Latest / The Moscow Murders and More / Mega Edition: What Classifies Someone As A Serial Killer? (10/29/26)

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Mega Edition: What Classifies Someone As A Serial Killer? (10/29/26) · The Moscow Murders and More

0:00
Speaker 1: What's up everyone and welcome back to the program. Whenever
0:04
Speaker 1: there's a situation like the one we see with the
0:07
Speaker 1: Gilgo Four and now the arrest of Rex Heuermann, there's
0:11
Speaker 1: always the question, why would somebody do something like this?
0:16
Speaker 1: And how could somebody's brain be so broken that this
0:20
Speaker 1: is something that they think is a good idea? Well,
0:24
Speaker 1: today we have an article from CNN and the headline is,
0:28
Speaker 1: What causes someone to become a serial killer? It's a
0:31
Speaker 1: malignant combination of factors, experts say. This article was authored
0:37
Speaker 1: by Ala Elazar. For decades, criminologists and true crime documentaries
0:45
Speaker 1: have attempted to understand what causes serial killers to commit
0:49
Speaker 1: the atrocities that they do. Dennis Rader, John Wayne Gacy,
0:54
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Dahmer, Albert DeSalvo and Ted Bundy are just a
0:58
Speaker 1: few of more than 3,600 serial killers documented in the
1:04
Speaker 1: United States as of 2020, according to the University of Michigan.
1:10
Speaker 1: Think about that for a minute, huh? 3,600 serial killers
1:14
Speaker 1: documented in the United States. How many are undocumented? Most recently,
1:22
Speaker 1: Rex Uerman, a 59-year-old New York architect, was arrested and
1:26
Speaker 1: charged with the murder in the killings of three of
1:29
Speaker 1: the Gilgo Four, a group of four women whose remains
1:33
Speaker 1: were found along a short stretch of Long Island's Gilgo
1:36
Speaker 1: Beach in 2010. Heuermann, who told his attorney that he's
1:41
Speaker 1: not the killer and pleaded not guilty, is also the
1:44
Speaker 1: prime suspect in the killing of the fourth woman, but
1:48
Speaker 1: has yet to be charged in that case. And honestly,
1:52
Speaker 1: I think it's only a matter of time before we
1:55
Speaker 1: see him get charged with Maureen's murder as well. There's
1:58
Speaker 1: no doubt that there's enough evidence there. They just have
2:01
Speaker 1: to put it all together and they have to use
2:04
Speaker 1: the technology that's available to them so that they can
2:07
Speaker 1: get that probable cause that a judge is going to
2:10
Speaker 1: sign off on. The unsolved killings confounded authorities on Long
2:14
Speaker 1: Island's South Shore Police. After the search for one of
2:18
Speaker 1: the missing women led investigators to find at least 10
2:21
Speaker 1: sets of human remains in addition to hers and launch
2:25
Speaker 1: the hunt for a possible serial killer. As yet, police
2:30
Speaker 1: haven't linked Heuermann to the eight other human remains. The
2:33
Speaker 1: Gilgo Beach serial killings have once again raised the question,
2:38
Speaker 1: how could someone do such a thing? CNN spoke with
2:42
Speaker 1: three forensic psychologists, and serial killer experts to better understand
2:47
Speaker 1: what causes people to become serial killers. The conversations have
2:51
Speaker 1: been edited for length and clarity. Are serial killers born
2:56
Speaker 1: this way, or are they a product of their environment? Dr.
3:01
Speaker 1: Scott Bond, criminologist, author, and public speaker. It's likely a
3:06
Speaker 1: combination of the two. Psychopaths are born that way, while
3:10
Speaker 1: sociopaths have been socialized into it. There's a spectrum. It's
3:14
Speaker 1: not black and white, and there are multiple factors. Dr.
3:19
Speaker 1: Louis Schlesinger, professor of forensic psychology at John Jay College
3:24
Speaker 1: of Criminal Justice. It's unknown, but there's a very strong
3:28
Speaker 1: neurobiological component to serial sexual murder because the sexual instinct
3:34
Speaker 1: is biologically determined. So this is where it gets all
3:38
Speaker 1: kinds of confusing for normal folks, right? We look at
3:41
Speaker 1: people like this and we say to ourselves, This MF-er
3:45
Speaker 1: is batshit crazy. We don't need no clinical explanation of
3:48
Speaker 1: why that person's crazy. They're just crazy. Anyone who's gonna
3:52
Speaker 1: go out there and murder a bunch of women, yeah,
3:55
Speaker 1: you're a crazy son of a bitch, and you need
3:57
Speaker 1: to be in prison. Now, I don't think you're insane.
4:00
Speaker 1: That's different. But crazy? Oh, hell yeah. Brian Koberger's former teacher, Dr.
4:06
Speaker 1: Catherine Ramsland, professor of forensic psychology and criminal justice at
4:10
Speaker 1: DeSalas University, If you study one case, you can identify
4:15
Speaker 1: the influences, but you can't generalize from that one to
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Speaker 1: all others. You might find some things in common across
4:22
Speaker 1: many cases, such as abuse or head injuries, but it
4:26
Speaker 1: won't be true of all serial killers. And that's certainly
4:30
Speaker 1: spot on. There's not one size fit all when it
4:33
Speaker 1: comes to these sick bastards. How do you know a
4:36
Speaker 1: murderer is a serial killer? Scott Bond. The way that
4:40
Speaker 1: you know that there's a serial killer is because they
4:43
Speaker 1: leave consistent markings, consistent evidence that you're dealing with the
4:47
Speaker 1: same individual. And that's certainly something you see with serial killers.
4:52
Speaker 1: Does that mean they never change their MO? Absolutely not.
4:55
Speaker 1: Some of them do. But before that happens, there is
4:59
Speaker 1: a distinct pattern that forms with most of these killers.
5:03
Speaker 1: Louis Schlesinger. If you look at serial sexual murderers, they
5:07
Speaker 1: often do things with the body above and beyond what
5:11
Speaker 1: is necessary to kill the person, like leaving the victim
5:15
Speaker 1: in a degrading position with her legs spread open with
5:18
Speaker 1: things shoved in or that type of thing. Why did
5:21
Speaker 1: they do that? And the answer is because killing alone
5:25
Speaker 1: is not psychosexually sufficient. So they have to go above
5:29
Speaker 1: and beyond killing to gratify themselves. And that's certainly something
5:33
Speaker 1: we see with most of these sick sons of bitches.
5:37
Speaker 1: And from what we heard from Mr. Dormer and from
5:40
Speaker 1: what we can take from the Google searches of Rex Heuermann,
5:44
Speaker 1: he certainly fits the bill. What factors influence a person
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Speaker 1: to become a serial killer? Catherine Ramsland. There is a
5:52
Speaker 1: great deal of variation in this population. from a range
5:56
Speaker 1: of motives, backgrounds, ages, and behaviors, to differences in physiology, sex,
6:03
Speaker 1: mental state, and perceptions that influence reasoning and decision. Each
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Speaker 1: person uniquely processes a given situation in their lives, and
6:13
Speaker 1: some gravitate towards violence. This can be defensive violence or aggressive,
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Speaker 1: psychotic or psychopathic, reactive or predatory, to name some possibilities.
6:25
Speaker 1: Any factor, abuse, neglect, deviance, bullying, might have different influences
6:31
Speaker 1: on different people, and new experiences can modify perceptions positively
6:37
Speaker 1: or negatively. And it does seem like the vast majority
6:41
Speaker 1: of these serial killers were bullied at some point in
6:44
Speaker 1: their life, and certainly there's a lot of evidence that
6:48
Speaker 1: there was abuse in childhood as That happened to a
6:52
Speaker 1: lot of these serial killers by a parent, a relative,
6:56
Speaker 1: an authority figure in their life. Do all serial killers
7:00
Speaker 1: suffer some sort of trauma? Scott Bond. There can be
7:04
Speaker 1: a correlation between childhood trauma, but it's not enough to
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Speaker 1: turn somebody into a serial killer. It's numerous factors that
7:12
Speaker 1: become a perfect storm that turn a person into a
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Speaker 1: serial killer. Louis Schlesinger. Most people want to search for
7:21
Speaker 1: a watershed event in somebody's life that will explain this behavior.
7:26
Speaker 1: It's human nature. It's a natural tendency. He did it
7:29
Speaker 1: because his mother abused them. He did it because this
7:32
Speaker 1: traumatic event happened. But you're not going to find it.
7:35
Speaker 1: Poor parenting and childhood trauma, that never helps. But those
7:40
Speaker 1: in and of themselves are not dispositive for creating somebody
7:45
Speaker 1: who's going out and killing for sexual gratification in a series.
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Speaker 1: Thousands of people have had horrible childhoods. They don't go
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Speaker 1: around killing people in a series. And he's right about
7:56
Speaker 1: that too. It's not just the abuse or the trauma.
8:00
Speaker 1: These MFers, they're wired wrong. And the trauma and the
8:04
Speaker 1: abuse is usually what initiates them dropping the facade and
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Speaker 1: becoming what they truly are. Are all serial killers psychopaths?
8:14
Speaker 1: Scott Bond. Not all psychopaths are serial killers. And not
8:18
Speaker 1: all serial killers are psychopaths. Being a psychopath alone does
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Speaker 1: not make one a serial killer. Something else has to happen.
8:27
Speaker 1: In the case of a serial killer who is a psychopath,
8:30
Speaker 1: their brain functions differently than a normal human brain. They
8:34
Speaker 1: process stimuli differently. In particular, the frontal lobe of the
8:39
Speaker 1: brain is where impulses are controlled. the thing that keeps
8:43
Speaker 1: you from just acting out on your initial knee-jerk reaction
8:47
Speaker 1: and from just acting impulsively. Psychopaths have virtually no impulse control.
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Speaker 1: Many psychopaths function incredibly well and highly in society because
8:58
Speaker 1: they're very driven, motivated, individuals, and goal-oriented. They're described as
9:04
Speaker 1: very organized, very persuasive, very patient. These are the characteristics
9:09
Speaker 1: that make a great architect, or a great salesman, but
9:13
Speaker 1: they're also perfect attributes if you want to be a
9:17
Speaker 1: psychopathic killer. And there is no doubt that Rex Uerman
9:21
Speaker 1: ticks off how many of those boxes. And remember, it
9:24
Speaker 1: was Scott Bond who had the profile of Rex Uerman
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Speaker 1: all the way back in the day talking about this
9:31
Speaker 1: is the guy. Now, he didn't have the name, obviously,
9:34
Speaker 1: but he was spot on with the profile that he
9:37
Speaker 1: came up with as far as who the suspect was.
9:41
Speaker 1: Lewis Lessinger, the American people want their serial sexual murderers
9:46
Speaker 1: to be evil geniuses with IQs of 180 that speak
9:50
Speaker 1: five languages. Nothing could be further from the truth. The
9:54
Speaker 1: vast majority are unskilled, unemployed, menial work type people. is
10:00
Speaker 1: an outlier. Yes, and so is Rex Uriman. There's no
10:04
Speaker 1: doubt that people that are this educated, very rarely, that
10:08
Speaker 1: we know of anyway, engage in this kind of behavior.
10:13
Speaker 1: What is a serial sexual murderer? Scott Bond. The sexual urges, sexuality,
10:19
Speaker 1: and arousal became intertwined and twisted with harming things and
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Speaker 1: sadism and blood and an obsession with hurting and death.
10:28
Speaker 1: When that happens, it sets off a trajectory that leads
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Speaker 1: one to become a sexual sadist. This does not happen overnight.
10:35
Speaker 1: No one wakes up one morning and says today is
10:38
Speaker 1: a great day to become a serial killer What happens
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Speaker 1: is these impulses begin to take off in right around adolescence,
10:46
Speaker 1: perhaps even earlier, 11 or 12 years old. What happened
10:50
Speaker 1: to Rex Heuermann at 12 years old, folks? That's right.
10:53
Speaker 1: His dad passed away and his mother became the domineering
10:56
Speaker 1: figure in his life. And that certainly looks to me
10:59
Speaker 1: like the event that set the trajectory that Mr. Bond
11:02
Speaker 1: was talking about. It becomes like a fantasy loop that
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Speaker 1: plays over and over in their minds throughout adolescence and
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Speaker 1: into early adulthood. They frequently combine it with masturbation, so
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Speaker 1: they fantasize about doing terrible things to people, bondage and
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Speaker 1: raping and killing, and they become sexually aroused. This reaches
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Speaker 1: ultimately what I like to call a tipping point, often
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Speaker 1: in the early to mid-20s, where this fantasy can no
11:31
Speaker 1: longer just live in their daydreams. They have to act
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Speaker 1: out on it. They must feel it. They absolutely have
11:38
Speaker 1: to live this experience, and then that's when they kill
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Speaker 1: for the first time. So, considering Mr. Bond had that
11:46
Speaker 1: great profile of Heuermann, do you think Heuermann started killing
11:50
Speaker 1: in his early 20s or mid-20s? And if so, the
11:54
Speaker 1: investigators certainly have their work still cut out for them.
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Speaker 1: Louis Schlesinger Many people, not serial killers, Regular people have
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Speaker 1: sexual fantasies that they keep to themselves. The question then is,
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Speaker 1: if there's a large number of people with very deviant
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Speaker 1: sexual fantasies, getting arousal, for example, from inflicting pain on others, torturing,
12:17
Speaker 1: why does a small number act out? We don't know.
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Speaker 1: But what seems to happen is there's a trigger, a
12:24
Speaker 1: loss of some type, which begins the acting out. Loss
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Speaker 1: of a job, loss of a relationship, are the two
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Speaker 1: things that tend to trigger it in men. And, incidentally,
12:35
Speaker 1: this is a male situation. There's no female serial sexual murderers.
12:40
Speaker 1: He's not wrong about that either, none that we know of. Now,
12:43
Speaker 1: we've seen serial killers, but serial sexual murderers? We have
12:47
Speaker 1: not seen those, at least none that have been documented.
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Speaker 1: Are all serial killers serial sexual murderers? Lewis Lessinger. There's
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Speaker 1: a world of difference between someone who's doing this for
13:00
Speaker 1: sexual gratification, like Ted Bundy, BTK, the Boston Strangler, Jack
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Speaker 1: the Ripper. Those are sexual murderers. A serial killer generically
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Speaker 1: means somebody who killed in a series. They could be
13:14
Speaker 1: contract killers, health care people like nurses that killed patients.
13:18
Speaker 1: You go into any state prison, you're going to find
13:21
Speaker 1: a number of people in their criminal career that may
13:24
Speaker 1: have killed two or three people. There is no doubt
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Speaker 1: that just about everybody, as far as the mafia, and
13:31
Speaker 1: as far as people who do wet work for the mafia,
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Speaker 1: they could all be considered serial killers. Sammy the Bull
13:37
Speaker 1: Gravano's certainly a serial killer. What, 17 bodies that he
13:40
Speaker 1: copped to? Meanwhile, dudes running around on a podcast on YouTube,
13:45
Speaker 1: getting that bag. Hey, more power to him, right? But, man,
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Speaker 1: this dude's a legit serial killer if you're going by
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Speaker 1: the numbers. Scott Bond. Serial killers are not one size
13:57
Speaker 1: fits all. They fall into different categories based upon the fantasy,
14:01
Speaker 1: psychological need that is served by killing. The public often misunderstands,
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Speaker 1: and I think comes to an erroneous conclusion that it's
14:10
Speaker 1: all about sex. Sometimes it's about power, domination, and control.
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Speaker 1: And just like the crime of rape, it may be
14:19
Speaker 1: a sexual activity, but it's really about domination, power, and control.
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Speaker 1: Catherine Ramsland. What defines a serial killer is the specific behavior.
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Speaker 1: Having killed two or more victims in at least two incidents,
14:33
Speaker 1: we see behavior as common to certain subsets, but to
14:36
Speaker 1: lump all offenders who have committed two or more murders
14:39
Speaker 1: oversimplifies them. And there's no doubt that this is a
14:43
Speaker 1: very nuanced issue. And there's so much psychology that goes
14:47
Speaker 1: into it that people like us, regular old folks, we
14:50
Speaker 1: might have a handle on. on, you know, the basic
14:53
Speaker 1: idea of what makes somebody like this tick, but we'll
14:56
Speaker 1: never understand the psyche of somebody like this the way
15:00
Speaker 1: that these psychologists do. Are there any signs that suggest
15:05
Speaker 1: someone might be a serial sexual murderer? Louis Lessinger. I
15:10
Speaker 1: have 10 ominous signs, when seen in combination, that indicate
15:14
Speaker 1: a risk for a potential sexual murderer. Now look, don't
15:18
Speaker 1: use these 10 signs to go and try and build
15:20
Speaker 1: a profile of your weird cousin, okay? One, childhood abuse
15:25
Speaker 1: is number one that has a very low predictive ability,
15:29
Speaker 1: but it's in the background of almost all serial sexual
15:32
Speaker 1: murderers to one degree or another. Two, inappropriate maternal sexual conduct.
15:39
Speaker 1: Boys need to see their mothers as asexual. When an
15:42
Speaker 1: adolescent boy sees his mother behaving sexually, it's very, very destabilizing.
15:48
Speaker 1: So his mother lost her husband. They were, what, 50
15:52
Speaker 1: years old or so? Did his mother have another guy
15:55
Speaker 1: come to the house? Was he calling somebody uncle? Look,
15:58
Speaker 1: we don't know. But in the background of a lot
16:00
Speaker 1: of these serial killers, there is a lot of that
16:04
Speaker 1: that occurred. Three, pathological lying and manipulation. Four, sadistic fantasy
16:11
Speaker 1: with a compulsion to act. Five, animal cruelty. particularly toward
16:17
Speaker 1: cats because a cat is a female symbol. 6. The
16:21
Speaker 1: need to control and dominate others is another one. 7.
16:26
Speaker 1: Repetitive fire setting. 8. Voyeurism, fetishes, and sexual burglaries, sexually
16:34
Speaker 1: motivated burglary. 9. Unprovoked attacks on females associated with generalized
16:41
Speaker 1: misogynistic emotions. 10. evidence of ritualistic or signature behavior. Now,
16:48
Speaker 1: how many of those 10 does our boy Rex Ewerman
16:51
Speaker 1: fit into? Do serial killers feel guilt or awareness that
16:56
Speaker 1: what they're doing is wrong? Scott Bond. Serial killers who
17:00
Speaker 1: may be psychopaths or sociopaths have antisocial personality disorders for
17:06
Speaker 1: which there is no cure. They know right from wrong.
17:09
Speaker 1: They just don't care. Society's laws and our morality mean
17:14
Speaker 1: nothing to them. That's why serial killers almost never are
17:18
Speaker 1: able to use the insanity defense when they go to trial,
17:21
Speaker 1: because they're not clinically or legally insane. They're just indifferent
17:26
Speaker 1: to the laws of society and indifferent to the suffering
17:29
Speaker 1: of others. Yeah, crazy, deranged MFers. They know what they're
17:36
Speaker 1: doing is wrong. Do they feel remorse or guilt? I'm
17:39
Speaker 1: going to say generally no. When you cover up the
17:42
Speaker 1: crime scene, when you use burner phones to cover your tracks,
17:46
Speaker 1: that shows you have consciousness of guilt and awareness of
17:50
Speaker 1: the wrongfulness of your behavior. So when you go to court,
17:54
Speaker 1: there is no basis for a jury to find you
17:56
Speaker 1: legally insane. You can have all kinds of psychological disturbance. Now,
18:01
Speaker 1: these people are not normal, obviously, but they're not legally insane.
18:07
Speaker 1: Keep in mind that I always say this is not physics.
18:11
Speaker 1: There's no formula to apply to all these cases. For example,
18:15
Speaker 1: William Herrings. Back in the 1940s, he was famous for
18:20
Speaker 1: writing on bathroom walls of the victims. Catch me before
18:23
Speaker 1: I kill more. I cannot help myself. He killed victims
18:28
Speaker 1: and then he put bandages on them. Did he try
18:31
Speaker 1: to undo that in his mind? In overwhelming cases, no.
18:34
Speaker 1: They don't feel guilt. But Herrings' behavior speaks to how
18:39
Speaker 1: this is more complicated now. then yes or no. Of course,
18:43
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's an outlier here or there, but for
18:45
Speaker 1: the most part, these are cold, calculating killers, and I
18:50
Speaker 1: don't think any of them really feel remorse. How can
18:53
Speaker 1: serial killers lead double lives so easily? Scott Bond. With
18:58
Speaker 1: most serial killers, the signs are going to be very subtle,
19:02
Speaker 1: because the problem is the Ted Bundys of the world,
19:05
Speaker 1: the John Gacy's of the world, the Dennis Raiders bleed
19:08
Speaker 1: into society so easily that because they're chameleons. They have
19:12
Speaker 1: this ability to flip a switch and go from family
19:15
Speaker 1: man to a sadistic killer with literally the flip of
19:18
Speaker 1: a switch, because what they do is called psychological compartmentalization.
19:24
Speaker 1: And this is what I always say about having two faces, right?
19:27
Speaker 1: They have one face that we all see, and then
19:30
Speaker 1: that other face that comes out when they're out about
19:33
Speaker 1: their bullshit. Compartmentalization is the ability to completely separate aspects
19:40
Speaker 1: of your life that seem contradicting. You know, Dennis Rader,
19:44
Speaker 1: known as the BTK killer, was a member of the
19:47
Speaker 1: Lutheran Church, president of the church. Council. Boy Scout leader.
19:52
Speaker 1: Successful father. And respected man about town. Who also happened
19:56
Speaker 1: to be. One of the most sadistic. Horrible serial killers.
19:59
Speaker 1: Of the 20th century. How can those two things coexist?
20:04
Speaker 1: It's through this process. Of compartmentalization. When they are able
20:07
Speaker 1: to completely separate it. So there's no contradiction. He suffers
20:12
Speaker 1: no ambiguity, no cognitive dissonance as a result. To him,
20:16
Speaker 1: it's just two completely different things. And I think that's
20:20
Speaker 1: a money explanation about all of it. I think Scott
20:24
Speaker 1: Bond really hits the nail on the head right there
20:26
Speaker 1: about how these people are able to just hide in
20:29
Speaker 1: society and hide in plain sight. What do you make
20:33
Speaker 1: of Rex Heuermann, the Gilgo Beach killing suspect? Catherine Ramsland.
20:38
Speaker 1: He's not convicted, so we can't say at this time
20:41
Speaker 1: that he's a serial killer. Just because the victims are
20:44
Speaker 1: sex workers doesn't mean the motivation was sexual. In the
20:47
Speaker 1: legal papers, there's a suggestion that one incident was about
20:51
Speaker 1: revenge for being scammed. If the murders sexually excited him,
20:56
Speaker 1: and that's why he did it, then it's serial sexual homicide.
21:00
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know how you can look at
21:01
Speaker 1: the charging documents, the bail application, and everything we saw there,
21:05
Speaker 1: and all the other evidence, and say to yourself, oh,
21:08
Speaker 1: you know, he might not be the guy. Now, don't
21:11
Speaker 1: get me wrong, that doesn't mean the process shouldn't be followed.
21:14
Speaker 1: That doesn't mean he doesn't deserve a fair trial. He
21:17
Speaker 1: most certainly does. I just happen to think his ass
21:20
Speaker 1: is guilty. Scott Bond. As soon as I heard the
21:24
Speaker 1: killer was carefully disposing of bodies in a very isolated,
21:28
Speaker 1: desolate area on Long Island, it's difficult to get to,
21:32
Speaker 1: and he was meticulously dismembering the bodies and wrapping them
21:36
Speaker 1: up in burlap sacks, tying them up tightly and neatly
21:39
Speaker 1: and depositing them out there. I know based upon past
21:42
Speaker 1: cases that this was going to be very organized, meticulous,
21:47
Speaker 1: unemotional individual who was a planner, sophisticated, probably professional, probably
21:53
Speaker 1: very articulate and persuasive and lived in that vicinity because
21:57
Speaker 1: he had to know it intimately. And Scott Bond had
22:01
Speaker 1: this profile years ago talking about who he thought the
22:04
Speaker 1: Gilgo Beach killer was going to be. So when I
22:08
Speaker 1: came across this article, I thought it would be a
22:10
Speaker 1: great add to the catalog, and I thought it would
22:12
Speaker 1: clear up some questions maybe, you know, just on a
22:15
Speaker 1: surface level obviously, but about what a serial killer is
22:20
Speaker 1: and how a serial killer might be made. Alright folks,
22:23
Speaker 1: that's going to do it for this one. All of
22:25
Speaker 1: the information that goes with this episode can be found
22:29
Speaker 1: in the description box. What's up everyone and welcome back
22:32
Speaker 1: to the program. One thing that most serial killers share
22:37
Speaker 1: is the fact that they target vulnerable populations. In the
22:41
Speaker 1: old days, it used to be hitchhikers or hippies, you know, transients,
22:46
Speaker 1: who were traveling from town to town and looking for
22:49
Speaker 1: a ride. Well, nowadays, people really aren't hitchhiking anymore, and
22:54
Speaker 1: people are very hip to the fact that there are
22:57
Speaker 1: psychopaths out there, so most folks aren't going to hop
23:00
Speaker 1: into the car with a stranger. However, there is one
23:04
Speaker 1: population that still does that, and is at very high
23:09
Speaker 1: risk of running into somebody like Rex Ewerman. And that,
23:13
Speaker 1: of course, is sex workers. So that's why sex workers
23:16
Speaker 1: are targeted by people like this, by people like Gary Ridgway,
23:21
Speaker 1: because they think that they're going to fall through the
23:23
Speaker 1: cracks and nobody's going to miss them. And unfortunately, a
23:26
Speaker 1: lot of times, they're right. Today we have an article
23:30
Speaker 1: from the U.S. Sun and headline, Vulnerable Victims, Gilgo Beach
23:35
Speaker 1: Suspect Rex Ewerman's Haunting connection to serial killer Joel Rifkin
23:40
Speaker 1: points to shared motive. And there's no doubt that both
23:43
Speaker 1: of these dudes were motivated by the same thing. They
23:47
Speaker 1: were both sexual sadists, they were both into hurting women,
23:51
Speaker 1: and they both targeted sex workers. But that's where it ends.
23:54
Speaker 1: It's not like they were connected as far as buddies
23:57
Speaker 1: or anything like that, but they do share some similarities
24:01
Speaker 1: as killers. This article was authored by Rachel Dobkin. The
24:05
Speaker 1: suspected Gilgo Beach serial killer shares the same sexual motive
24:10
Speaker 1: as the infamous Long Island serial killer, Joel Rifkin, according
24:14
Speaker 1: to a forensic expert. Rex Heuermann, a 59-year-old architect from
24:19
Speaker 1: Massapeca Park, New York, was arrested in July for the
24:23
Speaker 1: murders of three sex workers, Megan Waterman, Melissa Bartholomew, and
24:28
Speaker 1: Amber Costello. Heuermann is also the prime suspect in the
24:32
Speaker 1: murder of Maureen Brainerd Barnes. While Huerman maintains his innocence,
24:37
Speaker 1: the Suffolk County Police Department has been collecting evidence pinning
24:42
Speaker 1: the Long Island native to the four female bodies found
24:45
Speaker 1: near Gilgo Beach on December 2010, who became known as
24:51
Speaker 1: the Gilgo Four. If Huerman is to be found guilty
24:54
Speaker 1: of the murders, he would be thrown in with the
24:57
Speaker 1: likes of Joel Rifkin, a Long Island native who preyed
25:00
Speaker 1: on vulnerable women. Rifkin reportedly confessed to killing 17 women
25:06
Speaker 1: from 1989 to 1993. And Joel Rifkin was a sick,
25:11
Speaker 1: sick dude. And just a quick overview on who Rifkin
25:14
Speaker 1: is from my notes. Joel Rifkin is an American serial
25:18
Speaker 1: killer who terrorized the New York area during the 1980s
25:22
Speaker 1: and the 1990s. Born on January 20th, 1959 in New York,
25:28
Speaker 1: Rifkin's early life was marked by difficulties. He struggled with
25:32
Speaker 1: social interactions, and faced academic challenges leading to feelings of
25:36
Speaker 1: isolation and low self-esteem. Rifkin's killing spree began in 1989
25:42
Speaker 1: and continued until 1993. His victims were primarily sex workers
25:47
Speaker 1: and marginalized women, which allowed him to avoid detection for
25:51
Speaker 1: an extended period. He would pick up his victims in
25:55
Speaker 1: his car, engage in sexual activities, and then murder them,
25:58
Speaker 1: often through strangulation. Following the killings, he would frequently dismember
26:03
Speaker 1: the bodies to hinder identification. The authorities' efforts to capture
26:09
Speaker 1: Rifkin intensified as more bodies were discovered and linked to him.
26:13
Speaker 1: His capture ultimately occurred on June 28, 1993, during a
26:18
Speaker 1: routine traffic stop, for not displaying a valid license plate.
26:23
Speaker 1: When questioned by the police, Rifkin appeared nervous, leading them
26:26
Speaker 1: to investigate his vehicle further. To their horror, they found
26:30
Speaker 1: the lifeless body of his most recent victim still in
26:33
Speaker 1: the car. Rifkin was arrested on the spot and subsequently
26:37
Speaker 1: confessed to the murders. During interrogations, he provided chilling details
26:42
Speaker 1: about the crimes and the rationale behind them. He described
26:46
Speaker 1: the compulsion that drove him to kill, as well as
26:49
Speaker 1: his attempts to clean up crime scenes to avoid detection.
26:53
Speaker 1: In 1994, Joel Rifkin was convicted of nine counts of murder.
26:57
Speaker 1: He was sentenced to 203 years to life in prison,
27:01
Speaker 1: ensuring that he would spend the rest of his life
27:04
Speaker 1: behind bars. Rifkin's case shed light on the vulnerabilities faced
27:08
Speaker 1: by marginalized individuals, such as sex workers, and highlighted the
27:13
Speaker 1: challenges law enforcement agencies encounter in solving serial killer cases.
27:18
Speaker 1: The Joel Rifkin case serves as a grim reminder of
27:21
Speaker 1: the capacity for human cruelty and the importance of vigilant
27:25
Speaker 1: law enforcement efforts to protect society from individuals with violent tendencies.
27:31
Speaker 1: It also underscores the need to support systems for individuals
27:35
Speaker 1: struggling with psychological and emotional challenges to prevent such tragic outcomes.
27:41
Speaker 1: And for each one of these subjects that we talk about,
27:44
Speaker 1: I have some notes that I put down so that
27:47
Speaker 1: when we get to topics such as this, we can
27:50
Speaker 1: add a little more context to what the story is
27:53
Speaker 1: talking about. And it once again just goes to show
27:55
Speaker 1: you the danger that people who engage in sex work
28:00
Speaker 1: are in. They never know what sort of psycho they're
28:03
Speaker 1: going to run into. And chances are, If there is
28:06
Speaker 1: a psycho out there preying on people, he's going to
28:08
Speaker 1: be preying on a vulnerable group. And pretty much the
28:11
Speaker 1: only vulnerable group left are sex workers. So that's why
28:15
Speaker 1: the sex worker community is targeted as much as they are.
28:20
Speaker 1: All right, back to the article. He targeted sex workers,
28:23
Speaker 1: including Heidi Balk, who was known to be his first victim,
28:27
Speaker 1: and Tiffany Bresciani, his last victim, whose body led to
28:31
Speaker 1: his arrest. Forensic psychologist Joni Johnston said that whoever did
28:36
Speaker 1: kill the Gilgo Four had a shared motive with Rifkin.
28:40
Speaker 1: It certainly suggests that they're sexually motivated serial killers, Johnston
28:44
Speaker 1: exclusively told the U.S. Sun. The expert explained, We've certainly
28:50
Speaker 1: seen an increase in serial killers pick selecting prostitutes over
28:54
Speaker 1: the past 30 years. I'd say even going further back.
28:58
Speaker 1: Just look at Jack the Ripper. Who did he target?
29:01
Speaker 1: And it seems like most of these serial killers throughout
29:04
Speaker 1: history target sex workers. And I think part of that
29:08
Speaker 1: is because some of the avenues for other vulnerable victims
29:12
Speaker 1: have closed. Some examples of vulnerable populations in the 70s
29:16
Speaker 1: and 80s, including hitchhikers and children who are not as
29:20
Speaker 1: supervised as they are now, according to Johnston. And there's
29:24
Speaker 1: no doubt, even when I was growing up in the 80s,
29:27
Speaker 1: We were outside all hours of the day until the
29:30
Speaker 1: streetlights came on. You know, every now and then we
29:33
Speaker 1: would check in and shit, but I'd wake up, grab
29:36
Speaker 1: my bike, and it would be on. I'd be traveling
29:39
Speaker 1: around the streets the same way. Yonkers, the Bronx, you
29:41
Speaker 1: name it. Nowadays, there's zero chance that if I was
29:44
Speaker 1: a kid, my parents would let me do that, considering
29:47
Speaker 1: how dangerous all these sickos are. Johnston continued, they're looking
29:52
Speaker 1: for people that they can, number one, take advantage of easily,
29:57
Speaker 1: either physically or because the victim is in a vulnerable position.
30:01
Speaker 1: And number two, they oftentimes look for people who they
30:04
Speaker 1: feel like will not be looked for as quickly. It's
30:08
Speaker 1: not uncommon for serial killers, sexually motivated serial killers, to
30:13
Speaker 1: select women who are engaging in sex work, Johnston said.
30:17
Speaker 1: The expert explained the thought process behind the sexually motivated killer.
30:22
Speaker 1: It's more about domination and power and control, and I
30:26
Speaker 1: definitely think it is about a lot of things in
30:28
Speaker 1: addition to sex that sadism is being won. There's lots
30:33
Speaker 1: of ways to get sex, so it's never about sex
30:36
Speaker 1: per se, Johnston said, and it's always about power and control.
30:40
Speaker 1: That's what it's about with serial killers. Some of these
30:44
Speaker 1: guys don't even have sex. They don't get off on
30:48
Speaker 1: the sexual part. It's the domination and the killing. They'll
30:51
Speaker 1: go home and they'll pleasure themselves thinking about what happened,
30:55
Speaker 1: but they might not sexually assault their victim. And the
30:58
Speaker 1: whole psyche that goes into all of that is very fascinating.
31:03
Speaker 1: And if I had a chance to do it all
31:04
Speaker 1: over again, I'd go to school for that, for criminal
31:08
Speaker 1: psychology instead of political science. Because A, well, I don't
31:13
Speaker 1: ever use my political science degree. Hell, we hardly even
31:16
Speaker 1: talk about politics here on the podcast. And B... A
31:20
Speaker 1: criminal psychologist, that just sounds like a fun-ass job. Not
31:24
Speaker 1: only are you delving deep into the brains of these sickos,
31:28
Speaker 1: but you're doing good work, hopefully, to help keep people
31:32
Speaker 1: like this off the street. So if I could do
31:34
Speaker 1: it all over again, I'd probably go that route. It
31:38
Speaker 1: is unclear if the Gilgo killer engaged in sex with
31:42
Speaker 1: the victims before they were murdered, Johnston explained in a
31:45
Speaker 1: previous interview, that being sexually motivated does not always mean
31:50
Speaker 1: that the act of sex was involved. Balk and Bresciani
31:54
Speaker 1: were in their 20s when they were murdered, like the
31:56
Speaker 1: Gilgo Four. Rifkin was in his 30s during his killing spree.
32:01
Speaker 1: I think sexually motivated serial killers don't tend to pick women,
32:05
Speaker 1: for example, who are in their 70s and 80s, Johnston said.
32:10
Speaker 1: She explained, Most victims, well, female victims of serial killers,
32:14
Speaker 1: are young, as are most serial killers when they start.
32:19
Speaker 1: So I think that's another parallel. But most serial killers
32:22
Speaker 1: don't start out in their 40s and 50s, Johnston said.
32:26
Speaker 1: So they're looking for victims who are somewhat similar in
32:29
Speaker 1: age and therefore more attractive to them. And this is
32:32
Speaker 1: something we talk about a lot, how serial killers just
32:35
Speaker 1: don't start in their 30s or 40s. This is an
32:38
Speaker 1: early 20s thing, mid-20s thing, and they carry it on
32:42
Speaker 1: and carry it with them for the rest of their lives.
32:45
Speaker 1: One thing that Johnston found odd was Huerman's age. If
32:49
Speaker 1: he is the true killer, he would have been in
32:51
Speaker 1: his 40s when he committed the murders. That's very difficult
32:54
Speaker 1: to believe that he started that late, Johnston said. Whether
32:58
Speaker 1: there are more bodies that are linked to Heuermann is
33:01
Speaker 1: unknown at this time. There are six other victims that
33:04
Speaker 1: were found along the South Shore beaches of Long Island
33:07
Speaker 1: in the past decade, or so whose killer has yet
33:11
Speaker 1: to be identified. So look, we don't know for sure
33:15
Speaker 1: one way or the other, but as I've said multiple times,
33:18
Speaker 1: for me, there's no doubt. that Rex Ewerman is responsible
33:22
Speaker 1: for all, or at the very least, the majority of
33:26
Speaker 1: those bodies that were found near Gilgo Beach. And as
33:29
Speaker 1: far as the comparison to Rifkin, I think it's a
33:32
Speaker 1: pretty good comparison as far as their psyche and as
33:35
Speaker 1: far as what they were up to. And it just
33:37
Speaker 1: gives people another example of how these scumbags target the
33:41
Speaker 1: most vulnerable amongst us. And that's why these scumbags, once
33:45
Speaker 1: they're found guilty, shouldn't sit on death row. They should
33:48
Speaker 1: be introduced to the volcano. All right, folks, that's going
33:52
Speaker 1: to do it for this one. All of the information
33:54
Speaker 1: that goes with this episode can be found in the
33:57
Speaker 1: description box. And welcome back to the program. On this episode,
34:02
Speaker 1: we're going to hear from the man who caught the
34:06
Speaker 1: Golden State Killer and the same man Well, he says
34:11
Speaker 1: that right now in the United States, there's over 2,000
34:15
Speaker 1: serial killers that are active. Sounds pretty terrifying, yeah? Well,
34:22
Speaker 1: let's dive into the article and let's see what Mr.
34:25
Speaker 1: Paul Holes has found for us. Headline, 2,000 serial killers
34:31
Speaker 1: in the U.S. says the man who caught the Golden
34:34
Speaker 1: State serial killer. This article was published last On April 30th, 2022.
34:41
Speaker 1: The author here for this New York Post article is
34:45
Speaker 1: Brad Hamilton. About 2,000 serial killers are on the loose
34:51
Speaker 1: hunting for fresh victims all across the country. So that's
34:55
Speaker 1: the first line. Pretty terrifying when you think about it.
34:58
Speaker 1: But what? There's what? 350 million people in the country?
35:01
Speaker 1: Probably a little bit more. So if you do the math,
35:05
Speaker 1: it kind of seems accurate. But... We don't see the
35:09
Speaker 1: kind of serial killings per se that you saw in
35:12
Speaker 1: the 80s or the 90s even. And I guess a
35:16
Speaker 1: lot of that has to do with the technology. Or
35:19
Speaker 1: maybe these serial killers have just become smarter. That's the
35:24
Speaker 1: word from California cold case ace Paul Holes, who nailed
35:28
Speaker 1: notorious Golden State killer Joseph James DeAngelo in 2016 after
35:32
Speaker 1: a 40-year manhunt. And that dude was a sicko. The
35:38
Speaker 1: Golden State Killer? Rapist. Molester. Murderer. Ex-cop. Dude would crawl
35:44
Speaker 1: in windows and just bad news. A whole bad scene.
35:48
Speaker 1: Had an absolute panic gripping California while he was out
35:52
Speaker 1: there raping and murdering. He believes many more like him
35:57
Speaker 1: are still out there. I've seen the statistics. That's some 2,000
36:02
Speaker 1: serial killers are operating in the United States today, writes
36:06
Speaker 1: the acclaimed criminalist and unmasked My Life Solving America's Cold Cases,
36:11
Speaker 1: out now, in which he chronicles his career-long pursuit of D'Angelo.
36:16
Speaker 1: All right, so I'm going to have to get this book.
36:18
Speaker 1: In fact, as soon as I'm done today here, I'm
36:20
Speaker 1: going to get this book on Audible and give it
36:24
Speaker 1: a listen. It's a rough estimate for sure, but it's
36:28
Speaker 1: absolutely a realistic figure, Holes told the Post. He said
36:32
Speaker 1: murderers go after the marginalized, particularly prostitutes, drug addicts, and
36:38
Speaker 1: the homeless. Relatively easy marks as they tend to lose
36:42
Speaker 1: touch with family and friends and might have a history
36:45
Speaker 1: of disappearing for extended periods of time. It's always the
36:49
Speaker 1: people on the margins. It's always the people who are
36:53
Speaker 1: the most vulnerable. And we've seen it with serial killer
36:56
Speaker 1: after serial killer. And I'm sure we'll see it in
37:00
Speaker 1: the future. And that's one thing that scares me as well.
37:04
Speaker 1: How many of these serial killers are active in cities
37:07
Speaker 1: we live in or surrounding cities? And when girls go
37:10
Speaker 1: missing or girls turn up dead or whatever, they're not
37:14
Speaker 1: connected because they're people in the margins and You know,
37:18
Speaker 1: law enforcement doesn't want there to be a serial killer
37:21
Speaker 1: or crimes that are connected. That's a drain on resources.
37:24
Speaker 1: It makes people scared. And especially in a place like
37:28
Speaker 1: where I live in Las Vegas, that's the last thing
37:31
Speaker 1: the police want to talk about. But we have all
37:33
Speaker 1: kinds of odd strange-ities that happen here in Southern Nevada.
37:38
Speaker 1: And I've been saying for a long-ass time that I
37:40
Speaker 1: truly believe that there's a psychopath or multiple on the
37:44
Speaker 1: loose between here... Southern California, Southern Utah, and parts of Arizona.
37:51
Speaker 1: Just take a look in the NamUs database at all
37:54
Speaker 1: of the women that are missing and or haven't been
37:59
Speaker 1: identified who have been murdered. Often these predators are preying
38:06
Speaker 1: on people whose lives have spiraled down. So when they
38:09
Speaker 1: go missing, no one is really paying attention, he said.
38:12
Speaker 1: killers are hiding behind the opioid crisis. Now, that's a
38:16
Speaker 1: new one for me. I never even thought about that,
38:19
Speaker 1: but man, it's definitely true. How many of these victims
38:24
Speaker 1: are people that are effed up on drugs, people who
38:27
Speaker 1: are living their lives in an opioid-induced haze? And how
38:32
Speaker 1: much easier is it for a serial killer to snatch
38:37
Speaker 1: somebody like that, murder somebody like that, and have nobody
38:40
Speaker 1: else know what's going on? Widespread use of heroin, oxycodone,
38:47
Speaker 1: and fentanyl provides serial slayers with a smokescreen, Hull said,
38:51
Speaker 1: allowing them to choke or suffocate victims with less violence
38:55
Speaker 1: than would be needed to kill the fully conscious, and
38:58
Speaker 1: to fool investigators who wrongly assume that drugs are to blame.
39:03
Speaker 1: If the manner of killing is a softer manual strangulation,
39:06
Speaker 1: where the victim is intoxicated and barely conscious, it doesn't
39:10
Speaker 1: take much to kill them, he told the Post. Now,
39:12
Speaker 1: this is a pretty far out analysis and tell you what,
39:15
Speaker 1: I never even thought about it. And this is the
39:18
Speaker 1: first time I'm reading the article right now while I'm
39:21
Speaker 1: reading it with you folks. So it's a pretty interesting
39:28
Speaker 1: analysis and hypothesis. that this gentleman has. And again, look,
39:32
Speaker 1: this is somebody who was responsible for catching the Golden
39:36
Speaker 1: State serial killer. So it's not just some Yahoo yapping
39:40
Speaker 1: on web sleuths or Reddit or something. pathologists can write
39:44
Speaker 1: off these cases too fast. This is an OD. They're
39:47
Speaker 1: not paying attention to a small bruise around the neck,
39:50
Speaker 1: especially if the investigator is saying, let's kiss this off
39:54
Speaker 1: and get back to the bona fide homicides. And I'm
39:57
Speaker 1: sure that plays a gigantic part of it. And I'm
40:00
Speaker 1: not trying to be too critical of the homicide divisions
40:04
Speaker 1: who handle these cases because their workload is just overwhelming
40:08
Speaker 1: at this point. And it's easy to write stuff off
40:11
Speaker 1: like this as the marginalized, as people who live a
40:15
Speaker 1: risky lifestyle, and this is the expected outcome. Holes pointed
40:22
Speaker 1: to the example of Samuel Little, who confessed to murdering
40:25
Speaker 1: 93 women between 1970 and 2012, making him the most
40:30
Speaker 1: prolific serial killer in U.S. history. Some he killed were
40:34
Speaker 1: sex workers and drug users. He would strangle his victims
40:39
Speaker 1: and command them to swallow, he said. You could see
40:41
Speaker 1: he's doing this enough times to where they are unconscious
40:45
Speaker 1: and the amount of physical evidence is very subtle. It
40:48
Speaker 1: makes it difficult for the experts to determine exactly what happened.
40:54
Speaker 1: I never even thought, I never even... It never registered
40:57
Speaker 1: to me that something like that could be a way
41:00
Speaker 1: that people are masking these murders. And to digress a
41:05
Speaker 1: little bit, what about the people who just end up missing?
41:08
Speaker 1: There are serial killers out there that are so, say,
41:11
Speaker 1: sophisticated with the way they conduct their business, conduct themselves,
41:15
Speaker 1: that they don't even have the bodies turn up. A
41:20
Speaker 1: good number of serial killers are believed to be truckers,
41:23
Speaker 1: like the Happy Face Killer, Keith Jesperson, long-haul drivers who
41:27
Speaker 1: target prostitutes and take advantage of being on the road
41:31
Speaker 1: for weeks at a time to hide their crimes. There's
41:34
Speaker 1: no doubt that long-haul truckers are huge when it comes
41:41
Speaker 1: to suspects in serial killings. In the Great Basin series
41:45
Speaker 1: that we have going, the first three episodes, it's probably
41:49
Speaker 1: likely that at least one of those overlapping serial killers
41:54
Speaker 1: that was active during that period was a long-haul trucker.
41:59
Speaker 1: And it's certainly... possible and likely that there are many,
42:05
Speaker 1: many long-haul truckers active right now. And the FBI agrees,
42:10
Speaker 1: considering they set up the initiative in 2009 about the
42:14
Speaker 1: highway serial killings. They can work a circuit, Hull said.
42:20
Speaker 1: Picking up sex workers is something that has been seen
42:23
Speaker 1: over and over again. Hey, you need a ride? And
42:26
Speaker 1: the victim gets in their vehicle and they're done. And
42:29
Speaker 1: we saw that with Tanya Teske. That's exactly what happened
42:33
Speaker 1: to her. And it's, you know, well guessed, I should
42:39
Speaker 1: say at this point, that she was a victim of
42:41
Speaker 1: the Great Basin serial killer. So these long haul truckers
42:47
Speaker 1: I have a whole different viewpoint when I'm driving, like,
42:50
Speaker 1: to California from Nevada. The publication of the FBI's Highway
42:53
Speaker 1: Serial Killings Initiative in 2009 underscores the pervasiveness of truck-driving predators,
43:00
Speaker 1: he said. It's a huge aspect. And you can take
43:03
Speaker 1: a look at the map. They have a map out
43:05
Speaker 1: where there's, like, pinholes of all of the suspected serial
43:09
Speaker 1: slayings along the highway system in the United States. Years ago,
43:16
Speaker 1: killers like D'Angelo, a terrifying menace who raped 13 and
43:19
Speaker 1: killed 50 and sometimes taunted his victims afterwards, didn't have
43:23
Speaker 1: to worry as much about disguising their whereabouts. Back in
43:28
Speaker 1: the day. you'd find them working in any type of community,
43:32
Speaker 1: though not necessarily living there. In the distribution of crimes,
43:35
Speaker 1: you might see a void area, so maybe that's where
43:38
Speaker 1: he lives, said Holes. In the 70s, you had serial
43:42
Speaker 1: killers entering houses or picking up hitchhikers. It was very
43:46
Speaker 1: obvious that something had occurred. But as society adjusted to
43:50
Speaker 1: public security threats, surveillance systems, for example, the Predator tries
43:54
Speaker 1: to minimize the risks to himself. They're using technology to
43:58
Speaker 1: lure and isolate victims through things like online sex work.
44:02
Speaker 1: They're no longer standing around in playgrounds, and we've touched
44:07
Speaker 1: on that before. And the Atlantic City killings, the serial
44:13
Speaker 1: killings in Atlantic City and the ones in Gilgo Beach,
44:16
Speaker 1: it's another reason why I believe and believe strongly that
44:19
Speaker 1: they're connected. The overlap in those murders is just, there's
44:25
Speaker 1: just too much coincidence. DeAngelo pounced on his victims while
44:31
Speaker 1: they slept in their homes, shining a flashlight in their
44:34
Speaker 1: faces so they couldn't see him. He wore gloves, tied
44:38
Speaker 1: up and blindfolded his targets, typically couples, and carefully mapped
44:42
Speaker 1: out escape routes. And that, my friends, is why you
44:45
Speaker 1: must have a gun in your home. Shotgun, whatever it is.
44:48
Speaker 1: Somebody like this comes creeping in, They hear that shell
44:52
Speaker 1: rack inside that gun and it's a rat. He went
44:55
Speaker 1: four decades before identified by holes as a suspect in
44:59
Speaker 1: a rape and killing spree that began in 1974. The
45:03
Speaker 1: crime fighter discovered him using advanced DNA mapping and a
45:07
Speaker 1: genealogy researcher. And that's how it happens, right? Sometimes you'll
45:12
Speaker 1: get an investigator like Mr. Holes here who won't take
45:15
Speaker 1: no for an answer and literally makes it their life's
45:19
Speaker 1: work to catch people like this. And when the technology
45:23
Speaker 1: starts catching up, a lot of times people will get
45:25
Speaker 1: a break in the case. Two recent cases have captured
45:30
Speaker 1: his attention, Holes said. The Delphi slayings in Indiana, that's
45:34
Speaker 1: a serial predator, somebody who needs to be caught. And
45:37
Speaker 1: the Gilgo Beach murders on Long Island, an ongoing mystery
45:40
Speaker 1: involving sex workers and others who were strangled and dumped
45:44
Speaker 1: near the ocean. I think most of those cases are related,
45:48
Speaker 1: said Holes, referring to Gilgo. He's 100% right. There's no
45:54
Speaker 1: doubt that it was one person using that place as
45:58
Speaker 1: a dumping ground. He said serial killers as a group
46:04
Speaker 1: often blend in, leading ordinary lives in seemingly safe communities.
46:09
Speaker 1: Most are not loners or outcasts, he writes. They can
46:12
Speaker 1: and do function as your friendly next-door neighbor. They know
46:15
Speaker 1: what they are doing is twisted, and they can stop
46:19
Speaker 1: for periods of time, but their urge to kill is
46:22
Speaker 1: stronger than the fear of getting caught. So when we're
46:27
Speaker 1: talking about these serial killings and we talk about some
46:31
Speaker 1: of these unsolved cases and specifically Atlantic City and Gilgo Beach,
46:38
Speaker 1: it's almost clear as day to me that they're connected.
46:44
Speaker 1: I know that investigators are not very quick to try
46:47
Speaker 1: and connect cases like that because they don't want to
46:50
Speaker 1: cause a panic But I also know that behind the
46:53
Speaker 1: scenes there's a lot of them that feel that there
46:56
Speaker 1: are connections All you have to do is read some
46:59
Speaker 1: of the anonymous reports some of the anonymous Posts that
47:04
Speaker 1: have been made by people involved in the cases now Obviously,
47:10
Speaker 1: on the flip side, you will find people that say
47:12
Speaker 1: there's no way that they're connected, like the person that
47:15
Speaker 1: we talked about in the article a while back when
47:19
Speaker 1: we were talking about the Atlantic City killings. But I
47:23
Speaker 1: think some of these folks are way too boxed in
47:26
Speaker 1: to the way they've been taught, meaning the M.O. has
47:30
Speaker 1: to be the same, the murder weapon has to be
47:32
Speaker 1: the same. The visual profile has to be the same.
47:35
Speaker 1: And for me, I think for some of these killers,
47:38
Speaker 1: they're like hybrids, right? For them, it's all about the
47:41
Speaker 1: killing and whatever opportunity arises, they're going to take it.
47:46
Speaker 1: But most of them are preying on the most vulnerable
47:50
Speaker 1: people on the fringes, drifters, women with drug problems, homeless women.
47:56
Speaker 1: You know, stuff like that. Because those are the people
47:59
Speaker 1: who are not going to be missed. And when we
48:02
Speaker 1: hear about 2,000 serial killers that are active right now
48:06
Speaker 1: in the United States, how many of those missing women
48:09
Speaker 1: that we hear reports about in each and every one
48:12
Speaker 1: of our cities is not really missing at all. And
48:16
Speaker 1: instead has fallen prey to some sick bastard. And the
48:20
Speaker 1: scariest part about that is we know that the authorities
48:24
Speaker 1: aren't all that interested in dedicating the resources that are
48:28
Speaker 1: necessary when we're talking about people on the margins. So
48:33
Speaker 1: it's an interesting investigation. It's an interesting avenue to take
48:40
Speaker 1: a walk down and take a look around and see
48:44
Speaker 1: just how prevalent these serial killings are. possibly are right
48:49
Speaker 1: now under our noses, and it's all being underreported. So,
48:54
Speaker 1: it's fascinating, 100% interesting, and I'm going to pick up
48:58
Speaker 1: this book as soon as I'm done here, because I'd
49:01
Speaker 1: like to see what Paul Holes has to say about
49:04
Speaker 1: all of this stuff. And remember, the book is called
49:07
Speaker 1: My Life, Solving America's Cold Cases by Paul Holes, and
49:13
Speaker 1: it's out now. So, If you find that interesting, certainly
49:17
Speaker 1: a book you might want to grab. All right, folks.
49:20
Speaker 1: that's going to do it for this episode. I'll be
49:22
Speaker 1: back later on with a little bit more. But until then,
49:25
Speaker 1: I hope that all of you are having a fantastic weekend.
49:28
Speaker 1: If you'd like to contact me, you can do that
49:30
Speaker 1: at bobbycapucci at protonmail.com. That's B-O-B-B-Y-C-A-P-U-C-C-I at protonmail.com. You can
49:40
Speaker 1: also find me on Twitter at B-O-B-B-Y underscore C-A-P-U-C-C-I. The
49:47
Speaker 1: link that we discussed can be found in the description box.