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My Husband Is Jealous of My Success · Therapy Thursday with Ellen K

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I mean it's been que and far between.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: I'll say that, Okay, less sex now than there was.
• 0:06
  Speaker 3: Do you initiate more than he does?
• 0:08
  Speaker 4: And he's because I could see I could see him
• 0:11
  Speaker 4: being like, yeah, not tonight, not in the mood, can't
• 0:13
  Speaker 4: it's not working.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: That happens often, and that doesn't do seems forced.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's turned off in every way.
• 0:22
  Speaker 5: He's he's turned off.
• 0:23
  Speaker 6: And I think that and you can ask Ellen and Ryan.
• 0:26
  Speaker 6: I don't say this all the time, but it's really
• 0:29
  Speaker 6: essential that you get into couple theraphy.
• 0:32
  Speaker 5: And I'm hearing a couple of things that I think
• 0:34
  Speaker 5: are really concerning.
• 0:35
  Speaker 6: One is there's contempt here, Sarah are saying that you're
• 0:40
  Speaker 6: reporting that he's saying to you.
• 0:41
  Speaker 5: There's contempt.
• 0:42
  Speaker 6: There's also, I'm going to be direct, the beginnings of
• 0:45
  Speaker 6: an emotional affair.
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: We gathered together again for a therapy Thursday. I look
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: forward to this so much. I'm Ellen, I'm Ryan Mano,
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: and I'm Sarah Dash. Okay, so Sarah, you're the expert,
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: You're the pro. So they tell me, well, come on,
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, I've watched situations. We know that you know
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: you can size them up. And because you have so
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: much experience, and you've done this, you know, for years,
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: and you know how to solve problems. I like solutions.
• 1:19
  Speaker 5: I think I'm pretty solution focused in the end.
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: Can I ask you a question?
• 1:23
  Speaker 4: Of course, when you are faced with something, is it
• 1:26
  Speaker 4: about you solving it or giving the person the tools
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: to solve it themselves.
• 1:29
  Speaker 5: It is never about me solving it.
• 1:32
  Speaker 6: It is always about them finding clarity and also developing
• 1:37
  Speaker 6: a feeling of self efficacy. So I should eventually be irrelevant.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Sure, Oh okay, good. If someone told Ryan this week
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: that he's held together with duct tape and prayers, yep, really,
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: what's going on?
• 1:52
  Speaker 4: Well, I'm literally experiencing a medical emergency actively and I
• 1:56
  Speaker 4: have a hole in my head because I went deaf.
• 1:57
  Speaker 4: I've lost one hundred percent hearing this so scary, it
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: is scared. It's very scary.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: I keep trying to get him to the emergency room.
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: It's not comfy.
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: But so yes, held together by duct tape and prayers
• 2:08
  Speaker 4: and a lot of hope that these doctors know how
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: to bring it back.
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: And I have confidence because so many doctors are so competent.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: You're seeing the best of the best. But still, yeah,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: I thought. One of our listeners really like really picked
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: up on that. Oh really yeah, and said, Okay, Ryan,
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: I know that you know you're.
• 2:26
  Speaker 7: You'reparently holding on by a thread, buddy, listen, And I
• 2:30
  Speaker 7: swear it's so funny, and I think it brings it
• 2:32
  Speaker 7: full circle because we there are so many people going
• 2:35
  Speaker 7: through so many things all the time, right that we
• 2:38
  Speaker 7: don't see.
• 2:39
  Speaker 5: That's that's very true. We never know what's underneath the surface.
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: That's it.
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: Sometimes I'm at a traffic stoplight and I think, what
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: is that person next to me? What is that person thinking, feeling, doing,
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean? Like you look over and
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: I think, where are you on your way to? What's
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: going on?
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: Like? Did they are they going to? Maybe maybe someone
• 2:59
  Speaker 4: just had a baby in the family, maybe there was
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: a death, maybe someone's not well, maybe they lost their job,
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: maybe they're starting a new job.
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: You never know.
• 3:07
  Speaker 5: You never know.
• 3:07
  Speaker 6: And sometimes the people who sing them most together are
• 3:11
  Speaker 6: really suffering the most and you just never know it
• 3:14
  Speaker 6: because they're so practiced keeping it all together for everybody else.
• 3:19
  Speaker 4: And you brought that up, and that's what you do.
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: You see these things that people don't see.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: Well, Amanda's on the line, and Amanda's having a big
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: problem with her husband Tyler. Hi, Amanda, Hi, how are you?
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: Hey?
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: We're good. The question is how are you? And you
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: are here with us for therapy and Sarah Dash is
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: a pro, So what's going on?
• 3:40
  Speaker 8: Yeah?
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: I was hoping that you and Sarah could help me.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: I accidentally became my husband's boss, okay, yeah, and I
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: am afraid that it might be ruining our marriage. So basically,
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: we work for the same company, my husband and I,
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: and last year I got promoted and it happens to
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: be above him, and you know. Of course we discussed
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: it and he at first acted supportive and was proud,
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: But since then he hasn't shown those feelings. Necessarily, something's changed.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: At work, he barely looks at me. I don't know
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: if that's more of a even like a performative, like
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: he knows everyone knows we're married, and yet I'm his boss.
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: But at home, it's like every tiny disagreement somehow turns
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: into a fight about respect.
• 4:47
  Speaker 5: And this is something new. You never argued about this
• 4:49
  Speaker 5: type of thing.
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: Before, not to this extent. I mean, it's the type
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: of thing that if I ask him to help with dishes.
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: He'll snap and he'll say something like, well, you already
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: tell me what to do all day?
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, that is that I mean Tyler?
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And if I mentioned finances, he accuses me of
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: acting superior because I now make significantly more money than
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: he does. And it's just like everything is coming back.
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: He's like using this against me. And meanwhile, there's another
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: guy at work. His name is Brandon, and he does
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: report to me too, but unlike my husband Tyler, he
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: actually listens to me and he encourages me, and he
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: tells me that I deserve this success. And I've been
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: catching myself sort of looking forward to, honestly, meetings with
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: Brandon more than going home to my own husband.
• 5:48
  Speaker 5: So there's a transfer of anticipation.
• 5:51
  Speaker 6: What is that? It's a there's a transfer of anticipation.
• 5:54
  Speaker 6: She's where she would most likely, hopefully in the past,
• 5:59
  Speaker 6: anticipate sharing things and connecting with her spouse. The anticipation
• 6:05
  Speaker 6: has now shifted to the guy at work.
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: So sorry, when you see something like that, Sarah, what
• 6:12
  Speaker 4: what stands out to you more that Tyler is the
• 6:15
  Speaker 4: problem by not celebrating her, or that Brandon is more
• 6:22
  Speaker 4: enticing because he's giving her exactly.
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: What she wants.
• 6:25
  Speaker 5: They're one and the same.
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: They are really okay, fascinating.
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: That's interesting because now I mean this is a triangle, now, okay, and.
• 6:32
  Speaker 5: The triangle, this particular triangle doesn't exist with both these men.
• 6:36
  Speaker 5: And Amanda, oh, does that make sense.
• 6:38
  Speaker 6: It's like the I don't believe the issue with Brian exists,
• 6:43
  Speaker 6: I'm sorry, Brandon exists without the husband's issues.
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: Okay, right, so Tyler caused the emotions toward Brandon.
• 6:54
  Speaker 6: I think there's a high likelihood that she's drawn to
• 6:56
  Speaker 6: him for the very reason she said, you know what's going.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: On at eight?
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, what's your sense? My sense?
• 7:06
  Speaker 4: And I'm sorry, Amanda, I'm just going to say it.
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: I think that your your husband. First of all, I
• 7:11
  Speaker 4: immediately jumped off the page that he's very insecure, there's
• 7:15
  Speaker 4: a jealousy. But I also wonder, and Sarah, maybe you
• 7:18
  Speaker 4: can tag back in on this, and Ellen, is there
• 7:20
  Speaker 4: an emasculation happening?
• 7:23
  Speaker 6: I think there is an emasculation happening. I'm curious as
• 7:27
  Speaker 6: to if you know how your husband was socialized in
• 7:31
  Speaker 6: terms of traditional male roles.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: That's like, what was his dad like or his Grandpa.
• 7:38
  Speaker 5: What's the story. What's the story that he tells himself
• 7:43
  Speaker 5: about what his very said it.
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: He's very traditional, he has want that traditional. That's how
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: he grew up kind of very traditional gender roles in
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: the house. But my frustration is that when this all
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: happened originally he had no issue with it. If there
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: was really going to be an issue on his end,
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: I maybe would have thought twice about this.
• 8:07
  Speaker 5: He may have known that he didn't have an issue.
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: He didn't he was going to feel.
• 8:12
  Speaker 6: He didn't realize it until it happened and he started feeling.
• 8:15
  Speaker 6: I mean, I think the word humiliation is not too strong.
• 8:18
  Speaker 4: Yep, because now he not only so to me, this
• 8:21
  Speaker 4: would be different if they work somewhere else, Like if
• 8:23
  Speaker 4: they worked oh different places and Amanda was promoted, was
• 8:27
  Speaker 4: in the Breadwinner, he would have far less of a problem.
• 8:30
  Speaker 4: But you know, this guy's got to go to work
• 8:31
  Speaker 4: every day, yep. And the same people that are reporting
• 8:34
  Speaker 4: to Amanda are looking at him like.
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like he's the bitch boy.
• 8:38
  Speaker 5: I mean, there's now a hierarchy.
• 8:40
  Speaker 6: In the relationship where there wasn't before, and that can
• 8:43
  Speaker 6: be really tough to be tough for anybody especially if
• 8:47
  Speaker 6: somebody was raised with the idea that as provider, protector,
• 8:51
  Speaker 6: that's what it means to.
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: Be a man.
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: That would be so hard if if that's your traditional
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: and now all of a sudden, your wife was saying
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: too that everyone else is reporting to is now your boss?
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a double way.
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: Well, and now that's translating at home that like everything
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: is turned into like a competition between us. He's making
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: it that way.
• 9:12
  Speaker 8: It seems you don't have to answer this, Amanda, But
• 9:16
  Speaker 8: you're gonna ask. I know, I know, go ahead, you ask,
• 9:18
  Speaker 8: can't This is what Ryan wants to ask you. This
• 9:19
  Speaker 8: is Ryan's thoughts because I can read his mind. What
• 9:22
  Speaker 8: is it like in the bedroom? Are you making love?
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: Is it the same? Is he trying to dominate you there?
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: Gosh? I mean it's been you and far between.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: I'll say that, Okay, less sex now than there was.
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: Do you initiate more than he does? And he's because
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: I could see I could see him being like, yeah.
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: Not tonight, not in the mood. Can't it's not working.
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: Oh, that happens often, and that what we do this
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: sort of seems forced.
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's turned off in every way.
• 9:55
  Speaker 6: He's he's turned off, and I think that you can
• 9:58
  Speaker 6: ask Ellen run. I don't say this all the time,
• 10:02
  Speaker 6: but it's really essential that you get into couple theraphy.
• 10:06
  Speaker 6: And I'm hearing a couple of things that I think
• 10:08
  Speaker 6: are really concerning. One is there contempt here?
• 10:11
  Speaker 5: Yes, saying that you're reporting that he's saying to you.
• 10:14
  Speaker 6: There's contempt. There's also, I'm going to be direct, the
• 10:18
  Speaker 6: beginnings of an emotional affair. You take an emotional affair
• 10:22
  Speaker 6: and layering contempt at home, it's a serious problem and
• 10:26
  Speaker 6: it needs to be addressed sooner rather than later.
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: Has anything happened and sorry, we're just hitting you with
• 10:31
  Speaker 4: so much right now. Has anything happened with this other
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: guy at work that's not your husband?
• 10:37
  Speaker 9: No?
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: Nothing, nothing, nothing out of good line brand, nothing, nothing inappropriate.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: And though it's more so just like that, I more
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: so see this Brandon character in my life now as
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: someone that I wish my own husband acted like.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: You know, that's awful because if you feel more at
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: home with someone you work with than your own home
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: and you would never want to go home.
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: Well sometimes, yeah, that's how it's starting to feel.
• 11:04
  Speaker 6: Emotional affairs like we it's not necessarily about lust or desire.
• 11:08
  Speaker 6: It can be about seriously like oxygen, it's relief.
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: It's the relief from what.
• 11:13
  Speaker 5: You have at home.
• 11:14
  Speaker 6: You anticipate that feeling of just being able to breathe,
• 11:18
  Speaker 6: and you're you're not feeling connected to your spouse, and
• 11:22
  Speaker 6: you need to take a look at that.
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: How do you feel when you when you see him? Like,
• 11:29
  Speaker 4: do you do you still love him the way that
• 11:31
  Speaker 4: you don't?
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: I do? I always have imagine do you still admire him?
• 11:40
  Speaker 5: Do you admire him.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: Not for the way he's been treating me lately outside
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: of that, you know, because I will it seems childish
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: to me, you know, and it seems it seems insecure,
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: It seems petty, and it seems not unsupportive and almost
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: like backstabbing me in a way like, you know, I
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: get myself in this position and now I'm being punished
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: for it, and that's not He's childish.
• 12:13
  Speaker 6: I think you're in a particularly difficult position because if
• 12:17
  Speaker 6: you treat him with care and understanding, I think it's
• 12:21
  Speaker 6: going to be perceived as condescending.
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: Hmm.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: That is tough.
• 12:27
  Speaker 5: It's really tough.
• 12:27
  Speaker 6: And that's why I think couple's therapy is really indicated here?
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: And what would happen in couple's therapy?
• 12:33
  Speaker 6: Like what.
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: How do they work this out?
• 12:37
  Speaker 9: Well?
• 12:37
  Speaker 6: I think it's about creating a space where they can
• 12:40
  Speaker 6: both be vulnerable.
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: Okay, so he could finally just let it all out,
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: like how he's really feeling instead of the little jobs
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: at home.
• 12:48
  Speaker 5: Yeah, think about it. If somebody's feeling emasculated, the last
• 12:52
  Speaker 5: thing they're.
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: Drawn to be is vulnerable. Oh yeah, that's true. Yeah,
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: you need to find someone. Do you both feel comfortable with?
• 13:00
  Speaker 4: Is it possible? And Amanda, don't be upset with me
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: for asking have you changed with this promotion? Are you
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: becoming more dominant? Are you becoming a little different than
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: he's liking? And this is just his way of sort
• 13:13
  Speaker 4: of deflecting or reacting to your personality changes.
• 13:16
  Speaker 5: Good question.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: I mean I've been forced to at work. Sure, I've
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: been forced to and I've been forced to. You know,
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: it's my job, but.
• 13:28
  Speaker 4: It's also your marriage. Don't forget that. It's your husband too.
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: I know.
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but at home. I'm not trying to then bring
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: that up to home. I'm really not. I I don't know,
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: it's I guess I've seen enough that it's not working
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: whatever is happening, and I don't want Then it's like
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: the easy answer to me is like, oh, well one
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: of us needs to leave the job.
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: And that's what I was thinking too, like together his job,
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: what he wants for his life.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: Right, Because then it's like, well, which one of us leaves?
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: I just got promoted into this great opportunity, leave home
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: more money. But then it's like is that even more
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: double bit waiting for him to be like, oh well,
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: now you have to leave your job?
• 14:19
  Speaker 5: Yeah right, I see that.
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's frustrating.
• 14:23
  Speaker 5: Do you think that he would be open to seeing
• 14:25
  Speaker 5: a therapist?
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: I would hope, so, Okay.
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: It doesn't sound to me like he would.
• 14:36
  Speaker 6: I don't know.
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: Do you do you feel he loves you enough to
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: do it for your marriage?
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: Would hope that for the sake of our marriage.
• 14:43
  Speaker 5: Does he see the relationship as problematic?
• 14:48
  Speaker 6: Great question, because if he doesn't say it is problematic,
• 14:52
  Speaker 6: he is absolutely not going to be motivated to go
• 14:54
  Speaker 6: into therapy.
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: I mean I think so it's not it's not happy
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: at home, so.
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: It's known that it's not good.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, all right, yeah.
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: Okay, Well, congrats on your promotion.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: That's huge.
• 15:10
  Speaker 5: It is huge.
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you have you, thank you. Yeah, we definitely have
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: some things we need to talk through. And I think
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: at to this point it's just hasn't been laid out
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: on the table and discussed. Instead, we are gaslighting each
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: other and you know, it's just not working. And I
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: think you're right, like, we need to just bring this
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: to a head and talk about it, talk it through
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: and see if he can open up about how he's
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: feeling and maybe how we can resolve it. I mean,
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: this is a situation that we're in. We need to
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: find a way that we can resolve it. And if not,
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: I don't know. It's it's been a horrible feeling.
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: You know, you both can't go on this way?
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: No, yeah, okay, Yeah.
• 16:00
  Speaker 6: Ellen's right, you need to make a change. Something needs
• 16:03
  Speaker 6: to shift.
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: How would you feel if the marriage didn't last that.
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: Horrible? It's not what I'm trying to do, I'm not I'm.
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: Just saying, if you can't get him to meet you
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: in the middle, I would see the only way through
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: it is out of it.
• 16:24
  Speaker 6: Yeah, Like, are you is this good enough for you
• 16:27
  Speaker 6: for the rest of your life? I think is what
• 16:29
  Speaker 6: Ellen's asking you.
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: Okay, yes, never change your word. No, I mean no, okay, no,
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: it's so it's him forever.
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: But it's also not good enough.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: It's not him forever.
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: Right, yeah, it's not it's not good enough.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah right, yeah, I'm sure it's not for him.
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: No, it's not. It's not, and I would it's just not.
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: Then you're right, it's already I didn't even think about
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: it that. It's like emotional cheating. If I'm already towing
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: that line, my gosh, I I would hate for either
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: of us to do something beyond that.
• 17:14
  Speaker 8: And then don't obviously try to, right yeah, oh boy?
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: Okay, well so therapy or bust.
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: Okay, well yeah, before you go, Amanda, I always wanted
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: to know from Sarah when a couple separates, what is
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: the percentage that the separation works and they miss each other, Like,
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: is time away and apart from each other. Is that
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: ever a solution to make them both like see, oh
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: this sucks without you.
• 17:54
  Speaker 5: Yes, absolutely, I don't think that's a problem.
• 17:57
  Speaker 6: I've encouraged that before with couples, just to take a
• 18:00
  Speaker 6: little bit of time of part to get some perspective
• 18:03
  Speaker 6: and some clarity. So I think I mean, I think
• 18:05
  Speaker 6: that's a great idea and a really important question that you.
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: Just asked, because if you don't want to come home
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: because he's there and then he's jabbing you, like, why
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: not take, define it and take I don't know enough
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: time to miss each other, if you're going to miss
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: each other, and not too short like a vacation, like
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: like a month or.
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: Something, and it might. That's really good because I feel
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: like I can hear it in her voice. I think
• 18:28
  Speaker 4: that it's not too far gone yet.
• 18:31
  Speaker 6: No, it's not if it was too I mean she's
• 18:33
  Speaker 6: calling us, tells me it's not too far.
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: Gone, right, good? Yeah, that was good. That's good.
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: And maybe a trial separation.
• 18:41
  Speaker 6: Yeah, that's it's not a bad idea at all.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: Oh oh no, do you think what is the percentage sare?
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: What do you think?
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: I guess that I yeah, I know. I mean we've
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: never done that. We have never We've known each other
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: for many, many many years, married a long time. It's
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: never come to that. It's never even crossed our minds.
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: But I guess this is why I need to come
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: to you and a therapist to tell me the hard
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: things I.
• 19:10
  Speaker 5: Need to hear talk to a therapist.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know.
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: My mom and dad they loved each other for a
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: very long time. They were high school sweethearts, sixty three
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: years together. And she would say to me if there
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: was ever like an argument of that, she goes, don't worry, kids,
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: I want to die with your father. Wow, Like you
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: know what I mean, if there's ever an argument at
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: home or whatever, And there weren't very many at all,
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: and we were six kids in this crazy household, and
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: she would say that. It always made me feel like,
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: oh yeah, of.
• 19:48
  Speaker 5: Course it wasn't an option. It's not an option for them,
• 19:52
  Speaker 5: and I think that's beautiful.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: So maybe you know, if it's not an option for you, aman,
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: and maybe you start from that hard look and is
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: not an option.
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: No, right, Okay?
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: Oh boy, Well, thank you for the advice and support,
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: and I hope that we can work through this. I
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: really do.
• 20:18
  Speaker 5: Good luck, Amanda, thank you.
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: Following I'm glad I was able to talk to you
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: all today.
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: Thanks for coming on therapy Thursday. We hope it helps.
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: Thank you. I appreciate it.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: I wonder how he does with like.
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: You know, like needing help, you know what I mean,
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: Like like just in general things like, what do you
• 20:40
  Speaker 4: ever call air tasker to fix like a gutter?
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: You know what I mean?
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: If he's that masculine and a masculine and then he's
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: got like a wand in his backyard, you know what I.
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: Like, I mean, that would be like pretty awesome. That
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: that's a really good test. We should have said it
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: to like would he would he ever ask for help?
• 21:00
  Speaker 5: It's a good it's a good question.
• 21:01
  Speaker 6: My sense is that he's somebody who probably does struggle
• 21:04
  Speaker 6: to ask for help.
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but he hasn't used their task because anything else.
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: It's a life change. Okay, let's be serious. Once you guys,
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: once you get over yourself in that way. And I
• 21:15
  Speaker 4: think men, obviously men struggle with this thing more than women, Yes,
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: a lot.
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: Because we have this pride, we have this macho bullshit.
• 21:23
  Speaker 9: We are raised to think your value is basically based
• 21:26
  Speaker 9: on what we can or cannot do exactly, and so
• 21:29
  Speaker 9: when you need help, it is not always second nature
• 21:32
  Speaker 9: for a person.
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: And I'm I'm obviously you know that goes for emotional
• 21:37
  Speaker 4: things like this, and it goes for physical things in
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: daily life, like I can't I can't fix the gutter.
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: That sucks to say, right.
• 21:46
  Speaker 6: I think it takes a lot of guests to say
• 21:48
  Speaker 6: that you can't do something. I mean, that's the that's
• 21:50
  Speaker 6: the misinterpretation about asking for help. That's actually a strength.
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: If I'm dating a guy and we get a flat
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: tire and he can't change it, I'm like I'm judging.
• 22:00
  Speaker 5: And calling air tasker.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: I am judging. Yeah, and then I'm you know, it's
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: kind of like, wait, you didn't I didn't you know
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: how to Ryan? You told me you know how to
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: change oil. I'm very impressed by that.
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: Thank you. I taught myself on YouTube. Uh huh.
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: And I only did it again. It's like you do
• 22:18
  Speaker 4: you you figure things as men. This is how we work, ladies.
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: I only did it because I was pissed that I
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: had to have someone else do it.
• 22:27
  Speaker 5: Oh.
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: It wasn't like I was like, you know what, I
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: can't wait to learn.
• 22:31
  Speaker 5: So this was a practical decision.
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, okay, because then there's something that I can
• 22:36
  Speaker 4: always say, I know how to change oil. I know
• 22:38
  Speaker 4: where the plug goes, I know where the pan is,
• 22:39
  Speaker 4: I know where to put the the you know the jacks,
• 22:41
  Speaker 4: I know the jack points. You know, you just once
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: you learn it, you know it.
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: It's very empowering.
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because then I didn't want to take it to
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: some guy and be like, oh, I'm depending on this guy.
• 22:49
  Speaker 6: No, what if a woman shows up to do that?
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: Oh forget it.
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: So I had this girlfriend who was in marriage and
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: she was an importer and she had a client and
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: she'd never been to Bali before. So she decided I'm
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: going to go to the client. I found out while
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: she was there that she met another guy and they
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: were staying in Bali for three days together. Okay, And
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: I mean I know her whole family and her husband
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: and her kids. And then she told me, Hey, I
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: met this guy and he's here with me.
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: Holy c.
• 23:33
  Speaker 5: So she met him there or they went together.
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: She met him there, he flew to her, but she
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: knew him like prior.
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, got it.
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: And then she so she tells me about this, and
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: I was I was mortified. I'm just like, I was
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: just like our color, Michelle. I didn't want to know. Yeah,
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: and then she told me, and I was like, why
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: did you have to tell me that. I don't want
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: to know.
• 24:00
  Speaker 5: I mean, that's a big secret to hold, it's a
• 24:02
  Speaker 5: big ask.
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: It's a huge ask.
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: So why would Michelle's friend have told her.
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: Sometime friends tell us we don't want or.
• 24:13
  Speaker 6: Because we they are hoping that we'll say, you know what,
• 24:17
  Speaker 6: I understand why you did this.
• 24:19
  Speaker 5: This could happen to anybody. I did something, so they
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: want Yeah, that's what people are hoping to hear.
• 24:24
  Speaker 6: I truly believe that they are not looking for somebody
• 24:27
  Speaker 6: to say, this is completely.
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: That shit crazy, this is fucked up exactly. I mean,
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: And she came home business as usual. Yeah, and then
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: I'm left at the injured one.
• 24:42
  Speaker 4: That's it, because she's gone on. She's pretending she's living
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: a lie at home. This other poor effort at home
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: has no clue. Right, you're just the one, You're you
• 24:50
  Speaker 4: have got all.
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: Of it now, right.
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: It's almost like she transferred the guilt onto you.
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, very much. And then I'm obviously still carrying it.
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: I'm angry.
• 24:58
  Speaker 5: No, no, And people do in close relationships.
• 25:01
  Speaker 6: We download our you know, issues onto our partners, onto
• 25:05
  Speaker 6: our friends.
• 25:06
  Speaker 5: And it's something to be aware of. If you find
• 25:08
  Speaker 5: yourself doing that repeatedly, realize what's going on.
• 25:12
  Speaker 4: Maybe look, going back to Amanda's original you know situation,
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: maybe maybe it's just best to just stay single.
• 25:22
  Speaker 6: Well, it's best to stay single if you're not with
• 25:24
  Speaker 6: the right person.
• 25:25
  Speaker 4: And I don't think that either this Florida lady who's
• 25:28
  Speaker 4: banging her her accent a motel and then Amanda who's
• 25:33
  Speaker 4: about to cheat with this guy at work because her
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: husband can't help.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: Well, I mean, do you really think she's about to cheat?
• 25:39
  Speaker 4: What did you call it at the very beginning? Transfer anxiety?
• 25:43
  Speaker 4: What was the very first term you used today, Sarah?
• 25:45
  Speaker 4: Something transference? You're transferring? Remember, Okay, Well, it's that she's
• 25:50
  Speaker 4: that she's getting butterflies. Oh oh, her anticipation anticipation transference.
• 25:57
  Speaker 6: When you asked her about whether she would consider divorce
• 26:02
  Speaker 6: and she's like, it's not on the table.
• 26:03
  Speaker 5: I wonder how her husband would answer that question.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, me too.
• 26:06
  Speaker 5: Yeah, because of her not an option. I wonder if
• 26:08
  Speaker 5: it is for him.
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: I mean it's important to not Yeah, we need to
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: do another podcast, like Flipping This upside Down.
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, oh my god.
• 26:15
  Speaker 4: Imagine guys, if we could somehow find the two people
• 26:19
  Speaker 4: that we haven't talked to in this get him to
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: talk to us.
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: Uh. Oh, what a day.
• 26:27
  Speaker 5: Fascinating