Latest / Beyond the Paycheck / Why Your Employees Are Choosing the Wrong Health Plan — And How to Fix It
Transcript
- Kelsey Willock (00:42) Welcome, Erin Desrosiers Compensation and Benefits Leader at HOK. We are so excited to have you after this holiday weekend. To kick us off, I'd love for you to share a little bit about your background, your current role today, and where you're calling in from. Erin Desrosiers (00:56) Thank you. I'm excited to be here. I have worked in compensation and benefits for probably 10 or 15 years. I've been in benefits slightly longer than compensation. I've worked at several large employers around the United States, but am based in St. Louis, Missouri. Kelsey Willock (01:14) Well, I have so many questions for you about, you know, some of the places that you've worked, where you work today, but before we get into all of that, I'd love to learn a little bit more about you. So can you share with us your earliest memory of money? Erin Desrosiers (01:28) you ⁓ My earliest memory of money, well it's not something that I remember firsthand, but as a toddler I went through this experience and it was shared with me later. So when I was little my grandparents would share their spare change with my sister and me, and my sister is four years older than I am. So I idolized her and she quickly learned how to exploit that love. So with the spare change she convinced me that nickels were worth more. than dimes because they were bigger and then I subsequently traded her all of my dimes for her nickels. And after these fond memories were shared with me later in life, she's since apologized for that and many other older sister shenanigans. But I think that's a good memory to share because it comes with some important lessons like bigger isn't always better. Good things come in small packages and fact check everything you learn from an older sibling. Kelsey Willock (02:29) These are all very valuable lessons. As the eldest sibling, I unfortunately was also one of those conniving siblings that did something similar. But I'm glad that you learned from it and sounds like you not only learned from it, but you've carried it with you all the way through today. What was your first job and do you remember what you spent your first paycheck on? Erin Desrosiers (02:50) Yeah. My first real paycheck came whenever I worked at Raging Rivers Water Park in Grafton, Illinois. It took about 30 or 40 minutes for me to drive there and I made that drive frequently so I probably spent that money on gas. Mostly though I just remember the feeling of freedom with making my own money, having my own bank account, and watching it grow. I wasn't a big spender by any means but you know I enjoyed the freedom and I enjoyed you know how driving a car and a license and being able to drive, that just meant a lot to me having that responsibility. Kelsey Willock (03:26) And how do you think your money story from early childhood and your relationship with your sister all the way through your first job and even how your parents shaped your relationship with money has impacted how you think and show up for your employees in terms of pay and benefits? Erin Desrosiers (03:42) Yeah, well. You know, I'm just one person and while I have my personal thoughts and my experiences, I think it's more interesting to discuss what the majority of people are thinking about compensation and benefits. I'm very data oriented and as a leader of compensation and benefit programs, I'm here to make unbiased recommendations. And while most companies don't have the opportunity to survey their employees and ask detailed or specific questions every year, I can look at general survey data on these topics and glean a lot of information from those. So as is no surprise, most employees work for their paycheck covering most, or I'm sorry, covering their monthly expenses. That's their top rated challenge right now. And they've been facing that challenge over the past few years as we've seen. Inflation just a lot since COVID. Mercer does an inside employees mind survey every year and... I learn a lot from those survey results and there's a lot of other companies that publish similar surveys. So we know that money doesn't buy happiness, but happiness research shows that there's a minimum level of annual earning someone needs to feel free from financial stress. That amount was $75,000 annually a few years ago, so we can expect that it's increased since then. Very few companies though have moved to paying every full-time employee the same salary, so I don't expect this to become a new trend. And I think that's because not many people perceive that as fair. Workers expect higher wages in return for more responsibility, and research is also telling us that employees feel more comfortable with their pay if they understand how it's calculated. It's easy to see different jobs have different levels of responsibilities, discretion, experience, and skills requirements. And what's important is that employees and managers use tools and resources that help make fair pay decisions and that managers can easily communicate those decisions to employees. And if we go back to research and what's being shared in the media right now, we're in a period of what's called job hugging. Everyone is talking about AI, the jobs that have been cut as a result and jobs that AI is going to replace. Right now, employees are hesitant to move to the unknown and risk their seniority or their tenure. I also think job seekers have a lot of distrust with the job application process. Is it a human or is it AI that's disqualifying them? And is that happening based on a fair? or unfair process. Are companies really hiring for the jobs that they're posting or are they just posting jobs and testing the waters to see what talent is available on the market? Rejection is hard for whatever the reason may be and in such uncertain times I'm not surprised that we're seeing more people take a break from looking for a new job or risk putting their future in the hands of a new company. And finally, with benefits, the news has remained the same. We're seeing costs of medical and pharmacy benefits going up and up and up. And we're not sure when or how that will break. Previously, we've had nurse shortages and now we're trying to prepare for doctor shortages. If you talk to someone with a chronic condition or someone who's planning to have surgery and see how far out they're having to book their appointments, when you can't manage your care with a primary care doctor or a specialist, you'll lean more and more on urgent or emergency care. And that's more costly for employees as consumers of care. And it's going to be more costly for everyone when the premiums rise in the next year. So I think one of the biggest concerns of the U.S. government providing medical care to all of us is that it will take a long time to be seen by a doctor when everyone has access and the right to see all of the doctors. But we're beginning to head in that direction with private insurance now, so we could see narrower networks that would provide shorter wait times for appointments turned into a selling point for insurers. And that was actually a big question with mental health benefits around the time of COVID or right after COVID as employees were putting in mental health point solutions. The question was, how long does my employee need to wait for a counseling appointment to become available? Kelsey Willock (07:52) You touched on quite a few incredibly important. breakdowns that we're seeing in benefits today. And I'd be really curious where you've seen the company or even at prior companies do a really good job combating some of these things. One of the ones that I wanted to touch on first is the affordability crisis that we're experiencing. Financial stress is really at an all time high. You mentioned a really important point that there is a dollar, a quantifiable dollar amount in terms of people feeling like they can truly be happy. It's probably no longer just $75,000 as that Harvard research study said. What is your company doing about financial health, for example, or where have you seen the needle moved in a meaningful way? Erin Desrosiers (08:39) I think a lot of companies are providing a lot of resources and a lot of solutions that companies provide are also providing additional benefits with their offerings. So many companies offer a 401k match. Employees are very accustomed to hearing about the 401k match and you know the goal is to put however much into the 401k plan that you need in order to receive the maximum match. Similar things are happening with health savings accounts. I think to help them employees on their path to financial wellness. know, employees tend to shop for medical benefits in a way that's very different from their car insurance. For medical insurance, everyone thinks, if I can afford the most expensive plan, that's the best plan. And that's not the case. A lot of times the plans offer very similar coverages and services. It's just the premiums, the deductibles, and the out-of-pocket maximums that are different. instead of thinking I need to buy the best plan, that my company offers, think of it like you would car insurance, which premium amount do I want to pay that gives me the deductible that I feel comfortable with and you know the coverage that I feel comfortable with. I think that's very important. Likewise budgeting, there's a lot of apps that talk about you know we're watching where you're spending your money, we're going to bucket it for you and people need to do that with their medical expenses and their dental expenses and it will really help them make the best open enrollment decision for them and their family. Insurance companies and insurance is there to help us prepare against the unknown, but we can have a leg up on insurance companies because we should know more about our health than they do. Kelsey Willock (10:17) I think that... It's entirely correct and we often find that people get intimidated and it's challenging to engage the tools that help educate us. I'm curious if you found any specific ways in which to get people to utilize or have a greater understanding about how healthcare costs can impact them. Because I can't tell you how many times I've spoken with friends, colleagues, and people at prior employers that make decisions and only until they absolutely need that benefit do they understand the impact of that decision that they had made, which is sometimes quite unfortunate, right? Because we want to be able to proactively make good decisions for ourselves. Have you seen anything successfully help people get better educated, make those more informed decisions for themselves, or do you still think that there's more room to improve there? Erin Desrosiers (11:11) I think it's getting better, but I do still think there's more room for improvement. I've had to explain a deductible to many adults and I'm happy to do that. That's what I am here for and I want everyone to understand what they're buying. I don't want there to be any surprises. I think employers put a lot of information out to their employees during open enrollment. There's webinars, there's maybe an intranet site or a web page, there's packets of information. It's hard to go through it all. So what I would recommend is to ask questions. We are always happy to help. ⁓ Every employer I've ever worked for is always happy to make sure that everyone understands their benefits package. It's a benefit to you. We are giving this to you in return for your talent. Also, I think it's important for employees to not think of benefits just once a year. Maybe, you know, for 10 minutes during the year, go get a refresher wherever you can find information on your employer's benefits on what else offered. Likewise, insurance companies are a really good resource too. We share information with them on all of our benefits and then they can give that information out to employees as employees call in. So if someone gets an unfavorable test result, a lot of insurance companies offer a nurse line. Call the nurse, ask your questions, feel better about what to expect, get some questions that maybe you should ask your treating provider and likewise that nurse will probably be able to tell you if there's a second opinion program that you could go to in case of like a cancer diagnosis. A lot of companies and insurance programs offer genetic testing for cancer treatment. So again, these are things that employers don't go into the details about every year. It's not things that people want to think about when they're trying to decide what the best medical plan is for them. But when you're having that unexpected health care issue or condition, ⁓ It's important to get help and help can come from your employer. It can come from your insurance company. Ask both. No one wants to hide information from anyone. Again, all of these are benefits and tools that are available to employees. Kelsey Willock (13:24) What I love so much about your answer is it's, you know, how do you bring the human into the loop, the conversation, you know, as we enter this world of, you know, so much digitization, know, shifting conversations and sifting to AI chat bots, et cetera. What you're saying is talk to the people at the company. They are here to guide you and they're here to really hold your hand, whether it's someone within the HR organizations directly at the company talking to an on staff nurse. There really are people that are there to support you. One thing I also want to talk about is the benefits that you've seen employed, again, at either your company now or prior employers, where you've really seen move from attracting talent to transform the lives of your employees. Erin Desrosiers (14:13) You know, one of the most appreciated benefits that I've had the luxury of being able to offer through a couple of employers is fertility benefits. There are many ways that an employer or a company can go about offering fertility benefits, either through a lifetime maximum or an annual maximum on the insurance plan or by providing cycle coverage or cycle benefits through another provider. I've never seen more gratitude for any benefit offering than this one that helps build families. And honestly, a lot of managing benefits is heartbreaking. ⁓ I've had to, I haven't had to, but I have cried with coworkers who've lost a baby at childbirth. And I've, you know, also cried over... some of my coworkers who've had cancer diagnoses. And for me to keep my spirits up, I like to celebrate the wins. And that could be a back surgery that's successful in alleviating a lot of pain, but nothing makes my heart happier than when one of our families welcomes a new baby that they've wanted for years. Kelsey Willock (15:18) It's just so wonderful and I think that, you know, it's not only meaningful to women, it's meaningful to their partners too. It brings so much joy of the actual employee plus their partner who is at work or outside of work. So thanks for sharing that. I think it's a wonderful and immediately actionable. If you haven't already introduced it to your organization, I highly consider recommending it. What compensation and benefits trends do you think are going to shape the employee experience most over the next year? Erin Desrosiers (15:48) Well, one... that's been discussed for probably the past five years is where employees are working at home in the office or a mix of the two. And I find this very interesting because the research has been all over the place these past five years. And I think that's because we as individuals live very different lives. We're in different places in our careers and have different expectations with our families. And that makes all of us appreciate very different things and likewise, different companies have different ideas on what's fair in this regard. So that's been interesting to see. In many areas, technology and legislation, we see there's an early adopter and then it becomes more mainstream. But when it comes to where employees are working, we're seeing companies hold to their values and deciding what best fits their culture instead of doing what all the other companies are doing. And I think that's pretty exciting and I'm very curious to see if that will remain the case many years from now. Kelsey Willock (16:47) you couldn't be more correct in saying that the research is all over the place. I feel like sometimes I'll read an article one day that says, know, companies bringing everyone back into the office four or five days a week. And then the next article will be companies standing firm that remote office employees remain a part of their core culture. And I think it's a huge part of attracting the talent, right? You know, if you prioritize flexibility, those people will gravitate toward you. If you... prioritize something else, maybe you do get those folks to come more frequently into the office. But I myself am very interested in that trend as I run that remote company. So last question for you. I'd love to hear a 30 day experiment that you believe our listeners could try to boost financial well-being or even engagement at their companies. Erin Desrosiers (17:38) Well, we've talked some already about the 401k match. think that's a quick and easy win. We've talked some about shopping for the right medical plan. And if someone is taking a look at, you maybe I don't need to buy the most expensive plan, maybe a high deductible health plan would be, you know, better suited for me based on my medical and pharmacy expenses. A lot of those plans offer a health savings account and a lot of companies put money into those HSAs on behalf of their employees. So I would definitely recommend reading up on HSAs. say that they have a triple tax advantage because the money that you put in goes in pre-tax. The money that you invest in those accounts grows tax free and then whenever you use it for your eligible medical and pharmacy expenses, it comes out tax free for those reasons. And I guess, you know, something that's hopefully no one has offered this advice yet, but it's to share feedback with your benefits team. ⁓ We're typically notified when something isn't working well and we appreciate the opportunity to fix it of course but let us know what you appreciate about your benefits and let us know where you think we may be missing the mark. Just providing this feedback candidly and openly I think would really help benefits teams know what's on their employees minds and help them shape their benefits packages and programs for the future. So be a little bit more active and advocating for yourself and for your peers with your employer and you might just be surprised. Kelsey Willock (19:07) I love that one and it's so right. We often leave the Yelp review when things aren't going well or they're absolutely exceptional, but we forget that there's a lot of value in the middle. I interview a lot of folks like yourself and I think that sometimes there can be an intimidation factor of communicating also with HR, although HR and benefits teams do want to hear from their employees. It's something that we can also easily do. So if this is a good reminder for you, send the note to your team. They want to hear from you. Don't be afraid to do it. Erin, thank you so much for joining us in this conversation today. I've learned so much from you and some of the takeaways that I had that I absolutely loved for how you so meaningfully think about, you know, there's the affordability crisis going on. And while there is also this number that we can help people achieve in terms of finding happiness, and it also has to do with understanding the value of your total rewards, which includes decisions such as healthcare. I also just loved how you gave us such to tangible feedback of communicate with your HR and benefits teams. Don't be afraid to give them feedback so they can actually action it and also understand what is being appreciated at the company. Where can our listeners connect with you beyond this conversation? Erin Desrosiers (20:25) LinkedIn is the best place to find me. I am Erin Desrosiers, CCP. Kelsey Willock (20:30) Fabulous. We'll connect with Erin offline. Thank you so much for the conversation and look forward to having you hopefully on again soon. Erin Desrosiers (20:38) Thank you so much. you for all of the work that you're doing.