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Transcript

Sara Sutherland | A Mother’s Story Of Infant Loss And Unshakable Faith | This Is Life · Life Community Church

• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: Well, Jody.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_01: Am I in Duncan's chair?
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: Uh no, actually, I'm usually there.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: Duncan's usually behind the board.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: I usually don't navigate the board.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: Oh.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like forget what button does what, didn't record the last one right, all that kind of good stuff.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: Well, Jody, thanks for joining us today.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_01: This is where I sit in the She Wakes podcast, so I'm right where I belong.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: So it just feels like a home to you.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: And so and you guys have a load, a ton of She Wakes podcasts that are about to come out.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, from the conference.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm excited because I didn't get to hear anybody else exactly.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I don't know that you've um make mention of this on the She Wakes podcast.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe if I listened more, I would know.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: But so and uh I don't even list my own podcast.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: So but anyways, uh this is live podcast.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: But uh I don't know if the our listeners some of them do know, but Jody's working on our PhD.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's actually called the doctorate.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: A doctorate, sorry, that's what it's called.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's a little bit different than PhD.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: That makes sense.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so yeah, so working on a doctorate.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes and just recently you were in Texas.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: I was in Houston for intensive.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: Which was intense.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: Which is where your school is.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and so I I absolutely love the story that I was told.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: And if if it I'm not saying that story here.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: No, okay, why not?
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: You're saving it for the She Wakes podcast.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: No, I just don't know if I should say it.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: Why not?
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: Are you embarrassed by it?
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: Name dropping.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's not about name-dropping.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: I just think it's incredible that like for me to lead a chorus in a channel.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: No, so like Jody was asked to be a worship later singer, like no, I was asked to lead a chapel service for our school.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_01: Gotcha.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm like, what does that entail?
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: Well, it entails like choruses, singing, and then like some scripture.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm like, okay.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so Dr.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_01: Kohick, who is the president of our seminary, or maybe she's been to our church, spoken here.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: She was our speaker last year, and she said, You know, like songs that people will know, like that we don't need words on the board.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, oh, so you want me to lead some songs?
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: And so then I immediately walk away from the side.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_01: I phoned a friend.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: I phoned a friend.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: Phoned a friend?
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: And she told me what to do.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so anyway.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: She gave you some titles of a song.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: She gave me some titles, but the thing is, is this is a mixed crowd.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: So there's lots of people who do hymns.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: Oh.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, Well, what hymns should we sing?
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, actually, probably the majority of people don't do hymns, so we did not do a hymn, but what'd you say?
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: No, you can't.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: So anyway, the funny part was is that one of the songs I recommended was a chorus by Brooke Lidgerwood.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: And Casey, of course, Do you want to sing it for us just so we can tell how you did?
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: No, I'm just kidding.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_01: Praise the Father.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: Praise the So I sang that for Brooke because she was actually there.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: She's like, Well, what can you say So you went up to her face to face and said, Would you sing this song?
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_01: I said, Brooke, can you help us with the choral part of the chapel service?
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: And she said, Yes.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_01: And so I she said, What songs?
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I said, How about this one?
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_01: Well, it's her song.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, Well, what key do you want it in?
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I don't know what key.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, Well, let me hear you sing it.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I sang it.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: The best part though, if I know the story correctly, you understood you were introducing her to a Brooke Fraser song, but did know you were talking to Brooke Fraser.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_01: Well, she's Brooke Lidgerwood now.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_01: That's right.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, she used to be Fraser.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: So the guy said, I said, You don't know this song?
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, No.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: I said, You don't know this course, King of Kings, by Brooke Lidgerwood?
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, No, but there's a girl here.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_01: Apparently, she's a really good singer.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: Her name's Brooke.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe she can help us.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_01: I said, What?
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, Yeah, apparently she's a really good singer.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_01: I said, Well, do you see her right now?
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, Yeah, she's behind you.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I turn around, I'm like, This is her song.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, perfect.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: Then maybe she can sing it.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: Let her sing it.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_01: It was hilarious.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, this is not what we're here for.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: This is life with Dr.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: Jody.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so, anyways, it's good to have Sarah in the podcast.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: This is a funny story, but we tried this once already, and Sean must have not hit the record button.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: So we had a good long conversation, and here we are.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody heard the first one, but it was great.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: The second one's gonna be even better.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be fresh for me.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_01: I haven't heard your story, so I'm excited.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: All right, Sarah, why don't you introduce yourself?
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: Holly you're gonna come to the church and take it off, and we'll uh we'll just ride along with you.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_02: Sarah Sutherland, and I have been here at Life since September 18th of 2022.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: I almost said 1922, that's been a long time.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: Why do you know September 18th?
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: Why do you know that number?
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: Very specific turning point in my life.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_01: Is that right?
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: Something happened on that day?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, but that's not the story we're gonna share this time.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: To be continued story.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's a further out in life journey.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um I was invited here.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um, well, not necessarily just in here, but in general, was always invited to church um by Scott Geringer.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_02: I worked with him, and something extremely pivotal happened, and I looked at him and said, I will see you in Shannon in church on Sunday.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um The rest is history.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: The rest is history.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: So I felt like I found my home when I came.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: So very cool.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you want to share with us, you know, uh just the journey to like where you're at and your relationship with Jesus Christ currently.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_02: So um trying to wrap this up like really briefly and quickly.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: So just take your time.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_02: I was not raised uh going to church necessarily.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: My mother was raised in the Catholic church.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: My grandmother and some of my aunts and uncles attended church, um, the Catholic Church grandma faithfully on Sundays.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_02: And but she we just always treated people good, like basically.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_02: We wasn't like God was necessarily talked about, but it was about how we treated other people.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, did you do the sacraments, first communion, confirmation?
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: No, because I was not raised or brought up in the Catholic.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, so your mom's but we will get there.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Listen, Jody, this might be your last podcast.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_00: Just kidding.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: So, mom, I mean, around Christmas, mom, we always learn what the true meaning of Christmas was.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I fell in love with baby Jesus as a young girl.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: I always loved babies, and baby Jesus was cool.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_02: I liked baby Jesus, so I always liked them.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_02: So fifth grade rolls around, get invited to uh vacation Bible school, um, at a Nazarene church, and it was someone in our community whose husband drove the church ban.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but she had offered to pick us up, and it became a thing.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: My sister and I faithfully went to church from fifth grade on, used to ask mom why we couldn't be baptized, but um, that's when I actually asked Jesus to come into my heart and be saved by him.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um actually went to uh it used to be Tilden Church Camp.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: Um Tilden, Illinois.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's outside of Sparta, Marissa, kind of in between the two.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um doesn't exist anymore.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_02: I that that I know of.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: Doesn't look like it when I dri have driven by.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um there and went to another camp north of Springfield.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: But is your sister younger or older than you?
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_01: My sister is about 15 months younger.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh, she's the same age.
• 7:43
  unknown: Yeah.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: So, anyways, church camp save.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: The church camp save, like did that faithfully, did church all by myself like through high school.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: Always wanted to raise my own family in the church because I kind of I never understood why mom didn't let us because you loved it.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because I loved it.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_01: Was she going to mass the whole time?
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_01: And you guys were going to chat?
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: She knows she also did not go to the city.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, so she was just Catholic culturally.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_02: Got it.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_02: So she was raised in it, but she did not practice it.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: And so in asking all those curious questions growing up, is she said that she believed it was that a relationship with God was between you and God, and it didn't have to involve that church.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: Like you didn't necessarily have to go.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um, no, that's a whole nother story, too.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_02: So I was I was raised.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: I have a whole life story.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you hadn't said anything, so I wonder what his faith was.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um I grew up with a single mother.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_02: I've never met my father.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um they were married for a very brief time and then divorced by the shortly after my sister was born.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: That's the just gotcha.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: So now you're have kids, you're married?
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_02: So I am not married.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: What not so not are we at the church story or not?
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: You said you wanted to raise your family.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so that's where we're at right now.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: So yes.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: So um I always wanted to raise my family in church.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_02: So when I was dating and marrying my ex-husband, um he was brought up Catholic.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: So we got married in Catholic church.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I got pregnant with my first daughter, which we'll kind of talk about that because her story really leads me on a on my journey through Christ.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_02: And um we got married in Catholic church.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um I got had my firstborn daughter, her name's Brianna Nicole.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_02: Was pregnant at 24, I guess.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_02: A week after my 25th birthday, but at 18 weeks learned that she had congenital defects.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_02: So as far as the cry story goes, I had her baptized in the delivery room.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_02: So you delivered her at 18 weeks?
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_02: No, I and after birth.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: So carried her full term.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: Carried her full term.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_02: So I had her at 18 weeks.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_02: I always use that Marley and me movie because it's the perfect scene to describe the they go in for the ultrasound and they're looking around, and the nurse goes, the tech goes out and gets the doctor, and then they come in.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_02: So I had that whole story.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so at 18 weeks, I learned that her heart was pushed over to her right side, so they're having a very difficult time looking at her organs.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: And we were sent over for an in-depth ultrasound over to St.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_02: Louis, um, which I got a couple weeks later, and learned that she had diaphragmatic hernia and hypoplastic left-sided heart syndrome.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: So, what does that mean?
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_02: It means her diaphragm did not close and seal, which happens by the 10th week of pregnancy, so very early on, and all of her abdominal organs were up into her chest cavity, which pushed her heart to her right side, like and we've come to find out it was so far right, it was in her armpit pretty much.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so because of that, we transferred care to St.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_02: Louis and over to Barnes and Children's, and then I went through numerous things while being pregnant with her.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_02: So the next step was uh echocardiograms, because oftentimes, well, obviously her heart's on the right side, so they got to check out all the functions of the heart.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, she had some other issues within the heart, and the left side was smaller than the right side of the heart, which they did not diagnose her till about three weeks before I had her, officially with the left-sided hypoplastic heart syndrome.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and up until that point, her heart grew.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_02: They each side grew at the same rate, so they didn't diagnose her till officially till later.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_02: So all of that meant that she had to be scheduled, um, theory and section.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: What were they saying to you at this time?
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Were they saying she has a future?
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: What were they saying?
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um they wanted to right away the big thing was uh doing amniocentesis, which I refused.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um I told them that they weren't gonna be able to change the situation and what they could do.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_02: Like, can you can you save her with that?
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: And if not, then no, because you could make me miscarry her, and I'm gonna take as much time as I possibly can with her, and we're not doing that.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_01: Aaron Powell You're a 24-year-old young woman.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 12:33
  unknown: Oh my goodness.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: So what were they saying?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: They were saying you'll carry her full term, she'll keep growing, and then what's gonna happen?
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_02: You just kind of monitor, like watch her health and see how she grows and see what her options are as I guess she develops.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_02: Um said they'd try to have me carry her full term and then deliver and then go from there.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my serious.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_02: So then they would offer, they always had to tell me about they had to offer abortion because it was early on yet.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so were they recommending you do that?
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_02: Nobody recommended anything.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_02: They just said, like, here's your option.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: They push probably for an amniocentesis more than they push for that.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_02: But my care officially transferred it 20 weeks over there.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: And the first time I met with the high-risk OB, you sit down in this room and you have to tell them the first question is, so what's going on?
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_02: And you're looking at them like you know what's going on.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: Why am I telling you?
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: You've got the papers in front of you.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm kind of like, he goes, We have to ask you so that we know what you're aware of.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: Oh.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_02: What do you understand?
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_02: What you're understanding to me.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, okay.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: And so then so I explain it all.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_02: So he goes, Do you have any questions for me?
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_02: I said, Yes.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: Actually, right now on my file, right on there, I will not abort my pregnancy and do not ask me again.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_02: I am tired of hearing it.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_02: Oh.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_02: And he flips up in my folder and he goes, You're 24 weeks tomorrow and it's no longer an option.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_02: Noted.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_02: They have to let you know that you're it's an option.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, it's not one for me.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: Nice.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: So you knew that about yourself.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: I knew that.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I will say that during all of this going on and yeah, 24 years old and young and all the things, not once did I ask why.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: Not once did I You mean like ask God why?
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: Like why like, okay, well, I know I'm like, I'm not doing that.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: We my ex-husband and I didn't even talk about what we were doing with the baby.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: Did he have you were you was he in support of you?
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: And this is what I would say.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I don't I would say yes.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_02: It might have been more of I don't know that he had a choice in the matter.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: He probably knew he didn't have a choice.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um I mean, was he a part of the process with you?
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like he was around, he was like, he was at these appointments, all the appointments, all the things.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: That kind of thing.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: We even um like I had to have an MRI being pregnant with her for them to take another look.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like I was a patient.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: You had an MRI.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: She was a patient through me at children's hospital.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_01: Is this like your parents' first grandbaby?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm just thinking of 24-year-old, and my heart is like, oh first grandbaby.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_01: This is crazy.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: And we had to tour the NIC unit.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_02: We met with surgeons and all that.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_02: So we had our parents come with us to do that so that we kind of knew, kind of walked us through well, what happens if she survives and surgery, not surgery, things like that.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_01: So that those words were said if she survives.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's like, yeah, I think so.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: So what happens next?
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_02: So we go through um multiple testing and things like that, but what I would say is my thought process was immediately this is this is in God's hands, and I'm not I'm not living with what ifs.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_02: So if she is not going to make it, it's not going to be because I made a decision that caused it.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: And it's not going to be because I abort her, because I'm not.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_02: I would much rather live going through the process and trusting what he had for us than and letting it just, it's just not meant to be than living with, well, what if I had done this and then this happened?
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: Or what if I knew that I couldn't do that.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_02: I would not be able to live with that.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I did a lot of praying for a miracle.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_02: I did a lot of nursery rhyme CDs.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_02: I worked night shift at the time, so I played a nursery rhyme CD in the car.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yep, CDs.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_02: And uh I would sing to her, I'd sit in the in my rocker and read books to her.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_02: Uh the ultrasound technician, so after we were diagnosed and like sent for the high-depth tech there, when it was officially diagnosed, she had diaphragmatic hernia, gave me a minute and then came back and she said, You know what?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: The less stress on you, the less stress on that, on your baby.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_02: Decorate the nursery, have your baby shower, do all the things.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_01: What?
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, Okay.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_02: And then my husband's like, just fight back the tears as best you can until we get to the car.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_02: And then it and we did.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_02: We decorated the nursery.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: We had a baby shower.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: I did all the things.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_02: It was really hard.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: It was over the summer I was pregnant.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: She was um born in October to see people out because you're pregnant, and they're like, Oh, you're having a baby.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: And you're like, uh wait, uh, but yeah, and I didn't want to have, I knew I would have to explain.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I didn't want to explain.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: I knew in my heart she wasn't coming home.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_02: She and and she was so, and we did, we had her scheduled, had her baptized because I wanted, I wanted something for her.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_02: There was never going to be anything else, potentially.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so when she was born, um, there was no crying.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_02: Had a whole room adopted.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_02: I was in like just negated that?
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_02: She's not crying, she was not crying.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I'm watching.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_02: Did you go into late?
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_02: So they induced you.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_02: I I was scheduled C-section.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, scheduled C section.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, sorry.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: So I was at Barnes, they had the whole um transport nurse team, like the ones that also go fly on the helicopters, but the station within hospital.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_02: So they were in the room.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_02: The chaplain, I can't remember which country she was from, but she I at first I'm like, who are you?
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'm like, she was she actually gave me one of the best gifts ever because she was taking pictures.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, so Brianna Nicole was born um at 39 weeks.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_02: So she was due on October 23rd, which is actually my cousin's birthday.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but when we learned that we had to have a C-section for sure, doctors only scheduled them on Thursdays.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_02: My birthday happened to be a Thursday of that year, and thankfully I'd listened to my husband and said, Yeah, you're right, we're not doing it on my birthday.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_02: You're not gonna live with that every year.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_02: So her birthday is October 14th, which is good for her because she was actually, we learned we were pregnant on Valentine's Day.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: So there's the whole 14 thing, and she lived just shy of 14 hours.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_02: So she was born, she was transported over to the Nick unit at children's where they did further testing.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, my uh ex Where did you deliver?
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_02: At Barnes, downtown St.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_02: Louis.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_02: So it's just right over.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_02: Right over, yep.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_02: High risk, had all the things I never would have thought about having a baby.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I was not able to go with her because I had a C-section.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: So thankfully the hospital was very thoughtful and they put me in the the perinatal unit, um, which is so if you're on bed rest before you have a baby, so that I wasn't on the same floor as the babies and things.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oh.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_02: I was I learned kind of learned that.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: So did you get to be with her those 14 hours?
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_02: I did not.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_02: So I was taken over um to my room.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: She was transported over to children's.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um, my ex and his family kind of went there.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: We had two friends at the hospital with us, they went there.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_02: I went to my room.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: Are you alone?
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: My mom's there.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_02: My I had aunt and uncle.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_02: I we had some family.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_02: Like we had family that was kind of their only way they'd ever meet her, kind of thing.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so they were with me.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_02: Oprah's Miracle Babies uh episode was on that day.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, really?
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_02: And what I learned is the next day was National Um Pregnancy and Infant Loss Awareness Day.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: What?
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: So how did she look to you?
• 21:04
  unknown: Oh, weird.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_02: She was perfect.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_02: She had 10 fingers, 10 toes, a head full of hair, a beautiful face.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_02: The only thing that looked different was her tummy was more sunk in and that because everything was up, nothing, nothing gave her the round belly.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: She much did she weigh?
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_02: She weighed seven pounds and 15 ounces.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: Brianna.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: And so I got to see her later in the afternoon.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_02: They came over and wheeled me over really fast.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: Never rode so fast in a wheelchair in my life.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and the first time she opened her eyes was when she heard my voice.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_02: Oh.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_02: And it was very brief.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_02: So then we had her be we had met with the surgeon and all of that operating.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_02: We had already decided that we weren't putting her through further pain because it why?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_02: Like it just we weren't gonna do it for ourselves and be selfish.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so we had her transported.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: Luckily, they had an extra unit.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: It in so they brought her back over to my room at Barnes.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_02: The children's chaplain came over.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_02: We had called our the priest back up to come in and they spent and prayed and took pictures.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't even hold my baby first.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_02: Somebody else I let everybody else hold her before she was held by me.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't even hold her first.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_02: Um it was why is that?
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_02: She was hooked up to oxygen tanks, and I was in a bed and couldn't move that well.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: And it just different.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's just different.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_02: And it was just easier with the same thing.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_02: I think with any C-section, it's probably that way.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's very you don't get your baby first.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: A little bit.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: I would not know.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know either, actually.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: They bring you to the side.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: So my other kids, I have other kids, all C-section, and they bring on the side.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_01: How many kids do you have?
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I had a total of three.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_02: So after Bria and I actually miscarried, and then I had Nicholas, who is getting ready to be 20, and then Lauren will be 19 here soon.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, God bless me with more.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: But I have to say, I really admire like how wise you were as such a young woman to know that you did not want to have an abortion, that you were not gonna, the life was not gonna be, you know, the decision was not gonna be in your hands.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like that is so wise.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_01: We and we hear it so many women who deal with, you know, making that decision for themselves.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_01: Humans were not built to make life or death decisions, like who gets to live, who gets to die.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because when we do, we carry that scar forever.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_02: I it was probably like six, ten years after that I realized that I never, I never like we never even talked about what are we gonna do.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: It was just this is it was just we're not doing that.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_02: I never even thought I'm like, no, I'm not living with that.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_02: And that's as far as I got, like, this is in God's hands, and I have to so I just always thought that God needed an angel.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_02: So and he blessed me with her.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: So yes, so then you're in the hospital after this, yeah, still recovering.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_02: Man, girl, and on maternity leave, too, with no baby.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yeah.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah, and your body's all two things.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_02: And bodies doing all the things.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_02: Like there's a baby here.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: There's so much more I know now that that's out there that I think I could have helped with, maybe, but I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing, or if that adds to grief or not to grief, but that's okay.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, what did happen to you next?
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, this is life alternative.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_02: So um I it was I had a lot of hope.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: I never lost hope.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: Well, why why is that?
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm imagining you sunk into depression, you didn't come out.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how do you I just had I just had all this hope.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I always I don't know if it was because I didn't know my father, I always had this feeling, like this, just this feeling like there would be something that happened when I had kids.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_02: I always wanted to be a mom.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I used to be like, is it gonna be I can't get pregnant?
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_02: Is it gonna be that I something's because I don't know my dad?
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_02: I don't I don't know the reason.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: I just always had this feeling upon me that that something would happen.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: And after Brianna passed and they took her away, and my ex-husband and his parents left the room for a little bit, my mom was with me, and I looked at her and I was like, all the weights lifted off.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_02: God has her, she's good, she's in a better place, and all the weight is gone.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: That quickly.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_02: That and it was gone.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: It's amazing.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: I just I know I was I looked at her, I go, I know this is gonna sound like I don't mean this to sound bad or like not with love or heart.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_02: I go, I just it's gone.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I can picture a little bit.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: You had 20 plus weeks of carrying the weight of the future of Brianna.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: What is gonna happen, what is not gonna happen, and now you know what has happened.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_02: And then we had a funeral.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: So I we had the whole casket, visitation, funeral.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_02: She's actually buried across the street from my house.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um could see her from part of my yard across the street.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I would say the depression part hit in, or more anxiety probably hit in it.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_02: It took a while.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_02: They wanted to send me home with stuff and I refused it.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I was like, it doesn't change anything.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_02: Stubborn, Sarah, huh?
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's not gonna change the situation.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_02: I have to, like, I just wanted to feel the feeling.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'm gonna still feel it.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like, are you gonna give me medication and make me numb and I'm just gonna be like, oh yeah, it's fine.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's still there.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: You wanted to feel it.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_02: The biggest thing I found relief from besides uh really praying, and I was going to church and just like, okay, I don't, I don't know which what this is about, but what am I supposed to learn?
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_02: I just remember having a lot of conversations, like, what am I supposed to learn?
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_02: But I scrapbooked a lot, um, journaled a lot, almost obsessively, probably, but that was my way of doing something for her and getting to capture it all.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_02: And it was the best, it was the best gift for her and for myself, honestly.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I share it with other people.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I mean, I went back and showed it to the doctors and the nurses and all of that.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um, great relationships come out of things that you don't expect.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: And and I did.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: I've met, I have I have good relationships with people that came from that.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_02: Then I miscarried, and then there was like, God, what's going on here?
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like well, hang on a second, and you guys, I mean, forgive me, because you guys you've heard this story already.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't know if you're trying to get somewhere.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_03: No, go, Jody.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how would you label Brianna?
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what was the lesson that you learned there?
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: What do you think it was?
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_02: When I think back, the biggest message for me is I was humbled.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_02: I was humbled very quickly and at a young age.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_02: Who who at 25 a week after 25 has a baby, buys their burial plots, has a funeral.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_02: It I and and here's my thing.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: I was always a goal setter, achiever.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: Still are.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_02: Still am.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_02: I try to like bring it down a notch.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_02: A planner, and like, I'm gonna do, I'm gonna go to college and I'm gonna get married, I'm gonna have a family, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna uh I was like, no, you're not.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_02: You're not in charge here.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: Not right now, not yet.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I didn't know if it would be ever.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, and it was having me consider other things.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_02: Well, what if we can't get pregnant?
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what will we do?
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_02: Will we adopt?
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_02: Will we do this?
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that wasn't his kind of how quickly did you get pregnant um after that?
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_02: I got I got my camp.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: So no, if you've had a c-section, there's no c-sections allowed in a year.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_02: Two C-sections the year's like a medical no-no.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_02: If I guess they can't do anything about it if you do.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: You and your sister, I guess, aren't C-sections.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_02: Uh well, I I could wait four months and I got pregnant.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_02: Four months.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: And then a week after I found out I was pregnant.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: So at five weeks I lost the baby.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_02: And that's when I was like, God, I don't under I this is where I'm like, what am I, what are we, what are we missing?
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what are what are we not missing?
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I really felt like it was this message of telling us, like, hey, you guys just went from you know, husband and wife to mom and dad and no baby, and you guys don't even know who you are right now.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_01: How long had you been married?
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um, at that we got married in 2001, in June 2001.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: So four years?
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: Three years, three years.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that seems normal.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_02: Three years.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_02: We had been together for seven, six or seven, seven.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's a lot.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_02: So so then it was about 18 months after the miscarriage.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_02: I got pregnant with my son, Nicholas, and I was like, I felt really good.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_02: I never felt again.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I even had a conversation with my mom, like, mom, I just always felt like I had something.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_02: I feel really good and don't feel like anything's gonna happen.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, did you say you didn't feel nervous during that pregnancy?
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like something's gonna go wrong.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_02: I stayed focused on like I can't change this.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_02: And when I am not gonna live like nervous, nelly in what I just did not want to live like that whatsoever.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I didn't want to be the of would the hypochondriac be a right term.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_01: I just didn't want to live like that.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_01: And how did you have the strength to do that?
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_01: The spiritual strength.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: Were you in the scriptures?
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: As a Catholic, I'm thinking maybe not.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_02: I never honestly, I did not even read the Bible until 2015, other than I had a Bible and going to church and I would read parts of it, but reading it full no, I've I've just been filled with faith.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's all I can explain it.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_02: Been filled with faith.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um I mean so much of your childhood though was in church.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: Loving God, learning how to love God, knowing God loves you, knowing that you can trust him.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: And then just continue to translate.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I I think I always had the perception that God is good and he's not that's it's not mean.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_00: Did you ever get was there ever a moment where you were like, I'm angry at God?
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_02: Not really.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_02: I was more angry at my spouse being angry at God than I was being asked.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: Why is that?
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_02: I just I felt like it was just misplaced anger that things, you know, happen that we can't explain and there's reasons.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I've grew so much from that situation.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I and I never I never wished my kid other kids away, like just the frustration.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_02: Not that I trust me, I have plenty of frustration, but never the like, oh my gosh, why did I, why, why, why are we doing this?
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_02: I just always like, okay, God, I prayed for them.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_02: I get it.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, you know, but I just didn't.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_02: I just appreciated them differently.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember thinking at one point, why doesn't everybody have to go through this?
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_02: I did.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_02: I laid in bed one night talking about it.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_02: This is so good for people.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_02: God, like, why can't everybody experience this so that they can appreciate their children?
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_02: And then this, I hear this.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_02: If everyone did, it changed the experience.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_02: If you change the experience, the experience would change.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_02: You would not know how to appreciate something if you didn't have to go through the hard stuff.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_02: And that's I've carried that with me.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_02: Like it does.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_02: There's life is just life, but there's so much more out there, and it can be so good.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: And it takes going through the valleys to climb up the mountain.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, what uh what's amazing to me is the impact that your daughter's had on your life and for 14 hours.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know, outside of when you carried her.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like uh it's amazing when we talk about her, you talk about her.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's like she's still affecting your everyday life for the positive.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's not a negative experience, even though it it obviously could have been very negative.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and a lot of people uh would have seen it that way, you know, uh including your husband, but like just very, very positive and uh and how she continues to live on through your everyday day life.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's incredible.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: And made her a part of the family, talked about her, celebrated her birthday, made her part of traditions, wanted my other children to know very much about their sister.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because I didn't want them I wanted them to know that there are hard things in life and it doesn't mean it has to derail you.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_02: You could stay on track.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_02: Um but um Nicholas and Lauren are 14 months apart.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_01: What?
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my word.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: 14 is a number in your house.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah.
• 34:01
  unknown: Wow.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_00: What uh how do you what would you say to someone that's dealing with what I would say your story is impossible pain?
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_00: How do you deal with impossible pain?
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: What would you say to the whatever their pain is, whatever the situation is, how would how do you deal with impossible pain?
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_02: I would say I've probably experienced worse pain in the in the last couple of years than I did by that pain.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_02: Um I think I would say that, and I I I said this the first time is I came to realize that something that I had no control over that was God's plan, and not that some other interactions aren't God's plan, but the hurt from a human, human hurt, felt way worse than what God had laid out in that story.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um that that pain was the pain from my divorce stuff was way worse than what Bree was in a different way.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I would just say that you can, we have choices, and I we can choose to let it define us, or we can choose to feel it.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's okay to have emotions, it's okay to be sad, it's okay to get depressed over these things, but it don't lose all your hope.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um, definitely get into the Bible around the people that are going to love on you and that share who Jesus is and remind you how good he is, and that you just have to trust and be obedient and you don't know what's ahead.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_02: That door might have closed.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_02: And that, but that door was all about she served her purpose here because what I also learned, it doesn't matter how long someone is here with us, it's about how much they're loved and how much love you have for them.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_02: And she is forever with us.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um and you're if it's somebody else going through a loss, like they're forever with you.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_02: It's how do you choose to see them and how do you choose to let God pull you through that situation and guide you through?
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then even other hurdles in life, it's it's kind of you can use the same thing.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's hard when you're in that moment.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_01: It is hard.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, something devastating has happened to you.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you can you've got 50-50 shot.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_01: You're gonna turn towards him or you're gonna turn away from that.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_01: You're right.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_02: And you know what?
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_02: I always said I would rather turn towards him and figure it out and and then than to not turn towards him and find out I was I'm suffering way worse.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um I did, I and and Sean knows from the last you know, several years.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_02: There's so many times I was just like, I don't know.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I can't fix it, I have no solution, but I don't want to screw it up to screw the situation up more than it is or mess it up more than it is.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_02: Like and you hand it over to God, take it, help me figure it out.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_02: And then it's pretty amazing to see how just letting it be has changed and things progress and they get better.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_01: I think well, that's the thing.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we know that, like you said, this world, like stuff happens.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_01: You know, God doesn't orchestrate miscarriages for us, he doesn't orchestrate diseases for us.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_01: That happens in our sinful world.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_01: But what he does do is he will use it for his glory and for our good.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_01: Or it turns us on a totally different path, and we are not a hopeful person.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_01: We are in depression, we are functioning in a totally different way, not flourishing.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_01: And so in his hands, it can do it can be glorious.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: And in my experience, just in that marriage, I can tell you that's exactly it.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_02: It was, I can tell you how I viewed things and went with God, and how the other person went against God, and just totally different directions.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_02: And what becomes the things they idle and pride themselves on and destroys them because they feed yourself from God.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_00: When it grew in you because you moved yourself towards God.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: Faith begat more faith.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_01: Hope begat more hope.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I will always turn that way.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_02: Just from I can see it because I I've been given of a true example, and I can see it, and I don't want that.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel way better with Jesus than I do without him.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_02: Without him.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: Wow, girl.
• 38:27
  unknown: Yeah.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_00: There's gonna be an incredible reunion someday with you and your daughter.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's gonna be a good one.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: You'll know her instantly.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_00: It'll be amazing for sure.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_02: Uh when this was they had um what was the house, the first Baptist church, not instead of Hell instead of Hellhouse.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_02: Is it Hell House?
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: No, Hell House.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: It was called Hell House.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_00: Or a scene.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_02: Revelation house or something.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, maybe it was called some different.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_00: So when it was It's also called a Hell House.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_02: It was upstairs.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_02: All the different rooms.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_02: It was upstairs.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_02: The last part.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_02: Did you come here?
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_02: I a friend of mine did, yeah.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_02: And then I did actually go to the house.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_02: Everybody came to that job before that too.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_02: So they opened the doors.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like made to be like heaven, and they had these young girls all in the white choir robes, and I immediately just started crying because that's all I could see was my daughter.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_02: That's and that's what I picture.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_02: And in the very back of her of her um scrapbook, it says, One day I'll meet you in your nursery in heaven.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_00: Powerful.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_02: So we have choices.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_00: Which is mo what is m even more powerful is the fact that you can sit here and share your story so clearly and uh and not share it as in you're angry with God.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so thankful that you didn't blame God, that you turned towards him.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: I tried to share, that was one of my vows, was too much.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_01: Not that you can't be angry at it, he can take that.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_02: And and not that I I didn't I trust me, I went through a period of like I was not a nice person.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_02: I was sad, I was I was angry, not necessarily at him, just like angry at the whole situation overall, and then just having to process it.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_02: And um, but I always vowed to her like I will forever share your story because then there wasn't social media social media wasn't quite yet there.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_02: And you kind of had that generation before you didn't talk about it.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_02: I also learned a lot that people in that situation used to, in the old days, never even get to see their baby if something happened.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_01: Really?
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: So then I was thankful for the progression.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_02: Now there's even more progression in how they handle these situations.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_02: But I just wanted people to not feel so alone.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate you doing that.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_01: I've experienced two miscarriages, and I feel like if there's two things that women do not talk about, it's miscarriages and menopause.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like no one tells you anything, you just start suffering.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_01: But like in this experience with Brianna, I have not heard of people going through this at all.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_02: I uh now I have since been more aware because it's like once you're kind of in the club, you're you start to hear and connect in a different way.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_02: But I also think that's why we're better to share those things because it's it doesn't you can help them, you can give them what you what you know.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's why we're sharing your story today.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think that's a good idea.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_00: So someone else might be encouraged for sure.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, that's I said she would always live be here if you're gonna be able to do that.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_02: She's alive right now.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: She is alive.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like I met her.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_00: Have met her.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yep, she's beautiful.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_00: Two things as we close.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_00: One is would you mind answering a question?
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: And then second, would you mind closing us out in prayer?
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_00: The question is this if you could say anything to your LCC family, what would it be?
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and then obviously if you wouldn't mind closing us out in prayer, that'd be great.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_02: To LCC family, I'd say just keep loving on Jesus.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_02: And if you are in that stuck spot, seek help, friendship, anybody here.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um everybody's been great and welcoming.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_02: Find me.
• 42:10
  unknown: Yeah.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_02: If if you want to talk about a child loss or even other grief, trust me that I've got a whole background of it.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um just reach out and don't lose hope and faith.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_02: Keep following Christ.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's important.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_01: Don't disappear, don't isolate.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_02: That's the worst thing you can do.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_02: Definitely just keep, even if you're not feeling it and you don't know why and don't understand, just bring and skip into the church and sit in the church, even if you can do nothing else but listen.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we are not safe in our own thoughts.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_00: That is for sure.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_02: That's for sure.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_00: All right, Sarah, thanks so much for sharing your story today.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_02: You're welcome.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_02: Dear Heavenly Father, thank you for this time with Sean and Jody.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for giving me some words to share with whomever needs to hear it.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_02: And most of all, thank you for loving me, the church.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um thank you for holding on to my baby up there.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_02: And just I I pray that this reaches anyone who needs to know that you are always there to guide them and comfort them.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: And you are our our best father and guide.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know the plan, we don't, and you know what's going to make us stronger and help us grow.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_02: And just whoever needs that, just help them to feel your presence with them and know that you are there to love on them too.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_02: Love you, Jesus.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_02: Amen.