Latest / PNW Haunts & Homicides / Susan Cox Powell: Vanished | West Valley City, UT

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Susan Cox Powell: Vanished | West Valley City, UT · PNW Haunts & Homicides

0:00
He said he'd taken the boys to Simpson Springs campground.
0:06
When police checked, there were no tracks, no ashes, no proof anyone had been there.
0:13
Even more unsettling were the words of little Charlie Powell, just four years old at the
0:18
time.
0:20
When detectives asked about the family's strange midnight camping trip into Utah's
0:25
frozen desert, he told them that his mother had gone with them that Sunday.
0:30
But for some reason, she stayed behind at the campsite and didn't come home.
0:38
Hi Cassie.
0:39
Hi Caitlyn.
0:41
Hi creepy people.
0:43
Hello!
0:44
Hello!
0:45
Hello!
0:46
This is PNW Haunts and Homicides where we chat about true crime, the paranormal and all-thing
0:52
spooky in the Pacific Northwest.
0:55
Or the PNW, if you're nasty.
0:59
And we are.
1:00
It's well-established lore, I think.
1:03
Definitely lore at this point.
1:05
Nasty and nasty lore.
1:07
Oh my goodness.
1:08
We also do a terror reading at the end of every episode for a little bit of deeper insight
1:14
into our topic.
1:15
The lore about the nasty is so well-established.
1:21
Now our friends are going on other podcasts and spreading the good word, the gospel.
1:27
The nasty word?
1:28
Wait, what?
1:29
Yeah.
1:30
Yeah, Shay and Jody from Rainy Day Rabbit Holes were just on Live Laugh Larceny.
1:37
We found out that we are their gateway gals as it were.
1:42
They heard about Live Laugh Larceny from a promo swap that we did with them.
1:48
And that's how they connected with them.
1:51
Oh, I know.
1:53
I love it.
1:54
I love it when our friends become friends.
1:56
I love it when our nasty friends become nasty without us and do nasty things all over
2:01
the place.
2:02
I don't know if I said that right, but you guys get it.
2:05
You get it.
2:06
Well, should we do our little announcement?
2:08
We have just a tiny announcement.
2:10
Do it.
2:11
We used to release on Tuesdays.
2:13
You remember the thing we used to say at the end?
2:15
See you next Tuesday.
2:17
Yeah.
2:18
But I conveniently cut out of the last episode.
2:22
Because spoiler alert, we probably won't be seeing you Tuesdays anymore.
2:28
Don't cry.
2:29
It's okay.
2:30
We'll see you on the next Tuesday, which is Thursday.
2:35
We had to keep the tea theme so we can still call you cons, you know, under the table at
2:41
the end of every episode.
2:44
But it'll just be see you next Thursday now instead of Tuesday.
2:48
With shaking things up.
2:50
Yeah.
2:51
If you couldn't tell, we were already kind of shaky.
2:53
Shaky.
2:54
Our schedules are getting shook and up.
2:58
Shaky and shaking.
2:59
Shaky.
3:00
Very hard.
3:01
Shaky.
3:02
We're just suggesting.
3:03
But you guys are fine.
3:04
Do you guys have any other wild announcements?
3:06
Like what's going on in the world?
3:07
Does it tell me what's going on out there?
3:09
Oh, God.
3:10
No.
3:11
I think probably at a low.
3:12
No.
3:13
I need to hear anything about what's going on out there in the world.
3:17
Although I will say when we were eating breakfast this morning, Chris and I watched an episode
3:22
of South Park and my God.
3:26
Was it one of the ones?
3:27
Uh-huh.
3:28
That was quite enjoyable.
3:33
Which one did you watch, Labubu?
3:35
Uh, no.
3:36
I.
3:37
Yeah.
3:38
No.
3:39
Chris just turned it on and he, I don't know.
3:40
I think he probably just picked a random episode.
3:43
Oh.
3:44
Should we get into it?
3:46
Yeah, I think the people are some, are some ready.
3:49
I think the people are ready for some true crime is what I was trying to say.
3:53
Elequent.
3:54
They're sick of my, uh, man made of mouths.
3:57
The story isn't there.
3:58
Ready for some real true, down and dirty business.
4:04
Yeah.
4:05
Uh, hopefully you are correct.
4:08
I'm ready.
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Got my heated blanket wrapped around me.
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The blinds are closed.
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Well, prepare for the chills, regardless.
4:17
Susan Marie Cox was born on October 16, 1981 in Alamogordo, New Mexico.
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She was raised in Puyallup, Washington, where she graduated from Rogers High School before
4:32
training to become a cosmetologist.
4:36
She was active in the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints or the LDS church.
4:42
In fact, that's how she would eventually meet her husband.
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She met Joshua or Josh James Powell, a student at the University of Washington who was also
4:53
an active member of the LDS church in late 2000.
4:58
He was confident, attentive and at least at first, charming in the way that draws you in
5:04
before the warning bells register.
5:07
The LDS thing wasn't warning them.
5:10
Well, she was LDS as well.
5:11
I know.
5:12
I know.
5:13
Yeah.
5:14
I mean, clearly we have some thoughts and feelings around that, but we're gonna have to reserve
5:20
judgment because there's just no judgment.
5:23
Yeah.
5:24
I mean, also a little bit, but no judgment directly after I judge.
5:30
It was like, like no offense.
5:32
Yeah.
5:33
Yeah.
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Josh also grew up in Puyola, Washington, the son of Stephen Powell and Terrick Powell,
5:40
but his family dynamics were the stuff of whispered cautionary tales.
5:46
The Powell's, Josh's parents, had an extremely turbulent marriage that ended in divorce in
5:51
the early 90s.
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His father, Stephen Powell, was a controlling volatile man whose marriage to Terricka, she
5:59
went by Terry, ended in Acrimony.
6:03
When Susan and Josh first married, they moved into Steve Powell's South Hill home.
6:10
For Susan, it meant free rent and family nearby.
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For Steve, it became an opportunity for obsession.
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He secretly filmed her, collected photos of her, even wrote songs about her.
6:25
Susan, uncomfortable and alarmed, pushed for distance.
6:29
I have a question.
6:30
Yeah.
6:31
Who is this guy again?
6:33
That's the father-in-law.
6:35
The father-in-law.
6:36
Okay.
6:37
Yeah.
6:38
Okay.
6:39
It's just as creepy as it sounds.
6:41
Yeah.
6:42
Okay.
6:43
I know.
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I think your brain doesn't want to accept it.
6:45
You're like, "Who are we talking about?"
6:48
Just like a family friend, but it's her own.
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Either way, like secretly filming and collecting photos of someone is.
6:58
That is disgusting.
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But when it's your father-in-law, I feel like it takes it to a different layer than I don't
7:06
care for.
7:07
Okay.
7:08
Yep.
7:10
The couple relocated to Utah in 2004, settling in West Valley City.
7:16
There they purchased a home at West Sarah Circle.
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Susan shouldered much of their household financial burden, working full-time as an investment
7:26
broker at Wells Fargo Investments, while Josh cycled through jobs and risky real estate
7:33
ventures.
7:34
Ooh.
7:35
Yeah.
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Close friends and co-workers that Susan confided in said she seemed trapped between her
7:43
faith's emphasis on family unity and her growing fear of Josh's temper.
7:50
It'll definitely trap you when your church is telling you.
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Right.
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Oh, banging in and staying with your husband no matter what.
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Like you married him, you're together forever.
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Susan's journal entries would later reveal her growing discomfort with Josh's controlling,
8:07
manipulative and increasingly detached behavior, as well as the family's strained finances.
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Man.
8:16
Fucking Josh's, am I right?
8:18
I just feel like also it's really rough because in this kind of conservative, religious type
8:28
of traditional family values sort of a situation, the woman wouldn't historically have to be the
8:37
one that's like the primary provider.
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She shouldn't have to be dealing with the finances.
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Now, I mean, that's obviously that's like a very, you know, that's a very specific type of,
8:49
you know, lifestyle choice.
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And if everybody's on board with that, that's one thing.
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But to be forced into sort of this, you know, like I'm in service to the man, but she's
9:02
the one who's like bringing home the bacon.
9:05
And I just feel like, okay, so you're following through on all of the parts that kind of seem
9:12
satisfying to like the life from a man's perspective, but you're not really delivering on anything
9:19
that would be beneficial to the woman in this case.
9:22
You know what I mean?
9:23
Right.
9:24
Like she could just leave and like what then what would you do?
9:27
Right.
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Where normally it's like they're kind of stuck because the man is providing for them.
9:32
Like, yeah.
9:33
I guess he's just really, he has faith in that faith that she wants to stay in the family.
9:40
Yeah.
9:41
I think initially it's like the, it's the religious faith and it's, you know, the, the teachings of,
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like you said, it's like, well, you guys are married, you know, you stay together regardless.
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That is like sort of the initial thing that's keeping her there.
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And then eventually, you know, once you have kids, that's the other way that, you know, down
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the line that they trap you.
10:06
In 2005, the couple had the first of their two sons, Charlie, born January 19th, 2005, Charlie,
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Charlie.
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Two years later, on January 2nd, 2007, another son was born, Braden, reportedly later that
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same year, April 2007, Josh declared bankruptcy with debts exceeding $200,000.
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I want that much debt.
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No one will give me that much money.
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You do not want that much debt.
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Hey, man, I want to die with a negative number.
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I'm just saying.
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I want to take not leave behind.
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By 2006, Susan journals and notes reveal that she was walking on egg shells as she documented
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the mounting tension in her marriage and Josh's violent temper.
11:03
She managed the bills, cared for their sons, Charlie and Braden, and tried to preserve a picture
11:09
of domestic calm.
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Increasingly, her entries began to mention Josh's temper, his spending habits, and how he
11:18
isolated her from her family.
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In 2008, she wrote, "If I die, it may not be an accident, even if it looks like one."
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Jesus fuck!
11:30
Have we heard this before?
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You might know the story, but it's not the first time we've heard a woman say, "I feel like
11:41
we've said that on this podcast before."
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I'm almost certain that we have, because there are so many instances of intimate partner
11:50
violence against women.
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I feel like in this case, I don't know how much physical abuse that there may or may not
12:03
have been in their relationship.
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It doesn't seem like there's a real documented history of that.
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This seems more like there's financial abuse, and then there's a lot of coercive control.
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I can definitely understand that, even though some of them are not physically abusive towards
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you, they can still make you feel like your life is threatened.
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Absolutely.
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You have children with this man, so you're concerned about their safety and their well-being,
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obviously.
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She also recorded a video on July 29, 2008, at 12.33 p.m. documenting her home, property,
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damage, and possessions in case something happens.
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She had a lot of foresight.
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It's kind of creepy.
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I don't know what's going to happen to her, but I don't feel like it's leading anywhere
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great.
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Yeah, it definitely leaves you with a sense of dread, and I would say knowing what I know
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that is justified.
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In the footage, she referenced her husband's anger issues and noted that she had placed
13:14
a will in other documents in a safe deposit box.
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It's at least stating that Josh should not access it.
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What does that say when you're creating a handwritten will and your husband is the one person
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that you're like, he shouldn't be able to have access to this?
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I'd be the one person that you trust with everything.
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Right.
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Exactly.
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While the content of that video was certainly disturbing, increasingly so, in hindsight, it was
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hardly surprising.
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She was doing well professionally, having earned securities licenses, and Susan's income
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was the primary financial support for the family.
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Colleagues described her as "detail-oriented and ambitious."
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Trades consistent with why she might take the time, even during a lunch break or half
14:04
day, to document her home and assets for legal or financial reasons.
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Josh Powell was self-employed at that time, running a small startup called, and I shit
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you know it, Josh Powell Web Design.
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I mean, it's straightforward.
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It's, yeah, it's not creative.
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So he was running that business out of their home.
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He had a background in IT, web development, and some real estate and marketing ventures.
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But none were very stable.
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By 2008, he was reportedly struggling to maintain a steady income after their April 2007
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bankruptcy filing.
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You know, that time they casually listed about $200,000 in debt.
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Seen through that lens, Josh was home most of the time.
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So Susan may have used a short window while he was out of the house to make a private recording.
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As a financial professional, she may have framed the video in practical, almost procedural terms.
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She's not with her personality and training, but later when investigators viewed it in context,
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along with her handwritten will and the journal entries, it clearly carried a foreboding tone.
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She feared for her safety and wanted a record preserved.
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I think we all should just do this on a daily basis.
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Right?
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Just go around like, record everything.
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Yeah, always be recording.
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Yeah.
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We're always saying that.
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She'd once been the one bringing cast roles and laughter.
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Now she lingered after believed society meetings talking about patience in trials.
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Susan's discomfort extended to her father-in-law, Steve Powell, who openly admitted to being obsessed
16:05
with her, his behavior, including secretly filming and stealing her personal items, was later
16:12
used as evidence in his criminal conviction for voyeurism.
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Don't worry, we'll get to that.
16:18
Why is there so much happening?
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There's a lot happening.
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And I don't know how anybody is holding themselves together, holding down a job.
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Like, an important job in the financial sector while they have this much going on in their
16:41
personal life.
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On December 6, 2009, Susan attended church with her two sons.
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Later that day, the family ate a picnic dinner with a neighbor in attendance who left their
16:54
home afterwards at around 5 p.m.
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marking the last time that Susan was seen alive before she disappeared.
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This individual said that Josh had prepared the meal and Susan was tired after eating.
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Josh would state that after the meal, he took their young sons sledding at around 5.30,
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arriving home by about 8 o'clock.
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The series of events he claims for the remainder of that evening are truly bizarre.
17:29
According to Josh, he decided to take the boys on a spontaneous late-night camping trip
17:34
into Utah's west desert around midnight.
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Susan he claimed stayed home asleep.
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Multiple neighbors reported hearing the car alarm of the Powell's vehicle at approximately
17:47
11.45 p.m.
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So according to statements made by Josh, he and the boys left between midnight and 12.30
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a.m. to camp out roughly two hours away in Tbilah County when temperatures were below
18:02
freezing and there was a snowstorm predicted in the forecast.
18:07
That seems outrageous.
18:10
Yeah, and it actually…
18:13
He told police he wanted to try out his new generator.
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Which I guess you have to drive your two toddlers out into the middle of the Utah desert in a snowstorm
18:26
after midnight to test a generator, right?
18:29
Who wants to wake up?
18:31
Okay.
18:32
And who's… what parents write, fucking mind?
18:34
Are they going to wake up toddlers in the middle of the night?
18:39
Maybe he was just…
18:41
Maybe he was just…
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Maybe he was just carrying sleeping toddlers to the car.
18:49
Listen, all of this is so clearly ridiculous.
18:53
That's kind of the point is like, I'd have to believe the first part of what you said for
18:59
any of the successive pieces to make any sense.
19:02
And the problem is that I don't believe a goddamn thing.
19:06
But let's pretend that we did.
19:11
I'm not sure that seemed smart with a two and four year old intel.
19:16
The investigators thought it seemed ill-advised and frankly pretty suspicious.
19:22
Because it was, in fact, not their first, rodeo.
19:29
Officers listening to the explanation later called it "the kind of lie that announces itself."
19:36
That is exactly right.
19:38
It's so accurate, but it just gives me the chills because it's like, I can't even imagine
19:44
from their perspective just hearing this string of such obvious lies and being like,
19:50
"Okay, dude, that's the story you're going with."
19:54
That or you're like having a really manic episode, like was he bipolar?
20:00
Right.
20:01
I mean, that's one other potential explanation.
20:05
He said he'd taken the boys to Simpson Springs campground.
20:09
When police checked, there were no tracks, no ashes, no proof anyone had been there.
20:17
Even more unsettling were the words of little Charlie Powell, just four years old at the time.
20:23
When detectives asked about the family's strange midnight camping trip into Utah's frozen
20:28
desert, he told them that his mother had gone with them that Sunday.
20:33
But for some reason, she stayed behind at the campsite and didn't come home.
20:41
I actually don't think I have this next part in my notes.
20:47
I wasn't sure that I was going to include it.
20:49
It actually is more relevant to the timeline for part two later, but the grandparents, Susan's
20:57
parents, later questioned one of the little boys about a drawing that they did.
21:03
It was like a drawing of the family.
21:07
He explained, "That's us, driving to go camping, and that's mommy in the trunk."
21:15
Oh my god.
21:17
What the fuck?
21:20
They were so little when this first happened.
21:27
Time went on.
21:28
They had more vocabulary and emotional awareness.
21:32
People like the other trusted adults in their life were able to talk to them and help them
21:38
to process what they might have seen or heard.
21:43
Wow.
21:45
According to a search warrant, Affodavit filed the day after Susan was reported missing.
21:50
Charlie repeated the same heartbreaking version of events a week later.
21:55
Mommy stayed there.
21:58
The thing is, is that a child that young, it can be tough to know.
22:02
They don't always understand the impact of their words or their retelling of events.
22:09
It can be fragile.
22:10
It can be sometimes skewed.
22:13
But for him to say the exact same thing again later, it's pretty telling, I think.
22:21
The boy's daycare provider became concerned when Susan didn't show up with them the following
22:26
morning.
22:27
Josh's sister, Jennifer Graves, being the family's emergency contact, was contacted raising alarm
22:34
bells for her as well as Josh's mother.
22:37
She went to the couple's house on Sarah Circle in West Valley City and kept knocking
22:43
on the lock door of the house.
22:45
Worried about the well-being of her brother, his wife and their kids, she informed the police.
22:52
When the police arrived at the residence, they asked her if they should break in through
22:56
a window and she gave them the green light.
23:00
When police entered the family home, they found Susan's purse, keys, wallet, and phone.
23:07
All the things no one leaves behind willingly.
23:10
All indicators that she had not left voluntarily.
23:15
Detective stated there was nothing missing from the residence.
23:19
There were no signs of forced entry and it didn't appear there was a robbery, home invasion,
23:25
burglary, or signs of a struggle.
23:28
Now that last one I might say is debatable as our story continues, but I digress.
23:34
Okay, it's going to be a little surprise.
23:37
Better okay.
23:38
Yeah.
23:39
So the struggle I would say is perhaps yes and no.
23:44
Josh returned home later that afternoon claiming ignorance of Susan's whereabouts.
23:51
Investigators found her cell phone in his car with the SIM card removed along with a generator,
23:58
gas cans, and a shovel.
24:02
Suspicious?
24:03
Like, what other were, you know?
24:05
Yeah.
24:06
Circumstantial, obviously, right?
24:10
The SIM card removed and you have gas cans and a shovel.
24:14
Like, come on, dude.
24:15
Yeah, come on, dude.
24:16
Where's the duct tape?
24:17
Where's like, I know, where's the rest of the kill kit?
24:20
Because that's what it seems like.
24:21
Exactly, a thousand percent.
24:24
The search warrant served by the West Valley City Police revealed that Susan's blood was
24:29
found in the home.
24:31
Not that unusual a finding in and of itself for a resident of the home.
24:35
Right.
24:36
If your blood's going to be anywhere, your own house, that's predictable.
24:42
My blood's all over the pitch.
24:43
Right.
24:44
But some of the extraneous details surrounding the blood evidence they observed and collected
24:49
was perhaps concerning.
24:53
Susan's blood was found on the tiled, living room floor that Josh had reportedly cleaned
24:57
on the night in question.
25:00
The night that he went camping, he was also cleaning the floor.
25:05
That seems like a lot of activity for the middle of the night.
25:10
Yeah.
25:11
Yeah, it does, like the more you talk about it, right?
25:13
It sounds like, okay, this dude seems like he's having like a manic episode.
25:18
Yeah.
25:19
I mean, and I had very much the same impression.
25:23
And I think maybe that's what he was trying, like maybe he's thinking that's how he's going
25:27
to pass it off.
25:29
Also found in the living room was DNA belonging to an unknown male.
25:35
That was also found on the carpet and sofa in the home.
25:39
Two fans were running, reportedly pointed at the couch and/or carpet when police searched
25:45
the home.
25:46
So why was that?
25:49
A lot of the statements made by law enforcement indicated that it was like clearly there was
25:54
a massive cleanup effort.
25:56
They said it reaked of cleanser.
26:01
This later said the home looked frozen in the middle of an ordinary day.
26:07
The boy's coat still hung by the door.
26:09
I have made sandwich sat on a plate.
26:13
Oh.
26:14
A missing comforter and sheet hinted that bedding had been used potentially for cleanup.
26:22
Great.
26:23
Like where would that be?
26:24
That would be either on the better and the laundry.
26:26
Right.
26:27
Luminall testing suggested additional wipe downs.
26:32
Nothing singularly damning.
26:34
Everything collectively haunting.
26:38
Just the huge cleanup thing too.
26:41
Like I guess you have two kids, but.
26:43
Right.
26:44
But it doesn't sound like he was typically, you know, Mr. Super dad.
26:49
This guy can't even like keep a job, but he's like cleaning and like going on a road trip
26:55
and.
26:56
Yeah.
26:57
He's making a pancake dinner cleaning their floors, taking the boys sledding, which I think
27:05
right.
27:06
I think that part, I think the sledding, I think that part is true.
27:11
We had to be seeing doing one thing at least.
27:14
Right.
27:15
Right.
27:16
Yeah.
27:17
I don't know.
27:18
I don't know.
27:19
The part about him making the pancake dinner almost makes me think that perhaps he volunteered
27:26
for that so that he could drug her.
27:29
And there's no way for.
27:32
For them to prove that at this point.
27:35
Spoiler.
27:37
But sometimes what you don't find can be even more intriguing.
27:43
You know what they didn't find other than obvious signs of forced entry.
27:48
The supposed campsite Josh described showed no evidence of recent activity.
27:53
I already kind of touched on that.
27:54
Right.
27:55
I said like no ashes, no tire track.
27:57
Nothing.
27:58
Yeah.
27:59
Almost like that story about an impromptu camping trip at midnight was bullshit or something
28:03
weird.
28:04
Weird.
28:05
He just cleaned up his ashes and tire talks because he's like really into cleaning right
28:10
now.
28:11
Yeah.
28:12
He's in his manic cleaning era.
28:14
By December 9th, the case was officially criminal.
28:18
Then Salt Lake County District Attorney Laura Miller authorized a criminal investigation
28:23
into the disappearance of Susan Powell.
28:26
After a search warrant was served on Josh Powell's vehicle, he went to the Salt Lake City International
28:32
Airport to rent a Ford Focus, which he put 807 miles on before returning within 36
28:39
hours, refusing to explain why according to court documents.
28:44
Huh?
28:45
Yeah.
28:46
So they get a search warrant for his car.
28:59
It seized and he immediately goes to the airport, rents a rental car and puts over 800 miles on it
28:59
in 36 hours.
29:01
Like where did you go, dude?
29:02
And why can't you tell us just like where you went?
29:05
And he refused to tell anyone.
29:08
He is like, I'm out of stories at this point.
29:10
Can't even pretend to like make something up.
29:12
Right?
29:13
Meanwhile, Susan's family held vigils and plated for information.
29:18
Despite all of the findings from the investigation thus far, prosecutors faced a vexing challenge.
29:25
Nobody, no confession, and somewhat limited physical evidence linking Josh directly to foul
29:32
play.
29:33
Following Susan Powell's disappearance on December 6th, 2009, law enforcement in West Valley
29:39
city quickly became immersed in a case that blended domestic tension with national scrutiny.
29:47
Forensic searches of the Powell Home uncovered traces of Susan's blood, a handwritten will
29:52
describing her fear of Josh and life insurance policies totaling more than $1.5 million, naming
30:00
Josh as the primary beneficiary, including policies taken out in June 2009 for $250,000
30:09
a piece for each of the boys.
30:12
Jesus Christ.
30:14
That's six months before Susan went missing.
30:17
Why would you need to even like take out insurance policies on kids that are like that high?
30:23
Like you're not depending on the kids for like income or something, you know?
30:27
A thousand percent.
30:28
If you're taking out a policy and there are a lot of instances where parents have some type
30:33
of coverage, it is like a death benefit.
30:36
It is something to cover like a meaningful burial, you know, like something like in terms
30:44
of a memorial, not replacing their lifetime income.
30:50
Yeah.
30:51
What the fuck?
30:54
Utah investigators launched one of the most extensive missing person operations in state
30:59
history, collaborating with the FBI and employing ground penetrating radar.
31:05
The burial searches and cadaver dogs in both Utah and rural Oregon.
31:11
Friends described the search effort as both frantic and surreal.
31:16
Hundreds of volunteers combing the desert.
31:19
The volunteer command post occupied a church gymnasium off 4100 South.
31:26
Rose of tables grown under crockpots, walkie talkies, and printed maps of Tumila County.
31:34
I do have one thing to say before we move on.
31:38
Yeah.
31:39
I know like obviously we have our thoughts and feelings about organized religion and things
31:43
like that, especially maybe the like well, they're all kind of patriarchal, right?
31:49
Yeah, yeah, especially those ones.
31:53
But it is very nice to have a community and like all these people getting together to help
31:59
and support it.
32:00
Yeah.
32:01
A thousand percent.
32:02
We have the church community banded together and they were all helping with the search.
32:07
And I'm going to talk about some other things that they tried to do to help.
32:13
And I think that that's meaningful.
32:16
And to me, that was like, you know, we may not necessarily agree on every line by line thing.
32:24
But there's a lot of goodness in what the community, you know, tried to do.
32:31
It's a volunteer, LDS ward members, co-workers, complete strangers, checked in daily.
32:40
One woman said she driven from Idaho because you don't just lose a mother in the snow.
32:46
I'm just picturing like this like, you know, like middle age lady driving over from Idaho
32:53
with her crockpots.
32:55
Because it's like just as simple as that.
32:58
Like, you, yeah, is bullshit.
33:00
He's in his bullshit era.
33:02
Yeah.
33:03
Yeah.
33:04
Well, and everybody, you know, like at a certain point, like early on enough, I think there
33:10
was a lot of hope that, you know, she might be found alive somewhere.
33:16
I don't think that lasted very long for really anyone.
33:21
Like the community, for law enforcement, her family, I think everybody knew pretty, pretty
33:29
quickly.
33:30
They saw the writing on the wall.
33:32
I mean, I'm just like the weather conditions.
33:34
Like if she'd just get lost, like, if, well, and that's, that was hardly the leading story
33:42
or theory, but we'll get to it.
33:46
And of course, the press descended satellite trucks lined the cold asac, camera flashes
33:53
with the powel driveway at dusk.
34:04
Privately, he loyered up and packed boxes.
34:09
He drained Susan's retirement accounts, canceled her chiropractic appointments, and told
34:15
the boys daycare provider that the boys would not likely return to the facility.
34:20
These days after Susan's disappearance, Josh attended church appearing oddly composed.
34:26
Meanwhile, telltale, cell tower pings, contradicted his timeline, and he literally refused polygraphs.
34:35
I wonder why.
34:38
Yeah.
34:39
I know that like, they're like standing in the criminal justice system at this point is.
34:46
Yeah, I feel like their purpose is just to see if you turn it down or not.
34:51
Right.
34:52
Yeah, to rattle people.
34:53
And then they can ask you questions that let them know, okay, we know you're lying, but
34:59
like, where is the lie?
35:01
What's the thing that spikes, you know?
35:05
It's like a thing that could point just to give you like a little more insight and information.
35:11
They should do tarot with them.
35:13
You guys.
35:14
I think we should start doing tarot with the lie detector test.
35:17
What do you think?
35:18
You know, couldn't hurt.
35:20
History seemed to shift almost daily.
35:23
One day Susan had gone to work early.
35:26
The next she stepped out for a walk.
35:29
Or maybe she'd been depressed.
35:31
You know, that old chestnut.
35:33
Before long, Josh twisted the narrative even further, implying that she'd run off with
35:39
another man.
35:41
How fucking dare you, sir.
35:44
Like the fact that she was staying was someone abusive because she had so much respect for
35:49
marriage.
35:50
Yeah.
35:51
And then, oh, that is so messed up.
35:53
Okay.
35:54
Detectives documented roughly 40 inconsistencies in his statements within the first week while
36:03
circumstantial evidence mounted, including witness testimony about Josh's controlling behaviors,
36:10
investigators struggled to meet the legal threshold for indictment.
36:15
The case became Utah's version of a ghost story, a woman who disappeared from inside her
36:22
own home.
36:24
Josh's sister Jennifer Graves couldn't reconcile his calm detachment with the sister in
36:30
law she knew.
36:31
She volunteered to wear a wire for detectives, meeting Josh at their father Stephen Powell's
36:38
home on January 22nd, 2010.
36:42
Oh, shit.
36:44
Her goal, coax out a confession.
36:48
Dude, it gives me freaking chills when that happens.
36:51
Like that is so intense for somebody to do.
36:55
Yeah.
36:56
Like a civilian to do.
36:58
Yeah.
36:59
Like I get like stressed out for them so hard.
37:01
Like I don't know if I could, I could ever do that.
37:04
It is arguably like one of the kind of scariest aspects of this case in a way because Jennifer
37:14
and we're going to, we're going to get into it in part two because spoiler, there's two
37:19
parts.
37:21
She's going to get a serious like hero bell, but it is really scary.
37:28
It's knowing that like as a family member, she was so adamant about, I almost can't even
37:36
like put it into words because who wants to believe that their loved one had something
37:41
to do with this seriously, but it just is so, it's so obvious though you see through it.
37:50
If you or someone you know feels trapped in a relationship that doesn't feel safe, help
37:55
is out there.
37:57
You can call or text the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-safe or visit
38:06
thehotline.org.
38:08
Alright, so we are doing the tarot.
38:15
I'm a spread out.
38:20
Spread them cops girl.
38:23
Okay.
38:24
Where are we feeling?
38:27
Right side, ish.
38:30
Right side ish.
38:32
Okay.
38:33
Oh, I think this is a new one for us, especially with the PNW tarot.
38:38
Okay.
38:39
It is, it's whales.
38:41
Oh.
38:42
It's the chariot, but we got it in the reverse.
38:45
Oh, okay.
38:47
The chariot is the cancer card.
38:50
That's right.
38:52
Oh my god.
38:55
It's the cancer is in the zodiac side, not the, yeah, deadly disease, but it can fuck itself.
39:03
Okay.
39:04
So these are gray whales.
39:06
Oh.
39:07
Progress.
39:08
Overcoming obstacles.
39:10
Willpower.
39:11
Focus.
39:12
Ambition and determination.
39:16
Achieving goals with ease.
39:18
The gray whale side a low croak of pleasure and exhaustion.
39:23
As finally, the current began to sweep her forward.
39:28
The pod had been swimming for days, often fighting against the pushing of swells and pulling
39:34
of tides.
39:35
Now the ocean was working with them.
39:38
As the current shepherded her along, she had only to make subtle shifts in direction,
39:45
dipping a flipper or arcing her fluke as she navigated parallel to the distant coast.
39:51
She felt powerful with the strength of the ocean behind her.
39:56
When she eventually turned out of the current, it was with less regret than she might have
40:02
expected.
40:03
She found she carried the ocean's strength within her.
40:07
How she wondered, could I be the current that carries my pod along?
40:12
Wow.
40:14
Like I wasn't really seeing where that was going, like how this was fitting in really until
40:18
you said that.
40:20
Yeah.
40:21
Like it just reminded me of her like trying to carry keep her family together and like
40:26
be that person to keep her pod safe, which is what she was trying to do.
40:33
Also too when you said the chariot, like I was thinking of the car of like the trip.
40:39
So our keywords in the main terror book are controlling opposing forces.
40:45
So will power, resolving conflict and travel.
40:52
And as you so stu-chly pointed out, it says, at a literal level, the chariot relates to
41:00
travel and transportation.
41:03
The chariot reversed says, changes are happening so fast you feel out of control.
41:10
It may seem like you're being pulled in two directions at once and the stress is intense.
41:15
Yeah, that reminds me of like the two people who were like kind of obsessed with her.
41:22
Yeah.
41:23
You fear you won't be able to control the multiple factors of a given situation.
41:29
You're at a crossroads.
41:31
Choose your direction carefully.
41:34
The more you can tune into your own inner guidance, the more control you can exert outwardly.
41:39
Most likely, the solution to the problem at hand is to take the middle road between the
41:46
conflicting issues.
41:47
Wow.
41:48
I love how it's just casually like, oh, these two really hard things just, you know, go in
41:54
between.
41:55
Just split the difference.
41:57
In a reading about money, you could suffer setbacks or losses due to confusion, indecision,
42:05
or inattentiveness.
42:08
Bank of confidence or inexperience could result in a poor choice.
42:12
Or you may rush into a financial matter unprepared and run headlong into a wall.
42:19
Would you consider bankruptcy a wall?
42:21
Yeah, definitely.
42:22
That definitely fits financial skills.
42:25
Exactly.
42:26
Yeah.
42:27
Yeah.
42:28
If the reading is about your job, competing factions may cause stress in your workplace and
42:34
you feel incapable of controlling the situation.
42:38
Or things may be happening so fast, your head is spinning and you can't get your bearings.
42:44
Sometimes this card says you're being pulled in two different directions and can't decide
42:49
which one to take.
42:50
I feel like there's a number of ways that could really apply to be honest.
42:57
And they're talking about like inner professional applications.
42:59
They feel like they talked about like he was an entrepreneur, he was an IT, he did some
43:06
stuff in real estate and I just feel like it speaks to sort of the indecision.
43:13
In a reading about love, conflicts or differences in opinion, lifestyle or values can cause tension
43:20
in a relationship.
43:22
You don't say.
43:24
Or a change has thrown you off guard and you don't know how to handle the situation.
43:29
Sometimes this card represents romantic involvement with two different people or a conflict between
43:35
two things you love.
43:37
And I think that's really interesting because I feel like there's the duality of like, you
43:43
know, there's like a spousal love, right?
43:47
And then there's like the love of your family, your children.
43:51
But there's also like the more complicated like interpretation of that, which is like
43:58
there were two men that played such a prominent role in her life.
44:04
And I think love is sort of a misnomer in that case because it's like, this was obsession,
44:11
this was control.
44:13
But or like love of your religion.
44:17
Mm-hmm.
44:18
I think there's a lot of ways that this kind of, you can interpret that.
44:22
I feel like the chariot, just the whole thing with the car, like putting the kids in the
44:26
car and then the kid saying like, mommy was in the trunk and then us getting seriously.
44:31
Seriously.
44:32
Like I feel like that was just a side like she probably was in the trunk.
44:35
Yeah.
44:36
And I just feel like thinking about part one and part two knowing what I know, especially
44:41
for part one, I'd be hard pressed to come up with any sort of imagery that is stronger
44:47
or more representative of part one, what we've talked about so far than like a chariot
44:55
or a car.
44:56
Yeah.
44:57
I don't know, I don't know how else to play it other than it just kind of feels like dead
45:00
on and like the imagery really makes sense in this one.
45:04
I was thinking about it too like in the terms of it being a cancer card and like the crab.
45:09
And if you're thinking about the crab, like having that strong, she had to have this like
45:14
strong outer shell to put on like everything was okay.
45:18
But like things at home were not okay and she was even like, you know, writing about
45:22
it and stuff.
45:23
Like obviously it was like pretty hidden and deep.
45:27
Well and it's like everything that she was doing was like such a protective action.
45:32
I wish she would have just crab plot as little dick off.
45:36
Yeah.
45:37
Your lips to God's ears as they say.
45:39
That's like a creepy.
45:42
Yeah.
45:43
We'll see you next Thursday.
45:46
We'll see you next Thursday.
45:47
Oh my God.
45:50
We're gonna really mess that up.
45:52
No, we're gonna be fine.
45:53
I'm definitely gonna be saying Tuesday for a while.
45:57
I'll just talk really loud over you so nobody knows this.
46:02
Oh, perfect.
46:03
Oh, always covering my ass.
46:06
What can I say?
46:07
That's right.
46:08
It's a nice ass.
46:09
I gotta protect it.
46:10
Ooh.
46:11
Like a crab.
46:12
That booty.
46:13
Binge, peen.
46:14
Binge, peen.
46:15
Binge, peen.
46:16
[laughs]