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Austrian Economics and Zionism | Jerm Warfare · UK Column Radio

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: My name is Jerm.
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: This is Jerm Warfare. The Battle of Ideas. Jorge Besada,
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: thank you for joining me again in the trenches. Hey,
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: thanks for having me again, Jeremy. Yeah, I must tell you,
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: I enjoy your take on a lot of things. And
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: maybe it's because of your background, being Cuban.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I was born in Cuba, deep into a bad ideology,
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: into an error, into communism that lured a lot of
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: very bright people. into really screwing things up. And as
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: we will discuss again, you know, the same thing happened
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: with Zionism. Lots of very smart people thought that this
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: was the way to overcome anti-Semitism. And I mean, as
• 1:14
  Speaker 3: I hope to explain here, I mean, I think Zionism
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  Speaker 3: is actually the worst ideology that mankind has come up with,
• 1:19
  Speaker 3: even worse than communism. And so, yeah, but all my,
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: and I'm so lucky that you, you yourself, you ran
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: into Ludwig von Mises and I got his little bust here.
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: I don't know if you can see them. Yeah, I
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: can see it. You know, whenever you scratch somebody who's
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: really good on freedom, you know, that's what we all
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: have in common, that we understand, you know, these great
• 1:39
  Speaker 3: free marketeers. So, yeah, I was born deep into communism,
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: and here we are. You know, I left Cuba, and
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: now I'm here in the U.S., and now we have
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: to fight Zionism because it's destroying the world in a way.
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: What's that gulf that's next to Cuba that Trump renamed?
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: What's it called now? The Gulf of America?
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. And I'm sure you heard that he now
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: renamed Lake Ontario to Lake America or something.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: Yes.
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  Speaker 2: I'm hearing a dog. Yeah, sorry. Hopefully he'll shut up. Yeah,
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: so I mean, so one of your strong talking points
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: is Austrian economics. And I'm going to ask you about
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: what that is in a moment. But I'll say that
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  Speaker 2: I'm quite sympathetic to Austrian economics. I think for the
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: longest time, I've found it one of the most persuasive
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: outlooks on the world. And I don't know anything about economics,
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: but that's the beauty of Austrian economics. It's not really
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: about numbers. It's about humans. Yeah, it's about numbers.
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  Speaker 3: You know, the Austrians, I mean, I don't know how
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: much I'm going to regurgitate of our last talk, and
• 2:50
  Speaker 3: I encourage people to look at it.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: But, you know, they are- But just summarize, just summarize it. Yeah,
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: so when one thinks about economics, there's many schools.
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  Speaker 3: There's like the Marxists, there's the Keynesians, you know, and
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: the Austrians are the- Chicago school, right?
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: So the Austrians are really the people who got it right.
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  Speaker 3: If you ask Chad GTP or Grok AI, who were
• 3:09
  Speaker 3: the economists who predicted the collapse of the Soviet Union,
• 3:12
  Speaker 3: you know, who did the most to overcome socialism? All
• 3:15
  Speaker 3: of the major AIs, they know, and they will tell you,
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: it was the Austrian School of Economics, and it was
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: Ludwig von Mises and Friedrich Hayek, and these are the
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: men who got it right.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: So, I mean, these men are like, kind of like Galileo.
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: And Bruno, people who stumbled upon very important truths that
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: the Earth was not the center of the universe. That's
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: what the Austrians are like. And it's great that right now,
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: more and more people are sort of waking up to this.
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: You know, Elon Musk is a big fan of the Austrians.
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: You know, now we have Javier Millet, the president of Argentina,
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: you know, very tricky. person as well. We had the
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: Ron Paul revolution in the United States. You stumble upon
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: the Austrians, the Baileys, you know, who everybody loves in
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  Speaker 3: the world of like no germs and so on. They
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: stumble upon the Austrians. There's so many people behind the
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: scenes who are realizing that these men are the ones
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: that explain how freedom really works. It's this freedom and competition, right?
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: Competition is what turns the entire planet into a supercomputer
• 4:03
  Speaker 3: where entrepreneurs are motivated to innovate and to copy the
• 4:06
  Speaker 3: innovations of others. And the government is just a competition
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  Speaker 3: immune coercive monopoly that destroys civilization. So the Austrians are
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: grid the key. And I'm glad that their ideas are spreading.
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  Speaker 3: And one last thing I'll briefly throw in here that
• 4:18
  Speaker 3: is very relevant to hopefully what we'll be talking about
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  Speaker 3: next is that the key Austrians, after Mises died, who
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: was one of the badasses, you have 1974 Nobel laureate
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: in economics, Friedrich Hayek, and you have Mary Rothbard. And
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: both of those intellectual giants, they both knew what a
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: disaster the Israeli government was. So not only did this
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: man know that socialism was a disaster, but they also
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: knew that the Israeli government was just you know, doing
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: a lot of harm.
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  Speaker 2: So those are the Austrians. We're catching up to them.
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  Speaker 2: But I think one of the underlying threads of Austrian
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: economics is that, A, it's about being free. I mean,
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  Speaker 2: this is the first thing you stumble upon when you
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: are reading the work of Hayek and Rothbard and Mises.
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  Speaker 2: I mean, going back to what, 2012 already, I was
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: looking at Milton Friedman. I know he wasn't quite the same,
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: but he's kind of a gateway economist into, I mean,
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: I think he was from the Chicago school. But he
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: had some very good ideas. And if you followed his
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: work at any point, you would end up at Austrian economics. Yeah, yeah.
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  Speaker 3: And even Friedman himself, there's a really nice little clip
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: of Friedman himself saying, that Ludwig von Mises has done
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: the most for freedom. I forgot the exact quote, but
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: he himself said that Mises was like the champion of freedom,
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: the one that did the most to educate so many people.
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: And yeah, Friedman was great. And his son as well.
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: David Friedman has written a lot. He wrote a great
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: book called The Machinery of Freedom. He talked about what's
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: called anarcho-capitalism You know, if freedom and competition is what
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: allows us to discover what are the best products to
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  Speaker 3: make and so on, why not allow freedom and competition
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: in law? Why not let Elon Musk have his own
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: little island or his own city? And then we can
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: have competing legal systems where you always have to learn
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: from each other. So yeah, Milton Friedman is part of
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: the freedom gang, but he wasn't exactly an Austrian and
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: I could, you know, there was some back and forth
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: fighting in there.
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  Speaker 2: But I think one of the... I'm trying to think
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: of the right way to say this. A pushback that
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: you'll get from a number of people, particularly in my audience,
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: will be like if you mention Elon Musk, they'll go, yes,
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: but he's into mass surveillance, data capturing, and he's not
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: really one of the good guys. He says he's for freedom.
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: And so what ultimately happens is that you get a
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: lot of these aspects of freedom that in these people
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: who are not necessarily on our side. Like Donald Trump,
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: he's got a huge support base and very much in
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: that Austrian school also. But he himself, you know, pushes
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: things like Warp Speed and Project Stargate, et cetera.
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: I think lumping Trump with the Austrians, you know, I
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: don't know about that. I think you're stretching it a little.
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  Speaker 3: I mean, Trump, for example, like, you know, Javier Millet,
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: who is, at least his rhetoric about economics is very Austrian.
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  Speaker 3: You know, he says that Trump is great because a
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: lot of people just divide everything into like the communists
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: and the pro-freedom people. And since Trump is not, you know,
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: 100% communist, he ends up being- He's a protectionist.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: I mean, he's actually a protectionist. Yeah, I mean, Trump
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: is awful. And he's totally, you know.
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: Holocaust-inized Zionism is the religion of Trump. And that's why
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: we're having all those wars. I mean, we're having so much,
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: you know, pro-Zionist censorship. And Trump is like another Churchill,
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: somebody who's out there to save the world by killing
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  Speaker 3: all the enemies of the Zionists.
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  Speaker 2: I mean, I'm getting ahead of myself, but I mean,
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  Speaker 2: someone like Elon Musk.
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  Speaker 3: Elon Musk, a couple of years ago, he even tweeted
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  Speaker 3: a meme of Friedrich Hayek, two memes of Friedrich Hayek,
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  Speaker 3: one of The Road to Serfdom, which is a great book,
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  Speaker 3: and he said that Hayek was his favorite economist, and
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  Speaker 3: another meme of Selma Hayek, the hot actress, with a
• 8:08
  Speaker 3: great quote from Hayek, said that the best thing we
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  Speaker 3: could do to save civilization is to spread an understanding
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  Speaker 3: of economics.
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  Speaker 2: So those are great quotes.
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  Speaker 3: But one of the reasons why a lot of these
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: big tech people are doing all this censorship is because,
• 8:20
  Speaker 3: I mean, that's where the government is printing all this money.
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: I mean, if Elon didn't get all of his freebies
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: from the government, whatever protections is preventing the Chinese electric
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: cars from coming in here, if he didn't get all
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: those things, Elon really would probably not have his billions.
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: I mean, I don't want to say that all his
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: fortune is purely statist, but when the government.
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: But he is actually a statist though, isn't he?
• 8:45
  Speaker 3: I don't want to call him a statist. I mean,
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: I think he has to play that game And the
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: environment is what really drives what grows in there. And
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: right now, the government is blowing so much money on militarism, right?
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  Speaker 3: We're going to have, this year, we're probably going to
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: have a $ 2 trillion military spending budget. All that money
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: goes to Palantir. What is the quickest way to make
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  Speaker 3: money right now, the easiest way to make money in
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  Speaker 3: the United States? It's to join the battle of good
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  Speaker 3: versus evil against the evil Russians, the evil Iranians. I
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: think Trump's son, they're investing in like a drone-making company,
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: you know, And so militarism, when the government, I mean,
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  Speaker 3: $ 2 trillion, that's more wealth that the entire country of
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  Speaker 3: Germany like produces every year or something. No, Spain, Spain,
• 9:24
  Speaker 3: that's bigger than the entire GDP of Spain. That's how
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: much wealth the United States military industrial complex, which is
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: really just the Zionist industrial complex, because that's what all
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  Speaker 3: the militarism goes to. It goes to fight all the enemies,
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: you know, Zionists. And so I think it inadvertently warps
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: where big tech is going. And, um, Again, I don't
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: want to call Elon that much of a statist. I mean,
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: but you're kind of forcing it on me because he
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: is funding a lot of these things. But you know
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  Speaker 3: what I mean? When there's so much money to be
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: made by the militaristic stuff, even the Starlink satellite and
• 9:56
  Speaker 3: the Ukraine war, you.
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  Speaker 2: Know, he's being funded.
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: And he's been allowing, you know, the Ukrainians, you know,
• 10:02
  Speaker 3: to use Starlink. But even recently, Elon Musk himself said,
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: I am not going to allow, you know, Starlink to
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: be used, you know, to have all this targeting inside Russia.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: It's very complicated because if Elon said, oh, no, no,
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: I'm against this war, you human dodos with your tribalistic fighting,
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: I don't want to fund any of this. Then he's
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: labeled an anti-Semite. Who knows what would happen to his company?
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: So it's very tricky to really know what's inside Elon
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: Musk's head. But notice how he never talks about, oh,
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: I'm done for the war in Iran. I think it's
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: great that we're killing the next Hitler who is Putin.
• 10:33
  Speaker 3: He never says any of those things. So deep down inside,
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: he must know that we're just heading in the wrong direction,
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: I think.
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: So when I think about free market or Austrian economics,
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: for me, it comes down to me versus the state, ultimately.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: That is the theme that I find probably the most
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: important is how much of the state do I want
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: in my life? Yes.
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  Speaker 3: And, you know, the thing... Again, the Austrians knew that
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: the state is essentially competition, immune coercion, and it's bound
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: to be inefficient. But the Austrians, this is one of
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: the key insights, the Austrians also knew that the state,
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: the state is not a conspiracy. It's not a bunch
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: of bad guys that one day said, oh, let's just
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: create a state so we can rob everyone. The state
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: is something that like language, language is something that human
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: beings obviously invented, but we didn't design it. That's a
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: very key insight from like Carl Menger, that things like money, trade,
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: the division of labor, profit and loss calculation, interest rates,
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: the finance and banking industry, and how all of these
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: things come together to create what Carl Menger and Herbert
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: Spencer called the social organism. Those things are like language.
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: They're the result of human people acting. But all the
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: benefits that we get from all of these things that
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: create modernity, they were not designed by people. So, you know,
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: the Austrians are about understanding, you know, freedom. And because
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: freedom is counterintuitive. Do you know the story of like
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: the doro bird?
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: Have you heard about that?
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: Like the doro bird? It was like an ostrich-like animal
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: that existed. I think it was in New Zealand.
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: No, in Mauritius. Okay, excellent. But since the doro bird
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: had never ran into human beings, the doro bird didn't
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: see human beings as potential enemies. So the doro bird
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: was very easily, you know, beat up, hunted, and eaten,
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: and it quickly went extinct. So human beings are kind
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: of like doro birds. We evolved in these little tribes
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: where we would share everything, and the law of the
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: jungle is very intuitive to our instincts. But once trade,
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: once farming, once money emerged, and we started creating civilization,
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: you know, then we find ourselves like a doro bird,
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: you know. You know, trade, freedom, tolerance, you know, respect
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: for private property. Those things are not intuitive to our nature.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: And that is one of the reasons why we always
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: fall for the dumbest idea. Oh, let's just take the
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: wealth from everybody. Let's redistribute.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: And the people that don't want to go along, we
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: just kill them with our police state. So the Austrians
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: were very key on all of these things, on understanding
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: not only how freedom is what really creates civilization, but
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: why it is. How it is that freedom arose without
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: anybody planning it. How we got modernity without anybody planning it.
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: And also why it is that we keep making these errors.
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: You look at something like the First World War. During
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: the First World War, the bright people, intellectuals, engineers, theologians,
• 13:40
  Speaker 3: great leaders, they all fell for this idea. They encouraged it.
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: That what was needed to do was to have youth
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: across the trenches run and slaughter each other in Europe
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: for four years.
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: They went along with it.
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: So there's something deeply messed up in our understanding of
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: the world that has humanity falling for all the intuitive tribalism.
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: So again, the Austrians, they didn't just explain economics and
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: they were the best defenders of freedom. All of those
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: things that I'm mentioning that deal with human nature and
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: all that, they had like the whole package. And that's why,
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: you know, they're always like, you know, Ron Paul became
• 14:12
  Speaker 3: an Austrian when he read Hikes the Road to Surf
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: in Duke University as a student, Margaret Thatcher, Javier Millet.
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: So again, you know, the Austrians, and I'm just one
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: of the many people that I hope at some point,
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: just like we had in, you know, Ron Paul revolution,
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: maybe we can get something that finally triumphs and turn
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: this thing around because, you know, we're headed for another calamity.
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: It's becoming increasingly obvious. And just for clarity, Austrian economics
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: doesn't mean it's from the country of Austria. Great, great, right.
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: It's not from Austria, right? But a lot of the
• 14:42
  Speaker 3: main thinkers, Karl Menger, the founder, he was from around there,
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: Ludwig von Mises, Friedrich Hayek. Mises and Hayek, they both
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: fought in the First World War with the Austrians and
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: the Germans. So that's where it came out from. That's
• 14:56
  Speaker 3: why we call it Austria. It is a little confusing,
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: but they're the leaders of freedom.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: You make the comparison between the Soviet Union and the
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: State of Israel.
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, I mean, let's get to that. Because, yeah,
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: I mean, that is the way we have to see
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: these things. Number one, we have to see socialism and
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: the Soviet Union as an error. Socialism is a mistake
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: that really made sense to a lot of people. The
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: world is getting more complex in the late 1800s. You
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: have an increase in freedom. You have businessmen in the cities,
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: and they're creating factories everywhere. They're coming up with gadgets
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: and ideas. They're getting more productive. The more productive they get,
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: the more money, the more wealth they have to offer
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: labor and exchange. So you have more people moving from
• 15:41
  Speaker 3: the farms and the outside into the cities. You have
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: an incredibly complex metropolis. You have differences in wealth. Some
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: entrepreneurs are very rich. Some people are very poor. So
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: you have a lot of things that are really transforming
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: civilization for the better. But at the same time, you
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: have things that upset a lot of people. And give birth,
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: the environment changes. So people's ideologies begin to change. And
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: people said to themselves, wait a minute, this is unfair.
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: You know, we should share everything. Why should somebody have
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: more than others? It would be a lot better if
• 16:09
  Speaker 3: instead of having 10 companies, you know, we would standardize.
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: Let's just have the government, you know, take out all
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: the rich profits and then we can just have free education.
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: So all of these socialist fallacies began to spread like wildfire.
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: And then eventually you have people like Karl Marx who
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: writes a short little book. You know, the Communist Manifesto
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: is actually very short. So a lot of young ideologues
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: can read it.
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: So what happened?
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: We had a race between bad ideas spreading very quickly,
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: you know, and then that boom, that brought about, you know, communism.
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: And it was just a very bad idea. But it's
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: very important to see it as a bad, you know, idea.
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: It's not just like a bunch of bad guys, you know,
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: that want to do stuff. And I mentioned earlier, I
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: think in my other, with the last time we talked,
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: I mean, again, I was born and we talked at
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: the beginning.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: I was born in Cuba.
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: I was born, deep into a communist family. My grandfather
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: named his three sons after Lenin, Vladimir, Ilyich, Yulianov. So
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: I can't say that my family, and my family, I
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: have family members who fought in communist wars. They went
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: to Congo to sustain the communist bureaucracy over there. I
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: can't say that my family members were evil. And we
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: can't say that the British, when they had an empire
• 17:15
  Speaker 3: and everybody's grandfather served in the British army, was some
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: like malicious killer. So now very quickly, the same thing
• 17:22
  Speaker 3: with Zionism, right? If you look, so I'll give you
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: like my three minute version of why Zionism is a
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: mistake to give us some context. So, I mean, by
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: the time we get to the late 1800s, the ideology
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: of individual rights is making sense. You know, then obviously,
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: you know, we had Darwin as well, who told us, look,
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: we're all just slightly smarter apes. So we were moving
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: towards equal rights. We overcame slavery. women were getting more rights, right?
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: But one of the things that still remained was anti-Semitism.
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: You know, the Jews were constrained to live in certain areas,
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: especially in Russia, right? But outside of Russia, the move
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: towards equal rights and freedom was happening everywhere. Jews got
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: equal rights in the United States from day one. Also
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: in France from 1776, in the Austro-Hungarian Empire from 1850.
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: That is why Ludwig von Mises, who is Jewish, that's
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: why he has the von in his name. because Mises' grandfather,
• 18:16
  Speaker 3: I think, was one of the first Jews to get
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: the nobility title, because the Austro-Hungarian Empire was giving Jews
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: equal rights. Now, the German Empire, same thing, 1860, they
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: got equal rights. The Ottoman Empire, where the Muslims ran
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: the show, they also gave Jews equal rights under the law, England, France,
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: all of these places. So things were looking good for everybody.
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: And if you look at the Muslim world, for example,
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: In the year 1896, which is the year when Theodor Herzl,
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: you know, the founder of political Zionism, where he wrote
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: his famous book, The Jewish State. In that year, Baghdad
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: had a population of like 30% Jews. And if you
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: ask Grok, you ask Grok, okay, tell me how many
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: Jews got killed in some kind of program in the
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: entire 19th century in the Middle East. And maybe like
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: one or two Jews got killed as of anti-Semitic violence
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: in the Islamic world. So the obvious thing is, That
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: equal rights, you know, harmony, trade, commerce, everybody seeing each
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: other as the equal homo sapiens, that was spreading like wildfire.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: And it was also happening with the Jews. But now
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: what happened?
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: For understandable reasons, you know, there's still some lingering antisemitism.
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: There's a famous Dreyfus affair, right? I'll briefly mention it.
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: You know, in France in like 1890 or something, there
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: was a French Jewish guy and he was falsely accused
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: of being a spy for the Germans. So that created
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: a storm of controversy in the newspapers. Oh, look, you
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: can never trust the Jews, you know, because they're never
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: really Frenchmen. They always, you know, you know, they have
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: loyalties to other countries or whatever. So that created a
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: little bit of, you know, of some anti-Semitism in the news.
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: People would say bad things. Maybe you got a store
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: where somebody was saying, oh, the Jews are bad or whatever.
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: But anyway, so Theodore Herzl and people who are looking
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: to overcome anti-Semitism, Theodore Herzl said to himself, you know what?
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: We really need our own country to overcome anti-Semitism. You know,
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: we tried it. Some of us integrate. Some of us
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: go places, but there's still antisemitism. So in order to
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: overcome antisemitism, we're going to have to create our own country, right?
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: But now, so that is really the seed of where
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: Zionism came from. It was a way to overcome antisemitism.
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: But antisemitism is really just a set of easy to
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: understand intellectual errors. And you can only overcome errors through reason, logic,
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: sympathy for the misguided, and education. Now Zionism didn't do
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: any of that. Zionism brought us the standard toolkit of
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: Zionism today. Hate speech laws, vilification, and the coerced, and
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: the separation of the homo sapiens who identify as Jews,
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: the separation, they can't live with the non-Jews because through
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: some irrational evil, the homo sapiens that do not identify
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: as Jews, they can just kill us.
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: That is a mistake.
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: Right, from a simple evolutionary perspective, we're all equal, homo sapiens,
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: and all these antisemitic fallacies could be easily understood. And
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: then the Jews, the Zionists, decided to create themselves a
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: country in Palestine at the heart of the God of Abraham,
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: and to coerce the people in there. the people who
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: are living in there, to live under this newly made
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: up nationalist identity. Because it is very important when one
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: looks at the history of Zionism at the very beginning,
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: and anybody who looks at the history can really see
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: this in the books and understand it, it was a
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: very unpopular idea. You know, Theodore Herzog had to have
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: the first Zionist Congress in Basel, Switzerland. He wanted to
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: have it in Munich. but the rabbis in Munich tell them,
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: get the hell out of here. We differ with our
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: fellow Germans just on religion, but we love our country
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: just as much as they do. So it was very unpopular.
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: And then another very important thing is that a lot
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: of the early Zionists, they were hardcore socialists and atheists.
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: Like David Ben-Gurion, who was really the architect of Zionism.
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: He was such a commie that he went to Moscow
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: in 1923 to get a glimpse of his hero, uh,
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: Dev Lavidovich Bronstein, Trotsky, and celebrate the seventh anniversary of
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: the anti-religion Bolshevik revolution. So you had all these communist,
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: hardcore atheist, a lot of people, you know, who inherited
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: some of the racism from Europe. A bunch of these
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: white Europeans that are secular, You know, they're going to
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: look at religious people in the Middle East awful. So
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: these people wanted to coerce this made-up national identity in
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: there that had no connection to the God of Abraham, right?
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: Ben-Gurion himself, he said it. All of the early Zionist leaders,
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: they were not religious. So the problem is that that's it.
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: It was a mistake from day one. If you're not
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: going to overcome anti-Jewish fallacies through reason and logic and understanding,
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: and you're going to cause more reasons to dislike the Jews,
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: you are going to start a chain reaction. of polarizations
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: that are going to destroy civilization. And in my long essay,
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: I briefly talk a little bit about how Zionism played
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: a leading role in the First World War, you know,
• 23:12
  Speaker 3: in sparking the first, you know, in lengthening the First
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: World War and definitely the Second World War. The Second
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: World War was a war between Hitler and his anti-Jewish fallacies,
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: which I totally understand. The guy was an anti-Semitic, Semite.
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: You know, his Nuremberg laws, the race laws, that's awful.
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: Laws that prevent Jews from working.
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: I get it.
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: Hitler was bad. But again, the solution to a guy
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: who's making errors is not a world war. And the
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: second world war was a war between, you know, by
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: the Zionists, you know, by the Jews who are trying
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: to overcome anti-Semitism through violence and the anti-Semites. But we
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: cannot allow, you know, the people making anti-Jewish fallacies and
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: the Zionists who want to just spark wars to that,
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: to be what runs things. We need reason and understanding
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: So I mean, that gives you like the five minute version.
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: I could go a little more in depth in some
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: of these pieces, but that is the essence of why
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: Zionism was bound to.
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: Polarize the planet.
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: And it really is the main polarizing force. And I'll
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: lastly mention that even today, the speaker of the house,
• 24:16
  Speaker 3: Mike Johnson, he said, Hamas and Hezbollah are tied in
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: with Iran and Iran is tied in with Russia and China.
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: They are the new axis of evil. So that tells
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: you right there, right now, how the world is ready
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: for the final world war based on fallacies that grow
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: from due gentle misunderstandings that led to anti-Semitism, that led
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: to Zionism and are polarizing the planet. It's a complex
• 24:41
  Speaker 3: chain of stuff, but we need to focus on it.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: There, sorry. So, I mean, how do you make the
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: parallel then between Israel and the Soviet Union? Because it
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: could be argued that Israel is not communist or socialist
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: for that matter. No, great.
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: I'm glad you brought that up. They are similar and
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: to me, identical, not in the way the economy runs,
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: but at a deeper theoretical level where it's a flawed
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: ideology that fools a lot of very bright people and
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: they have to keep growing the police state. and the coercion,
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: you know, to keep their ideology going. So again, it's
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: not about the economy. It's something deeper, right? It's that
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: it's just a flawed ideology that where the ideologues create
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: their own intellectual bubbles, both ideologies inadvertently emerge from the
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: destruction of freedom of speech.
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: The Soviet Union would have never gotten off.
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: The ground if Lenin, like a week into the revolution,
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: decided to make freedom of speech criminal. You couldn't, very
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: early in the revolution, he said, oh, no, no, no, no.
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: Of course we're for freedom of speech. You know, one
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: of the interesting things, like Lenin, they were ideologues. They
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: resented the Tsarist police putting them in jail for having
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: the freedom of speech to spread their ideas. So they,
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: you know, they were ideologues. Oh, we're for freedom of speech.
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: And the Soviet constitution tells you that you have freedom
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: of speech, you know, and everything. But as soon as
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: they got into power, they made it a criminal act
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: to criticize the bureaucracy. And the same thing has happened
• 26:08
  Speaker 3: with Zionism. The Zionists don't realize that by having Holocaust
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: denial laws, you know, and we can get into that,
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: by having hate speech laws, that they're inadvertently preventing the
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: necessary criticism to show how flawed their ideology is. I
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: don't think they do it on purpose, you know, just
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: like the Soviets. I guarantee you that the average communist
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: had no idea that by... You know, they thought that
• 26:33
  Speaker 3: they were doing good by taking the revolutionaries, the counter-revolutionaries,
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: the evil capitalists, the kulaks, the people that didn't want
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: to share, the greedy. They thought that it was good
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: to take these people and put them in jail. Like
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: that we can have our work towards our paradise, you know?
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: And the Zionists are doing the exact same thing. So
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: they have that in common as well. You know, like
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: Marxist professors, you know, a Marxist professor in the Soviet
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: Union wouldn't exist if you didn't have the tyranny that
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: taxes people to fund the bureaucracy and makes a criminal
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: of people with competing views. Well, the same thing happens
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: with Zionism. If it weren't for the fact that Zionism
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: has evolved as an ideology where it's taught in our schools,
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: where we have the Holocaust museums and all these things
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: are taught by government force, if we didn't have the
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: Holocaust denial laws in all these European countries, the entire
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: edifice of, like I've said it in our previous chat,
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: all those people in Yad Vashem and all the people
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: that are teaching you all this Holocaust stuff, They are
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: like Marxist professors. You know, everything that they're teaching is
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: ultimately based on mythology that wouldn't exist if you have
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: real freedom of speech. So that is another way in
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: which both ideologies are the same.
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I like what you're saying because you're
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: getting to the heart of, again, what I was alluding
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: to at the beginning of the conversation when I said
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: it's the individual versus the state. And it's that tug
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: of war that's constantly happening. It's the state trying to
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: impose– all sorts of restrictions on freedom. And it's the
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: individual wanting to break free from a lot of those restrictions.
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: I personally lean into what you're saying. And I find
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: that parallel very interesting because you could probably also argue
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: that the South African apartheid state would have parallels to
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: the Soviet Union.
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And a lot of people use that parallel with
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: Israel as well. And this relates to, again, Again, it's
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: very important. And this is something that, you know, the
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: apartheid kept going, not just because it would be wrong
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: to say that the apartheid lasted for so long because
• 28:36
  Speaker 3: the white people were just like evil and they just
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: wanted to oppress everyone. You know, a lot of them
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: had real legitimate concerns, just like when we ended slavery
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: in the United States. When people ended slavery, there was
• 28:47
  Speaker 3: a lot of people who had real concerns. They were like,
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: wait a minute. If suddenly we give these people equal
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: rights to have guns, they might be chaos. They might
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: start killing their previous people. A lot of these people
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: have spent their entire lives living as slaves managed by
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: the white man. What if it's going to be chaos?
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: How are they going to handle their lives? There were
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: all kinds of fallacies that kept the slavery going, just
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: like there were a lot of fallacies that kept the
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: apartheid in Africa going.
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: And the same thing happens in Israel.
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: A lot of Israelis are understandably scared. They say, wait
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: a minute, if tomorrow we all live in the same country,
• 29:21
  Speaker 3: you know, we get rid of all the restrictions and everything,
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: it may very well be chaos.
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: You know, we have people who really hate our gods.
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: There are children that are brought up from very little,
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: you know, to maybe really dislike all the Jews. There
• 29:33
  Speaker 3: may be chaos. So again, they do, that's another reason
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: that they have that parallel. You know, we can see
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: how all of these smart people fool themselves into keeping
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: a flawed ideology, you know, going.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I grew up in apartheid and it
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: was a fairly tightly controlled country, South Africa, at the time.
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: But if I think Back, and I compare that to now,
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: I would still have what we have now. And what
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: we have now is a complete disaster. We are a
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: failed state. Without any metrics being used, we are a
• 30:12
  Speaker 2: failed state. But I would still have what we have
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: now because we have such an inept, corrupt, useless, ineffective government.
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: that it forces somebody like me to be more creative
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: in what I do on a day-to-day basis. It means
• 30:28
  Speaker 2: I rely less on the state. No, yeah, I mean,
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: that's a great point.
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: You know, you have evolved this like black market, you know,
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: to stay away from all the bureaucracy that, but this
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: is a great example of how, I mean, apartheid was bad,
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: but a mass democracy can sometimes be even worse.
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: Because what really brings prosperity is private property. Private property,
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: how much the rule of law is respected.
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: Like, I wouldn't mind living in a dictatorship if the
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: dictator is familiar with Mises, he keeps low taxes, and
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: that kind of stuff, you know? So South Africa is
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: a great example with a lot of economic ignorance and
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: a lot of understandable resentment, I guess, has now led
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: to this bureaucracy that might be, I mean, you know better,
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: might be redistributing wealth. You got the farmer issue and
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: all these things. And And it's really sad to see.
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: And this relates to Israel as well. A lot of
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: Israelis would fear that we turn Israel into some mass democracy.
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: And now you're going to have a higher population of
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: very understandably upset Muslims that may end up bankrupting the country.
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: They'll say, oh, look, you mistreated us. Now we want
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: free health care, free this, free that. And since you
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: make more money because you have more wealth, it's fair
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: that you have to pay your fair share. So I
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: can understand how the Israelis would be fearful of that.
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: That's why it's very important that if we have a one-state.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: Solution, it has to be like, well, thought out. Well,
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: before you tell me about that one-state solution, a question
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: that will invariably come up is, okay, but Rory, China,
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: this is a communist country that is very successful. How
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: do you respond to that? But before you respond to that,
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: I can probably also tell you that it's not a
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: communist country and it has been gradually moving away from
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: communism since the 1970s into something that is not Austrian,
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: but pointing in that direction.
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And I know you were just there within this
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: last year. And also you had a very recent talk with, gosh, Zaha.
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: I forgot.
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. He did a great job of explaining things.
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: And I've been to China as well. I was in
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: China for about two months in 2013. And, uh, Yeah,
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: I mean, the Chinese is another great example that in
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: many ways fills me with hope with Zionism. The Chinese too,
• 32:46
  Speaker 3: they bought into the communist nonsense. And even Deng Xiaoping,
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: you know, who was the initial like leader that brought
• 32:53
  Speaker 3: up all these changes, he admitted, he said, you know what?
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: We have to learn from the Japanese. He himself said,
• 32:59
  Speaker 3: he quote, he said, look, you know what? We made mistakes.
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: And so it's a great example of how some people
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: little by little realize they made a mistake.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: And it is true. China now, you know, they have
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: private property. I mean, it's I mean, I wouldn't be surprised.
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: I mean, I think China by now is likely more
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: free market and more as far as the rule of law.
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: There's no crime over there. People are doing all kinds
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: of stuff. And it just goes to show how quickly
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: a little bit of freedom and how quickly Zionism is
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: destroying the United States, because you cannot have prosperity where
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: you're blowing two trillion dollars every year. you know, on militarism.
• 33:36
  Speaker 3: And so, yeah, no, China is definitely no longer a
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: communist country. And even, you know, in your discussion, you know,
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: with your friend, you know, those restrictions that they have,
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: you know, they're nowhere near as.
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let me ask you a question. Someone said to me, okay, but,
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: you know, are you really that free in China? Now,
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: I know we're not talking about China, but let me
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: just quickly ask you this. I live in South Africa,
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: one of the most dangerous countries in the world, right?
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: We've got exceptionally high crime. You know how bad it
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: is here in many ways. We have a useless government,
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: so that means our police is useless. Everything is pretty broken.
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: We have a very derelict infrastructure, okay? So on one hand,
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: there's a sense of freedom that comes with that. But
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: how free are you if your wife cannot go walking
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: to the shop at night because she's going to get
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: raped or shot? Whereas in China, you can.
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, even with some, you know, what they call communism,
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: you know, but again, it's weird because we know that
• 34:37
  Speaker 3: it's not a communist country anymore. I mean, again, you know,
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: the days of communism are long gone. You know, I
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: wouldn't be surprised if the legal system, you know, is
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: even way cleaner than maybe what we have over here.
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: It's hard to tell. It's hard to tell.
• 34:53
  Speaker 3: But one of the main reasons why China is seen
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: as this evil country is as an inadvertent side effect
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: of the Zionification of the West, right? Because that quote
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: from the Chinese, they do not see the Iranians as
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: some crazy fanatical mullahs that just want to strap a
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: bomb and blow up.
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: The whole planet.
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: They know very well that the Iranians are normal people,
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: they're thoughtful people, you know? And again, it's amazing how
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: much of it just grows from this. And the same
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: thing happens with the Russians. At least 50% of the
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: Chinese are evil comes as an outgrowth of the Zionist
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: mindset that paints anyone who is somehow connected to critics
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: of Zionism with the terrorists and so on.
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: So we have to be very aware of that. Tell
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: me more about your idea of a one-state solution for Israel.
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: All right, let me....
• 35:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so just like the Soviet Union, when one looks
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: at the history of the Soviet Union, there were many times...
• 35:58
  Speaker 3: when the fallacies look like they were about to be overcome, right?
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: At the very beginning, when the Soviet Union was really going,
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: there was the Kronstadt Rebellion. But this was like early
• 36:07
  Speaker 3: on when the revolution was going. The people in the
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: Kronstadt Rebellion, they were still socialists. They didn't like maybe
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: how Lenin was running things, but they were still socialists.
• 36:14
  Speaker 3: So they still had the mentality, right? Then we had
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: the Pride Spring, right? We've had all of these times
• 36:20
  Speaker 3: where the Soviet Union, where the bad idea looked like
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: it was going to break apart.
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: But what happened?
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: We needed to wait. We needed to wait for enough suffering, right?
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: For the books, critical of the Soviet Union, for Mises
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: and Hayek and all these guys to win the Nobel
• 36:34
  Speaker 3: Prizes and write. And by the 1980s, even the bureaucracy itself,
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: a lot of people in the bureaucracy themselves, they were like,
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: you know, what's going on here? You know, we have TVs,
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: we can see how others are doing. And then eventually
• 36:47
  Speaker 3: you have enough people at the very top themselves, like
• 36:50
  Speaker 3: Mikhail Gorbachev. And Boris Yeltsin. These were people who realized,
• 36:54
  Speaker 3: wait a minute, we got to let this thing end.
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: And very important, as the bureaucracy, as there were little
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: rebellions and there were more parts of the Soviet Union
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: that wanted autonomy and so on, Mikhail Gorbachev, he had
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: this policy of glasnost, which means like openness. And then
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: they had perestroika, which is like change or something like that.
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: So they allowed more freedom to criticize. And as the
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: various pockets of resistance and people wanting to break away
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: from the Soviet Union as they were happening, in the
• 37:24
  Speaker 3: Soviet Union, you had two sides. You had the people
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: who said, okay, we've got to let this thing end.
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to clamp down and have another rebellion
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: where we're going to kill a bunch of young people.
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: And you had the hardliners who said, oh, no, no,
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: look at these people, the sellouts, the Americans are getting
• 37:39
  Speaker 3: in here, and so on.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: But we were very lucky.
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: That Mikhail Gorbachev was one of those people that said, no, no, no,
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna step back and I'm gonna let this thing.
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: So the point I wanna make.
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: Is that the Soviet Union during all of its time,
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: there's been many chaotic periods where the whole thing could
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: have collapsed. And luckily in 1989, the Berlin Wall and
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: 91 and the whole thing like collapsed. Now, the same
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: thing has been happening with Zionism. Zionism is a flawed ideology, again,
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: that keeps spreading chaos, more wars, more wars. And right
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: now we are reaching a point Never in my lifetime
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: has the chaos around Zionism been just as incredible as
• 38:17
  Speaker 3: it is right now. The entire United States is talking
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: about it. You got Tucker Carlson. It's become the dividing issue.
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: We just saw the Gaza calamity. We see the war
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: in Iran, all those things. So the point I want
• 38:29
  Speaker 3: to make is that we find ourselves at another point
• 38:32
  Speaker 3: that is exactly like what was happening with the Soviet Union.
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: Going forward, we can either increase the tyranny and quickly
• 38:39
  Speaker 3: pass Hate.
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: Speech laws, right?
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: Like the CEO of the Anti-Defamation League, Jonathan Greenblatt, all
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: of these people are already calling for hate speech laws.
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: He himself said that anti-Zionism is anti-Semitism. He said that
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: anti-Zionism is genocide. When you look at the percentage of
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: Zionists out there that want to make it a criminal act,
• 38:59
  Speaker 3: you know, to disagree or to feel like the entire
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: Israeli state is illegitimate, it's growing by leaps and bounds.
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: And just like in the Soviet Union, when the Soviet
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: Union was growing, it was profitable to join the NKVD, right?
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: And right now it's profitable to grow the police state.
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: So we find ourselves in a very similar situation. So,
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: I mean, there is enough chaos, enough books about the
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: disastrous history of Zionism have been written. You got the
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: so-called new historians like Benny Morris, Ilyan Pop, and all
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: these guys that have shown us how Zionism is just
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: a mixture of, again, just like communism, good intentions, corruption,
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: bad ideas, cracking eggs for the greater good. But when
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: you crack those eggs, you're going to have you know,
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: all kinds of issues. So there is enough people, enough
• 39:48
  Speaker 3: has been written, enough chaos, just like the Soviet Union
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: is happening, where maybe very soon we can put together
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: the right ideas and have a Berlin Wall fall of
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: moment for Zionism. And in order for us to have that,
• 40:03
  Speaker 3: I mean, we need many things. Number one, Zionism has
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: to be seen as a mistake, not as a result
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: of a bunch of sinister Jews wanting to conquer the world.
• 40:11
  Speaker 3: That's the first one, right? You know, at least, you know,
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: that's how I see it. And this relates again to
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: Ludwig von Mises. Ludwig von Mises, I mentioned in our
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: last talk, in his great book, you know, Human Action
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: that I have here, he has a section called The
• 40:23
  Speaker 3: Fight Against Error. And Mises says that the problems are
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: purely intellectual and they must be dealt with as such.
• 40:29
  Speaker 3: You know, we cannot get too deep into the moral
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: sphere and label opponents as just being villains because that
• 40:35
  Speaker 3: can never solve the problems. So again, so we have to,
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: I really believe that the world is in such chaos
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: right now that there's enough people thinking about and trying
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: to solve the problem. when we can't solve it. So,
• 40:45
  Speaker 3: but in order to solve it, so many things need
• 40:48
  Speaker 3: to fall into place. We need people who understand the
• 40:51
  Speaker 3: history of the conflict, you know, who we need a
• 40:54
  Speaker 3: solution that can show us a path to peace. Because
• 40:57
  Speaker 3: right now, when you look at the talking heads and
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: the politicians, everybody has this mythical concept of like a
• 41:02
  Speaker 3: two-state solution. But when you dig down deep, it's just
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: pure mythology, you know? There's nothing concretely written down. And
• 41:10
  Speaker 3: a two-state solution, I actually agree with Netanyahu. I agree
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: with the most hardline Zionist. To me, a Palestinian state
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: would just mean a better armed Hamas, a better armed,
• 41:22
  Speaker 3: very pissed off group that instead of being able to
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: launch a couple of drones and so on, is going
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: to be able to launch something far more powerful. And
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: something else very important, and a lot of people have
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: commented on this, we are in a race against time
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: and technology. If the Houthis, who are so relatively poor,
• 41:38
  Speaker 3: can already launch ballistic missiles from so far away. In
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: five years, thanks to technology, any disgruntled group of people
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: will be able to just fly a little drone with
• 41:48
  Speaker 3: something powerful enough that will just blow up half of
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: Tel Aviv or, you know, whoever you want to like
• 41:53
  Speaker 3: blow up. So again, in order for us to have
• 41:56
  Speaker 3: a solution, we are already there. I think, you know,
• 42:00
  Speaker 3: if something can happen, if we, you know, we need
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: a path to peace. And that is one of the
• 42:04
  Speaker 3: things that I write about in my article. And maybe
• 42:06
  Speaker 3: we can talk a little bit More now, you know,
• 42:07
  Speaker 3: something that can, you know.
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: But the thing is, though, the counter argument is that
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: a one state solution is not desirable by the Israeli state.
• 42:19
  Speaker 3: That is true, but not so fast. There's been polls
• 42:24
  Speaker 3: that show that I think over 50% of Jews under 30,
• 42:27
  Speaker 3: like the younger Jews, because of the internet, because of
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: the ability to interact maybe online, you know, with Palestinians
• 42:38
  Speaker 3: and learn more, learn more about the chaos, there's already
• 42:40
  Speaker 3: a significant proportion of Jews, especially in the United States, right?
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: Because remember, the environment helps shape the ideology. If you
• 42:49
  Speaker 3: live in Israel and you are in an environment where
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: you're surrounded by people who understandably hate your gods and
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: you create a TV structure and a media that is
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: always telling you how the Palestinians are this irrational, non-homo
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: sapiens that just want to kill us all, and that
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: kind of stuff, you're going to have a mentality that
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: says that we can never live with these people, especially
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: now after October 7th. October 7th proves that the homo
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: sapiens who identify as Palestinians are so different from the
• 43:13
  Speaker 3: homo sapiens that are the most moral homo sapiens in
• 43:15
  Speaker 3: the world that we can never live together. So this
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: mentality is very solid over there. But if you look
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: at the polls of the Jewish Americans, the ones who
• 43:24
  Speaker 3: live in New York City, the ones who go to
• 43:26
  Speaker 3: a grocery store, the ones that interact with Palestinians or
• 43:28
  Speaker 3: Muslims in New York City, you can see that they're
• 43:30
  Speaker 3: far more likely And I think statistically, over 50% of
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: those people feel like the future is a one-state solution, right?
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: So one of the things that we need is to
• 43:40
  Speaker 3: have a beacon. If we had a beacon of these
• 43:43
  Speaker 3: young Jews saying, oh yeah, look, interacting with Palestinians, showing
• 43:46
  Speaker 3: how something could work, we could get there.
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: And it's the same thing like the Soviet Union.
• 43:50
  Speaker 3: You can only overcome the Soviet Union, you know, once you,
• 43:54
  Speaker 3: you know, you can envision the prosperity. So yeah, I
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: understand it's a high hill to climb, but if we
• 44:00
  Speaker 3: have a beacon, we have to have faith. And this
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: relates to the next quote I want to tell you, okay? So,
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: Ludwig von Mises, you know, again, you know, the badass
• 44:09
  Speaker 3: of the 20th century, he has a quote, he says,
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: liberalism is rationalistic. It maintains that it is possible to
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: convince the immense majority. It has full confidence in man's reason.
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: It may be that this optimism is unfounded and that
• 44:22
  Speaker 3: the liberals have erred, but then there is no hope
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: left for mankind.
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: Kind's future.
• 44:27
  Speaker 3: So we either have enough people who understand that just
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: like a lot of errors led to Baghdad having one
• 44:33
  Speaker 3: third of population Jewish where everybody was getting along to
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: the chaos that we have now, we have to have
• 44:38
  Speaker 3: faith that with the right ideas we can go back
• 44:41
  Speaker 3: to having real freedom and real coexistence because I see
• 44:45
  Speaker 3: it as an opportunity to show people, we, the descendants
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: of the Austrians, we the people who understand how freedom
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: really works, we can actually solve this mess. So it's
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: an opportunity for us, you know, To at least try, right?
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: If we do not have enough people who feel like
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: they can solve this mess, then it's just a third
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: world war. And it's right around the corner because we
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: can see everything is just good versus evil, you know?
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: So anyway. But I suppose you could also argue that
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: Hamas is effectively a consequence of the Israeli state. Exactly, exactly.
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: And Peter Baynard, Peter, oh, sorry, Hamas.
• 45:26
  Speaker 3: Peter Boehner is one of these Jews who grew up
• 45:30
  Speaker 3: in Israel, and he's very critical of Zionism. And he
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: himself said, because a lot of the Zionists will tell you, oh,
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: look how the Islamic world, they kicked us out in
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: the 1940s. They kicked us out of Baghdad. They kicked
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: us out of Libya. They kicked us out of Morocco
• 45:44
  Speaker 3: and all these things. And it's like, but wait a minute.
• 45:47
  Speaker 3: What happened in 1948? that led to this enough Muslims
• 45:52
  Speaker 3: to get so angry that some of them.
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: Would push you out. Of course, it was the Nabca.
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: It was the civil war in 1948 where, you know, 700,000
• 46:01
  Speaker 3: Palestinians got expelled and you have an increasing number of
• 46:05
  Speaker 3: Zionists that the Muslim world is seeing as a fifth column.
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: So again, I'm not justifying it, but again, we have to,
• 46:12
  Speaker 3: it's just like you said. I mean, what changed? What
• 46:16
  Speaker 3: is it that took two gentle relations that were getting
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: better and better and better with time, that suddenly changed
• 46:21
  Speaker 3: things to now the entire planet is ready to have
• 46:23
  Speaker 3: another world war over the Gentile conflicts.
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: That change is Zionism, right?
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: It's the ideology that we're going to overcome intellectual errors
• 46:33
  Speaker 3: through violence, through hate speech laws, and through core separation.
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: I mean, that really is, to me, that is like,
• 46:39
  Speaker 3: you know, the essence of why the entire thing is
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: like messed up.
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: But a call... aspect of Zionism is also not just
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: the Jews it's evangelical Christianity.
• 46:53
  Speaker 3: True true yeah because yeah yeah and that's part of
• 46:56
  Speaker 3: the problem and in the massive article I wrote an
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: article for uns.com and I'm super thrilled that it even
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: got headline, you know, at the front page of the site.
• 47:05
  Speaker 3: And the article is called Austrian Economics, Revisionist History, and
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: a One-State Solution. And everything we're going to be talking about,
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: I go into more detail there. And remember, the Zionists,
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: once you have enough people believing in Zionism, they think
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: that the idea is wonderful. These are very smart people,
• 47:20
  Speaker 3: very smart Jews who thought, man, this is really great.
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: Who can we persuade, you know, to help us in
• 47:25
  Speaker 3: our cause? So they started persuading the Christians, right? In
• 47:29
  Speaker 3: the late 1800s, the average Christian wasn't a Christian Zionist.
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: There were hardly any Mike Huckabees or Ted Cruz, you know,
• 47:37
  Speaker 3: telling you that the whole purpose of our country is
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: to back Israel. That didn't exist in the early 1900s, right?
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: But in my essay, I explain this big transition when
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: Menachem Begin was an Israeli prime minister when he won
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: in 1977. To me, it's a very important historical point
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: because Zionism before that was very socialist. It was very
• 47:57
  Speaker 3: secular and it was very central planning. But Menachem Begin
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: took things in the direction of capitalism and religion. So
• 48:06
  Speaker 3: Begin immediately became friends with a lot of American pastors,
• 48:10
  Speaker 3: Pastor Hagee and all of these people. And that's when
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: we began to see American Christianity evolve from just a
• 48:17
  Speaker 3: different Christianity to a Zionized Christianity. I mean, I almost
• 48:22
  Speaker 3: like to create a new verb. You're being Zionized. when
• 48:26
  Speaker 3: suddenly you think you're going to overcome anti-Jewish fantasies through violence,
• 48:30
  Speaker 3: through coercion, separation, and through a Jewish state. So little
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: by little, the Western world got Zionized. And that is
• 48:37
  Speaker 3: what we need to de-Zionize ourselves. Just like my own family,
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: we became communists, right? Before you're a communist, you believe
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: in private property, you know, and all these things. But Cubans,
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: we became socialists. We devoted our lifetime to a tyrannical error.
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: And the same thing happened to the Zionists. They had
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: a The Jews had a different way of looking at
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: the world, and they made a monumental error. They Zionized
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: their identity, and they're causing immense chaos.
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: Again, it's a mistake. It can happen to anyone. When
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: I was in China, I met up with an economist
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: friend of mine. He's an American, actually, who lives in
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: China now. And and funnily enough an Austrian economist and
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: I asked him what led to the success of China
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: and without even taking a moment to think he answered
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: private property yeah yeah it really is do you think
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: that that is also what can work successfully in Israel.
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah.
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: Private property.
• 49:45
  Speaker 3: I'm glad you brought up private property, you know, because
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: Mises has another quote where he says, like, civilization is
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: inextricably linked to private property. And from private property, I'll
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: show you the sequence of connections from private property. If
• 49:59
  Speaker 3: you have private property, from private property emerges the freedom
• 50:02
  Speaker 3: to trade because your property is yours. Therefore, you have
• 50:06
  Speaker 3: the freedom to trade it with anyone. So from freedom
• 50:09
  Speaker 3: to trade emerges economic competition.
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: It's my freedom to buy the Honda that has the
• 50:17
  Speaker 3: power windows instead of the Chevy that may not have
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: the power windows.
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: That brings about economic competition that motivates the Honda to
• 50:26
  Speaker 3: put the power windows and then forces the BMW and
• 50:29
  Speaker 3: the Chevy and so on to copy the power windows idea.
• 50:31
  Speaker 3: So from private property emerges the freedom to trade from
• 50:34
  Speaker 3: which emerges economic competition, which is what turns the entire
• 50:38
  Speaker 3: planet into a global supercomputer where you're always innovating and
• 50:41
  Speaker 3: copying innovations and so on. So yeah, private property is
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: the key to everything. And it's not just freedom of
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: speech regarding all of these errors that we have. It
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: is very important to that It's not enough to just
• 50:52
  Speaker 3: have freedom of speech. You actually need private property. In
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: the United States, I have the freedom of speech to
• 50:57
  Speaker 3: doubt the mass gassing myth. I have the freedom of
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: speech to say that the war in Iraq, that all
• 51:01
  Speaker 3: this money that is being sent to Israel, that those
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: things are mistakes.
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: I have the freedom to do that.
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: But the government can still tax and take away my
• 51:10
  Speaker 3: wealth to sustain a bad idea. But if you have
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: real private property, if you get to keep your wealth,
• 51:17
  Speaker 3: the government wouldn't be able to carry out a bad idea.
• 51:20
  Speaker 3: You see, ideas require two things. They need the information
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: that guides them, and they need the wealth that must
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: be consumed while the idea is being carried out. So
• 51:28
  Speaker 3: it's not just enough to have freedom of speech.
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: We need private property.
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: We need people to keep their money so that only
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: what they think is good and moral and useful gets
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: the funding it needs to be carried out. So that's
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: very important for people.
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: You know, to realize.
• 51:42
  Speaker 3: So yeah, private property is really what leads to everything.
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: And we need people to understand that vital connection.
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: But I guess somebody will ask, okay, but who is
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: the arbiter of that private property? I mean, somebody didn't
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: own it initially. Like for example, Israel, 1948, right? So they,
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: so Israelis now can say, yeah, but where I'm living
• 52:03
  Speaker 2: right now is private property. But a Palestinian might say,
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: but before 1948, it wasn't yours.
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: Right, right.
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: And then there are some Jews like Professor Walter Bloch,
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: who I think is a good buddy of mine. He'll say,
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: wait a minute, the Jews were there 2000 years ago.
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: They'll still have a claim on that property. You know,
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: some people will make that argument, you know. But I mean,
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: that's what we have, our legal norms and so on.
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: Like now this will get into a solution. For example,
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: Saifuddin Amos. Have you heard of him? Saifuddin Amos? Saifuddin
• 52:34
  Speaker 3: Amos is a Palestinian born Muslim Muslim. Austrian economist. He's
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: like the king of Bitcoin. He wrote a book called
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: The Bitcoin Standard.
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: I have it here somewhere. Which is like the Bible
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: of Bitcoin.
• 52:48
  Speaker 3: It explains how Bitcoin works, you know, how, you know,
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: the great things about Bitcoin is that you can't just
• 52:52
  Speaker 3: have the government print a bunch of money, you.
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: Know, to use it for whatever. And, gosh, what was
• 52:57
  Speaker 2: my point?
• 52:59
  Speaker 3: Uh-oh.
• 53:01
  Speaker 2: No, Saifedean.
• 53:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Saifedean mentioned that, look, I want a solution. If
• 53:07
  Speaker 3: some Jews, because of the 1948 war, you know, they
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: found themselves and then, you know, they're living in a
• 53:13
  Speaker 3: property that used to belong to a Palestinian and it's
• 53:15
  Speaker 3: been like three generations and the Jews living there now
• 53:19
  Speaker 3: are not even the people who did this.
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: It's like, fine, let them stay there. You know?
• 53:25
  Speaker 3: I mean, it all depends, you know, how Again, we
• 53:29
  Speaker 3: have to sympathize with how everybody sees things. The Jews
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: weren't running away from the Second World War. They were
• 53:34
  Speaker 3: running away from the Holocaust. We want some kind of solution. Also,
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: think how that would destroy the economy. Let's just say
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: that there is a plot of land where right now
• 53:43
  Speaker 3: there's some Israeli company that has some chip manufacturing plant.
• 53:47
  Speaker 3: And that belonged, you can trace it back, and that
• 53:49
  Speaker 3: belonged to some Palestinian 80 years ago. you know, that
• 53:53
  Speaker 3: may end up destroying the economy. So we just have
• 53:55
  Speaker 3: to do the best that we can with reason and
• 53:57
  Speaker 3: understanding how we're going to, and I deal with that
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: in my one-state solution, how we deal with this tricky thing.
• 54:01
  Speaker 3: So we just have to do the best we can.
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think what you're saying has some merit.
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: You can't, I suppose, now suddenly go to somebody's house
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: and go, well, listen, we're going to take that away
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: from you, even though you have nothing to do with
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: what happened 100 years ago. We have a similar situation
• 54:23
  Speaker 2: here in South Africa. We see this happening actually in
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: a lot of countries where they're going back to the
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: first nations or whatever, but it leads to a spiral
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: downwards of all sorts of problems.
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: And that is part of what we need. We need
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: careful thinking and yeah, you know, and my little one
• 54:46
  Speaker 3: state solution sort of tries to, you know, overcome those things. So,
• 54:51
  Speaker 3: The first thing we need is, of course, a beacon
• 54:53
  Speaker 3: of people, right? We need to have a beacon of
• 54:55
  Speaker 3: people who believe that we can solve all this mess, right?
• 54:58
  Speaker 3: That's something that we need from that Mises quote. Just
• 55:01
  Speaker 3: like we have to have faith that we can educate
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: people so they don't fall for socialist nonsense, we have
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: to have people who believe that we can have some
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: kind of prosperity, you know, in the future.
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: Now, we also have to see.
• 55:12
  Speaker 3: Zionism as a mistake, at least the Zionism that was
• 55:16
  Speaker 3: carried out by the early Zionists. The Zionism of Ben-Gurion,
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: this arrogant communist atheist, you know, to believe that he's
• 55:25
  Speaker 3: going to create this national identity in this massive chunk
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: of land where a future Palestinian might have to go
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: to the Olympics, right? And represent this atheistic man-made monstrosity
• 55:37
  Speaker 3: that has nothing to do, it's very important for people
• 55:39
  Speaker 3: to realize that the state of Israel has nothing to
• 55:40
  Speaker 3: do with the God of Abraham. The most ardent critics
• 55:44
  Speaker 3: of Zionism are the real religious Jews. And I highly
• 55:46
  Speaker 3: recommend Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro's book, The Broken Wagon. I think
• 55:52
  Speaker 3: he's one of these real religious Jews who is a
• 55:56
  Speaker 3: carrier of the real identity that got us the Ten Commandments, right?
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: A lot of Zionists will tell you, oh, Israel, you know,
• 56:03
  Speaker 3: we represent Western civilization. All of the contributions that were
• 56:06
  Speaker 3: made to Western civilization by the Jews, were made by
• 56:09
  Speaker 3: the Jews, not the Zionists, right? The Zionists have only
• 56:12
  Speaker 3: brought us chaos, right? So it's important to see that, again,
• 56:18
  Speaker 3: how can the real God of Abraham have any connection
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: to Theodor Herzl and David Ben-Gurion, who were hardcore atheists?
• 56:24
  Speaker 3: Theodor Herzl, it's important to realize that Theodor Herzl, he.
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: Was a nice guy.
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: He wanted to overcome anti-Semitism. But one of the ideas
• 56:30
  Speaker 3: he had to overcome anti-Semitism is to get the Jews
• 56:33
  Speaker 3: to convert to Christianity and have the Pope have a
• 56:35
  Speaker 3: mass conversion.
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: I mean, that, It's.
• 56:38
  Speaker 3: Astounding that someone who is really so anti-Semitic, you know,
• 56:41
  Speaker 3: has this picture of the Knesset as if he's the
• 56:43
  Speaker 3: great leader of the Jews. You know, a guy who
• 56:45
  Speaker 3: cared very little for actual Jewish, you know, traditions. So, again,
• 56:51
  Speaker 3: we have to see both. Also, we have to focus
• 56:54
  Speaker 3: on anti-Semitism. We have to see antisemitism as an intellectual
• 56:57
  Speaker 3: error to be able to come through reason and logic
• 56:59
  Speaker 3: and education. When Candace Owens goes out there and says, oh,
• 57:02
  Speaker 3: that Israel is a satanic state and Netanyahu is run
• 57:07
  Speaker 3: by satanic forces. I mean, I think that's a bit
• 57:10
  Speaker 3: of a mistake, you know? And when Dan Bilzerian, who
• 57:13
  Speaker 3: I have a lot of respect for, when Dan Bilzerian
• 57:15
  Speaker 3: says that the Jews should pay reparations for the Bolshevik revolution,
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: that too is an anti-Jewish fallacy. Just because the Jews
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: are overrepresented in the Bolshevik Revolution, it doesn't mean that
• 57:28
  Speaker 3: they plotted it to screw everyone on purpose. The Jews
• 57:31
  Speaker 3: are overly represented in freedom and capitalism.
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean? So the point I want
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: to make, yeah? Yeah, so what you're arguing is that
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: there's a lot more emergence than design. Of course.
• 57:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you said it in a very nice way. All
• 57:47
  Speaker 3: of these problems are the result of emergence. They're not
• 57:50
  Speaker 3: the result of good guys or bad guys or sinister plotters.
• 57:55
  Speaker 3: It's an emergent thing. And we have to be intellectually
• 57:59
  Speaker 3: deep enough to see how the fallacies arise. And we
• 58:02
  Speaker 3: have to treat both as fallacies. Zionism was a fallacy
• 58:06
  Speaker 3: and anti-Jewish fallacies. I should say the anti-Jewish fallacies first.
• 58:10
  Speaker 3: Anti-Jewish fallacies are intellectual errors that then led to a
• 58:14
  Speaker 3: simple-minded mob who fell for Zionism to make their own errors.
• 58:18
  Speaker 3: So we need to have a beacon that is intellectually
• 58:20
  Speaker 3: strong and educated enough to treat.
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: Both as errors.
• 58:24
  Speaker 3: We cannot just treat one as error and then go
• 58:27
  Speaker 3: along with the other. So that is something else that
• 58:28
  Speaker 3: we need. We need that beacon to somehow emerge.
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: You said earlier in passing that you wouldn't mind staying
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: or living under a dictator who's somewhat benign. I actually
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: agree with you on that. In fact, I'm no fan
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: of democracy. I don't vote. I'm no fan of any
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: real state sanction system, I suppose. But there's a great
• 58:53
  Speaker 2: book that influenced me quite a lot, Democracy, the God
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: That Failed. And in it, what's his name now? Hans
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: Hermann Hopp. Hans Sermonhop, he makes the argument that democracy
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: is basically a publicly owned government, whereas something like a
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: monarchy is a privately owned government and therefore more focused
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: on private property which is now.
• 59:18
  Speaker 3: Alluding to what you've been talking about No, I'm glad
• 59:21
  Speaker 3: you brought that up because that is an excellent book.
• 59:23
  Speaker 3: You know, that is a fantastic book that really shows
• 59:26
  Speaker 3: those things. I mean, I think Habba said that democracy
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: is just a soft variant of communism because that's really
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: what it is. And one of the American founders, Thomas Jefferson,
• 59:36
  Speaker 3: he had a quote where he said, democracy is nothing
• 59:39
  Speaker 3: more than mob rule, where 51% of the population can
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: take away the rights of the other 49. And that
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: is one of the problems that you're having in South Africa.
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: And now you have this massive democracy.
• 59:49
  Speaker 3: I think you have a higher population of maybe black
• 59:51
  Speaker 3: people that were victims, you know, the oppression and they're
• 59:54
  Speaker 3: more likely to vote for this big government redistributed policies,
• 59:57
  Speaker 3: which get in the way of private property, right? What
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 3: we want is just private property and the increasing wealth,
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 3: you know, that arises from that. Yeah.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 2: And the other thing also is, I must be careful
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: here because I know that someone's going to moan, but
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: the emphasis on free speech, I often think is misguided.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: I counter that by saying the emphasis should be on
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: private property, not free speech. Excellent.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: And that goes to the point I was making earlier.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 3: We need private property because, like I said, we might
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 3: have the free speech to question, you know, the Iraq war,
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 3: all the government spending.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: But as long as we do not have.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 3: Private property, the government can still take our wealth and
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: with direct taxes or with inflation. I mean, we didn't
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: talk about that, but the main robber of wealth that
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 3: allows the US government to do everything these days is
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: the fact that it's.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: Printing $ 100 billion every month.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 3: It's creating an extra $ 100 billion every month to pay
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 3: the arms manufacturers, to pay the COVID mania companies, you know, and,
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: you know, to do all that.
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 2: So when, if we really.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: Understand economics, it really comes down to private property. But
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: very few people, unfortunately, today can really see the connection
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 3: between private property and freedom and competition and freedom of
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 3: speech and so on.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: Because on your private property, you can have free speech. Yes, yes.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 2: I mean, in my home, I can say whatever I want. True, true, yeah.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: And it makes sense to have restrictions on freedom of speech, right?
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 3: You know, like the person faking yelling fire in a
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 3: movie theater.
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 2: Well, I mean, well, let's say you come into my
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: home and you start talking smack about my wife. I'll say,
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 2: there's the front door, you can leave. So you don't have... Yeah, exactly. Exactly, yeah.
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 3: And I can totally envision some people, you know, who
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 3: own a big plot of land or they create their
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 3: own little, like, Disney World little city.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: And it's like, look, in this city here.
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 3: Of course, we respect people's freedom of speech, but we
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 3: don't want you coming in here, you know, either saying that, oh,
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 3: it's OK for 13 year olds, you know, to become prostitutes.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 3: You know, we don't want that. We don't want that
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 3: speech that creates an environment of things that we don't want.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 3: You know, so people should have the freedom, you know,
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 3: to then restrict speech.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: Right. But that comes from private property. Yeah, and I mean,
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: I think free speech restrictions are not that bad, depending
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: on the context. If on my private property, I don't
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 2: want you saying certain things, or I don't want you
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: bringing pornography into my home. Of course. Then you have
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 2: to respect the rights of my private property, as it were.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: I mean, that is a key. But the key to
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: that is, again, what Mises was all about.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 3: We need to get people to understand this stuff.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: All right, I'm looking at the time, Jorge. How can
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: I read more of your work? Okay, so, well, just
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 2: Google my name, Jorge Besada, and UNS.com.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 3: I really recommend people go to UNS.com and check out
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 3: my article with the one-state solution that.
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 2: Deals with a lot of these things.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 3: And I also have a website, Besada.com, and to please
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 3: follow me on Twitter, at Hayekian.
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: Let's just quickly spell that. Jorge is J-O-R-G-E. Yeah, J-O-R-G-E. Besada, B-E-S-A-D-A.
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 2: Jorge Besada.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 3: And you'll also find my Mises.org articles that deal with
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 3: economics and so on. But definitely UNS.com, you know, and UNS.com too.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 3: And there's something very important going on with UNS.com. You know,
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 3: Tucker Carlson, everybody knows, you know, who Tucker Carlson is.
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 3: But about two weeks ago, Tucker Carlson, looked at the camera,
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 3: and he told his millions of followers to go. He
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 3: told them that Ron Unns is one of the greatest
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 3: intellectuals of America. And he told them to go to
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 3: Ron Unns' website. And the day he told everyone to
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 3: go to Ron Unns' website, the leading article was an
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 3: article questioning a lot of the mass gassings narrative. So, Doubting,
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 3: the effects of doubting the mass gassing narrative and what
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 3: that does for the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, that is about to explode.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 3: It's about to hit the mainstream. And it is a
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 3: subject that needs to be treated with a lot of
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 3: care in a very wise manner. So anyway, so yeah,
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 3: you know, to just make sure to go to uns.com
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 3: and read my article there, if that is like, you know,
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 3: my ending statement.
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: Jorge Besada, thank you for joining me in the trenches.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 2: All right, thank you.