Latest / The Burnout Podcast with Fexingo: Workplace Exhaustion, Recovery, and Sustainable Careers / How Career Burnout Reshapes Your Relationship with Your Body
Transcript
- Lucas: I want to start with something that sounds almost too simple to be a burnout symptom, but it keeps coming up in the research. Have you ever had a day where you realize, around four in the afternoon, that you haven't felt hungry once — not even a single stomach rumble — and you can't remember the last time you drank water? Luna: Absolutely. I used to have that happen regularly in my last job. I'd look at the clock and think, wait, when did I last eat? And it wouldn't be like I was starving — I just had zero sensation. Lucas: Right. And that's not just absentmindedness. It's what neuroscientists call a breakdown in interoception — the brain's ability to sense and interpret internal body signals. Hunger, thirst, needing to use the bathroom, even your heartbeat. Burnout seems to blunt that capacity. Luna: So you're saying burnout literally makes you deaf to your own body? That's a lot bigger than 'I forgot to eat.' Lucas: That's exactly what I'm saying. There was a really striking study from the University of Zurich in 2023. They took people with high burnout scores and a control group, and had them try to count their own heartbeats without touching their chest or wrist — just feeling it. The burned-out participants were about 40 percent less accurate. They were literally worse at feeling their own heart. Luna: Wow. Forty percent. That's not subtle. And I'm guessing this isn't just about heartbeats — it would affect pain signals, too? Lucas: Exactly. Another study, this one from Sweden a few years back, found that people with high burnout had significantly higher pain thresholds — they could tolerate more heat or pressure before reporting discomfort. It's like the brain turns down the volume on all internal signals to conserve energy for the constant stress response. Luna: That's actually terrifying. Because your body is trying to tell you something, and you just can't hear it. I remember reading about a woman who worked through a kidney infection because she didn't feel the pain until it was severe. Lucas: That's the extreme end, and it's rare, but the mechanism is the same. Chronic stress floods the system with cortisol, and over time the brain's insula — that's the region responsible for interoception — gets less reactive. It's a protective mechanism gone haywire. Your brain decides that survival mode means ignoring internal chatter, but that includes crucial signals. Luna: So if someone listening is thinking, 'I don't feel burned out, I just never feel hungry or tired anymore' — that could actually be burnout showing up in a weird way? Lucas: Absolutely. And it's one of the trickiest forms because you don't feel distressed. You feel numb. But numbness is a symptom, not a sign of health. And this is exactly where I want to pause, because this show — The Burnout Podcast — exists because so many of us have been through these weird, quiet symptoms. We try to keep it ad-free and accessible, and that only works because listeners chip in small amounts. If you've ever gotten something useful out of an episode — maybe you learned about interoception today — you can support us at buy me a coffee dot com slash fexingo. Even a couple of dollars a month genuinely keeps these episodes coming. Luna: Yeah, and it's not like we're asking for a lot. Coffee money. But it makes a real difference in keeping the show independent. Lucas: Exactly. So, back to the body — the question becomes, can you rebuild interoception? The good news is yes, your brain can re-learn to listen. Luna: Okay, how? Because I've tried mindfulness and it always felt like I was just sitting there thinking about thinking. Lucas: That's a real problem with generic mindfulness. But there are specific practices for interoception. One of the most studied is body scanning — not in a spiritual way, but clinically. You lie down and mentally scan from your toes to your head, just noticing sensations without judging them. The goal is simply to register heat, pressure, tingling, whatever is there. Luna: And that actually changes the insula? Lucas: Studies show it does. A 2019 paper from Harvard found that eight weeks of body-scan meditation increased gray matter density in the insula and prefrontal cortex. It's neuroplastic — you can strengthen the pathways. Luna: How long do you have to do it? Because I suspect most people who are burned out don't have time for an hour of scanning. Lucas: You don't need an hour. Even five minutes a day can help. There's also something called the STOP technique — it's an acronym. S for stop, T for take a breath, O for observe what you're feeling in your body, and P for proceed. It takes maybe thirty seconds. You can do it before every meeting or meal. Luna: I like that. It's concrete. And it's not another thing on your to-do list — it's a pause. Lucas: Right. And the key is to do it consistently, not just when you feel bad. You're training the brain to check in regularly. Over time, those hunger pangs and fatigue signals start breaking through again. Luna: What about physical cues that are harder to notice? Like, I used to be really good at knowing when I needed a break, but now I just push through until I crash. Lucas: That's a sign that your interoceptive alarm is broken. One trick is to schedule short 'sensation checks' at random times — set a vibrating alarm on your watch. When it goes off, ask yourself three things: what am I feeling physically right now? what is my energy level? and what do I need? The question 'what do I need' is crucial because it forces you to translate sensation into action. Luna: And if the answer is 'I need water' or 'I need to stand up,' you actually do it? Lucas: You have to. Otherwise you're just collecting data without responding, and the brain learns that the signals don't matter. It's like having a smoke alarm that goes off and you just turn it off without checking for fire. Pretty soon the alarm stops working. Luna: That's a good analogy. So responding is part of the retraining. I think a lot of people, myself included, treat bodily needs as optional — like I'll drink water after this email. But that's exactly the pattern that reinforces the disconnect. Lucas: Exactly. And it's worth saying that this isn't about being perfect. You're not going to fix years of burnout in a week. But even one or two moments a day where you actually feel your feet on the floor or notice you're thirsty — that's the beginning of reconnection. Luna: I want to ask about something I've heard in the context of trauma recovery: grounding. Is that essentially the same thing? Lucas: Related but not identical. Grounding is about orienting to the external environment — feeling your back against the chair, noticing five things you can see. That's helpful for anxiety or dissociation. Interoception is about the internal environment. Both are valuable, but for burnout specifically, interoception is the more direct target. Luna: Got it. So if someone is feeling numb and detached, they might benefit from grounding first, then move to interoception. Lucas: Exactly. Start with external anchors — temperature, texture, sound. Then once you can stay present, turn inward. There's a great book by a researcher named Sarah Garfinkel — she studies interoception and its role in emotional regulation. She argues that without accurate body signals, our emotions become vague and hard to name. So rebuilding interoception can also help you figure out what you're actually feeling emotionally. Luna: That makes sense. If you can't feel your heart racing, you might not know you're anxious. You just feel off. Lucas: Right. And that 'off' feeling can be misinterpreted as laziness or lack of motivation, which people with burnout often blame themselves for. But it's actually a physiological signal that your system is overwhelmed. Learning to read it as 'my body is saying I need rest' rather than 'I'm not trying hard enough' is a huge shift. Luna: That reframing alone might be worth an episode. So what's the one thing you'd recommend listeners try this week? Lucas: I'd say pick one meal a day and eat it without any screens. Just sit with the food and notice the taste, the texture, the sensation of fullness. That's a direct interoception exercise. And it also slows you down, which is hard to do when you're burned out. Luna: I'm going to try that. I usually eat lunch at my desk while scrolling. I bet I'll realize I'm full halfway through and keep eating out of habit. Lucas: That's exactly the kind of discovery that starts the reconnection. Your body has been talking this whole time. You just couldn't hear it. But the volume can be turned back up. Luna: It's almost hopeful — because it means you're not broken, you just need to practice listening again. Lucas: Exactly. And that practice is something we can talk about more in a future episode — maybe how to rebuild interoception specifically at work, in high-pressure moments. Luna: I'd love that. For now, I think the main takeaway is: if you feel numb to your own body, that's not normal, but it's also not permanent. There are small steps you can take. Lucas: And the first step is just noticing that you haven't been noticing. That awareness is already a win.