Latest / Voices for Voices® / The Deadliest Drug Crisis in History | Episode 118

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The Deadliest Drug Crisis in History | Episode 118 · Voices for Voices®

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Voices for Voices TV show and podcast.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: I'm your host, justin Allen Hayes, founder and executive director of Voices for Voices.
• 0:10
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• 0:39
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• 4:42
  Speaker 1: So we're on episode two for our guests now in studio from the Summit County Public Health Department.
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: We interviewed both of these guests last year.
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: I had great feedback on the content that was provided, the awareness that was provided in the programs that are being instituted and then the growth of that.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: So we thought we'd bring them back for 2024 for a new episode, which now we have new episodes plural, since we're covering so much great information.
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: So in studio from the Summit County Public Health Department we have David McCartney and Megan Scott.
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: Thank you for coming back.
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: So for those viewers and listeners and the tune in for our first of this two part series, we were closing out that episode talking about poly substances and how, which means, just for the common person, more than one substance put together, whether knowingly or unknowingly.
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: So maybe we could pick up the conversation there.
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: Absolutely so.
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: Just to give a little context, a poly substance death is like you said, or a poly substance overdose is one where someone has more than one substance in their system.
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: So it could be a combination of really any of the substances that we look for.
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: So most people think like fentanyl, cocaine, methamphetamines, but we also look for alcohol and marijuana so that we can really get an idea for what that person had in their body that caused their death.
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: One of the things that we have that David and I work on at Summit County Public Health is actually a overdose fatality review board.
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: So we look at those fatalities and we take data from them, kind of an aggregate, and look at what's happening in the community and try to see what's going on, what interventions can we help, what recommendations can we make based off this information?
• 6:55
  Speaker 3: And poly substance deaths is something that we've seen a big rise in Sure.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: And further that we also do individual case studies on us.
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: So we do have an aggregate report that comes out at the end of the year, in April, and but in collaboration with the EDM, the justice system, court systems.
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: Who else do we have on that board?
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: Several different partners that we get information on, like criminal justice, law enforcement, some treatment and recovery when it's available, and the medical examiner.
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: Yes, and so all that data is then compiled on individual case studies that we pull and so it is a multi-clarer effort to try to understand the bigger picture.
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: But again, that data only tells us what the data tells us, and so we've recently started to expand on the overdose fatality review board to do next-of-can interviews where we can then reach out to the family or the friends or whoever is next-of-can for that individual and try to pull together a lot more of that story and who that person was as a person and not just as a data point.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: So, like Megan had said, we have seen an increase in the number of polysubstance use deaths overall, but also in our review board we see that often times as well I mean 60% of all the overdose deaths last year did have polysubstance use, and so when we look at that, normally you think of overdosing.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: You would think of a lot all at once.
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: But that's not the case with all these substances.
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: You know, if we see somebody who has a prior medical history of cocaine substance use but then in their toxicology report there is cocaine but also a small amount of fentanyl, they're not expecting to have that fentanyl in there.
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: There's no tolerance, so understanding how the body reacts to different substances is important as well, and so, you know, it's not always like Megan had said at the end of the last episode, it's not always what they're getting, it's what they're expecting to get, and so, again, that's why we have the phenyl test strips, that's why we promote that for any substance and not just for what you normally typically expect to use, and so like.
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: That has been fun, but interesting to see how that trend has increased over the past couple years, what substances are being more affected and what type of individuals are using those substances.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: So we're seeing all sorts of shifts demographically, with different substances, with areas, and so it's just, you know, it's hard to pinpoint the exact.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: There's no magic wand to weigh it all the way and to fix it.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: You have to look at it as an individual, case by case basis, while also trying to reach the general population as a whole.
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I would think that that's a challenge for a lot of areas.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: But specifically trying to pinpoint exactly.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: And then you have the zip codes and there's a lot of things you're trying to cross-reference and say, oh well, if it's this and this and this, then we can troubleshoot and this will take care of a high percent, but that's not always the case.
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah and with.
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: Whenever you're working with people, there's always going to be unique factors.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: So we can look at the data and we can see, like, if we talk about the data that David shared last time, just looking at it you might think that white males were the only people who were really experiencing a problem, because overwhelmingly that is the proportion.
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: But when you look at it in the context of our actual population and the spread of different races and ethnicities, in age groups and genders and sex, then even though one population might look like they have a lower number of overdoses, in the context of the population as a whole there's a large rate of overdoses.
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: So that's why we look at things like targeting interventions to reach the black community, because even though when you look number to number, they might have less overdoses overall, it's affecting their population at a larger rate than it might affect another population.
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: So we have to look at all of that and then, with the case studies, we're able to really drill down and talk to people instead of just about the numbers.
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: Tell me what your loved one was like, tell me who they were, tell me what you think could have helped them and then incorporate that into the data that we have to see both sides of the picture.
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so maybe you can share.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: I see not specific conversations, but just at the aggregate.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: Maybe in general family members they feel good about sharing the story about their loved one, that somebody cares and somebody's at least asking that it's not just a number.
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it does that, but it also, I think it allows the family member to really get the real story out.
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: So, for example, we might look at someone's criminal history and get a certain image of what the stereotype of that person is.
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: But then we find out maybe while that person was incarcerated they got a college degree and, you know, learned new job skills and came out of that incarceration a completely different person.
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: That is two different stories.
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: If all you have is the data to show that there were poor choices in their life and not see what they did with it afterwards, it completely changes the narrative.
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: So the family members are able to give us that information so that we can really look at that person as a whole, and it also allows them the opportunity to get their story out and kind of remember their loved one in a way.
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: That's pretty unique.
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: But also on that note, it also allows us to have a little bit more of a gap filling into.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: So not necessarily like the context of the story in the person's life absolutely, but also where were the interventions that we could have expanded upon?
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: Where could we have done better?
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: What was missing from different subsections of their life that we could have?
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: that need something need that extra little boost need to be examined, need to have conversations with community partners as to what can be done, and so that's also a very important aspect of these conversations with the family, because the data tells us one thing, but that's not the full picture.
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: For example, maybe the person was offered treatment, and treatment was available to them, but they would have had to quit their job, which means they would have lost their income and the insurance that would have paid for the treatment.
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: So what we see when we look at the data is they never went to treatment, but the story is that there was a hurdle that they weren't able to come over.
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: So how can we work with our organizations in the community to help make sure that next time that that happens, that barrier isn't there for the next person?
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I can think of one area that our organization is looking at is the transportation issue potentially being a part of that.
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: They had employment opportunities or they had a chance to get help, but other than $3,000 or $5,000 ambulance ride to the hospital, they're like, ok, do we have insurance?
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: Don't we have insurance?
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: How are we going to pay for this?
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: Getting people not to feel so alone, specifically on the job front, or doctor visits or therapy visits, and like, ok, yeah, I can do the Zoom and the online.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: Maybe they don't have a phone, they don't have access to internet, unless they have a ride.
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so that's what the Overdose Fatality Review Board.
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: We get a decent amount of data and then the very new addition of the Next of Kin interviews and really talking to people who knew that person allows us to kind of see where those things lie.
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: So I talked to David and got his feedback about how the work he's doing makes him feel and how his career path was and to where he's at now.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: And that is core helping people where he sees himself as putting a lot of energy in a positive sense and hopefully taking some of the stress and so being able to identify.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: Ok, I like doing this, but this specific could cause me extra stress.
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: So how can I still be a part of this bigger picture and not have potentially the added stress?
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: For you, megan, how are you tied into your role and how did you get to where you're at?
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: And if somebody is watching or listening has an interest of how they can learn more about the type of work that you do.
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: I actually came in and I think I talked about this when I was here last year.
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: I came into public health as a licensed peer supporter, which means that I was someone who was in recovery that was able to use not only my life experience but a specific set of guidelines and trainings and education that's provided by the state to get licensed to help other people in their multiple different paths of recovery.
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: So I was able to use that experience to come in just kind of in a very isolated role to work in some of the opioid programings and once I got here, at the same time I was working on my master's in counseling.
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: So I'm also a mental health provider and I have my substance use counseling degree.
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: So it's very client level, very focused on working with people individually.
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: As I came into public health I realized that the things that are available for my clients are only available because there are organizations that have this data and are able to realize what gaps we have in the community and tie that to the best practices that organizations like the CDC and SAMHSA are able to do and really use evidence to provide the best possible situation for each person back down on that individual level.
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: So I still work on an individual level outside of public health, but it has really shown me how everything that we do is connected and how all the different systems that we have are connected, and that, admittedly, there's problems with some of them and there's some that don't communicate as well as they should.
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: So being able to be a part of the organization that takes the data and combines it with best practices to help people has been incredible.
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fantastic from a.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: What type of education or certifications did you have to go through?
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: So somebody's like, yeah, this sounds like something that's interesting to me.
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: What do I have to do?
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: I will always promote peer support.
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: So anyone who has lived experience with mental health disorder or mental health issue or substance use disorder or both can get licensed through OMOS, the State of Ohio Mental Health and Addiction Services Board, and that peer certification.
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: Like I said, it just gives some additional training on things like ethics and multiple pathways to recovery because abstinence is not everyone's story Different ways that you can work with people, using certain types of techniques like motivational interviewing and being able to guide people on their path in a professional way, but also combining lived experience.
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: So peer support certification is incredible For the job that I work.
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: Technically none of my certification was required, but I do maintain a CDCA, which is a Chemical Dependency Counseling Assistant License, and I'm also currently working towards my LPC, which is a licensed professional counselor.
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: So that kind of mental health training and education and knowledge and practice because I do have clients that I see allows me to take all those varied experiences and apply them in a way that's very different than the way David does.
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: As we saw, he's very numbers and data oriented and I can combine that with the behavioral health perspective and see where we can meet in the middle to make recommendations to people.
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: And I feel like that's why we work so great together as well.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: We have different approaches to how we come to it, but we still come to the same conclusion.
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: We still want the same things, we still are advocating and pushing for exactly the same thing from just different perspectives, and so it's kind of interesting.
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: It'll be like on We'll be communicating and we'll say the same exact thing at the same time, so we are a great team.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: We're pretty much the same person just the right side and the left side of the brain separately.
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's worked really well.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: And I think, yeah, there's that common thread of wanting to help others at the core and there's different ways you can do that.
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: So, if you want more of the applied and the project based versus numbers, that there's still a way that we're helping people, we still have that overarching goal that whatever we're working on is going to impact, and the fact that you're able to share not only the data but a little bit of the story I think is helpful as well.
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: I know for myself traditionally I'm an earlier my career having the numbers was like the best thing, but then as things evolved, it was okay.
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: How do we take the numbers and have actionable and transfer that?
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: And to see you be able to do that, david, is awesome.
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: That you're taking not just the numbers but making some inferences and recommendations, and that you're working so closely that you're able to bounce ideas off and still have that overarching goal.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: yeah absolutely okay, so we are.
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: We have a couple more minutes left.
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: How can I can viewers, listeners, learn more about the Summit County Public Health organization itself, the different programs, how they can, if?
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: There's volunteer opportunities or when the programs are going to be occurring, if there's a calendar just how to, of how to find that information yeah, that's a great question.
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: Our harm reduction program, summit Safe, meets on Mondays, wednesdays and Fridays.
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: So Monday and Wednesday it is at the Arlington WIC location, which you can find the address for on our website, and then on Fridays it's at our main location, our main Summit County Public Health location, and that's where people can get in our can and harm reduction supplies, meet with a peer supporter and get referred to services like housing or food services if they need them.
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: That's the major like client-facing program that we have in our harm reduction department.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: But on our website, scph, summit County Public Health, scphorg we list all of our different programs and information about project on, but also our WIC programs and our dental clinics and everything else that we have there to help the community great, yeah, I, and I think that's one thing that I've I've noticed is that the the public health department, there's not just one thing that happens once a year, that there's ongoing programs that are happening, so they hear that.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: I think it can be helpful to individuals like I can't wait tomorrow, sure I might not be here like they have that, that attitude of being in the depths of despair and you know, oh my gosh, instead of that it's like okay, well, what day is it?
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's Wednesday.
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: I get a ride, or it to be able to, and the lock zone, I will also say, is available for free online.
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: It can be mailed directly to someone's home on our website.
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: You just fill out a little form so that we have your address and we can send it to anyone.
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: And so we find we have a lot of people who maybe aren't ready to talk to someone person to person or family members who know that they have a loved one who is actively using a substance or on pain management.
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: They can get it for free without speaking to anybody, on the website and also, on that note, making the vending machines you can also access naloxone through that.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: Technically we would want you to register so we can just have some demographics.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: But you can still access naloxone without registration at both of the machines, one outside of CHC in East Akron and then one outside of one in the barber ten million simple building and so if you just type in four, zero yes, four zero machine, you'll be able to access naloxone and get it for free there as well and both machines have the instructions written out.
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: It's a very simple and, yeah, it's available 24-7.
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: So and that's I.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: I think that's I mean it's very, very helpful and I think I'm noticing that a little bit of a growth in.
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: You know, last year there might not have been those, those vending machines, and so that that growth of okay, this is an issue we need to continue, investing dollars and grants and the donations to, to use errors and to see that kind of kind of growth of okay.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: We have this product that can help, but you can't get it everywhere, and now it's a little bit more widespread and now it's in vending machines and I think that also it can be helpful.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: Of.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: I don't want to log on the website, I don't want to talk to somebody, but I can go to a vending machine and and gather.
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: That is, I think, a great, great, great thing To take.
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: Just the last, I guess, kind of thought that it was coming to mind.
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: I was in Las Vegas for a conference a couple years ago and I was right in front of the Bellagio, just walking down, walking down the street, and there was a person that had just overdose and so she was laying on the pavement on the sidewalk and there was a group of people and saying help, help, and then hear the sirens and you don't think whatever about Vegas.
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: But my reason for bringing that up is this isn't just a Summit County problem.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: This isn't something that was born in Summit County.
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: This is a wider problem and that's how things kind of got to the local level as it started as maybe like the big cities potentially, and then it started to seep in to really everywhere and so that's really we're taking maybe like a reactive situation and now we're turning into more of a proactive of okay, we got the data, we're gonna continue to report that and we're gonna continue to look at the best ways we can intervene if possible, if somebody wants to.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: That intervention that's another story.
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: But are there other touch points where we can reach out to others that may be experiencing the same things, and then to have the ongoing projects and the syringe exchange program and all the harm reduction.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: To know those are even available is great for community members.
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: And it's a great place for people to come to just feel safe in their own dignity, in their own respect.
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: Our staff is incredible.
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: Like I said, it's a peer supporter mostly that manages that, and so we found that just allowing people a few minutes with someone who can talk to them like they're a person and they don't have that stigma placed upon them keeps bringing people back, and the more that we see them, the happier we see that they start to become with themselves and hopefully it makes some behavioral changes to keep themselves safe.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: Keep them safe.
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: And yeah great, is there anything we haven't covered?
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: Any information, websites, socials we wanna share to make sure that we I think that's really it.
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: We do have Summit County Public Health does have Facebook and, I think, in LinkedIn account, and so we share a lot of our programming across the department completely, not just harm reduction.
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: Anytime we have awareness campaigns and things like that, they can be seen there as well.
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: Right, david.
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: Just from the data aspect, we do have dashboards online as well, you can see numbers one.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we can also request data.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: I can't guarantee that we'll be able to provide it all the time, depending on what you want.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: But sorry to our Epi department, but we do have a form you can request data through as well, and so that's one other aspect of the situation.
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, a big part of what we do is making sure the community is aware.
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: So anytime someone has a question like that or we do our best to provide factual, evidence-based information.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: Megan Scott.
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: David McCartney, thank you for joining us.
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: Thank you for coming back for a second episode, Thank you for the work that you're doing and we look forward to having future episodes in 2025, if not, maybe sooner.
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: Thank you for having us.
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: Absolutely, and thanks to you, our viewers, our listeners, checking out, maybe, our transcript across any platform YouTube, vimeo, audio platforms you can find us.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: Share this episode and other episodes of the Voices for Voices TV show and podcast.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: I am your host, justin Allen Hayes, founder and executive director at Voices for Voices, and until next time, be a voice for you or somebody in need.
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: Good luck.