Latest / Cait & Court's Cozy Corner: Romance Readers / Let's Talk About: My Killer Vacation with author Tessa Bailey
Transcript
- Caitlin Stryker: Hi. Courtney Richter: Hi. Yes, I know. It's there's never a non-awkward way to start after the countdown. This happens on our show constantly. Caitlin Stryker: Alright, there she is! Tessa Bailey: Hi. you to introduce me or something, but I was like, ⁓ it sounds like they're leaving me a silence, so I'm gonna go for it. I'm gonna hop right in. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Say hello. Courtney Richter: well, but yes, ⁓ we will cover that. We are talking today the Queen of Smut in my opinion, Michelangelo of ⁓ sexual scenes. I know I'm wording that wrong. There's like an actual saying of it. Caitlin Stryker: I read a quote, it was Tessa Bailey is the Michelangelo of erotic writing. And I was like Courtney Richter: There we go. That's a nicer way to say it. Tessa Bailey: It's actually dirty talk. Tessa Bailey is the Michaelangelo of dirty talk. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Dirty talk. Dirty talk. Courtney Richter: talk. I was like, ⁓ it was put into PG. ⁓ But ⁓ New York Times best-selling author, to my for a into ⁓ romance, into spicy romance, literally. You were the first book that I read. Then I'm like, wait, these exist? Like, this isn't a book? What? ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Where have is where has this been all my life? It was such like a cute purple cover with like a pink dress and a guy and a ladder, and I'm like, ⁓ this looks cute and sweet when I just had a baby. And I dove I'm like, ⁓ my God. Yeah. Tessa Bailey: Very deceiving. Very, very deceiving ever. We're just a full target, basically, is the the whole idea behind that. Caitlin Stryker: Very deceiving. Courtney Richter: Yes, yes. And it's such a it's such a lovely surprise. It was such a welcoming surprise. I'm like, ⁓ I love this. And then I was just full throttle. That's what I how I got through postpartum and my time off work, with the baby, was reading Bailey. ⁓ Which Caitlin Stryker: Haha! Tessa Bailey: I'm so glad I could ⁓ give you a helping hand in that, you know, in that way. I put- ⁓ Romance novels got me through my postpartum depression as well. So ⁓ could totally to that. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, they they really they really boost you up, you know? Like you're they hit the serotonin levels in many, many ways. I'm sure there's science behind it. Behind how good it is for us to read smut. Courtney Richter: Yeah, it's the perfect escape. Yeah. Tessa Bailey: I think women just like need to turn their brains off ⁓ in order to feel sexy. I think 'cause we're our brains are just going like a fifty cylinders all day long and we're ten different identities and like we just have to like get into a fictional scenario to be able to just like let ourselves feel sexy. I think it's just like yeah, it's just we just have to turn off. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yeah, because otherwise you're trying to feel sexy, but you are. You're thinking about how you have to get the laundry done. ⁓ I forgot to move the camp week to the other week. When's the cutoff for doing that? ⁓ Oh my God, now I'm gonna have to pay twice. You know? Like not feeling sexy ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Right. Not hot. Courtney Richter: So instead we call to you, which I'm gonna say, I'm gonna just read the amount of series you which you already know you've done, but we're educating our listeners, because without even just listing the books, the series you have done of Romancing the Clarkson's, Phenomenal Fate, Hot and Hammered, Academy, The Girl, Bellinger Sisters, Beach Kingdom, Big Shots, A Vine Mess. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: And the standalones of Window Shopping, My Killer Vacation, which we're talking about today, Wreck the Halls, Same Time Next Year, Merry Ever After, Happenstance, and the Newest One, S'more of You, and the Upcoming Broken Revival, which is so good! Coming in October. And that's just like the series with a couple standalones. And all these series have like five to six books, some are three, but I just realized you're adding to the Bellinger Sisters as well, which I did not know until I was looking at your series. Tessa Bailey: ⁓ It's like was kind of I, I never really expected to write a third book in that series because I the way I ⁓ sort of it was I f- in my opinion, it felt like the perfect ending, the pla- the perfect place to stop. ⁓ But then I- ⁓ The adaptation really does seem like it's ⁓ it's Like the film date is July thirteenth, they're gonna start filming it. And I ⁓ yeah, I, I can't believe it's ⁓ I I ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes. Amazing. Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ amazing! Tessa Bailey: I just didn't let myself believe it until I had like there's a production schedule, which is like pretty wild. And I, I thought, well, maybe now's a good time for a third book, ⁓ because you people are gonna be discovering the series. And I I'd always had this kind of like thing in the back of my head of wanting to write a ⁓ you know, a female fisherman. So I went ahead and did it. Courtney Richter: Yeah. So it was actually happening. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yes. Courtney Richter: Yes. ⁓ Oh my ⁓ That is such a ⁓ way to add a third book into that series. Because you're right. You ended those two ⁓ in such a perfect spot and so well. But that is ⁓ a perfect vibe to bring into that. And Hook, Line, and Sinker, which was number one New York Times bestseller, among other books, it ⁓ the sequel to It Happened One Summer, which obviously as soon as that movie's made, it's gonna go right ⁓ Hook Line and Sinker because people are gonna be frothing for ⁓ ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Nice. Tessa Bailey: Yeah. I hope so. Courtney Richter: So good. You have so much going on. You're writing so constantly. So right now you've just re-released A Killer Vacation. You have the novella S'more of You and your new book that's coming out in October, Broken Revival. So why don't we jump into My Killer Vacation first, which is the one that just re-released, if you want to tell us what it's about. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Tessa Bailey: Okay. Yes, My Killer Vacation, ⁓ it kind of was inspired by a trip that I took with my family to Cape Cod. ⁓ We, we know we're l I live in on Long Island, New York, and ⁓ Cape Cod is like a three hour drive from here. So it's kind of like a it's an ideal beach vacation spot. But like what I noticed when I went there in the summer is that like there's a lot of people renting ⁓ And there's people that live there year round who are ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: like clearly a little exasperated by the amount of people that like descend on their idyllic, you know, real like regular folks town and they kind of turn it into sport town for three months a year. And I I thought, wouldn't it be funny if ⁓ someone murdered somebody over this? Like, you know, I, I run a romance I'm a romance author, but my humor is very dark. It's like a kind of like dark humor to me. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Ha ha ha ha. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, yeah, I think so from the little bit that I've read. Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: They're so spicy, but then they have the dark humor. It's such a perfect balance. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Yeah, thank you. Caitlin Stryker: because I remember when read to Catch Her If You Can, ⁓ and then this Once More of You and this K- My Killer Vacation. And it always has this sort of this really kind of like blue-collar believable like ⁓ layer to it that is like ⁓ this is best smut. Courtney Richter: If we can. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Which I really love. I love when we like get into it and we're just like hot and heavy and it's totally there. ⁓ But I love how it's balanced out with these storylines where I'm like, ooh ⁓ these are really interesting characters. They're like, ⁓ oh this is really fun. I didn't see this coming with like, you know, ⁓ totals smut which and then the Cape Cod element for is ⁓ so fun. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: And I think it's interesting where you say like they get annoyed that people come for the summer, but it's also like no one's there in the winter. If nobody came in the summer, how would they financially survive all year long? Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: I know. I, I like it makes me wonder. ⁓ it's like yeah, it's like a necessary evil. I live on Long Island, so we have right, we have a lot of the same thing, you know. ⁓ New York, tourism is is what it is. ⁓ But in this, so in this particular book, Taylor, she, ⁓ like brought her brother with her to Cape Cod. They discover a dead body in their Airbnb on the first day. It's the owner. And ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: So she's like, I'm a true crime podcast listener. So obviously I can solve this and I know everything. And so ⁓ this bounty hunter like arrives, like if you go in a picture like Jason Momoa, like prime Jason Momoa arrives on a Harley and he's like Courtney Richter: ⁓ Yes, yes. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: always want picture prime Jason Momoa. ⁓ Yeah. Yeah. Tessa Bailey: ⁓ it yeah, so he arrives, he's doing a favor a local friend by like solving this ⁓ murder really quick before he gets back out of town he like lives on the road. But then this like second grade teacher, which is my main, my main character who discovers the body, she's like, I'll I'll be helping you solve this crime. Like, welcome to Cape Cod. ⁓ And ⁓ he's just like popping antacids and he has time this, but he like Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Tessa Bailey: just immediately develops this soft spot for her. And then like she's kind of in danger because she's been helping him solve this crime and she, she is digging her nose and kind of like where doesn't belong. So he has to protect her. It's it's just like a really funny, outlandish like beef. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: is, and it's that grumpy bounty hunter with like sunshine school teacher and that dynamic that... Well the I liked about this one particularly too, that you do very well, but ⁓ most the ⁓ what's the word? Like intimate sexual slowburn part of it is seen through his gaze, and I really like seeing his like Caitlin Stryker: Mm. Courtney Richter: lust and his- the building from his point of view. And you do that really well. And I think it's something that's actually really important why women are drawn to spicy romance is because there's something about reading it from the male point of view, but written by a woman that's safe and lets us let go of our brain and lets us kind of like escape into that world. And you do it with him pretty quick like pretty early on in this book. We're like into like hot spice, like you can feel it like simmering. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Tessa Bailey: Yeah, he's like He's immediately like, Wait a minute, like what how would she be in bed? ⁓ Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Which is my favorite, thank you. Mm-hmm. Courtney Richter: Yes, exactly, which happens. And so I love that it's like, ⁓ hot woman. Tessa Bailey: definitely, I mean, I, I do like to at least start building, even if like they're not going to actually act on these, you know, at this attraction until like maybe like 30%, 40% to the book. I feel like that sexual tension needs to start on page one. ⁓ I just want it to be like, Oh, I've never been this attracted to anybody as long as I can remember. Like that's to me is like the fantasy of it. It's like, Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yes. Tessa Bailey: him to be like, ⁓ Oh, she's cute. I want him to like, ⁓ my God, she's the most stunning thing on this earth. 'Cause like that's at least that's the that's why I read romance. I him to be like, That's the only woman who's ever made me feel like this, period, the end. Like so ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes! That's what we want. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yes. Courtney Richter: if it was just like, eh, she's okay. Like if I have to. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: urgent and I needed to be like there's nobody that can scratch this itch but her. ⁓ And that's just like, ⁓ it's just so much fun. ⁓ Yeah, I, this is a really, it's a really, it's a really fun book. And then I also so for the years are asking me for the brothers ⁓ novella, the brothers story. ⁓ And I've so now in the re-release of the print version, I, I put Caitlin Stryker: Yeah! Courtney Richter: Yes. Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: There's a n it's a free novella for her brother in the back, Jude. ⁓ Courtney Richter: had the original, so I d I like I've just read the I didn't know that. Now I gotta go look. Okay, I need to go read the novella. ⁓ Oh my gosh. Okay. Well, now I've gotta get the new print. Tessa Bailey: Yeah no. People are like, How do I read it with that? And I'm like, I don't know. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Tessa Bailey: It's called My Role because ⁓ you Dante his ⁓ love is an actor. So yeah. Courtney Richter: ⁓ Oh that's so great. Caitlin Stryker: very cool. That's super fun. ⁓ Okay, so ⁓ a little bit around here, but how can we not? You have so many books. ⁓ the summer novella, we just read that one, S'more Of You, ⁓ is so and fun, ⁓ and spicy for ⁓ summer camp. ⁓ Yeah. Tessa Bailey: True. Courtney Richter: Yes. Tessa Bailey: need them to like get ⁓ out of the camp to do this. was like ⁓ they can't be doing at camp around children. I was like, they're gonna need to like go to a cabin like outside of the camp ⁓ to make this happen. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Yeah Courtney Richter: Yes. Yes. But you made like it's like ninety pages or something or eighty seven like it's it's short 'cause it's novella. Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ my gosh. Kiss Tessa Bailey: So Amazon, they do these like little bites and they come to me once in a while and they're like, We... 'Cause like I will be like, ⁓ sure, I'll I'll stick to ten thousand words and then I'll like turn in something that's like thirty thousand words and they're like ⁓ you the point. ⁓ So time I really was like, I gotta stick to the ten thousand word count and ⁓ so I really had to like, like she had she has to make her love confession in the first chapter. So, so basically the backstory is that ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: They went to camp together since they're 13, but now they're like in college and they're doing summer camp counseling. They're counselors now. He, his family owns the camp. She's like always loved him. She finally decides she's gonna like fess up and tell him. But like she's been pranking him since she's 13 years old. So he just assumes that this like love confession is just her way of like, you know, getting under his skin or making fun of him. Courtney Richter: Yes. Yes. Tessa Bailey: ⁓ And then like he slowly realizes that like she actually does have feelings for him and he's blown her off now. So he has to like scramble and like make it up to her. ⁓ So it's like everything you want in a really condensed thing. Like it's like big love confessions, sexy times, and then also lots of groveling, which is like that's my catnip. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. also like a Clark Kent meme, like kind of geeky can' counselor dude that somehow through Margot's eyes we're just like, ⁓ Oh, and he's hot and like the young love. Slutty little glasses. It is a slutty little glasses. And ⁓ I've like, I love that wrote about the pranking because I now looking back fell victim to like if I didn't like a guy, I was just mean to him. Like I fully, even in high school. Like Tessa Bailey: ⁓ yes, bloody little glasses, right? We can enough. Courtney Richter: Like are you going the party? I'm like, no, 'cause you're going and they wouldn't catch my sarcasm 'cause I had like a dad, my older brother, and that's how I that's how I spoke. Yes. It worked out, but I loved it 'cause I'm like, this is how it goes. You do this and you don't you think you're showing acts of love and they're like, This person hates me and I'm just going to avoid him. Tessa Bailey: They're loss, you know what I mean? That's their loss. You can't assume that men understand what you're doing. ⁓ don't learn that till later. ⁓ Courtney Richter: They don't They never But I love that he's also like, I've had sex before and it's two people and he's comparing. But you did like that the innocent way that they're both like, is this what sex is like? But it's so amazing and still so hot. It's a really hard thing to actually do, I think, in such a small book. But you really did it. Like it's a really enjoyable bite-sized novella. Like you really captured it. Tessa Bailey: Yeah. He's like, I know everything about this. I think the key to that was like making it clear that they have this like really established history and this like ⁓ sort of like of intimacy without ⁓ being a couple, without like, you know, taking it past the platonic stage. Like, but they have like this intimate relationship that you'd only get when you're at camp with people for like months at a time. ⁓ You know, it's like a really specific thing to summer camp of like you become almost inseparable from people and you tell them your darkest secrets and you cry and you have bad days in front of them and good days in front of them, and then suddenly you go back to your regular life and it's like you just keep thinking about camp. You keep thinking about the camp people all the time. ⁓ I know like it I don't know if you went to summer camp, but that's it's kind of like a culture and it's got this very specific feeling. Courtney Richter: Yes. Yeah. Yes. Yes. Tessa Bailey: I, I'm hope was able to kind of bring that across along with the... ⁓ Courtney Richter: It reminded me, I did summer camp once, one week. And it, I but I felt that instant joy, your best friend for life that you've met and you're sleeping. You feel like you go through such a roller coaster in one week as the child. And then I kind of did adult summer camp, which is I worked for the Fairmont Jasper Park Lodge. And when you work, people from all over the world, you all get pulled in. It's like summer camp for 19 to 28 year olds because you're all living in staff housing. You're all working in the same shifts and you're partying together. So it really feels like Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Like I feel like I got so much closer with those employees than I have any other job, even though it was just for like a few months in the summer, because you basically take that camp culture and put it into adults with alcohol. And it just Yeah, exactly. Tessa Bailey: ⁓ It's like that's your found family. ⁓ and you, you're you're in it. you can't get away from them. they're you ⁓ know, and then you just like kind of form this bond that just with you your whole life, you know. It's like intense. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes. And Cait will be joining us again. Her- The in New York tends to cut out her internet every so often and coming back from the apartment. Tessa Bailey: I can Imagine, yeah, it's unbearably hot here. ⁓ Courtney Richter: a question for you about your Big Shot series. ⁓ So, is that it's complete, that that was the final one? Catch Her If You Can. Tessa Bailey: Okay. I think it is. Yeah. I, you know, it's like a sixth sense that I have kind of after like 14 years of being an author, which doesn't seem like it's that long, but romance changes like the industry itself, like changes so frequently. Like, you know, things that are popular one day are not popular the next. And ⁓ ways that you promote books changes weekly and Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: It's just, it's just like sometimes I, I think I just have a sixth sense at this point to know like when a, when ⁓ readers are ready for something else ⁓ when I need to pivot. It's just like kind of a something that I it's like a feeling I get now. ⁓ it, I've had this idea ⁓ this dystopian time travel that's kind of been sitting in the back of my head for the longest time. And I thought I think I'd feel more passionately about writing that than writing another sports rom-com right now. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: And I just was like, if that's what I'm feeling, I just have to do it. 'Cause, you know, if you want to write your best book, it's gotta be something that you're like excited about, like really excited about. Courtney Richter: Yes. Which brings us into Broken Revival, which is your dystopian. Broken Rival, sorry. Broken Rival. I'm thinking of revivals in my head. Broken Rival. So do you wanna tell us what it's it's coming out in October, October 6th, I wanna say? Yes. Tessa Bailey: Broken rival, yes. ⁓ So it's a dystopian travel romance. ⁓ Our heroine Magnolia, parents invented time travel. But time travel has been made illegal. ⁓ So, because it's just like it sews, it's sews chaos, basically. So it's been made illegal, but they abuse it and they break the law to travel back in time to 2026 to warn us about something that's coming in the future. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: And they're executed for their crimes. And this leaves Magnolia stranded in 2026. ⁓ So family kind of brings her in. ⁓ And so basically the reason they were executed for this crime is because they ripped open like basically these breaches of time. And now people are pouring in from the future. So it's become like basically a civil war. ⁓ And so she has this family that she's living with. One of them is like, I'll protect you, I'll Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: like, ⁓ I'll be your best friend, I'll be your comfort, like ⁓ he's like the golden boy of the town. And then the other brother is joining the militia to kill time travelers. And there's sort of this like, like, is everything what it seems? Is everybody who they say they are? There's a lot of twists and turns in it. ⁓ But ⁓ yeah, it's a pretty sexy love triangle ⁓ between Magnolia, Ramsay, and Fallon. Courtney Richter: Yes. Yes. It is. Like as someone like got to see an ARC it is very sexy. Both men, you're like Good luck, girl. I don't know. They're like ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Good luck, girl. Courtney Richter: There are worse problems to have. Tessa Bailey: But I think that's like it's the theme the book is that you know like you, you have to be constantly like ⁓ you have to be aware that people can a role and you have to be kind of like always just always have your- as a woman, have your guard up, ⁓ you know. Courtney Richter: Yes. Yeah, it's really, it's really a, a ⁓ ⁓ of novel for you compared to like the romances that we know and your style. But it still has your darker sense of humor. It still has your spice. But then it's this gorgeous dystopian world, new world that you build so well. Like, so incredibly well. And I'm so excited for everyone to read it, 'cause we're everyone's just gonna go insane when they read this book. They will. They ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Thank you. Yeah, I hope that people love it. ⁓ I love it so much that like I ⁓ my f- my of twenty years and I decided to write the screenplay for it. We're writing it- well, she's writing the screenplay, I'm writing a series Bible for it. We're like consulting really closely with each other and I was just like, ⁓ I just I'm so passionate about the world and the characters that I just don't want it in anybody else's hands, kind of, you know. Courtney Richter: Did you? Ugh. Yeah. I think that's so important. As we're seeing more and more book adaptations happen, some really great ones and then some not so much. I think keeping your voice and your vision, especially something you're so passionate about, is so important. So the more like ownership you can hold on it, the truer it'll stay to what you want to see. Tessa Bailey: We're in this time now where like everybody's eyes are on ⁓ everything. There's many new romance readers. There's so the, the like, the readership is it's so, so much bigger than it was when I started. And like you can't really make a little mistake. ⁓ You know, mistakes are definitely more amplified than they used to be. ⁓ You can't just throw, you can't- You just have to be very, very thoughtful about everything. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yes. It's Yes. Tessa Bailey: Not that I you didn't always have to be, but now there's just more at stake, it seems. Courtney Richter: Do you find that now compared to when you start because you've been doing this for quite a while, as you said, over- years. Now with Instagram and with TikTok and with- are you get, is the response to your books coming at you so much more intensely and quickly, or is it still like are you able to like slow the roll and still like take it in kind of as you did before? Like just kind of filter through reviews and feel how you feel about your book? Tessa Bailey: Yeah, I mean like I don't really read reviews unless I'm, you know, sometimes they I'm tagged in them and that's fine. I, you know, I don't I, I I do d disassociate from social media pretty frequently. Just because it's like if I if I give it too much ⁓ energy and too much focus, like I just won't do any work. ⁓ like it's you know, like that's why I do this. I don't I didn't become an author to be on Instagram. ⁓ you know, I, I did it because I Courtney Richter: Yes. Tessa Bailey: I literally writing is my favorite thing in the world. I love writing. I, I I write on my days off. I write constantly. Anytime I get a few minutes, I'm on my laptop doing something or planning or plotting. And ⁓ that's why I'm in it. And I just kind of keep reminding myself that of of that. And if like I'm feeling like I'm having a bad day on social media or something, I'm like, ⁓ well, I'm just gonna go escape into the world Courtney Richter: I think yeah. Tessa Bailey: that I'm really enjoying writing and I know it's gonna resonate when it comes out, and I just have to trust the process and trust that it'll be it'll like reach people the way it's supposed to. And you know, ⁓ social media, it's just such a constantly evolving, loud, crowded place. And it's hard to be creative and focus on that because Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Yes. Yeah. Tessa Bailey: it makes you feel bad about yourself. Like I feel like that's like the hallmark of social media. It like... No one's feeling great about themselves a hundred percent of the time on social media. So it just kind of it diverts your creative energy and it and that's not always good. So you gotta kind of like learn to disassociate, learn to know when to check out and just focus on something else and how to balance that. Courtney Richter: Although I have to say you're very funny on social media. Like you heard out for a while. The videos you do make, ⁓ like they they are very funny. They're they still have your sense of humor, so much what we've got to know from your writing. And so you found a way to still stay true to yourself in your videos too, which is a talent not everyone can do. So Tessa Bailey: Hey. I have a really weird sense of humor, which I think we've established, and like so I'm just some and I'll sit and I'll be like, This is funny to me. ⁓ Is it gonna be to anybody else? I don't know. ⁓ But ⁓ you know, I have to I, I I've learned to trust my sense of humor as I've gotten older. But I've also ⁓ I feel like I've also started keeping my sense of humor like locked into my head. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: Over the past couple of years almost like a thing I'm like coveting for ⁓ 'Cause it, it's like very vulnerable thing to try and be funny ⁓ on social media. It's like if you crash and burn or your, your post doesn't get any attention, it just becomes this like ⁓ ⁓ assign value. Like you assign too much value to ⁓ And ⁓ so I just have to ⁓ I just like focus on what I can ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes. Tessa Bailey: Who's in front of me, like what I can see and touch and writing. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Well, 'cause it's a weird pull because you can use your creativity on social media. Like there is some fun in that in making your little in making the videos and going like I have so many good ones in my head that I just never actually have time to do or post or ⁓ They me laugh. But ⁓ it let you play. Like it's kind of play-doh for adults. But then there's that side of it of like, ⁓ but then people actually react and you d, dopamine, everything gets sucked into it even when you're trying to avoid it. So yeah, it's that balance. Tessa Bailey: Yeah. It's true. ⁓ But you're Like if you can find a way to just have fun with it and then just go, all right, well it's out there and that's it, and I have to just walk away now and like it's not ⁓ a ⁓ it's not a judgment on my like, ⁓ you know, as a human. ⁓ How this video ⁓ and ⁓ walk from Like if you can learn to do that ⁓ and go, ⁓ hell with it, like my life I I'm still Courtney Richter: Yeah you're writing. Yeah Tessa Bailey: hear breathing and like living and everything's fine, even if my video doesn't get views. ⁓ Then it's like it, it's just a healthy, a healthier mindset to just be able to just turn that off, you know? Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah. That's the best- well, and you're a mom too. ⁓ As you know, I have two kids. Caitlin has a son as well. How do you balance being the queen of dirty talk? And with your son, like I love when you do your dedications and you're ⁓ like, don't read like 25 and 55. Skip those scenes ⁓ going. Like ⁓ do you ⁓ that balance? Cause even for Cait and I we, like we get really explicit on the show and things we'll talk about because we're really pro healthy sexual lives for women and talking about it. Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Because it didn't happen enough when we were younger. ⁓ But yes, is that balance with having your son and being known to the world for your ⁓ your daughter. Tessa Bailey: ⁓ She's fourteen. ⁓ She is you know, like think it works to my advantage. I, I mean like I don't think I think the girls, ⁓ her friends and her are like really comfortable saying anything in front of me because they know that I write explicit books. I, I, even her ⁓ her guy friends, I, I they seem to any kind of shyness whatsoever just saying Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: whatever they want to say in front of me. ⁓ I think one of them- ⁓ you know, he was trying to like, ⁓ know, mac on a girl in my house and, ⁓ and I walked in like, Break it up! And I was like, he called me a cock block and I'm like, you're you can't call me that. ⁓ like, you know, this is the kind of ⁓ thing that I, I don't know, I just I am very not embarrassed when it comes to talking about anything, ⁓ you know about intimacy or sexuality or whatever. Like and so I think if they if they want to come talk to me about it or my mo- my daughter talks to me about it, she knows like I'm just gonna react like it's a conversational thing. It's not like a like ⁓ you shouldn't be doing that. You're you know, or you shouldn't be talking about that or thinking about that. It's like be realistic. ⁓ I've been you know, I was born horny so I, I think that she knows that she can talk to me about pretty much anything and I yeah, being a romance author Courtney Richter: Yes. Tessa Bailey: It's like kind of not just my daughter and her friends, but like people ⁓ like readers come up to me at signings and really feel comfortable telling me like that, ⁓ like your books have made my sex life better with my husband, things like that. And I like welcome it. I, I think it's not I think it's very author to author. Like some people might not be comfortable with that, and that's also understandable, but for me I'm like we just this have this established intimacy almost because of what I write. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes. Tessa Bailey: And people feel like they want to express that to me and talk to me about it. And ⁓ like it does not I just like it. I don't know. I thought like, great! Let's help you ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah. What? You have that sound bite right now of like you know if it's Tessa Bailey, sh they're gonna put the finger in the butt that's currently on yours, which I love so much Caitlin Stryker: ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: entitlement. Tessa Bailey: Like yeah, ⁓ that's uh... Didn't, didn't I post that TikTok from Adien like a couple of weeks ago? Yeah, it's so funny. I'm, I'm like trying to like space it out. I feel like every single book there's a there's something happening with butts and I'm like I gotta like really like ⁓ skip a of books in between ⁓ before this my signature. ⁓ Courtney Richter: You did post that, yes. No, I think it's important though. I think it's important because honestly, it is kind of where most people go taboo. And if you don't have the encouragement, it definitely romance smut books encouraged me to explore butt play with both myself and partner. That I don't know I necessarily would have done had I not been reading about it over and over and over and the enjoyment of it. So Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: You Tessa Bailey: Yeah, it's like it's you know It just yeah, it takes a little bit of the like, ⁓ should I or should like it's like, ⁓ people are obviously enjoying this and obviously if it's in this mainstream book then people are the people are buying, people are curious about it or must be interested in it. And it's it's just not like, ⁓ you try it once and it doesn't work. You know, you know it's fine. No harm, no foul. Courtney Richter: Yes. ⁓ Most it'll just improve. It'll be a happy experience. ⁓ What so I know you were a big in romance reader. So did you know when you started writing like that's what you were gonna write? And did you know you were gonna go into like the smuttier spicy side of it, or did that just come out? Caitlin Stryker: none at all. Yeah. Yeah. Tessa Bailey: Exactly. Yeah, I mean when I I've never written anything but romance. I it like when I decided to try and write a book, like there it was just kind of like a Books I've ever read are romance novels. I mean, you know, like I've read books outside of that, but like the ones that I feel most passionately about are romance novels. And ⁓ anytime I read a book that doesn't have romance or watch a movie that doesn't have romance, I'm like, I'm only half paying attention. It's just the thing that draws me in the most. I'm like, who's fucking in this movie? Like what's going on? Where's the yeah, where is like the longing, where's the pining? Courtney Richter: That's me. Yes. Same. Like where where is it coming? Tessa Bailey: ⁓ So, when I decided to write a book, I was like the only thing I can see myself having the discipline to sit down and see through to the end is like a love story. ⁓ And the spice, I was like, I think the first couple of times I attempted to write, I was like writing as if people I knew were gonna read it. And once I stopped doing that, once I was like, no one's ever gonna see this. No one's even gonna read this. And then I, I was like Caitlin Stryker: Mmm. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: That's actually the number one advice I give to romance authors is like write it like your mom isn't gonna read it, ~ because if you're worrying about, Oh, I'm a, I'm a sister, I'm a mother, I'm a I'm a friend, I'm a a daughter, I'm like all these different things. I'm an employee of this company and all of those things are gonna hold you back from expressing true feelings and true passion on the page, then like you just have to tune it out because you're also just you're also your own person. You're you know Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: And that's okay just to be that person while you're writing. ⁓ You know what I mean? I think that when I was originally a romance reader, the number one scenes I would want to read were the it mostly just the dialogue during the sex scenes. I was like, Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: I love that. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Tessa Bailey: Wow! I can't believe you just said ⁓ Filter would be off and it was like this refreshingly honest, these refreshingly honest moments. ⁓ I, I would like go into like Barnes and Noble like Borders and I would just like look at the, the sex scenes and I would just like look at the dialogue. Honestly, that was my favorite part. So ⁓ it just ⁓ yeah, like I and I still to this day, sixty five books in or whatever it is, I still race to those scenes. Caitlin Stryker: Hahaha Courtney Richter: Me too. I'm like a duh, duh, duh, duh.. Which the thing I, I also really appreciate about you is when you get to those scenes, you give us those scenes. They're not rushed. get to like ⁓ settle in and enjoy it and enjoy the full experience. It's not like a little tease or go. Once you hit it, once you get to this spice in your book, you're like, okay, and we're here. And we like enjoy ⁓ whole interaction. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Yeah. Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: be on this spicy ride ⁓ for a while it's so much fun. Yeah, yeah. Thank you so much because ⁓ they don't all that. And sometimes it's like, no, I'm reading smut for a reason. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes, thank you. Yeah. Tessa Bailey: Yeah. I mean like I, I wanna be there for the intimate moments of the the whole relationship, not just like the meet cute and the bantering and the dates and like I wanna be there for like how's he gonna get that how's he gonna make it happen for her? Like I wanna know the details. I think like it shows a lot about their characters when they when in those ⁓ intimate moments when like they don't have their filter on and they reveal something about themselves or ⁓ you know Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: like a character that maybe isn't vulnerable in like in the rest of the book is really vulnerable in those moments. That's so effective. And like as as like we were talking about at the beginning, like just being a woman and and having so many hats on all the time and like being able to just shut it off and read a book and put yourself in the character's shoes. It is you're having that experience with them. So you kind of need it to be a a Courtney Richter: Deaths. Tessa Bailey: an experience as opposed to just a taste. Yeah. That's how I think about it. Courtney Richter: but I, I love it because that's exactly what's always come through in your books. Like literally, when I say it got through post partum, it also like ⁓ reawoke my sexual during that time because you're going through you just had a baby. You've just said that you're feeling gross. Like I would be fine if my husband didn't touch me for a year. Like I just I'm good. ⁓ But then reading I would get it. And remember the first time my husband realized like a book was making me horny. He was like, wait. ⁓ This is from a book? What are reading? ⁓ Or doing? And then I'd read it to him and you'd like, ⁓ maybe we should do some more bedtime stories with these books before we go bed. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: start realize that like it's like a really positive thing as opposed to just some like weird hobby that your partner has. Like you're you're like, ⁓ this is really benefiting them. And now also benefiting me. Yeah. It's like ⁓ it's ⁓ it's like ⁓ I, I love I love so much when a partner comes to a signing and they're like, ⁓ my gosh, like Courtney Richter: Yes. Yeah, this is making your life better. Tessa Bailey: They've got me reading the books now and like it's like we have this dialogue that we didn't have before about like what we want and what we like. And that's another really powerful thing about romance novels is it just starts a conversation. It's you know, like you're gonna take you take more agency because you're watching characters do it over and over again and like say what they want in really clear terms and it's just really refreshing. Courtney Richter: Yes. Yes. Yeah, it is. And the thought like you said, the dialogue they say and the thoughts that they're having, that's it pulls you in a way that movies can't. Because you really get to get in there and think, like, ⁓ yeah, and I've had those thoughts, and that is how this kind of goes as opposed to watching people demonstrate it. It like puts you in it. And that's where I find I'm able to imagine myself or imagine my husband and taking on those qualities. It lets you kind of live out those little fantasies in the moment 'cause it's so visceral. So yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yes. Tessa Bailey: Yeah. You imagine your husband? ⁓ Courtney Richter: become a version of my husband. I know. ⁓ I would make it- I married a hot man and he's very muscular and dark, dark hair and dark eyes, so he like fits into a lot of descriptions. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: That's so sweet. Okay. Yeah, he's like he's kind of like almost yeah, like a bunch of yeah, it's always like the tall, dark and handsome guy, you know? Courtney Richter: Yeah, exactly. And so it it yeah, it usually most of the books make me ⁓ fantasize him and I in that position or in that age or that time. So yeah. Yes, I usually tell him. Sometimes like I don't think he understands that it doesn't always happen that way for people. Like I think he just assumes that's what people do. Where I'm like Tessa Bailey: ⁓ that's so sweet. Did you know that? Caitlin Stryker: Nice. Tessa Bailey: We're just imagining their husbands. Not so. Not so. I would say you're definitely the exception and not the rule. Courtney Richter: Ha ha ha. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yeah. Courtney Richter: It's not always. There's definitely occasionally other people, but yeah. It get yeah, it just Tessa Bailey: I mean it's not like unheard of, but you know, yeah. Caitlin Stryker: I think for me it's more the... It's more the like overall feeling. Like when I read, I don't necessarily see, I get like this kind of like 4D feeling experience that I can't really describe. And I think it's so interesting that everybody experiences a book differently. Like when they read the images they get or the feeling they get is different. It's really interesting, particularly with romance and getting turned on. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: And ⁓ what I realized, yeah, ⁓ a lot of authors actually don't see like necessarily like features on their characters when they're writing the books. Like I personally see like an outline ⁓ of a character. hear their voice and I see like mannerisms, ⁓ but I don't like features. So like when people ask me like, ⁓ did you picture a certain actor? I'm like, Caitlin Stryker: Mmm. Tessa Bailey: No, like I don't I don't honestly there is no actor that could fit the d- the kind of like feeling I have of this character. Not- Like nobody could. ⁓ But I'm usually able to go, yeah, he could he could work. He could definitely work. But it's not like it's never what I actually pictured in my head because I'm not picturing I'm, I'm picturing more of like this like, yeah, like almost like a person is a feeling, if that makes sense. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. of someone. I like even I know ⁓ obviously you know of the Fourth Wing and they're talking about casting that as a movie. And I'm, I've said it many times. Like, no, I don't want it. I, I have no interest. ⁓ There is no real life person can be that. Caitlin Stryker: Mm-hmm. Tessa Bailey: Yes. Its so hard. I'm- That's gonna be a tough one. Like God speed to whoever gets cast in that movie. ⁓ gonna be really hard for them. ⁓ Yeah. I mean like it, you know, ⁓ readers, I think and I think we're in a time right now where we're a lot of what we're picturing is AI. It's not real people. ⁓ Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Like good luck. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Readers and fans, they've become feral and they're like fully making AI videos of these romanticies. Tessa Bailey: It comes in my like regard- like whether I click on it or not, it comes up ⁓ in my Facebook feed for some reason. Like these kind of like shorts. ⁓ Do you what I'm talking about? Like they're like one minute shorts and they're they're not perfect and they're they're AI. And I'm like scroll, scroll, scroll. Like I'm telling myself scroll. But then there's just like stuff happening where I'm like, would they be having this on Facebook? And it's always like some version of like, Courtney Richter: Mm hmm Yes, I know what you're talking about. Caitlin Stryker: Huh. Tessa Bailey: this like poor girl and this like evil guy and he's like being mean to her and I'm like, is this what? ⁓ Where's the good guys on Facebook? They're so mean. Courtney Richter: ⁓ When we write the males that are like, you know, have that masculine toxic, there's just there's like a it's like a grumpy sunshine version or a thing underneath. But those never end up being the AI ones. The AI ones are always just the really mean Tessa Bailey: You? I would never want you as my wife. You're pathetic. And I'm like, Oh my God. ⁓ That's like seven views. ⁓ You know, I'm no ⁓ I'm definitely not you know, I, I think there, there's definitely ⁓ a draw in that type of storyline where the hero is terrible in the beginning and then he at by the end of it he's like falling at her feet. I totally get that. Courtney Richter: Get out of it. I see those two on Tessa Bailey: ⁓ But that's like the not the part I see. I only see the mean Like, and I'm just like so sad. But I yeah, I will never ⁓ yeah. What going back to what we were saying, I think yeah, a lot of people picture this like kind of paragon of like poreless perfection, you know. Then get like a real person and we're like, no way. ⁓ And just like something we're gonna have to get over because ⁓ we want real people in movies and we want to ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Yes. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah Courtney Richter: Yeah. We do. Tessa Bailey: Yeah, and then they usually end up being amazing, you know, and capturing the character really well. So I, I know what you're saying though. Fourth Wing is gonna be a tough one. It's such a like hard character to cast. Courtney Richter: Yeah. Caitlin Stryker: Good. Courtney Richter: It's just also on taste. Like some books for me just don't need to be movies. And that's okay, because I'm a reader, so like they can just live in my head and I don't have to watch them. But then people that would never read, I'm so ecstatic for them to get to see a film version so they still get the story and they still get to learn it that way. Right? They and they might. I hope they do. Tessa Bailey: I have to assume ⁓ well, I want to assume but I know the author is a, know, really conscientious person who feels passionately about the story and I'm sure she, you know, will... Yeah, I, I you know, I'm sure she wants to do ex- everything she can for the readers and so we should trust. Courtney Richter: Day Oh I do. I think it's just when you write, but all of you you guys just write such amazing main male characters that it's just a very high bar to live up to, which is why we all love them and devour them so much, because it's like the perfect ⁓ on platters that you all give us. ⁓ like, Yeah. ⁓ when they're like a grumpy golfer, they're still like underneath that you're like, Yeah, that's forgivable. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: It's yeah, it's hard to see one streak into one screen. ⁓ So true. So true. would fall in love with a grumpy golfer? Not, not me. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yeah. ⁓ my gosh. Well thank you so much for coming on, Tessa. ⁓ It's been such a pleasure talking to you. I've literally read your entire library. I hope I need Cait to pop back on so that this can load because it's from her end. Tessa Bailey: They keep out in here. She had a tough one today, huh? Courtney Richter: I know. I think it's so awful. So and then we didn't get to tell you. So basically Cait is like a new to romance reader. She started reading last September. I pulled her into like romance and romantacy. And I've been reading it forever. So usually we kind of can talk about it as someone like new and popping into the scene now. And then me who's been reading it forever. And that's kind of our way of breaking down books and looking at it. So it's been really fun because she only knows like literally those three of yours so far. Tessa Bailey: ⁓ okay. ⁓ ~ Oh okay. Courtney Richter: And then I started- and loving it. So when she read Catch Me If You Can- Catch Me- Her If You Can She was like, ⁓ it's so spicy and it goes like that's actually almost like Tessa Spice Light. Like it is spicy, but it's not as spicy as other ones. I'm like, wait till we get Tessa Bailey: I know, right? I, I feel like what's my spiciest book? ⁓ Maybe well maybe she should read Follow or Happenstance if she wants to read like something like ⁓ in like indie that that like nobody was editing me. ⁓ But feel like Fix Her Up is also a really good one. Like I, I actually go back to that dugout scene pretty frequently to read it because it like puts me in some kind of mood, you know. Courtney Richter: Yes. Baker is nice and spicy. Tessa Bailey: The the dugout scene in Fix Her Up. Yeah. Courtney Richter: And second one is it Lorenzo, and, oh gosh. I was just reading it. Rosie. Rosie and Dominic, thank you. ⁓ Tessa Bailey: Rosie and Dominic and yeah, Rosie and Dominic. And then the last one is Bethany Courtney Richter: Yes. And but that Rosie I was just like I hadn't read it in years and just reading little snippets because I also just jumped to scenes. And their chemistry, I still think their chemistry was the most off the charts of all your coup- couples. They're just like that going around each other and just feeling it but not acting on it. So hot. Cait, we were just talking about her spiciest books, which ones you should read, 'cause you've only gotten Tessa Bailey: Thank you. Mm-hmm. which one you should read. I think Fix Her Up maybe, or if you wanted something like Follow is also one of mine that I feel like is ⁓ like I was saying, he like ⁓ nobody was editing me 'cause it's indie and it was just like straight up like she has like a ⁓ being paid for sex so he like acts that out with her and th you might like that one. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: Ooh. reading reading Catch Her Your Can. That was the first one of yours that I read. And I said to Court, I was like, ⁓ she's, she's the best. She's my favorite. She it. just gets right in there and she writes that smut. And I was like, she's the one I'm going to, and that's exactly what I want. ⁓ Cause I get very impatient with a slow burn. Courtney Richter: Yeah, that's a good one. Tessa Bailey: Yeah. I know, I know. And I feel like I do ⁓ as I'm getting older, I do wr- write like like the intimacy does come towards the middle of the book as opposed to my early books where it was like maybe chapter three. I'd be like, Woo, let's go. ⁓ Now I'm like, I need to establish an emotional connection. So boring. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah. Courtney Richter: Ha ha Caitlin Stryker: No. Yeah. Courtney Richter: Depending on your mood, there's different versions too if you just wanna hit it. ⁓ Caitlin Stryker: It's true. They do They do Tessa Bailey: Thank you. I agree. Yeah. That's amazing. I agree too. Courtney Richter: Thank you for coming. We hope everyone will read S'more Of You 'cause it's it's a perfect little short read. It's a little as they say, it's an appetizer bite ⁓ of the Summer Lovin' series. And you I said obviously read it one sitting. Just go. But it leaves you like if just need a little pop to your day. Kindle Unlimited has it. Tessa Bailey: Prime members so you can read you can check ⁓ out like writing for almost free or I think ⁓ and it's only a little sampling, so it's kind of like a like an amuse bouche of of romance. ⁓ Courtney Richter: Yes. a little Jason Momoa in your life, grab ⁓ My Killer Vacation. And for October, Broken Rival. You ⁓ everyone, you are gonna so happy that this book exists and that you get to read it. It is so fun and hot and sexy and it's almost a fantasy, but it's still in that dystopian romance. ⁓ It's so well done. And I'm so excited for everyone to get to read this and see what happens with it. Yes. Tessa Bailey: That my color vacation. A hundred percent. Thank you. Thank you so much. Caitlin Stryker: Yeah, thank you for coming on. It's been wonderful listening to you. Courtney Richter: Thing. Tessa Bailey: Yes, Thank you for having Courtney Richter: Whoa. All right everyone, we will see you next time. Happy reading. Bye. Tessa Bailey: Bye. Caitlin Stryker: Bye.