Latest / Miss Understood with Rachel Uchitel / MLB's Dwight "Doc" Gooden Talks Highs and Lows On and Off the Field and Getting HIs Number Retired

Transcript

MLB's Dwight "Doc" Gooden Talks Highs and Lows On and Off the Field and Getting HIs Number Retired · Miss Understood with Rachel Uchitel

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  Speaker 1: I remember being in a small town in Italy, struggling
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  Speaker 1: That's B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash P-O-D. Start your journey to
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  Speaker 1: real conversations in a new language today. Welcome back to Misunderstood.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: I'm your host, Rachel Yucatel. So you guys, this week,
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: I had the pleasure of going to Port St. Lucie
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: and I went to the Mets Fantasy Camp, which I
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  Speaker 1: gotta tell you is like the coolest thing for men
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: who really wanted a career as a baseball player or
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  Speaker 1: wanted to meet some famous players and never got a
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  Speaker 1: chance to. They spend a week with some of the
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  Speaker 1: most iconic baseball players in the country and they're And,
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  Speaker 1: you know, when I got there, they were all in
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  Speaker 1: the middle of a game and it felt like being
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  Speaker 1: in a big leagues game. It was actually quite enthralling.
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  Speaker 1: I sat down with Dwight Gooden, Dr. K himself. This
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  Speaker 1: man has won three World Series, Rookie of the Year,
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  Speaker 1: Cy Young, played in four All-Star games, pitched a no-hitter.
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  Speaker 1: And next year, his number, number 16, will be retired
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  Speaker 1: by the Mets organization. Growing up in New York, I
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  Speaker 1: feel like I've been watching Dwight Gooden my whole life.
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  Speaker 1: And pitching is no easy feat. I mean, this guy
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  Speaker 1: was an icon. Baseball is a huge part of his story.
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  Speaker 1: And man, does he have stories. But hearing about his
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  Speaker 1: love for his family, his loss, his struggles with substance
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  Speaker 1: abuse makes the legend of Doc feel like a man
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  Speaker 1: we can all relate to. We talk about some of
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  Speaker 1: our favorites. Gary Carter, Keith Hernandez, Jesse Orozco, Daryl Strawberry,
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  Speaker 1: Derek Jeter. a ton more and he takes us on
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  Speaker 1: the mound with him during his unbelievable Yankees no-hitter and
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  Speaker 1: what he was thinking that night and it's not what
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  Speaker 1: you imagine Dwight's struggles have been well documented but now
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  Speaker 1: he's using his life experiences to help others fight to
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  Speaker 1: stay clean and inspire kids it was truly an honor
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  Speaker 1: to chat with him and I can't wait to be
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  Speaker 1: there cheering him on at the ceremony when his number
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  Speaker 1: is retired next year So, you know, I cannot wait
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  Speaker 1: for you to write me, DM me, leave a review.
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: Let me know what you thought of this episode. You
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: do not have to be a baseball fan to find
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  Speaker 1: it interesting at all. He is fascinating. And not only that,
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  Speaker 1: it's a little bit different. We were sitting in the
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  Speaker 1: dugout as we were doing this episode. So you do
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  Speaker 1: hear a little what I will call ambiance in the
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: background of the game finishing up. But I hope you
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  Speaker 1: won't be too distracted by that. Really listen to the
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  Speaker 1: words that Dwight Gooden is speaking because he is just
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  Speaker 1: he's a he's a guy who's really been through it.
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  Speaker 1: And it's really my honor to bring him to you
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  Speaker 1: here and misunderstood. Dwayne Gooden, thank you so much for
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: joining me on Misunderstood. It is so good to see
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  Speaker 1: you again.
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  Speaker 2: It's great to see you as well. Thanks for having me.
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  Speaker 1: Of course, of course. So here we are. We are
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  Speaker 1: at the Mets Fantasy Camp. Can you tell people what
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  Speaker 1: that is and what your role is here?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, so the Mets Fantasy Camp is fans that's living
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  Speaker 2: their dreams. They come down here for two weeks. They
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  Speaker 2: get a uniform. They get their home uniform, which is
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  Speaker 2: all white, and their road uniform is all gray. We
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  Speaker 2: share the same locker with the players as they do
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  Speaker 2: with the former players. They play two games a day.
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  Speaker 2: At night, we do different things. Like tonight, the coaches
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  Speaker 2: go out to eat with the players. Tomorrow night, what
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  Speaker 2: they call Casino Night. It's a charity event. We play casino,
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  Speaker 2: have a good time. Wednesday is called Kangaroo Court. That's
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  Speaker 2: where guys who maybe go out the back without their helmet,
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  Speaker 2: wrong shoe, late, or do something crazy, they get fined $ 20.
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  Speaker 2: And two of the guys... Two of their former players
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  Speaker 2: pretend to be judges. So it's just a fun time.
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  Speaker 2: Thursday is cocktail night. You just hang out at the games.
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  Speaker 2: But it's great, though. The guys get to come out here.
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  Speaker 2: They live out their fantasy. They get the jersey they want,
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  Speaker 2: the number they want. We get autographs. We get to
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  Speaker 2: hang out with the guys. We have breakfast in the morning,
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  Speaker 2: lunch in the afternoon. I think it's like five grand
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  Speaker 2: to come down for a week. So I would say
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  Speaker 2: for all the Mets fans who enjoy baseball and want
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  Speaker 2: to be around their former players and their favorite players,
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  Speaker 2: come down. It's a great time, and the weather's always great.
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  Speaker 1: Right, absolutely. So they are absolutely living their dream if
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  Speaker 1: they get to hang out with people like you, especially
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  Speaker 1: these Mets fans.
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  Speaker 2: I enjoy it, too. This is my 10th straight year
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  Speaker 2: that I've been down here.
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  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah?
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  Speaker 2: I enjoy this as much because as a player, you
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  Speaker 2: don't get much time to really talk to the fans
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  Speaker 2: because you've got things to do and get ready for
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  Speaker 2: the game. Down here, you can reminisce a little bit,
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  Speaker 2: talk about your moments. Get to know them. So now
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  Speaker 2: it's like a big family. Right. A lot of these
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  Speaker 2: guys stay in contact, get around. A lot of doctors,
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  Speaker 2: police officers. I mean, you got a little bit of
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  Speaker 2: everything down here. Right.
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  Speaker 1: And are they talking to you about your former, like,
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  Speaker 1: highlights and where they were when you hit something or
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  Speaker 1: if you pitched something?
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  Speaker 2: Oh, for sure.
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  Speaker 1: Are they all sharing that with you?
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  Speaker 2: Yes. Last night at the welcome dinner, like, last night
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  Speaker 2: was the first night. So we had, like, a welcome dinner.
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  Speaker 2: We teach them everything, explain everything. So there's one guy
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  Speaker 2: telling a story that when he was a kid, I
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  Speaker 2: tried to toss him a ball, but somebody jumped in
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  Speaker 2: the way to get it. So I signed the ball
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  Speaker 2: last night, and I had to get the mic. I said, hey,
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  Speaker 2: remember the ball that you didn't get? Here you go,
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  Speaker 2: and I tossed it to him. So he loved it.
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  Speaker 1: That's amazing.
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  Speaker 2: The guy was crying, and it was just great. That's awesome.
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  Speaker 1: So I want to go back, because obviously you've had
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  Speaker 1: a long history with the Mets.
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  Speaker 2: Yes.
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  Speaker 1: And I want to go back to your childhood. The
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  Speaker 1: first question I have for you is, how did you
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  Speaker 1: know you wanted to be a baseball player? Was there
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  Speaker 1: a backup plan? Did you want to be something else
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  Speaker 1: when you were a kid?
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  Speaker 2: Great question. I always tell people I wasn't playing baseball.
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  Speaker 2: I have no idea what I'd be doing. My dad
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  Speaker 2: was a baseball, like, he loved it. I mean, he
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  Speaker 2: just loved it. He knew all the teams lined up.
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  Speaker 2: And growing up in Tampa in the 60s, we only had,
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  Speaker 2: you know, one channel. We only watched Atlanta Braves from Tampa.
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  Speaker 2: And we listened to games on the radio. So my dad,
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  Speaker 2: he coached Little League baseball, coached girls softball. He coached
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  Speaker 2: semi-pro baseball. So I would follow him. Everywhere he goes,
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  Speaker 2: he could not leave the house without me following him.
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  Speaker 2: So kind of growing around baseball, when I was small,
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  Speaker 2: the guys would roll me the ball. As I got older,
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  Speaker 2: they'd toss me the ball. So once I got old
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  Speaker 2: enough to play organized ball, I got to play on
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  Speaker 2: my dad's team. I was coaching a little league team.
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  Speaker 2: And he said, just sign up and I'll get you
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  Speaker 2: on my team. So I signed up and got me
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  Speaker 2: on his team and I just started playing from there.
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  Speaker 1: And were you a natural from the beginning?
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  Speaker 2: You know, it's funny. So my first year, I was
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  Speaker 2: playing and I remember I was waiting to hit, go
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  Speaker 2: up the bat. And I saw my parents in their stands.
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  Speaker 2: And for some reason, I just got Jitterbugs or something.
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  Speaker 1: I got nervous.
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  Speaker 2: I got very nervous. I don't know why. I mean,
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  Speaker 2: so I didn't go up to hit. I said I
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  Speaker 2: didn't want to play anymore. So for my parents to
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  Speaker 2: watch me play, they had to watch me from across
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  Speaker 2: the street. And then when I would get home, they
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  Speaker 2: would tell me what I did. Then I felt like
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  Speaker 2: it was okay for them to watch me play. But
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  Speaker 2: I would say from probably 9 to 12, I just
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  Speaker 2: totally dominated. But then we go to the bigger field
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  Speaker 2: with the 13, 14, 15-year-olds, things kind of evened out
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  Speaker 2: a little bit. And then I didn't know that I
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  Speaker 2: had a shot at playing Major League Baseball probably until
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  Speaker 2: my junior year in high school. Right.
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  Speaker 1: Now, how did you get into pitching? Like, was it
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  Speaker 1: a position a coach put you in, or did you
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  Speaker 1: know that that's where your strong suit lied? How did
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  Speaker 1: you decide that that was your position?
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  Speaker 2: You know what? Oh, man, you got some great questions.
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  Speaker 2: So my dad, he taught me and my nephew, Gary Sheffield,
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  Speaker 2: who played professional baseball. We lived in the same house.
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  Speaker 2: Somehow my dad knew I was going to be the
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  Speaker 2: pitcher and Gary was going to be the hitter. So
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  Speaker 2: when we used to watch the game until little, I'm
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  Speaker 2: talking like 9, 10 years old. I'm 4 years older
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  Speaker 2: than Gary. He said, do you guys love the game?
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  Speaker 2: I said, yes. He said, every day he comes home
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  Speaker 2: from work, we're going to go to the park. I said,
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  Speaker 2: all right, no problem. We go to the park. We
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  Speaker 2: did all these drills, but it wasn't fun because we
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: couldn't take a glove. You couldn't take a bat. You
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  Speaker 2: couldn't take a ball. He was just teaching us all
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  Speaker 2: about mechanics and talking to Gary on all the bat scenes.
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  Speaker 2: So one thing I regret is before my dad passed away,
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  Speaker 2: I never actually wanted to get his knowledge from him,
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: but he taught us all that. And so going into
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: playing organized baseball, you just start off pitching, and Gary
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: was starting to hit, and it just kind of happened. Right.
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  Speaker 2: I didn't like pitching that much because the guy would
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: pitch me like every chance he'd get. But I was
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: the type of player, I want to dive for the balls,
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  Speaker 2: I want to slide, get my uniform dirty. But that
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  Speaker 2: was my ticket. Right. But I always wanted to be
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  Speaker 2: a hitter, but pitching was my ticket.
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  Speaker 1: Got it. Okay. Now, how were you scouted for the
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  Speaker 1: first time?
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  Speaker 2: First time, so I got my, when I was in
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  Speaker 2: high school, I'm telling my age now, we didn't have
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: freshmen and all that stuff. So they started like 10th grade,
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: then they started from year one. And our team was loaded.
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  Speaker 2: We had three guys that, went on to play professional baseball.
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  Speaker 2: So we would play Tuesday, Friday, and Saturday. I was
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  Speaker 2: a good hitter in high school, so we had a guy,
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  Speaker 2: Floyd Yeomans, who played professional. I got Vance Lovelace, who
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  Speaker 2: was a professional. And Albert Everett, who was Carl Everett,
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  Speaker 2: who played with the Mets, his bigger brother. So those
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  Speaker 2: guys were the starting pitchers because my sophomore year, hold on,
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  Speaker 2: let me back up. My sophomore year, I made the team,
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  Speaker 2: but the coach thought sophomores don't play. You're just on
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  Speaker 2: the team, you learn, but I felt that I was
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  Speaker 2: better than some of the guys on the planet, so
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  Speaker 2: I quit the team.
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  Speaker 1: Okay.
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  Speaker 2: And then the next year, I went back out. He
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: treated me like a sophomore. I had to try out.
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: I had to do all the positions. So I played outfield,
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  Speaker 2: a little bit of infield, but I wasn't pitching. So
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: I was a little upset. But then he said, you'll
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: be the relief pitcher. So I got in trouble coming
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: in and pitching a little bit. And halfway through the season,
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: you almost got kicked off the team for missing practice.
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: And I got into the sort of rotation. Once I
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: got in, I just totally took over. I just totally dominated.
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  Speaker 2: And that's where the scouts were like, sort of watching
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  Speaker 2: me because they'll come to the game to see the
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: other pitchers. And then they're packing their bags and they
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: hit a mint poppin'. This is what my dad told me.
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: They hit a mint poppin'. They're packing and they open
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: their suitcase back up where they have the radar going
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: in and they can't make out. So technically, I tell kids,
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  Speaker 2: only play a year and a half. So never give
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  Speaker 2: up on your dream.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's obviously happened to you and a good lesson. So, okay,
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  Speaker 1: how did you first get– so the scout came in
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  Speaker 1: and said, we want you to play with the minors
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  Speaker 1: for the Mets.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, so they scout you, right? And so they come
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: and say, oh, we want to try you out. They'll
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: come get me out of class. They'll see me throw.
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  Speaker 2: They'll let me hit. And then they always take me
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: to the mound and throw. And so they say, if
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: we get a chance to sign you, we're going to
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: sign you. I'm like, okay. So I didn't know much
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: about it. And then my high school coach told me
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: that I would probably go between the 10th and the
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: 15th round. Mm-hmm. So I signed a letter of intent
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: to go to the University of Miami. And so the
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: day of the draft, I was out in Tampa with
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: a couple guys and watching the board. It's not like
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: now where the guys go to MRB Networks or ESPN
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: to run their whole thing. Back then, you go watch
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: it on TV or you go to the newspapers station,
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: and they have a little screen going across. So I
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: went there, and I'm thinking 10th or 15th round, and
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  Speaker 2: then you see first round. I think Sean Johnson was
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: in more with the Cubs. And I forget the other
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: four guys, three guys. Then the Mets came up. They
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: said Dwight Gooden, fifth pick, first round. So I had
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: the guy call New York to make sure it was
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: right because I'm like, no way. Based on what my
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: coach told me. He said, no, they're taking you. And
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: I was like, couldn't believe it. Me and a friend
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: came to the station to see it. My friend had
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: to drive me back even though it was my dad's car.
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: And I was just so excited because, you know, I
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: grew up in the inner city. At one time me
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: and my dad, we shared the same winter coat, you know,
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: sitting by the stove to get heat and stuff like that.
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: So my whole goal was that I made it. My
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: mom's like, yeah, but you have to go to school.
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: But I said, well, I'm going to sign no matter
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: what they give me. So my dad did my first contract.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: He negotiated. We signed. And the biggest thing for me
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: was getting my mom a house and getting my dad
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: a car. At that point, my job was done. But
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: even though I've been going to play a long time.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: Right, right. So you went from the minors. to the
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: majors with skipping a couple steps there, right? I mean,
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: that went very quickly. Were you surprised by that? Like,
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: what did you feel when they said you were moving out?
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: Oh, I was surprised because my first year, you know,
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: being 17 years old, signing out of high school, I
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: was a mama's boy. I have 500 siblings. I'm the
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: youngest by 13 years. So everybody's for me. First time
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: leaving home, I cried every day, calling home every day.
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: And my dad's like, stop calling here. You either come
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: home or stick it out. And then my mom went
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: ahead and she was like, well, your dad don't get
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: home from work at such and such time. Call between
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: these hours. Yeah. So at first I did okay. It
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: was only two months, but I was homesick. My first
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: full season was the next year. I was in Lynchburg, Virginia.
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: I started off 0-3. They were talking about sitting me down.
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: I worked with my pitching coach on a couple things
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: about pitching inside because I would not pitch inside because
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: in high school I had a kid in the head
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: and a paramedic came on the field. Oh, wow. So
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  Speaker 2: I was afraid to pitch inside. So he told me,
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: pitch inside. If a guy hits a ball hard off you,
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: the next guy, I want you to knock him down,
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: meaning throw it tight while he goes down. If a
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: guy hits a horn off you, I want you to
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: hit the next guy. So after starting off 4-3, I
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: learned about pitching inside. I ended up 19-4 the rest
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  Speaker 2: of the season after 1-3. So technically I went 19-1
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  Speaker 2: the rest of the way. I got called up to AAA.
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: That's the league right before the majors. And David Johnson
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: was the manager. He said wherever he managed to follow
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: me here, he's going to take me with him.
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  Speaker 1: Got it.
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  Speaker 2: Joyce Bamberg was the big league manager before him. He resigned.
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  Speaker 2: Davey got the job, and he stuck with his word
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  Speaker 2: and brought me to spring training, and I made the
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: team out of spring training. I was a 19-year-old. Wow.
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  Speaker 1: So he followed through on his word.
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  Speaker 2: Yes. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: What was it like telling your parents you were moving up?
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  Speaker 2: Oh, man, that was the best. I want to see
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: my dad cry twice.
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: When his mom passed.
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: Well, how did they literally tell you, and then how
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: did you tell your parents?
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: That's my question. So Davey, you know, it's funny. So
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: all through spring training, every game I pitched in spring training.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: I was.
• 13:55
  Speaker 4: They think you're done for the day, but they don't
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: know about the drawer. The drawer.
• 14:02
  Speaker 5: Just the one square before bed. Or two, you know.
• 14:08
  Speaker 5: Nobody's watching. You deserve a treat.
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: With eight flavours to choose from, you can choose the
• 14:17
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• 14:25
  Speaker 2: The media would come up and say, oh, we hear
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: you're going back down to the minors because of the age.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: So I'll run in Davey's office like a little kid.
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: I'll say, Davey, they said I'm going back to the minors.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: He goes, no, don't worry about it. You're going to
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: make the team. The last day of spring training, like
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: the 15th day, Davey comes and goes, congratulations, you're making
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: a team. Called my parents because spring training day was
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: in St. Petersburg. I lived in Tampa, so it was
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: like a 30-minute drive. My parents came over and I
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: told my dad, I made the team. He couldn't say
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: congratulations or nothing. He just had tears coming down. My
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: dad was one of those guys that He grew up
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: in the country, like in the 6th of Georgia, where
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: men don't cry, men don't hug, you know what I mean,
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: stuff like that.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: So that was emotional for him.
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: It was his dream come true because initially his dream
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: became my dream of playing baseball because my brothers, they
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: played a little bit, but they weren't that good. And
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: then he always wanted to play, so he coached. And
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: then for me to make it that far was like,
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: you know, it was definitely a dream for him.
• 15:18
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  Speaker 1: Amazing. So now you head up to New York, right?
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: You're up in the city. Are you homesick still?
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: Once I got to New York, I wasn't homesick, but
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: I was like, um, cause I was real shy and
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: laid back. So I was like scared to go to
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: the city for sure. So I lived in Port Washington,
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: Long Island and I was only 19.
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: I used to live in Sands Point. So I know.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So today I never took this away. I never
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: did that. And so I was like, I said, I'll
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: go to ballpark and come home. I'll go to the
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: movie theater like two blocks away.
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: Were you roommates with one of the players or you
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: lived by yourself?
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: By myself. Okay. Yeah, so it was great. First time
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: I've been to Milwaukee, I had my high school girlfriend
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: come up for a little bit to stay with me.
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: I didn't know how to cook.
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: I didn't know how to clean.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: I didn't know nothing.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: So she would do all that and taught me some things.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: So it was great. But the first year was very nerve-wracking.
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: After about, I'll say about two months, then I felt okay.
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: Right. Tell the story about the very first night that
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: you pitched. I feel like you have a great story.
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: Your parents came, your dad came, right?
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: And how you walked to the stadium.
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: Oh, yes.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Did I get that right?
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes. Okay. So my first big league start was
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: in Houston. So I'd never been to the Astrodome before, ever. Okay.
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: And the Mets was kind enough to fly my parents in. So, earlier,
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: it was a 7 o'clock game. So, we got there.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: We had lunch about 2 o'clock. The bus wasn't going
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: to leave until 5. So, I went to the concert.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: I asked them, how far is the Astrodome? They said, like,
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: 3 miles. I said, do you have a map? Because,
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: you know, by then, there was no cell phones or
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: GPS or that. They gave me a map. So I
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: saw the way, walked to the ballpark. Like, it was
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: about 3 o'clock. I left to go to the ballpark.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: Once I get to the ballpark, I'd never been there,
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: so I don't know how to get in. It's like
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: an eight-foot fence. True story, eight-foot fence. I climbed the fence.
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: And as I get on the other side, the security
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: guards come up. Hey, kid, where you going? What are
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: you doing? Right. I said, I'm Dwight getting on pitch tonight.
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: So I show them my license. You know, they say, like,
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: we don't know. So luckily, the trainers was there.
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: But did the security guard believe you? Were they like, yeah, right?
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: No, they were like, yeah, right. Oh, my God. So
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: they called. You know, on the walk-in, they called down
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: to the locker room. Our locker room. Our trainers were there.
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: So the trainers had to come get me. And my
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: parents were in the stands, so I pitched. But I've
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: never been so nervous in my life. Pitched my first
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: pick-and-lead game and had my parents there. Because remember, the
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: first time my parents let me play, I wouldn't go
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: back out there. And so now here they are at
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: my first game.
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: Right. And how'd you do that night?
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: Did good. Pitched five innings. Got the win. Gave up
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: one run. Right. And it was funny. My dad goes, son,
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: what do you think? I said, it should be good.
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: I should win a lot of games. But my next
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: game in Chicago, I got knocked out of the game
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: in like the second inning. Oh, wow. And then my
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: dad was like, what do you think? I said, no,
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know if I'm ready. Right. So I went
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: from I should be fine to now I don't know
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: if I'm ready. Right.
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: Did you ever get to the point where you weren't
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: nervous in front of your parents to play?
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: Never. Because even my whole career, like they would drive
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: up to Atlanta. I lived in Tampa. I had a
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: lot of family in Atlanta. Mm-hmm. They would come there,
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: but it's just something about my parents being there. Because, like,
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: you want to do well, which they don't really care.
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: They're just happy you're there. Right. But I just always
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: was more nervous. So a lot of times when they
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: say they were coming to Atlanta, I was like, I
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: want to see my parents, but I don't want them
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: to come to the game. But I never told them that.
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: Right. I always had a question about your number. What
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: was the first day you saw you were going to
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: be number 16?
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: Probably the first year outside because my number was always 10.
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: Always liked number 10 through Little League and high school.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: When I got drafted, I went to Kingsport. I was
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: actually the guy that did number 10. It was a guy,
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: Russ Orrick. I'll never forget him. He had number 10.
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: He had been in the Mercury Bowl for like four
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: years in a row. Wasn't going anywhere. And he goes,
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: I don't care if you're a bonus baby or not.
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: You're getting my number. What they call bonus babies is
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: guys that's drafted in the first round. Because normally you
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: get a big bonus. So they call them bonus babies.
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: So he's like, I don't give you a bonus baby.
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: You're not getting my number. So I said, the guy,
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: the equipment manager, what number do you have that's close
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: to 16 but not 13? I always thought 13 was
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: bad luck. He said, I have 16. I said, all right,
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: I'll take 16.
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: And it's your birthday.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: And my birthday. Yeah.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: Did that matter to you or it just was the
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: closest number to 10?
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: Just the closest number. But you know what's weird since
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: you said that? So when I was in spring training
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: the first year of the Mets, right, I was number 64.
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: At the Mets, I was 16. And with the Yankees,
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: I was number 11. My birthday is 11, 16, and 64. Oh, wow.
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: But it just kind of happened that way.
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: That's weird, right?
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, my God. That is weird.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: How did you get the nickname Doc?
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: So Doc comes from, I used to tell people basketball,
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: but actually my dad's best friend was a doctor. So
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: he did autopsies. And when I was very young, I
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: used to go with him to see the autopsy. I
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: don't know why I had the interest, but, like, today
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: I would not go in there. No way. But when
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: I was young, I would go in there and watch
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: him do it. I mean, you got body parts hanging
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: and stuff. So he would always tell my dad, he's
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: going to be a doctor. He's not going to be
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: a baseball player. So for some strange reason, every time
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: I would pitch, literally, you know, he would always say,
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: come on, doc, strike him out, doc. And when I
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: got to high school, he would say the same thing.
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: Before every game, my dad and his friend would have
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: a cup of drinks and watch the game. Every time
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: I get two strikes on the bat, he's like, come on, Doc,
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: operate on Doc. You have another patient, Doc. Put him away, Doc.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: And I rode it. And so my teammates started calling
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: me Doc. When I got drafted, everybody was calling me Goody.
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: They give everybody nicknames. And so I didn't really like Goody,
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: so I said, by calling me, call me Doc. Right.
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: It's just kind of stuff.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a great story. Now, how did you become Dr. K?
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: So Dr. K, so you know how I got Doc.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: K means strikeouts. And I thought my first year, when
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: I broke the strikeout record, They added a K, Dr. K.
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: All the fans, they went running around the stands hanging
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: up these Ks. So the writers actually gave me the K, Dr. K.
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: Right. And how often did you look at that K corner?
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: Were you aware of it?
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: Oh, yes, I was aware. Like when I was playing,
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: I would always say, yeah, I don't know. But, you know,
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: give them a political correct answer. But I definitely used
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: to take a peek up there. Right. Because in the
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: left field corner, that's where they hung the Ks. And
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: when they passed the ball around the infield, The third
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: baseman is always the last guy to get the ball
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: before he throws it to me. So I always take
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: a peek up there and see the Ks because Carter,
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: who's my catcher, he always wanted me to get 10 strikeouts.
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: So I would see where I was at to see
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: what I'm going to need. Right. So I would definitely
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: look at it.
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: That's awesome. So who were the most influential guys on
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: the team when you were finally on the Mets? Like
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: who were you closest with? Who meant a lot to your,
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: you know, because you were so young. So these guys
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: must have really taken you in and helped you, right?
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: Yes, big time. So Keith has helped me a lot.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: Just about on the road, he'll come by and make
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: sure I'm okay, make sure I'm not homesick, you know,
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: and talk to me. We had this guy, Mike Torres,
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: older guy. He's actually going to be retiring my number
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: next year. So you have to come to that.
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: I would love that.
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: I gave you the information. I would love that. So
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: Mike Torres told me this morning, he goes, if you
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: make the team, they're probably going to release me. So
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: he said, but as long as I'm here, I'm going
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: to help you. So he used to tell me about
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: pitching the hitters, how do you look for the hitters' weaknesses,
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: and so on. So I made the team. They kept
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: him on the team. But then they told him once
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: some guys get healthy, they're going to release him. So
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: when he went pitching, I went pitching. I had to
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: sit by him. He would say, what would you throw here?
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: Why would you throw this here? So he had a
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: big influence on my career. Yeah. Hisself, same as off
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: the field, too. I had to go out and eat
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: with him. And, like, back then, the veterans kind of
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: took care of their wings. Yeah. The only problem they
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: made the young guys pay for the tab.
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's so funny. You know, that was the only thing.
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: So I didn't like that.
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: Teaching you some responsibility, I guess.
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: Yes. Oh, yeah. All right.
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: Well, that's cool.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: I learned a lot from him.
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: Was there anyone that was harsh with you or difficult
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: or tough on you?
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: There's one guy who's actually here. This guy, Ed Lynch, right? So...
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: I make the team. Well, first of all, I took
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: his position.
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: They made me the starter. He went in the bullpen.
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: And when I got to the bullpen, I made the
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: team and got to New York. And normally, like now,
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: guys who make the team, they put you in a
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: hotel for three days and then until you find a place. Okay.
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: By then, in the 80s, you get to park and
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: you're on your own. Oh. So, Darryl Strawberry, I said, look,
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: I was a counselor a couple days ago. Oh, my
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: family's here. My wife's here. So, Ed goes, I'll help you.
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: You can stay with me. I'll help you find a place. Right.
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: And the true story, he takes me on Queens Boulevard.
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: I think 108th Street. It's the projects. He takes me
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: there and goes, this place, I said, Eddie, come on,
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: I'm not staying here. He goes, because of your salary?
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: I said, no. I said, I'm not getting out of
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: this car. Then you see a guy running out of
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: the building with no shirt on and a TV. Right.
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: Oh, my God.
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: Let's talk about this. I'm like, I'm not staying here.
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: So I stayed with Eddie for a couple of days
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: and then I found the place in Port Washington. Right.
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: So that's how it kind of worked out. Okay.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: But now you have a good relationship with him.
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, now we're cool. We talk about it, we laugh
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: about it and all that, so it's good. He's a
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: good friend as well. Okay.
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: So talk about what it was like to be Rookie
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: of the Year.
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Being Rookie of the Year was definitely a dream
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: come true because you only got one shot at winning
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: the Rookie of the Year. Yeah.
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: And it was your first year.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: First year, yes. So I made the team. I told
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: my dad, I just want to play a long time
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: and stay healthy. I never thought about any awards. And
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: I remember at the end of the season, the public
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: relations guys, Jay Horace, told me, Doc, it's between myself
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: and this guy Juan Sanuel, who's with the Phillies, of
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: winning the award. So every time I faced Juan Sanuel,
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: I was trying to strike him out because I knew
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: it was me and him having an hour. Yeah, yeah.
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: And when the season's over, I still didn't know because
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: they don't like giving pictures of those awards. And I
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: got the call that you want to work in a year.
• 27:22
  Speaker 4: They think you're done for the day, but they don't
• 27:25
  Speaker 4: know about the drawer. The drawer.
• 27:29
  Speaker 5: Just the one square before bed. Or two, you know.
• 27:35
  Speaker 5: Nobody's watching. You deserve a treat.
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: With eight flavors to choose from, you can choose the
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: flavor you favor with Cadbury Dairy Milk.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: I was like, wow. I shared that with my parents.
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: I was still there with my parents. I was in
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: the major leagues. I was like, I couldn't believe it. But,
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: you know, I stayed humble. I was happy with it.
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: But I wanted to keep working hard because I was
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: always furious about taking my job.
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: Right, right. Okay, let's talk about 1986.
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: That year, obviously, changed a lot of people's lives, and yours,
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: I'm assuming. What was it like to be at Shea
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: Stadium with that kind of electricity? I feel like it's
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: never been like that since, in my opinion. I mean,
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: I was 11 years old. I remember my mom waking
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: me up at night to watch the games, and it
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: was such a big part of my childhood. And New York,
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: it was... a different place, it feels like. You guys
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: weren't just ballplayers. You were like celebrities. You know, people
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: loved you. The electricity, the excitement, going to a Mets
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: game was something like you can't, I don't know, you
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: can't describe it to people that weren't there.
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: No, you're right. It was crazy because we're connected with
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: the fans. Yeah. They do these curtain calls, clapping when
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: you come out, you do something great. Yeah. And, you know, being,
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: at that time I was 21, I mean, it was
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: just overwhelming. And then to win the World Series in
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: New York after coming so close the previous year in 85,
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: And I went in at home. I remember, you know,
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: running on the field and the fans all crashed down
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: on the field. It was fun and scary at the
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: same time.
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: Right. I always wonder, do you guys ever get hurt
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: when you guys jump on each other like that?
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: You get sore like these couple days, especially at the
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: bottom of the power.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: But are they all like, oh, help him up. I mean,
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: is everyone worried about the guy on the bottom?
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: You're just so excited.
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: You're just so excited.
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: You're so excited about going. But the next day you
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: feel some aches and pains, no doubt. We had fans
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: running out there, jumping all out, celebrating. I mean, it
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: was crazy, but Like I said, it changed everything. It
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: was the greatest.
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: So that moment when you guys know that you're throwing
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: your final pitch, and you guys know you're going to
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: the World Series and that's it, you guys are excited.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: How did you feel? Could you believe it? Were your
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: parents going to fly in? Just tell me the state
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: of mind of you guys knowing you're now going to
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: the World Series.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: Oh, it's the greatest feeling you're going to have because
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: we're playing the Houston Astros and it was a battle
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: because they had a pitcher, Mike Scott, who It was
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: unbelievable that year. Yeah. You know, he won the Cy Young,
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: had over 300 strikeouts, and we couldn't hit him. He
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: beat me the first game, won nothing, and then he
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: won another game. So it was game six. We had
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: to win game six because if they would have won,
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: we had to face them in game seven.
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: Oh, right. Okay.
• 30:12
  Speaker 2: So we had to win that game. We ended up
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: going 16 innings, but we just kept battling. And to
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: win that game, I mean, we was on a plane
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: coming back to New York, and we destroyed that plane.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: We was basically, the scene that you saw when we
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: won the World Series. Uh-huh. It was like that. Just
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: picture that, but on the plane. Wow. I mean, it
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: was crazy. Guys, girlfriend-wise, everybody jump on you. Right. I
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: don't even know if we realized we was on the plane. Right.
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: I mean, it was just a blast. Oh. We were
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: just celebrating because, like I said, it had been so long.
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: And the year before we came so close, we won
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: 98 games and had to go home. Right. Because back then,
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: there was no wild card teams. Yeah. You just did
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: two divisions. Right. So it was tough. And to win
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: that and to win it, you know, in 16 innings.
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: It's a feeling that's kind of hard to describe right now. Right.
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: I mean, it was awesome.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: Now, let's talk about Game 6. I mean, obviously, there
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: was a lot of stuff leading up to this. But, like,
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: where were you when Game 6 happened and that ball
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: went between his legs?
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: Oh, man. In the club, I was something that.
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: Did you think it was over? I thought it was over.
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: I did. And you're taught, even like in Little League,
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: that it's not over until it lasts out. Right. But
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: I say it's over. You know, everybody thought it was over. Right.
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: Because I think it was the three-run league going in.
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: We had two outs, nobody on base. There was, like,
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: a hit, another hit, a wild pitch. Right. And then
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: Kevin Mitchell... He was in the clubhouse, too. The bad
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: boy had to come in the clubhouse to find him
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: and pinch hit. So he had to throw in his jersey,
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: go up there, and he got the hit. And then
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: we finally tied it. Obviously, the Mookie, the ground ball.
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: Once we won it, I mean, we knew it was
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: going to win game seven. There's no way it would
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: beat us again. Yes, because even game seven, we were
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: down three runs early. But we knew it was just
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: a matter of time. We had them because there was
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: no way possibly it was going to bounce back from that.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: And where were you during that last pitch of game seven?
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: Game seven, I was And the bullpen, I think from
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: a selfish standpoint, because I didn't pitch that well in
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: the World Series, Roscoe was pitching and Jim Rice was
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: on deck waiting to hit him. But if Marty Barrett,
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: who made the last out, if he would have got
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: on base, I was going to come in to face
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: Jim Rice.
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow.
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: So I was kind of hoping Barrett would have got
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: on base. I mean, it's selfish. Because I wanted to
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: redeem myself and face Jim Rice.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: I mean, Jesse struck him out. I mean, he was
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: the greatest.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: And did you come running out?
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: We all came running out like kids, jumping on each other.
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: He was the greatest thing ever. Right.
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: Greatest moment, I'm assuming. One of them of your life.
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: Yes, one of them.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: Okay, so now let's talk for a second about kind
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: of that night and then what leads up to people
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: seeing that there's a red flag in your behavior. So, well,
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: ultimately you don't make the parade.
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: Now, by the way, is the parade the next day?
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: Is it a couple days later? Okay, it's the next day.
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: So talk me through what happened that night.
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: So actually that, I'll say after the 85 season and
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: off season was my first experience with drugs, heavy drugs, cocaine.
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: It was my drug of choice. I've always smoked marijuana
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: and drank at the games. But during the season of 86,
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: I was always like, we'll use a little bit here
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: and there, but never the night before the game. 86,
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: we win the World Series, we're all happy. I go inside,
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: we're celebrating on the field. I call my parents, tell
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: my dad we won the World Series. Unfortunately, they called
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: me to the drug dealer. That's when what should have
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: been the greatest day of my life up until that
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: point turned out to be the worst day at that time.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: Because calling him, my deal was... go pick up drugs
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: and meet everybody at the club. Right. That night, I
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: went to the house to get the drugs and I
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: never made it back to the club. I mean, the
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: clock just started spinning. Right. I'm in the house with
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: people I don't know. Right.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Were they celebrating with you?
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they were celebrating. You know, I'm buying everything for everybody.
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: I'm so excited, so happy. I mean, just going. And
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: the drug dealer, obviously, just throwing it all out there because,
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: you know, the celebration and plus I'm giving all this money.
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: The clock started spinning and I'm thinking, I'll go home
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: in an hour. Okay, I'll leave in an hour. Now
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: the sun's coming up. Right. Now, the parade, you see
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: the parade on TV, and that's when it really hit me.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh my God.
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: So you were watching it on TV.
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: I screwed up. I watched the beginning of it, and
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: I left to go home. I mean, I looked at, like,
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: I can't imagine being up all night. It looks like
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: a mess. I get home.
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: So you didn't even attempt to make it?
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: No. You get home, there's no cell phone, so I
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: had a phone. I must have had a hundred messages
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: from my parents, the team, Darryl, everybody's calling. It was
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: one of the worst feelings that you could possibly have,
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: because now All the denial that I was in, now
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: everybody's going to know something. Right. The shame, the guilt.
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: Now I just, like, from exhaustion, pass out, sleep, come out.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: Later that day, a couple of players come by the house,
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: knocking on the door. I'm looking through the people. I
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: didn't want to answer. I didn't want to be bothered.
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: My mom done called, asked me what's going on. My
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: mom actually knew I had a problem from the year before. Yeah.
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: She knew something was up.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: Did your teammates know you had a problem?
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: I think some of them knew. I used with some
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: of them, you know. Everybody thought that it was okay.
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: You know, when you're doing well, you kind of push
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: on the road.
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: Well, especially back then, I mean, I think that it
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: was really prevalent. Like, cocaine was like everyone did it,
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: and it was like a party drug. You did it
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: when you were happy. It wasn't like people were going
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: and using and doing it because they were sad. You know,
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: it was something that was, I don't want to say accepted,
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: but sort of. I mean, a lot of people did
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: it at the time.
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: And so....
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you if that's the first time, though,
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: people really saw that there was a problem.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: Yes, I think so. I would say the people, like
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: my parents, my family knew. Because I was like the youngest.
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: They knew it was going on. But obviously, you know, caretakers.
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: So everybody's like, you're fine. Just drink. You're okay. It's
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: not that bad. You're fine. Because I was, you know,
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: I had a whole family I was taking care of.
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: So it kind of pushed it to work. And I
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: was in denial also. So... I wasn't going to say
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: if there was a problem at the time. And so
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: at the time, I'm not sure if it had got
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: to the problem at the time, but it was definitely
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: on its way. But missing the parade, that's when the
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: team called me in and said, hey, what's going on?
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, I had too much to drink. I
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: overflew up. So some of it kind of, you know, positive.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: But then the general manager, Frank Cashin, the PR guy,
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: David kind of knew someone, right? Because there was rumors
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: during the season that a couple players on the team
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: was doing drugs, which I denied. And I called it to...
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: the Major League Baseball office that season, and they asked me,
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: they had rumors about the club hanging out and stuff
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: going on, everything. But now they come full circle.
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: Did the media catch the fact that you weren't at
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: the parade? Oh, yeah. And were there articles written about that?
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: Not really, because I still was like the quote-unquote golden boy.
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: Got it. Doc oversleeps, no big deal. So a week later,
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: we go to the White House. I make it to
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: the White House, we do that. But then when I
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: go home, I want to say, I can't remember the date,
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: but I think early January before spring training, I got
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: into a scuffle with the cops, the Tampa police. Me
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: and my nephew and some friends were getting beat up.
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: I won the lawsuit, but I got put on probation.
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: Beat up by cops?
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I got beat up by cops. Why? They had
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: been harassing me the whole time, but where I was wrong,
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: they had followed us. We had just did a charity
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: softball game. I was leaving Applebee's, and me and my
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: friends and all people were like, all these fancy cars.
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: So we're like, what is the cop in there? And
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: prior to that, many times they pulled me over and said, hey,
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: what are you doing? Where are you going? Whose car
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: is this? We didn't know whose car it was. So
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: they knew I was doing something, but I just never
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: got caught. Like, they would pull me over, have the dogs,
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: but I would never have nothing on me. But they
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: knew because they was following me at different times and
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: the people I was hanging with. So this one particular night,
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: we're going to Sheffield to the Corvette. My nephew, they
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: throw the lights on him. He don't see it. He
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: don't pull over. They throw the lights on me. I
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: pull over. And I was already pissed before I asked him.
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: So the cop goes, where are you going? I said,
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: why did you pull me over? You put the lights
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: on him. So I started talking back to him. He goes,
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: just do what I say. Let me see your lights.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: I said, you already know who I am. Yeah. But
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: I made a mistake when he said get out of
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: the car. Talking about as I get out of the car,
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: cops are pulling it up in. So it was already premeditated.
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: So they pulled it in. And finally, you know, I'm like,
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: why do you guys keep effing with me? So he goes,
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: turn around. You're going to jail. I make the mistake.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: When he went for the cuffs, I grabbed his hand.
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: I was completely wrong and out of control when I
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: grabbed his hand. Once I grabbed his hand, they all....
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: That sounds like they were waiting for you to screw up.
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they was. And once they cuffed me and put
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: the shackles on me, they said they were hitting me
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: and beating me. And luckily, there was a couple there,
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: all the white cops and white guys doing that. So
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: I played like I was out. They took me about
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: three miles off the road. And so they called the paramedics.
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: When the paramedics came to the hospital, they put two
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: black cops in the paramedics to go with me so
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: it wouldn't seem like this. But when we went to court,
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: the black cops admitted that they weren't there on the scene.
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: Oh, my gosh.
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: But then, obviously, it was something like that. And from
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: me missing the parade, the men's right away said, something's
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: going on. Right. The next day, I get to spring training.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: We're hanging out. We're a couple guys. We're doing drugs
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: all night. The next day, I get to the park.
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: And I just knew that it felt good. I didn't
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: know how long it was going to.
• 38:46
  Speaker 5: Stay in the system.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: So the men said, hey, we want to test you.
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: I said, test me for what? They said, drugs. Just
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: to make sure everything's good. They cleared the air. I'm like, oh,
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: you can text me. And no one... I didn't know,
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: you know, how long it would take. I didn't know
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: anything about it, so I took the test. I failed
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: the test. They said.
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: Do some people refuse to take the test?
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: Yes, because I didn't have to.
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: Oh, my gosh.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: I could have said, no, I'm not taking the test,
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: and then it wouldn't happen. Got it. But eventually, it
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: was going to come out. Eventually.
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: I see, yeah.
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: So I took the test. They said, come in and
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: say you tested positive. First, I said, no, it can't be.
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: It can't be right. Then I finally broke down crying.
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: I said, you know what? You're right. I did. Right.
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: How long have you been doing it? I said, I
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: don't know. Yeah, I did. So they say... You can
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: go to treatment. We'll continue paying you, or we can
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: suspend you without pay. I said, okay, I'll go to treatment.
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: Scared to death. I mean, you got to remember, I
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: went from rookie of the year, Cy Young, all-star team,
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: World Series.
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, not only scared to death about you personally, what
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: you're going to have to go through, but like how
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: people were going to see you now, right?
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: That was the whole thing, yes. I didn't know how
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: people were going to take me. So, as a matter
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: of fact, I got to go back to the house.
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: I got to tell my parents, which... That was the
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: hardest thing. I crushed him. I mean, my parents are older,
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: and they're like, you know, third grade education from Georgia,
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: working at Cottonfield. I got to tell them that. And
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: the thing that really crushed me, my mom said, it's okay, son.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: Now you get the help you need. But my dad
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: never said a word. Never said a word. He never
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: talked about it. But by him being quiet, I knew
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: I had hurt him. I knew I hurt him bad.
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: So now I got to go fly to New York,
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: go to Smithers. I go in this van. When I
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: get there, all these kids, all these kids, they brought
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: all the school's, They're clapping. Doug, we love you. I'm crying.
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: I'm walking in there. I didn't know anything about it.
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: I'm like, man, this is like, I'm done. It's funny because, well,
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: not funny, but the girl who I just started dating,
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: while I was in rehab, I actually started marrying me,
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: but I only actually started marrying me because I was
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: afraid that no one was going to like me anymore.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: It was going to be different, but at least I'll
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: have her.
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Is that who you ended up marrying?
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: I ended up marrying her. Oh, my gosh. I ended
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: up marrying her, but When I got, well, before I
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: got while I was in there.
• 40:49
  Speaker 4: They think you're done for the day, but they don't
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: know about the drawer. The drawer.
• 40:56
  Speaker 5: Just the one square before bed. Or two, you know.
• 41:02
  Speaker 5: Nobody's watching.
• 41:04
  Speaker 4: You deserve a treat.
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: With eight flavors to choose from, you can choose the
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: flavor you favor with Cadbury Dairy Milk.
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: I still was in denial that I had a problem.
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: I just told her, like, it's no big deal. I'll
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: just be able to stop, you know. I can't go
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: my whole life without drinking and doing something. You know,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: I'm 22. No. Yeah, 22 at the time. I'm like, hey, man,
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: I can't go the rest of my life without drinking.
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: Not knowing that all these problems are going to come later. Yeah.
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: But I'm in there, and they still, like, they bring
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: me food from outside. They're doing it on the set.
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: They gave me the newspaper. So when we had the
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: meetings and learning, doing 12 steps and all that stuff,
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: I really went into it. I was just... counting down
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: my days.
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: Right, going through the motions.
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, going through the motions, watching the news, seeing what
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: the men's are doing. Mm-hmm. Do my 30 days, I
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: get out. I start by working out. Then I figure
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: out that all these people, they still love me. My
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: first game, it was sold out. Everybody's there, pitch well. So, like,
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: I didn't miss anything that day. Right. But then the
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: girl who asked to marry me, she's planning for the wedding. Oh, gosh. Like,
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: in Tampa. We're going to get married in November, and
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: this is May. Mm-hmm. I'm like, man, now I'm thinking,
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: how can I get out of this? Right. Days are going,
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: and I didn't want to hurt her, you know? Right.
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: So I'm like, man, now season over. I pitched good.
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: I went 15 games. Let a team win. Everything's back.
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: Still drinking. I wasn't using because it was testing, but
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: I was still drinking. So now November comes. The girl
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: who I really liked, my high school sweetheart, I run
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: into her the night before I get married, and I
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: can't even look at her. It was just meant to be.
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: I'm looking at her, and I'm like, man. And I
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: didn't want to marry the girl. I didn't love her.
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: I mean, we only dated for like two months. Right.
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: So I got married anyway. But it felt like... Me
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: and her have talked about this all the time. She's
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: remarried and moved on. We're good friends now. I mean,
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: I heard a bad... But we talked about it, that
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: we got married. She knew that we didn't want love,
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: but she didn't know why. And I told her the
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: whole thing. Right.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: Well, it's not always meant to be like that. Incidentally,
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: whatever happened to your high school sweetheart? Did you ever
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: date her again?
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we tried, but it wasn't the same no more.
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: The time wasn't right anymore.
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: The time wasn't right anymore. And then this was basically like, maybe,
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: let me see here. My mom passed four years, maybe
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: like six years ago. I ran into her, was talking,
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: she was going through divorce issues. I wasn't married. You know,
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: and it was talking and we tried. But it wasn't
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: the same anymore because we were trying to live what
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: we had back in high school. But we're two different
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: people now.
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: Right, of course.
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: Everything is different and it's just, no. Yeah. It didn't
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: work out.
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: Not the same.
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: No.
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: Okay, so you had an amazing time with the Mets,
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: but then you moved on to the Yankees. So after
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: this rehab, you came back to the Mets for a
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: little while.
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: Came back to the Mets for a little bit.
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: And then how did you end up with the Yankees?
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: So what happened, I came back to the Mets after the,
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: that was in 87. I went seven years. I stayed
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: clean the whole time from drugs. I was drinking the
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: whole time. 1994, I pitched opening day in Chicago. I pitched.
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: A guy, Tuffy Rose, hit his 300 off me. I
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: broke my foot. And so now I'm pissed. So when
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: I was rehabbing my foot.
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: Oh, my goodness.
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I was going to the monitors. I was hanging
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: out in the sports club. I was upstairs drinking. Oh.
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: So I'll go to a monthly rehab, throw, and then
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: right away, I'm like, wow, they're not testing me down here.
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: I see. Yeah.
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: So you started again.
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: Started again. Started back up. And it was with me.
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: I started back up. And now I go to Monty Stark.
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: And the guy is there to test me. It was
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: like somebody saw me. I don't know. I said, we're
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: here to test you. So I get to the Yankees, right? Yeah.
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: So in 94, I break my foot. And I'm working out.
• 44:42
  Speaker 2: I notice they're not testing me because I'm rehabbing with
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: the Monty Stark players. Yeah. So I go to the
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: strip club. I'm sorry. I start to throw hands. I
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: start back using. Man, and then the next time I
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: go to throw, the guy from Major Baseball, the drug test,
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, shit. And I got nowhere around it.
• 44:57
  Speaker 2: I'm like, well, I haven't done this before.
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: Could you deny doing it? Could you say no this
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: time or no?
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: When they're there, if you don't test, it's like a
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: positive test.
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: They'll know, yeah, okay.
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: But then I'm thinking, I'm like, well, I haven't done
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: it in two days. I've got hours of all this
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: crazy stuff. I say, maybe I'm all right. Maybe I'll
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: give it another shot.
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: Maybe.
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: So I do it, I test positive again. So I say,
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: now we've got to give you 90 days. Because first
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: it's 60 days, then it's 90 days. So... So they're
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: going to spend me 90 days. No, 60. I'm sorry, 60.
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: This is my first one. The first one, they sent
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: me to rehab, so it was 60 days. Okay. I went, wow.
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: So they sent me to Betty Ford. So I go
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: to Betty Ford. I do my month there, do everything.
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: And I know what I have to do, because this
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: time I go to Betty Ford, I want to learn. Yeah.
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: So I'm learning everything about it. Doing the 12 steps,
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: doing everything. So before the season, when I got out.
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: So you got some tools while you were there, you think?
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I got the tools.
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: Definitely.
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: And plus, my wife at the time, who I married,
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: she was pregnant. So I fly home, fly back home,
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: but I had to go to New York first to
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: see the doctors before I go home. I saw doctors,
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: and there's one doctor who don't know nothing about nothing.
• 45:56
  Speaker 2: He goes, well, why don't you just drink instead of using?
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: Even though I know you're not supposed to do that,
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: but it triggered. I'm thinking, my sick thoughts were like, yeah,
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: maybe I should just drink and not do nothing else.
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: On the plane to Tampa the next day, I started
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: drinking on the plane.
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: Right after rehab.
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: Right after rehab. I get home. I didn't go home
• 46:12
  Speaker 2: for three days. Right back on the bench again. At
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: that point, it's like I had given up on myself.
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: At that point, you knew you had a real problem.
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: I knew I had a real problem, yes.
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: But you didn't have the wherewithal to say, I want
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: to stop.
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: No, so I did it. But it was like I
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: kind of wanted to get caught because I didn't have the...
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: I guess my ego would allow me to call them
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: and say, hey, look, I really have some help.
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: But I'm just curious from someone who's listening to this,
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: your love of the game or... I don't know, the
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: fear that your father would be angry or that the
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: money would run out because you wouldn't have a job.
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: None of that stuff stopped you from doing drugs, which
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: I think is an important thing that you said no,
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: because people that have an addiction, you know, people that
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: don't have an addiction don't understand how difficult it is
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: to stop.
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: Very, very much. I mean, you're sick. You're not just, well,
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: I wasn't myself. I was very sick. I was in Janelle.
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: Even after test positive and going to treatment and knowing myself,
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: they only speak for three days. And like you said,
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: the kids, I had kids. It didn't matter. My wife
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: is pregnant. Yeah. My dad and mom already hurt him
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: one time.
• 47:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 47:15
  Speaker 2: I got my baseball career. I'm doing something I love.
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: The only thing I know, making a decent amount of money. Yeah.
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: Just built a house. And still, the drug was more
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: important than all of that because of the sickness. And
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: my ego wouldn't allow me to ask for help. All
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: I needed was that one doctor to say, drink. And
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: don't do anything else. Yeah. Knowing I can't do anything.
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: What a shitty doctor.
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Because those doctors, they got the job, but they
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: don't have the experience. Right. But I can't blame him.
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: No, of course not.
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: I don't blame him because I knew better. And so
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: I go back out. And then when I get that letter,
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: they said, and when I said positive, I could have said,
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: because off-season, I could have said, I'm going to cruise,
• 47:50
  Speaker 2: I'm going to this, I'm going to that. But it's
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: like I wanted to get caught because I said, okay.
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: And you were just done.
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I know. I went to the test, knowing what
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: was going to happen. Yeah. So they go, what are
• 48:02
  Speaker 2: you thinking? Am I trying to kill myself? Technically, I was,
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: but I wasn't.
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know what you mean.
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: Kind of hoping that one time I'd do it. I mean,
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: it's a selfish thing, but that's where I was. So
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: then I get a letter from Buzz Selig. I read
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: the letter. It said you're suspended for the entire 95 season. Wow.
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: And I'm looking at the letter. I'm reading the letter.
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: And I keep reading the letter. And I put it down.
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: I go read it out again. I'm like, something I
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: got to miss. But that hit hard. And again, instead
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: of saying, okay, I got to go back and get help.
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: And they tried to say, go back. I said, no,
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: I'll be fine. The next two months, I went hard.
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: Harder and harder and harder. Missing my kids' birthdays. I mean,
• 48:41
  Speaker 2: I just hit rock bottom.
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: I mean, hard.
• 48:43
  Speaker 2: Very hard. And I still was like into it now
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: because I'm still like, who can I call? I want
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: to go to Japan and play. Right. Because somebody told me,
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: you can still go to Japan and play. And this guy,
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: Raina Groen, who's a good friend of mine now. He
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: works with the Yankees. He said, I'll get you to Japan,
• 48:59
  Speaker 2: but I got this guy I want you to meet.
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: And this guy's name was Ron Dock. He was, I
• 49:03
  Speaker 2: don't know how many years clear at the time, but
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: he became my sponsor. He said, we're going to go
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: to a meeting every day. We're going to work out.
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: Then we're going to eat together. Then you spend time
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: with your family.
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: So finally you found someone who was not enabling.
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: Right. Wasn't enabling. It was caring. Every day, they'd come
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: by in the morning, pick me up. We'd go work out.
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: Come home. I'd shower. We'd go eat. We'd go to
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: a meeting. That was a routine. Then I started liking
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: myself again. My kids started to forgive me. I started
• 49:26
  Speaker 2: picking my kids up from school. Spending time with my wife.
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: Spending time with my parents. And I started getting back
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: on track. And then I told the guy, I said,
• 49:31
  Speaker 2: you know what? I don't want to go to Japan.
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: I want to take this time to get my life
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: back together. I don't care about baseball. I got to
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: get my life back now. Because I understand I hurt
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: these people. I want to do it for myself.
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: So what did you do that year to get your
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: life back together?
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: Going to meetings every day.
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: Oh, that was what you did, just being active in
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: the program.
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: So you didn't go back to rehab.
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: No, I didn't go back to rehab. I just found
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: a good home group.
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: And it worked that year.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: It worked because these guys was old school. They knew,
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: call you out, what you're doing. They had certain nights
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: we'd go to dance, we'd go skating. So I felt like,
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: okay now.
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: You had a purpose.
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: Yes. I started understanding it. So I got on track
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: to doing that. And then the scouts started coming and
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: watching me throw up. And I was like, okay. And
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: then Sheffield, my nephew was with the Marlins. He said,
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: I'll get you a tryout with the Marlins. But still,
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: I was out the 95 season. In the 95, my
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: suspension was up. So I went down to Miami. I threw.
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: They said, okay. They offered me a two-year deal, but
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: I couldn't officially sign, but we shook hands. And then
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: I told them, I said, I'm going to Puerto Rico
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: to throw a little bit because I haven't thrown. They said, okay.
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: Ray had been with the Yankees, working with them for
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: a long time. So he told me, he goes, I
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: got good news and bad news. I said, okay, what's
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: the bad news? He went to Marlins. They say you've
• 50:37
  Speaker 2: got to go to Puerto Rico first, and then they'll
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: decide whether you want to guarantee a contract. He said,
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: or you can sign with the Yankees. They'll guarantee you
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: a contract right now. Plus, I want to go back
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: to New York anyway.
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: I love New York.
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: I want to make it right with the fans. So
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: I took the deal with the Yankees. The next day,
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: Gary calls me and goes, man, what are you doing?
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: I thought we had a deal. He said, yeah, but Dombrowski,
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: the general manager, said I had to go to Puerto
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: Rico first. He never said that. So Ray never talked
• 50:58
  Speaker 2: to them. He made the whole thing up. Oh, wow.
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: To get me back to the Yankees. I mean, it
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: worked out great. I mean, the whole thing off, I'm like, man,
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: you made me look bad, but it worked out good.
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: How did the fans react when they found out you
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: were coming back to New York?
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: I think it was mixed. I think the Yankees fans
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: was happy I'm coming, but the Mets fans had mixed emotions.
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: Did they see you as a traitor, I'm curious?
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: No, because I made it sure when I did my
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: press conference. I told them that I love what the
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: Yankees are doing. Mr. Stanford, I thank you for giving
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: me the opportunity to play. But I said, Mets fans,
• 51:25
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry the way it ended. I wanted to come back,
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: but unfortunately they wanted to cut ties, which I understand. Yeah.
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: You're going to move on.
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: And so I went to the Yankees. But the thing
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: that you bring up with that question, just to fast
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: forward a little bit. Yeah. So I played with the
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: Yankees for two years, 96, 97. And then I called
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: the Mets after that. I said, hey, I'd like to
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: come back to the Mets. You know, he goes, unfortunately,
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: I don't wish you the best. So I signed with Cleveland, 98, 99.
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: After 99, which I was, I wasn't the pitcher I
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: was before, but I was pretty good. Yeah. I called
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: him again. He said, unfortunately, Doc, we wish you the best.
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: We've got nothing there. So then in 2000, I signed
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: with Houston, pitched one game, got traded to Tampa, pitched
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: eight games, got released, called the Mets again. I said,
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: I'll go to the Miners. I'll do whatever. I just
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: want to come back to the Mets because I still
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: want to make it right with the fans. I said, no, unfortunately,
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: you can't do it. Mr. Steinbrenner called me, but I
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: want to still play. I was living in Tampa at
• 52:14
  Speaker 2: the time, so yes. He said, come work out with us.
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: If you don't work out, come work with me. Went
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: with the Yankees. Dueled a bit. Worked out. I actually
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: got the pitch against the Mets. I beat them. I
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: beat the Mets in a row series. And I was
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: going to retire. I called the Mets again. Say, can
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: I sign a one-day contract so I can retire as
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: a Mets? They said no.
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow.
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: That really hurt it. I understood. But it goes full circle.
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: Because now, make sure they're going to retire my number. Right.
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: Exactly. So we're going to get to that in a minute.
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: But I do want to talk to you about your no-hitter.
• 52:43
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: So I think as people that are not, you know,
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: into baseball like you guys, we don't understand the mindset. Like,
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: we don't understand what's going on. The only time we
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: kind of got an inside scoop on that was when
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: Kevin Costner played, you know, the baseball player in For
• 52:57
  Speaker 1: Love of the Game or whatever.
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: He basically stole that from a movie, that whole thing. But, oh,
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: my movie's coming out. Make sure you're getting to shoot
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: now with Ben Stiller and Charlie Baby Productions.
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: Oh, my gosh.
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: It's a life story on my whole thing from childhood
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: to the no-hitter.
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: Oh, my God. Until the no-hitter. Who's playing you?
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: They had decided, I'm going to show you this guy. Okay.
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: I'm going to show you his name. Okay. I'm going
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: to show you the picture.
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: Who did you always want to play?
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: Denzel. Obviously. Only because when I pitched No Hitter, we
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: met with Warner Brothers. They bought the rights to the movie.
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: He's too old at this point.
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I met with Denzel. This was in 97. I
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: met with him and we had it all set. But
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: then I guess you're no better than me for the
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: production with movies and stuff. They did the writing. What
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: do you call it? Ghostwriter or whatever.
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: Ghostwriter.
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: I showed them where I grew up. Showed them my
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: high school in Lilliefield. They gave me a check. Then,
• 53:43
  Speaker 2: two months later, he disappeared. I never heard from him again.
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow.
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: Oh, my goodness.
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: All right.
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: But it's happening now.
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: Now it's happening. Okay. Yeah, it's real now.
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: All right. So, to go back to your no-hitter, what
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: are you thinking? How do you compartmentalize all the noises,
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: all the things? Like, mentally, first tell me what it's like.
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: That was crazy because that year I started off 4-3. Mm-hmm.
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: And they basically benched me. So, when a pitcher gets benched,
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: that means you're not getting in a game if you're
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: up 10 or down 10. Right. They always try to
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: decide whether to send me to the minors or release me.
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: So... I'll go to the park every day, just sit there,
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: nothing's going on.
• 54:17
  Speaker 4: They think you're done for the day, but they don't
• 54:20
  Speaker 4: know about the drawer. The drawer.
• 54:24
  Speaker 5: Just the one square before bed. Or two, you know.
• 54:30
  Speaker 5: Nobody's watching. You deserve a treat.
• 54:36
  Speaker 3: With eight flavors to choose from, you can choose the
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: flavor you favor with Cadbury Dairy Milk.
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: And unfortunately, David Cohn got an aneurysm in his shoulder. Oh.
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: So they had to take him on rotation. And Mr.
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: Steinbrun is the only guy that said, put good and
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: back into the rotation.
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: Let him pitch.
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: Joe Torre, the manager, he didn't want to put me
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: back in. But Steinbrun said, put good and back in
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: or I'm going to fire you. Put him back in
• 55:03
  Speaker 2: the rotation. The third start in. The first three games
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: back in was so-so. And then the day that I
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: was going to pitch the no-hitter, my dad was having
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: open-heart surgery the following day. So I had a ticket
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: to go home to be with him. Mm-hmm. But that
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: day I woke up, you know, I said, you know,
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: he'll probably want me to pitch. Because all I could
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: think about is all the days that he was training
• 55:21
  Speaker 2: me and Gary. Yeah. I said, he'll probably want me
• 55:23
  Speaker 2: to pitch. So I called Joe Torre. I said, I'm
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: going to pitch. I'm coming in tonight to pitch. He goes, no,
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: be with your dad. I said, no, I'll see you
• 55:29
  Speaker 2: guys tonight. Right. Then I called my mom. I said, Mom,
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: I'm not coming home. She goes, no, you have to
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: come home. Your dad needs your support. Everybody's going to
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: be here waiting on you. I don't want to hear it.
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: So I ended up hanging the phone up on my
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: mom because I was feeling guilty. Yeah. But that's something
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: you don't do. You don't hang up on your mom. Yeah.
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: I had to. So... The whole day before I got
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: to the park, it was like this dark cloud. Am
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: I making the right decision? Am I going to see
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: my dad again? Because he had been on Dallas for
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: like 15 years. So I get to the park. Mel
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: Saldemar came up to me and goes, how do you feel?
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: Because Mel Saldemar was my pitching coach with the Mets
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: and now with the Yankees. So I said, I'm fine.
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: The first three minutes of that game, I was standing
• 56:04
  Speaker 2: in the walkway between the clubhouse and the dugout. So
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: I'm trying to figure out whether I made the right
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: decision or not. And so I didn't know. I'm going
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: to see my dad. Is he going to be okay?
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: What's going on? Not until the sixth inning. I was
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: looking at the scoreboard to see who was going to
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: come up to hit. And you see no runs, no hits,
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: no errors. And I'm like, wow.
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: And then you're like, there's something to this.
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: There's something there, yeah. So I was able to put
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: my dad's situation aside.
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: Were they watching?
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: Yes. From the hospital? From the hospital. Okay. The doctor
• 56:28
  Speaker 2: took us watching. So in a pitching no-hitter. Obviously, I
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: didn't sleep that night. It's a photo where they carry
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: him off the field. All I could think about was,
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: my dad going to be okay. Pitching no-hitter. You know,
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: a month ago, I wasn't even pitching.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: Last year, I was sitting at home. Not knowing if
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: I'm going.
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: To play again.
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: Right. Right. Healthy.
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: He must have been on top of the world.
• 56:48
  Speaker 2: Oh, man. The greatest. I was one of the greatest
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: footballers in baseball. Yeah. I get to the hospital the
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: next day. I take my ball from the game. He
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: had the surgery. Yeah. His own life support. But Doc
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: said he did see the game. He was crying. You know,
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: he passed away. He never came after that. But the
• 57:02
  Speaker 2: last game he saw me pitch was a no-hitter.
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: That's amazing.
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: I didn't know that story. Yeah. That's amazing. That that
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: was the last thing he.
• 57:09
  Speaker 2: Saw of you. The last thing he saw. Yeah.
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: So, but what is it like physically? Were you exhausted?
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: Oh, mentally and physically. Yeah. I was, like, done because
• 57:18
  Speaker 2: everything that was going on prior to that.
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: Was exhausting already.
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: Yes, already. Yeah. And then Seattle, at that time, they
• 57:24
  Speaker 2: had the best team in baseball for his hitting. You know, like,
• 57:26
  Speaker 2: Kate Griffith, Julia, Alex Rodriguez, Edgar Martinez, Jay Bruner, Paul Sermon.
• 57:31
  Speaker 2: I mean, they lined up with a stack. Yeah. So,
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: the pitching against that team and everything that I've been
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: through and now what my dad's going through. Right. There's
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: just so much stuff going on. Right.
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: Amazing.
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: Okay. Um.
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: Can you recall a particularly tough opponent or game in
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: your career?
• 57:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, I guess I'm trying to think. The toughest hitter
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: was Chili Davis by far.
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: He was with the San Francisco Giants and also the Mets.
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: I could not get this guy out. I tried to
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: intimidate him. I threw balls over his head, balls over
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: his chin. Could not get him out. And then he
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: went to the Yankees and also Cleveland. Same thing. Could
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: not get him out. One of the toughest guys. And
• 58:06
  Speaker 2: for his game, I would probably say... Most of the game,
• 58:12
  Speaker 2: I would say, when I was with the Yankees pitching
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: against the Mets at Shea Stadium.
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. And how did the fans treat you that night?
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: It was pretty good. Yeah. You know, because the thing was,
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: when I got released by Tampa, I traveled to the Yankees,
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: and then they called me in the office the next morning.
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: They said, we need a pitcher in New York. It
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: was a day-night double hitter. The day game was at
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: Shea Stadium. The night game was at Yankee Stadium. They said,
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: George said, we want you to pitch the day game
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: against the Mets and stick it up the, you know,
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: you know what? Right. So all I wanted was to
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: go back to Shea Stadium one more time. But I
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: couldn't say I wasn't ready. So I went there. I
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: warmed it up before the game, and nothing's working. But
• 58:47
  Speaker 2: for some reason, when I got in the game, being
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: at Shea Stadium, it was like I was back at
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: home again. Right. I was accustomed to the mound, fans,
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: and everything just clicked. And I beat the Mets right
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: there at Shea. So that was, like, probably the toughest
• 58:58
  Speaker 2: game for me to go through emotionally. Right, emotionally. And
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: coming from there, visiting, dugout, wearing a Yankee uniform. Right, right.
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: Obviously, winning World Series for both teams is an amazing thing. accomplishment.
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: What was the difference between the two? And incidentally, did
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: you make it to the parade for the Yankees?
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: Yes. In 96, I made those two. But you know
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: what's funny? The night before, I stayed in the city
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: to make sure. Okay. Yeah.
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: And were you good?
• 59:22
  Speaker 2: Yes, I was good. Yes, everything was good because I
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: made sure. Because I was wearing a thing. I was like, man,
• 59:27
  Speaker 2: I'm not missing this one because you don't think you'll
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: get another opportunity. Yeah. Even though one of the things
• 59:30
  Speaker 2: that kept me kind of, I guess, a little depressed
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: or guilty was missing that freshman because you can't do
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: it over. Yeah. But with the Yankees, I was like,
• 59:37
  Speaker 2: in 96, I'm like, I'm not missing this one. I'm
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: staying in the city. Right. I'm going to get a
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: hotel at Red Coast by where you're going to be. Right.
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: So I made it.
• 59:43
  Speaker 1: Did you have the same relationships with the guys on
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: the Yankees that you did with the Mets? Because it
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: seemed like you were so close to those guys on
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: the Mets.
• 59:49
  Speaker 2: It was different because the guys at the Mets was young.
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: A lot of us came up together from the minors.
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: And the Yankees was more like an all-star team.
• 59:55
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: They had Jeter, Posada. Bernie and there's one more guy
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: I'm missing. Andy Pettit. Those guys get through the system,
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 2: but everybody else came from different teams. Right. And it
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: was veterans. I mean, good guys. Yeah.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 1: But it was different.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 2: When it met, all of us came up together. Right.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: Mostly besides Carter.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: So you guys were like family.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: It was like family. Yeah. And the year before, we
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 2: came so close and lost out. And so it was
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 2: just different. Right. They all were special, though, in a
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 2: different way. Of course.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: Of course. After you retired, you went through some very
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: public struggles still with addiction again.
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: I guess my first question with that is I know
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: a lot of retired athletes, and I think it's a
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: common phenomenon that they struggle with what to do when
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: they retire. A lot of them become alcoholics. A lot
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: of them take a deep dive into something, whatever it is,
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: because they can't find their purpose anymore. They're so used
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: to being put on a pedestal. They're so used to
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: having one purpose to do all the time, and then
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: they don't know that they're good at anything else. So
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: my question would be what happened to you, but also
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: like Talk me through what you would say to people
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 1: that are retiring every year, how they can, you know,
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 1: move forward with their life and not struggle or not
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: think that that was like the best years of their
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: life and they'll never amount to anything again.
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: But you're definitely right on because the adrenaline rush you get,
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 2: the adrenaline rush that I got as an athlete playing
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: in New York, playing with both teams, being at the top,
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: all this stuff going on, and then all of a
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 2: sudden it's over. Yeah. And trying to find that adrenaline
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: to match it.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 1: And then you're a soccer dad or something.
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 2: Yes, 100%. You can't. You can't match that, so you've
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 2: got to find something. But I would say to athletes
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: now and young guys, if you're playing sports at any level,
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: especially major league level, whatever you want to do when
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: you retire, start doing it now during the offseason so
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: you get a feel of it. So when your career
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 2: is over, whether it's an injury, whether you get released,
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: or whether you retire, you've got something to go into.
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: Because as you say, a lot of us have been
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: playing from low league, 7, 8 years old, all the
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: way to 35 or whatever. That's why, like you just said,
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 2: the suicide rate is up. Divorce rates up. Right. You know, jail, prisons, death,
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: all this stuff is up. My thing was, when I retired,
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: I think I retired too soon. I wasn't ready. I
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: was 35. I still felt like I had time to go.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 2: I was with the Yankees in spring training. And Joyce
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: told me I had hurt my knee. And they said
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: it was going to take about three months to get
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: it right. Then you got to go to the minors
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 2: for two months. Then the season's over. Joyce said, oh,
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: you can cover it for me. So I said, wow. First,
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 2: they hit me because I wasn't going to meetings no
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: more and all that. I was still drinking. Mm-hmm. I said, wow,
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: first thing hit, and I'm just being honest, was, wow,
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: no more drug testing. Right. Not thinking about, let me
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 2: sleep on it one day.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: So it was still in your bones, kind of. It
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: was still there.
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: It was still there, because I thought I was like,
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: quote unquote, healthy now, I'm healed, I'm good now, I'm different.
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 1: So you thought you could try it a couple times
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: and it wouldn't affect you.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and as soon as I said it, I started thinking, wow,
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: even though I had some time, it still hit me.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: No more drug testing. So I said, okay, I'll come
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: work for you, George. And then that's when I called
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: the meds, the foot and the tummy, and they said no.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: That night, I went out with my family, went to dinner,
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: talked about it. I didn't even tell them what was
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: going on. I was already premeditated what I was going
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: to do. I retired, but then the next two spring
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: trainings were both to March. I got arrested both times
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: because mentally, well, I got my kid in the program.
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 2: I still was missing the game, and I hadn't filled
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 2: in that void. So spring training, I'm like, oh, man,
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 2: knowing I should be playing or doing something, I'm not playing.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 2: So I started drinking more, partying more. I got arrested.
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: A year later, same thing in March, brain training. Yeah.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: So it was attached right there. Wow. Yeah. So I
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 2: would just say to guys, like you said, find something
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: you want to do when you retire before it's over.
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 1: I think that's such good advice. All right. So there
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 1: was a certain part of your life years later that
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: you ended up in celebrity rehab.
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: How did we get to that point?
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 2: I still don't know how that happened.
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 1: Well, did you do it for the paycheck or you
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: were really struggling?
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: I needed it, but what was weird was I was
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: going through divorce. I'm not justifying anything. I'm going through divorce.
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: With my second wife now. First marriage, I screwed that up.
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: I messed it all up. I took it away. Second wife,
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: I went all the wrong reasons. Who had two kids.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: And then got a divorce. Well, we're going through a divorce.
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 2: And I hadn't seen my kids in like six months.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 2: I talked to them in six months. At that time,
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: my daughter was one. My son was four. So I
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: found myself. I leave the house. Because she said I
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 2: threatened to kill her. And I found all this mess.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: And you weren't talking to your kids because you were
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: so immersed in other things?
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: No, those two. She wouldn't allow me. Oh, she wouldn't
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 2: allow you to. Because she moved back to Maryland.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: Got it.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: Okay. I was talking to my older kids, but then
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: so I was in a hotel. Once I got to
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: the hotel, going there by myself, basically, you know, bike
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 2: on it, doing it again, doing it again. Look, I
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: needed help. So I ran into Lenny Dykstra. It's funny.
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 2: I ran into Lenny at the hotel with a friend,
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 2: and we were talking. He goes, hey, man, I hear
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 2: you're going to celebrity house. I said, celebrity house? What's that?
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: And then they had on a bike on a post.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 2: It was me, Michael Lohan. Mm-hmm. What's the girl?
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: Amy Fisher.
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 2: Amy Fisher. Yeah. The guy was on a post. And
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: I had to talk to nobody. I didn't know anything.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 2: But my agent, one of my agents at the time,
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: I guess he talked to Dr. Drew or somebody to
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: represent him about me coming there. And he goes, Doc,
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 2: what about separate rehab? I'm like, no, because the thing,
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: my thing was, I knew I had a problem, but
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: I didn't think nobody else knew. Right. Okay. He thought
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: this would be a good way to go in there
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 2: and remove that mask. Right. I'm like, man, I can't
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: go in there. I got kids. I don't want to
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: embarrass myself. He said, Doc, trust me. Your family, everybody
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: that's around you, everybody, we know what you're doing. Right.
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 2: You go to a hotel. We don't hear from you
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: for three days. You look up mess. Go in there.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 2: I said, well, I got to go on TV. He goes, well,
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: I don't know. And then Bob Forrest, I don't know
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: if you remember Bob.
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: Of course I remember Bob.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 2: He called me. I love Bob.
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: I love Bob.
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 2: We still talk. And he said, Doc, this would be great.
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 2: You don't have to go on TV if you don't
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 2: want to. We can just do some work outside. I
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 2: think it would be great. He said, but if you're going,
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 2: we can check whatever. I said, they're about to check.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: I'm good with that. He said, but it's up to you.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 2: Whatever you want to do. He said, well, what about
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 2: if I fly you out here and we talk? Yeah.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 2: Did you think it was real?
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: Because so many people talk about how reality TV is fake.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 1: In my opinion, listen, I was there for Love Addiction.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: It wasn't something drug-related, but I thought it was real.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: I thought it was a great program for people that
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: really need it.
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 2: For me, it was real because... It helped me in
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 2: two ways. Number one, I got a lot of work
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: done with Bob behind. Yeah. With the TV wasn't on. Yeah.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: But for me to go on there and, like I said,
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 2: remove that mask. Here I am. Yes, I have a problem. Yes,
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 2: this is what I did. Yes, this is what I'm doing.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: This is what I did. This is why I missed
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 2: the parade. This is what I was. Right. To release
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: all that, it was like, ah.
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 1: It was the first time you admitted it. First time
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 1: I admitted it. And to people, yeah, that it mattered to.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 2: Yes, and not having somebody else tell my story. So
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: it felt like, I mean. Like the road that's off
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: my shoulders because I can't clean everything. Right.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: I don't want to say I loved being on that show,
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: but I thought it was great. It was helpful. And
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: for me, listen, they wanted me to be on the
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: show because of the scandal I was in and because
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: of the notoriety I had at the moment. But in reality,
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: I didn't deal with that when I was on it.
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: I dealt with... losing my fiance on September 11th, and
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 1: I dealt with losing my father when I was 15.
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: And I don't know if I've ever shared this with you,
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: but my father died of a cocaine overdose when he
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 1: was 44. And I had to spend years trying to,
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: thank you, trying to, you know, as a young kid,
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: watch it where he thought no one knew, right? And then,
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: you know, be part of, you know, interventions and hoping
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: that I wasn't going to be someone that grew up
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: without And I remember when I first saw you on
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: the show, I remember thinking it was so great that
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: you were on there because I came from a position
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 1: of knowing from the child, right? Of knowing how awful
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: of a loss that would be if something had happened
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: to you. So that's why I appreciated meeting you at
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: the very beginning because I... Obviously, I knew you from
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 1: New York and your history as a baseball player and
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 1: watching you as a kid. But for me, it was
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: more special being able to meet you because I knew,
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 1: you know, in the back of my head, you were
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 1: getting the help and how devastated your child would be
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 1: if you weren't here. So that was my connection with
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: you originally.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 2: Thanks for sharing that right now because like that, I
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 2: need to hear it because a lot of times I
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 2: talk to my kids. I know I hurt them. I
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 2: hurt them bad. But they never would tell me. how
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 2: they really felt. I always tell them all the time,
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 2: I screwed up. I know I done some bad things.
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 2: I missed your parties. I missed this. I did this.
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 2: I divorced them all for their own reasons, all this stuff.
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 2: But we had the family intervention and stuff. I just
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 2: need you guys to tell me how you feel. They'll
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 2: just cry. So I knew I crushed them, and I
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: wanted to hear from them how I did it because
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 2: I needed to feel that. I needed to feel it.
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 2: But I just knew, but they would never say it.
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 2: But here you just tell me now from the kid's side.
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: And it is so hard when you're a child because
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: you don't know how to verbalize that because you're scared.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: You don't want to say something to make your parent mad.
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: But also you're angry. There's so many emotions. But losing
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 1: the parent is worse because then you haven't said what
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: you wanted to say. Do you know what I mean?
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 1: So even though they may not have had the words
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 1: to say it, they at least still have you. And
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 1: they can be pains in the asses and mean to
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: you or whatever it is now.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: But.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: I think it's because they know that you're here. You
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 1: know what I mean? And they appreciate you're here. And
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: it's so hard to verbalize any of that while someone's around.
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 1: It's sometimes easier to make sense of it after they're gone.
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 1: And luckily for them and for you, you didn't have
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 1: to go through that. Yeah.
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 2: I always tell myself I do not want to be Right.
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 2: And my kids are like, I got to live with that.
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 2: How did your dad die? Right. Because they'll forget about
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 2: all the great things you did. They'll just remember that
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: last thing. Right. I get it. But then I also
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 2: say I have to do it for myself. If I
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 2: do it for myself, then it's doing it for everybody else. Yeah.
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 2: I had to get to that point because.
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: And I know that you said you didn't think you
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: would make it to 50.
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 2: No.
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 1: Like you thought.
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: Well, you remember that? Yeah. Yeah, I didn't. I thought
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 2: there's no way because... Yeah. There's so much going on
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 2: and I'm like, I've done so much damage. Yeah. Every
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 2: time I get a cold or I don't feel good. Right.
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 2: I don't want to take no physical because I'm taking
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 2: my kidneys, my liver. Right.
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 1: Something.
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 2: Something. But everything has been fine. And so now I
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 2: feel like I'm still here. I'm sure people lost their
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 2: life to a lot less than I've done. Yeah. So
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: I think it's keeping me around because baseball was my dream. Oh,
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry. Yeah. Because baseball was my dream. Now I'm
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 2: living a dream for others just to share my message.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: That's all. Yeah. Just to be accountable, just to show
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: up and just to share my story. I'm not ashamed
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: of it anymore because I don't live that life anymore. Right.
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 2: So it's easier now to talk about it. Right. Exactly.
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: Exactly. So, obviously, you've gone through a lot of ups
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 1: and downs, but clearly you've been noticed and people want
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: to remember you. They are retiring your number next year.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: Where were you when you got that call?
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 2: I was at home, and it was funny because Steve Cohen,
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: when he called me, like I've talked to him maybe twice.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 2: At the overtime of his game and then once at
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 2: a celebrity, I mean a charity event. But I never
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 2: talked to him on the phone. So when he called,
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: he goes, hey, you want to speak to Dwight Gooden?
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 2: I said, speaking. He goes, this is Steve Cohen, the
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 2: owner of the Mets. I said, hey, Steve, how you doing?
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 2: He goes, are you sitting down? I said, yes. Then
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: I say, who the F is this?
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 1: Because I'm thinking, I'm like, this is a prank call.
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 2: He said, this is the accordion. And I'm like, I
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 2: intentionally hung the phone up, but I called that number back.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: It was a mess. You know, the office. I'm like, oh, man.
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: So I had to apologize to him.
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 1: You hung up on him and called him back?
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: Yes, because I thought it was a prank, so I
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 2: called him back. Right. You know, that number.
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: So I'm like, oh, man.
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 2: So I apologized to him. And he said, yeah, we're
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 2: going to retire.
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 1: Did he laugh?
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he laughed a bit. But I still think he
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 2: was like, this guy is cursing at me. Yeah. They say,
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 2: we're going to retire your number next year. Well-deserved. We
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 2: don't know the date yet, which they told me the
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: date now. So I look at that as like a
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 2: celebration for myself, my family, my fans, friends, everyone who's
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 2: been with me from day one as a fan, everyone
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: who's been with me to help me still be to
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: this point. Because without so many people in my corner,
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 2: it don't happen as a career. And then my first
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 2: wife was married 17 years. For her, basically being a
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 2: mother and a dad, because when I was playing ball,
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 2: even when I was healthy... I miss a lot of
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 2: school activities because I'm in New York, they're in Florida.
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 2: They do all that. So there's so many people who
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 2: made it possible for me to play the part. Right.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 2: So I look at it as a celebration. Right.
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 1: Absolutely. And how special is it that Daryl's number is
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: getting retired the same year? Have you guys talked about it?
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we talked about it. We had a great talk
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 2: about it. We laughed about it because we basically have
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 2: the same life. We've got the same middle names. We've
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 2: been to the same rehabs, same institutions, jails, prisons, all
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 2: this stuff, the same. Right. And now for this to
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 2: happen the same year. Right. But neither one of us
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: thought we would be here. Right. No, he's doing great
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 2: with his ministry now. Everything is going well. And I'm
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 2: just more proud of him than I am myself, basically.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: Because with me, I look at it, I'm glad for myself,
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 2: but I look at it as for everybody. Right. It's
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: a big celebration. But I'm very, very proud of him.
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 1: You've, you know, been given or you've had a lot
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: of accomplishments in your life.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 1: Where does this fall in that lineup, having your number retired?
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 2: This is number one. Because what I'll tell you, I
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: was trying to get back to the message. Retire is
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: a message. But to have your number retired, that's like
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 2: the highest honor a team can give you. Now I
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 2: think I can close the book on my career because
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 2: it's always like you always want to have that one
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 2: day where you can go back out there and tell
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 2: the fans you're sorry. Yeah. Tell them, you know, this
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 2: is how I feel. You guys are part of this. Yeah.
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 2: And now I get to have that day. Earlier this year,
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 2: in September, I got inducted into the Negro League Museum
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 2: Hall of Fame. Oh, wow. Which was like, that was amazing. Yeah.
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 2: They hit a history and they walked through the museum
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 2: with my kids and grandkids. It's amazing. And now... To
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 2: have them all there at the stadium when they hang
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 2: my number up there with a lot of grace. I mean,
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 2: that's like, I can't really find the words, but I'm sure,
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 2: hopefully I get through it. I'll get emotional. Yeah. I'm there,
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 2: but even if I get emotional, who cares?
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, who cares? I think everyone else will be pretty
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 1: emotional too watching you.
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 2: I look at it as a celebration for everything I've
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: been through, all I have to feel to have that day.
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 2: You know, it's just going to be amazing. Right.
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 1: You've talked about a lot of happy days and sad
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: days in your career. Can you pick out one that
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 1: was your happiest?
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 2: My happiest day? Oh, wow. The happiest day I ever had? Probably,
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 2: besides today. I mean, each day I wake up, I'm like,
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 2: it's just a joy to be here.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's amazing.
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 2: Happiest day. I would probably say, wow. Put me on
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: the spot right there. Sorry. There's so many days. I
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 2: would probably, wow. If I had to pick just one,
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 2: I would probably say my granddaughter. She's four now because
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 2: she was born prematurely. She had born two months premature,
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 2: and then watching her in the incubator or whatever, I
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 2: thought there was no way she was going to make
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 2: all the tubes and stuff in her. And my daughter
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 2: was calm, but every day I would go in there,
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 2: I would just cry. And I'm like, man, you know,
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 2: and for her to make it now, and then when
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 2: she comes, she was here yesterday, hugged me and, oh, Papa,
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 2: I love you. So I think seeing her come home
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 2: the day that she came home.
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: That's amazing. Okay, good answer. What do you think made
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: you such a good player?
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 2: I think the hard work I put in, like I
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 2: tell a lot of players, when you don't have a
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 2: game and you don't have practice, what are you doing
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 2: to make yourself better? For me, all I want to
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: do is baseball. I think I love the game. I
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: studied the game. I worked hard. And even when I
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 2: was younger, my dad taught me that no matter what,
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 2: don't let nobody outwork you. That's the same thing I
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 2: try to tell young kids. So I think the work
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 2: ethic I put in, even when the Yankees had benched me,
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 2: I still was working hard. I still believe in myself.
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 2: So I would say probably confidence in my work ethic.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 1: Okay. What person did you play with that you thought
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 1: had the most natural talent?
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: Darryl. Darryl. Strawberry, yeah. I always tell people Strawberry probably
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: had more talent than anybody I would play with. I
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 2: would say Jeter was probably more consistent. But Darryl, when
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 2: he wanted to play, it was nobody better. Right.
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 1: Okay, who's the next star that we should be watching?
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 2: In baseball? The next star... Ronald Kuhner.
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 1: Who's that?
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sorry. It's okay. He's in the Atlanta Braves,
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: even though I should have picked a man at Yankee. No, no.
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 1: I want to hear who you like.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 2: This guy's amazing. I mean, this past year he hit,
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 2: I think, 30 or 40 home runs with like 70
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 2: stolen bases. I mean, unbelievable. He can run. He can throw.
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 2: He can do it all.
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 1: Okay. So we should watch him.
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 2: Ronald Kuhner, yes.
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 1: People that watch baseball probably all know who he is
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 1: besides me. Okay. Let's see. All right. I'm going to
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 1: go through a couple players and just give me the
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 1: first– word that comes to your mind. Tim Tuffle.
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 2: Gritty, tough, gamer.
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 1: Gary Carter.
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 2: Carter, toughest guy. I mean, can you say it one word?
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 1: You can say a sentence.
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: Carter probably was a better guy than a player, if
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 2: that's possible. Wow.
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 1: I always loved Gary. Keith Hernandez.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 2: Keith Hernandez, the ultimate warrior.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 1: Darryl Strawberry.
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 2: Most talented guy I've ever seen.
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: Davy Johnson.
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 2: Best manager I ever played for.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 1: Mookie Wilson.
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 2: The nicest guy, but he was a quiet assassin as well.
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 1: Mel Stottlemyre.
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 2: Nicest guy, but sneaky. Sneaky. Okay.
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 1: Roger McDowell.
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 2: Roger McDowell, the funniest guy I ever met.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: Jesse Orozco.
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: Jesse, when we're done, I got a funny story to
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 2: tell about Jesse, but Jesse was an ultimate competitor. He
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 2: could pitch forever.
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: Okay. What's the funny story?
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 2: The funny story is we're in St. Petersburg. I moved
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 2: my family after we had a scuffle with the cops.
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 2: So I'm moving all my family from Tampa to St. Pete, right?
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 2: And it's this nice house on the water, so I'm
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 2: getting for me and my parents. So I go there,
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 2: and the lady goes, well, we have a guy coming
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 2: here tomorrow to get this house. I'm like, did he
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 2: put anything down? She said, no. I said, what if
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 2: I give you a check now? Can I get it?
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: She said, give me a check now. It's yours. I
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 2: give her a check to get the house. I come
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 2: to find out it was Jesse going to buy the
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 2: house the next day. Oh. He goes, Doc, how can
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: you do that? I said, I didn't know it was you.
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 2: She didn't say no names, nothing.
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 1: Oh, my goodness.
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry. And today, when I see him, he still
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 2: gets on me about that. Yeah, it's crazy.
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 1: Oh, my God, that's funny. Okay, just a few more.
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 1: Derek Jeter.
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: Derek Jeter, the most talented guy and consistent guy. Well,
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: not talented, most consistent guy ever.
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: Consistent in baseball. Mariano Rivera.
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 2: The best closer ever.
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: Joe Torre.
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 2: Joe Torre. Oof, you got me. I don't really care
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 2: for Joe Torre.
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 1: Okay. Well, that's good enough. Okay. Aaron Boone.
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 2: Aaron Boone. Great guy. I don't really know him too much. Okay.
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 1: George Steinbrenner.
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: Best owner. Should be in the Hall of Fame. Best guy. Tough,
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 2: toughest guy, but the most caring guy I ever met.
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 1: Doc Gooden.
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 2: Doc Gooden. Oof. Doc Gooden. Quiet guy. Caring guy. Loves people. Okay.
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 1: I love that. Looking back, is there anything you would
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 1: have done differently in your career?
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 2: My career, on the field, nothing. Off the field, plenty. Okay.
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 1: All right, tell us what you're doing now. I know
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 1: you're helping kids.
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, now we're helping kids. Well, I do a lot
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 2: of stuff for Hackensack Hospital, cancer patients. I spend a
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 2: lot of time with the kids, with their families, because
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 2: their families come in and they fly from different states
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 2: to be with their kids. So I just try to
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 2: be there. They like baseball, talk baseball with them. If
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 2: they want to play a game, take them to a game,
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 2: just kind of get their mood in, just try to
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 2: get them happy for just an hour, talk to them
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 2: a little bit. Did it with teen addictions, doing that
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 2: stuff as well. Okay. And now we're getting ready to
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 2: start a baseball school in New York.
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: Amazing.
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 2: Oh, my God.
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 2: But it's not going to be just about baseball. It's
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 2: going to be about life. Right. The place they can
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 2: come out to school, do their homework.
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 1: Talk about- So really mentoring them.
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 2: Mentoring too as well. Oh, amazing. So we use baseball
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 2: to get their attention, and then we switch it to
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 2: life on life terms. Yeah.
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Um, incidentally, I'm just curious, what other sport do
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 1: you love to watch?
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 2: Football. Like I love watching football, board and baseball, you know,
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 2: unfortunately I'm a Giants fan, which it's been tough.
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 1: So I have to ask you then, are you obsessed
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 1: with Travis and Taylor, Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey? You
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: don't care about this love story.
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 2: I'm a Giants all over. I'm a diehard Giants fan.
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 2: If it's, if it was like Saquon Barkley and somebody,
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 2: then yes.
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 1: Then you would care.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 2: Then I would care. All right.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: Um, All right, I guess that's it. Is there anything
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 1: I'm missing? Oh, tell me the date next year. Do
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 1: you know?
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: Oh, April 14th. So every time in Georgia, April 14th,
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 2: which is the day after my daughter's birthday and a
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 2: week before my mom's birthday.
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 1: Amazing. Okay, so we are all rooting for you. We've
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 1: always been rooting for you, and I just wish you
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 1: the best.
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 2: Thank you, and I appreciate your friendship, and it's good
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: to talk to you as well.
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you too.
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 2: Keep doing a great job.
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 1: I'm going to give you a hug. Thank you so
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 1: much for listening to Misunderstood. I'm your host, Rachel Yucatel.
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 1: Please be sure to subscribe to the show and give
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 1: us a five-star rating and review. You can support the
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 1: show by joining our Patreon at patreon.com slash misunderstood with
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 1: Rachel Yucatel. Do you have ideas for the show or
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: want to reach out? Email us at infomisunderstoodpodcast at gmail.com.
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 1: That's spelled M-I-S-S understood. Thank you so much, and I'll
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 1: see you next time.
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 2: This family is on the brink of civil war.
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 3: Mobland, the hit original series, is back, exclusively on Paramount +.
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