Latest / Straumann® ProTalk / Straumann® ProTalk with Dr. Prof. Tim Joda

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Straumann® ProTalk with Dr. Prof. Tim Joda · Straumann® ProTalk

0:00
Tim Joda: I love change.
0:01
I love innovation.
0:03
But I'm open to it.
0:04
If you have maybe a brain surgery, do you want somebody, a surgeon who's shaking
0:09
their hands and doing something, or do you want to have a robot assisted and with a
0:13
three dimensional and there we accept it?
0:15
So why does it take so long?
0:17
The job will change.
0:18
You have to accept the new learning curve.
0:21
It's not only investment into time for the learning, it is
0:24
also an investment in money.
0:26
It is.
0:27
Just the question when you will jump on the train.
0:45
Andreas Utz: Welcome to this episode of Pro Talks, the Path of Dentistry.
0:49
My name is Andreas Utz and alongside my friend and colleague George.
0:53
I am the host of this series of inspiring Conversation and what we do
0:57
in this podcast, we interview remarkable personalities, and today we welcome a
1:03
very special guest, which is Professor Tim Yoda from the University of Zurich.
1:07
Welcome, Tim.
1:08
Great to have you today.
1:09
So Tim, you are a professor at the.
1:12
Clinic for dental medicine in Zurich to be more precise.
1:16
The clinic for Reconstructive Dentistry.
1:18
That's great.
1:19
At the University of Zurich.
1:20
And your Title I looked it up.
1:21
It's a very interesting title.
1:23
You are the head of eHealth in reconstructing Dentistry.
1:27
Yeah.
1:27
And looking at your career and your training I realized you, you have a very
1:33
broad enjoyed a very broad training.
1:35
You have a PhD in biomedical technologies.
1:39
You have a masters in reconstructive dentistry.
1:45
And also you have an executive MBA, which is a completely different field, so a
1:48
very broad training that you experience.
1:50
You are also a certified period.
1:54
Total specialist.
1:55
You are a specialist in reconstructive dentistry.
1:58
Yes.
1:58
And also last not least, you are also a specialist in
2:01
implantology and implant dentistry.
2:03
So a very broad training and, very broad background and that's
2:07
going to be very interesting for our podcast moving forward.
2:10
Today, your main interests in research are digital technologies.
2:15
One of the main fields is probably also artificial intelligence.
2:19
And also this is a very interesting topic that we might touch later in our podcast.
2:23
Warm, welcome to za, great to have you.
2:25
And the first habits that we try to create is, to have every guest introducing
2:31
himself and herself in one minute.
2:33
Tim, who are you in one minute?
2:35
Tim Joda: Thank you very much, first of all for this kind invitation and with
2:38
you both here and now we had a long monologue and you already mentioned
2:42
everything maybe that is important to, related to my person and yeah, I might
2:48
say I'm really passionate dentist.
2:50
I really love what I'm doing and this is beyond everything else.
2:54
Now you mentioned previously and.
2:57
What is very important also, as a dentist, I treat patients regularly.
3:01
So every day I see my patients.
3:04
And so I know the real world problems.
3:07
And as you said I'm there as a head of eHealth and Reconstructive
3:11
Dentistry that is quite new.
3:13
And I am allowed to work in a remarkable team together with professor Ronald Jung.
3:19
And we had the idea five years ago to say, okay, what's the next things in dentistry?
3:26
And of course this is implant dentistry that comes together, but
3:30
also technology, not just following the things that you guys give us
3:34
from the industry to test it out.
3:36
It was something I started 10 years ago.
3:38
So going further and combining the knowledge imperial and implant and proto,
3:44
and also from economics point of view, to bridge it together with data science.
3:48
And this is something we are working right now,
3:52
George Raeber: Tim, looking at your at UCV it's very fascinating, very, you ended up,
3:57
and it's often not very linear that people get to such positions like yourself.
4:02
Looking back, what was one of your most defining moments or let's say a pivotal
4:07
moment in your career that actually helped you to get where you are today?
4:12
Tim Joda: I think I would say it's not just one moment.
4:15
It's maybe two moments.
4:17
First of all, it's my first, let's say academic teacher.
4:21
It's Professor Thomas Fleming.
4:23
And he was the head of the Department of Periodontology at the University
4:27
of Munster in Germany where I studied, and also not only my undergrad
4:31
program, also my postgrad program.
4:33
And he was the first professor I got to know who explained us the
4:39
term evidence-based dentistry.
4:41
And he says, always.
4:43
We show you some treatment protocols, but we do not say, just follow this pathway.
4:49
They explained us why with evidence, and this was the first time in 1999
4:55
and 2000, as I heard about, and I was really impressed about this, and
4:59
this was one of the reasons why I said, okay, I want to know more in
5:02
the periodontal field, combining with clinics using my hands because it's very.
5:08
Yeah, you need some skills to train.
5:11
It is not just very root, it is very delicate with the soft tissue to deal
5:16
regeneration with the bone structures and infra bony defects, and also
5:21
combine it also with implantology.
5:24
And this was.
5:25
The first part, I was really impressed about it and to learn more and get into
5:29
science and to understand why, to do and to treat people in a specific way.
5:34
And secondary, I might say it is, was the decision more from this
5:38
clinical track to decide to apply an ITI scholarship at this time.
5:44
And then I was really lucky in 2011.
5:48
That I was selected for one of these scholarship centers and my first
5:51
choice was the University of Burn.
5:54
And there was a one once in a lifetime chance to get this and work
5:59
close every day with Professor obr.
6:03
With Professor Dani Booza.
6:05
And I might say even as a kind of friends to work together and.
6:09
I learned so many things from those guys all in the surroundings
6:14
and the University of Berlin.
6:15
That changed my dental life at the second point.
6:17
First starting the clinics and starting already a little bit into science,
6:22
but then later on to have a really great chance to work with those huge
6:27
persons, let's say in dentistry.
6:31
Andreas Utz: That's beautiful hear also that the ITI had a huge impact.
6:34
I'm I, we were talking about this before the podcast and
6:37
I was very impressed by this.
6:38
And how do you see the ITI today looking back and also for young people,
6:42
how can they benefit from the ITI.
6:45
Tim Joda: Today, I think it's, it is two things, mainly.
6:49
Two things.
6:49
It is a fascinating network and even if you're starting as a young dentist, your
6:54
career, you have a chance to connect with other people at the same stage.
6:59
And there you learn your experience and into with.
7:03
Yeah, mixing up some emotions, some ideas in a worldwide network and
7:09
secondary of course, you have access to real leaders in the field of implant
7:13
dentistry and there is no other.
7:16
I think organization where you have these possibilities,
7:20
there's a lot of things going on.
7:21
This is in parallel and since I started, I'm now an it I member almost 15 years.
7:27
I started in 2010 as a member and now of course then it evolved over time.
7:33
Yeah.
7:33
Becoming then the speaker also integrating the ITI Consensus conference
7:39
as a group leader and it is really.
7:44
It sounds maybe a little bit silly, but it's a kind of a big
7:47
family and you know each other.
7:49
And this is really something all around the globe.
7:52
You're connected now to personalities like Lisa Heights Mayfield.
7:56
You're invited with HP Web at this time in Boston.
7:58
I was there lecturing and this is something with Steven Chen.
8:03
I was able to work together during his presidency.
8:06
The online college I was.
8:08
Therefore digital transformation.
8:10
Combining the co diagnostics planning, I provided the first cases that were
8:15
used during these online courses.
8:17
And now I at this time I am allowed to write as the main author, the
8:21
latest ITI treatment guide about minimally invasive implant therapy.
8:25
And this is something I progressed to work together into this huge family.
8:29
And I think this is something I can only recommend to everybody to join
8:33
this, organization because it helps you a lot to stay fresh, to stay
8:39
hungry, and to meet fascinating people.
8:43
Andreas Utz: Yes.
8:44
We can already sense your passion that you have for the
8:47
field of expertise you work in.
8:49
And there's the science of dentistry, but there's a second passion and
8:53
I would say a second science.
8:54
That, that you spend a lot of time and you, you're very curious person.
8:58
You work yourself very hard into wine.
9:01
Yeah.
9:01
And you are holding.
9:02
You're holding a certificate, which is, I think, exceptional.
9:06
The WSET, I think.
9:08
Is it called certificate?
9:09
What is fascinating you about wine?
9:12
And then do you see some parallels to your, let's say, professional
9:16
science or some of the learnings that you can transfer to dentistry even?
9:21
Tim Joda: Yeah I, this wine is, it's fabulous.
9:26
So one, just think about it is only a grape or a fruit.
9:30
And then later on in a complex process, it develops to something unique and special.
9:36
And every year it is not.
9:38
The same.
9:39
It's not repeatable, it's not highly predictable.
9:42
And this is something to teach us to accept this on the one
9:45
hand, and this is only possible in a process, working in a team.
9:50
There is so many people working together to achieve the final result.
9:55
And then it's the aging potential.
9:57
There is nothing artificial that comes together.
10:00
It's only the.
10:02
The product from Mother Nature and then it develops in the barrel, in the
10:07
bottle and later on, even in the glass.
10:09
And when some you're sitting together with friends, you can enjoy it.
10:14
And this is something very fascinating for me.
10:18
On the other hand, it is.
10:21
So at least myself, I do not drink a glass alone.
10:24
I always like to share this, moment with somebody else.
10:28
Ideally I like or even I love.
10:31
So with my wife, we opened a lot of portals together with friends
10:35
and com combining it together with some foods and pairing and some
10:39
cooking and a lot of memories.
10:41
And this is maybe comparable to music as well.
10:43
A lot of things that happened in my life.
10:46
I have a specific song in my head and then I remember it, and this is.
10:50
Especially with wine and some of the moments I had I still remember
10:54
the bottle, what kind of grapes what kind of vintage and together,
10:59
and this is so fascinating for me.
11:01
And again now maybe to bridge again to science today.
11:04
It is.
11:05
It is science to create a great wine and sometimes it needs some
11:10
times as well to establish an environment, to invest into people
11:15
and to build some young researchers.
11:17
Now, I think this is the best way I can do right now.
11:21
I had the benefit to work with so many great people, as I said, and I learned
11:26
so many things, and this is now something to put some insight into somebody like.
11:33
Putting some seeds into the soil and now to see what comes out of it.
11:36
And I love to be surprised by with my young colleagues.
11:40
I give them some ideas and we are talking about something and
11:43
then they pop up with new ideas.
11:45
And I never had in my mind, and this is something to I. Yeah, a great moment.
11:50
And this is maybe comparable to that.
11:52
And it's always, again, also science, a team approach.
11:56
You never can do something alone.
11:58
And this is maybe the linking part of it.
12:00
Andreas Utz: So a lot of knowledge required a lot of hard work.
12:03
Yeah, that's true.
12:04
But then very rewarding outcomes.
12:05
So very similar to hopefully very similar to the dentistry.
12:07
Yes.
12:07
Hopefully.
12:08
Yeah.
12:08
Yeah.
12:08
Yeah.
12:09
Okay.
12:09
Thanks for sharing.
12:10
George Raeber: Yeah, that's a very fascinating topic.
12:12
The second topic where we started actually within, in, in the dental
12:16
field, where you are super passionate is about digital dentistry.
12:20
And here I'm sure that our listeners, they are very curious to actually
12:23
hear your vision of digital dentistry in the years to come.
12:28
Can you share a little bit, where do you see us going in the next five to 10 years?
12:33
Tim Joda: Yeah, I think one, one major aspect is.
12:37
To see automatic simulation to make.
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Process is easier and for that way accessible to a broader
12:48
audience or a broader area of general practitioners as well.
12:52
And this is for instance combining a.
12:56
In the field of computer assisted implant surgery to have diagnostics,
12:59
three dimensional cone beam ct, for instance, matching it with surface scans.
13:05
And this is always a kind of a painful procedure.
13:08
Nowadays.
13:09
We have ai, so artificial intelligence algorithm that helps us to make
13:13
this process more predictable, safer, and then in an easier way.
13:17
So I think this is one area combined also with.
13:21
Treatment simulation because the expectation of the patients when
13:26
it comes to new treatments, and especially when it's combined
13:30
with high costs, are very high.
13:32
So we have to talk about this.
13:35
We need to simulate the outcomes, and then we can use AI technology,
13:41
digital tools to simulate these outcomes non-invasively in advance.
13:46
And this helps a lot.
13:47
So I think this is one area.
13:50
Where we can benefit in the future.
13:52
The second part is to go beyond dentistry and link it more
13:58
to oral and systemic health.
14:00
So the, as we all know, the oral cavity is the entrance, one of the entrances to
14:05
the human body and this is maybe something that's a job description will change, and
14:10
digital technologies will help us a lot.
14:13
This could be maybe using smart devices with intraoral sensors, capturing some
14:19
markers in the mouth of the patients for early risk identification and
14:24
or not only in the localized way.
14:26
Let's talking about periodontitis periimplantitis,
14:28
but also maybe in the future.
14:30
And we are talking about the next five to 10 years maybe.
14:33
About systemic health.
14:34
And just think about the.
14:37
Population.
14:38
We're getting all elder, so we have their change.
14:41
And this is something a lot of these people are wearing dentures, removable.
14:46
And then we have new opportunities to put some new sensors maybe inside.
14:51
And one third thing beyond this is.
14:57
Moving a little bit, let's say, from purely evidence-based dentistry.
15:02
So one solution for every indication, more to a personalized, specifically
15:07
tailored dental medicine.
15:09
And this is something that helps us, the digital technology, to jump into
15:14
it and have more of these really individually need for the patient
15:18
and the focus and to treat them.
15:19
So these are the three areas I mainly think will help us a lot, but.
15:24
Only the future will tell.
15:27
George Raeber: Yeah.
15:27
It sounds like a very interesting future and I'm also fascinated by a lot of
15:31
themes that, that you just mentioned.
15:33
Now, on the contrary, and maybe to be a bit provocative, we know now many of
15:39
these technologies that you mentioned, they are actually already here today.
15:42
Not specifically in dentistry, but they're in general accessible.
15:46
And to take an example in dentistry, interval scanners, they have been
15:50
around for 15 years or even more.
15:52
Yeah.
15:52
But, we're still debating oh, should I actually, get an interval scanner
15:56
because, and that's the, I would say also the starting point of any
16:00
digitization in in, in the dental field.
16:02
So why does it take so long?
16:04
What's your take on this?
16:04
What.
16:05
Does industry maybe need to do different?
16:07
What does the mental professional as a community need to do different?
16:11
It's taking so long yeah,
16:13
Tim Joda: that would be interesting to hear.
16:15
It is a very interesting question.
16:17
So as a university guy, an academic teacher, I see our digital natives
16:22
and we are teaching them in this new stuff and they immediately
16:25
jump into it and they love it.
16:27
They do not need even instructions.
16:29
They play around until they achieve the final result.
16:32
And they have fun with that.
16:34
And I think there.
16:35
Is something in between the human factor, and we are talking now about
16:40
maybe dentist 40, 45, 50 years of age, and they learn things that
16:47
changed over a time of 10, 15 years.
16:51
Only minimally, let's say the example is a porcelain infused
16:54
to metal crown, PFM Crown.
16:57
This was the gold standard over two decades.
17:00
Several, yeah, at least decades and now we have the turnover in digitalization of
17:06
new ways and clinical protocols very fast.
17:09
And this is something.
17:11
I love change.
17:12
I love innovation.
17:14
But I'm open to it.
17:16
But somebody else, maybe not, and this is the human factor I might call to
17:21
accept a little bit changes, and they have fierce maybe with that, because
17:28
this is something the job will change.
17:30
You have to accept the new learning curve.
17:33
It's not only investment into time for the learning, it is
17:36
also an investment in money.
17:38
Sometimes you're.
17:40
You do not know what will happen.
17:41
Or another example, I love photography and as it changed from analog to
17:46
digital, we had several companies and they had all their own storage device.
17:52
SD cards, CF cards, or the memory stick from Sony, for instance.
17:56
And, but nowadays we still have.
17:59
Just SD cards more or less.
18:01
And it takes some time to establish to a specific standard.
18:05
Exactly.
18:06
And a lot of people say, or they ask me, Tim, when should I start
18:10
with digitalization and my practice?
18:12
And then of course I say Yesterday.
18:14
Yeah.
18:14
And yeah, but there is not the right point and it.
18:18
It is not unstoppable.
18:19
It is just the question when you will jump on the train and, but I think
18:25
this is the human factor that a lot of things, they're afraid of it.
18:28
But another provocative question is if you have maybe a brain surgery,
18:33
do you want somebody, a surgeon who's shaking hands and doing something?
18:37
Or do you want to have a robot assisted and with a three dimensional and there we
18:41
accept it, but in dentistry it's quite.
18:44
A different way to accept from a patient point of view as well,
18:48
some kind of digitalization.
18:50
George Raeber: Let's go back to exactly this segregation that you
18:52
said, digital natives and Yeah.
18:54
Let's say the traditionalists.
18:56
So in your view, what is maybe one of the persistent myth or misconceptions of that
19:02
group to actually start with digital?
19:05
Tim Joda: I think, yeah, the learning curve.
19:07
On the one hand, on the others, there were two ways.
19:10
These are the pessimists and they said everything that's new.
19:13
I have to, yeah, start learning again and accept maybe in five years
19:18
I have to relearn and forget this and they do not want to do this.
19:22
And on the other hand, we have the other people who say, okay, I buy now
19:27
all this stuff and now it's working, but this the other way around.
19:31
You have to use it.
19:32
Every day.
19:33
And I think this is important to involve all of your members in the team.
19:37
And explain and train and explain why are we using it
19:41
and how it helps and to see it.
19:43
And this is something, this kind of training is missing maybe in this area.
19:51
Andreas Utz: So we are living the understanding, the life, usually
19:55
retrospective, but living the forward.
19:58
So in 2025.
20:00
If you would've a colleague that approaches you opening a
20:03
new dental practice, where do you see the technologies where
20:08
you say, okay, there's a clear
20:10
Tim Joda: yeah.
20:11
Andreas Utz: Benefit, to this technology in the practice.
20:14
And which technologies would you recommend this person really to start?
20:17
Because you say, look, this is really something you wouldn't want
20:20
Tim Joda: to miss.
20:21
For me, it's clear and intraoral scanner.
20:24
This is something to start with because this is not just for therapy.
20:29
Most of the people that think it is a replacement of an analog or a
20:32
conventional impression, I see it.
20:35
It is more than this is it helps you to digitize the patient, to communicate with
20:39
the patient, to have a chance to start immediately with a digital workflow,
20:46
combine it, then step by step with a cone beam ct with a facial scan, maybe even.
20:52
And you do not have to buy a full facial scanner for several
20:56
thousand dollars or euros.
20:58
You can use a app.
21:00
Of your smartphone and link it together and then you can interact with other
21:05
colleagues there in this as well.
21:07
And it helps a lot for this communication as well.
21:11
But also for follow-ups, it helps you.
21:14
There is no radiation.
21:16
This is it can be done within seconds.
21:18
So if you're a little bit trained, it's one to two minutes to scan both arches.
21:23
You have no storage limited.
21:25
Limitations nowadays that makes it easy.
21:28
I think this is clearly would be my advice to start with an intra
21:32
scanner or at least two at every dental chair you have in your office.
21:36
Yeah.
21:37
Andreas Utz: And then you mentioned cone, bem, CT and face scan.
21:40
So you would start in the field of data capturing and diagnostics.
21:43
Yeah.
21:43
Is that, do you, why is this, do you see that then once you go into
21:47
production like 3D printing or mailing, it becomes much more complex?
21:50
Or why is this.
21:53
Tim Joda: Not the reason that it's more complex, but I would say as a dentist,
21:56
my core group is treating patients.
21:59
And then of course if you have a dental lab and you have other personal and
22:03
human resources there, of course you can think about to invest into it as well.
22:08
But this is more the productive part and I have my partners there and
22:12
I work then with these dental labs and for me, but as a dentist and in
22:17
the university environment, I do not have the economic driver, I must say.
22:20
So therefore, I do not think about this.
22:23
We have all these.
22:24
Playground and these tools there, and I can use it but I'm not an expert into it.
22:29
But this is of course the second step for me as a dentist, I think clinically.
22:34
And I want to interact with my patient and therefore I thought I am more
22:38
into the diagnostics and how can I do better dentistry for my patients.
22:45
Andreas Utz: Yeah, I think it makes sense.
22:46
And you are, I know you're on the university setup, but still I think,
22:49
working with specialized experts Yeah.
22:52
And partnering up with them.
22:53
Yeah.
22:53
Also, I would say in the clinical everyday practice out there is a good argument.
22:57
Yeah.
22:57
I could see this clearly.
22:59
What other areas of digital technology do you observe a lot of activities at
23:05
the moment if it comes to research?
23:06
I imagine you can also look a little bit into what happens in the future.
23:09
Yeah.
23:10
I know you are connected to many interesting companies.
23:13
You see a lot of stuff that is in the pipeline, after what we see now and
23:17
what is working today in 2025, what is going to do to be the next step.
23:22
Tim Joda: I think two areas.
23:23
So I'm also in the function as associate editor for clinical
23:26
oral implants research.
23:27
So I see the highest level of publications right now, and they're responsible for
23:32
the field of digital technology and implant prosthetics, and a lot of papers
23:37
who are now submitted are in the field of computer assisted implant surgery.
23:41
Especially dynamics and robotics and so the robotic execution and
23:46
dynamics and implant placement.
23:48
This is a very hot topics and I think this is not relevant to all dental
23:54
indications where you want to replace a two plus area with with an implant,
23:58
but it will be, especially for OUS cases, maybe something and the other
24:03
area that what you mentioned is.
24:05
New technology for the production in terms of 3D printing.
24:09
I think this is a very hot topic and we are there at the
24:13
beginning and with all these.
24:16
Kind of digital technologies.
24:18
We have a kind of a hype from the beginning and everybody
24:20
is very enthusiastic.
24:22
But then after a certain while we realize there was a kind of disillusion maybe.
24:28
And then it starts the real things who develop some of the things.
24:32
And I think 3D printing is now we.
24:36
We have now missed the well, and now it comes to an road that
24:40
become more in a productive way.
24:42
And this is something that would offer totally new options in the
24:48
prosthetics part and maybe something that we do not see right now.
24:52
For instance, we are talking about sustainability and what
24:56
is sustainability in dentistry.
24:58
This might be something that we say.
25:00
Nowadays, everything has to last 10, 15 years.
25:04
But we cannot say this in dentistry because there's a biological protocol.
25:08
There is a patient behind.
25:10
We do not know what will happen with this person medically.
25:13
But there is maybe a new way in a. Maybe cheaper is the wrong word,
25:18
but in a very streamlined way to produce a final restoration and
25:24
replace it after three to five years.
25:26
But then it is it doesn't have to cost thousands.
25:30
But we can adapt to the needs of the patient more individually.
25:35
This is maybe something that changed in our head in treatment protocols.
25:39
And with 3D printing, we have the chance to embed some new
25:44
technologies into restorations.
25:46
For instance, sensors that measure specific areas in this, yeah, so I think
25:51
this is something very interesting,
25:53
Andreas Utz: very exciting.
25:54
Yes.
25:55
You mentioned now twice the topic of robotics and and I know you in Zurich,
25:59
you guys are also looking into this.
26:01
So I just wonder, how do you see this topic?
26:03
Robotics in implant surgery going on and.
26:06
What is the, what is going to be the space where this technology will be helpful?
26:10
Because I wanna avoid, a situation where it's, perceived as, us,
26:13
as humans against the machines.
26:15
I think at the end, it'll be a blended positive combination.
26:18
Where do you see this blended positive combination?
26:20
Potentially?
26:21
I
26:22
Tim Joda: see it maybe more in a different direction as it goes right now.
26:26
Nowadays it will be used for placing an implant.
26:29
So we're talking about surgery.
26:32
And I made the example with the neurosurgeon a few minutes
26:36
ago, or maybe for eye surgery.
26:38
But then people are sleeping, they're not awake like our patients.
26:44
Yeah.
26:44
They're not moving.
26:46
And I think robotics is a high standard for quality standard to achieve the final.
26:52
Outcome that we want, but more on the productive level maybe for
26:56
restorations in this area, not compellingly placing implants.
27:01
If you have some specific areas, maybe it is a good way, but
27:04
I. It can be, you never know.
27:06
The dental environment will change, and we have more of these dental
27:10
service organizations in the future so that we have big centers.
27:14
And then of course, it is affordable for such an economic system.
27:18
To have a robotic system there.
27:21
Otherwise it will be not the way to buy something for a single dentist.
27:27
It doesn't make sense.
27:28
That was the reason 10, 12, 15 years ago for Dynamics.
27:32
So we had some kind of systems in Germany at this time, but they
27:36
never came out to the market because
27:38
Andreas Utz: ent
27:38
Tim Joda: Yeah, exactly.
27:39
Andreas Utz: Exactly.
27:40
Maybe last question from my side.
27:42
Artificial intelligence you mentioned this before briefly, yeah.
27:44
In your vision that George asked you though how do you see this moving on?
27:48
What will be the first really tangible benefits that,
27:51
clinicians will benefit from
27:52
Tim Joda: that we already have today is that we free up maybe our time.
27:59
So an algorithm won't get tired.
28:03
You can use it.
28:04
24 7. So that makes it easy and for tasks that are, might be
28:08
boring for us as a human being.
28:10
So why not using this for diagnostics analysis maybe
28:15
even for treatment planning?
28:16
For sure.
28:17
It will not replace that dentist.
28:19
And as a clinician, you will all be, always be responsible
28:22
for the final approval of it.
28:24
This is for sure, but this will help us to free up time for some
28:28
tasks that might be boring and then have more time for our patients.
28:32
Again.
28:33
Now, on the other hand, maybe some sentence and it.
28:36
Yeah, it belongs to the question before about robotics.
28:39
It is all about empathy in dentistry.
28:42
We need to have a trust with our patients on both ends and this is
28:46
maybe something this is missing, and if you have a decision making process
28:50
using ai, it needs to be explainable.
28:53
Otherwise, you have a kind of result that comes out of a black
28:56
box and there's always a problem.
28:57
So we need to integrate AI in a very smart way.
29:02
That ourselves, but also our patients will accept this kind of decisions.
29:07
And this is the next task.
29:09
From a technical point of view, we are much more focused than than this.
29:14
And on the other hand, it is AI is, for me, it is only a tool.
29:18
So it is like a digital dentistry five, 10 years ago.
29:21
Yep.
29:22
Or aesthetic dentistry.
29:23
This is ridiculous For me.
29:24
Dentistry has to be aesthetic.
29:28
Beyond function and therefore ai, we will not talk about AI in five years
29:33
because it's automatically in everything.
29:35
Yeah, it's already integrated.
29:37
So for me, the smarter term might be data science and how can we use
29:43
data like an implant registry that we are from Straumann and our site
29:46
at the University of Zurich as well.
29:48
How can we use this data to improve dental treatment?
29:53
George Raeber: Maybe to touch upon a different topic that is often mentioned
29:56
when we talk to clinicians, but also people in private dental practice.
30:01
So it's staff shortening.
30:02
Yeah.
30:02
So be it on dental systems or also in the dental lab.
30:06
Now talking about ai, digital technology, do you think also there it could
30:10
make a difference and have an impact?
30:13
Tim Joda: Yeah, a little bit.
30:14
As I touched also these things in diagnostics that help us.
30:19
You can delegate or use digital tools like an intraoral scanner that your
30:24
dental assistants can already start working with the patient, matching this
30:28
information with radiology assessment.
30:31
So this helps again, that somebody can work with the patient alone.
30:36
And then working as a team together.
30:39
So it helps you to free up there these areas.
30:42
George Raeber: And how would you see this materialize?
30:44
First what would be the first applications where we could see this?
30:48
Tim Joda: I also see maybe some smart glasses.
30:50
So we worked on it with a startup at the university and with smart glasses,
30:55
with a camera on the one side with some kind of wifi and this helps us a lot.
31:02
To think you can work alone because there is a voice control.
31:05
It is linked to your smartphone.
31:07
So you can see visualized on the smart glasses.
31:10
You can say like Siri, or we know all these kind of tools from other providers.
31:15
You can see an x-ray in your smart glasses and this helps you to work alone.
31:19
So for, not for all of the steps, you need a dental assistance anymore.
31:23
Just sitting next to you.
31:24
Andreas Utz: I think that's a very interesting field that we went into.
31:26
What does it do to the practice staff?
31:28
And I would say to the professions working in a dental practice we
31:33
talked about this also before.
31:34
How do you see this?
31:35
Because you know it, the whole dental field, dental technicians, assistant staff
31:39
dental professionals, the field is getting much more loaded with technology, which
31:44
is very positive and can be very exciting.
31:46
How do you see this, all this technology changing the profession?
31:50
I.
31:51
Tim Joda: Yeah it would change the image of
31:53
Andreas Utz: The image of the profession.
31:54
Tim Joda: Yeah.
31:54
It the image of the profession, the job description itself.
31:57
You have to accept that it will change from a, let's
32:00
start with a dental laboratory.
32:03
Maybe 10, 15 years ago, you have a dental technician who is aware in all
32:07
of these areas, it's more specialized.
32:09
Now we have more digital areas like this.
32:11
So I think there is already a kind of a way that you can use online services to
32:18
create something and then get information less an SDL file of the design back.
32:23
On the other hand, it will help us to make jobs.
32:26
A lot of people, let's say the other way round, are afraid of these
32:29
developments, but I see it as a chance.
32:31
It makes it more interesting.
32:33
But you again, it is like the same question from the beginning.
32:36
Why it takes it so long to implement something new and this is something
32:41
that the people needs to understand.
32:43
That is a chance, and this will be something maybe to get the job
32:48
more attractive on the other side.
32:50
Also for dental assistance, that they have more own responsibilities
32:54
to work with their patients.
32:55
As I said, integrating them in the intraoral scanning with the diagnostics,
32:59
preparing something more maybe even as I said, as either as a dentist.
33:06
We see patients more often than a general general or medical doctor.
33:10
And this may be something combining with saliva diagnostics on a
33:14
regular basis to identify some risk.
33:17
Factors have a microbiome testing and this could be delegated to
33:21
a dental assistance as well.
33:22
So we have a kind of a laboratory work that we know from the
33:25
blood analysis, but this is now.
33:28
Non-invasively, just collecting some new yeah, information out of the saliva of
33:33
the patient for a new way of treatment.
33:36
This could be just dental replacement.
33:38
We can stick to implant dentistry.
33:40
So nowadays, every patient receives the same treatment protocol, more or less.
33:45
We have the same implant, more or less the same material.
33:48
It's the same GBR procedures, but if we have more information about
33:51
the risk profile and not just an emesis and asking the patients.
33:55
Having more robust data out of this, putting together, then
33:59
we have maybe a personalized treatment way in this patient.
34:02
We need more this material in combination with that to have a
34:06
better wound healing later on.
34:08
And this could help from all aspects to have a personalized approach and
34:12
also involving the dental assistance to having a more attractive job.
34:16
Okay.
34:17
Yes.
34:17
It sounds like I think this, but it's a more or less a dream
34:19
and we do not know, oh, no.
34:20
But this is, could be something to work in and all of this.
34:24
Obstacles are educational wise, and we should start at the university also first,
34:30
and to integrate this and to tell our students what are new ways to integrate
34:36
and to see dentistry in the future.
34:38
Yeah.
34:40
Andreas Utz: I think dentistry has always been a very attractive
34:43
profile and profession always been.
34:45
And I think with these technology, technological advancements I think there's
34:49
no doubt that this is going to continue to be a very attractive field to work in.
34:53
Yeah.
34:53
Sounds like maybe last last topic to this to this, to the practice staff, let's go
34:58
to the, back to the thought experiment.
35:00
The dentist that was.
35:02
Creating a new practice and you said he should buy an intro scanner.
35:05
So imagine, he has this practice for a long time already, and he's still not in,
35:09
in digital now he decides to go digital.
35:12
And I imagine this is a big challenge for many practitioners out there.
35:15
How do you manage this change management process?
35:18
How do you take the team with you?
35:20
Because I imagine this is not very, not a very simple task for a
35:23
lot of practice owners out there.
35:25
This is.
35:27
Tim Joda: A very difficult task.
35:29
And it depends where you start.
35:30
If you start at the level zero, then it's even, yeah.
35:33
I think you would need some kind of professional help
35:36
and this step needs to be.
35:40
Prepared in advanced, I think.
35:43
And this is not something you can decide at one moment and then jump into it.
35:48
I would recommend to work with the companies together and to integrate
35:55
them into this plan and just think.
35:58
Exactly in advance what kind of technology you want to implement.
36:03
And you have to teach and involve everybody in the team
36:06
and use it on a regularly base.
36:08
And this is something, yeah, I have maybe in my genes to say never stop exploring.
36:13
I am curious, but not everybody is about this.
36:16
And you have to Yeah.
36:19
Take the fear of the people away and show it to them.
36:23
And show them and not be, it's like.
36:28
Dealing education with your kids.
36:31
On the one hand you need the strong hand and then you need something to
36:35
allow more, and this is there as well.
36:37
And you have to accept some mistakes or failures will happen from the
36:40
beginning, and you have to accept on your own maybe from the beginning.
36:45
You will not be that fast, as everybody tells you from the beginning.
36:49
And you have a very steep learning curve there as well, and with the entire team.
36:53
And this is maybe something on your personal mindset for the expectation
36:57
management to work there as well.
37:00
George Raeber: Okay.
37:01
That's that, that's a very beautiful vision and it's a very
37:04
inspiring team to talk about this.
37:06
I could go on for another hour, but this brings us already close
37:09
to the end of of this postcards, postcards episode with you.
37:13
And we have this let's say rhythm that we want to ask everyone
37:16
the same question to end with.
37:18
Okay.
37:18
And this last question is if you would have the chance the magic went to invite.
37:23
Anyone that you could think of for a evening long fireside
37:27
chat, who would you invite?
37:30
Probably you have now to decide whether you go for wine or for
37:32
dentistry or for something else.
37:34
But who would that be for you?
37:36
Tim Joda: I think I. As I said, I had really a great chance to meet fantastic
37:41
people in the field of dentistry due to the fact that I'm connected.
37:46
Thanks to the ITI there is really great and I had a lot of memories
37:50
and great moments with people on this area, but one people.
37:55
I missed so far.
37:57
And this would be Jan, Linda.
37:58
Okay.
37:59
Oh, interesting.
37:59
Very.
38:00
And I think it's always good in the older how I become I see to learn from such
38:08
people who were from the really beginning and this area, and to tell them something
38:13
from the drawbacks, from their beginnings or something, because from a innovative.
38:20
Point of view.
38:21
I see sometimes exactly what you mentioned, there were some obstacles
38:25
and you're not running as fast as you wish you can right now and to ask
38:32
such a people or like young Linde.
38:34
How was it at this time?
38:36
You were very forward thinking about the essis, about period.
38:41
Ontology or peri-implant disease, et cetera.
38:44
So what can you recommend and what is your story behind it?
38:47
So I think this would be something I would really love to talk to you young Linda.
38:51
Beautiful.
38:52
Andreas Utz: Yeah.
38:52
Good choice.
38:53
And I'm sure everybody's interested what would be the pot?
38:56
Why in your surf for this evening please report
38:58
George Raeber: back.
38:58
So
39:00
Andreas Utz: that's that's true.
39:01
Okay.
39:03
Tim, thanks a lot for your time for coming to Basel and for
39:07
joining us in this podcast here.
39:08
It was very inspirational.
39:09
It was fun too.
39:10
So thanks a lot for being here.
39:12
Charles, thanks for co-hosting and to our listeners, this was the series with
39:15
Tim Yoda, so I hope you enjoyed it.
39:17
Thanks a lot.
39:18
Thanks a lot for listening in, and as usual, you can also ask
39:23
questions to us if you want.
39:25
You can put some question on our Instagram accounts and we can also pass
39:28
a question to Tim Yoda, if you have some questions in the field of digital
39:32
dentistry or the vision of digital dentistry, we are happy to pass those
39:35
questions on and to resolve them later.
39:38
So thanks a lot for listening in.