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Ross Fulton Analysis: How Nick Saban Helped Inspire Matt Patricia's Hiring At Ohio State · Buckeyes TomOrrow Morning

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  Speaker 1: Welcome to buck Eyes tomorrow morning for Tuesday, March eleventh.
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  Speaker 1: I'm your host, tom Or. The Texas game is in
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  Speaker 1: one hundred and seventy two days, the game against Michigan
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  Speaker 1: in two hundred and sixty three days. On today's show,
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  Speaker 1: we're gonna be talking about the hire of new Ohio
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  Speaker 1: state defensive cordator Matt Patricia, and in particular this very
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  Speaker 1: interesting stuff that Ryan Day said about that hire. Well,
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  Speaker 1: we get a chance to talk to him about about
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  Speaker 1: that last Friday. We're going to be doing all of
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  Speaker 1: that with our buddy, Ross Fulton, the ex's and nose
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  Speaker 1: guru at Buckeyheadle dot com. And when Ross is on
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  Speaker 1: the show, we're presented by Jeff Rubies of Columbus probably
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  Speaker 1: offering nationally acclaimed USDA Prime Stakes, seafood and sushi and
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  Speaker 1: that is simply unmatched. Just go to Jeff Ruby dot
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  Speaker 1: com slash Columbus to check out the menu and make
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  Speaker 1: a reservation today. All right, before we get to Ross,
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  Speaker 1: I'm just going to play the full clip from Ryan Day.
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  Speaker 1: It's a couple of minutes long, but he talks about
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  Speaker 1: a whole bunch of different stuff and what Ross and
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  Speaker 1: I are going to do. We're going to kind of
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  Speaker 1: work our way from back to front on this. So
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  Speaker 1: the last stuff he talks about on this is gonna
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  Speaker 1: be the first stuff we talk about, but we're gonna
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  Speaker 1: take had a bunch of different stuff that he gives
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  Speaker 1: all in this same answer. There was a ton of
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  Speaker 1: interesting stuff. So here you go, here is Ryan Day.
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  Speaker 2: You can tell that we were very thorough and how
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  Speaker 2: we went about the process.
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  Speaker 3: It took some time.
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  Speaker 2: One of the things that you know, people asking all
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  Speaker 2: the time, like you know, one of the biggest learning
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  Speaker 2: lessons every year that you learn as a head coach,
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  Speaker 2: and one of them is to make sure that you
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  Speaker 2: know your thorough and the you know your hiring process
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  Speaker 2: that you bring in you know the right fit.
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  Speaker 3: And I felt like Matt was that guy for a
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  Speaker 3: lot of reasons.
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  Speaker 2: I think the first one is his experience, you know,
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  Speaker 2: coaching nineteen years in the NFL, He's coached in six
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  Speaker 2: Super Bowls, has three Super Bowl rings. It was important,
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  Speaker 2: so the experience speaks for itself. I think, you know,
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  Speaker 2: he's one of the best, you know minds in the game.
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  Speaker 2: But also, you know, pairing him with Tim Walton as
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  Speaker 2: a co coordinator, pairing him with Larry Johnson mc rary,
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  Speaker 2: you know, James laurniis that was important to have continuity.
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  Speaker 2: When you interview certain coordinators, you know, they have an
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  Speaker 2: idea of what they want to do. They want to
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  Speaker 2: come in and run their style of defense.
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  Speaker 3: They want to you know, bring in their own guys.
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  Speaker 3: So that was the first thing.
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  Speaker 2: The second thing, and so part of that was having
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  Speaker 2: somebody that was willing to work with the guys that
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  Speaker 2: were in the room.
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  Speaker 3: That was very important. And I just want to make
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  Speaker 3: sure that.
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  Speaker 2: I, you know, really praise the guys in that room.
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  Speaker 2: And you know, having Tim Welton is a co coordinator
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  Speaker 2: there is a huge part of our defense. And he
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  Speaker 2: was this year, and so it was Matt, and so
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  Speaker 2: was Larry and and all those guys. But you know,
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  Speaker 2: I think Matt and Tim working together as the coordinators
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  Speaker 2: is going to be critical. I think that we need
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  Speaker 2: to continually look at how we have to evolve with
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  Speaker 2: our defense. And Matt brings a different approach to the
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  Speaker 2: game in terms of he's run different styles of fronts
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  Speaker 2: in the past. You know, he's been multiple and what
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  Speaker 2: he's done. And I think when you look at his defenses,
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  Speaker 2: they've always utilize their players, and I think we've talked
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  Speaker 2: about that a lot, especially on offense. You know, how
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  Speaker 2: do we put our players in the best position to
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  Speaker 2: be successful. I also, you know, studied how Nick Saban
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  Speaker 2: went on his run, and you know, he brought in
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  Speaker 2: different offensive coordinators. You know, you think about that run.
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  Speaker 2: It was Lane Kiffen, it was Sarkesian, it was day Ball.
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  Speaker 2: You know, it was Mike Oxley, it was Bill O'Brien,
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  Speaker 2: you know, a lot of different coaches, but you know,
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  Speaker 2: they kept a lot of the defense intact. And we
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  Speaker 2: want to make sure that our identity of what we
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  Speaker 2: do on defense stays intact as we have movement on
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  Speaker 2: our staff. So you know, all those things let me
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  Speaker 2: down this road of mad who even in a short
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  Speaker 2: period of time, you know, has already worked hard on
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  Speaker 2: building relationships with the staff, with the players, and his
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  Speaker 2: experience is going to have credibility the minute he walks
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  Speaker 2: in that room of the guys that he's coached the
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  Speaker 2: teams and this experience on the field, you know, and
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  Speaker 2: now that we were playing in a longer season understanding
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  Speaker 2: you know, how that goes and playing in the playoffs.
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  Speaker 2: I think all those or reasons that we ended up
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  Speaker 2: with Matt.
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  Speaker 1: All right, So Ross, let's sort of work from back
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  Speaker 1: to front on this answer, because there's a lot of
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  Speaker 1: interesting stuff in here. Let's start with the element of
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  Speaker 1: the Nick Saban, what Brian Day learned from Nick Saban.
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  Speaker 1: That's a good person to learn something from, and how
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  Speaker 1: he hired offensive porinators, but sort of they kept some
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  Speaker 1: sort of the bigger picture stuff intact and really you know,
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  Speaker 1: sort of maintained their identity on offense because Saban, of
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  Speaker 1: course a defensive, defensive minded guy, so the offense is
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  Speaker 1: not the side of the ball. He's kind of keeping
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  Speaker 1: his focus on sort of the reverse here for Ryan Day,
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  Speaker 1: who's an offensive guy, talking about the defense and the
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  Speaker 1: defensive identity.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I think there's like five different points there,
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  Speaker 4: but I think a couple of them are interrelated, and
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  Speaker 4: namely this one with keeping the rest of the staff
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  Speaker 4: there and so that this is the part of the
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  Speaker 4: answer that really jumped out to me when I heard it.
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  Speaker 4: You know, I think, in fact, maybe alluded to this
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  Speaker 4: concept when we discuss some Matt Patricia being hired in
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  Speaker 4: terms of you know, analogizing it to this Nick Saban
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  Speaker 4: on the offensive side of the football, and you know,
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  Speaker 4: to me, it stood out as like we're going to
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  Speaker 4: keep I think, you know, the structure, the overall structure.
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  Speaker 5: Of the defense intact.
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  Speaker 4: You know, I think that from you know, the period
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  Speaker 4: in time that day was referencing there with Nick Saban,
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  Speaker 4: like from laying Kiffen on right, Like to me, like
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  Speaker 4: that those Alabama offenses all looked pretty similar, even though
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  Speaker 4: you had five different offensive coordinators, Like each person probably
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  Speaker 4: brought some of their own you know, flair or minutia
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  Speaker 4: to it.
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  Speaker 5: But you know it's the same.
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  Speaker 4: You're not you're not jumping from system to system, right,
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  Speaker 4: And I think you'll see similar here like the within
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  Speaker 4: you know, I think like generally speaking, like the four
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  Speaker 4: two five concept, right, Like it's kind of like the
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  Speaker 4: structure of what you're working with.
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  Speaker 5: And again like I think that there's.
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  Speaker 4: Room for you know, some Matt Patricia putting his own
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  Speaker 4: stamp on things in it. And also like the fact
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  Speaker 4: that Jim Noles, like by the end of the three
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  Speaker 4: years here had run a lot of different stuff, particularly
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  Speaker 4: in the back end, like we talked about, like you know,
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  Speaker 4: every different coverage you can think of, they ran it
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  Speaker 4: at some point, so that there's a lot there to
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  Speaker 4: choose from. And like you can you're going to feature,
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  Speaker 4: you know what you feature is, and just depending on
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  Speaker 4: who the coordinator is, it's you know who the who
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  Speaker 4: your personnel is. And like both Matt Patrician right day
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  Speaker 4: talked about that and you know, we can get into that.
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  Speaker 4: But like so I think, you know, there's some room
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  Speaker 4: for like you know, as Dave referred to to some
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  Speaker 4: like you know, evolution and like I think particularly on
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  Speaker 4: third down, you'll see like Matt Patricia put his stamp on,
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  Speaker 4: you know, thesing simulated packed pressures and maybe they'll mix
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  Speaker 4: in some odd front. But yeah, obviously that was part
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  Speaker 4: of what Jim Knowles wanted to do too, And so
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  Speaker 4: I think you know by by doing that though, the
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  Speaker 4: point is, like you know, when you're turning over a
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  Speaker 4: staff or when you're having a new d you come
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  Speaker 4: in because like you want to be successful, and that
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  Speaker 4: leads to turnover, but like you don't want to have
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  Speaker 4: to restock your whole defensive staff and then you're suddenly
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  Speaker 4: losing you know, Recruiting is an issue, you know, retention
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  Speaker 4: of your current roster becomes an issue. So like there's
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  Speaker 4: a lot of benefits to having some continuity.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, you want continuity, that's that's obviously a positive. But
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  Speaker 1: you don't want to get stagnant either, And that's you know,
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  Speaker 1: you sort of heard too. It's sort of seemingly contradictory
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  Speaker 1: ideas at work in that one answer, where they want
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  Speaker 1: to keep their identity intact, but they also want to
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  Speaker 1: keep evolving with the defense. It's interesting to me that
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  Speaker 1: Nick Saban has been such a talking point around the
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  Speaker 1: Ohio State defense over the last six months or so
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  Speaker 1: where he called them, you know, sort of some antiquated
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  Speaker 1: or outdated sort of things that they were doing, you know,
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  Speaker 1: during the Oregon game, and then that sort of continued
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  Speaker 1: to evolve after that, and now Ryan Day talking about
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  Speaker 1: the fact that you need to continue and keep evolving
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  Speaker 1: with that defense, and that Matt Patricia has run different
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  Speaker 1: styles of fronts and been multiple and put play you know,
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  Speaker 1: what they need to do to put play is in
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  Speaker 1: a position to be successful. I think it would not
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  Speaker 1: be a bad idea to just sort of you know,
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  Speaker 1: we talk about stuff like odd fronts all the time,
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  Speaker 1: and I don't know that everyone just immediately knows, you
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  Speaker 1: know when they talk about odd fronts or four down like,
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  Speaker 1: what are we talking about here? Like can you sort
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  Speaker 1: of spell some of that stuff out and then you
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  Speaker 1: know some of the stuff that they might be doing
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  Speaker 1: in order to put guys in a position to be
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  Speaker 1: successful this year?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, and even odd front and even front
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  Speaker 4: have less you know, less impact I guess as a
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  Speaker 4: terminology than they did even a few years ago, because
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  Speaker 4: like it really depends how you're gapping things out up front,
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  Speaker 4: like are you doing eight eight man spacing where you're
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  Speaker 4: are you know, like we talked about like Clarry Johnson's
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  Speaker 4: traditionally done, like every person has one gap, right, and
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  Speaker 4: that's like your traditional four down, whereas like in an
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  Speaker 4: odd front or a three down, you usually have one
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  Speaker 4: guy you know, traditionally and you're like classic three four
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  Speaker 4: that Matt Patricia would have run with Bill Belichick. You know,
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  Speaker 4: the noseguard is responsible for both a gaps, right, so
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  Speaker 4: he's basically trying to hold the point of attack and
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  Speaker 4: account for two gaps. And so then you need only
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  Speaker 4: seven guys in that structure. But like as we saw
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  Speaker 4: with I say, this year, there's now techniques you can
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  Speaker 4: do that. You can you know, get a gap and
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  Speaker 4: a half two gaps from your your four down look.
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  Speaker 4: You can obviously you can play three down and still
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  Speaker 4: do single gapping.
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  Speaker 5: You know.
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  Speaker 4: Belichick and Patricia used to do like kind of hybrids
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  Speaker 4: or like they'd have to one side of the formation
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  Speaker 4: like a guy do a gap and a half, and
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  Speaker 4: to the other side like they do sing one gap.
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  Speaker 4: So I think there's like a lot of fluidity there, right,
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  Speaker 4: And so I think sometimes people get like two hung
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  Speaker 4: up on those concepts.
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  Speaker 5: I think really the question becomes.
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  Speaker 4: Like how much do you want to use your defensive
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  Speaker 4: alignment to get to try to play more than one gap,
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  Speaker 4: which allows you to play you know, two deep safeties
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  Speaker 4: in the back end or do a variet, bigger variety
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  Speaker 4: of stuff with the back seven Because like if you
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  Speaker 4: need to have a single gap, then like as the
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  Speaker 4: term applies, like eight man spacing, right, you need eight
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  Speaker 4: guys to count for the eight gaps up front, and
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  Speaker 4: so that like that basically forces you into playing a
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  Speaker 4: lot of like cover one and cover three.
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  Speaker 1: One of the other things that Ryan Day talked about
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  Speaker 1: is Matt Patricia and Tim Walton sort of working together
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  Speaker 1: as the coordinators here. And Patricia has in his background
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  Speaker 1: he's sort of a front end of the defense guy,
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  Speaker 1: and Walton in terms of his background, the sort of
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  Speaker 1: a back end of the defense guy. And actually I
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  Speaker 1: asked Tim Walton about this last Friday, and you know,
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  Speaker 1: sort of the different parts of you know, why it's
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  Speaker 1: important to have those two different sort of perspectives on things,
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  Speaker 1: and he, you know, he talked about the fact that
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  Speaker 1: you know, of course they've both run their own defenses
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  Speaker 1: in the past, so they both you know, it's not
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  Speaker 1: like they only know that half of things. But why
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  Speaker 1: is that important to sort of have a guy who
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  Speaker 1: maybe specializes more in one half and then specializes more
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  Speaker 1: in the in the other half and they can kind
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  Speaker 1: of work together. Why is that an important thing?
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  Speaker 4: I think it's yeah, it's all for what I have
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  Speaker 4: division of responsibilities, right, like you can focus more or
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  Speaker 4: there's only so many hours in the day, and you know,
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  Speaker 4: both in terms of scheme and personnel though too, right
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  Speaker 4: like Tim Wolton is going to spend a lot more
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  Speaker 4: of his time with the defensive backs, you know, so
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  Speaker 4: you can focus more on on your personnel there what
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  Speaker 4: you want to do with them, how you maximize them,
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  Speaker 4: you know, Matt, Patricia can do that more with the
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  Speaker 4: front end. Although you know, like as Patricia said, and
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  Speaker 4: this goes back to her like previous question, like the
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  Speaker 4: first thing is like you know, maximizing your defensive talent,
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  Speaker 4: and like for our state next year, that starts with
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  Speaker 4: the Caleb Downs and like we talked about, like you know,
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  Speaker 4: how Patricia's used Patrick Chung in New England is kind
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  Speaker 4: of like a big nickel a lot of like some
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  Speaker 4: of the things that Downs has done, particularly in the
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  Speaker 4: latter half of lash European like you know, playing more
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  Speaker 4: is like a big nickel in the box, you know,
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  Speaker 4: like kind of at the second level. And so I
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  Speaker 4: think like that's where they start with, right in terms
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  Speaker 4: of like how do we maximize Downs? And then I think,
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  Speaker 4: like how do we maximize our past rush? You know,
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  Speaker 4: and I think even without like Patrick's background, you know,
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  Speaker 4: I think just because of like the loss of you know,
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  Speaker 4: I think Day talked about you know what he called
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  Speaker 4: losing five guys up front, including hero Canoe. You know,
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  Speaker 4: the the depth is obviously a lot less than last year,
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  Speaker 4: so you know, whether that's using a sunny styles you know, CJ.
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  Speaker 4: Hicks potentially if that pans out as more of like
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  Speaker 4: a kind of stand up pass rusher or pass rusher
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  Speaker 4: from the second level. And again that gets to like
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  Speaker 4: using more you know, simulated pressures in the lake on
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  Speaker 4: third down. But I think you know, just like having
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  Speaker 4: like on the on the offensive side of the ball,
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  Speaker 4: like you where you have heartline, much more of like
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  Speaker 4: a passing game background focus, and so like Tyler Bowen
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  Speaker 4: is just entrusted more at the run game, I think
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  Speaker 4: it you know, helps everyone have like sort of clear
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  Speaker 4: demarcation of responsibilities and focus.
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  Speaker 1: And then the last thing I wanted to ask you
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  Speaker 1: about was continuity. And this was this was the first
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  Speaker 1: thing that they talked about. The last thing we're talking about.
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  Speaker 1: But the first thing he brought up, which I thought
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  Speaker 1: was kind of interesting, the fact that Patricia was willing
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  Speaker 1: to come in and not just sort of bring in
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  Speaker 1: his own guys like this is this is probably a
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  Speaker 1: little bit of a if it ain't broke, don't fix
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  Speaker 1: it situation where you're coming off of an incredible defensive
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  Speaker 1: season and a national championship, so you're not really looking
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  Speaker 1: to do a total tear it down to the studs
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  Speaker 1: by any means, but the importance of the fact that
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  Speaker 1: he was willing to work with the guys who are
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  Speaker 1: already there. Now you look at that, it all makes sense.
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  Speaker 1: And then I also look at that and I go, well,
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  Speaker 1: you go back to Kerry Combs taking over the defense
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  Speaker 1: and Brian Day wanted him to run what Brian Day
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  Speaker 1: wanted him to run in twenty twenty, and Kerry Combs
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  Speaker 1: didn't really have a lot of experience in that. So
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  Speaker 1: I think that that might be something that you're asking
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  Speaker 1: someone to you know, I think people may look at
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  Speaker 1: that and go, you know, you're asking someone to do
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  Speaker 1: something and work with people he doesn't know and all
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  Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. Is that going to be a problem.
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  Speaker 1: Is that going to be a problem or is that
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  Speaker 1: going to be something where you're kind of because you're
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  Speaker 1: working in a system with people who have worked in
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  Speaker 1: that system before, you're going to have that continuity is
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  Speaker 1: going to sort of hold everything together.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: I mean, I think the problem with Kerry Combs is
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  Speaker 4: more like lack of experience running any defense, right, which
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  Speaker 4: is not Matt Patricia's issue.
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  Speaker 5: I mean, he's he.
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  Speaker 4: Has in fact, for quite a variety of things over
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  Speaker 4: his time, you know, like he talks about event July
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  Speaker 4: and Edelman podcast, like they were kind of known as
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  Speaker 4: a cover two team for a time and then like
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  Speaker 4: in Detroit and with the Eagles, you ran a lot
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  Speaker 4: of cover once. So it's like he's done. He has
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  Speaker 4: in fact, in a wide variety of three to a halt,
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  Speaker 4: four down, you name it. I you know, I think
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  Speaker 4: it's more like you know, today's point, it's more like
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  Speaker 4: you want to continue to evolution, not revolution, right, Like
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  Speaker 4: you don't want to be like having to turn over
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  Speaker 4: your whole staff every time, in every basically like on
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  Speaker 4: the highest state timeline. Now, like you have a defensive
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  Speaker 4: coordinator for one to two years, and you don't want
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  Speaker 4: that to like lead to a massive staff overhaul. Like
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  Speaker 4: I think that was probably part of the you know,
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  Speaker 4: friction at the beginning with Jim Knowles coming in and
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  Speaker 4: he did not get to bring in his own staff.
• 14:59
  Speaker 4: And so you know, I think you want, you know,
• 15:02
  Speaker 4: kind of another probably coaching sound bite, like the new
• 15:06
  Speaker 4: coordinator to accentuate what you do rather than like tear
• 15:09
  Speaker 4: it down and start from scratch. And so, you know,
• 15:13
  Speaker 4: I think that that'll be their goal obviously, and that
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: you know, it should help the players not have to
• 15:19
  Speaker 4: learn a whole new system all the time.
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: I mean, like you know that was akin to Chip
• 15:22
  Speaker 5: Kelly last year, like he picked up.
• 15:24
  Speaker 4: Ohio State's terminology rather than using his own, and so,
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: you know, just to reduce that learning curve.
• 15:32
  Speaker 5: And so you know, I think that's just what Day
• 15:34
  Speaker 5: is gonna be looking for.
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: Though, to your point, like if Matt Patricia moves on,
• 15:38
  Speaker 4: you know, if he gets an nfl A DC job
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: a year or two from now, you know, you want
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: to find someone who's comfortable, who has that background of
• 15:45
  Speaker 4: being able to you know, adapt system wise and you know,
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: be able to work with people on your staff. And
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: you know, I think Patricia talked about right that, like
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: he has some background with Tim Bolton and others, and
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: so that that obviously helps with that.
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Patricia and Matt and Tim Walton actually worked together
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: at Syracuse back in I think two thousand and three.
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: So it has been a while since Matt Patricia's been
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: in college, but when he was in college, he was
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: in college with Tim Walton. So everything old is new
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: again with the Ohio State defense this year. So that's
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: going to be a fascinating thing to watch starting next Monday.
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: That's when springball starts Monday, March seventeenth. We'll be there
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: and covering that practice. We'll be there all spring covering
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: the Buckeyes as they roll out the new new look
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: defense with Matt Patricia, a whole lot of new new folks,
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: new faces in that starting lineup. This year going to
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: be a lot of fascinating stuff to watch. We'll be
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: talking about all of it at Buckey Huddle dot com.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: That's where Tony, Kevin and I cover the team, markcover's recruiting.
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: We got our whole team of ex's and those gurus
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: there as well to make you a smarter football fan.
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: All at Buckeye Huddle dot com. And thanks again to
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: Jeff Rubeis of Columbus, the award winning Upscale steakhouse in
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: downtown Columbus named one of the top fifty steakhouses in
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: America with America Buy Food Network. Just go to Jeff
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: Ruby dot com slash Columbus to check out the menu
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: and make a reservation today. That'll do it for today.
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: Thank you guys all for joining us. Have a great day.
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: We'll talk to you tomorrow.