Latest / Coffee People Podcast / Coffee Smarter: Barista Competitions

Transcript

Coffee Smarter: Barista Competitions · Coffee People Podcast

0:00
Like, hey everyone, if you like the roast West Coast coffee
0:03
podcast, you might also appreciate the, I like, beer the
0:06
podcast, listening to these guys is like being a fly on the wall
0:10
of the pub with a few of your favorite mates.
0:11
Having a pint these professional beer appreciators, have plenty
0:15
of stories to share on everything from the mating
0:18
habits of penguins to there behind the scenes Brewery
0:21
experiences check out the, I like beer the podcast where
0:24
ever, you are listening to this show about coffee or head.
0:27
To, I like beer, the podcast.com Hey, good morning everyone.
0:46
Welcome to season 4 episode 15 of the roast West Coast coffee
0:50
podcast. I'm Ryan Walt.
0:53
And this is the show where I bring you the stories of coffee
0:56
professionals, entrepreneurship and coffee education, Chris
1:00
O'Brien, the founder and head roaster of coffee cycle,
1:02
roasting in Pacific Beach. California is back this week to
1:06
talk about Barista competitions, at least.
1:09
I was the plan for the show but as he and I often do we got off
1:13
on more than a few tangents and this episode goes from the world
1:17
of coffee competition. Into the economic impacts and
1:20
innovations that come out of those competitions.
1:22
And then that topic leads us into some social justice issues
1:27
before we wind our way back around to the competition
1:30
landscape. It's a lot and there will be a
1:33
bunch of extra info or clarifying content on roast
1:35
westcoast.com. You can always go there after
1:38
listening to These shows to get Recaps Coffee News, clarifying,
1:42
content coffee education and updates from our roast industry.
1:46
Partners, if you are stoked on this show and you do feel coffee
1:51
smarter after listening to it, please consider subscribing to
1:54
the newsletter so you don't miss any future shows.
1:58
Right now, take a big sip of your coffee.
2:00
I hope it's a good one because it is time to get coffee Smarter
2:04
with Chris O'Brien of coffee cycle.
2:06
Roasting on the roast West Coast coffee pot.
2:09
It cast. I feel like I feel like a dad
2:25
you know it's like everything I do.
2:27
I'm just tired and I don't have the energy for it.
2:29
I just do it anyway. You know you kind of look like a
2:32
dad to Let's is think I'm getting fat.
2:35
No, I'm just saying like you know it's the middle of the
2:39
afternoon gets t-shirt on you're just kind of lounging, you're
2:43
yawning. It's It's middle of the day
2:46
seems really bad like to me, I don't know.
2:48
It's very real, huh? You kind of have kids.
2:51
You got your employees. They feel like it's a lot of the
2:54
time we do. Did you notice?
3:00
I got a haircut. I you never noticed any more
3:05
Chris, you know. It's a little picture you know.
3:10
Honestly I thought you grew hair.
3:12
That's what I thought. And it's I feel like we're
3:16
growing apart. Chris, I feel like we're growing
3:18
apart. You don't even comment when I
3:21
get a nice haircut. You don't even notice when I do
3:24
have are Welcome back to roast West Coast Chris.
3:31
Maybe it's not just one-sided, you know, Ryan, maybe, maybe I
3:34
don't feel like, you know, you think I'm pretty anymore.
3:38
Chris, you've never gotten a haircut and just because I said,
3:40
you looked like a dad doesn't mean, I don't think you're not.
3:43
You're not pretty. Thank you.
3:44
Thank you. I appreciate.
3:46
You're welcome. I'm not committing to saying
3:48
that I do think you're pretty either because I feel like being
3:52
a little attitude he about it. Thanks.
3:55
Thanks for coming to help us get well, it's coffee smarter but I
4:00
actually wrote coffee smarter in the email.
4:03
So that's kind of indicates all. This is going today.
4:08
Strong starts with a very strong.
4:11
We can, we can edit this out. Are you saying that wasn't
4:13
deliberate? Honestly, I don't know if it was
4:16
or not. Well, maybe there's a, we're in
4:19
the Multiverse and this is how they smell.
4:21
This mouse spell. This is how this is, how they do
4:28
coffee smarting smartening in that Universe.
4:32
I would like to talk to you about Barista competitions.
4:35
Chris you mentioned something to me when I saw you for a cup of
4:38
coffee the other day about them in particular?
4:42
Well, for starters, we should explain what they are and from
4:45
their kind of go into how they impact the industry at large,
4:50
either through Innovation or Spreading the word about the
4:55
skill of the Barista and also is it.
4:58
I always say, I alternate between Barista and Barista
5:03
preference. Hmm.
5:04
I mean, I don't, I don't have a preference, you know.
5:07
People ask me how to pronounce things all the time and say, you
5:09
know, what is, what how do you say that Ethiopia coffee over
5:12
there? What's the name of that Mill?
5:14
And say, I'm not Ethiopian, I don't know.
5:17
I'm not Italian. I don't know how to say Barista
5:19
Barista. I know what I've been told and
5:21
And maybe that's wrong. I said Barista.
5:24
I don't know if I'm right. Well, let's start by describing
5:27
for the audience that is listening.
5:29
Intently, if they haven't, they haven't left by now.
5:34
After the first few minutes of the show, they're definitely
5:36
listening intently, what is a barista competition.
5:40
Well, you know one of the reasons I wanted to talk about
5:43
and you know you usually come up with the topics for discussion
5:47
on this is as I'm working or in the cafe.
5:51
And you know if a barista competition is mentioned or
5:53
comes up just because it's something sort of in our
5:56
industry at a certain level, I often get a lot of surprise from
6:00
customers. That just have no idea that this
6:01
is, this is even a thing and it's not just a thing.
6:04
There's there's all kinds of different levels to it and
6:07
different types of Rista or coffee competitions in So the
6:13
there's tasting competitions, there's the Brewers cup, which
6:18
is how to brew a coffee and manually and, and the selection
6:22
of the coffee that you've used. But the most famous are the
6:25
Barista competitions, and those generally get the most
6:29
attention. And as I've already noted, the
6:32
amount of attention is dedicated to a certain subculture, I guess
6:36
is the best way to put it. But that being said there is
6:41
money and recognition and and there's certainly some some
6:45
benefits that go along with placing or being be well known
6:50
in the Barista competition field.
6:51
So these things get sponsored by big coffee companies, espresso
6:57
machine manufacturers copy, cleaning, product makers, you
7:01
know, that sort of thing they get sponsored at that level.
7:03
And the Barista competition, you know, people trained for months.
7:07
For these, they put together a routine and what it consists of
7:11
basically is the Barista has 15 minutes to present three
7:17
different drinks to a series of subjective judges.
7:22
So there's I think for judges that sit there and you serve
7:25
them each an espresso round a cappuccino round and a signature
7:31
drink round which is not involved.
7:33
Of alcohol. There is another Barista
7:36
competition that does involve alcohol called the coffee in
7:39
good spirits competition. But the bruise to come involves
7:44
the serving of those three different styles of beverages,
7:47
espresso cappuccino and signature drink to a series of
7:51
subjects objective judges, they taste and evaluate each one and
7:55
as you serve them, you present them and you talk about the
7:58
choices that you've made in serving them, the coffee's that
8:01
you've chosen to pull as the Essos.
8:04
The recipe that you're using to pull the espresso or the coffee
8:08
that you've chosen to pair with the milk in the cappuccino.
8:10
The other ingredients that you choose a chosen to pair with
8:14
your coffee, and for the signature drink, use present
8:20
them to the subjective judges and they judge your
8:22
presentation, the judge, the drink and then there's also
8:26
technical judges that follow you around with clipboards and note
8:31
all the different subtleties of your Or technical approach to
8:35
Brewing the coffee. If you are messy on the bar.
8:38
Basically, if you are extracting, the espresso in a
8:42
way, that's not, you know, really ideal.
8:45
If you're if you're getting a lot of channels or uneven
8:47
extraction in it, things like that.
8:49
So there's technical judgment, active judges.
8:53
I'm not hearing you say anything about Flavor yet.
8:57
Is that part of this? So yes, let's and let's sorry.
9:00
I don't mean to interrupt. I mean I do it mean to interrupt
9:03
you, but Or we go too much further.
9:04
I want the audience to know, do all of the contestants, get the
9:08
same coffee to work with. No.
9:11
So the choices of the coffee that you're choosing to use in
9:15
each round are a huge influence in the overall score as far as
9:21
how they're tasting. But the choices are not just
9:25
based on the taste. There are also based on the
9:27
presentation of them. So as a subjective judge you or
9:31
I might like our coffee a Way we might have a favorite type of
9:35
espresso or flavor in our coffee of whatever kind, you might like
9:39
a cappuccino that always has paired with a more chocolatey
9:43
caramel e coffee. But the Barista might decide to
9:47
choose, you know, a more citrusy coffee that some people might
9:51
not like as much with milk because they also chosen a
9:55
certain milk that they want to go with that citrusy coffee.
9:59
Or because they think that the taste of the milk, when it's
10:03
full And when paired with the specific flavor brings together
10:06
a certain combine flavor like an orange, creamsicle type of
10:09
thing. And so the presentation will
10:12
have to reinforce that choice and present it to the judges
10:16
that they can appreciate the deliberate nature of the coffee
10:22
choices being made and the way that they're extracted.
10:25
So it's very intentional and every step and they've set up
10:28
the judging to judge every step, including the taste, of course,
10:32
but only as component of the overall presentation.
10:36
So obviously you can't have your espresso taste bad or your
10:39
cappuccino taste bad or your signature, drink is bad.
10:43
But the way that they're presented my ADD weight to how
10:49
much the judge enjoys it or rates it.
10:52
It makes sense. Yeah, absolutely.
10:55
I think I was imagining it all in my head and just thinking
10:59
about when you said the word subjective and that kind of semi
11:02
spiraling. And so I was thinking about how
11:06
the flavor or a holler type of coffee or has.
11:09
I wasn't even thinking about the type of milk yet, but like how
11:12
that might all Impact me as a judge which I should be a judge.
11:16
I feel like that's one of the things I'm best at.
11:21
Yeah, absolutely. Be like I'm not going to be the
11:23
guy who's going to, who's gonna win the competition from the
11:26
Barista side. So I should be involved
11:28
somewhere. I think you go, maybe I can
11:31
sweep up afterwards, I don't know.
11:34
So yeah that makes a lot of sense.
11:36
So you your 15 minutes three categories?
11:40
You prepare as a barista ahead of time by determining what what
11:46
products you're going to be sharing and how you're going to
11:48
prepare them. And then they get judged just to
11:52
Based on a combination of all those things that presentation
11:56
The Taste, the skill involved in the actual process.
12:01
That one was an interesting one that I thought I'm assuming more
12:04
than one competitor. Competes at a time.
12:07
That might be the next question. Yes, but not with the same
12:10
judges. Okay, Stella.
12:12
Yeah. The judges are getting getting a
12:14
whole presentation and they have their whole focus on the one
12:17
competitor. And, you know, I did say they're
12:19
called subjective judges. I think the actual name for them
12:21
is sense. Three judges, but I could be
12:23
wrong on that. But yeah, you have your sensory
12:25
judges on your technical judges, okay?
12:27
And either way, there's some subjectivity, they're based on
12:30
what they see and what their personal preferences are and you
12:33
mentioned, you know, the way they pull the espresso for
12:36
extraction and you know somebody's style might not be
12:40
what someone learns, you know, if you have a I imagine there's
12:43
traditionalists versus you know, more modern or Innovative and
12:47
they're all kind of negotiating this space which also Yeah,
12:53
maybe we get into this at the end but I'm assuming there's
12:55
probably been some controversial controversial victories or
12:59
losses. Absolutely.
13:01
Yeah, there's there's, you know, a couple competitors that have
13:03
really made big changes in the coffee scene overall based on
13:07
what they did and not all of them will winners think arguably
13:11
one of the most influential if not the most influential coffee
13:15
Barista competition was by a guy who got second place and I think
13:19
two Thousand Eleven or so he's the reason that you see See this
13:23
coffee grinder that UK 43 in almost every Cafe.
13:26
I mean, at some point, the UK 43 is qualities.
13:31
May have become popularized on their own, but there was a time
13:35
when these things were sold at this a sticker of this guy's
13:38
face on the side of them because he really was the face behind
13:43
this grinder. And everybody wanted one because
13:45
what did what he did in that presentation?
13:48
So many as far as traditionalist go, you know there's a famous
13:53
Bruce to competitor. Who is a part owner and some
13:56
shops in Los Closed and he was always just kind of always
14:01
second place guy for all these years and he was always a crowd
14:04
favorite go in second place and then he came back and when he
14:07
finally did win at Nationals, he had brought a blender on stage
14:12
for his signature drink when nobody had used a blender in a
14:15
barista competition in like a decade because that was all old
14:19
school. You know, frappe a style from
14:23
late 90s, early 2000s, kind of thing and so and twenty fourteen
14:27
or fifteen. In or whatever it was that that
14:29
this guy one, he brought the blender out and everyone's kind
14:32
of Jaws in the floor but also like if anyone can do it and get
14:36
away with it, it's this guy and anyone Nationals with it.
14:39
So yeah. Some some cool stuff happens in
14:41
the competition scene and it's really vigorous and a really
14:45
impressive culmination of people's skills as a coffee
14:50
person. Let's start there on your side.
14:53
Why are these competitions of Interest or important or a?
14:58
All you, and then we'll follow that up by saying as someone who
15:02
buys a cup of coffee and a Coffee Roastery and or a coffee
15:06
shop. And makes a point to say, I want
15:07
a good cup of coffee. Why do I, why am I interested?
15:10
Why do I care? So I mean as a coffee person,
15:13
you know I try to pay attention to things that are going to
15:16
shake up the industry and that being said, you know, I don't
15:19
follow competition, that closely generally if there's something
15:24
that really is gonna shake things up.
15:27
Up in the industry, you know, hear about it one way or
15:30
another, just by kind of keep my eye open to Media Outlets,
15:35
revolving coffee like roast West Coast.
15:39
Sure that that might might bring it, you know, to my, to my
15:42
immediate attention. I know that you don't listen to
15:45
it, you know, isn't it enough that I'm on it?
15:52
You know, I I give you a pass because I know that you you've
15:56
spoken on about half of the sewed.
15:58
So we let it go. Well and I'm very appreciative
16:03
of the fact that you keep wanting me back for some reason.
16:07
But, you know, there's also ways that, that Barista competitions
16:10
effects, kind of come across my radar in ways that no, I don't
16:15
realize it first, you know, so I watched a barista competition
16:18
won by this guy who was really originally a She was in the wine
16:24
industry and he used to go to, you know, Vineyard to Vineyard,
16:28
and then he became a coffee buyer.
16:30
And so we'd go to coffee farm and coffee farmer.
16:32
Need by these green coffee's for importers, or for Roasters and
16:38
You know, when he won the Barista competition, I wasn't
16:41
really that thrilled about that Victory because I didn't really
16:45
feel like what he showed was really that Innovative on a
16:53
barista level. But you know, I'm not one of the
16:55
judges and I don't like I said I don't follow the scene that
16:58
closely. So for all for all I really
17:01
know. It was totally legitimate to
17:04
give him the way but what he the coffee is he competed.
17:07
With and the presentation he made, has impacted most high-end
17:12
Roasters in that there's a style of coffee processing.
17:15
Now, that's very popular, and very sought-after.
17:18
And, you know, it's been spreading a lot on the producer
17:22
level. It's called Carbonic maceration.
17:26
It's basically a kind of a intense anaerobic process where
17:30
they they really remove all the oxygen by pumping another gas
17:35
into a sealed chamber and you might have It was some of this
17:38
with other me or Syria before, you know.
17:41
Oh, mirror. Yeah, the big difference being
17:44
that it's for that style of processing from traditional
17:47
Styles, which is where the wash stations just have either in a
17:51
big pool of water. That's kind of open air, or
17:54
they're drying beans out in the sun and this is like a very,
17:58
very much a controlled science experiment to some extent.
18:02
Right? And, you know, it's very
18:04
impactful in a lot of ways because for one The
18:08
infrastructure needed to do it at the producing.
18:10
Level is very expensive. I'm talking, stainless steel,
18:13
Vats, compressed gases, and a lot of the coffee-producing
18:18
places out there. You know, they're fertilizing
18:20
with with organic fertilizer from their actual Farm or, you
18:25
know, they're, they're reusing byproducts to make compost,
18:27
teas, and whatnot. They're not going down to Home
18:30
Depot and buying, you know, whatever they need to, you know,
18:33
do this or ordering it from their website.
18:35
There, it's a challenge to get some of The stuff to a lot of
18:39
these places. I mean there's there's coffee
18:41
Farms that are barely accessible by motorized vehicle.
18:45
So to get stainless steel Vats, that are capable of holding,
18:49
hundreds or thousands of pounds of coffee, thousands of pounds
18:52
of coffee and also, carrying hundreds of pounds of compressed
18:55
gas tanks up there. It's like, it's not really
18:57
practical in the sense. So, you know, the fact that that
19:02
style of preparation has been popularized is impactful on that
19:05
farm level where it's kind of a defying farms in some ways but
19:09
also giving some Farms an opportunity to raise their
19:14
income, incredibly significantly, if they can do
19:17
the investment and then the other, you know, one of the
19:20
other elements of that it's really interesting is the fact
19:24
that we've cut it kind of helped change some of the things that
19:27
we look for in coffee because a lot of The Taste qualities that
19:32
we find in a really good Carbonic.
19:34
Maceration would have been written off.
19:37
As flaws 15-20 years ago because those flavors would have only
19:42
come from an imperfect fermentation of more traditional
19:46
style. But when you can control in that
19:48
controlled science experiment like you like you described, you
19:51
can kind of make it something that actually tastes good.
19:54
But as long as your kind of controlling it really well and
19:58
have that quality control, that makes sure that you only get the
20:01
things that you're trying to get.
20:03
So yeah. I mean something like that can
20:05
have a huge impact you know, there's another one that puts
20:07
that Grinder in every Cafe and the world.
20:09
There's another one that says, hey, it's okay to have a blended
20:12
drink on your menu in a specialty Third Way of Cafe, you
20:15
know. And so those are just three, you
20:17
know, really interesting examples of how a barista
20:19
competition can affect the coffee World At Large from the
20:23
producer level, all the way to the consumer level, or you can
20:26
actually buy a blended drink and a third wave Cafe.
20:29
Sometimes. Now, without having to feel like
20:31
you're at a Starbucks, have you participated in any of these
20:36
competitions or something? Miller.
20:39
Oh no, I'm way too sloppy. Then I'll I'll adjust that
20:45
question to say or to a different question, different
20:47
tact, which is you've mentioned these major impacts that that
20:52
have come out these innovations that have come out of a barista
20:55
competition for the people that are participating.
21:00
Besides the victory, the feeling of victory that they might get
21:03
that day. Do these competitions?
21:05
Actually impact their life. It sounds like.
21:07
The, the the first jump that the UK 43, I think you said the name
21:12
of that Rider, but did they benefit from that?
21:15
Do they become people who are known in this industry?
21:17
Does it give them more opportunities?
21:20
It's a subculture. Yes.
21:21
But there are still, you know, stars in any industry to some
21:26
extent, you know, it's so I'm wondering if that's what happens
21:29
here. That is another motivating
21:31
factor is kind of the fame of being a coffee barista champion
21:35
and if so, If there are standouts that you're aware of.
21:41
Yeah, absolutely. And you know, I don't want to,
21:43
you know, I've kind of avoided mentioning these competitors
21:46
names just because at least one of them has sort of tarnished
21:49
his reputation, but absolutely gotten more risque on this show
21:55
before. So, I'm not really too worried
21:58
about if you want to know what they are.
22:00
But absolutely, I mean each one of those three competitors.
22:03
I mentioned has started a business Partly based on the
22:07
reputation, you know, from this and in addition to having the
22:13
reputation from that you're able to get investment money from
22:15
people that see that and see that success and I'm sure you
22:19
get, you know, job offers. I have a bruised, it works with
22:22
me, who is a certified counterculture train Barista,
22:27
which is, you know, a larger Coffee Company on the East
22:29
Coast. That does a lot of coffee,
22:31
trainings and certifications. And, you know, great trainings,
22:34
we use the counterculture. Flavored coffee tasting flavor
22:38
wheel in our shop regularly but humans trained and certified by
22:42
a gal who was a u.s. barista champion.
22:47
And so she has that job with counterculture and is able to
22:52
train other Baristas and be an authority on it, because she is
22:56
an authority, she's one and placed high in National level
23:00
competitions, and you really do have to be expert in a really
23:04
wide variety of Coffee aspects to place, while Ms. I mean, I
23:10
think the description of the way, the competition goes, kind
23:13
of points that out, but you have to have a good palate.
23:16
You have to have a good knowledge of everything from
23:18
the, you know, production to through the roasting to the
23:22
extraction. You have to be personable and
23:25
present things. Well, in an entertaining fashion
23:28
and a good communicator, so they can all hear and understand you
23:32
and you have to be less sloppy than me, you know, which is
23:36
arguably. Say something that I could maybe
23:37
work on but has never really been a goal of mine.
23:41
Not not being sloppy. I do work on that regularly but
23:45
not being sloppy to the point where I could compete is not not
23:49
been a goal of mine. So, yeah, I mean, it's really
23:52
incredible what they do and, yeah, I'm grateful for a lot of
23:56
the effect that a lot of those have had.
23:57
And I've seen people compete or prepare for the Brewers cup,
24:02
which is different than the Barista competition.
24:04
But in the Brewers cup, No. It's sort of a 50-50 judgment
24:09
50% of it is sort of based on how well do you brew the coffee
24:13
and you can make certain choices on that it can be Innovative or
24:18
or just impactful. But then the other half is, is
24:22
which coffee are you choosing to present?
24:24
And I remember watching my friend prepare for his
24:28
competition at Nationals and they roasted this very special
24:32
coffee just in practice and they got a good roast on it.
24:36
And then they taste Stood. It every single day from the
24:39
day, it was roasted to determine which day was the best day to
24:44
present that coffee on. So five days after roast or four
24:47
days after roast, which one tastes better.
24:50
And that way, when the actual date of the competition rolled
24:52
around, they could have a supply of coffee, you ready to brew?
24:56
That was exactly four days from roast.
24:59
So that they knew that they were presenting it on the ideal day
25:03
and we'll get into, you know, things like water chemistry and
25:06
Brewing. Apertures and water stream
25:09
thicknesses, going into grounds beds, and all kinds of things
25:13
like that. That really do affect the flavor
25:16
of the coffee and how well it's brewed.
25:18
But ultimately, that competition is a blend of that aspect.
25:22
All the technical choices you made to extract coffee in
25:25
general. And then the other aspect of
25:27
which coffee are you choosing to present?
25:29
So that in some ways is almost a roaster competition because
25:32
you're really competing with which coffee or able to source
25:35
and roll. East.
25:36
Well, it seems to me just as listening to you talk about
25:40
these two different styles of competition.
25:43
That one value there too. Is that it encourages?
25:48
It encourages people in the coffee profession, to look at
25:52
the work that they do. And to do it with, with
25:57
precision and intention and to try to look for ways that they
26:02
can improve or create a unique experience, which ultimately
26:06
will transfer to a guest at some point in the future.
26:09
And whether it's just that one person who's working towards
26:14
becoming the Brewers Cup champion, they will then
26:18
influence other people who are in that industry to follow their
26:21
lead and two things I want to clarify.
26:24
You said something about A national competition.
26:27
But I'm assuming there's International competitions and
26:30
international competitors in competitions say in the United
26:34
States or everywhere because coffee is such a worldwide
26:37
experience. Absolutely.
26:39
You know, there's in the US, there's regionals before you get
26:42
to Nationals. And then, you know, the only
26:44
people who compete at the international level are people
26:46
that have already won their respective National competitions
26:50
and one of the really cool things we've started seeing this
26:53
year and in previous years in the international competition is
26:58
that we're starting to see more Barista winners from
27:02
coffee-producing countries and as someone who's really tries to
27:07
be really dedicated to recognizing the effort and the,
27:12
the skill that's put into coffee, at that farm level and
27:15
at that producer level, you know, it's really encouraging to
27:18
see that be reflected, or at least that greater awareness of
27:21
that effort to be reflected and how much support Ort, Baristas
27:26
are getting to train and prepare for this and those countries and
27:30
how much recognition they're getting for all that hard work
27:33
that they're doing. I cannot remember right now and
27:36
I should have prepared for today by looking, look it up and
27:39
refresh my memory. I can't remember who won this
27:41
year's World Barista competition but I believe they were from,
27:45
you know, a coffee producing country and I think it was the
27:47
first time that that country had ever won the international
27:51
Barista competition. So that's a really cool Trend
27:54
that we've been seeing in the international competitions.
27:58
But it's also internationally is also a really cool forum for
28:01
some of the political advocacy that we see in coffee.
28:07
I think coffee is a really wonderful industry in that being
28:12
an entry level job in most ways in the cafe, where those
28:16
entry-level job, people have a voice where they're interacting
28:22
with customers in a fairly organic way in many settings.
28:25
Things, you know, I mean I let my shop be pretty free rein with
28:29
most people, and I've worked in shops that are a little bit
28:31
tighter, but even in a shop where the, the customer
28:35
experience is a lot more controlled by management.
28:38
And you know what, I would call sterilized, I still think that
28:42
Bruce does have a pretty loud voice compared to a lot of other
28:45
Industries. And I think that we see that in
28:48
that a lot of A lot of coffee industry gets a lot of excellent
28:53
advocacy for things that are really important.
28:57
You know, basically just social justice issues, social justice
29:00
issues in general. And I love to see that that that
29:02
brought up in our industry regularly and it always needs to
29:05
be brought up more in our industry and in every other
29:08
industry. But it's interesting when on
29:12
that International level some of those social justice issues come
29:15
up on you know the international stage.
29:19
And I think most recently Lee. You know, there was a the
29:22
Barista competition at one point recently was supposed to be held
29:25
in Dubai and there were some competitors that due to their
29:30
identities were either uncomfortable or not even
29:35
necessarily allowed to be in that country in a way that was,
29:40
that was really acceptable and so the coffee industry spoke out
29:43
really strongly against that and I think the competition did
29:47
proceed there. And And you know, like I said, I
29:52
don't follow these things, super closely all the time, but I
29:56
think that that's super important for us to have that
29:59
really big push back against that and say hey like just just
30:04
like with the Olympics in China this year and their treatment of
30:06
weaker, muscle Muslims. I think it's really important to
30:10
have that loud or not. International voice that says,
30:13
hey something about this is not okay, we cannot give our tacit
30:17
support to this. Yeah, International Bristol
30:20
competitions are our thing and they are very important and in
30:24
some ways it's like a World Cup for an Olympics of coffee.
30:29
Because you do have to be really high level just to get to the
30:32
National level. And then you have to be
30:34
incredibly good to get Beyond. And another interesting thing is
30:37
that, you know, International judges.
30:39
Don't always look for the same things that National judges do
30:42
one of the three National competitors that I mentioned
30:44
earlier. You finally won and he got there
30:48
this blender routine but there are some things that he did with
30:51
his espresso that, you know, in the u.s. we like.
30:56
But that in most other countries are not very popular.
30:59
And I'm talking about, you know, pulling some shorter a little
31:02
bit less extracted, but higher, viscosity shots with with
31:05
lighter espresso, lighter roasts espresso.
31:08
So and those can be really challenging and really divisive.
31:11
And you know, I think as a whole coffee industry has moved a
31:16
little bit. Away from that or move
31:17
significantly away from that. But it doesn't mean they don't
31:20
have a place in at least a place in our in our history as an
31:24
industry, just like the blender does.
31:26
And so I thought it was great that he won nationals, but it
31:29
was really kind of not shocking that he didn't do as well
31:32
internationally. So, yeah, just a lot, a lot of
31:35
different things come into play differently on the national
31:37
person national scale. And I don't really know how that
31:40
plays out on the original verse national scale.
31:43
I have watched some Regional competitions and there are some
31:46
Things that go on there, you know, everyone's got something
31:50
creative to them. I believe.
31:52
I love to see that happen in our, in our, in our industry and
31:55
coffee. I think that I would just add to
31:58
that by saying that when you mention regionally to, we are in
32:02
a you and I are in a large Metropolitan Community, that has
32:08
a pretty thriving coffee scene. Definitely one that's up there.
32:13
But if I were still in a small community, my hometown, for
32:17
example, I don't think think there's only one person that's
32:21
like publicly roasting coffee on their own people in other
32:26
communities. That may not be quite to that
32:28
same level yet. They're going to be looking to
32:30
these competitions because there is attention on them and they're
32:33
going to be saying what are they doing?
32:35
Where can I go to learn to do what they are doing?
32:38
So there's value there too. And listening to you talk about
32:42
Social justice in particular and advocacy.
32:46
I'm a big sports fan and I come from a kind of a sporting
32:48
background to some extent and it kind of reminds me of even very
32:54
recent examples of how Sports Community has got together and
32:58
used their voice to say. We're not going to play in your
33:01
state. Unless you make some changes for
33:04
the better, whether it's for voting rights in Georgia, or
33:09
anti-trans bills, in North Carolina with the helper.
33:12
National sports, leagues, moving games and moving, you know,
33:15
competitions and championships and, and, while the numbers
33:20
might not be quite the same, I think, I don't know if the
33:23
Barista championships are on ESPN yet.
33:25
But you know, there is definitely a devoted following
33:28
of coffee people, who would, who would respond to that.
33:32
And when you mention Dubai in particular, and so not just
33:37
overseas and internationally, but also right here at home, you
33:39
know, and we're seeing that kind of across the country right now,
33:42
in Florida. It away with Disney being
33:44
pressured to address the, the lgbtq bill that's going through,
33:49
you know? And it's it is amazing how yeah,
33:52
we're on the show to talk about coffee and we started by talking
33:55
about, you know, this fun, Barista competition which I
33:59
imagine is probably pretty fun. It's bloody cold and see it.
34:03
Connects, you know, there's a through-line to all of these
34:05
things that we were choosing to support and follow and I love
34:08
that coffee. As part of that, I look at and
34:11
I'm just going to relate a little Sorry, which is, I did
34:14
come from a small town and relatively small town in the
34:18
Midwest. And if you tell this in song,
34:22
Ryan, no guitar and sing it to us.
34:26
I was born in a small town. I did own a guitar at one point.
34:32
I've never learned how to play it, but I did carry it around at
34:35
parties. But what I would say is I got
34:38
into sports very young and because of sports, I traveled
34:42
and And at least regionally and I met people from larger cities
34:46
and different backgrounds and I didn't know it at the time but
34:50
that had a huge impact on me as a person and how I judged other
34:55
people because I was able to have that experience, whereas,
34:59
some of my classmates or even family members didn't have that.
35:03
And now as adults, we have differing opinions on things and
35:06
differing experiences to look back on and coffee and this
35:09
coffee Barista, there's people that are traveling to these
35:12
coffee of Answer, regionally or locally or nationally, and
35:16
they're having that same experience.
35:17
And you can find that in sports, you can find it in coffee, you
35:21
can find it in church, you can find it, you know, anywhere it
35:24
all creates this kind of collective experience where we
35:28
have commonalities and we see those commonalities more and
35:32
more and more, the more that we experience events like that.
35:35
Well, yeah, it was all right, don't want to talk about
35:39
competitions was this is going to pisode.
35:42
Yeah. I mean sure it's always a good
35:44
episode with You Chris because I wasn't really fishing for that.
35:48
I just don't like I said was but it was its it has nothing to do
35:53
with the with the competition it's because when I go back
35:55
later to edit I can see on the screen that like okay, here's
35:59
where I checked out and Chris talked for 20 minutes now if
36:03
they're there, I am again. It's just a lot easier on me,
36:06
but I do appreciate. I appreciate the time and I
36:08
appreciate your willingness to engage on, you know, sometimes
36:12
topics that Even Oculus at first, I certainly wasn't
36:14
expecting to get into some of these things today, but your
36:17
willingness to go there. So, thank you for that.
36:19
Of course, I always appreciate your perspective on those two,
36:22
so it's always nice to bring them up with you because, you
36:25
know, it's, I love talking about coffee.
36:27
I love the taste of coffee. But, you know, something I do
36:31
talk about in my shop, but I do trainings is, you know, it
36:35
doesn't really matter how good the coffee is, if we're not
36:39
doing something with it, if you're not, if you're Coffee
36:42
isn't good enough to start a conversation about where coffee
36:46
is coming from and its supply chain.
36:48
And you know, all these hands that touch it.
36:50
Like alright, sure. It might be a living for me or
36:53
for my Barista and it might be a nice calm moment in the life of
36:59
the mom or nurse, or whoever it is that comes in to get a cup of
37:02
coffee. You know, it might be all those
37:05
things but none of none of the things that matter about that
37:09
are actually to do with the coffee there about the people.
37:13
You know, the people in the community that we have around
37:16
coffee is always the most important thing.
37:18
So, you know, if Bruce a competitor starts anaerobically,
37:23
fermenting the cherries, or it starts getting this new grinder
37:27
in or starts, you know, the blood over the whatever it is it
37:30
doesn't really matter unless it's connecting us as people and
37:33
giving us a chance to do a better job by each other,
37:37
because we all should be able to do well by each other.
37:42
I think I think that's a great place to end it and I think we
37:46
should both go take a nap because I think we both started
37:51
this conversation and I'm just, I'll be honest.
37:54
I was a little tired. I'm a little worn out and now I
37:57
just feel like I want my brain to think on all of that but I
38:00
don't want to actually have to do any of the work and an app is
38:04
going to be the best way to do it.
38:06
That sounds good. It sounds good.
38:08
Chris. Thank you for being on the roast
38:10
West Coast coffee podcast. And and given me a lot to think
38:14
about sweet dreams read and I couldn't have written that one.
38:20
Good for you sweet dreams. I was like waiting this man to
38:32
I'm keeping that one in there. There's no question about it.
38:37
Oh boy. To recap what I learned today is
38:48
fourfold first, when Chris, and I don't record a show for a
38:51
while. We need a few minutes to get
38:53
through the jokes, and the ribbing and turn the coffee,
38:56
smartening wheels back on second Barista, competitions are not
39:01
only fun celebrations of this amazing beverage.
39:04
They are also sources of innovation and inspiration in
39:07
the coffee community at Large, The Barista competitions are
39:11
generally judged on three different coffee presentations.
39:16
Once each for espresso cappuccino and a signature
39:19
drink. The judging is based on so much
39:22
more than just flavor competitors are judged on their
39:25
choice of coffee and its characteristics taste
39:28
presentation and their technical skills.
39:31
It should be noted, that Kris is not up for a competition spot
39:34
because he self proclaims. He's a bit too sloppy on the
39:37
bar, which yeah. I have to agree, but in his
39:41
defense, the flavor results, speak for themselves, coffee
39:45
cycle, roasting is putting out some amazing coffee drinks.
39:48
Third, I did some post-show research and Barista is from the
39:52
Italian and Spanish words for bartender.
39:55
It has been documented that the term has been used to describe
39:58
someone serving hot and cold drinks in a coffee house since
40:01
at least 1916 as for pronunciation were both, right?
40:07
Barista is a common pronunciation in the United.
40:09
Dates and Italy, although the Italian pronunciation, drags the
40:13
e sound in the middle butter ISTA Barista is the more common
40:17
usage in the UK and Western Europe.
40:19
When speaking English and lastly, I should be a
40:23
competition judge. I really like judging things.
40:26
I'm judging this cup of coffee. I'm drinking right now and I
40:29
have to say I'm doing a really good job of it.
40:33
If anyone out there wants a podcast host and a passionate
40:35
coffee drinker added to their judging table.
40:38
Give me a shout and not just for your Barista competitions.
40:42
I'll judge anything about coffee or not during today's show.
40:46
We referenced Carbonic maceration coffee processing
40:50
which was actually a coffee vocab term in a previous season
40:53
of the show. I'll link to that episode on
40:56
processing on roast westcoast.com.
40:59
But as a reminder Carbonic maceration is a type of coffee,
41:03
bean processing where the beans are kept at lower temperatures
41:07
in sealed tank. Thanks for up to three days, the
41:10
Restriction of oxygen and the increase.
41:12
In CO2 slows down the process of sugar breaking down which allows
41:17
for a longer fermentation period, which then creates a
41:21
very unique flavor profile. That's all the coffee smarter in
41:24
we can do today. I want to thank you for
41:26
listening and for supporting your local coffee roasters,
41:30
there are so many great coffee roasters and coffee
41:32
professionals out there. Each week on this show.
41:35
I think the roast West Coast coffee industry As I swing into
41:40
the final quarter of season 4, I've realized that most of these
41:44
Partners have been with me for at least a year.
41:46
That's pretty amazing. So a very big thanks to Cafe
41:50
lechera. Most, your coffee company, leap
41:52
coffee, Maria, coffee steady-state, coffee, roasting
41:56
coffee cycle, roasting Camp, Coffee Company, Cape Horn
41:59
coffee, importers first light whiskey, and our first-ever
42:03
supporter, and interviewee zoom bar, coffee and tea, thanks to
42:07
the owner, Steve. With his support really gave the
42:09
show a boost at the very beginning and our newest
42:12
partner, ignite Coffee Company, links to all of those.
42:16
Great Roasters are right there on the front page of this shows
42:18
newsletter at roast westcoast.com.
42:22
And if you have a question, you want answered on a future
42:24
episode of coffee smarter hit us up on Instagram at roast West
42:28
Coast, Kim. If you're out there listening,
42:30
I'm on that question about frothing milk.
42:33
Stay tuned and I'll be sure to get that answered before.
42:35
The next coffee smarter episode this.
42:38
Regular episode of The Rose to West Coast coffee.
42:40
Podcast is was has been written produced and recorded by me Ryan
42:46
Walt. I hope this show is found you
42:48
happy healthy and with a least enough sanity and coffee to make
42:51
it through the day. And please always tip your
42:55
Baristas and be sure to drink good coffee.
43:04
Hey out there. Thank you for listening all the
43:23
way to the end of the show. If you liked this episode of the
43:27
roast West Coast coffee podcast, I just wanted to let you know
43:30
that we now have tip your Barista stickers available.
43:34
Online. Check out the most recent post
43:36
on roast West, Coast to get yours.
43:39
I'll be tipping a barista for every sticker sold.
43:42
And if you want more coffee content, please consider buying
43:45
a cup of coffee or signing up for a paid subscription to the
43:49
roast West Coast newsletter. That'd be really cool.
43:52
And with enough subscribers, we'd be able to focus on
43:54
creating coffee content, for you all day every day.
43:58
Subscriptions are a great way to show appreciation.
44:00
For the show, just head to roast westcoast.com to subscribe.
44:04
Or to leave a tip and it is still March.
44:07
So I'll be donating 100% of the new subscriber proceeds to a
44:11
humanitarian Aid group supporting Ukrainian refugees.
44:14
There are links on roast westcoast.com to some of those
44:18
groups if you're interested in doing so yourself.
44:20
Thanks for listening, everyone. Or to leave a tip and it is
44:06
still March. So I'll be donating 100% of the
44:09
new subscriber proceeds to a humanitarian Aid group
44:12
supporting Ukrainian refugees. There are links on roast
44:16
westcoast.com to some of those groups if you're interested in
44:19
doing so yourself. Thanks for listening, everyone.