Latest / Beyond our Stories / Can Thinking About Death Change the Way We Live? | Beyond Our Stories with Constance Brenneman
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- speaker-0: From when I started this to now, I think ⁓ documentary was a huge part of it. It was learning to trust my internal compass a whole lot more. I think life can be bigger and brighter, and that's the journey that I'm on. But it's not about making anybody believe anything. speaker-1: Every person has his story. Some stories make us laugh, some challenge us. speaker-2: Some stay with us long after they're over. speaker-1: But sometimes the most meaningful part of the story isn't the ending. speaker-2: But it's the conversation that begins afterwards. speaker-1: Welcome to Beyond Our Stories. I'm Ali. And our guest today is Konstance Brennan, an actress, producer, and director whose own experience and curiosity about what may exist beyond the life eventually led her to spend years exploring one of the biggest questions we can ask: What happens when we die? speaker-2: I'm Stephanie. Her documentary Afterlife, Beyond the Light, brings together personal accounts of near death and also shared death experiences with researchers who have spent decades studying this. And today we don't just want to talk about what might happen after we die, even though this is a fascinating topic, but we also want to hear more about Constance herself, her journey as a creative, her journey in the industry, and how she even came up with the idea to create a movie like that. speaker-1: Gunsans, welcome to Beyond Our Stories. Very welcome and we are very happy to have you with us. speaker-0: Thank you. I'm happy to be here. speaker-1: Before we talk about the documentary, when you stream away director, producer and actor, who are you? speaker-0: When I strip all of those things away, I think I'm, you know, the inherently the same person that I was when I was a kid. I think we get, you know, more complexity in terms of the responsibility we take on, but we're always the same core person. And that person is curious and always loves to grow, takes on too much to do. But out of out of an interest of of wanting to grow and dig and explore. people, culture, story a bit stubborn and ⁓ I love truth and authenticity. And I think it when you strip everything away, that's kind of what remains. speaker-1: Okay, so ⁓ yourself experienced in your twenties the out of body ⁓ experience, right? And since then ⁓ you become ⁓ what you have described as a seeker. So ⁓ can you tell us what happened and what did those experiences make you start a question? speaker-0: that's a you know, it's a it's a huge question and the start and you know, where I am at now is a is is a whole wide, complex journey. And at the start I'd like to say it was a glorious thing, but it it simply it really wasn't, I I have to say, it it threw me because the questions that opened up in terms of who am I really? What is the source of thought if I'm thinking beyond this speaker-2: ⁓ yeah. speaker-0: body, ⁓ w what is the purpose? I'd never really asked any of those things. I don't know why. I was in my early twenties and I wasn't brought up to believe anything specifically. And so I think in the beginning all of that was a touch overwhelming. And then after that after the overwhelm subsided, then I just started digging. I started digging into different customs, into different religions, into the through lines that tied together the the major world religions. And then I started seeing kind of roles to the game and systems at play and beauty. And I'm like, okay, this isn't chaos. It doesn't feel overwhelming. All the sciences are trying to view this magnificent unknown entity. under a different lens. And so it is a great masterwork where you can constantly keep learning. And that flip, you know, eventually happened where the unknown became really exciting and magical versus daunting. speaker-1: Okay, and the viewers and the listeners might not know that making a documentary might take years from the preparation, the research and the shootings and and even the post production sometimes it takes years because for example we had we had also a documentary P D B leg, which took ⁓ took me ⁓ three and a half years to do the post production and doing editing, re editing and everything. So How long it took to ⁓ to create ⁓ afterlife beyond the light? speaker-0: think from idea origination to the end, it was five years. And there you know, there really is no end 'cause we're here doing a podcast together talking about the story. And so I hope that the story has continues to live on for years and years and years. But ⁓ through post production I would say five years and it wasn't consistent work on the film because at some points it needed to breathe so that I understood what needed to come in. You know, and I didn't feel like pushing it because I thought if I just pushed it too hard it would just be something that I wasn't proud of. And speaker-2: And ⁓ you described ⁓ a process for you internally from ⁓ a feeling of being overwhelmed to just more of a curiosity to just learn whatever is happening, whatever is revealing itself to you, if I summarize it correctly. How would you say like what state would you say were you in when you started with a project? speaker-0: Well, I s I'd say it was pretty far along into the disc sort of discovering myself, some key touch points of what I thought about life based on the the culmination of these world religions. Everyb there's a lot of disparity, but I think at there are some fundamental points that tie them together and I think those that's kind of the core of my system. So it didn't feel like I was flailing into no man's land. But I think I was pretty far along in that before I started this documentary. And the documentary ⁓ enhance, I think, a sense of peace and do not only this human experience, but what could potentially lie beyond. speaker-1: Mm-hmm. Okay, interesting. And what was the question you wanted to explore with this documentary? Because this topic is very is is is a very interesting topic and many people have many different opinions about that. And many people are very skeptical ⁓ for the ⁓ with that. ⁓ so what what what did you want to achieve with this documentary? speaker-0: Well, I I just I I wanna just preface by saying I think skepticism is really healthy and I and I wouldn't want anybody to look at at my piece or anything and just just sort of blankly. In doing this, it was also not to prove anything. I didn't go go into it thinking that I needed to change anybody's mind or get anybody on my team because I didn't really have a team to get anybody on. I I was curious about the The fundamental touch points that these researchers had come to. And I thought, if I'm really curious about that, if I think, wow, this is worth exploring, because they're talking about a journey where people are saying very distinct things along the way. And if thousands of people are saying this, that seems ⁓ like something worth exploring. And if I want to explore that, if I want to be an explorer into that world. We all die. I think there are enough people who would want to explore that world. speaker-1: That's cool. ⁓ we hear two terms often in the documentary. I one is near death experience and the other one is shared death experiences. And I believe that many of viewers and and listeners ⁓ today they didn't watch the movie yet and the documentary yet and they might ask, What are these terms? What what they really mean? Can you tell us so so the listeners and the viewers understand what what these terms mean and what they can expect from the documentary ⁓ when they decide to watch it? speaker-0: Yes, happily. So near death experience is when ⁓ a person dies technically, ⁓ flat lines or long state coma, and has an experience that is beyond this realm of the world in which we know, and then comes back to tell their story of what that experience was. And shared death experience. is looking at that experience of a human's transition from from this r world into a potential afterlife from a third party lens. So they're not under any kind of biological duress. They're usually a nurse, a doctor, a loved one, a hospice care worker viewing it from typically bedside. speaker-2: And did you know when you started the project that you wanted to include both experiences, or did that happen more or less while you created this? speaker-0: You know, it w I think that was an important part for me in terms of wanting to do the documentary, because so much of the ⁓ the criticism in terms of the experience themselves is a biological ⁓ criticism that, you know, it it's it's probably some sort of hallucination or chemical reaction to the dying process. For one thing with near-death experiences, I thought, well, that's a really interesting hallucination for thousands of people to have the same one, you know, in terms of these touch points. But then furthermore, the shared death experience has the same touch points that can be statistically analyzed. And so how they're not experiencing that same biological breakdown. And so again, I I wasn't trying to prove anything, but for myself, I thought this seems too regulated. It seems too systematized to be a just a hallucination because that's a singular experience. And it and and and then the the shared death gave me well, and it's a non biological experience in terms of shared death. And so that that's one of the reasons that really pulled me into wanting to explore further. speaker-1: Very interesting to hear if this specific situation happened to you as well during this document making this documentary. Because when I make a documentary, I have a very specific expectation, a specific idea of the topic that I'm I'm focusing on at that moment. Often it is the case that when I start creating the documentary, I start shooting, interviewing people and and doing research and many things. It turns out that some of my expectations are either wrong or not the way I think they are good or they are real. So ⁓ was there a moment or something you expected to find and it turned out to be completely different that what you expected? speaker-0: I think this answer might be unfortunately a bit boring for you because I don't I did not have an expectation of what I was gonna find. I did find a lot of interesting takeaways personally, and I thought, well, that if that has a profound impact on me, then it could for others, certainly. But I I really didn't go into this as ⁓ with with anything besides a desire to explore and play. speaker-2: But was there a discovery that ⁓ stayed with you for a longer time? speaker-0: ⁓ definitely. Yes, definitely. the documentary I and I think I think we'll get more into the nuts and bolts of this, but I would say the overall takeaway from making this piece has been a greater sense of peace, freedom in terms of my own life, joy, and you know, and it's really interesting how that looks. It's not like my life got easier, but making peace with a lot of different elements of things or, you know. knowing what to really focus hone in on or what to let go of has seemed to become a lot easier. And you know, the end of life reviews has has had a profound impact on me, but not necessarily, I think, in the in like a generic sense. So, you know, the end of life reviews is something that statistically has a high you know, if you're a really you know, if your if your mind loves clinging to y a a logical framework, any people who go it it's it's usually people who did not flatline and come back immediately. They have sort of a a more long term experience. ⁓ and then they all get to this place where they have an end of life review. And it's not like this lengthy thing. You'd be like, ⁓ my gosh, my whole life. It's gonna be like let me get some popcorn. No, it's it's sort of ⁓ it's all at once and it's all sort of known and then people say that they can ⁓ zoom in almost on key moments where they're learning something really important. And that the takeaway is profound. And how I can really tell that that's true is that the experiencers when they talk about it, it's very emotional for them. But not in this way where where it makes them carry extreme shame or blame. ⁓ it's really, it's like, ⁓ it's more like, ⁓ It's about learning and about I see where I could do better. I it's almost like a game, but it's not a trivial game. It's like a a game of like love and of life. And I think that that can be taken in sort of ⁓ this gross way of like, you know, love and light, like all of these things. But I actually think that showing up authentically, what I've learned is showing up authentically and sometimes it's having a very honest conversation. is the kindest thing to do. Because I think sometimes you can get stuck in this, you know, l all everything is love viewpoint. And the most loving thing to do is actually really hard. Or maybe it is just gracefully letting go of something. And that is the most loving thing to do. And so it's not that this thing, I I think there's a trap that people are like, ⁓ my gosh, I should just be really kind or I'm going to like burn an house. Some kind of But that's not at all what I I got from this thing. It's that we are all connected in this fundamental way. That's what it the framework seems like. That we're all designed to learn and grow and that it's not punitive fundamentally. So it's not like we're gonna be guilted or shamed for not getting something. And so in that way it doesn't feel like I I think the the end of life review can seem really daunting if it's this. hyper judgmental framework. Do your best and we're all going to get the lessons. And ⁓ it's more like from a loving viewpoint. speaker-2: Yeah. And it seemed like that from ⁓ all the interviews we see in Afterlife that no nobody described it as a judgmental space but more of I understand it better. I have a I have a better a better viewpoint of it and I can appreciate ⁓ I I I understand my choices on a higher level and appreciate more what I can see now. Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah. And and that we're given sort of an internal mechanism. ⁓ oftentimes people are talking and and that that if we sort of don't necessarily listen to that I think we have a lot you know, we have this other voice that's not necessarily helpful oftentimes, but the one that's peaceful and, you know, open that people find that when they go away from that thing that they get into kind of the mire. But it's but The we Yeah. So there's a lot of take takeaways there. It's huge. speaker-2: Yeah. Before I learned about that, I would have thought maybe if I were in a place where I was looking back at my life, maybe there would be some more of a feeling of regret. But nobody described it that way. So so that was really interesting to hear. speaker-0: ⁓ yes, Stephanie, if I thank goodness, 'cause there's some you know, there are and oftentimes there were the mistakes I made, honestly, if I think about my intention, came from a place of loving the other but in a very misguided way. Yeah, and and but I made some really big mistakes in my particularly in my younger life, but I I don't I don't see it it gave me a lot of peace with that actually. speaker-1: interesting. And ⁓ in a documentary, you have amazing ⁓ experts and ⁓ professors who are who have spent ⁓ decades studying these experiences. ⁓ and at the same time, you had also people who actually lived through them and experienced that those situations ⁓ themselves. Was there a specific story or encounter that genuinely changed the way you understood death? Or even your personal experience that you had in your trainings. speaker-0: Well, I think the the personal experience I had was just an opening and at the time I saw it as a very inconvenient one. but y you know, and by the time I hit this, ⁓ it was more in terms of like a a a fun exploration that also was a lot of work. The experiences themselves, although I'm a you know, seeker ⁓ somebody who who likes to sort of explore the nature of the world of the what I you know, this life and beyond, I'm still a very logical, grounded person. And I like numbers. I like tangible things. And so when I come across something called a verifia, I think it's called a verifiable near death experience. There was one I didn't include it actually, but ⁓ where a a blind woman ⁓ had a near death experience and she can't she can't see in in in this world. And then ⁓ when she got outside of her body and the near death, she could see like the three sixty viewpoint that everybody talks about. And in that, she could see where everything was in the hospital room. And so she could describe specific moments during her surgery when they were bringing her back that she would have no way of knowing outside of having a viewpoint. And she relayed these, and of course, not just the near death experience component, but just the fact that she could see was shocking and verifiable because everybody else was in the room. To the point where it was like sp specific colors and instruments that were used and things. So and she was unconscious. So it wasn't just that she couldn't see. ⁓ another one that I did use was ⁓ Anne Atherton, who was in a coma for for a long time, and three people that She knew, her family knew, had passed away and she had seen them in in her near death experience. And so when she came out of the coma, she had relayed this information to her family and obviously they were shocked. And she's and they said, you know, they had died. And I think that probably made a lot of sense to her. speaker-2: And was it difficult to find people that wanted to share ⁓ their story and their experiences? 'Cause it's also, at least in my opinion, something very personal. speaker-0: ⁓ yeah, so that part was an extreme stroke of luck. ⁓ I had done the interviews and was already talking to ⁓ the modern dance company about the ⁓ the dance pieces to tie together the point where kind of words we don't have words for this territory, but we were running low on budget, which is a very real constraint for independent filmmakers. And I reached out to Coming Home channel because I love their content and I did a collab with them on the experiential side. Okay. So they they provided their footage for the experiencer. speaker-2: Okay. And then ⁓ how did you choose to integrate the dance parts? 'Cause I think that's a wonderful idea, especially especially because ⁓ we're talking about something that is so hard to ⁓ to to grasp. And I think the dance parts are really helpful for this. How did you come up with that? speaker-0: lucky break that was. So I wanted to appeal to the our our logical sensibilities, but it is a very heart-driven experience and story. And so if you don't have something that can convey that, then I really felt like I was gonna miss the the boat or the plot, whatever that saying is. I thought I don't know really I sat with that for a while and then came to modern dance because it seems like something that doesn't have the form is open enough to be able to convey this kind of like very open, otherworldly kind of experience, but also bounded enough to convey the structural key points that are within the experience. And I came I talked to a couple of dance companies and I came across a a girl. ⁓ a woman who one of the key dancers, she was the first to get back to me and she's very with it and amazing, ⁓ Elizabeth. And she choreographed the dancers. I would give her a piece of prose and she was like, I've got you. And then she she pulled the dancers together. She's like, These are my friends. I trust them. And I'd I'd give it to her and she would be twenty minutes later she's like, We're we're ready to shoot. ⁓ By the time we had cameras set up for the next shot, they were ready to go. And I would read the prose, you know, whether it was from the experiential side, because they didn't have the interviews. They would either have pieces of the interviews that I'd pulled or a a bit bit of a poem or a piece of Shakespeare, and I would read it and they would do the danced to aligned with the words. Now my editor would say that wasn't as easy as it sounds. But ⁓ she did a brilliant job. speaker-2: Mm. Yeah. No, I think that worked out really well really well. ⁓ I would like to see it again now, knowing that as well. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah. It was such a fun few days of shooting. Yeah. speaker-1: Before we continue, I want to tell the viewer and ⁓ listeners ⁓ if this conversation has made you curious about the experiences and the research we're talking about after life beyond the light is available to watch on Aleph Cine Stream under www.acstream dot com. So please feel free to check it out and share with us what you think and what are your thoughts. And if you even ⁓ experience ⁓ this similar situation, we'd be happy to ⁓ hear your ⁓ story in the comments. I'd like to move a little bit away from the documentary ⁓ for a moment and talk about what spending so much time thinking about death has done to the way you live now. Because in a documentary There is also a part that people talk about it ⁓ that the life of the people who experience that changes a bit sometimes because they have a r a different point of view from that moment. ⁓ so now my question is, how is it for you? speaker-0: Perfect as always, but I would say truly there's a lot more freedom and peace. And I think that I've learned from the end-of-life reviews not to be ⁓ feel contained by it because it can be it can be a very daunting idea that we all of our life is recorded in some capacity, but It doesn't make me feel minimized. It actually makes me feel really open to embracing this moment. And and like I said, that's not perfect. I get caught up in the minutiae all the time. But ⁓ I I do think that I'm getting better at it. And also not sweating the small stuff, allowing things to come and go lovingly. And knowing that it's growth and learning not as much kept up in the emotional quality of life, but still holding space for the responsible responsibility of it. Like having those loving conversations with people, both in terms of joy and in terms of the, you know, real moments of the connection. Knowing when, you know, a lesson is learned and not trying to take it back on again. Just being like No thanks. And then, you know, moving on. From when I started this to now, I think a documentary was a huge part of it. But it was, I think if I could just say it came down to one thing, it was learning to trust my internal compass a whole lot more. And when I did that, when I do that, there's so much more peace in a profound way. And What I thought was I was doing out of kindness or love oftentimes was just holding together a stuck system. It actually this whole peace idea actually requires a lot more bravery, truth be told, but ⁓ but I'm enjoying the ride much more. speaker-2: And has it changed the way for you, ⁓ that you look at conflict and approach conflict? speaker-0: Yeah. It and and it and it's not like a one stop shop. ⁓ sometimes I go in and address things head on and sometimes I lovingly walk away because we both learned from what it was. And then a space opens and the new enters, whatever that is, situation, person, XYZ. And so but it's trusting myself From a place of peace, not from the you know, the noise of I can or I shouldn't or you know, all of that the negative self talk. From really from that internal place of peace that I know like how to navigate. speaker-1: After spending years with this with these stories and this documentary and your personal experience, has that changed the way you treat people in your life? speaker-0: Yes and no. Y I mean, yes, overall, yes. But I don't think it's always the way you would think. I don't think it is I'm not going to say that it's this ⁓ this umbrella of ⁓ overwhelming niceness. ⁓ that's not honest. I I and I don't think it's my role. It has and I am always kind, but some kinds kindness is saying the thing that causes growth for both of us. It is about learning. And learning isn't a surface experience. It is an involved experience. And you can't have an involved experience with ⁓ I think we can there's a trap in ⁓ niceness for the sake of like getting into some kind of ring of heaven or something. You know what I mean? ⁓ so yes, fundamentally But it's not like a clean cut thing or answer. It's a very circumstantial and moment by moment relationship with others and with myself. speaker-2: And has some ⁓ have some of your relationships also reflected that back to you and speaker-0: some way? Yes, absolutely. I think ⁓ it's interesting. You the authentic love has stayed and I've let a lot of role playing that I was doing, frankly, go and way more authentic love has come in. speaker-2: That is so interesting. Cause I also feel like from my perspective, I'm raised in a way that's very people pleasing. So like I understand what you described to ⁓ work towards the growth that the situation needs right now and that's not always like the nicest options. Like I what I understand is that it's not the only the people pleasing option, but it's the option that's more real for for the situation you're in. Like you're talking more about what's really there instead of trying to make the nicest situation out of it. So that's really interesting for me to hear. speaker-0: Yeah, and and I don't even know how a good differen I I'm glad that you f you find you find something in that because it was a massive lesson for me. And and and what I actually found was that nice and kind, I I just have to differentiate them. I don't know ⁓ they're not the same thing. Yeah. Because I spent so many years I think being unkind to people by being inauthentic in ways and not because I was Doing it on purpose in a manipulative way, but doing it to try to like make somebody else happy or peace, but at the expense of peace and authenticity for myself. And then when that really happened, I found that a lot of people who needed me to just buffer wanted to slide and I let them slide. It was actually really free. And then a lot of people who wanted to have this next speaker-2: Mm-hmm. speaker-0: real life with me. I didn't have to work for it. They were there. They came. So there was never like a I'm so lonely moment. It was just a transition. But there's a lot of trust in that. That's what I say. It's not it's not this easy like freeing. There's so much trust involved. speaker-1: One thing that is that is interesting for me is that we also hear that in the documentary from from from the people who experience ⁓ these accounts. Many people don't like to die or they are scared or they have fears of dying. And people often say who experienced ⁓ near death experiences, they say often that they have a different view of dying and they d and the d the the fear the the fear of death change for them. How is that for you and and what and how how is that for for the people you interviewed and ⁓ you you talked to in your research process? speaker-0: Yeah, thank you. This is so you know, it's so big and so loaded in terms of I just wanna say one thing and then I'll and then I'll answer your question. There is a real pain and loss that most people experience at the end of life. And so I can under s fully understand and appreciate and empathize for the attachment to that for us as humans. We've I'm sure you've lost people in your life. I've lost people in my life. And so it's not just the actual physical. Pain, but it's also the grief that associated with losing someone. So that is real. And I don't want to take away from that. When I also say that the documentary itself is very hopeful. And I didn't set out to make it extraordinarily hopeful. The experiences are just, I just really wanted to be a fly on the wall. And the experiences are are very hopeful. They're experiences where they encountered. deceased relatives on the other side and they're guided through the process of understanding and examining their life. And that, you know, they're celebrated for what they learned and then talk through it's like a the talking points of, you know, what what you can, you know, conquer you know, in the continuation. And so all of that, you know, the death in the physical sense, I just want to say I'm not trying to gloss over that. And The death in the documentary, the actual transition and beyond is something I think, if you're open to it, can really ease your mind and give you a sense of peace about d death, dying, and about the exploration of living. speaker-1: Very, very interesting. ⁓ You worked you said you worked on a documentary for almost five years. Yeah. Or about five years, ⁓ less and more. And after spending those years thinking about death and what might come after it, is there anything you change or adopted in your own life? speaker-0: ⁓ gosh. It's that runs so deep and wide. ⁓ but I do you know I'm gonna take this phrase from Dr. Moody because not only is he an absolute delightful human being, but he's a he has a brilliant mind and he's been i in enveloped in this research for six decades. And he really looks at this journey as a narrative, our human stories. And so this is I feel like the more We can embrace the hero part of our journey that we're it, like even if really hard things come, that those hard things are lessons. We can feel like a victim, or it can be an opportunity. And how we play it is how our role within it is defined. And I'm not saying terrible, terrible things can't happen. And I'm not saying that it's not okay. To be sad or to be angry, but ultimately, what can I take from this and how can I be bigger, better, wiser? And I think that is one of the biggest things that I took away from him, as well as and and this piece, as well as the sense that he never says I know. He never says I believe. He's doing something that I've seen very few of us be able to do, which is ride this wave of the human experience with learning, saying, I'm sure he has takeaways, he has a framework, he's not gelatin, but he is open to the conversation. He's open to the experience. He's open to the learning. Because ultimately, not a single human has it all figured out or ever will or ever has. I think the mystery is partially a mystery on purpose, and I think there's a lot of magic in it. And that was a huge takeaway for me too. speaker-1: And and what what would you say to people because because there are there are people who deeply believe in these accounts and an in an afterlife. There are also people who say, Yeah, there might be something, but I'm not sure, but there is something after ⁓ after we are close to die or we are dying. And and even there are people who say I don't believe in that. That's not explainable for me. That I I don't believe that such such thing exists or so because there are many, many different ⁓ type of ⁓ beliefs and belie ⁓ and people ⁓ who believe or don't believe. how do you personally navigate that line between evidence, belief and what we simply don't know? speaker-0: Ugh That is a great question. It's it's a it's a very big question. and it it's it's an unending question because fundamentally I think whatever you believe is great. I don't I'm not trying to take any b way buddy away from their core belief systems at all. And I think the way people celebrate and the way they people c have ceremony and have customs. I think There's so much beauty in that, truly. If it's not infringed or fear-based or made other people to feel marginalized, ⁓ you know, I I think it it all can work. And what I would say in terms of fundamental belief, it's just whatever framework you create for yourself. I I know that we're all given a lot of frameworks. whether that's country or familial or faith based or, you know, w whatever the framework is. And I would say for me, one of the the greatest gifts and challenges has been to s examine the cycles of the gifts, the what has been given, and decide what actually works for that core person. That you were like, who is the core person beyond all of these things? What actually works for her? What does she want to see forward? And what doesn't? What framework, what systems are are more authentic, more based on my viewpoints through this current life experience? Because otherwise we're trapped in loops that we don't want to be in. And oftentimes those loops keep us stuck. Oftentimes those loops are created on fear or conditioning or ⁓ keeping us small for the sake of making everybody else feel comfortable. And I would just say that I think life can be bigger and brighter. And that's the journey that I'm on, but it's not about making anybody believe anything. And speaker-2: Were there conversations that came up with audience members after ⁓ they watched the movie? Did you have conversations with them after speaker-0: Yes. yes. I there's the the audience who gravitates towards the doc tends to have done a lot of introspection and digging and all of these things. And so ⁓ I find that the conversations are very enriching and and I always walk away feeling like I've received and given. That's nice. I don't know how to get into the nuts and bolts of it. There's so so many pieces. speaker-2: Yeah. speaker-1: That's that's very interesting because now I'm curious to hear if making afterlife beyond the light has taught you just one thing. Not about dying ⁓ and not about near death experience ⁓ or shared death experience, but about living. What is that? speaker-0: I feel ⁓ gosh, one thing. speaker-1: It i i it can be many things, so you feel feel free to to tell ⁓ to tell us ⁓ what you are comfortable with. speaker-0: Definitely think there's purpose here. So many people say when they when they when they are told to go back or that they're gonna keep living, ⁓ they're like, No, because it's so great, but it's not like when they're back, they're like, ⁓ yes, it's good, I'm reinvigorated because they they have a sense of there's they're told that they have purpose. And ⁓ I think for me, when I when I try to put purpose and find it in the external. The world is so noisy. It's, you know, and and glossy and fast. And so I think it's really hard and disorienting to try to get purpose from the outside in. I think s for me, it's often derived in the quiet and meditation, in sort of like where that peace drives me from the inside out. And then I don't feel like I'm lost in the wilderness. And helping the the documentary has reinforced the idea that we have purpose. We're not just floating entities. And that, you know, I find that that feels more grounded and trusting that purpose process that I I already have all of the mechanisms needed to. To walk that path. I just need to hear them. and you know, you can see the beauty of that in nature, whether it's bees, you know, all doing their designated roles, or birds flying in a V, or, you know, the comet coming every so years. There's a method to the madness. So if we just trust and don't get flown away by all of the I need to. have X, Y, Z or look like, you know, whatever it is, then I think ⁓ it can be a really good ride and not devoid of extreme challenge. I'm telling you, like I there's y you know, but but like but that's those those are some of the key takeaways from the documentary. And and I'm so grateful for the audience and please watch please watch the documentary because I I I I really hope and I do believe that You'll get something from it. But even if not if there there wasn't nobody seeing it, I'm I I would still wanna make it. Yeah. But I made it speaker-1: ⁓ But after you watch Forder and you hear the experiences and everything, so it it's it's it will it will be a different experience and different ⁓ point of view. ⁓ and it's very, very well made. ⁓ thank you for making this documentary ⁓ consensus. Yeah, we are slowly moving towards the ending of this episode ⁓ with ⁓ Constance. ⁓ and we have always ⁓ some questions, often one or sometimes two, which are or signature questions. We are very interested to know from you, Constance, if there was just one thing you wanted people to remember from this conversation and this episode of the podcast, what would it be? speaker-0: Well, I ⁓ I really I just wanna say that when you walk watch the documentary, take what you will from it. I really would rather it be that than some sort of prescriptive thing. ⁓ but just ⁓ you know, come in with all of whatever whatever you want and then and then see if there's a even a subtle shift because I think it could offer a lot of ⁓ potential joy and peace if you're open to it. speaker-1: And what's one story or a movie or even a personal experience that changed the way you see people? speaker-0: ⁓ I you know, I I I'm just gonna go with the relationships with people who have shown me unconditional love. Yeah. That's nice. It's true. 'Cause that's a no restar. speaker-1: Yeah, amazing ⁓ Constance. ⁓ thank you so much for joining us and for having this ⁓ interesting thought provoking conversation with us. I think what's fascinating about about this subject is that even though we started by asking what might happen after we die, we somehow ended up talking just as much about how we live, how we treat the people around us, and what we choose to do. We did time behalf. speaker-2: And if you would like to explore the experiences and research behind today's conversation, you can go watch Afterlife Beyond the Light on Aleph Sinistream. That's acminus dream.com. speaker-0: Thanks guys. speaker-1: If this episode resonated with you and you liked it, please feel free to like it, left a review, and comment, and share it with whoever needs to watch this. Every story begins on the screen, but it continues within us. Thank you for joining us and we'll see you next Thursday on Beyond Our Stories.