Latest / We Are More: Sisters Talk Faith & Feminism / Ep. 41: The Priscilla Perspective

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Ep. 41: The Priscilla Perspective · We Are More: Sisters Talk Faith & Feminism

• 0:14
  Speaker 1: My name is Alyssa. And my name is Bree.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: We're 2 sisters passionate about
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: all things faith and feminism. We believe that Jesus trusted, respected, and encouraged women to teach and preach his word. And apparently, that's controversial. Get comfy.
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Hello. It's me. Just gonna start off by singing
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: a song. Is that a song? I'm sure you
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: didn't sing it. I know that it is a song, but I didn't sing it.
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: But you were going to. Hello?
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: It's me. You're looking for me.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: I was. I was looking for you, in fact. Mhmm. They were all also listening, or nope. Looking for you.
• 0:56
  They were all looking for me, but
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: they couldn't find me because this is a podcast.
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: And they definitely don't know what you look like, because we never post our pictures on social media.
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: Not ever. Not once. Not one time. Nope. Those are all AI generated.
• 1:09
  Those are fake pictures of us. We said, AI,
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: we want you to create the most beautiful women in the world. And that's what it came up with. Yes. And it did a good job.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: A great job. Actually, the picture that I posted yesterday on Instagram, it's just like a picture of a stack of books that we used for research for this podcast. But I took the picture on my bed, so it's like, oh, there's a sheet in the background. Mhmm. And I used AI to generate a book shelf.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: It actually it looks really natural too. It looks really good. I've been using
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: AI to, like, just live my life lately.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: Like, any text response that I have to do, any thought in my head, I just put it into chat gpt. Any thought in your head?
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: Any thought. Wow. I had a lot of thoughts today.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: Were they positive thoughts? Not really. Oh, well I thought maybe I should pray for the country. Well, that's fair. Yeah.
• 2:07
  We we had a slight hiccup with our TikTok. Yeah. We're all surviving. Dang it. Yeah.
• 2:14
  I'm not gonna get into it. It's quite a political thing, and I'm just not in the mood.
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, you haven't been dealing with it all day.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: No. I have not. I've been home all day. If any of you are living in the Midwest, are you in the middle of a polar vortex? Oh my gosh.
• 2:27
  It's so cold.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: It's unreasonable. I stopped to get gas today because I was like, I'm at a half a tank. I don't know what cold does to cars, but I know you're supposed to have gas in your car. And I know that it's gonna be even colder the next 2 days, so I was like, I'll just get it now.
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: And I thought I was going to pass away. Mhmm.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: It was so cold.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: Well, we've had the nicest, fluffiest snow over the last couple of weeks. And so, you know, when when snow comes down fluffy, it tends to stay fluffy on the ground, but it is so cold that the snow itself has frozen. Mhmm. So it's not like it's melted and then refrozen and become ice. It's like the snow itself still looks like snow until you step on it and you realize it's ice, and then you slide and you die.
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: Oh, crap. Yeah.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: It's unfortunate. On the way
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: to work today, the snow you know how when, like, it's really windy and you have, like, little snow tornadoes all over the road and you see it? It was all the way to work. Yeah. And I thought, wow. There were quite a few This is The Day After Tomorrow.
• 3:32
  Remember that movie? Yes.
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: There were quite a few places on the freeway today that were having, like, white out snow.
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah. On the way back. I was like, woah. Only for, like, 2 minutes, maybe 3.
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: Mhmm.
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: But it it was blustery
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: blustery day. So on this freezing cold, horrible day, we're gonna talk about a woman who probably never experienced snow. Did you like that transition? Was that a good one? Yeah.
• 4:00
  I did. So this week, we're taking a little break from our devotional series, I guess, is what I'm gonna call it. A break? Are we I'm just done with that. Well Oh, yeah.
• 4:11
  Yeah.
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. No. Have to buy that
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: boys' book. Brief forgot that boys' book. So the last couple weeks, we did episodes on Let's Talk by Danae Dobson. Mhmm. We had many a thought.
• 4:25
  Yeah. They weren't great thoughts. I had 1 or 2 thoughts. 1 or 2 thoughts. But this week, we're taking a quick pause for our own mental health.
• 4:35
  So we're gonna talk this week about a woman of the Bible, a woman of the
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: Bible, who
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: was really impressive and encouraging, mostly because, frankly, I need some encouragement in my life, and so that's where we are.
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: Huzzah and hallelu.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: So we're gonna be talking about Prisca or Priscilla depending on I I think from what I read, the formality of her name, I am not a 100% clear, but it sounded like the more formal form of her name was Prisca. And so that's what Paul often called her. Okay. Yeah. So it kinda depends on your translation.
• 5:13
  It kinda depends on what you're looking at, but she is one and the same. If you hear about Prisca, it is also Priscilla of the Bible. So she is mentioned four times throughout the Bible. Indeed, she is. And all times by Paul.
• 5:30
  So it is a couple of times in Acts. Hold on. Hold on, guys. I have my actual Bible out. Are you proud of it?
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: I think it's Acts 18.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: Yep. So Acts 18, she's mentioned 2 time 3 times throughout that chapter. She's also mentioned in Romans 16, and then she's also mentioned in 1st Corinthians 16. If you're not familiar with Priscilla, she is always mentioned in the bible alongside her husband. So her husband is Aquila.
• 6:02
  Aquila? Aquila? I don't know, guys.
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: I like to say Aquila. Aquila is fun. Priscilla and Aquila. Sounds good. Sounds like
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: you could have a rap about it. Mhmm.
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: Go on, Bri. Why don't you rap for us? Priscilla and Aquila. That was good. Thank you.
• 6:21
  That's all I had.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: I think that'll be on the radio soon.
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: Soon. Soon.
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: Any day now. So they are always mentioned together in the bible, which is really interesting, because you don't see that a lot, a couple absolutely always being mentioned together. Mhmm. In fact, a lot of the couples of the Bible, you really only ever hear about 1. Right.
• 6:44
  Like, we know Deborah, who's a judge. Big Deb. Big Deb. She is married, but we know we know nothing about her husband. Mm-mm.
• 6:54
  He is not mentioned one singular time. No. He's not important.
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: And we do hear about Jael. She's the stabber.
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. Stabber. Yes. She's the stabber.
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: We heard about her husband, but Jael's more important because she's a stabber.
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: He's also not mentioned alongside her, like No. Working with her. So Priscilla and Aquila are a Team. Yeah. They're a team.
• 7:19
  So they have they're tent makers. Mhmm. And they are tent makers together.
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: Do you think they made the tent bag that JL used?
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: I don't think so. Mostly because one was in the old testament, and one was in the new testament. Got you.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: That would be the difference.
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah. That's that's really the main difference there. Time travel was not invented just yet.
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: Like doctor who?
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah. They didn't have that yet. So they are tent makers. They're working alongside one another. They have a business together.
• 7:50
  Mhmm. Now one of the books I've got, guys, I've got alongside my Bible here 5 additional books that we're gonna be talking about today. Buckle up.
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: I wanted to post on the TikTok yesterday that it
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: wouldn't allow me to post.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: You know that quote, women who read are dangerous
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: Or something along those lines? And I was like, watch out.
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: We're literate. Now. So literate. I have literally a stack
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: of books that we're gonna go through.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: But one of them brings forth Priscilla and Aquila as the first egalitarian couple mentioned. Not not that they were the first ones ever, but, like, that they're kind of an example of what an egalitarian marriage looks like. And if you don't know what that term means, it means equality in, like, a Christian setting. So complementarians within the Christian world, and we've talked about this before, but complementarians believe that women are complementary to men. So, essentially, men are The wine and we're the cheese?
• 8:55
  Well, that gets confusing. That's confusing
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: because both are
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: good. No. But in that thought process, men are kind of, like, higher up in authority, and women compliment them. They help them out. They help them hit their goals and etcetera, etcetera.
• 9:11
  Whereas egalitarianism is kind of where the 2 people are equal. They're working together. They're living life with no one in authority over the other.
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: It's partnership. Exactly.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: A little tit for tat. Stop that. So the first time they're mentioned is right at the beginning of acts chapter 18, and I'm reading from the message today just because I find it very easy to understand. It's not technically a translation. It's like a interpretation.
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: There you go.
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: It's not exactly a translation, but I really like it as somewhere to start. So chapter 18 verse 1 says, after Athens, Paul went to Corinth. That is where he discovered Aquila, a Jew born in Pontus, and his wife, Priscilla. They had just arrived from Italy, and then it kind of goes on. And it says that they worked together at their common trade of tentmaking.
• 10:04
  Now something of note is that any time, other than right here where Paul is just saying, like, hey. Met these people. Mhmm. Priscilla is always mentioned first. Every other time they're talked about, it says Priscilla and Aquila, which might seem just kind of like, well, okay.
• 10:22
  It flows off the tongue better. Right. Who cares? But at this time, that would have been very significant Mhmm. To name the wife first.
• 10:31
  And frankly, at our time right now, it would be significant. Mhmm. Like, if we're talking about, I I think of how people refer to my husband and I as a couple. They would say Nathan and Alyssa. Mister and missus.
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. You have to really put in an effort to mention the female's name first.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. Even as feminist because it's so ingrained in you. Even think about it. He and she. Mhmm.
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: His and hers. All those little things. If you switch it, because I've done that before where I made a post on social media and I said, like, hers and his Mhmm. Or something like that. It feels weird.
• 11:07
  Mhmm. It feels like
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: it's not how we do things. Yeah.
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: But Paul
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: intentionally and you Paul does everything on purpose. Right? This is the Bible we're talking about. This isn't like, oh, well, accidentally, Paul just constantly named her first. No.
• 11:21
  Paul intentionally says Priscilla and Aquila over and over and over every time he talks about them. Now Priscilla and Aquila, like I said, they were tentmakers. That's not that thrilling. So was Paul.
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: That's why they got along.
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: That's true. Paul came and he worked with them for a while. He lived with them. Before he ditched them. Yeah.
• 11:41
  So, basically, Paul meets them in Corinth. They had just gotten there from Rome. And together, yeah, they all make tents. It's not a thrilling time to be alive. Okay?
• 11:52
  I
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: mean, they're the architects of their time. Right?
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: Did they have buildings? Yes. Yes. They did. I assumed
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: that everybody was in a tent. No.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: I'm sure some people were. Otherwise, there wouldn't be a tent making business. They weren't camping over here. Maybe they were a little bit.
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: Do you think they're they're making yurts?
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: Yes. I think they're making really elaborate yurts.
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: I really like a yurt.
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: You've never been in a yurt.
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: I like the idea of a yurt.
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: So anyway so they are in Corinth together for a while. Paul starts ministering. It says after Timothy and Silas show up, he kind of devotes his whole life to ministry. And you assume that alongside of him are Priscilla and Aquila, because Mhmm. He's living with them.
• 12:42
  They're his good buds.
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: BFFs forever. Exactly.
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: So, eventually, Paul stays in Corinth for a little while, and then he's like, alright. I gotta go somewhere else. Ministry is moving. I'm moving with it. Go make disciples, you know, all that stuff.
• 13:00
  And so Paul decides to go to Syria, and Priscilla and Aquila go with him. Now that's also significant. Mhmm. Because they picked up their whole lives. They picked up their tents.
• 13:10
  And they split
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: up their tents and said, see you. Bye. Yeah. Let's go make tents of men. What?
• 13:15
  Let's I'm gonna take that back.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: I was gonna do a playoff fishers and then Did it work? Nope.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: Okay. In fact, it made me uncomfortable.
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: So they all go to Syria together, and they it says before boarding the ship in the harbor town of Sincria, he had his head shaved. So Paul shaves his head. I don't understand that moment, but that is significant enough to go into the Bible. Hair has
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: a weird place in the Bible. I just feel like people Voltaire hair. I don't know what it means for Paul, but I imagine that he looks like M and M at this point.
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's unfortunate for him. Yeah. So anyway, they it says they landed in Ephesus where Priscilla and Aquila, again, Priscilla mentioned first, got off and stayed. Paul got off for a little while and said, alright. I'll hang out with you for a bit, get you settled, because he cares about them.
• 14:13
  Right? They're friends. He calls them coworkers. He knows that they are there for the same ministry that he is. Mhmm.
• 14:23
  And they beg him to stay, but he says, no. The the ministry keeps go it's going. Ministry of magic has been compromised, or whatever they say. And so Paul has other places that god wants him to go. Mhmm.
• 14:36
  But that doesn't mean that the people of Ephesus aren't important. They're really important. Later on, we see the book of Ephesians Mhmm. Written to the people of Ephesus. So because Paul can't be there himself because there's other places for him to go and spread god's word, who does he leave?
• 14:55
  To speak
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: to the people of Ephesus.
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. Oh, hey. His great coworkers, Priscilla and Aquila.
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: Which I didn't we say that the term coworker was very important back then?
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: Yes. So Paul called a lot of people his coworkers. Mhmm. He did not use the term pastor very often. He did not use the term elder very often.
• 15:19
  He did not use the term deacon very often. For the most part, he called people his coworkers.
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: Because, like, the, how do you say it, hierarchy. The hierarchical Hierarchical? Structure, I think, is not as important to him, because maybe everybody, you know, is spreading the news of god. Maybe everybody's kind of on the same level, whereas, like, we here in 2025 are very concerned with hierarchical girl.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: That would have been hierarchy. Hierarchy. You said 2025, and it threw me in a big giant way.
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: You looked at me, and I was like, what? You were right. But I was like, oh, no. No.
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: I just feel like we're always concerned with, like, who's at the top and who's on the bottom. Well, because for us today, who's at the top are the ones that get to make all the decisions. Mhmm. They're the ones that get to say women can or cannot preach. Women can or cannot be part of the conversation.
• 16:26
  Back then, that's clearly not the case.
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: No. Clearly not the case.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: These two people show up out of nowhere. Nobody knows them. They don't have any friends. They're rapping. I don't know.
• 16:40
  They're rapping. It's a rough time.
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: Priscilla and Aquila. Word.
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: They just said their names over and over and over. And they show up, and they make a church. Mhmm. They make the church of Ephesus. That's an important early church.
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: A first century church. A first century church. Very impactful. Yeah. Very demure.
• 17:07
  Very mindful.
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: I think we've moved past that in in history now. It's in the past.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: I'm blue and in the past, baby.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: Well, maybe we should. But it it basically says that that they were left there to start the ministry. Mhmm. That they were left there with the same responsibility that Paul was doing himself. Mhmm.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: It just shows how much trust that Paul had in his ability to teach and grow other leaders. Mhmm. Right? He was like, I'm gonna teach you everything that I know, and I know because we're coworkers, we're BFFs, that you're gonna do as good of a job as I would. Mhmm.
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: So I'm comfortable leaving and spreading news somewhere else, and you and these Ephesians
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: are gonna live it up and church it up.
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: And I wanna point out that I and I was thinking about this as I was reading through all of the research that we're gonna have to speed through
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: because there's 5 whole books.
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Speed. Speed. But I was thinking about the fact that, you know, Paul is the one that wrote a lot of the stuff that we find controversial for women. Right?
• 18:22
  A lot of women that are entering into this feminist Christian world Mhmm. Struggle with Paul Yeah. Because we blame Paul for all this crap.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: Would highly recommend reading The Making of Biblical Womanhood when she has a whole chapter of, like, maybe we've misunderstood Paul.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Actually, one of the I've got it sitting right here. Mhmm. We'll get into it. But let's say that now if you read this book, if you've listened to some of our other podcasts, Paul is very misinterpreted.
• 18:53
  Mhmm. We've really filtered Paul through a patriarchal viewpoint.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: It's because he shaved his head.
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah. That was it. But let's say let's assume for a minute that Paul did mean all of those things, that he did mean that women should be silent in church and be the only ones that were submissive to their husband instead of a mutual submission, etcetera, etcetera. Where does Priscilla fit in that? Right.
• 19:21
  Because he doesn't say, and I left Aquila to handle the church of Ephesus. And Priscilla could not because she is a woman. Right. It says he left Priscilla and Aquila.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: To start a church to be
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: pastors Right.
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: To teach and preach.
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: Both of them. I I think it's interesting because Paul hadn't written
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: a
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: lot of the the more controversial stuff yet. Mhmm. And so she wouldn't have had those expectations on her. At this point in history, there was no assumption that Jewish women couldn't lead a church. Mhmm.
• 20:00
  That Jewish women couldn't preach, that Jewish women couldn't spread the gospel, or that they should stay home and only be homemakers. Mhmm. None of that was put upon her because it wasn't written yet. Mhmm. So if Paul's the one that's gonna write this and he's getting revelations from god to say, like, this is how the church is supposed to be structured, why wouldn't he have told Priscilla?
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. His bestest best friend.
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: Wouldn't that be pretty cruel?
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: Mhmm.
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: He's leaving her in some massive sort of sin? Yeah. That doesn't sound like a best friend.
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: That doesn't sound like a very nice person. I mean, I like to leave you
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: to your own devices, but that's just because it's funny. Rude. I just think that Priscilla and we don't know a lot about her. That's what kind of is is a bummer.
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: That's the thing is she's only mentioned 4 times. Right. But the 4 times that she is
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: mentioned, it's very significant It's really significant.
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: In what being a biblical woman means.
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: We've said this about a lot of other biblical women, but because she works with Paul, that's really significant. Yeah. Because Paul, who wrote the other stuff, if we're interpreting it correctly, that he's really trying to relegate women to a secondary status, Paul did a really bad job with Priscilla. Right. He was actually really cruel to Priscilla in that viewpoint because he, in that viewpoint, would have left her in sin.
• 21:30
  Mhmm. So how do then how do we make that make sense with Paul? Mhmm. Now Paul is kind of a crappy person. That doesn't work either.
• 21:40
  So the next part of their story is also very interesting. So it's still in we're still in acts chapter 18, but we're down in the message kind of divides verses up funny. It gives them to you in chunks. Now we're actually in verses 24 through 26. Actually, 24 through the end of the chapter, really.
• 22:00
  So what happens is Priscilla and Aquila have started their church. They're ministering to Ephesus. They are the church leaders of this area. Now a man came named Apollos comes to Ephesus. It says he was a Jew.
• 22:15
  He was born in Alexandria, Egypt, and he was a great speaker. He was well known for being a religious speaker. So think like a televangelist. A Benny Hinn. Well, that's a mean comp comparison.
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: That was the first, like
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: That was the first one? First one. Not like Joel Osteen or something. Okay. Benny Hinn.
• 22:42
  Alright. Well, he's the Benny Hinn of his time. Moving on. And he shows up, and he's very smart. It says he's well educated.
• 22:50
  He's enthusiastic. They don't have a lot of entertainment right now in history. Maybe he is. Joel Osteen. Maybe he is.
• 22:58
  And so he shows up, and he starts preaching. Right? Mhmm. Now it doesn't say Priscilla and Aquila are offended by him or, like, they feel like he's usurping their territory.
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: Mhmm.
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: But they're listening to him, and, essentially, he was preaching all the way up my understanding is all the way up until Jesus was baptized. Mhmm. That's the story he was telling all the way up until that point, and then he just kinda, like, stops.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That, like, that's all he knew.
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: Right. Because that was all he had studied up until that point. So what happens is Priscilla and Aquila, it says they heard him, and they took him aside and told him the rest of the story.
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry. Back up for a second.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: It's just it cracks me up that he's like, I've only read up until this point, and now I'm gonna preach. I'm gonna preach to everybody I can find. Like
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: what the heck? I think it's because, like, for us, we have one Bible. You know? Like, it's one long book, and if you're gonna preach it, you should probably have, like, read it. Well But history was happening at this time.
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry. I'm gonna read the first, I
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: don't know, 2 Twilight novels, and then
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: and I don't know what happens with breaking dawn
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: or whatever they are. Eclipse. You're revealing too much about yourself here.
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: Okay. We can continue.
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: You could've said Harry Potter. There were so many options. You actually looked at your bookshelf where Harry Potter is featured heavily. I know. Bridgerton is also featured heavily.
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: I don't even know how to do it.
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: Is up there. I don't have the time. There's so many options. Robert Pattinson, Alyssa. I don't know what to do with Taylor Lautner.
• 24:44
  Which team are you on? I'm so frightened. I feel like I'm back in 2012. Well, yeah, because she said the word twilight. Anyway, so Apollos is preaching, but he's preaching with half the story.
• 24:59
  Mhmm. He has not read whatever the crap
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: the last twilight book is. Is it new moon?
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: I don't I don't know. Proudly, I sincerely don't know that information. And so Priscilla and Aquila, they hear him preach, and they're like, you know, he's doing a great job. And now this is me this is me saying this. But you assume they're like, he's doing a great job, but he doesn't have the whole story.
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: So we're gonna help him out and tell him the rest of the story. Kinda like how Paul helped them. Right. Exactly. Yes.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: Like, we're we're gonna grow another leader.
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. So they pull him aside, and my understanding is kind of that they pull him into their home, and the Jewish Yeah. That's kind of what the different versions have said. They bring him into their home. Right.
• 25:52
  And the Jewish home would've had, I think, like a my best comparison is if you had a really big entryway in your house, but it's got, like, seating and everything. So that's where their house church would've met also. So they would've brought him into this part of their home, which is where you would've entertained guests.
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: I'm picturing La Casita from
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. That's a great comparison. Yeah. So that's where people would have kind of gathered. Mhmm.
• 26:18
  That was intentionally the gathering space. So they brought him to this meeting space where their church would have normally met, and they probably pulled out all of their informational texts. Mhmm. You know, anything that Paul had left with them, maybe letters that he'd given them Mhmm. Whatever their copy of the Bible would have been at the time.
• 26:38
  I don't know what they would have had up till that point. Mhmm. But they pulled all this stuff out, and they're like, look. Here's the rest of the story. Let me teach it to you so that you can then go on the rest of your mission wherever wherever you're headed.
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: I'm holding in so many songs right now.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: You can sing one song. No. And so they taught him all of this, and I think it's actually a credit this is a side note, but a credit to Apollos that he was not offended. Yeah. He was open to that.
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: I feel like if you were
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: now here's an example. I was listening to a sermon on YouTube about Priscilla and Aquila,
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: and this pastor kinda went off on a tangent about how they pulled him gently aside. He kept harping on, like, gently aside, kinda not, like, correct him, but, like, you said, give him the rest of the story.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: And this pastor went off on, now I field all of our emails and yada yada yada. Everybody's complaining all the time, and my suggestion is to just, you know, not.
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: That's not what they're saying. I think there needs to be that open discussion, and, yeah, Apollo's is the the thing that you see here where it's like that speaks to his character Mhmm.
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: Is
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: that he was fully open to being taught new things. Yeah. So pastor out there that that spoke this sermon Right. I didn't listen to it, so
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: I don't know which pastor
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: it was. But you should be open to people knowing more than you do even if you're a well educated pastor. Mhmm. Even if you're the Benny Hinn of your time, You should be open to that.
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: We actually talk about that
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: a lot. So I'm in dentistry. I don't know if we ever said that. But we
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: talk about that, are you stuck in your ways, or do you have a growth mindset?
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: Mhmm.
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: A growth mindset means that you're open to learning new things and learning new ways of doing things that you might not have thought of before.
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: Right. The thing that's significant about that part of the story and there Priscilla's mentioned a couple more times, and I gave you the references already, but she's kind of just mentioned as, like, Paul saying, hey. Say hello to Priscilla and Aquila who have had a hand in helping me serve Jesus. And, oh, hey, Priscilla and Aquila. Say hello.
• 28:54
  Like, he's just kind of saying hi to them in other letters.
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: Mhmm.
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: So the most of their story is here in acts, and it's, again, it's short. But what's significant for Priscilla in particular about this section is that she is teaching and having authority over a man. Yeah, girl. And according to the complementarians and the KJ Veers, that's not a thing that the Bible permits. Right?
• 29:26
  So the Bible at one point now, again, we've talked about this, about why it means something differently than we've interpreted, but it does say, and I don't permit a woman to have authority over a man. Mhmm. Women should be silent in church, etcetera, etcetera. But if those things were just surface level, if they meant exactly what they said word for word, where does she fit in?
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: I don't think they would've mentioned her in the bible Mhmm. To be documented all throughout history if her life was not something that we should have followed. Right. It would have said, and here's an example of what not to do. Right.
• 30:06
  Don't be like Priscilla. You should not teach and preach. Here's why.
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. But
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: instead, it is used as an example. Mhmm. She is important enough to be written down in the book of life four times for all of us to read forever.
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: Right. And for Paul to consistently say, even after this instance, to consistently say Mhmm. I love these people. Yeah. They're doing amazing work.
• 30:30
  Mhmm. Look at them. Be like them. Be like them. Now the arguments that I've read from complementarians, and you'll see this in some of the research in just a second, but the arguments that I've read, which are just sad they're just they're sad and pathetic, frankly.
• 30:49
  So they try they try to explain Priscilla away
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: Oh. Because she doesn't fit.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. So you have to explain her away. So the first explanation that I've heard is, well, she taught him in private.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: Oh, come on.
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: I'm not even kidding. She didn't teach him in public in her church, she taught him in private. Now, first of all, it does not say that. It says they took him aside and told him the rest of the story. Did they take him aside privately, or did they take him aside during their own church?
• 31:19
  Right. No way to know. The Bible doesn't say. But, also, the Bible does not say, and I permit women to have authority over men only in private. Only in a closet.
• 31:31
  Like, that's not in there. So if you're gonna take it at face value of women can't have authority over men, they also can't have it in private. Mhmm. Exactly. And if they can have it in private, then what does that say about marriages where you want men to have authority?
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: What is private and what is public? Great. Right? How many people have to be around for you to say, okay, this is a more intimate setting. Right?
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: This is okay. Right. But I think it also says that if you believe that, if it's fine in private, then husbands really have no authority over their wives in their homes. Right?
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: Because their marriage isn't public all the time.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: It's private. Right. So women could certainly have authority then. So we've destroyed your argument. There you go.
• 32:17
  And then I've also heard it was okay for her to teach him because her husband was present. What?
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: What?
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: If you ever wanna use the phrase grasping at straws,
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: show me a verse.
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: I know. Show me a verse. The Bible does not say a woman can have authority over a man Mhmm. If her husband is present. It doesn't say that.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: And we've said this a 1000000 times before, but how desperate do you have
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: to be and how insecure do you have
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: to be to make these kind of arguments to keep your authority?
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: Right. Desperate. It just really when you look at when you really dive into the women of the bible and you see how strong they were, you see how much authority god gave them, Jesus gave them, Paul gave them, all the men of the Bible that were like, yeah, they're doing great stuff. Let them do it. Yeah.
• 33:15
  God gave them the abilities to do these things. It flies in the face of all of the patriarchal structure Mhmm. That the KJ viewers are holding on to so tight. It just rips it apart. Right.
• 33:29
  Priscilla, in being who she was, stands in the face of all
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: of it, which is why you're not really gonna hear too much about them in those conservative fundamental churches. Like, I never heard about Priscilla Mhmm. Growing up.
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: Not until we started studying this stuff.
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: Very recently. And I was like, there's a woman named
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: Priscilla in
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: the bible? That sounds too modern.
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah. They'll forget she exists. Yeah. Because it's too hard it really is too hard to explain her away.
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: She's only mentioned 4 times. Like, it's just a little bit. Mhmm.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: But it's very significant. And even if you didn't hear a whole sermon on her, have you ever heard her mentioned in church? No. And maybe some of you have, but I certainly haven't to this day even. When I go to churches that I try to find that are not as conservative Mhmm.
• 34:22
  I still am not hearing her name because she doesn't fit the narrative. It's rare to hear
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: a her. Mhmm.
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: Period. Right. Right. Exactly. So now I'm gonna go into like I said, I've already given you a couple more of the verses that she's in, but because I only have 20 ish minutes left, and I don't want this to be a 4 hour podcast,
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: I think that would be good.
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: Let's make it as long as that Pride and Prejudice. No. So I'm gonna go into some of my research, and I have 5 books here. Well, I have 4 books in front of me and one that I've taken pictures
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: of. You can't do that.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: Well, too bad I didn't. So the 4 books that we're gonna talk about are Half the Church by Carolyn Custis James.
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: Custis?
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah. What the The Making of Biblical Womanhood by Beth Alison Barr. Our bestie. Our bestie. Jesus Feminists by Sarah Bessey.
• 35:16
  And All We're Meant to Be by Aletha Scanzoni and Nancy Hardesty. And then there's another book, the only one written by a man, interestingly. Amun. And that's The Bible versus Biblical Womanhood by Philip Paine. What a pain, Philip.
• 35:36
  So some of these had appendices, and that helped me to find where they talked about Priscilla. So if in here, they do talk about her more than I found, please let us know on our socials. I would love to look it up.
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: If we still have a TikTok, who's to say?
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: Well, currently, we do. So there were a couple of sections. I actually in half the church so that's the one I'm gonna start with. It's called half the church, a recapturing God's global vision for women. Now this book is not the highest on my list of, like Would recommend.
• 36:11
  Yeah. Mhmm. It's good. It's interesting, but I don't think she takes quite enough of a stand. She does say, I'm not gonna say whether I believe women should preach or not.
• 36:21
  I'm not gonna say whether I'm an egalitarian or a complementarian. Mhmm. She kinda wants to hit that middle ground. Yeah. Which to me doesn't go far enough.
• 36:29
  I think women need us to say Take a stand. Yeah.
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: But I think it's interesting if you're on the fence. Right. You know, there's a place for it.
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: If you're dipping your toe into the water
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: of egalitarianism or Jesus' feminism, and it's late. I'm tired.
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I think if you if you're coming from a very conservative background, this would be a really great starting point. I know a lot of people, their first book is Jesus Feminist. Mhmm.
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: We're just so far down the path now that this seems not far enough. Yeah. For us.
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: But if you if this is, like, a starting moment for you, this would be a great one. Mhmm. But she doesn't and I couldn't find where she specifically talks about Priscilla in this book. But I thought it was really interesting because she's talking about so it's a section called the debate zone Oh. Between complementarians and egalitarians.
• 37:28
  And so she's talking about, you know, what are you supposed to be? Are you supposed to be an egalitarian? Are you supposed to be a complementarian? And and I don't know what to do. So this section and I thought it was interesting because, again, Priscilla wouldn't have had this problem.
• 37:44
  Mhmm. So what she says, and I'll just read it. It says, for many women, it creates a butt a boatload not a buttload. I'm just saying a buttload. We should edit her.
• 37:57
  A buttload of uncertainty and anxiety. Are we overusing or underusing our gifts? Are we too independent, too competent, too strong, or are we too weak, too hesitant, too deferential? Friends I love and scholars I respect are on opposite sides, wrestling with the biblical text and earnestly seeking to figure out what women can or cannot do vis a vis men. I've read the scholars on both sides and studied the text, and I even suspect Solomon, with all his wisdom, would have a hard time settling this one.
• 38:26
  Now I disagree with her on that bit. But it's interesting because she's right. Women are stuck in the middle. What I find so interesting is women can. Women can.
• 38:38
  Mhmm. Women can do anything that men can do other than pee standing up. We could if we tried. If we really tried.
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: But they're wondering if, like, should you stifle yourself? When we would never ever say, yes, a man is fully capable of peeing standing up, but should he?
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: Frankly, they make a mess. I really wish they wouldn't. I think all men should sit down.
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: It's a different argument.
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: It's a different topic for a different day. But I just think it's really interesting because we, here in 2025, and I think this book was published in, like, the 20 tens, we have that that, like, what do we do? Are we too strong? Are we too weak? Are we too much?
• 39:25
  Are we too little? Mhmm. Where do we stand? What should we do? And I don't know about you, but, like, as a woman who's been in the church, I have felt that every time I've walked through the door of a church.
• 39:35
  Yeah. Because even if you don't believe that you should stifle yourself, you're told it so much. Yeah. Or through subliminal messaging. Right.
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: Like, never hearing about women in church or hearing a man's name before a woman all the time. But Priscilla wouldn't have had that problem. Mhmm. She'd be like, I'm a boss b. I am a tent maker.
• 39:57
  Heck yeah. But also, that's not just who I am. Let me tell you.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: I could start rapping now. Oh, good. We've really come a long way. Full circle.
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: Full circle. Like a yurt.
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: But she says so Carolyn here, she she goes on to talk about, like, how it's very confusing. But she says women are living in a debate zone. Mhmm. Mhmm.
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: And I
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: just think that's really significant. We are. We're living in this middle ground, and we're expected to just follow whoever's in charge that day. Yeah. And that'll change.
• 40:32
  And she talks about that. You know, when a new pastor takes over, all of a sudden, at at the church that we used to be at, it was primarily a complementarian church. And then I remember seeing an email where we got a new lead pastor, and they were like, what do we do about this particular situation? He was like, well, I'm an egalitarian, and they're like, we are now too. Yeah.
• 40:52
  So where it depends on where you land that day.
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And women are just supposed to live in this flux. Am I allowed to do this today?
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: Right. We'll see. Imagine what women can do without that, and look at Priscilla for an example
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: of
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: what women can do without having to live not knowing what to do Mhmm. In this fear that god is gonna lightning bolt them Yeah. If they go too far one way or the other.
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: That's the hard thing is when you put god into the equation. You could be sinning against god just by teaching his word. Mhmm. Preaching his word. I don't think
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: that he would punish you for that. I mean, it doesn't sound like loving god to me to give women all of these gifts, these abilities, these strengths, and then say, but I don't want you to use them, though,
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: which is why I wear low cut tops. God gave me these.
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: You can cut that out. No. I'm gonna cut that. Stand it. And everyone gets to hear, and all God's people said amen.
• 42:01
  Amen. So then next, I'm gonna go into the making of biblical womanhood, And, again, there's no appendix. So she may have mentioned, she's got notes in the back. She may mention Priscilla more times. I did find her on page 64.
• 42:19
  She's mentioned, and it says, Priscilla or Prisca, whose name is mentioned before her husband's name, something rather notable in the Roman world, as a coworker with Paul. So she's sort of named in that list of amazing biblical women. Mhmm. And then she talks about, so this is Beth Allison Barr, our best friend.
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: Our best friend.
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: She's a professor, and she talks to her students, and she says, did you know I asked my students that more women than men are identified by their ministry in Romans 16? This book is full of so much so much intelligent knowledge. You
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: could read it a 1000000 times over and still find
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. Good things. Yeah. So then, on the next page, she says, as Romans 16 makes clear, the reality is that biblical women contradict modern ideas of biblical womanhood. That was so impactful as I read it.
• 43:15
  And I've I've read this book multiple times, but different things hit you, you know, in different ways. And prior to that so I'm gonna read this whole little section. She says, as a historian, I knew why the women in Paul's letters did not match the so called limitations that contemporary church leaders place on women. I knew it was because we have read Paul wrong. Paul isn't inconsistent in his approach to women.
• 43:36
  We have made him inconsistent through how we have interpreted him. And then she says, as Romans 16 makes clear, the reality is that biblical women contradict modern ideas of biblical womanhood. And you have to ask this question of if absolutely every biblical woman is not what we think a biblical woman should be, is not what we think a modern Christian woman should be, we've done something wrong. We've interpreted something wrong. Yeah.
• 44:01
  Because the women in the bible,
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: those are the women that we should be looking to, for example, how how we should conduct ourselves. And they are words that I can't say. They're type of pegging some people. They're hardcore. They are teaching.
• 44:20
  They're preaching. They're on fire for the Lord. But we're telling women in the church to be quiet, to be demure, to be mindful, grow your hair out long, wear a skirt, don't go to the movies, think about what everybody thinks about you.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: Well, think of the titles of the women in the bible. Judge, prophet Murderer. Murderer, preacher Mhmm. Apostle, coworker. Do you hear these words used for women today in the church?
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: No. And if you do hear of a female pastor, not only is it an anomaly, but it's also like, oh, are we okay with that? Yeah. Are we okay with that?
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: They say that even one of these books cites a source that says that even denominations that allow female pastors Mhmm. Are still very predominantly run by men. Mhmm. Because even though in theory, they say we're okay with it, practically, a lot of congregations are saying no. Mhmm.
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: And, also, women are so conditioned to not accept that authority. Like, there's a podcast that I was listening to, and this woman came from Africa. Her mother and father started a church back in Africa. Her dad died. So then her mom kinda took it over because they started it together.
• 45:43
  Mhmm. But even still, the mom didn't feel like she should have.
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: She's like, oh, no. No. No. No.
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: I'm not a I'm not a pastor. No. No. No.
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: No. Even though she is leading these people. Well, I think we love semantics, and and that's why you see in Priscilla's story, it's like, well, she was she wasn't preaching. She was just she was just helping. She wasn't teaching.
• 46:05
  She was just informing. Like, you know, it's this stupid little semantic thing, and it's like, if any other person if a man was in that situation, we would have said he was teaching. But because it's a woman, we've decided to use a different word for it. Mhmm. And just because it's a house church, they're like, oh, no.
• 46:22
  That's more private than Joel Osteen's church Right. Where it's broadcast. But it would have been as public as there could have been at the time. And I've also heard, you know, people that don't believe women should preach, but they're fine with women getting up on stage and sharing their stories. Right.
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: Tell me the difference.
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah. A male pastor is getting up there every week and sharing part of his story and then sharing how it integrates with the Bible. And some of them are incredibly stupid. Have you seen that TikTok trend? Mm-mm.
• 46:53
  Where they're like, a crazy story, like, I went to Subway, and they gave me a footlong sandwich, and let me tell you how that relates to the Bible. Yeah. I don't know what to do with that. Man, I know. They can relate anything
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: back to that.
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: It's like book comedians. The they'll be like, this happened to me the other day, and you're like, no. It didn't. I know. Did not happen to me.
• 47:13
  Yeah. But either way, a pastor that shares nothing about himself is a pretty bad pastor. Yeah. But a woman gets up there and shares something about herself and then talks about the bible, and she's not a pastor. She's sharing her story.
• 47:27
  She's not preaching. She's sharing her story. It's it's silly. It's silly. We've made up categories.
• 47:36
  So then let's see. In Jesus feminist, because I've got, like, 6 minutes to go, guys, on page pages 92 and 93 of Jesus feminist, which is also a great one. We don't talk about this one quite as much, mostly because I think I read it a while ago, and I kinda need to jump back into it. But it was my first introduction to this world of, oh, hey. I don't have to just be a submissive wife forever.
• 48:01
  Yeah. So she says, in the 1st century Christian church, Priscilla was one part of a powerhouse couple beside her husband, Aquila. The apostle Paul partnered with them as tentmakers by trade, and he had full confidence in them. They risked their necks on his behalf once, and he was always grateful. When they heard the eloquent evangelist, Apollos teaching in the synagogue of Ephesus, they brought him home to correct some of his teachings and then sent him back out again.
• 48:27
  Priscilla and Aquila are always mentioned as a pair, oftentimes with Priscilla's name first, indicating their mutuality in the relationship and leadership leadership. And then it says so this is interesting also. In fact, Priscilla may have been the author of the book of Hebrews according to some scholars. So that's, that's a total side note, and it's no one knows who wrote the book of Hebrews. It's just a guess.
• 48:51
  Priscilla would have been one of the suspects, I guess. You know, there's several Apollos is also one of the people that whose name is thrown around. Right. Paul is another person.
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: I feel like if it was either of
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: them, it would have been noted Mhmm.
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: That they wrote that. I when I googled who wrote the book of Hebrews, it said that she was a possibility because the author was kept anonymous because they didn't think that a woman writing it would've
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: it would've had as much authority Mhmm.
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: As it does.
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: Right. And I also read that it has more gender neutral pronouns in the original texts. Mhmm. And so that would have also been part of why.
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: And it's just it's just a guess. Yeah.
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: But it's a really interesting thought. Like, what if the book of Hebrews, which is one of the most quoted books of the Bible,
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: was written by a woman. Yeah. Would all the pastors like it as much?
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: What would that say about women? Mhmm. Because that book is teaching and preaching. Right. So if that's true, and total guess, assumption, whatever, but if that's true, what does that do to the face of Christianity?
• 50:00
  What has to change, or how do we excuse it? Yeah. You know? How are we gonna jump through a hoop this time?
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: Right. Well, it's okay if she wrote it, but she wrote it next to her husband, so it
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: was okay. He was in the room, so it's fine. God was talking to her, but he was he was around, so it was probably okay.
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: He was probably talking to Aquila, but Aquila whispered it in Priscilla's ear.
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: So she could be his secretary. Yes. Yeah. Take a letter. So then I think probably this is the last one I'm gonna go into because I'm running out of time.
• 50:36
  So the next book is All Were Meant to Be, a biblical approach to women's liberation. Oh. And this was written in the 19 seventies.
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: A good year. Actually, we were burning our brows at that time.
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: We weren't doing anything. We were born in the 19 nineties.
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: I meant we as in the royal we.
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: We as all of women. We as all of women. So this book, it's a little bit it's amazing to me to see how long this argument's been going on, because it seems like this is new. Right? Nah.
• 51:11
  But it's not. Nah. I think we wanna say it's modern, because if it's modern, then we can say, well, we should be in society, but not of society or whatever. But the reality is this has been going on for Mhmm. For a long time, clearly since the Bible.
• 51:26
  Mhmm. So The Bible. So I'm gonna read from there's there's actually quite a bit in this book about her and about this topic, but this section is called your daughters shall prophesy. And I just love that. Isn't that like cool?
• 51:44
  Just gives it, like, you also like the word, prophecy. So it's a first she says, in Romans 16, among the 29 people greeted by Paul, 10 are women. So for all of you out there that are thinking Paul does not respect women, Paul didn't want women as part of his ministry, Paul didn't allow women to teach and preach, 10 of these people. A huge percentage for the time.
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: Or women.
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: As some people say, huge. Some people say. It says, according to Acts 1 14, women were present in the upper room, so with Jesus, and received the filling of the Holy Spirit, which signaled the founding of the church. Women were right there. They were alongside the male apostles, who, yes, were the ones that were named, but that was because of the time period.
• 52:34
  Right. And among these women that Paul mentioned is Priscilla. Priscilla is named in this book alongside John Mark's mother from acts 12 and Nympha from Colossians 4 15, who both started home churches. Mhmm. And we've heard of other women as well that started home churches.
• 52:54
  And there's there's a decent amount in this book about her, but that's what I'm gonna say about it. It's a really interesting book. I got it off of Thriftbooks because it's old, and I'm not even sure it's technically in print anymore.
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: I should read that book.
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: But it's very good. It only cost 4.95 back
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: in the day. It's practically free.
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: I paid more for it. But Bree wanted to talk a little bit about the end of Priscilla's life as well.
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: Oh, there's a rumor that, well, she's known as, like, what, a saint?
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: I believe so. Yes. And is that In the Catholic
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: tradition. Yeah. So if you Google it, she was martyred. She was put in what they call an amphitheater, so think, like, the gladiators Mhmm. So that a lion would attack her because of her faith.
• 53:38
  And the the legend goes that the lion laid down on her feet, and then they didn't like that, so they killed her anyways.
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: Mhmm.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: But, well, Alyssa and I were talking about this yesterday. We believe that Daniel was saved by the lions from the lions with the lions. He was best friends with the lions. But if we were to hear this story about Priscilla, we would question it. Mhmm.
• 54:07
  Right from the jump, we'd be like, well, I don't know about that.
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: Mhmm. Now it's not, like, canonically biblical.
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: No.
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: You don't see the end of her story in the bible. But remember that, like, this was a historical time. There are historical records of these things. Mhmm. So this doesn't come out of nowhere.
• 54:24
  No. There are reasons for now I don't know where exactly the historical context is for it, but this is what's traditionally believed about her.
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: Right. That's why she's a saint.
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: Right. She was She's a saint. She was martyred at the end of her life. Mhmm. So that, again, puts her alongside the apostles Right.
• 54:44
  Who died for their faith. She did all of the things that her male counterparts were doing,
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: things that we don't believe that women are capable of doing today.
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: Right. And we'll make weird excuses about it. It's like, well, women aren't emotionally capable of handling ministry. Okay?
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: What do you mean? Or we've heard the argument where women would just take over.
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: Yes. So men, they need that. They don't they they would just lay down and let the women take over They would no. I think at the end of the day, if we value everyone equally, no one feels the need to take over. Mhmm.
• 55:28
  And if you feel called to ministry, Jesus is asking you to do something.
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: Speak, teach, preach, whether you're you're a woman or a man. Right.
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: And I think the argument I and that argument was made directly to me that, like, women will just take over. If we if we give them an inch, they'll take a mile. How dare they? And it's like, that to me speaks to where your priorities lie in ministry. Mhmm.
• 55:53
  Your priority isn't, I want to lift everyone up to where Jesus wants them to be. It's, I wanna stay in charge. Yes. I want to have power in this space.
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: And why are you afraid of women just taking charge?
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: It's because women get things done. Mhmm.
• 56:15
  Speaker 2: I
• 56:15
  Speaker 1: think we should hold men up to the same standards. Men, be better. Mhmm. Get things done. Mhmm.
• 56:21
  And get them done properly, for heaven's sake.
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: Come on. I don't wanna come behind you and have to wipe your butt.
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: No one wants that. No one wants that. Wipe your butt properly so
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: your underwear stay mater moderately clean.
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: That would be a positive. I don't even have a husband. I don't know.
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: I just complain.
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: Alright. So next week, we are gonna be talking about a devotional geared towards
• 56:47
  Speaker 2: Young boys.
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: Young boys, which is sound actually sounds really creepy now that I say it like that. I mean,
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: is it also creepy when we say a devotional geared towards young girls?
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah. But we've been young girls, so it feels less creepy somehow. I could be a young boy. My name is Brian. We'll be going over one year devotions for boys.
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: Volume 2. I don't know about volume 1.
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: Well, we're going with volume 2.
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: For boys.
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: So we're gonna talk through that and kind of compare and contrast it to Let's Talk by Danai Dobson, but then also what we have learned from girls' devotionals or devotionals geared toward girls.
• 57:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: I always find it a little silly when you have biblical things that are geared towards one gender or the other.
• 57:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: But we're going there.
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: We're going there. I mean, to me, I feel like God's word is pretty consistent, and I feel like it can apply to girls and boys, but we like to separate people. Yeah.
• 57:48
  Speaker 1: It's like a men's study Bible versus a women's study Bible. And the women's study Bible, all the examples are like, and when you bake cookies for your family Yes. Imagine it like that. Quite right. And then they, like, black out the verses about Priscilla.
• 58:01
  Yeah. She's just redact it. Redact it.
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: Or just like, we're going
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: to have a ladies' tea. Not that I have anything against tea. We do have tea. All of the tea.
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: But Do you think they're doing embroidery? Yes. They sit around, they do embroidery, and they drink tea, and they talk about submission.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: And then for the men, they do taxidermy, and they talk about testosterone, and they are they they go. We've never been to a women's or men's conference. No. I don't know if that was clear. I assume that I'm completely correct.
• 58:35
  I think you are probably a 100% correct. They grunt and they scratch themselves. To be fair, there was a recent men's conference with a male stripper. So Yeah. That's a whole other thing.
• 58:46
  Wait. A male stripper? Oh, yeah. They hired him to do, like we've talked about this.
• 58:53
  Speaker 2: I know, but it's just now clicking. And I'm like,
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: testosterone, Bree. That's I that's all I got for you. Okay, guys. We we'll talk more about this next week. I'm sure.
• 59:06
  Okay. Bree's gonna have a mental crisis. Disorder. And I also I don't know. Alright.
• 59:14
  We'll talk to you guys next week. I'm sorry. Goodbye. Love you. Bye.