Latest / Destination Unlimited with Victor Fuhrman / Lisa Marchiano – Dream Wise

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Lisa Marchiano – Dream Wise · Destination Unlimited with Victor Fuhrman

0:04
Speaker 1: My name is Victor Furman. Some call me the Voice.
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Speaker 1: I've always been fascinated with human nature, spirituality, science and
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Speaker 1: the crossroads at which they meet. Join me now and
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Speaker 1: we will explore these topics and so much more with
0:22
Speaker 1: fascinating guests, authors and experts who will guide us to
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Speaker 1: Destination unlimited. Is there a dream maker who visits us
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Speaker 1: each night with gifts of wisdom? How may dream work
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Speaker 1: assist us on the path of healing and growth? My
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Speaker 1: guest this week on Destination Unlimited, Lisa Marciano, says dream
0:51
Speaker 1: work assists us on the path of becoming whole, what
0:55
Speaker 1: Carl Young referred to as individuation. Lisa and her Young
1:00
Speaker 1: Analyst colleagues Deborah Stewart and Joseph Lee host the popular
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Speaker 1: podcast This Young in Life. Her website is Lisamarciano dot com,
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Speaker 1: and she joins me this week to share her path
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Speaker 1: and book co authored with Stuart and Lee, dream Wise,
1:17
Speaker 1: Unlocking the Meaning of Your Dreams. Please join me in
1:22
Speaker 1: welcoming to Destination Unlimited, Lisa Marciano. Welcome, Lisa, Thank you.
1:28
Speaker 2: It's great to be here.
1:29
Speaker 1: Lisa. Please share with us your path and how you
1:32
Speaker 1: chose Youngian analysis as your practice.
1:36
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know that I chose it. I think
1:38
Speaker 2: it chose me. I think a lot of people that
1:41
Speaker 2: come to Young's work do feel a deep draw to
1:45
Speaker 2: it and maybe even what we might call a calling.
1:48
Speaker 2: So I was actually in graduate school studying international relations,
1:53
Speaker 2: but I was twenty eight years old. I was at
1:55
Speaker 2: that time of life that you know. Astrology refers to
1:58
Speaker 2: it as a sodern return, and psychologists call it the
2:01
Speaker 2: age thirty transition, where I think a lot of things
2:04
Speaker 2: were coming into focus for me, and I went through
2:09
Speaker 2: a difficult passage. A relationship failed. I wasn't really sure
2:12
Speaker 2: about my path, and at that time, I came across
2:16
Speaker 2: a book that, well, it sort of followed me from
2:20
Speaker 2: place to place. I kept on not buying it because
2:22
Speaker 2: I thought, well, I'm in graduate school, I have four
2:24
Speaker 2: hundred pages of reading this week. I can't buy a book.
2:27
Speaker 2: But then I kept on coming across it until even
2:30
Speaker 2: I recognized that that probably meant I needed to buy it.
2:33
Speaker 2: So I did, and I brought it home to my
2:36
Speaker 2: apartment and I started reading it, and I realized it
2:38
Speaker 2: was as signed copy by the author, who was a
2:41
Speaker 2: union analyst named Linda Leonard, who has become a kind
2:46
Speaker 2: of mentor and friend. And the book was so remarkable.
2:49
Speaker 2: It was a book about relationships from a union perspective,
2:53
Speaker 2: and it really introduced me to Young's ideas in this
2:55
Speaker 2: really wonderful way. And it didn't take away my suffer
3:00
Speaker 2: but it did change my relationship with my suffering. And
3:04
Speaker 2: by the time I was into reading it, not only
3:06
Speaker 2: was I feeling somewhat less acutely distressed, but I also
3:11
Speaker 2: started to think, well, this is really interesting. Maybe I
3:15
Speaker 2: would like to do that someday. And it took me
3:18
Speaker 2: a number of years to get around to pursuing it,
3:20
Speaker 2: but that was the beginning.
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Speaker 1: What is the foundation of Jungian analysis and how does
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Speaker 1: it differ from other forms?
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Speaker 2: Well, Jung was a colleague and contemporary of Freud. Freud
3:34
Speaker 2: was a little older, but the two men were both prominent,
3:38
Speaker 2: and they did collaborate and work together for a while.
3:42
Speaker 2: And in the beginning, Jung was kind of a follower,
3:46
Speaker 2: i would say, of Freud's new method of psychoanalysis, which
3:50
Speaker 2: of course took really seriously what was going on in
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Speaker 2: the unconscious, but also was very interested in what had
3:57
Speaker 2: happened in childhood that might be face, might be shaping
4:01
Speaker 2: the present, and of course Freud had these ideas about
4:05
Speaker 2: the role of sexuality. So the Twoman collaborated for about
4:09
Speaker 2: seven years, but Jung's theories started to diverge. He didn't
4:14
Speaker 2: feel that sexuality was the only important motivation, as Freud
4:18
Speaker 2: tended to do, and he also was interested not only
4:22
Speaker 2: in what had happened in the past in a person's life,
4:25
Speaker 2: but where the psyche wanted to go. So a big
4:28
Speaker 2: difference between Young and Freud is that Freud saw the
4:31
Speaker 2: unconscious as the repository for things that had been forgotten
4:36
Speaker 2: or maybe repressed, or maybe just never made it beyond
4:39
Speaker 2: the threshold of consciousness. Well, Jung thought it was all
4:43
Speaker 2: of those things. But he also thought that the unconscious
4:47
Speaker 2: could be generative, that the unconscious was creative, that the
4:51
Speaker 2: unconscious could produce images, emotions, new attitudes, ideas that would
4:59
Speaker 2: lead us in a new direction that consciousness couldn't even
5:02
Speaker 2: begin to imagine.
5:06
Speaker 1: Before we discuss dream wise, please tell us about your book,
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Speaker 1: The Vital Spark, Reclaim your outlaw energies and find your
5:14
Speaker 1: feminine fire. What inspired this book and what message do
5:17
Speaker 1: you offer women?
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Speaker 2: Well, you know, the book's inspiration actually came from a
5:25
Speaker 2: podcast episode that we recorded. I have a podcast called
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Speaker 2: This Union Life, and we did a podcast called Fierce
5:33
Speaker 2: Female Initiations. And while recording that podcast, I realized I
5:38
Speaker 2: just had one fairy tale after another about the process
5:42
Speaker 2: of female initiation. And by the time the podcast was done,
5:46
Speaker 2: I literally thought to myself, well, that's a book. And
5:50
Speaker 2: so it just sort of arose in a sense, I
5:53
Speaker 2: think very organically from work I've done on myself, as
5:57
Speaker 2: well as work that I've accompanied women on, and you know,
6:02
Speaker 2: in a way, it's really all about reclaiming what is
6:08
Speaker 2: sometimes called shadow. Shadow was, of course Yung's formulation. Now
6:13
Speaker 2: the idea of shadow has really entered the popular culture,
6:16
Speaker 2: but it was originally Jung's idea. And what Jung tells
6:20
Speaker 2: us is that there are aspects of the personality that
6:23
Speaker 2: we leave undeveloped, that maybe we kind of push off
6:27
Speaker 2: to the side, or we kind of exile because we've
6:31
Speaker 2: learned that they're not appreciated or valued in our culture
6:34
Speaker 2: or by our family, let's say. And this is a
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Speaker 2: necessary process. Everyone goes through it. It's not a bad
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Speaker 2: thing to have a shadow, but what is often true
6:45
Speaker 2: is that those aspects of ourselves that we've relegated to
6:49
Speaker 2: shadow can be the source of new energy and enlivenment,
6:55
Speaker 2: especially in midlife. So it's a book about reclaiming qualities
7:01
Speaker 2: that you, as a woman, may not have let yourself develop.
7:06
Speaker 2: Now this doesn't apply to all women, but the majority
7:09
Speaker 2: of us tend to be accommodating and agreeable and likable,
7:16
Speaker 2: and so what do we do with those other qualities?
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Speaker 2: So I identify these seven qualities disagreeableness, shrewdness, trickster desire, sexuality, rage, authority,
7:30
Speaker 2: and ruthlessness, and using fairy tales, personal experiences and clients,
7:35
Speaker 2: stories and dreams, I explore what happens if we develop
7:40
Speaker 2: a new relationship with some of these qualities. Can we
7:44
Speaker 2: integrate them and then they become capacities that we have,
7:49
Speaker 2: So we, for example, have the capacity to exercise authority.
7:54
Speaker 2: It doesn't mean we're going to go around doing it
7:55
Speaker 2: all the time, but it means that when it's appropriate,
7:59
Speaker 2: and of course that takes discernment to know when it's appropriate,
8:02
Speaker 2: we can step into that and then we're stronger, we're fuller,
8:07
Speaker 2: we are more of the person we were meant to be.
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Speaker 1: An important message in light of recent cultural and political developments.
8:17
Speaker 2: Yes, I think so absolutely.
8:19
Speaker 1: You had touched upon fairy tale groups and your bio
8:23
Speaker 1: shares that you facilitate these groups. What are they for
8:26
Speaker 1: and what may be learned from fairy tales?
8:29
Speaker 2: Well, I love fairy tales. Fairy Tales are part of
8:32
Speaker 2: what really connected me with union work, because unions we
8:38
Speaker 2: really value archetypal materials, myths, fairy tales, religious images, these
8:46
Speaker 2: ancient kind of primal stories that speak to the very
8:50
Speaker 2: essence of what it means to be human. And fairy
8:53
Speaker 2: tales are of course universal. They occur in all cultures,
8:57
Speaker 2: and many tales have van across cultures, so there's sort
9:01
Speaker 2: of like a Cinderella in nearly every culture that we know.
9:05
Speaker 2: It may be very, very different, but the bones are
9:07
Speaker 2: the same. So fairy tales are beautiful, and they contain
9:11
Speaker 2: this kind of distillation of human wisdom that really comes
9:16
Speaker 2: from the deepest strata I think of ourselves. So fairy
9:20
Speaker 2: tales are a big part in most of the books
9:23
Speaker 2: that I've written, The Vital Spark and also my book Motherhood.
9:27
Speaker 2: I use fairy tales to show these kind of fundamental
9:32
Speaker 2: psychological and relational patterns, and fairy tales are a beautiful
9:37
Speaker 2: way in but also also instructive. They're full of wisdom.
9:42
Speaker 2: So I also have an online fairy tale group for women,
9:46
Speaker 2: and we explore a different tale every month. So some
9:51
Speaker 2: fairy tales really are specifically about a woman's journey, some
9:55
Speaker 2: more speak to a man's journey. And obviously, in this
10:00
Speaker 2: fairy tale group that I run, I pick fairy tales
10:02
Speaker 2: that are focused on a woman's experience, the kinds of
10:06
Speaker 2: things that we might face. And we have a lovely
10:10
Speaker 2: group of women there, and as the month progresses, we
10:14
Speaker 2: discuss the fairy tale applying it to our own lives.
10:19
Speaker 2: So that's where the magic really happens is when you
10:23
Speaker 2: can say, you know, where in me has it happened
10:26
Speaker 2: that I've lost contact with my brothers? For example, this
10:31
Speaker 2: month we're looking at the Beautiful Grim's fairy tale of
10:34
Speaker 2: the Six Swans, and the heroine of the tale loses
10:38
Speaker 2: her six brothers when they get turned into swans, And
10:41
Speaker 2: what does that mean symbolically or psychologically? And has that
10:46
Speaker 2: ever happened to me in some way? So that's the
10:50
Speaker 2: kind of work that we do in Spinning Straw.
10:53
Speaker 1: Do you have a favorite fairy tale?
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Speaker 2: Well, I do I have one that I just I mean,
11:00
Speaker 2: I have many that I love. It's hard. It's hard
11:03
Speaker 2: to answer that because I can get so enthusiastic about
11:06
Speaker 2: several of them. But I would say that my favorite
11:09
Speaker 2: fairy tale is the Russian tale of Vastlysa the Beautiful,
11:13
Speaker 2: And somehow whenever I write anything, vast Lisa the Beautiful
11:17
Speaker 2: winds up in it. It's just such a deeply magical,
11:21
Speaker 2: wise profound tale with some wonderfully colorful imagery, and I
11:28
Speaker 2: have loved it since childhood.
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Speaker 1: Do all the fairy tales that you folks talk about
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Speaker 1: have happy endings?
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Speaker 2: Most do. Now. I have included some fairy tales in
11:41
Speaker 2: my books that don't, But for the most part, fairy
11:45
Speaker 2: tales do have happy endings because they are ultimately about
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Speaker 2: the process of individuation or about the process of growing
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Speaker 2: more whole.
11:56
Speaker 1: Absolutely, Please tell us about your collaborators in dream Wise,
12:00
Speaker 1: Deborah Stewart and Joseph Lee, and your podcast The Young
12:04
Speaker 1: in Life.
12:05
Speaker 2: So deb and Joseph and I all went through Union
12:09
Speaker 2: training together, which is a wonderfully rich but also arduous experience.
12:15
Speaker 2: We were in training together for the better part of
12:17
Speaker 2: a decade, so we got to know each other really well,
12:21
Speaker 2: and we were united by a sense of common purpose
12:25
Speaker 2: as we struggled through the program together and helped each
12:28
Speaker 2: other get through it. And of course we were relieved
12:31
Speaker 2: when we graduated and we were each you know, certified
12:35
Speaker 2: union analysts, but we missed having a project together, and
12:39
Speaker 2: so in twenty eighteen, we decided to experiment by starting
12:46
Speaker 2: a podcast. It's called This Union Life, and it began
12:50
Speaker 2: in April of twenty eighteen, so just a little over
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Speaker 2: seven years ago. And it's a weekly podcast where we
12:57
Speaker 2: take just any number of themes and explore it through
13:03
Speaker 2: a union lens in just kind of a casual conversation.
13:07
Speaker 2: And then at the end, we always interpret a listener's dream,
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Speaker 2: so anyone can submit their dream to the podcast for
13:15
Speaker 2: possible discussion on the podcast, and we spent about the
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Speaker 2: past the last fifteen to twenty minutes of every episode
13:22
Speaker 2: discussing a dream.
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Speaker 1: Dream Wise starts with a beautiful quote from young Would
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Speaker 1: you share that with us?
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Speaker 2: Yes, this is a really beautiful quote. The dream is
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Speaker 2: a little hidden door in the innermost and most secret
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Speaker 2: recesses of the soul, opening into that cosmic night which
13:44
Speaker 2: was psyche long before there was any ego consciousness, and
13:47
Speaker 2: which will remain psyche no matter how far our ego
13:51
Speaker 2: consciousness extends.
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Speaker 1: Beautiful, Thanks for sharing that.
13:56
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that idea of the dream as a
13:58
Speaker 2: little hidden door. And so dream Wise is the book
14:02
Speaker 2: that we wrote together, the three of us on dream
14:05
Speaker 2: Interpretation from a Union Lens.
14:08
Speaker 1: And what inspired that book.
14:11
Speaker 2: Well, we have an online self paced course called dream School,
14:17
Speaker 2: and we had created this course back in twenty twenty
14:21
Speaker 2: and many, you know, several thousand people have been through
14:25
Speaker 2: the course, and it just occurred to me that it
14:28
Speaker 2: would be a wonderful thing to include that material in
14:33
Speaker 2: a book. I'll tell you what really inspired me working
14:37
Speaker 2: on the book is that I love dreams, and I
14:40
Speaker 2: work with dreams every day, my own and other peoples,
14:45
Speaker 2: and I feel like there's so much wisdom in them.
14:50
Speaker 2: But dreams are really hard. It's really hard to learn
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Speaker 2: how to work with dreams, and it's especially difficult to
14:58
Speaker 2: learn how to work with your own dream So, you know,
15:01
Speaker 2: I wake up for my dreams and I may feel
15:05
Speaker 2: pretty confident working on other people's dreams, but my own
15:08
Speaker 2: dreams I just feel oftentimes very very perplexed. So we
15:13
Speaker 2: really wanted with dream wise to make it as explicit
15:18
Speaker 2: as possible. You know, I sometimes laugh that we're trying
15:22
Speaker 2: to systematize something that really isn't systematizable. But I think
15:28
Speaker 2: we've done a pretty decent job of making dreamwork kind
15:32
Speaker 2: of as clear and accessible as it can be, so
15:35
Speaker 2: that anyone, with the help of dream wise could begin
15:40
Speaker 2: to work with their dreams symbolically.
15:44
Speaker 1: And how is it different from other books on dreams?
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Speaker 2: So there are many wonderful books on dreams. There are,
15:51
Speaker 2: of course, many dream dictionaries, and I'm not a big
15:54
Speaker 2: fan of dream dictionaries.
15:56
Speaker 3: You know.
15:56
Speaker 2: These are the kinds of books that tell you, oh,
15:59
Speaker 2: you know, if you dream about a hose, it means
16:02
Speaker 2: that you're going to trip that day or something. I
16:05
Speaker 2: just made that up. But dream dictionaries tend to have
16:08
Speaker 2: a very kind of concrete understanding of the dream images,
16:12
Speaker 2: and they don't take into account the fact that, you know,
16:15
Speaker 2: a different image might mean something very different to me
16:18
Speaker 2: than it does to you. I have my own personal
16:21
Speaker 2: experience with that thing. I have my associations and my
16:27
Speaker 2: life experience, so no one can tell me what a
16:32
Speaker 2: particular image in one of my dreams means. It's an
16:36
Speaker 2: individual thing. Now, there are some beautiful union books about
16:42
Speaker 2: dream interpretation. There's in classics. I think dream Wise adds
16:47
Speaker 2: to that canon because again, it's it's very explicit it
16:52
Speaker 2: really it does offer kind of a basic grounding in theory,
16:57
Speaker 2: but it takes it beyond that to help you really
17:00
Speaker 2: apply it. And one of the ways that we've done
17:04
Speaker 2: that is through the addition of what we've called the keys.
17:09
Speaker 2: So throughout dream Wise there are sixty nine keys, and
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Speaker 2: they are really little prompts that help you apply the
17:18
Speaker 2: theory to your dream. So you can go to dream
17:22
Speaker 2: wise and look at the keys and just ask yourself
17:26
Speaker 2: the question does this apply to my dream? And you
17:28
Speaker 2: can try it on. Doesn't always work. There're sixty nine
17:31
Speaker 2: of them. Not all of them are going to apply
17:33
Speaker 2: to every dream, but usually if you try a handful
17:37
Speaker 2: of them, you'll find that, or at least I find
17:40
Speaker 2: that the meaning begins to open. The thing is that
17:45
Speaker 2: our dreams come from the unconscious, and they come from
17:50
Speaker 2: the unconscious to tell us something that we are conscious
17:55
Speaker 2: personality doesn't yet fully understand. The dream always carries with
18:01
Speaker 2: it new information that we either don't know, or sometimes
18:05
Speaker 2: we don't want to know. We're defended against it in
18:09
Speaker 2: some sense, and that explains why it's so difficult to
18:14
Speaker 2: understand our own dreams. It's really like asking us to
18:18
Speaker 2: turn our head around and see our back. It's the
18:22
Speaker 2: thing the dream carries, the message that is very alien
18:27
Speaker 2: to ego consciousness, but it's important because it's a different perspective.
18:33
Speaker 2: It may not be that the dream brings the absolute
18:36
Speaker 2: correct perspective, but it certainly brings a different perspective, and
18:41
Speaker 2: that can be so valuable, especially if we're feeling stuck.
18:45
Speaker 2: You know, there's there's another quote in here from Young
18:49
Speaker 2: that I really like that i'd like to share, if
18:52
Speaker 2: that's okay. He says, in each of us, there is
18:58
Speaker 2: another whom we do not know. He speaks to us
19:03
Speaker 2: in dreams and tells us how differently he sees us
19:06
Speaker 2: from how we see ourselves. And this is so important.
19:12
Speaker 2: There's another in us who can who has a totally
19:16
Speaker 2: different perspective, and who can help us get unstuck. You know,
19:21
Speaker 2: ego consciousness can be very one sided, so we can
19:24
Speaker 2: get stuck. You know, we feel like our life doesn't
19:29
Speaker 2: have any energy, Like we're not sure what we're doing,
19:34
Speaker 2: Like we're not sure what the juice is. We don't
19:37
Speaker 2: know how to move forward in our personal or professional lives.
19:41
Speaker 2: You know, if we could think our way out of it,
19:43
Speaker 2: we already would have. And that's where dreams come in,
19:46
Speaker 2: because they bring in this new perspective from this other within,
19:51
Speaker 2: and that's the value of working with dreams. But it
19:55
Speaker 2: is also what can make it difficult, because we're straining
19:59
Speaker 2: to hear something thing that is pretty different from what
20:02
Speaker 2: we're already thinking.
20:04
Speaker 1: My guest is Lisa Marciano. Her book is called dream Wise,
20:09
Speaker 1: Unlocking the Meaning of Your Dreams. Lisa, please share with
20:12
Speaker 1: our listeners where they can get the books and also
20:14
Speaker 1: find out more about your podcast and your work.
20:17
Speaker 2: Sure well, our podcast is this Unionlife dot com and
20:23
Speaker 2: that's j U N G I A N this Union
20:26
Speaker 2: Life dot com. You can find out about our podcast
20:29
Speaker 2: and lots of our programs there. And my author website
20:35
Speaker 2: is Lisamarciano dot com. You can find out about all
20:39
Speaker 2: of my books there, including dream Wise, and you can
20:42
Speaker 2: also find out more about my women's fairytale group Spinningstraw
20:47
Speaker 2: dot com.
20:48
Speaker 1: And we'll be back with more of Lisa after these
20:50
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23:50
Speaker 1: Back on Destination Unlimited. My guest this week Lisa Marciano
23:55
Speaker 1: her book dream Wise, Unlocking the Meaning of Your Dreams. Lisa,
24:00
Speaker 1: what are some of the benefits of learning to work
24:03
Speaker 1: with our dreams.
24:05
Speaker 2: Well, dreams are beautiful and they're mysterious, and so even
24:10
Speaker 2: just from that standpoint, it's a wonderful thing to welcome
24:13
Speaker 2: them into our lives. You know, most of us go
24:16
Speaker 2: through our days and we have a list of things
24:20
Speaker 2: to do, and we have to be so concrete and
24:24
Speaker 2: on task, and yet here's this moment of mystery when
24:28
Speaker 2: we wake up in the morning and we contemplate these
24:31
Speaker 2: very strange images that we could never have come up
24:35
Speaker 2: with with our conscious mind. So they're beautiful. That's the
24:38
Speaker 2: first thing. The other thing is that dreams introduce us
24:43
Speaker 2: to the inner companion. So a minute ago, I was
24:47
Speaker 2: sharing Young's quote about how there is another within who
24:50
Speaker 2: speaks to us in dreams, and this is remarkable and
24:54
Speaker 2: it's true. And when you work with dreams, you begin
24:58
Speaker 2: to develop a relationship with us other within that inner companion,
25:03
Speaker 2: and you really do learn that you're not alone, that
25:06
Speaker 2: there is another perspective inside of you, who cares about you,
25:11
Speaker 2: who wants the best for you, who is always watching
25:15
Speaker 2: out for you and giving you a nudge do a
25:18
Speaker 2: little bit more of this, do a little bit less
25:21
Speaker 2: of that, and helping you grow towards wholeness.
25:25
Speaker 1: I had I've been having vivid dreams, lucid dreams for many,
25:30
Speaker 1: many years, and I had one a few months ago
25:33
Speaker 1: that when I awoke, I was in tears from May
25:36
Speaker 1: I share it with you?
25:37
Speaker 2: Oh?
25:37
Speaker 1: I love that My dream was is that I was
25:40
Speaker 1: enrolled in an angel academy and there was this huge
25:44
Speaker 1: temple and we walked inside and it was shaped in
25:47
Speaker 1: a U. Eighteen tables shaped in a U, and we
25:51
Speaker 1: were instructed to go from table to table make eye
25:54
Speaker 1: contact with the angelic being at each of these tables,
25:57
Speaker 1: and when they nodded their head move on to the
25:59
Speaker 1: next and we made this complete circuit of the eighteen tables,
26:03
Speaker 1: and then we were instructed to go back to the
26:05
Speaker 1: main table and make eye contact with the main angel there.
26:09
Speaker 1: And at that point we were given two things. We
26:12
Speaker 1: were given our angelic name and our angelic assignment. The
26:16
Speaker 1: name that I was given was Avil, which translated from
26:19
Speaker 1: Hebrew means God as my father. And my assignment was
26:23
Speaker 1: to be an angel to other angels. Now I haven't
26:26
Speaker 1: know what this was about, but I would welcome your feedback.
26:30
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, that is truly a remarkable dream. That's
26:34
Speaker 2: what we might call a big dream. And you know,
26:38
Speaker 2: dreams always relate to what's going on in our lives.
26:43
Speaker 2: And of course I don't know anything about your life,
26:45
Speaker 2: so I don't have any associations or any contexts. But
26:49
Speaker 2: I will just say that this seems to be a
26:53
Speaker 2: momentous dream of great import In some sense, it's introducing
26:58
Speaker 2: you to your destiny, which my guess is that you've
27:02
Speaker 2: you already know something about your destiny, but perhaps this
27:05
Speaker 2: was confirming it. I mean, it's it's interesting that it's
27:09
Speaker 2: almost a sort of an image of kind of angel
27:12
Speaker 2: speed dating. But but I love this image of making
27:17
Speaker 2: eye contact, and I wonder if you could tell me
27:21
Speaker 2: did you have that experience of making eye contact with
27:24
Speaker 2: each angel? Yes, that must have been very, very profound
27:29
Speaker 2: and full of numinosity and.
27:32
Speaker 1: Awe, absolutely so.
27:34
Speaker 2: It was a real confrontation, I would say, with what
27:38
Speaker 2: Yung called the self, the guiding center of the personality,
27:42
Speaker 2: and it is the self that keeps our destiny and
27:46
Speaker 2: introduces us to it sometimes through dreams. Sometimes that's where
27:51
Speaker 2: we learn the nature of our, of our of our
27:55
Speaker 2: of our purpose here. And that was indeed given to
27:58
Speaker 2: you in a very explain way. And I would wonder too,
28:02
Speaker 2: since it was angels, it does make me wonder if
28:06
Speaker 2: the dream was hinting at, you know, an issue around mortality,
28:12
Speaker 2: you know, if it was providing insight or comfort perhaps
28:15
Speaker 2: around that issue.
28:17
Speaker 1: What this meant to me is I have been I'm
28:20
Speaker 1: an ordained interfaith minister, among other things, and for many,
28:23
Speaker 1: many years I've been assisting and providing guidance and compassion
28:28
Speaker 1: to my sisters and brothers who are interfaith ministers and
28:31
Speaker 1: others that have come across my path. And I recognize
28:35
Speaker 1: that this was basically confirming that I'm doing what I'm
28:38
Speaker 1: supposed to do in this life.
28:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you must have woken up deeply grateful and
28:45
Speaker 2: also with a real sense of clarity.
28:47
Speaker 1: Absolutely, And that's why I was in tears, because it
28:49
Speaker 1: was a revelation to me, was something that I knew already,
28:52
Speaker 1: but it sort of confirmed everything that I had experienced.
28:56
Speaker 2: Well, you knew it at a different level, right, do
29:00
Speaker 2: it at a different level, and it was Yeah, it
29:04
Speaker 2: sounds so so profound.
29:06
Speaker 1: Yeah. I know from my personal experience that if I
29:10
Speaker 1: have a dream that I want to remember, I keep
29:12
Speaker 1: a notepad next to my bed and journal the dream
29:15
Speaker 1: as soon as I wake up, which included this one.
29:18
Speaker 1: What would you offer to someone who says they can't
29:20
Speaker 1: remember their dreams.
29:23
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a question that we get asked a lot,
29:25
Speaker 2: and we actually have a whole appendix in the book
29:29
Speaker 2: about how to remember your dreams. So there are many
29:33
Speaker 2: many tips that we offer. The main one is the
29:37
Speaker 2: one that you just shared. Get yourself a notebook, get
29:40
Speaker 2: yourself up, you know, a pen, do it with intention,
29:43
Speaker 2: I think. So I chose a special notebook for myself
29:46
Speaker 2: and a special pen. My pen has a little red
29:49
Speaker 2: light on it at the tip so that I can
29:51
Speaker 2: write even in the dark, but you know whatever sort
29:55
Speaker 2: of speaks to you, and then write down whatever you
29:59
Speaker 2: can when you wake up in the morning, even if
30:01
Speaker 2: it's just a little fragment. The more that you engage
30:04
Speaker 2: with your dreams, the more you write them down, the
30:07
Speaker 2: more that you are likely to remember them. There are
30:10
Speaker 2: other techniques. For example, you can visualize yourself recalling your
30:15
Speaker 2: dreams in the morning. You can tell yourself you're going
30:18
Speaker 2: to recall your dreams. You can try taking some supplements,
30:23
Speaker 2: so vitamin B six, I believe, is the supplement that
30:27
Speaker 2: can help you remember your dreams, and there's more information
30:30
Speaker 2: about that in the book.
30:32
Speaker 1: Are all dreams meaningful?
30:35
Speaker 2: Well? I think so. I think all dreams are meaningful.
30:39
Speaker 2: I know that not everyone agrees with me, but I
30:43
Speaker 2: think all dreams come to us and the interest of
30:46
Speaker 2: healing and wholeness.
30:49
Speaker 1: I'm going to share one from someone else that allowed
30:51
Speaker 1: me to share this. I'm not going to mention the
30:53
Speaker 1: person's name, but this person had a dream that they
30:56
Speaker 1: were climbing the staircase and the staircase would go to
30:59
Speaker 1: the next level. They kept climbing the staircase and it
31:01
Speaker 1: went on forever and ever and ever, continually climbing with
31:05
Speaker 1: no resolution of exit. What would you say about that?
31:09
Speaker 2: Well, the first thing is I would be really curious
31:11
Speaker 2: about the feelings in the dream, the feelings in the
31:14
Speaker 2: dream and also the feeling upon awakening. And one of
31:18
Speaker 2: the things about dream Wise that I'm very proud of
31:21
Speaker 2: is we have an entire chapter on emotions and dreams
31:25
Speaker 2: and what they mean and how to work with them.
31:27
Speaker 2: Emotions are such an important part of a dream, and
31:31
Speaker 2: as far as I know, no one has ever written
31:34
Speaker 2: extensively on it. So that is a really special thing
31:37
Speaker 2: about our book. Do you happen to know how this
31:41
Speaker 2: dream was experienced?
31:42
Speaker 1: It was experienced with frustration? Yeah, so, I.
31:46
Speaker 2: Mean the two possibilities would have been frustration, and the
31:50
Speaker 2: other possibility would be just a sense of sort of,
31:56
Speaker 2: you know, a kind of calm acceptance of moving forward
32:00
Speaker 2: and again not knowing anything about the person or his
32:02
Speaker 2: or her psychology or the circumstances of this person's life.
32:08
Speaker 2: I would say that, you know, climbing climbing stairs with
32:14
Speaker 2: no end in sight. You know, it's a little it's
32:16
Speaker 2: a little bit like a task from a Greek myths.
32:20
Speaker 2: You know, where where there's there's no sense of resolution,
32:24
Speaker 2: And the fact that the person felt frustrated tells me
32:27
Speaker 2: that that's kind of a dominant part of the image.
32:30
Speaker 2: I mean, on the one hand, it is an image
32:34
Speaker 2: of ascension. The person is going up, and that of
32:38
Speaker 2: course could be kind of taken positively, but the fact
32:42
Speaker 2: that it's a negative feeling tells me, oh, maybe not
32:46
Speaker 2: so much. You know. One thing about climbing and dreams,
32:49
Speaker 2: for example, is that although it's it's certainly good to
32:53
Speaker 2: be rising, also sometimes climbing means we're getting away from
32:59
Speaker 2: our chick basement. You know, we might be getting too
33:03
Speaker 2: far up in our head, and that might be part
33:06
Speaker 2: of the reason why the person was just climbing and
33:09
Speaker 2: climbing with no end insight. Because you know, our thinking function,
33:13
Speaker 2: our kind of cognitive abilities, that sort of wonderful neo
33:17
Speaker 2: cortex that we evolved is really terrific. I mean, we
33:20
Speaker 2: wouldn't be human without it. But we can sometimes get
33:24
Speaker 2: so lost in our psychic attic in our head upstairs
33:28
Speaker 2: that we really lose contact with the instincts, and that
33:32
Speaker 2: can create a feeling of emptiness and lifelessness.
33:38
Speaker 1: And if I share with you that this person had
33:40
Speaker 1: a great frustration and dissatisfaction in their career. Would that
33:44
Speaker 1: make help? Would that help?
33:45
Speaker 2: Yeah? Sure? I mean you know, yes, you know that
33:49
Speaker 2: my comments were general, but certainly, you know, perhaps the
33:53
Speaker 2: person was striving endlessly and you know, couldn't couldn't seem
33:59
Speaker 2: to get where they wanted to go. Now, I will
34:02
Speaker 2: say this that dreams usually tell us something that we
34:06
Speaker 2: don't already know. Or as with your dream, like you said,
34:09
Speaker 2: you knew it, but you kind of understood it in
34:11
Speaker 2: a different way after you had the dream. So if
34:13
Speaker 2: the person woke up from this dream and said, oh,
34:16
Speaker 2: that's about my frustrations at work, I'd say, well, I
34:18
Speaker 2: think the dream probably was trying. Yes, maybe, but I
34:22
Speaker 2: think the dream is probably trying to give you a
34:24
Speaker 2: slightly different perspective on it. And then it might be
34:27
Speaker 2: interesting to know what is going on at work? What
34:30
Speaker 2: were the particulars of the staircase? Were there any details?
34:33
Speaker 2: And you know, does it resonate that perhaps you've been
34:36
Speaker 2: approaching work with kind of too much of a either
34:41
Speaker 2: like a task orientation, like a sort of drudgery like oh,
34:44
Speaker 2: I've just got to climb another flight of stairs, or
34:48
Speaker 2: even what I alluded to before, that there's a lot
34:51
Speaker 2: of thinking going on and where are your instincts?
34:56
Speaker 1: Absolutely, how do you address nightmares or band should they
35:01
Speaker 1: be attention to, paid attention to, or ignored.
35:04
Speaker 2: Well, I think that a nightmare is really just any
35:07
Speaker 2: dream that's fearful, and we do talk a little bit
35:10
Speaker 2: about nightmares. I think nightmares are kind of the psyche's
35:15
Speaker 2: way of really trying to get our attention. It's like,
35:20
Speaker 2: you know, the dreammaker sends us dreams when we're off course,
35:24
Speaker 2: and if we're a little off course, we might have
35:26
Speaker 2: a kind of small dream. But if we're a lot
35:30
Speaker 2: off course, the dream maker is going to be kind
35:33
Speaker 2: of shouting at us. And that is a nightmare. And
35:36
Speaker 2: by the way, the dream maker does sometimes us send
35:38
Speaker 2: us dreams to sort of confirm something, and that's your
35:41
Speaker 2: dream is a good example of that. But those are
35:44
Speaker 2: a little unusual. You should have the dream maker showing
35:47
Speaker 2: up to tell us something that we need to pay
35:50
Speaker 2: attention to, and nightmares are really a strong statement of that.
35:55
Speaker 2: So I think it's especially important to pay attention to nightmares.
35:58
Speaker 2: And it's no wonder that we tend to remember them.
36:01
Speaker 2: They usually really make an impression on us. So the
36:04
Speaker 2: nightmare doesn't come to encourage you to be afraid of something.
36:10
Speaker 2: It wants you to wake up and pay attention.
36:13
Speaker 1: What is what Jung referred to as animus anima and
36:17
Speaker 1: how does it arise in our dream worlds?
36:20
Speaker 2: Well, the anonymous or aima is an archetype that Jung
36:26
Speaker 2: postulated was part of our psyches. So Jung said that
36:30
Speaker 2: every man has an inner aspect of himself that is feminine,
36:35
Speaker 2: and he gave it the Latin word aima, which means soul.
36:39
Speaker 2: And he said that every woman has a masculine part
36:42
Speaker 2: of her and he called that the anonymous. So technically,
36:47
Speaker 2: in Yungian formulation, men have an anima and women have
36:51
Speaker 2: an anymous and it may show up in your dreams
36:55
Speaker 2: as an opposite sex figure. Now, anything that I say
36:59
Speaker 2: about dreams, by the way, there are no absolutes. It's
37:02
Speaker 2: not that this is always what it looks like. It's
37:04
Speaker 2: not that every opposite sex figure is going to be
37:07
Speaker 2: an anoma or anonymous. There are no hard and fast
37:12
Speaker 2: rules in dream interpretation. We try to give you, in
37:15
Speaker 2: dream wise, just a place to start. And so if
37:19
Speaker 2: you have an opposite sex figure in a dream, you
37:21
Speaker 2: might start by wondering if it's an image of onoma
37:24
Speaker 2: or anymous. And what this can mean is that the
37:30
Speaker 2: onoma or anymous shows up to show you your unrealized potential.
37:37
Speaker 2: So it would be a part of you, but it
37:39
Speaker 2: would feel something, It would feel pretty alien, often in
37:43
Speaker 2: a very entrancing inviting way. So you might have a
37:47
Speaker 2: dream about a lover, for example. Sometimes the anoma or
37:52
Speaker 2: anymous can show up in its negative form, and that
37:55
Speaker 2: can be quite frightening, But that has a purpose too.
38:01
Speaker 1: And what are some of the other archetypes that manifest
38:04
Speaker 1: in our dreams?
38:05
Speaker 2: Well, you might you might find the shadow, and you
38:11
Speaker 2: also might find images of the self, the guiding center
38:16
Speaker 2: of the personality. And you capitalize the s when you
38:20
Speaker 2: use the word self. And in a sense, all dreams
38:23
Speaker 2: come from the self. But sometimes we have dreams that
38:27
Speaker 2: are incredibly numinous where it's almost as if the self
38:30
Speaker 2: makes an appearance. And I think that your dream does that,
38:34
Speaker 2: you know, with that kind of that central angel or
38:37
Speaker 2: even the eighteen other angels who are who are maybe
38:40
Speaker 2: aspects of that guiding center of the personality.
38:45
Speaker 1: What is the practice of active imagination?
38:49
Speaker 2: Active imagination was Young's technique for dreaming the dream onward.
38:55
Speaker 2: It was essentially a direct encounter with the unconscious that's
39:00
Speaker 2: initiated by consciousness. We have a whole chapter on active
39:04
Speaker 2: imagination in the book. Active imagination is a helpful technique
39:09
Speaker 2: on its own, but it can be especially useful when
39:12
Speaker 2: working with a dream. If you have a dream that
39:15
Speaker 2: has a perplexing image that you don't understand. Let's say
39:19
Speaker 2: that I don't know it's a strange animal shows up
39:24
Speaker 2: in your dream, and you've worked with it, you don't
39:27
Speaker 2: know what to make of it. You could try active imagination.
39:30
Speaker 2: So close your eyes, turn off your phone, get about
39:32
Speaker 2: half an hour when you're not going to be bothered,
39:35
Speaker 2: and then let yourself kind of enter a light hypnogogic state.
39:39
Speaker 2: So take a few deep breaths, go inward, check in
39:44
Speaker 2: with your body, and then see if you can kind
39:48
Speaker 2: of call up the image of this strange animal and
39:52
Speaker 2: sit with it and just wait patiently until it begins
39:56
Speaker 2: to move or speak, and invariably will, and then you
40:01
Speaker 2: can engage it. You can ask it questions and see
40:04
Speaker 2: what it answers. And when you're done, you should always
40:08
Speaker 2: journal about it so that you capture it Sometimes it
40:12
Speaker 2: really opens up the experience of the dream and kind
40:16
Speaker 2: of makes clear what's happening. Sometimes it's just some more
40:20
Speaker 2: adjunctive material that gives you more to speculate about as
40:25
Speaker 2: you're working with the dream. And sometimes it's just a
40:28
Speaker 2: deep feeling experience that kind of extends that the extends
40:36
Speaker 2: the experience of the dream.
40:38
Speaker 1: My guest is Lisa Martiano her book dream Wise, Unlocking
40:43
Speaker 1: the Meaning of Your Dreams. We'll be back with more
40:45
Speaker 1: after these words on the Olden Times Radio Network.
40:49
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44:35
Speaker 1: Back on Destination Unlimited. My guest this week Lisa Marciano
44:39
Speaker 1: her book dream Wise, Unlocking the Meaning of Your Dreams. Lisa,
44:45
Speaker 1: what is the practice of active imagination, Young's signature technique
44:50
Speaker 1: for psychological healing and growth.
44:53
Speaker 2: So, in active imagination, we really want to meet the
44:57
Speaker 2: unconscious where it is, but we start from our conscious standpoint,
45:02
Speaker 2: and instead of it coming to us at night in
45:05
Speaker 2: our dreams, we kind of go to it. So we
45:08
Speaker 2: invited in. We find an image, perhaps it's an image
45:12
Speaker 2: from a dream. So that's why we included a chapter
45:15
Speaker 2: in active imagination in dream Wise, because it can be
45:18
Speaker 2: helpful in working with dreams. And you let the image
45:22
Speaker 2: begin to move on its own and speak to you.
45:27
Speaker 1: Now you touched upon this in our last segment, How
45:30
Speaker 1: does dream work assist us on the path of becoming whole?
45:34
Speaker 1: What Jung called individuation.
45:37
Speaker 2: Jung's major idea was that over the course of a lifetime,
45:43
Speaker 2: we are growing into the person we were meant to be,
45:46
Speaker 2: and he called this individuation. Jung was one of the
45:50
Speaker 2: only theorists that was really interested in development beyond childhood. So,
45:57
Speaker 2: you know, Freud and a lot of other early psychoanalysts
46:01
Speaker 2: focused on what happened in childhood and kind of said
46:04
Speaker 2: that that sets the stage for everything that comes after. Ericson, Eric, Erickson,
46:10
Speaker 2: and Young were kind of standouts, and then they said, well,
46:13
Speaker 2: wait a minute, what about all the growth and development
46:16
Speaker 2: that happens later in life as well. Jung said that
46:21
Speaker 2: we spend the first half of life roughly developing an ego,
46:26
Speaker 2: getting out in the world, establishing a career, finding a relationship,
46:31
Speaker 2: maybe having a family, but that at some point we
46:34
Speaker 2: begin to kind of turn inward, and we get curious
46:37
Speaker 2: about other things that maybe got pushed aside while we
46:41
Speaker 2: were doing this. And this is often called the second
46:44
Speaker 2: half of life and can be characterized by kind of
46:47
Speaker 2: a midlife crisis. But this process of turning inward is
46:52
Speaker 2: an important part of individuation. It's an important part of
46:56
Speaker 2: picking up those aspects of ourselves that we may have left,
47:02
Speaker 2: you know, unacknowledged, undeveloped, you know, just kind of glowing
47:09
Speaker 2: coals on the sore room floor. Young refers to them
47:13
Speaker 2: at some point. You know, they never really took fire,
47:16
Speaker 2: but they've still got some glow in them. And if
47:18
Speaker 2: we if we can find them and pick them up
47:22
Speaker 2: and maybe blow on them, they'll get new life and
47:25
Speaker 2: then we'll be enlivened by that content. So the aim
47:30
Speaker 2: of individuation is not perfection. It's wholeness. It's finding those
47:36
Speaker 2: parts of ourselves that we haven't yet paid attention to.
47:39
Speaker 2: And I would say that every dream at its essence
47:43
Speaker 2: is nudging us continually toward individuation. It's reminding us of
47:49
Speaker 2: the aspects of ourselves that we've forgotten or have never
47:52
Speaker 2: paid attention to. It's letting us know where we're out
47:55
Speaker 2: of balance. It's bringing into consciousness that which has been
48:01
Speaker 2: spurned or set aside.
48:04
Speaker 1: Why is it that some people find dreams nonsensical and
48:08
Speaker 1: difficult to understand?
48:11
Speaker 2: I think most of us find them difficult and nonsensical.
48:16
Speaker 2: I certainly do, as I said before, especially when working
48:19
Speaker 2: with my own dreams. And I think this is because
48:22
Speaker 2: the dream maker, the other within, the inner companion, doesn't
48:27
Speaker 2: have access to directive thought and kind of straightforward language
48:32
Speaker 2: the way our conscious mind does, so it has to
48:36
Speaker 2: speak in the language of image and metaphor and symbol.
48:40
Speaker 2: You know, Freud felt that dreams were a disguise, but
48:43
Speaker 2: Young said, no, the dream is not a disguise. The
48:47
Speaker 2: dream is not trying to trick you. The dream is
48:50
Speaker 2: the best possible the best possible expression of something that's
48:58
Speaker 2: known in the psyche at that time. But it just
49:01
Speaker 2: may be a bit of a puzzle. And that's why
49:03
Speaker 2: we have to learn the language of dream interpretation.
49:08
Speaker 1: What would you share with those who don't pay attention
49:10
Speaker 1: to their dreams.
49:13
Speaker 2: Well, it's certainly not my role to tell anyone what
49:17
Speaker 2: they should or shouldn't do. And if dreams are just
49:20
Speaker 2: not interesting to you, then there you go. But if
49:26
Speaker 2: you have any curiosity about your dreams, if you've ever
49:30
Speaker 2: awakened from a dream and felt moved, if you've ever
49:34
Speaker 2: been tickled by one of these images that occurs to
49:37
Speaker 2: you as you're sleeping, then I think that it is
49:42
Speaker 2: well worth your effort to explore it a little bit further.
49:47
Speaker 1: Ancient cultures felt that dreams could help predict the future.
49:52
Speaker 1: Can dreams let us know what's going to happen?
49:55
Speaker 2: Some dreams are indeed precognitive. There are some remarkable examples
50:00
Speaker 2: of precognitive dreams that have been documented. And of course
50:05
Speaker 2: most of us have had, or many of us, I
50:07
Speaker 2: should say, have had an experience or two that certainly
50:12
Speaker 2: felt really uncanny, or perhaps a dream alerted us to
50:16
Speaker 2: something that was going to happen in a strange way.
50:20
Speaker 2: But most of the time dreams point us toward the
50:24
Speaker 2: future in a rather more ordinary way. It is certainly
50:28
Speaker 2: true that dreams can let us know what might be coming,
50:34
Speaker 2: but usually this is a kind of sigh capability that's
50:39
Speaker 2: finding expression through a dreams, but rather just an artifact
50:44
Speaker 2: of the reality that the unconsciousnes is constantly collecting all
50:50
Speaker 2: kinds of information that consciously you know, it's too much.
50:54
Speaker 2: We couldn't possibly pay attention to it all. But it
50:57
Speaker 2: goes into the unconsciousness incredibly good at reading patterns. There's
51:03
Speaker 2: all of this information for it to take account of,
51:06
Speaker 2: and then it can kind of spit out a basically
51:09
Speaker 2: kind of a prediction based on patterns, and you don't
51:12
Speaker 2: actually likened it to a weather forecast. So the meteorologist
51:19
Speaker 2: takes a look at what's going on, says, hey, there's
51:21
Speaker 2: a high pressure system over here in a low pressure
51:23
Speaker 2: system over there, and that means there might be rain
51:26
Speaker 2: next week. And in some sense, that's what our dreams
51:29
Speaker 2: are doing. So dreams can often provide a warning. There's
51:35
Speaker 2: a dream in the book where someone who was kind
51:40
Speaker 2: of beginning to contemplate having an affair or dreamt that
51:45
Speaker 2: she was driving a car at night. She started driving
51:49
Speaker 2: across a long, winding bridge and there was absolutely no light.
51:57
Speaker 2: So in the dream, it became apparent to her that
52:00
Speaker 2: she was running a real risk of driving off the bridge.
52:05
Speaker 2: That was a real warning that she needed to stop.
52:10
Speaker 2: She needed to just kind of view where she was
52:12
Speaker 2: and not make any movement for the time being, and
52:16
Speaker 2: that's what she did.
52:18
Speaker 1: Do you have another example of a pre cognitive dream.
52:21
Speaker 2: Well again, I wouldn't say that that one was pre cognitive.
52:24
Speaker 2: Pre cognitive, you know, I can tell you a little
52:27
Speaker 2: bit about an example of a pre cognitive dream. These
52:31
Speaker 2: are these eerie dreams that are difficult to explain, that
52:35
Speaker 2: really seemed to kind of come from the realm of magic,
52:40
Speaker 2: if you will. And so one of those is was
52:44
Speaker 2: documented in nineteen sixty six an Aberfan in South Wales.
52:50
Speaker 2: There was a slide of coal waste that inundated this
52:56
Speaker 2: small mining town and it covered the school and it
53:00
Speaker 2: killed more than one hundred children. So the psychiatrist John
53:05
Speaker 2: Barker arrived in Aberfan later that same day and was
53:10
Speaker 2: told the story of a ten year old ten year
53:14
Speaker 2: old girl named errol May Jones, and she had a
53:17
Speaker 2: dream before the tragedy. So she woke up and she said,
53:20
Speaker 2: I went to school and this was her dream. I
53:23
Speaker 2: went to school and there was no school there. Something
53:27
Speaker 2: black had come down all over it. And little errol
53:32
Speaker 2: May told her mother that dream in the morning, and
53:35
Speaker 2: then she went to school and was killed and died
53:38
Speaker 2: in the accident. So that's a rather remarkable example. And
53:43
Speaker 2: Jung himself had a dream of meeting a gigantic wolfhound
53:49
Speaker 2: in his dream and knew that the wild huntsman had
53:52
Speaker 2: commanded it to carry away a human soul. And in
53:55
Speaker 2: the morning he awoke and found out that his mother
53:58
Speaker 2: had passed away. So these things certainly do happen, but
54:03
Speaker 2: a lot of times our dreams just kind of come
54:05
Speaker 2: to warn us. There's another another dream in the book,
54:08
Speaker 2: similar circumstance. A woman was getting very involved emotionally with
54:13
Speaker 2: another person outside of her marriage, and nothing had happened yet,
54:17
Speaker 2: but there was a lot of intensity to it, and
54:19
Speaker 2: she had this dream that she bought a new house,
54:22
Speaker 2: but when she moved into the house, the house was
54:24
Speaker 2: falling apart and kind of kind of went from bad
54:27
Speaker 2: to worse, And that dream really kind of woke her up.
54:31
Speaker 2: She she woke up in the morning, she thought, you know,
54:34
Speaker 2: I think I need to think about this more. I
54:36
Speaker 2: think I need to think about what I'm doing.
54:38
Speaker 1: Absolutely. What would you like your readers to take away
54:41
Speaker 1: from dream wise?
54:44
Speaker 2: I would like for readers to be inspired by their dreams.
54:48
Speaker 2: I would like for them to be in love with
54:51
Speaker 2: the process of dream work and to know that they
54:53
Speaker 2: have a tool that they can carry forward in Life.
54:57
Speaker 2: You know, I love our keys because they're portable, they're usable,
55:02
Speaker 2: you can pull them out, and when you have a
55:04
Speaker 2: dream and you're stuck on it, you can you can
55:07
Speaker 2: use the keys to help understand it. And I want
55:11
Speaker 2: people to know that dream work is doable and that
55:14
Speaker 2: they can have that relationship with the inner other, the
55:17
Speaker 2: inner companion, the dream maker.
55:20
Speaker 1: My guest Lisa Marciano, her book dream Wise, Unlocking the
55:25
Speaker 1: Meaning of Your Dreams. Lisa, one more time, please share
55:28
Speaker 1: with our listeners where they can get your books and
55:30
Speaker 1: find out more about you and all your work.
55:32
Speaker 2: Sure well, you can find out more about dream Wise
55:35
Speaker 2: and about my podcast This Union Life by going to
55:38
Speaker 2: This Unionlife dot com and that is spelled j U
55:43
Speaker 2: n G I A N This Union Life. My author
55:48
Speaker 2: website is Lisamarciano dot com and you can find out
55:52
Speaker 2: about all of my books there, including dream Wise, The
55:56
Speaker 2: Vital Spark, and Motherhood. And you can also find out
56:00
Speaker 2: about my online women's fairy tale group called Spinning Straw.
56:06
Speaker 1: Lisa, thank you so much for joining us and sharing
56:08
Speaker 1: this fascinating information about our dreams. Thank you and thank
56:13
Speaker 1: you for joining us on Destination Unlimited. I'm Victor the
56:17
Speaker 1: Voice Ferman have a wonderful week.