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The Impossible Challenge of Managing a Travel YouTuber · Gimbal Podcast

• 0:00
  Does Drew fly into a country as a tourist or is he a journalist?
• 0:04
  It's one of the most off-limits places in the whole world.
• 0:08
  What makes a video a Drew Binsky video?
• 0:09
  Yeah, he was banned from Syria.
• 0:11
  No way.
• 0:12
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 0:13
  What does your day-to-day look like?
• 0:15
  I just spoke to Mr.
• 0:16
  Beast.
• 0:17
  I need to get on a plane to Brazil right now.
• 0:20
  My guest today is the production manager for Drew Binsky,
• 0:24
  a creator with 1.2 billion views and 6 million subscribers.
• 0:29
  AJ, how did you first get a job working with Drew Binsky?
• 0:33
  So I was living in New York City and I had recently graduated.
• 0:38
  I was a creative writing major, but I have always loved travel and I was a fan of Drew and I decided that I was going to go to Russia.
• 0:49
  I wanted to do the Trans-Siberian Railway for New Year's.
• 0:54
  Oh, yes.
• 0:55
  I've seen this.
• 0:56
  It looks incredible.
• 0:57
  The longest railway in the world or something like that?
• 1:00
  Arguably, yes.
• 1:01
  And I realized that, oh, one of my favorite creators,
• 1:05
  Drabinsky, is also doing the Trans-Siberian.
• 1:08
  No way.
• 1:09
  And he had posted an Instagram story.
• 1:13
  Does anybody know of a local guide or friend or fixer
• 1:18
  in this random Siberian city?
• 1:20
  And I swiped up and I was like, as a matter of fact,
• 1:24
  I just passed through this place and I met this local friend and she might be able to help you
• 1:30
  out.
• 1:31
  And he just responded, thanks.
• 1:33
  That was it.
• 1:34
  And then I got home to New York and a couple
• 1:36
  months later, he posted a story saying that he wanted to hire a producer.
• 1:41
  And at this point,
• 1:42
  it's really just Drew and his camera.
• 1:45
  And that's it.
• 1:46
  What year is this?
• 1:47
  How long ago?
• 1:48
  2021, 2022, I was one of his first hires.
• 1:51
  And now our team is about 20 to 25, 30 people.
• 1:55
  We've scaled a lot since then.
• 1:57
  And I do.
• 1:58
  I like to think the production quality has increased since then.
• 2:02
  And we have so many editors working on both long form and short form content.
• 2:08
  And they're global.
• 2:09
  Our team is all over the world.
• 2:12
  Can you break down the like who's on your team?
• 2:15
  Obviously, you have Drew Binsky.
• 2:16
  He's the creator.
• 2:17
  He's been making YouTube videos for 10 years.
• 2:20
  We also have three or four US based editors.
• 2:25
  And you know, these are the guys that I work very closely with.
• 2:29
  They're cutting the main channel videos that you watch, crafting structure, deleting scenes, moving scenes around, adding voiceover, and then it gets passed to the next guy who puts on the finishing touches.
• 2:43
  and one of our guys, the person in LA,
• 2:46
  he's our graphics wizard.
• 2:48
  This is my core team,
• 2:50
  but there's a whole another operation that's happening
• 2:54
  that I'm less involved in.
• 2:56
  We have a number of editors in the Philippines.
• 3:01
  They are focused on everything.
• 3:04
  They do everything.
• 3:04
  Short form and Facebook and trailers and Instagram.
• 3:09
  What are the other non-editors do?
• 3:12
  Well, we have an executive assistant who is booking flights and who is functioning as a de facto HR.
• 3:19
  And we have people who ideate, who work on conceptualization and scouring the Internet for, you know, freak ideas and, you know, interesting cultures, shocking rituals that we want to learn more about.
• 3:35
  we have editors working on second channel and that's uh drew is famous for his ten dollar show
• 3:40
  you know what can ten dollars get you in afghanistan what can ten dollars get you in taiwan
• 3:45
  um and people really love that so our second channel is kind of geared towards that and it's
• 3:51
  taken on various forms over the years we at one point in time we were working on a podcast
• 3:57
  at one point in time we had a kids channel the kids geography and i i think right now there's
• 4:03
  like a tennis channel in the works.
• 4:05
  And at one point in time, there was a golf channel like
• 4:08
  golfing in other countries.
• 4:09
  And is this all rooted in what Drew's interested in?
• 4:12
  Like,
• 4:12
  is he interested in golf and tennis to the point where he's like, Yeah, I'm gonna make content
• 4:16
  around this now?
• 4:17
  100% That's what it is.
• 4:18
  Yeah.
• 4:19
  And then I'm like, I love it.
• 4:20
  Maybe and I'm like,
• 4:21
  maybe we shouldn't do this.
• 4:22
  And but he's like, No, and, and, and, but he's passionate about that.
• 4:26
  And if he wants to do it, you know, we have the editors to pull it off.
• 4:31
  And the audience too.
• 4:32
  So
• 4:33
  That's awesome.
• 4:34
  Okay, so you among this entire team, you are the production manager.
• 4:38
  I've also
• 4:39
  heard that you're the producer.
• 4:40
  It sounds like you're also creative director.
• 4:42
  I mean, it sounds
• 4:43
  like you cover a lot of things like what are your main responsibilities?
• 4:47
  What's your what does your
• 4:47
  day to day look like?
• 4:49
  I would like to say writing voiceover and revising voiceover.
• 4:54
  At the end of
• 4:55
  the day, I do consider myself a writer.
• 4:58
  And when these editors are crafting their stories,
• 5:02
  ultimately, the voiceover is what ties these narratives together.
• 5:07
  When I'm not writing
• 5:09
  voiceover, I'm giving feedback to the editors on frame, that is a very involved process,
• 5:16
  you know, it can be easy, it can be easy to lose track of who's working on what and how far along
• 5:21
  long are we and what needs to be recorded and what has been turned over to dubs and what's the
• 5:25
  still needs color we have a colorist and what and you know what needs graphics myself and drew were
• 5:31
  the ones critiquing these cuts nobody else on the team is really giving feedback or creative
• 5:37
  direction i mean sometimes we'll have our executive head in bali who she she'll hop in and add a sound
• 5:44
  effect here delete this scene move this scene around you know working in the weeds of structure
• 5:49
  structure is a question that i'm dying to ask you about because when you're traveling you
• 5:53
  you go into it with best intentions but you never know exactly what you're going to get who you're
• 5:58
  going to meet you know what stories to follow and pursue do you know the storyline or does it unfold
• 6:03
  and then it's your job in post to piece it all together we know the title and we know the thumbnail
• 6:09
  going going into it and that's usually the extent however it really depends uh on a case by case
• 6:19
  basis.
• 6:20
  There have been videos in which I have done a lot of pre-production and what that looks like
• 6:28
  is writing the intro voiceover in advance so Drew has it and can record it to camera and then
• 6:36
  write act one, do this, act two, do this, visit this school.
• 6:42
  Sometimes I will outline for Drew
• 6:45
  What is the mission of this video?
• 6:47
  I'm on a mission to meet XYZ.
• 6:49
  I'm on a mission to deliver these supplies to this tribe and explore this aspect of their way of life.
• 6:55
  I wanted to go back and you mentioned earlier that, you know, if you have like a yearly cadence, like what is kind of like what is going on throughout the year?
• 7:02
  Well, the first truth is that Drew is always, always traveling.
• 7:07
  He is based in Arizona.
• 7:09
  And then during the summer months, he is based in Prague.
• 7:13
  And our camera person is also based in Prague.
• 7:17
  And it is true that Drew likes to batch shoot.
• 7:21
  So if he knows he's going to be traveling in South America, then he's going to try to film as many videos as possible on that trip.
• 7:31
  And, you know, then he'll come home to Arizona and he'll rest a while because, you know, we have all these videos in the pipeline.
• 7:38
  The editors have something to work on.
• 7:41
  How many videos might you have from like one shoot trip?
• 7:44
  I would say four to eight.
• 7:47
  And all of them are planned or some of them kind of just happen?
• 7:51
  they're all planned i mean at least at least generally um do you handle the production side
• 7:56
  of things as well are you someone who is working with local fixers governments even yes i will work
• 8:05
  with local fixers and i will search for local fixers if drew doesn't already have someone in
• 8:12
  country a or b in terms of um governments we do work with governments and we do work with airlines
• 8:20
  in the cases of tourism boards who would like to sponsor us.
• 8:26
  But we have a whole nother team or Drew has a whole nother team working with brands for sponsorships.
• 8:33
  Does Drew fly into a country as a tourist or is he a journalist?
• 8:38
  Do you need certain visa requirements to be an official production?
• 8:43
  That's a great question.
• 8:45
  And he actually got in trouble.
• 8:49
  I believe it was in Syria because he traveled to Syria on a tourist visa, but they considered him a journalist because of the YouTube videos, which, by the way, I think is such an interesting dynamic in the sense that, you know, a couple of years ago, like if you told somebody you were a YouTube, a YouTuber like that would not be considered journalism.
• 9:18
  But actually, well, but according to the Syrian government at the time, we were journalists.
• 9:23
  So I find that whole dynamic really interesting.
• 9:26
  Yeah, he was banned from Syria.
• 9:28
  Because yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 9:31
  Because of a visa, because of the visa situation that I just explained, he only recently returned, because the Assad regime collapsed, and there was this window.
• 9:46
  And this is when you got to be plugged into like the travel community that there's like people who like to do extreme travel.
• 9:53
  Like there was this window when the Assad regime collapsed, when you could literally just go to Syria with like a lot less restrictions because the government was in transition and the borders were kind of like open.
• 10:10
  That was Syria was crazy.
• 10:13
  What kind of gear do you travel with?
• 10:15
  And then second part of that question, what is it like filming while you're traveling?
• 10:19
  We're big on only carry-on bags.
• 10:22
  And he has two backpacks.
• 10:24
  And one is his clothes,
• 10:27
  and the other is all his gear, whether it's a drone or hard drives.
• 10:31
  And in terms of my personal
• 10:33
  gear, I mean, I travel pretty lightly.
• 10:36
  But our editors, obviously, they've got double monitors
• 10:40
  and the whole shebang.
• 10:41
  And we're shipping drives all across the world to our editors in the
• 10:44
  Philippines and the US.
• 10:46
  And it's an operation.
• 10:48
  Over the course of your time working with Drew, like how have you guys improved in the past few years?
• 10:53
  What are things that you used to do that you don't do anymore or things that you've learned that you do more of?
• 10:57
  The obvious choice would be thumbnails.
• 11:01
  I mean, if you just scroll back and look at some of our thumbnails, they're almost laughable, but almost heartwarming in a way, because you think about how our roots and how this all started and Drew just personally.
• 11:15
  I do believe we are trying to update some of these older thumbnails and, you know, repopulate them.
• 11:22
  That's an ongoing process.
• 11:24
  That's another aspect of our team.
• 11:27
  We have a thumbnail designer and we have people who draft the thumbnails and all kinds of people involved in that conversation.
• 11:36
  How else have we improved?
• 11:38
  I mean, I think just in terms of narrative storytelling, the videos are now like documentary productions versus earlier videos, which are very vloggy.
• 11:49
  And there's nothing wrong with a vlog.
• 11:51
  But we recently released a video about Ukraine.
• 11:55
  I got nominated for a Webby, didn't it?
• 11:57
  Wow.
• 11:58
  Thanks.
• 11:59
  Yeah.
• 12:00
  There you go.
• 12:00
  Congratulations.
• 12:01
  Huge.
• 12:02
  You're tuned in, I guess.
• 12:03
  We got nominated in news and politics category, which we really don't consider ourselves to be that.
• 12:10
  That was a great moment for everybody.
• 12:12
  Everybody on the team was so stoked.
• 12:14
  And obviously that was a really important story to tell.
• 12:18
  What's kind of like critical to this is a Drew Binsky video?
• 12:22
  Like what makes a video a Drew Binsky video?
• 12:24
  When I was a fan before he had a team, what I looked for was raw, unfiltered contact with a person or a place that I can only imagine in my dreams.
• 12:40
  And that kind of sense of adventure on the road, I think movement is very important.
• 12:46
  That's a note I'm always giving.
• 12:48
  We stand still for too long in this scene.
• 12:50
  Let's move on.
• 12:52
  And I encourage Drew when he's filming or interviewing somebody, like, don't just stand there or sit down, like, walk and talk, like, movement is good.
• 12:59
  And I think a Drew Binsky video inherently has that sense of movement.
• 13:04
  You know, the story is in motion.
• 13:05
  I think there's something very charismatic about Drew and something very loving.
• 13:11
  And I think people realize that and appreciate that in the sense that I may be a very opinionated person, but when it comes to Drew making videos about these different countries and cultures and governments and economies and landscapes, he's just trying to show it as it is and you can form your own opinion.
• 13:32
  And he's constantly saying, like, we all smile in the same language.
• 13:37
  You know, we all bleed red.
• 13:38
  Like, I think he truly believes that, like, there's we have more in common than what separates us.
• 13:45
  And I think he's always thinking about that no matter what he's filming.
• 13:49
  It's cool to be a part of that.
• 13:51
  Back to the thumbnails again.
• 13:52
  So you said you you go into a video with at least like the thumbnail and the title.
• 13:57
  What is that process like coming up with those?
• 13:59
  Well, we have a master spreadsheet that we are constantly pouring over and that has the videos that are being edited, the videos that are upcoming to be filmed and and then just ideas.
• 14:12
  And Drew has taken it from the other creators that he's friends with.
• 14:18
  And and a lot of a lot of these major YouTubers, they begin with title title and thumbnail.
• 14:23
  And if I I tend to think more in terms of destination and story.
• 14:27
  So like, I'll pitch him like an awesome idea in the east of Russia.
• 14:32
  And he'll be like, what's the title though?
• 14:34
  And we have the spreadsheet and each and these ideas for videos.
• 14:38
  I mean, we have like 20 titles like that we can choose from and that we're constantly workshopping.
• 14:43
  In terms of thumbnails, you know, we draft them, we draft the idea, and then we design it and we match it to the thumbnail and we do A-B testing and all of that to know how we're going to package the video before we actually film it.
• 14:57
  Does it ever change?
• 14:58
  Like you go in with this title and thumbnail and then you come out like that doesn't work anymore?
• 15:03
  Yeah, all the time.
• 15:04
  I mean, it depends on the A-B testing, but also just how we're feeling in the moment.
• 15:09
  What I like about our team is like, yeah, I guess you could say I'm a creative director alongside Drew, but like our editors also have like a lot of creative control and we really value their thoughts as well because they're the ones doing the magic here.
• 15:24
  I mean, they're amazing.
• 15:25
  So, I mean, if they don't like a title, like we want to hear that and we'll listen to them if they feel that, you know, we're packaging the video the wrong way.
• 15:33
  We also want to be sensitive if, you know, a video is controversial.
• 15:38
  But at the same time, we do want to make sure the title and thumbnail stands out.
• 15:42
  So it's it's drama.
• 15:43
  It's it's a lot of back and forth.
• 15:47
  So I have two more questions.
• 15:48
  My first question is regarding Drew's recent appearance on a Mr.
• 15:55
  Beast video.
• 15:56
  Your team also got a video out of it as well, which is great.
• 16:00
  What was that experience like from a production standpoint, from a communication standpoint, working with the largest channel on YouTube?
• 16:06
  It was incredibly last minute.
• 16:09
  I got a phone call from Drew and he's like, I just spoke to Mr.
• 16:13
  Beast.
• 16:14
  I need to get on a plane to Brazil right now.
• 16:17
  And I'm like, OK, great.
• 16:19
  And what do you want me to what do you want me to do?
• 16:23
  And he's like, I don't know.
• 16:26
  but we always wanted to tell this story of Snake Island in Brazil.
• 16:32
  It's one of the most off-limits places in the whole world,
• 16:36
  but getting access to that place is like near impossible,
• 16:40
  even for somebody like Drew.
• 16:41
  But Mr.
• 16:42
  Beast pulled it off.
• 16:44
  So Drew hopped on a flight very last minute to be a part of Jimmy's video.
• 16:48
  A lot of these major YouTubers are feeling very confident
• 16:53
  in the sense that they pose a very real threat to Hollywood and traditional cinema.
• 17:00
  And I think it
• 17:01
  excites them.
• 17:02
  And why wouldn't it?
• 17:04
  I mean, when YouTube is like the number one app on TV, and
• 17:08
  when like half of our views are coming from the TV, like that's crazy.
• 17:12
  When you think about our
• 17:13
  audience, I mean, it really does feel like I'm in the right spot versus, you know, my friends who
• 17:19
  in the gig economy and jumping from shoot to shoot to shoot.
• 17:22
  And there's a lot more bureaucracy and
• 17:24
  hoops to jump through.
• 17:26
  And I love cinema and I love film and it's my background.
• 17:30
  I love movies.
• 17:31
  I love going to the theater.
• 17:32
  But I think Drew and Mr.
• 17:35
  Beast, as I heard in that conversation,
• 17:37
  I mean, they're they're very excited for the future of YouTube.
• 17:40
  And I think YouTube is even
• 17:41
  going to start introducing shows is a new update.
• 17:44
  So we're talking about that.
• 17:46
  And and it's it's
• 17:47
  It's like really cool to be like a production manager on a channel that is growing and has
• 17:54
  and has longevity.
• 17:55
  Let's circle back in five years and see where where things stand.
• 17:58
  But it's pretty cool.
• 17:59
  I am equally excited about the future of YouTube.
• 18:02
  I think we're just getting started.
• 18:03
  AJ, my last question for you is who is a creator that is on your radar right now?
• 18:09
  Like who's someone you really like?
• 18:11
  Can I bounce it to a production manager that's on my radar?
• 18:14
  I would love that, actually.
• 18:16
  That sounds fantastic.
• 18:17
  Please.
• 18:17
  There is a creator named Jesse James West and his production manager, who is also named Jesse, Jesse Crim, has really impressed me with her drive, but also her community building.
• 18:33
  For the longest time, I felt like I was working in like my own little bubble and I've become friends and I've networked and there's a sense of solidarity.
• 18:43
  So, yeah, shout out to Jesse Crim at Jesse James West.
• 18:46
  I definitely think more producers are worthy of having their name put out there, hence why this show exists in the first place.
• 18:53
  So you really struck a chord.
• 18:55
  And it was a pleasure meeting you and hearing your story and everything that you had to say working with Drew Binsky.
• 19:01
  Thank you for being on the show.
• 19:02
  Thank you so much.
• 19:04
  Thank you very much for watching this episode.
• 19:06
  If you liked it, please consider subscribing or leaving us a review on the audio platforms.
• 19:10
  Thank you to everyone on my team.
• 19:11
  Thank you to AJ for the interview.
• 19:13
  And if you want to see another episode, please go check us out on YouTube, Apple, Spotify, and see who we've interviewed.
• 19:20
  Also, if you're someone who works for a channel that has over a million subscribers, we want to hear from you.
• 19:25
  So please consider reaching out and maybe you will be someone that we interview in the near future.
• 19:30
  See ya.