Latest / Autoras de palabra con Rosa / Las coautoras Sara Gutiérrez y Eva Orúe: “Unos calcetines pudieron originar un conflicto internacional”

Transcript

Las coautoras Sara Gutiérrez y Eva Orúe: “Unos calcetines pudieron originar un conflicto internacional” · Autoras de palabra con Rosa

• 0:05
  Some socks were about to provoke an international conflict. Neither of the two protagonists
• 0:10
  of this story, his, had any objection to being arrested. After all,
• 0:15
  knowing the police station and its dungeons could well be part of my country
• 0:20
  ' s in- depth knowledge of the Transiberian, a personal history of the
• 0:25
  train that forged an empire Sala Gutiérrez and Eva urue in word authors with pink
• 0:29
  welcome, well supported. Thank you for inviting us, Thank you for inviting
• 0:33
  us, so thank you for inviting me to your house and for inviting me
• 0:39
  to get a little bit into your lives and how you came to ride in
• 0:43
  this Transiberian. But first I started with the subject of socks. Being accused
• 0:48
  of selling on the street is a very peculiar way of knowing oneself and saying
• 0:53
  that they serve us at the police station. At that time it was not
• 0:56
  so much to go to the Commission as because I knew that as soon as
• 1:03
  I mentioned it, they would leave, because it was evident that I was
• 1:07
  not a smuggler. I was selling nothing I didn' t drink. The
• 1:10
  story is that at that time, although there were open shops, the shops
• 1:15
  were often empty and people, even sometimes the dependents themselves, sold everything outside.
• 1:19
  We were left unknowing because we had met through friends to buy skils and
• 1:23
  I, who am a woman of foresight and zaragoza, went with my socks
• 1:26
  to try on the boots that I also had to buy. And then,
• 1:32
  when we got there, there was the whole shop window. Out there full
• 1:36
  of people selling anything, anything, and I mean, my socks and at
• 1:40
  that point they fell on my two cops and accused me of trying to sell
• 1:44
  socks on public radio. And Sara, who had been there for years and
• 1:51
  knew the percal very well and also that it had turned out well, went
• 1:53
  to Vestia with a mink coat, that that always impressed, because it came
• 1:57
  out in my defense and I spoke a Russian very dirty still. And yet,
• 2:00
  because he had the Russian leader in his hand in a pretty way,
• 2:04
  as if you did, you studied medicine, not obvious if you specialized in
• 2:08
  octomology, on the Soviet plane, you went there. Yes, in the
• 2:14
  first letter my grandmother said. Okay. It' s okay that I love
• 2:17
  you. I know you wanted to leave home, but so far was necessary.
• 2:22
  Well, yes, it was necessary out of curiosity, more than anything,
• 2:25
  that when the time came to make it a specialty, it seemed to
• 2:35
  me that the mirror filter was not interesting to me and that I wanted to
• 2:38
  do it outside. Besides, I' m from a city where ophthalmology is
• 2:40
  important. We have great ophthalmologists, an important saga and it was with whom
• 2:47
  I was and I thought that if I wanted to highlight because it didn'
• 2:53
  t belong to that nucleus, to that environment, it had to be for
• 2:59
  something that they didn' t have, and that could be training me,
• 3:02
  not in the United States, where I could go at any time, but
• 3:06
  somewhere strange. And since the Sobetic Union had a reputation for having very good
• 3:12
  octernology and the refractive surgeries of myopia correction began and, well, I wrote
• 3:20
  at the embassy to ask how it could go. I was told that only
• 3:27
  through a scholarship that they called just that month that if they gave it to
• 3:34
  me, because I could if it wasn' t impossible, I filled out
• 3:39
  the application papers. They gave me the scholarship and we didn' t doubt
• 3:44
  it for two seconds. The Professor had already managed to go to Italy,
• 3:47
  because that was when we were still there. He told me any title of
• 3:52
  Europe will also be worth in Spain, because we are about to unify everything.
• 3:57
  But I thought who wants to go to Italy. The Soviet Union could
• 4:00
  have, and I have no idea what it is or what it is doing
• 4:02
  there. You found more, much more Eva Zaragozana, who travels to Barcelona.
• 4:12
  You quit your radio job and went as a correspondent to London and Paris.
• 4:15
  You do a course at the University of Colorado and for a year you
• 4:19
  go through America just under a year. Something I lied about was the ultimate
• 4:21
  goal, but I stayed a little. I went out just robla and you
• 4:26
  ended up covering Justin' s referendum yes, and the project to open an
• 4:30
  office in Moscow. Yeah. The idea is that I joined up after that
• 4:31
  trip. I won' t say failed, because it was a delight,
• 4:34
  but it wasn' t a full year. I joined the team of a
• 4:36
  tracer in Madrid and was sent to cover a constitutional referendum that he did not
• 4:42
  organize at the end of April of the ninety- three and left with the
• 4:45
  task of finding out how much it could cost to open a co- responsibility.
• 4:47
  But no one told me they were thinking of me to occupy her.
• 4:51
  We' re talking about the end of April. I was covering the first
• 4:55
  of May of the ninety- three there and my birthday, which is the
• 4:57
  27th of May, I already celebrated it there as a correspondent. I mean,
• 5:00
  it was all super fast. I must say that a few days before
• 5:03
  I went to Russia, my radio had not yet decided whether to send me
• 5:08
  to Rome or Moscow, and I told them to send me where you want
• 5:12
  me what I want to get out of here. Not because I disliked my
• 5:13
  colleagues, which I didn' t like badly, but because I was on
• 5:15
  the night shift and after a few years of correspondent and a few months traveling
• 5:19
  to my air on the nights of the radio, the newsroom became very hard
• 5:25
  uphill and I didn' t want to shut up microsurgery eye, Marsa,
• 5:30
  your hospital tutor, vacation in Asturias and your mother who doesn' t understand
• 5:34
  anything. A lot of things. Yeah, my mom doesn' t understand
• 5:40
  anything and I didn' t understand anything. I didn' t think to
• 5:43
  see this woman either, she doesn' t understand me, because she doesn
• 5:44
  ' t understand me. Well, because, yes, it' s true.
• 5:46
  I dreamt in Russian already so that you could find dates and when I
• 5:55
  arrived in Oviedo, at the beginning of the holiday, I was always a
• 6:00
  little out of place the first few days and from a good morning to my
• 6:03
  mother and had the habit of bringing us an orange juice to bed. If
• 6:08
  I woke up and saw her there and said Javier, then that' s
• 6:12
  what you' re saying. But I don' t understand anything, and
• 6:15
  I thought my mother was already after two again, of course, two years
• 6:20
  goes by because I don' t understand myself and suddenly I realized that I
• 6:24
  also told her, but why don' t you understand me and that I
• 6:27
  was talking to her in Russian, I mean, that I really spent months
• 6:34
  and months there, in the first one in the Soviet Union, then in
• 6:39
  Russia alone, without talking to anyone in Spanish. In fact, until I
• 6:40
  did not know Eva, I had spoken very little to Spaniards a little,
• 6:46
  a few months earlier I had started to relate to people from the embassy And
• 6:54
  more to it because when I changed from Hardkov to Moscow, because I was
• 7:00
  afraid that I would see a war and I thought that I better catch myself
• 7:06
  near an international airport and I had already finished a cycle according to the training
• 7:12
  system there, I mean, everything fit more or less, because when I
• 7:18
  arrived at the Moscow hospital I was introduced as Sara, María Gutiérrez Torre and
• 7:25
  the one that was going to be my tutor. He said," Oh,
• 7:28
  how nice of you to have in Mary too We' re going to
• 7:34
  call you more because Sarah is a Hebrew man who didn' t like her
• 7:36
  much there" And that' s how he introduced me to everybody else you
• 7:40
  love, and then that sounds very familiar. You get a lot. He
• 7:44
  ' s very welcome. Then I didn' t give a damn, but
• 7:47
  there was a point there. Emma called you Gotty because of the last name.
• 7:51
  Yeah, I was used to it. He called me Goty and because
• 7:56
  I imagine that his sister' s name is Sara too, which is by
• 7:59
  chance. I was unique in school, unique in school. When I spoke
• 8:03
  to her sister, she also says no. I' ve never met so
• 8:05
  little like this with a six percent sar now. In my house I have
• 8:09
  even two nieces called Sala. We' re all Sara, but I didn
• 8:16
  ' t think if it was for not calling me as her sister, for
• 8:20
  keeping a distance, because it was going was quite distant, I would say
• 8:28
  Cold in the sense I don' t know, cold, not against,
• 8:31
  no, calculator wasn' t going to say it and I cut myself because
• 8:35
  not calculator, no, but I would calculate that distance to keep the distance
• 8:41
  at best, as if I eat in a way being cold for the other,
• 8:43
  being like sometimes too formal. Not this of treating people, of you
• 8:45
  shaking hands with these kinds of behaviors that mark a little distance from you that
• 8:50
  you don' t know very well how far you can go and where you
• 8:52
  don' t. And then he kept mutilating my name, i e I
• 9:01
  always said when I called some friend on the phone, it was always her
• 9:05
  laughing at everyone, because I was like a very educated girl and she called
• 9:09
  hello such and this franeta I am Sara Maria, always will Mary. And
• 9:11
  when we wrote the first book and I wanted to sign Sara to María Gutiérrez
• 9:18
  Torres, because what she eva and said to see is that you eat the
• 9:22
  whole cover. Let me leave Gutierrez and I, who am sentimental, I
• 9:26
  thought Sara Gutierrez, very correct. But Sara is my mother, Gutierrez,
• 9:31
  my father, enough for me, that is, she kept a distance.
• 9:37
  She' d say you' d have less of it In fact, it
• 9:41
  ' s reflected in the book, but she comes up with the brilliant idea
• 9:46
  of giving you an eye stuck in a jar of good jam. You'
• 9:46
  ve made a gesture that looks like the boat I said is that I mean,
• 9:50
  but it was a little boat of that' s like that little hotel
• 9:54
  jam. Yes, then I had one, I lived in a building where
• 9:58
  there were other journalists and other foreigners, and then one day he showed up
• 10:03
  in the office with this little boat, with his white and red paintings,
• 10:07
  which is like I don' t know snack in the field and told me
• 10:11
  I have a gift and I saw him I thought he brought me honey or
• 10:15
  jam and what came inside a precise eye, a human eye. I don
• 10:20
  ' t know what was out of control at that clinic that allowed you to
• 10:24
  pull out human eyes, but a certain strike control adds. But the end,
• 10:28
  what has already been done is an eye. Obviously I was going to
• 10:31
  serve no one, but she brought it to me to do what she thought
• 10:35
  was a gift and I was still heights of product that was to show me
• 10:41
  the very exactly the lens. Then he pulled it out of the jar and
• 10:46
  proceeded to open it and pull out the crystalline and the poor water. He
• 10:48
  was gorgeous. The lens is a beauty, but you also say that the
• 10:52
  elbow is handsome and neither after seeing it or seeing it. But in the
• 10:54
  end it is clear then, that is, it appreciates, it appreciates parts
• 10:58
  of that anatomy, but not the reasons, that we are all trapped.
• 11:01
  Yeah, but it was as a gift, it was frankly original. Yeah,
• 11:03
  yeah, well, I had what was on hand. I wasn'
• 11:07
  t trying everything, but not that there are more used gifts, but that
• 11:11
  one I think must be something punic. You receive the award for the best
• 11:16
  Spanish journalistic work abroad. From the International Press Club. You speak above all
• 11:20
  for your knowledge of politics and you speak also of the Russian soul. You
• 11:24
  knew all that very well. I' d say when I got here I
• 11:33
  came so hurriedly without speaking a word of Russian. The first months are always
• 11:35
  to adapt, to adapt. In May, June July I went on vacation.
• 11:41
  Then I went back to Lithuania with the Pope with John Paul II.
• 11:43
  See if long ago and immediately it' s Yells' desatonous hell without bombarding
• 11:50
  Parliament' s bomb order a few crazy weeks ago, let' s say
• 11:54
  I did an accelerated training. He didn' t hesitate to say that in
• 11:56
  the sense of October. I dare not say that I understood very well in
• 12:00
  the Russian soul, what I do believe is that at a very difficult time,
• 12:03
  besides, when there were still no mobile phones as usual. Therefore,
• 12:07
  covering this situation is difficult from outside your home. I had, on the
• 12:11
  one hand, the courage to do so, and perhaps I told him well
• 12:18
  after the luck of having companions who were left with each other and who were
• 12:22
  generous. Rafa Pock of the vanguard, Rafa Manzano of the chain, is
• 12:26
  Ricardo Ortega, of Antena three, with whom he enters the Parliament. With
• 12:31
  Ricardo I went through a kind of demonstration that ended up in the television shoot
• 12:35
  and with all of them I learned every day. And then I was lucky
• 12:39
  that this is good radio. I came from before I was Corsponsal. He
• 12:43
  had never worked in news he had worked with Luis del Olmo in a masí
• 12:48
  and Luis, who was then on zero wave, was a person who appreciated
• 12:52
  the value of the information told as if it were not information. It was
• 12:56
  more about counting your neighbor, your friend, and I think the radio played
• 13:00
  a very essential role there. Let' s just say that, saving all
• 13:05
  the distances, you can remember what happened on the 23rd ephe. Radio is
• 13:07
  much more than a medium of information. She' s family and you listen
• 13:11
  to her in bed and you listen to her in the bathroom and you listen
• 13:13
  to her in the kitchen. So what I was telling other comrades was also
• 13:16
  being told, but perhaps I was telling them about my training or about my
• 13:20
  training. I think I was right to explain, if you' ll allow
• 13:24
  me the expression very much to the bollocks, what was going on and I
• 13:28
  think that was it. It was the reason for the recognition in a simple
• 13:33
  normal way. What you' re saying is, I' ve been going
• 13:33
  on just like that. Yeah, press newspaper journalists are people who need to
• 13:37
  write a lot of words, give a lot of information on the radio is
• 13:41
  something else. I mean, there' s information, of course, you
• 13:43
  can' t lie of course you can' t, but there' s
• 13:48
  a lot of feeling too and I' ve never defined myself as a journalist,
• 13:50
  you' re a journalist. Yeah, I studied journalism, but I
• 13:54
  ' m not an investigative journalist. He hasn' t done parliamentary journalism.
• 13:56
  What I think I do well is to tell the things that and that space
• 14:01
  in which we were living that moment was ideal for this ability. The comments
• 14:07
  that you count after that award. I leave it to readers who are also
• 14:11
  very curious about some perhaps distracted maps. The word Siberia is spelled over an
• 14:18
  extension that occupies more than three quarters of the present Russian Federation and covers seven
• 14:22
  hourly uses. The question is what you make. There' s Siberia.
• 14:28
  The short answer is no, or at least not what we believe. When
• 14:33
  we think, I think everyone says Siberia and you think about white extension,
• 14:37
  Asian Russia. Basically and administratively, it has never been so and now,
• 14:43
  of course, no lois. The furthest area from Moscow is called the Far
• 14:46
  East and Siberia is the central zone. That is why Siberia does exist,
• 14:52
  but there is no Siberia, the mythical Siberia, the Siberia that we all
• 14:56
  have in our heads. It doesn' t exist on real maps, on
• 14:58
  official maps. Thursday, August 11, 1990, ninety- four, at
• 15:03
  14 hours, you left Moscow because you propose a trip. Yes, because
• 15:11
  I was running out of time in May and had already been given the title
• 15:15
  that I had to help, or I already had the papers I needed to
• 15:18
  approve the title in Spain and the visa expired in December, with which I
• 15:26
  had a margin there to be in the country. But little more. And
• 15:31
  eva then, well, I had not just given clear signs that it could
• 15:37
  be the future and I thought that doing the Transberian could be a good thing
• 15:43
  and I proposed it with the thing that it stings. Okay. You'
• 15:50
  re reporting, not Moscow. You' re reporting on Russia and you know
• 15:54
  the surrounding area. But this is a sample and surely bad. Or what
• 15:58
  the country really is. Why don' t you throw yourself and make the
• 16:04
  trans- Brian of Moscow talks about Goostok and, at the same time,
• 16:08
  I thought that so many hours of train, even if we did it in
• 16:15
  sections to go that way to get to know the country, going down in
• 16:19
  the cities that seemed to us a priori and more interesting, because, that
• 16:26
  so many hours of train had to give to talk and finally and to clarify
• 16:30
  a little, to know us and see what could be that future that I
• 16:30
  wanted and that I didn' t see very clear. Gamezunes. It is
• 16:34
  true that no capital is representative of the country. If you come to Spain
• 16:38
  and Minis to Madrid, you can say that you have been to Spain,
• 16:41
  but you don' t know Spain, right, yes, because compusi obviously
• 16:45
  happened the same. It' s a huge country. The Transiberian has from
• 16:48
  Moscow to God a touch of one thousand two hundred and eighty- eight kilometers.
• 16:52
  Interestingly, some more makes the inverse path ten, which is a curve,
• 16:56
  yes, but some more rivers, Yes, a lot of hourly uses
• 17:00
  and you go from Europe to Asia, you go from Moscow or the zaa
• 17:06
  Petersburg, or are Petersburg very much like the Nordic countries, because you go
• 17:10
  towards something that looks a lot like Japan, which has Japan practically a stone
• 17:14
  ' s throw, and the road is more exciting. I think that,
• 17:17
  from a cultural and political point of view, that it is landscape, yes,
• 17:21
  landscape has no greater among that you spend many hours at night than if
• 17:26
  it is winter, that I would want to be winter, but well,
• 17:30
  I guess it is all white, that is that image that we have,
• 17:33
  but when we saw it, because it was all yellow green, that is,
• 17:38
  it was not green either. But yes, it is true that culturally
• 17:42
  and politically it was being very different, because some brushstrokes of the sounding facts
• 17:52
  and Katerimburg is the city in which they had shot alzar and his family took
• 18:00
  away his name was Sviarblogs and so put our Moscow ticket in the Espiar Logsk
• 18:08
  because they had changed the name of the city quickly, because they were already
• 18:17
  doing very prozaros and already in the place where they had been and the house
• 18:23
  Hipatiev that had ruined it and had ruined the whole neighborhood so that people did
• 18:27
  not locate it, because there they were already planning to build a church in
• 18:36
  honor or hunger. It is said that because of the attack, because of
• 18:40
  the shooting, it was a city that was in all the chronicles, it
• 18:45
  was said very mafiosa and yes, there was an atmosphere. I, too,
• 18:45
  was going from Moscow with that atmosphere that you went to a bar and
• 18:49
  you had to go through a metal control to see if you were carrying weapons
• 18:55
  and there were places to leave the gun like the one that leaves the backpack
• 19:00
  and almost chairs of these. There was that ambientillo. Why, because there
• 19:03
  was a lot of industry there and when the Soviet Union fell, well,
• 19:10
  all that wealth was left in the hands of those who were running the factories
• 19:15
  and so on, and logically, came people who wanted it and because there
• 19:18
  was an important power vacuum, because also people who thought they could cover it.
• 19:23
  When we arrived in Ircus, there was a sad, nostalgic Soviet atmosphere,
• 19:30
  a lot of drunk, a lot of trisi very much not to understand
• 19:36
  what had happened. But we got to the north of Baikal and that was
• 19:40
  the Soviet Union. I told him here you have the time capsule of what
• 19:45
  it is were people who had just been trapped there, in a place in
• 19:48
  nowhere, because they had gone from enthusiastic young people in the seventies, twenty
• 19:53
  years before we passed, that is, not so much to build a second
• 19:59
  trans Siberian world, and the fall of the Soviet Union left them there with
• 20:03
  the train already built. But if he knows what to do or where to
• 20:07
  throw and then the rest of the trip. Well, then, you'
• 20:11
  re moving away from Europe and you' re getting to what looks like another
• 20:18
  wing of the country that' s an Asian wing, but not China,
• 20:22
  it' s Japan. Basically, there' s a good part of the
• 20:26
  final route that' s stuck to the border with China and then I tell
• 20:30
  you what' s in front of Japan. But the influence we saw Japanese,
• 20:33
  yes, as at that time. Yes, for example, in it
• 20:36
  I say these many cars carried the steering wheel to the right, but a
• 20:38
  traffic code that applied to himself and it was simply because they bought second-
• 20:42
  hand cars from the Japanese and one thousand two hundred and eighty- eight kilometers
• 20:48
  from Moscow they didn' t care what he said in the rules of circulation.
• 20:49
  That' s where they did whatever they wanted. That' s probably
• 20:52
  the most interesting part, people' s eyes. According to Ibais, coming
• 20:57
  to the different stages, on the one hand, the people who avoided there
• 21:00
  and, on the other hand, the people who traveled with you are also
• 21:03
  different looks. Yeah, and we were traveling with quite a few Russians.
• 21:07
  But and orally, not turist. I don' t mean people, because
• 21:11
  that' s right, people who were on the train, who were traveling,
• 21:15
  that' s to get around, out of need or maybe, there
• 21:21
  were also people on vacation, because it was summer, but well, family
• 21:23
  home. Or yes. It is important to remember that there are no roads,
• 21:29
  there were no roads on that road and that, in addition, the
• 21:30
  trains are complicated, because, in fact, there are trans- Siberian trains,
• 21:36
  several trans- Siberian lines, but from north to south, for example,
• 21:37
  there is practically nothing. Moving is something that was done and I guess
• 21:41
  it' s still done basically by plane. And although everything was a pile,
• 21:45
  a peculiar, good, peculiar and very common view of it, the
• 21:48
  truth was that of the Prabatnitz. There' s one that' s like
• 21:55
  a reviewer, but it' s more than a reviewer and a person who
• 21:57
  always takes care of a car and takes good care that everyone stays clean or
• 22:04
  adequate and that people also stay in order. Passengers and, for example,
• 22:10
  the last journey from Ircusa, not from Ircus A to javaros. Yes,
• 22:18
  we were going to ask Jussa for javaros, but what he proposed was that
• 22:25
  next door, in the compartment next door, two sailors were traveling to talk
• 22:27
  about Bostock, that they had two days and a peak, I don'
• 22:32
  t remember how much of a journey and that man who were bored and that
• 22:37
  we too had to go bored because we were already going with her day and
• 22:42
  a half and that finally the boys asked Jorda for that because we didn'
• 22:48
  t pass and when we told her that we didn' t. And so,
• 22:48
  she didn' t just understand it like saying these two breeches that she
• 22:52
  catches my young man like her with these two chicks, which is true that
• 22:56
  they were two nice and handsome guys, but anyway it wasn' t the
• 23:00
  plan of the moment and she made me good that kind of thing. Yeah,
• 23:04
  well, since we' re here, life' s still on the
• 23:08
  train. However, it is continuous and good, you speak also within what
• 23:12
  was the train, a restaurant wagon that was not the conditions in which it
• 23:15
  was traveling. It' s if the restaurant wagon existed there was restaurant restaurant,
• 23:25
  novel, but the funniest thing is that we were getting along because it
• 23:27
  actually had a lot more grace once we saw that here and didn' t
• 23:30
  know at all to see. It wasn' t because it was always closed,
• 23:33
  yes, or it had things, but the car existed, it was
• 23:37
  and it was. We got off at the train stops because it was full
• 23:41
  of slugs and children many times that came to sell the products and it made
• 23:45
  us more funny because, by the way, you talked and commented something and
• 23:49
  ate varied and more, but the best, the best. It was one
• 23:52
  of the times we went to the restaurant wagon and it was full, but
• 23:56
  to the top of sweet sun and blood products. The be of those who
• 24:00
  sell in glass bottles with a duck' s head or something in alpaca or
• 24:03
  but I don' t think it' s silver. No. Those people
• 24:07
  used the restaurant wagon for their own business, for almag there was no police
• 24:11
  and not for learning. Well, it was there for that, but I
• 24:18
  could really outrage you because you were hungry and you couldn' t eat and
• 24:21
  you couldn' t have breakfast. But it was very much the country,
• 24:23
  that is, yes, the country was falling apart and people managed. If
• 24:27
  you think about it, I had all the logic and they didn' t
• 24:30
  offend you. And it' s like and not because we were used to
• 24:34
  it and, for example, we came across the trans- Mongolian in no
• 24:40
  Gosh and Birs and there was a flea market there mounted with people half-
• 24:45
  body outside the windows, those who came from China, mainly in clothes.
• 24:49
  And well, it had to be daily, because people looked, touched,
• 24:56
  bought, heard, looked at in another, in another car, in another
• 25:00
  baon, and it was something that we were very used to too much that
• 25:04
  people went to China for so much merchandise, and that was good for everyone,
• 25:11
  because so much for the people who had, then, an increasingly low
• 25:15
  income, because there was brutal inflation, daily growth, daily to get some
• 25:19
  bitches out with what they brought and sold. But also for those of us
• 25:29
  who were there. We needed some things that there was nothing. Then it
• 25:33
  was to go to the markets to see who had gone to China. And
• 25:37
  I had brought you, because chalk kills cockroaches, that there were many cockroaches
• 25:41
  and it was a fundamental product such things and clothes fundamentally also, but above
• 25:48
  all cleaning products, this kind of basic things that someone had to provide you
• 25:56
  and that there was before talking about the part of the documentation, because you
• 26:00
  also talk about how it was built, the difficulties, the difficulties to build
• 26:06
  the train, the people who died prisoners. Well, it wasn' t
• 26:11
  easy. But there' s one detail that' s funny to me.
• 26:12
  Speaking of products I had. Vodka doesn' t prove it, nor does
• 26:17
  the baron colony give it not to be once you had to take it for
• 26:26
  good stuff, because I have a relationship left. That' s why to
• 26:32
  cheat thank you. It will always be a serious word, one of these
• 26:37
  most striking. In a country I insist that it was the Russia of ninety
• 26:41
  - four, and it was a Russia that was completely outstanding at the time.
• 26:45
  A bottle of no crime, a little bit smaller vodka was cheaper than
• 26:48
  a loaf of bread and a fetching bottle is warmer than a loaf of bread.
• 26:52
  He thinks it' s a lot more expensive a little bit later without
• 26:55
  going over the same guy. But there was some kind of belief that vodka
• 26:57
  was the barsa. So to go you were listening on the radio that there
• 27:02
  had been a nuclear leak somewhere and that people were distributing vodka but throwing it
• 27:04
  over the furniture. But I was either listening or they were telling you not
• 27:08
  to freeze your breeze cleaner. We didn' t have a car for a
• 27:12
  partner who did. Instead of water. It is necessary to lay down a
• 27:15
  mouth that does not freeze or so that in order to speak closings, i
• 27:19
  e vodka served for anything and I did not like it without liking what makes
• 27:26
  a couple say at social meetings, because it is not the ontigo that get
• 27:30
  drunk or pass to another dimension in which you will never be, but above
• 27:33
  all because the way to drink in Russia is substantially different. As we drink
• 27:37
  here, someone rises there, they serve all the people. At the same
• 27:41
  time it is given and drunk. And if you don' t drink,
• 27:45
  then you can' t been' s done something and I' m not
• 27:51
  really clear if they didn' t have all the grades that vodka has.
• 27:52
  I wouldn' t care for the taste. It was hard to stand up
• 27:56
  after drinking something and I didn' t like it like that and they looked
• 28:00
  at me a little bit like a weirdo, but time they filled my gaps
• 28:06
  with but good to see if they hadn' t been like that, well
• 28:11
  it' s the fluency of the Russian. It comes from there I perfected
• 28:12
  it with the Brindis for the friendship of the peoples then. But the truth
• 28:22
  is that we went to Chernoby and that was already in the ninety- six
• 28:26
  and there Eva already let herself be remeasured. Yes, yes, because the
• 28:30
  gentleman told him that he almost took an eye out of them with the jaijer
• 28:36
  counter This one that the best was for those I used to, to remove
• 28:38
  the gels before, and I was going to say we encouraged you yes.
• 28:41
  The question of whether we were entering the Chernoby nuclear power station, in that
• 28:45
  area and at the entrance of the exits were subject to what they said was
• 28:48
  an extremely anal test. They charged you for that and then on the way
• 28:52
  out the team that passed us the count was drunker than I' ve ever
• 28:56
  been in my life and with a lot of conviction hhh. Or a lot
• 29:00
  of sparse people, they insisted that it was best to drink vodka. And
• 29:03
  then, when we came to our house where we were working together at night,
• 29:06
  we were going to Sarah Loamerino or at the time of the Catalan newspaper
• 29:11
  and myself. Well, indeed, baby and vodka. I don' t
• 29:15
  know if it was the first time, because if there was any lactim,
• 29:22
  we said the tremendous documentation that you have in the book of the whole History
• 29:29
  and it is very dotted with book covers, both authors pardon Spanish udictors and
• 29:33
  Russian authors. I think that part of being doesn' t say hard,
• 29:36
  but it' s super rich. I take this opportunity to say that I
• 29:41
  always say that it is a gift. That is, when there is a
• 29:42
  documented book, the reader does not value the gift you make and more we
• 29:48
  would have wanted to document it. Uh yes, we would have liked Russia.
• 29:51
  Yes, but this one gave the war exactly. The point is that
• 29:53
  there are many books about the Transiberian, many in Spain and abroad, but
• 29:59
  many of them all. There are some spectacular ones where a lot of Russian
• 30:02
  documentation is handled. In many of them no, all sources of information are
• 30:06
  Western, which allows you to give an idea of what happened, but probably
• 30:11
  not the most complete idea here to see the feeling of construction. I think
• 30:15
  it' s the one we caught with that. And then, when we
• 30:18
  started working, once we decided not to go to Russia because we didn'
• 30:22
  t want to go to a country that was invading another country in which we
• 30:25
  have friends. Some sources of information were also closed on the Internet. You
• 30:30
  can access things worse for everyone, but there were many that were still open
• 30:33
  and here we were lucky that, understanding Russian, sometimes make an effort that
• 30:36
  we would have been able to make, because many of the documents that we
• 30:38
  have studied or analyzed or read are in ancient Russian. As if of product
• 30:44
  you are given to the Spanish of the seventeenth century. Maybe you do understand,
• 30:45
  but it did seem relevant to us. Let' s say not repeat
• 30:52
  everything everyone has said, but rely on slightly alternative sources and then enrich that
• 30:56
  alternative thing with some peculiarities. For example, the newspapers we quote from Spain
• 31:03
  are never from Madrid or Barcelona. They are all newspapers of provinces, of
• 31:07
  Palencia, of Mahón, of Gerona, even of the postcard what is called
• 31:11
  the post office of Havana, the media or the newspaper of the post office
• 31:14
  of the Vara. Why, Because what we wanted was to reflect to what
• 31:17
  extent the construction of the Siberian trans was done there, but it was lived
• 31:22
  all over the world and, moreover, lived with passion, It was served
• 31:25
  with authentic passion what was happening, what Russia was doing, which was something
• 31:29
  monumental and literature. Necessarily why, First, because we are book people,
• 31:33
  whether we like books or because we like to read. Third, because Russian
• 31:37
  literature is spectacular. And fourth, and no less important, because when something
• 31:41
  came into everyday life and therefore, literature is ended. That' s one
• 31:47
  more time, that means to what extent. It is that the Transiberian,
• 31:48
  the Siberian line, is much more than a train and that is why it
• 31:53
  appears in works of the greatest of Russian and Soviet literature and even before the
• 31:57
  Transberian existed. Many other Toysky Tolstoi, who lived the Transberian or Googol,
• 32:05
  talk about trains, because the trains were revolution everywhere. Of course, but
• 32:10
  in Russia, much greater progress was made in the field of talmology. There
• 32:17
  came a time when you had to decide whether to progress, continue or live
• 32:22
  openly with Eva and add a sunflower. Someone or you showed up with a
• 32:29
  sunflower that they sold at one of the stalls. You did, yes,
• 32:31
  well, that I had found very pretty this part there were solas suns there
• 32:37
  and I was reminded of when I was little that my father didn' t
• 32:40
  bring them to us and we put them and face them, although it didn
• 32:44
  ' t give us time to dry anything. And then we thought that the
• 32:45
  window could be like a TV and that well, because we already ate them
• 32:49
  looking out the window. And yes, there I started to see that I
• 32:54
  don' t know how we relaxed more on the train, although we had
• 33:00
  been seeing each other for seven months and so on but I saw that a
• 33:06
  relationship was possible and that Eva, even if she didn' t show it
• 33:10
  by giving her an IpO Holtzin, also saw it. And there, even
• 33:15
  though I had thought about it a long time before and was going to have
• 33:22
  that problem all my life, something changed in Russia and it was perhaps the
• 33:28
  one that came from living years without social conditioning that knew me on the street,
• 33:35
  without anyone worrying about who I was, more than that of the name,
• 33:38
  which was easily solved. And I thought that that I liked that because
• 33:44
  I was going to have to avoid my relationships that were not second- class,
• 33:47
  that they were not shameful or embarrassing and that if I was going to
• 33:57
  be with Eva, because Eva would say good, there is one. I
• 33:59
  believe that the period itself that the arts are thus a little more tolerant,
• 34:04
  although I am not very clear either. She wasn' t very clear either
• 34:07
  and, in fact, we kept a long time, a good fiction,
• 34:12
  a long time, not months later still a fiction that was absurd, because
• 34:15
  everything was obvious. But I knew that professionally I wasn' t going to
• 34:23
  be a low- profile person and I wasn' t going to be allowed
• 34:30
  to society either, I wasn' t going to allow myself to self-
• 34:35
  censor and I wasn' t going to allow myself to move forward. And
• 34:37
  that it was either a brilliant career or a happy life and I chose it
• 34:45
  was happy, which is like the happiness of fools. But because I also
• 34:50
  gave you this journalist interviews, I have s good, you have to survive
• 34:55
  and eat, because it was worth it, the trip, the decision.
• 34:59
  And I' m going to finish up one thing about your mother, your
• 35:01
  mother, that' s like what your grandmother likes is the one that led
• 35:05
  you to read. He didn' t tell you that if it had been
• 35:08
  her, he would have walked to Russia. Yeah, always give me the
• 35:12
  oes. You went not walking, but you went. My grandmother always told
• 35:15
  me if I had been studied, Russia would walk a way of saying that
• 35:19
  if she had been given a chance to study. And when I told him
• 35:23
  that I had been given the scholarship, the first thing he said to me
• 35:28
  was you see how you studied base by plane. It was his pleasure,
• 35:32
  the truth. Thank you very much and I hope we like that you liked
• 35:37
  it. It' s a treat. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We
• 35:39
  had a lot of doubts, uh, but I mean, we were very
• 35:43
  clear about what we wanted to do, because I was very clear about what
• 35:46
  I wanted to tell, that it was fundamentally about this. Although we'
• 35:49
  re fine, in the latter, I don' t mean in the last
• 35:52
  of life, but well, the problem of the relationship, no, but
• 35:58
  of the problem maybe a few years ago I wouldn' t have talked about
• 36:04
  the stay, the distance, that were normal lives, normal people, but
• 36:10
  that were cut off by some social conditionings. So I basically wanted to use
• 36:17
  the trip to count. That was my main object and evades the part of
• 36:22
  history, construction, literature. Yes, yes, because, but we didn
• 36:25
  ' t know if it would fit what we said before that much has been
• 36:30
  written about the Transberian in Spain, not especially. There are some books,
• 36:36
  but it is not in the country, in the United States, in England,
• 36:39
  of course, in Chosia, but it is a train, I have
• 36:43
  said several times that it is more than a train when in Spain the bird
• 36:46
  is inaugurated, Spain changes, because imagine what it is in a country like
• 36:51
  Russia, in which the Zais had never visited in the Siberian area, which
• 36:57
  means that they can go without getting off a train. The work is with
• 37:00
  all its defects, with all the cruelty, with all the pain. The
• 37:05
  work is to magnify itself and change the country and as the country changed it
• 37:09
  changed us all, because there were political, economic, military effects. So,
• 37:15
  to write the Transiberian history, the history not of the nails that were
• 37:20
  put on, the rails that were planted or the ballast that was sown,
• 37:22
  but the political and social history of the Transberian, is, to some extent,
• 37:28
  to take a back trip to tell why we are, how we are
• 37:31
  and why the things that happen happen. Moreover, it is that the Transberian
• 37:35
  still has political, economic and social consequences and, of course, military in
• 37:40
  Russia and today' s world. So, if it serves at least to
• 37:44
  look a little bit at how it started, because it followed and how we
• 37:49
  got to where we are, because we will be satisfied in the historical part
• 37:52
  and then the person is clear. Thank you very much for the lack of
• 37:58
  sight for the book a pleasure. Thanks to you. Thank you so much, ros,