Latest / Smart Business Growth with Nicky Miklós / The Shocking Truth: Why Only 24% of Australians Have a Will with Mary-Ann de Mestre

Transcript

The Shocking Truth: Why Only 24% of Australians Have a Will with Mary-Ann de Mestre · Smart Business Growth with Nicky Miklós

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Thrive in Business Together with Nikki and Ness.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: We would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of country, the Yagara and Bunarong people of Brisbane and Melbourne, respectively, where Nikki and I both work and live.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Now do we have something a little bit different for you today?
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Mary-anne De Maastre is a highly motivated speaker with over 14 years in the legal sphere, not only as a practising solicitor but also an academic and a contributor.
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: She works with groups, individuals and organisations to empower and educate them to take control of not only their personal estate planning but also their business succession planning.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: Now, if you're in business, you probably understand the business succession planning part, but for those of us who aren't familiar with the term estate planning or have some idea of it a vague idea of it, but perhaps avoiding it Mary-Anne is here to break the myths, to dispel the myths and to help us understand the importance that we have of taking control of our circumstances into the future when we're no longer here.
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: She comes with some amazing and sobering and shocking statistics with her because she is an academic and she teaches this at uni.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: We have a fantastic discussion about breaking cycles and really talking about the things that aren't talked about enough.
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: So it's a little bit left of centre to our normal kind of topic, but it is so relevant to everybody, particularly women and particularly women business owners.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: I know you are going to love it.
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: Enjoy, mary-anne.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: When you sent through an email to us in preparation for today, there was one particular lot of stats that jumped out at me and shocked me a little bit, to be honest, and it was the study by Graham Welle Project that showed less than a quarter.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: So 24% of Australians have prepared a will, about 13% have completed a superannuation death benefits nomination, 12% have appointed an enduring power of attorney and only a mere 10% had sought financial advice.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: Now, as our listeners our regular listeners, will know, wealth creation and looking at making sure that our businesses are sustainable and we set ourselves up for financial success.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: This kind of shocked me a little bit that as a population, we're not being proactive around this kind of stuff, and I wonder what look.
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: To be honest, it's probably only been I'm 53 and it's probably only been in the last few years.
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: That has even come up in my mind as a thing.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: I've just started working with a financial advisor and I wish I had have done this so many years ago.
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: So what is it that you see?
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: Or, through your experience that you notice.
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: What is it that contributes to these stats, which are pretty horrifying really?
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: I know.
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: When I was preparing for speaking with you, I enjoyed looking up the updated stats and it is shocking when you first look at it.
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: So just to repeat that only 24% of Australians have a will.
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: That's crazy if you think about the size of our population.
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: Now there was a newspaper article that was floating around about the amount of inheritance that's likely to pass through.
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: So trillions of dollars up until 2050.
• 3:27
  Speaker 3: That's going to pass through generations.
• 3:30
  Speaker 3: So I think from me in practice, a lot of people say hey, I need to get around to doing a will.
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: Hey, that's a good idea, I hadn't thought of that, but they struggle to get themselves organized.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: They struggle to get it together.
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: For me it's like going to the dentist.
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: I hate the dentist, I put it off, I do it and then I'm relieved.
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: So I think it really is.
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: Most people know what a will is, so everyone has that understanding.
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: It's the process and the mystery around how do we go about preparing a will and what is estate planning and what do we need?
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: So for me, in practice, we often get a number of questions that are where do I start?
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: Who do I talk to?
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: Do you need a lawyer?
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: Can you still go to the post office and get the post office will.
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: The version of that now for Generation Y is electronic will, so that's becoming a really big thing.
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: At the moment People always think, oh, is it going to cost me thousands of dollars, it's too expensive, I'm not going to do it, it's not a priority for me for the financial year.
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: So for me the educational part of it is to try and help answer those questions, to give people confidence, to say hey, it's not really that hard.
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: Most people, once they walk out the door, think, hey, I should have done that sooner.
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: And you've covered it.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: There's so many myths out there around the cost, but I guess we've got to really weigh that off.
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: With what are we investing elsewhere?
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: How much money are we spending on things that don't have as bigger impact on our family, our immediate family, when we're gone?
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: And so I think this is such a relevant topic to bring up for people who run their own businesses, like everyone, but particularly if you have your own business, because that's another legal entity, and so if we if I think about it my two children are 21 and 19, if I were to die, there's so much complication if I don't have something legally in place for them, and it feels like something that I've only really started to consider and think about.
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: It's a closer I get to to death, no to retirement and things like that.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: So I think it's such an important topic to be talking to our children about, and, as business owners, I really think it's a personal responsibility that, along with all the other legal things we need to do, we really need to be thinking about it.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: So how would you sum up estate planning?
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: Because that could be that that phrase itself can be offputting, because people don't know what that means, yeah, exactly, Exactly.
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: I feel that and that's where people get stumped up.
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: I think that sounds really complicated.
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: You hear all the juicy, controversial cases in the news and I think, having that TV series succession, people think, oh, it's juicy and it's controversial and dark and mysterious.
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: But it's really not.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: And if you're looking at it from the legal entity and the business perspective, you want to make sure that someone can step in your shoes.
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: Heaven forbid if something happened to you, Ness.
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: So it's really you've got to think of it, of okay, if I'm not here, who's going to step in and who's going to make sure that my business is either still running or sold?
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: And then, from a personal perspective, the estate planning really is okay.
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: Do I have a will?
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: It can just be a simple document.
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: Who do I want to get my assets and who's going to take care of my kids?
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: That's the main thing in your will.
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: Then you would look at a power of attorney.
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: So who can make financial decisions for you?
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: Heaven forbid, you become incapacitated.
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: So what do I mean by incapacitated?
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: Tragically, you're in a car accident, You're suffering from a terminal illness.
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: You want to make sure that someone can access your funds on your behalf, sign contracts, act as you in a financial way should something happen to you.
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: And then, finally, a guardianship.
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: So that's medical decisions the same thing.
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: So if you're in a tragic accident, you want to make sure that you have someone that has the legal authority to make health decisions for you.
• 7:19
  Speaker 3: It's more relevant now with privacy law, Ness, if you tried to ring on behalf of your partner to get some medical information, you'll be stopped in your tracks because privacy law will say no, you can't, unless you've got that guardianship document and you can step in that foot.
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: So that's really what I would say for a estate planning, Just very simple.
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: It doesn't need to be that complicated.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: You've got your three documents your will, your power of attorney and your guardianship.
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: And then, from a business perspective, considering I'm that legal entity who is going to step in my shoes and do I need a company power of attorney?
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: Well, when you put it like that, I do feel like it's breaking down a bit of a stigma around this whole fancy estate planning succession.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: Totally.
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: It's really not.
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: I'm glad that people think it's that we're very intelligent.
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: It must require someone that has.
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: It's really not it once you distill it down to that.
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: It's a couple of documents.
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: It doesn't have to be fancy.
• 8:13
  Speaker 3: I mean, I was a tip staff to Justice Lindsay and he's the pro-bed and protective judge.
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: He listens to the cases that are challenged on wills and his advice over and over again to me was simple is best.
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: So simple is best.
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: What is the purpose?
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: Why are you doing it?
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: And simple is best, and I think that is all you need to answer.
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: I think that's a really valuable insight and quite comforting as well, going into something that maybe isn't our area of expertise, but I think also what I want to touch on in a moment around that is, actually we need to be aware of what is the consequence, because I think all of that there's a couple of aspects around this, around the practicality, the logistically doing.
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: It can feel overwhelming if we don't know what we're doing and the reality is it means that we're facing the truth of our own mortality.
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: People want to avoid the fact that we're all going to die and guess what?
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: There's one thing that's guaranteed in life people it's going to happen.
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: There is no guarantee of how long we're going to be here, and I feel like as a society, we have to have more real conversations around this.
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: And look, I speak totally honestly.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: I need to get my Sorted as well in this and it's funny because something can happen.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: Funny, but something can happen.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: We lose loved ones and I need to get this together.
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: I need to do it, and then still somehow I'm looking back on our jewels.
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: We need to have a conversation after this podcast.
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: I'm going to my wife, jewels, and saying we need to get this sorted right.
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: So there's a mortality we have to face.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: We have to have uncomfortable conversations, maybe thoughts and feelings, and that doesn't feel great.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: So we've got to step through that.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: So I wonder just a little bit what are the consequences if we don't?
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: You alluded a little bit to that in a couple of instances, but actually what could go wrong if we don't get this sorted?
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: I need a bit of fear put in me.
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, fair enough, and I'm happy to do that for you.
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: Gosh, what have I done?
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: Okay, good cop, bad cop, and we come at you from different angles.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: But interestingly for me it's hard when you're doing it day to day and you're sitting on the other side of the table.
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: But I had a close family friend pass away over the Christmas holidays and that was that gave me a bit of compassion and empathy in terms of estate planning and he was 89, so he lived a very good life, very healthy.
• 10:33
  Speaker 3: It was very sudden, so it was quite a shock.
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: He left a wife, adult children and a lot of grandchildren.
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: So that's a really good case scenario to look at what would happen if he didn't have a wheel in place.
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: He was a lawyer himself, he had a business, so there's all these intermittent Assets, children, grandchildren, etc.
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: So for me it was a bit more of an awakening almost to realize that when you're sitting on the other side is the client and someone's passed away.
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: How to deal with an address and be a bit more comfortable with death when you presented with it interestingly covered, and the pandemic forced a lot of people to have to be dealing with the idea of mortality and sickness, and so we saw quite an uptick in people thinking okay, I really need to get my affairs in order, because you're seeing on the news the tick tick of how many people are passing away and all the pictures of people then.
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: But I think it going back to the question of what are the consequences for you, nikki, and to slap you on the wrist to do it because I also don't have kids, so that also doesn't motivate me.
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: You have a partner and I love a pet.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: I have two beloved pet.
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: I'm having one of them right now.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: He's leaning into me, little Eddie, yes.
• 11:46
  Speaker 3: Some of them with this fun that we do for the students and also on our social media, is whether or not your pets can inherit your estate.
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: So that's quite an interesting question, very topical.
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: I'll give you a fun fact that we did it in class in New South Wales.
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: Your pet can actually inherit your estate, but you can set up a maintenance, trust and other things to make sure that your beloveds are taking care of.
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: In the US there have been so she pet was a pet that received $300 million from Karl Lagerfeld and we use that as a case sample in class.
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Wow, so unfortunately we're not as progressive as the US.
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: But that, nikki, that's probably your target point.
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: It would be what's going to happen to your partner, yeah, and your beloved pets.
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, yep, true, okay, you hooked me, it was.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: It was Eddie and Oscar in the end.
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: Eddie and Oscar and Jules and Jules third but Eddie and Oscar and then Jules.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: but it's not just that episode.
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: It's not if you have, if you had children as well.
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: The statistics now on blended families I can pull them up in a minute.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: We can come back to it and the rate of divorce it's now the most common family dynamic is a blended family.
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: A partner has children from another marriage.
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: Who is taking care of the kids?
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: And, I think, a lot of people.
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: That's the driving force.
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: I want to make sure that X or Y are the person that has my kids and you want to have that.
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: Say same with beneficiaries.
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: Time and time again we have clients in the grandparents level that come in and say look, I want to make sure my kids get the stuff that I have grown and I want to make sure that my grandchildren are the ones that benefit.
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: I don't want anyone else to benefit.
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: So I think if you don't sit down and actually have that discussion and think about it, you run the risk of who's going to challenge and who else is in the zoo that's going to have a look at what I've built throughout my life.
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: And, I think, within control, I want to go on.
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: That's right, and what I hear within that is, by not having your affairs in order, you're actually putting a lot of stress on those loved ones that are grieving your loss and then also having to navigate the Legality of having to figure out what to do next if you haven't got your affairs in order.
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: It doesn't matter children, pets, partner, no partner.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: It's still something that's really important for us to be considering, because it then becomes what we want yes to someone else making a decision for us.
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: Yes, that's right.
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: We want to have your say as to where you've spent.
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: If we look at the statistics on life expectancy, this statistic for women is about 85 years.
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: You're spending that time presumably working and growing your nest egg for those around you.
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: You want to make sure that they receive it.
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: Why are we going to spend all this time up until that age of retirement Slogging it out and making sure we're building that savings and everything and building our assets, to then decide who cares who it goes to?
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: I'm dead.
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: I respect those that are happy to just say stuff that I'm not.
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a really.
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: I think this is a very important thing.
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: I really hope that our listeners and I know I am taking so much from this conversation to just go.
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: Actually, I need to suck it up and do it.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: Yes, I'm.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: I've gone on a journey the last few years Facing my mortality, so that that part I'm all good with that.
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: Are you stuck in the busy trap on juggle street being all things to all people despite having a team?
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: Or perhaps your business is feeling chaotic?
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: Do the mini business health check to get 10 strategies in under 10 minutes so you can get time, freedom back, experience peak performance and finally Leverage smart growth in your business.
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: Head over to b2businesstogethercomau forward slash health check and, if you're ready for us to help in a more hands-on way, email us at hello at business together comm today.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: You and we'll set up a time to chat.
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: What's the first step?
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: What do I do?
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: What's the first step here?
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: I know we're jumping, I'm jumping ahead, but I'm keen.
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: What action do I need to take?
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: How do I get this sorted?
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: What's the first thing I need to do?
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: I think my first step would be having a conversation with your partner, your significant other, and say, hey, look, if something Happened to you or I, what do we want to do with our assets?
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: How do we want to divvied up Ness with kids?
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: So what do you want to do for the kids?
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: How do you want to make sure that they're maintained and taken care of?
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: What will happen to the house and the family home, nikki, for you, for your beloved pets, how do I make sure that they're taken care of if they're going to be here past me?
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: Because the hope is both of you live to the life expectancy of 85 and onwards.
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: But, as I experienced over the Christmas holidays with my family friend, people can pass away in their sleep Unexpectedly, and you don't expect it to be you, but it happens.
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: So we have to really think about now Planning for the unexpected.
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: So have that conversation, say, hey, how do we want to deal with this?
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: What do you have a specific preference in terms of if you do pass away?
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: Do you want a funeral?
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: Do I've had all sorts of things?
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: I've had that.
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: We can get into more.
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: But if you want to Scattering your ashes over the sea, having an Irish party at the Irish pub, if you're so inclined.
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: Marie folio.
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: I saw her a few years ago and she said that she has a savings account.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: She's put money away and it is for a kick-ass, huge, amazing party.
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: And.
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: I love that idea.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: I'm like, yes, yeah, I have a big party.
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: I might get.
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: FOMO, but I won't even realize that I'm looking down at everyone, let's say it's the tradition of black ride and that's that significant color of death and remorse, and I understand the significance around that.
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: But I have had clients that have said, look, we want color.
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: I don't want anyone to wear black, I want everyone in bright colors.
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: It's a celebration of my life.
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: I don't want it to be a morning, so for me, that's how I've always taken succession law to be.
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: It's a should be a celebration of your life, your hard work, the things that you have built, your legacy for your family.
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: That's how I see it, but I'm a minority still, so my job is shouting to the rooftop saying, hey, let's try and celebrate it.
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: Can I just jump in quickly there, because I know next you'll have so much to say around this.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: But what I love about that is we talk a lot in business.
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: Don't just have a revenue target.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: What's the meaning behind it?
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: It make it something that feels Exciting and fun might be about people or impact.
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: That is exactly what you've just said.
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: There we're turning something that, in my lens, is boring and yeah, I'm like, oh, I've got to do this to go.
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, hang on a second, this actually could be fun, and now I'm much more enticed to take that action.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: So I think that's a really cool way.
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: And look some of our listeners.
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: They might already have some of this set up.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: Statistically, 24% of them will, and the rest of us.
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: But also I guess it's challenging.
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: How often do we need?
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: You were changed right, so if you've done this 10 years ago, maybe we need to do it again.
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: So that's a good question.
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: So usually the advice is every five or so years.
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: It's usually with major life events.
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: So birth, death, divorce, inheritance that's really when you would look at it again and it may be.
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: The way it works now is everyone gets emails.
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: You might just quickly look at it.
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: Takes five minutes to say hey, I made this 10 years ago.
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: Still looks relevant.
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: Nothing's changed.
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: We'll put it back in the filing cabinet.
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: But usually within that five, ten year bracket something's bound to have happened.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: It's funny because I'm actually going through the process of updating my will right now and I thought I had one from recently and I realized actually it was from 2009 and Just separated, wasn't divorced.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: My kids were young, so I was.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: It was all about I still had a wedding dress and an engagement ring back Then which I was gonna leave to my daughter.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: That's long gone.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: I had I had to put in who was gonna look after the kids if we'd both.
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: I had to put in I Specifically don't leave anything to my ex-husband.
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: I had to.
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: You know, I just saw it who would be my Medical and my financial power of attorneys, because it couldn't be the children then and now that they're adults, I'm wanting to get that updated to have it be them.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Side note, I do want people wear black, but it's got to be black and bling to my oh yeah, I like that.
• 19:58
  Speaker 3: I haven't heard.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: So that's my.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: I don't think that goes in a will, but I'm telling all my family, so surely someone will get the memo, because I think that goes in the will, pop it in the will.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: You've got a fun way to get that.
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you can say that's my wish, I like that.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: So these are the kinds of things that just the reality of gosh.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: That was such a long time ago and things have changed a lot.
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: And I would imagine into the future, if I repartner, I will definitely be wanting to make sure my children yeah looked after and and obviously, if they, if my partner has children, that their children are looked after, and I think that these Questions beyond just running your own business, but it's really about what are we working for?
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: Exactly what you said before Correct, so important to get done.
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: And I guess the other thing that comes up for me, too, is the luxury and I call it a luxury that we have as women, to be able to make this choice now, because another one of the stats that you sent us through was in 1965.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: And that is only five years before I was born Women had got the legal right to drink in a bar.
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: Truly, wtf, yeah.
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: That's the stat that you picked up on, I know.
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: I know you can drink at the bar.
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: Yes, I want to drink at a bar, thank goodness, and.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: I can go and drink at a bar on a Friday night is because something happened you know, that is not very long ago now and it just.
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: It blows my mind when I hear stats like that, because we are in such a better position as women to be able to take control of our finances, to take control of our choices around what we want to happen whilst we're alive and after we pass, and the gratitude that we have around women before us who broke the cycle and said this has got to change.
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: And Nikki, I know that you have a great story around.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: It's not a great story, but you have a relevant story about this with your grandma.
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, again thank you for shedding the light on some of these statistics, Marianne.
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: And the first thing I thought as well looking at some of these stats even 1969, equal pay right, that's not it.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: That's not it.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: Actually, that's a whole other conversation.
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: Equal pay rate, Like the concept of, the concept of.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: In 1969, crazy.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: So my grandmother and some of you will have heard this.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: She came over to Australia in 1956, and she fled the Hungarian Revolution.
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: Her husband was in Hungary.
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: She fled him as well as the war.
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: So she was over here as a single woman and she could not just even buy.
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: Obviously she was a refugee, but she couldn't lease a room, she couldn't rent a room in her own name, but she didn't have a husband, she didn't have a boyfriend.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: So I remember her telling she's still alive.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: She's a staunch woman, that one.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: So she would tell me stories that she had to actually rely on the stranger kindness of a strange man, like a man that she didn't even really know had to sign the lease for her Sign the lease so she could live there.
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: I just think of that and go.
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: That's so dangerous.
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: Was the safety in that?
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: She doesn't go into any other detail around the guy or who.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: It's just such a different world and this is.
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: These are our moms and our grandmothers.
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: This is.
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: We are breaking cycles.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: Just the three of us having this conversation, the women and men and non-binary people listening now, are breaking cycles and it is astounding to me when we're reminded, when I'm reminded how recently a lot of these statistics and it's not just women, the LGBTQI plus statistics.
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: In 1980, I think, it was still illegal to be in the same sex with a married relationship not marriage.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Forget about that.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: That was just a few years ago, right Like that was the year I was born.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: So over to you as the expert, because I'm a little bit speechless still Every time I'm reminded of these stats.
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: So where to start.
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: So it always pops up for me, like I love Oscar Wilde and I have since I was a little girl, and there was a quote that he said, and I'll read it out the duty we owe to history is to rewrite it.
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: I'll say that one again, these two the duty we owe to history is to rewrite it, and I think that is so relevant to what we're talking about and your podcast about breaking cycles, this topic of women and being able to own property and have a will.
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: Now I'm going to give you both a bit of a history lesson and we're going to briefly dive into some of those statistics to give you some context.
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: So it wasn't until 1882 in England that a married woman so prior to that had no legal testamentary rights.
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: So that meant she couldn't have a will, she had no legal entitlement to make a will.
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: So a married woman was seen as one with her husband.
• 24:43
  Speaker 3: So what that meant is she had no legal personality, identity at all.
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: It meant she couldn't hold property in her own name, she couldn't sue or be sued, she couldn't enter into any contracts, be subject to bankruptcy laws.
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: It wasn't until what we call the Married Women's Property Act which came in and which was part of the movement in the 19th century that allowed a woman to actually own property in her own name and have a will.
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: It's really interesting delving back before that, looking at what we call forced succession, and that's what we talk about with the students at university, and their question last year was analyzing the historical progression of testamentary freedom in Australia.
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: Now that spits up all different topics, but relevantly for us today, in terms of women owning property, we have this concept of forced succession, so the married woman would be completely cancelled and it would go directly to this firstborn son.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's like in the movies that's like in Pride, and Prejudice and all those period Netflix series.
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: It's not just a fictional thing.
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: It's the same with the British monarchy that it was the eldest son was the one that took it, took on everything.
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: So it's the same that happened for us Women.
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: Married women were cancelled.
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: So it wasn't really until the 19th century, where the industrial revolution, people's living standards were increasing, that women started to have this push for hey, we're undervalued here, we want to emancipate for equal rights on this topic, which saw the introduction of that legislation.
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: So, moving from the Married Women's Property Act, we then move to what's called the Family Provision Legislation.
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: So what was happening is we've gone from.
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: We don't have any rights at all to own property, have a will or sue.
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: Our son takes all of our property from our family.
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: We then move to what's called family provision.
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: So the reason this was introduced was to ensure that women didn't become a burden to the state, basically, or to the government.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: So A man could decide who we wanted to give his estate to, but with having a wife and children, he had to make sure that they were maintained and adequately taken care of.
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: So that was what this legislation was brought in to do.
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: We can have a whole nother discussion about whether we think that's gone too far now in terms of who can actually inherit, but that's a topic for another time.
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: So we saw a whole heap of change in that 19th century and that's why I thought you guys would find it fun to have a look at some of those silly statistics Not silly, but they jump out at you.
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: The fact that we couldn't just walk into a bar and have a glass of wine and cheers each other until 1965.
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: That's ridiculous.
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: It's not that long For me.
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: I mentioned when we started in my own legal profession as a lawyer.
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: You couldn't be a lawyer or a barrister because person didn't include the definition of woman.
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: That's just ludicrous.
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: Just some other things.
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: 1960s if you worked in the public service sector and you were getting married, you'd have to quit your job Because you were required to stay at home and be the married wife.
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: I just listened to this and I'm so grateful that we live in an age now where women, men, anyone non-binary can start their own business, can get out into the world, make their impact, earn an income from it.
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: It'll be interesting to see how that continues into the future and what more changes are on the horizon, but for now, I think we're just in a really fortunate phase of history where we get to do this kind of thing.
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: So with that, I implore anyone listening to this fascinating conversation to really stop and consider if you haven't got those things in order.
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: It's time to, because you can and because it matters.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: Yes, let's just go back to that quote Oscar Wilde the duty we owe to history is to rewrite it.
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: Women now have the ability and we're now starting to educate that we can disperse our assets, get our state in order, make sure our kids are taken care of, make sure our beloved pets are taken care of.
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: Yes, thank you.
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: We have a duty and an obligation to do that as females.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Absolutely.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: And also another thing that I reflect on fairly regularly is the fact and it's related to all of this the fact that, realistically, our mothers and grandmothers are the first generation of women to earn their own money.
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: You said it yourself even in the 60s, women had to resign if they got pregnant.
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: So let's also be aware of that and cut ourselves in slack and realize that we really are breaking some deeply entrenched cycles here.
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: My friends and we can stay stuck in a place of feeling guilty or bad because we know we should be doing something like get our estate planning sorted or whatever that might be, or we could go you know what I might be the first woman, actually, I might be the first woman in my family or person in my family to be this organizer or have the opportunity to even write a will, have a will.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: These are the sites sorts of I'm getting so passionate I can't even speak Types of cycles that we're really breaking and I have to jump on the bandwagon, the platform, the soapbox of the other cycle around.
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: This is that hustle culture.
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: We have learned how to be successful in business, in life, in a very masculine push, push, push environment, and we do not have to do that anymore.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: Yes, healthy hustle is a thing, my friends.
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: We still have to step up and work hard, but there's a way to do it, and all of this is related.
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: All of this is related.
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: So, with that in mind, we've definitely gone over our usual time, but I feel like it's been so worthwhile.
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: Thank you for all these amazing insights, gals.
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: What do we think is one action that our beautiful listeners can take, mary Ann, in light of this conversation, what do you think could be one actionable action people can do in the next 24 hours?
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: I know one thing I'll already be doing.
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: The mind a little bit more generic.
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: Mine is let's celebrate life and celebrate our legacy.
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: So, whatever that means to you personally, celebrate your legacy, celebrate your hard work.
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: That's my, actionable for 24 hours, love it.
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: I just got goosebumps.
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: What a way to finish out.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: It's been amazing and that really gives the opportunity, I think that question for people to take the time out to really consider what a great life, the ups and downs and everything included, what a great life and how privileged we are.
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: So, thank you, thank you, what a fascinating conversation so fascinating.
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: Can I say something?
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, can I just add to that?
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: Also, when you're reflecting on that, actually think about what cycles am I breaking?
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: What cycles have I broken to be here today doing what I'm doing?
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: Love it Really acknowledge that Love it.
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: Ok, marianne, if somebody wants to enter your orbit and understand what you're all about, where's the best place for them to come in?
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: What did we say?
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: Friendly, stalk Friendly stalk, friendly stalk.
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: So Instagram at MDemesta.
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: Underscore lawyers is our social media page.
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: My name Marianne Domesta for the LinkedIn and our website mdemestalawyerscomau.
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: That's where you can find us.
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: Amazing.
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: We will make sure those links are in the show notes for people and thank you again for coming on and having this conversation with us today and thank you for listening.
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: Bye for now.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to today's EPP.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: If you loved what you heard, find us on LinkedIn and let us know what you enjoyed.
• 32:12
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• 32:18
  Speaker 1: Ness and I are obsessed with helping you break through your business and life barriers to get you to your next frontier of growth.
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: We bring two business minds and two perspectives into your business.
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: As the magician, I help connect the dots, see the possibilities and the hidden potential, and as the architect, ness turns those possibilities into practice, implementing plans and frameworks.
• 32:44
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• 32:49
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• 32:55
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• 32:58
  Speaker 1: Send us an email or go old school and give us a call.
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: All our details are in the show notes and on our website.
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: Until next time, happy listening and here's to thriving in business and life.