Latest / Simply Bitcoin / Adam O'Brien | Simply Bitcoin IRL

Transcript

Adam O'Brien | Simply Bitcoin IRL · Simply Bitcoin

• 0:00
  You think we'll see $10 million Bitcoin with today's purchasing
• 0:02
  power anytime soon? I don't see how we don't see
• 0:06
  10,000,020 million like we already have a 10 million, you
• 0:10
  know, yen Bitcoin, right? How far off are we in pesos?
• 0:13
  Like are we a 2X or A3 XOA in pesos like 10 million?
• 0:16
  Yeah, why so bearish man? Like how about 50 million?
• 0:19
  How about 100? It is inevitable wealth will
• 0:23
  transfer to the scarcest most valuable asset.
• 0:26
  There is literally 0 things on planet Earth more scarce and
• 0:30
  valuable than Bitcoin. What happens when most of
• 0:33
  society comes to the realization that like wait a second, if I
• 0:36
  take self custody of my Bitcoin, I have the power?
• 0:39
  Bitcoin is the gunpowder. It's the better version of
• 0:42
  someone else having access and control of your money.
• 0:45
  And so those that do not embrace that will perish.
• 0:49
  The politicians are in a state right now, or they print, or
• 0:52
  they 'cause, you know, mass catastrophe and failure.
• 0:55
  The only way out of this is by holding an asset that's better
• 0:59
  than the sinking ship. The sinking ship is the money
• 1:01
  that everybody currently, the entire system is working on a
• 1:05
  sinking ship right now. Yeah, it's 2025.
• 1:11
  It's been an absolutely crazy year in Bitcoin.
• 1:14
  I mean, start of the year, I think the rest of the year is
• 1:17
  going to be absolutely incredible.
• 1:18
  Today I'm joined with the CEO and founder of Bitcoin.
• 1:22
  Wow, man, thank you so much for joining me.
• 1:24
  It's some of the Bitcoin. IRL It's great to be here, man.
• 1:26
  This place is amazing. Yeah, dude, thank.
• 1:27
  You so much for coming to my side of the town.
• 1:30
  I really appreciate it. I hope you've been enjoying
• 1:33
  yourself so far. And it's been a wild year in
• 1:35
  Bitcoin, man. I think.
• 1:37
  I think it's underperformed to a lot of people's expectations.
• 1:40
  Yeah, man, I think Bitcoin has a way of taking expectations,
• 1:44
  putting them into like a meat grinder, grinding it up really
• 1:47
  good, smashing it down and then spitting out something else.
• 1:51
  And I think that that's what we've seen so far in 25.
• 1:54
  I think obviously we expected SBR, we got SBR, but it turns
• 1:58
  out, you know, Bitcoiners maybe didn't really want SBR, They
• 2:02
  wanted a number to go up. And so we aren't getting that
• 2:05
  that nice release that we were expecting from all the positive
• 2:09
  sentiment because it's not coupled with price action.
• 2:11
  I think that's showing how early we are.
• 2:13
  We are so incredibly early in Bitcoin in people's
• 2:17
  understanding of what Bitcoin is.
• 2:19
  And I think that people like you and I look at this and we
• 2:21
  texted, it's like, hey, cheap sats, like we get to stack more
• 2:25
  and this is amazing. And I think that broadly,
• 2:28
  probably we aren't seeing that as much people are are hindered
• 2:31
  by the, you know, the lack of an immediate number go up and so
• 2:34
  underperformed, yes. That said, though, I mean, my
• 2:37
  goodness, Can you imagine in 25 years how it's going to, you
• 2:41
  know, in, in 25 years when you know the US government or
• 2:44
  whomever is paying off their debt, you know, how many
• 2:47
  hundreds of trillions of dollars in debt at that point?
• 2:50
  I. I think Bitcoiners are spoiled
• 2:51
  though, Adam, because like I don't think we're used to that
• 2:54
  25 year time scale, right? We all talk about low time
• 2:57
  preference, but especially from your, your era in your class of
• 3:00
  2013, right? I'm class of 2016.
• 3:03
  Back then the volatility happened to, you know, it
• 3:07
  happened to be a little bit more positive, right?
• 3:09
  And things happen to happen in a much shorter time frame.
• 3:13
  They're a little bit more extended or that's what it seems
• 3:16
  like, right? I still think we're going to
• 3:17
  get, you know, what Samsung Mao calls the Omega candle.
• 3:21
  Dude I actually have a bed out right now with someone on
• 3:24
  Twitter. I forget who it is but 100K
• 3:26
  SAT's that will see 500K in 2025.
• 3:29
  I'm like I'm Bolt. Hard.
• 3:30
  I think that too. I mean, I've been making it like
• 3:32
  full caps on Twitter, like just tweeting out just because of the
• 3:36
  SPR stuff. Yeah.
• 3:37
  Like, I think the initial executive order, a lot of people
• 3:41
  were underwhelmed because it included, you know, a lot of the
• 3:43
  alt coins. Yeah.
• 3:44
  He renamed that though recently. I know Trump came through like
• 3:47
  he freed Ross ended operation choke point 2.0.
• 3:51
  The strategic Bitcoin Reserve is only a strategic Bitcoin was
• 3:54
  what? But what do you think like what
• 3:56
  were the back end games there where he's he's fully like what
• 3:59
  did he had XRP in there? He had yet ETH he had you know
• 4:02
  is there is little tweet was only you know these garbage
• 4:04
  coins. So I kind of have some like kind
• 4:07
  of the backroom talk. Essentially what was happening
• 4:10
  at that moment was that there was a tremendous amount of
• 4:14
  lobbying pressure from the XRP lobby and.
• 4:16
  People. People were decentralized.
• 4:19
  Exactly right. So decentralized it needs a
• 4:21
  lobby and a CEO, but that's what was happening in the background
• 4:24
  and a lot of people didn't see that and what I what I posted
• 4:27
  was essentially like, look guys like as Bitcoiners, we
• 4:30
  completely underestimated the altcoin lobby.
• 4:33
  However, it doesn't matter because everything goes to zero
• 4:36
  against Bitcoin anyways. Yeah, naturally so.
• 4:38
  But I mean, I think it was like 3D chess.
• 4:40
  Like it was like, you know, kind of teasing them saying of course
• 4:42
  we're going to include Cardano and XRP and ETH.
• 4:46
  And at the end it was Bitcoin only and Brad Garlin House had
• 4:49
  to sit on the meeting, which was absolutely hilarious.
• 4:50
  What do you think is the significance of the SBR?
• 4:53
  Like do you do you think? Because like clearly no short
• 4:56
  term significance whatsoever, But I think long term I
• 4:58
  completely agree with you. I would not be surprised that by
• 5:01
  the end of the year we saw 500 K Bitcoin.
• 5:03
  Yeah, man, I think significance of SPR is challenging for me,
• 5:07
  like for, you know, I'm a Canadian.
• 5:09
  So watching this, my first kind of feeling is jealousy.
• 5:13
  I'm infinitely jealous that, you know, once again, the Americans
• 5:17
  have seemingly better everything, including a
• 5:20
  government willing to adopt and support Bitcoin.
• 5:23
  You know, as, as you know, and many people probably know like
• 5:26
  I'm permanently debanked in Canada.
• 5:28
  I do not have the luxury of a checking account.
• 5:31
  My wife is missing bank accounts.
• 5:32
  And so operation choke point is really the thing that I think
• 5:35
  is, is very, very meaningful. And I think the the true benefit
• 5:40
  of the SPR moves away from just number go up and pay off the
• 5:43
  debt. There's probably Fiat games that
• 5:45
  can be played to pay off the debt.
• 5:46
  I mean, Japan is is playing them poorly, but is playing them.
• 5:50
  I think that the the actual benefit is that Bitcoin
• 5:53
  entrepreneurs now have comfort that in America they're going to
• 5:57
  be maybe not looked after, but at least not targeted.
• 6:00
  Like I am actively targeted in Canada.
• 6:03
  There is a massive target on my chest.
• 6:05
  Bitcoin entrepreneur for now 12 years.
• 6:08
  The government does not like that.
• 6:09
  The banks do not like that. You know, there's a reason you
• 6:11
  and I were chatting even last night like Bitcoin or Canada has
• 6:14
  some of the the most per capita Bitcoiners on the face of the
• 6:17
  Earth. Oh, it's crazy.
• 6:18
  And it's just because we have to be and, and like, but we're not
• 6:21
  getting a new wave of Bitcoiners right now.
• 6:22
  And it's only because it's so difficult to be a Bitcoin
• 6:25
  entrepreneur in Canada versus now with the SPR and you know,
• 6:29
  no more choke point, et cetera, et cetera.
• 6:30
  The government completely legitimizing it here.
• 6:33
  I think that's the only thing the government needs to do is
• 6:35
  just get out of the way. And, you know, if you're going
• 6:38
  to have an opinion, make it based in facts.
• 6:41
  And I think that the Trump admin has done that pretty well.
• 6:44
  And the SPR just adds to that. So I would say, yeah, it's just
• 6:47
  going to increase competition and and benefits for
• 6:50
  entrepreneurs here. And, and I agree because I
• 6:52
  remember like last year, you know, there was moments in time
• 6:55
  where I was like, Oh my God, you know, like I might have to move
• 6:57
  to El Salvador because Operation Choke .2 point O is getting
• 7:00
  scary. And all the things that were
• 7:01
  happening behind the scenes that they weren't admitting to.
• 7:04
  Yeah, like they were actively de banking people.
• 7:06
  Now I want to circle back to what you were saying about you
• 7:09
  being debanked. How do you get debanked and
• 7:12
  managed to run a publicly trained Bitcoin company.
• 7:14
  How does that work? Yeah, man, it's not easy.
• 7:17
  Our story of going public actually was pretty interesting.
• 7:20
  When we went public, it took us almost a year and a half, or
• 7:23
  just over a year and a half, and it cost us like over 2,000,000
• 7:26
  bucks just to do it. Typically it should take four,
• 7:28
  maybe six months and shouldn't cost even $1 million.
• 7:32
  And, and that was strictly because of the Bitcoin.
• 7:34
  And then because we're non custodial, like the securities
• 7:37
  commission's just couldn't understand that we never had
• 7:40
  custody of funds. And so it, it was, it was
• 7:42
  confusing. But I think like I'm building a
• 7:45
  product that I need in, in Canada.
• 7:48
  And so I live on Bitcoin and it's kind of, it's kind of just
• 7:52
  the only way that you can live. It's like when I talk about
• 7:56
  Bitcoin in self custody being some, you know, unconfiscatable
• 8:01
  money that only that only you can have access to.
• 8:04
  I'm speaking from experience and I, and I think now more than
• 8:06
  ever, like in Canada especially, we saw the trucker protest a
• 8:08
  couple years ago. We watched people actively
• 8:12
  losing banks. Like there's horror stories that
• 8:14
  people just donated 50 bucks because, oh, my uncle's a
• 8:16
  trucker and I wanted to donate 50 bucks to the truckers, not
• 8:18
  knowing the political, you know, turmoil happening behind the
• 8:21
  scenes. Then, you know, the single mom,
• 8:23
  her bank is, is shut down and, and she can't pay her rent and
• 8:26
  she's got eviction notices coming in.
• 8:27
  The power is getting turned off. And it's like really, really
• 8:29
  dire consequences because someone has the kill switch on
• 8:33
  your bank and it's it's catastrophic.
• 8:35
  And so, you know, in Canada, especially having ways to move
• 8:39
  money around without the, the government, you know, saying yes
• 8:44
  or no is super is super important.
• 8:46
  And so how do like, how do I do it is literally with Bitcoin,
• 8:48
  it's Bitcoin and self custody. And I'm probably lucky that
• 8:51
  there were no like when, you know, 2013, there was no
• 8:54
  custodial wallets, there was no place to leave your coins.
• 8:58
  I just kind of was forced, like my first Bitcoin wallet was a
• 9:00
  node that was the only one that existed.
• 9:02
  And then we got like this, you know, jankyblockchain.com app,
• 9:07
  which then hilariously Apple banned.
• 9:10
  And I remember phones with the blockchain app post Apple ban,
• 9:15
  like I was not updating my phone.
• 9:17
  I was like, this is sacred. Like I've got this Bitcoin on
• 9:20
  here. I I'm not going to lose this
• 9:21
  app. And so it's just, I mean, I'm
• 9:25
  kind of just tearing away from the like original question
• 9:27
  maybe, but the the ethos of the only thing that has protected me
• 9:32
  and my family and to be able to live and, and you know, buy a
• 9:36
  vehicle and a house and this stuff is strictly Bitcoin and
• 9:39
  self custody. That's the only thing that's
• 9:40
  been reliable for. No.
• 9:41
  And I think you, you really, you show that in the way that you've
• 9:45
  built your company, which in from my perspective, I think
• 9:48
  it's the much harder way because the easier way would be to build
• 9:52
  a platform that allows individuals to keep the Bitcoin
• 9:55
  on the platform, right? It makes it much more accessible
• 9:58
  for let's say someone that has spent most of their Fiat, most
• 10:02
  of their life in the Fiat matrix.
• 10:04
  And they're just like the idea of taking self custody of their
• 10:07
  wealth and enabling their independence in the process is
• 10:09
  such an alien concept to them. You decided to do it the right
• 10:13
  way, right, which sets up the right incentives right from the
• 10:16
  beginning. For anyone who doesn't know
• 10:17
  Bitcoin well, is a self custody by default on ramp.
• 10:20
  So essentially what that means is you can't, you can't buy
• 10:24
  Bitcoin on the exchange if you don't intend to take self
• 10:27
  custody. You guys don't hold people's
• 10:29
  Bitcoin. Why do you decide to do it that
• 10:31
  way? Because I, I, I feel like the,
• 10:32
  the critique is like men, like you're essentially you're,
• 10:36
  you're not targeting the, the, the biggest, the biggest
• 10:40
  potential customer base. Why did you decide to make it
• 10:43
  the right way, which is self custody by default?
• 10:46
  Yeah. I mean, I'd love to say because
• 10:48
  I like wanted to have, you know, this altruistic vision of
• 10:52
  philosophy. I think it was just the only way
• 10:55
  that made sense to me at the time.
• 10:56
  Like, you know, starting from there and then we start, we
• 10:58
  start with with Bitcoin ATMs and then which are just self custody
• 11:00
  by nature. And then we wanted to bring that
• 11:02
  same experience to the online portal.
• 11:05
  And I think that at that time when we launched the online
• 11:07
  portal, I wanted the Bitcoin ATM experience to come online.
• 11:12
  I don't think I fully acknowledged it was going to be
• 11:15
  that much harder in my mind. Who like, as someone who'd been
• 11:17
  self custodying for a decade at that point, it was kind of like,
• 11:20
  Nah, this is, you know, like, you know, how we, we sometimes
• 11:24
  forget how early we are. And you, you know, you look at
• 11:26
  the bus and it's like, none of these people know like you've
• 11:30
  got this big secret. And I was a little bit naive in
• 11:32
  in thinking that you know, 30-40 million Canadians would be
• 11:36
  willing and and able to self custody funds you regret.
• 11:39
  Your your decision. No, no, no, not, not one bit.
• 11:41
  I think knowing what I know now, I would still make the the same
• 11:44
  decision simply because what you said it's this is the only way
• 11:47
  that you should be building like it is.
• 11:49
  Uncle Ben says like with great power comes great
• 11:51
  responsibility. Like we have a great power.
• 11:53
  We have the power of knowledge. We know that Bitcoin in self
• 11:55
  custody is the better way. We know that it is.
• 11:59
  And like the safest way, we know that it is the only way.
• 12:02
  There was actually, there was someone yesterday on Twitter was
• 12:05
  talking about he had the government, he has 135 Bitcoin
• 12:10
  that he has in self custody the government wants Yep.
• 12:13
  And they're finding, they're finding about $10 a day, 10
• 12:16
  grand a day. And my response to that is like
• 12:19
  Bitcoin in self custody works because that's not even going to
• 12:22
  court. Yeah, if that's in a custodian,
• 12:24
  if that's in any Bitcoin exchange, it's just handed over.
• 12:27
  Government is like, hey, by the way, here's the order, Here's
• 12:30
  the guy's name, here's this SSN. Like I want the and I think.
• 12:33
  The government takes that for granted and I think that there's
• 12:35
  still this there's still this perception in people that the
• 12:39
  government has that power. But yeah, what happens when most
• 12:42
  of society comes to the realization that like, wait a
• 12:45
  second, if I take self custody of my Bitcoin, I they have the
• 12:48
  power, right? I think things are really going
• 12:50
  to change. That's the.
• 12:50
  Superpower. It's I've said it many times,
• 12:53
  it's not number go up. And I and I think if you want
• 12:55
  number go up only like frankly, like don't even self custody,
• 12:59
  just like stick to your number go up platform.
• 13:02
  You're like Fiat Bitcoin exchange, custodial, like just
• 13:05
  whatever, it's fine. You don't get to kind of where
• 13:08
  the Bitcoin ethos. You don't care about
• 13:09
  sovereignty, you don't care about generational wealth, you
• 13:11
  don't care about all the important things like Bitcoin is
• 13:14
  at most 20% price, at most 80% freedom.
• 13:18
  And I think that there are lots of things that probably do
• 13:20
  number go up better than Bitcoin, especially now that
• 13:23
  we're kind of reaching some sort of critical mass.
• 13:25
  I think that the most important thing that we have to remember
• 13:28
  is that we want freedom go up. We want maximum independence.
• 13:32
  I call myself an independence maxi or a freedom maxi.
• 13:35
  And I just don't see how these, you know, so-called Bitcoin
• 13:41
  platforms are custodial, you know, and, and like offering a
• 13:46
  product that they know is wrong under the guise of mass mass
• 13:49
  market. It, it just, it rubs me the
• 13:51
  wrong way. And I and I, I think that as
• 13:53
  Bitcoiners, we have to be better.
• 13:54
  We have to be stronger and and we have to do more than just
• 13:57
  like educate and then profit off of the, you know, the wrong way.
• 14:02
  So I want to go back to something that you said earlier
• 14:04
  in regards to Bitcoin being early, right?
• 14:07
  You're early to Bitcoin still. I mean, how can you say that,
• 14:10
  right? Like, you know, you've been a
• 14:12
  Bitcoin entrepreneur for 10 years now.
• 14:13
  I think it's been 11 years since you got into Bitcoin in the
• 14:16
  first place. How can you still say at this
• 14:18
  point, I mean, you're not really that early.
• 14:20
  If the US government is saying, hey, look, guys, like probably
• 14:23
  going to buy. We're probably going to buy.
• 14:24
  It 20% or whatever it is. Like, you know, you can't, you
• 14:28
  can't be that early. Are you talking about like
• 14:30
  adoption terms, price terms? And then I'll add a follow up
• 14:35
  question to that. Like, you know, what are the,
• 14:37
  what should people expect getting into Bitcoin?
• 14:40
  Because and you know, it's almost getting a little bit
• 14:42
  boring in a way. It's kind of, yeah, you're
• 14:45
  right. It is getting a little bit
• 14:46
  boring and it's interesting to say that I it's like 5%.
• 14:48
  Like it feels like the stock market, man.
• 14:50
  Like I feel like Bitcoin Twitter is still operating and it's
• 14:53
  2017. We're about to RIP, you know,
• 14:56
  20X. We're all degens looking for.
• 14:59
  It, I mean, the market cap is just so big.
• 15:01
  You know, it's not to say that I can't do it totally.
• 15:03
  Like gold's market cap increased tremendously, but I think it was
• 15:06
  like 6 trillion. Yeah, market cap really only
• 15:08
  works for businesses, not for like commodities or protocols
• 15:12
  like, you know, gold, oil, Bitcoin like you don't like
• 15:16
  market cap is completely irrelevant because there's
• 15:19
  there's no way that we can capture, you know, mass
• 15:22
  distribution. And I think that's what I mean
• 15:23
  when I'm early is Bitcoin hasn't hit a mass distribution, not
• 15:26
  even close. Like if we just walked, you
• 15:29
  know, walked anywhere down any St. in any city and said, hey,
• 15:35
  do you have a Bitcoin wallet? I bet less than half say yes.
• 15:40
  And of the half or of the, you know, whatever percentage say
• 15:42
  yes, less than 5% actually have a seed phrase.
• 15:46
  And when you think about, you know, where is Bitcoin going to
• 15:49
  go? It's going to go one of two
• 15:51
  ways. It's going to go to 0 or as the
• 15:54
  global, you know, monetary policy.
• 15:57
  And if it goes to 0, it'll be because everyone holds Bitcoin
• 16:02
  in a custodian and or you know, is 61 O2.
• 16:05
  And if it goes to be global monetary policy, it's going to
• 16:09
  be because we've mastered self custody and everyone's
• 16:11
  comfortable custodying their wealth for like moving backwards
• 16:14
  150 years to gold coins under my mattress, but preferably, you
• 16:19
  know, not held under your mattress.
• 16:21
  Is that, is that possible? Because in my experience, right,
• 16:24
  it's been like there's just some people that there's, it doesn't
• 16:28
  matter how many times I've showed them, I still end up
• 16:32
  being like Uncle Jim, yeah. The Internet tech support, yeah,
• 16:37
  no, it's not possible today. It's not supposed to be.
• 16:39
  And I think that's actually. Hardware.
• 16:40
  Limitations. No, it's nobody has to change
• 16:45
  right now to survive. I mean, you think safety explain
• 16:47
  this perfectly, the adoption of Bitcoin more akin to to
• 16:52
  gunpowder than to like a fancy iPhone or something like that
• 16:55
  where you know, you don't really know who adopted gunpowder last
• 16:59
  because they're just dead. The history books, they're not
• 17:02
  in them, their colony or their their citizenship is just gone
• 17:06
  because they lost. You brought a knife to a
• 17:08
  gunfight and you lose 100% of the time.
• 17:11
  And Bitcoin is the gunpowder. It's the better version of
• 17:15
  someone else having access and control of your money.
• 17:18
  And so those that do not embrace that will perish.
• 17:21
  Their bloodline will not have access to wealth.
• 17:25
  It will be very, very, very difficult for their descendants
• 17:28
  to have any level of access to wealth.
• 17:31
  And this Fiat world where we can pass wealth from generation to
• 17:34
  generation without teaching the next generation how to manage
• 17:38
  it, is going to evaporate, probably in the generation from
• 17:42
  from our parents to us. Why?
• 17:45
  Why? Why so?
• 17:45
  Because I think there's going to be a tremendous amount of of tax
• 17:48
  and government authoritarianism where like right now we're
• 17:52
  seeing this narrative play out where we've got the rich are bad
• 17:56
  and we have to, you know, steal from the rich and give to the
• 17:58
  needy. I mean, but that that's always
• 17:59
  been the case. Right, but we haven't it hasn't
• 18:02
  been paired with, you know, the seeming the end of a monetary
• 18:05
  like we're looking at the end of Fiat.
• 18:07
  I think we'd agree. Like if you know, even in the
• 18:10
  70s, even like you know, back in into the 30s, Fiat currency
• 18:13
  wasn't as as bad as it was as it is right now.
• 18:17
  And so when you look at A at a generation of people who have,
• 18:23
  you know, now for two generations just received
• 18:26
  account statements and a built in manager and it became
• 18:29
  somebody else's problem to train up a new manager, you know, oh,
• 18:32
  hey, I'm leaving. But Bob's here and he's been at
• 18:34
  the firm for 20 years and he's going to look after your kids.
• 18:36
  And it's like, awesome, Bob, where's my rib eye steak?
• 18:39
  Thank you very much. I'll go to a ball game with you.
• 18:41
  And, you know, you can manage my $35 million.
• 18:44
  And I think that that's going to completely disappear in favor of
• 18:48
  Bitcoin in self custody. And when it does, it will be our
• 18:53
  parents passing wealth to us because people our age, I'd say
• 18:57
  half of them are comfortable with self custody.
• 18:59
  And I think that the generation coming up is more comfortable
• 19:02
  than ever. I am so bullish.
• 19:04
  I have like the girl who babysits my kids who's like 16.
• 19:08
  I'm always talking to her. You know, what's the latest?
• 19:11
  Like I'm getting the pool teenager lingo.
• 19:13
  I'm like figuring out how they speak and how they think and
• 19:16
  their freedom. Maxis man, like they understand
• 19:20
  they're not bought into the liberal brainwashing that I
• 19:23
  think that our generation kind of was exposed to and and was
• 19:26
  bought into. They're not they are digital
• 19:29
  natives and they have no problem money being in the cloud and
• 19:33
  they're incentivized to want to learn how to manage that because
• 19:37
  I think they they understand what's going on.
• 19:39
  And so I'm super bullish on self custody, not because your
• 19:42
  grandma is going to self custody.
• 19:44
  Frankly, your grandma doesn't need to self custody like she's
• 19:48
  15 years. Like I don't know your grandma
• 19:49
  specifically, but like, you know, grandmas in general are
• 19:52
  probably fine. Our parents probably have us so
• 19:55
  so they're OK. But our generation and younger
• 19:59
  like consider this a direct call out to learn how to self custody
• 20:02
  so. I'm of that belief too, right?
• 20:04
  And I think it's 'cause, you know, again, the class that
• 20:08
  you're from, right? But as Bitcoin continues to go
• 20:10
  up in value. But I don't think everybody's
• 20:13
  going to have the luxury of being able to deal with the main
• 20:16
  chain just because of essentially being outpriced.
• 20:19
  I mean, what would your response be to that?
• 20:21
  Yeah, I think layer 2 is to be determined still.
• 20:24
  There's two real prominent players right now in Liquid,
• 20:27
  which is kind of a, you know, hybrid custodial solution
• 20:30
  federation style and Lightning. I think that, you know, I'm
• 20:34
  probably more in the camp of Lightning because I'm
• 20:37
  technically capable to set up a lightning node and and you know.
• 20:40
  The lightning is great, but it's not ready.
• 20:42
  For not ready for what I'm saying completely not even close
• 20:45
  because it takes. It takes one of the entire
• 20:46
  reason, like all of a sudden we're back to square one we're
• 20:48
  relying on. Custodians, yeah, man,
• 20:50
  completely and and in in both scenarios.
• 20:52
  So you either have to be technically adept to be able to
• 20:54
  set up a lighting node and and and balance the channels and
• 20:56
  manage the channels and and be able to spend in self custody
• 20:59
  or. Is Bitcoin destined for only a
• 21:01
  few people to have self custody of their Bitcoin?
• 21:05
  No, no, no. I think that the layer 2 that
• 21:07
  wins doesn't exist yet. I think that we're going to see
• 21:11
  some sort of, I mean, dude, think about how easy it is to
• 21:14
  self custody Bitcoin today even compared to 2016.
• 21:17
  It was. It's significantly easier.
• 21:19
  And bro, let me tell you 2013. Wallets.
• 21:22
  They didn't. Exist 100% like and why, right?
• 21:25
  It wasn't necessarily one company or one initiative, but
• 21:29
  collectively the industry, the free market, if you will,
• 21:32
  identified yo, Bitcoin wallets suck and we should make them
• 21:36
  better. And you know, tons of open
• 21:38
  source software, tons of guides, you know, tons of tutorial, like
• 21:41
  like just so much stuff coming out And what do you know, like
• 21:44
  now you download, you know, like blue wallet or you know, any
• 21:46
  other self custody open source software, two buttons, you know,
• 21:50
  write down your words and like you're good.
• 21:53
  And I think that, you know, look at even like the bit key that
• 21:56
  launched. That's maybe controversial, but
• 21:58
  but is is seedless and self custody focus.
• 22:01
  They're there is people and are people innovating in the space
• 22:06
  that I think have the right incentive and the right motive
• 22:10
  that want to see Bitcoin scale. We all understand, you know, our
• 22:15
  sacrifice of of having UTXOS and I am very, very, very convinced
• 22:20
  that layer 2, whatever it may be in the future, I don't think it
• 22:23
  will be lightning. I don't think it will be liquid.
• 22:25
  I think it will be some other kind of combination thereof is
• 22:27
  is going to work and and who knows?
• 22:29
  I mean, it could be it, it could be like liquid, like federation
• 22:32
  style inside smaller communities where you just have like
• 22:34
  federation bridges. Like like I said, that's not my
• 22:37
  field. Whatever the smart people do,
• 22:40
  I'm going to adopt A Bitcoin well, but like, you know, wipe
• 22:43
  my hands. But as someone who's been in the
• 22:45
  space a long time and has seen the innovation, I am very, very,
• 22:48
  very convinced Bitcoin will scale.
• 22:50
  Bitcoin is for everybody or it won't work as a as a reserve
• 22:55
  currency. It has to be for, but it isn't
• 22:57
  for everybody on the main chain. Guys, I want to tell you about
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• 23:05
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• 23:10
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• 23:30
  I think eventually, and maybe not everybody, but it is for
• 23:35
  every bloodline, It is for every generation on the main chain.
• 23:37
  I think that we have to think about the downstream effects of
• 23:40
  a Bitcoin standard and how it aligns incentives, how it
• 23:43
  doesn't allow for frivolous spending.
• 23:45
  It doesn't allow to not teach your kids like how many people
• 23:48
  right now have so many, you know, have their two kids or
• 23:51
  whatever the standard is and they just dump them in the
• 23:54
  school system. Don't teach them about saving or
• 23:56
  budgeting or or smart spending or time preference.
• 23:58
  And and ultimately just, you know, their kids get brainwashed
• 24:01
  by the state and then and then off they go to make the same
• 24:03
  mistakes. That is not possible on a
• 24:06
  Bitcoin standard simply because the incentives do not work when
• 24:10
  you've got this low time preference and you instill that
• 24:12
  in generation, let's call it generation one.
• 24:14
  Our children's generation is generation one in, in this
• 24:17
  example, we're going to be passing down Bitcoin to them.
• 24:20
  And let's say we're starting right now, we're starting at
• 24:22
  Ground Zero right now. We make 100% and we, you know,
• 24:27
  spend 90 and 10% of our income goes into into layer 2 and it's
• 24:31
  sitting there. And we do that for 30 years,
• 24:34
  probably as part of our succession, our our life
• 24:37
  succession. That 30 year accumulation in
• 24:40
  layer two goes on the main train and it's and it's there and
• 24:44
  hopefully that child does the same thing and it's stacking and
• 24:48
  then that goes, you know, onto the main chain.
• 24:50
  And so I agree the main chain is probably not to use, you know,
• 24:56
  every year or, you know, like I consolidate Utixos quarterly.
• 24:59
  That won't be a thing in 20 years.
• 25:01
  But you know how the like the like the Jewish have like the
• 25:05
  bar mitzvahs and the like this becoming a man, It will you will
• 25:08
  be becoming a man when you you have your coins transferred from
• 25:12
  layer 2 to the main chain. This is like this is a
• 25:15
  celebration. Get the cake, get the, you know,
• 25:18
  get the bubbly water. Like this is a big deal.
• 25:20
  So OK, let's talk about like the the long term, right?
• 25:24
  So where are you? Do you agree with Hal Finney's
• 25:26
  posts? You think we'll see $10 million
• 25:28
  Bitcoin with today's purchasing power anytime soon?
• 25:31
  Anytime soon? I mean anytime soon in regards
• 25:34
  to the next 1020 thirty years. Oh yeah, like I don't see,
• 25:39
  unless the government stops printing, I don't see how we
• 25:43
  don't see 10,000,020 million. Like we already have a 10
• 25:47
  million, you know, yen Bitcoin, right?
• 25:50
  How far off are we in pesos? Like are we a 2X or A3 XOA in
• 25:53
  pesos? Like you know, yes, because the
• 25:56
  US dollar and the Canadian dollar and the Australian
• 25:58
  dollar, we are no better than the peso.
• 26:00
  We are just a little bit further down or further behind in the
• 26:04
  life cycle. And so 10 million, yeah, why so
• 26:06
  bearish, man? Like how about 50 million?
• 26:09
  How about 100? It is inevitable that sound
• 26:13
  wealth will transfer like wealth is like water and it's no one is
• 26:17
  questioning does water go downhill?
• 26:19
  It's like, yeah, and wealth will transfer to the scarcest, most
• 26:24
  valuable asset there is literally 0 things on planet
• 26:28
  Earth more scarce and valuable than Bitcoin.
• 26:32
  Not gold, not oil, not the US dollar, obviously not land, not,
• 26:37
  you know, beachfront real estate, like nothing is more
• 26:39
  scarce and valuable than Bitcoin.
• 26:41
  And so yeah, 100 percent, 10 million.
• 26:43
  I agree with Hal. Yeah, 100%.
• 26:46
  Yeah. And and I agree with you as well
• 26:48
  too. One of the phenomenons that
• 26:49
  we've been seeing in developing countries, specifically in South
• 26:52
  South America, Africa, Southeast Asia, is the mass adoption of
• 26:57
  stable coins, specifically Tether.
• 26:59
  I think Bitcoiners had this initial concept that, you know,
• 27:03
  this is a perfect fix, right? You have an unstable Fiat
• 27:06
  currency, boom, boom, boom, Bing, you're going to adopt
• 27:09
  Bitcoin. You know, makes sense.
• 27:11
  Listen, that's not what the free market is saying.
• 27:13
  The free market is saying is that people want dollars.
• 27:16
  So do you think that's an educational issue?
• 27:18
  Do you think stable coins are a threat to Bitcoin?
• 27:22
  Do you think that my my own public opinion is that they're a
• 27:25
  Trojan horse in a way because it gets people exposed to digital
• 27:28
  wallets? That phenomenon surprise you at
• 27:31
  all? No, I don't think so.
• 27:33
  The first time I was exposed to stable coins was during kind of
• 27:38
  the ICO craze in 2017. And I was like, wow, moving
• 27:42
  money should go a lot easier or moving dollars got a lot easier.
• 27:47
  I was already very used to like my first Bitcoin transaction,
• 27:50
  real Bitcoin transaction was buying a Bitcoin ATM in 2013.
• 27:54
  I paid for it in Bitcoin like I, I moved money on a Sunday
• 27:57
  afternoon from my wallet to to his and it was a done deal.
• 28:00
  And so I was used to this idea that money needed to move.
• 28:03
  What I wasn't used to was that stable money could move.
• 28:06
  And I think that it's less of an education thing, especially in
• 28:08
  these several countries, but you, you have to imagine a
• 28:12
  person who is looking to balance their risk tolerance and their
• 28:18
  innovation kind of levels. And there's kind of on a bit of
• 28:21
  a scale. And for us, you know, we have
• 28:23
  stable currency already in our bank accounts and in our pockets
• 28:28
  and, and, and whatever. And So what we're escaping with
• 28:31
  Bitcoin is not so much the the failing dollar, although that is
• 28:37
  part of it. That's the number go up part,
• 28:38
  but it's mostly the freedom. That's how I talked about
• 28:40
  earlier. Like what we're escaping is the
• 28:42
  tyranny in, you know, a developed country that our money
• 28:46
  can be stolen. That's why Bitcoin is so
• 28:48
  valuable. They're not escaping that same
• 28:52
  thing they are in thermal countries.
• 28:54
  But I think they're more excited about holy smokes, I finally
• 28:59
  have access to a stable current a stable currency, and I'm not
• 29:06
  going to jump from my already unstable currency to another
• 29:11
  unstable currency in in Bitcoin. Obviously over the long term,
• 29:14
  Bitcoin has number to go up. And I think most stablecoin
• 29:16
  users would probably agree with that.
• 29:18
  But they don't yet have the luxury of thinking long term
• 29:20
  because they are exposed to yeah, man or not even like
• 29:25
  probably shorter than that. I actually read a a thing the
• 29:27
  other day. Well, Walmart CEO said that they
• 29:30
  can see their sales drop on the back half of a two week paycheck
• 29:34
  cycle. People are buying like smaller
• 29:36
  packages, less food when their paychecks are running out.
• 29:40
  And that's petrifying for us. But that's how it's been in
• 29:44
  thermal countries for decades, for generations.
• 29:47
  And so they're not, you know, forget self custody, forget, you
• 29:51
  know, freedom go up. Their version of freedom is just
• 29:54
  number stability. And so we, and that's what I
• 29:56
  mean by early and, and also like we have to count our blessings
• 29:59
  here in North America with how lucky we are that we have, you
• 30:03
  know, relatively stable footing to sit on and, and have the
• 30:06
  opportunity to look at Bitcoin benefit from number go up, but
• 30:09
  also, you know, really push for freedom go up.
• 30:12
  Yeah, absolutely, 100%. So you said something earlier
• 30:14
  which is really interesting. I want to further explore that
• 30:17
  topic talking about setting up your first Bitcoin ATM 2013 use
• 30:22
  Bitcoin to buy the first machine.
• 30:24
  How do you get from the first machine to how many years later
• 30:28
  till you went public? 9-9 years and then you're a
• 30:33
  publicly trained company with how many machines now 100?
• 30:36
  And sixty across Canada or so, but a. 160 ATM.
• 30:40
  We've yeah, we've basically we've, we've moved at one point
• 30:43
  was 300 with partnerships and and things we only own 160, but
• 30:46
  we operate like many more. So essentially 300X.
• 30:50
  At peak, yeah, I guess, yeah. So how did you do 300X?
• 30:56
  Yeah, I mean you just it it's funny, like I am not very good
• 31:00
  at traditional business. You know, I was very young when
• 31:03
  I found Bitcoin. Very young.
• 31:04
  Wanting to bring ATMSATMS feel like the most logical you're.
• 31:09
  In your teens? No Early 20s.
• 31:11
  I was 19 when I found Bitcoin, and then I think I was just 20
• 31:15
  when I launched the first Bitcoin ATM.
• 31:17
  So yeah, like pretty young, you know, back then I thought I knew
• 31:20
  everything. And today I'm like, wow, that
• 31:21
  guy wasn't a complete idiot like, you know, but it was like
• 31:25
  no business plan. It was just let's get a Bitcoin
• 31:29
  ATM. Honestly, those are the best
• 31:31
  types of business. Bro, you have a dream in your
• 31:32
  head. You're naive.
• 31:34
  Yeah, enough to believe. Dude.
• 31:35
  And that, that was part of it. I had 10 people that I asked,
• 31:38
  hey, should I do this? And they're all like, no, this.
• 31:40
  Is 10 of them said no, it's. A terrible idea.
• 31:42
  It's not safe, it's not stable. You know, we don't know how it's
• 31:45
  going to pan out, blah, blah, blah.
• 31:47
  And I was like, I don't really know why.
• 31:48
  I asked what I think is. Entrepreneurship like you need a
• 31:51
  little bit of overconfidence, optimism and self belief because
• 31:55
  if not, it's not going to work. Yeah, man and self belief, but
• 31:58
  also and something that I realized later on was like
• 32:02
  passion and adaptability are probably the only things that
• 32:05
  you need in in. When we went public, my friends
• 32:07
  were calling like to congratulate and like all this,
• 32:10
  all this stuff or sorry. My friends parents were calling
• 32:12
  to graduate and, and one of them talking to my dad was like, oh
• 32:15
  man, like I'm just so happy Adam got so lucky.
• 32:18
  Like getting into Bitcoin and my dad was like lucky.
• 32:21
  He's like that kid is so frustrating and stubborn.
• 32:24
  There is no one that hasn't told Adam stop or no.
• 32:27
  But the idiot just keeps on, you know, bursting through walls and
• 32:31
  like frankly man, every single wall can be can be pushed
• 32:35
  through every single one. I am not convinced and I have so
• 32:38
  much, I have the audacity to say there are 0 problems that cannot
• 32:42
  be solved with brain power and manpower.
• 32:45
  And I mean, look at like we have, we have more of that than
• 32:49
  any time before. Like we are just going to blast
• 32:52
  problems. And and that's, that's
• 32:53
  ultimately what it was. It was like, oh, we want to run
• 32:55
  ATMs. No one wants a Bitcoin ATM.
• 32:57
  So I remember there's this one time here's the first problem I
• 33:00
  ever experienced. So Bitcoin ATM comes to my
• 33:01
  house. It's really heavy.
• 33:03
  I like lift it up and carry up the stairs, like hurt my back.
• 33:06
  So put it down, set it up. I send 100 Bitcoin to the to the
• 33:10
  Bitcoin wallet in there. It's gone.
• 33:12
  It leaves and I'm like, oh, that was a good scam.
• 33:16
  Like it didn't work very good. And so I called the
• 33:19
  manufacturer, the guy that sold it to me, and I'm like, dude,
• 33:22
  like what is going on? He's like, Oh yeah, we
• 33:25
  accidentally loaded one wallet onto 50 different machines when
• 33:30
  we shipped from the factory and we forgot to wipe that.
• 33:32
  So someone must have just taken the coins.
• 33:34
  And I was like, well, that was kind of like, you know, I didn't
• 33:38
  do test transaction. It was just like 100.
• 33:40
  No, but at the time it was worth how much?
• 33:43
  It would have been like probably a couple $1000 which like and
• 33:47
  today. Now it's. 10 million or well,
• 33:49
  yeah, yeah, for sure. But even even like couple $1000
• 33:53
  though like when you're 20 years old.
• 33:55
  Yeah, of course. That's just like, I was like
• 33:57
  sick to my stomach. I wasn't sure I was going to
• 33:59
  recoup. And so eventually like called,
• 34:02
  he was like, I don't know. And I was like, well, you got to
• 34:03
  figure this out. He's like, OK, OK, So we like
• 34:05
  talk on the phone. He ends up finding the coins.
• 34:07
  We go through this big long. The guy that ended up having
• 34:09
  them was like some, you know, wanted to feel very important to
• 34:12
  me. I did this big long drawn out
• 34:14
  phone call and all this stuff and then, you know, a week later
• 34:17
  I get the coins back. I was like whoo.
• 34:18
  And so did he do it on purpose? No, he was just like, oh, coins
• 34:22
  in the wallet, like like any reasonable.
• 34:24
  He did want any. I don't fault him.
• 34:25
  He probably could have handled the situation a little bit
• 34:27
  better, but when he'd be like, hey, like here's proof that I
• 34:30
  sent them. They're mine.
• 34:31
  Can you just put them back please?
• 34:32
  But anyways, so that was like problem one.
• 34:34
  Then problem 2 was oh, hey, no one wants, no one's heard of
• 34:37
  Bitcoin and no one wants a Bitcoin ATM.
• 34:39
  So lucky for me, my father-in-law, who also gave me
• 34:41
  the seed capital for the first ATM and the Bitcoin that were
• 34:45
  subsequently gone and then and then returned.
• 34:47
  He had a pub. And so I was like, great, we'll
• 34:49
  put the pub, we'll put the ATM in the pub.
• 34:51
  And then the third problem was, which is amazing.
• 34:53
  And we were the first one in Alberta.
• 34:54
  It was great publicity, I think for, for, for his pub.
• 34:57
  It was really awesome for me to be able to have a friendly face
• 35:00
  and, and whatever. But then, you know, the third
• 35:03
  problem was like no one wanted to use the like no one was using
• 35:06
  the ATM. And so it was a slow grind, a
• 35:08
  slow build up to to end up using it.
• 35:10
  And you know, but any, any one of those things could have been
• 35:14
  like, oh, my coins were stolen. This Yep, Yep, no, everyone was
• 35:18
  right. Like this is done.
• 35:19
  You know, no one wants it. I'm going to hang it up.
• 35:21
  Like you just got to keep on, just keep on grinding.
• 35:24
  You know what's really interesting too is like those
• 35:26
  times, those dark times, right? They if you, if you survive and
• 35:31
  then like, honestly, it's very rare that I've ever met an
• 35:36
  entrepreneur that doesn't eventually succeed.
• 35:38
  Totally, man. What I find more often is
• 35:42
  someone who gives up, someone who quits, Yes.
• 35:44
  But if you keep chipping at it, eventually you either have a
• 35:48
  break or you know, but you're going to have extremely dark
• 35:51
  days and pain throughout the entire process.
• 35:54
  But I feel like that's the price that you have to pay.
• 35:56
  Yeah, man. And I think it's healthy.
• 35:57
  I don't think we want successful people who haven't gone through
• 36:00
  pain. We definitely need.
• 36:03
  I don't think you can be successful.
• 36:04
  If you haven't, I would, I would agree with you.
• 36:06
  And, and I think that as a society, we want the leaders,
• 36:12
  you know, whether they be business people or, or leaders
• 36:16
  in politics or whatever. And that's not how it works now.
• 36:19
  Not anymore, but it used to be. Because now the way that society
• 36:22
  works, too, and it was recently in Washington, DC, and it's so
• 36:25
  like, it's a beautiful city. But so, yeah, I just, I have to
• 36:36
  remember where I am. So it's a beautiful city.
• 36:39
  But I guess what I'm trying to say is like, essentially, like
• 36:42
  the way that society works now is, you know, there's a
• 36:44
  popularity contest. Yeah.
• 36:46
  And whoever wins that popularity contest controls the money
• 36:50
  printer, essentially, dude. And it's crazy.
• 36:52
  It's a complete because like in business, right?
• 36:55
  If you make bad decisions, what happens?
• 36:57
  You die, You go out of business. Yes, right.
• 36:59
  You have to start from zero. You get a massive piece of
• 37:01
  humble pie and you start again. And then you learn what not to
• 37:04
  do. And then, of course, the free
• 37:05
  market kind of decides, OK, you know, this guy's really good,
• 37:08
  this guy's winning, right? So it's like the free market
• 37:10
  kind of takes care of itself and the political system.
• 37:13
  The only feedback mechanism that they get that the government
• 37:16
  gets is an election, at least in the US, every four years or
• 37:20
  every two years is, you know, kind of how.
• 37:22
  But for presidents every four years, that's a terrible
• 37:24
  feedback. Mechanism, it's a very difficult
• 37:27
  four years is also it's the same in Canada, but it's, it's even
• 37:31
  worse because it's, it's somehow too short to get anything done,
• 37:36
  but then too long because it's got such a long feedback loop.
• 37:39
  You almost like in business if you make bad decisions for four
• 37:42
  years. Actually, I don't think you can
• 37:44
  make bad decisions for four years in business.
• 37:46
  You can do bad decisions for like 6 months Max and then you
• 37:50
  just end up, you know, disappearing and no one has
• 37:52
  heard of you. It's because you have this like
• 37:55
  at Bitcoin. Well, especially like I love the
• 37:57
  short feedback loop of, of the portal.
• 37:59
  Even with ATMs, the feedback loop is so long.
• 38:02
  We, we discovered that it takes about 8 months for a machine to
• 38:06
  hit it's it's stride. And so we have an 8 month feed
• 38:10
  from placing machine on day one. Whatever the machine is doing at
• 38:14
  8 months is kind of the cap that it will ever do.
• 38:17
  And if that's, you know, 50 grand a month, it's like
• 38:20
  dynamite, but if it's 100 bucks a month, it's like time to yank
• 38:24
  it. And so we have a place and wait
• 38:27
  strategy. You have to wait eight months on
• 38:29
  the portal. If we launch like we just
• 38:31
  launched recurring buy in the USA and it's been like a huge
• 38:34
  hit, which I'm, you know, we were expecting.
• 38:35
  But if it wasn't, that would be, you know, in the first week.
• 38:39
  If we didn't have our expected uptick, it would be like, oh,
• 38:41
  hey, you know, why did I think it would?
• 38:43
  Where did I make that mistake? Let's change, you know, in our
• 38:47
  future decisions and then make better decisions next week.
• 38:50
  Like we get to make a better decision next week.
• 38:52
  We have to wait eight months or four years or it's like we can
• 38:55
  take meaningful action now. And and that's why again, like
• 38:59
  back to, you know, even like the layer 2 conversation, like we're
• 39:02
  getting really good feedback currently in Bitcoin in its
• 39:05
  digital nature, in its global ability.
• 39:07
  And I, dude, I'm just so bullish on the future of this, you know,
• 39:11
  product or currency or monetary. Policy 100%.
• 39:13
  I mean, like Bitcoin essentially has incentivized the smartest
• 39:16
  people on earth to come on or yeah.
• 39:18
  Yeah, you'll end. Incentives are insane.
• 39:19
  They're just working for their bags essentially, I think Kaiser
• 39:22
  says, like, Sailor is the employee of the month, Trump,
• 39:25
  Trump was the employee of the month with the hands.
• 39:27
  Trump was the employee of the month for, for, for February.
• 39:31
  Like without a shadow of a doubt.
• 39:32
  And I mean, he came through so hard.
• 39:34
  Like I and I remember, you know, the end of 2024, it was, it was
• 39:40
  put us in a very difficult position because we've always
• 39:42
  taken a very neutral stance, right?
• 39:44
  Like I'm like, look, don't care if you're left, right.
• 39:46
  You know, Democrat, Republicans, all the same thing.
• 39:48
  And then they arrested the Samurai wall.
• 39:50
  Yeah, man. Like simply Bitcoin endorses
• 39:53
  Trump 2024 and but RFK, you know, 2024 a 100% they have.
• 39:59
  And then so many people in the chat loss was like, why are you
• 40:01
  guys getting political? Like you guys do not understand
• 40:04
  this is survival. I got to say, we told you so,
• 40:07
  right, right. And I think this is a very
• 40:08
  interesting phenomenon. This is where it leads me to the
• 40:11
  next topic where we're kind of in this weird transition period
• 40:15
  in politics. I really do believe the theory
• 40:17
  from the sovereign individual where information technologies
• 40:21
  or the adoption of them is going to lead to the eventual death of
• 40:24
  politics like politics. Is going to take a backseat in
• 40:28
  terms of the importance in people's lives.
• 40:30
  And we're kind of seeing that system go through that
• 40:34
  transition. Like what was a really
• 40:36
  interesting phenomenon to me was how much they fought to control
• 40:40
  information. Like now Inbuka has a very
• 40:42
  famous quote from Bitcoin magazine.
• 40:45
  The name of the article is don't drink the elite kool-aid.
• 40:48
  And in that article, he says their most important weapon is
• 40:50
  their control over the truth. And we saw this.
• 40:52
  I mean, the mainstream media was like, if it's a tweet, it's
• 40:55
  misinformation. Yeah, right.
• 40:57
  You know, And then at the same time, they're blaming inflation
• 40:59
  on the weather. Like, it's so absurd.
• 41:02
  But we saw the collective consciousness of the world as
• 41:05
  soon as Elon freed the bird. Like wake up and eventually
• 41:09
  reach this critical mass where the the majority of people are
• 41:12
  no longer getting their information on legacy media,
• 41:15
  which in my opinion is like propaganda for.
• 41:17
  The states 100%. And most people are doing their
• 41:20
  own research on social media, for better or worse.
• 41:22
  I think it's better. Yeah, I think.
• 41:24
  It's a free market of ideas. But what I'm trying to make is
• 41:27
  like, you know, where does politics go from now?
• 41:29
  Like where, where does it go? Like this is going to be some
• 41:32
  some crazy times. Need liquidity without having to
• 41:35
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• 42:44
  I think it's pretty clear that democracy as we have it doesn't
• 42:48
  work. Oh God.
• 42:50
  It's like it's obvious I don't know what the right solution.
• 42:52
  Is what is the alternative? Well, this is this is the right
• 42:55
  question. And I think this is the question
• 42:56
  that our generation needs to be asking internally and also in
• 43:03
  conversation. But also we need to be having
• 43:04
  this discussion with our with our kids and and with the next
• 43:08
  generation, because it is very clear that the popularity
• 43:10
  contest to give someone, you know, God like power for four
• 43:13
  years and then also restrict it to just one of two sides like
• 43:17
  it's not working. I mean, to play to play devil's
• 43:19
  advocate, right? Like how else would you get
• 43:22
  equality? How else would you get, you
• 43:24
  know, fairness? Like what would happen to the
• 43:26
  people that are left behind, right?
• 43:28
  Well, I think I think that we. That's the like, essentially the
• 43:31
  main proponents of democracy are like, look like there's massive
• 43:33
  wealth inequality. Democracy fixes that.
• 43:36
  Right, Yeah. I think that we rely a lot,
• 43:38
  though, on someone else like wealth inequality.
• 43:42
  If we had a nice naturally incentivized monetary policy,
• 43:47
  like a Bitcoin standard, let's say, wealth inequality would be
• 43:51
  first of all like levelled out just by the nature of the value
• 43:55
  economic system, you'd. Think it'd be much better than
• 43:57
  where it is stands today. Way better, but because it would
• 44:00
  be more decentralized, but even even even further so investing
• 44:03
  stops to look like Fiat gains number go up and it starts to
• 44:08
  look like building the world that I want to see.
• 44:11
  And and this can, you know, obviously pose problems.
• 44:15
  If enough people want to see a bad world, then you know, they
• 44:18
  will spend their money on making bad old things.
• 44:20
  I believe, and this is probably where my optimistic, you know,
• 44:24
  puppy dog nature comes out. But I do believe that humanity
• 44:29
  is good. I believe that we have more good
• 44:33
  in us than than evil as a like as a Christian, I believe that,
• 44:39
  you know, God has the ability to help us see the benefits of
• 44:46
  good. And I would love to think, and I
• 44:50
  think others would join me in thinking that with monetary
• 44:55
  equality, meaning everyone has access to the same ability with
• 44:58
  a value based, you know, monetary system, they would also
• 45:03
  start investing in a good world. And you actually probably won.
• 45:08
  You want that, but you also want, you want people
• 45:12
  incentivized to, we're not incentivized to make a good
• 45:14
  world right now. We are, we are all being stolen
• 45:17
  from by, you know, inflation. But even deeper than that, we're
• 45:21
  being stolen from by a, a third party in Fiat, in Fiat money.
• 45:26
  And when you don't know who is stealing from you, it looks like
• 45:29
  your neighbor, it looks like your, your brother, it looks
• 45:32
  like your friend is stealing from you and you, you're being
• 45:35
  punched in the face and you just can't figure out where it's
• 45:37
  from. And so you just start swinging.
• 45:39
  And when you start swinging, you go into, like you said, this
• 45:42
  self preservation mode. And you have no ability to look
• 45:45
  out further. You have no ability or desire to
• 45:48
  try and fix the world because you're just so focused on, on
• 45:53
  maintaining what you have. I think that the the future of
• 45:57
  of politics or or in my mind, lack thereof, it it doesn't look
• 46:02
  like a democracy like we know it because it doesn't need to be
• 46:05
  the problems that existed. The reason democracy is here is
• 46:08
  because money was centrally controlled.
• 46:10
  Like we've never seen an opportunity for a society to
• 46:14
  work with an openly fair democratic money.
• 46:18
  I just think that we have such a cool opportunity to adopt the
• 46:21
  principles of Bitcoin, you know, rules, not rulers.
• 46:24
  Like like I don't know why we don't vote on multiple things
• 46:28
  like voting. You know, we vote on Twitter
• 46:30
  like 9 times a day with a poll. We can, we can probably get
• 46:33
  smart enough to figure out how to, you know, have have
• 46:36
  individuals in a community campaign for certain things.
• 46:41
  You know, like I live in a suburb in Alberta of like
• 46:44
  100,000 people. Like it shouldn't be hard for me
• 46:47
  to say guys, why do we have grass?
• 46:49
  We should have fruits and vegetables here.
• 46:51
  So what you're saying is essentially Bitcoin essentially
• 46:54
  fixes democracy. It's not necessarily.
• 46:56
  It's not necessarily that Bitcoin gets rid of democracy,
• 46:59
  it's that democracy is broken because of Fiat and it's
• 47:02
  essentially misaligned the incentive structure.
• 47:04
  Maybe said differently, Bitcoin actually enables democracy,
• 47:07
  where right now I wouldn't call what we have right now
• 47:10
  democratic. I don't think it's democratic at
• 47:13
  all. I didn't vote for a carbon tax.
• 47:16
  Like actually, literally right now.
• 47:18
  Then there's a brand new Prime Minister that came into Canada.
• 47:21
  He he's just got in on Sunday and he is never once been on a
• 47:27
  ballot sheet, never once been elected at all.
• 47:30
  The people voted for a party. And then the party leader was
• 47:35
  like, yeah, he was garbage. And he left.
• 47:37
  And then the party leaders appointed someone new.
• 47:40
  And he's, by the way, a global essential banker.
• 47:41
  Like it cannot get any less democratic than that already.
• 47:45
  But they're like, oh, this is democracy.
• 47:47
  Like you voted for this. I didn't vote for this.
• 47:49
  I didn't vote for you to shut down the truckers have bank
• 47:52
  accounts and for you to, you know, lock me in my home because
• 47:54
  I didn't think of medicine and and for you to like put a diaper
• 47:56
  on my kids face. Like no, no, no, no, I do not
• 47:58
  vote for this. And So what is, you know, a
• 48:01
  democratic system if it's not having the ability to vote on
• 48:04
  the things that are deeply, deeply important?
• 48:07
  And like, can we even call a world that has mass, you know,
• 48:12
  mass restrictions put upon it in the name of safety?
• 48:15
  Can we call that democratic if they can just play the safety
• 48:18
  card, like climate emergency, you know, medical emergency,
• 48:21
  like we're just, we're just giving them.
• 48:23
  I think they've taken these God like powers and removed our
• 48:27
  democratic powers. And I think that Bitcoin kind of
• 48:31
  throws everything back in the middle and I think we have an
• 48:33
  opportunity now to kind of regain our democratic powers
• 48:36
  from what has been taken. Yeah, absolutely.
• 48:38
  I mean, specifically if you take self custody, if you take self
• 48:41
  custody, you're reclaiming back your financial sovereignty 100%.
• 48:45
  You're empowering yourself and you're empowering your family.
• 48:47
  100% agree. And it's going to be very
• 48:50
  interesting to see how this plays out.
• 48:52
  I, I, it's going to be because it's a pivotal moment in human
• 48:54
  history really. We're seeing the balance of
• 48:56
  power shift from the state to the individual.
• 48:59
  The individual just haven't realized that yet.
• 49:01
  They don't realize how much power they're really taking back
• 49:04
  once they take self custody. It's going to be an interesting
• 49:06
  phenomenon to see how they try to stop it.
• 49:09
  I think that this previous election in the United States, I
• 49:13
  think the stakes were so high because I think both, and again,
• 49:17
  you know, both parties are not monolithic, right?
• 49:20
  But I, I, I really do believe, like if you look at one party,
• 49:23
  they voted essentially for a central bank digital currency.
• 49:27
  You look at the other party, they're like, oh, Bitcoin,
• 49:29
  right? Like it was like, you know, fork
• 49:31
  in the road which way you're going, Bitcoin or slavery type
• 49:34
  of thing. And I'm glad that we went in a
• 49:36
  certain direction, But again, we're only four years away from
• 49:40
  essentially the color that being reversed, right?
• 49:43
  So it's very, very interesting. Now I kind of want to circle
• 49:45
  back to something that we were talking about earlier in the
• 49:47
  conversation regards to essentially us being early and
• 49:51
  the price, right? So, you know, this this year,
• 49:55
  like, like I was saying, has been underwhelming.
• 49:57
  You're you're anticipating 500K Bitcoin.
• 50:00
  And I think my question to you is like, is Bitcoin going to be
• 50:03
  boring heading into the future? You know, it's, it's very easy
• 50:06
  for us to be like, ah, you know what, like this is great.
• 50:09
  Yeah. I mean, you know, we've been in,
• 50:10
  we've been at this for a couple of years.
• 50:12
  What would you say to someone that was just getting in and
• 50:15
  they're seeing Bitcoin and, you know, they they want to improve
• 50:18
  their lives? Like what would your response to
• 50:20
  them be? Because they're looking at, you
• 50:22
  know, a lot of the meme coins or a lot of these stocks, EXA has
• 50:25
  more volatility. They're like, why shouldn't
• 50:26
  this, this Bitcoin thing is boring.
• 50:28
  Like you know the best days of Bitcoin are behind it.
• 50:31
  Certainly I think from a dopamine level, the best days of
• 50:34
  Bitcoin are are behind, and that's a feature, not a bug.
• 50:38
  I think that if you are coming into Bitcoin because you want
• 50:42
  maximum dopamine, you're probably not quite ready to be
• 50:48
  in Bitcoin. I call the alt coins, the crypto
• 50:50
  casino, and there's a reason nobody with a, you know, with a
• 50:55
  sound mind takes their paycheck every two weeks, throws it on
• 50:58
  red and just sees what happened, right?
• 51:00
  No one's going to the blackjack table thinking I'm going to work
• 51:04
  like I'm a blackjack pro. I'm going to.
• 51:06
  It's like, no, no, no luck in the draw.
• 51:08
  You get the card. You can know when to place big
• 51:10
  and and when not to. You can play probabilities to
• 51:13
  your advantage, but you do not have the ability to determine
• 51:17
  when the card is going to hit and when it's not.
• 51:20
  And I think that as Bitcoin becomes more boring, it only
• 51:24
  becomes boring because we have a group of people that
• 51:27
  collectively believe that the casino, like I used to love, you
• 51:31
  know, gambling on the football games and, and, and playing
• 51:34
  cards with my friends, like very, very fun.
• 51:36
  I used to get a rush when I played with more money and I
• 51:39
  don't anymore. Now, I just love the act of
• 51:41
  doing it. I don't need or want to bet big
• 51:45
  to win big because I know the risk and the cost associated
• 51:48
  with that. If 1% of the generation before
• 51:51
  me thinks this way, maybe 5% of my generation thinks this way.
• 51:55
  But we're all having kids right now.
• 51:57
  And so probably 50% of the next generation thinks this way.
• 52:00
  And then they're going to have kids and probably it's 80% after
• 52:03
  that. And during those generational
• 52:06
  transfers, dude, they're going to line up with the monetary
• 52:10
  supply basically unchanged. Bitcoin is going to be boring.
• 52:15
  Bitcoin is going to be the GDP. Like that's just what's the
• 52:18
  market cap. It's like, what's the GDP of the
• 52:20
  world do? You agree with sailors
• 52:21
  prediction where he's saying $13 million base case by 2045?
• 52:26
  I mean, I, I don't think Sailor has the, the missing variable
• 52:29
  here is how much money will be in existence.
• 52:31
  It's like I have no desire to predict 20 years down the road
• 52:35
  because I think 20 years ago you could have never predicted the
• 52:38
  M0 like the base money supply in Canada, it quintupled in, in an
• 52:44
  18 month period. Like who's predicting that?
• 52:46
  And what if that happens twice more in that same time frame?
• 52:49
  13 million. No, no, no, it's like 100
• 52:51
  million. So yes, like it's going up
• 52:53
  because the politicians are in a state right now where they print
• 52:57
  or they 'cause, you know, mass catastrophe and failure.
• 53:01
  And I think that's something that we often ignore as
• 53:03
  Bitcoiners is the only way that's kind of the game three
• 53:06
  playing up. The only way out of this is by
• 53:08
  holding an asset that's better than the sinking ship.
• 53:11
  The sinking ship is the money that everybody currently entire
• 53:14
  system is working on a sinking ship right now.
• 53:17
  You know, we've heard the analogy.
• 53:18
  Bitcoin is the lifeboat when you run out of lifeboats when they
• 53:21
  get more expensive. And yeah, I just, I think that
• 53:24
  without question, number goes up for the long period, but
• 53:28
  eventually that stops because it's we as a society just get so
• 53:31
  much healthier with our finances.
• 53:33
  Investing will be a word that does not mean the same thing in
• 53:37
  50 a hundred. Percent because it's essentially
• 53:38
  the way that the system works now, right?
• 53:40
  And I want to talk about essentially the root thing that
• 53:43
  Bitcoin fixes, right? Essentially the way that
• 53:45
  investing works now is you have to you're forced to invest just
• 53:49
  to maintain your purchasing power, which is absolutely
• 53:51
  ludicrous. But if you want to identify the
• 53:53
  root cause. And also just quickly, that all
• 53:56
  sounds fine. If if that was the case, it's
• 53:58
  like fine just to maintain, I have to invest.
• 54:00
  So I maintain fine. But it comes with the risk of
• 54:03
  losing. Like you have two situations,
• 54:05
  you either hold or you invest. If you hold your guaranteed
• 54:09
  loss, if you invest, it's 5050 loser gain.
• 54:11
  So you have of the three options, 2/3 of those options,
• 54:14
  you have a 66% chance of loss and only a 33% chance of gain
• 54:19
  of. Money of money that you worked
• 54:21
  for, dude, right? Of money that you paid taxes,
• 54:23
  right? Like, and I think the
• 54:26
  essentially the root cause right, is inflation.
• 54:29
  Bitcoin fixes inflation. The more the more days that
• 54:32
  Bitcoin survives and the price goes up and not only proves that
• 54:36
  money can exist without inflation, it actually proves
• 54:39
  that money could be deflationary.
• 54:41
  No, it's not the correct technical word, but just for the
• 54:44
  sake of the conversation, I think it describes it right.
• 54:46
  Everything essentially trends to 0 towards Bitcoin.
• 54:49
  And it's a very interesting phenomenon.
• 54:51
  You adopt Bitcoin, you start feeling those benefits,
• 54:53
  everything starts getting cheaper, your time preference
• 54:55
  starts getting larger because you're just like, dude, like,
• 54:58
  you know, I'll just wait a couple more years and that thing
• 55:01
  that I want is going to be half off essentially.
• 55:03
  Yeah, man, so. What has inflation in your eyes
• 55:07
  as a Bitcoiner class of 2013? What has inflation done to
• 55:11
  society? I think it misaligned incentives
• 55:14
  so poorly to the fact that it has created an invisible force,
• 55:19
  which has eliminated the opportunity for for for fairness
• 55:24
  and prosperity. And I think that when you look
• 55:26
  at a family unit, you know, the smallest form of community,
• 55:30
  which is, you know, call it even just a, a partnership, a husband
• 55:34
  and a wife that is designed to be in such a way where you have
• 55:37
  the ability to think about your future and you have the ability
• 55:40
  to understand and think about what your goals are, make
• 55:45
  strides towards those goals, and then either achieve or miss
• 55:49
  those goals, but on your own accord.
• 55:51
  And probably in that some of it is his kids.
• 55:54
  But now you know, your goals probably include a certain
• 55:58
  number of hours or a certain dedication to A cause.
• 56:01
  And so as a result, you know, for half the partnership,
• 56:04
  usually the female variety, you're forced to choose.
• 56:08
  Do I want to, you know, be a part of those goals and
• 56:11
  contribute because, you know, hey, we decided we wanted to
• 56:13
  travel like this and have a house like this and drive a car
• 56:16
  like that and have a lifestyle like this that's not attainable
• 56:19
  anymore, like we thought it would be.
• 56:20
  So now I have to, you know, either enter or re enter the
• 56:23
  workforce. And so, you know, you make it
• 56:25
  work. And, you know, thank goodness
• 56:27
  the government's here and, and they, and they gave it the so
• 56:30
  there's maternity leave and there's systems set up and all
• 56:33
  the, you know, regulations and like good, I'm pro, I'm pro like
• 56:36
  inequality in, in, in that way. But now we have a generation
• 56:41
  coming into the world, which no longer has the luxury of, you
• 56:44
  know, a caring individual at the home who is, you know, making
• 56:48
  good food, educating in a certain way.
• 56:50
  And so, you know, last generation, what was it?
• 56:53
  It was like, well, we're just going to eat out a little bit
• 56:55
  more, right? Our food can come from a box, no
• 56:57
  problem. So we get a little bit, you
• 56:59
  know, unhealthy. And so, you know, that creates
• 57:01
  an incentive to make quick dinners that taste good and who
• 57:05
  cares about health? So boom, like Fiat food, like
• 57:09
  there's the apocalypse in in health.
• 57:12
  And then now what we're seeing even worse is I don't have time
• 57:15
  to cook. I don't have time to clean.
• 57:18
  And these kids are driving me crazy.
• 57:19
  I don't have the ability myself to even think because I'm, you
• 57:22
  know, busy at work and doing all my stuff.
• 57:24
  So I dumped the screen into a kid and these, you know, 8 month
• 57:28
  old, 2 year old, 5 year old kids are buried in their screens from
• 57:33
  an early age. So we're at the point where
• 57:35
  their dopamine receptor, they don't ever properly learn how
• 57:38
  to, how to think, how to be bored, how to have an
• 57:41
  imagination, how to, how to be a kid and how to, how to develop
• 57:46
  their brains in a certain way. And so that that's this next
• 57:49
  generation coming in and, and even like even me, like my, my
• 57:54
  parents were, you know, relatively good with screen
• 57:57
  time. We're like at our house where
• 57:58
  superstars on it, but my brain is fried, my dopamine receptors
• 58:04
  are fried because of the dopamine that I receive as like
• 58:07
  a 30 year old man. Like what does that do to the
• 58:11
  six year old? And and you know, it's so often
• 58:15
  like, oh, your kids crying iPad, your your toddler won't sleep
• 58:23
  show in the bed. No problem.
• 58:25
  So what does it caused? It's like, what didn't it 'cause
• 58:28
  man? Like as a result that we have a
• 58:30
  broken monetary system. We have families that can't
• 58:34
  support themselves on a single income, which forces, you know,
• 58:36
  both, you know, parents into the workforce, which removes the
• 58:40
  attention from from the child. Or reliance on the state.
• 58:42
  Yes, exactly. Like so now I'm on food stamps
• 58:44
  and, and like, you know, it's just where does, where do we
• 58:47
  end? Like we end up like Wall-e.
• 58:49
  Yeah, I mean, the, the it's it's very dark.
• 58:51
  It's we end up in slavery. Like essentially that's what it
• 58:54
  is. Like, I mean, like it it's
• 58:55
  essentially a coercive system. It's a system based on theft.
• 58:59
  Most people don't see that. And if it's a system based on
• 59:02
  theft, it needs coercion or to function.
• 59:05
  And the more theft occurs, the more tyrannical they become.
• 59:08
  Like, I remember there was this law that was passed or they
• 59:11
  tried to pass it during the infrastructure bill, and
• 59:15
  essentially it was monitoring every $600.00 transaction had to
• 59:18
  be reported to the government. Crazy.
• 59:20
  Meanwhile, Dodge is getting in there and they're just
• 59:23
  discovering all this type of misallocation and just blunt
• 59:27
  fraud, right? That no one agreed was a good
• 59:31
  idea to spend on. And, you know, essentially,
• 59:35
  they're screaming bloody murder. They're saying, like, how could
• 59:37
  you audit the government? So, like, let me get this
• 59:39
  straight. They can audit you at any
• 59:41
  moment. If not, you go to jail.
• 59:43
  But the moment you decide to say, hey, like, what are you
• 59:46
  doing with my tax dollars? Like you can't know.
• 59:49
  Who do they work for? Like who's never been installed
• 59:51
  to protect and surf? I think as long as it's a Fiat
• 59:53
  standard, it's a government by the government for the
• 59:56
  government. And I think that's really what
• 59:57
  Bitcoin fixes. It aligns incentives in society
• 1:00:00
  again. And that's a really, really
• 1:00:02
  beautiful future. And I think that's what we're
• 1:00:04
  fighting for, dude. It's crazy.
• 1:00:05
  Just quickly on that, it's crazy how politicized the Doge like
• 1:00:09
  the Department of Government facility is.
• 1:00:10
  Like it's wild to me that there are just facts like here's the
• 1:00:14
  receipts, here's the problem, here's the receipt.
• 1:00:17
  And half the country is like, how dare you?
• 1:00:20
  And it's like, regardless of who this is, like I was in in a, in
• 1:00:24
  a chat with some friends and they were, they were talking
• 1:00:26
  about this. And he was like, don't think you
• 1:00:28
  wouldn't be sceptical if it was Biden or if it was Trudeau on
• 1:00:30
  the other side of the doge. It's like, sure, be sceptical.
• 1:00:33
  But when someone comes with a receipt and says here's a fact,
• 1:00:38
  here's a problem, we got rid of it, that's a good thing.
• 1:00:41
  I don't care what your last name is, that's just a good thing.
• 1:00:43
  I, I think, I think unfortunately a, a big
• 1:00:47
  percentage of people are essentially consuming legacy
• 1:00:50
  media. And I think legacy media is able
• 1:00:52
  to paint a very, very a different narrative than what's
• 1:00:56
  happening. And if you meet someone who
• 1:00:58
  consumes legacy media as their main source versus someone who
• 1:01:01
  consumes does their own research, like on X, YouTube,
• 1:01:04
  Roma, whatever platform, Noster Protocol, they live in totally
• 1:01:07
  different realities. Yeah, man, right.
• 1:01:08
  And you can tell within yeah, within a minute they.
• 1:01:13
  Live in they live in totally, totally different realities,
• 1:01:15
  man, but the future is bright. You know Bitcoin fixes these
• 1:01:18
  things. I think it's going to be a hell
• 1:01:20
  of a fight. And last question I'll ask you,
• 1:01:23
  Adam, is what is the future of of Bitcoin?
• 1:01:26
  Well, man, like what are you planning on, you know, five
• 1:01:29
  years down the line, 10 years down the line?
• 1:01:31
  Oh, I love that. I dude, I love thinking about 10
• 1:01:34
  years down the line because that's when that's what we're
• 1:01:35
  building for. Like I think I've got, I've got
• 1:01:37
  4 kids. I've got an 8 year old, A7 year
• 1:01:39
  old, A5 year old and a three-year old.
• 1:01:41
  And when I think 10 years down the line, they're they're all
• 1:01:45
  teenagers, which is which blows my mind.
• 1:01:47
  And they're all going to need to be meaningfully interacting with
• 1:01:49
  the world and with the economy. And we're building a world where
• 1:01:53
  they never once have to think, where's my money?
• 1:01:57
  Because they have some because they're working and producing in
• 1:01:59
  the world, but also they have custody of their money, but they
• 1:02:03
  can still interact with the real world, interact with the current
• 1:02:08
  world. I know that three years ago we
• 1:02:10
  had Mahler's on stage like at the Bitcoin conference, you
• 1:02:13
  know, super jacked up. We're going to have you want to
• 1:02:16
  go to Chipotle and Walmart like you do that pay with your
• 1:02:19
  Bitcoin. It's like that's not coming to
• 1:02:20
  USA for decades. Like we are so far away from
• 1:02:24
  corporate America adopting Bitcoin in any meaningful way.
• 1:02:28
  I went to El Salvador. I was surprised at how well it
• 1:02:30
  worked, but also shocked at how little anyone knew about.
• 1:02:34
  Like, it's like, you know, listen to this Puerto Π guy,
• 1:02:37
  call him Bitcoin. I, there's my Spanish and it's
• 1:02:39
  like, get the Bitcoin phone. Someone's got to get it dusted
• 1:02:43
  off, like turn it on. Oh, it's out of batteries.
• 1:02:45
  Let's plug it. I guess it's not a good
• 1:02:46
  experience. No one's using it down there.
• 1:02:48
  And that like, you know, up until recently it was legal
• 1:02:49
  tender. It was like part of the part of
• 1:02:51
  the thing. And so we are so far away and,
• 1:02:54
  and I want to build a platform for the early adopters, for the
• 1:02:58
  ones that are class of 2030 when you're still very early in
• 1:03:02
  20-30. I firmly believe this.
• 1:03:04
  I want to build a spot for you to have to be a freedom maxi you
• 1:03:07
  like. Our mission is to enable
• 1:03:08
  independence. You should have the ability to
• 1:03:10
  hold and control your money and be able to use it.
• 1:03:14
  And you know, we're currently in this current system, we have a
• 1:03:18
  dilemma. You can either hold your money
• 1:03:20
  in cash. That's the only way you can hold
• 1:03:22
  your money or you can use your money in a bank.
• 1:03:26
  I don't know about what it what it's like here, but I know that
• 1:03:28
  I got a really hard time paying for anything in EU or in in
• 1:03:31
  Canada with cash. Like you can't buy a car with
• 1:03:33
  cash. You can't, you can't buy a
• 1:03:35
  obviously a house with cash. Like I went to the street or
• 1:03:38
  down the street from the office to buy a sandwich with a $50.00
• 1:03:40
  bill. They were like, we don't take
• 1:03:41
  50s. Like I was like, what?
• 1:03:42
  Like the sandwich is 13 bucks. You don't have $30 to give me
• 1:03:45
  back. Like this is ridiculous.
• 1:03:47
  And so when you're forced withhold your money or use your
• 1:03:49
  money, you're obviously going to choose used what because you
• 1:03:51
  can't use and it creates negative incentives.
• 1:03:54
  And so I want to build a world and a platform that allows
• 1:03:57
  people to hold and use their money.
• 1:04:00
  And that means we're a conduit to the, you know, traditional
• 1:04:04
  Fiat world. If you want to pay your credit
• 1:04:06
  cards with Bitcoin, no problem. You want to send money to your
• 1:04:08
  friend, no problem. You want to, you know, have your
• 1:04:10
  paycheck deposited and then and then buy Bitcoin and send itself
• 1:04:13
  custody, no problem. But we're doing this the hard
• 1:04:16
  way because I'm building this for my kids like, you know, the
• 1:04:19
  user growth and stuff. We're public like you, you know,
• 1:04:21
  our investors will be very unpleased if I only thought
• 1:04:23
  about the 10 years. So obviously we're, we're, we're
• 1:04:25
  working very hard to make sure that, you know, number go up in
• 1:04:27
  the short term. But at the end of the day, I'm
• 1:04:30
  building a platform that I'm going to be very proud that my
• 1:04:33
  kids use, not because, you know, daddy built it, but because it's
• 1:04:37
  just the best platform to have the ability to interact with the
• 1:04:41
  Fiat world through Bitcoin in self custody.
• 1:04:44
  Amazing, amazing. Well, Adam O'Brien, thank you so
• 1:04:47
  much for joining me on since the Bitcoin IRL.
• 1:04:49
  Appreciate it bro. Appreciate it man.