Latest / The Authority Podcast — Expert Insights and Fresh Ideas for Education Leaders / Make Every Podcast Want You with Kimberly Spencer
Transcript
- Ross Romano: [00:00:00] Welcome in everyone. You are listening once again to The Authority Podcast here on the Be Podcast Network. Thanks as always for being with us. Really happy to bring you a conversation today. That's going to be something a little bit different. If you have been a guest on this show, if you're interested in being a guest or just interested in the podcasting in general, you're probably in some form of leadership role or. Really, regardless of what your role is, there's a lot of reasons to think about your message, how you communicate, how you talk about the work you do, and leveraging platforms like podcasting and being a guest on podcast to do so. So we have something for you today with my [00:01:00] guest, Kimberly Spencer. She's an award-winning, high performance trauma-informed coach and trainer, an Amazon best. Selling author, TEDx speaker, and the founder of crownyourself.com, helping visionary leaders transform their self-limiting stories, build their empire, stand out fearlessly, and make the income and impact they deserve. She has a book called Make Every Podcast Want You: how to be so radically interesting, you'll barely keep from interviewing yourself. It's won a number of awards recently and it's what we're talking about today. So Kimberly, welcome to the show. Kimberly Spencer: Thanks Ross. I just realized that with my title, I better be radically interesting or also I'm not like embodying the message of the book. So I'm just so honored to be here and speaking to your audience and just being able to serve with the benefits of going on podcasts. Ross Romano: Yeah. Well, we've at least found the right audience in the sense that if they're listening, they have interest in podcasts. Right. So, and whether or not they've [00:02:00] been on some shows before or would like to, there's a lot of reasons to do so. And of course, we're both believers in the medium, but I figured let's start with why should leaders want to be on podcasts? What, why is that something that they should care about? Kimberly Spencer: So I'll start with the story, is the fact that how I got into it in the first place. 'cause I'd had a podcast and commonly when most leaders come to me, they're like, oh, I'm gonna start a podcast. And I'm like, have you ever had a baby? And they're like, what? And so I said, if you're in a relationship, if you're doing something and you're like, Hey, let's just add to the mix of the benefits of this relationship. That's what having a podcast is. It's like adding a baby into the mix of what's going on. If you're in a great relationship and it's thriving and it's amazing, awesome. But if you're in one where there's like. Cash flow issues or challenges or like you're doing, dealing with other things in life, and you're like, [00:03:00] okay, this is maybe not the time to start a new project. There is a reason why 90% of podcasters don't make it past 10 episodes. So when I, so I had my own podcast, the Crown Yourself Podcast. Since 2019, fast forward to March of 2020. I'm in Australia with my husband and then 2-year-old son. And where are those Americans who get stuck abroad in COVID. And I became the primary breadwinner and I was like, okay, well how can I generate new business revenue? And we tried a bunch of things. We tried having our own podcast and our own podcast we found was really great for building and nurturing our existing clientele or for those clients that maybe have wanted to jump in, but they needed to get to know me a little better before jumping into a program. And then I said, well, let's try guesting and. We jumped into guesting and within 50 interviews we generated over $70,000 of new business revenue. Fast forward, we generated over a quarter of a [00:04:00] million dollars in new business revenue, and I said, I think I'm onto something. So I took I created a course. And then cr I then created an agency where we served other clients and tested our belief system that you not only can get on podcasts, but you can use these as a powerful source of building relationships. And relationships lead to referrals. They lead to business. They lead to growth of your message and impact. What we found consistently was that our clients were getting referrals. They were getting clients for their companies. They were getting customers coming in. They were getting people buying their books. They were getting people signing up for their webinar, like podcasts were a medium that were driving a very discerning buyer. When I looked at the re, the stats for going on podcasts when I was writing the book, make Every Podcast Want You, 42% of millennials report purchasing based on podcast hosts recommendations. And the more I dove into the statistics, the more podcasting just became, and [00:05:00] not just podcasting of as in having your own, but guest podcasting just became the absolute no brainer as a strategy for those who want to. Who aren't necessarily interested in dancing on TikTok to generate clients or to get their message out there For those who don't necessarily want to be an influencer, but they want to influence and impact collective thought or the thought of their audience. And when we can start structuring as far as what are the right podcasts to go on, what is your message? Your story? The. The thing that you want to get out in the world based on your life experience or your studies or your research, all of these things can be incredibly valuable for podcast hosts and for podcasters and for you getting your voice heard. (ad here) Ross Romano: What do we know about podcast listeners? Because I know this is something you've looked into, you referenced some of it there. The stat about the 42% of millennials reporting, they've purchased things from podcasts, and [00:06:00] we've seen in our own research here with the network that there's high affinity, high trust right. And we've gotten good information on Listeners, for example, are. Interested in hearing from advertisers and they they want advertisers that are relevant to their interest and needs, but it is kind of counter to the conventional wisdom or what you hear about a lot of things where it's like, I don't want ads, no ads all of this where it's saying, look, if I've found a show that I trust and like, and I feel like I'm getting good information, I do want to have other information, especially if it's professionally focused. Right. That's relevant to my profession and things like that. That I think we've learned a lot about. But what are some of the other things that, in your experience, in your research you've discovered that sort of helps to illustrate here's why this is a good medium, as you said, in contrast to if you're not [00:07:00] super interested in some of the social media channels or. Even, I think the way some channels are in decline where some of the longer lasting ones it's totally unclear what the future is. There's others that are strong. But depending on what your business is, what your profession is, who your audience is, the channels that are really strong right now might not really be the ones for you anyway. But podcasting is a medium that could fit. Kimberly Spencer: Yeah, I think podcasting is a wonderful strategy for introverts, especially for those who like value having a deep conversation. And I always give the example of like, imagine having coffee with your best friend and you're diving into all the deep. Things you're sharing, you're swapping stories, you're enjoying your conversation together. 'cause transformations happen in dialogue. And I know this, having coach leaders for nine years, transformations happen when you're in a in, in a level of conversation. That's an elevated level of conversation. And what's [00:08:00] powerful about podcasting specifically is that. It's an intimate medium. So it's like being that fly on the wall of the conversation that like that person that you would dream about, that you would always love to sit and have coffee with. Getting to pick their brain essentially. And then having that conversation blasted out to thousands if not hundreds of thousands of subscribers. And so it allows for this intimate medium to then be broadcast in a big way, rather than almost the intimidation of like, oh, here's social media, here's all of these numbers and followers. Like that's. On the forefront of podcasts, like as a podcaster, you do know your numbers, I would hope as far as your downloads are, but like those aren't being broadcast. That's not The purpose of the podcast is fame. The purpose of the podcast is really sharing value and good quality information. And if you think about the medium as well, it's very intimate, medium. Like when do you mostly listen to a podcast? Well, you have it in your earbuds maybe when you are do running errands. Maybe you have a [00:09:00] podcast when you're carpooling the kids to school, or you have a podcast when you get out of the shower. And so you're listening to these voices and very intimate moments. They're in the private spaces of your home and your personal life. So it by it adds to the to the model of communication. There, there's a model of communication called the Morian Communication Model, and 38% of all communication is tonal and vocal. Seth. Only 7% is actually the words that you use, so you're getting an additional amount of communication from combining the 7% of the words. 38% of the auditory. And then if you are talking to someone who has in, in what's called NLP a representational system who processes the world through dialogue and through auditory, then you're actually. The, their sound waves have vibration and we feel vibration. So it's actually a kinesthetic response that we also have through the podcast. So podcasts actually hit all of the communication models and allow us to really just [00:10:00] soak in that intimacy that makes us feel like I've had. Audience members and people hop on a call with me and start crying and I'm like, whoa. Like it's, it's just me. But that, that because they feel like I know them and that I've spoken thing, words of truth to them that they have valued, that have impacted their lives. So the level of impact comes from a deeper level of intimacy that the medium provides. Ross Romano: Yeah. Yeah. It's. Something I wanted to ask is how to know when you're ready. As a perspective podcast guest, like somebody who has an interest in the objectives that we've been talking about and in engaging, these audience hasn't gotten into it. One of the things that stands out to me is that all of the data that we've seen. In the, of the medium and in the podcast industry is that this really has become a significant media the number [00:11:00] of listeners, monthly, the number of unique individuals who listen to podcasts all and yet I feel like a lot of times the people who want to be on them are. Or like the ones who aren't listening somehow there's like a gap in the Venn diagram and it's like becoming, in, becoming familiar with the medium, what it is and not necessarily having to always be a listener of exactly the shows that you think you want to be on for professional purposes. But just kind of. Engaging with the medium, but that's something that, that I think about sometimes. But, Kimberly Spencer: i I completely agree and I've seen the trend too where there's a lack of respect and reverence for the medium in a way. And one of the things that, in my coaching practice that I've, 'cause I work with a lot of entrepreneurs a lot, whether you're they're just starting out with their business or very successful having built successful multimillion dollar companies in that space, I [00:12:00] always see a. A correlation between like market the way you like to consume. So if you have a message and you want to market it out into the world and you love consuming Instagram, then go put it on Insta. Go put your message on Instagram because like attracts like. I personally, I love podcasts. I love listening to podcasts. It's a very convenient medium for me as a mom of three. I have a 7-year-old, a 3-year-old, and a seven week old, and so it is like, it is a convenient medium to be able to consume because I don't have to watch it. I don't have, like if I'm driving my kids around, like I can listen to it in the background of my life, and I also know that my kids are getting value. Through osmosis and through just listening and hearing these these tools and tips and podcasts that I listen to. So there's a benefit to it. And I mean, I had one client who was put putting on a marketing, her marketing angle was doing a lot of summits, and I asked her, I said. Do you enjoy doing that? And she goes no. I sign [00:13:00] up for them. But then I I never go. And I was like, and she was not seeing success with her. Marketing strategy consistently for like a year of trying to do summits. And I said, well, what type of marketing do you enjoy? And she's like, oh, I love hosting in-person events. She started pivoting to that. Suddenly her business skyrocketed, but it happened because she was Mark. She was marketing in a way that she liked to consume. So if you like to consume podcasts and you enjoy a depth of conversation podcast, guesting can be for you. If you don't and you just wanna be like. Here's my visibility, and in my book I talk about the difference between a visibility one night stand and what the power of the podcast can be. So, and because it can build a real quality relationship, and what I call a visibility one night stand is like when you go on the show, it's like you meet someone for the first time, they share the episode, hooray za, here's your visibility experience, and then buy peace out. You never [00:14:00] see or talk to them again versus. The podcast has an opportunity. You have an opportunity. There's a quality conversation like you and I are spending 45 minutes to an hour together of time, and that time is valuable and. If you're spending that amount of time in a deep and intimate conversation, I like to think of the podcast as like a first date to open a first business date to open up potential opportunities for collaboration, for partnership, for referrals, for other options out there. But you just have to get to know each other a bit first. And I think we have to remove our egos from having it be like, this is a spotlight PR, press on me experience, and instead say, this is a collaborative experience and a conversation that we're creating together. Ross Romano: Yeah I mean, and we're mostly talking about guesting here, but certainly from the perspective of. Having one's own podcast, whether you're a business, whether you're an organization, a school whomever. I'm a big believer in the value of [00:15:00] that. And a lot of the things you just talked about is exactly what I would discuss with people, which is the media product of it is. Almost a secondary objective, right? I mean, you want it to be good. You want people to enjoy listening, but it's all the other things that come first. It's the people you get to connect with, the conversations you have. The way that you are putting that intentional thought and planning into how you're communicating about things you're doing and initiatives, right? All of that stuff has value, even if. Even if you didn't even distribute it, even if nobody ever heard it, and yet it's a bonus that people get to hear it and you get to share it and and and you use it for a variety of channels and repurpose the content and all the different things that happen, right? And if it becomes really valuable people in that way, but it really is something that. Every step along the path. [00:16:00] There's a lot of good that comes out of the mechanics of just getting into the routine of the habit of really thinking about communication and what are we doing that we should be communicating about and who are the people that are interested in knowing that and what do they want to know? Right. And I think having, whether it's a podcast or whether it's a newsletter anything that is. On a schedule and a routine where you're thoughtful about who it's for, and you're forcing yourself basically to be in the habit of, okay, this is our schedule and we have to think about what we want to include. And if you get in the habit, you will come up with good things that won't just be obligatory, you know? But everybody, if you're leading an organization of some type. There are things that you should be telling people about and it's a great way of thinking about how to do that. And then you get to pull in [00:17:00] external voices and experts and customers and collaborators and different people and make those conversations interesting. Kimberly Spencer: I mean, I can definitely say having had. The Crown Yourself Podcast for now six years. Like I've put my clients on the podcast and so that's Like when I have a new client who's interested in working with me. They wanna a re reference, I'll send them to the podcast interview that I have with a client that is very similar or started out in a very similar space that they were, the other benefit of having your own podcast is I have had conversations with people that I didn't think I'd even get to be in a room with, but because I had a platform that I could provide for them, then that allowed me to ha start having conversations with people that I. Like were mentors to me that then became friends. But it was because I provided them with a platform and then I also had the integrity. Yeah. I know you mentioned Ross about like there's value in the conversation, but like you could even like not distribute it and there's still [00:18:00] value in that conversation. And I would say like if you agree that this is for a platform, have the integrity to. Follow through on your commitment and distribute it so that they do get the benefit just as much as you got the benefit from having that conversation, because then that keeps a congruent level of integrity in the relationship. Ross Romano: Yeah, no, you should distribute it, but in theory, if you didn't, Kimberly Spencer: theory. Yes. True. Ross Romano: It's just, it's good to, to have it. And and, but that's one of the. Yeah, certainly with when you think about people who are hosting and what they're who they wanna connect with and the conversations it opens up saying, think about, just think about the benefit of each part of that, right. And not just the end product, the end result, the, and understanding that one of the limitations of the medium is. The data, there are shortcomings that we don't always know exactly who was [00:19:00] listening what, and sometimes we start to. Understand that over time, right? Once you get a listenership, you can survey them, you can collect information, you get feedback. You start to hear from people who are coming to you because they heard a podcast and they're saying, okay, I want to connect because I heard this episode you did, or I enjoy listening. But you don't always know all that stuff upfront. You have to just. Let it happen. Once you commit and get consistent and if you know that the things you're doing are worthwhile and high quality, that will happen. And just enjoy the journey. I. Kimberly Spencer: It very much is en enjoy the journey and also like be discerning with who you have as a guest. 'cause initially when a lot of podcasters start out, they're like, oh my gosh, people wanna be on my show. Yes, yes, yes, yes. And as you grow, like we've gotten to be very discerning because we went from doing bi week, like two episodes a week and to just doing, releasing one episode a week just because. I just was maxed out with my family [00:20:00] life and other responsibilities with my businesses. So we moved it to doing just once a week. So if you think about it from a guesting perspective, if you're wanting to go on somebody's show and they produce a once a week show, they have 52 opportunities. That's it. And if they're only, and that's only if they're only doing interviews, otherwise they have. Half of 56, 52, which I don't, I never math them public. So, so, but that they don't have as many spots. And so looking at what am, how am I adding value of what I'm sharing with the audience? And a big thing that I've, I kinda harp on in my book a bit, is the perception of positioning and how you're positioning yourself and what you do. And with podcasts. Three outta four people tune into podcasts to learn something new. And if you go by that stat, there's a lot of things that are circular knowledge, like they're kind of regurgitated. And one of the things that I get consistently with [00:21:00] people who pitch my podcast is, well, I want to empower women. And I'm like, that's awesome. But by now, six years into a podcast and over 250 episodes, we've had empowered, like empowering women. Like what specifically are you doing? Have you impacted 10,000 lives? Have you gone over to Africa and built 4,040 wells? Like show me specifics and get granular because. Our unconscious mind. It speaks in pictures and specifics are able, they allow you to paint a picture. So if there is an overall purpose of something that you wanna bring awareness to, or something that you wanna educate on, or something that you want to empower or inspire in others, then look at how are you actually doing this. Like, if you've. Been teaching for years and you have over 30,000 students. Oh my goodness. That shows a level of longevity in your career. It shows a level of professionalism that you have. It shows a level of [00:22:00] impact, and those numbers are tangible. I have a whole section where I go into like, what are the numbers that you can put into place? 'cause numbers can actually paint a really beautiful picture for the specificity of your story, of the things that you actually are doing that make you a much more. Interesting podcast guest. (ad here) Ross Romano: So what, what matters when you're deciding which shows to target, what are the things that one should be looking at and determining, okay, this is a show I should maybe try to be on. Kimberly Spencer: Yeah. So first is looking at what are you an authority in? So that's the first tier of our authority alignment strategy. It's looking at what are you an authority in? If it's education, then you're gonna be focused on more education podcasts, and then there's two tiers to that authority. So there's one where you are going on podcasts that are very similar to you. So for example, as a female coach, I would go on other female coaches podcasts. Or I would go on other female like, or I would target those global top oh 0.1% podcasts like Women of [00:23:00] Impact and Hal Taha Young and Profiting those types of podcasts are like, they're two branches of authority, so you can have the one that is. Is just mirroring who you are and what you're an authority in. Because for the most part, tho those are podcasts that you can add into your email funnel for, to nurture potential potential customers to say, Hey, like I was just on this podcast. See, I'm already being positioned as an authority. So the great part is about podcasting is you don't have to work as hard to prove you are who you are or to prove your. Your status. You already have built in social proof with the podcast because the podcaster is introducing you to their audience. And secondly, we have that second branch of like, those that, and when most people think about going on podcasts, they think of, oh, I wanna go on those big, big, big shows. Give me the visibility. And actually, you don't need to be on those big, big, big shows to have conversions to, into your business, to have beautiful relationships developed to get clients out of it. It took me a few years before I [00:24:00] was even on a global Top 100 podcast and. I've had podcasts convert much higher than the one that I was on that was a global top 100. So it, it really, it's not about the numbers, it's about making sure those, that authority is targeted. The second piece of the strategy is looking at your angle. So who are those customers that are unique to you? Who are those people that you want to attract? Who are the who are, who is the avatar that you are specifically targeting to speak to? So if you're a health coach, who is the client that you serve? Is it somebody who is a single mothers who are trying to lose weight? Great. Go on single mother podcasts. Go on weight loss podcasts, and you can leverage the keywords of your ideal customer avatar of the description, like basic description of who they are to then search out podcasts on that topic, I had one. Client come to me and he was like, can you get me on trucker podcasts? And I was like, I dunno. Let's see. Like, let's see how many trucker podcasts. There's surprisingly a lot, but [00:25:00] that trucker is where he was like, that was his avatar for what he wanted to target with his business. Then you have your angle, and that's the third piece of our strategy of looking at what are those unique aspects of your story that you are comfortable with talking about, that you can, that share a bit about who you are and humanize you. So for example, I. I'm a mom. I go on a lot of mompreneur podcasts. I go on a lot of working mom podcast, career mom podcasts, and talk about productivity and how I juggle two businesses and three children. It was two businesses and two children. Now it's just the numbers increased. Ross Romano: they need to start another business. Kimberly Spencer: Yeah. No, no, no. I think at this point, maybe down the road, but not right now. But with the but with your angle, it's looking at all of those unique aspects of your story that. Something that you can shine a light on. So we had one client who, she was in the corporate workplace and so she, and then she wanted to talk about something very deeply [00:26:00] personal and traumatic, which is childhood sexual abuse. She had experienced that and then she experienced toxicity in the workplace, and she was talking about how childhood trauma correlates to a workplace trauma. And in that experience though, she was comfortable talking about that trauma. Like that was part of her messaging. And I've been asked before, like, do you have to have some sort of like big traumatic, dramatic story to then get booked on podcasts? And I say, no, you don't. You just have to be a master in your field and be. Equipped with storytelling technique to share certain and specific stories. If you do have trauma in the background, if you're going to share it. Like I was on a coaching call today with with a woman who really wanted to share her story about her divorce and how awful it was. And yet at the same time through our coaching, she was like, maybe it's not the best time to share about it right now. 'cause there were still some ties that she had with her ex-husband that she needed to kind of work through. So. With any sort of trauma story, you wanna make sure that it's [00:27:00] not only like mostly healed, but also of really looking at, is this gonna impact me in any way or with legal issues. As far as divorces or business buyouts, for me it was a business buyout that I was concerned about. Because I was legally not allowed to talk anything negative about my business partner. So when I go on podcasts and talk about my buyout experience, I share about it from my lived perspective, and I don't, there's no blame whatsoever in that space. So there is an elegance in how you talk about certain specific harder topics, but I've been able to go on very successful business owner podcast because I've had a successful exit from the company. Ross Romano: Yeah. How do you prepare to be an interesting guest? Once you've reached out, somebody has said, yes, I'm gonna have you on. How do you make them glad they said yes. Kimberly Spencer: I think one of my questions that you'll know that I asked you is like, who is your audience? Like, tell me more [00:28:00] about who specifically your audience is, because especially if you're going on, if you're pitching a lot of podcasts or you're going on like a podcast guesting tour for your book or something, it. You're gonna be pitching a lot of people and you may not remember every podcast that you submit to. I know I definitely don't. But when they say yes, like give their episodes a listen, ask the podcaster. The podcaster will give you the best. The best answer for who their audience is. They will know what, they will know their audience the best, and trust that who you're speaking to, that they're gonna give you clarity. And if you don't have clarity, then seek more clarity and ask more questions of the podcaster for who that audience is and how they feel that you could best serve them. Because when you start asking those questions, it demonstrates not only that you care. But that you care about their most valued asset, which is the audience, like they have spent sometimes years cultivating a loyal audience and they are opening up the doors and positioning you as an authority in your field and in what [00:29:00] you do. And that's a position that deserves respect and reverence. Ross Romano: Yeah. Yeah. I think taking the host's guidance in many ways is a good thing, right? Regarding format length you know, trusting the host is one thing that I. Talk about Sometimes it hasn't. It hasn't been an issue on too many occasions, but every now and then there's a case of just having to trust the host. Will, there will be another question. It will guide the conversation. There will be more to come. Right? Like, don't have your list of things you wanna say and just start jamming them all in at once or going for eight to 10 minutes uninterrupted. It's not a good listening experience. Right. And it also doesn't give the host an opportunity to say, okay, I know what we should. Talk about next what the listeners will be interested in. And it doesn't help yourself as the guest. You might think, okay, I'm coming in [00:30:00] equipped to make the points I wanna make, but it doesn't necessarily make you come across well to a listener. And at a certain point when you're going unbroken for a long time or you're kind of going from one topic to the next and there's not as much of a through line. That if somebody's going to tune out, they might. I mean, they probably will literally tune out and say, okay, I guess I'm gonna turn this episode off. And that doesn't really help you there. So I sometimes if you're, again, I think that a lot of that goes back to if you're going to pursue this strategy of being on podcasts, you should really be a podcast listener, and it does, again, it does not require that you're listening to any particular show. Some the shows you want to be on. The audience you're trying to reach, you might not be in that audience, right? So it might not be the show for you that you would listen to. It's still recommended to maybe [00:31:00] listen to a couple episodes before you're on there to have a familiarity with it, right? But it might not be the one you listen to every week because you're, it's, there's other shows that are more for you. But I do think you would, you have that understanding of, okay, here's the cadence, here's how it usually goes. Here's sort of how I should tailor my responses and let myself be guided, right. And understand that the host, I. Certainly it's their show. They want the listeners to have a positive experience, so they're going to try to make you look good. They're not there to waste their own time or make people tune out. But you really just have to trust that. Kimberly Spencer: I think the the other piece, especially for authors that I've seen all happen a lot is the guarding information, or especially if you have, it's a nonfiction book, guarding information behind the walls of your book. And when you're going on shows saying, oh, well we show that strategy. That's the strategy I share in my book. And obviously [00:32:00] there, like I've said that a few times, but I've gone into what the strategy is. Obviously I can't go into a 297 page book within 60 minutes, but what I can do is give you snippets. I can go deep into certain aspects of the book, and I think that that's something that. When you're on a show, especially as an author promoting your book, don't hide things behind the brick wall of your, the behind the paywall of your book like. Trust that you, there's so much information probably in your book that there, there's no way, even if it's a like an 80 page, like smaller self-published book, there's no way you can get to all of that within the span of the time of the podcast interview. So allow people overdeliver really add value and then let. The audience decide, oh my gosh, this is so much value. I've got to get the book now, because if that's what she shares in a podcast interview, I now need this [00:33:00] book. It makes a big difference when you come from that service place instead of hiding things. And I've seen this with coaches and course creators as well, where they hide things behind the paywall of their course, or their coach, or their app. App or their book. And so just be a generous speaker. Ross Romano: I mean, I always think, and that's why we, I mean, that was part of the thought behind making this show specifically about interviews with authors about their books and having more length and depth to it, is that the more people hear about it the more they'll be interested in learning more. Nobody ever went into listening to an interview. With an author where they were interested in potentially reading that book, listened to it and said, wow, that was great. Now I don't need to read the book. Right. They might say, turns out that wasn't really something I was interested in. Or they might say that was pretty good, but eh, now I think I know enough about that. It's not totally [00:34:00] for me. Right? But nobody was you know, convinced not to read a book because the interview was too good. There was too much information in it. And if they chose not to read it, they weren't going to have read it anyway if they didn't get that information right. But you need to give people more than what they can get just by going to the webpage. Otherwise. Don't put, don't do the effort to do the interviews because the webpage is already there. But yes and if every single thing that's in the book can be covered in the interview, then I don't know, maybe there's just not that much in the book, I guess, but in most cases, there's a lot there and there's certainly more details and angles people will get from reading and it will make them much more interested in it. And that doesn't only go for books, it goes for all different types of work and insights and coaching. Right. Perfect example of. Certainly you can listen to a great interview [00:35:00] with a coach and get a lot of great insights and ideas, but still, in order to make the most of it, you would need to engage in the coaching yourself, right? So there's not anything there is that marketing. Maxim because give away the best stuff for free. Right? Like, not the worst stuff. Because let people know your good ideas and they'll wanna know more if you are saying, oh, let me hide my really good stuff and just give them the what's left over, how many people are gonna be will that appeal to Right. Some, I guess if you have a lot of good ideas. But there's gonna be a lot of people who are. Not going to necessarily think that it's that good. Kimberly Spencer: And there's a lot of good ideas out there. So I think the biggest thing is checking your own ego. And just coming and approaching it from a servant's heart, like from a service oriented space. And then that is how you build relationships. We don't wanna build relationships with takers anyways. It's like, if you think about it in [00:36:00] romantic relationships and business, if they're, if you're in a relationship with a taker, they're typically called the narcissist. So we wanna be in relationships with people where it's generous and giving and kind. And there's a mutual level of respect, so. Be that generous, giving kind person and share the information. The only caveat I would say would be if it was like a fiction book. You don't have to give away the spoilers or the ending, like you don't have to give away the plot twist, but you can definitely highlight your journey of writing the book, your experiences of how you related to the characters. There's story within the story that you can play with without giving away the spoilers for the book. Ross Romano: Yeah, it's making me think of, I mean there was a, this goes back to the forties, I guess, but at the time when television still knew there was this. Fear of putting baseball games on television [00:37:00] because they thought if people can see it on tv, then they're not going to wanna pay for a ticket and come to the stadium. And it was the opposite. Now that I see what it is now, I really want to go and see it in person and experience it. Right. And it's not the same experience. This makes me more of a fan of it. Because now I can experience more of it and I'm more motivated to go deeper. The same thing applies with all sorts of things, where the more I know what it is, the more in depth it is, right? I mean, why do people go to concerts? They could listen to those songs on Spotify, right? Kimberly Spencer: Without the drive, without the expense, without paying for parking. Like, but it's for the experience and there is an experience that's also in reading a book and diving in and being alone with yourself. That's different beyond the scope of a podcast as well. So I've, that's why I've always been a fan of the written word. Ross Romano: Right. Excellent. So. That leads us to an important question, what to [00:38:00] do after you're on a podcast. So you've gone through all these steps, you've found shows, you've been on 'em, you prepared, you were a great guest, you did a good job. Now the episode's going to come up. Now what? Kimberly Spencer: So there's a metaphor that I give in the book of so. You had a show with Oprah and then you just like got busy and you forgot to tell people about it. And I'm like, if you really had a show with Oprah, like you would be blasting that out from the top of your lungs. And I think giving podcasters, we don't know who the next Oprah's gonna be. So showing up and offering with generosity sharing the show to your audience, what, no matter the size of your audience, you've your email list, your social media, share the show and let people see it and get the word out about it because they. It's audience to audience collaboration. That's part of the reason why you're being brought on, especially as your influence grows with more audience, like share it with [00:39:00] those, be generous with your sharing your audience and trusting that your audience will enjoy this episode. This is also why in the episode itself, you want to highlight certain points or things that you may not have. In depth on multiple episodes. So it going into a podcast interview and thinking like, how can I bring a unique approach to this episode? Because the harder part is to get your audiences as a guest to listen to the episode. If they think, oh, I've already heard her origin story. I've already heard this strategy. I've already heard this thing, then. You wanna see how can I bring something new and fresh to this podcast episode to make it special? And then that way my audience will wanna tune in then after that, building that relationship with the podcasters. So drop them a five star review on Apple Podcasts or on if it goes on YouTube, like, subscribe to their YouTube channel, add it to a playlist of all the episodes that you go on as a guest. Drop them a review on Spotify and to drop a review on [00:40:00] Spotify, you actually have to have listened to the podcast. So that also boosts you in the eyes of the podcasters saying, Hey, this person really, they took the time to care about something that I put. Deep care into which is the podcast and I'm sure you do as well, like in the podcast, there's a lot of care, energy, and effort that goes into the production of the episode, and the guest actually has it pretty darn easy because all of the production aspect all of the time. I've talked to podcasters for a long time, for a lot of years. Some podcasters are spending two to 10 hours of their time listening, re-listening to your video, to your audio to make sure that episode is crisp and tight and right for their audience. Like do them the respect and share the episode with your followers. And build the relationship. So at the end of this conversation, I'm like, we're gonna sign off and I'll be like, Hey Ross, this was amazing. Is there anything else aside from [00:41:00] sharing the episode that I can do to contribute to your success? And he may say yes. He may say no. He may say like, just share the episode and then like, let's see where this goes. Great, but whatever he says to me, like, I am gonna look at how can we foster and build this relationship versus like, thanks for having me on your show and now I'm gonna piece out and we won't ever talk again. So I always make sure that you're following the podcast on social media. Make sure that you're following them on LinkedIn, and then build a list of all the podcasts and hosts that you've connected with because there is. Power in that relationship and we need to just have a little bit more reverence, I think, in this world for the people that we come into contact with. 'cause I don't believe anything happens by accident. Ross Romano: I mean, that's very true and certainly all the things that there's, there is a lot of. Work and effort that goes into these things. And and certainly if the host agrees to have someone on, it's because they think that it'll be valuable to their listeners. So they're not just doing it as a favor and yet at the [00:42:00] same time, it can make a big difference. All those little things and all the things that you're doing to help the show and the host. Help you too, right? Like, we have a network of shows here, and I will tell the other hosts in our network, Hey, I had this person on my show. They were a great guest. They did a great job sharing the episode. You might want to have them on your show too. Right? Especially when it's somebody like that. They wouldn't necessarily always be obvious because they're not the biggest name or they're not the person that. Everybody's had on their show before and say, look, when I, when they had me on, they sent it out to their email newsletter and a bunch of new people listened to it and that you probably would like to have them on too, or just, they were really interesting to talk to. They had a lot of good things to say. Write when you rate and review somebody's show. It's social proof for the show that you were on. So [00:43:00] when people go and check it out, oh, this has a lot of good ratings. It must be a good show, right? I mean, that's, you're helping yourself there. So there's a lot of things there. And you know, when you think about it, like you said, if you were on an episode with Oprah or or something like that, you would certainly share it. Well, why You don't need to. I mean. Whoever a million people are already gonna hear it. Right. Why are you doing it? Well, because you want people to know that you were on there, right? Well the same thing applies here and it could really make a difference. And if it's a handful of new people maybe two of them really like it and they subscribe and they listen further, and then. Maybe they tell a couple of people about it, maybe in a few months you're back on that show again. And now like the word of mouth is spread and there's a lot of new people hearing you because you shared it, right. People that you didn't directly end up getting it to. So, makes a big difference and it just, I. It certainly opens up more opportunities, whether it's in podcasting or otherwise, when you [00:44:00] demonstrate that, that engagement and that support for what people are doing. So yeah, all really important things, important things to hear. If you're out there and you're maybe you're working with people who wanna be on shows, right? And you're helping them get those interviews that, it's a great way, again, to help yourself, like when you have another client or somebody else you know, somebody is much more inclined to say yes or to hear you out when they say, oh, last time they gave me a guest, it was a guest that was really relevant. I had a great conversation with them. They shared the episode afterwards. Yeah. I'll certainly take another guest to recommendation from that person because and vice versa, if you're sending me I don't know what it is in the financial services industry, but I'm getting a lot of pitches lately and like, that's just not what this show is about. Right. Kimberly Spencer: A lot of real estate ones for my podcast, and I'm [00:45:00] like that's not what I mean. We talk about generational wealth building, but not, I don't need to know your golden nuggets for real estate. Ross Romano: You're not doing yourself a favor by proposing that because then. Maybe eventually you have a better recommendation, but by that point it's getting lost in the sea of irrelevant ones. And it's just, it's something to think about that certainly with the amount of attention and effort that, that people put into their shows they notice, right? They notice how people are sharing or not sharing, and when people are coming prepared and all of those things. It, it certainly makes a big difference. Kimberly Spencer: Yeah, don't be the example that I had to share in my book. I literally copied and pasted one that was one that we received and I blacked out off all the names, obviously. But I definitely was like this, here's all the things. That they did wrong in essence. And you know, not even addressing the host by name, not even saying hi, not even [00:46:00] saying thank you. Like little niceties, like general polite things go a long way. Noticing something about the show, like when you're pitching, notice something about the show like, Hey, congratulations on getting over 150 episodes. Like that shows to me you're a top quality committed podcaster. Like that's a huge accolade. And so. Y'all are, no, Ross has a hundred over 150 episodes now. Like that's a huge deal. And it, I mean, honestly, I celebrate anytime I see a podcaster that's over 30 episodes because most podcasters quit after 10. And so notice something about their commitment, about their, the quality of the episodes, about the quality of the guests. Just notice something about the show before you go blindly pitching yourself for it to show that you again, that you care. Ross Romano: Yeah, half a podcast is gonna after three and sometimes I wish I had, but no, we. Kimberly Spencer: you're committed and. Ross Romano: Yes. Well, it's been awesome Kimberly, to have you on the show and before we wrap, wanna give you an opportunity to [00:47:00] share anything else, any last thing that I didn't ask about, but I should have. But also where people can learn more about you, what they should check out on your website, where they can find the book, all that good stuff. Kimberly Spencer: Yeah, so the, if you want to learn more about podcast guesting on my other podcast is a communication queen podcast, and that one we focus solely on. Tips to really position you as a wonderful guest to be able to share your story. And I do live coaching on that. And so we're constantly taking applications for that show. So if you'd like to get live coaching from me and just have that be shown on the podcast episode, don't worry. I don't share coach in a way that makes anything very embarrassing. Or highlight anything that's like anything that you're not willing to share. But I do a little bit of live coaching around how you share your story and what you can do to better position yourself on shows so that you can get booked more. And if that's something that's interested to you, I will give Ross the direct link for that so that your audience [00:48:00] specifically can apply for that show directly without having to go through all the jumps and hoops and leaps and things. And if you wanna get the book, make every podcast want you, how to become so radically interesting, you'll barely keep from interviewing yourself as available@communicationqueens.com slash book and or on Amazon or Kindle, and all places where books are sold. And yeah. Ross Romano: We will put all those links in the show notes, everybody as we do to make it nice and easy to find all of those resources. You can check out any and everything you'd like there. And interestingly enough normally one of the things that we talk about in podcasting is. Don't worry too much about the website and the links because people listen on the apps, they're listening on the go, and yet every week I get a report on the website and people visit it when the people are going. So, we like to make it nice and resource rich there and make it easy for [00:49:00] everybody. If they are listening on the go, they can come to the site later, find the links, find everything, not have to hunt it down. So we'll put all that below. For you listeners, if you have not already, please do subscribe to the Authority for more Author interviews coming your way every week. Like we talked about rate and Review. You can also visit B podcast.network to learn about all of our shows. If you like this one, there's definitely something else there for you. Kimberly, I want to thank you again for being here. Kimberly Spencer: Thank you so much for having me, Ross. It's been a pleasure and I look forward to continuing this relationship.