Latest / Hurdle with Emily Abbate / 313. In Pursuit Of Passion: U.S. Top-Ranked Wheelchair Tennis Player Dana Mathewson On Finding Herself Through Sport & Setting An Example

Transcript

313. In Pursuit Of Passion: U.S. Top-Ranked Wheelchair Tennis Player Dana Mathewson On Finding Herself Through Sport & Setting An Example · Hurdle with Emily Abbate

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Speaker 1: I'm just really excited about what sport is like, how
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Speaker 1: it's evolved, and that I get to kind of be
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Speaker 1: writing different chapters and help other people write theres.
0:22
Speaker 2: Good morning, good afternoon, Good evening, Emily O Badi. Here
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Speaker 2: you are listening to episode three hundred and thirteen of Hurdle,
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Speaker 2: a wellness focused podcast where I talk to inspirational people
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Speaker 2: about everything from their highest hies and toughest moments to
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Speaker 2: essential tips on how to live a healthier, happier, more
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Speaker 2: motivated life.
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Speaker 3: We all go through our fair share of hurdles.
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Speaker 2: My goal through these discussions is to empower you to
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Speaker 2: better navigate yours and move with intention so that you
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Speaker 2: can stride towards your own big potential and of course
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Speaker 2: have some fun along the way.
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Speaker 3: For today's episode.
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Speaker 2: I am so amped to bring you my conversation with
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Speaker 2: Dana Matthewson. She stands as one of the most prominent
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Speaker 2: paralympians and professional wheelchair tennis players in US history period.
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Speaker 2: She is the first American woman to win a Grand
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Speaker 2: Slam title in wheelchair tennis and is currently a ranked
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Speaker 2: number one in the United States. Like many at Paralympians,
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Speaker 2: she is excitedly gearing up for this year's Games, which
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Speaker 2: start this Wednesday, August twenty eighth, and I have my
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Speaker 2: fingers crossed that I'm heading back to Paris on September first,
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Speaker 2: and hoping that I might be able to squeeze in
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Speaker 2: some time to watch her play. Dana's story is absolutely remarkable.
1:50
Speaker 2: In today's episode, she talks to me about how she
1:51
Speaker 2: was diagnosed with a rare autoimmune condition at the age
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Speaker 2: of eleven, which left her paralyzed from the waist down. Now,
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Speaker 2: it was her others, persistence and never ending support that
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Speaker 2: introduced her to wheelchair tennis at age thirteen, and that
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Speaker 2: is when everything changed.
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Speaker 3: In our convo today.
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Speaker 2: Dana talks to me about how wheelchair tennis became a
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Speaker 2: quick passion for her and helped her reclaim independence that
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Speaker 2: she lost when she was paralyzed. We talk about what
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Speaker 2: it was like for her to attend the University of
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Speaker 2: Arizona on an athletic scholarship, then moving to London for
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Speaker 2: a couple years to work on a degree in audiology,
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Speaker 2: and of course the transition to playing wheelchair tennis as
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Speaker 2: a professional.
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Speaker 3: Data gives us the.
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Speaker 2: Lowdown on what the sport requires, how it's different from
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Speaker 2: able bodied tennis and what she sees for the future
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Speaker 2: of this sport. As a reminder again, the Paralympics start
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Speaker 2: this Wednesday night and I personally cannot wait to watch
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Speaker 2: this woman do her thing. Make sure if you're not
2:58
Speaker 2: yet following a law with Hurdle on Instagram, do it
3:02
Speaker 2: right now. It's over at Hurdle podcast. I am over
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Speaker 2: at Emily a body and with that, let's get to it.
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Speaker 3: Let's get to hurdling today.
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Speaker 2: I am sitting down with the one and only Dana Matthewson.
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Speaker 2: She's the number one a female wheelchair tennis player in
3:24
Speaker 2: the United States.
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Speaker 3: Does it ever get old hearing that data?
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Speaker 1: Absolutely not. It's something that you put a lot of
3:31
Speaker 1: time and work into, and to be able to say
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Speaker 1: that you're the number one in anything that you put
3:35
Speaker 1: a lot of blood, sweat and tears into feels incredible.
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Speaker 1: It doesn't get old ever.
3:40
Speaker 2: It doesn't get old ever for some that are listening
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Speaker 2: to this right now, they may not even know that
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Speaker 2: wheelchair tennis exists. So talk to us a little bit
3:50
Speaker 2: about when you first found out about wheelchair tennis and
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Speaker 2: if you were as enthusiastic about it then as you
3:57
Speaker 2: are now definitely not. I, like you and many other
4:02
Speaker 2: people probably when you initially heard about me, had never
4:04
Speaker 2: heard of wheelchair tennis before.
4:06
Speaker 1: I grew up, not a sheltered kid by any means,
4:09
Speaker 1: But I think our country is so big that you
4:12
Speaker 1: don't often run into different demographics all the time, if
4:15
Speaker 1: that makes sense. And so I hadn't really met people
4:18
Speaker 1: with disabilities that weren't also someone else's grandparent or someone
4:22
Speaker 1: that was very sick. And it's sad that that was
4:26
Speaker 1: my life that I hadn't seen that, but that was
4:29
Speaker 1: the truth. And so after I got injured when I
4:31
Speaker 1: was ten, I got a rare autoimmune disease called transverse
4:34
Speaker 1: miilitis that caused me to go from being a very healthy,
4:38
Speaker 1: able bodied kid to someone who was paralyzed and needed
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Speaker 1: a wheelchair two hours later. I had no idea what
4:44
Speaker 1: wheelchair sports were. I had no interest in them. I
4:47
Speaker 1: couldn't conceptualize what they would look like. If you can
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Speaker 1: imagine a ten year old being told they would play
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Speaker 1: sports in a wheelchair, and the only people in chairs
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Speaker 1: i'd seen were grandparents, I was like, well, how's that
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Speaker 1: going to work? Why would I do that? It seems
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Speaker 1: silly to me now because I've seen so many incredible
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Speaker 1: athletes with disabilities now, but at the time, I just
5:07
Speaker 1: I wanted no part of it. My mom, luckily, was like,
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Speaker 1: do you know what you're going like? You're an active
5:11
Speaker 1: kid before your injury, you're going to be an active
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Speaker 1: one after. And she signed me up for every camp
5:17
Speaker 1: under the sun, regardless of me protesting. So there was rugby,
5:22
Speaker 1: there was basketball, and then tennis, and tennis ended up
5:26
Speaker 1: being the one that I just liked more than the others.
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Speaker 1: For those that don't know what wheelchair tennis would look like,
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Speaker 1: it's very similar to the able bodied game. The only
5:35
Speaker 1: difference is that we get two bounces if we want
5:38
Speaker 1: to use them, as long as the first bounce is
5:40
Speaker 1: within the regulation court. So the net height is the
5:44
Speaker 1: exact same. People always ask like, is it a shorter net,
5:46
Speaker 1: is it a smaller court? It's not. All of that's
5:49
Speaker 1: the exact same. The rackets we use are the same,
5:52
Speaker 1: the balls that we use are the same, The scoring
5:54
Speaker 1: is the exact same. The only difference is the bounce rule,
5:57
Speaker 1: and you'll find that at the professional level a lot
6:00
Speaker 1: of us don't use that second bounce anyway, because we
6:02
Speaker 1: don't need it, or it gives your opponent too much time.
6:05
Speaker 1: So it's really seamless between the able bodied and wheelchair
6:10
Speaker 1: counterpart at the pro level, and I think that's such
6:12
Speaker 1: a cool thing. The only difference is really that I'm
6:15
Speaker 1: moving on wheels and they're moving on their feet.
6:18
Speaker 2: Wow, that visual or that explanation that you shared about
6:21
Speaker 2: how you were so resistant to play sports in a wheelchair,
6:25
Speaker 2: that's entirely understandable, right, this complete change in your life
6:29
Speaker 2: in such a short amount of time. Do you remember
6:33
Speaker 2: how you felt when you started playing? Were you really
6:36
Speaker 2: frustrated about the circumstance.
6:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that. I there's a lot of ways
6:43
Speaker 1: to break down. I think my emotional flow through that
6:47
Speaker 1: time in my life. You have to remember I was
6:49
Speaker 1: ten years old, right, and as you can think back
6:52
Speaker 1: to like a teenage girl yourself when you're ten, you're
6:54
Speaker 1: wanting to look like everybody else, and like if someone
6:57
Speaker 1: buys a pair of jeans, you're like, I got to
6:59
Speaker 1: have those jeans, Or like you know, someone starts wearing
7:01
Speaker 1: their hair a certain way, you want to do that too.
7:03
Speaker 1: And I think then for me to have something that
7:06
Speaker 1: made me stick out so obviously that's dunk, you know,
7:09
Speaker 1: like that's something that I couldn't conceal no matter what,
7:12
Speaker 1: and that made fitting in feel like the most impossible thing.
7:16
Speaker 1: And I was really lucky that I had really great
7:19
Speaker 1: friends and I never I was never made to feel
7:23
Speaker 1: ostracized or anything like that. But everyone internalizes their own
7:28
Speaker 1: what they perceive as flaws, and I think for me
7:31
Speaker 1: at that point, that was a massive one and it's
7:34
Speaker 1: still one that I struggle with sometimes today. I'd be
7:36
Speaker 1: lying if I told you I didn't. So that mentally
7:39
Speaker 1: was the biggest hurdle was just being different from everybody.
7:43
Speaker 1: But that was a big thing that attracted me to
7:46
Speaker 1: adaptive or wheelchair sports was that I met so many
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Speaker 1: other people that were my age, or even adults or
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Speaker 1: paralympians or professional athletes that were just like me. And
7:56
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, where have these people been?
7:58
Speaker 1: You know, like I met kids that were my age
8:01
Speaker 1: that were you know, super active, super healthy, seemingly super
8:05
Speaker 1: happy with their lives. And I was like, whoa, this
8:07
Speaker 1: is so cool, because the thing that makes people so
8:10
Speaker 1: happy in life, I think, is when you can meet
8:13
Speaker 1: people that are like yourself and you feel like you're
8:16
Speaker 1: part of a community, and because I felt kind of
8:19
Speaker 1: in between communities at that point in my life, I
8:21
Speaker 1: no longer could play soccer with my able bodied friends.
8:24
Speaker 1: I then was searching for that new community and I
8:27
Speaker 1: found that in sports, and that was really really important
8:30
Speaker 1: for me finding my independence again, I think after my injury.
8:34
Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks for sharing that and such a beautiful sentiment,
8:38
Speaker 2: that concept that you were seeking for belonging right, and
8:42
Speaker 2: we hear it all the time.
8:44
Speaker 3: In order to be her, you need to see her.
8:46
Speaker 2: And so for you at that age, you saw people
8:48
Speaker 2: that you can identify with, and fast forward to now,
8:51
Speaker 2: I'm sure there are so many young individuals who see
8:54
Speaker 2: you at the top of this game and think to
8:56
Speaker 2: themselves whether or not it's within tennis, Hey, this person
9:00
Speaker 2: is doing great things.
9:01
Speaker 3: That means that I can do them too.
9:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you know. When I first went to
9:07
Speaker 1: that tennis camp, I remember seeing and meeting a woman
9:10
Speaker 1: named Karen Korb and she was a Paralympic tennis player
9:14
Speaker 1: and I just remember seeing her and I was like,
9:15
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, she's like so fit, and she had
9:18
Speaker 1: all these like necklaces and bangles on, and I was like,
9:20
Speaker 1: she's so just like interesting looking and so cool, and
9:22
Speaker 1: I was so intrigued by her, and I remember just
9:25
Speaker 1: like wanting to listen and soak up everything she said
9:28
Speaker 1: about what I should be doing on court and hearing
9:31
Speaker 1: her stories about being on Team USA. And it's so
9:33
Speaker 1: crazy to me that when I meet future players now,
9:37
Speaker 1: they kind of talk about me the way that I
9:39
Speaker 1: am talking to you about Karen, And it's a real
9:42
Speaker 1: pinch me moment, and I think it's really humbling and
9:44
Speaker 1: reminds you like wow, like I've it's like a full
9:47
Speaker 1: circle moment, and that to me is like my favorite thing,
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Speaker 1: Like that never gets old.
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Speaker 3: It's so special.
9:53
Speaker 2: And also, to go back to that conversation that you
9:57
Speaker 2: started about navigating being an other or navigating that trauma,
10:03
Speaker 2: it never really ends right. You can do all of
10:06
Speaker 2: the work in the world, but you're still going to
10:08
Speaker 2: have a gremlin, so to speak, that pops in every
10:11
Speaker 2: once in a while and makes you remember that you
10:14
Speaker 2: are different or you did go through X or Y.
10:17
Speaker 2: I was on a podcast myself earlier today and we
10:20
Speaker 2: talked about how as someone that went through a major
10:23
Speaker 2: late loss at one point in my life, I still
10:25
Speaker 2: navigate body dysmorphia despite doing so much work on that front,
10:29
Speaker 2: right on wanting to feel good in my body and
10:33
Speaker 2: embrace what it is that I have to offer and
10:34
Speaker 2: how awesome that I am. But that doesn't mean that
10:37
Speaker 2: you still don't struggle with those thoughts that you once
10:41
Speaker 2: had as a younger version of yourself.
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Speaker 1: Absolutely, I think that my struggles very much are tied
10:47
Speaker 1: to the wheelchair or But it's always like a physical thing,
10:51
Speaker 1: isn't it, most often because it's something that you feel
10:54
Speaker 1: everybody looks at, even though they might not even notice it.
10:57
Speaker 1: And yet for me, I always feel like, well, of
11:00
Speaker 1: course people are looking at it, because of course they
11:02
Speaker 1: are right. It's a wheelchair. It's the first thing you
11:04
Speaker 1: see when I come into a room. And I definitely
11:07
Speaker 1: have days where I'm very confident about it, and I'm
11:10
Speaker 1: confident in who I am. And those are days when
11:12
Speaker 1: I'm probably in my workspace quote unquote, so at the
11:16
Speaker 1: tennis center at a tournament, where I know that I'm
11:19
Speaker 1: in a community that knows who I am, knows what
11:21
Speaker 1: I do. But a lot of times when I go
11:23
Speaker 1: out of that world and i'm just even a grocery
11:27
Speaker 1: store or I'm somewhere else, I know that I'm getting
11:29
Speaker 1: stared at or I'm very different from people. They have
11:32
Speaker 1: no idea that I'm actually an accomplished athlete, that I
11:35
Speaker 1: have multiple degrees or things like that, and people don't
11:38
Speaker 1: really understand that people with disabilities can actually achieve like that,
11:42
Speaker 1: which really is an unfortunate mindset that I wish a
11:46
Speaker 1: lot of people in our country didn't have. But that
11:49
Speaker 1: is probably a big reminder to me, like I'm different,
11:52
Speaker 1: and so that definitely can weigh on you. Luckily, you
11:56
Speaker 1: have the days that are good that help outshine those
11:59
Speaker 1: I think, if that makes sense. And yeah, it's kind
12:02
Speaker 1: of like a badge that you have to wear for
12:04
Speaker 1: the rest of your life, but it's not every day
12:06
Speaker 1: and it's not all the time, and that's okay.
12:09
Speaker 2: And I'd love to talk a little bit about the
12:11
Speaker 2: topic of confidence, something that, like we said, is a
12:15
Speaker 2: continuous work in progress for all of us, no matter
12:18
Speaker 2: how strong you feel in your sense of self. For
12:20
Speaker 2: those that are listening to this that may struggle a
12:23
Speaker 2: little bit with their self confidence, what do you have
12:26
Speaker 2: to say to them? How do you show up and
12:28
Speaker 2: stand proud and tall as you are despite having to
12:32
Speaker 2: navigate those difficult hurdles.
12:35
Speaker 1: It's a really good question. I wish I had like
12:37
Speaker 1: that formulaic answer of like this is how you have
12:40
Speaker 1: to be confident. I think I've just always had the
12:43
Speaker 1: mindset of just keep going. I know it sounds cliche,
12:47
Speaker 1: kind of like definding nemo, just keep swimming type of attitude,
12:50
Speaker 1: but it really is what you have to do. I
12:52
Speaker 1: think that, you know, having such a major setback in
12:55
Speaker 1: my life when I was such a young age, it
12:59
Speaker 1: kind of teaches you and ingrains in you that, like
13:02
Speaker 1: you literally like life's gonna throw punches at you and
13:04
Speaker 1: you just have to keep going. And that in itself
13:07
Speaker 1: can instill a sense of confidence in you that it's
13:09
Speaker 1: like I'm gonna be okay. I'm just gonna keep going.
13:12
Speaker 1: Everything's gonna be fine. And I think that can go
13:15
Speaker 1: along with the confidence of how you portray yourself to
13:18
Speaker 1: the world. Even if you don't feel good one day,
13:20
Speaker 1: know that tomorrow might feel better, it might feel different.
13:23
Speaker 1: And I think that a big thing that I try
13:25
Speaker 1: to focus on is like, yeah, I might not be
13:28
Speaker 1: truly happy with my lower half, but that doesn't mean
13:31
Speaker 1: there's not a lot of things that I love about
13:33
Speaker 1: my body. At the same time, And I think that
13:36
Speaker 1: for everything that I might wish is different about what
13:39
Speaker 1: happened to me with a disability. Look what it's done
13:42
Speaker 1: for me. I'm talking to you right now doing a podcast.
13:44
Speaker 1: I've represented my country, I travel the world, I play
13:47
Speaker 1: a sport for a living. I would never do that
13:50
Speaker 1: had I, you know, not sustained my injury. So I
13:52
Speaker 1: think it's it's a matter of being a bulldog, you know,
13:57
Speaker 1: keeping your head down, keep going, but then also being
13:59
Speaker 1: able to reframe things and step back and see the
14:01
Speaker 1: bigger picture, if that makes sense, and just knowing that
14:05
Speaker 1: today doesn't dictate tomorrow.
14:07
Speaker 2: Entirely makes sense. What a really awesome sentiment that you
14:10
Speaker 2: shared there. To go back to your journey after you
14:13
Speaker 2: started playing at age thirteen, forced by your mother, when
14:17
Speaker 2: did it really feel like for you that wheelchair tennis
14:21
Speaker 2: started to click. You mentioned dabbling in other sports as well,
14:24
Speaker 2: so the wheelchair tennis was the thing that you were like, yep,
14:28
Speaker 2: this is the one.
14:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know. Again, I wish I had that
14:31
Speaker 1: one moment where I was like, do you know what
14:33
Speaker 1: it was? April twelfth, Like it was sun finding, Like
14:37
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think I just remember having a
14:39
Speaker 1: lot of fun out there, and there was a different
14:41
Speaker 1: feeling I had with tennis than I ever had with
14:44
Speaker 1: sports growing up. And I'm not sure if that's because
14:47
Speaker 1: it was the first individual sport that I tried, so
14:50
Speaker 1: it challenged me in ways that I hadn't been challenged
14:52
Speaker 1: when I was a soccer player. Team sports are incredible.
14:56
Speaker 1: I love them. I love being part of a team,
14:58
Speaker 1: probably why I still love play doubles now. But there's
15:01
Speaker 1: something different about tennis. When you're playing singles, like you
15:05
Speaker 1: have to work hard. If you're having a bad day,
15:07
Speaker 1: you can't pass the ball, you can't do you know
15:10
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like that it's all on you and
15:12
Speaker 1: there's a sort of pressure and also a sort of
15:16
Speaker 1: like a dopamine hit that you get when you do
15:19
Speaker 1: something right because you know it was you that did it.
15:22
Speaker 1: And I think for some reason that became really addicting
15:25
Speaker 1: for me with tennis, and I loved it. I loved
15:26
Speaker 1: it required me to work hard, It required me to
15:29
Speaker 1: show up every single day, and that when I did
15:32
Speaker 1: something great, it was because I put that hard work
15:35
Speaker 1: into it. And I think for that stage of my
15:37
Speaker 1: life where everything felt kind of like up in the air.
15:40
Speaker 1: To have something that was so governed by me probably
15:43
Speaker 1: was what drew me towards it, if that makes sense.
15:47
Speaker 1: And I still loved basketball, I loved rugby, I loved
15:50
Speaker 1: all those sports. But tennis also offered me the ability
15:54
Speaker 1: to travel and to meet tons of tons of different
15:57
Speaker 1: people and then eventually led to me going to call
16:00
Speaker 1: and all sorts of things like that. So I think
16:02
Speaker 1: it just it had a lot more upsides, maybe in
16:04
Speaker 1: my opinion, and then challenged me in ways that other
16:07
Speaker 1: sports didn't. And I'm stubborn, so I like a challenge.
16:11
Speaker 3: I can relate to you on that.
16:13
Speaker 2: I appreciate that sentiment of it was something that I
16:16
Speaker 2: was in control of. It was my destiny, my faith
16:19
Speaker 2: that was in my hands by how hard I worked
16:21
Speaker 2: at this specific thing. If you think of that broadly
16:24
Speaker 2: in the sense of your life outside of tennis, is
16:28
Speaker 2: there anything else that you feel like you are in
16:31
Speaker 2: pursuit of or that you really enjoy that falls into
16:33
Speaker 2: that same category as something that you can really do
16:36
Speaker 2: on your own.
16:39
Speaker 1: That's a great question. I think. For a really long time,
16:42
Speaker 1: all the way up into just about a year ago,
16:45
Speaker 1: that was my academic career. I've always been a student.
16:49
Speaker 1: I think my mom always instilled that, like school is
16:52
Speaker 1: my job ever since I was a kid, And even
16:56
Speaker 1: when I wanted to go pro in tennis, my mom
16:58
Speaker 1: was like, no, you're finishing your degrees, and that's degrees plural.
17:02
Speaker 1: She made me promise that I would go and get
17:04
Speaker 1: my master's and my doctorate in audiology, and so I
17:07
Speaker 1: always did that alongside of tennis, and so I didn't
17:10
Speaker 1: really have any space to do anything else hobbywise, just
17:14
Speaker 1: because if I wasn't playing tennis, I was studying or
17:17
Speaker 1: I was writing papers. But I think both of those
17:19
Speaker 1: things kind of fulfilled me in different ways. So like
17:22
Speaker 1: when the tennis part of my brain was filled up,
17:25
Speaker 1: I could put my head down and work hard and
17:27
Speaker 1: fill up the academic side of me, if that made sense,
17:30
Speaker 1: And I love that. As for now, I don't know.
17:35
Speaker 1: I think I put so much time and energy into
17:37
Speaker 1: my tennis career that the rest I try to just relax.
17:41
Speaker 1: I've not really done that for a big part of
17:43
Speaker 1: my life, and so it's kind of like me just
17:46
Speaker 1: appreciating being home or spending time with my husband or
17:50
Speaker 1: my friends or my dog. But yeah, I would say
17:53
Speaker 1: that for a big part of my life. It's just
17:55
Speaker 1: always been school or sports that's been the major thing.
17:59
Speaker 2: There's so much to double click on here, but the
18:01
Speaker 2: first thing I want to double click on is that
18:03
Speaker 2: concept of embracing the stillness. Is it something that's challenging
18:07
Speaker 2: for you.
18:08
Speaker 1: Yeah? Absolutely. I think I'm kind of a weird dichotomy
18:12
Speaker 1: of someone that is very lazy but also feels the
18:16
Speaker 1: need to be doing something. So I like, if people
18:21
Speaker 1: are like, oh, what are your hobbies? Like, literally, the
18:23
Speaker 1: first thing that comes to mind is like, doing nothing?
18:26
Speaker 1: Like is that a hobby? Like? The older I get,
18:30
Speaker 1: the more I think I've realized the importance of rest.
18:34
Speaker 1: And I think that a lot of people think that, oh,
18:37
Speaker 1: you're not being productive by resting, But I've kind of
18:40
Speaker 1: learned that I am actually being productive by giving my
18:42
Speaker 1: body a rest. That is something that is healthy for me.
18:46
Speaker 1: If I do it every day for six days, maybe
18:49
Speaker 1: that's not productive. But you know, when I'm on the
18:51
Speaker 1: road for eight weeks at a time and then I
18:53
Speaker 1: come home and have a few days of rest, that's healthy.
18:57
Speaker 1: That's good for me, and I don't always have to
18:58
Speaker 1: be searching for things to fill my time. It's been
19:02
Speaker 1: difficult for me to do, but I've realized how good
19:05
Speaker 1: it is for me, and hopefully I don't get too
19:08
Speaker 1: good at realizing how good that is for me.
19:11
Speaker 2: Hey, maybe it's about time you gave yourself a little
19:14
Speaker 2: bit more rest. I also talked about and highlighted your
19:19
Speaker 2: academic accomplishments, mentioning that doctorate in audiology. What encouraged you
19:24
Speaker 2: or what was it about the field of audiology that
19:27
Speaker 2: really sparked your interest?
19:29
Speaker 1: Great question. So when I was going to college in Arizona,
19:33
Speaker 1: I remember going by the Speech and Hearing Sciences building
19:36
Speaker 1: and I saw I just saw a lot of people
19:39
Speaker 1: that were going in and out. I was intrigued by
19:41
Speaker 1: what it was called. I'd never heard of speech and
19:43
Speaker 1: hearing sciences before. My mom is a physician and she
19:46
Speaker 1: was there with me on my college tour, and I
19:48
Speaker 1: just asked her, like, what is that? And she explained
19:51
Speaker 1: it to me. And I initially was gravitating towards speech pathologies,
19:55
Speaker 1: like a speech therapist for little kids. And I remember
19:58
Speaker 1: just going through the motions take all the classes, and
20:01
Speaker 1: audiology was the one that stuck out. I think that
20:03
Speaker 1: I love that it's very puzzle based. I'm a very
20:06
Speaker 1: problem solving based person, which very closely relates to tennis.
20:11
Speaker 1: It's a game of chess. It's a game of problem solving,
20:13
Speaker 1: constantly thinking of what you can do next and next moves.
20:16
Speaker 1: And audiology is very similar, like if you were to
20:19
Speaker 1: come in, I would test your hearing with certain tests
20:21
Speaker 1: that would lead me to other tests which leads to
20:23
Speaker 1: another one and another one until I ultimately get a diagnosis.
20:26
Speaker 1: And every patient is different, but I can immediately help
20:30
Speaker 1: you because of the results I get, and I liked that,
20:33
Speaker 1: Whereas with speech pathology, you do do diagnoses with people,
20:37
Speaker 1: but it's a longer term process, almost like physical therapy
20:41
Speaker 1: to help someone, where someone has to go in day
20:43
Speaker 1: in and day out. And I wanted that immediate help
20:46
Speaker 1: of someone, and for whatever reason, that just really clicked.
20:50
Speaker 1: And then being able to treat a human sense was
20:52
Speaker 1: just wild to me. And yeah, I loved it.
20:56
Speaker 3: And I loved it.
20:57
Speaker 2: That's so awesome to hear in What a serendipitous moment
21:00
Speaker 2: for you to not only see this building but then
21:02
Speaker 2: ask questions. There's any amount of curiosity I would say
21:07
Speaker 2: that's displayed by that story.
21:09
Speaker 3: Do you feel like you are a curious person.
21:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, probably too curious. I would say, I've always been
21:16
Speaker 1: the kid, like you know that stage that little kids
21:19
Speaker 1: go towards where when they're a kid, they're like why though, why, why? Why?
21:22
Speaker 1: I was probably the most annoying toddler to my parents.
21:26
Speaker 1: I am always asking why, Like if there's something that
21:28
Speaker 1: I'm really interested in and someone tells me, no, I
21:31
Speaker 1: need to understand the rationale behind it, or I'm not
21:35
Speaker 1: good at accepting just flat reasons without explanations. I've always
21:40
Speaker 1: been curious for answers. I've always like learning things. Again,
21:44
Speaker 1: that's probably a big crossover with tennis. In sports in general,
21:48
Speaker 1: you're constantly having to learn things to improve your skills.
21:51
Speaker 1: And yeah, very curious person. Sometimes too curious, but I
21:55
Speaker 1: think it's a good trait.
21:57
Speaker 3: Too curious is interpretive.
21:58
Speaker 2: I would say also that arguably that curiosity probably plays
22:03
Speaker 2: to your favor within your training. No, because you want
22:07
Speaker 2: to have the best understanding of not only what your
22:11
Speaker 2: body is capable of, but what you can do to
22:14
Speaker 2: perhaps get an edge or improve that capability.
22:17
Speaker 1: Absolutely, I think in my training I really like to
22:20
Speaker 1: try to ask questions like, oh, should I have done
22:23
Speaker 1: this instead? Would this work better? How can we design
22:25
Speaker 1: a drill to practice this skill today? Everything's about self improvement,
22:30
Speaker 1: like you said, And if you keep doing the same thing,
22:32
Speaker 1: or you're not curious or wanting to ask questions, then
22:35
Speaker 1: you're not going to grow and you're not going to improve.
22:37
Speaker 1: And I would be super bored, to be honest. So
22:40
Speaker 1: I think that it definitely ties into what I do
22:43
Speaker 1: in training, and I think it's ultimately what makes me
22:46
Speaker 1: a better player.
22:47
Speaker 3: I love that.
22:49
Speaker 2: Speaking of training, let's talk a little bit about training
22:52
Speaker 2: and how it does differ as a wheelchair based athlete
22:55
Speaker 2: versus an able bodied athlete. When you think of a
22:59
Speaker 2: regular session, or if you could describe a regular session
23:03
Speaker 2: for us, when it comes to a typical day of training,
23:05
Speaker 2: what does that look like? What kind of exercises are
23:08
Speaker 2: you doing in addition to playing on the court.
23:11
Speaker 1: What's really cool about this is that it's really not
23:14
Speaker 1: that different. I think that a lot of people are like, oh, well,
23:18
Speaker 1: you're probably just not really doing much in the gym
23:21
Speaker 1: because you can only focus on a couple muscle groups
23:23
Speaker 1: and things like that. It's like, no, absolutely not. I
23:26
Speaker 1: train alongside Madison Keys and other players that you might know,
23:30
Speaker 1: and we all use the same gym, we use the
23:33
Speaker 1: same tennis courts together, and I think that's such a
23:35
Speaker 1: cool thing that not many people know. But in terms
23:38
Speaker 1: of my specific training, I have two days of lifting,
23:43
Speaker 1: and with those lifts, it's a lot of stuff that
23:45
Speaker 1: you would probably imagine for upper body, like you know,
23:48
Speaker 1: bicep curls, tricep dips, bench stuff like that. But then
23:52
Speaker 1: I also do have use of my legs to a degree,
23:55
Speaker 1: so they even have you doing squats like goblet squats,
23:58
Speaker 1: which I remember when they first told me. I was like,
24:00
Speaker 1: you're joking, right, Like I use a wheelchair, and they're like, no,
24:03
Speaker 1: if you have muscles that work, we're going to train them.
24:06
Speaker 1: So I actually do quite a fair amount of lower
24:08
Speaker 1: body stuff as well. Yeah, there's two days of weightlifting,
24:12
Speaker 1: there's two days of conditioning. So where an able bodied
24:16
Speaker 1: athlete might work on their footwork, I'm working on my
24:19
Speaker 1: chair skills, which is basically the same thing. So it's
24:22
Speaker 1: how you move around the court. The drills are more
24:24
Speaker 1: or less the same. On an able bodied tennis court.
24:27
Speaker 1: You would call them spider drills, where people are running
24:29
Speaker 1: back and forth with cones and you're trying to time
24:31
Speaker 1: them and I do the exact same drill. I'm just
24:33
Speaker 1: doing it in a chair. There's a lot of parallels.
24:36
Speaker 1: You just have to kind of transfer whatever you would
24:39
Speaker 1: see on someone's feet to someone in a wheelchair. And
24:42
Speaker 1: there's obviously technique involved that I will be doing that
24:45
Speaker 1: someone on their feet doesn't do. Like I don't do
24:48
Speaker 1: a split step, obviously that someone on their feet does,
24:50
Speaker 1: but I do something else that's unique to wheelchair tennis.
24:54
Speaker 1: But there are a lot of parallels. And then the
24:56
Speaker 1: other day of the week that I have is just
24:59
Speaker 1: like a circuit training thing that you might see at
25:01
Speaker 1: like a CrossFit gym where they're pulling sleds, throwing medicine balls,
25:07
Speaker 1: that sort of thing. And then I also train two
25:10
Speaker 1: times a day on the tennis court, and that's working
25:12
Speaker 1: on different skills. That's doing match play, that's you know,
25:15
Speaker 1: just improving new skills or refining old ones. So it's
25:19
Speaker 1: very similar to what an able bodied athlete would do.
25:22
Speaker 1: And the only difference is really if something involves their
25:25
Speaker 1: footwork or jumping or something, I'm just doing something more
25:28
Speaker 1: wheelchair based, if that makes sense. But the weight stuff
25:31
Speaker 1: is almost all the same.
25:32
Speaker 2: I have to giggle a little bit, because let's go
25:34
Speaker 2: back to like four to seven minutes ago when you
25:37
Speaker 2: were talking about the fact that, like, oh, I was
25:39
Speaker 2: just playing tennis and studying for my doctorate, and so
25:41
Speaker 2: I didn't have a lot of bobbies. And when you
25:43
Speaker 2: talk about all of the different things that go into
25:47
Speaker 2: you being your best version of yourself on the tennis
25:50
Speaker 2: court and then also working on your doctor in naudiology,
25:54
Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, light work, it's fine, it's absolutely I literally.
25:57
Speaker 1: Had no time. I don't know how I met a
25:59
Speaker 1: guy got married to him. I really don't know how
26:01
Speaker 1: I had time.
26:02
Speaker 3: Well, now you're really rubbing it in for the rest
26:04
Speaker 3: of us here.
26:06
Speaker 1: Look, I haven't wait a long time.
26:08
Speaker 3: Data. I'm like, shoot, I'm just not drying hard enough,
26:11
Speaker 3: I guess.
26:14
Speaker 2: But I love this for you, and it really is
26:16
Speaker 2: exemplary when you detail the efforts and the intricacies of
26:20
Speaker 2: your training, how much, how much you're really dedicated to
26:23
Speaker 2: your sport, and you have been for quite some time.
26:25
Speaker 2: You're gearing up for your third appearance on Team USA.
26:30
Speaker 2: How are you feeling in this moment heading into your
26:33
Speaker 2: third Olympics.
26:35
Speaker 1: I'm really excited to be going to my third Paralympics.
26:38
Speaker 1: I think it's it's always an honor to be part
26:40
Speaker 1: of Team Usay, it never gets old. I think looking
26:44
Speaker 1: at everything that the Olympians are doing, seeing them go
26:46
Speaker 1: through team processing, a lot of Paralympians joke that the
26:49
Speaker 1: Olympics are almost like a test run that we get
26:51
Speaker 1: to watch everything on TV and be like, oh, that's
26:53
Speaker 1: where I'm going to be here, or that's the outfit
26:55
Speaker 1: that we get to wear. Oh, like you get to
26:57
Speaker 1: see it before you get to do it yourself. And
27:00
Speaker 1: I'm getting really excited. I think that getting to be
27:03
Speaker 1: part of TMOSA is an honor and it's something that
27:08
Speaker 1: I could say I'm a seventeen time Paralympian and I
27:11
Speaker 1: don't think that the honor of that would would go
27:14
Speaker 1: away at all. So I'm very.
27:15
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28:03
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Speaker 2: a new flavor today. To go back a little bit
29:17
Speaker 2: to your training, I do want to talk about how
29:21
Speaker 2: you take care of your hands.
29:22
Speaker 3: I feel like this might be a weird question, but
29:24
Speaker 3: it has to be.
29:24
Speaker 2: There has to be some sort of a routine or
29:26
Speaker 2: some sort of maintenance that you do or exercise that
29:29
Speaker 2: you do just specifically strengthen your hands. Because something that
29:32
Speaker 2: a lot of people may not know, who aren't familiar
29:34
Speaker 2: with watching wheelchair tennis is they might think that you're
29:37
Speaker 2: putting your racket down and wheeling around, but a lot
29:40
Speaker 2: of it is single hand.
29:42
Speaker 1: Yes, everybody thinks that we put the racket down and
29:45
Speaker 1: then like like on our lap and then push and
29:47
Speaker 1: then pick it up and hit the ball. And I'd
29:49
Speaker 1: like to dispel any false beliefs about that that does
29:53
Speaker 1: not happen, especially on the pro side. There's just no
29:56
Speaker 1: time to do that and it looks silly, let's be honest.
30:00
Speaker 1: So yeah, like I think that the main thing that
30:04
Speaker 1: really just keeps my hands how they are is the
30:06
Speaker 1: fact that I do use a wheelchair in daily life
30:08
Speaker 1: as well. So I mean, I'm definitely never going to
30:11
Speaker 1: be a hand model, let's be honest, the same way
30:13
Speaker 1: tennis player's feet they're not going to be foot models, right, Like,
30:16
Speaker 1: you've got a lot of blisters, you get callouses. My
30:20
Speaker 1: hands are basically my feet in that way. So in
30:24
Speaker 1: terms of maintenance, a lot of it is really I mean,
30:26
Speaker 1: I was just putting lotion on like all the time.
30:29
Speaker 1: But then at the same time you want to have
30:31
Speaker 1: callouses because that prevents blisters, So it really I don't
30:35
Speaker 1: have like a set routine. It's an amazing question. I
30:38
Speaker 1: bet people that want their hands to look nicer than
30:42
Speaker 1: I do probably have like a nine step Korean skincare
30:45
Speaker 1: routine and they do something really nice.
30:48
Speaker 2: But are there certain strengthening exercises that you have to
30:51
Speaker 2: do specific to your hands?
30:53
Speaker 1: Do you don't know? I think that a lot of
30:55
Speaker 1: it really just goes with being a wheelchair user on
30:58
Speaker 1: a daily basis keeps your hand and strong. I do
31:01
Speaker 1: notice that when I come back from having a break
31:03
Speaker 1: from training, that when I go back to play, my
31:06
Speaker 1: hands do get sore. So I know that those muscles
31:09
Speaker 1: do like atrophy even just from not playing for maybe
31:13
Speaker 1: a week. But really a lot of it just gets
31:16
Speaker 1: built up by use. There are exercises that we do
31:20
Speaker 1: in the gym that just strengthen your upper body that
31:22
Speaker 1: maybe by nature of that strength in my hands. But
31:25
Speaker 1: I actually don't have any exercises where I'm like gripping
31:28
Speaker 1: that thing for hand strength or anything like that. I
31:30
Speaker 1: think it's all just kind of come naturally. It's a
31:33
Speaker 1: really good question, though no one's ever asked me that
31:36
Speaker 1: great question.
31:37
Speaker 3: Thank you. It's just curiosity for curiosity's sake.
31:40
Speaker 2: On that note, I do want to then continue on
31:43
Speaker 2: your journey now within tennis. You said that there wasn't
31:45
Speaker 2: one specific moment that you were like, light bulb, this
31:48
Speaker 2: is it.
31:48
Speaker 3: This is for me.
31:50
Speaker 2: But obviously you did fall into a rhythm in a
31:52
Speaker 2: pattern where you were excelling within your sport. You got
31:55
Speaker 2: a scholarship in college and then went on to continue. Then,
31:59
Speaker 2: as we know, to play professionally. Talk to me about
32:02
Speaker 2: that inaugural professional season and how that really impacted you,
32:06
Speaker 2: about your excitement and love for the game.
32:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, that that was one of the coolest seasons I
32:12
Speaker 1: think of my career. I think because the reason why
32:15
Speaker 1: I decided to go pro and take a leave of
32:18
Speaker 1: absence from my studies at Arizona was because I wanted
32:21
Speaker 1: to try to qualify for my first games. So my
32:24
Speaker 1: first games was in Rio twenty sixteen, and in tennis,
32:28
Speaker 1: the way that you qualify is that you have a
32:29
Speaker 1: whole year to do it, So that would have started
32:33
Speaker 1: in springtime of twenty fifteen leading up to spring of
32:37
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen, so I would have had that gap to qualify.
32:41
Speaker 1: And I remember coming back maybe at the end of
32:43
Speaker 1: twenty fourteen, and I was telling people like, Yeah, I'm
32:46
Speaker 1: gonna I'm going to qualify for a games, and they
32:49
Speaker 1: were like, no, you're not, because prior to this, I
32:51
Speaker 1: actually had taken a hiatus from tennis. I'm not sure
32:53
Speaker 1: if you knew that or not, but I that was
32:56
Speaker 1: me coming back and I was like, I'm coming back.
32:57
Speaker 1: I haven't played in three years. I'm going to qualify
32:59
Speaker 1: for a game and everyone's like you're crazy, like you
33:01
Speaker 1: need to have some skills to do that, and I
33:03
Speaker 1: was like stubborn. Me was like, hold my beer, I'm
33:06
Speaker 1: going to do it. And so I took the leave
33:11
Speaker 1: of absence. I started traveling. I played a bunch of tournaments,
33:14
Speaker 1: and my goal at that time was just to get
33:17
Speaker 1: into the top twenty four in the world so that
33:19
Speaker 1: I could, you know, punch my ticket to the Games.
33:21
Speaker 1: I didn't care about winning every single tournament. I didn't
33:24
Speaker 1: care about getting a medal. Of course I would have
33:27
Speaker 1: loved those things, but it was just about being on
33:29
Speaker 1: the team. And so that first season, I think I
33:32
Speaker 1: just really embraced tour life. I embraced seeing the world,
33:36
Speaker 1: I embraced playing matches, I embraced all the new experiences
33:41
Speaker 1: that I had, and it was incredible. I think I
33:44
Speaker 1: really got a taste for what tour life was like.
33:47
Speaker 1: That was the first time that I ever got to
33:49
Speaker 1: travel to Asia and compete that I did the whole
33:52
Speaker 1: European summer, playing on clay, doing all of the different surfaces,
33:58
Speaker 1: and it really solidified like I like this kind of
34:03
Speaker 1: vagabondish type of lifestyle. I liked the competition day in
34:07
Speaker 1: and day out. I loved it, and that kind of
34:10
Speaker 1: just was like a snowball effect. Once I did qualify
34:12
Speaker 1: for the games, it was like, maybe I'm really good
34:15
Speaker 1: at this. Maybe I can stay doing this and then
34:17
Speaker 1: see what can happen, and then here.
34:19
Speaker 3: We are now, and then here we are now.
34:21
Speaker 2: I know you mentioned playing in Asia and that I
34:25
Speaker 2: know that that's one of your favorite places to play.
34:27
Speaker 2: What is it about playing over there that really makes
34:30
Speaker 2: you light up?
34:31
Speaker 1: It's a weird response, but I think I'm just really
34:33
Speaker 1: type A and they love rules over there, so I
34:35
Speaker 1: love it. No, There's something about like the Japanese culture,
34:41
Speaker 1: for example, they're so happy to share their culture with you,
34:46
Speaker 1: Like it's not very often that you go to different
34:49
Speaker 1: countries and they're so excited to have you there, especially
34:52
Speaker 1: as like you know the quote unquote American tourists. We're
34:55
Speaker 1: usually spotted out a mile away and people like, oh,
34:58
Speaker 1: there's an American, do you know what I mean? Whereas
35:00
Speaker 1: in Asia, Japan specifically, just for this example, they love
35:04
Speaker 1: it and they want to show you foods and they
35:06
Speaker 1: want to have you there, and everything runs on a
35:09
Speaker 1: schedule and everything's clean like I've never seen in my
35:13
Speaker 1: life someone here in America doing what people do there.
35:18
Speaker 1: For example, I was going through a park with my
35:21
Speaker 1: husband and we noticed an elderly lady planting flowers in
35:25
Speaker 1: like a public park. You would never see someone do
35:28
Speaker 1: that in America if someone did that in like a
35:29
Speaker 1: public park, like, what are you doing? This isn't your home.
35:33
Speaker 1: But they do that sort of thing over there because
35:35
Speaker 1: they want to better their places for each other. And
35:38
Speaker 1: I think there's just something really beautiful about that, and
35:41
Speaker 1: so I find it really special when I'm over there.
35:43
Speaker 1: I'm also half Chinese, so maybe I just love being
35:46
Speaker 1: in Asia. Unfortunately I've never played in China. I would
35:49
Speaker 1: love too, we don't have any tournaments there, but I
35:52
Speaker 1: just like it over there.
35:53
Speaker 2: Yeah, I hear what you're saying, and that story is
35:56
Speaker 2: a great one. I really also appreciate the center and
36:00
Speaker 2: surrounding the opportunity that comes hand in hand with being
36:03
Speaker 2: able to play sport professionally. All of this travel really
36:06
Speaker 2: opening you up to some really stellar experiences. When we
36:11
Speaker 2: go back and talk about the training, we addressed the physical,
36:14
Speaker 2: but we haven't yet talked about the mental. You shared
36:16
Speaker 2: a bit about the struggles that go hand in hand
36:19
Speaker 2: with regularly accepting the circumstance and admitting that although there
36:22
Speaker 2: can be at times things that you might want to change,
36:26
Speaker 2: you are in a place now where you can accept
36:29
Speaker 2: what is and stop being So, let's say, frustrated with
36:34
Speaker 2: what isn't talk to me about the mental side of
36:37
Speaker 2: things for you. Do you work with a sports psychologist?
36:40
Speaker 2: How do you train your brain to perform your best?
36:44
Speaker 1: Yeah? Great question, so definitely work with a sports psychologist.
36:48
Speaker 1: Mental skills training is something that I wish I had
36:51
Speaker 1: come into earlier in my career, but it's something that
36:54
Speaker 1: I've done ever since I moved here to Orlando to
36:56
Speaker 1: train at the USTA, and I learned a lot. I
37:00
Speaker 1: know that people always talk about how your mentality plays
37:04
Speaker 1: such a big role in sports, but I think I
37:07
Speaker 1: was too immature to understand or accept that. In the
37:11
Speaker 1: earlier part of my career. It was kind of like, yeah, well,
37:13
Speaker 1: my brain works fine, right, Like people told me I'm smart,
37:16
Speaker 1: so I'm fine. But obviously that's not the case, right everyone.
37:20
Speaker 1: It's like a muscle. Everyone needs to go to the
37:22
Speaker 1: gym to build up their muscles, and that your brain
37:24
Speaker 1: is no different. That was explained to me one of
37:27
Speaker 1: the first times that I had a mental skills session,
37:29
Speaker 1: and it really resonated with me. I think that I've
37:33
Speaker 1: learned that there is a lot to be said about
37:36
Speaker 1: how you speak to yourself, and that that can really
37:39
Speaker 1: apply off the court as much as it does on.
37:42
Speaker 1: There were studies that found that players that win a
37:46
Speaker 1: lot of the time, like consistently win, so top five
37:48
Speaker 1: ranked players are the ones that actually say things to
37:51
Speaker 1: themselves like that's okay, great point. Doesn't matter that I
37:55
Speaker 1: lost that one. You did all the right things. Let's
37:57
Speaker 1: do this for the next one, Like just constantly reinforcing
38:01
Speaker 1: themselves and kind of being that like cheerleader for themselves.
38:06
Speaker 1: You have twenty five seconds in between every point, and
38:08
Speaker 1: you need to fill that with constructive thoughts. And I
38:12
Speaker 1: think that prior to working with a mental skills coach,
38:15
Speaker 1: a lot of my thoughts could be negative, like all
38:18
Speaker 1: you saw, how did you miss that ball that was
38:20
Speaker 1: so easy? Blah blah blah, And you don't feel like
38:23
Speaker 1: it affects your next point, but it does, And so
38:26
Speaker 1: that was a big thing I learned. You also learn
38:28
Speaker 1: a lot about creating routines for yourself, which I found
38:31
Speaker 1: really interesting. I don't know if you've watched a lot
38:34
Speaker 1: of tennis, but like everyone makes fun of Rafa and
38:36
Speaker 1: Nadal or share a Pova or different players for their
38:40
Speaker 1: routines that they do before they serve, like picking wedgies
38:43
Speaker 1: or always having to tuck hair behind their ears, or
38:46
Speaker 1: wipe sweat even if there's no sweat, And I've learned
38:49
Speaker 1: that that's for a reason. It's not because someone has
38:52
Speaker 1: OCD or that they're neurotic. It's because you're trying to
38:56
Speaker 1: make every point feel the same, regardless of what country
38:58
Speaker 1: you're in, what court you're on, whether it's match point
39:02
Speaker 1: or whether it's the very first point of the match.
39:04
Speaker 1: And that's something that's really helped me a lot. It
39:06
Speaker 1: creates like routine and comfort in a very stressful environment.
39:10
Speaker 1: And I would have not learned any of that stuff
39:13
Speaker 1: without mental skills. And I still have a lot to learn,
39:15
Speaker 1: but it's definitely helped me a lot.
39:18
Speaker 2: Do people gatekeep their routines or are you allowed to
39:21
Speaker 2: talk about it openly?
39:24
Speaker 1: I think you really see people's routines just because a
39:27
Speaker 1: lot of them are very physical. So like a lot
39:29
Speaker 1: of people in tennis will go and wipe their face
39:32
Speaker 1: off with a towel after a bad point, or you know,
39:36
Speaker 1: you'll see people have to bounce the ball X number
39:38
Speaker 1: of times before they serve. My routine specifically is like
39:42
Speaker 1: I have to literally bounce the ball three times with
39:45
Speaker 1: a racket. Then if I go to lineup for a serve,
39:48
Speaker 1: I'm bouncing in another three times just in my hand,
39:50
Speaker 1: and then I serve. And there's really no rhyme or
39:53
Speaker 1: reason for that. It just was like I like how
39:54
Speaker 1: that felt, and then it just became my routine. Yea, yeah, everyone.
39:58
Speaker 1: I don't think people really gatekeep what they do, but
40:00
Speaker 1: they probably gate keep what they say because it's all
40:04
Speaker 1: just in their own head, right, And I think a
40:07
Speaker 1: lot of us might feel weird if we were to
40:09
Speaker 1: tell people like the kind of stuff we tell ourselves.
40:11
Speaker 1: But the best people I'm learning are ones that literally
40:15
Speaker 1: just positively scream like great job, you're doing great, like
40:18
Speaker 1: in their head over and over and over again.
40:20
Speaker 3: Are you telling me that you won't tell us what
40:22
Speaker 3: you're saying to yourself.
40:23
Speaker 1: And no, I'll tell you. I literally just try to
40:27
Speaker 1: tell myself like great job, data, you're doing great, and
40:29
Speaker 1: sometimes I mouth it. You can see me do it,
40:32
Speaker 1: and that's not to say that I don't ever get frustrated.
40:34
Speaker 1: I think I've also learned that I have to allow
40:37
Speaker 1: myself the first three or four seconds to react to
40:40
Speaker 1: a point, whether that be excited or bad. I have
40:43
Speaker 1: no idea how some people can play Roger Federer, for instance,
40:48
Speaker 1: I know that he actually used to have some anger
40:50
Speaker 1: management issues earlier in his career if you ever watch those,
40:54
Speaker 1: and a lot of people are shocked to hear that
40:55
Speaker 1: because when you watch him later, he's almost emotionless in
40:59
Speaker 1: between points, can't tell if he's winning or losing just
41:02
Speaker 1: by looking at him, and I personally can't do that.
41:05
Speaker 1: Like I if I've played a point that I thought
41:08
Speaker 1: was so good and that I lost it at the
41:09
Speaker 1: very end, I have to have that split second where
41:13
Speaker 1: I'm like upset or reacting, and then I'm allowed to
41:18
Speaker 1: then go into my routines, think about what I'm going
41:20
Speaker 1: to do for the next point, reinforce my positivity or
41:24
Speaker 1: what have you. But everyone's different that way. Some people
41:28
Speaker 1: try not to feel negative at all. I personally have
41:31
Speaker 1: to for a split second just to get it out
41:33
Speaker 1: of my system. But that just goes to my personal routine,
41:37
Speaker 1: and everyone's different.
41:38
Speaker 2: Hey, it's understandable, right, you don't work hard, whether it
41:41
Speaker 2: be on or off the court, for things not to
41:44
Speaker 2: go as you'd hoped. Right, So when these instances happen
41:47
Speaker 2: that there is frustration and things don't show up or
41:50
Speaker 2: pan out as you want them to, you own that
41:54
Speaker 2: moment and then you out of the opportunity to respond
41:58
Speaker 2: and decide what's best for you moving forward. And I
42:01
Speaker 2: think that that's a really beautiful lesson that is so applicable,
42:05
Speaker 2: like I said, off of the court, regardless of who
42:08
Speaker 2: you are, whether or not you played tennis.
42:10
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yeah. I think there's so many metaphors that I've
42:13
Speaker 1: learned from tennis that apply to life, like what we've
42:16
Speaker 1: kind of talked about already about like you know, keep
42:19
Speaker 1: going the last point doesn't tactate the next one, And
42:22
Speaker 1: what we're talking about now is really no exception. There's
42:25
Speaker 1: so many metaphors with tennis that can help you do
42:28
Speaker 1: better in life. I can see why a lot of
42:29
Speaker 1: people sell a lot of books about mental skills with tennis,
42:33
Speaker 1: and everybody's buying them because it all applies.
42:35
Speaker 2: I see your mental wheels turning, Dan as like, okay,
42:38
Speaker 2: book author, Right, that's what I'm gonna do when I'm
42:41
Speaker 2: feeling exactly now. To go back to the mental skills training,
42:47
Speaker 2: we kind of like just about the things that you
42:49
Speaker 2: you worked on or what really helped you, But for
42:52
Speaker 2: the actual training itself, what does that look like in practice?
42:57
Speaker 1: It can change depending on what we're working on. Sometimes
43:01
Speaker 1: it's literally me just talking to him the way that
43:04
Speaker 1: I would talk to a therapist, because sometimes if you're
43:08
Speaker 1: stressed about something or whatever, if you just need to
43:11
Speaker 1: get that out, that will actually help you just perform better.
43:14
Speaker 1: So sometimes a training session is just talking. Other times
43:18
Speaker 1: it's unpacking a performance that I might have had, so
43:22
Speaker 1: watching film and then unpacking things or remembering certain points
43:27
Speaker 1: and going like, do you know what I think that
43:29
Speaker 1: here I was really nervous and this is what I
43:31
Speaker 1: did wrong. Or I'll tell him that I'm having a
43:34
Speaker 1: lot of trouble committing to a shot. I get nervous.
43:38
Speaker 1: My biggest thing that I struggle with is I'm more
43:41
Speaker 1: of an aggressive hitter, but that also for that to work,
43:44
Speaker 1: you need to have a lot of confidence in yourself
43:46
Speaker 1: to hit like that, right, Like, I'm not that person
43:49
Speaker 1: that likes to just get balls back and run around
43:51
Speaker 1: and scramble, and so when I'm feeling nervous, I'm morphed
43:55
Speaker 1: into that other type of player. But that's not where
43:57
Speaker 1: I find a lot of success, and that can be
44:00
Speaker 1: a really hard balancing act to manage. And so I've
44:04
Speaker 1: had a lot of talks with him about how do
44:06
Speaker 1: I convince myself to be brave And a lot of
44:10
Speaker 1: that comes with visualizing. So sometimes I'll literally sit there
44:16
Speaker 1: with my eyes closed and he walks me through visualization.
44:20
Speaker 1: So he'll have me like picture a scene of a
44:23
Speaker 1: tennis court, a very specific memory of a court where
44:26
Speaker 1: I can like literally feel like I'm there. Then we
44:29
Speaker 1: go through motions of either constructing points or how it
44:33
Speaker 1: feels to win points, how it you know, is there
44:37
Speaker 1: something that makes me feel powerful? What am I wearing
44:39
Speaker 1: that day? What color is it? You know, very detail
44:43
Speaker 1: oriented things. I'd say a big bulk of my training
44:46
Speaker 1: has been visualization based, just because that's that helps a
44:50
Speaker 1: lot with the feeling of confidence. But there's a lot
44:53
Speaker 1: of different things that we had to work on when
44:56
Speaker 1: I first started because I was so new. So, like
44:59
Speaker 1: what you do in between points in terms of breathing,
45:02
Speaker 1: type of breathing, you need to be doing like there's
45:04
Speaker 1: belly breathing where you're a lot of times, if you
45:07
Speaker 1: were to breathe in deep right now, your stomach contracts
45:10
Speaker 1: in and a lot of times we actually want to
45:13
Speaker 1: have the opposite, where you're filling up your belly outwards.
45:17
Speaker 1: I don't remember why, but I remember that I had
45:20
Speaker 1: to learn what belly breathing was. I had to learn
45:24
Speaker 1: different ways to do like box breathing where you're holding
45:27
Speaker 1: your breath for four, breathing in, breathing out, all of
45:30
Speaker 1: those different types of counts to relax myself. So I'd
45:34
Speaker 1: say there's been a lot of different things, but a
45:36
Speaker 1: lot of it for me personally, has been focused around
45:39
Speaker 1: the sense of confidence in how to keep myself being brave.
45:42
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love a box bruh first and foremost.
45:46
Speaker 3: Secondly, I do I really do.
45:48
Speaker 2: I feel like it is one hundred percent my go
45:50
Speaker 2: to in any situation where something feels like it is
45:53
Speaker 2: beyond my control, I'll usually either repeat a mantra that
45:57
Speaker 2: feels really good for me right now.
46:00
Speaker 3: I don't know where this came from.
46:02
Speaker 2: I had never used it before, but in a chaotic
46:05
Speaker 2: time for me, in this moment, I say to myself
46:08
Speaker 2: you are made for this moment, and it reminds me
46:10
Speaker 2: that I am capable of handling whatever chaos that is
46:13
Speaker 2: happening around me.
46:14
Speaker 3: So I will lend it to you and everyone.
46:16
Speaker 1: I'm going to use that in Paris. I think I'm
46:19
Speaker 1: made for this moment. No, No, I really love that
46:23
Speaker 1: because that goes with like a confident feeling right, like
46:26
Speaker 1: I'm made for this moment, right, And.
46:28
Speaker 2: Even when it feels like things are beyond your control,
46:30
Speaker 2: it's like, no, like I am made for this moment,
46:33
Speaker 2: Like I get to show up and decide what happens
46:35
Speaker 2: next or put my best foot forward and respond right.
46:38
Speaker 2: And so I either run into that affirmation at this
46:41
Speaker 2: point that's the one that's resonating with me, or I'll
46:44
Speaker 2: do at least like three to four rounds of box
46:47
Speaker 2: breath and it just helps you reset and remember, like
46:50
Speaker 2: who the hell you are?
46:52
Speaker 3: Right, It's like notally it is, I've got this.
46:55
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, yeah, You've already gone through mental skills training.
46:58
Speaker 1: You're ready to be a tennis player.
46:59
Speaker 3: I think I'm to be at onnes Is Layer.
47:01
Speaker 2: I don't know how good I am with the racket,
47:03
Speaker 2: but I do make sure to go every year to
47:06
Speaker 2: the us open with my oldest and dearest friend.
47:09
Speaker 1: Yes, amazing.
47:12
Speaker 2: Well, I love these mental training tricks, and I really
47:15
Speaker 2: resonate with this visualization tool. Something that I also use
47:20
Speaker 2: in addition to that visualization and what I mentioned about
47:23
Speaker 2: the mantras is something called I am statements. So when
47:27
Speaker 2: things feel that are beyond my control, I sit down
47:31
Speaker 2: and I, through visualization or actually seeing things in front
47:35
Speaker 2: of me, write down facts that I know to be true.
47:38
Speaker 2: So right now, if I'm about to sit down with
47:40
Speaker 2: you to record this podcast and I'm feeling really nervous
47:43
Speaker 2: or anxious about it because I'm such a fangirl, I
47:45
Speaker 2: can sit down and look at my notebook and write
47:48
Speaker 2: down things like I am a successful podcaster, I am
47:52
Speaker 2: good at what I do.
47:53
Speaker 3: I am someone who gets hired.
47:55
Speaker 2: Because I'm good at what I'm doing, Like things like
47:58
Speaker 2: that that are facts, and that helps kind of shove
48:02
Speaker 2: that imposter syndrome gremlin to the side that says I
48:06
Speaker 2: don't know if I can do this, and affirms that
48:08
Speaker 2: not only can you do.
48:10
Speaker 3: That thing, but you can do it well.
48:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that. I think that that's something that
48:15
Speaker 1: I'm hearing this and I'm like, oh, I want to
48:17
Speaker 1: do that. That's a great idea.
48:19
Speaker 2: This is the goal, right You and I are here
48:21
Speaker 2: for the betterment of all of the hurdlers that are
48:24
Speaker 2: listening to this conversation.
48:25
Speaker 1: It's great. No, I'm definitely going to take a page
48:28
Speaker 1: out of your book, so to speak, and do a
48:31
Speaker 1: little bit of that. On match days, I actually have
48:34
Speaker 1: a little note card where I write down jobs for myself.
48:37
Speaker 1: I'm very job oriented, so depending on who I'm playing,
48:41
Speaker 1: I'll have little list for myself, like three or four
48:44
Speaker 1: jobs that I want to execute during the match. And
48:46
Speaker 1: some of those things are mental, and I think I'm
48:49
Speaker 1: going to add a couple things saying like I am
48:51
Speaker 1: such and such or I'm made for this moment. I
48:54
Speaker 1: love that. I'm going to write my note cards for sure.
48:57
Speaker 3: I'm on team data. I'm here to help.
49:00
Speaker 2: Someone comes to your Instagram page, they see the number
49:03
Speaker 2: one wheelchair based tennis player in the United States. You
49:07
Speaker 2: look in the mirror. What is it that you see
49:10
Speaker 2: looking back at you?
49:12
Speaker 1: Gosh, I don't know. I think if you if you
49:15
Speaker 1: say that sentence before I look in the mirror, then
49:19
Speaker 1: I see a tennis player. You know. I think I'm
49:22
Speaker 1: someone that like anybody else looks in the mirror and
49:25
Speaker 1: probably initially sees a flaw that they don't like. So
49:29
Speaker 1: I think that it's it would be a good practice
49:31
Speaker 1: for me to look in the mirror and say those affirmations,
49:34
Speaker 1: like I am the number one wilchair tennis player in
49:37
Speaker 1: the United States, I am number eight in the world,
49:39
Speaker 1: I am a college graduate, I am X Y or Z.
49:43
Speaker 1: I think that it's definitely something that I carry proudly
49:46
Speaker 1: within myself. But do I look in a mirror and
49:48
Speaker 1: think that all the time? No, But I think that
49:51
Speaker 1: I would probably have more confidence if I did. I
49:53
Speaker 1: think that's a great I'm getting a lot of good
49:56
Speaker 1: mental skills training from you.
50:00
Speaker 2: We're giving everyone homework. Also, that's listening. Yes, you now
50:05
Speaker 2: need to write down eight I am statements and practice
50:08
Speaker 2: saying them in the mirror for at least one minute
50:12
Speaker 2: every morning.
50:13
Speaker 1: It's your hurdle homework.
50:15
Speaker 2: Your hurdle homework. Oh my god, it's going to be
50:17
Speaker 2: a new segment on the show. Just love that. We
50:21
Speaker 2: are coming to the end of our conversation today, which
50:23
Speaker 2: I have seriously so much enjoyed.
50:26
Speaker 3: But before I let you go, I would be remiss
50:29
Speaker 3: if I didn't ask you.
50:30
Speaker 2: Aside from the pending Paralympics on deck, what excites you
50:34
Speaker 2: right now?
50:36
Speaker 1: I think just being I mean I've been away for
50:39
Speaker 1: the entire summer. I've been away for nine weeks, so
50:42
Speaker 1: just being home right now excites me. I think getting
50:44
Speaker 1: to spend time with my husband really excites me. He
50:47
Speaker 1: is doing a medical residency up in Gainesville right now,
50:51
Speaker 1: so we don't live together during the week, and so
50:54
Speaker 1: any time that I actually get to spend time with
50:56
Speaker 1: him is really exciting. Aside from that, I'm really excited
51:00
Speaker 1: about just the growth of wheelchair tennis. I think that
51:03
Speaker 1: I'm seeing so many cool things happening just within Orlando.
51:07
Speaker 1: Like we've got Maylee, who is a new up and
51:09
Speaker 1: comer player that has come out and is basically moving
51:12
Speaker 1: here very soon. She's going to be my doubles partner
51:14
Speaker 1: in Paris, hopefully if she gets a wildcard, which we
51:17
Speaker 1: should find out in a few days. So seeing things
51:21
Speaker 1: like that, like I used to be the only wheelchair
51:22
Speaker 1: tennis player here, She's coming now and I get to
51:25
Speaker 1: kind of have that full circle moment where I get
51:27
Speaker 1: to help coach her and you know, have training sessions
51:30
Speaker 1: with her. Now We've got more and more of our
51:33
Speaker 1: junior boys coming in. It's a cool time. I think
51:35
Speaker 1: that I'm just really excited about what sport is like,
51:39
Speaker 1: how it's evolved, and that I get to kind of
51:41
Speaker 1: be writing different chapters and help other people write there
51:44
Speaker 1: as it's exciting.
51:45
Speaker 2: It's so special right now, Dana, you have an opportunity
51:49
Speaker 2: to offer yourself a piece of advice looking back on
51:52
Speaker 2: that hurdle, the resistance that you felt of trying something new,
51:56
Speaker 2: of being forced into this wheelchair beyond your choice. You
52:01
Speaker 2: have an opportunity, knowing what you know now, to offer
52:04
Speaker 2: that younger self a piece of advice.
52:06
Speaker 3: What do you tell her?
52:08
Speaker 1: Don't be afraid of being different and try new things anyway,
52:11
Speaker 1: because you might fall in love with them.
52:13
Speaker 3: Try new things anyway. Dana Matthewson, I'm so amped for you.
52:17
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be cheering you on in Paris hopefully IRL.
52:20
Speaker 2: For those that don't follow along with you just yet,
52:23
Speaker 2: how do they keep up with you?
52:25
Speaker 3: On social?
52:26
Speaker 1: Search for me on all the different social channels. Everything
52:29
Speaker 1: is just under my name. Look for Dana Matthewson. But
52:31
Speaker 1: Matthewson's got one tea and you'll find me.
52:34
Speaker 3: And you'll find me.
52:35
Speaker 2: I'm over at Emily a Body and at Hurdle Podcast,
52:39
Speaker 2: Another Hurdle Conquered.
52:40
Speaker 3: Catch you guys next time.