Latest / Giving Pain Purpose with Lyndsay Soprano / Psychedelics: The Answer is Within You with Zappy Zapolin

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Psychedelics: The Answer is Within You with Zappy Zapolin · Giving Pain Purpose with Lyndsay Soprano

• Lyndsay Soprano (00:01) This is Giving Pain Purpose, where we talk about the game of living in and with chronic pain and trauma. I'm your host, Lyndsay Soprano. On this show, I sit with the warriors, loved ones, doctors, holistic practitioners, and those who walk through hell and want their voices heard. You don't have to heal quietly and you don't have to fight alone. Throughout my entire life, I have suffered with some pretty extreme anxiety and depression. And when you live in the kind of chronic pain that I do, it's extremely difficult to not experience anxiety and depression. But it didn't start when my physical pain started. It started at a very, very young age. And to handle the pain of living in sometimes debilitating anxiety, I have always reached straight for alcohol. It was modeled by every single adult in my life to do so, and so I did it too. And I still do. Not like I once did, but it is still a crutch that I lean on to take the edge off of my anxiety and to quote unquote help with my pain. Does it help? No, absolutely not. But I still do it. To also help with my pain, I started down the road of ketamine therapy. And you guys have heard me talk about ketamine in the past episodes and seasons before. But for the last year and some change, I've been injecting myself at home with ketamine. And I told myself that if my anxiety and depression was lower, then my pain would be lower. And that was not the case. If anything, my pain went up. The treatments became problematic as the doses increased, leading to dark and distressing experiences without proper support. But what I did get out of ketamine therapy was the unlocking of some deep, dark and hidden memories. One in particular was of a sexual molestation by an uncle when I was nine years old. Uncovering that has been a monumental part of my healing journey, but it's just the beginning, guys. And I'm at a point in my life's journey that I'm ready to explore psychedelic therapy at a much deeper level, one where I can truly expand my mind and transcend what I think my life is all about and the universe that I live in. But I'm not quite sure which type of psychedelic therapy road to go down. But today I have the most Epic guest here for you that has experience beyond experience on working with psychedelics and training others to guide people like you and me through their healing journeys. So without further ado, I would like to introduce you to my guest, Mr. Zappy Zaplin. And yes, that is his name. Zappy, what's up? my God. Zappy Zapolin (02:48) Wow, we are living in the greatest time ever because it's so fun for me because when I meet people like you and I realize like what they've gone through on a day-to-day basis for years and decades. And then I'm like, we have the solution. We literally have it within plants and it's just now coming out. So it's like, I know that you are eventually gonna do iboga or ibogaine. It is gonna do a 180 degree reset on you physically because that's what it's capable of. Gonna wipe your prefrontal cortex. You're gonna have no cravings for alcohol or anything else. And you probably, like we were talking about previously, you and I, you know, ayahuasca to get that, you know, hug from your grandmother that says, Hey, you know what? All that stuff that happened to you, it happened to you, but that's not you. You're you, and you go, my god, I'm me, you know. And so I'm just like so excited to see your your. journey because for you to be a brave enough to wake up every day and do what you do despite for you now to have access because the prohibition of sixty years of is ending and you're gonna access these incredible medicines and they each have a different attribute and some amazing way to heal and give you maybe peak performance or you know introduce you to God. I don't know, like what else do you need this thing to do? Lyndsay Soprano (04:15) What else do you need this thing to do? That's for sure. Well, okay, so real quick before we get going here, Zappy is a serial entrepreneur and filmmaker and pioneer in the psychedelic wellness space. After building a highly successful career on Wall Street, Zappy's path took an unexpected turn when he witnessed the devastating impact of trauma, addiction, and chronic suffering on people he cared about, determined to find answers where traditional systems had fallen short. He began exploring the healing potential of psychedelic medicine. Today, through his documentaries, the Ketamine Fund and Psychedelic Concierge, he's helping expand access to innovative treatments and educating practitioners on the power of psychedelic assisted healing for trauma, addiction, PTSD, and emotional recovery. And I'd like to start, if you would, with what brought you to the place in your life to where psychedelic assisted healing became your calling. And let's take it from Zappy Zapolin (05:13) There. Yeah, that that was a very organic situation for me, you know, throughout my life. I had actually, when I was younger, I had this transformational psychedelic experience where I had taken psychedelics and I look at my hand and I could see that it was trillions of atoms and they were, but they were vibrating at this certain frequency. And I looked at it and then I looked over at my friend, and he's the same exact atoms, just a different frequency slightly. Then I look at the table and I'm like, my God, everything's frequency. My five senses are muting out all this stuff that's really happening. And and and they're and they're muting it down so I can have a conversation. I get it. There's so much more going on here. And I, you know, I go through my life and I'm, you know, trying to live the American dream, what they told me, you know, go to school, get a job, make money, have a family, make a lot of money, become a philanthropist, and you will be. Totally fulfilled. Lyndsay Soprano (06:13) Yay, we did. Zappy Zapolin (06:15) So, you know, I I went that path and and you know, I was doing these domain names back in the day, and I buy beer.com for $70,000, $80,000. I sell it a couple months later for seven million dollars, and then I'm getting this one and that. I'm doing and I finally get there and I'm like, okay, I did it all. Okay, okay. wait, I'm not fulfilled. Like I don't even know what the hell I'm doing here. I don't even know actually if this is worth doing, because if The answers aren't out there. Like they told me, then, like, what am I going to get some more of it? No, I'm I'll take myself out if this is it, you know? And so I remember back to that psychedelic experience I had. And I thought, you know what? I think I'm gonna have to go back inside my own mind, inside for some answers. Not out there, but inside. And I had heard about some people going to the jungle and sitting with a shaman, doing ayahuasca, this brew that they give you a vine, a leaf in the And they brew it together. And I was like, I think I have to go to the jungle and sit with a shaman right now. Like I this there's no other everything else has been tried, you know? And so I convinced myself I was gonna go. And I was lucky I had production equipment and things around me at the time doing marketing. And I said, I'm gonna bring a crew with me and I'll just film whatever happens to me, because if it works for me, then maybe. There'll be something I could share, and that will be like maybe worth doing this thing over. And got really lucky. I was able to get the actress Michelle Rodriguez to come with me at the time and some friends of ours. And we went down to the jungle and we sat with the shaman and we drank the ayahuasca, and we went to the top of another mountain. We drank San Pedro, which is a cactus, and we had this life. transforming experience that you see in the movie, The Reality of Truth. And I'm really glad that the movie resonated with you. 25 million people have now seen that movie. It said that that that she's so good in the movie that it's said that over a million people have done psychedelics because they saw the movie. The movie ends and they go, that's it. I think I'm doing ayahuasca. And then they call, you know, Rhythmia that's in the movie, or they go to Costa Rica or they go to Peru. And It's just one of these situations where as soon as I got the medicine myself, I had the realization like, my God, like this is what everybody needs. And the medicine told me, because you see in the movie, I actually wound up meeting God in the jungle. And God, it turns out, was a woman, which seems, you know, actually when you think about it. And it was at least the creative energy of, you know, mother nature and creation, you know, and I I'm with God and it's half man, half woman, it's all of it. And so I said the moment that changed my life, it's not in the reality of truth. In the reality of truth, I tell someone what happened to me. But what really happened was that at a certain point I was in this ayahuasca transcended moment with God. And I said to God, I had asked a couple questions, God says to me in a woman's voice, says, Do you know how you're breathing right now? And I was like, No, I don't, I don't know how I'm doing it. No. And then God's like, well, you're, you know, you're growing your hair, you're digesting your food. Do you know how you're doing it? And you're doing it, but do you know how? And I was like, No. And God said, if you don't know how you're breathing, then what makes you think I need your help? wow. Yeah. And I was like, my God, you're right. I'm like, I'm off the hook. Like what? I don't even know how I'm breathing. I don't do that for two minutes. I die. And like I'm gonna get all upset because these people over here aren't listening to me. I my God. And and God was like, It's perfect. Just enjoy it. And I thought, wow, you know, that is now my life because to know that, you know, I I don't know anything. I don't know why I'm here. I don't know what the Rules are, I don't know what comes next, but I I realize that if you could be in that reality, but still be grateful to be there, that that's how you win the game. It's not what deeds did you do, because we all do good deeds and bad deeds, and you know, half the time you're doing it for your own ego anyway. So it's Lyndsay Soprano (10:44) Yeah. Zappy Zapolin (10:45) so it's like if you can be grateful, and I realize that, and then I realize that every time I do psychedelics. They reconnect me to the fact that I'm in a miracle right now. Lyndsay Soprano (10:57) Well, and I'll say for one thing that I've had to learn, especially with Giving Pain Purpose, it was actually, we just changed the name of my podcast after four seasons of doing the Pain Game podcast. I rebranded it to Giving Pain Purpose. It was the tagline of the show. But what this was is so much more actionable for me because what ended up happening with my diagnosis of CRPS, I have Lyme disease and all these other coinfections and all this other bullshit. And I truly believe that what is going on within my body is 100% curable by doing what you're talking about and by doing what your documentary, The Reality of Truth, did for these people. Because there's no pills that have helped me. There's no therapy. How how I've been in therapy since I was fucking 14 years old, right? Okay. I'm still as messed up as I was when I was 14 now, if not even more so. But what I'm learning about myself is that I wake up to do something that is meaningful. And that is actually what we're doing right now. And all of the things that lead up to this, watching your documentary and watching, watching a bunch of other videos on you and YouTube stuff and reading about you and your podcast and all these things that I do. I I'm so grateful to have you come into my life at this particular time because I've been thinking about doing ayahuasca. I've been talking, I was talking to my husband right before we got on. I was like, I've been talking about doing ayahuasca for how long now? And I told you that as soon as I found the person that was gonna be the right guide, I would know. And I know. And I told you I was gonna cry. So here it comes. Anyways. But the the breathing part is so interesting because I don't remember who said it in your documentary, but it was breathing is the most important tool. I don't know if it was Deepak or who it was. And there Zappy Zapolin (12:43) Sri Sri Ravi Shangkar. Lyndsay Soprano (12:44) yeah, yeah, yeah. And it was like all of a sudden I I when I was watching the documentary and I heard that, I was holding my breath. And I catch myself holding my breath all the time. Where I'm like, my God, like how long have I been holding my breath for? Like I gasp for air all of the time, almost like I'm a walking sleep apnea patient, or kind of walking sleep apnea patient since I'm half in a wheelchair. But you know, the the 50% of the medicine part and the 50% of is you was very strong for me as well to hear. I'd like to talk a little bit about because you brought up a couple different names of things today. We've already talked about psilocybin, ayahuasca, San Pedro, the eboga or ibogain. Can you talk to us a little bit about a what is your favorite? But also why do these work the way that they do? You don't have to get into the specifics of each one of them. Zappy Zapolin (13:36) Gonna, I'm gonna drop a little science on YouTube, but the we have just incredible science that's come out of Yale, Johns Hopkins, University of California, San Francisco, Mayo Clinic, NIH. Now it's stacking up. This is real, this is the real deal. I do want to tell you something that a yogi told me. He said something so profound to me that is exactly what you were saying. And he said, pain is just your brain. Trying to remind you to breathe. Lyndsay Soprano (14:09) shit. Zappy Zapolin (14:11) That's all it is. It's just a signal to breathe. Wow. And and I've, you know, I've I've thought about that in a few kind of instances where I was like, and I hammer my hand and then I'm like, you know, you freeze. Lyndsay Soprano (14:24) Right, right. Zappy Zapolin (14:24) Then I'm like, my God, breathe, breathe. And after just a little little bit of breathing, it it sh it it takes a certain edge off. But Let me tell you these different psychedelic compounds, these plants, okay, they're growing out of the ground for the most part. You have receptors in your brain for them. So you're supposed to be interacting with them. Lyndsay Soprano (14:45) Right. Zappy Zapolin (14:46) And they each have a different frequency and they differ have a different attribute and something that they can do, which is amazing. So as the psychedelic conceivers, when somebody comes to me and they say, Hey, I'm interested in psychedelics, of which there's like 39 million people in the United States that say they're psychedelic curious right now. 70% of them say they want to be guided the first time. So that's like 20 million people that want this kind of guiding. a lot of times right now, if you just, you know, are curious, you go on the internet, you're gonna find like five ayahuasca places and maybe a couple mushroom places in Jamaica. And you're like, I guess I have to do ayahuasca. And is Lyndsay Soprano (15:26) Right, right. Zappy Zapolin (15:27) you don't, maybe that's not really what you need. and so for me as a psychedelic concierge, what I do when people come to me is I ask them, you know, what's your intention for what you're trying to do here? And what are the traumas that you're trying to overcome? And in knowing that, now I can set up like you might have in my Lamar Odom Reborn documentary, you see his formula. And so because of what they're trying to overcome, I can make a better recommendation. So for example, if somebody is Out of touch with nature. They live in the city. They're walking on concrete in their shoes and they like they start spinning out. You give them San Pedro cactus. It immediately connects you back to nature. And you're like, and you just kind of reset yourself and it's really beautiful. If somebody lost their joy, I would probably say, hey, start microdosing psilocybin mushrooms, a subperceptual amount. You're just gonna. bubble up with a little more joy. And then over time you're going to get neuroplastic and you're going to actually be joyful. if you need a hug from your grandmother, you probably need ayahuasca. If you have an addiction, you'd need iboga or ibogaine, which is an extract from that iboga plant. on and on, DMT. If you had a stroke, you should be smoking DMT because they just showed that this is Building new neural pathways in your brain. If you're suicidal, I'm going to say ketamine immediately. This is a micro crystal with a very high frequency. And you take the ketamine crystal frequency, you put it into your frequency, and you rate you resonate so high that almost like when somebody says, you know, I feel like these dark entities are on me and something nothing can hold on when you're, you know, vibrating at this very high frequency. And so Then afterwards, in the hours after, the ketamine metabolizes and grows these new neural pathways in your brain. So you're literally getting smarter. It's growing new dendrites. This is why Elon Musk does it twice a month. For number one, for depression, because I'm sure, as I always say, it's got to be. Pretty annoying to be Elon Musk and every room you walk into, everybody's a moron, you know, and you just have to keep repeating yourself, like, this is what we're gonna do. And then they go, Well, why should we listen to you? And you're like, Well, because when NASA couldn't get the astronauts back from the space station, I sent my rocket up and I got him. So can you kind of just listen to me now? And they're like, No, because you know. So he has depression and he's been taking ketamine for a while, a couple of times a month. His neural pathways are growing. He's getting smarter. He's tapping into physics that he never knew existed and all kinds of upgrades that he's getting. All of these compounds, you know, LSD for cluster headaches has been proven out now. All of these opportunities we have, and the reason we don't have them right now as regular healthcare is that 60 years ago. There was a prohibition put forward on these compounds. So what happened was there was like a perfect storm of three different things. One was that the Vietnam War was happening and the government tested psychedelics and they were like, my God, nobody's gonna go kill somebody if you have to give them psychedelics. So we gotta stuff this down. Nobody's gonna join the military. We gotta get rid of this. Okay. That was number one. Number two was the pharmaceutical companies. Just came out with their SSRIs, their antidepressants, and they were looking at decades of tens of billions of dollars of profit. They're like, we don't need a mushroom resolving somebody overnight. We don't need eyebogame breaking their addiction in one session. So they put a the prohibition into it. They lobbied to get rid of this thing with the politicians. And then third, and super sinister, is the alcohol companies. Who knew that there was a day like today, 2026, that was going to come where the younger generation was not going to be drinking alcohol anymore. They were going to be f focusing more on like marijuana, mushrooms. and they were like, wow, this is horrible. Like, we have to put this off as long as possible. So they spent tens of millions of dollars a year discrediting the research, you know, telling people that you're gonna like fry your brain, you jump off a building. And meanwhile, Tens millions of people did do mushrooms, and some of them are Steve Jobs. And the reason that we have the phone is has to do with LSD. And now, in the last few, you know, weeks, a matter of weeks, we just had this executive order signed by Donald Trump to for Ibogain, MDMA for PTSD, and mushrooms for basically replacing antidepressants. He signed this fast track executive order, money for research. And it looks like the psilocybin mushrooms are going to get rescheduled from schedule one, where they are now, illegal, over to schedule three, just like marijuana just went from schedule one to schedule three. The mushrooms are to go to schedule three. And so psilocybin's about to have that. I'm projecting 10 or 20 million more Americans try psilocybin, either microdose, macro, something like that, in the next like 18 months. And the veterans. When they get this MDMA and the psilocybin and the ibogaine, a year later, let's say they get it six months from now, they're having it. A year later, they're gonna look back and they're gonna go, wow, suicide rates are down 50%. we're giving out half as much medication. Wow, let's get this out to the rest of society. And when things come out of a prohibition, the uptake curve on it is like this, and then it's like a hockey stick. It's gone. millions of people. This is going to be the biggest thing in mental health. It's going to be the biggest thing in addiction interruption. It's going to be the biggest thing for peak performance. And it's going to be the biggest thing for longevity. Because Brian Johnson, the biohacker, I'm sure you saw, don't die, live forever. Recently did some psychedelic work and he came out and said that it was the most impactful experience of his whole life. And all his biomarkers for every single thing are better than they've ever been. And he's like, I'm here to tell you that I'm so excited about psychedelic medicine because diet can help you a little bit, your longevity, sleep, exercise, a little bit, each one of those. He goes, but psychedelic medicine is more than all those, plus plus, plus. And so I mean it's just the best time to be alive. I mean, just, you know, even anybody who's in pain or sick or what I'm just like, just hang on because the AI And the psychedelics are coming at the same time. And everything that we think is uncurable is the the solution is in these plants already, proving it out. Pain, you know, strokes, addiction to any substance. It's like we got it. And people always go, Well, don't pretend it's a panacea. And I'm like, it's pretty much a panacea. Lyndsay Soprano (22:50) Cloud. Yeah. Zappy Zapolin (22:52) Yeah. And what you said, you know, that medicine's gonna do half the work. And then you have to do half the work integrating it into your life and making these changes and seeing the world different. So but it's exciting because we never we haven't had this for 60 years. And here it is come back around. So once we get enough people with the mushrooms doing this, we'll raise the empathy level and we solve any problem we have as a society easily. Lyndsay Soprano (23:19) Well, and we need it. Big time. We've lost we've lost all connection to each other. And some of that is it from my perspective is some of it is technology. Our faces are down. We're looking at our phones. Every time I see somebody walking on the sidewalk or in the supermarket or wherever coming to me and they're looking down, I always say, Look up and it startles them. And then they're like, yeah, that's right. Like I literally almost just ran into a person or got run over by a shopping cart, or they're in the Crosswalk as you're driving and they're looking down like you're gonna get hit by a bus. We have just lost touch of each other in so many ways. And at the soul level, we need so much healing. And and in watching your documentary, The Reality of Truth, there are so many moments in it. A, I cried through basically the entire thing. because there there are these places within me that I know I'm holding on to and I don't know how to get them out because I'm not even really sure. where they are or what they are or where they came from. And it is it is such an enlightening film to watch because it is filled with hope from the very second to the very end and for the start of it and to the very end. And it it it gave me peace and hope for my future for me and for the future of my husband having to live with me in this kind of pain. Zappy Zapolin (24:43) P S D that he has. Lyndsay Soprano (24:45) Yeah, God. Yeah, absolutely. He deals with this on a whole other level that I can't touch. And so while I was watching it, I'm thinking, okay, I can't walk my dogs. You know, like I can I can walk, but I can only do these like short little stints. Like I can't go for a walk with my dogs, can't ski anymore. I I can barely do yoga on my feet at all. All the things that I used to do skiing, hiking, biking, all those things, I can't do right now. Right now I can't. Right. And in watching the documentary, you guys are climbing through all of these like windy things. I'm like, I'm not gonna be able to do that to go do this with him. And Zappy Zapolin (25:20) Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (25:21) I'm like, you know what? I bet you I can. Zappy Zapolin (25:24) You can. That's the power of these plants. You know, Ibogaine, the one that's in the movie where Gerard has who started Rhythm Lyndsay Soprano (25:32) Right, right, yeah. Zappy Zapolin (25:33) did Ibogain. that one, their science out that when you do Ibogaine, you are one point three years younger in the hours physiologically in the hours after than you were in the hours before it. And the upgrades are absolutely wild. I took a group Down a couple a few months ago, they went to do iboga in the traditional buiti tribal way. For thousands of years in Africa, they've been taking this plant, they commune with their ancestors, they get the answers, or they break whatever situation, and come to realize that in your body, you're storing the memories of all of your ancestors. It's in your DNA. You're like, no way, there's no way. Yes. You could store like everything in the universe on a strand of DNA. That's Lyndsay Soprano (26:26) Ancestral trauma. It's like boom, boom, boom. Like they raped and pillaged villages, and that is in our DNA. Like, hello. Yeah. Zappy Zapolin (26:35) And you don't have to go back that far in anybody's family, 10 generations. Probably horrible, you know, disease, death, and you know, all these things. And so, you know, when you realize this ibogain, this iboga, this plant can go in and help you to go back into these this file cabinet and look at things from a different perspective to see things, to resolve them. And then you clear that, and it's like cleared in your account. Record in your family. You've you've it's gone for the next generation. And like, you know, there's a very famous study with mice where they were giving these mice, they were showing them a purple light, and then they would shock them, show them the purple light, shock them. Eventually they just show them the purple light and they would like go into this fear response, PTSD, and they looked at the the children of those mice, they'd show them the purple light, they go into the fear PTSD. Their grandchildren fear it went back to like something like 13 generations. You show them the purple purple light and they go into a fear response. So you have all these things that are triggering you in your DNA stored in your fascia, all these places. And the iboga is able to go in, rewire it. Everybody says they feel like they got like It's like a defragging program. It goes in and it's like, you don't you don't need this bullshit information, Lyndsay Soprano (27:59) Ray. Zappy Zapolin (27:59) advertising and marketing jingles. Like you don't need this shit, you know. But we have all these plants, we have these receptors in our brain, we're supposed to be interacting with them. And here we have we're cut off and we're we're about to get our rights back. We're about to be free again. And I'll tell you my origin story. Actually goes back to the day that I was born, which is October 3, 1966. On October 4th, 1966, the next day they made LSD illegal in California. And that led to all the psychedelics being prohibitioned on Schedule One. And I really believe I had one day of actual freedom of my mind. And I think I might have been put here to. right that wrong that was taking place in that Lyndsay Soprano (28:54) love that that you're like damn it I just missed it by it like but I like that because that circles back to the whole idea of that of of meaningful and living living with our life with purpose and you know we why am I here? What am I doing this for? You know, like we're sitting here you're you're you're you're you're working at a supermarket and you're bagging groceries and you're like, is this it? This is my life. And I'm not poo-pooing you. If you are bagging groceries, good for you. You're out there, you're working, you're doing the thing. That's what we're supposed to be doing. But you're sitting there going, Is this all? Is this it? This is it. This is my life. This is what I'm here for. And then I have similar conversations with myself about my pain. I'm like, is this fucking it? Like I am going to live in this kind of pain. People don't look at me and go, Wow, she must be in super pain because I don't show it. I show it inside the walls of my home with my spouse and my my closest and dearest friends. But I even try to curb my enthusiasm with that as much as I can to protect them, which is something I've done for my whole life is protect other people but myself. But that's for a different episode. Yeah. Yeah. But it's like the the the meaningfulness. I want to be remembered on this earth somehow, some way. And if it's doing what we're doing right now together, then so be it. But I know that there's so much more in me. And I have from a very, very, very young age. And I I chose routes that Right now, I'm not I don't have any regrets about decisions that I've made in my life. I'm just like, damn it. I like I could have done that, and it may have done this, but none of that would have led me to what I'm doing right now, which is purposeful and meaningful. Yes. And it's something that I wake up to do because without this, it is really fucking hard to get out of bed. Yeah. Really Zappy Zapolin (30:38) Yeah. No, that's so Lyndsay Soprano (30:40) fucking hard. Yeah. And showing up is the key. Showing up is the key. And Zappy Zapolin (30:45) Is it? Lyndsay Soprano (30:46) yeah. Absolutely. So you're talking to me. Here I am. I call Zapi and I'm like, I want to do this because, bro, I want to do this. If we're talking about me with depression, anxiety, chronic pain, past sexual abuse multiple times throughout my life, physical abuse, abandonment issues, safety issues, like name it. How would you actually like, how do you diagnose? Yeah, how do you? Zappy Zapolin (31:12) I got you. I know exactly what you what your formula is. So Lyndsay Soprano (31:17) you do do you? Yes. Zappy Zapolin (31:18) there's there's three things I'm gonna recommend because I know you've done everything else. Number one, I would one well, number one, you're doing, which is you know, your ketamine and you're going inside, okay? But number the what I would do is I would start microdosing psilocybin mushrooms because the point of that. Is is that when you take a true microdose, that's a subperceptual amount. That's what microdose means. So you're just taking a little, but what's happening is it's building up in your brain, it's building up this neural plasticity. So right now, we're all of our our brains are, you know, in these rigid patterns. People have things like, nothing's gonna work out, nobody's gonna love me, I'm a drug addict. Whatever you you're saying to yourself. Even when something good happens, it comes into that rigid pattern, gets spun out. But when you use psychedelic medicine, and I'm saying this is not years, this is like you know, weeks and months of doing a microdose of psilocybin, you get this neuroplastic state where those thoughts that you know start and then they start to ruminate and then they're going out, it's getting more ridiculous. None of it's ever probably gonna happen, but you're worrying yourself about yeah, yeah. No, it stops right about here, and it's like. You know what? That's not serving me. So okay, here I go. I'm now gonna because you have this area of your brain called the default mode network. And your default mode network is either it's between defaulting to worrying or creativity. And I can see that in you, you have both, you know. So you're yeah creative, but you're worrying, and you're supposed to be in the middle, but you it seems like you're jamming, you're jammed here because of physical. And real big T trauma and stuff like that. So potentially, you know, you are going, but I'm gonna say this the microdosing is to lead to you doing iboga or ibogaine because those are the ones that do the actual physical reset. My ex-wife, when she came back a month ago from or two months ago from Ibogain, Iboga. Afterwards, she came back, she's like 53 years old. She started ovulating. after her iboga. Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (33:38) Holy shit. Zappy Zapolin (33:39) So I'm like, she's like, yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (33:41) to happen, please God no. Zappy Zapolin (33:45) You no you are Benjamin buttons going backwards, you know. And so yeah. The Lyndsay Soprano (33:53) Benjamin Button. Zappy Zapolin (33:54) iboga. You know, they say when you if you microdose ibogain very small amounts every day, it's shown anecdotally to be reversing Parkinson's disease. And the Fox Lyndsay Soprano (34:07) That is. Zappy Zapolin (34:08) Foundation is working on that. But you know, we're talking about not just like, he you know, make my pain less or something like that. We're talking about rewiring your brain, rewiring your nervous system, and you know, putting you in a place where you don't you wouldn't care to put some alcohol in because you're just like I feel like good. I'm not gonna, I don't know, Lyndsay Soprano (34:30) Right. Zappy Zapolin (34:32) you know, so. It's all about regulating your nervous system. I bogein iboga, I know is going to be the one. And then, you know, to have a relationship with that, to probably, you know, restructure your, you know, your nervous system. But no question about it. If you start microdosing right now, it's going to be amazing. there's one called Amanita muscaria mushrooms, the red ones with the white polka dots that you see everywhere, those cute little mushrooms. Lyndsay Soprano (35:01) They are cute. Zappy Zapolin (35:02) Yeah, those ones are actually legal. They are psychedelic, but they don't have psilocybin in them. They have an active called muscomole. And different than psilocybin, which the more you take, the more kind of crazy chaotic it can get. The muscomole, the more you take, the more mellow you get. And the anecdotal evidence, and this is in my life and a lot of people, is that people who are drinking alcohol and and are on antidepressants, if you microdose them on ammonita after a few weeks, they will start to drink less, take their medicine less. And eventually they're just gonna be like, I feel fine. Like I don't need anything, you know? So this thing Lyndsay Soprano (35:42) Yeah, right, right. Zappy Zapolin (35:43) is people don't even know it. They're like, my God, the cute red and white mushroom. my God. And meanwhile they're about to find out that this is the one that's gonna break the alcohol and the drug or the SSRI stuff. Lyndsay Soprano (35:57) Well, yeah, because we're all, especially us in the chronic pain department, we're the the doctors just throw the frickin' kitchen sink at you and they're like, Well, just give it a whirl and we'll see how y'all shake out. And what I have, which is called CRPS, is called the suicide disease. And so s a lot of people commit suicide because the pain level is so high. They say that it's higher than natural childbirth when you're in in our largest flares. So I'm walking around having fucking babies all day. That's also why I'm like, no. I'm already doing it every day. Zappy Zapolin (36:29) Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (36:30) I'm too old, and my husband is definitely too old. We don't need any more of those running around here. But it it really is a place. Talking to you about this is such a it's such a relief to hear that there is legitimate hope for all of us. Not just people that live in chronic pain, not just people that have chronic illness, but people that struggle with all kinds. Of things that we're that people are walking around us and we don't know what we're all carrying with us. Our backpacks are getting heavier and heavier and heavier, and we can all see it and we're all starting to crunch down like a question mark. And even our bodies are showing us bending over and forward. It's like we're going backwards in evolution, right? We're like, shit. And I just feel like the the psychedelic medicine is such an important part of what we need to all be thinking of and not be such a skeptic of it. Because we should be skeptical of all the things that are killing us. Yeah. All of these, all of these pills that they are giving us, give us suicidal ideation. Yeah. Straight up. Like every time you read the things that can happen, all of them say suicidal ideation in them. And they're like, just go for it. You're with Zappy Zapolin (37:41) Wow. Lyndsay Soprano (37:43) one of my best friends who also shares CRPS with me, she called me one night, and this was like a year and a half ago, and she said, I just asked my husband to drown me in the tub because her pain was that high. And I have had similar conversations with my husband, and we don't want to have them anymore. We don't want to have them anymore. Zappy Zapolin (38:02) To tell you, I I started this psychedelic concierge program to train people to you know prep people for journeys, to sit with them, to integrate them, whether it's trauma or these different things, to it help them integrate. And the reason I bring it up is that one of the people in my program, she described herself as having level six pain every day that she can remember is level six. And she's like, it's horrible. And I was going through life and I was just like miserable. And she's like, and then one of the mushroom journeys that she did, a large dose of mushrooms, put her into a level 10 pain situation, which she was not expecting. And she's like, my God. Lyndsay Soprano (38:46) Right. Like this is shocking. Zappy Zapolin (38:48) Like God. And she said she came out of it back to six. And she was like, my God, I'm only in six. She's like, I can. Use my use my arms like I can, you know, sit in a chair like, my God, this is amazing. And so sometimes this these technology from nature that you you know are God given here, they have the capability to give you what you need. And I think, you know, doing what you're already doing, which is sharing what happens to you, the people are gonna be like it's in you know the results are going to be so overwhelming that, you know, I think you're going to touch a lot of people. And that's what you're doing here. And that's like why you're we're sitting here. And if one person watching this gets these medicines, you know, one day earlier than they otherwise would have, I feel like the whole thing is worth it. The whole the whole you know, the whole computer making the it's all worth it if that Lyndsay Soprano (39:52) Absolutely worth it. Every single minute of this conversation with you has been wonderful. And I want to talk to you for a billion hours more, but I know we are pressed for time here. Thank you for taking the time to be with me and for caring for all of us and for caring for yourself because it's pretty it is it is transcendental and it is liberating and it is hopeful. And those are the kinds of conversations that I like to have on this show with my guests and for my audience because we love you guys and we care about you, and that's why we're sitting here doing this thing. Zappy Zapolin (40:21) Amazing. Yeah, no, I and thanks for being a think-for-yourself person, because you know, I doctors don't love when I say this, but you know, doctors don't even know about nutrition, you know, which 80% Lyndsay Soprano (40:33) No, of course they don't. Zappy Zapolin (40:34) of the things they're working on. So why would I think they know about psychedelic medicine, plant medicine? They don't don't wait around for them. Johns Hopkins, Yale, it's already don't wait for your doctor in Boca Ratan to be like, okay, now I get it. Go after this. It is your right and you're about to have the right to take psilocybin mushrooms. Start with a microdose, the smallest amount possible, and then build it up, build it up and see how it is for you. And I guarantee it's gonna be amazing, gonna change your life. Lyndsay Soprano (41:04) I love it. I love it. And I love changing lives here day by day here on Giving Pain Purpose. You can find our buddy Zappy at psychedelicconcierge.com. He's on Insta. He's super insta guy. Zappy Zapilin Z-A-P-P-Y-Z-A-P-O-L-I-N. You can find him on YouTube as well, and he's on LinkedIn forward slash Zappy. I love that you just did your first name for that one. He also has a podcast called Psychedelic Concierge Podcast. Thank you so very much for being here with us. I am just deeply rooted to you at this moment in time and I'm so grateful for you. Thank you so much. Zappy Zapolin (41:35) I'm grateful you can get up in the morning and put a smile on and help other people. I'm grateful. Thank you. Lyndsay Soprano (41:43) Thank you. Thank you. You are exclusively invited to share this Think For Yourself psychedelic VIP pain journey together. Let's get to the heart of how to heal with you by my and Zappy side. Please follow Giving Pain Purpose wherever you digest your podcast content. We will be there. Visit us at giving painpurpose.com and follow us on all the socials. Thanks for listening, my little VIPs. Catch you on the other side. Zappy Zapolin (42:08) Yes.