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Inside J6 #2 Paul Hodgkins · Cultural Wars | America Out Loud News

• 0:24
  You've been through a lot.
• 0:26
  We talked we talked before you went to prison.
• 0:28
  Is that correct?
• 0:29
  Yes.
• 0:30
  You talked to me within the two months, just uh shortly after I was sentenced in July of 2021.
• 0:37
  Was it 21?
• 0:38
  Okay.
• 0:38
  I thought it was 21 or 22.
• 0:40
  Okay.
• 0:40
  All right.
• 0:41
  All right.
• 0:41
  And um we did a uh interview on the voice of a nation, I believe.
• 0:45
  We did a radio interview at that point.
• 0:46
  Yeah.
• 0:47
  I was hoping.
• 0:48
  I was hoping, Paul, frankly, at that point with you.
• 0:51
  I I was just hoping, praying that uh I thought something was going to intervene in this thing.
• 0:58
  I thought that uh somehow you you guys would escape some of this.
• 1:03
  I I that was my prayer, my hope on it.
• 1:06
  And I kind of convinced myself a little bit of that.
• 1:10
  Uh how did you feel at that point when we talked?
• 1:13
  Did you have any sense of that as well, or were you pretty well knew that it was going to happen?
• 1:17
  Well, I knew once I was sentenced that in all likeless, what was uh what was given to me in the courtroom that day was what was going to happen.
• 1:27
  Like you're saying, I did have some hopes that given the complexity and you know how much unusual uh things were concerning the case that something would come from outside the box and change that.
• 1:41
  And actually, something that changed in my uh whole case after we had spoken was I obtained myself a new attorney, uh, who still represents me to this day.
• 1:53
  My attorney retired care uh colonel Carolyn Stewart has represented me as well as several other J6 uh defendants since then.
• 2:01
  Okay, she did uh have some appeals and uh challenges to the case.
• 2:07
  Um one of which was uh ineffective of uh ineffective counsel.
• 2:13
  Uh basically what it broke down to at the time.
• 2:16
  Uh, even though this was something I could have continued on with pursuing it, the chances of danger in it for me in the case outweighed, you know, the chances of relief for me.
• 2:28
  Therefore, at the time, regrettably, I decided to just move forward, serve my time, and then see what can be done about the conviction following that.
• 2:37
  Yeah, yeah.
• 2:38
  And I remember that I'm and I remember your thinking a little bit as you just state that that you kind of hinted to that a little bit when we talked, and and you kind of looked at probably as a hurdle, you just had to get through and get to the other that's the way I would have looked at it.
• 2:50
  Okay, I gotta get to the other side of this thing.
• 2:52
  That's how that's how I do milestones in life.
• 2:55
  I don't know about you, but in other words, it as people as good.
• 2:58
  We have a lot of power within us to really buckle down and perseverance, call it whatever you want, but uh that's what I would have done.
• 3:05
  Okay, I gotta get to the other side of this thing, and on the other side of this, the other hurdle.
• 3:10
  It it'll be okay.
• 3:11
  We'll we'll make it through somehow.
• 3:12
  You know, you have to kind of convince yourself of that.
• 3:14
  All right.
• 3:15
  How many years?
• 3:17
  Remind me how many years you were sentenced, please.
• 3:20
  I was sentenced to eight months in a uh federal prison.
• 3:25
  It was just eight months, eight months, followed by 24 months of supervised release.
• 3:30
  Okay, I thought it was years.
• 3:32
  I did not recall that it was eight months.
• 3:34
  Okay, now uh wait a minute now.
• 3:36
  Hold on, hold on.
• 3:37
  When you were sentenced, I seen as I reported on a lot of the other cases, and a lot of the key people, they got years thrown at them.
• 3:46
  I mean, some of them got what 20 years, 20, right?
• 3:49
  Some of them were pretty outrageous.
• 3:51
  Yes, some of them were.
• 3:52
  I know personally some who were sentenced to right around 20 years in prison.
• 3:57
  I I heard uh I thought if I remember, and I'm just I go by you know, I I think one was even as high as 24 years, but whatever it is, they were pretty outrageous.
• 4:05
  Why was yours eight months and a lot?
• 4:07
  Do you know?
• 4:07
  Do you have any idea why others were so high and yours were my conviction was the very controversial 1512 obstruction charge, which was a charge that was a law that was created following the Enron scandal many years ago, uh as which involves things with document shredding, witness tampering, uh pertaining to funding, essentially it is a tax law.
• 4:33
  Somehow by uh entering the Senate chamber that day, I broke a tax law.
• 4:37
  But regardless, uh that was a nonviolent charge.
• 4:42
  I never had any violent charges brought against me.
• 4:45
  I had no prior criminal record uh before January 6th.
• 4:50
  And as much as I do have regrets about it now, I did plead guilty.
• 4:55
  Generally, a guilty plea will help you to find a better sentence.
• 4:59
  Let's talk about that a moment because I wanted to ask you about that.
• 5:02
  I remembered you pleaded guilty, and I I wondered at the same time what I would have done in that.
• 5:07
  I you know, when I was talking to you early on, and then after I was putting myself in your position, because I could have been easily caught up into that thing as well.
• 5:14
  I was invited up there many times over, and uh my work would not allow me to with the network and everything going on here.
• 5:20
  There's no way.
• 5:22
  Uh but I you know, but I could have easily got caught up into that.
• 5:26
  I I mean I could see how that would happen, you know, just on the moment of what it is.
• 5:30
  But again, I would be in the same boat you are, Paul.
• 5:33
  Uh no pass record, no violent stuff, no any of that stuff.
• 5:36
  That would all be check, check, check, check.
• 5:39
  And then it would be some technicality or some bullshit thing they'd get you on, you know, or whatever, and then hang out there.
• 5:45
  Because they they were adamant.
• 5:46
  It seemed to me they were adamant about locking everybody up, everybody.
• 5:52
  And you know, so the whole system was sort of against at that point.
• 5:55
  Remember, Trump was, you know, uh that was in the rearview mirror, and we didn't know what was going to happen down the road.
• 6:01
  If we we were fighting like hell with the next election, but we didn't know.
• 6:05
  And so everything was against you, and uh so out of all right, so out of the eight months, how much how much did you end up serving?
• 6:13
  I had served physically in the prison.
• 6:16
  I was there for six months.
• 6:18
  Now, while I was in there, an interesting thing came about where in as 2021 was finishing, there was a bill that President Trump signed into law in December of 2018, the first step act, where this inmates who qualified, low to level, low to minimum level inmates, would receive some relief uh from their sentence uh as far as time served.
• 6:45
  This became retroactive while I was serving my sentence, and it resulted in me having 34 days off of the eight months.
• 6:53
  Now, Paul, when did he do that?
• 6:55
  When did he do that?
• 6:56
  He had signed the bill into law in December of 2018, uh during his first term as president.
• 7:02
  Oh now, it something uh through the workings of that.
• 7:06
  I don't understand.
• 7:07
  I'm not fully clear on what and why, but that became retroactive for people who had gone into the prison system since then.
• 7:14
  And that so that had nothing to do with the J6 event.
• 7:17
  That was just a general that's what I was confused.
• 7:19
  That was a general thing.
• 7:20
  Oh, he said he signed this into law two years before January 6th.
• 7:24
  Exactly.
• 7:24
  Exactly.
• 7:25
  Yeah, and uh, like I said, 34 days off of my sentence, and also I qualified to have a small amount of the sentence served uh at a halfway house and then under house arrest.
• 7:36
  So about the last three weeks of it, three to four weeks of it I served back here in Tampa.
• 7:42
  Okay, uh halfway house, and then right here in this living room.
• 7:45
  Okay, okay, all right.
• 7:47
  So you had so help me here then.
• 7:50
  You had pretty well completed your you had pretty well got to the finish line before he did the pardon.
• 7:57
  Oh, yes.
• 7:58
  I had uh actually I had finished during 2024, finished the 24 months of supervised release.
• 8:05
  Right.
• 8:06
  From that, I was able to uh under Florida law, convicted felons who have not committed murder or any type of sex offense are eligible to vote in the state again.
• 8:17
  Uh so I re-registered myself the vote and gladly voted, you know, cast my vote from one convicted felon to another.
• 8:24
  You know, both who were convicted by the same cabal.
• 8:27
  And uh what an honor, what an honor, man.
• 8:31
  Oh, what a story that is.
• 8:32
  Well what a what a paradox that is wow.
• 8:36
  It just let that resonate in your soul a moment, what you say there is pretty significant, you know.
• 8:43
  Casting my vote from one convicted felon to another, convicted by that same cabal.
• 8:48
  Yeah, it's pretty pretty serious stuff.
• 8:50
  What the country went through, and we're still in the murkiness of it all.
• 8:56
  It's still there's still a lot to happen here, and we know that we know there's a lot more to happen, a lot more to come out.
• 9:02
  This thing isn't anywhere near complete.
• 9:05
  Uh if we get there, we'll see.
• 9:07
  I will get to that a little bit here.
• 9:09
  All right, so you so the benefit of the pardon in your case, then like a many of these cats were still in prison when this thing happened, and that this was like huge for them.
• 9:20
  That like they were like, I mean, they had to get on their knees and pray right away.
• 9:26
  I mean, based on that happening, uh, you know, save their lives, right?
• 9:30
  Save their lives.
• 9:32
  But at the same time, Paul, you um the benefit of the pardon for you is it sort of gave you your life back in a legal status that you could do all these things again and not be held, uh, you know, that it wasn't gonna be held against you.
• 9:48
  So, how did you feel when that came through with the pardon?
• 9:50
  What what went?
• 9:51
  I mean, that was a pretty big deal for you.
• 9:53
  It was still a big deal for you, huge.
• 9:55
  Oh, it was.
• 9:56
  Um, my time in prison was already served at that point, and that's time.
• 10:00
  We can't obviously we can never get that back.
• 10:02
  Well, you get compensated for that.
• 10:04
  No, I was not.
• 10:05
  Now I have received generous support from many of you know the Patriot community, you know, both locally and far from abroad.
• 10:14
  But I uh did, you know, my time it was already served.
• 10:20
  Like you said, many other uh defendants, they were probably in their cells praying.
• 10:25
  I imagine they were on their radios listening late at night for election results.
• 10:29
  Yeah, but um what was more painful for me than facing prison was the sheer principle of this and being convicted of a felony, you know, someone who had no criminal record whatsoever, yeah.
• 10:45
  Uh, and then you know becoming a convicted felon, you know.
• 10:51
  You you you read the docket, it says United States of America versus Paul Hodgkin.
• 10:56
  I did not like the feeling of that one bit.
• 10:59
  Wow.
• 11:02
  You know, I went there as a patriot, that would be painful as a patriot.
• 11:05
  Yeah, someone who loves their country, you know, loves you know, always has and that you know was uh blow, you know.
• 11:14
  That was well, they should have had the radical left democratic cabal of the United States of America.
• 11:19
  You would have felt better, at least at that point, maybe you know, I don't know.
• 11:22
  I would I I probably would have worn my my wrestling gear if I had gone to the case on that.
• 11:26
  But uh it was uh that in principle, it was the most painful thing for me, was the sheer principle.
• 11:34
  So having the pardon uh does remove the conviction now it uh rather the conviction still stands, but you are no longer a felon once but the conviction right, they don't there's no way that that gets removed, so that's still part of the record then the conviction in order to have that removed, it does need to be overturned by the court, even after you have been part of the I didn't know that.
• 11:58
  I thought the pardon took that right out as well and put that in the trash, but it doesn't do that.
• 12:04
  It removes any status on your record of being a felon, but there in the record books you once were a felon, pardoned by a president, okay.
• 12:13
  And that uh you know, is something I think myself and probably many many more J Sixers need to work at, right?
• 12:19
  Right, right, right.
• 12:21
  I heard reports somewhere along the line, and if this is accurate or not, that there was talk or something about Trump pursuing possibly compensation for these uh uh for these people that were caught up into this whole thing.
• 12:37
  Was there any word about that?
• 12:38
  Was there any conversation talk about that?
• 12:41
  Not that was brought up to me.
• 12:42
  I have heard in what you're uh bringing up there from President Trump, but I've also seen his appointed U.S.
• 12:48
  attorney Ed Martin talk about this as well.
• 12:51
  Okay, uh, that he feels that there should be compensation for the J6 uh defendants, uh, or at the very very least, uh, give them a refund on the restitution that they had paid to the government from their cases at the very least.
• 13:06
  But yeah, um, I'm kind of surprised you didn't that that hasn't been pursued back to Martin saying that as well.
• 13:14
  Do you is there any hope that that might still be pursued, or is that like no way?
• 13:18
  Uh I mean, I certainly wouldn't turn it away if it was.
• 13:21
  Uh there's something I could, you know, in a positive manner be helpful to that cause.
• 13:27
  I would, but uh, again, the pardon thus far, the pardon was you know, I felt not only honored by that, but in principle, it was so helpful.
• 13:38
  Yeah, and I think the next thing before I even worry about compensation is that you know, myself and many other defendants need to work to have the case have the convictions just overturned by okay.
• 13:48
  So, are you gonna be doing that?
• 13:49
  Let's talk about that now.
• 13:50
  Are you are you doing that?
• 13:52
  I believe I right now I am not actively engaged with my case.
• 13:57
  Um I think this is a wheel that turns very, very slowly, unfortunately, as I understand.
• 14:04
  But this is something that again, I I uh there's no to my understanding, there is no time constraint as far as statutes on when you can do that.
• 14:13
  So even if it's something that doesn't happen overnight, if it happens, okay.
• 14:19
  All right, yeah, all right.
• 14:20
  All right, Paul.
• 14:21
  Let's get back to um the event itself.
• 14:23
  I've got a lot of questions here, and I know listeners do, uh, viewers do.
• 14:28
  Um the actual J6.
• 14:31
  Okay.
• 14:32
  Uh we remember the context of all of it.
• 14:35
  We remember the context of the speech.
• 14:37
  Um peaceful protest.
• 14:40
  We get all that.
• 14:41
  We reported on all that many times over.
• 14:44
  And uh, you know, um when he actually and just recent here, uh the BBC was caught with their pants down.
• 14:54
  You seen that saying uh I'm unbelievable, and others have as well.
• 14:59
  They're not the only cats, by the way.
• 15:01
  But they took it a nip the whole thing about 50 some odd minutes apart, almost an hour apart, glued some crap together to try to create another narrative, which is basically what the media does anyways.
• 15:11
  I'm not even sure they went to that trouble why they did, because they just create their own narrative anyway, so but they almost didn't even need that.
• 15:17
  Uh, they could have just continued to lie, which is what they always do.
• 15:21
  Uh, that's what made this thing so uh unsettling to so many people that uh the lies were coming so fast, the whole thing with Pelosi, the the committee, what had taken place there.
• 15:33
  But let's get to J6 a moment.
• 15:35
  Okay, so everybody kind of Trump, you know, he says he says what he says, and then they head down to the Capitol, and uh I can see where the emotion and the images are striking to me.
• 15:48
  Uh that it happened.
• 15:50
  Uh again, I have a different viewpoint of this thing than a lot of other people.
• 15:53
  How did you feel about it?
• 15:55
  When things were happening that day, did you I'm I'm I'm thinking like in your mind, what you're saying to yourself that you might not have said out there like, oh, this is getting out of hand, or man, this is kind of cool, or uh this is interesting.
• 16:10
  Uh I what went through your mind.
• 16:13
  Oh, interesting would be an understatement about what happened that day.
• 16:17
  Uh what when I went to DC that day, I had my intentions and my plan was to be there to be part of President Trump's rally, someone who I had been in such support of for years leading up to this, and something I wanted to be a part of, and also a march on Pennsylvania Avenue following his speech at the in this rally at the ellipse.
• 16:39
  Now, going to DC, I was concerned uh about what kind of behavior we could see from counter protesters.
• 16:47
  Uh, only about three weeks before January 6.
• 16:51
  Uh President Trump had made a motorcade rally in DC for his supporters, which had overwhelming turnout just for his motorcade appearance.
• 17:00
  That was quickly followed up by attacks by Antifa BLM protesters, and it got to be a very, very nasty situation in the streets.
• 17:08
  Many people hurt, you know, law enforcement having to use measures to break that up.
• 17:13
  I was concerned that that could happen on a much larger scale that day, considering you know the amount of attention that was being put on this.
• 17:20
  Yeah, I did not see in the streets so much clash with counter-protesters that I had seen.
• 17:27
  I did not expect you know what happened at the Capitol building to happen that day.
• 17:33
  Uh Pennsylvania Avenue directs you down right towards facing towards the Capitol building, and I expected to see a large crowd gathering, which there was, but I didn't uh expect uh as I got closer and closer to see the crowd doing what it did, which seemed uh interesting to me, and curiosity pulled me in as I grew closer and closer.
• 17:56
  So when you start to see the crowd, what was the at that moment when it started to take a life on of its own?
• 18:04
  What was happening exactly?
• 18:06
  I'm trying to picture that moment.
• 18:07
  Was it what?
• 18:09
  Well, something at the time I don't have a lot of time to really ponder everything that I'm seeing around me.
• 18:16
  But yeah, yeah, at times it did seem odd to me that Trump supporters would have just barreled in like a bull in a China shop completely on their own, predetermined on their own.
• 18:26
  Well doing so.
• 18:28
  And let's stop right there a moment here.
• 18:30
  And we both know correct me on this, please, but we both know that did not happen, by the way, still to this point.
• 18:35
  Am I correct, sir?
• 18:36
  Oh, you're very correct.
• 18:38
  We've learned so much since that time.
• 18:40
  Uh yeah, and I've been a part of MAGA, you know, since it got off the ground during Trump's first campaign for president.
• 18:48
  I've been part of many crowds, which has a lot of energy, yeah, but generally not people who are out trying to pick fights, trying to hurt somebody.
• 18:56
  That's not the energy that I ever found.
• 18:58
  It never has.
• 18:59
  I love that picture that was just on there, by the way, with the Magarola, and then the people there just it's a moment, it's a moment here.
• 19:06
  We uh, as we've known learned since then, even recently, there were a minimum of 274 FBI agents or affiliates on the ground in the crowd during January 6.
• 19:19
  And there it is, bingo bingo bingo, and they lied like hell about that for that whole duration of time.
• 19:26
  They lied.
• 19:27
  They said they were what a couple or something or whatever.
• 19:30
  I had given my testimony following January 6th that before I had ever even entered the building that day from outside, okay.
• 19:38
  That I saw, and many, many other people saw.
• 19:40
  I'm sure plenty of cell phone camera footage of it.
• 19:44
  Three individuals who got on a uh motorized lift made for washing windows and painting, turned it on and went up three stories of the building.
• 19:55
  Stir I thought it was strange to me, this was left there so conveniently where it could just be turned on.
• 20:00
  And three men go up to the windows of the third story, pulling hammers, a hammer out the front of their pants and smashing the windows, which got a lot of reaction from the crowd.
• 20:11
  Okay, something like that, as profound as that, you would expect if a criminal, if somebody went there and decided to do that, they would have been persecuted, prosecuted, and blasted on the media.
• 20:23
  I don't recall seeing that in the news.
• 20:25
  So I was gonna say you heard nothing about that.
• 20:27
  Yeah, these men were put there to do things like that to agitate to encourage and honey trap people.
• 20:35
  So did we ever find out who they were, though?
• 20:37
  Because I never heard anymore about that.
• 20:38
  But I do remember, I do remember the left.
• 20:40
  I do remember the visual of that, and that was kind of weird.
• 20:43
  Yeah, but you don't hear about stories.
• 20:46
  You didn't hear about those individuals uh being pulled away and arrested at their homes and later on convicted of crimes.
• 20:53
  No, probably because they were one of the you know, hundreds that were there that day, infiltrating the crowd, and I think encouraging reactions that otherwise there would not have been.
• 21:06
  Now, there may have been some defendants who got a little carried away, or they would see this and they could be easily persuaded to do things that they wouldn't have normally done.
• 21:15
  Yeah, uh, but again, I think this and uh the amount of data that has been gathered since then really goes to show that any destruction that happened on January 6th was not an organic type of thing, was not right, right?
• 21:30
  All right, so the the media portends and have state on that page, Paul, that this was definitely organic, that this was just kind of happened, as you say the lift, the hammers, and not only that, but all of the uh the it we seen the images, we've seen the videos uh with the capital police opening up things, letting people come in and what have you.
• 21:49
  And this is after the point, the other big point that we knew about and was discussed is that uh, you know, Trump had offered uh the speaker of the house, um Nancy Pelosi, uh the National Guard and extra help and what have you, just as a point of reference that that's documented for sure.
• 22:06
  And she declined that.
• 22:08
  So when you start to look at all that evidence, and it's been looked at pretty heavy now from people who really have dived into this.
• 22:15
  Does the does the record correct itself historically?
• 22:20
  Does the record correct us has well, has it corrected already in your opinion?
• 22:24
  That the point we're making here, and or will it correct itself otherwise moving forward?
• 22:29
  I wonder everything over the last decade, particularly has been any issue at all, is usually so divided and so polarized amongst people.
• 22:42
  And January 6th, there's no exception.
• 22:45
  Yeah.
• 22:45
  Um I would like to say that uh we've been able to refine and make a decision on what happened that day and how the public will view it, but the public is still as divided as they were before about January 6th, no matter what facts we bring forth about it.
• 23:04
  Yeah, basically, because you know opposition to MAGA, opposition to Republicans, opposition to Donald Trump at will will do this, you know, relentlessly.
• 23:16
  They will do this at uh by any means necessary.
• 23:19
  They will project, you know, their opposition to be some of the worst types of people, the worst types of energy as there is, and that's what's they are still trying to do their best with with James.
• 23:28
  Well, it's even more I agree with what you say there, but it's even more than that a little bit here, because I think as you recall the pictures, the images and the videos of what had taken place.
• 23:39
  Uh, people had been brainwashed.
• 23:41
  Uh they've been indoctrinated into this line of thinking.
• 23:44
  It had been uh you remember, I got so tired of them covering this story that I didn't even want to hear anymore about the the lies and the deceit and the BS coming from I I just didn't pay, I didn't want to hear what the media was saying anymore because it was all just rubbish and it kept going on and on.
• 24:02
  But this the point I'm making, there's information.
• 24:05
  All she's seen on the big screen there was the constant videos, and it was the most dramatic pictures, the lift and the hammers and the people and the uh you know, the pushing through, and that cry they took the worst images they could and they blew that sucker up like there was no tomorrow 24-7.
• 24:22
  It's just played, it was just put it on a tape and just keep running that sucker all day long.
• 24:27
  And that's what I seen happening.
• 24:29
  And I it was obvious to me it was a total setup, like everything is with the media, which is disgusting.
• 24:34
  Uh that happens.
• 24:36
  But I have people in my circle, probably you may have some too, I don't know, that are more center, even a little bit left of center, friends, people you know, you know, that kind of thing.
• 24:44
  They they exist, they they're around.
• 24:46
  And uh and uh they're part of the part of the woodwork and uh friends and others, and uh they fall into the camp you just said with the J6, they because they're part of that indoctrination of the visual, a landscape that was showed and jammed down their throat, and the media does that real well, they jam it down your throat, and it's incessant and they do it constantly, and it's all of them, it's not just one or two, Paul, it's everybody that does that across the spectrum.
• 25:12
  Uh they all do it.
• 25:14
  So I think this is there's been a lot of brainwashing here.
• 25:17
  You don't just wash that away.
• 25:19
  Uh, when you know, uh it's not that's not easy to wash away that sort of vibe that has been like everything else in our lives and like everything else had coming out of Washington that's been pushed into people, and so I I wonder uh you know, it so I guess no matter what they put out there, the chances of them probably ever changing people's minds, those people probably will never happen, Paul.
• 25:42
  The damage is extreme, it's been done, huh?
• 25:46
  Uh unfortunately, you know, they felt so many of them felt so strongly about this that they're not even open to the idea of that they could have been mistaken about something.
• 25:56
  They could they're not open to the idea that maybe they were fed misinformation or they've been misguided.
• 26:01
  And you know, many of them will probably say the same things about us, they'll say that we're the crazy ones.
• 26:06
  We're we're the ones that they do, you know.
• 26:09
  There's uh so unfortunately, you know, how this mitigates into society going forward is still gonna be a difficult thing.
• 26:17
  Still going to be well, well, we when if you could just wrap your take what you just said, if you wrap your mind around the fact that they have been successful with making uh this phrase make America great again, a bad thing, the nemesis to fight the evil and all of this.
• 26:38
  That's been the bad story here.
• 26:39
  Make America great again.
• 26:41
  You say, All right, like what's the downside of that, please?
• 26:45
  Would you help me please figure that out?
• 26:47
  But then the media, every time they would talk about it, they would say, MAGA, those MAGA people, they're just horrible.
• 26:54
  It's like I I've so often I've heard people of the left make this ridiculous comparison of MAGA and Donald Trump being working in society as something along the lines of past dictatorships and past tyranny that we've seen in parts of the world.
• 27:11
  You know, they they've acted like Donald Trump's whole visionary and his rise to power is some type of fascism.
• 27:18
  Uh Hitler, Nazi.
• 27:20
  We heard it all.
• 27:21
  We heard it all.
• 27:21
  Yeah.
• 27:22
  Donald Trump's governance essentially in conservatism wants less big government.
• 27:28
  Okay, fascism does not want less government controlling people.
• 27:32
  Okay, they want more people voting, more people having say in in laws that are made, who we put in charge of it.
• 27:38
  That is not fascism.
• 27:40
  Okay, there is no I've heard them go on and on with this ridiculous idea that there's some sort of genocidal plan behind everything here with with MAGA.
• 27:49
  Uh I have been as ingrained with the America First movement as I could be for the last decade now.
• 27:57
  I have never seen, nor have I ever even sensed a scratch of any type of mentality like that within it.
• 28:04
  If there ever was, I wouldn't be a part of it.
• 28:06
  And right, right.
• 28:07
  I think that deep down in people, if they really really do believe this, then yeah, they're brainwashed and they've they've drinking the Kool-Aid big time.
• 28:15
  Yeah, yeah.
• 28:16
  If they if I think many of them deep down in, they know that we're not we are not Nazis, we are not fascists, and they probably deep down in, even though they don't want to believe it, they realize that Donald Trump is not either.
• 28:29
  But they still don't like it, they still don't like us, so it's up to them to make the worst, worst imagery of us that they ever possibly could in order for their own gains.
• 28:38
  Yeah, yeah.
• 28:39
  And and this, what you're when you say they, and you reference they and in the way that you do, and you reference really the cabal, the cabal, the the they them as how many of them like to be preferred to, but yeah, right, yeah.
• 28:53
  Oh, yes, yes, they them, him, her, how um wow.
• 28:57
  But you know, uh, although there's less of that now because of Trump, he put a real hole through DI DEI and through all of that.
• 29:04
  In fact, nobody thought that sort of and and and we're not out of the woods with that crap yet, either by any shift, but the woke left, the radical woke left.
• 29:12
  I don't think anybody thought that he could turn the ship, even to the degree that he has in that capacity with woke with the radical woke left that that that there would at least come back to some sort of civility of conversation about okay.
• 29:24
  Maybe this is a little screwed up that we're trying to put you know a penis on a on a woman in a vagina on somebody else, so that maybe this isn't the right thing to do.
• 29:32
  Um, and maybe we should stop some of that indoctrination, and maybe we should, you know, whatever.
• 29:37
  Uh so you know, I think that's kind of uh uh a pretty big fact.
• 29:41
  Um, but you know, these are people that when we talk about MAGA in the way that it is, uh, they're constitutionalists far and wide, they're definitely patriots, definitely patriots, man.
• 29:54
  Uh, which our country wouldn't be here if we didn't have that line of blood uh throughout our two.
• 30:00
  249 plus years, by the way.
• 30:05
  We wouldn't even be there.
• 30:07
  And so it is uh it's remarkable.
• 30:10
  And it, you know, that um that this you know, but listen, listen, what I really blame a lot of this on.
• 30:17
  I mean, the Pelosi's of the world are going to do what they're gonna do.
• 30:20
  I mean, the radical left is the radical left, and you give them an inch and they'll take a mile every time.
• 30:25
  And they've been doing that right along.
• 30:27
  And the Republicans and a lot of the conservatives, Paul.
• 30:30
  What bothers me or worries me is that there's sort of before Trump, they're sort of wimpish.
• 30:36
  Uh, I could use a lot of other words here, but I'm not going to uh remain in general, but they're sort of wimpish.
• 30:41
  They let a lot of this happen over the years, just like with the media and the social media, which I've talked about in his programs and uh buying it all up and controlling the narrative and the schools and the indoctrination and everything.
• 30:51
  In other words, you know, we've sort of created this this um this illusion that um somehow we're putting we're making the fight, but we are constantly give in to the radical left.
• 31:02
  Trump is, I think you and I would appreciate and agree.
• 31:05
  He's the first one to really come along to say, you know what, this isn't working uh with the left per se, and I'm gonna push back against it.
• 31:14
  And that made a lot of people uncomfortable, which is probably what got you excited, and a lot of people got excited about that because he was a different character for a different day.
• 31:24
  I mean, we know what Obama, those eight years with Obama was like, uh, we know with the first four years, how interesting they were with Trump, and we know what they tried to do to him for four years.
• 31:35
  They they did everything they could, clearly, but then you had the election of Biden and the cabal was on a complete shift here, really to take over the whole.
• 31:43
  I think people really felt that.
• 31:45
  Uh, do you how do you feel about what I described there?
• 31:48
  Did you have that sense as well?
• 31:50
  Or did you were or did you absolutely uh of all the past presidents that we have had, all except nine of them had served in some form of public office already, where they had been elected to.
• 32:05
  And eight of those uh nine of them who were who were not high-ranking generals from within our member, our military.
• 32:14
  And the one of those nine that was neither one of those things is sits in the Oval Office now.
• 32:21
  And I think in principle, that made things very exciting for people.
• 32:26
  I think it also made things very concerning for some people as well.
• 32:29
  Yeah, they feel there could be risks in this.
• 32:31
  This is someone who's never held public office, they're not going to be able to handle things, they're not gonna have the savvy there.
• 32:38
  Yeah, he's gonna run on ego and nothing else.
• 32:41
  Yeah, things like that.
• 32:42
  And you know, there's also people like me who you know may be a little bit of a risk taker, but might see, you know, how enthusiastic this is.
• 32:51
  Let's have you know, the American people coming together and electing a leader that was neither neither one of those things, not a military personnel and not somebody of public office, you know, and somebody who I thought was a tremendous visionary for what he wanted to do for the company, uh country, what he wanted to do, you know, bringing us to new heights economically and in defense and socially, and it really inspired me to finally get behind a candidate, you know, and get behind something that I wanted to see in leadership, and I really really did put my eggs in that basket.
• 33:28
  So before then, did you ever put eggs in any baskets before then, or was Trump the first one?
• 33:33
  I mean, I had always uh uh voted in presidential elections ever since I was a legal voting age in the 2000 election, but every time I did it really it felt like who who do I dislike less here?
• 33:46
  You know, there was nobody who I was really excited to have as a leader.
• 33:50
  I wasn't I voted for George W in the first one just because I felt he was slightly better than Al Gore.
• 33:58
  Uh I could I could tell you each one I had.
• 34:00
  I and I was always an independent voter.
• 34:02
  You know, it wasn't until 2017 where I became a registered Republican.
• 34:06
  Okay.
• 34:06
  I had voted Republican, I had voted for a Democrat, I had voted third party.
• 34:10
  At one point I even wrote myself in to be president.
• 34:14
  And uh in 2012, I said, okay, I don't like either one of you.
• 34:18
  I'm not I could do it.
• 34:19
  We all went through that every election cycle.
• 34:22
  That you you you picked the lesser of evils.
• 34:24
  It's it's it's uh you know, evil one evil two.
• 34:26
  Thing one thing too.
• 34:28
  Remember, Dr.
• 34:28
  Seuss, right?
• 34:29
  The thing one thing too.
• 34:30
  Everybody kind of went into the voter booth thinking in those terms, and uh really weren't sure.
• 34:35
  You took the lesser of evils.
• 34:37
  I know about everybody I know was doing that time and time again.
• 34:39
  Very seldom were they really excited about a candidate.
• 34:43
  Um Trump, um you described it really well with uh the fact that he'd not run for, I think people should understand he did not run for any office before then.
• 34:52
  Uh, we haven't seen that ever in our lifetimes.
• 34:54
  I don't know if it ever happened in the history of our country, probably not.
• 34:57
  All right, everything we describe about Trump there kind of changes the rules a little bit.
• 35:02
  I mean, he was a different guy for a different day, and I think that's what set up a lot of this, the deep state and the cabal, and that created J six.
• 35:11
  I think the disbelief that Trump had lost that election uh was too much to bear for a lot of people after the success metrics of those four years, in spite of headwinds of dealing with every sort of calamity and storm they threw at him, everything.
• 35:33
  We don't need to go down that list, but it was there was not a day.
• 35:37
  I'm sure he could wake up in the White House and say, okay, everything feels great today.
• 35:40
  Nobody's after my ass.
• 35:41
  I mean, they all were after him.
• 35:43
  Uh every day he was fighting the bandits.
• 35:46
  And uh, so it got to that point, Paul, uh, where uh I think people couldn't believe.
• 35:51
  And so then the reaction of this with J 6 that now what was really weird about Biden is is that he he didn't run a campaign.
• 36:00
  COVID was used as sort of a really lame deal.
• 36:04
  Uh so all of that was uncomfortable for us as well, how that was happening.
• 36:09
  And then the guy doesn't campaign.
• 36:11
  We never see, I mean, we've never in our lifetime seen any candidate win any election.
• 36:16
  I mean, you probably couldn't win mosquito control if you didn't have an aggressive campaign to go campaign.
• 36:20
  And this guy didn't do crap, and he won the presidency of the United States with the most votes ever.
• 36:25
  I mean, the most votes ever.
• 36:27
  That was what uh right?
• 36:29
  Uh it was we'd never seen those kinds of numbers before.
• 36:33
  Uh, I mean, only it only exceeded by those who actually believe Joe Biden absorbed 81 million votes and 81 million.
• 36:41
  I do not, but uh yeah.
• 36:44
  Well, that was the problem.
• 36:45
  That's why they went up to contest that at J6, and then Pence kind of all that happened and all.
• 36:50
  And you know, so this whole idea of a conspiracy where you guys were being uh blamed for a conspiracy to overthrow the United States government.
• 36:58
  Uh, where's that at?
• 37:00
  That that was the whole conversation coming from this committee and the left, and then you know, you put the images all up there, and then you you put those comments out there, and you look, and then you like you say a minute ago, you got the thing up and down, you got hammering things, you got things happening.
• 37:15
  You say, Well, this looks like a pretty bad deal here.
• 37:18
  Um, what does it look like?
• 37:20
  We want to believe what they want to believe, no matter what is being put forth for them.
• 37:28
  Again, evidence we've shown on the ground that day, you know, the unbelievable, you know, look at the cases.
• 37:34
  You can look at them compared to other cases for that charge.
• 37:36
  The persecution that was involved with it.
• 37:39
  Uh and then, you know, as we've confirmed, verified now, almost 300 FBI agents and affiliates on the ground that day.
• 37:49
  Christopher Ray, when he was grilled about this in the last two years, couldn't even give a straight no that you there wasn't.
• 37:56
  He knew that there was, and he didn't dare to just sell the truth at the time.
• 37:59
  Yeah, and on top of all that, look, if there was absolutely no truth to anything that President Trump and his attorneys had been claiming about the 2020 election, there was no truth whatsoever to that.
• 38:12
  Joe Biden really did absorb 81 million votes, and this is the direction America took.
• 38:17
  If that was the case, I don't believe for a moment that Donald Trump would have been able to come back and win the election last year that he did, especially to the in the capacity that he had.
• 38:30
  He didn't just squeeze by and get this with a few states with just enough votes like he did in 2016.
• 38:36
  Right.
• 38:37
  This was a landslide.
• 38:39
  Right, right.
• 38:39
  That I think that should make some sense to people too.
• 38:43
  Um Paul, why doesn't it?
• 38:46
  Why doesn't that make sense?
• 38:47
  Uh but why are still people in disbelief in there, and even the Democrat Party and and centrist Democrats and people, JFK Democrats are not radical left people.
• 38:57
  I'm talking about they're different segments of that party.
• 38:59
  They've been taken over from obviously the radical left and all, but there's still a lot of people looking for a home in that middle aisle and just in that left middle aisle as well.
• 39:08
  I thought for years the Democrat Party in the establishment that I've seen coming through the uh some of the changes happening through the Obama years and then thereafter.
• 39:17
  I kind of felt it was gonna burn out historically and come to its end.
• 39:21
  I still believe that's gonna happen at some point.
• 39:23
  I think it's on track to do that with the communists and the socialists taking over.
• 39:27
  We see what's happening right now in full daylight now.
• 39:30
  This would the stuff that's happening right now today would have been hidden uh just five years ago, they would have never had this out to the degree that it's out there now.
• 39:38
  But now they're out right, they're like everything else they do, they're out of the closet, and they're just exposing all this, and they're not hiding any of this anymore.
• 39:46
  And it's just out there now.
• 39:49
  And so now we leave we know who sort of the enemy is, I guess.
• 39:52
  And I say that because you know, communism and socialism and Marxism is an enemy.
• 39:57
  I mean, it's an enemy to our constitution, it's an enemy to our nation.
• 40:00
  You agree with that?
• 40:02
  Oh, I absolutely do.
• 40:03
  And I think right now things, you know, the Democrat Party had so many people in it going so far to the left.
• 40:10
  And in some districts, that's what works for them, unfortunately.
• 40:14
  But I think it got to be where someone who was, you know, a Democrat but was towards the center and was reasonable about things was caught starting to be rejected by their own party.
• 40:24
  You look at a senator like Joe Manchin, right?
• 40:26
  Who uh you know represented West Virginia, he's a blue, he's a Democrat senator from a red state, yeah, and has to consider his voters that put him in his seat.
• 40:36
  Yeah, yeah.
• 40:36
  And someone like him, I remember was constantly being scrutinized by his own party while he was in it.
• 40:41
  I think towards the end of his tenure, he had uh converted to being an independent.
• 40:46
  Yep, yeah, and then decided not to run again, which I hate to say it, I don't blame him because he doesn't feel like he belongs anywhere.
• 40:54
  That's what happened.
• 40:54
  That's yeah, it's what happened with him.
• 40:56
  I believe John Senator John Fetterman is facing this right now.
• 41:00
  Uh, I think he's actually being reasonable.
• 41:02
  We look at his opinion on things through this government shutdown we just had, yeah.
• 41:06
  You know, the only about the only Democrat we saw you know through it that was able to be reasonable.
• 41:11
  And folks like that that actually could, you know, yeah, someone like that, you know, where folks we could see come to the center, and if we saw politicians doing that publicly, I think that could help have a ripple effect, and people could stop fighting as badly as they are, but they don't want that.
• 41:27
  Too many, yeah, yeah.
• 41:29
  Yeah, they're they're gonna try to drive Fetterman out of the party just like they didn't mention, by the way.
• 41:34
  They're gonna, and I think Fetterman is some point may not be able to handle it, like we like we you know, because I mean he's he does have some health issues, he just went through a couple of things and he didn't.
• 41:46
  I know I know just before uh he was elected to his seat, he had suffered a stroke.
• 41:51
  Yeah, big time, big time, yeah.
• 41:53
  And but I mean he's a very interesting guy, but I think they'll try like hell, they don't like him because he's sort of a uh uh an acorn in their shoe, and they don't like that.
• 42:01
  He makes them uncomfortable because they don't want that uh sort of viewpoint that logical common sense central.
• 42:08
  I mean, Trump ran on common sense, those are the words he used here in the in his inauguration here in uh 2024, and uh with that election, and uh, you know, they just don't want that.
• 42:19
  They, you know, so the the other rest of that party.
• 42:22
  Why is it that uh do you think these people in their in their right mind still think somehow that uh that Biden did get 81 million votes and that and that he did sort of what because I can't see anybody confessing right now that they were I don't hear anybody that story has those, and that's the problem I see here.
• 42:41
  A lot of those stories, they just sort of go away.
• 42:43
  We never get the clarity on them, we never get the answer back, we just keep moving.
• 42:47
  And we're very frustrating.
• 42:49
  Well, it is even with COVID, as bad as that was, and the way they hijacked all the mail and voting and the way all of this stuff.
• 42:55
  We we know I've had experts on to the to the cows come home on that story alone, and we never get clarity.
• 43:02
  We we never get the the issue addressed.
• 43:05
  We never get we never get the answer.
• 43:07
  We just keep moving forward.
• 43:09
  Is that a weakness of the Republican Party?
• 43:11
  I want to because the left's never going to admit anything.
• 43:14
  Is that just a weakness that we don't?
• 43:15
  I'm just asking, I don't know.
• 43:17
  I mean, when when if you confront somebody on the left, if like did Joe Biden absorb 81 million votes, even if they realize that it's probably likely he did not without campaigning, yeah, without the basement.
• 43:29
  I mean, you know, uh, they they they will either duck and dodge the question, or they they will just uh you know won't let go and just insist that yes, he did absorb 81 million votes.
• 43:43
  Donald Trump upset America enough where 81 million Americans would come out and vote against him, even with a completely uninspiring candidate like Joe Biden.
• 43:52
  Yeah, uh before this election, the highest uh number of votes in a presidential election was uh in 2020 where Barack Obama got almost 70,000.
• 44:03
  That's right.
• 44:04
  Which, as much as I had seven million, million, you mean excuse me, I meant to say million.
• 44:08
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 44:09
  And uh in 2008, it's pretty tough for me to admit this now.
• 44:14
  I was one of those votes, not because I was a Democrat, I was an independent who felt that was just disappointed with the Bush Cheney administration.
• 44:22
  Yeah, yeah.
• 44:22
  Uh yeah, but the point I'm getting at is in 2008, I can understand why Barack Obama would absorb uh a vote total like that because he did inspire America, like him or not.
• 44:33
  He did was very inspiring at the time.
• 44:36
  Okay, Joe Biden was not.
• 44:38
  Joe Biden did not offer new ideas, he did not offer a big new direction, he didn't set a bold vision ahead of him.
• 44:44
  He just wasn't Donald Trump, and you know, basically his party just wanted somebody, you know, he had the most name tag value at the time, I think.
• 44:53
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 44:54
  No, that's right.
• 44:55
  That's right, name recognition and all.
• 44:57
  Uh yeah, listen.
• 44:58
  Um, uh, I think that um uh it's good to remind people.
• 45:03
  I'm glad you just said what you said, because I think everybody, you know, you don't I don't want them to think it's that's really important that okay, Paul is some radical, uh right wing, uh whatever, you know.
• 45:16
  I mean, you voted for Obama back in the day, correct?
• 45:19
  I did you just admitted that you just and I remember you said that to me before and I forget about that, but yeah, I mean, so you were just looking for answers to our country, and he did appeal to a lot of people with this hope and change thing.
• 45:30
  Um, you know, I did I did not vote for uh uh I don't uh mean to throw you under the bus, brother, but I did not vote for Obama ever.
• 45:38
  Uh so he was not my uh not my bag by any stretch of the imagination.
• 45:42
  I'm a uh pretty pretty strong conservative on every level, even when I was a kid uh or a younger guy, whatever.
• 45:48
  But I fact I railed against Obama with on national radio.
• 45:52
  I got a gig when I left the corporate boardrooms and had an opportunity, and uh there's not a lot of radio programs railing against his policies and his Marxist um agenda and how evil I thought it was for our country.
• 46:03
  And because I never thought Biden was going to get in the white house, he was such a doofus and just low intelligence.
• 46:09
  Uh the guy just had nothing to offer.
• 46:11
  I never thought in a million years that he would get anywhere near uh 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue Paul.
• 46:17
  I didn't I never thought it was gonna happen under any condition.
• 46:21
  I thought the eight years that he spent as vice president was the closest he was it was bad.
• 46:25
  It was bad.
• 46:26
  That's right, and even that is because Obama wanted a uh uh somebody who had some history and he wanted a uh uh you know uh um a career politician and a white guy.
• 46:39
  Um so he needed a white guy because you were gonna put you weren't gonna have a two black ticket with two black people.
• 46:45
  Um that's just wasn't gonna happen.
• 46:47
  And wasn't gonna yeah, identity politics remembers their thing there.
• 46:51
  Go ahead.
• 46:52
  Yeah, he uh at the time Barack Obama was a young candidate for president.
• 46:57
  He is was serving as a senator, but his you know political resume was still not the not the largest.
• 47:04
  No, no, and someone like Joe Biden who had been in you know the Senate since the 70s, you know, knew Washington in and out, and at that point was still cognitive, had plenty of cognitive ability in 2008.
• 47:16
  Uh, but you know, again, I don't think he had very much positive to run on, except you know, the biggest thing he had was that he was Barack Obama's uh vice president was the biggest thing on his resume that he could offer, yeah.
• 47:28
  And again, it's uh yeah, which tells you why, and then you know, you know, an inverted reason that's why Kamala Harris was eventually chosen to be his running mate, and eventually the eventually the candidate for president for reasons.
• 47:43
  Well, they're the leaders of identity politics, whatever it may be.
• 47:47
  Um, and uh they'll pick whatever flavor on the Crayola K crayon box they need.
• 47:52
  Uh, and that goes for anything, it doesn't matter.
• 47:54
  But the you know, it's really about uh intelligence and it's about capabilities, it's about voting for the right person, is what it should be, but it's not in the on the left.
• 48:04
  In fact, they have actually chosen, as you know, through multiple elections, they chose they're they're a party that doesn't even listen to their constituency, they picked the leaders through the through their primary process.
• 48:15
  In fact, they've thrown Bernie and and they've become more radical over the past, so I don't know, multiple elections, but certainly the last 20, 30 years.
• 48:23
  I mean, you look at the fact that two elections in a row, Bernie Sanders would have won.
• 48:26
  He would have won, and he's a nut job.
• 48:29
  I mean, he's he's like the professor in the back to the future, meaning although he had a little more brains than he had, and uh, you know, he looks he looks like him anyways.
• 48:37
  I I would say between the comparing them, both of them were insane, but in different kinds of ways.
• 48:42
  Joe Biden, Joe Biden, you would describe more as being clinically insane just for the sake of where he's losing cognitive ability, becoming senile, and he's just a functional.
• 48:52
  Uh now Bernie Sanders, I don't think that had happened to him, at least not yet.
• 48:58
  However, he was ideologically insane.
• 49:00
  His ideas for America was not America, it was not you know our constitution, and he he he was promising things so outrageous that much of his own uh the Democrat Party weren't even in favor of it.
• 49:12
  He was promising things he would have never delivered, but um and now you see him and AOC, they make quite a team.
• 49:18
  I'll tell you what, and all the rest of them.
• 49:20
  Uh I don't want to spin off too long about Bernie Sanders, but what I'll point out is in 2016 when the WikiLeaks revealed what happened within the DNC, uh, between fundraising, super delegates being given to him, having uh the debate questions from CNN funneled the Hillary Clinton and not him.
• 49:42
  Uh he he never had any reasonable chance.
• 49:46
  Now, had the DNC not done these things, he would have been the nominee in 2016.
• 49:50
  It came down, it came down to the state of California.
• 49:54
  He where it was gonna decide.
• 49:56
  I remember in that primary cycle who the nominee was going to be.
• 50:00
  And uh once we had realized the corruption from the DNC and how they did that, even though I was no fan of Bernie Sanders, it just seemed like such such a sham.
• 50:12
  It was primary.
• 50:14
  It was that this is not this is deceitful to the American people.
• 50:18
  This is not okay.
• 50:19
  This is something that you know, nobody who who obtained a nomination that way should win it.
• 50:24
  Similar reason as to why Kamala Harris never never ever could have won the election.
• 50:28
  Yeah, yeah, you would think not.
• 50:29
  You would think not, but uh this is a good idea.
• 50:31
  She didn't have a problem.
• 50:31
  She didn't win a primary.
• 50:32
  She was put there when their own party realized they put a doofus who can't do the job and people aren't going to vote for.
• 50:38
  So they said, Well, we maybe we'd fare better with her.
• 50:42
  All of this highlights the corruption in the radical left and how corrupt it is, really, is what it is.
• 50:47
  And when you're playing identity politics uh to pick your winners, and you're not listening to your uh constituency, uh, then uh you have a real problem.
• 50:57
  And uh I don't know how this party continues to exist.
• 50:59
  I did, I did I do anticipate them to burn out still.
• 51:03
  Uh something else will come into its place.
• 51:05
  It's not going to be just one party, it's we're not a one party country.
• 51:08
  That's not in fact, I'd like to see more than two parties, frankly.
• 51:11
  You know, uh so anyways, I think we need some competition in there, some competition of different levels, you know.
• 51:17
  Uh, in fact, uh, you even the Republican Party, the grand old party, the GOP.
• 51:21
  Uh, you know, that became uh, I think MAGA really has, you know, I I almost thought there was going to be a name change on the Republican side.
• 51:28
  I thought both parties were going to burn out.
• 51:29
  Let we'll talk about that in a moment.
• 51:30
  Give me just a moment here.
• 51:31
  I want to talk to our our audience here a minute, and uh, especially this time of the year when people are uh getting uh colds, flus, viruses, all kinds of stuff here.
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• 53:33
  That spike protein buildup is where people are suffering and struggling like hell.
• 53:37
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• 54:15
  That's that's all that's what we do here, is put that out there throughout our platform.
• 54:19
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• 54:29
  But anyways, let's get back to uh Paul here.
• 54:31
  And uh, and by the way, follow us on the new feed.
• 54:34
  Uh I know you have the at out loud news if you're following the network.
• 54:38
  That's cool, but I've just set up a new one on X and uh at Malcolm Out Loud.
• 54:43
  So I should probably tell you that.
• 54:44
  I don't get to social media a lot, but our team will be will be putting stuff out there and engaging more and more with folks.
• 54:50
  Uh, but uh I'm in I'm in the factory making the spaghetti more or less.
• 54:55
  So I don't get a chance to get out a lot, but um, I'm making the spaghetti all the time, man.
• 55:00
  Uh so that's what I'm doing.
• 55:02
  So it's it's really easy.
• 55:03
  Anyways, yeah, I'll feel pretty good, Paul.
• 55:05
  I'm out uh uh in my you know, walk four or five miles a day every morning, and I commit to that.
• 55:10
  I don't care what else is going on in the world.
• 55:12
  Um I mean how busy I am, uh-uh, it's an obligation for me.
• 55:15
  I do it for me, and uh you gotta have your lifestyle and health, and uh and you know, I had a little bit of scare at the beginning of the year with an AVM and arterial venous malformation, so you kind of you know you get slapped upside the head with your uh health, just a little bit.
• 55:30
  And that wasn't anything I bought on myself, that's a mechanical problem when the intersection of arteries and veins kind of you know collide a little bit, and then you end up with a problem, but uh, but it makes you weary, we have to take care of ourselves.
• 55:41
  So I preach that on the network to people all the time, and it's yeah.
• 55:46
  I think it's great that you do that.
• 55:48
  Uh, I've always been someone who pays mind to physical health, you know, myself.
• 55:52
  Interestingly, I can tell you upon my release from prison.
• 55:56
  Yeah, I was not in the healthiest shape when I came out.
• 55:58
  I was wondering that.
• 55:59
  I was wondering, yeah.
• 56:00
  What kind of condition were you in?
• 56:01
  What was happening, please?
• 56:03
  Thankfully, I while I was in in the prison, I had never gotten hurt.
• 56:07
  Thank you.
• 56:08
  Okay, okay.
• 56:09
  Never got hurt.
• 56:10
  Yeah, tell tell me, tell me about that.
• 56:11
  I want to hear about that.
• 56:12
  I want to leave uh I want you to tell us here.
• 56:15
  You're you're you're you know, you and I, I could be the same guy as you and got caught up in another thing.
• 56:19
  I'm gonna look at you and I I see I see me in that same sense, really, Paul, really, as a patriotist and constitutionalist and and getting caught up into something that is a little bigger at the moment than what I thought uh might have chewed off just a little more, not knowing, you know.
• 56:33
  So tell me, I I can't, it's hard for me to wrap my arm around.
• 56:37
  So you know, a guy like myself, got like you, so you put a step into prison.
• 56:41
  What tell us what I mean?
• 56:43
  What is this like?
• 56:44
  What do you what how does it go?
• 56:46
  Tell tell me what are you saying to yourself, man?
• 56:48
  Well, I mean, uh, it hit pretty heavy once I realized uh I was in uh in the courtroom that day.
• 56:54
  I was gonna be going away to prison.
• 56:56
  Uh you know, the press was right there to capitalize on my emotions, right?
• 57:00
  As soon as I was out of the door of the courthouse.
• 57:04
  I yeah, again, never been in trouble beyond a speeding ticket.
• 57:08
  So this was pretty massive for me, especially as public as it was, too.
• 57:13
  We see plenty of convictions happen in the courts and people will go to jail, maybe a small item in the paper or some or a clickbait, but no, I was a big story for a while there on national news.
• 57:24
  And so not only am I going away to prison now for the first time in my life, but I'm doing this on a very uh public national stage, where you know, we talked a little bit about how divided people are, how divided the media is about things.
• 57:41
  You know, I had you know, division from the media and how they treated this.
• 57:45
  Of course, you had conservative media all the way up through uh prime time on Fox News.
• 57:51
  Many of the journalists there saying how outrageous this was, you know, you're putting a man who with no priors uh away for a length of time in prison for a non-violent, you know, trespassing uh infraction.
• 58:05
  And uh how that they thought that this was uh completely out of line.
• 58:09
  Then you had media from the left, you know, outraged that I didn't have far, far more prison time to serve than eight months that they thought that I should be getting a life sentence, if not the death penalty for this.
• 58:21
  And that uh you had you were the first one to be sentenced as it is that true.
• 58:26
  The very first January 6th defendant who was sentenced to prison.
• 58:30
  Prison, yeah.
• 58:31
  It was just a few uh sentences before mine on misdemeanor charges, which were only I believe probation.
• 58:38
  Right, right, right.
• 58:39
  I do I do remember that.
• 58:40
  Yeah, Paul, that is uh seriously now.
• 58:43
  That is a badge of honor.
• 58:47
  I mean, can I say that?
• 58:48
  It is a badge of the you can.
• 58:50
  Um it is a badge.
• 58:52
  I mean, you're uh what the point the point I'm making here is you're a piece of history, historical.
• 58:58
  Thank you.
• 58:58
  Um it's something like uh I used the term earlier, a paradox.
• 59:04
  It uh of course it broke my life down quite a bit going in.
• 59:09
  They had referring to me as things as a white supremacist, an extremist, a terrorist, and I've got this all loud in the media, loud and clear from the media as I'm going into a prison, which very, very uh Caucasian inmates are very far and few between in this prison.
• 59:31
  Now, to me personally, that doesn't mean anything.
• 59:34
  You know, I I doesn't matter to me if people are I'm around are white, black, Hispanic, whatnot.
• 59:41
  But you know, all you know, obviously in all men's unit that I was in, very few other Caucasian men were in there.
• 59:47
  So you're going into this gen pop uh general population in a prison where people have committed crimes that were not political uh protesting, you know, much more severe crimes.
• 1:00:00
  And you've got the media calling you all these things on the way in.
• 1:00:04
  So you can imagine I said to myself on the way through the door.
• 1:00:07
  Oh, God, you are putting me to the test with this one.
• 1:00:14
  It uh God looked out for me, and thankfully nothing horrible happened while I was in there.
• 1:00:21
  I had never been got hurt.
• 1:00:23
  I did not get in a fight.
• 1:00:24
  Uh I kept to myself very much as I was going in.
• 1:00:29
  I sat around and I read books.
• 1:00:32
  Uh I didn't talk about January 6th or why I was in the prison.
• 1:00:36
  Did anybody know that was the reason?
• 1:00:37
  Any of the other inmates know?
• 1:00:39
  Uh, very uh interesting story that I'll spin off to about this was the first anniversary of January 6th while I was serving my sentence.
• 1:00:49
  I remember that day I got up in the morning, got my breakfast tray, went back to my cell and tried to go back to sleep.
• 1:00:57
  You know, try to sleep as much as I can because mentally you're not there, you're someplace else.
• 1:01:01
  So it helps it to go by.
• 1:01:03
  Unfortunately, I couldn't sleep very well at all the whole time I was there.
• 1:01:06
  But anyways, went back to my cell in the morning on January 6th to go to sleep.
• 1:01:11
  The prison's captain eventually came into my cell and called my name out.
• 1:01:16
  Um he says, Why don't you come step out here?
• 1:01:19
  We want to have a talk with you.
• 1:01:20
  And uh this was a little bit alarming to me.
• 1:01:23
  It's very rare that the captain himself will uh will come and intervene on uh in on an individual like this.
• 1:01:34
  He said, Well, we'll come out in the hallway so nobody else needs to hear.
• 1:01:38
  And he brings me out to the hall, and he says, Okay, you know what today is, don't you?
• 1:01:42
  I said, Yes, sir.
• 1:01:44
  He said, We have picked up some intel that apparently there's going to be a uh organized protest outside the prison today in your name.
• 1:01:54
  Which I had no idea about this, and I uh was adamant with this to the captain, and he said, Well, we know you don't know about it because we've scanned every one of your communications from the prison.
• 1:02:05
  Wow, but as a precaution, I do have to put you in the shoe for today.
• 1:02:10
  The shoe is the special housing unit, it's what most people who haven't been to prison think of as the whole.
• 1:02:16
  Okay.
• 1:02:16
  Um, he had said, if everything goes well, uh, nothing gets out of hand, we should be able to bring you back to your unit tonight.
• 1:02:23
  But I spent about 12 hours that day in the prison's dungeon in isolation in isolation.
• 1:02:30
  They are still usually two person cells after what I was brought to it.
• 1:02:34
  I was brought they brought a 20-year-old inmate in for premeditated attempted murder who I spent the day with, and uh it was uh pretty interesting.
• 1:02:46
  I wasn't uh very very uh closed off from what's gonna happen next.
• 1:02:50
  There's no televisions anywhere, I don't have access to the phones, I don't have um eventually I was brought back to my unit that night, but while I was away in the special housing unit, the televisions inside of where I was normally housed were showing the local news and what was going on outside of the prison that day and why it was going on.
• 1:03:14
  The cat was out of the bag now.
• 1:03:16
  Everybody knew why I was there, and I was the first you know, person from January 6th to be in a prison at that point.
• 1:03:24
  What surprised me the most about that was the reaction I got from most of the uh other inmates?
• 1:03:32
  Oh, what was I thought I was gonna be a goner after that?
• 1:03:35
  Wow, but um so that made me feel a little bit more comfortable.
• 1:03:40
  Prison's still very uncomfortable, but it made me feel like I could walk around a little bit more easily with uh a little more relaxed if that's that's quite a story.
• 1:03:49
  That is quite a story, man.
• 1:03:51
  Uh I can see where that would have happened, and you didn't know, and then but it worked out okay, thank God.
• 1:03:57
  How when you get into a system like this, and you know, you're with these other inmates and some pretty pretty uh um uh some people have done some pretty big crimes and stuff.
• 1:04:09
  I mean, they're criminal minded.
• 1:04:11
  Um how how is it you're able to safeguard yourself?
• 1:04:17
  Like you don't get help and support from uh the um the guards and stuff, right?
• 1:04:22
  You're on your own.
• 1:04:23
  I mean, right, they're not gonna help you.
• 1:04:25
  Surprisingly, in a unit that has hundreds of inmates uh housed in within it, yeah.
• 1:04:31
  Most hours of the day, you have one corrections officer monitoring the whole unit.
• 1:04:36
  Now, everything is under surveillance, and obviously there's plenty of other correctional officers within the prison to address something if needs to be right.
• 1:04:43
  But uh, one person sitting at a desk, you know, with about two, three, four hundred inmates who are on this unit, you know, a lot of things fly under the radar.
• 1:04:53
  Now, like I said, you're not in the best of company, you know, not everyone's terrible.
• 1:04:58
  There's some inmates who just made a poor choice or thought they could save some money in the way they filed their taxes.
• 1:05:04
  Not everybody is some career, right?
• 1:05:07
  Right, right.
• 1:05:07
  But many, there are also many who are many of them and they get all mixed together, don't they, Paul?
• 1:05:12
  The the less and the the more severe.
• 1:05:14
  How does that happen?
• 1:05:15
  I uh this was a federal prison that I went to, which was uh yeah, uh different from going to a state penitentiary.
• 1:05:24
  Generally, people who are convicted of things like murder, uh will will serve their time in state uh state okay.
• 1:05:31
  So those are those are gonna be harder, those are gonna be harder.
• 1:05:34
  Uh the you're gonna uh hard.
• 1:05:36
  Yeah, people who generally, if you're inside of a uh any kind of detention where you're surrounded by people who are serving life sentences, yeah.
• 1:05:46
  You know, these are folks who have done something horrible enough to warrant a life sentence, and they don't have really much to lose going forward.
• 1:05:53
  So if you do anything they don't like, you know, they don't they feel a lot of repercussion to dealing with you, right?
• 1:06:00
  But but in all the time you were there, you never had a fight, and nobody tried to attack you.
• 1:06:06
  No, nobody that's unbelievable.
• 1:06:08
  Especially when you see all these movies and these plays and where there's constant attacks, constant fights, and they're constantly trying to rape the inmates and do all this kind of stuff.
• 1:06:18
  And people think about this when they go into a position like this.
• 1:06:22
  Like, how do you I'm sure people are like, wow, but I but it's interesting.
• 1:06:26
  I'm I'm I'm glad you brought that to the attention of the big difference, it is a big point.
• 1:06:30
  The state penitentiary versus the federal is one part of it, probably.
• 1:06:34
  You're right, I guess for a lot of those crimes, but uh some pretty reprehensible crimes within the federal.
• 1:06:41
  We have many uh they shouldn't put them all in the same area.
• 1:06:44
  I don't agree with that, man.
• 1:06:46
  You shouldn't be having people with hard ass criminals like that, you know, with the crimes, and then put them with somebody who just happened to fudge their taxes or something.
• 1:06:53
  That's wrong.
• 1:06:54
  Well, and in the in the federal, like I said, you generally won't have like serial killers and murderers in there, yeah.
• 1:07:00
  But you have things ranging from trespassing, like I did.
• 1:07:04
  There was another rim uh inmate in for only three months because he off hours decided to visit his wife while she was serving at a prison minimum security prison camp.
• 1:07:14
  Uh you have people who were serving 30 years who are robbery wrong banks, and it was uh you know, and then you have a lot of drug dealers, you know.
• 1:07:25
  You have what a lot of inmates will refer to as chomos, child molesters.
• 1:07:31
  Wow, wow, and you know that that's it today.
• 1:07:34
  Do they get screwed?
• 1:07:35
  They get cheated, uh, they get um uh treated uh har harder.
• 1:07:39
  Don't they uh do am I wrong or don't they go after those cats more?
• 1:07:42
  They're shunned quite a bit more than uh say somebody who sold drugs.
• 1:07:47
  Uh because this is that's that's that's a particularly unforgivable thing.
• 1:07:51
  That's something where even other criminals will look at.
• 1:07:54
  That's what I understand.
• 1:07:55
  That's what I understand.
• 1:07:56
  So they would look down on that and probably do them harm, I would imagine, huh?
• 1:08:01
  I I think they would be at more risk for that because you know, even to a hardened criminal, you're a disgusting person, you know.
• 1:08:07
  So a lot of these hardened criminals might have had children at some point out there, and they think about these things, and um, you know, that's you're not you're not in the best company in these things.
• 1:08:18
  You hear you have that.
• 1:08:20
  But you know, there were some people, you know, not everybody wasn't necessarily a terrible person.
• 1:08:25
  So yeah, all right, cool.
• 1:08:26
  Very good.
• 1:08:27
  So you got through it.
• 1:08:28
  You're you're able to manage to get through and the grace of God, and you were able to hold on to your uh your dignity and what I started uh with saying about going uh when I came out of prison, you know, I wasn't the healthiest that I had always had always been.
• 1:08:43
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:08:44
  Um the particular prison where I stayed at, FDC Miami has no outside to its facility.
• 1:08:52
  Uh for the whole time you're in, you don't see the sun, you don't have fresh air.
• 1:08:57
  Uh, it's basically like serving your time in a submarine.
• 1:09:00
  And I had asked other inmates while I was there who have been in and out of different prisons.
• 1:09:05
  What's the worst one they've been to?
• 1:09:06
  Most of them would say that that FDC Miami was the very worst prison they had been at.
• 1:09:11
  Maybe not the most dangerous, but the worst is in lack of resources, it is understaffed.
• 1:09:18
  The food is worse than just about any other prison they've been to.
• 1:09:21
  Wow.
• 1:09:22
  Well, yeah, it's a trade-off, but the trade-off on your health, your safety could be uh the big trade-off that you don't want to trade that off or you know, something else, the food or the outdoors.
• 1:09:34
  I'm saying, so then that way it was would be a blessing, I would think a little bit here.
• 1:09:38
  But um, how'd you feel when you first went outside and you seen the sun again?
• 1:09:42
  I wonder.
• 1:09:44
  I had asked uh when I was the uh someone was picking me up from prison.
• 1:09:48
  I asked them to make sure they brought a pair of sunglasses with them for me to wear because I knew the sun was gonna be particularly blinding for me, not seeing it for a while.
• 1:09:58
  Um it felt
• 1:10:00
  Great to be out.
• 1:10:01
  Um, you know, first step towards freedom again.
• 1:10:05
  And you know, a lot of people showed a lot of love towards me, you know, reaching out, you know, wanting to talk to me as quickly as possible.
• 1:10:12
  And it was a big big sigh of relief to be out.
• 1:10:15
  The battle was still a long, long ways from over.
• 1:10:17
  It's still a long ways over from now.
• 1:10:19
  But um, yeah, anyways, a huge hurdle I'd gotten past, and I vowed I was never ever gonna go back ever again.
• 1:10:26
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:10:26
  Well, again, let's remind everybody, you got out before everybody was pardoned before all that had happened, and so uh, you know, there was a lot to uh to to yet happen under Trump's uh uh uh administration and what he did.
• 1:10:41
  You know, when he uh pardoned uh the group, the the whole group, and uh about everybody I know was just uh it's like uh were just blown away, thrilled beyond measure.
• 1:10:55
  I I don't know anybody who wasn't like a static that everybody was finally free of this nonsense.
• 1:11:01
  That's there's a lot of hope and faith in that as well, Paul, because that means that those people thought that this was a ruse all the way from the beginning that it should have never happened, and that uh it was a setup, and a lot of that evidence had started to come out.
• 1:11:14
  You're exactly right, and people started to see that Pelosi was a less than honorable person, and that committee was an at less than honorable committee, and uh that it was it was a joke, it was a horrible joke, uh played on the American people.
• 1:11:27
  You know, I looked at the J6.
• 1:11:29
  Let me just talk to you here a moment here.
• 1:11:30
  I look I looked at the J6, Paul as a um, I don't know.
• 1:11:35
  I I looked at it as a uh it definitely a historical moment of our country.
• 1:11:42
  Uh see, I didn't see the negative part of it like others did and like the media did now again, short of any uh aggression or uh criminal activity.
• 1:11:52
  We're not talking about that.
• 1:11:53
  Uh I I don't condone that.
• 1:11:55
  I don't think you do either.
• 1:11:57
  Uh we're not gonna do that.
• 1:11:59
  But uh I looked at these people from the first time it happened as uh you know, as as heroes.
• 1:12:07
  I looked at them as um as uh people that historically were standing up for a country in a big way, you know.
• 1:12:14
  I really do thank you.
• 1:12:17
  And um, yeah, yeah, as painful as damaging as many of the things that I went through concerning uh January 6th, and uh being prosecuted afterwards, persecuted afterwards.
• 1:12:30
  I I'm really not one to victimize myself.
• 1:12:34
  I don't like to.
• 1:12:35
  I I uh feel the folks who tend to have a habit of doing that, you end up showing a little bit of weakness.
• 1:12:44
  Now it was pretty rough for everything that I went through, but a silver lining I'll take from from it all, including going away to prison was that this did this did make me tougher.
• 1:12:55
  You know, I considered myself a relatively tough person to begin with.
• 1:12:59
  So this confront facing this and getting through it, coming back out on the other side did make me a little tougher, and also in a weird kind of way, I say I did gain some credibility through all this too, because until January 6th, I really I was just another guy in a MAGA hat, you know, someone who just was an outspoken Trump.
• 1:13:19
  I told you you you became a piece of history, didn't I?
• 1:13:22
  You did you certainly did, and you were right.
• 1:13:25
  And um it uh I've been able, you know, when life gives you lemons, what are you gonna do?
• 1:13:31
  So life certainly gave me some lemon through all that.
• 1:13:34
  I'd say that I have definitely turned that into lemonade.
• 1:13:37
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:13:38
  Uh I've gotten uh garnished a lot of respect from a lot of people, uh a lot of support and love from a lot of individuals.
• 1:13:46
  Uh it it outweighs the vitriol and uh and that's a shot of you there, that picture that was just on there.
• 1:13:52
  That was you on there, right?
• 1:13:53
  That yes, that was from this past uh September.
• 1:13:56
  I was uh attended a vigil for Charlie Kirk.
• 1:13:59
  It was on within not.
• 1:14:01
  Oh, it was, and you're okay.
• 1:14:02
  All right, not even uh two weeks after his you know most tragic, you know, death.
• 1:14:08
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:14:08
  Uh there was a vigil put together nearby here in Florida that had a great turnout, and they had taken the organizer had uh asked people who might like to say a few words, and I was one of the one of the ones she was happy to hand a microphone.
• 1:14:22
  All right, right.
• 1:14:23
  I have to ask you here.
• 1:14:24
  Uh oh man, if they had had that that vigilant thing up at up near the Capitol uh there, would you have gone to it?
• 1:14:32
  Had uh had what up there at the if they had that uh celebrate of Kirk's life or that vigil, as you call it, if they had had that up near the Capitol in that same area, would you have gone to it?
• 1:14:42
  Oh, oh, absolutely.
• 1:14:44
  No, it's available and available.
• 1:14:47
  You were not no hesitation, you would have gone.
• 1:14:50
  Yes.
• 1:14:51
  And in fact, I think they probably have been a few vigils in DC.
• 1:14:56
  Uh, from down in Florida, there's only so much I can physically get.
• 1:14:59
  Well, but you see why I ask you that.
• 1:15:01
  You see why I ask you that.
• 1:15:02
  I mean, because I wouldn't be surprised at all of some people have PTSD from that whole event.
• 1:15:07
  Oh well, I can tell you uh it's within my plans.
• 1:15:10
  I'm going to be making a return to DC for this coming uh January 6th, the fifth five-year anniversary of J6.
• 1:15:19
  Wow.
• 1:15:19
  My reason for that, Charlie Kirk, what happened to him in this past year is about the most upsetting thing we've seen happen.
• 1:15:26
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:15:27
  Um, and interestingly, this coming January 6th, I am going to be making a return to DC.
• 1:15:33
  Uh, we are going to have an organized march on Pennsylvania Avenue to commemorate the life of Ashley Babbitt.
• 1:15:41
  Okay, whose life was tragically and brutally taken on January 6th, only a stone's throw away from where I stood in the Capitol building.
• 1:15:50
  Uh that's about I believe the worst thing that happened that day was that.
• 1:15:54
  And uh since that time I've met with her mother.
• 1:15:57
  Yeah, I've met uh and I'm I'm anxious to be there to be able to support this cause and commemorate the life of Ashley Babbitt, someone who unfortunately I never got to know personally, right, right.
• 1:16:10
  Uh, but certainly learned quite a bit about her since then.
• 1:16:13
  Well, she she also has a place in history, clearly, uh, for a lot of reasons.
• 1:16:17
  And uh that was the one um the that was the one casualty that came out of that.
• 1:16:21
  Now there were a couple of other things that a couple a couple of other casualties from weren't there something else that happened.
• 1:16:29
  There was another woman there, Roseanne Boylan, who uh her also lost her life that day in similar fashion.
• 1:16:37
  There were two other individuals who allegedly had had some type of health hiccup during the rally or during the during the event at the Capitol.
• 1:16:47
  And since that time, there have been a string of individuals who have taken their own lives out of just being horrified.
• 1:16:54
  I heard that too.
• 1:16:55
  Uh uh they've committed suicide.
• 1:16:56
  You we've had right.
• 1:16:58
  How many do we know what the number is on that, Paul?
• 1:17:00
  I believe it's five that we are up to at least.
• 1:17:04
  Unbelievable.
• 1:17:05
  So this is well, that's what I was asking you there a moment ago too is about this PTSD.
• 1:17:10
  I would think that would be a real thing for some people who would have that trauma from that because this was pretty serious stuff.
• 1:17:16
  Not only did they get caught in that moment, then swept into the of the glory of the moment, what have you, but then they had what happened afterward and the corruptness that came from that committee and what they went after.
• 1:17:27
  So uh when you talk to different ones through J6, is that a thing?
• 1:17:31
  Has I mean you you you seem to have a good sensibility about your your your mental uh faculties at this point?
• 1:17:38
  I mean, to understand the gravity of the situation, I'm saying, you know what I mean in that way.
• 1:17:42
  But does everybody have that?
• 1:17:43
  Or are people are some people pretty bad off?
• 1:17:47
  I could tell you uh when I was arrested after January 6th, I had a team of about eight armored uh FBI come to my house, barreling in crack of dawn, handcuffed me naked in my living room, and uh you know, hauled me off to a courthouse to have some very serious charges uh thrown in my lap in front of me for a long time after that.
• 1:18:09
  When I would try to be asleep in bed, if I heard any rustling outside at all, it would cause me to uh feel that tough.
• 1:18:18
  I don't know.
• 1:18:19
  I've gotten past all of that, but it did for a long time, did give me some PTSD.
• 1:18:24
  Like I'm living just walking on eggshells with everything I'm blue.
• 1:18:27
  I'm being watched, I'm being monitored.
• 1:18:29
  Yeah, and of course that had happened before we did that first interview back then in 21.
• 1:18:32
  So uh Paul.
• 1:18:33
  So I remember you suggesting something about that with the FBI coming in.
• 1:18:37
  It was pretty horrific experience.
• 1:18:39
  And uh they don't they treat you pretty ugly, I know when they do that kind of stuff.
• 1:18:44
  They're pretty rough, you know.
• 1:18:45
  Yeah, I mean, uh again, they they didn't, I was never hurt, you know, when that happened either, but even if they don't physically hurt you, it's still a pretty uh traumatic thing that had happened, yeah.
• 1:18:55
  And it uh you know, just stepping on eggshells, you know, with everything lawfully afterwards, like it's almost you were making extra extra sure of yourself everything you do that there's you're not opening any window for for you to get in trouble again, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:19:09
  And um do you do you ever look over your shoulder now with having gone through this experience in life as a whole, knowing what that other you know, you mean you're not a criminal, but what that how that other side is does do you ever worry about that stuff and look over your shoulder, make sure you're being a good guy, you're doing the right thing.
• 1:19:28
  I mean, does that ever come into play, or is it just back to normal life and don't worry about it?
• 1:19:33
  It's important to have confidence with ourselves.
• 1:19:36
  Um, but it's also important that we learn from experiences, you know.
• 1:19:42
  Even if it never comes to be that we're persecuted over something like this again, it it is very important that we learn, you know, what worked, what did not, and you know, how how how can we yeah, yeah, how can we be more useful with ourselves in this.
• 1:20:00
  Paul, what's going on today?
• 1:20:02
  How tell us uh today, current day.
• 1:20:04
  Um, what um how you've gotten back to life.
• 1:20:07
  What does it look like, please?
• 1:20:09
  Well, immediately when I came home from uh prison, one of the first things I did was I began the seeds of my own uh fruit tree farm, which I've uh a new fruit.
• 1:20:22
  What what kind of fruit?
• 1:20:23
  I have uh combination of Valencia orange trees, uh red papaya trees, and then also a handful of star fruit trees, about a hundred of them all there.
• 1:20:34
  Okay, cool, cool.
• 1:20:35
  And uh it's been a really really uh fun thing to get going on since I've been home.
• 1:20:38
  Great for me to keep up with, could transform into a career eventually, but uh unfortunately when I was sentenced to prison, I had lost a career I had spent for seven years at a company, uh coming right up on the promotion of my life.
• 1:20:52
  So that was quite a big letdown for me, as you can imagine.
• 1:20:56
  Yeah, I did uh two years ago, got myself a job working uh as a machinist doing work that's similar to what I've always done.
• 1:21:04
  And I'm coming into a new promotion just now in doing that.
• 1:21:07
  Wow.
• 1:21:08
  So work life uh has not been the most dismal for me.
• 1:21:11
  I'd like to be doing something bigger and better than what I do.
• 1:21:14
  Uh but will that will that come?
• 1:21:16
  Will that come?
• 1:21:17
  Will that come?
• 1:21:18
  Uh that's for God to decide.
• 1:21:20
  I will I will definitely put my best self forward for that.
• 1:21:23
  Uh-huh.
• 1:21:24
  And uh I I'm always open to opportunities for other things, but I I am working class and I am maintaining myself well now with that.
• 1:21:34
  Uh socially things are very interesting.
• 1:21:38
  Like I said, I've gotten a lot of love and support from a lot of people.
• 1:21:41
  I have a great circle of friends, uh, folks who I enjoy you know, spending holidays with.
• 1:21:46
  Awesome.
• 1:21:47
  And uh so many other ordeals.
• 1:21:49
  Uh a lot of them I didn't even know them personally before before my January 6th experience.
• 1:21:54
  The people who kind of come together with me.
• 1:21:57
  Well, that says that you've become an inspiration to many people, is what that uh says, buddy.
• 1:22:01
  That's what I'm saying.
• 1:22:02
  And that's why I'm so you know enthused to come and do interviews like this and be a part of shows and things to share my experience and try to you know give it what advice I can to help others who want to be have a cause and you know want to move forward with that.
• 1:22:16
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:22:17
  Well and uh but what I was saying was along with all the uh positive energy that I've learned from all this, there is still a lot of vitriol and a lot of hatred, and people are still divided about this.
• 1:22:30
  No, do you have the hate and vitriol?
• 1:22:31
  Do you have it?
• 1:22:32
  Oh, yes.
• 1:22:33
  Oh, yes.
• 1:22:34
  I see uh uh sometimes things in the media will say things uncommon.
• 1:22:39
  No, I mean it comes after you, but do you have it yourself personally?
• 1:22:43
  No, no, okay.
• 1:22:44
  Well we we they just had a uh about a month ago, the this ridiculous no kings protest going on.
• 1:22:52
  Right, right, right, right.
• 1:22:53
  We had several of them right around my area of floor, yeah, yeah.
• 1:22:56
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:22:56
  And some of the other uh Trump supporters had always said, you know, they wanted to go ruin their fun and do all that.
• 1:23:01
  And I said, you know what, just let them bury themselves.
• 1:23:04
  Right, right, right.
• 1:23:06
  Well, you know, I ask you that I ask you that because I could see where somebody would go through that experience, Paul, and they would have a total chip on their shoulder.
• 1:23:13
  When you talked about the anger in the vitriol, and you were you thought I meant it was like targeted to you, and not so much that you're gonna always probably have that from the the loons that we talked about early on in the broadcast.
• 1:23:24
  But I'm talking about um that uh I could see where somebody like self go through all of that and you know would end up with the chip on their shoulder, pretty good chip on their shoulder.
• 1:23:32
  I'll tell you what, uh I have to tell you full confession.
• 1:23:35
  I don't know if I could be as good as you.
• 1:23:37
  Um, you know, having gone through that.
• 1:23:39
  I might be a little um unsettled as well.
• 1:23:42
  And uh that is the story of Paul Alard Hodgkins and what a story it is.
• 1:23:47
  And you know, the inspiration from this story uh is a barn on incredible.
• 1:23:53
  He is a remarkable fellow.
• 1:23:56
  I mean, to go through what he went through and to come out and be inspired, and like he says, he really feels like he is an inspiration now.
• 1:24:04
  Uh I think that's a very cool thing.
• 1:24:06
  I mean, very, very cool.
• 1:24:08
  It's a credible story of uh what this man has been through.
• 1:24:11
  But think about all of the people and what they've all been through uh in J6 and all they were just up there to um do what they thought, be at the people's house.
• 1:24:21
  Uh they thought it was just uh many of them were not doing there, there was nothing, you know, uh criminal about many of the things, but they got caught up into that uh cabal the the moment, you know.
• 1:24:32
  But then the left took over, of course, and we know what happened there, friends.
• 1:24:34
  Pretty pretty sad.
• 1:24:36
  Uh we wish Paul the very, very best.
• 1:24:38
  And uh we'll see you back there in Project Outloud.com.
• 1:24:43
  It's time to get involved and get loud, America.