people take the course,
• 1:53:43
  contribute their experiences and helping each other on that site.
• 1:53:48
  So all you have to do is sign up for that and the 33 day journey
• 1:53:51
  are off and running to get a lot of these kind of concepts of the
• 1:53:54
  scientific framework of all this as well as meditative technique.
• 1:53:59
  Yeah, we'll put a link in there and it's and it's free too.
• 1:54:01
  It's free yeah, and and that's why we encourage people to share
• 1:54:04
  it everywhere, the 33 day journey and lots of people get
• 1:54:07
  tremendous value out of that. It does come with four Sacred
• 1:54:11
  Acoustics audio files that you can use for differential
• 1:54:14
  frequency brain wave entrainment, a very powerful
• 1:54:16
  mode of meditation that I use daily, and I've done that for
• 1:54:20
  the last 12-13 years, something like that.
• 1:54:24
  Extremely powerful. By causing this oscillation in
• 1:54:27
  the lower brain stem, it allows conscious awareness to basically
• 1:54:32
  be set free. I think that oscillation is a
• 1:54:35
  way of kind of monotonizing the normal information processing
• 1:54:38
  that keeps us in the brain and body, but allows us to connect
• 1:54:42
  with that more primordial mind across the veil.
• 1:54:45
  Yeah, I, I, I love sacred acoustics and you know, I, I, I
• 1:54:49
  made this point multiple times on the podcast.
• 1:54:51
  I'm just self funding this. There's no hats or anything,
• 1:54:54
  but, but I love it. I, I was introduced to it by
• 1:54:57
  reading your books. I think it was, I think it was
• 1:55:00
  the map of heaven actually, that first introduced me to it.
• 1:55:03
  I've read, I've read the Map of Heaven and Proof of Heaven
• 1:55:05
  twice. And it was, it was in, it was, I
• 1:55:10
  think towards the end of that where where it was first
• 1:55:12
  introduced, if I'm remembering correctly right.
• 1:55:15
  But it's, it is, it is a incredible meditation app.
• 1:55:20
  It is a really. I've had I've had very some very
• 1:55:23
  cosmic journeys on on, on that and and some very loving ones.
• 1:55:27
  I mean, there, you know, quite a quite a few where my mom.
• 1:55:30
  Showed up, right. Well, I've used, I mean, that's
• 1:55:33
  how I encountered my father, you know, I tell that story and
• 1:55:36
  living in a mindful universe. But my adoptive father, you
• 1:55:39
  know, to me, one of the biggest struggles I had after my NDE, if
• 1:55:43
  I had scripted it, he would have been there front and center.
• 1:55:45
  He had passed over 4 years before my coma.
• 1:55:48
  He was so important in my life and yet he was nowhere to be
• 1:55:51
  found. And, and, and yet this, this
• 1:55:54
  spiritual guy that I had was so mysterious, that beautiful young
• 1:55:57
  woman. And of course, the end of proof
• 1:55:59
  of heaven is where we kind of get to who's she actually was
• 1:56:01
  and why she was so important in my life.
• 1:56:03
  But if I'd scripted it, I, I wanted to meet him.
• 1:56:06
  And so in many of my meditations beginning a few years after my
• 1:56:10
  coma, that's what I was kind of seeking.
• 1:56:12
  But in fact, there was one meditation I described in
• 1:56:14
  particular. And it had to do with the fact
• 1:56:16
  that I was, at the time, I, I was learning a lot of this
• 1:56:20
  through the Monroe Institute. And you know, Robert Monroe had
• 1:56:25
  developed many of these techniques of differential
• 1:56:27
  frequency brain wave entrainment, what he called
• 1:56:29
  Holosync or Hemisync was his version.
• 1:56:34
  But at any rate of the vision I had in this beautiful
• 1:56:39
  meditation, my father was there. First time I'd seen him since he
• 1:56:43
  passed from this world. And he was there with his
• 1:56:46
  college roommate. They were in their early 20s.
• 1:56:48
  Often when you see a loved 1, he had passed from this world at
• 1:56:51
  age 91 in 2004. But when you see them in
• 1:56:55
  spiritual form, they're this beautiful kind of ideal age.
• 1:56:58
  And that can include children who might have died as a child,
• 1:57:01
  but they often appear late teens and early 20s when you see them
• 1:57:04
  in spiritual form. And he looked at me with this
• 1:57:09
  one little wink and and smile like he used to give me when I
• 1:57:13
  was a kid. And in that one wink and smile,
• 1:57:15
  this incredible amount of information, what I call a
• 1:57:18
  thought balloon, it's just filled with kind of rich
• 1:57:21
  understanding came to me. Yes, you're on the right path.
• 1:57:24
  Sound is a powerful way to investigate consciousness.
• 1:57:27
  Consciousness is fundamental in the universe.
• 1:57:29
  Every bit of that. But the vision also included his
• 1:57:33
  college roommate. And so when I came back to this
• 1:57:36
  world after that incredible download, I'm saying, why was
• 1:57:40
  his roommate there? And that led to a long process
• 1:57:45
  that we cover in living in mind for Universe or anyone
• 1:57:47
  interested. But for several months emailing
• 1:57:51
  people connections with Monroe, I found out that his college
• 1:57:55
  roommate had actually been a very good friend with Robert
• 1:57:58
  Monroe. And after the the college
• 1:58:01
  roommate had died in 1964, he was a pilot and he crashed his
• 1:58:05
  plane. And I knew all about that as a
• 1:58:07
  child. You know that because I knew his
• 1:58:09
  kids. They were older than we were,
• 1:58:11
  but I knew that they'd had this family tragedy.
• 1:58:15
  But I didn't realize that afterwards.
• 1:58:18
  It turns out that Agnew Bonson, that roommate's youngest or
• 1:58:24
  daughter, had worked to help transcribe one of Bob Monroe's
• 1:58:28
  first books. And so there was a deep family
• 1:58:31
  connection. And she said that when she went
• 1:58:34
  to visit Monroe, he'd often say, and this was after her father
• 1:58:38
  passed in this world, that he'd seen Agnew.
• 1:58:40
  And Agnew was doing great. He's passing through, very busy
• 1:58:42
  over there. Don't bother him.
• 1:58:44
  But this incredible realization of putting all the dots
• 1:58:48
  together, I finally connected why that message was so
• 1:58:52
  powerful. And this story with with the
• 1:58:55
  college roommate was so critical at defining that connection with
• 1:58:59
  Monroe and all of his techniques.
• 1:59:01
  And then coming full circle to understand that my father was
• 1:59:05
  basically blessing my journey of the primacy of consciousness,
• 1:59:10
  you know, as a loving father and fellow, a surgeon, that I was on
• 1:59:14
  the right path, right? And it was so beautiful and life
• 1:59:18
  affirming to go through all that.
• 1:59:20
  But that's why meditation and centering prayer can be so
• 1:59:22
  powerful and are such a gift to all of us, to be able to shift
• 1:59:26
  our own perspective and start realizing we're much more than
• 1:59:30
  our physical bodies. Yeah, there's, there's a,
• 1:59:33
  there's a book called Why Buddhism is True.
• 1:59:36
  I think it's written by Robert, right?
• 1:59:38
  It's just a pure kind of science approach.
• 1:59:41
  It's all about natural selection, wine, our brains of
• 1:59:43
  all this way, etcetera. But it ends with a spiritual
• 1:59:48
  tone. Even though he was attempting
• 1:59:51
  like the order of time, just write a pure science book.
• 1:59:54
  And what he says is he says, look, I don't know what
• 1:59:58
  consciousness is, but the Buddhist had it right that.
• 2:00:04
  Let's be thankful that whatever our reality is, when you
• 2:00:08
  meditate, you can glimpse that everything is rooted in love and
• 2:00:14
  connection, absolutely. And that if everybody glimpse
• 2:00:18
  that, we would have a much better world.
• 2:00:21
  Right. Because then people would know
• 2:00:24
  that that's the actual reality that we're in.
• 2:00:27
  And so he ends it that way and he kind of jokes and he says,
• 2:00:30
  what if it was, you know, we were meditating?
• 2:00:32
  We're like, Oh my gosh, it's horrible in there, right?
• 2:00:35
  That right. That's not, it's not at all.
• 2:00:37
  It's not what you find at all. That's right.
• 2:00:39
  Meditation and centering prayer, such gifts.
• 2:00:41
  And it also reminds me. You would talk a little bit ago
• 2:00:46
  about materialists and what, what do you say to material?
• 2:00:48
  What, what's the evidence that can finally push them around,
• 2:00:51
  Right. And I'd say one very important
• 2:00:53
  part of this, you can study near death experience, shared death
• 2:00:55
  experiences after death, communications, deathbed dreams
• 2:00:59
  and visions. That's the work of Christopher
• 2:01:01
  Kerr, who wrote a book called Death is But a Dream.
• 2:01:07
  That was in a think about 2015. But he's Hospice and he doesn't
• 2:01:11
  care about Ndes. But what he found in his Hospice
• 2:01:14
  work and pale and terminal care work is that 86% of people have
• 2:01:19
  these same things that indie years report.
• 2:01:21
  Their loved ones come to escort them over.
• 2:01:23
  They end up having life reviews, making amends.
• 2:01:26
  All that kind of stuff happens in the dying population too.
• 2:01:29
  People often complain, oh, well, an indie year doesn't die.
• 2:01:32
  I want to know what happens when you die.
• 2:01:33
  We'll go to Christopher Kerr's work and some of the the other
• 2:01:36
  work out of the Hospice literature.
• 2:01:37
  You'll find out it's the same thing.
• 2:01:41
  Brakes materialism is the work, and I often quote the work of
• 2:01:47
  the University of Virginia Division of Perceptual Studies.
• 2:01:50
  Ian Stevenson was a psychiatrist at UVA back in the 60s and he
• 2:01:55
  heard of reports of children who claim to have past lives.
• 2:02:00
  And interestingly enough, when they would investigate some of
• 2:02:02
  these cases, they would find out that somebody actually existed
• 2:02:07
  who had that name that all the things the child reports about
• 2:02:10
  behaviors and lifestyle and brothers, sisters, challenges
• 2:02:15
  with friends and then mode of death, you know, whether they
• 2:02:20
  were shot or what have you. And an important feature of
• 2:02:23
  these memories of past lives and children is that something like
• 2:02:27
  70% of these cases died suddenly, violently in a
• 2:02:31
  previous life. And I think what that means is
• 2:02:33
  an unfinished business for the soul.
• 2:02:35
  And so there's, you know, an impetus for them to come back in
• 2:02:40
  and, and continue with their soul work.
• 2:02:42
  And that's why you find that very commonly in these stories.
• 2:02:45
  But to date, the group at UVA have studied more than 2500
• 2:02:50
  cases over 6 1/2 decades of reports of past life, memories
• 2:02:54
  and children. Of those, more than 1700 have
• 2:02:59
  been solved. That is, they found the person
• 2:03:01
  who lived before. That's incredible.
• 2:03:03
  And it's it's astonishing. And another important thing to
• 2:03:07
  point out is what in his early series, something like 35% of
• 2:03:12
  those children had a physical deformity, A birthmark or defect
• 2:03:17
  that was associated with the mortal wound of the previous
• 2:03:21
  life, an axe wound, A machete, A gunshot, what have you.
• 2:03:25
  But they had a birthmark that pointed that out.
• 2:03:28
  Only one fifth of those solved cases were hereditarily linked.
• 2:03:34
  You know, they were familial. The other 80% were not.
• 2:03:38
  They were across, you know, broad swathes of space and time.
• 2:03:42
  One of my favorite stories is a story that has been vetted by
• 2:03:47
  Jim Tucker at UVA, so very rigorously analyzed from a
• 2:03:52
  scientific perspective. And it's the story of the
• 2:03:56
  Lininger. Bruce and Andrea Lininger wrote
• 2:03:58
  about their son, James Lininger, who was born in Louisiana in
• 2:04:03
  April of 1998. And then he, when he was about 2
• 2:04:07
  1/2 years old, I think, he started having nightmares, you
• 2:04:09
  know, playing on fire, You know, little man can't get out.
• 2:04:12
  And he'd crash and die. And these were nightmares that
• 2:04:14
  would wake him up at night. It was really haunting.
• 2:04:17
  And his parents started doing more and more investigation into
• 2:04:20
  this. They came from kind of a
• 2:04:22
  Christian background, but the more they dug into it and, and
• 2:04:26
  the book of that they wrote is called Soul Survivor.
• 2:04:29
  Soul Survivor. I highly recommend it.
• 2:04:32
  But it's an incredible story with just these many, many, many
• 2:04:38
  strong connections that prove the reality of this.
• 2:04:42
  I mean, he ends up meeting this kid, ends up meeting the sister
• 2:04:48
  of who he was before. I mean, he's reincarnated more
• 2:04:50
  than 50 years later because he died in the Battle of Iwo Jima
• 2:04:53
  in March 1945 and then is reincarnated in 1998.
• 2:04:59
  So there's no, nobody's sitting over there looking at the watch,
• 2:05:02
  right? Of course, that's the important
• 2:05:04
  thing is that realm is timeless. So that's why we can have full
• 2:05:08
  blown life reviews. That's why somebody can
• 2:05:10
  reincarnate. Although the average time for
• 2:05:13
  those cases is a is a few months or years, but there are some
• 2:05:16
  that are many decades, like the Leininger case.
• 2:05:19
  And when you review, start reading that literature, you
• 2:05:23
  know, because of course the materialist would say that's
• 2:05:25
  nonsense. It's made-up, it's faulty, you
• 2:05:28
  know, people's imaginations. It's not rigorously performed.
• 2:05:31
  But Ian Stevenson was a very smart, competent scientist and
• 2:05:35
  so are the others who work there now, Ed Kelly, Bruce Grayson,
• 2:05:38
  Jim Tucker, who's recently left but was the head of the of these
• 2:05:42
  reincarnation cases for decades. And that literature is so
• 2:05:48
  stunning that you just have to say, OK, back up a step.
• 2:05:54
  We got a much bigger challenge to understanding this thing we
• 2:05:57
  call brain, mind, consciousness awareness and this obvious
• 2:06:03
  reality of reincarnation. And if, and as I mentioned
• 2:06:07
  earlier, important to point out, most people don't remember past
• 2:06:09
  lives and between lives. But there is a process that I
• 2:06:13
  called a program forgetting that when you hit age 6 or 7, those
• 2:06:18
  memories start disappearing. And in fact, even the children
• 2:06:20
  have been most heavily written about.
• 2:06:22
  You ask them at age 10 or 11, do you remember this, that and the
• 2:06:25
  other? They say, I don't remember that.
• 2:06:27
  And I think that is what gives us skin in the game.
• 2:06:30
  So we're not meant to remember those past lives necessarily,
• 2:06:34
  although I think a lot of spiritual wisdom does come
• 2:06:36
  through. We accumulate that over time.
• 2:06:38
  That's what leads to the growth of the soul.
• 2:06:41
  But this is what brings this notion of the living tapestry to
• 2:06:44
  life, because it's a tapestry of these interwoven threads of our
• 2:06:48
  soul lines all interacting and contributing to a deeper
• 2:06:53
  understanding of the nature of our shared reality.
• 2:06:57
  And it's it's a real blessing to the world that this deep
• 2:07:01
  understanding of the primacy of consciousness and of the
• 2:07:04
  importance of love, the binding force of love, which to in the
• 2:07:08
  ears is the be all and end all that they've bathed in that
• 2:07:11
  ocean of love. That's why they come back here.
• 2:07:14
  They've felt that sense. As I said, more than 90% come
• 2:07:17
  back believing in God or whatever you want to call that
• 2:07:19
  force. But they know it's real through
• 2:07:22
  personal experience. And This is why this kind of
• 2:07:25
  revolution of understanding is so important for our world
• 2:07:27
  today. Because in many ways, I would
• 2:07:29
  say the tragedies and kind of conflicts and the kind of a
• 2:07:34
  backwards stepping of our civilization in the last few
• 2:07:37
  decades is due to the false sense of separation that comes
• 2:07:41
  from materialist thought. You know, I'm a body, a brain.
• 2:07:45
  I'm isolated from all else. Well, no, I'm not.
• 2:07:48
  I'm actually living. I only know the inside of my own
• 2:07:51
  consciousness. That consciousness is an Eddy
• 2:07:54
  current that my brain constructs in a dissociative mechanism.
• 2:07:58
  But ultimately it's part of that God mind and that's why we can
• 2:08:02
  return to that. We do that in meditation and
• 2:08:04
  centering prayer. You don't need a near death
• 2:08:06
  experience for all this. Get into consciousness.
• 2:08:09
  Put the ego mind into time out. The ego, although it it's a
• 2:08:13
  program that serves a purpose in kind of preserving body and body
• 2:08:17
  function and taking care of self and all that, it's not your ally
• 2:08:21
  in spiritual journeys because there's a lot of toxicity
• 2:08:24
  bundled with the ego. Things that Karen and I call
• 2:08:26
  baby wounds, like my adoption abandonment wound.
• 2:08:29
  And the ego is kind of soaking in that.
• 2:08:31
  You look at cases of addiction, it's all about kind of ego
• 2:08:37
  toxicity. You know, you look at fear of
• 2:08:40
  death and terminal cancer patients, that's an ego issue.
• 2:08:43
  The ego fears is incredible death.
• 2:08:46
  That's and that's something that is alleviated tremendously by a
• 2:08:50
  single dose of psilocybin. But these ego issues, it's by
• 2:08:54
  dissolving the default mode network, which is what
• 2:08:56
  psychedelics do. That's what meditation does.
• 2:09:00
  That's our kind of sense of, you know, existence is 1 ego.
• 2:09:03
  But when you dissolve that and allow yourself to float more
• 2:09:07
  easily into that ocean of that God mind of the cosmic mind,
• 2:09:11
  that's the Co creative force of the whole universe.
• 2:09:14
  That's where we start to come into a deeper recognition of who
• 2:09:17
  we truly are and how it's all interconnected.
• 2:09:20
  And it's through the binding force of love.
• 2:09:22
  And with this false sense of, of, of, of separation and
• 2:09:26
  materialism, it's led to all kinds of crazy nonsense in our
• 2:09:30
  modern world of conflict and violence, of souls kind of
• 2:09:35
  battling other souls. And that's not our truest
• 2:09:38
  nature. Our truest nature is revealed
• 2:09:40
  through this quantum field, the entanglement field.
• 2:09:43
  It's acknowledgement of of, of our grander being together.
• 2:09:48
  Yeah. And that we do have free will.
• 2:09:51
  I would say the best term for the philosophical position I
• 2:09:55
  think I'm trying to defend is evolutionary panentheism.
• 2:10:00
  I was at a conference 2 weeks ago where someone was kind of
• 2:10:03
  making a joke. They would say you're either a
• 2:10:04
  materialist or a or a panpsychist and and in the book
• 2:10:09
  Living Mindful Universe we make very clear that panpsychism is
• 2:10:13
  not a viable explanation. Panpsychism is what happens when
• 2:10:17
  a hardcore materialist hits the wall, realizes there's way too
• 2:10:22
  much here suggesting consciousness is fundamental and
• 2:10:25
  not derivative from matter. And So what they then do is
• 2:10:28
  dream up this crazy model where every subatomic particle is
• 2:10:32
  connected with an element of proto consciousness.
• 2:10:35
  And as you assemble the the subatomic particles, if they're
• 2:10:39
  properly assembled, those proto consciousness elements also line
• 2:10:42
  up to give a phenomenal conscious experience that's
• 2:10:45
  related to that physical combination of a particles,
• 2:10:49
  which is nonsense. The the best way to explain it
• 2:10:52
  is evolutionary pan entheism. Pan entheism is that God force,
• 2:10:56
  that God mind. There's a top down causality
• 2:11:00
  that comes from that. But we participate, we have free
• 2:11:03
  will participating with that God force in the evolution of all
• 2:11:07
  the events of our lives. If you wanted to expand
• 2:11:10
  consciousness and if, if the universe, you know, God wants to
• 2:11:15
  explore itself, you would do it in a way which would create
• 2:11:20
  maximum entropy. So you do it in a way where
• 2:11:23
  you're not going to give people like, hey, here's the cheat code
• 2:11:27
  to your life. Like here's your past lives.
• 2:11:30
  Here's exactly what happened. You know, it'd be like showing
• 2:11:34
  up, you know, for school and your professor pulls you aside
• 2:11:38
  and says, here's here's the answer key.
• 2:11:40
  Don't worry about it, right? You're going to get an A.
• 2:11:43
  So so this this amnesia is actually an important element.
• 2:11:48
  I think very. Very critical expanding
• 2:11:50
  consciousness. It is, it's like like we're
• 2:11:52
  constantly having to relearn how to manifest love, how to be, you
• 2:11:57
  know, hopefully very selfless, you know, loving, giving human
• 2:12:01
  beings to each other. And over time, like we're we're
• 2:12:07
  doing more and more to ascend, but we're also constantly in
• 2:12:13
  this world of form or the Earth school, right, having to
• 2:12:17
  overcome the assault of that. Frankly, we're propagating on
• 2:12:22
  ourselves like the salt of the algorithmic manipulation from
• 2:12:26
  social media, the constant like we're living in a dystopia, you
• 2:12:30
  know, push stories that are hijacking our amygdala, right?
• 2:12:34
  And the food hijacking that's that's going on to keep this
• 2:12:39
  chemically addicted pharmaceutical companies have a
• 2:12:44
  solution for that. You know, but you have to take
• 2:12:46
  it forever. You know, it's not you can't
• 2:12:48
  just take it once and and and that's amazing thing.
• 2:12:51
  You know, you raise psychedelics like Deborah and I have been
• 2:12:55
  proponents of the Americans for ibogaine initiative because the
• 2:12:59
  efficacy so far on on on this very powerful psychedelic.
• 2:13:06
  I, I haven't taken ibogaine, but you know, for vets that are like
• 2:13:10
  suicidal, for opioid addicts, for Alcoholics, like over 80% of
• 2:13:16
  the time with one dose they're cured.
• 2:13:17
  I know I was just incredible. It's it's absolutely amazing.
• 2:13:21
  I was at a meeting 2 weeks ago in Houston where I talked about
• 2:13:24
  a lot of this and one of the features of that meeting they
• 2:13:28
  had, they showed the two hour documentary.
• 2:13:31
  I think it's War and Waves. Yeah, it's on Netflix thing.
• 2:13:34
  Exactly. And it is all about of these
• 2:13:38
  veterans who've been traumatized by war, tremendous post
• 2:13:42
  traumatic stress disorder, just an incredible, you know, and,
• 2:13:46
  and so sad that these wonderful souls who have gone out to fight
• 2:13:51
  for freedom. I mean, I have a very positive
• 2:13:54
  view of our kind of military and and what it can do for the world
• 2:13:57
  in the right circumstance. But these guys were traumatized
• 2:14:01
  incredibly. And Ibogaine, you know, in this,
• 2:14:04
  in this very nice therapeutic setting was extremely powerful.
• 2:14:09
  And, and it reminds me what I often refer to is the work of
• 2:14:13
  Roland Griffiths. He, he passed sadly from this
• 2:14:16
  world about a year and a few months ago, but he was at Johns
• 2:14:19
  Hopkins and he's largely responsible for the Renaissance
• 2:14:23
  of study of psychedelics in our, in our modern world.
• 2:14:27
  And he ran some projects at Johns Hopkins that were very
• 2:14:30
  kind of revolutionary to help study this.
• 2:14:33
  But one of my favorite reports that he put out to the world had
• 2:14:38
  to do with treatment of severe addictions, alcoholism, drug
• 2:14:42
  addiction, and then also treatment of cancer patients,
• 2:14:47
  terminal patients with severe debilitating fear of death,
• 2:14:51
  which are all ego issues, addiction, the sphere of death,
• 2:14:54
  big ego issues. And one dose of psilocybin and a
• 2:15:00
  year later 80% of patients in in all these studies still had a
• 2:15:05
  tremendous positive benefit of not being addicted and not
• 2:15:10
  having a fear of death. All right, right from one dose
• 2:15:13
  you don't have to keep taking it.
• 2:15:15
  I would say that the psilocybin is like a catalyst.
• 2:15:18
  And the other reason I'm very thankful to Griffiths is a lot
• 2:15:25
  of the neuroimaging work that they've done with psychedelics.
• 2:15:27
  Because beginning in 2012, there was a paper from Imperial
• 2:15:32
  College London by Robin Carhartt Harris where they used
• 2:15:35
  psilocybin and showed that with functional MRI.
• 2:15:38
  And they later showed with Magneto encephalography, which
• 2:15:41
  are very great, wonderful ways of looking at neural activity
• 2:15:46
  And what you find, surprisingly enough, anybody who's ever taken
• 2:15:49
  those psychedelics would think their brain must be lighting up
• 2:15:52
  like a Christmas tree. But that's not what's happening.
• 2:15:55
  It's the exact opposite. The brain is going dark.
• 2:15:58
  The default mode network, which kind of connects several areas
• 2:16:01
  in the frontal and parietal lobes and brainstem dissolves.
• 2:16:07
  And in fact, you won't find a single of neuron or neuronal
• 2:16:11
  node that's increasing in activity.
• 2:16:13
  In fact, that's a huge subject of of Dan Brown's book of secret
• 2:16:17
  of secrets is getting into that kind of mystery.
• 2:16:20
  But Griffiths did this incredible work and kind of to
• 2:16:24
  set the stage. And then Cara Harris, I think
• 2:16:26
  that that his team at Imperial College in London actually had
• 2:16:29
  trouble even interpreting the results.
• 2:16:31
  They were so surprising, right, because they just showed no you
• 2:16:34
  for the neuroscientist who says we have these great tools for
• 2:16:37
  looking at the brain, those great tools don't.
• 2:16:41
  All they do is show you the brains getting out of the way.
• 2:16:43
  It's stopping activity. And so we have to look beyond
• 2:16:47
  the brain to even begin to explain those phenomenal
• 2:16:50
  experiences. And that's what I think is such
• 2:16:52
  an important lesson for us there.
• 2:16:54
  It's not like they're insoluble or that we can't understand
• 2:16:58
  this. But what we have to do is move
• 2:17:00
  beyond the model of brain and body.
• 2:17:02
  You know, brain creates consciousness, birth to death,
• 2:17:05
  nothing more or and acknowledge that consciousness is something
• 2:17:08
  fundamental, right? And the very important part
• 2:17:10
  about that, I think a lot of confusion in the scientific
• 2:17:13
  world with these kind of discussions in the late 20th
• 2:17:16
  century was they said, and in wait a minute, you're talking
• 2:17:19
  about human consciousness being something that's generalized
• 2:17:23
  throughout the universe. But how can that be?
• 2:17:26
  Because human consciousness has only been around for a few
• 2:17:28
  100,000 years. And the answer is it goes the
• 2:17:32
  other way. We borrowed consciousness from a
• 2:17:34
  self aware universe, right? That was there before The Big
• 2:17:38
  Bang. That self aware universe, that
• 2:17:40
  God mind is part of all that has happened, you know, in this in
• 2:17:45
  this universe. I was recently involved in a
• 2:17:48
  project, you know, I mentioned the work was on stone in Paris
• 2:17:52
  and Morocco, but also I got involved with a book called God
• 2:17:56
  the Proof, the evidence. That book is just came out in
• 2:17:59
  North America in October of last year.
• 2:18:02
  I highly recommend it, but it is based solely on kind of big
• 2:18:07
  physics like The Big Bang cosmology, thermodynamics of the
• 2:18:15
  fine tuning of physical constants, which is a absolute
• 2:18:18
  mind Bender. When you realize the probability
• 2:18:22
  that all 26 of the major physical constants of this
• 2:18:25
  universe will be so precise in tune that they allow this
• 2:18:28
  universe to exist, the chances of that happening randomly,
• 2:18:34
  something like one in 10 to the 120th power.
• 2:18:37
  It's it's, you know, Roger Penrose has done a calculation
• 2:18:40
  to help. Yeah, point it out, but it's
• 2:18:43
  absolutely Ray. Kurzweil even quotes that in the
• 2:18:45
  singular. It is nearer in his book on AI.
• 2:18:48
  Well, it's a very important concept, but what it all gets
• 2:18:51
  down to in that particular book is they're using all of those
• 2:18:55
  scientific arguments to point out the reality of a creator
• 2:19:00
  God. But that creator God that they
• 2:19:02
  point out is one that would be certainly of Spinoza would agree
• 2:19:06
  with. Spinoza's God was the one that
• 2:19:08
  Einstein, a creative, infinitely intelligent God, but not one
• 2:19:14
  that dealt with individual humans.
• 2:19:16
  Now the NDE literature would certainly, and plus all the
• 2:19:19
  associated literature will start to educate us at that incredible
• 2:19:23
  God that is so well demonstrated through all those big physics
• 2:19:27
  pictures is also part of us as individuals, right?
• 2:19:32
  And that's where I think our evolution of the understanding
• 2:19:35
  of the nature of that cosmic intelligence is so important.
• 2:19:40
  And it's not just kind of from idle philosophical curiosity,
• 2:19:44
  but actually plays a deep role and our existence in human as
• 2:19:48
  humans and our ability to bring healing and wholeness into our
• 2:19:52
  lives. So as a physician, I look at
• 2:19:54
  things like placebo effect. And to me, it's a beautiful
• 2:19:57
  example of mind over matter. That's exactly what we're
• 2:20:01
  talking about. Mind over matter.
• 2:20:03
  Placebo effects been around for thousands of years.
• 2:20:05
  It's been used as the gold standard of scientific studies
• 2:20:08
  in medicine for the last 60 years.
• 2:20:11
  You know, and placebo effect is just the tip of the iceberg.
• 2:20:14
  You can move beyond that kind of mind over matter demonstrated by
• 2:20:18
  placebo into the world of, of what are called spontaneous
• 2:20:23
  remissions, right? For example, if you go to the
• 2:20:25
  Institute of Noetic Sciences website, noetics.org, put in
• 2:20:29
  spontaneous remission as a search term.
• 2:20:31
  You'll find a book that they wrote in the mid 90s, I think
• 2:20:34
  O'Reilly and Hershberg or Hershberg and O'Reilly.
• 2:20:38
  But that book discusses more than 3500 cases of people who
• 2:20:43
  had advanced cancer infections, even some with congenital
• 2:20:47
  anomalies, and medical treatment was of no avail.
• 2:20:51
  And then comes the spontaneous remission where they start doing
• 2:20:57
  spiritual things, meditation, prayer, going within of, of, you
• 2:21:02
  know, cultivating positive emotions, processing and, and
• 2:21:09
  leaving behind negative emotions, all these different
• 2:21:11
  things, having purpose in life that then LED them to healing.
• 2:21:15
  And then of course, you can move into miraculous healing and near
• 2:21:20
  death experiences like in my case, Anita Moore, Johnny, whose
• 2:21:22
  lymphoma just disappeared through an NDE.
• 2:21:25
  And in fact, in my case with that medical case report that we
• 2:21:28
  discussed, the back story of that that's very important is
• 2:21:31
  when the peer review editors of the Journal of Nervous and
• 2:21:34
  Mental Disease challenge the authors who are not involved by
• 2:21:38
  care but fascinated by my recovery.
• 2:21:40
  How do you explain this? It's unprecedented in medical
• 2:21:43
  literature. A weakened coma from of severe
• 2:21:46
  bacterial meningoencephalitis with full healing over a few
• 2:21:49
  months afterwards. How do you explain it?
• 2:21:51
  They said it's because he had a near death experience.
• 2:21:54
  And the peer review editor said, OK, we got an explanation and
• 2:21:57
  they ran with it. That shows me great promise in
• 2:22:01
  the scientific community that there are open to facing truth
• 2:22:05
  and fact about understanding these cases and just realizing
• 2:22:08
  we have a much bigger universe to explain than the simple kind
• 2:22:13
  of materialist view that we've had before.
• 2:22:15
  And so this world is awakening. It's an important change.
• 2:22:19
  It has everything to do with this acknowledgement of the
• 2:22:24
  primacy of consciousness. Well, Evan, I think I think we
• 2:22:26
  should wrap this part up here because tonight we're going to
• 2:22:31
  have a fantastic time in front of the J Men audience.
• 2:22:36
  And it's going to be with with Doctor Bob Frochman, who's one
• 2:22:39
  of my best friends, who's actually the individual that
• 2:22:42
  introduced me to your book. Fantastic.
• 2:22:44
  I was interviewing John Mackey on stage.
• 2:22:47
  Who's very good friend the founder of Whole Foods.
• 2:22:49
  He was on episode 30 of the podcast and and Bob at the end
• 2:22:53
  of it, he runs up to us and he's like you both need to read proof
• 2:22:57
  of heaven and we we both did you know, and it's definitely been a
• 2:23:03
  a big heart shift for me. So I just really, really want to
• 2:23:07
  thank you for being on Love Conquers Fear for being being in
• 2:23:12
  our home. Last night's dinner was was
• 2:23:15
  magical. Well, it people that showed up
• 2:23:17
  for that. A lot of people flew in for
• 2:23:18
  that. It was just beautiful.
• 2:23:20
  Well, it's been an honor and privilege for me to be in your
• 2:23:23
  wonderful home and meet your family and your friends.
• 2:23:27
  Thoroughly enjoyed it and especially your passion and
• 2:23:31
  energy. You know, love conquers fear,
• 2:23:34
  absolutely no question. That's where all of this takes
• 2:23:38
  us. And the fear is kind of the
• 2:23:39
  materialist side because that's where all the buttons get pushed
• 2:23:43
  and the love is what in the ears.
• 2:23:45
  And every spiritual journeyer for thousands of years has said
• 2:23:49
  is the is the coin of the realm. And that is why it's so
• 2:23:53
  important and it's accessible to all of us.
• 2:23:55
  No human is limited from this. We all have access to.
• 2:23:59
  It, and we'll get into it tonight, but technology is the
• 2:24:02
  forcing function for us to make that fateful choice for love, to
• 2:24:08
  conquer fear, which the ancient Mystics have been telling us
• 2:24:11
  since the beginning. So hey, I really appreciate it.
• 2:24:13
  Yeah. Thank you so much.
• 2:24:15
  Yeah. Joy for me and I look forward to
• 2:24:17
  keeping in touch. Yeah, yeah, well, sure.
• 2:24:19
  We'll be together tonight and we definitely will be staying in
• 2:24:22
  touch too. All right.
• 2:24:23
  Well, thanks so much for having me.
• 2:24:24
  Thank you. Thanks everybody for tuning in
• 2:24:27
  to Love Conquers Fear. Stay tuned.
• 2:24:29
  Part 2 coming up. Can't wait to do that on stage
• 2:24:33
  tonight alongside Doctor Bob Brockman.
• 2:24:37
  What an episode. I also want to just give a huge
• 2:24:40
  shout out to Jacob Solomon, who is the CEO of Love Conquers
• 2:24:45
  Fear. Jacob and I work together at
• 2:24:47
  Bizarre Voice. Gary Hoover was actually the one
• 2:24:50
  that introduced to us. He's he's a famous entrepreneur
• 2:24:53
  who created Hoover's and a bunch of other different companies and
• 2:24:57
  including Book Stop, the first book superstore.
• 2:25:01
  And Jacob worked for Bizarre Voice as an intern and then
• 2:25:05
  became our head of marketing for all of Europe.
• 2:25:08
  And when he showed up to help Love Conquers fear, it was just
• 2:25:12
  a big yes. And he's just doing a fantastic
• 2:25:14
  job. So he'd shout out to him, to the
• 2:25:16
  team. Don is the videographer.
• 2:25:18
  He's doing a great job too. And just a lot of love for for
• 2:25:24
  all of you and all the messages you're sending my way.
• 2:25:27
  And the meditation today, we actually did it in this room and
• 2:25:31
  we did it as a group. And I was feeling all the energy
• 2:25:35
  from all the guests I've had on all the beautiful people who
• 2:25:39
  sent me messages about how they've had a heart shift as a
• 2:25:43
  result of this podcast or jumping into some books that
• 2:25:46
  have been recommended here. So means the world to me.
• 2:25:48
  Keep it coming. Thanks again.