Latest / SOTA Personal Training Podcast / Should You Do Cardio on Non-Lifting Days?

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Should You Do Cardio on Non-Lifting Days? · SOTA Personal Training Podcast

• 0:01
  Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the SODA Personal Training
• 0:05
  Podcast. We help busy adults get strong
• 0:07
  and fit and stay that way for a really long time.
• 0:09
  I'm coach Sean here with coach Phil.
• 0:11
  How we doing, Phil? I'm good.
• 0:13
  You're never gonna be able to do that intro again, ever, are you?
• 0:15
  If we ever make a tweet why, it's gonna throw you off.
• 0:17
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's, it's the intro, it's
• 0:19
  the way it is now, part of your. DNA, we can't change it exactly,
• 0:23
  no. Today, cardio Should you do
• 0:25
  cardio on non lifting days? I have a lot of clients asking
• 0:30
  me this, Phil OK. And it's actually going to get a
• 0:31
  little bit like controversial, dare I say.
• 0:34
  But to start, I want you to give me the yes or no answer.
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  Yes or no. Should you do cardio on non
• 0:40
  lifting days? Yes.
• 0:43
  OK, good. All right, Maybe good.
• 0:44
  I don't know. OK.
• 0:45
  Yes, sort of cause depends. Because as you guys know,
• 0:49
  there's there's, there's nothing in fitness that says it depends
• 0:52
  or it depends on your goal or there's some nuance to it that.
• 0:54
  'D be weird. If it's yes or no.
• 0:56
  Right on you. Yeah, it's yes or no.
• 0:59
  OK, So Phil said yes, so do it. OK.
• 1:01
  All right, All right, joking aside, OK, we're going to talk
• 1:04
  through all of the nuances of whether or not you should do
• 1:06
  cardio on days where you don't lift weights, because obviously
• 1:10
  you do lift weights, right? Of course you lift.
• 1:12
  Weights. They're listening to this They.
• 1:13
  Got to be they got to be the thing weights, right?
• 1:15
  You lift weights, OK, should you be doing cardio?
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  The nuances of it? What type of cardio should you
• 1:19
  do? How much should you do?
• 1:20
  The whole 9 yards here. OK, so that's going to be the
• 1:22
  goal in this episode. We're going to talk about, you
• 1:25
  know, for general health, for for building muscle, for burning
• 1:28
  body fat. If you have other specific
• 1:30
  fitness goals, you know, like I said, how many minutes of it per
• 1:33
  week should you do, you know, for X set goal, whatever.
• 1:37
  And then actually what I'm going to do too.
• 1:39
  I want you guys to have this in your head.
• 1:40
  OK? Could could actually think about
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  this. Phil, for me personally, because
• 1:45
  I'm not going to reveal the you do cardio.
• 1:47
  Well, yeah, yeah, yeah. Or do I?
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  OK, we'll come back to the answer at the end.
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  But how much? How many days a week do you
• 1:54
  think I do cardio? I don't think you do any.
• 1:57
  Well. Let's define cardio.
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  I know you walk a ton. And as far as as far as what it
• 2:02
  looks like, I think you're getting everything you need out
• 2:04
  of that except for maybe some zone 5, maybe a little Zone 5.
• 2:09
  The answer shall be revealed later in the podcast, so stick
• 2:11
  around for that. I want I want to start this off,
• 2:13
  though, with an an anecdote about a client.
• 2:16
  And for those of you keeping score, this is actually client A
• 2:19
  from the previous episode. Yeah, Yeah.
• 2:21
  Where we talked about the clients who are having really
• 2:23
  good success right now. OK, so this client, she's funny
• 2:27
  the other day. And once again, I'm keeping her
• 2:28
  anonymous, OK. But she'll know who she is if
• 2:30
  she listens. So she's like, she admitted
• 2:34
  she's like, yeah, I've been kind of like lazy to start the year.
• 2:37
  Like she's still been coming in for her workouts.
• 2:39
  But she's like, yeah, I didn't really like change my diet.
• 2:41
  And anyway, and like I've been just kind of lazy when I've been
• 2:44
  outside of here, whatever. And now she's telling me she's
• 2:47
  like, I need you to put together a full on full week plan like
• 2:52
  what I'm supposed to do everyday because she's in here two or
• 2:56
  three days. A.
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  Week. That's funny.
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  She calls herself lazy because she's doing like way above like
• 3:01
  the bare minimum. But I get what she's saying.
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  She's a high achiever. So that makes sense.
• 3:05
  Exactly. So then she tells me she's like,
• 3:07
  you need to lay out a full plan for me.
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  It wasn't in that, like, language.
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  She's like, hey, could you help me?
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  I want like a full on plan seven days a week.
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  She wants to exercise seven days a week because she's, you know,
• 3:16
  yeah, she gets the the mental and physical benefit from it.
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  So she told me, you know, lay out a full plan of what I'm
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  supposed to do each day and she's going to be here probably
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  3 days lifting weights, right? But then what are we doing on
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  the other four days? You know, how much cardio?
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  Is it cardio? Is it yoga?
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  Is it other stuff? Is it, you know, you name your
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  other fitness thing, right? And so, you know, with her it's,
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  and it's funny because we didn't, I don't even really know
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  where we left off with it right now.
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  But like I gave her this plan and then the first, the first
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  question that she asks in response is no more cardio than
• 3:49
  that, like just that much cardio, right?
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  And it's interesting to see because her specific goal, not
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  that this is going to be everybody's specific goal, but
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  the specific goal we're working out with her is we want to just
• 4:00
  continue to to recomp a little bit, right?
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  We want to gain 3 to 4 lbs of muscle mass and just burn a
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  little more body fat, right? OK.
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  So like in her specific case, well, like I recommended 2 days
• 4:13
  of cardio per week basically, right?
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  You know, kind of like 3 lifting days, two days cardio, 2 days
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  mobility, yoga ish stuff, right? But like I say, this is an
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  example because a lot of people always, they always assume that
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  more cardio is the right answer for everything, especially if
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  they're trying to like lose weight or something like that,
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  right? Which it's, you know, spoiler
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  alert, cardio I think is very good for your health.
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  Like in general, the more the better probably, but in terms of
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  body composition, like weight loss, this is where it gets a
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  little more nuanced. It's in the equation, but if you
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  look at like a, a, a foundational pyramid of what you
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  should be doing, strength should come first.
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  So if you have only three hours a week to exercise, most of that
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  should be done strength training.
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  And then they kind of goes up from there as far as like a fat
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  loss pyramid, right? Strength training should come in
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  before cardio. I think I'd hope most trainers
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  would agree but the reason people get caught up in cardio
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  is they're like but look at the calorie burn and I'm so sweaty
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  it must have been a good workout.
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  I feel destroyed and that is a bit of a fallacy.
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  Yes, yeah, yeah. And, and one thing, I've said
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  this before, I'll say it again. You know, if someone, if someone
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  right now says, OK, I want to lose weight, I want to burn body
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  fat, I can get you to burn body fat with no cardio whatsoever. 0
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  cardio, right? It may might just be 3 days of
• 5:33
  weightlifting per week and the proper type of diet, right?
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  That's not to say that we should never do it if we're trying to
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  lose weight, but I can definitely get you there without
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  doing any cardio whatsoever. And because cardio, like we're
• 5:47
  going to go into more of the nuance, but like I, I look at
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  cardio as more of a thing that's good for your health.
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  For one, it's good for your heart health, right?
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  It's good for your just endurance overall, right?
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  Your ability to perform certain activities, right.
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  It's a little bit more of not a non factor, but just like not
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  one of the main factors when it comes to body composition, you
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  know, like burning body fat and obviously building muscle,
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  whatever. Does that.
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  Does that make sense? Does it make sense?
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  Absolutely. Well, I think we should define
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  what cardio is because people might think about that a million
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  different ways. It's like, am I breathing kind
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  of heavy? Am I sprinting?
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  Like they all have different definitions for that.
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  And that's why the whole question of is should I do it
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  is, well, it depends. Like what are you doing?
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  Because what you don't want to do is do five days a week of
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  like hit style intervals where you are gassing yourself every
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  single day. There's a lot of studios that
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  that do that proper like interval training at like 10 out
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  of 10 intensity should be done in like 4 minutes and then
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  you're done. And this is the science all
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  backs us up. And so if it's very, very high
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  intensity, it should be very short duration and then you
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  should be done for the day. You know, if you're talking
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  about walking on the other end of that scale, well, then yes,
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  you can and should do that for longer periods of time because
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  the calorie burns are going to be way less.
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  But the wear and tear and the effect it has in your hormones,
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  specifically cortisol and, and other things that regulate your
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  appetite don't get out of whack. And that's what happens.
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  People go to the, the studio with all the bright orange
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  lights in the ceiling and they're just doing sprints and
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  all outs and they're like, I'm gaining weight, like what's
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  going on? And they might even lose muscle
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  and it's because they their appetite is through the roof and
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  it's just too much wear and tear on like a 40 plus year old body
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  in a lot of cases. So they're a lot of people are
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  scratching their head because they're like, put cardio burn so
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  many calories. A lot more to it than that as
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  far as behavior goes. So coincides with right.
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  What you're saying is you don't need to do any of that.
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  In a lot of cases, you're better off walking.
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  The barrier is time for a lot of people.
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  Or a perceived barrier. And, and yes, and because what
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  you just said, you know, cardio burns calories, that's a true
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  statement like that. That's a fact.
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  You know, cardio burns calories, right?
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  It's then what you said, what are the downstream behaviors of
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  it? I'm, I'm not going to speak a
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  ton about the hormonal changes in the cortisol and stuff like
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  that, because it's a way above my pay grade.
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  But like the, you know, what we talked about a lot of times is,
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  you know, you OK, you burn 300 calories during a hard 3045
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  minute cardio session, but then you do less NEAT the rest of the
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  day. The non exercise activity
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  thermogenesis, because usually you do like you do a really hard
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  cardio session, right? Whether this is like, you know,
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  a hit class or just, you know, a Peloton, whatever.
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  Like usually after that the rest of the day you are like plopped
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  on your ass on the couch and you don't do very much like just you
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  know, other walking or other like just moving around in
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  activity, right? Then they say I need something
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  salty. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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  What? Was that bake of potato chips?
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  Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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  And so This is why I like, you know, at the beginning here, you
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  can you guys can kind of hear us making the case for like, don't
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  overdo cardio. If if, if body fat loss, if
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  burning body fat is your main goal.
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  You know, if training for a marathon, on the other hand, is
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  your main goal, run a freaking lot and learn to run a marathon.
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  Like do a lot of cardio. You know, if doing a sport that
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  involves a lot of cardio is part of your goal.
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  If you want to be a professional soccer player, which we don't
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  have a ton of clients who fall into that category, but then do
• 9:25
  a lot of cardio, play a lot of soccer, right, because that's
• 9:28
  what's going to get you better at that, right.
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  And then obviously, you know, for for your health in general,
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  you know, cardio is great. Once again, don't overdo it and
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  you don't want to overdo anything, right?
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  But but you know, for heart health, and this is where I want
• 9:43
  to bring in, you know, Doctor Peter Attia, right, because we
• 9:45
  have a lot of clients who who follow him and I think he's
• 9:48
  great. I think all of his stuff fitness
• 9:50
  related is, is really, really good.
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  And so he's one that out of all of these longevity experts and
• 9:56
  people that I follow, I would say he might be like the most,
• 10:00
  he might, he might do like the most recommend the most total
• 10:04
  activity throughout the week compared to all of these people,
• 10:07
  you know, like his protocols. I suggest sometimes I want to
• 10:10
  say up to like 2 hours a day, like at least an hour of
• 10:13
  exercise per day. It's pretty rigorous, Yeah.
• 10:15
  It's setting the bar really high.
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  But I like that because you fall slightly short of it.
• 10:20
  You're still in a very favorable zone for your for your house.
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  Like I, you know, I feel like he's recommending a total of
• 10:25
  like 10 to 12 hours of relatively challenging exercise
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  per week. And within that is at least
• 10:31
  several hours of, you know, the different cardio zones, you got
• 10:33
  at least a couple hours of zone 2, the lower zone cardio,
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  probably some interval stuff like like it's, it's, it's a lot
• 10:40
  overall that he's recommending for optimal longevity, which is
• 10:43
  probably good. You know, there's, there's
• 10:44
  probably value in that. I think I'll like communicate it
• 10:48
  in a little bit of a different way for our average client who
• 10:52
  you know who, who walks through the door, kind of the same thing
• 10:55
  I was talking about with client A, for example, like if if you
• 10:58
  want to try to get some exercise in every day, 30 to 45 minutes
• 11:02
  or up to an hour is really good. I would say, you know, even
• 11:07
  seven days a week and like 1 sample of what I'll give is what
• 11:11
  I told her. It's like, OK, do your strength
• 11:13
  training, your weight lifting for three days of the week.
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  Maybe it's Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Tuesday might be a
• 11:20
  cardio session, Thursday, maybe it's just like a yoga session,
• 11:24
  Saturday cardio again, Sunday yoga again, whatever, right?
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  Doing something every day. But you're not totally, totally
• 11:30
  overdoing it, you know? Like yoga you can do, especially
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  if it's more, you know, restorative yoga, you can do
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  that every day and a lot of cases, perfect world.
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  You should, but most people don't have the luxury of two
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  hours a day for working out. So I get it.
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  But you should be doing something active to move your
• 11:46
  body every day, even if it was a 30 minute walk on those days and
• 11:49
  not a run, you know, or something like that.
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  So cardio, if you think about the zones, zone 2 is still
• 11:55
  considered cardio and that's just a brisk walk.
• 11:57
  You're still able to walk and and talk comfortably, but that's
• 12:01
  still considered cardio, which I think is an important
• 12:04
  differentiator between what some people consider cardio, which is
• 12:07
  like, I'm running, I'm putting in my running shoes and I'm
• 12:10
  running and it's a workout. Cardio doesn't have to be like a
• 12:13
  huge thing. You can install that into your
• 12:16
  daily flow without it being too without interrupting too much,
• 12:20
  as long as you care enough to integrate it.
• 12:22
  Yes, yeah. And the best body fat burning
• 12:24
  behavior in general is just to be on your feet during the day,
• 12:27
  moving around, doing stuff. Yes, you know.
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  Which really ties into to metabolism in general.
• 12:32
  And something I wanted to hit home was the idea that people
• 12:35
  who want to do cardio to burn calories.
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  I get it, it's great. It's not, it's not that much
• 12:40
  more at face value than any other modality.
• 12:43
  But you know, if you put things into perspective like if you
• 12:47
  exercise, you know, say you do three days a week and you burn
• 12:51
  about 500 calories per hour of exercise, which is in some cases
• 12:55
  higher than what people do, maybe a little bit less.
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  If you do that three days a week, your single day average,
• 13:01
  if you divide it up, that's how we do a lot of our nutrition
• 13:04
  stuff is going to say look at your seven day like single day
• 13:08
  average, which is only a couple 100 calories from exercise.
• 13:11
  Really like if you divide it out, your non exercise activity
• 13:16
  thermogenesis, which is fidgeting, walking, gardening,
• 13:19
  whatever you call it. If you walk 3 miles a day, it's
• 13:22
  about 10,000 steps or so. That's probably going to be
• 13:24
  around like 3 to 350 calories per day.
• 13:27
  And that's The Walking portion. So we think about exercise for
• 13:31
  burning calories. It actually does in fact almost
• 13:33
  the least amount of any other part of your metabolism.
• 13:36
  So you still want to lift to get strong for that reason, but just
• 13:40
  to burn calories. I invite you to change your
• 13:43
  psychology on this and, and change the mentality around.
• 13:46
  They serve different purposes and they should both be into
• 13:49
  your your daily movement flow for slightly different but
• 13:53
  connected reasons. Yes, yes.
• 13:56
  And you know, just to back off what you just said is the the
• 14:00
  purpose of the purpose of most workouts that most people do
• 14:04
  here at soda, for example, shouldn't be calorie burn.
• 14:08
  It should be muscle building and preservation.
• 14:10
  For the most part, for the most part, there's some nuance there,
• 14:13
  but for the most part, here's another little tricky little
• 14:16
  thing that I'll add in just to just to keep the audience on
• 14:18
  their toes. Why not?
• 14:20
  Is a lot. A lot of times when you do a
• 14:21
  good strength training session, you're doing some cardio too.
• 14:26
  Like if you go out there with Coach Blake and he puts you
• 14:28
  through three rigorous sets of walking lunges down the length
• 14:30
  of the turf, I know your heart rate is pretty high.
• 14:33
  By the end of that, you're in like zone four or five.
• 14:36
  Yeah, by the end of that right, 20th lunch.
• 14:38
  Yes, yes, go do a set of 12 any type of squat.
• 14:42
  What are you laughing? At So it's just funny.
• 14:44
  You're like if you do it with Blake.
• 14:45
  If you do it with Blake, it's going to be harder.
• 14:46
  It's going to be really tough. If you do it with Rowan, it'll
• 14:48
  be more technically correct. If you do it with Blake, he'll
• 14:50
  just be screaming in your ear the whole time.
• 14:52
  Like, come on, come on, come on. Come on.
• 14:54
  Come on. Come on, my keeper going.
• 14:56
  And if you do it with me then I'll just give you a really
• 14:59
  really heavyweight and you might only get 3 steps with the weight
• 15:01
  and they'll be OK. Drop the weight down and then do
• 15:03
  body weight the. Rest.
• 15:04
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, Your hands will give
• 15:06
  out before your legs do. Then people think I'm joking,
• 15:08
  but I'm not. OK.
• 15:10
  Yep. Anyway, all that kind of joking
• 15:13
  aside, where are we going to go with this?
• 15:17
  No, I think you're. Right.
• 15:18
  It's just a matter of like, you don't have to think that hard
• 15:21
  about doing cardio. And everyone's like, I got to do
• 15:22
  cardio. So our question is always why?
• 15:24
  And then we can work from there. But if it's truly like, I want
• 15:27
  to run, I should run. It's like, why do you want to
• 15:29
  run? Like, I don't know if it's to
• 15:31
  get better at running, by all means, yeah, I think we should
• 15:34
  all be able to, like, hold the jog for a while just from a
• 15:37
  standpoint of functionality and survivability, right?
• 15:40
  You should be able to like, trot and get somewhere quickly, but
• 15:45
  you don't have to do it just for the sake of exercising because
• 15:48
  that just sounds so dry. People who love running are
• 15:51
  already running. If you're not running and you
• 15:53
  want to pretend like you want to run, that's fine.
• 15:55
  But like, why don't you do something else you like but go
• 15:57
  play pickleball or something? Like do something fun.
• 16:00
  Dude, pickleball kicks my ass. Way more yeah than running.
• 16:04
  Well, yeah. And it's great cardio.
• 16:05
  Like this is like if you like any sort of a sport, you know,
• 16:08
  pickleball, basketball, whatever the heck.
• 16:10
  Like there's lots of them that are really great cardio and you
• 16:12
  don't even think about it as a workout exactly, you know.
• 16:14
  That's why I was doing this, the Coed Soccer League thing, and
• 16:18
  hopefully I get invited back this summer because that's like
• 16:21
  I don't have to think about cardio at all.
• 16:23
  I don't think about for one second, even though I'm gassed.
• 16:25
  And it's one of the toughest things I do because I'm
• 16:28
  sprinting, because I like to Sprint.
• 16:31
  I don't want to hold a jog for 30 minutes, but yeah, I don't
• 16:35
  think you do either. You well, kind of we'll come
• 16:38
  back to that. By the way, I like to I hold on,
• 16:41
  hold on right, all right. By the way, you've seen Austin
• 16:43
  been running in here lately. Yes, he's been up by he's been
• 16:46
  on the treadmill. He's he's back to two a day
• 16:48
  workouts. Yeah.
• 16:49
  He's on it. Yeah.
• 16:50
  Yeah, he's on it, right? Now, for those of you listeners
• 16:52
  who don't know, so I've talked about the stronger than Austin
• 16:55
  program that I'm on recently. Everybody at this point, nobody
• 16:57
  who listens to this podcast doesn't know who Austin is.
• 16:59
  Everybody knows who Austin is at this point, right?
• 17:01
  But he's been he's been on that treadmill recently, you know,
• 17:04
  and he's, he's, he's doing like, I don't know, is it a couple
• 17:07
  miles, like, you know, just a little light jog during he have
• 17:11
  a lunch hour. So with his whoop strap, he had
• 17:13
  blood work sent in and they, they looked at his levels.
• 17:16
  And basically from that, from that panel, he had I think a
• 17:20
  nurse practitioner to look at and say, yeah, you could benefit
• 17:22
  from zone 2 to 3 cardio this amount of time.
• 17:25
  And so he's tracking his heart rate.
• 17:26
  I mean, he's, he's into the data, which is just fun, but
• 17:29
  he's, he's monitoring everything, even if.
• 17:32
  It's the data. He should.
• 17:33
  He should be less into the whiskey, but he's into the data.
• 17:35
  Too. Oh yeah, he's equally into both.
• 17:37
  Yeah, but he's honest about the whiskey.
• 17:39
  I like, I know, I like that when people do this.
• 17:41
  I just got, I got, I got to give you some shit, Austin.
• 17:43
  You know, I like that when people do this too.
• 17:44
  Like I want to be data-driven to hit my fitness and health goals.
• 17:47
  And then they go get plastered on the weekend, but they're
• 17:49
  like, I've got all the data. He's like put down the drink.
• 17:52
  Exactly. But he but he's still got the
• 17:55
  right head and shoulders like it was important enough, I think as
• 17:58
  he really enjoys his bourbon nights.
• 17:59
  He has friends. Oh yeah, no, he's like a part of
• 18:01
  his. Life.
• 18:02
  Yes. Yes.
• 18:03
  But but that part he can go hard and and everything else he's
• 18:06
  like he's very healthy. It's like the only real, I don't
• 18:10
  know, bad habit that he could remove.
• 18:14
  If he listens to this like not not to hate, you know, me and
• 18:17
  Austin would all all love and respect.
• 18:19
  You know, we love each other for many different reasons.
• 18:20
  Not to hate, but like I think that very healthy is maybe a
• 18:24
  strong word. Like that's very strong
• 18:27
  description. He gets like 5 hours of sleep at
• 18:29
  night. I'm not hate.
• 18:30
  He's a great guy. He does great like.
• 18:33
  I think about Austin in terms when I first met him like 8 1/2
• 18:36
  nine years ago. I keep comparing to like when
• 18:39
  he's on and off and all things considered, like he runs two
• 18:42
  shops. He's, you know, he's a parent,
• 18:44
  he's a husband. So it's like there's a lot going
• 18:46
  on and he's doing great and that and that, relatively speaking,
• 18:50
  everything else. So he's taking, he's trying,
• 18:52
  he's taking care of his health, you know, Yeah, more sleep, less
• 18:55
  plastered would would help, but. Possibly change the game, but.
• 18:59
  He does get enjoyment out of alcohol and out of doing those
• 19:02
  things. Awesome, bought us all pairs of
• 19:03
  shorts. Did you buy?
• 19:05
  Shorts, I didn't try them on yet.
• 19:07
  I gotta try. Mine.
• 19:08
  OK. They get rid of home and I'm
• 19:10
  like, she's like, what are those shorts?
• 19:12
  She's like, OK, why do you have shorts?
• 19:13
  It's like Austin bought us all shorts.
• 19:15
  OK. And then he realized how funny
• 19:16
  it kind of sounded cause Austin's such a nice guy that
• 19:19
  would like, I wasn't surprised he did it.
• 19:21
  He just does stuff like that. And she's like, Austin bought
• 19:24
  you guys all matching shorts. I was like, yes, yeah, yeah.
• 19:27
  She's like, why? I was like, 'cause he's a nice
• 19:29
  guy. Yeah, he'd say what?
• 19:31
  And so she was like shocked and questions.
• 19:32
  I'm like, I, I actually don't know why.
• 19:34
  He's just a really nice dude. Yeah, yeah.
• 19:36
  But anyway, there's my tangent for the day.
• 19:39
  But yeah, yeah, he's doing great.
• 19:40
  Smack talking about the podcast, Yeah, yeah, I didn't even try to
• 19:43
  mine yet. I got to try to get my legs so
• 19:45
  big and strong that they pop out of the shorts.
• 19:47
  He got me largest and you got to do some leg extensions for a
• 19:50
  bit. OK, all right.
• 19:51
  I want some XLS and I'm still going to just pop out of those.
• 19:53
  That's right. I'm going to be stronger than
• 19:55
  him by April. I know you are.
• 19:56
  I thought that was him walking in right now.
• 19:57
  It's Blake's. Hi, Blake.
• 20:01
  Anyway. OK.
• 20:03
  We covered, yeah, we covered a lot of kind of segue into to
• 20:06
  metabolism, I think. Are there any questions that
• 20:09
  you've kind of heard how much media about cardio and why they
• 20:12
  should do it? Or is it just like AI should do
• 20:14
  more, shouldn't I? Kind of, yeah.
• 20:15
  This is what I want to touch on is like, how many minutes per
• 20:18
  week or like how much should you do or when should you do it
• 20:20
  right? I mean, like, I think for a lot
• 20:23
  of people who work out here, like let's say, let's say it's
• 20:25
  not even all about body composition.
• 20:27
  I talk about body composition all the time because I'm kind of
• 20:29
  a, you know, meat head, body. Your favorite way.
• 20:32
  Yeah. It's recomp is my favorite.
• 20:34
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 20:35
  It's not even a word. Recomp, burn body fat, build
• 20:37
  muscle at the same time. OK.
• 20:39
  It's a recomp favorite word in the English Dictionary that is
• 20:42
  not in the English Dictionary. OK, so but we're talking about
• 20:45
  like health in general. Let's say you know, your client
• 20:47
  here and who, you know, you're not necessarily about the
• 20:49
  recomp. You don't really care about the
• 20:50
  booty gains. You're like, OK, I just, I want
• 20:52
  to be healthy, right? I want to be a healthy
• 20:54
  individual, right? Like then probably the best
• 20:57
  thing to do is to be like, OK, I'm going to lift weights
• 21:00
  Monday, Wednesday, Friday for 30 to 45 minutes, obviously with
• 21:04
  one of our own wonderful soda coaches or in a small group.
• 21:07
  And then Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday, I'm going to do let's
• 21:10
  call it 30 minutes. Like, you know, 45 I feel is a
• 21:14
  little excessive, but let's call it like 30 minutes of
• 21:17
  challenging cardio, OK. And this could be a run outside
• 21:21
  if you like to run around a treadmill.
• 21:22
  It could be a bike, it could be the elliptical machine.
• 21:25
  It could be a Peloton. It could be running around with
• 21:27
  your kids at the playground. It could be playing pickleball.
• 21:29
  Like it could be it could be zone 2 steady state.
• 21:32
  It could be some intervals like I think that we could, you know,
• 21:36
  go into all the bajillions of studies out there and like
• 21:38
  debate the research or whatever on like is zone 2 steady stayed
• 21:42
  better or is zone 4 interval training?
• 21:44
  Is Tabata's is the Norwegian method?
• 21:46
  Did the Norwegian zoo something nobody knows?
• 21:48
  No, no, it's what's the what's the thing that No, it's what's
• 21:52
  the thing that they call it. Maybe it's one of those
• 21:55
  countries and it sounds like fart, but it's like it's like
• 21:58
  fart luck. I don't know about this.
• 22:01
  No, look it up but. Now I need to know.
• 22:03
  It's out there on like the somewhat controversial Instagram
• 22:06
  space. Should I look up a fart method?
• 22:08
  I'm worried. I believe it's.
• 22:09
  Actually like pronounced like fart luck or something.
• 22:12
  It's a method of cardio where they go very high intensity,
• 22:15
  then they bring. Man, fart training.
• 22:17
  Why did they have to? Well, it's a different language,
• 22:20
  Phil. Not everybody's word for fart is
• 22:22
  the same as ours. But like what are we bringing
• 22:24
  over here is it's Swedish for speed play.
• 22:28
  It's an unstructured form of interval training that combines
• 22:31
  fast high intensity bursts with slow recovery paced in one
• 22:34
  session. It's interval training but
• 22:37
  unstructured. Basically you just decide when
• 22:40
  you want to go faster and slower.
• 22:41
  OK, like Sprint to the next mailbox and then walk, which
• 22:44
  that's something I've used a ton.
• 22:47
  Yeah. Cardio training.
• 22:47
  It's just like, all right, I feel arrested.
• 22:49
  I'm going to Sprint again. Yeah.
• 22:50
  But so it's a little less structured, which probably makes
• 22:53
  sense. Yeah, so exactly so do.
• 22:57
  That if you want. Yeah, do that if you want.
• 22:58
  And there would be the plan that I would give most people.
• 23:00
  If you just want to be healthy, lift some weights, strength
• 23:02
  train three days a week and then on the opposite off days, do 30
• 23:05
  minutes of cardio of whatever is whatever cardio you like or you
• 23:08
  don't hate that much. Yes, you know, and then on the
• 23:11
  7th day, I mean, I was going to make a religious joke, but I
• 23:14
  won't. But like the 7th day you can
• 23:16
  just rest, you know, like. 7th day, you go to church, yeah,
• 23:20
  yeah, yeah. And you repent for the the Oreos
• 23:22
  and stuff. You get back on it.
• 23:24
  Something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 23:27
  But yeah, so that's that's what I would say.
• 23:29
  Like for general health purposes, I mean, is more cardio
• 23:31
  better? I mean, I think up to a point.
• 23:34
  Like, let's be honest, we live in a pretty sedentary lifestyle.
• 23:37
  Like I don't think anybody listening to this is going to
• 23:39
  overdo it on cardio, you know what I mean?
• 23:42
  Like I got, I got one guy who's a client of ours who like, in
• 23:45
  addition to his three strength training sessions per week, he
• 23:47
  runs religiously like 5 to religion again, like 5 to 7
• 23:52
  miles every morning. And he's just done it for years
• 23:54
  and years and years and you know, he's in good health and
• 23:56
  everything. Like even that, it's like you're
• 23:58
  not going to overdo it putting on, you know, say 2530 miles a
• 24:02
  week if you've been doing it for a long time.
• 24:04
  Like overtraining. Sorry, I was going to say, like
• 24:07
  overtraining sure is, is a thing.
• 24:11
  It can really happen, but like for everybody, listen to this
• 24:14
  podcast is not going to happen. It's not.
• 24:16
  Very. It's very rare and don't be
• 24:18
  worried about that like you getting stressed, but
• 24:20
  overtraining is going to be worse than overtraining for you.
• 24:22
  There you go. Yeah, now, now.
• 24:24
  Key distinction though, 'cause I'm talking about for health in
• 24:27
  general, this is where we get into like the controversial part
• 24:30
  of this and the, the whole like the, the cardio kills gains.
• 24:35
  You've heard that right? Like doing air quotes here.
• 24:37
  Cardio kills gains. It's funny because one of my
• 24:40
  other clients told me that like her son, well, it's actually a
• 24:43
  couple, he'll know who they are. But like their son said this
• 24:46
  like cardio kills gains. You guys shouldn't do so much.
• 24:48
  You want to keep your muscle mass, right?
• 24:50
  And so this is where it does get a little bit, you got to be a
• 24:55
  little bit more careful if your goal is to optimize your muscle
• 24:59
  mass and your strength, You know, in that case, you don't
• 25:02
  want to do a ton of cardio, okay?
• 25:05
  Not to say that, you know, going out there and you know, riding a
• 25:07
  bike for 30 minutes is you're going to lose all your muscle
• 25:09
  mass by doing that, but. It's like the opportunity cost
• 25:13
  of of. Kind of.
• 25:14
  Right. Because if you're like, well,
• 25:15
  I'm going to focus on just cardio.
• 25:17
  We've had people come here and they do twice a week and they're
• 25:19
  like, well, now it's time for me to focus more on my running.
• 25:21
  And like every running program, that's a solid running program.
• 25:25
  Marathon training, what have you, has two days a week of
• 25:27
  cross training that's strength focused and then you mix in your
• 25:30
  runs. He's probably, he's probably
• 25:33
  taking apart the tank that you just put together.
• 25:35
  No, I think it runs like a top. He's good.
• 25:37
  He probably doesn't know he does not do that, but but if he's
• 25:41
  like I've got 5 hours a week to exercise and I spend four of
• 25:44
  them on cardio and and one hour on strength.
• 25:47
  Well, yeah, you're not going to see a a fast twitch muscle fiber
• 25:50
  like increase, right? You, you can develop your slow
• 25:53
  twitch running fibers, but not your fast twitch, which is what
• 25:56
  affects how your body looks more than anything.
• 25:59
  Yeah, and that's a whole other discussion about muscle fiber
• 26:02
  types and how training effects how you look.
• 26:03
  But point being is the people who say that one, it's, it's bro
• 26:07
  science at its finest, right? There's a grain of truth to.
• 26:11
  It you're right, a lot of times go on.
• 26:13
  Go on. But if people run or do cardio
• 26:14
  before they lift, your capacity is lower.
• 26:17
  And so there's, there's some truth to it.
• 26:19
  But I think like the overarching theme and what I want people to
• 26:21
  take home is the question of should I do more cardio is like,
• 26:24
  well, probably a little bit. But really it's a question of
• 26:27
  should I be doing more than what I'm doing now?
• 26:29
  And the answer there's probably almost certainly yes because of
• 26:33
  our just lifestyle and our society, right?
• 26:35
  We sit too much. Nobody over walks, right?
• 26:38
  Like you should always do a little bit more where you can.
• 26:41
  But what that thing is, you know, shouldn't be hit cardio
• 26:44
  for 30 minutes five days a week and doing some training three
• 26:47
  days a week, you know, that's different.
• 26:50
  So. Yeah, let's reveal the answer to
• 26:54
  the question at the beginning and then I have a couple more
• 26:56
  points that I'll go through. Yeah, I've never seen you like
• 26:59
  hold the jog. You've never, Yeah, you've never
• 27:01
  seen. You and I sprinted at that, at
• 27:02
  that thing in Alexandria and and I still have, I still have some
• 27:07
  like trauma, I think from that something happened in my lungs.
• 27:09
  From the well, yeah, we know We did a, we did a 400.
• 27:13
  Yeah, we did A1. 100 and 400 yeah yeah, both it ruined it
• 27:16
  ruined the next couple of hours for us I.
• 27:18
  Think no, the 400 meter dash is one of the most torturous things
• 27:21
  that can happen to a human being.
• 27:22
  OK, sorry for the joke, but like, but no, it's it's it is.
• 27:27
  Yeah. I don't know if the 400 or 800
• 27:29
  is worse just in terms of because you you almost like the
• 27:32
  400. You actually basically have to
• 27:34
  Sprint. Yeah, you can almost hold it the
• 27:37
  whole time, yes, because you can work that energy system for up
• 27:39
  to like 90 seconds at the most. Yeah, but but that's it.
• 27:43
  So you're hitting that, you're hitting that wall, and you got
• 27:46
  to try to push through it for another like 30 seconds.
• 27:48
  Yes. And if you're doing the 800,
• 27:51
  you're holding a slightly less pace.
• 27:52
  You're not sprinting until the very last minute.
• 27:54
  So I'd be it's, it's, it's still pretty bad though, you know what
• 27:57
  I mean? Because for a relatively fast
• 27:59
  person, the 100, the 400 it happens is like one minute.
• 28:02
  And the 800 is like between two minutes and 2 1/2 minutes, you
• 28:05
  know? And so it's just, it's, it's
• 28:07
  either one minute of hell or two and 2 1/2 minutes of hell, you
• 28:10
  know, Anyway, go ahead. This is going to say, yeah,
• 28:14
  it's, yeah. Like, honest to God, there are
• 28:17
  people listening to this. Like if you wanted like great
• 28:19
  cardiovascular benefits, you could probably go run a 400
• 28:22
  meter dash twice a week at like 90% of your maximum intensity
• 28:26
  level and Oh my God, like you would like I just, I just think
• 28:30
  it would help a lot. Like it's a it's a one to
• 28:33
  two-minute thing. Maybe warm up a little first.
• 28:35
  We don't want everybody to pull a hand me, but like, yeah, but
• 28:38
  like you're just gonna dip it into that zone 5 cardio briefly
• 28:42
  a couple times a week and kind of getting like the Sprint
• 28:44
  benefit, like turn that on like, well, that's.
• 28:46
  About the foundation by PDRT and a lots of other people.
• 28:49
  It's like literally do 4 minutes of of high intensity work and
• 28:52
  then you're done. Then you're done with the
• 28:54
  workout. That's it.
• 28:55
  You've crossed off that check box Exactly.
• 28:57
  It shouldn't be any longer. So it's basically the same
• 28:59
  thing. That's what I want all you guys
• 29:00
  listening to do. Regardless of the cold,
• 29:02
  regardless of the cold or what time of day it is right now.
• 29:05
  I want you to walk out onto your street right now, OK?
• 29:08
  I want you to mark 400 meters down your street and I want you
• 29:12
  to Sprint it, OK? I want you to.
• 29:14
  I'm gonna get sued, John. Why are we gonna get sued?
• 29:17
  There's a nice. There's a nice.
• 29:19
  Which one you talking about? Oh geez, the watery substance
• 29:22
  that freezes? Or are you talking about 1?
• 29:24
  Well, I guess both, but no, go into come in here and run on the
• 29:29
  curve or something. Yeah, yeah.
• 29:31
  But no, you're absolutely right. Go outside and just do a little
• 29:33
  run. Do a little run.
• 29:34
  When was the last time you tried to Sprint run?
• 29:36
  What happens? Run a 400.
• 29:38
  Run a 400. OK, OK.
• 29:40
  But so yeah, like so me with cardio, OK, because it's funny
• 29:43
  that you say that you've you've never seen me do cardio, right?
• 29:45
  You've never ever seen me do it right.
• 29:47
  And the answer to the question is how much cardio do I do right
• 29:51
  now? Especially like right on this
• 29:53
  like stronger than than Austin program that I'm doing.
• 29:57
  I'm trying to freaking get really strong and build more
• 29:59
  muscle, right? And it's really freaking hard
• 30:01
  because he's so big and strong, right?
• 30:03
  So how much cardio do I do? I want you to guess how many
• 30:05
  days a week do I do cardio on average?
• 30:08
  Am I counting The Walking? No, no, we're not going to.
• 30:11
  We're going to call like a structure to actual cardio
• 30:13
  session, a somewhat structured session.
• 30:15
  I feel like you know what I'm going to say, so you're going to
• 30:18
  have me guess. I'm baiting you into a wrong
• 30:20
  guess. I know, I think it's, I think
• 30:21
  it's 0. It's 1.
• 30:24
  One minute. Barely.
• 30:25
  No, no, no. One day.
• 30:26
  One day. OK, OK, it's one, One minute
• 30:28
  cardio. Sweet.
• 30:30
  I was like, Dad, I just got up on the bike for a minute.
• 30:33
  No more. Than what I thought, yeah, OK,
• 30:35
  no. No, no.
• 30:36
  Here's what usually happens. Yeah.
• 30:38
  So like, and it's, it's it's barely structured at all.
• 30:40
  This is what usually happens. It's not even part of the actual
• 30:43
  program, you know. So like right now, Nina and I
• 30:45
  lift 4 to 6 days per week. We try to get 6.
• 30:48
  We do like an upper, lower split, right.
• 30:49
  So it'd be like essentially Sunday through Friday every
• 30:54
  morning, maybe with the morning where I don't really.
• 30:56
  Lift. It's like diligent.
• 30:57
  Yeah, no, we, we get at it. Yeah.
• 31:00
  And then so like Saturdays, I don't do any lifting, right.
• 31:03
  And then like what usually happens is I like, you know, I
• 31:06
  work here from 8:00 to noon ish, right.
• 31:08
  And then I come home Saturdays. And then I got all those other
• 31:10
  dumb stuff I got to do and I'm like, oh God, like freaking
• 31:12
  sucks. And I'm, but if I get like
• 31:13
  peopled out by the end of the day, you know what I mean?
• 31:15
  I don't want to see any people anymore.
• 31:16
  I've been in the gym so much. Whatever.
• 31:18
  Don't want to go back into any gym, anything.
• 31:19
  I don't want to see any people. Don't want to talk to anybody.
• 31:21
  Hopefully there's sun outside there.
• 31:22
  It hasn't been hardly any sun in Minnesota since like freaking
• 31:24
  October. But like, I, I need to get
• 31:26
  outside. So what I do is I put on my
• 31:29
  crappy old running shoes and I go outside and I run for no
• 31:34
  determined amount of distance. It's just me.
• 31:38
  I just start jogging and I don't care where I go or where.
• 31:41
  I you're fart looking. I'm no, not even really.
• 31:43
  I don't go that intensely. I'm not farting anything.
• 31:45
  OK, I go out there and I jog for maybe 20 to 25 minutes at a
• 31:51
  moderately slow pace. That's good cardio, right?
• 31:54
  And so like maybe I go 2 miles or something like that, right?
• 31:57
  It's my zone 2 cardio for the week, right?
• 32:00
  And like the reason I don't do very much like especially right
• 32:04
  now is because, well, trying to get stronger than Austin, so I
• 32:09
  need as much freaking muscle as is humanly possible, right?
• 32:13
  And so, you know, in the, in the, in the cardio kills gains,
• 32:17
  you know, air quotes again here. It's like, does it?
• 32:21
  No, but like if I were to try to do like 3 days of intensive
• 32:24
  cardio every week, something's got to give.
• 32:26
  Like eventually I'm, I'm not going to have enough energy to
• 32:29
  lift hard enough, you know, to try to build the muscle I'm
• 32:31
  trying to build. And ultimately it then it kind
• 32:34
  of makes it just even harder to you just you just making it
• 32:38
  harder for yourself basically to gain a lot of strength, right.
• 32:42
  So like, and if your goal, if we have any clients out there whose
• 32:47
  goal is to be like a six foot one 260 LB freak of nature, like
• 32:52
  Austin from next door and you want to have muscles in your
• 32:55
  back that people don't even know existed, right?
• 32:58
  And then like, do you know crazy stuff like lifting me up above
• 33:02
  your head like Austin did that one time?
• 33:05
  Then you probably should limit your cardio because it's going
• 33:08
  to take a lot to get you to have like 200 and some pounds of pure
• 33:13
  muscle all over your body in places you didn't know existed,
• 33:16
  and cardio may limit that. But for everybody.
• 33:20
  Everybody else. So for the other 100% of people
• 33:23
  who are listening that didn't fall into that category, you can
• 33:26
  probably do some cardio and it won't do anything any harm to
• 33:30
  you. Yeah, get 30 minutes of some
• 33:32
  brisk cardio, get outside, tie it to something, something that
• 33:35
  you love to do already and and then just call it good.
• 33:39
  Don't overthink it. Don't major in the minors or get
• 33:41
  caught up in the nonsense or the Instagram BS or there's no.
• 33:45
  BS on Instagram it's a great. I forgot it's Phil All legit
• 33:49
  peer reviewed. I'm on Instagram.
• 33:51
  Come on, I. Forgot.
• 33:52
  Yeah, No, you share the good. Stuff do I Yeah, I share me
• 33:55
  doing. Everyone else.
• 33:57
  Yeah, they're the problem, not me.
• 33:59
  But yeah, get out there. Do do more.
• 34:01
  Don't worry about overtraining, like don't worry about that
• 34:04
  ceiling when you hit it, then, then we'll talk and we'll help
• 34:07
  advise and coach you. But but until that happens, keep
• 34:10
  doing as much as you can because more than anything else, you'll
• 34:14
  settle in a in a place that's more than what you're doing now,
• 34:17
  but not too much, if that makes sense.
• 34:19
  Right. Move as much as you can.
• 34:21
  Get out right now. Go walk and go get some fresh
• 34:25
  air soaking a little sun. How much cardio do you do, Phil?
• 34:31
  Depends on how fast my kids are running down the hallway.
• 34:34
  That's most of my cardio right now to be honest is chasing
• 34:37
  kids. I mean they want me to throw
• 34:39
  them they want to do this like TikTok clock thing where I hang
• 34:41
  them by their feet and that has kept me actually didn't in body
• 34:46
  because I was like I haven't done 1/3 years.
• 34:48
  Did you look jacked? You know, I was about the same,
• 34:52
  which shocked me and I. Think, my children, you thought
• 34:55
  you'd be less. I thought I I thought I lost
• 34:57
  some muscle. I thought like, but no, I was
• 34:59
  actually lower body fat percentage and maintain my
• 35:02
  muscle somehow. OK, because I'm not on like a
• 35:05
  real strict lifting program, but yeah, I'm about to be.
• 35:09
  You guys are. Oh yeah, OK, I'm enjoying the
• 35:11
  stronger I'm gonna be like I'm. Gonna be like I'm gonna be
• 35:14
  stronger than Austin. It's 75% program, no?
• 35:17
  No, no, no, no, no, no. Stronger than Austin.
• 35:19
  I want you throwing up the £100 dumbbells.
• 35:21
  Vertical pressing fun. Oh, vertical.
• 35:23
  Yes, he vertical. Haven't touched.
• 35:25
  I can't freaking vertical, but God Almighty like I'm, I'm, I'm,
• 35:29
  I'm stuck on the 90s on the vertical press.
• 35:31
  Like I've been in, I've been at 5 reps with the 90s for like the
• 35:34
  last like 4 weeks, right? And I go to the 6th Rep and I'm
• 35:38
  like God. You're gonna, you're gonna get
• 35:40
  there. It's just gonna be from, you
• 35:41
  know, 3 inches higher next time. You're like, oh, I got 75%.
• 35:45
  Like a not quite full range of motion shoulder.
• 35:47
  Press heavy. It's like you don't see that
• 35:50
  next Rep for. Quite a while.
• 35:51
  No, No. Yeah.
• 35:52
  But yeah, no, I'll get them up there.
• 35:54
  I'll get them up there. Hundreds.
• 35:57
  All right, I like it. No, you got to do it, man.
• 35:58
  You got to do it. Well, awesome.
• 36:00
  Anything else you want to close with?
• 36:01
  Any other big takeaways? No, we went full circle from
• 36:03
  cardio to hundreds so. That's just like a drop.
• 36:06
  We would. Yep.
• 36:07
  Yep, sweet. All right.
• 36:09
  Well, thank you guys. Thanks for listening.
• 36:11
  Thanks. Phil, we'll see you on the next
• 36:13
  one. Thanks everybody.
• 36:14
  Peace.