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Sprinkler Systems and Firefighters: A Powerful Partnership with Shane Ray · B Shifter

• 0:48
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to B-Shifter John Vance, here along with Josh Bloom, and today a very special guest, shane Ray, is here.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: He's from the National Fire Sprinkler Association and he's not only the president of that organization but also a long time fire chief, firefighter and real expert in the field of fire extinguishment when it comes to fire protection systems in buildings.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: And we've had Shane on before on our big box bulletin, which, by the way, is one of our most popular episodes we've ever put out, so we're happy to have you back.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: You're here right now doing a big box workshop at the AVBCTC in Phoenix.
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: It was a great class today.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: You're doing an awesome job delivering this message and this material, and I learned a lot today.
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: How are you doing?
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: I'm fantastic.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: It's great to be here with B-Shifter, it's great to be at the CTC, always loved coming to Phoenix, where I was an intern back a hundred years ago, and so, ms Bruno, every day.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: But it's always good to be back with you guys hanging out, sharing the word and, as Josh said when we opened up today, we're just trying to make a little bit of a difference.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: For those who don't know, you did an internship here for a while in the 90s, right?
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: I was a summer intern here in either 92 or 93, i believe so spent the summer and lived at station 18 and, of course, spent the rest of my career coming back and forth here with baggers and all the good things that Bruno had going on.
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: He was always so good to me.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: First of all, what has been the successes since the last time we talked?
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: We're continuing to get fires in big box buildings.
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: We're seeing it happen all the time.
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: We're seeing it in my area, throughout the country.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: What are some of the successes that we can build on and best practices that you've seen that have helped in these situations?
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: Well being.
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: In the class today you hear from the students that they say you know, hey, i'm being patient, i'm listening, i'm learning.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: The awareness level has increased.
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: They're like I had no idea about all these things that we're talking about.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: So, again, it's great having fire command officers, chief fire officers, operations tactical people sit in the room here, and especially those guys and gals that have been in prevention and things You know.
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: It all opens their eyes.
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: Putting it together and, as I told them, that's what my mission is is to bring the fire protection world, the fire sprinkler contractor, the firefighters, fire chiefs, fire officers, fire marshals, fire sprinkler contractors, everybody to the table right and say, hey, this problem is all of ours to solve And the word is getting out.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: You've heard some successes.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: Josh shared the success, maybe in an area We've heard from some of our friends in Minnesota that said, hey, we pulled up, we hooked up, we pumped the system, we were patient.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: So that's what we want.
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: It's like slow down, gather all your things together, make sure you can get to know and understand what you're dealing with and we're happy the word's getting out.
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: Do you think that's the biggest?
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: if there was one message that you'd want to get out to fire commanders out there listening, because you know there's commanders and people who are coming up through the ranks that are going to be ICs, what's the one message you'd want to send to them?
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: I think I like our message of when you pull up, hook up, it's like we said today.
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: There's a reason we call it the fire department connection.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: It's like it's put there for you to pull up, supplement the sprinkler system with extra water and do a good job with it and then get all your resources ready.
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: Know your buildings, know your first, do get out there, spend time in it.
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: But the simple message is pull up, hookup.
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: And then the second message is do not shut the system down until you're sure the fire's out.
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: And that's one of the biggest things that we're trying to spread is one size don't fit all.
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: You don't operate the same way in a single family dwelling as you do a high rise.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: You don't operate the same way in a cracker barrel you do in a Walmart distribution center.
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: You don't pull up to a cold storage warehouse and treat it the same way you would a 20,000 square foot mercantile ace hardware.
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: So all those things are where we're trying to get everybody to understand too that they're operating with many more sprinkler buildings than we've ever seen in our careers.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: There's been a 70% increase in the number of occupancies required to be protected with automatic sprinklers since 1980.
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: That's most of our careers.
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: And then you think, well, everybody's got it, but it's like.
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: No, like you said, there's a whole new group of firefighters, whole new group of apparatus operators, whole new group of fire marshals, incident commanders, fire chiefs, city government.
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: It's like our message will never stop.
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: One thing when you said earlier today you asked a question, who's familiar with NFPA 13E?
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: and everybody looked and it was kind of crickets right.
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: And you said I'm waiting, i'm waiting like what, does anybody answer the question?
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: I'm patient.
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: And nobody responded.
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: And then you started down that path.
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: Hey, we're going to talk about this.
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: And then you got threw out some things that, like the one thing you already said the fire department connection.
• 5:55
  Speaker 3: we need to pull up and hook up.
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: So when you said that, i was watching pretty close, we got 42, 3, i think people ended up in this class, almost every person in the room stopped and wrote that down And it's like, well, that's a win, right, it seems like common sense.
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: but it's not so common sense because you know, we're hearing on the other side of the events where they pull up, got called to a fire alarm drop, it turns into a fire.
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: They didn't hook to the fire department connection.
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: And then they get too far down, not too far down the road.
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: they get down the path so far that they just totally forget because other critical factors start popping up.
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: So it comes, that whole thing, i think, comes back to once.
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: you know, you know, and that's this message you're telling them facts, i think is what you said.
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: Hey, i'm telling you facts.
• 6:41
  Speaker 3: you got to make your own decisions.
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: But I think that's where it ties back to the strategic decision-making model of the critical factors.
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: The house fire isn't the big box, isn't the high rise, isn't the mobile home on fire, but those are all different critical factors And that's where we have to start with the decision-making.
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: So you know, when we go to a hazmat incident, we treat it different too And you know we always bring up the EMS incident right, like chest pains.
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: Well, when you get the chest pains, you don't just shock them, you evaluate the critical factors, if you will, or what the patients show it with.
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: Well, when we pull up on a building fire, far too often we get pulled into what we do all the time, which we know those statistics are 80 or so per cent or residential type buildings and we're not making decisions.
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: So hopefully, these, i guess I think really like five or six things.
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: Shane is, if they just do these five or six things, they're going to be much more successful on a big box And hopefully they can take those facts, figure out how they plug them into their own organization and make that make sense, shane.
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: Jones.
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and it was shocking that out of the 40 people we had in there, not a soul had heard of NFPA 13E, which is the recommended practice for fire department operations in buildings protected with automatic sprinklers, right.
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: And then you couple that with NFPA 1620, which is the pre-planned side of that, that said, hey, these documents all go together.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: A lot of people spend a lot of time putting them together for a reason.
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: And then two to simply summarize those when you, when you supply them with the information that says, hey, when you pull up hookup, do not shut the sprinkler system down, to improve visibility, right, and to try to get away from this cold smoke you heard me pushing all day that says, hey, this smoke is pressurized, it's hot, especially in these big box facilities, especially in these gigantic distribution centers.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: It's like there's still a lot of fire in that piece.
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: So pull up hookup, don't shut down, do not ventilate.
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: The sprinkler system is not made to function with ventilation.
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: There has to be a lid on it, right?
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: That's how it collects the heat to do its job is because there's something above it that pushes the heat down to where it is to operate.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: And so when you get those things and then two, once you do get to where visibility improves in the building, then it says in 13E when to start doing manual control ventilation, but during that time do not shut the sprinkler off.
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: And then the most shocking thing I find is I travel around and work with my colleagues still in the business.
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: It's like you know what.
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: They had no idea that million square foot facility is supposed to operate for two hours on its own.
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: Am I saying, stand outside and wait for two hours and let her work?
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: It's like no, you've got a lot of things to do.
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: Get somebody to the fire pump.
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: Make sure it's running, make sure it's holding pressure.
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: Get somebody to the riser.
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: Make sure the riser that you know in this bank of eight risers okay, these two are flowing water or only one's flowing water or find out what that is and then isolate that area.
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: So you know, this is my fire area.
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: Somewhere between here and the other side of that building is where this fire is.
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: It's not 600 feet to the left or 600 feet to the right.
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: It's probably right straight ahead in this area.
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: So everybody has been I mean, it's just good to see them hungry for the information.
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: It's so rewarding for me to get the feedback that says, hey, i didn't know that and I want more.
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: And that's where, again, blue card.
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: Thank you for what you all are doing and be shifter, for getting the word out, because it is making a difference.
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: We're seeing saves and anytime you can have a success on this that don't spike the charts, that says, oh, we had a $750 million loss.
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: That's immeasurable, i think.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: Something else I heard today is it was like the first two hours somebody said I got my money's worth already.
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: I can go home right now and I really need to get home and change this before something happens.
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: And it's like that's a powerful thing too.
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: And that came.
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: Both of those people got over 25 years in the fire department and both of them worked for fire departments that got over 20 fire stations, and it's like, yeah, we have to do something different.
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: But I think it probably aligns with something you said that 70 or 80% increase in these sprinkler buildings being put up all over the country and we're seeing a spike in the events that were going there, just because there's gonna be events.
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: And now there's sprinkler systems and we're just not as familiar with it as you know that we really should be.
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: So I think it's though it's not new.
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: I think whatever 1905, whatever the number was, that's irrelevant really, i guess, but it's not new.
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: It's something that we're just seeing more.
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: So it's on our radar.
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: So we're trying to do something with it And for us, if everybody leaves here with one thing and it makes a difference, then it's a win.
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: So yeah, absolutely.
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: And the good thing is to get the information out there, knowing that, hey, a Walmart store is different than a distribution center, a dollar general store is different than a Walmart.
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: It's like no one knows things.
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: A residential, a high rise, like we said, we don't want you to turn the sprinkler off in the distribution centers or those with automated retrieval systems.
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: It's like, let the sprinkler work until you know that you can get visibility and you can see.
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: But if you go to Hampton Inn and there's a e-cigarette on a bed and you walk in and it's like, hey, this fire is contained in the room of origin.
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: I got an inch and three quarter hose line in the hallway with a backup line at the stairs.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: Okay, let's go to each floor at the end of the hallway and shut that floor control valve.
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: Because when we shut the floor control valve off, open the main drain in that floor control valve, we'll stop the water damage and we won't ruin a bunch of rooms.
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: But when the Walmart's on fire and it's got flames licking the ceiling, everything in that thing's probably gonna be thrown out.
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: And so when you do that, it's like that's where we're putting on the burden that says, hey, don't get caught with your pants down.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: You can walk in the front of the store, see a fire in the back And it's like, whoa, i got this.
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: It's like, no, it's gonna get nasty and ugly in there in about 10 minutes And in that big box within a half hour or an hour you're gonna lose visibility in almost all of it.
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: You gotta plan for those things, but unfortunately which is good thing we don't have a lot of experience with operating in that environment.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: So we're getting more of that.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: We're trying to do some training.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: We have our valve trailers.
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: So we have a valve trailer in the Chicago land area, new Jersey, have one in Tennessee and one in Maryland, about to put one in Milwaukee.
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: So again, we're trying to get these out.
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: We're trying to work with fire departments also on their training centers to get them to where it's like okay, have your wet pipe and a dry pipe and a fire department connection So you can just get your people comfortable, so they're not intimidated when they pull up and say, oh, i'm not supposed to touch that.
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: It's like well, hey, there's times when we don't want you to touch it, but there's times when we want you to turn it off.
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: So how do you make the difference between that?
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: And I think this program has certainly been good to help us get that word out and making them hungry for more.
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: I wanna hit on something here that it's been floating across all the social media platform for the last couple of weeks about and it's a question kind of thing, but it's a question to get people to think of who.
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: The question is who is training your firefighters?
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: And most recently I think in the last few days, there was a question put out of who's training your chiefs or command staff.
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: And I think that's something to be careful with.
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: And for us, if we're talking about sprinkler buildings, we want the National Fire Sprinklers Association, people there that know about the system, right, and there's a lot of things going on out there with well, if you have pull up and there's a fire pump, don't hook to the fire department connection, and it's like well, who's saying that?
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: Where is that coming from?
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: What does that really mean?
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: And I mean there's somebody in this class that said that today.
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: Like, well, we were told that if there's a fire pump that we never hook to it, and it's like, well, how do you know what's really going on with the fire pump?
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: And you've hit on that a bunch of well, what happens when that thing shuts down?
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: or it's not really doing what it's supposed to, or somebody shut a valve.
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: And it's just taking me to the next thing, or something that has been said at all three or four of these workshops we've done with you.
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: All is well, when you pump the fire department connection, you're bypassing the pump anyway because you're pumping over the top of it.
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: Well, they didn't know that.
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: And when that question comes up, it's like well, who told you that?
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: So it just comes back to like who's training your firefighters?
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: Which just brings me back to the.
• 14:56
  Speaker 3: We should be connecting with the people who know and it's facts, not somebody out there who, for whatever reason, is spooing their opinion.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, same thing.
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: We heard somebody that taught a class in an area that said, hey, take, immediately, take out the scar lights.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: And it's like, hey, that's the futhers thing from the truth, right, you definitely do not want to do that in a sprinkler building.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: Same thing with the fire department connections.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: You know it's like don't hook to that.
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: It's a 2,500 gallon a minute pump in some of those, yeah, but some of them it's only a thousand gallon a minute pump.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: But you don't know, in the 2,500 gallon a minute or the thousand gallon a minute pump whether the system's been overrun or not.
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: And so we did the research.
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: We showed the videos today.
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: We did the research at X sprinkler in a typical occupancy that's a building with a mechanic shop.
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: And so it's like, hey, it activated.
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: We purposely had the system turned off and it activated all the sprinklers in the space.
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: But we put one, two and a half inch connection and within three minutes the fire was under control.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: And so it's like that's why you hook up.
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: It is there to supplement the capabilities that's already there.
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: And again, we're hearing more and more stories And if you're out there listening it's like share those stories with us.
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: We love to promote the success.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: Every Friday I put out an email called spotlight on sprinklers.
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: It goes to all of our members that again tries to dial the fire department into the sprinkler world and vice versa, right, so that the sprinkler people understand the fire.
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: Dan Madrakowski said Shane, you're the man in the middle here.
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: It's like you got the sprinkler folks who don't necessarily understand the fire And you have the fire folks who don't understand the sprinkler.
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: So it's like, hey, that's what I do every day.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: I get up as let's go bring that all together, cause, you know, we do have the solution.
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: We do have the solution to keep people from dining and buildings, and we have the solution to keep firefighters from dining and buildings And we dang sure can mitigate all of their exposures by getting water on the fire fast.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: And that again goes back to I was just in South Carolina and that goes back to Spartanburg burns.
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: It was nine years ago.
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: One of our instructors there shared Hey, here's a picture of you standing in the street nine years ago.
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: And I'm like and unfortunately we've had some firefighter fatalities since then I'm like they probably didn't even know about Spartanburg burns.
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: And when we do that, that's where I do take that personal.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: I'm like you know what?
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: We fail, we let them down.
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: But then I come here and I hear Hey, in Arizona we're still using thinking firefighters, which is from Spartanburg burns to train our firefighters here in Arizona as a state class.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: So I'm like say it's, it's working and we're all doing good.
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: We're just trying to get the message out and make a difference.
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: If we can save a firefighter, save some property and save some occupants, good for everybody.
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: I think you touched on it a little bit about firefighters being uncomfortable with either the um, the pump, or just how the system works.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: You have those trailers.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: What are, what's the objective of those trailers and how can someone access them for training at their department?
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So you can go online and see the trailers and put in a request for them.
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: Now, naturally, it's hard for us to fill all the requests we get, but we still like to do that reasonably.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: And again, the trailers are functional fire sprinkler systems.
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: So from the fire department connection you pull up, you hook up, you flow it.
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: The fire officer is standing in one room of the trailer.
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: He can see and access the valves, he knows what it's flowing, he knows the valves are either open or closed.
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: We can create a scenario to drop the pressure or change the pressure Firefighter in the next room, which simulates the stairwell, or where the control valves are in another part of the building.
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: And so again, we'd like to have the pump operator at the apparatus, fire officer at the riser, firefighter in the hallway, in the stand hallway or the stairwell, and then the incident commander in the command post that says, hey, what happened?
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: What happened?
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: I lost pressure or it's holding at 150 PSI.
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: Right, pull up, hook up at 150 PSI, unless there's a sign marking the building that says, hey, pump this at 230, pump it at 300, whatever the case is.
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: So that's where, again, those trailers and we get them out.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Our New Jersey team, our Chicago team.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: They've been doing that for a number of years, training on 13 E, nmp 13 E specifically.
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: So we're wanting to just spread that across the country and keep these trailers on the road So again we can mitigate the loss and, most of all, say firefighters lives.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: I do not want a firefighter dying in one of these buildings.
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: And if you want to see that trailer, october 5th and 6th we're going to have the trailer at the Hazard Zone Conference in Cincinnati, ohio, right, so they'll be probably on opportunity three or four times I think to run through that demonstration for people to see it there.
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: So if you're in that region or you're going to make it to the conference, that's another place you'd be able to see that work.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, come join us at the Hazard Zone Conference.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: We will have the trailer, it'll be functional.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: We'll pump it, we'll do a burn every time because the front of the trailer we can do a sprinkler burn so you can see it flow and then control the valves.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: Speaking of the Hazard Zone Conference, you're going to be there.
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: What else do you have on tap for people who are going to be there?
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we're going to talk about some of these big fires again in all different types of occupancies, from homes to high rises and everything in between.
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: Touch on a little bit of this latest research we're doing and give a little bit about where we think we're going.
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: The great thing with Shane is it's a topic that people are intimidated about, it's some engineering, but you break it down to the firefighter level in such a way.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: Today was eight hours that just flew by because you're talking to us as firefighters.
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: I really appreciate that.
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: One of the quotes and I wrote down a bunch of quotes today, but one of the great quotes when the building is on fire, you're going to be the last one to the show.
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: Don't ruin the ending.
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: Talk about that quote a little bit.
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: And what do you mean by?
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: that Well again, in some of these buildings, the owners have spent millions of dollars trying to protect their assets right And also to protect the workers that's in the building and also to protect the firefighters that have to respond to it.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: So that's where we have an obligation to know a little about those systems and how to function with them.
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: And the fire environment is so much different than it was a decade ago and it's going to be much different a decade from now, and so that's where it's so important that says hey, there's been somebody that's invested in this thing, it's on fire, there's an event in there, and we believe we have a fire a week in these type of facilities that the sprinklers contain the fire, so we know that they work.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: Our effectiveness rate, as I show, is over 96%, has been for 100 years, and so again, we want that training and interaction to know that says hey, make sure this show, as I say too, you didn't cause the fire, you didn't, you didn't create the environment that it's in those kind of things.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: Let's just make it all work.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: And, as we say, we do a program called partners in progress, that's fire sprinklers and firefighters and unbeatable team.
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: And when you combine us together.
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: Like I said, we got the solution.
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: Well, we know that you are close to Bruno.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: He loved you and talked about you all the time, and every show that we do, we do a timeless tactical truth.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: You want to hang out with this one, absolutely.
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: I remember, i remember those playoff nuggets.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: So our timeless tackle truth today is the eight of diamonds and it says the first five minutes can be worth the next five hours.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: The first five minutes can be so in your industry.
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: What does that mean to us?
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: Well, the first five minutes, again, fast water.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: We do everything and we use hashtag fastest water because it's like you can't beat us right, it's like we're already there, there's pipe, there's water.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: So, as I said today, here's some fire hose, here's a nozzle, i say.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: But I also say we are never saying that we replace the firefighter right, because, as I said today, we're here to control this event.
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: So it's control, not totally extinguish control.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: And so that's where the first five minutes get command established, get somebody to the riser, get somebody to identify where the fire is before you lose all visibility, and get somebody to the fire pump.
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: If there's a separate fire pump building and tank, get somebody that.
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: Make sure that'll determine the next five hours.
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: And over the next five hours, you know, the first 60 minutes, 90 minutes or two hours, depending on the building, is what's going to make a difference in that.
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: So you're going to need a lot of logistics and things, but also would add to that now that says if you mess up the first five minutes or the next five hours, you're going to be there for five days, and that's the last thing you want.
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: Because then the headline reads largest loss property loss in states history and nobody wants that fire on their hands you go to a lot of these fires after the fact and you know not, not to throw anybody onto the bus, but what are you finding when they are there?
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: the first five minutes are they.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: Are they going at this like it's a residential fire without a fire protection system, or where do you see the breakdown at that?
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: yeah, so the they are, you know, using standard operating procedures.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: I won't necessarily call it a house fire, but they're using their standard operating procedures, with pre-connected hose lines and those kind of things.
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: And hey, it's a thousand feet across the breadth of this building.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: It's like, all right, you're not going very far.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: So, again, that's where we're seeing and most people just don't know.
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: They just don't know that the system, that that sprinkler is flowing 250 gallons of water a minute, right, they're like whoa, i'm like, well, it's rated to flow at its pressure, 160 gallons a minute, but when the pump's flowing, pumping 177 psi, it's flowing way more water than that.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: And so they just don't know the fact that, hey, this thing's designed to run two hours by itself or in a walmart store.
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: Right, it's like there's going to be several of those sprinklers operate in that walmart store because the commodities have changed the configurations of how we put used to.
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: You could buy one roll of paper towels.
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: You can't hardly do that, no more.
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: Right, you're getting the double jumbo roll, right.
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: So that's where they're setting these places on fire the fireworks, the charcoal lighter, the.
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: That's where they're setting these buildings on fire and it takes several sprinklers to contain that, and it's not a very nice environment in there, and that's why we're advocating look, we don't want to kill anybody in these buildings because they don't have to die.
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: The system will hold this in check, but you will have to put it out yeah, you said something today and you've said it at every single class and it's it's.
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: It's funny, but it's really the truth.
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: The sprinkler system when that sprinkler system goes off because the fire is happening, and then we get notified there, the sprinkler system's calling from u2-8 lines already been stretched, water's on the fire, right?
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: the sprinkler system just saying, hey, i'm gonna need a little help here.
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: To finish mopping this thing up, which you know, i remember bruno saying that 15 years ago, when we go to these big boxes, we're the overhaulers, we're not, we are not like the 100 percent fire expression, we're the overhaulers at these events, and i'll never forget him saying over and over and over again sometimes, when you look at history, it might have been better if the fire department didn't show up.
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: And we've got some cases like where the fire department got called.
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: You know, on monday morning workers showed up, our building's full of smoke and there's water everywhere and the fire was on.
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: You know, saturday night, for whatever reason, the alarm system didn't notify or whatever, and sure enough, the fire was, you know, contained by the sprinkler system.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: So the sprinkler system i think it's just another way for us to think about it that when that sprinkler system goes off, the first line's already been stretched.
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: There's water on the fire which comes down to your you know the fastest water thing.
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: But i think the firemen out there, all of us officers, chiefs, whoever we got to think about that, that when there's water flowing already, that that's what buys us a little time to put together a plan.
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: What's this really look like?
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: because we're going to be there for a while.
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: Which lines back up for that?
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: what are we going to do in the first five minutes?
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: i ain't stretching a 200 foot cross, lay in there and solving this thing and being back at quarters for dinner, right you, we're going to be here for a little while, no matter what yeah, and, like our logo, we got a campaign called fire sprinklers.
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: By time, time buys life and that goes for us as firefighters too, because again it's going to be as we've seen in all those fires and i show video after video and picture after picture it's a nasty mess in there, even with a sprinkler fire.
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: So it's like we got to take that piece serious and even then, you know, i show those videos of the residential, of us doing the test burns with in conjunction with the energy code.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: This house is built of the energy code.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: It is nasty in there.
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: You're going to need to rescue people.
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: You're going to need to get to them and isolate yourself from the fire, probably get them out a window or something.
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: So it's a much different fire environment and that's where i think that, again, get on the scene, hook up, supply the system, get your people to the riser, find where the fire areas, isolate that area, make sure the pumps running if it's got a pump, if it's that big of a facility, all those things.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: So again, it seems pretty simple, but we're not used to operating in it and i can't encourage you enough get out there, meet the sprinkler contractors putting the sprinklers in the building.
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: Get with the building owners, their maintenance facility people, and work with them to know and understand your buildings and your systems, because they're all there to help you well, we will put a link in our show notes so you can sign up for Shane's email that comes out on Friday.
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: We really look forward to seeing you in Cincinnati on October 5th and 6th, and these big box workshops are well worth it.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: I today was a wealth of information for me and i i know the class was riveted.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: I mean, it was eight hours and it went by like that.
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: So, shane, just thank you so much for the partnership with the national fire sprinkler association and for being here and and participating in this, because it really is helping move the fire service along glad to do it we got one last opportunity in 2023 to see the big box workshop.
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: It's in Loveland, colorado.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: I think there's maybe 19 seats left in it so you can go to bshiftercom if you want to sign up for that.
• 29:16
  Speaker 3: I'll be last the last big box class of 23 and then we're working on 24 dates to continue working with Shane and the national fire sprinkler association.
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: Continue sending this message, trying to make a difference yeah, come hang out with us, we'll have fun all right, thanks, shane.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: Thank you, we appreciate you.
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening to bshifter today.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: If you like the show, make sure you subscribe and tell your friends.
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: You can also sign up for the bshifter buck slip and hopefully we'll see you at the workshop, either in Loveland, colorado, or we'll see at the hazard zone conference in October.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: Until next time, thanks for watching and listening to bshifter.