Latest / Reflect Reclaim & Liberate - with Sallyanne Hartnell / Living Together Apart - separated but living under the same roof

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Living Together Apart - separated but living under the same roof · Reflect Reclaim & Liberate - with Sallyanne Hartnell

• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Reclaim and Liberate the Podcast.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: Finding the space for all of you in life and love.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host selling love.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: And this podcast is for anyone wanting to reclaim and liberate themselves in their relationships and their lives.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Wherever you are on your relationship journey, these conversations meet you right there.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: In thoughtful, deeply supportive DMs with me and interviews with other gorgeous humans.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: Moving you from where you are to where you most want to be.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: Completely aligned with your deepest desires to have it all on your own terms.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: If you're seeking a relationship and a life that lights up all of you, you're in the right place.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'd also like to acknowledge that this podcast is recorded on the traditional lands of the World Tree people and pay my respects to elders past, present, and emerging, and acknowledge them as the original storytellers of this land.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to another episode of Reflex, Reclaim and Liberate.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: Today I'm going to talk about what we call living together apart or living as a separated couple but under the one roof.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_00: Now, living together apart was one of my predictions back in January for 2023 that we would see more and more of this, and that has actually come to fruition anecdotally and also in the media, it's being reported a little more broadly.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: Another prediction that I made back in January was that we would see more combined households, for example, two single parents, two single mums living in the same house, sharing resources, sharing space for their kids, and we are actually seeing more of that in 2023.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to drop in the show notes a link to the room exchange so that if you are in a situation where you need to find space, safe space to share with your kids, to share potentially with another family, another mother, another single parent, the room exchange is a really, really great resource that helps connect people who have extra space with people who are seeking it.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: So just as a little aside, check the show notes if that's something that you're looking for.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: Now back to living together apart.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: According to Services Australia, the number of people registered with Centrelink who are separated but do live under the same roof was 53,000 in 2022, up from 38,000 in 2017.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: And as I said earlier, anecdotally, it's continuing to rise.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: And there are lots of reasons, you know, housing prices, prices, interest and interest rates, um, the cost of living more generally, groceries, utilities, fuel insurance, it's all going up.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: The rental crisis.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: Now I I hesitate to use the word crisis, but in the media, everyone's using it.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: It is difficult to find rentals, really difficult, really challenging.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: So that is pushing people to remain living in a shared home, the family home, um, even after separation.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: Also fluctuating house prices, you know, that's creating uncertainty and fear, and people are holding back on selling or settling their property matter due to that uncertainty, which again means we have more people who are living together apart.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Now, historically, living together apart has been a really common experience in the really in the very early phases of separation, but we're now seeing more and more couples needing or choosing a bit of both to do it for much longer.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I would suggest if you're thinking about it, go really deep on exploring your options.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: What other creative solutions can you come up with for your family's living arrangements before you opt for living together apart?
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: Because there are unique challenges in living together once you've decided to separate.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: Financial pressures and financial stress can absolutely tip you into fear and paralysis and stop you from feeling able to seek advice, and that in turn increases the stress.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I would really strongly suggest that if you're thinking about doing this, if you're separating and you're worried about how it's going to look in terms of your living arrangements, get really clear.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: As I always say, get really clear on your finances.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: Do seek help or support.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: And this might look like talking to your bank, getting your property valued, talking to your bank and looking at borrowing capacity.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: And it may be as simple as getting full clarity on what it actually costs you to live, where you can trim, if you can trim, where you can increase your income, reduce your expenses, and how you can tighten things up if at all possible so that you may be able to find a creative solution to your living arrangements.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: Fear can just keep you stuck.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: So if you find that you're remaining stuck, remaining fixed because of fear of your finances, I would encourage you to even Google free financial counseling or seek out professional support and advice.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: Don't sit in fear.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: Get clarity on those on those numbers, crunch them how best you can.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: And if you need help to do that, there are actually free services available.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: Contact your lender.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: One of my clients recently saved herself thousands by contacting a mortgage lender.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_00: She was able to actually pause repayments while they navigated their settlement, while they negotiated their settlement, saving thousands.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: But for you, that might be similarly requesting a pause or going on an interest-only repayment for a period of time while you navigate your settlement.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: So freeing up a bit of cash so that you can look at creative options for your family's unique circumstances.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: It might even be that you just need a circuit breaker, that you just perhaps can you house sit for someone?
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: Can you register as an official house sitter?
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: There's there's websites that do that.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, is there somebody within your family or your social circle who has a granny flat or a holiday house that you can access on a short-term basis until you get yourself sorted?
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: So there are other options to think about, but if you are looking down the barrel of a living together apart or living separated under the one roof situation for your family, there are some things to think about.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we I often get asked, well, does it are we actually legally separated if we're still living under the same roof?
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: And the answer is yes, you can be officially legally separated provided you're operating as individuals rather than a couple.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um the easiest thing is to just agree on a separation date.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um and it you know sort of looks like that you're no longer doing things that you used to get to do together as a couple, maybe you no longer eat meals together, you're not sleeping in the same room or the same bed, maybe you're not going out and socializing together, you know, or doing the recreational stuff together.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, family interests, if if there are kids in your family, you know, you may or may not be choosing to do those together.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: And often living separately under the same roof, as I said earlier, is really a temporary arrangement until you've each worked out and finalized how things are going to look.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: You've sorted out your shared finances so that you can each go your separate way.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: It may be at some point that you need to file an affidavit to confirm your separation date, and your lawyer or your coach can help you with that.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there are also, I think there can there can be in some families real benefits to this living together apart situation, and then much like the benefits or the positives of a bird nesting arrangement, which I've spoken about in previous podcast episode and blog post, there are benefits of a slower transition or a period of living together apart for the couples, for the kids.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: So some couples and families do even manage it longer term, for example, with a studio or a flat at the back of the property, you know, as part of a larger property for one of the parents, and it becomes more a bird nesting arrangement with a separate space.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, some do it even within the same house.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: It's harder if you've got a small house or you live in an apartment, and most will eventually choose to move to separate homes.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, financially, running one home costs less than running two spaces, and this is the biggest reason at the moment that we're seeing an increasing number of separated couples choose or not choose, be forced into a living together apart arrangement.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: The cost of living combined with rental prices, mortgage and repayment rates, interest rates, um, as well as just rental availability.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's really hard at the moment to get a rental.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: Another benefit to living together apart is that there's less pressure.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: There's less pressure to quickly, quickly find alternate accommodation.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: You can have a gentler and slower transition for everybody, including the children.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: Now that has positives and negatives, and whether it's a positive for your kids is really down to your unique set of circumstances and how you're going to handle it.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: So the biggest things to consider, I think, when it comes to living together apart, um, communication, boundaries, managing expectations, who's responsible for what, who does what, who pays for what.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so my top tips, here we go.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, firstly, really plan out the physical space.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: You will each need a separate space if at all possible.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: A separate bedroom is ideal, and if that simply cannot be made to work, a separate space to sleep.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_00: So think about creative solutions.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: I know of one family who used their caravan as a second sleeping and living arrangement for one of the adults parked in the driveway.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so they had the common space for the kids and the family.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: One parent kept the main bedroom and the other parent used the caravan as their bedroom.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: Second thing to consider budget.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: Talk about how you're going to split costs while you're living together apart.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: Will things change or will you just run the household finances exactly as you always have?
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever you decide, clarity and communication is really important here.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_00: So have the conversation so that the expectations are clear who's responsible for what, who actually pays the bills, and where that money is coming from.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's an opportunity to start to separate your finances, even completely separate them and split into like a housemate housemate financial arrangement.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you can open new accounts, you can close joint accounts, and you can begin to separate yourselves financially, and you can do that gradually because you are still living together.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: But it's really important to have an open conversation and be clear about what that's going to look like.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: If you have a mortgage together, again, as I said earlier, consider your options.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_00: It may well be possible for you to have a conversation with each other and then go to your lender and talk about how that can look, as I mentioned earlier.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: And here, if you've not previously had full visibility or full clarity on the financial position of your family and your household, now is the time to rectify that.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: Get really clear on what's coming in, what's going out, where that could possibly be trimmed or cleared up.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: Ring your service providers, make sure on the best deals, and look at if there's any fat, if there's anywhere you can tighten things up.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: Third thing to consider is the kids.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: Now, there's a number of other episodes of the podcast about parenting and telling your kids you're separating, and it's especially important that you are clear and open with your kids about your separation when you're still living in the same space.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, age and stage dependent, it can be confusing for them, so clarity, being open, answering their questions, and preferably, as always, I say this telling them together can be really important and supportive for them.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: Tell them that you're working together to make arrangements to live separately at some point in the future, and of course, you'll keep them informed, it won't be a sudden announcement, all of that.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: But be really clear with them about what this means for them.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: Create a parenting schedule or at least have a parenting conversation and create some clarity around that.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: Who does what when, who is the on parent, if you're going to have an on and off time period, and the ways for the kids to spend time with both of you or each of you independent of the other parent, how's it going to look?
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_00: So decide as parents how it will look for each of you, for your family, because it might be that you do continue to do things together as co-parents, or it may be that you move to a more parallel on-off arrangement.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: Again, communication and a plan here is critical between the two of you, and then communicating it to the kids so everyone knows what's happening.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: A good old whiteboard or a shared digital calendar that everyone has access to can be really helpful here.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: Communicate with your kids about this new arrangement if things, especially if things will be changing for them.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're not all going to be eating uh dinner together or spending time together as you once did, explain how it will look for them and for you all.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: Next tip or next thing to consider is boundaries.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: Again, communication, have an open conversation about what is and is not okay now that your relationship is shifted and you're living together but apart.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: Really important conversations to have around dating and socializing, even as simple as who is welcome in the house and when.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: You know, friends and family that were really openly warmly welcomed might not be so warmly welcomed by your ex-partner.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it might not be okay for your mum to turn up at 7.30 on a Tuesday morning now that you are live living together apart.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: Separating shifts the social dynamics and affects extended family relationships.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: So having that conversation and being really clear on what that's going to look like moving forward is important and can reduce conflict.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: Deciding together and agreeing about whether new dates or new partners are brought into the house is also critical.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: In the early phase, unless it's something that you've you've both agreed to previously, and I mean both of you have agreed to, my strong suggestion is to keep your dating life separate from your home life.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: And if there are kids in the house, if the kids in if there are kids involved in your relationship, I even more strongly suggest this.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Let the kids just settle into the new arrangement without bringing new people in.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: Also, in terms of boundaries and physical boundaries, who has access to the spaces and when?
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: Are you going to continue to share the communal spaces or are you going to, I was going to use the word ration, but are you going to use a more parallel arrangement?
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: Are you going to be all in or are you going to split them out?
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, if there's only one TV in the main living space, who gets to choose what you watch?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: Bathrooms, how will you navigate the sharing of bathrooms now that you're separated?
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_00: All those private spaces that you used to share as a couple need to be renegotiated.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: So respecting each other's private spaces is really important.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: Hopefully, you both have a bedroom or a private sleeping space, and if you do, not encroaching on the privacy of your ex's space is important.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Respect their right to privacy and a space that you don't access without their permission or their invitation.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: Another part of boundaries, or another thing, sorry, to consider really is load.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_00: Who does what, who's responsible for, and when.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: And again, this needs to be negotiated and communicated.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: So if one of you was previously responsible or took the main part of responsibility or load for a particular thing in the household, the cooking, the shopping, the washing, the gardening, the cleaning, the gutters, the kids' school pickups, drop-offs, whatever it is, this needs to be renegotiated and communicated really, really clearly.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: I suggest, if this is going to work for you, that you do look at all the regular tasks that it takes to keep your household and your family running smoothly, and you create a schedule.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that might be shopping, cleaning, tidying, cooking, paying the bills, mowing the lawn, and you clearly assign each of these tasks in a visible and more equitable way now that you are effectively operating as housemates.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: Make that mental load visible so it doesn't completely fall on one of you, even if it did previously.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: This is something that really needs to start shifting and changing almost immediately that you decide to separate.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: But it's a conversation that needs to be had.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: And remember that what you decide right now may need further negotiation and discussion in a week's time, a month's time, six months' time, if you're still in this living together apart relationship.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: So load kind of sits in underneath boundaries, but it's also a little bit different.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_00: And the big, big, big thing, communication.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: So before launching into communication, it's really important to decide how you will communicate as separated people living together.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you're separated and getting divorced for really good reasons, and often one of those reasons is that your communication hasn't been as effective or as calm or as whatever as it could be.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: It hasn't been great.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: So find the ways that you can communicate about the household, about the kids, without inflaming things.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_00: You will need regular check-ins, and so a really good way to do that is to formalise them.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: Meet over a coffee or a meal, discuss the key issues, and they're going to be money, kids, parenting, chores, mental load, who does what, who pays for what, how that all lands.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so talk about whether each of you feels it's an even split.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: And bear in mind that fair and even is not necessarily 50-50.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: So you can negotiate this in a way that works best and feels fair to all of you.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: Really work hard on dialing down your emotions and your reactivity, soothing your nervous system, soothing that reactivity so that you can start to communicate in a more business-like fashion with one another.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: Try and keep your emotions out of the conversation, and there's whole other podcast episodes on this sort of stuff, but try and keep your emotions out of the conversations about the practicalities of living together while you're separated.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: Find other spaces and other people to vent to and share those big emotions with.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: Friends, yes, but of course, I'm going to say this is where a coach can be invaluable.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's a private, safe, objective space and sounding board to support you in sessions with me, but also between sessions when things get tender or or you're fired up or feel too big or too hard.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: So find a safe objective space that you can vent and you can deal with those big emotions that is not in that household where you are that you are still sharing with your ex.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: And if there are kids, do your utmost to keep the communication between the two of you calm, respectful, and positive when you're in the space with them.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: Even when your ex is not there.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_00: Calm, respectful, kind, and positive.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: They still have a relationship with your ex.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_00: They are the kids I'm I'm speaking about here.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: The kids deserve a positive relationship with your ex.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: They're not divorcing them.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: You are.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: So try and keep that communication calm, kind, and positive.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: And if you really can't do that, if you really can't communicate calmly and kindly with your ex, it might be that you really need to look at other living arrangements.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_00: And it's maybe it's just that circuit breaker.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: Go and stay with someone else.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_00: Go and you know, if you can just rent a hotel room for a couple of days, stay with your parents, whatever it is, find a circuit breaker to help you dial down your emotions so that then you can step back into the space.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: The common family space, the living together apart space.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: And just another point on dating.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: If you are dating, you're out in the world, you're connecting with other people, be open and honest with whoever you're dating about your living arrangements, because it can throw up all sorts of doubts in their mind about whether you are actually separated, whether the story you're telling about living together apart is truth.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_00: So don't hide it, is my Top tip, be really open and clear about it.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we're separated.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, sorry, yes, we're living together, yes, we share a house, but we are absolutely definitely separated, and we are looking towards a more permanent arrangement, and we are looking towards a divorce.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: And if you've been here for a while, you know that my theory and my belief and my lived experience is that separation and subsequent divorce does not need to be destructive.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: Sharing a roof after separation means you may be, you may be less inclined to burn things down to it for each other.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: Living together apart may just mean that you're able to take things slowly, unravel from one another a little more gently, and support your kids together through this transition with a little more kindness for one another.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's it can be, it's not always, and and here I'm clarifying, I'm not talking about abusive relationships.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: You it can be more difficult to be angry and aggressive and upset with one another when you have to share a space, when you're sharing a dining table, when you're sharing a kitchen, when you're sharing a space with your kids.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_00: So it may be that for you and your family, living together apart actually has the potential to change the experience and the landscape of your separation and divorce from one of inferno, damage, destruction to a little more like that reorganization that I often talk about.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: And if because if you've been around for a while, you know that that's my aim.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's a reorganization of your family.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: Now it's not easy to do the LTA Living Together Apart transition, even short term, but it can be done.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_00: The key is open communication, or the keys are open communication, clear boundaries, and really well-defined expectations so everyone is on the same page.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: Communication, compromise, compassion, empathy are going to be really, really important.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_00: And in closing, I just want to remind you that you used to like this other person, you used to love this person.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe try and tap into some of that while you're doing the living together separated under the same roof thing.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: Remembering the things that you used to like about someone can actually be really helpful and supportive to get you through this transition phase.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: So good luck if this is you.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: Reach out and share with me the good, the not so good, I'd really love to hear from you.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: I'll drop a couple of links in the show notes to resources that can help.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: One that is a government page detailing separation under one roof and the legalities of it, and another one is linked to the room exchange that I mentioned earlier in the episode.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: If you know someone who's transitioning through separation, divorce, or even thinking about it and is worried about how it might look in terms of living arrangements, I would love for you to share this episode with them if you think it will support your person.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: As always, thank you for being here.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Stanley Ann Hartnell, Relationship Coach, and you've been listening to Reflect, Reclaim and Liberate.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: You can follow me on Instagram at Reflect Coaching, and if you can think of anyone who would love this episode, please, please share it with them.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'd also be so grateful if you'd follow the podcast and review this episode so we can get it in the ears of a whole lot more humans just like you who are ready to reclaim and liberate themselves in life and love.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: I hope you'll join me next month for another episode of Reflect, Reclaim and Liberate.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: Until then.