Latest / The Courtroom Files / January 30 Court Hearings: Judge Boyd, Simpson, Middleton + More | TCF Podcast #221

Transcript

January 30 Court Hearings: Judge Boyd, Simpson, Middleton + More | TCF Podcast #221 · The Courtroom Files

0:02
Good morning friends. Happy Super Friday.
0:04
Welcome to TCF Live. It's good to have you all here.
0:06
So we started a trial with Judge Mercer yesterday and it did
0:10
conclude yesterday. I did record it and we are going
0:13
to pick up, but let's start in Judge Anselone's court for a
0:17
little bit. This is live this morning and
0:19
give people a chance to kind of file in who want to see the
0:22
conclusion of that trial. I'm doing exceptionally well
0:29
with his drug testing. He did miss one, but he still,
0:31
and he is testing positive for THC.
0:34
He has, Oh no, he didn't say he was doing well.
0:37
He said he was doing so. So to date, he has not provided
0:41
the court with a medical marijuana card.
0:44
I advised Mr. Packard on December 17th that he needed to
0:48
get into outpatient counseling. He did sign a release to attend,
0:52
but he has yet to start and he stated he's trying to figure out
0:57
his private insurance. He has stayed away from using
1:00
cocaine, but there are concerns that unless he receives home, he
1:07
would relapse well on probation. So, Mr. Castleberry, you did
1:11
receive a copy of the pre sentence report.
1:13
All right. And you are?
1:15
Kate Packard. Yes.
1:16
Ma'am. All right.
1:17
And Mr. Packard, you had an opportunity to read and review
1:20
that pre sentence report and you've had an opportunity to
1:24
discuss that with Mr. Castleberry.
1:26
Are you satisfied with Mr. Castleberry as your attorney and
1:30
the advice that he has given you?
1:33
Mr. Castleberry, do you wish to explain or challenge the
1:36
accuracy or relevancy of any information in the precincts
1:41
report? Yeah, the only thing is on page
1:43
one of the actual investigation, it says he has a 13 year old.
1:47
Yeah, I, I, I saw that. I didn't.
1:49
Yeah, that should be 3. He should, he has a three-year
1:53
old. Otherwise he became a dad at 10.
1:56
So we will definitely make that change.
1:59
Anything else, Mr. Casper? All right, Does the pre sentence
2:03
report disclose any prior convictions in which there
2:06
exists any known constitutional defect?
2:08
I see no indication he has any prior offenses, correct.
2:11
OK. And the probation officer
2:14
computed the minimum sentencing guidelines to be from zero to
2:17
one month. Do agree with that computational
2:19
guidelines? All right.
2:21
Before the court passed the sentence, is there anything
2:24
you'd like to say on behalf of Mr. Packard?
2:26
Yeah. Nothing other than I'm asking
2:29
the court to follow the agreement that was that was
2:31
placed on the record and we agree with the recommendation of
2:35
the probation. Anything you'd like to say, Mr.
2:39
Packard? No, ma'am all.
2:41
Right. So Mr. Packard, you are a young
2:43
man, This is your first offense. Unfortunately, this offense is a
2:48
common occurrence in our court and unless you get help and deal
2:52
with this now, you'll be back again and again.
2:54
Do you understand addiction is very serious?
2:59
You had methamphetamine and there was some cocaine issues.
3:04
So without assistance, it's really hard to break that cycle.
3:09
OK. And you will be required to do
3:10
that during probation. And if you don't do that, I can
3:13
put you in jail, Do you understand?
3:15
Yes, ma'am. All right.
3:16
So, in determining the appropriate sentence in this
3:20
case, the Court has considered the seriousness of the offense,
3:24
your history, the principal proportionality, the statutory
3:28
penalty, the cost of confinement, the sentencing
3:31
Guidelines, the report and recommendation of the Probation
3:33
Department, as well as what has been set upon the record at this
3:37
hearing. The criterion, reasons for the
3:40
sentence on the nature and gravity of the offense, the
3:42
discipline appropriate to its Commission, deterrence against
3:46
repetition by you and by others, the potential for reformation,
3:49
vindication for the law, and the protection of society.
3:52
Sentence of the Court will be placed on probation for a period
3:55
of 18 months. During that term of probation,
3:58
you can't use or possess alcohol, can't use or possess
4:01
any illegal controlled substances or marijuana.
4:05
I understand it's legal, but because you're in front of me on
4:08
a drug offense, you understand you can't use them.
4:11
OK. You must comply with all
4:13
requirements for alcohol and drug testing.
4:17
Failure to do a test when ordered would result in
4:20
violation of probation. Do you understand that?
4:22
All right, let's see. Use prescription drugs only as
4:27
prescribed. Complete any mental health
4:30
counseling or treatment as referred to by the Probation
4:35
department. Have you completed your high
4:38
school degree? I have not.
4:40
OK, that'll be one of the terms, and there's different programs
4:43
in the county that will help you with that and they'll give you
4:45
information on that. Not to use any object as a
4:50
weapon. They can search your person,
4:52
your property, your car, your computer, your phone if they
4:55
have reasonable cause to believe that you have items that violate
4:58
your probation. Do you understand that they can
5:01
also enter your home at any time for probation supervision?
5:04
Do you understand that there is a crime victim assessment fee in
5:10
the amount of $130.00 You are employed, right?
5:13
Yes. OK, good, $30 supervision fee
5:20
per month, 60 if we have to put a tether on you, $750 in court
5:25
costs, $60.00 DNA fee, $68 and state costs.
5:30
I'm going to send you under the 7411 statute, which means if you
5:34
successfully complete your probation, this won't show on
5:37
your record, and then I'll give you credit for two days served.
5:40
Anything else, Miss Holly? Don't think so.
5:43
All right. Now you do have the right to
5:45
appeal this sentence and my bailiff is going to hand down to
5:49
you your notice of right to have pellet review.
5:51
He's going to have the initial and date one copy for our
5:53
records to acknowledge you received the paperwork.
5:56
If you wish to appeal the sentence, you would fill out the
5:58
information on the other forms and mail them to the address
6:01
list on the form within 42 days. All right.
6:25
The records will reflect I received back a signed copy of
6:29
the notice of Right to Appellate Review.
6:31
Miss Halley an instructions for reporting.
6:33
Tuesday. Today and 10.
6:36
OK, All right. Thank you, Mr. Casper.
6:39
Thank you. All right, friends, once again,
6:43
good morning. Welcome to TCF Live.
6:45
Happy Super Friday to you. Why Super Friday?
6:48
Because we achieve, try to achieve more here.
6:50
We strive for more. We want to be better.
6:54
Anybody can have a Friday, only we can have a Super Friday.
6:57
Any who started out with Anna Marie Anselone just to give
7:00
people a chance to file in. People have filed in.
7:04
So we're going to go into the Wayback Machine now for the
7:07
majority of the day. This is the second-half of the
7:11
trial that we started yesterday in Wade Mercer's court.
7:13
If you weren't with us yesterday, the long and the
7:16
short of it, this is a Florida case.
7:19
You have a person who is charged with unlawful discharge and
7:25
display of a firearm. She was drunk, allegedly, all
7:30
those kind of things. So basically Florida Man woman
7:34
edition. That's the best way to to to
7:37
summarize it. But we're going to pick up with
7:39
the afternoon session. I'm going to, for the most part,
7:43
run this uninterrupted because even when they don't have
7:46
witnesses and stuff going, there's a little bit of how the
7:49
sausage is made that goes on. So I'm probably not going to
7:55
edit a lot of this, but any who, let's get it rolling.
8:03
It did not. Still good.
8:05
OK, so everybody's present with the jury still outside.
8:08
And Deputy Spates, I just learned Deputy Spates was
8:11
advised by one of the jurors that they know one of the
8:13
witnesses are going to testify this afternoon.
8:15
Debbie Spates, come on up so we can make sure we understand
8:22
which juror was it and what did he or she say.
8:27
Mr. King, Mr. King is an elevator.
8:32
He say he know one of the jurors, that's what he just
8:35
blotted out. He say different states.
8:37
I know her round up. We don't have a Mr. King justify
8:41
anyway. So oh, the the witness said
8:46
they, the jurors say that he knows one of the which which
8:49
juror? We don't have a Mr. King.
8:50
It's a juror. We only have one male juror.
8:52
I'm sorry, Mister Jack and I say James, hang on Mr. Jackson,
8:57
there's only one male on the jury.
8:58
Male Mr. Jackson. And Mr. Jackson said he knew one
9:00
of the jurors that was going to testify.
9:02
Did he say which juror? He he did not know which
9:06
witness. I'm sorry, which witness?
9:07
He did not say her name. He pointed at he said, I know
9:11
that Lady right there. She was sitting on the bench.
9:14
And I didn't ask, no. Thank you.
9:16
Thank you. That's what he said.
9:17
So, Mr. Mitchell, the state wish that we inquire Mr. Jackson any
9:20
further. Yes, your Honor.
9:22
OK, several witnesses. I'm not going to be calling, so
9:25
maybe it'd be prudent to ask. Have the deputy ask Mitchell.
9:29
He didn't tell me a name. Just ask.
9:33
Ask Mr. Jackson only to come in, please.
9:40
I heard you think for just the limited opportunity to see which
9:44
witness he's referring to, we may bring that witness in also?
9:47
I'm going to ask him who he's talking about.
9:49
I have no idea. I'm not going to bring in a
9:50
bunch of witnesses. Just give us a minute and we'll
9:53
figure it out. There's a right way to do it.
9:54
Mr. Jackson, come on up. Mr. Jackson, Just come on up and
9:57
have a seat. So we're just trying to make
10:04
sure we do have a fair and impartial trial.
10:06
Mr. Jackson, we've been advised that you may know one of the
10:09
potential witnesses now, is that correct?
10:11
Do you know which one it is? OK.
10:15
This young lady on the 2nd row and it then I'm assuming this
10:18
since she's in the courtroom, she's not a witness.
10:20
She's not going to test. She is not going to be called as
10:22
a witness. OK.
10:23
So are you still good feel like you can be fair and impartial?
10:26
She's she's not going to testify.
10:28
OK. Mr. Mitchell, any further
10:30
questions of Mr. Jackson? State satisfied with his
10:32
response. Mr. McDaniel, All right.
10:34
Any any reason we can't bring the rest of the jury in?
10:36
No, you're all right. So you go ahead and have a seat
10:39
back where you were then. Mr. Jackson, we'll bring the
10:41
rest of the jury panel in. You remain.
10:45
In the. Courtroom.
11:07
Ladies and gentlemen, make yourself comfortable please.
11:11
And we are getting started. Back on time.
11:15
Hope you enjoyed your lunch break.
11:17
Ladies and gentlemen, we are at the conclusion of the morning
11:21
session. The state had rested and we're
11:22
now ready for Mr. McDaniel, on behalf of the defendant to
11:25
present in defense he wishes to defenses, that is.
11:28
And Mr. McDaniel, do you have any witnesses you would like to
11:30
call? Yes, Your honor, we're going to
11:31
call Catherine Lewis, AKA Noel Lewis.
11:36
Catherine, was that Catherine Lewis?
11:51
Miss Lewis, if you're just staying right there, ma'am, what
11:55
we're going to do, Miss Lewis, is I'm going to ask the clerk to
11:58
place you underoath and then we'll get you to have a seat in
12:00
just a moment. Miss Lewis coming around to have
12:11
a seat. Ma'am, make yourself
12:11
comfortable. And Mr. McDaniel, counsel for
12:18
the defendant, may have a few questions for you first.
12:19
Thank you, Honor. Miss Lewis, can you tell the
12:22
jury your name? Catherine Noel Lewis, you'd.
12:26
Like to go back, Noel? Yes.
12:33
You familiar with Ashley Nichols?
12:36
Yes, Sir. How are you familiar with her?
12:39
I met Ashley six years ago. I was in a relationship with her
12:42
for four. Are you familiar with Miss
12:49
Provett Jan Provett? Yes, Sir.
12:52
Have you communicated certain things to Miss Provett about
12:57
Ashley? Yes, Sir.
13:01
And this is all before the incident happened in November.
13:04
Yes, Sir, I have an active injunction against Miss Nichols.
13:07
OK. Let me ask you, so I'm just be
13:09
careful. So what is her reputation in the
13:15
community for violence object? Let me get you to a price
13:19
please. I told you earlier, sometimes
13:52
things come up in a trial. That happens in almost every
13:54
trial. That just going to take some
13:57
time. So what I'm going to do is ask
13:58
you to have a seat in the jury room.
13:59
Hopefully this is going to take less than 10 minutes.
14:01
When we get ready to proceed, we'll be back with you just as
14:03
quick as we can. I'll move as long as efficiently
14:05
as possible. But this is something I've got
14:07
to take care of outside of your presence, OK?
14:24
All right, so the jury is outside the jury room.
14:26
The jury room door is closed. First, Miss Lewis, I need you to
14:33
answer the questions and only answer the questions.
14:36
You have possibly created a big issue by mentioning something
14:39
the jury has no right to hear and has nothing to do with this
14:42
case, and that's an injunction. That injunction was not an
14:45
answer to the question he asked you.
14:46
It was not responsive at all. It was something you chose to
14:49
throw in on your own that was not responsive to the question.
14:52
Do not do that anymore. I do not care what your
14:54
relationship is with the alleged victim.
14:56
I couldn't care less. But I don't want you to do
14:58
anything. It's going to cause us to have
14:59
to try this case again. Does the state request any type
15:02
of curative instruction in response to Miss Lewis's non
15:07
responsive answer introducing evidence that's otherwise
15:10
probably not admissible? I guess Mr. McDaniel, let let me
15:14
talk to them. You, you just wait just a
15:15
second. I'm I need their attention.
15:17
Focus on me, please. I know that Mister Gill's got a
15:19
lot more experience than you do, Mr. Mitchell.
15:20
So my question is, does the State request any type of
15:23
curative instruction in regarding her introducing into
15:27
the jury evidence of an injunction which is, unless very
15:30
unusual circumstances, is not admissible before this jury?
15:33
Mr. Mitchell. Mr. Gill.
15:34
I think the only curative instruction we would we would
15:38
suggest is that they disregard what you just said previously on
15:44
the record and proceed from there.
15:47
Mr. Gill, do you have anything can?
15:49
I just have one moment. Sure.
16:20
I actually didn't hear the the response.
16:22
And given that, I think that I don't want to draw any more
16:26
attention to it. I think it would be appropriate
16:29
for you had to have, you know, given Miss Ashley Lewis, Miss
16:34
Catherine Lewis, you know, that instruction.
16:36
I think we'll go from there. I think we.
16:37
We'll you don't want to make because the jury may not have
16:39
heard it either. I don't understand.
16:41
And. And I think the jury did.
16:42
So I I think that would be, you know, I don't.
16:43
Do you want to make it? The instructions you've given,
16:46
Miss Lewis, I think is fair. OK.
16:47
She clearly said there was an injunction against her and it
16:50
was clearly not responsive to the question Mr. McDaniel asked.
16:53
So, but given the states not requesting A curative
16:55
instruction, we will not do one. Now, what we're going to do now
16:58
is I'm going to ask Mr. McDaniel to ask her the specific
17:01
questions that you intend to ask her in front of the jury.
17:04
I will rule on the admissibility of those questions if there are
17:06
any objections and there may not be, And then we will get the
17:10
jury back in and we'll let the jury hear some relevant and
17:13
admissible testimony. Mr. McDaniel, you're fine.
17:16
Stay calm. OK, so how do you know Ashley?
17:23
Was in a relationship with her. And.
17:27
You can answer like you did before.
17:28
Full answers. I mean, how do you know her?
17:29
You've been in a relationship for how long?
17:32
We were together for four years. I've known her going on 6.
17:35
OK. And you also have a relationship
17:38
with Jan? Yes, Sir.
17:40
And part of November, did Jan know about some of the
17:45
circumstances of violence that had happened?
17:48
Yes, Sir. And she's aware of those.
17:51
Yes, Sir. And does the Ashley have a
17:54
propensity or a community knowledge of being valid in the
17:58
community? Yes, Sir.
18:02
Or. Reputation of being balanced.
18:05
Yes, Sir, no. Further question, Mr. Mitchell,
18:10
are you objecting any of those questions?
18:12
Well, I guess before I state my objection, I did want to clarify
18:18
how long has she known Miss Prevat?
18:20
She said four years together, six years she's known her.
18:23
That's Miss Nichols six years. You've known Miss Prevat 6
18:27
years. Yes, Sir.
18:28
OK. And your honor, I'll just
18:32
basically restate my objection that I had earlier when it comes
18:35
to this reputation evidence that we discussed at sidebar.
18:40
The defense is more than welcome to introduce reputation if the
18:44
foundation has been laid. At this point, there is no
18:48
foundation that has been laid. She can, the defense can call
18:52
Miss Pervat first, put her on the stand if she wants to do
18:55
establish that there's a self-defense argument and case
18:59
law shows that once the self-defense argument has been
19:02
laid, I think Brown V State and Strange V State is 1/2 of the
19:07
cases that come to mind. That when that self-defense
19:09
argument has been laid, then they can make the character of
19:14
the victim admissible in those circumstances.
19:18
There is no foundation for the the admissibility of that
19:23
character at this moment. Let's assume Mr. McDaniel does
19:27
that and he calls his witness and she tested, causes client
19:31
and she testifies that she acted out of fear and in part of that
19:36
her base is frightening. The way she did was prior
19:38
information given to her by Miss Lewis.
19:41
What is your position on the last question he asked?
19:44
Which which is not? Are you aware of the specific
19:47
information given by Miss Lewis? But are you aware of her
19:49
reputation in the community, which is a very different
19:53
question. So in this situation, we just
19:57
need to make sure that there is, what's the word for it?
20:01
There is a solid predicate for this reputation.
20:04
It's not based on just prejudice, bias or rumors among
20:08
the community. I don't know that there's.
20:11
That case we have to establish. The community.
20:16
Yeah, I think one particular case is, and I apologize for
20:21
mispronouncing the name Rick Turing, B State citation
20:24
66SO3D866200011 saying that reputation evidence must be
20:31
based on discussions among a broad, broad group of people so
20:36
that accurately reflects the person's character.
20:38
So. There's no basis that you've
20:41
established that she's aware of her reputation in the community
20:45
as a law at large for violence, this witness and or that Miss
20:50
Pravat was a reputation. That's a different question than
20:53
asking her if she was aware of a specific incident.
20:56
So you have laid the basis for that.
20:59
But asking her her reputation in the community is a question that
21:02
requires her miss Provat to know her reputation in the community.
21:09
And where did she get that from? So the last question is
21:14
troublesome. I think that's that's too far.
21:16
I do also agree with the state that you've got laid appropriate
21:19
foundation and show that this is a a the self-defense argument,
21:23
which you are essentially simply trying to do, but you haven't
21:26
called Mr. that first. So if the state wants you to
21:28
follow it, the procedurally correct.
21:30
I think they're they're accurate.
21:31
That's the that's the sequence it should take place.
21:34
And even when you do that, you can ask her where their specific
21:38
instances, the same questions you asked.
21:40
But that last question asking her reputation, the community
21:44
require a much broader foundation than you've
21:46
established. This witness hasn't testified
21:48
anything about her reputation in the community.
21:50
She's testified about specific acts, which is not the same as a
21:54
community reputation. Does that make sense?
21:56
It makes sense. I can just reward the question.
21:58
You can certainly, you know. So, Noel, are you aware of the
22:06
reputation in the community of of Ashley?
22:13
Yes, Sir. And during that six years that
22:15
you knew her, did you develop a reputation?
22:16
Did she develop a reputation that time that you become aware
22:18
of? During that six years that you
22:21
knew her, that reputation developed and your idea of what
22:24
her reputation is. Yes, Sir.
22:26
And that reputation is to say reputation of being violence.
22:30
Yes, Sir. And what are you basing that on?
22:33
What How? What are you?
22:35
What leads you to believe she has a reputation of violence
22:38
other than your? I mean, you obviously got your
22:39
specific incidents, which you you can testify to, but you're
22:42
talking now about her reputation in the community.
22:44
What are you basing that on? Also, during our time together
22:49
trying to rent a house, I had to do a background check on Miss
22:52
Nichols and she has a history of domestic violence.
22:56
And more specifically, what do you mean about history of
22:59
domestic violence? I know nothing about her history
23:01
at all. She's been arrested multiple
23:02
times for domestic violence with her ex-wife Angela.
23:08
She's got several other females that she has assaulted as well,
23:13
as well as myself and my child. And you think all this
23:16
information is well known in the community?
23:18
Yes, Sir. And that's what leads you to the
23:19
conclusion that she reached. Yes, Sir.
23:22
So this is kind of, I know we're getting things out of order.
23:25
So I, I, I agreeing with you that the appropriate sequence is
23:29
Miss Pravat testifies and then he could call this witness and
23:33
we could talk. We're going down that road even
23:35
though it's out of order. So what would the state's
23:37
position be? Or do you have further questions
23:39
for this witness or argument? I think I would just want to
23:41
elaborate a little bit more. She's mentioning about past
23:45
arrests when it comes to domestic violence.
23:47
She has no prior convictions other than the PTI that she's
23:50
currently on right now. So.
23:52
Defense agree with that. I don't have no reason to
23:55
disagree with that. So you can't mention past
23:57
arrests. That's not admissible.
23:59
Y'all want? Y'all want?
24:00
That kind of stuff. Or I thought.
24:01
We were just going. To leave it straight up straight
24:03
as she's got a reputation of being, you want specifics, so
24:05
we're coming in. The community has to be
24:14
established. Where is she getting your
24:16
information? I mean, I think she's getting
24:17
close. She has not been able to say,
24:19
First off, who's the community? What is her community that she's
24:22
getting this information from? All the stuff she testified to
24:25
there that she did a background research.
24:26
That's all. Here's.
24:28
And I wasn't going to ask for you those questions about it.
24:30
I'm just going to ask her. But that's the answer that.
24:32
She said I think that she can testify to specific acts and
24:35
that she can say I all the specific acts.
24:37
I communicated those to miss for that.
24:41
I agree. I'm going to determine that that
24:43
there's it's unless you have multiple witnesses in that
24:47
community to put on the stand and say the reputation, I think
24:50
the reputation in the community is a different, much different
24:53
question than was she aware of a propensity for violence?
24:56
Propensity and reputation two different things.
24:59
So if you change the word for term for a reputation, was Miss
25:07
Provat aware of her reputation and you change that was she
25:09
aware of her propensity? It's much less objectionable.
25:11
OK, so state agree we're. In agreement.
25:14
Yes. OK.
25:15
So then that remains, the following question remains.
25:17
I think procedurally you have the right to have Miss Provat
25:22
testify whatever her testimony is going to be first and
25:25
establish the foundation that you've referenced multiple times
25:27
and then come back to this witness.
25:28
Is that what you're asking Mr. McDaniel to do?
25:30
If it is her right to take the stand and testify to that, yes,
25:34
yeah. I think, yeah, we're fine with,
25:35
I mean, we're talking about taking her off the stand and
25:37
then proceeding with Miss Pravat testifying and then putting her
25:39
back on. Mr. McDaniel, you OK with that
25:41
procedure? So we get it correct.
25:43
Then what we need to do is bring the jury out.
25:45
Mr. McDaniel, you want to say something?
25:48
You know, I think they're going down the argument saying that
25:50
that Mister Vet has to testify for self-defense.
25:53
But there are some cases out there, and there's a specific
25:55
case, 412SO3D829, which essentially says it's Gonzalo's
26:02
V State, 6th Circuit DCA case and says a dependent is titled
26:06
to a jury instruction on this theory of the case if there is
26:09
any evidence to support it. No matter how.
26:11
Flimsy that evidence may be public to warn a self-defense
26:15
instruction. The dependent does not have to
26:17
testify at trial. His or her statement to the
26:20
police admitted into the evidence may be sufficient.
26:23
And this has nothing to do with whether she's entitled to
26:25
self-defense instruction. This has to do with whether or
26:27
not there's extrinsic evidence of knowledge of propensity for
26:29
violence. That's admissible.
26:31
And that is not admissible unless the defendant testifies
26:34
that she acted in reliance upon some belief that she had in the
26:38
basis for that belief is apples and oranges.
26:41
So her testimony is not amissable at this point.
26:44
You certainly can. Can say no further questions.
26:46
I may have a few questions a few minutes later.
26:48
Judge won't ask. Reserve the right to recall.
26:49
Or you can do that. But you can't ask for these
26:51
questions until Miss Pravat has laid an appropriate foundation.
26:55
That's my understanding of the law.
26:56
We'll reserve the right to recall the re honor perfectly.
26:59
OK, let's bring the jury back in, please.
27:07
You are entering the foreground. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you.
27:26
And we were in the middle of a direct examination.
27:29
And Mr. McDaniel, any further questions for this witness?
27:32
Nothing else, Your Honor, just reserve the right recall.
27:34
Any further questions for this witness at this time, Mr.
27:37
Mitchell? Not at this time.
27:38
OK. So, Miss.
27:40
Miss Lewis, youth testimony is complete at this time.
27:42
As Mr. McDaniel has said, he's reserved the right to recall
27:45
you. You may be recalled in just a
27:46
little while. So I'm gonna ask you to have a
27:47
seat back in that area with the other witnesses, and we'll call
27:50
you. They may call you back in just a
27:52
little while. OK.
27:53
Any other witnesses? Mr. McDaniel.
27:54
Aubrey Whitfield. Aubrey Whitfield.
27:56
Aubrey Whitfield. Miss Whitfield, if you'll stand
28:30
right there, we're going to ask the clerk to place you
28:32
underoath, ma'am, and then we will get some testimony from
28:34
you. Just a moment.
28:36
To have the evidence you're about to give is the truth, the
28:40
whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
28:42
Miss Whitfield, go ahead and have a seat, ma'am.
28:45
Make yourself comfortable. The attorneys may have some
28:48
questions for you, starting with the defense counsel, Mr.
28:50
McDaniel. Thank you, Aubrey.
28:55
Can you state your name for the record?
28:57
Aubrey, Jade. Whitfield, Aubrey.
29:01
How old are? You I'm 19 years old.
29:04
You go to school. Yes, Sir, I go to Chipola
29:06
College. OK, awesome.
29:10
Do you know Jan Privet? Yes, Sir, she is my grandmother.
29:15
And she's your grandmother, you know, Ashley Nichols.
29:17
Yes, Sir. And who is Ashley to you?
29:20
I think she's my cousin. What do you call her or?
29:23
I just call her Ashley. Just call her Ashley y'all Some
29:26
relations though and. Yeah, I've known her.
29:29
I've known her for like my whole life, but I've never really hung
29:33
out with her or did any of that. I usually just see her at the
29:35
store or something like that. Usually you've.
29:37
Known her your whole life. Yes, Sir, I'm.
29:41
Gonna go back to November 11th. Did you go to school that day?
29:45
Yes, Sir, I did. What time did you guys school?
29:47
I got out of school at 2:40 and it's about 20 minute drive to my
29:52
nana's house so I got there around 3:00 probably.
29:55
So you went to school that day and you got to school and you
29:57
went to your Nana's house. What happened when you got
29:59
there? Whenever I got there, I had
30:02
visited my mom because she was living there at the time and I
30:06
was going to see her and I was going to see my Nana for my
30:08
birthday because my birthday is November 14th.
30:11
And whenever I had gotten there, you know, I was there for like
30:15
probably 30 to 45 minutes. And the kids that live with
30:20
Ashley and Desiree, they were around the house never running
30:24
around with the dog. I think they had just rescued.
30:27
And the dog, it was running around, my kids couldn't get it
30:31
or whatever. And there was this guy named
30:33
Harold that was living there also.
30:35
And he had made a comment to one of the kids and he had said if
30:39
you can't get the dog to listen, then just put it down.
30:42
But he didn't. It wasn't in any kind of mean
30:44
manner. He just said it calmly, like
30:46
jokingly. And then after that, the kids
30:50
had went home, I guess after that, after they had gotten the
30:52
dog. And then they must have told
30:55
Ashley or Desiree what Harold had said.
30:58
And the next thing I know, Ashley's coming up to the house
31:03
and she's running up to the house almost.
31:08
And Harold was sitting in a recliner on the porch and she
31:11
comes up there and she's yelling at him.
31:13
And I had he, I guess he had been using the bathroom outside
31:17
and she didn't like that with her kids living there also
31:20
behind the house. So she come up there and she was
31:23
yelling at him. She didn't bother to like stay
31:27
calm at first. Anyway, she came up there
31:28
yelling at him and she was yelling at him saying why?
31:32
I don't I don't know if it's inappropriate or not, but she
31:34
was saying, why do you have your little thick out outside in
31:39
front of all the kids and everything?
31:41
And Harold, he didn't mean nothing by it.
31:42
And he was just like, like, I'm sorry, like I just use the
31:44
bathroom outside because he's always outside anyways.
31:47
And then so she was yelling at him some more.
31:50
And my Nana, she had been in her bedroom and she had heard all
31:53
the commotion outside. So she comes outside and she's
31:57
asking Ashley not know, she's not yelling at her or anything
32:00
like that. And she asked her, she said,
32:03
like, what's going on? Why are you out here yelling?
32:06
And then Ashley turns and starts yelling at my Nana because my
32:09
Nana was trying to stick up for Harold, like saying that's how
32:12
he was and stuff like that. So Ashley's yelling at my Nana
32:16
and next thing I know Ashley like lunges at my Nana and
32:19
they're just standing there and she lunges at her and the next
32:21
thing I know they're botting each other like grabbing onto
32:24
each other and then rob out. Whenever they started really
32:29
getting into it, they had they had like backed up in a corner
32:32
and Ashley had got my Nana at that time, like she was on on
32:36
top of her. And then my Nana was looking
32:39
around for something to grab because she was in the corner.
32:41
And then she seen a board right there and she picked it up and
32:43
struck Ashley in the head with the board because she was she
32:47
was in the corner and everything like that.
32:49
And then as soon as she struck Ashley with the board, Ashley
32:51
kind of stepped back for a few seconds and then she came back
32:56
like it was only a few seconds that she had stepped back and
32:58
she came right back on my Nana and was trying to fight her
33:01
again. And then they had end up fought
33:04
in and they got around the porch and everything like that and I
33:07
was scared. I was crying and I was like
33:09
asking them. I was asking Ashley like, Hey,
33:11
can you get off my Nana Like and then I was asking them to like
33:14
break it up and everything, but you know, I couldn't do nothing
33:17
about it. I didn't want to get in the
33:18
middle of it. And then as soon as they had got
33:21
broken up because Desiree was there to trying to get Ashley to
33:24
get off my Nana too. And then I also know my Nana has
33:27
a hard time, has hard time breathing and stuff like that.
33:29
She gets to like not too active, but you know, worked up and
33:33
everything. And then they finally got off
33:35
each other and then I guess Ashley turn around and walk home
33:39
and she got about a few feet from the house and then she
33:42
turned back around and she had made remarks saying to my Nana
33:46
that she was going to burn her house down.
33:47
And she had also said that she had my Nana had a heart attack
33:50
and died in her sleep. And it and it honestly hurt me
33:53
to hear that because I love my Nana and.
33:55
And that's how she was asked after she was fighting with her.
33:58
Response out. There she extremely how did, how
34:03
was her eyes? How did she appear Ashley during
34:06
this time? Ashley was, she was very scary,
34:09
honestly, and me trying to, I was asking them to stop.
34:13
I was honestly scared that she might, you know, try to lunge at
34:16
me because I was close to them because I was trying to break
34:18
him apart. But I was, I was honestly really
34:20
scared seeing her like that. And Ashley's wife was present
34:25
during this. Yes, Sir.
34:27
She's had a whole different version of this, so, but she was
34:29
sitting there, so she's seen all this.
34:30
Yes, Sir, she did see all of this.
34:32
OK. And I think she did admit that
34:33
she going to burn her house down, but what happened after
34:37
that? I mean, let me ask you a
34:39
different question. So are you aware of your
34:42
mother's health conditions? Of my mother's health.
34:44
Condition grandma, Your Nana's. I'm sorry.
34:46
Yes, Sir. What kind of health conditions
34:48
does she have that you know of? Well, I know that she's had a
34:51
stroke before and it was really hard on her.
34:53
I think she'd fell on a heater and I and it actually had burned
34:55
her. And then I also know that she
34:57
has trouble breathing and I think she has a fib, something
35:01
called a fib. And I think isn't that something
35:02
with your heart or it's. Yeah, I know, I know she has
35:06
that. And that's pretty much all I
35:09
know from there. And you're, you know, since you,
35:12
you know, grew up with her. The A-fib is her heart rate run
35:16
a lot and she just talk out of her mind sometimes and talk
35:20
just, you know, talk and talk and talk.
35:23
Yes Sir. I will admit whenever I do go
35:25
over there, I will admit she does kind of talk my head off
35:28
sometimes, but she don't. She don't mean no harm, but she
35:32
really can't help it. Does she repeat herself
35:34
sometimes? Over and over.
35:35
Yes Sir, she'll tell. She'll probably tell me a story
35:37
like 5 times with it. The same story over and over
35:40
again while I'm there. Right after one after another.
35:42
Kind of. Yes, Sir.
35:43
She's only drinking when she does this?
35:45
Or is it just that's how she? Gets not usually, not usually
35:48
whenever she's drinking, but you know, if she does drink, it does
35:51
happen too at both times it does.
35:53
Happen, but it's something that's normal for all the time.
35:55
Yes, it is normal for her to talk a lot and I've read.
35:58
Because these health conditions higher is her appearance
36:01
normally because I've heard stories about, well, she's her
36:03
face. Yeah, don't sustain that.
36:06
You're getting into your testimony, which we've done
36:08
multiple times through the course of this trial, which is
36:10
inappropriate. So please ask the question
36:12
without giving your own testimony.
36:13
Mr. McDaniel. Yes, Your Honor.
36:16
How is her facial appearances normally as far as color of her
36:20
cheats eyes, bloodshot eyes, glossy eyes?
36:25
Is that something normal? Because she's got it today.
36:27
So. Yes Sir, usually whenever I do
36:29
see her, her face, her cheeks usually are red and her face is
36:33
usually swollen a little bit and some yeah, sometimes our eyes
36:36
can be glossy, but honestly, yeah, she her face is swollen
36:40
and red most of the time whenever I see her Sir are.
36:42
They glossy today? Yeah, yeah, they eyes bloodshot.
36:47
Yep, a little bit. A little bit.
36:49
Yes, Sir. You think she's been drinking
36:50
today? No Sir, I don't imagine she'll
36:53
be drinking today with everything going on.
37:05
And you, you and Ashley y'all get along very well, is that
37:08
correct? Yes.
37:09
So actually, me and Ashley, we did get along very well, which
37:13
was I, I mean, I'm going to be honest, I've never in my life
37:17
seen her like so mad like that. I mean like I've heard stuff of
37:20
her getting mad, but I've never seen it myself.
37:22
And that day, whenever I actually seen it, it genuinely
37:25
did scare me. And I haven't talked to her
37:27
since. I haven't ever.
37:28
I haven't been around her since the incident happened was.
37:30
Your grandmother scared. Yeah, yes, Sir, she was.
37:34
And, and what made you believe that she was very scared of
37:37
this, this incident that happened a few days?
37:39
Well, she didn't expect it. I mean, I mean, honestly, I
37:42
didn't expect it whenever it happened and she had just she'd
37:45
been in the bed also. I mean, she didn't, you know,
37:47
she wasn't she wasn't prepared for this attack to happen.
37:49
And I could tell it whenever, whenever Ashley had had her in
37:52
that corner by the back door that I think I'm sure my name.
37:56
I thought it was over for her at that point.
37:57
But whenever she had seen that stick, she whenever she could
38:00
grab something to get Ashley off of her.
38:02
Yes, Sir. Thank you very much for your
38:04
testimony. Yes, Sir.
38:05
Thank you. Thank you.
38:06
Mr. McDaniel, Just second ma'am. Mr. Mitchell, any questions for
38:09
Miss Whitfield? Just.
38:10
A few brief questions. Afternoon Miss.
38:18
Whitfield, good afternoon. So you had a lot to say about
38:23
the incident that happened on November 11th.
38:26
That's that was the one involved in the stick, right?
38:29
Yes, Sir. Were you at Mr. Vet's residence
38:32
on November 18th? No, Sir, I was not.
38:36
So did you observe any of the events that we are here for
38:43
today? No, I was not there for the
38:47
event of my Nana having the gun. I was not there for that.
38:50
No, Sir. So as it relates to November
38:52
18th, you have no first hand knowledge as to what happened on
38:57
that day? No, Sir.
39:00
No further questions your. Honor, thank you.
39:02
May this witness be released. Yes.
39:03
All right. Thank you, Miss Whitfield, for
39:05
your testimony. That concludes your appearance.
39:07
You're free to leave. You're also free to watch
39:09
remainder of the trial if you wish.
39:10
Any other witnesses, Mr. McDaniel?
39:12
Yes, Your Honor. Thank you, Honor.
39:23
We'll call Christy Joe Alderman. Christy, Joe.
39:27
Basswood, I'm sorry. Spatford, come on up, please.
40:01
This pass for Roman do is just ask you to stand there.
40:03
We're going to ask the court to place you underoath and then
40:04
we'll get you to have a seat. OK.
40:18
Dispatch would just have a seat. Make yourself comfortable.
40:21
The attorneys may ask you a few questions, starting with fence
40:23
counsel, Mr. McDaniel. Is Bassford Key station name for
40:38
the record please? Christy Joe Bassford.
40:41
So I'm going to get something uncomfortable for you out real
40:43
quick. Like long time ago, you got in
40:46
some trouble, legal trouble. Yes, Sir.
40:48
You get convicted of a felony. I did.
40:50
You also been convicted of a misdemeanor involved in bad
40:53
checks or something is. That no Sir, just.
40:56
You sure? No, it's been a long time ago.
40:59
No checks, just trafficking felony 21 years ago.
41:03
You remember? I really don't remember.
41:10
It's been a long time ago guys. Sometimes I hate to go back and
41:14
try to my. Memories not as good as it used
41:16
to be. Talk to.
41:16
You about this? That's OK.
41:43
Back in 2000. 3. I guess I don't recall, but I
41:47
mean if it's in there. It's not I don't I should have.
41:51
The I wasn't on probation or anything for it.
41:53
That's all right, All right. So.
41:56
If you don't. Remember though, that's fine
41:58
though, all right, So. Long time ago.
42:03
So Christy, tell me about go back to November 18th, you were
42:16
at the dollar store. Yes, Sir.
42:18
What happened? I was at the dollar store.
42:21
It was just a few minutes before 10 PM when they close.
42:25
I pulled up. Let me let me get you out to
42:28
approach. Gives me just a SEC.
42:29
Let me get you out to approach. Good morning once again,
42:34
everybody. Welcome to TCF live on a Friday,
42:37
a Super Friday here. That's what we do at TCF.
42:40
We don't just do regular Fridays.
42:42
Once again, we're in the way back machine this morning.
42:44
This was yesterday afternoon, the second-half of the trial
42:48
that we started watching yesterday morning.
42:51
This is Judge Mercer in Florida. Long in the short of it.
42:55
The defendant is accused of firing off a couple of rounds in
43:00
the air while supposedly drinking.
43:04
So like, illegal brandishing of a weapon, illegal discharge of a
43:09
weapon, being all around a bad person.
43:13
That's pretty much it. So we're continuing with this.
43:16
It'll take up the majority of the morning, but it is worth
43:19
watching and I promised you we'd finish it.
43:21
So we are. But I've got my eyes on other
43:23
courts as well. So we'll we'll be able to go to
43:27
some other places as need be all.
43:33
Right, Mr. McDaniel, whenever you're ready, please.
43:35
Who read the Dollar Store? I don't know if it matters.
43:39
What? Kind of milk you get the dollar
43:40
store, anything you left the dollar store and went straight.
43:45
To. Jan's house, correct?
43:47
Right. Yes, Sir.
43:48
OK, as they were closing, how long were you at Jan's house?
43:53
What? What happened when you got to
43:54
Jan's house? Well, I was there maybe 10
43:57
minutes and previously at can I, can I recall the dollar store or
44:04
No, I, I was at the dollar store, yeah, I.
44:06
Knew you. Were there, I had walked out
44:09
and. No, you can't talk about what
44:11
happened that dollar store because it's not relevant.
44:13
So just answer the question he's asking you.
44:15
Ask the question again. Please, I was there.
44:17
Just wait just a second. Yes Sir, ask the question again.
44:19
Please just answer the question as directly as you can.
44:22
I was there about 10 minutes so. You got to her house.
44:25
I did yes Sir, 10 minutes before and what happened?
44:28
We were just talking and she told me about the incident that
44:32
happened the week before, which kind of made me understand why I
44:37
was being yelled out at the dollar.
44:39
Store The incident happened week.
44:40
Before she told me that they had got that Ashley had come to her
44:43
house and attacked her. She owed her rent money or
44:47
something like that. I'm.
44:48
Sorry, just like ma'am wanted to.
44:50
You've got to let them finish answering the question please.
44:52
Mr. McDaniel, I'm sorry he interrupted you and you were in
44:55
the middle of answering your question, so I'm going to ask
44:57
him to re ask the question. Let her answer the question
44:59
completely before you ask her next question.
45:01
Mr. McDaniel, what was the question you asked What
45:03
happened? When you got there, I apologize.
45:05
We were just talking and I didn't know about the incident
45:08
week before. I've been moving Michigan and I
45:11
hadn't really spoke much during that past week and we were just
45:15
catching up. She had told me that she came to
45:18
the home and attacked her and I don't think she had filed
45:23
charges or anything but she was distraught about it and upset
45:26
about it and we were just chit chatting like that and they,
45:33
Ashley and her girlfriend were coming through the drive through
45:37
driveway and she was. Yes.
45:39
I asked. Your question so.
45:41
You. Get there to you and her that
45:42
she seemed like she was scared. I mean, that's your impression.
45:45
That's why she's talking to you about it.
45:47
Not at the time. We were just chit chatting about
45:50
what had happened. She didn't, you know, really
45:52
portray any type of anything really.
45:54
We were just talking in general, like you and I were just
45:57
talking. She was just letting me know
45:58
what all had happened so. Before we move on in general,
46:01
does she normally leave her house unlocked?
46:04
Yes. Nothing's ever locked up, so go
46:07
on. What happened after y'all talked
46:09
about ADD someone pulled up into the drive.
46:11
Right, Yes Sir. A car had come in, then they
46:14
have to use the side driveway to get to the property in the back
46:18
and she had hit the brake line where were.
46:21
You standing at when she come in?
46:23
Oh, we were sitting at her dining room table, which has a
46:25
window to the front and a door to the back.
46:28
The door window, we could see the brake lights and Miss Jen
46:33
was like, oh, I don't know what she's doing.
46:35
You know why she's stopping and, you know, things like that.
46:38
So Miss Jen had opened up the back door and she had put the
46:42
brakes on the car again and reversed it and, you know, kind
46:47
of just yelling stuff out the window when she was here
46:50
yelling. Out the.
46:51
Window I heard her saying stuff like what do you want your bitch
46:56
and I'll kick your ass and stuff like that.
46:59
Miss Jim's like this is what she was doing last time.
47:01
She better not come up here and start no trouble with me at my
47:04
house again and attack me and I heard the girlfriend say don't
47:10
get out of the car, don't get out of the car.
47:12
So then they proceeded to go on through the driveway and her
47:16
constantly putting the brakes on and just yelling stuff out the
47:19
out of the window and just just. Did you hear threats?
47:25
Yeah, she was going to kick her a double S and yes Sir, you old
47:34
BITCH. That sort of thing.
47:36
Just obscenities from. Did you ever hear someone say if
47:45
you want to talk, we can talk? If you want to, what now?
47:48
You want to talk, we can talk. No.
47:51
That's not that's not what you heard being screamed out the
47:53
window. So.
47:56
She's y'all. She opens up the door and looks
47:59
like I see why she stopped in the yard.
48:01
There. She's screaming out the window.
48:06
What happened next? Did you see the doors open or
48:09
you heard her? The.
48:10
Driver door, the driver door, you could see the the light come
48:14
on in the car and the I could hear you could hear the
48:17
girlfriend saying don't get out, don't get out, don't get out
48:19
instead of the door shut again. And then they was driving on,
48:22
but she was still yelling things and it was too far.
48:24
I couldn't really understand what she was saying, but she was
48:26
still, she was saying something and, and.
48:29
What did Jan do during that time when she went out and heard her
48:34
stopping the door open yelling at her?
48:35
What? Did she said You better not come
48:36
up here? You better not.
48:38
What did she do? Next, I think Miss, I want to
48:41
say Miss Jan, that's when she went and got her gun and she
48:45
said if she comes in this house and attacks me again, you know
48:49
I'm going to stay in my ground and did.
48:52
She get the gun and walk outside.
48:54
She stood on the back porch and watched her driving on to watch
48:57
her driving on to the where they live and when she hitting the
49:02
brakes again and still yelling things out the window, you know,
49:06
Miss Jan, she stood on the end of the porch and she shot a fire
49:09
in the air. So she's still yelling stuff out
49:11
the window. It was yes, Sir, and.
49:13
Then she fires off. Right, That's right.
49:17
Yes, Sir. And they proceeded to get out of
49:19
the car and was going to their house going run, run.
49:24
She's going to kill us. She's going to shoot us, Miss,
49:26
Jan said. I'm not going to shoot y'all,
49:28
but you're not coming up here to start no more crap with me and
49:31
jump on me. And they went in the house and I
49:35
guess that's when they called 911.
49:38
Yeah. I say.
49:39
Yeah, I watched the. Videos with you and you.
49:41
Didn't really seem like you wanted.
49:42
They didn't ask you specific questions.
49:44
Really. You really didn't.
49:46
Did you really want to be involved with this?
49:47
No, I mean, of course, I mean, I'm Miss Jan's not in the wrong.
49:51
I don't believe she is. I believe that she was a scared
49:54
that she was going to come jump on her again.
49:56
I really do. And, you know, Miss Jan's like,
49:58
she's old. She's not, she's not.
50:00
She's elderly and she does have health problems.
50:03
You know, she that's a young girl jumping on her.
50:06
You know, I don't blame her, OK? And I, I think she was probably
50:12
drinking, but did you see her drinking?
50:14
I didn't see her drinking, so I mean, there was empty bottles
50:18
there. But like she said, she was
50:19
making pepper sauce, so there was probably 20 empty bottles.
50:22
And I know she didn't drink 20 bottles of wine that night.
50:26
I mean, there was, yeah, there was a bunch of them sitting on
50:28
the table where she had been washing them out, cleaning them
50:31
out for pepper sauce, that sort of thing.
50:33
My grandmother used to do. Rash.
50:34
Yes, Sir, You. Know just saying.
50:38
Just saying there was an objection Mr., Mr. an objection
50:40
I I. Think this for Daniel's just
50:42
adding in. I want to ask you limited to
50:44
questions, not commentary. Mr. McDaniel, go ahead, please.
50:49
So she was she making pepper sauce at night?
50:51
Yes, Sir, as far as I noticed that's what she was doing do.
50:54
You use hot Peppers or what kind of Peppers she used?
50:56
I don't know, I guess they were hot Peppers I assume look like
50:59
jalapenos and all sorts of Peppers.
51:02
Is there an aroma when you're bottling hot Peppers of that
51:05
comes? Out.
51:06
I don't think she was cooking them yet.
51:07
I think she was just washing the bottles, preparing to start it.
51:11
Yes, Sir. On a normal basis, is her eyes
51:15
normally bloodshot? Normally, yes Sir.
51:17
And her face is usually red. It's cause of her health.
51:19
Condition it is. Yes Sir.
51:21
Her blood pressures always skyrocket.
51:24
Yes, ma'am. Nothing else, Sean.
51:32
Thank you. Mr. Mitchell, any questions for
51:35
this witness? Yes, Your Honor, just.
52:03
Afternoon, Miss Bassford. So do you recall talking with
52:10
deputies from the Jackson County Sheriff's Office?
52:14
I remember them asking me if I saw her shoot the gun, which I
52:18
did up in the air. You.
52:21
You were. Actually, oh, I apologize.
52:24
No, go ahead. I mean, that's asked me that,
52:29
asked me where I was. I was standing in the house.
52:31
I was actually going to the bathroom to get toilet paper and
52:34
standing right there at the doorway beside the bathroom in
52:37
the back door where I could see Miss Jan and when it happened.
52:42
You were actually the first one that made contact with Deputy
52:46
Grover, is that correct? I believe I was standing outside
52:50
when the police pulled up. So yes, Sir, they asked me if I
52:52
had, if I where the shooter was, if I had the gun and I was.
52:55
It is not me. The guns inside with Miss Miss
52:59
Chan. So you actually said it wasn't
53:02
me, it was the lady inside. I said yeah, because they were
53:07
wanting to know where the gun was, who was the shooter, And I
53:09
said it's not me. I said the gun is inside with
53:12
Miss Jan. So you.
53:13
Deflected blame to Miss Jan. Well, she's shot the gun.
53:17
She was in trouble. I don't think that's in trouble
53:21
to shoot a gun in your home. I mean I don't see it but maybe
53:27
I'm wrong to be scared and shoot a gun.
53:32
Nonetheless. Do you?
53:34
Remember speaking to a deputy, Michael Swift.
53:37
I don't recall. You don't recall speaking?
53:40
I mean, I may have, I don't know the name, I if I if I maybe I
53:44
did. You, you basically said to him
53:49
that you have been there 10 minutes before the shooting
53:51
happened. That's what you testified to
53:54
here today, and that's what you told.
53:55
Him right? Yeah, just a few minutes.
53:58
That you were just stopping by to visit.
54:00
That's right. And it was your testimony that
54:05
in those 10 minutes prior, Miss Pervet was talking about the
54:08
incident that happened a week. Ago do.
54:11
You recall telling him that you had no idea about anything that
54:16
happened last week. I didn't know anything about I
54:19
had what had happened last week until that moment when she was
54:21
telling me just in those few minutes before that incident
54:24
happened. But you were inside the house
54:29
when Miss Pravat fired the gun in the air and you said that
54:36
Ashley Nichols, according to what you saw that she was just
54:41
breaking outside and just doing just breaking on the road.
54:46
You are aware of the condition of that road, correct?
54:53
Like I'm use a little dirt Rd. driveway.
54:56
You're not aware as to the bumps and the potholes and puddles
55:03
that are on that road. It's not that bad.
55:06
It's not that bad to you. No, Sir, I have a little car and
55:10
I go down it. So if you were to hear testimony
55:15
from Deputy Ryan Grover and Deputy Swift that you can't even
55:19
operate, that they operate on that road at a high rate of
55:23
speed, they would be lying. I didn't say they would be
55:27
lying, I'm just saying I can drive down that dirt road or
55:31
driveway fine. Ashley Nichols, did you ever see
55:39
her come up to the house? No, Sir.
55:42
Did you ever see her pull a weapon on this for that?
55:47
No, she was in her car driving to her home.
55:50
So she was in the car the entire time?
55:52
The door opened, I don't believe she got out of it.
55:56
The door was closed and then they were proceeding to drive on
56:00
to where there were living in the a trailer rental behind Miss
56:04
Jan. You said Miss Nichols never got
56:06
out of the vehicle. Not that I'm aware of.
56:10
That is what you just testified to, right?
56:12
Now the door opened, the light came on but I heard the
56:14
girlfriend saying don't get out, don't get out.
56:16
So the door shut and they proceeded on.
56:19
I'm not asking you about a light.
56:21
I'm asking, did you see Miss Nichols get out of the vehicle
56:28
and you basically gave a house tour to Deputy Swift walking him
56:35
around the inside and you took him to the back porch and you,
56:42
you may have knowledge it does the light on that back porch
56:45
work? I believe it does.
56:48
I don't think it did. I think it's one of those sensor
56:53
lights, but I believe it was undone that day.
56:55
The cord was hanging down. Think it came on.
56:57
You don't. Remember telling Deputy Swift
56:59
that it was broken. Yeah, well, I mean it broken the
57:04
cord out of it. Now it's your testimony that you
57:11
said Miss Provett was not drinking anything in.
57:17
Those 10 minutes I didn't see her drink anything.
57:19
You don't recall telling Deputy Swift that she had been drinking
57:24
wine all day? No, I wasn't there all day so I
57:27
don't know that she had been drinking wine all day.
57:29
I know there was wine bottles on the table.
57:31
She told me she was making pepper sauce.
57:34
She had a she always drinks water out of a big thermosy cup
57:38
and so I assume that's what she was drinking.
57:42
Listen my question again. You do you.
57:46
Remember saying to Deputy Swift in response to his question, Has
57:51
she been drinking? Do you remember saying to Deputy
57:54
Swift she's been drinking wine I think all day, maybe one or two
57:59
bottles. No, Sir, I don't remember
58:02
telling him that she'd been drinking all day.
58:04
I hadn't even seen her all day. Yara, can we approach right
58:08
quick? Sure.
58:17
Good morning once again, everybody.
58:18
Happy Friday, happy Super Friday.
58:20
Welcome to TCF Live. I hope you're all having a good
58:22
day so far. Once again, just a reminder,
58:25
this is the trial that we started yesterday.
58:28
We're in the Wayback Machine watching the afternoon session.
58:31
It will be concluded. It did get concluded yesterday.
58:35
So we will see the end of this here on today's show.
58:39
And yeah, great Granny, I think it's sidebar #3 so again,
58:47
welcome. I've got eyes on other courts as
58:49
well and we'll go to those when and if appropriate.
59:41
Just a moment. None.
1:00:36
It is about a 5 minute video, but I'm going to skip to the
1:00:39
point where it is crucial for this next line of questioning.
1:01:16
Miss Bassford, I'm going to place this right here for right
1:01:20
now. When?
1:01:21
Prompt is. So.
1:01:36
So I'm going to ask you one more time, Miss Bassford, did you
1:01:40
tell law enforcement on that day that you observed Miss Prabat
1:01:44
drinking? I don't remember telling that I
1:01:47
saw her drinking. I mean, the wine bottles were
1:01:49
sitting there. She had a cup.
1:01:50
I never saw her pour anything into the cup, so I can't say for
1:01:54
sure. I mean, I don't.
1:01:57
And I'm going to have you look at and play a video in an effort
1:02:03
to refresh your memory. OK, OK, OK.
1:02:06
He said phones have been sterilized.
1:02:08
They're clean and I will back it up.
1:02:14
And I guess for record purposes, we are watching a portion of
1:02:19
Deputy Swiss body Cam at body Cam time 225930.
1:02:28
Tell me if the volume is giving up convenience.
1:02:31
Password you. Need me to go higher?
1:02:39
Let me. Know.
1:02:39
No, it's fine. No, it's fine.
1:03:05
I have stopped the video at body Cam time 230005.
1:03:13
Well, that's what it said. So you just said that's what you
1:03:17
said. But that wasn't drinking all
1:03:19
day. But.
1:03:22
That said. But after viewing that video and
1:03:27
refreshing your memory is now your memory that you told Deputy
1:03:31
Swift that you observed her drinking wine and you said
1:03:35
somewhere in the area of 1 to 2 bottles I.
1:03:37
Mean if it was sitting on the table, I must have said it.
1:03:42
I mean, I didn't see her pour it in there.
1:03:43
I was just assumed Miss Jan likes to have a drink in the
1:03:47
afternoon, so relax her back if she did.
1:03:51
She did. I mean, I can't say that she did
1:03:53
for sure. The bottle was sitting there on
1:03:55
the table. She has a cup, my man.
1:03:58
I didn't see her pour it in there, but I assume because Mr.
1:04:01
N does like to have a drink it does help relax her back.
1:04:09
You testified. I don't think she was
1:04:11
intoxicated. She seemed fine.
1:04:15
You testified to Mr. McDaniel that you heard some yelling and
1:04:21
it was your testimony. You could hear what was being
1:04:25
yelled at, and yet when you were speaking to Deputy Swift, you
1:04:32
told him that you have no idea what was being said.
1:04:35
Well, I was just, I don't want to say.
1:04:39
I mean, I'd rather speak to a lawyer than come right out.
1:04:42
I mean and make sure. I'm having a hard time hearing
1:04:45
you, if you could speak up a little.
1:04:46
Bit please, Mr. Repeat your answer please.
1:04:49
Yes, Sir, I just wasn't wanting to say anything that might hurt
1:04:54
Miss Jan or myself. I mean, I heard things being
1:04:57
yelled, but I didn't want to say anything to the deputy without
1:05:01
counsel and knowing what what should be said and what
1:05:04
shouldn't be said. Without council president.
1:05:07
Without talking to Mr. McDaniel first.
1:05:10
You told Deputy Swift though, about everything that happened
1:05:13
that you observed. Yes, Sir.
1:05:15
Wouldn't that be something that you may want to consult Council
1:05:18
with? Sure, but you didn't.
1:05:23
I was just trying to save minimal.
1:05:30
Did you see the weapon involved? Yes.
1:05:34
Do you remember what kind of weapon it was?
1:05:36
A handgun of some sort. You don't know if it was a
1:05:39
revolver or a or a semi auto. I don't think so.
1:05:43
I have no idea really. Do you see Mr. Vet with the
1:05:47
weapon? Yes.
1:05:50
How would you describe her demeanor when she got the gun?
1:05:56
I think that she was scared that she was going to come up there
1:05:59
and start trouble again, busting her house and try to attack her.
1:06:03
She was distraught. And just, I think, you know, I'm
1:06:10
scared. You said she was scared.
1:06:15
I believe so. I believe she was nervous she
1:06:17
was going to come up there and start something with her again.
1:06:20
Miss Shane can't handle that kind of stuff.
1:06:24
She's a young girl. Miss Shane's an elderly woman.
1:06:27
I mean that. So if Mr. VAT said to deputies
1:06:34
post Miranda. I'm not scared of her in
1:06:38
reference to Ashley Nichols, is that correct?
1:06:41
I guess so. I was outside when they were
1:06:44
doing all the questioning. I don't know exactly what they
1:06:47
asked her, what they didn't ask her.
1:06:51
So it would be fair to say you weren't exactly sure if she was
1:06:55
scared of Ashley Nichols or not. No, I believe that she was or
1:06:59
she wouldn't have went and got the gun because she stated that
1:07:01
she's not going to come in here and attack me again.
1:07:04
So I believe that made her go and get her gun for protection.
1:07:08
Even despite the fact that you said they were driving away.
1:07:12
Now they reversed. They act like she had, like she
1:07:15
was going to get out of the car. The door opened.
1:07:17
You can see the light come on. You could hear the other girl
1:07:20
hollering, don't get out, don't get out.
1:07:23
So Miss Jan, that's about the time Miss Jan said, Oh no, this
1:07:25
ain't going to happen again. I'm not talking about that.
1:07:29
I'm talking about seconds before she fired the gun off.
1:07:33
You told Mr. McDaniel that? She had stopped.
1:07:37
No, no, listen very carefully. You told Mr. McDaniel that right
1:07:43
before Mr. Vet fired the weapon off, you could see out the back
1:07:48
porch door and you could see the tail lights of Ashley Nichols
1:07:53
and Alexis Nichols driving away. They're driving across the
1:07:57
backyard to their house. Their house, which is about 100
1:08:01
yards behind this for Vat's house.
1:08:06
Whatever about a football length of the field is, it's about a
1:08:09
football length, yeah. So Miss Nichols is nowhere near
1:08:15
this for VAT before she fires the weapon off.
1:08:21
It seems like she fired it before that, then when she was
1:08:24
over here more on the side of the house, Miss Jan fired it and
1:08:28
then they drove on to their house.
1:08:29
That's not. What you testified to when Mr.
1:08:32
When Mr. McDaniel. That they driving on to their
1:08:36
house, I mean. Best for how long have you
1:08:45
known, Mr. Vapp? She was friends with my mom and
1:08:50
dad 20 years ago and I've known her about that long.
1:08:55
Going on 20 years? Sure.
1:08:57
So you're good friends with her? I'd say so you.
1:09:01
Love her. Like her?
1:09:02
Absolutely. Yes, Sir, I'd.
1:09:04
Hate to see her get in trouble, would you?
1:09:06
I'd hate to see anybody get in trouble.
1:09:08
More particularly a friend of 20 years.
1:09:14
Just a moment, Your Honor. So As for one last question, did
1:09:30
you see her retrieve the weapon? What do you mean?
1:09:34
Did you see her? Where does she get the weapon
1:09:36
from? The back bedroom from somewhere.
1:09:39
So she got it from the back bedroom.
1:09:41
Where is that in relation to the kitchen table?
1:09:47
Closer than you and I, I mean, probably from here to Mr.
1:09:50
McDaniel, it's just right there where she keeps her stuff in a
1:09:54
safe. But you saw her retrieve the
1:09:57
weapon from her bedroom and bring it to the kitchen table
1:10:00
before she fired it off. No, I believe she she got the
1:10:06
the the the gun and then went outside and then she put it on
1:10:11
the table when she come back in. Did you see her reload the
1:10:17
weapon? No, Sir, I didn't see her
1:10:19
reload, no weapon. She didn't shoot it like two or
1:10:21
three times, but that was. Going to be my next.
1:10:24
Question. Yeah, Three times.
1:10:25
Yeah, that was it. No.
1:10:28
Further questions at this moment.
1:10:29
Thank you. Mr. McDaniel, any further
1:10:31
questions? This witness?
1:10:31
Yes. What was the first thing after
1:10:34
the shooting happened and y'all went in the house that Jan did
1:10:39
with the doors and windows? Locked them.
1:10:41
That's not something normally she does.
1:10:43
No, Sir. Sign that someone.
1:10:45
Scared. Yes, Sir, She.
1:10:47
Locked the windows actually. Yes, Sir.
1:10:49
Doors and windows. The windows.
1:10:51
In the house. Sir, how?
1:10:52
Hard was it to lock the windows in the house.
1:10:55
Well, you know, I guess the things.
1:10:58
Yes, Sir. Yeah.
1:11:06
Thank you very. Much did you say you had nothing
1:11:09
else, Mr. Mitchell? Anything.
1:11:11
One question. You remember telling law
1:11:18
enforcement that you were shocked when Miss Pervette went
1:11:21
and got the gun. No, I don't recall.
1:11:24
You don't recall that? I don't.
1:11:27
Everything happened so fast I don't remember verbatim what I
1:11:30
said. I mean, if I did, it's on
1:11:35
record. Then I guess I did OK.
1:11:37
I've never seen her pull a gun. I've never seen her distraught
1:11:40
like that. So I was shocked.
1:11:43
I mean, that's. So it's your testimony today
1:11:47
that there's majority of things you don't remember about what
1:11:51
happened that night. No, I remember everything.
1:11:54
I just don't remember verbatim what I said.
1:11:56
It was a lot of commotion. A lot of, you know, upset and
1:12:02
just distraught. You know, when you're in that
1:12:05
moment, you just, you're kind of just going with the motion.
1:12:09
I don't think Miss Jen did it out of malice or anything, but
1:12:11
just being scared and didn't want to be attacked again did.
1:12:21
You say her actions that night were very reckless.
1:12:25
I don't think they were reckless, no Sir.
1:12:28
She seemed to be knowing exactly what she was doing.
1:12:31
She was scared the girl was coming to attack her.
1:12:33
She's known for violence. She's seen her beat up her wife
1:12:36
in the backyard. Your Honor, Your Honor, I'm.
1:12:38
Gonna strike that statement. I'm gonna tell the witness
1:12:41
again, you can't testify. The stuff that aren't is in the
1:12:44
response to a question. There's no question we asked
1:12:46
about prior alleged incidents. Yes, Sir.
1:12:49
You have any more questions? No more.
1:12:52
Questions. This witness is completed, then
1:12:53
you can have a seat back in the audience.
1:12:54
Ma'am, your testimony is through.
1:12:56
Have a good day. You want to release from her
1:12:59
subpoena or do you want to subject recall?
1:13:01
You're free to leave, ma'am. Leave or have a seat and watch
1:13:04
any other witnesses Mr. McDaniel may have one more, Your Honor,
1:13:29
if I just take a break. OK, let's do this.
1:13:38
Ladies and gentlemen, we're going to take a recess.
1:13:39
This is probably going to be somewhere between between 5 and
1:13:43
20 minutes, depending on what all we have to cover.
1:13:45
We may can go ahead and resolve some other stuff to prevent a
1:13:48
break later on. So we're going to ask you to
1:13:50
have a seat in the jury room. Make yourself comfortable.
1:13:52
As soon as we can get started back up, we will.
1:13:53
OK, Just have a seat in the jury room, please.
1:14:18
All right, the jury's out of the room.
1:14:20
Mr. McDaniel, you need to talk to your client in private.
1:14:22
Yes, Your Honor. So if you want to step outside
1:14:24
and talk to her, we're just going to wait here while she
1:14:26
decides if she's going to testify or not.
1:14:28
And. What time do you want to spend
1:14:34
we're. Just going to wait.
1:14:35
We're not going anywhere. We're just going to wait because
1:14:37
depending on what she decides and what she decides, we're
1:14:39
going to decide if we're going to.
1:14:42
Yeah, sure. You got time to get a
1:14:43
restaurant? Sure.
1:14:45
You can ask the judge. So just an FYI, I'm going to let
1:14:51
it run because there's some back and forth, some things they talk
1:14:55
about. You can kind of see right now
1:14:58
how Mercer's just kind of had enough.
1:15:00
So, so we're just going to experience it as they did in
1:15:04
real time. Make sure that it's unlocked so
1:15:17
they can get back in. Gary.
1:15:19
He can't hear me, John. OK.
1:15:56
OK. She.
1:16:21
Hasn't taken her attribute. Yet.
1:16:47
1. You let down, I said.
1:17:54
It would love. What's up to her?
1:18:25
Real quick, while we're going through this bit of a quiet
1:18:27
period reminder In the Blind with Mike and Dan starts live
1:18:32
Monday, this coming Monday, 7:00 PM Eastern, 4:00 PM Pacific.
1:18:39
In the Blind is really cool. If you haven't seen the pilot,
1:18:41
go over there and check that out.
1:18:43
Barbara, if you could drop a link, that would be great.
1:18:46
Basically, Mike and I have no idea what we're going to talk
1:18:48
about until we start the show. We've got no prep, no safety
1:18:52
net, no nothing. Just here's what you're going to
1:18:55
talk about. Go.
1:18:57
We do 2 rounds of that and then we do a true false lightning
1:18:59
round. It's all sorts of fun.
1:19:02
Check out the pilot if you haven't already and then join us
1:19:05
on Monday. Please subscribe to that
1:19:07
Channel, hit the notification bell.
1:19:09
All those things help us get found quickly.
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We really want to grow that show.
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So, Jake, we know that the on the jury instructions draft on
1:19:20
Page 3, paragraph one on page three, I may have already taken
1:19:24
it out. Yes, I didn't.
1:19:25
Have here on order. Was the one too.
1:19:28
Can we get a court of copy? Of that so I want to make sure
1:19:30
that the 1 Pamela print out for me is your second one.
1:19:34
Do they both have the same number of pages?
1:19:37
The second one should have two or three more pages because it
1:19:41
has the self. Defense, how many pages does
1:19:43
yours have? The 11 I've got is 19 pages.
1:19:45
Is that the right one? If not, I've got your first
1:19:51
draft, which is I just want to have your first draft when we
1:19:54
start a charge conference, so. Does it 19?
1:20:05
Does it end with a? 2.2 instruction, all of them end
1:20:08
with a 2.2. Is it 19 pages?
1:20:10
19 pages, yeah, yes, so that's the second one and I.
1:20:15
Am, but 2.2 has already been given.
1:20:17
That's not going to be part of the final instructions, all
1:20:19
right. Take that out.
1:20:21
That was just a OK. So I'll have to send Lawrence a
1:20:25
copy so that we can update the jury instructions.
1:20:32
Thank you for numbering them. It just make as you have the
1:20:35
charge conference. It makes it so much easier if
1:20:36
they're numbered Lance, it's I know there's posing constant
1:20:40
number. Does it make it easy when you
1:20:41
have to read reorganize on the on the IT?
1:20:43
Doesn't. But when we're saying preferring
1:20:45
instructions, I agree because some instructions are multiple
1:20:48
pages. I'll.
1:20:49
Say, where's Lance? I want to give him credence.
1:20:51
He tapped him up for us. And sometimes you don't want you
1:20:55
to number them, but for me it just makes it easier to say
1:20:59
instruction 10.2 page 13, whatever.
1:21:03
Did you get them? I'm.
1:21:04
Right next to. You, I'm sorry, I don't know.
1:21:15
That's why they're signing this. This doesn't.
1:21:23
Oh my gosh. That's kind of amazing.
1:21:49
I sent him the very instructions and he hasn't received them
1:21:55
right next to me. You know, as I'm watching this
1:22:10
and I'm thinking about Mercer right now as.
1:22:13
You these are not right at all. The verdict forms not right.
1:22:19
The 1st 2 are the wrong crime. All right, real quick, just to
1:22:22
complete my thought, his He's being fidgety.
1:22:25
He's being impatient. It makes so much sense because
1:22:27
he rushes through his dockets every day so fast.
1:22:30
This has got to be driving him nuts.
1:22:31
Change. That.
1:22:32
Judge Yeah, we'll get that changed.
1:23:32
But you're going to take out. All right, so we're back in the
1:23:41
jury room with our defendant and our defense counsel.
1:23:44
And Mr. McDaniel, do you have any further?
1:23:46
The jury's not in here for the record.
1:23:47
Do you have any further witnesses you anticipate
1:23:49
calling? I spoke with my client at this
1:23:51
point in time, I, you know, she's having some issues and I
1:23:55
think it's best for her not to testify and she is following
1:23:59
that advice. And we're not going to testify
1:24:00
because I'm quite frankly, I'm afraid she's having some medical
1:24:03
issues going on. OK, well, you've created a
1:24:07
muddy. You just muddied the record
1:24:09
substantially just then when you said that.
1:24:11
So I have to make sure that she's freely and voluntarily
1:24:14
waving that right. And not because of medical
1:24:16
issues either. So, Miss Prevent, let me explain
1:24:18
it this way, ma'am. Most things in a trial are a
1:24:22
defense. Defendants, defense counsel's
1:24:25
decisions, who to call as witnesses, how to handle cross
1:24:28
examinations, what questions to ask.
1:24:30
Those are Mr. Mcdaniel's decisions.
1:24:32
That's his job. He's trained, he's educated.
1:24:35
He's had many, many trials. He's been doing this a long
1:24:37
time. There are two decisions that are
1:24:40
entirely A defendants. Now, he may ask for your advice
1:24:43
or give your thoughts or input. Ultimately, those things that
1:24:46
I've just mentioned are his decision.
1:24:47
The two things that are your decision are whether or not to
1:24:50
take a plea offer. That is always a defendants
1:24:52
decision and whether or not to testify.
1:24:55
Now, whether or not you testify, you can consider his input,
1:24:58
which is fine, but ultimately that is entirely your decision.
1:25:02
He can make a recommendation and so forth, but you've decided you
1:25:06
do not want to take the witness stand in this case, Is that
1:25:08
correct? Yes, Sir.
1:25:09
Now he's mentioned a medical situation.
1:25:11
If you have a medical situation, then I can get more information.
1:25:14
And that may be a justification for some kind of delay or
1:25:17
continuance. But I don't know if it's another
1:25:19
situation where you just feel extremely stressed, which is
1:25:21
probably natural, but ultimately you get one chance to make the
1:25:25
decision. So my question for you is this,
1:25:28
are you comfortable with your decision not to testify?
1:25:31
And that's what you decided, Correct.
1:25:33
OK, Thank you. Mr. McDaniel, do you have any
1:25:36
other witnesses? No, Your Honor.
1:25:37
OK. So let's look at the go ahead
1:25:40
and look at the jury instructions then.
1:25:42
But if you have a copy of the jury instructions prepared by
1:25:44
the state, we'll do that while the jury's out.
1:25:46
And that way we won't have to let them out again.
1:25:48
Does the state intend to call any of your butter witnesses?
1:25:50
No. Your Honor.
1:25:53
So Page 1 is just a standard jury instruction form.
1:25:58
Page 2 is a statement of the charge charges.
1:26:02
OK, we need to we need to address this.
1:26:05
It says discharging A firearm over residential property.
1:26:08
It's. Supposed to be.
1:26:09
On, the charging document says on and the verdict form says
1:26:13
over it's. Supposed to be on.
1:26:15
So the state's theory is you want to track the language of
1:26:18
the statute which says on own any property not over.
1:26:22
Is that correct? Correct, your Honor.
1:26:23
OK, so that needs to be changed to own and the verdict form also
1:26:28
needs to be changed to own. Yes, we just did that.
1:26:31
OK, improper exhibition of a firearm.
1:26:34
OK, it says firearm which is correct, but the verdict form
1:26:36
says weapon which is incorrect. Yes, it's.
1:26:39
So the verdict form needs to be changed to firearm OK and use of
1:26:42
a firearm while under the influence.
1:26:44
Any objections? Just do it this way.
1:26:46
Mr. McDaniel, if we get to something, there's an objection,
1:26:48
please let me know. Page 3 is instruction 10.6,
1:26:53
discharging a firearm in public to prove the crime, discharging
1:26:55
A firearm over there it is again, it's not charged with
1:26:59
that so we're. We're.
1:27:00
We're fixing it's got to be changed on Page 3 on residential
1:27:04
property, which what the statute says the state must prove the
1:27:07
following element beyond a reasonable doubt #1 Jan Evelyn
1:27:12
provat recklessly or negatively discharge a firearm outdoors on
1:27:15
property used primarily as a side of a dwelling.
1:27:18
Yes, the former #1 will come out after that.
1:27:22
The rest of that page is standard instructions.
1:27:25
Knowingly, yeah, knowingly does come out.
1:27:28
Because it was. OK, knowingly was only in there
1:27:31
in the part I've granted Mr. Mcdaniel's motion on Mr.
1:27:33
McDaniel agree that's got to come out then?
1:27:34
Yes, Ronald so knowingly will come out.
1:27:36
Thank you all for pointing that out.
1:27:38
Any other changes from the state on Page 3?
1:27:41
Not on Page 3, Mr. McDaniel Anything else on page three Page
1:27:45
4 is if you find the state proved beyond a reasonable doubt
1:27:51
that defendant was not lawfully defending law for property
1:27:54
should find her guilty father helps the charge of improved
1:27:56
beyond reasonable doubt state federal proved beyond any any
1:28:00
suggested change to page. 4 This was the original page 4 but now
1:28:03
it's gone to page. Three that will be part of the.
1:28:06
It'll come up when we take out that section.
1:28:09
But no objection to that instruction. 10.5 the next
1:28:13
charge prove the crime improper exhibition of a firearm
1:28:15
statements for the firing elements carried A firearm rude,
1:28:18
careless, angry or threatening manner.
1:28:20
It's on the presence of one more person and then the definition
1:28:23
of firearm. Any objections to the standard
1:28:26
instruction on page 5? Page 6 is instruction 10.16
1:28:31
using a firearm on end of the influence 2 elements normal
1:28:36
faculties. I was surprised that normal
1:28:37
faculties, impaired normal faculties are are defined in the
1:28:41
DUI statute, but they're not defined in this is either side
1:28:44
requesting that we pull that definition of normal faculties?
1:28:46
If either side's requesting it, we're not.
1:28:49
If you are, we need to have that discussion.
1:28:50
I. I was surprised it wasn't
1:28:52
included in here, but I I'm fine with just sticking with the
1:28:55
standard for right now. I mean, I've, we've had this
1:28:58
charge before, never went to a jury trial on it.
1:28:59
And I've, you know, I've always knew it was not in there.
1:29:02
I think there should be some kind of definition of it because
1:29:05
nobody knows what normal faculties are.
1:29:07
And am I correct that normal faculties are, are defined in
1:29:10
the DUI statute? Is the defense requesting that
1:29:12
we copy that exact same definition and put it here?
1:29:15
Yes, you are. OK, let's look at that
1:29:17
definition. I think it's, I think Mr.
1:29:19
McDaniel is, I think he's right. I think it's defined.
1:29:22
It it is I can recall. That normal faculties are
1:29:25
defined as ability to walk, talk, those kind of things.
1:29:27
I think that's in the statute. Let's see where DUI is at. 28.1.
1:29:32
28.1 Yes. And it's on the first page.
1:29:37
So Mr. Gill, if you could please cut and paste that definition.
1:29:41
Yeah, that's and and I didn't ask the state are is a state
1:29:47
opposed to inserting that? I mean, it's not the standard
1:29:50
it's pulling from, you know, sort of report said that was the
1:29:55
standard for that charge. I don't think we have big
1:29:58
objections. Given that, we'll pull that
1:30:01
definition of normal faculties which are included in 28.1 A and
1:30:07
insert it into 10.16 and. 10.16 Do you want it as the last?
1:30:18
Instruction. I would say yes, please, because
1:30:24
that's a there's three definitions before that, so
1:30:27
it'll fit perfectly right there. Next page is page 7 is 3.6 F
1:30:34
page seven and eight. That appears to be a standard
1:30:36
instruction for justifiable use or threatened use of deadly
1:30:40
force that's requested by the defense in this case.
1:30:43
Mr. McDaniel correct is wrong, and that's Mr. McDaniels, I
1:30:47
think is absolutely correct. What he said earlier, she does
1:30:49
not have to testify to get the instruction.
1:30:51
That was a slightly different question than trying to get in
1:30:54
these other alleged acts. So is the defense, excuse me, is
1:30:58
the State opposed to the Mr. Mcdaniel's request for 3.6 F?
1:31:03
We are not opposed to that. I will say that brief typo where
1:31:06
we're going to take out the over and put on in the very first
1:31:09
sentence right there. On residential property, there's
1:31:14
a or down here. So that was something that I was
1:31:20
hoping we would address while we're right here because I don't
1:31:24
believe. The second part should be
1:31:27
included after the OR. Yeah, I don't believe the second
1:31:29
part because there's been no apprehensible forceful felony
1:31:33
that's been alleged on behalf of Ashley Nichols in this manner.
1:31:37
So I think the only thing would be necessary to prevent imminent
1:31:40
death or great bodily harm to herself.
1:31:44
Sure, McDaniel, no objection. So we'll take out the word or
1:31:47
and the rest of that sentence. Yeah.
1:31:50
The next agreed in deciding whether yes agreed your.
1:31:53
And then we'll leave the rest of that as is second page, correct
1:31:58
if you. Find at the time, Yes, Your
1:31:59
Honor. So that instruction stays.
1:32:02
Page 9 is Rolf is instruction 3.7, which is the standard
1:32:07
instruction about reasonable doubt.
1:32:09
But I think that's where we get into some things have to be
1:32:12
included only if there's evidence of them.
1:32:14
So let's go to 3.9. Excuse me 3.7, 3.7 appears to be
1:32:25
up, 3.7 actually appears to be a all standard instruction.
1:32:29
It's all. Standard 3.8 weighing the
1:32:33
evidence. 3.93.9 Yep. 3.9 weighing the evidence.
1:32:38
The first five are standard 6. Has a witness been offered or
1:32:42
received any money, preference, treatment or other benefit in
1:32:44
order to get to testify? I've heard no testimony of that.
1:32:47
Anybody asking for six to be in there?
1:32:49
No, Your Honor. Mr. McDaniel, there you go. 6
1:32:52
comes out. Seven.
1:32:53
Is pressure a threat? I've heard nothing about that.
1:32:56
Any anybody requesting 77 will come out eight inconsistent
1:33:01
statement. There has been suggestions that
1:33:04
there's been inconsistent statement by Miss Bassford.
1:33:06
So that number 8 will become number six, felony, misdemeanor
1:33:10
conviction. There was evidence of that.
1:33:12
That'll become #7 reputation for dishonesty or truthfulness.
1:33:19
I don't remember any the other side requesting.
1:33:21
Was there any evidence of reputation for dishonesty or
1:33:23
truthfulness? Not.
1:33:25
For dishonesty or truthfulness, I think the only thing that was
1:33:27
alleged was violent tendencies. Number that one will come out
1:33:32
then Mr. Gill all of page 11 starting weather states medicine
1:33:36
burden approved. All of that is standard unless
1:33:38
I'm missing something. Anybody have any other suggested
1:33:42
changes to 3.9 weighing the evidence?
1:33:45
No, Your Honor. No, your Honor. 3.9 a defendant
1:33:48
not testify, the defendant becoming a witness, I guess may
1:33:52
need to come up. 3.9 Wait, wait, where we at?
1:33:56
3.9 a three-point 9A give either paragraph or both a defendant
1:34:03
request. Is that where you're at?
1:34:04
Mr. McDaniel on page 11. Back on page 11.
1:34:08
Oh yeah, import. About her becoming a witness.
1:34:11
Help me What where we at? What paragraph?
1:34:13
Paragraph from the bottom, it's in three.
1:34:15
So that whole paragraph should come out because she's chose not
1:34:19
to testify, correct? Thank you.
1:34:21
Catching that. I missed that.
1:34:23
Then we go to 3.9. A defendant not testifying.
1:34:29
Mr. McDaniel, do you want either or both or neither paragraph?
1:34:36
Both paragraphs, both the words give either paragraph or both of
1:34:40
the defendant request comes out, but both paragraphs will stay.
1:34:44
3.9 B Defendant statements that should stay.
1:34:50
I think that's a standard. Any objection of 3.9 B as the
1:34:53
standard 3.10 are most of those are standard until you get down
1:35:00
to #7, I believe. OK, so #7 is about juror
1:35:07
questions that will come out. We don't have any juror
1:35:10
questions and #8 will become #7 agreed.
1:35:15
Agreed. Cautionary instructions.
1:35:18
A standard verdict is a standard.
1:35:21
That's page 16. Page 17.
1:35:24
Submitting a case to a jury. That's all the standard.
1:35:30
The verdict form itself appears to have the right case number.
1:35:37
Miss Proveat's name is spelled the same way it is on the
1:35:39
information. I've already said that the state
1:35:44
actually I think I found, I found a inter directive verdict
1:35:47
on over residential property. So the only thing left is on
1:35:50
residential property. So we've already talked about
1:35:52
that and then the exhibition of dangerous weapons.
1:35:57
We're changing it to improper exhibition of a firearm.
1:36:01
Yeah, it doesn't make sense as written.
1:36:03
It says dangerous weapons of firearm.
1:36:05
So it's just going to be exhibition of firearm, OK or not
1:36:12
guilty. And we don't have usually have
1:36:16
lesser included as a misdemeanor court or any lesser included.
1:36:18
Mr. McDaniel, you're requesting I'm not aware of any.
1:36:21
I'm not aware of any. Lesser included that would go
1:36:23
with any. Of those charges, I wasn't aware
1:36:26
of anything. OK.
1:36:27
So I don't know that I have anything else.
1:36:29
Any other requested or suggested changes from the state, Mr.
1:36:34
Mitchell? Just kind of a procedural thing
1:36:38
is that when I do the verdict form, it's going to be 2 pages,
1:36:42
just the way it's coming out to be formatted.
1:36:46
Makes it look cleaner too. Count 3 will be on the last
1:36:49
page. OK, you.
1:36:52
Put a space right there between. No, not that one right there
1:36:55
above the best account. There we go.
1:36:59
OK. OK, so that appears to take care
1:37:16
of those. We do need 3 copies of the whole
1:37:17
thing, including the verdict form, please.
1:37:20
So what we'll do is when you tell me how much time you need
1:37:22
to make some notes for closing argument with the jury back in,
1:37:26
we'll let Mr. McDaniel rest on the record and then we will
1:37:30
stop. And then we will immediately
1:37:32
move into the standard instruction for closing
1:37:35
arguments, which is 2.7. I'll read that instruction.
1:37:39
Then you'll be given your closing arguments.
1:37:40
Obviously Mr. Mitchell goes 1st and Mr. McDaniel then Mr.
1:37:43
Mitchell, there's all of you requesting the podium for the
1:37:46
closing argument. Mr. Mitchell, you want the
1:37:49
podium? You want to use the podium for
1:37:50
the closing argument. Mr. Mitchell, focus on Mr.
1:37:52
Mitchell. Mr. Gill, Don't, please.
1:37:53
I'm having a conversation with him.
1:37:55
Do you want the podium up here for your closing argument?
1:37:57
No, Your Honor, I. Do want to bring something else?
1:38:00
Just a second. We'll get that in just a second.
1:38:01
Do you want the podium up here? Yes, sure.
1:38:03
OK. So, Gary, would you get the
1:38:05
podium up here please, Mr. Mitchell?
1:38:06
So we used a map as an exhibit to the jury earlier.
1:38:12
Should demonstrative aid? Yes.
1:38:14
Yeah, I think we may have to enter that into evidence.
1:38:16
Do you want to? It just needs to be entered as
1:38:19
an exhibit that was at trial, but it's not a piece of evidence
1:38:22
at. This it's it's the same way that
1:38:24
those photographs were introduced.
1:38:25
It's entered as a demonstrative aide.
1:38:27
We'll get a copy for the court. There has to be a copy for the
1:38:29
file. OK.
1:38:30
OK. Because you'll have shown it to
1:38:32
the jury. All right, So that's everything
1:38:36
I'm aware of. Mr. Mitchell, how long are you
1:38:38
requesting before we bring the jury in?
1:38:40
Are you ready or do you need a few minutes?
1:38:41
I'm ready. OK.
1:38:43
If we could get just 5 minutes or 510 minutes, judge to get the
1:38:47
jury instructions ready to go and.
1:38:49
And all that. I would appreciate that.
1:38:50
Mr. McDaniel, that's fine. OK, so let's do this.
1:38:53
We'll shoot for five. May take a little long.
1:38:55
One that as soon as we get the jury instructions ready, we'll
1:38:57
try to start some closing arguments and get this thing
1:39:00
moving. Thank you.
1:39:08
Not until the fence rests, because they can always change
1:39:10
their mind. As soon as everybody rests, then
1:39:12
they can't. Those will not go with the jury.
1:39:17
The two CDs with nothing else will go with the jury.
1:39:21
DVDs. I'm sorry, CDs or DVDs?
1:39:41
Stay calm. You know, this case started in
1:39:45
November 18th and 75 days later, less than that, we're having a
1:39:55
jury trial. It's extremely efficient, about
1:40:01
70 days. She was released.
1:40:12
They were. They were released though, but
1:40:15
they've been released. Well, if he doesn't, if he
1:40:18
doesn't rest, I'll let him move. I mean.
1:40:34
You can see I was about to say. If you OK.
1:40:40
I mean, that's. Fine, I guess that would be
1:40:45
exhibit. Yeah, I use letters for your
1:40:49
exhibits and we use numbers for the demonstrative aids.
1:40:52
So that's going to be states. Those other three were the
1:40:57
States and the other states. Four Stage 4 identification.
1:41:04
Is your identification sticker different than your every entry
1:41:06
sticker? Same sticker.
1:41:11
So identification means that it was used in the trial but wasn't
1:41:15
actually a piece of evidence. We always called it.
1:41:32
We should have the case about. 3:30 So unrelated to this, but
1:41:42
some interesting breaking news that just came out a few minutes
1:41:46
ago in the Luigi Mangione case, he's the guy who is accused of
1:41:52
murdering the United Healthcare CEO.
1:41:55
Judge has ruled they cannot seek the death penalty against him.
1:42:00
So I'm going to continue to let that story develop and we may
1:42:03
cover it later today. But I know there's some of you
1:42:06
out there who are following this case and that's interesting.
1:42:09
They cannot seek the death penalty.
1:42:13
I'll be good. He's just smart, smarter than I
1:42:18
am. Beautiful bud.
1:42:45
Ashley just put in, just put in the chat.
1:42:48
Must be a technicality. The story is breaking, but it
1:42:51
looks like the judge, Margaret Garnett, dismissed the federal
1:42:56
firearms charge, which is what carried the possibility of the
1:43:00
death penalty, but left in place the stalking charge, which can
1:43:04
bring a maximum punishment of life in prison.
1:43:07
So again, it's still developing, so I'll see if there's more
1:43:09
details later. It's like a mint made in a sulfa
1:43:21
factory. They they work on a cough you
1:43:31
just skip. Want to take a real common
1:44:02
cheaper brand? It's like a tic tac.
1:44:05
It does nothing for me for a call.
1:44:06
I think it's yeah when it has wild.
1:44:10
Cherries. It's a halls.
1:44:12
For that stuff there, you ever had a fisherman's friend?
1:44:20
But they work. Thank you as.
1:44:24
I looked over those, I think those have all the items we
1:44:27
discussed, correct? OK.
1:44:31
Thank you. But please review them, make
1:44:33
sure that. We Austin, I just was quickly
1:44:38
discussing breaking news in the Luigi Mangione case.
1:44:43
A judge has thrown out the federal firearms charge against
1:44:46
him, which means they cannot seek the death penalty against
1:44:49
him. Again, this is breaking.
1:44:51
I'm going to see if there's more information that becomes of
1:44:54
that. And if there is, we might
1:44:55
discuss it deeper later. But it's just something I shared
1:44:58
because I know a lot of people are following that.
1:45:23
OK. I've had a chance to look at the
1:45:43
jury instructions. They appear to me to match what
1:45:47
we've gone over and agreed to. Any other requested or suggested
1:45:52
changes to the instructions from the state?
1:45:54
No, Your Honor, from the defense.
1:45:55
No, Your Honor. All right.
1:45:57
So, Mr. Mitchell, on behalf the state, Are you ready to bring
1:46:02
the jury in? And give them the closing
1:46:05
argument instruction and the the new closing arguments.
1:46:08
Yes, Your Honor. Mr. McDaniel, Are you ready?
1:46:10
Ready. All right, Thank you.
1:46:11
So take your space if you'd please bring the jury in the
1:46:14
courtroom. Jury.
1:46:21
In the courtroom. All right, ladies and gentlemen
1:46:40
of the jury, please be seated. We were able to take care of a
1:46:45
lot of things outside of your present.
1:46:47
So we are about ready to move this thing along.
1:46:51
And I believe at the time we were took the recess, Rich
1:46:54
McDaniel was I'm going to make a decision whether he had any
1:46:57
further witnesses. Any further witnesses from the
1:46:58
defense? Mr. McDaniel, you are the
1:47:00
defense rests. Thank you.
1:47:01
Mr. Mitchell, any rebuttal witnesses?
1:47:03
No. Your Honor.
1:47:04
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen of the
1:47:07
jury, both the State and the defendant have now arrested
1:47:10
their case. The attorneys will now present
1:47:12
their final arguments. Please remember that what the
1:47:15
attorneys say is not evidence or your instruction on the law.
1:47:19
However, do listen closely to their arguments.
1:47:21
They are intended to aid you in understanding the case.
1:47:24
Each side will have equal time, but the state is entitled to
1:47:27
divide this time between an opening argument and a rebuttal
1:47:30
argument after the after the defense has given its closing
1:47:34
argument. Mr. Mention.
1:47:38
Thank you to the end, ladies and
1:47:52
gentlemen. And before, before you go into
1:47:59
the backroom to deliberate, I just wanted to run through a
1:48:04
couple of things that the judge is going to read out to you and
1:48:08
go over what you have heard today.
1:48:12
So when you go into the backroom, you're going to have
1:48:15
two questions on your mind. Was there a crime committed and
1:48:21
in this case did Jan Pravat commit the crime?
1:48:25
And in this case there's three. The first one is discharging a
1:48:32
firearm on residential property. To prove the crime of
1:48:39
discharging a firearm on residential property, we as the
1:48:42
state have the burden of proven beyond a reasonable doubt that
1:48:48
Jan Evelyn Pravat recklessly or negligently discharged a firearm
1:48:54
outdoors on property used primarily as a site or as the
1:48:59
site of a dwelling. And you've heard all those words
1:49:04
be mentioned today through the testimony.
1:49:07
You've heard recklessly, which means with a conscience and
1:49:11
intentional indifference to the consequences.
1:49:14
You heard Deputy Grover, you heard Deputy Swift come up here
1:49:17
and say a fire in a firearm while under the influence,
1:49:22
that's reckless. Fire in a firearm in the
1:49:26
blinding dark, that's reckless. Another word that you didn't
1:49:35
hear a lot, but it's very important to this charge is
1:49:40
negligently. Negligently means failing to use
1:49:44
reasonable care under the circumstances.
1:49:49
You all know firearms are dangerous.
1:49:52
There is a reasonable care that comes with handling, handling a
1:49:56
firearm. And I ask you this question, do
1:50:02
you think it's a good idea to fire a firearm off in the air at
1:50:07
10:30 at night? Keep that in your mind when
1:50:10
you're going through your deliberation.
1:50:14
Now, dwelling, we heard a lot about property houses.
1:50:21
This may be the first time you're actually hearing about
1:50:23
what a dwelling is, and you're going to hear the judge
1:50:26
emphasize this again. But just for right now, a
1:50:30
dwelling means a building or conveyance of any kind,
1:50:34
including any attached porch, whether the building or
1:50:38
conveyance is temporary or permanent, mobile or immobile,
1:50:43
which has a roof over it, including a tent, and is
1:50:46
designed to be occupied by people lodging there in at
1:50:50
night. There's no question that the
1:50:54
there's no issue when it comes to a dwelling.
1:50:58
You heard so much testimony about a porch, whether it be the
1:51:04
front or the back porch. You've heard them say that this
1:51:08
where the shots were fired off was Miss Pervet's residence.
1:51:13
Keep that in mind. Now, what is a firearm?
1:51:17
A firearm is any weapon, including a starter gun.
1:51:21
You know what, right quick, I just noticed.
1:51:24
Let me fix that for you so it makes it easier for you to seek.
1:51:32
A firearm is any weapon which includes a starter gun which
1:51:37
will, is designed to, or may readily be converted to expel a
1:51:43
projectile by the action of an explosive.
1:51:47
The term firearm does not include an antique firearm
1:51:50
unless that antique firearm is used in Commission of a crime.
1:51:54
There's no question that a firearm was used in this manner.
1:51:59
You heard that from Mr. Batt's own words.
1:52:02
You heard that from the testimony involved.
1:52:04
More specifically, it's a 38 revolver.
1:52:07
There's no question. Now, the defense may touch on
1:52:16
this a little bit more, but I'll go ahead and let you know about
1:52:18
it. When it comes to discharging a
1:52:21
firearm on residential property, remember that it is a defense to
1:52:27
that particular crime if the defendant was lawfully defending
1:52:31
life or property and if you find that the state has proven beyond
1:52:37
a reasonable doubt that the defendant was not lawfully
1:52:41
defending life or property. You should.
1:52:43
Find her guilty if all of the elements of the charge have been
1:52:47
proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
1:52:50
However, if the state has failed to prove beyond a reasonable
1:52:54
doubt that the defendant was not lawfully defended by, I
1:53:01
apologize. That may be a typo.
1:53:02
Right there. It may be that the defendant was
1:53:05
lawfully defending life or property.
1:53:07
You should find her not guilty. I'll put it as simple as this.
1:53:14
You heard the testimony of Ashley and Alexis Nichols.
1:53:18
They never approached Mr. Batts house.
1:53:22
They never antagonized her in any way that night.
1:53:26
They were just going home. They were driving away.
1:53:30
From Miss Pervet's residence. We'll say stuff all the time.
1:53:34
People say words all the time. It doesn't mean that the threats
1:53:42
or the idea of a threat is there if it's not reasonable.
1:53:48
Miss Pervet testimony put on by the defense saying that Miss
1:53:55
Pervet is a fear for her life that night.
1:53:59
But keep this in mind. Is it really a threat?
1:54:03
Is there really fear involved if the threat is going away from
1:54:09
you? Remember reasonable apprehension
1:54:13
of a threat. Now let's go on to charge #2
1:54:19
improper exhibition of a firearm.
1:54:23
To prove the crime of an improper exhibition of a
1:54:26
firearm, the state has to prove three elements beyond a
1:54:30
reasonable debt. We have to prove that Jan Evelyn
1:54:33
Corvette had or carried A firearm.
1:54:36
She admits to that. She says it's my 38.
1:54:39
I shot it in the air. Jan Evelyn Corvette exhibited
1:54:43
the firearm in a rude, careless, angry or threatening manner.
1:54:49
What is the testimony of Ashley and Alexis say?
1:54:51
She was just standing there posturing in a bully like way,
1:54:56
an angry, threatening manner. And there's that word again,
1:55:01
careless. And finally she did so in the
1:55:06
presence of one or more persons. That's a testimony.
1:55:11
Miss Christy Joe Bassford, she puts herself there.
1:55:14
She says she was there. She is the person that is in the
1:55:20
presence of Mr. VAT when she fires the firearm.
1:55:25
And there is the definition of firearm again.
1:55:28
I'm not going to read it again. Judge will go over it again.
1:55:32
But it's the same definition you heard in the previous slide.
1:55:38
And finally, using a firearm while under the influence.
1:55:42
To prove the crime of using a firearm while under the
1:55:45
influence, the state must prove 2 elements beyond a reasonable
1:55:48
doubt. Jan Evelyn Pervet used a
1:55:51
firearm. Again, there's no question.
1:55:55
That she used the firearm. And two.
1:55:58
Jan Evelyn Gravatt was under the influence of an alcoholic
1:56:02
beverage, but affected to the extent that her normal faculties
1:56:07
were. Enhanced.
1:56:08
When? Using the firearm now it's not
1:56:12
in this slide because for some. Reason it wasn't.
1:56:14
Safe. But normal faculties?
1:56:17
You will hear the definition of what normal faculties are from
1:56:20
the judge. He will tell you what
1:56:23
constitutes normal faculties. But you heard the testimony of
1:56:29
Deputy Swift, a man with an extensive knowledge and training
1:56:34
of conducting DUI investigations, a man who
1:56:39
understands when he sees signs of impairment.
1:56:43
And you heard him testify that based on his training and
1:56:47
experience, Jan Provett's faculties were impaired on that
1:56:51
night. She was intoxicated, and she
1:56:54
used a firearm while she was under the influence.
1:56:59
Again, there's the definition of firearm.
1:57:03
That definition applies to all three of these counts.
1:57:06
You'll hear it again. There it is again, just so you
1:57:09
can know. It's going to be there.
1:57:15
Now a couple more things when it comes to discharge use.
1:57:21
Of a fire. That.
1:57:23
Means to discharge. A firearm or to have a firearm
1:57:27
readily accessible for immediate discharge.
1:57:30
Christy Bastard. Said sorry.
1:57:32
Grab it from the backroom. Bring it to the kitchen table.
1:57:36
Get out of the. Bag get it ready for she had it
1:57:39
readily accessible for immediate discharge and she discharged the
1:57:43
firearm. There's no question when it
1:57:45
comes to that and readily accessible for immediate
1:57:50
discharge loaded and in a person's hands.
1:57:56
Now those are the definitions of the charges that you'll be
1:58:02
determining if the state has proven beyond a reasonable
1:58:05
doubt. And you're going to do that by
1:58:07
weighing the evidence how we we touched on this when it came to
1:58:13
jury selection. How do you weigh the evidence?
1:58:17
Well, you asked yourself, did the witnesses seem to have an
1:58:21
opportunity to see and know the things about which the witness
1:58:26
testified? Try to remember the testimony of
1:58:30
Ashley, Alexis and Jacobi. They saw, well, two of them saw
1:58:39
the muzzle flash from the firearm be fired off.
1:58:44
All three heard these shots get fired off.
1:58:48
They could tell you it was about three shots.
1:58:50
They could even tell you how they were fired in succession.
1:58:54
You know who couldn't remember how many times they were fired?
1:58:58
Jamper bad. You heard the testimony of
1:59:01
Deputy Swift. You saw the body Cam about how
1:59:04
many times she kept tripping over her own words about how
1:59:06
many times she shot. She was the one that admitted to
1:59:11
using the. Fire and she's still.
1:59:13
A straight answer. Keep that in mind.
1:59:18
Did the witnesses seem to have an accurate memory?
1:59:21
Now, I believe there's another question that's going to come
1:59:24
into play when it comes to accurate memory.
1:59:27
But when you're thinking about accurate memory, you have to
1:59:31
think about did the testimony line up with another person's
1:59:37
testimony? Ashley, Alexis, Jacoby, their
1:59:41
testimony all seem to line up. They seem to have an accurate
1:59:45
reflection of what happened that night.
1:59:47
You know who did it? Chrissy Bassford.
1:59:51
Chrissy Bassford couldn't recall most of the stuff that happened
1:59:55
that night. You heard from Aubrey, you heard
2:00:02
from the granddaughter of Mr. Vatt.
2:00:05
She testified as something that happened a week ago.
2:00:08
She was not there November 18th. We're not here for what happened
2:00:12
November 11th. We're here for what happened on
2:00:15
November 18th. Remember that.
2:00:20
Were the witnesses honest and straightforward with the
2:00:23
attorney's questions? That's the one I was just
2:00:26
talking about. Do they line up and were they
2:00:28
honest with each person with the attorney's questions?
2:00:34
Remember their testimonies. Try to try to evaluate who was
2:00:38
honest, who was straightforward and who was not.
2:00:43
Did the witnesses have some interest in how the case should
2:00:46
be decided? I'll go back to Christy
2:00:49
Bassford. Remember when I asked her how
2:00:52
long have you known Mr. VAT? 20 years.
2:00:57
Been good friends with her. I love her as a friend, maybe
2:01:02
even considering she may be family that close.
2:01:07
Who doesn't want to see Miss Prabat get in trouble?
2:01:11
Miss Bastard? And do the witnesses testimony
2:01:16
agree with the other testimony and other evidence in the case?
2:01:21
I've said what any is said when it comes to the testimony, line
2:01:24
it up. That's up for you to determine
2:01:26
who's credible and who's not when it comes to their
2:01:29
testimony. Now, the judge is going to
2:01:35
elaborate more on what reasonable doubt is.
2:01:38
You hear that statement all the time.
2:01:40
You've heard it from me, you've heard it from the court, you've
2:01:42
heard it from the defense. Reasonable doubt, What does that
2:01:46
really mean? Well, the definition will be
2:01:49
given by the judge. But to sum it all up, reasonable
2:01:53
doubt only applies to the elements, only those elements
2:01:57
that I mentioned earlier when I was talking about the charges.
2:02:00
It is not a mere possible doubt. It's not a speculative doubt.
2:02:07
It's not an imaginary doubt. It's not a forced doubt.
2:02:11
Remember that if you have an abiding conviction of guilt,
2:02:17
once you look at the facts and evidence, you must vote guilty.
2:02:24
Now, the judge will go over these rules for deliberation,
2:02:29
but I'm going to stress this is the most important rule when it
2:02:33
comes to deliberations. You must follow the law.
2:02:40
This case must be decided only upon the evidence presented to
2:02:45
have no sympathy, bias or prejudice.
2:02:50
You heard testimony relating to an incident that happened a week
2:02:55
prior to this incident. You her testimony talking about,
2:03:00
oh, this person acts this way, this person acts that way.
2:03:05
They're trying to play on your sympathy, they're trying to play
2:03:08
on your empathy, they're trying to push bias and they're trying
2:03:12
to put prejudice on you. The most important thing when it
2:03:16
comes to ruling on deliberation, don't decide this case on
2:03:21
sympathy, bias or prejudice. Decide this on the law only on
2:03:28
the facts that are presented to me.
2:03:33
Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Daniel's going to get a chance
2:03:36
to come up here. He's going to say what he wants
2:03:39
to say. But if this is the last time I
2:03:43
get to speak to you, it might not be.
2:03:45
But if it is, appreciate your time and effort being here with
2:03:48
us today. I'm sure it was a lot warmer in
2:03:50
here than it is outside. But.
2:03:53
I'm going to leave you with one phrase, one phrase that is very
2:03:58
important that I want you to keep in mind when it comes to
2:04:01
this case. What goes up must come down.
2:04:08
What goes up must come down. And on November 18th, 2025, Mr.
2:04:15
Vet shot that weapon up. Those bullets went up.
2:04:19
No one knows where they came. Now think about.
2:04:22
That. Thank you.
2:04:26
Thank you Mr. Mitchell, Mr. McDaniel, thank you.
2:04:34
So thank you all for being patient today.
2:04:40
Y'all been a wonderful jury. I know y'all listen to
2:04:43
everything. I've kind of glanced over there
2:04:44
before and I see y'all taking notes and listen to what's going
2:04:47
on. Jan appreciates it.
2:04:50
I appreciate it. The court system appreciates it.
2:04:52
Y'all did a great job as part of being a citizen of coming and
2:04:54
listening to cases like this. Because you make decisions in
2:04:57
the community, whether someone's guilty or not guilty, that's
2:04:59
what your decision is. You make those decisions.
2:05:02
A lot of people think the judge makes those decisions.
2:05:04
Attorneys or cops make those decisions.
2:05:06
No, you make those decisions. I appreciate you for being here
2:05:09
today. I'm going to go back to my story
2:05:12
that I initially told you about Mr. Pittman.
2:05:14
Great old man. I love him to death.
2:05:16
That I thought I was. Going to take a fight with my
2:05:18
uncle gave me a quick little lesson real quick.
2:05:19
Like you don't start a fight with an old man because he can't
2:05:23
fight, but he can't kill you. Now luckily no one's died on
2:05:28
this right here instance. I don't think Jan intended at
2:05:31
all. Her intention was exactly what
2:05:33
it was. Scare her.
2:05:35
Get away from me. Don't they realize if you come
2:05:37
into my house and attack me again, something's going to
2:05:39
happen? Now, truthfulness, If she come
2:05:42
back in the house again, attacked her, would she shoot
2:05:44
her? I don't think so.
2:05:45
I don't think she would. She's her family.
2:05:47
She loves her. That's not going to happen.
2:05:50
But she wants to. She wants her not to be
2:05:53
attacking her in her house. You heard all the evidence come
2:05:56
in. You heard Jake talk about, you
2:05:58
know, well, this person might have been saying this and this
2:06:01
person may have not been credible.
2:06:05
You know, their whole statements all stuck on one little bit of
2:06:09
credibility, which was if you want to talk, we can talk.
2:06:15
If you believe that's what was said that night, Well, I got
2:06:20
some land. I'll say here, that's what
2:06:23
Alexis, that's what Alex said. If you believe we want to talk,
2:06:26
we can talk. I was right after she threatened
2:06:30
to burn her house down and kill her the week prior and.
2:06:35
Your Honor, can we stop by right quick?
2:06:37
Sure. Well, they're at sidebar
2:06:47
Reminder. Monday in the Blind with Mike
2:06:50
and Dan goes live for the first time. 7:00 PM Eastern, 4:00 PM
2:06:54
Pacific. It is on its own channel if you
2:06:56
scroll through the chat. A link has been dropped for that
2:06:59
once or twice this morning. Hi Daniel.
2:07:03
So please head over there and sub if you haven't already.
2:07:06
You also heard evidence of threats to kill her that night
2:07:11
from Christy Joe. She you know, some of her
2:07:18
statements may have been a little bit off.
2:07:19
Things happen in the moments of times.
2:07:22
Memories are not exact. I know we heard several
2:07:25
statements about her being off the porch a long ways.
2:07:29
You know, most of the statements all were she was standing on the
2:07:31
porch. So many statements.
2:07:34
That's all kind of normal. But the real question here is,
2:07:37
you know, when you go through these charges, self-defense.
2:07:40
I mean, if you believe she's using self, if you believe she's
2:07:43
scared and she's using self-defense, it's over with.
2:07:47
Every charge is gone. Yeah, you stop right there.
2:07:50
You'll go through these jury instructions that make it quite
2:07:53
easy for you. If you believe this is
2:07:54
self-defense, if you believe that she has a, if it's
2:07:57
reasonable that she's reasonably scared her person, if she, if
2:08:00
she in her condition, her medical conditions is reasonably
2:08:05
scared from her, it's over. Not guilty, come back and it's
2:08:09
over with. If you believe it's not
2:08:11
self-defense and go through every charge and see if they've
2:08:13
met the elements, I suspect you. I mean, I don't know.
2:08:17
I think you have a hard time going through that self-defense
2:08:19
and saying she has no right to be fearful of this girl who had
2:08:22
just attacked her a week prior. The officers, God bless some
2:08:32
great officers and these are some good officers that was up
2:08:34
here. I don't want to say anything bad
2:08:36
about them. Really good officers.
2:08:37
We got some good officers in Jackson County.
2:08:41
But I asked officers, quite frankly, you know, is it illegal
2:08:45
drink alcohol and use a gun? Both of them said yes.
2:08:49
And Jake put that I wish I could do that fancy stuff he does with
2:08:53
the. Higher Putin stuff.
2:08:55
But he puts the instructions right up there with y'all and it
2:08:57
clearly says drinking alcohol and using a weapon is not what a
2:09:01
crime is. Your normal faculties have to be
2:09:03
impaired. Your jury instructions will have
2:09:06
what those normal faculties are. Can you walk?
2:09:08
Can you talk? You've seen the video.
2:09:10
She's got her hands behind her back walking at a few instances
2:09:14
at a lightning speed. I thought man she's walking
2:09:16
fast. I was watching the video when
2:09:17
they fight it while it goes. She wasn't tripping they said
2:09:20
but she was swaying. I didn't see him swaying.
2:09:23
Where eyes bloodshot. Absolutely they were.
2:09:25
I had never seen her where eyes were not bloodshot.
2:09:27
Their bloodshot right now. They're watery right now.
2:09:30
That's what they testified to. Was she drinking?
2:09:33
She probably had been drinking some.
2:09:34
Was she intoxicated to a point their normal faculties were
2:09:37
repaired? I didn't see anything.
2:09:38
She's clearly able to walk. She's clearly able to handle a
2:09:40
gun, shoot it straight up in the air for warning signs and take
2:09:44
the gun back inside. Now she was stressed out that
2:09:46
she'd be loaded right then. She don't recall these things
2:09:49
she said on the video. She just confused in a very
2:09:52
stressful situation. Things get muddled and she's
2:09:55
clearly confused. I mean, it's it's a difficult
2:09:58
situation. I don't think Jan would like to
2:10:01
be put back in that situation. It's probably the first time in
2:10:05
her, you know, 60s plus years that she's been in a situation
2:10:08
like this. I don't, I don't think she'd
2:10:11
like to be back in that situation again.
2:10:13
But hopefully she won't be back in that situation because this
2:10:16
lady's gone her her niece and hopefully, you know, she won't
2:10:20
be back. At least it's there at that
2:10:22
house. So the real thing I want y'all
2:10:25
to look at when we get the instructions is self-defense.
2:10:28
If you think self-defense, you think she's reasonable for her
2:10:31
what she did and she's in fear for her life and it's a
2:10:35
continuing fear from the week before, from other acts that may
2:10:39
have happened prior to that, then you're perfectly able to
2:10:42
say self-defense. This case is over with, come
2:10:45
back with not guilty. You think it's not self-defense
2:10:47
and go through all these elements.
2:10:48
Look at them. I mean, is it reckless to shoot
2:10:51
a gun straight up in the air? What goes up comes down.
2:10:54
My gosh, I don't think it's a person in Jackson County that's
2:10:56
going to be able to comply with that because we've all shotguns
2:10:59
up in the air. But I do realize it probably
2:11:01
don't go off in space somewhere. I don't know if I would have
2:11:04
ever heard of 1 coming back down.
2:11:05
And but I, I just just me personally, I that's not
2:11:07
evidence. But I mean, what goes up does
2:11:09
come down like Jake said, but I've never heard seen it.
2:11:15
It's a big deal about a gun that was readily and assessable.
2:11:19
I don't know. I think I remember asking y'all
2:11:21
who owned guns and you know, and I believe this jury here,
2:11:25
everyone owned guns, I believe. But what gun is useful for
2:11:29
self-defense if it's not ready and available?
2:11:33
It was ready and. Available, Absolutely.
2:11:34
She went in the bedroom and got it come back out there and shot
2:11:37
the gun because she wanted to make sure.
2:11:39
She. Knew that she tried to come in
2:11:40
her house. Something was going to happen
2:11:43
whether she was shot or not. I seriously doubt it, but.
2:11:46
She wanted at. Least make her believe that what
2:11:49
is the first thing she done when she went in that she never does
2:11:53
locked your doors went around locking all over windows if that
2:11:56
don't show fear I don't know what is a woman that never locks
2:11:59
her house never locks her windows had to go figure out how
2:12:02
to lock the windows because she was afraid this lady was about
2:12:04
to jump come through the house on her that to me that shows
2:12:07
fear it's reasonable under her circumstances.
2:12:10
So I, I think if you use reasonableness, I think it's
2:12:13
pretty reasonable, You know, the they went through that alcohol
2:12:20
using, you know, under the influence of alcohol.
2:12:23
Normally you, there's all kind of things that can cause all the
2:12:26
stuff that they said. There's no doubt.
2:12:29
I think she was using alcohol, but was she intoxicated?
2:12:31
Everything they said is all due to medical illnesses that they
2:12:34
failed to ask any questions about.
2:12:36
They did ask one question about them to her.
2:12:39
They didn't ask any questions about her those and they did no
2:12:41
testing. They didn't let her go air walk
2:12:43
a line. Let me see how you can.
2:12:44
But you can see her walking on those videos.
2:12:46
She's walking fine. They didn't.
2:12:48
Go in there and give her letharizer tests.
2:12:49
They didn't give her blood tests.
2:12:50
They didn't see, well, let's see how much alcohol was in there so
2:12:53
we can determine if you're really that intoxicated.
2:12:56
They just decided that because they thought the law was if
2:12:58
someone's drinks and they're guilty of using a gun while
2:13:01
drinking, that's not what the law is.
2:13:03
Jury instructions will tell you that.
2:13:12
Jake mentioned about you had these three things to determine
2:13:14
was a crime committed? Did Jan commit that crime?
2:13:17
Was it self-defense? Like I say, I was talking to
2:13:19
self-defense. We get those self-defense has a
2:13:22
crime committed. I don't that's for you to
2:13:24
decide. I'm not sure if a crime has been
2:13:26
committed. Can't tell you how many times in
2:13:28
Jackson County my neighbors are just shooting guns up in the
2:13:30
air. I mean, that's that's part of
2:13:32
Country Life. That's part of rule.
2:13:33
I don't know. Is that a crime?
2:13:35
You make that decision. We never did really get into it,
2:13:40
but they did. I know Jake did mention they
2:13:42
mentioned it 3 calls from the same household and I'm why in
2:13:45
the world I never even got a clear answer to that.
2:13:48
They brung it up. Why did the three calls and I'm
2:13:50
when we made from the same household.
2:13:52
You know I don't really understand that and and I'll
2:14:02
leave you with this right here, because I'm not going to take up
2:14:04
all y'all something. Y'all listen to all this
2:14:05
carefully. You listen to everything.
2:14:06
You know what's going on here? It really comes out of me.
2:14:10
Just some simple words. If you believe Ashley and Alexis
2:14:15
when they say we just said if you want to talk, we can talk.
2:14:19
If you believe that, then go through the liberations and see
2:14:22
if she's guilty of it. You think that's a total
2:14:25
baloney? I think it's total baloney and
2:14:27
that's my opinion. If you believe that's total
2:14:29
baloney, go back and look at the self-defense and come back with
2:14:32
self-defense and she is not guilty due to self-defense.
2:14:36
I'm going to leave it. With that, with y'all, and I
2:14:38
appreciate y'all, y'all done such a wonderful job and you
2:14:41
know, Jan really appreciates it and I'm going to try to get her
2:14:45
out of here safely and and we thank y'all very much and y'all
2:14:47
have a wonderful day. Thank you.
2:14:51
Mr. McDaniel, Mr. Mitchell, Anything.
2:14:53
Else. So Mr. McDaniel touched on
2:15:02
self-defense. I'm not going to read the whole
2:15:06
instruction. Judge is going to do that for
2:15:08
you, but I'm going to read a portion of the instruction that
2:15:11
you're going to hear. And I want you to listen very
2:15:14
carefully. To justify the use or threaten
2:15:19
use of force, the appearance of imminent danger must have been
2:15:25
so real that the defendant actually believed the use or
2:15:30
threatened use of force was necessary.
2:15:33
Moreover, to justify the use or threatened use of force, a
2:15:38
reasonably cautious and prudent person under the same
2:15:42
circumstances would have believed the use or threatened
2:15:46
use of force was necessary. Think about that.
2:15:54
The vehicle in question, Ashley and Alexis's vehicle, nowhere
2:16:00
near Mr. Batt's residence. It was going away.
2:16:04
It was driving away. Words may have been said, but
2:16:08
there was no imminent danger. The danger, if there was any
2:16:14
present, was gone. And ask yourself, would a
2:16:19
reasonably prudent and cautious person act in that same manner
2:16:25
if the danger was gone now? I believe Mr. McDaniel talked
2:16:36
about an issue on the three calls that were made in there.
2:16:40
I don't know why he really made such a big deal about the 3911
2:16:44
calls or never got a real answer to that.
2:16:47
It's an assumption. My assumption, and you heard the
2:16:52
testimony that came from all three of those people who made
2:16:56
the calls, is that all three people were in fear for their
2:17:01
life. All three said that Alexis,
2:17:04
Ashley and Jacoby heard those shots and called 911 because
2:17:09
they were fearful of their life that night.
2:17:13
But you know who didn't show any fear?
2:17:16
Who? Who said to Deputy Swift that
2:17:19
she wasn't afraid? Jam Pervet, You saw the body
2:17:24
Cam. You saw her say I am not afraid
2:17:27
of her. Everybody else may be afraid of
2:17:29
her, not me. Now, let's talk about the
2:17:36
testimony of Christy Joe Bassford, very important witness
2:17:41
to the defense. But you saw there's a lot of
2:17:44
credibility issues when it comes to what she was saying.
2:17:48
She didn't recall that. She didn't remember that you
2:17:50
saw. I actually had to play a portion
2:17:53
of a video to refresh her memory.
2:17:57
That's the credibility that we're talking about right here.
2:18:00
She couldn't even recall if Miss Pervette was drinking until
2:18:04
finally she was refreshed. Now let's talk about that
2:18:08
drinking. You heard Deputy Grover and
2:18:13
Deputy Swift both say that when it comes to non DUI cases, it is
2:18:20
very rare if ever for them to do any field sobriety exercises.
2:18:26
But they both came to the termination based on their
2:18:30
training and experience that Miss Pravat was under the
2:18:35
influence and that our normal faculties were impaired.
2:18:39
And I submit to you this question, do you think that
2:18:46
Deputy Swift or Deputy Grover would have allowed Mr. VAT to
2:18:51
drive away that night? Think about that.
2:18:56
But nonetheless, like Mr. McDaniel said, we appreciate you
2:19:00
being here today and we thank you for your attention.
2:19:05
We thank you for everything. And I'll leave you with that
2:19:09
same phrase one more time so you can remember it.
2:19:12
Take away anything from this trowel.
2:19:15
Just remember, what goes up must come down.
2:19:20
It's also Newton's third law of motion.
2:19:22
An object in motion stays in motion.
2:19:25
Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Mitchell.
2:19:29
Ladies and gentlemen, I'm about to read to you the law.
2:19:31
For those of you who are taking notes, you do not have to take
2:19:34
notes of the law. This law, this instructions on
2:19:37
the law will go back with you in the jury room.
2:19:39
So please listen carefully these instructions, our members of the
2:19:42
jury. I thank you for your attention
2:19:43
during this trial. Please listen carefully to the
2:19:45
instructions I'm about to give you.
2:19:47
Jan Evelyn Pravat, the defendant in this case, has been accused
2:19:50
of discharging a firearm on residential property, improper
2:19:53
exhibition of a firearm, and use of a firearm while under the
2:19:57
influence. To prove the crime of
2:19:59
discharging a firearm on residential property, the state
2:20:01
must prove the following element beyond a reasonable doubt one.
2:20:05
Jan Evelyn Provat Recklessly or negligently discharged a firearm
2:20:09
outdoors own property, used primarily as the side of a
2:20:13
dwelling. Recklessly means with a
2:20:15
conscious and intentional indifference to consequences.
2:20:19
Negligently means failing to use reasonable care under the
2:20:22
circumstances. Dwelling means a building or
2:20:24
conveyance of any kind, including an attached porch,
2:20:27
whether the building or conveyance is temporary or
2:20:30
permanent. Mobile or M mobile, which has a
2:20:32
roof over it, including a tent, and it's designed to be occupied
2:20:36
by people lodging therein at night.
2:20:38
A firearm is defined as any weapon, including a starter gun,
2:20:42
which wheel is designed to or may readily be converted to
2:20:45
expel a projectile by the action of an explosive.
2:20:48
The term firearm does not include an antique firearm
2:20:52
unless the antique firearm is using the Commission of a crime.
2:20:55
It is a defense of the crime of discharging a firearm on
2:20:57
residential property if the defendant was lawfully defending
2:21:00
life or property. Is there a typo in that?
2:21:07
Oh, there is a typo. 10.6 Page 3 The word firearm at the end
2:21:19
shouldn't be there, should it? No, it shouldn't be there.
2:21:22
The next to the last paragraph is your McDaniel.
2:21:24
That's wrong. We can print that out very.
2:21:26
Quick, you agree? I agree.
2:21:28
I want to mark through that there's want to read that
2:21:30
sentence again. It is a defense of the crime of
2:21:34
discharging a firearm on a residential property.
2:21:36
If the defendant was lawfully defending life or property, the
2:21:39
word firearm is right. After that, the word firearm
2:21:41
should not be there. I've stricken through that.
2:21:43
It's a typo. We all three missed it.
2:21:46
If you find that the state proved beyond a reasonable doubt
2:21:48
that the defendant was not lawfully defending law for
2:21:51
property, you should find her guilty if all the elements of
2:21:53
the charge have been proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
2:21:55
However, if the State failed to prove beyond a reasonable doubt
2:22:00
that the defendant was not lawfully defending law for
2:22:01
property, you should find her not guilty.
2:22:04
To prove the crime of improper exhibition of a firearm, the
2:22:07
state must prove the following three elements of a reason.
2:22:09
What beyond a reasonable doubt #1 Jan Evelyn Provat had or
2:22:13
carried A firearm #2 Jan Evelyn Provat exhibited the firearm in
2:22:18
a rude, careless, angry, or threatening manner #3 she did so
2:22:22
in the presence of one or more persons.
2:22:24
A firearm means any weapon which wheel is designed to or may be
2:22:28
readily converted to expel a projectile by the action of an
2:22:30
explosive. The term firearm does not
2:22:33
include an antique firearm unless the antique firearm is
2:22:36
used in the Commission of another crime.
2:22:39
To prove the crime of using a firearm while under the
2:22:42
influence, the state must prove the following two elements
2:22:45
beyond a reasonable doubt #1 Jan Evelyn Provat used a firearm #2
2:22:50
Jan Evelyn Provat was under the influence of an alcoholic
2:22:53
beverages beverage when affected to the to the extent that her
2:22:57
normal faculties were impaired when using the firearm.
2:23:01
Firearm means any weapon, including a starter gun, which
2:23:03
will is designed to or may rarely be converted to expel a
2:23:06
projectile by the action of an explosive, the frame or receiver
2:23:09
of such weapon, any firearm muffler or firearm silencer, any
2:23:13
destructive device, or any machine gun.
2:23:15
The term firearm does not include an antique firearm
2:23:19
unless the antique firearm is used in the Commission of a
2:23:21
crime. Use of use a firearm means to
2:23:24
discharge a firearm or to have a firearm readily available for
2:23:27
immediate discharge. Readily accessible for me to
2:23:30
discharge means loaded and in a person's hand.
2:23:32
Normal faculties include, but are not limited to, the ability
2:23:37
to see, hear, walk, talk, judge distances, Dr. an automobile,
2:23:42
make judgments, act in emergencies, and in general to
2:23:45
normally perform the mental, mental, and physical acts of our
2:23:48
daily lives. It is a defense to the crimes of
2:23:53
discharging a firearm on residential property, improper
2:23:56
exhibition of a firearm, and using a firearm.
2:23:58
One under the influence if the actions of Jan Evelyn Provat
2:24:02
constituted the justifiable or threatened use of deadly force.
2:24:06
Deadly force means force likely to cause death or great bodily
2:24:10
harm. Great bodily harm means great as
2:24:13
distinguished from slight, trivial, minor, or moderate
2:24:16
harm. Jan Evelyn Provet does not have
2:24:19
the burden of proving that she was justified in using or
2:24:21
threatening to use deadly force. Instead, for you to find the
2:24:24
defendant guilty, the State must prove beyond a reasonable doubt
2:24:27
the defendant was not you justified in using or
2:24:30
threatening to use deadly force. The law on justifiable use of
2:24:34
or, excuse me, the law on the justifiable use or threatened
2:24:38
use of deadly force is as follows.
2:24:40
Jan Evelyn Provett was justified in using or threatening to use
2:24:44
deadly force if she reasonably believed that such force or
2:24:48
threat of force was necessary to prevent imminent death or great
2:24:52
bodily harm to herself. In deciding whether Jan Evelyn
2:24:57
Provett was justified in the use of or threatened use of deadly
2:25:00
force, you must consider the circumstances at the time of the
2:25:03
force or threat of force was used.
2:25:06
The danger you need does not have to be not have.
2:25:09
Excuse me? The danger need not have been
2:25:12
actual. However, to justify the use or
2:25:16
threatened use of deadly force, the appearance of imminent
2:25:19
danger must have been so real that the defendant actually
2:25:23
believed the use or threatened use of deadly force was
2:25:26
necessary. Moreover, to justify the use or
2:25:30
threatened use of deadly force, a reasonably cautious and
2:25:34
prudent person under the same circumstances would have
2:25:37
believed the use or threatened use of deadly force was
2:25:40
necessary. If you find the defendant her
2:25:43
because of prior threats or difficulties with Ashley Nicole
2:25:46
Nichols has had reasonable grounds to believe she was in
2:25:49
danger of death or great bodily harm at the hands of Ashley
2:25:53
Nicole Nichols, you may consider this fact in determining whether
2:25:56
the actions of the defendant were those of a reasonable
2:25:58
person. If you find that at the time of
2:26:01
the alleged discharging a firearm or residential property,
2:26:04
improper exhibition of a firearm and use of a firearm while on
2:26:07
the influence, the defendant knew the alleged victim had
2:26:11
committed an act or act of violence, you may consider that
2:26:13
fact in determining whether or not the defendant reasonably
2:26:16
believed it was necessary for her to use or threaten to use
2:26:19
deadly force. If you find the alleged victim
2:26:22
had a reputation of being violent and a dangerous person
2:26:25
and that her reputation was known to the defendant, you may
2:26:28
consider this fact in determining whether the actions
2:26:30
of the the defendant were those of a reasonable person in
2:26:33
dealing with an individual of that reputation.
2:26:36
If you find the alleged victim had a reputation of being a
2:26:39
violent and dangerous person, you may consider this fact in
2:26:41
determining whether she was the initial aggressor.
2:26:45
The defendant has entered a plea of not guilty.
2:26:47
This means you must presume or believe the defendant is
2:26:50
innocent. This presumption stays with the
2:26:52
defendant as to each material allegation and the information
2:26:56
through each stage of the trial unless it has been overcome by
2:27:00
the evidence to the exclusion of and beyond a reasonable doubt.
2:27:04
To overcome the presumption of innocence, the State has the
2:27:08
burden of proving the crime with which the defendant is charged
2:27:10
was committed and that the defendant is the person who
2:27:13
committed the crime. The defendant is not required to
2:27:16
present evidence or prove anything.
2:27:20
Whenever the words reasonable doubt are used, you must
2:27:22
consider the following. Proof of beyond a reasonable
2:27:25
doubt does not mean proof beyond all doubt.
2:27:29
A reasonable doubt is not a mere possible doubt, a speculative,
2:27:32
imaginary, or forced doubt. Such a doubt must not influence
2:27:36
you to return a verdict of not guilty.
2:27:38
If you have an abiding conviction of guilt, on the
2:27:40
other hand, if after carefully considering, comparing and
2:27:44
weighing all of the evidence, there is not an abiding
2:27:47
conviction of guilt, or if having a conviction, it is one
2:27:51
which is not stable, but one which waivers and vacillates,
2:27:54
then the charges not prove beyond every reasonable doubt,
2:27:57
and you must find the defendant not guilty because the doubt is
2:27:59
reasonable. It is to the evidence introduced
2:28:01
in this trial and to it alone that you are to look for that
2:28:04
proof. A reasonable doubt as to the
2:28:06
guilt of the defendant may arise from the evidence, conflict in
2:28:09
the evidence, or lack of evidence.
2:28:11
If you have a reasonable doubt, you should find the defendant
2:28:14
not guilty. If you have no reasonable doubt,
2:28:16
you should find the defendant guilty.
2:28:19
It is up to you to decide what evidence is reliable.
2:28:21
You should use your common sense in deciding what is the best
2:28:24
evidence and which evidence should not be relied upon.
2:28:27
In considering your verdict. You may find some evidence not
2:28:30
reliable or less reliable than other evidence.
2:28:33
You should consider how the witnesses acted as well as what
2:28:36
they said. Some things you should consider
2:28:39
are #1 Did the witness seem to have an opportunity to see and
2:28:43
know the things about which the witness testified #2 Did the
2:28:46
witness seem to have an accurate memory #3 Was the witness honest
2:28:50
and straightforward in answering the attorneys questions #4 Did
2:28:54
the witness have some interest in how the case should be
2:28:56
decided #5 Does the witness's testimony agree with the other
2:29:00
testimony and other evidence in the case?
2:29:02
Number six. Did the witness at some other
2:29:05
time make a statement that is inconsistent with the testimony
2:29:07
he or she gave in court and #7 Has the witness been convicted
2:29:11
of a felony or a misdemeanor involving dishonesty?
2:29:16
Whether the State has made its burden of proof does not depend
2:29:19
upon the number of witnesses it has called or upon the number of
2:29:23
exhibits it has offered, but instead upon the nature and
2:29:26
quality of the evidence presented.
2:29:28
The fact that a witness is employed in law enforcement does
2:29:31
not mean that his testimony deserves more or less
2:29:34
consideration than that of any other witness, expert witnesses,
2:29:38
or like any other witnesses. With one exception, the law
2:29:41
permits an expert witness to give his or her opinion.
2:29:44
However, an expert's opinion is reliable only when given on a
2:29:47
subject about which you believe him or her to be an expert.
2:29:50
Likewise, like other witnesses, you may believe or disbelieve
2:29:53
any or all part, all, or any part of an expert's testimony.
2:30:01
You have heard the testimony of a child.
2:30:03
No witnesses disqualified just because of age.
2:30:05
There is no precise age that determines whether witness may
2:30:08
testify. The critical consideration is
2:30:10
not the witnesses age, but the what whether the witness
2:30:13
understands the truth between what is true and what is not
2:30:16
true and understands the duty to tell the truth.
2:30:18
It is entirely proper for a lawyer to talk to a witness
2:30:22
about what testimony the witness would give if called to the
2:30:24
courtroom. A witness should not be
2:30:26
discredited by talking to a lawyer about his or her
2:30:29
testimony. You may rely upon your own
2:30:31
conclusion about the credibility of any witness.
2:30:33
A juror may believe or disbelieve any, excuse me, may
2:30:37
disbelieve all or any part of the evidence or the testimony of
2:30:40
any witness. The Constitution requires the
2:30:44
State to prove its accusation against the defendant is not
2:30:47
necessary for the defendant to disprove anything, nor is the
2:30:50
defendant required to prove her innocence.
2:30:52
It is up to the State to prove the defendant's guilt by
2:30:55
evidence. The defendant in this case has
2:30:57
exercised A fundamental right by choosing to not be a witness in
2:31:01
this case. You must not view this as an
2:31:04
admission of guilt or be influenced in any way by its
2:31:06
decision. No juror, excuse me, by her
2:31:08
decision, no juror should ever be concerned that defendant did
2:31:12
or did not take the witness stand to give testimony in the
2:31:15
case. A statement claimed to been
2:31:18
claimed to have been made by the defendant outside of court has
2:31:21
been introduced into evidence. Such a statement should be
2:31:24
considered with caution and be weighed with great care to make
2:31:26
certain it was freely and voluntarily made.
2:31:29
If you conclude that the defendant made the statement,
2:31:31
you should must also determine from the evidence whether the
2:31:33
defendant's statement was freely and voluntarily made.
2:31:36
In making this determination, you should consider the
2:31:38
circumstances including but not limited to #1 whether, when the
2:31:42
defendant made the statement, she had been threatened to get
2:31:45
to get her to make the statement, and #2 whether anyone
2:31:48
had promised her anything to get her to make the statement.
2:31:50
If you conclude that the defendant made out of court a
2:31:53
statement, but it was not freely and voluntarily made, you should
2:31:56
disregard it. Rules for deliberation.
2:31:59
These are some general rules that apply to your discussion.
2:32:02
You must follow these rules in order to return a lawful verdict
2:32:04
#1 you must follow the law as it is set out in these
2:32:08
instructions. If you fail to follow the law,
2:32:11
your work verdict will be a miscarriage of justice.
2:32:13
There is no reason for failing to follow the law in this case.
2:32:17
All of us are depending upon you to make a wise and legal
2:32:19
decision in this matter #2 This case must be decided only upon
2:32:24
the evidence that you have heard from the testimony of the
2:32:26
witnesses and have seen in the form of the exhibits in evidence
2:32:30
and these instructions #3 This case must not be decided for or
2:32:35
against anyone. Because you feel sorry for
2:32:37
anyone or are angry at anyone #4 Remember, the lawyers are not on
2:32:42
trial. Your feelings about them should
2:32:44
not influence your decision in this case.
2:32:46
Number 5. Your duty is to determine if the
2:32:49
defendant has been proven guilty or not in accord with the law.
2:32:52
It is my job to determine a proper sentence if a defendant
2:32:56
is found guilty. Number six, whatever verdict you
2:32:59
render must be unanimous. That is, each juror must agree
2:33:03
to the same verdict #7 your verdict should not be influenced
2:33:06
by feelings of prejudice, bias, or sympathy.
2:33:09
Your verdict must be based on the evidence and on the law
2:33:12
contained in these instructions. The signing a verdict is
2:33:16
exclusively your job, and I cannot participate in that
2:33:19
decision in any way. Please disregard anything I may
2:33:22
have said or done that made you think I preferred 1 verdict over
2:33:26
another. You may find the defendant
2:33:28
guilty as charged or not guilty. The verdict must be unanimous.
2:33:32
That is, all of you must agree to the same verdict.
2:33:34
Only one verdict might be returned as to each crime
2:33:37
charge. The verdict must be in writing
2:33:39
and for your convenience, the necessary verdict form has been
2:33:42
prepared for you. It is as follows.
2:33:45
This is your verdict form which you'll take back to the juror
2:33:47
room. Scott in the County Court 14
2:33:50
Judicial Circuit of the State of Florida in and for Jackson
2:33:52
County, the State of Florida plaintiff versus Janet Evelyn
2:33:54
Provat defended has the case number and it says we the jury
2:33:58
find as follows as to the defendant Jan Evelyn Evelyn
2:34:01
Provat in this case as to count one check only one so as to
2:34:05
count 1, you'll check one of these A if the defendant is
2:34:09
guilty of discharging a firearm on residential property as
2:34:11
charged B the defendant is not guilty.
2:34:15
And it says as to count 2, check only one A the defendant is
2:34:19
guilty of improper exhibition of a firearm as charged.
2:34:22
B, the defendant is not guilty. Second page of the verdict form
2:34:27
says as to count 3, check only one, A, the defendant is guilty
2:34:32
of using a firearm while under the influence of alcoholic
2:34:35
beverage as charged, or B the defendant is not guilty.
2:34:39
So say we all dated this blank day of January 2020, Sixth, and
2:34:44
it's signed by the foreperson. That is your verdict form.
2:34:49
In just a few moments, you'll be taken to the jury room by the
2:34:52
bailiff. The first thing you should do is
2:34:53
choose a four person who will preside over your deliberations.
2:34:56
The full person should see to it that your discussions are
2:34:59
carried on in an organized way and that everyone has a fair
2:35:03
chance to be heard. It is also the four person's job
2:35:05
to sign and date the verdict form when all of you have agreed
2:35:09
on the verdict and to bring the verdict form back to the
2:35:12
courtroom when you return. During deliberations, jurors
2:35:15
must not communicate, must communicate about the case only
2:35:18
with one another and only when all jurors are present in the
2:35:21
jury room. If a juror goes to the restroom,
2:35:23
the liberation should stop until that juror returns.
2:35:26
You are not to communicate with any person outside of the jury
2:35:29
about this case until, excuse me, read that sentence again.
2:35:33
You are not to communicate with any person outside the jury
2:35:35
about this case until you have reached a verdict.
2:35:38
You must not talk about this case in person or through the
2:35:40
telephone, writing or electronic communication such as a blog,
2:35:43
Twitter, e-mail, text communication, text message, or
2:35:46
any other means. Do not contact anyone to assist
2:35:50
you during the these these deliberations.
2:35:52
These communication rules apply until I discharge you at the end
2:35:55
of the case. If you become aware of any
2:35:57
violation of these instructions or any other instructions I've
2:35:59
given you in this case, you must tell me by giving a note to the
2:36:02
bailiff. Many of you may have cell
2:36:04
phones, tablets, laptops, or other electronic devices here in
2:36:07
the courtroom. As I've told you earlier, the
2:36:09
rules do not allow you to bring your phones or any of those type
2:36:12
of devices into the jury room. I'm going to ask that you leave
2:36:15
those in your chair and what will happen is that Sergeant
2:36:19
Applewatt or Deputy Spates, one of those fellows will stay in
2:36:22
the courtroom right outside that door.
2:36:24
So your phone will be in your chair.
2:36:26
If you didn't take notes or even if you took notes, but you
2:36:29
decide not to take them to the jury room, you leave those in
2:36:31
the chair and the the bailiff will be in here.
2:36:33
So nobody will touch anything that yours.
2:36:35
They'll be right right here the whole time.
2:36:37
If you took notes and want to take them to the jury room,
2:36:39
obviously you can do that. If you need to communicate with
2:36:43
me, you send a note through the bailiff.
2:36:46
If you have voted, do not disclose the actual vote in the
2:36:48
note. If you have a question, I will
2:36:50
talk to the attorneys before I answer it.
2:36:51
So it may take some time. You may continue your your
2:36:54
deliberations while you wait for my answer.
2:36:56
I will answer any questions if I can, in writing or orally here
2:36:59
in open court. During the trial, items were
2:37:02
received into evidence as exhibits.
2:37:04
You may examine whatever exhibits you think will help you
2:37:07
in your deliberations. These exhibits will be sent into
2:37:09
the jury room with you when you begin to deliberate.
2:37:12
If you wish to see any exhibits, please request that in writing.
2:37:15
In closing, let me remind you that it is important that you
2:37:18
follow the law spelled out in these instructions in deciding
2:37:21
your verdict. There are no other laws that
2:37:22
apply to this case. Even if you do not like the laws
2:37:25
that must be applied, you must use them.
2:37:28
For more than two centuries, we have lived by the Constitution
2:37:31
and the law. No juror has the right to
2:37:34
violate rules we all share. So I'm going to ask Sergeant
2:37:39
Applewhite or Deputy Space to check the jury room one more
2:37:41
time. Let's make sure there's nothing
2:37:43
for it in there. No newspapers, no magazines.
2:37:46
That's an old instruction there about the magazines.
2:37:49
We haven't had magazines around in years, except the doctor's
2:37:51
office. But check.
2:37:53
Make sure there's nothing in there please.
2:37:55
And we've got, we only have two items that were introduced into
2:37:58
evidence, I believe 2 DVD's. Those will go back in there.
2:38:03
Any objection to the instructions as given?
2:38:05
The missing thing from the state.
2:38:07
Objection should I have? That one corrected page 2 pages.
2:38:12
Mr. McDaniel, any objections to the instructions as given?
2:38:15
No objection. What page numbers?
2:38:17
Mr. Gill, I'm going to give you my page 11 and take the
2:38:24
corrected 1. OK page number.
2:38:30
Page #3 page #3. OK.
2:38:36
So that the jury room is clear. OK, so let's see who our
2:38:41
alternate is. Our alternate juror is Miss
2:38:46
Lopez Santana. Miss Lopez Santana, I'm gonna
2:38:49
ask you to stay where you're at for just a second.
2:38:51
I'll give you some instructions in just a moment.
2:38:53
I'm going to give the jury instructions and the verdict
2:38:59
form. Oh, there it is.
2:39:03
So the jury instructions and the verdict form and those two
2:39:06
exhibits. Sarge, I'm going to ask that you
2:39:09
place those on the table in the middle of the jury room with the
2:39:13
exception of Miss Lopez Santana. I'm going to ask the other six
2:39:16
jurors to retire to the jury room and begin your
2:39:18
deliberations. If you have a question, as I
2:39:21
just instructed you, write it down, present it to the bailiff,
2:39:23
I'll present it to me and we'll go from there.
2:39:25
You do not have to wait on. We had a jury one time that
2:39:27
waited because they didn't realize the 7th person was not
2:39:30
on it. It wasn't real clear.
2:39:32
So you do not wait on Miss Lopez Santana and you go ahead and
2:39:34
begin your deliberations because she will not be joining you or
2:39:37
participating in the verdict because the six of you, the
2:39:40
other six of you have made it to this point successfully.
2:39:43
So I'm going to ask everyone remain in the courtroom while
2:39:45
the jury exits to begin their deliberations.
2:39:48
Honor, they have a smart watch. They need to leave that in the
2:39:51
seat as. Well, in addition.
2:39:54
To itself. Thank you.
2:39:56
If you have a device that receives electronic
2:39:59
communication, such as a watch, that needs to stay in the jury
2:40:01
in the in the courtroom. Miss Lopez Santana, I've already
2:40:25
talked about this a little bit earlier thing about our net
2:40:27
jurors. And we never, as we never know,
2:40:29
someone may be in a Fender Bender at lunch and they may not
2:40:32
come back. We don't know.
2:40:33
So just like that, we can have an alternate juror go from being
2:40:37
an alternate to a regular juror. So that's why the law doesn't
2:40:40
allow us to tell the jurors which is the alternate.
2:40:43
But I do thank you for your tenants and your participation
2:40:46
is obvious. You've been very diligent in in,
2:40:49
in watching the trial and listening to the evidence.
2:40:51
I do appreciate that. Ma'am, if you want to remain
2:40:54
with us and wait on the verdict, you're certainly welcome to do
2:40:56
that. It could be 5 minutes, it could
2:40:58
be 5 hours. We, we don't know.
2:41:00
On the other hand, if you want to leave, you certainly are free
2:41:03
to do that if you want, if you want the card to call you and
2:41:05
let you know what the verdict is later today, then you can leave
2:41:08
your phone number or you actually finally got your phone
2:41:10
number. If you want to know the verdict,
2:41:12
she can let you know that. But thank you for your time and
2:41:15
your attention. In this case, I'm going to ask
2:41:16
that you leave your, your, your badge in your chair.
2:41:21
And if there are any notes in that folder, I will destroy them
2:41:24
like I previously told you. Do you have any questions?
2:41:27
Thank you, ma'am. Ladies and gentlemen, what we're
2:41:34
going to do is we're going to clear the courtroom and as I
2:41:39
told the jury, either Sergeant Applewhite or Deputy space will
2:41:44
remain in the courtroom and watch over the the jurors
2:41:47
belongings and also be available in the event they have a
2:41:50
question or note. I'm assuming the state
2:41:54
attorneys, assistant attorneys will be in your office.
2:41:57
Mr. McDaniel, you're going to be around in the hallway or
2:41:59
something. So if we get a note or
2:42:02
something, we'll notify you immediately.
2:42:04
But we're going to give them time to deliberate.
2:42:06
It's 334 and the courts in recess.
2:42:08
We're going to end this. Zoom and YouTube recording will
2:42:11
restart. OK, so they do just that.
2:42:14
They go off and deliberate. So what we're going to do at the
2:42:19
top of the hour, somewhere in there, top of the hour ish will
2:42:23
return to this case to get the verdict and a sentencing.
2:42:28
If if she's found guilty, if she's not found guilty, then I'm
2:42:34
sure they'll be cheering. But we'll, we'll get that at the
2:42:38
top of the hour. But for now, what I'm going to
2:42:43
do is let's take a break from it for a few minutes and we'll do
2:42:48
some other judge kind of stuff, some live stuff from this
2:42:52
morning just to kind of cleanse our palate a little bit.
2:42:55
But feel free to discuss in the chat where you think this thing
2:42:58
is going to fall. We had a poll earlier where
2:43:02
y'all felt she was going to be found guilty.
2:43:04
But we've got three different charges here.
2:43:05
We've got discharged on a residential property, discharged
2:43:08
on a firearm, unlawful display of weapon and then discharge of
2:43:12
a firearm while drunk. So where do you think they're
2:43:17
going to fall on those three? Kind of talk that out in the
2:43:19
chat for the next 20 or so minutes.
2:43:23
And while we're doing that we can watch.
2:43:26
Well, let's start with some Judge Stevens.
2:43:29
But what we'll do again at the top of the hour, we'll, we'll
2:43:32
show this verdict and what happens after that and then
2:43:38
probably spend a little bit of time talking about it.
2:43:40
Fourth hours been kind of blown up the last couple of days
2:43:42
anyways. So let's just let's just make it
2:43:44
about this case anyways. Judge Stevens.
2:43:50
OK. Is there a prosecutor maybe on
2:43:53
this one? Who's this, Jeff?
2:43:56
Gregory Renfro, This one's Daniel Boy, You, you filed a
2:44:08
motion a long time ago. See.
2:44:16
There's I, I don't even know the facts right now, but I'm looking
2:44:19
at this and something doesn't smell right at all.
2:44:22
And all of this I didn't seem on my doctor, but I guess it's
2:44:24
something doesn't seem right at all.
2:44:27
OK, OK. We have a motion to revoke
2:44:29
probation that was filed on October 2023 / 2 years ago.
2:44:36
Was the defendant an absconder? Anybody.
2:44:43
I don't know, Judge we. This was not on my docket.
2:44:45
I'm just trying to so I'm trying to look and see.
2:44:48
Added late yesterday. I know this, but it's I've done
2:44:56
this long enough, something is not right here.
2:44:58
I can say I'm just looking at it for the first time and a motion
2:45:02
was filed over two years ago. He's on regular probation for
2:45:06
all things evading the tension with a motor vehicle and
2:45:10
something tells me that he had absconded for two years and had
2:45:14
been on the land. But but if somebody figured.
2:45:18
There was. There had to be a warrant issued
2:45:20
for his arrest on or about October of 2020. 30 / 2 years
2:45:25
ago and looks like this is some information shows he was
2:45:32
arrested December 16th judge so if you would of.
2:45:35
What? Of 2025, so he would have had to
2:45:38
bend and I was kind of. I got to just keep getting.
2:45:43
It that's not good. If that's true, I'm going to let
2:45:47
you out. How would I?
2:45:50
Why would anybody in their right mind do that?
2:45:53
If he had compassion, I've got compassion.
2:45:57
What he doesn't have is rule follow.
2:46:00
He was. He was on regular.
2:46:02
Probation he had been. Convicted for, of all things,
2:46:04
evading detention. So.
2:46:07
We filed a motion. So he evaded answering to the
2:46:12
motion for over 2 years. So they caught him somehow and
2:46:15
now he wants to get let out. You don't know how.
2:46:18
The circumference of him going into custody or why wouldn't you
2:46:23
know that you're representing him?
2:46:24
I haven't had an opportunity. Yet well.
2:46:26
I've I've. Just.
2:46:28
Pulled the file and. Looked at it and.
2:46:30
I think I can. This is simple enough to figure
2:46:33
out. This is just math.
2:46:34
Why? Don't.
2:46:38
You wait. Wait.
2:46:39
You're going to ask him things? Raise your right hand because
2:46:41
you're Underoath. Do you solemnly swear or affirm?
2:46:45
Any statements that you make during this hearing will be the
2:46:47
truth, the whole truth. And nothing but the.
2:46:49
Truth subject to perjury. So help you God lower your hand.
2:46:53
Go ahead. He sure for there appears to be
2:46:56
a period of time where a motion to remote probation was filed
2:46:59
and then you know around 2 years on that before you were taken
2:47:04
into custody. Were you reporting during the
2:47:06
two years and then security disposition?
2:47:08
Or reporting at first. Mr. Harmon.
2:47:10
David Homer. Yes.
2:47:11
Who's the probation officer on this one who can answer for
2:47:13
this? Because he's saying some things
2:47:15
and I'd like the probation office to to be at to tell me
2:47:19
what is accurate because I don't rely on this.
2:47:22
I'm not going to rely on him. Anybody.
2:47:25
Somebody's got to be here. It's.
2:47:26
It's not on the. That's why nobody.
2:47:29
We got pulled at the last minute.
2:47:31
He he files a motion just yesterday because of his
2:47:40
mother's funeral here. I mean, I'm not.
2:47:43
You only have one mother in this world.
2:47:45
When she dies, you're telling. What are you?
2:47:48
Preaching to me. I'm just saying that's my
2:47:51
reasoning is trying. I understand that I'm trying to.
2:47:54
Put in the district. Attorney's office and perhaps
2:47:56
everybody has disadvantaged doing this since the last
2:47:58
minute, but the excellent circumstances that we only have
2:48:02
any to to try to know this mom's funeral.
2:48:05
We're just going to consider reports rhetorical language.
2:48:08
Just tell me what the facts are. That's all I need.
2:48:10
You know you don't have. Michelle, us all, we only have
2:48:12
one mother. Well, that's I'm saying.
2:48:15
Far as my reason to try to accommodate Mr. But irrespective
2:48:19
of this, but. Think of this.
2:48:20
What you're going to have to answer.
2:48:21
Is the question of. Number one, he's on.
2:48:23
Invading. #2HE absconded for two years.
2:48:27
Well, that's what I'm sorry. And you can interrupt, I guess,
2:48:30
all day long like you had done historically, and we're not
2:48:32
going to get anything. What's the Church of the
2:48:34
Explorer of the reason? Can we just speak one at a time?
2:48:37
You all? You know that the court reporter
2:48:39
can't take both of us speaking over each other, please.
2:48:44
So that's what needs to be answered.
2:48:47
Is not that his poor mother passed away.
2:48:50
My God, my, my mother is very ill.
2:48:53
So I'm not non sympathetic. But what I have is.
2:49:00
Looking. At the circumstances here, he's
2:49:02
on probation. We placed him on probation.
2:49:05
He pleaded guilty and he was convicted for evading arrest or
2:49:10
detention. That is then for two years.
2:49:14
He. Fled from probation and he had
2:49:17
been an absconder for two years. As far as attempting to explore
2:49:20
Can I finish by? It was this was a solo I was
2:49:25
performing. Let me just complete it.
2:49:29
So he absconds. And when was he?
2:49:31
Arrested. December of 2030. 5 just the
2:49:35
last month. So just last month he was
2:49:38
finally arrested after two years.
2:49:40
And. Over. 26 months.
2:49:44
Of. Evading responsibility so you
2:49:49
can see the concerns this course has.
2:49:52
What in the world can I possibly have as a guarantee that he
2:49:57
would could be released and come back?
2:50:00
No, he's started off this case. He got in trouble.
2:50:05
For evading and and running from the police when he was supposed
2:50:09
to stop #2 For two and two years and 226 months he's been evading
2:50:14
and fleeing his responsibilities.
2:50:17
We caught him last. Month.
2:50:18
And. Now.
2:50:20
You're asking. For him.
2:50:22
To be released on his own word that he will look for the Bible.
2:50:27
You can see where he that's going to be a tall mountain to
2:50:30
climb. Go ahead, you may speak.
2:50:33
What were you doing during the last 26 months between the time
2:50:37
the MTRP was filed in the center?
2:50:39
Oh St. Rose and Lamar Steak Hospital
2:50:41
author. For Lamar, reporting as as.
2:50:44
Ordered by the my probation officer Gator Miss Gary Harman.
2:50:49
He had retired and didn't impress this to somebody else.
2:50:52
They never let me know. A new day, Mr. Harvard, the
2:50:55
informants did not come up there and report was able to take me
2:50:58
to jail. But he said keep reporting over
2:50:59
the phone. That's what I was doing now.
2:51:04
I went to college. I didn't start a business on my
2:51:07
own. It wasn't just right.
2:51:08
I've been doing productive things and.
2:51:10
You've stated the residents you've been at since you're
2:51:13
wrong relation with business, there's any attempt That's an
2:51:18
instant Gator Harman. Where is he?
2:51:23
I know, but is he still in the Beaumont area?
2:51:25
No, he's in Houston, Sir. OK, you were I'm.
2:51:31
I'm I'm. Going to turn him.
2:51:33
Up if you think I'm going to take your word without
2:51:36
substantiate you, won't you? You're going to lose every time
2:51:39
with me on your facts. You cannot be trusted by your
2:51:47
history. Criminalistic you cannot be.
2:51:52
Not procedure. Go ahead.
2:51:53
If the court were to see fit to allow you to be released from
2:51:57
jail either by posting a long or having means, what guarantees
2:52:02
could you provide to return to custody after having your name?
2:52:08
How? How can you assure the boy that
2:52:10
you would return to custody once you attend your mother's
2:52:13
frequency? What do you mean by that?
2:52:16
Well, you know. The representative judge that
2:52:18
you're going to go back into custody after you attend your
2:52:21
military and let you. Out.
2:52:23
Yes, I apparently will. Be with this straightened out,
2:52:26
you didn't leave the state or attempt.
2:52:31
That's it. There's not a ton of trying to
2:52:39
pay all my fees. I don't damn turn myself in what
2:52:42
I've been trying to do. I never smoked any trips.
2:52:50
Yes. Well, let me tell you what Gaeta
2:52:52
Harmon actually said on September 14th, 2023 that caused
2:52:59
this motion to revoke for two years when you that you have
2:53:04
been AWOL for two years. On September 14th, 2023, the
2:53:12
defendant failed to report to the Criminal District Court as
2:53:15
summit. So there we go.
2:53:17
You didn't report to the court as you were summoned to do.
2:53:21
You failed to report to the probation office for a scheduled
2:53:24
visit alleging medical issues. At this time, the defendant has
2:53:30
not produced any medical documentation concerning his
2:53:33
absence. The defendant has not made any
2:53:36
effort to address his delinquent court assessment since February
2:53:39
of 2023 as ordered by the floor. It is therefore requested that a
2:53:44
motion to invoke probation be. Fired.
2:53:47
He recommended it. The man you're saying was
2:53:50
letting you do all of this. He recommended and urged the
2:53:54
motion to revoke probation. It was filed and a warrant had
2:53:58
been issued for your arrest and we finally caught you after two
2:54:02
years. I have Miss Corbis.
2:54:04
I had COVID. I sent my forearm into
2:54:06
something. Later Miss Kelly I sent to Mr.
2:54:09
Harmon. He received both of them.
2:54:13
Failed to report asked him to produce produce medical issues
2:54:18
medical documentation concerning his absence, never did and
2:54:25
junior after two years we. Finally caught him.
2:54:33
Anything. I've just asked for the court to
2:54:37
exercise some passion. For how to.
2:54:39
Attend the female. Honestly, he doesn't report back
2:54:44
then that would not bode well disposition of the NGOP in any
2:54:49
sense. It's not going to, no, we've got
2:54:52
him right now. We've got him.
2:54:53
It's what has been done. Doesn't bode well for his
2:54:57
disposition, but we're not letting them go on my watch.
2:55:02
Now that we caught him. After two years, I don't know
2:55:05
that he was making taking active measures to obey Your Honor, he
2:55:10
was taking active measures not to report his report.
2:55:14
If you don't. Report you're not on and what's
2:55:17
good for you is good for the other 5000 probationers.
2:55:20
If you can just scamper off and decide when you want to report
2:55:24
or want the terms you want to set for yourself, it's a good
2:55:27
through every 5000. That's what's fair.
2:55:31
We're not going to treat you difficult, but you're supposed
2:55:33
to matriculate into the group that the first thing you do,
2:55:36
it's the first order. You must report as required,
2:55:39
otherwise you're not on probation.
2:55:41
You're on your own. Probation, which isn't the way
2:55:44
it works. What does this stuff have to
2:55:46
say? Judges compassionate as I am and
2:55:52
would like for him to attend. There's just yeah, nobody nobody
2:55:56
thinks this is. I feel sorry for the family, but
2:56:00
not you. I mean, this is you cannot be
2:56:03
sure if if it was years ago. We used to do a furlough where
2:56:09
they would get a furlough, but they would have to pay a deputy
2:56:12
sheriff to escort them from the jail.
2:56:14
They would have to pay for his time to escort him there, stay
2:56:17
for the funeral and come back and pay for his salary and that
2:56:20
was the only way. We would do it.
2:56:22
Back when they had a conviction like this, how did you get
2:56:24
arrested? Trash stuff.
2:56:30
That warrant was only out for two years.
2:56:34
I don't care what you it's not what you know or what you say
2:56:37
you didn't know. But the fact is, it had been an
2:56:39
issue for good reason and you for whatever reason they have
2:56:46
not been able to catch you until two years later.
2:56:49
But. We're certainly not in a
2:56:52
position to let you. Let you go. 3 Not under what
2:56:58
you're charged with in the 1st place, which was deceptive.
2:57:03
And now with you were you were convicted, sentenced 10 years,
2:57:08
right? Yeah, sentenced to five years in
2:57:13
prison, probated for 10 years. So you were convicted and did
2:57:19
your statement about Mr. Harmon is completely different for what
2:57:29
Mr. Harmon submits. In.
2:57:32
This administrative report that caused the motion to revoke
2:57:35
probation and. I don't see.
2:57:36
Anything in the file that states him asking to refute or to
2:57:45
withdraw his statements or this motion that he asked to be fine
2:57:50
and without anything else, Sir, we're I'm not granting the
2:57:53
relief. I was just.
2:57:55
Going to add your honor. Before looking for some
2:57:57
assurance that he would attend a subsequent hearing.
2:57:59
And obviously if he misses his granted bond and post bond and
2:58:05
he willfully fails to appear at the next court setting, there's
2:58:09
a bond jumping statute. It would be fine.
2:58:12
And that would be 1 level above what he's on this what the case
2:58:17
is, which will be a second case. So he would he would expose
2:58:19
himself to 2 to 20 years incarceration if he didn't.
2:58:24
This is just the five that he's exposed to.
2:58:27
Stay asking. I don't have an objection to a
2:58:29
bond being said, judge, but we'd have Agps monitor on him so we'd
2:58:34
know where he is. And of course, what is, is this
2:58:42
what we do? We're going to open this door
2:58:44
right now after 20 years here. We're going to open this door
2:58:48
and say that he is allowed on his own on his good word, which
2:58:52
he has defied twice. I'm just saying not before to
2:58:56
ask what is the Senate, what assurance the court would have
2:58:59
and he reappears. It would be his exposure to many
2:59:02
years. Well that was what he was
2:59:03
exposed. He was exposed to criminality,
2:59:07
additional criminal sanctions in the 1st place.
2:59:10
That didn't deter him. I'm just there's he would be
2:59:14
exposing himself to an additional state of sentence.
2:59:18
Are you stating you have no objection to releasing him under
2:59:25
this? Not saying just releasing judge,
2:59:27
but under certain conditions. What conditions?
2:59:30
Well, my first suggestion I think was always the best way to
2:59:34
do it, which was they make arrangements with the Sheriff's
2:59:36
Office to have a deputy take him out of jail and take him to the
2:59:39
funeral and bring him back. That that's the way you know
2:59:42
that. He's still in custody.
2:59:43
There is no way he's going to pay for that.
2:59:45
The family wouldn't. I'm just, I don't know if the
2:59:49
Sheriff's Department still does this.
2:59:50
Well, I don't. Think they do?
2:59:52
That well, you. Why don't you figure that out?
2:59:54
The only other way I've been. To.
2:59:56
They don't do that. Sir.
2:59:58
They I think. They do.
3:00:00
OK, so they'll say they don't. Then what if they don't do it?
3:00:06
What does the state say? Have a bond on GPS, Set it next
3:00:11
week for a disposition. You got a short preset.
3:00:15
I mean, it's a failure to report something to your or having
3:00:19
pleaded to trade to it now and set it for six.
3:00:26
What difference would that make? He would abscond and abscond.
3:00:30
He absconds. That pleading true doesn't make
3:00:33
a bit of difference. If he absconds.
3:00:35
He throws. Himself to a 20 year consecutive
3:00:37
sentence on top of just the five that you know.
3:00:42
That's. This sort of stuff is half.
3:00:44
This is the situation that's happened before.
3:00:46
When has that ever been done? It's.
3:00:48
Not launching. Where it's been filed like that?
3:00:51
You. Know you can't even recall it
3:00:53
and I take state better because the last one all right if
3:00:56
there's no objection to the state from the state then yeah
3:01:00
OK he's allowed release from how much in the bond well he does do
3:01:07
you have any money to pay for a month he's.
3:01:09
My family does. How much I?
3:01:11
Don't. I'm gonna say yeah, I haven't
3:01:13
talked to anybody today. Oh, yesterday.
3:01:19
Well. It's 3rd degree felony.
3:01:23
He's looking at 10 years and he was looking at 10 years in
3:01:26
prison in this so $5000 bond says GPS device as a condition
3:01:33
of bond and he has to report back.
3:01:39
He has to report back immediately after the funeral.
3:01:45
If you don't, I want to put this on the record too.
3:01:47
Then if you don't and something goes amiss here, you don't have
3:01:51
missed your next school date. They're representing they're.
3:01:53
Going to follow. Up on a dropping case with your
3:01:55
exposure 20 years consecutive to this all right do you understand
3:01:59
that's. All.
3:02:19
Right, I'll set in next week for.
3:02:23
McConnell. Williams, McConnell, Williams,
3:02:27
that's your. OK.
3:02:30
So that ended in an interesting way.
3:02:33
I think what I might do is see if he comes back and I'll look
3:02:39
for that while we're watching the end to this trial.
3:02:45
So. So here's what happened
3:02:47
yesterday after the jury went to deliberate.
3:02:52
At one point they sent a note to the judge and they asked to see
3:02:58
one of the videos over again. But interestingly enough, as
3:03:01
often happens in that courtroom, they had tech issues and they
3:03:07
weren't able to show the video up on the big screens.
3:03:12
They actually had to put a laptop in front of the jury and
3:03:15
have them watched on the laptop. So the whole thing is like a 15
3:03:20
minute stream of pretty much silence and watching Mercer
3:03:25
twiddle his thumbs while the jury watched this thing on a
3:03:28
laptop in the courtroom. So I'm not going to show that
3:03:30
there's no value to it. However, a short time after
3:03:34
that, they do come back with their verdict.
3:03:36
So we're going to go ahead and watch that and we'll probably
3:03:40
have a little bit of discussion afterwards.
3:03:42
Channel members, if you go to the Discord, the link to join me
3:03:45
here in the fourth hour is there if you'd like to chime in on the
3:03:50
case after it's done. And then I also want to see if
3:03:54
we get more with this defendant out of Judge Stevens Court.
3:03:58
So with all that having been said, let's see how see how all
3:04:03
of this turned out, shall we? All right, so ladies and
3:04:21
gentlemen, we're back in the courtroom, We're back on record,
3:04:24
We're on Zoom, on YouTube. We have been advised, the bank
3:04:27
has been advised the jury has a verdict.
3:04:29
Is that right? Deputy states.
3:04:31
So a couple things are going to happen.
3:04:32
We're going to call the jury and we're going to get the verdict.
3:04:35
Regardless of the verdict, regardless of what which which
3:04:38
way the verdict is, I'm going to pull the jury.
3:04:40
I've done that every case I've ever had as a trial.
3:04:42
Think that's a better, cleaner way to do it.
3:04:44
Holding the jury simply means asking each individual juror, is
3:04:48
this your verdict? So we'll get the verdict.
3:04:50
Clark will read the verdict. I will then pull the jury.
3:04:54
You're in court. You've got to act like you're in
3:04:57
court. Some people are going to be
3:04:58
happy with the verdict. Some people may not be happy
3:05:00
with the verdict. You will not show out.
3:05:03
You will not say anything. You will not do anything to make
3:05:06
this jury there were anything less than appreciative of their
3:05:08
service. You get outside this courtroom
3:05:10
and you want to complain, you won't get on Facebook.
3:05:13
You want to do whatever, that's fine.
3:05:14
But in this courtroom you will be quiet or you will ask be
3:05:19
asked to leave. And if you show out, we're going
3:05:22
to have a contempt hearing. I'm not going to tolerate it.
3:05:25
So I'm telling you that now. That's the only warning you get.
3:05:28
We're not going to be disrespectful to the jury, Mr.
3:05:31
Mitchell. Anything else before we bring
3:05:32
the jury in for the verdict? Nothing but state, Your Honor.
3:05:34
Mr. McDaniel, All right, happy space.
3:06:01
All right, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, everyone, please be
3:06:04
seated. Ladies and gentlemen of the
3:06:05
jury, I've been invited. You have reached a verdict, is
3:06:07
that correct? All right.
3:06:08
Will you hand the verdict to Deputy Spates, please?
3:06:16
The verdict form appears to be signed and appropriately filled
3:06:22
incorrectly. And what I'm going to do is I
3:06:24
want to ask Madam Clerk to please publish the jury.
3:06:31
In the County Court, 14th Judicial Circuit of the State of
3:06:34
Florida and in for Jackson County, State of Florida,
3:06:37
plaintiff versus Jane Evelyn Provett, Defendant Case number
3:06:41
25, MMM 563 verdict. We, the jury find as follows as
3:06:48
to defendant Jane Evelyn Provett in this case.
3:06:51
As to Count 1, the defendant is guilty of discharging a firearm
3:06:55
on residential property as charged.
3:06:58
As to Count 2, the defendant is guilty of improper exhibition of
3:07:03
a firearm as charged. As to Count 3, the defendant is
3:07:10
not guilty. So say we all.
3:07:13
Dated this the 29th day of January 22,000.
3:07:17
And 26. Thank you.
3:07:20
So, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, what I'm going to do is
3:07:22
I'm going to poll the jury. That means I'm going to ask each
3:07:24
of you individually if this is your verdict.
3:07:26
It's a very simple question. Miss Sprague, is this your
3:07:29
verdict? Miss Williams, is this your
3:07:32
verdict? And Miss McGriff, Miss Ross, on
3:07:36
the back row we have Miss Santana Lopez is gone.
3:07:40
Mr. Jackson, is this your verdict?
3:07:42
And Miss Henderson, is this your verdict?
3:07:46
Ladies and gentlemen, I believe there's a standard instruction
3:07:49
for discharge of the jury. Let me see if I can put my hands
3:07:52
on that. 4.2 is the instruction number.
3:08:02
This is a pretty brief instruction, but please listen
3:08:05
to this final instruction. Ladies and gentlemen, I wish to
3:08:08
thank you for your time and consideration of this case.
3:08:11
I also wish to advise you of some very special privileges
3:08:13
enjoyed by jurors. No juror can ever be required to
3:08:17
talk about the discussions that occurred in the jury room except
3:08:20
by a court order. For many centuries our society
3:08:22
has relied upon juries for consideration of difficult
3:08:25
cases. We have recognized for hundreds
3:08:27
of years that a jury's deliberations, discussions, and
3:08:30
votes should remain their private affair as long as they
3:08:33
wish it. Therefore, therefore, the law
3:08:35
gives you a unique privilege not to speak about a jury's work.
3:08:39
Although you are at liberty to speak with anyone about your
3:08:41
deliberation, you are also at liberty to refuse to speak to
3:08:44
anyone. A request to discuss either your
3:08:47
verdict or your deliberations may come from those who are
3:08:49
simply curious, from those who might seek to find fault with
3:08:52
you, from the media, from the attorneys, or elsewhere.
3:08:55
It will be up to you to decide whether to preserve your
3:08:58
privacy. As a juror, it is entirely your
3:09:00
decision whether or not you speak to your to speak to people
3:09:03
about the and or your deliberations.
3:09:06
You've heard me give the instruction, I think a couple of
3:09:08
times to jurors that weren't chosen that you have another
3:09:13
privilege. And that is that for one
3:09:15
calendar year from today, you have the right of refusing to
3:09:19
serve as a juror in state court in Jackson County.
3:09:22
You can also, if you get, it's a random draw, but our driver's
3:09:25
license, as you probably know, if you get a summons to come to
3:09:28
jury service and you want to come, please come.
3:09:30
Love to have you again. On the other hand, you don't
3:09:32
have to. You can contact the clerk's
3:09:34
office and let them know that you've been sermons in the last
3:09:36
year. You showed up, you served, and
3:09:39
in that event, you will not have to serve again.
3:09:40
I also want to personally tell you thank you very much.
3:09:44
You've been a very attentive jury.
3:09:45
You paid attention. You obviously put some time,
3:09:47
effort, and thought into your deliberations.
3:09:49
We appreciate that and thank you for your time and your service.
3:09:53
As I promised, I will personally destroy any notes that you have
3:09:56
made. Someone asked that you leave
3:09:58
your juror pen and your notes in the chair as you leave and I
3:10:02
will take it from there. Once we get the court and
3:10:04
cleaned out, I will take them downstairs and shred them.
3:10:06
Do any of the jurors have any questions?
3:10:09
No questions, ladies and gentlemen, remain at the
3:10:11
courtroom, please, as the jury exits the courtroom.
3:10:13
Thank you again. Anybody.
3:10:15
Have anything back to? You and check your chairs.
3:10:18
Don't forget your, your watches, your, your electronic devices,
3:10:22
and so forth. Verdict form.
3:10:47
All right, the jury has departed.
3:10:48
Please be seated. OK, So Mr. McDaniel, Mr.
3:10:52
Mitchell, Miss Pravad has been found guilty of the jury by the
3:10:55
jury of two of the three charges she's accused of.
3:10:58
She's always been found not guilty of using a firearm while
3:11:01
under the influence of alcoholic beverage and guilty of
3:11:04
discharging A firearm, residential property and Count
3:11:07
2, improper exhibition of a farm.
3:11:10
I know they're both misdemeanors, but I'm not sure
3:11:12
what degree misdemeanors they are.
3:11:13
Mr. Mitchell. Both of them are first degree
3:11:16
misdemeanors. I'll get to that in just a
3:11:20
second. So thank you.
3:11:22
First degree misdemeanors as far as sentencing goes, Mr.
3:11:25
McDaniel, I'm going to ask you first.
3:11:27
Is your preference to go ahead and move to that today or give
3:11:30
you time to research that one issue that I kind of mentioned
3:11:33
I've we'll take a closer look at or any other issues.
3:11:36
Do you want to go ahead and, and post sentencing now or do you
3:11:38
want to set it for a sentencing date in the future?
3:11:40
We want to go ahead and go through the sentencing.
3:11:43
But you know, on that other issue, I, I still just would be
3:11:46
my objection to it. I did a little research on that
3:11:50
issue. Let me be clear.
3:11:52
Yeah, put the microphone on the. The issue he's referring to is
3:11:54
I, I, I ruled, I denied the Mr. McDaniel motion for directive
3:11:58
verdict on the account of improper exhibition of a
3:12:01
firearm. I did some research during the
3:12:03
lunch break. The question was since they
3:12:06
didn't see the firearm, could it be exhibition?
3:12:09
But they at least two witnesses, the young man and one of the two
3:12:12
people in the truck. So they saw the muzzle flash and
3:12:16
there was nothing definitive on point but that.
3:12:20
So I think I made the correct ruling.
3:12:22
I feel confident in that. But obviously I think that's a
3:12:25
huge factor and the the sentencing so I thought my role
3:12:31
is going to be the same. But I think your argument is
3:12:34
very well made argument that is that exhibition jury felt like
3:12:39
there was enough. So we'll see where we go on
3:12:43
sentencing. So this the fence is requesting
3:12:45
go ahead and post the sentence today.
3:12:46
Mr. Mitchell State have any objection to that?
3:12:48
No objections. I believe I heard you 2 talking.
3:12:54
I don't think I was involved in the conversation, but I heard
3:12:56
that there was a reference to APTI which would imply no prior
3:12:59
criminal history. That is correct.
3:13:02
Is that correct? There's no prior criminal
3:13:03
history, correct? That's actually been the state's
3:13:06
offer from arraignment, which was a one year PTI with a $370
3:13:12
fine with the conditions of no firearms while on probation and
3:13:18
since there was allegations of alcohol alleged in the original
3:13:22
complaint, no alcohol possession or consumption.
3:13:25
That was the original offer. Yes, that was the original.
3:13:28
Offer given the verdict that's been reached by the jury and two
3:13:31
first degree misdemeanors, what are you requesting as far as
3:13:35
sentencing, Mr. Mitchell? Aaron, this PTA offer's been on
3:13:40
the table since the very beginning and we came to trial
3:13:44
on this regardless. So given that she's been found
3:13:48
guilty on two first degree misdemeanors, State's
3:13:51
recommended sentence would be 11/29 probation instead of PTI
3:13:57
with the same conditions and fines.
3:14:00
Mr. McDaniel, I would just ask that, you know, as far as the
3:14:04
the gun, you know, she's a older lady that lives at home by
3:14:08
herself. I think the Sheriff's Office
3:14:09
took her gun. We last the court to maybe ask
3:14:11
the Sheriff's Office to return that to her.
3:14:14
You know, I think that's putting in her.
3:14:17
She's the. Problem is gone.
3:14:19
The problem has been removed from the from the land.
3:14:22
So there's not going to be the issue with that person anymore.
3:14:27
You know, and we understand, we went to trial.
3:14:28
We've lost it. And the courts going to send us
3:14:30
her. But we'd ask the court, you
3:14:31
know, we have nothing against what Miss Jacob said.
3:14:35
We just asked the court she'd be allowed to have a gun.
3:14:37
I mean, she needs a gun for protection.
3:14:39
She's, you know, 67 years old, never been in trouble and never
3:14:42
misused the gun. It's still our position that she
3:14:45
was in fear for her life on that day and for the incidents that
3:14:49
come up to that. But I understand the jury's made
3:14:51
that decision, so I don't want to assume anything.
3:14:56
Do either law enforcement or your alleged victim wish to be
3:15:01
heard? Actually, it's really not an
3:15:06
alleged victim on these charges. But does you have anybody else
3:15:09
that wishes to be heard, Mr. Mitchell?
3:15:12
I'm not certain. No law enforcement.
3:15:15
I see Jacoby's way that said no. Ashley.
3:15:20
They're saying no. I apologize, Your Honor, I
3:15:23
forgot a condition of no contact with Ashley Nichols as being a
3:15:29
part of probation. Mr. McDaniel, anybody else on
3:15:31
behalf of Miss Pravat or from Miss Pravat herself that you you
3:15:35
want me to hear from before I post sentence?
3:15:39
No, we're fine. But I don't know if there's a,
3:15:42
you know, me, like you said before, I mean, she's not really
3:15:44
a victim in the case. You know, she's alleged to have
3:15:47
shot a gun, a gun, you know, the resident.
3:15:49
She's not really technically a victim.
3:15:52
You know, I don't think she wants to have any contact with
3:15:55
her. And I don't think the other one
3:15:56
was heavy. But they just need to stay away
3:15:57
from each other. But I'd rather not have an order
3:15:59
that says that could create more issues in the future by saying
3:16:03
calling the probation office. Oh, she was at the dollar store
3:16:06
when I was there. I mean, you know how these
3:16:09
things can act. I just would prefer not to have
3:16:12
that. OK.
3:16:14
Thank you both. So, Miss Pravat, you've been
3:16:15
found guilty of two first degree misdemeanors that carry maximum
3:16:17
penalty of one year in jail each.
3:16:19
Based upon the testimony in the circumstances, as the jury found
3:16:22
them and as I heard them, and especially based upon your
3:16:25
criminal history, I don't think putting you in jail for this
3:16:27
kind of case is appropriate or fair, OK.
3:16:29
The state isn't asking for it. Even if they were, I don't think
3:16:33
that's the solution. I think the solution is
3:16:35
probation given the jury's verdict.
3:16:37
What I'm going to do is withhold adjudication of guilt.
3:16:39
I'm going to send you to the amount of probation of 11 months
3:16:42
and 29 days. That's one day short of a year.
3:16:45
You will have the standard conditions of probation, Miss
3:16:47
Pravat. Those are the normal reporting
3:16:49
in conditions. You have a condition that you
3:16:52
not possess consume alcoholic beverage at all.
3:16:55
I personally think this event might not have happened were it
3:16:58
not for the effect of the alcoholic beverage that the
3:17:02
witness testified and witnesses testified.
3:17:05
You are the influence of if you get caught consuming or
3:17:07
possessing alcoholic beverage during the next year, Miss
3:17:10
Pravat, then you will like to go to jail with no bond.
3:17:14
You cannot possess or consume alcoholic beverage at all.
3:17:17
No alcohol you also have a condition no contact with the
3:17:22
with the alleged victim and again, Mr. McDaniels technically
3:17:24
correct, but as part of this based upon the testimony this to
3:17:28
me it's kind of a no brainer that there needs to be a
3:17:30
condition the no contact with Miss Nichols and specifically
3:17:34
that's Miss Ashley Nichols. That's the Miss Ashley Nichols
3:17:38
is the project and have no contact with you have to pay
3:17:41
standard court costs and fines. They are the amount of $370 for
3:17:45
this charge. I'm not going to post court
3:17:46
costs and fines and count 2, they'll be waived on the
3:17:49
improper exhibition charge. So we've got standard probation,
3:17:53
withhold standard fines, no contact, no alcohol.
3:17:57
What? About the.
3:17:59
Firearm issue turn the firearm. I am not going to put a
3:18:03
condition no contact, no possession of firearms on her
3:18:07
probation. And the reason is I've heard
3:18:11
nothing that make me think. I've heard nothing to think
3:18:14
there's been no testimony that anyone else lives there.
3:18:17
And if Miss Provett was my mom, I would want her to have the
3:18:21
right to have a firearm. Now, having said that, she will
3:18:24
not have the right to get this firearm back until the
3:18:28
completion of her supervision. OK, So once this case is over,
3:18:32
actually, that's not appropriate.
3:18:33
What's appropriate is once the appellate period is over, she
3:18:37
would have the right to have the farm return.
3:18:38
So Mr. McDaniel would explain to your appellate options.
3:18:41
You've got the right to appeal and that appellate period is 30
3:18:45
days. So if there's no appeal filed
3:18:47
after the time period of 30 days, you'd have the right to
3:18:49
have this firearm return because it's no longer has any
3:18:52
evidentiary value. Mr. Mitchell, I understand the
3:18:54
request, but again, I felt this is alcohol fueled and hopefully
3:18:59
the condition of alcohol would would suffice to prevent any
3:19:03
future issues. And again, if it's my mom and if
3:19:07
she wants a firearm, I want her to have one there.
3:19:09
Not because of Miss Nichols, I don't think that's an issue
3:19:12
anymore, but just in general, I think that's the, you know, we
3:19:16
live in a a country that believes in firearms for
3:19:19
self-defense. And I want her to have that
3:19:20
right if she chooses to exercise that right.
3:19:26
Other requests that you made that I may not have addressed.
3:19:29
Mr. Mitchell, I. Think that addresses everything
3:19:32
that I. Mentioned Mr. Gill.
3:19:35
Mr. McDaniel. The only other thing, Miss
3:19:38
Pravat, is that the probation office is gone for the day.
3:19:41
They left at 4:30. We at that point, we didn't know
3:19:44
if it's going to be another 5 minutes or another two hours.
3:19:47
So I told them go ahead and go home.
3:19:49
What that means there's no one that can instruct you on
3:19:51
probation today. Can you be at the courthouse
3:19:53
tomorrow morning by 8:00 or 8:30?
3:19:58
Yeah. OK, I need you to be at the
3:19:59
Jackson County Probation office no later than 8:30 tomorrow.
3:20:02
And the reason is so they can instruct you.
3:20:04
They can give you the terms of probation and writing, They can
3:20:06
give you a copy of all the rules.
3:20:08
You'll sign something saying that you received it, and then
3:20:10
you'll be free to go. So it will take about 10 or 15
3:20:13
minutes at most. They'll get you instructed and
3:20:15
they'll get you out of here and they'll tell you what what day
3:20:18
of the month, reporting in and so forth.
3:20:22
That's everything I can think of.
3:20:23
Mr. McDaniel. Anything else on behalf of Miss
3:20:25
Pravat? No, Your Honor.
3:20:27
Miss Pravat, do you have any questions, ma'am?
3:20:28
Hello, Sir. No questions, Mr. Mitchell.
3:20:33
Anything else in the state? Nothing for the state, Your
3:20:36
Honor. I'm signing this disposition
3:20:39
then and ladies and gentlemen, that concludes today's
3:20:44
proceedings. I'm going to ask the alleged
3:20:48
victims, Mr. Miss Nichols, Mr. Highsmith, if you want to go
3:20:51
ahead and leave, Chuck, if you'll.
3:20:54
I don't want any arguments or disagreements outside.
3:20:57
So if. Our investigator.
3:21:00
Investigator Jackson's helping get them out the door, so give
3:21:04
them just a couple of minutes to get down the elevator and all of
3:21:07
you are free to go. Any questions?
3:21:10
All right, that's pretty much it.
3:21:11
They're friends. They just usher them out from
3:21:13
there. So just to recap, oh, by the
3:21:17
way, before we go there, the Judge Stevens thing, the guy he
3:21:21
was talking with did not come back.
3:21:23
They actually are. They've moved into a trial right
3:21:26
now, so it's possible he might come back later this afternoon
3:21:29
or something, but it won't be anything we'll end up covering
3:21:32
here. But I'll keep an eye out anyways
3:21:34
and maybe we can update it on Monday.
3:21:38
Any who so just to recap this. So she was found guilty of
3:21:43
discharge of a firearm on residential property, guilty of
3:21:47
unlawful display of a weapon, but not guilty on using the
3:21:52
firearm while drunk, which was interesting because if you
3:21:57
listen to judge during his sentencing, he said that he felt
3:22:04
that this was alcohol related. So what he felt fuelled this
3:22:09
whole thing. He said that he felt it was
3:22:12
alcohol fuelled. The jury did not agree with him.
3:22:15
The jury found a not guilty on that part of of the charges.
3:22:20
So it's interesting, by the way, we're going to talk about this
3:22:23
case for a few minutes and then probably call it a day.
3:22:26
But channel members, the link has been posted.
3:22:28
If you want to call in and talk to me about this case, now would
3:22:31
be the time to start lining up. So it's up to you.
3:22:38
But yeah, great. Granny.
3:22:39
The judge thought she was drunk. Yeah.
3:22:41
You know, it kind of makes you wonder if this is yet another
3:22:45
person who, you know, we talked about them last night on
3:22:48
sidebar, these people who have, like, a dependency for it.
3:22:52
I wonder if this is one of those people because they were making
3:22:55
excuses for the fact that she had red, watery, glassy eyes or
3:22:59
whatever. They're in court.
3:23:01
But, you know, I put in the chat and I was rather serious about
3:23:06
it. Was she drunk in court?
3:23:09
You know, I have no idea. Was that a factor in not putting
3:23:12
her on the stand? I don't know.
3:23:14
I'm just, I'm not convinced there isn't a bigger problem
3:23:17
there. But, you know, it didn't come
3:23:19
out in court whether there was or was not.
3:23:21
So nobody will know. But another interesting thing
3:23:27
that struck me about this. A functioning drunk.
3:23:30
Yeah. Great Granny.
3:23:31
Entirely possible. We talked about those on sidebar
3:23:34
last night, at least in part. So it's, you know, it's nothing
3:23:39
we haven't seen before they become dependent on it.
3:23:43
But another thing that caught my attention during this portion of
3:23:47
the trial, this this verdict and sentencing portion was that it
3:23:51
came out what she was offered before she chose to go to trial
3:23:56
and that was a 12 month PTIPTI is pretrial intervention.
3:24:02
Basically you follow through the year with the probation
3:24:05
requirements and everything else and at the end the case is
3:24:09
dismissed. She would not have had a charge.
3:24:12
Instead she chose to push her to trial anyways.
3:24:16
The result was essentially the same.
3:24:18
She ended up with the 12 months of probation in the same fine
3:24:22
and everything else. But she has a charge now on her
3:24:29
record that will stick. There's no PTI, there's no
3:24:31
wiping it out. So this is yet another case.
3:24:34
You know, we saw this in Middleton's court a few days ago
3:24:38
where you had the guy who was offered a misdemeanor deal and
3:24:42
he decided to press his luck and he's going to take it to a
3:24:46
felony trial and open himself up to prison time.
3:24:50
Here you had a situation where all she had to do was what she's
3:24:55
going to end up doing anyways. And it would have been, it would
3:24:59
have been dismissed at the end, but instead, stupid decisions.
3:25:09
Instead, she's going to have a she's kind of a charge on the
3:25:11
record. I don't get it.
3:25:14
I don't get it. Not even a little bit.
3:25:19
So that might be another one of the, the top five dumbest things
3:25:26
that we've seen on TCF from a defendant.
3:25:31
Plus the attorney cost, Well, that was a public defender,
3:25:34
Wahoo. So I don't, I don't know what
3:25:36
she'll have to pay an attorney's cost there, but it would be
3:25:38
minimal. This is the same guy, Mr.
3:25:41
McDaniel, that we see every morning with the first
3:25:44
appearances. I find him personally to be much
3:25:48
more impressive on 1st appearances than I do on trials,
3:25:55
that's for sure. But maybe it's just me.
3:26:02
There's another thing that I wanted to talk about real quick
3:26:04
and then if you guys want to say something, we're good to have
3:26:07
that discussion. If not, we'll probably call it a
3:26:09
day. But the defense during his
3:26:13
closing arguments said we've all shotguns in the air.
3:26:21
Now, if you've hung around this channel long enough, you know
3:26:24
that I am unapologetically to a I, I don't believe in
3:26:28
restrictions on firearms. For the most part.
3:26:33
I believe everybody should be allowed to carry.
3:26:36
It is one of the founding principles of this country, in
3:26:39
my opinion. It is in the document.
3:26:42
I think gun laws in many areas are overdone.
3:26:46
I like it here in my home state of Arizona that Michael and I
3:26:51
have joked about this before, that it's kind of illegal not to
3:26:53
carry a gun here. And there's some truth to that.
3:26:56
But we don't register our firearms here.
3:26:59
We have constitutional carry and a metric ton of us here are
3:27:05
armed. And for the most part, it has, I
3:27:08
think, made for a more peaceful state.
3:27:10
Now, we have our problems, don't get me wrong.
3:27:13
However, there is something to be said for an armed society
3:27:16
being a peaceful society. That having been said, the the
3:27:24
defense saying we've all shotguns in the air was one of
3:27:29
the stupidest things I think I have ever heard from an attorney
3:27:32
in the history of ever. Even if it's true.
3:27:38
Dumbest thing in the world to say, but certainly the dumbest
3:27:40
thing in the world to do. Here is my take on firearms and
3:27:47
how I have always approached them.
3:27:52
It is how I have trained our son because we have we have done a
3:27:58
whole lot of dry fire target practice.
3:28:01
We have one of those laser rounds and we have done that
3:28:04
with him. So he understands how to how to
3:28:07
properly handle a firearm. And even with the laser round in
3:28:10
it, we treat it like it's a live weapon.
3:28:13
So we go through that discipline, but you do not draw
3:28:21
your weapon out unless whatever it is you are pointing that
3:28:27
weapon at, you intend to destroy, at least if need be,
3:28:32
period. If you have no intention to
3:28:36
destroy it, you don't point your weapon at it.
3:28:39
Now obviously even if you're pointing your weapon at
3:28:41
something, the the hope is that you do not have to destroy it
3:28:44
specifically if it's a person, but that is how you have to go
3:28:47
into it, that at that point you're willing to destroy.
3:28:53
That is the purpose of a firearm.
3:28:56
It isn't to tickle something, it's to kill it.
3:29:00
I don't view the air as any different.
3:29:03
If you're pointing your gun up in the air, then you damn well
3:29:07
better be trying to kill the air, which of course we know you
3:29:09
can't do. Which is why it's stupid to
3:29:11
point the gun up in the air and fire it.
3:29:13
Because it is true. What goes up does come down.
3:29:15
I shared the story the other day at the house I grew up in.
3:29:18
At one point after I had moved out, there was a leak in the
3:29:22
roof and I came back to repair it.
3:29:25
If I recall correctly, Dad was in the hospital or something.
3:29:28
I think that was the case. But when I was up there
3:29:31
repairing that leak in the roof, I found two bullets in the roof
3:29:36
where somebody had fired their gun up in the air.
3:29:40
And sure enough, they came down and they came down right in the
3:29:44
asphalt shingles on top of that house.
3:29:48
So the house, the house got killed that day.
3:29:51
Interestingly enough, though, that was not the cause of the
3:29:53
leak. But they were nearby and there
3:29:55
they were shining under the sunlight.
3:29:57
I saw them. So you just, you can't do that.
3:30:02
There is, you have to have a discipline with your firearms.
3:30:08
You have to have a respect for them and a respect for the fact
3:30:12
that the tool that you are holding will destroy.
3:30:16
Therefore, don't point that tool anywhere unless you have an
3:30:21
intention to destroy that which you're pointing it at.
3:30:24
Period. End of discussion.
3:30:26
And it drives me nuts when people don't have that kind of
3:30:30
discipline with their weapons. And that kind of yeehaw kind of
3:30:35
approach just does not fly with me because I think with with the
3:30:41
right to carry it also comes the responsibility to handle it
3:30:45
properly. Now, we probably have some
3:30:48
different thoughts on responsibility.
3:30:50
You know, one of the things you hear all the time is you should
3:30:52
keep your guns locked up. No, no, no, no, no, no.
3:30:57
At least not all of them. Some of them need to be readily
3:31:01
available. Because if somebody breaks into
3:31:03
your home, if there's some kind of intrusion, some kind of
3:31:06
threat, are you going to go hold on a minute?
3:31:08
I got to go to my gun safe and put my fingerprint on it so I
3:31:11
can get my gun. I know a lot of people will
3:31:15
fight me on that one, but that's how I feel.
3:31:17
Any who Miguel, are you feeling better?
3:31:22
Yeah, I'm coming around. I I had a little hypoglycemia, a
3:31:26
little, a little dizziness or a little Lightheadedness.
3:31:31
So I had to lie down for a while, but I was listening the
3:31:34
entire time. I, I kind of dozed a little bit,
3:31:36
but I was mostly here. It was interesting that I got to
3:31:41
see two of my least favorite attorneys on the same day.
3:31:45
That other guy in Judge Stevens court, I've seen him and he's
3:31:49
and of course he goes into West's court too.
3:31:53
That guy is never prepared. He is never prepared.
3:31:57
He is always interrupting the judges.
3:32:00
He seems to not have any clue about any of his clients at all.
3:32:05
That guy why is he allowed to practice?
3:32:09
He has been beat down by the Judge Stevens and by Judge WA
3:32:12
few times for for his lack of understanding or knowledge or or
3:32:16
just being kind of a a goof. I meant Jefferson County needs
3:32:22
some help. Yeah, he kind of needs to move
3:32:25
someplace where they don't know him and straight over.
3:32:29
I think so because I don't think he's doing.
3:32:31
His clients any favors? No, he's not.
3:32:34
And then Mr. McDaniel, I, I've, you know, we've seen him most of
3:32:38
the time in Judge Mercer's court.
3:32:41
We're, we're watching first appearances.
3:32:44
No, I have seen him you know, of also on Judge Garcia's streams
3:32:48
and stuff. And even Judge Clark.
3:32:51
I think I've seen him a couple of times.
3:32:54
I've never really liked him either because he's he's one of
3:32:59
those country lawyers that often will weave a tale about
3:33:03
something and try to relate it to what's being talked about,
3:33:07
but nobody knows what the hell he's talking about.
3:33:10
But that statement where he goes, well, you know, well, shot
3:33:13
her gun in the air and what? OK, maybe that's a Florida
3:33:18
thing, like a Florida Panhandle thing or the Deep South thing.
3:33:22
But I don't think so much as I make fun of the hay seeds.
3:33:27
I I don't think they're just out shooting guns up in the air,
3:33:30
Yosemite Sam style. Only while making pepper sauce.
3:33:34
Pepper sauce. Yes.
3:33:39
That's when it's allowed. Oh my God.
3:33:42
Under Florida law. I, I will tell you that was,
3:33:49
that was a strange trial in a lot of ways, but never mind the
3:33:57
10 sidebars. I don't know.
3:33:58
I think I, I can't say because I wasn't completely, I wasn't
3:34:04
completely in, in reality for the entire trial.
3:34:08
I'm going to go back for the little bit that I did kind of
3:34:11
miss, but there was still a lot of different sidebars.
3:34:14
Most of them occurred on day one.
3:34:17
And it was just strange how he just inserted his comments
3:34:25
randomly throughout partially testifying.
3:34:28
And I know finally Judge Mercer sort of stepped in and, and
3:34:31
stopped him from doing that. And I know that there's some
3:34:36
latitude on cross when people do that.
3:34:39
And I know there's some, but this was, it got a little bit
3:34:42
weird. I will say.
3:34:45
Then of course, the weirdest part was, and I, I thought it
3:34:51
was strange that a, the jury found not guilty for the
3:34:55
possession or the, the alcohol portion discharge.
3:35:01
What was it discharge? Well, intoxicated or yeah,
3:35:05
basically, yeah. And then to give a no, no
3:35:11
stipulation of or the basically giving an order saying you're
3:35:16
not allowed to consume alcohol during this probation, which I
3:35:19
know is kind of a standard thing, especially in Texas, we
3:35:21
see that a lot. But if the jury found not guilty
3:35:25
on that, it's kind of weird that you would say, well, you're
3:35:27
still not allowed to to drink. That would be almost an
3:35:33
appealable part. Probation conditions though.
3:35:36
Yeah, I guess you could. It's just weird.
3:35:39
Really charge related at that point.
3:35:41
Yeah, but it's weird to tie that in and say, well, I, I still
3:35:44
think this was caused by alcohol, which of course I
3:35:47
believe it was too. Alcohol definitely fueled this.
3:35:51
We saw the video or we heard the video in, in, you know, on, on
3:35:55
day one. And she was, I mean, clearly
3:35:59
she's sounded intoxicated. Oh, I, I, so I can't say for
3:36:05
sure, but it sure sounded like it.
3:36:08
If I was on the jury, I would have, I would have really pushed
3:36:10
for that because it sure seemed like she was intoxicated.
3:36:13
But whatever, it doesn't matter. I I just think that that's,
3:36:16
yeah, you want to make that a standard condition.
3:36:18
But to say that that was the root cause, even when the jury
3:36:21
found it wasn't, was, was odd. I mean, the whole thing was odd.
3:36:24
It was, but I guess I could sum it up by saying that was a very
3:36:27
Florida trial, very especially rural Florida.
3:36:33
That was very Jackson County or Bay County or you know, one of
3:36:37
those. It was very like yeehaw kind of
3:36:39
kind of trials. That is very good way to put it.
3:36:44
Barbara. Thank you for gifting the
3:36:45
membership. Yeah, I mean, it definitely had
3:36:50
that Florida feel to it. Yeah.
3:36:53
And, and I agree with you on McDaniel, too.
3:36:55
It was driving me nuts the amount of of commentary he was
3:37:00
giving during his questioning. I mean, even even harmless stuff
3:37:04
like, like, oh, she's making hot sauce.
3:37:07
Yeah, my Mama makes hot sauce too.
3:37:09
What kind of Peppers did she use?
3:37:11
What does this have to do with any?
3:37:14
And then the the one that that I caught yesterday and that I know
3:37:18
got Ashley all fired up was the comment about redheads that was
3:37:25
so weird like that. I mean, why what?
3:37:31
Well, I know y'all redheads, sometimes you get temperamental
3:37:34
or whatever. I mean, what, what next?
3:37:39
Well, I know that sometimes people, you know, that it just
3:37:42
happened. I just a lot of that the
3:37:46
commentary was very strange. So I don't know, man, that that
3:37:49
was it was kind of it was kind of interesting.
3:37:53
I mean, I I still say well worth the time investment and and well
3:37:57
worth anyone to watch that trial beginning to end.
3:37:59
It was fascinating. I can't I can't say it wasn't
3:38:04
it. As a matter of fact, maybe
3:38:05
that's the circus aspect of it was what made it so fascinating.
3:38:11
The characters involved were all pretty interesting in the in and
3:38:14
of themselves because I I do think that there was probably
3:38:18
not to victim blame here, but there was probably some
3:38:21
instigation on the part of the plaintiff or the not plaintiff,
3:38:24
but the the complaining witness, if you will.
3:38:29
Yeah, I mean, obviously, I think, yeah, I mean, this was
3:38:34
one of those things where not going to say that the Mr.
3:38:40
McDaniels defense of, hey, she was in fear of her life and, you
3:38:46
know, these people harassed her. So it was kind of OK that she
3:38:49
did. That was necessarily a a winning
3:38:52
defense. However, that was one part of
3:38:55
his defense where I I have to say I I can't 100% disagree
3:39:01
given the history that was obviously there.
3:39:06
I think she would have been better off being more aggressive
3:39:13
if if she was truly in fear of her life.
3:39:15
She would have been better off drawing the weapon, aiming it at
3:39:19
the person and saying get off my property.
3:39:22
Yes. I think that would have been
3:39:23
more defensible than shooting it up in the air yelling yeehaw
3:39:27
she's drunk while making her pepper sauce.
3:39:30
Right. You know, I mean, honestly,
3:39:34
because at that point there's no discharge, you can argue that
3:39:37
there was an intrusion and you made the threat go away without
3:39:42
firing a shot. That probably would have been a
3:39:45
cleaner defense. Well, and Florida has the castle
3:39:49
doctrine and you know, Florida has long stood as the eight.
3:39:53
You know, if you if your life, you do feel that your life is in
3:39:56
fear and you have a reasonable belief of that and you point
3:39:59
your weapon at somebody that's not aggravated assault or that's
3:40:02
not whatever they call it. Their deadly conduct is what
3:40:06
they call it in Texas and all that's it.
3:40:08
You know it's not. Just so long as that that is in
3:40:12
place and that could certainly be much easier argued in a trial
3:40:16
setting, then I'll, I just fired my gun up in the air because as
3:40:19
soon as you do that, you lose, at least in my view.
3:40:23
Yeah, because at that point you're adding the, you're adding
3:40:27
the layer of actually discharging that weapon.
3:40:31
Right. And, and in many jurisdictions
3:40:33
simply the discharge of a weapon in, you know, in the city or in
3:40:37
the, in the municipality or whatever is in and of itself
3:40:42
usually a misdemeanor at least. So yes.
3:40:45
You know, in most in most places.
3:40:47
Yeah. Again, unless you're discharging
3:40:50
it in self-defense. I mean like a legitimate, like a
3:40:54
legitimate good shoot. Sure.
3:40:56
Well, obviously, yeah. But at that point, yeah, then
3:40:59
it's all moot. But so this is just one of those
3:41:03
things. Yeah.
3:41:04
But about the only thing you get charged with there at that point
3:41:08
is, hey, as long did you pick up your shell casings?
3:41:11
You didn't. OK, well, that's littering.
3:41:16
But yeah, very Florida. And I will say this too, because
3:41:21
I don't know how everybody else feels about this, but based on
3:41:24
what the chat was saying, these kinds of trials, if, if we can
3:41:28
catch these from time to time, I think these would be, you know,
3:41:31
one of those things I'd love to see more of here.
3:41:34
Yeah, it's just a matter of running across them at the right
3:41:36
time and right. Something that isn't gonna drag
3:41:38
on for days and days, right? You know?
3:41:41
Maybe, but a case like this was fascinating.
3:41:44
Maybe a future TCF spin off, But yeah, no, this was this was good
3:41:48
to watch and I enjoyed watching Mercer do something different
3:41:52
from the norm. Yes.
3:41:54
Because normally what we see is the first appearance stuff for
3:41:56
the, the one day a week where he does like the traffic violations
3:42:01
and whatnot. And yes, those, those can all be
3:42:04
interesting. But it was good to see him in a
3:42:05
different kind of form. And I do think it was driving
3:42:08
him nuts that he couldn't move at his his normal racing pace.
3:42:12
Oh, I know he, he loves to move things along quickly.
3:42:16
And, you know, I, I, I could kind of see him at times really
3:42:20
trying to push it along and, and he really tried to, when he, I
3:42:25
think about, I don't know, sidebar #7 or 8, he really was,
3:42:31
I think trying to get these attorneys to, to come together
3:42:36
and say, Hey, can we stop with the shenanigans?
3:42:38
I, you know, I got a lot to do today.
3:42:43
I don't know, that was still I, I like seeing that.
3:42:46
Just like I like seeing, you know, these kinds of things from
3:42:48
McNally or some of these other places that we go to often where
3:42:51
it's I'll have a procedural just mostly plea deals and mostly
3:42:55
traffic or or, you know, arraignments.
3:42:58
And it's always fascinating to kind of see, you know, when it
3:43:02
goes the other way. No, I agree.
3:43:05
One other thing I might, I might want to ask you and I I still
3:43:09
might want to ask you that. I'm going to ask you why not
3:43:12
sure. And I mentioned this a few
3:43:16
minutes ago. Do you think that that this this
3:43:20
defendant was stupid for not taking the plea?
3:43:24
I do because the plea we found out during the sentencing here
3:43:29
that she was offered was a one year PTI with like the same
3:43:32
conditions. So after one year, this would
3:43:36
not even be on her record. Right now she ends up with the
3:43:40
same result, except it's going to be on a record, right?
3:43:44
I That struck me as such a dumb move.
3:43:47
It is dumb. I'm not, you know, I question
3:43:51
the the legitimacy of all of these plea deals that we're
3:43:55
doing and is it the right thing to do or what not?
3:43:58
But I will say for me, if I was in a situation like that and I
3:44:03
had the ability to walk through a year of, of jumping through
3:44:08
hoops to have that stay off my record, I that strikes me as a
3:44:12
no brainer than rather take the risk at a trial.
3:44:16
Absolutely, because you don't know what's going to happen.
3:44:19
You don't know what your sentence might because you're
3:44:21
it's two misdemeanors now, they're not going to be run
3:44:24
consecutive. But you could, you could still
3:44:27
face up to a year in jail. And at 64 years old, do you
3:44:30
really want to spend a year in jail?
3:44:35
You know, best case scenario you're found not guilty.
3:44:37
But but really the other case scenario is you're still not
3:44:41
guilty so long as you behave yourself and and don't do
3:44:45
anything for 11 months and 29 days, you would be you'd be
3:44:51
again without a conviction. So kind of like I don't yeah.
3:44:56
I don't get why she wouldn't have taken the plea deal.
3:44:59
I don't know if she was pushed toward trial by the defense
3:45:03
there or, you know, if she was steadfast and saying I'm not
3:45:08
going to trial or I am going to go to trial.
3:45:10
These guys, you know, maybe she wanted, she thought something
3:45:14
else would happen. I don't know, weird.
3:45:16
Well, I think, I think Charles might have just nailed it in the
3:45:19
chat. He said she didn't want to stop
3:45:20
drinking. That could.
3:45:24
Very well, you know. And and you know, they kept,
3:45:27
they kept referencing the fact. And this was stupid to me too.
3:45:31
The defense pointing out in court that, yeah, her eyes are
3:45:34
red and glassy and watery and all that stuff now.
3:45:37
Weird. I'm like, are you out of your
3:45:39
mind by pointing that out? And I know that they tried to
3:45:42
make that about her congestive heart failure and endless not
3:45:48
doctor is not something I am. But you know, my dad had
3:45:53
congestive heart failure. I know that his eyes were not
3:45:58
glossy because he had congestive heart failure.
3:46:02
It didn't happen. That's dumb.
3:46:05
She was likely drunk in court. Very possible.
3:46:09
And that's the, you know, this reminds me a lot.
3:46:12
And I always go back to this example.
3:46:14
You know, we saw this case in Judge Fleischer's court where
3:46:18
there was this young woman and she just wanted to get a
3:46:23
conviction for theft. As she was up, she was facing
3:46:27
theft, a misdemeanor theft. She just wanted to get the
3:46:30
conviction out of the way. And Judge could not figure out
3:46:33
why, why he even like did Sale of the Century with her, like,
3:46:40
hey, all right, I'm going to take it down to, you know, three
3:46:42
months or whatever, 9 days probation.
3:46:47
And she just didn't want to be supervised because then she
3:46:49
couldn't use because she was also, you know, kind of, it was
3:46:52
very questionable that, well, it was very likely that she was
3:46:55
using drugs of some kind and she didn't want to have that
3:46:59
supervision. She wanted to get her
3:47:01
conviction. She wanted to do some time and
3:47:04
then get out so she could use without having any sort of
3:47:07
supervision again. And I thought that was so
3:47:10
strange and also so very sad. I think, you know, Judge
3:47:14
Fleischer kind of saw through that, too.
3:47:17
And this is kind of a similar thing.
3:47:18
Like, yeah, she just wanted to keep drinking.
3:47:21
And while she wasn't found guilty on that, I do think Judge
3:47:24
Mercer, even though I thought it was weird to bring it up that
3:47:27
right after the jury said that. But still, the fact is that
3:47:32
alcohol has probably been the cause of a lot of her problems.
3:47:36
Yeah. You know, so that congestive
3:47:40
heart failure may very well be part of it.
3:47:44
Yeah, that's a symptom, not a feature, though.
3:47:47
I mean of, of the right the eye, you know, I, I think you
3:47:52
understand what I'm trying to say.
3:47:53
It's not yes, it's not the cause of the of the eyes being what
3:47:56
they are. She's.
3:47:57
Just no. And the the heart is probably a
3:48:00
a result of the drinking. She's sure she's undoubtedly A
3:48:03
functional alcoholic, or at least she thinks she's
3:48:05
functional. But yeah, and it's probably good
3:48:10
from that standpoint that she didn't go on the stand.
3:48:12
It probably would have made things worse.
3:48:14
Barbara did ask in the chat if they're gonna do a soberlink, a
3:48:17
random test. There was no order for a
3:48:18
soberlink so it'd just be a patient testing her.
3:48:21
Yeah. And.
3:48:22
That'll be and probably be regular.
3:48:24
Cuz he did make it clear that if she had any alcohol, if she was
3:48:28
discovered with any during the year, she'd be in jail.
3:48:31
So. Well, and that's a thing to
3:48:33
watch. Feeling we'll see her.
3:48:36
Yeah, I was just Dan. We did it again because I know
3:48:40
that at some point over the next year, we'll see first
3:48:43
appearances. We know you never know and might
3:48:45
see her pop up. So that's one to keep an eye on.
3:48:50
It would not surprise me. No.
3:48:53
All right, All right, Michael. Well, let's remind everybody,
3:48:56
Monday, 7:00 PM Eastern, 4:00 PM Pacific.
3:48:59
You and I go live with no idea what we're going to talk about.
3:49:03
I am. I'm excited for this.
3:49:06
You know, this is unlike the pilot, you know, this is gonna
3:49:09
be the live, the first real episode, episode 1, it's gonna
3:49:13
be live. And we're going into it in the
3:49:17
blind and it's going to be it's gonna be fun.
3:49:21
But, you know, maybe a little, maybe there'll be a little
3:49:25
butterfly sneaking in, you know, little, little nerves sneaking
3:49:29
in right before the the live because we have no idea what
3:49:33
we're going to talk about and we have no idea where this is going
3:49:37
to go. Yeah, I mean, I'm used to that
3:49:40
here because I go into each day without really knowing what's
3:49:43
going to happen. But I know it's court, I know
3:49:46
it's law, stuff, you know with within the blind, we have no
3:49:50
idea what she's going to throw. Yes.
3:49:53
So that's that's the beauty of it.
3:49:55
So. Could be anything you.
3:49:56
Know just just for the record, when we did the pilot, it was
3:50:00
one take. We did not hit the pause button
3:50:03
or anything else. So what I see was, you know what
3:50:06
we recorded in real time, but we did have the option to hit the
3:50:11
pause button. Going forward, we will not.
3:50:14
So it should be a yeah. My my biggest fear, quite
3:50:18
honestly, is that we get presented with something that
3:50:21
I've never even heard of before. Yeah, that's very possible.
3:50:27
Yeah, that's. Doing a quick Google.
3:50:33
Yeah, that's, that's very possible that we will just run
3:50:35
into something that we have no idea or I, I don't think it's
3:50:39
going to be something that we don't have an opinion about one
3:50:42
way or the other, but it's just going to be something that's out
3:50:44
of left field. Because, you know, I for the
3:50:47
first episode, I, I kind of, you know, I was looking at, you
3:50:50
know, even more current events and kind of just looking just
3:50:54
randomly at all sorts of stuff from around the country and just
3:50:58
trying to see if, you know, get a gauge of, of, you know, maybe
3:51:02
what could come up. So I did a little bit of
3:51:06
preparation, even though it's a show without prep, but then of
3:51:10
course, what I looked up and of course, none of that came into
3:51:14
being. So you know, that's the beauty
3:51:18
of this show. That's that's what makes it a
3:51:19
little bit different from, you know, the other shows that are
3:51:24
out there are the the other talking head shows and the other
3:51:27
shows on YouTube and all the stuff out there.
3:51:29
So I that's what's going to be. Exciting, but I could be wrong
3:51:32
and I'm sure I am, but I've personally not run across a show
3:51:35
I can think of where they go into it completely unprepared
3:51:40
with no idea what they're even going to begin their show with.
3:51:46
Well, I, I would say based on scrolling through YouTube Shorts
3:51:51
sometimes and then seeing like the live shows that come up in
3:51:54
the YouTube Shorts and there's some people I think that are not
3:51:58
prepared. But the difference is they are
3:52:01
completely inarticulate. They don't know how to speak off
3:52:06
the cuff. They don't really know their
3:52:09
subject anyway, So it just comes across as kind of like, you
3:52:14
know, very, you know, just just completely clusterfuck.
3:52:21
You know, it's just, it's just awful.
3:52:24
So and that's that's kind of sums up live YouTube shorts.
3:52:27
I mean, and that's the best stuff.
3:52:30
I mean, you should see that there's somebody that has like
3:52:33
that'll that eats random condiments.
3:52:36
YouTube Shorts live Shorts has is is if you ever just want to
3:52:43
find what a what a train wreck looks like without actually
3:52:49
seeing 2 trains collide or train flying off the tracks.
3:52:52
If you just want to see the virtual equivalent of it, that
3:52:56
would be your place to go. It's.
3:52:59
Very true, or you can find it on Tiktok too.
3:53:03
Either way. Oh my God.
3:53:05
Well, that's a. Way.
3:53:07
Train wreck that's like that's, that's like a yeah, that's a
3:53:10
virtual Hindenburg there. Oh, the humanity.
3:53:17
All right, Mike. Well, have a good weekend and I
3:53:20
look forward to debating whatever it is we're going to
3:53:23
debate with you on Monday. Yeah, I do too.
3:53:25
And now I got to get to work because I I kind of stayed in
3:53:28
bed all morning. So I actually have to work now.
3:53:30
Yeah. You got to go make a video.
3:53:32
Yeah. All right, bring US1 all.
3:53:35
Right. See you later then, yes?
3:53:39
All right, friends, that was Michael again.
3:53:40
Join us for In the Blind. Looks like Barbara just dropped
3:53:45
a link. Again, if you're not subscribed
3:53:46
to that Channel, please go over there and do that and hit the
3:53:49
notification bell so you're ready to go on Monday.
3:53:51
We're incredibly excited about this.
3:53:53
It's different from what we do here.
3:53:56
I'm not saying that a court or a law topic couldn't come up, but
3:53:59
the shtick here is Michael and I get 2 subjects we talk for each
3:54:04
120 minutes. We have no idea what they're
3:54:06
gonna be. And then we have a true false
3:54:08
lightning round at the end where we're presented with five things
3:54:11
and we have to decide whether or not what we're being presented
3:54:14
with is true or false. And it's fun.
3:54:17
So go check out the pilot if you haven't already and then
3:54:19
subscribe if you'd be so kind cuz we're really excited about
3:54:24
that project. All right, friends, that is it
3:54:27
for today. We will be back on Monday, 7:00
3:54:31
AM Eastern. No, 9:00 AM Eastern, 6:00 AM
3:54:35
Pacific. There we go.
3:54:36
I'm it's 7:00 AM here. Time zones are tough.
3:54:40
I'm telling you guys, one time zone for the United States,
3:54:44
we'll call it freedom time, one time zone and we can put, we can
3:54:49
put Alaska and Hawaii on their own time zone.
3:54:51
We'll call it Freedom West, but there needs to be one.
3:54:56
It just has to happen. Call your congressman, start a
3:55:01
start a petition, whatever. Let's make this happen.
3:55:04
We hope we'll be back on Monday. I should have some best of this
3:55:10
weekend, but they're not produced yet, so it's going to
3:55:14
be a matter of if I can get them done.
3:55:15
But keep your eyes out for that. If not, we'll see you Monday,
3:55:18
but go have yourselves a great weekend.
3:55:20
Take care. God bless.