Latest / 3 and Out with John Middlekauff / Colin Cowherd Podcast - NFL Win Totals, USC vs. Notre Dame Revival? Steelers Headed For Disaster?

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Colin Cowherd Podcast - NFL Win Totals, USC vs. Notre Dame Revival? Steelers Headed For Disaster? · 3 and Out with John Middlekauff

0:01
Speaker 1: The volume.
0:08
Speaker 2: John Middlecoff is joining us. We'll chop it up for
0:12
Speaker 2: about thirty five minutes. I wanted to start with this.
0:16
Speaker 2: So reportedly in the last week, Notre Dame in USC
0:22
Speaker 2: have begun talking again. So USC always had all the
0:28
Speaker 2: leverage because they play a much better schedule, they're in
0:31
Speaker 2: a real conference. Notre Dame I was told a month
0:35
Speaker 2: ago Notre Dame initiated this. Notre Dame I was told
0:40
Speaker 2: this by somebody at a major television network that knows
0:44
Speaker 2: the athletic director of Notre Dame, and the athletic director
0:48
Speaker 2: had said, we're having a hell of a time scheduling
0:52
Speaker 2: games because what happens is with a twelve team playoff
0:55
Speaker 2: where two of the slots go to your James Madison's
0:59
Speaker 2: and Notre Dame with a week schedule is guaranteed if
1:02
Speaker 2: they're in the top tennis spot. It's essentially a nine
1:05
Speaker 2: team playoff. And if it doesn't expand people are like,
1:09
Speaker 2: you know, USC's, Ohio States, LSU's Michigan's are going timeout.
1:16
Speaker 2: It's a nineteen playoff. You can't lose more than two games.
1:21
Speaker 2: And because the big ten in the SEC, JOHN have
1:24
Speaker 2: now been fortified with Texas, Oklahoma, Oregon, Washington, US UCLA,
1:31
Speaker 2: and because of the NIL Vanderbilt and Indiana are now
1:36
Speaker 2: powerful that a lot of these schools told Notre Dame
1:39
Speaker 2: take a hike, we're not scheduling you. That is why
1:42
Speaker 2: Notre Dame is in favor of an expanded playoff suddenly,
1:46
Speaker 2: and why Notre Dame is revisiting a willingness to change
1:50
Speaker 2: the time of the USC game. USCOS said, we'll play
1:54
Speaker 2: a Labor Day weekend. We're not playing you in the
1:57
Speaker 2: middle of our Big ten schedule. I mean, if you
2:01
Speaker 2: look at go look up with Notre Dame's home schedule,
2:05
Speaker 2: I mean they don't have Miami, is it? It is
2:08
Speaker 2: unwatchable dreck. So essentially basically USC said you're out, and
2:13
Speaker 2: Notre Dame circled back.
2:15
Speaker 3: Well, I think one thing that obviously limited Notre Dame
2:18
Speaker 3: is they do this deal with the ACC, and the
2:19
Speaker 3: ACC became an awful conference. Right now, they play in Miami,
2:24
Speaker 3: but the rest of the conference, I mean, it's a
2:25
Speaker 3: lot of North Carolina's, it's a lot of teams that
2:29
Speaker 3: you get no credit for. Are they becoming a little
2:32
Speaker 3: Obviously they're one of the biggest brands in all the sports,
2:35
Speaker 3: but like, you know, some of these basketball programs that
2:38
Speaker 3: are really good that no one wants to play in
2:39
Speaker 3: the non conference. You know, it became Randy Bennett left
2:43
Speaker 3: Saint Mary's to come to Arizona State because once Gonzaga
2:46
Speaker 3: left the conference, no one would schedule them, so it
2:49
Speaker 3: made no point. Now I'm not comparing Notre Dame to
2:52
Speaker 3: Saint Mary's basketball, but when you're independent like that or
2:55
Speaker 3: in a conference where you're not forced to play these people,
2:58
Speaker 3: we're not going to do a deal with. If I'm
3:00
Speaker 3: in Indiana, if I'm Texas, if I'm whoever, I will
3:03
Speaker 3: do my occasional one offs with Ohio State or Michigan plays.
3:07
Speaker 3: You know, I guess Michigan Oregon are the same conference.
3:09
Speaker 3: But you know how some of the big programs they
3:11
Speaker 3: do the home and home non conference with another big program.
3:14
Speaker 3: It's also what became complicated in college sports is these
3:20
Speaker 3: rivalries like Clemson South Carolina, which means a lot to
3:24
Speaker 3: a lot of people, or Florida Florida State. Well, now
3:27
Speaker 3: with the playoffs, it's like, well, you know, it gets
3:30
Speaker 3: what I have. I know a lot of like assistant
3:33
Speaker 3: college football coaches, and I was talking to a buddy
3:35
Speaker 3: the other day on the road. He was actually at
3:37
Speaker 3: I think Modern Day. He's like, bro, this this place
3:40
Speaker 3: looks like a college, and the talent on this field
3:42
Speaker 3: of like sixteen year olds blows you away. But he said,
3:46
Speaker 3: there are a lot of rumors out there in college sports.
3:49
Speaker 3: You know, the government has got involved. One thing he
3:51
Speaker 3: heard is that potentially they're going to cap the earning.
3:56
Speaker 3: The conferences are going to try to get a hold
3:58
Speaker 3: of this because three years ago is like ten million
4:01
Speaker 3: dollars for a roster. Well within a couple of years
4:03
Speaker 3: is fifty million. So you just keep doing the math.
4:05
Speaker 3: Are we talking one hundred million dollars roster in three
4:07
Speaker 3: or four years? You can't maintain it's gonna be parallel
4:09
Speaker 3: with the NFL, you know, if you just play this out.
4:12
Speaker 3: But if you're gonna cap the players, you got to
4:14
Speaker 3: cap the coaches. So one thing I think these conferences
4:17
Speaker 3: that the rumors are out there is the conferences are
4:21
Speaker 3: gonna be like the most you could make. It doesn't
4:23
Speaker 3: mean everyone's gonna make the same, but you can't make
4:26
Speaker 3: more than a million dollars as a defensive end, but
4:28
Speaker 3: you can't make more as a head coach than ten
4:30
Speaker 3: million you can pay your coach for. But like that,
4:33
Speaker 3: you can't keep getting in this arms race. There is
4:35
Speaker 3: an economic kind of pullback because college football's or college
4:40
Speaker 3: sports have never been a normal business, right, the majority
4:43
Speaker 3: of the sports non basketball or non football. Some of
4:47
Speaker 3: these basketball programs non North Carolina, Kentucky. Not every basketball
4:50
Speaker 3: program is making money. So these tennis programs and are
4:53
Speaker 3: all subsidized by the football program. And now you've got
4:57
Speaker 3: to pay the football program and the players becomes a
5:00
Speaker 3: little more complicated. It's why you've seen these tennis programs.
5:03
Speaker 3: Well that's just the start, and then you got Title nine.
5:05
Speaker 3: So I think it's all intertwined. When you talk about
5:08
Speaker 3: the playoffs, the money. Isn't that football's greatest advantage, you know?
5:12
Speaker 3: I mean the Dodgers are way different economically than the
5:16
Speaker 3: race because of the local market. Well, the Cincinnati Bengals
5:19
Speaker 3: make the same as the Cowboys from the TV deal, right,
5:21
Speaker 3: So that's where I think college sports is kind of
5:24
Speaker 3: in this weird spot which they got to figure out
5:28
Speaker 3: in the near future because there's just too much money
5:29
Speaker 3: on the line. That's where Notre Dame eventually, don't they However,
5:32
Speaker 3: the Shiks kind of join the version of the Big
5:35
Speaker 3: Ten that becomes like the NFCAFC North versus South.
5:38
Speaker 2: I think that's what that's what they're trying to do.
5:40
Speaker 2: But just to give you a sense of Notre Dame's schedule,
5:43
Speaker 2: it's it's awful Wisconsin now, awful, Rice, Michigan State bad, Perdue,
5:50
Speaker 2: North Carolina awful, Stanford bad at BYU They'll win by
5:54
Speaker 2: two touchdowns off Navy Miami at home BC SMU series.
6:00
Speaker 2: It's just dreadful. So they're trying to you know, that
6:04
Speaker 2: USC game meant a lot to Notre Dame. Don't listen
6:08
Speaker 2: to x USC players who are in my day. USC's
6:11
Speaker 2: playing Oregon, Ohio State at Indiana Michigan. You know, they
6:16
Speaker 2: don't need to Washington. They're like, listen, we'll play on
6:20
Speaker 2: our terms. We're gonna play in LA We're gonna play
6:22
Speaker 2: in September. We're not putting in October right in the
6:25
Speaker 2: middle of our Indiana Ohio State three week slates. We're
6:31
Speaker 2: not doing it.
6:32
Speaker 3: Don't you think it's sad? Because Notre Dame now with
6:34
Speaker 3: Marcus Freeman, they were like, this is Brian Kelly two
6:37
Speaker 3: is a real top five, top six. From a talent
6:39
Speaker 3: stand if instead of the deal with the ACC, they
6:44
Speaker 3: had to deal with either the SEC or the Big Ten,
6:47
Speaker 3: it would be incredible. It's like, hey, Notre Dame Washington
6:49
Speaker 3: coming up, Notre Dame Oregon. Instead they're playing Belichick. Which
6:53
Speaker 3: you see the comments by the former quarterback for Belichick
6:56
Speaker 3: about how miserable that place is. It's like, Bill, the
7:00
Speaker 3: Patriot Way is not going to work with eighteen nineteen
7:02
Speaker 3: year olds, and you don't have the talent, so it's
7:04
Speaker 3: like it's a double whammy.
7:06
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, listen, this, we should talk about this.
7:08
Speaker 2: Let's be totally honest about Belichick. He took over the
7:12
Speaker 2: drafts the last seven to eight years. They were horrible.
7:16
Speaker 2: He's an atrocious drafter. Remember when the Rams inadvertently made
7:20
Speaker 2: fun of him for drafting a guard around early. I mean,
7:27
Speaker 2: people I talked to in the league are like, Bill
7:30
Speaker 2: is not a personnel guy. He does not understand He basically,
7:33
Speaker 2: if Bill wanted a player, he would reach three. He'd
7:36
Speaker 2: reach over half a round to get him. I mean
7:39
Speaker 2: usually gms go have players they like, but they'll be
7:43
Speaker 2: within five or six picks of kind of talent. Wise,
7:48
Speaker 2: you know, some GM looks at a card and think
7:50
Speaker 2: these are the next five good players. You try to
7:52
Speaker 2: find one in that five where value and need. Belichick
7:57
Speaker 2: would make massive twenty five pick reaches for a guard. Well,
8:03
Speaker 2: one year he drafted like two kickers and three guards,
8:06
Speaker 2: and it was like till you have the slowest offense
8:07
Speaker 2: in the league and he's basically taking you know, interior
8:11
Speaker 2: offensive lineman.
8:13
Speaker 3: Here's the other thing. You know, when they got hired,
8:15
Speaker 3: their big thing was the thirty third team, and we're
8:18
Speaker 3: gonna approach it like the NFL. You know, in the NFL,
8:21
Speaker 3: if it's the middle of training camp and you give
8:23
Speaker 3: your team of the day off, a lot of those
8:25
Speaker 3: guys go home to their wives and kids.
8:28
Speaker 1: Yeah.
8:28
Speaker 3: I remember when I worked for Pat Hill, who had
8:30
Speaker 3: worked for Belichick in Cleveland. We would give a practice off.
8:33
Speaker 3: We would take everyone to the water park. You know why,
8:36
Speaker 3: they're eighteen nineteen year old kids. They're just having a
8:38
Speaker 3: good time. Even though you're paying these guys now, they're
8:41
Speaker 3: still a nineteen year old boy. You know, they are
8:44
Speaker 3: a guy. Their interests. Belichick was used to yelling at
8:48
Speaker 3: Tom Brady when he was thirty five years old, and
8:50
Speaker 3: then everyone fell in line. And if you think about
8:52
Speaker 3: the last iteration of that great team in the mid
8:55
Speaker 3: twenty tens, Edelman mccordy high Tower, like they had a
8:59
Speaker 3: lot of veteran guy's late twenties, early thirties. He has
9:03
Speaker 3: a team and listen, the quarterback, I'm not gonna shoot
9:07
Speaker 3: the messenger here was not a great player, but he
9:10
Speaker 3: did just yeah, he did his transfer to wake Forest
9:12
Speaker 3: who went nine and four last year. So that's you know,
9:15
Speaker 3: the guy from Washington State that went there's a real program.
9:18
Speaker 2: They didn't have a player drafted at Carolina. Not a
9:21
Speaker 2: player drafted me.
9:23
Speaker 3: What I mean, there's no law, there's no lock that
9:25
Speaker 3: they're gonna have one this year. But my point is, Belichick,
9:29
Speaker 3: you lived in the northeast forever. I lived there for
9:30
Speaker 3: a couple of years. The wiring of those people it's
9:34
Speaker 3: very Wall Street like, you know, successful people in the
9:37
Speaker 3: private sector, they're emotionless, and Belichick fits that to a
9:40
Speaker 3: t well. He goes there. How often do people at
9:44
Speaker 3: seventy five When he has a resume of doing it
9:46
Speaker 3: a specific way, He's not gonna change. So he treats
9:49
Speaker 3: these guys exactly like he would treat Julian Edelman at
9:51
Speaker 3: thirty three. Meanwhile, this guy's eighteen, not nearly his football
9:55
Speaker 3: smart because he's never been taught. He's getting yelled at,
9:57
Speaker 3: he's overwhelmed, and he's not that good because college football's
10:01
Speaker 3: it's not the ex'es and the o's when it's the playoffs,
10:04
Speaker 3: but a lot of time in college sports about the
10:05
Speaker 3: jimmy's and the joe's, and he does not have those.
10:08
Speaker 3: But he's trying to force these the x'es and the
10:10
Speaker 3: o's that is way over the head of all these guys.
10:12
Speaker 3: And then his personality. He's not taking guys to the
10:16
Speaker 3: water park Saban used to take. They had movie night
10:18
Speaker 3: every Friday night before the game. Because he's dealing with kids,
10:22
Speaker 3: even though they're eighteen nineteen future pros. I just think
10:25
Speaker 3: Belichick when I look back, because I kind of bought in.
10:28
Speaker 3: I bought in would be strong, but I thought, yeah,
10:30
Speaker 3: I could looking back, like, no, it's a transactional sport,
10:34
Speaker 3: but you still got to be able to interact with
10:36
Speaker 3: a eighteen nineteen year old and they are wired a
10:38
Speaker 3: lot different than NFL player is twenty six, twenty seven
10:42
Speaker 3: years old.
10:43
Speaker 2: Let's be honest. Deon Sanders has mostly been a dud.
10:47
Speaker 2: They're not well coached. At Colorado. He's interesting, and so's Belichick. Belichick.
10:54
Speaker 2: You know that Bill Parcells used to have a rule
10:56
Speaker 2: that you can't really live by now, but his rule was,
10:59
Speaker 2: don't draft a celebrity quarterback, don't hire a celebrity coach.
11:03
Speaker 2: In college it's Belichick and Dion Sanders. Those teams aren't
11:08
Speaker 2: well coached, they don't have the personnel. I mean, what
11:11
Speaker 2: does Colorado do well? They're they're in the Big twelve.
11:14
Speaker 2: They're getting bullied every Saturday. Now, I think Colorado's limited.
11:18
Speaker 2: Carolina's got real money. But in the end, both those guys,
11:22
Speaker 2: it's it's college football. Look at the guys that win.
11:26
Speaker 2: Dan Lanning, Kurt Signetti, you know, it's grinders, Kyle Whittingham.
11:32
Speaker 2: You know, Lane Kiffin's got a little flash, but he's
11:34
Speaker 2: also a great recruiter. Like it's just it's a grind
11:37
Speaker 2: you have to be even though it's more of a
11:39
Speaker 2: transactional sport. It's it's sixty to seventy hour weeks. And
11:44
Speaker 2: you know, I think we have to be honest. Belichick
11:46
Speaker 2: and Dion both are. I'll give Dion credit because he
11:50
Speaker 2: does make him interesting, But there's just so much of
11:52
Speaker 2: that sort of Northeast ear against Mike Lombardi Belichick, like,
11:56
Speaker 2: let us teach you football? Is that, guys, you're not
11:59
Speaker 2: good with personnel at the college level. And for the record,
12:04
Speaker 2: you know the Houston Texans GM Casia Nick Casario, he
12:11
Speaker 2: was in New England for years when all those bad
12:14
Speaker 2: drafts were happening. He leaves and goes to the Texans,
12:18
Speaker 2: and Belichick doesn't have his thumb on him. Have you
12:21
Speaker 2: seen how well Houston has drafted under Nick Casario?
12:25
Speaker 3: They, I mean, honestly, Colin, they could if you remove
12:27
Speaker 3: the quarterback, they could have the best roster in the NFL.
12:31
Speaker 3: Right Obviously they don't have the best quarterback. So you
12:33
Speaker 3: might give the you know, edge to a couple other teams,
12:36
Speaker 3: but just remove the quarterback all the other positions. I
12:39
Speaker 3: might take the Texans. I would definitely take the Texas defense,
12:43
Speaker 3: you know well.
12:43
Speaker 2: I mean even this draft, they got Kamari Ramsey in
12:46
Speaker 2: the fifth round. He may end up being the best
12:48
Speaker 2: fifth round player. They have done such a good job
12:51
Speaker 2: to find middle and later round talent. And again, Nick
12:56
Speaker 2: Casario is in New England. Clearly Belichick didn't give him
13:01
Speaker 2: control because he just doesn't miss on skill players offensively
13:06
Speaker 2: got Tank Dell Woody marks, they don't miss on them.
13:10
Speaker 2: And New England couldn't draft him for seven eight years.
13:14
Speaker 2: So it just I mean, I think sometimes you have
13:16
Speaker 2: to revisit dynasties, you have to revisit legends and kind
13:22
Speaker 2: of peel back chapters and skin on it. And the
13:26
Speaker 2: more you look at the New England dynasty, I mean,
13:29
Speaker 2: it's a lot of it was Josh McDaniels, o seeing
13:32
Speaker 2: and Tom Brady quarterbacking. Overcame those last six or seven years.
13:37
Speaker 2: Overcame a lot of deficiencies in the skill department.
13:41
Speaker 3: I do think Bill is the greatest defensive mind of
13:43
Speaker 3: all time, but clearly toward that the latter half his arrogance.
13:49
Speaker 3: I mean, isn't Andy a good example. You've known Andy
13:52
Speaker 3: for a long time. No, he is no different now
13:56
Speaker 3: with the rings than he was when everyone said he
13:59
Speaker 3: was a choke artist. And Bill went into North Carolina
14:02
Speaker 3: like we invented football, and it's like, bro, you're in
14:05
Speaker 3: a laughingstock conference and you are getting lapped in your
14:08
Speaker 3: own com I mean, wake Forest, who just took the
14:11
Speaker 3: quarterback Dickard came from Washington State and went nine to four.
14:15
Speaker 3: So it is doable at Wake Forest. It should be
14:18
Speaker 3: doable in North Carolina. And is anyone gonna pick North Carolina?
14:21
Speaker 3: I mean, if you if I told you North Carolina
14:23
Speaker 3: doesn't even win six games this year, that's very believable. Right,
14:27
Speaker 3: There's no that they're gonna that they're gonna win any games.
14:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean in Miami is just freaking rolling because
14:34
Speaker 2: they've got so much money in the NIL. So two
14:41
Speaker 2: people in the NFL now have told me they're not sure.
14:48
Speaker 2: Omar Khan, the GM of the Steelers, who was in
14:51
Speaker 2: house for years, they're they're not really sure. He knows
14:55
Speaker 2: personnel particularly well. And this Aaron Rodgers situate. He's in
15:01
Speaker 2: Pittsburgh and the organization didn't know where he was, which,
15:06
Speaker 2: let's be honest about Aaron. He likes to make people uncomfortable. Now,
15:10
Speaker 2: the Jets and the Packers called his bluff and in
15:13
Speaker 2: both cases he was kind of burned and upset on
15:16
Speaker 2: how they treated him. So you'd think Aaron would learn,
15:19
Speaker 2: But in this case, Pittsburgh is backed into a corner.
15:25
Speaker 2: I was thinking about this today. I was driving back
15:27
Speaker 2: from working out and I knew we were going to talk.
15:30
Speaker 2: If you told me there was an organization a brand
15:33
Speaker 2: in sports, because right now, a lot of the big
15:35
Speaker 2: brands John Notre Dame, you know, Duke Basketball, Green Bay Packers, Eagles, Niners,
15:46
Speaker 2: you know a lot of the big brand Dodgers, Yankees, Braves, Cubs.
15:50
Speaker 2: They're doing very well in sports. The big brands are
15:53
Speaker 2: doing very well. If you told me, and if Luca
15:58
Speaker 2: was healthy, the Lakers would be you know, they would
16:00
Speaker 2: be at least giving ok See a fight, but they
16:03
Speaker 2: still want a playoff series without Luca and mostly without
16:05
Speaker 2: Austin Reeves. If you told me there was a big
16:08
Speaker 2: brand that in five years we looked up and was
16:10
Speaker 2: just an absolute mess, I would guess the Pittsburgh Steelers, John,
16:15
Speaker 2: they're going to have the highest paid defense again, fifth
16:20
Speaker 2: year rogue brutal.
16:25
Speaker 3: I got a text because I talked about this a
16:28
Speaker 3: couple of weeks ago after they were embarrassed on the
16:30
Speaker 3: Makai Lemon thing. Think about this the Cowboys, you know,
16:35
Speaker 3: funny Jerry gets talked about like he's the grand poo bah.
16:38
Speaker 3: If you watch some of the clips coming out of
16:39
Speaker 3: that draft room, Steven Jones, the guy running point on
16:42
Speaker 3: Steve ru I mean, Jerry's in his mid eighties. He
16:46
Speaker 3: likes talking, but Steven runs the show. They knew exactly
16:49
Speaker 3: who the Steelers wanted, because if you would have asked
16:52
Speaker 3: me the day of the draft, I would not have
16:54
Speaker 3: said they would have liked wanted a wide receiver. They
16:56
Speaker 3: just traded for Pittman they invisted last year in DK.
16:59
Speaker 3: But yeah, they could take a wide receiver in the
17:00
Speaker 3: third fourth round. I wouldn't have guessed in the first round.
17:03
Speaker 3: And they have a lot of other question marks on
17:05
Speaker 3: the offensive line. Their left tackle just got has that
17:07
Speaker 3: neck injury. So I talked about it and I had
17:09
Speaker 3: to someone in associate with the league as well, shoot
17:11
Speaker 3: me a text and said that I have been told
17:15
Speaker 3: that Omar Khan does not pick up a clicker, so
17:17
Speaker 3: he's not watching any tape. But he doesn't or he's
17:21
Speaker 3: not that involved with the contracts at this point either, right,
17:24
Speaker 3: And I said, well, you know, Apple, they just hired
17:28
Speaker 3: this guy to take over for Tim Cook. He's a
17:30
Speaker 3: products guy. I would expect when he takes over for Tim,
17:34
Speaker 3: like huge emphasis on whatever the next AirPods is, whatever
17:38
Speaker 3: the next like that's what he does. When Howie was
17:41
Speaker 3: first hired as a GM. He was a cap guy, right,
17:44
Speaker 3: and he I need you wheeling and dealing on the money. Now,
17:48
Speaker 3: I was around Howie. He spent a lot of time
17:50
Speaker 3: watching players, and he's clearly grown into a great evaluator.
17:53
Speaker 3: But like when I hire you and you have a
17:55
Speaker 3: specific background, like, hey, John, you're gonna do a podcast,
17:58
Speaker 3: what are you gonna talk about football? You know, we
18:00
Speaker 3: don't need to talk about ten million things at first,
18:02
Speaker 3: just go down that lane. Then expand from there. Well,
18:05
Speaker 3: shouldn't his background be a dominant cap guy, less need
18:09
Speaker 3: what's his background scouting players? John Schneider scouting players? Then
18:13
Speaker 3: as you get more comfortable doing other things, well, Omar
18:16
Speaker 3: Khan's background should be dominant at wheeling and dealing in money,
18:20
Speaker 3: because that's kind of his background. They're not good at that.
18:23
Speaker 3: Even last year. It's like DK Metcalf out of nowhere.
18:26
Speaker 3: That deal made no sense to me. It's like this guy,
18:29
Speaker 3: you're gonna take John Schneider's third contract guy and immediately,
18:34
Speaker 3: I mean, if they could do that one over, they
18:35
Speaker 3: would not have done that deal, right, clear, I just
18:39
Speaker 3: watched the Steelers and went you could nitpick Colbert at
18:42
Speaker 3: the end in Tomlin, but their identity never changed, and
18:46
Speaker 3: Kevin Colbert felt like their version of a guy that
18:48
Speaker 3: would have been the Packers GM old school scout, tough
18:51
Speaker 3: guy looked for, you know, physical players. Every scout misses
18:55
Speaker 3: or every GM misses. But if I hire Omar Khan
18:59
Speaker 3: or I hire a quote unquote cap guy to be
19:01
Speaker 3: my general manager, I would expect to be pretty dynamic
19:06
Speaker 3: from a financial standpoint. And then I mean part of
19:09
Speaker 3: the reason how he gets so much credit around draft
19:11
Speaker 3: time because he's Wheeling and Delan. Well, his background if
19:14
Speaker 3: it wasn't, if he didn't wasn't obsessed with football, he
19:17
Speaker 3: would have been a finance type guy. So that should
19:19
Speaker 3: be his comfort zone is Wheelan and Delan market values.
19:22
Speaker 3: You watch the Steelers, that was a pretty all time
19:27
Speaker 3: embarrassing moment to have a kid on the phone and listen.
19:31
Speaker 3: McCarthy's to blame to By all accounts, you know, McCarthy
19:34
Speaker 3: and his people couldn't keep their mouth shut because the
19:36
Speaker 3: Cowboys obviously were connected to McCarthy. They knew exactly who
19:39
Speaker 3: they wanted, and they knew that. They got on the
19:42
Speaker 3: phone and started shopping around. Who would want mackay Lemon.
19:44
Speaker 3: They wanted their division rival. I think the Steelers right now.
19:49
Speaker 3: One they feel like this relationship between the quarterback and
19:53
Speaker 3: the team feels like two people that would love. It's
19:57
Speaker 3: like they're in a relationship, but they want to be
19:58
Speaker 3: dating other people, but they can't find other people because
20:00
Speaker 3: if they could, if Aaron could go to a team
20:02
Speaker 3: that like the Buffalo bill you know, a team that
20:05
Speaker 3: he thinks he could win, he would, but they don't exist.
20:08
Speaker 2: It's called Aaron Tomorrow.
20:10
Speaker 3: He'd be gone. Oh he'd walk there, you know. And
20:14
Speaker 3: if the Steelers could find a young quarterback that had
20:16
Speaker 3: a ceiling in a future, they would not pick up
20:18
Speaker 3: the phone and call Anaron Rodgers. So they're kind of
20:21
Speaker 3: both stuck with each other. Aaron knows he's got a
20:23
Speaker 3: little leverage because what are they gonna do? Roll out
20:26
Speaker 3: Will Howard's six round pick. Typically you don't just start
20:29
Speaker 3: a six round pick week one, right, and so McCarthy
20:32
Speaker 3: can talk them up. And if you noticed, I think
20:35
Speaker 3: at the owners meetings he said, if I was here
20:39
Speaker 3: when the draft was last year, Will Howard would not
20:41
Speaker 3: have been a six round pick, basically insinuating we would
20:44
Speaker 3: have drafted him higher. Kind of trying to put like
20:46
Speaker 3: I like this guy. It's like, come on, Mike, like
20:49
Speaker 3: there's a reason he was there for reasons. So I
20:52
Speaker 3: just think the Steelers have a lot like the Packers,
20:56
Speaker 3: This consistent organization my entire life have won. The difference
20:59
Speaker 3: is Green Bay has been able to kind of keep
21:00
Speaker 3: it in house. And just from Ted to Goot back
21:04
Speaker 3: to ron Wolf, it always this was a little clunky,
21:08
Speaker 3: and it's not, you know, DaCosta take it over for Ozzy,
21:11
Speaker 3: pretty smooth transition. This has not been a smooth transition.
21:15
Speaker 3: And I think this organization and I think the true
21:17
Speaker 3: fans know something's a little off. And when Tomlin tapped out,
21:22
Speaker 3: I think he knew this little Sean Paytony a couple
21:24
Speaker 3: of years ago with the Saints, like this thing's over,
21:27
Speaker 3: I gotta get out now.
21:29
Speaker 2: Yeah. And I think you know you're seeing this in
21:33
Speaker 2: the NBA now where the NFL is, it's really becoming
21:38
Speaker 2: a GM league. I mean like in the NBA, I
21:40
Speaker 2: mean the best teams all have one thing in common. Celtics, Spurs, OKC,
21:46
Speaker 2: Minnesota Knicks have really good front offices. I've always said
21:51
Speaker 2: with the Knicks, when when James Dolan built the Spear
21:55
Speaker 2: in Vegas for two and a half years. He stopped
21:57
Speaker 2: meddling in basketball, and they built this pretty good roster.
22:00
Speaker 3: He wasn't right, you know.
22:01
Speaker 2: So it's like, I mean, most of the in the NFL.
22:04
Speaker 2: You start looking at the best teams. Well, I mean,
22:06
Speaker 2: it's like Seattle in LA in Philadelphia and Detroit and
22:11
Speaker 2: Kansas City, and the one thing they have in common
22:13
Speaker 2: isn't superstar quarterbacks. It's really good front offices. Because when
22:18
Speaker 2: you have these hard caps, that's kind of the difference.
22:21
Speaker 2: And I think Pittsburgh, I mean when two people I
22:24
Speaker 2: call two people who know the Steeler situation and they're
22:28
Speaker 2: both like they're in trouble and John it does not
22:33
Speaker 2: take long, and competitive interest it does not take long
22:36
Speaker 2: in competitive industries to flow. I mean, it's it's I mean,
22:42
Speaker 2: you just start looking around the NFL right now, I
22:44
Speaker 2: don't even know what Pittsburgh gets. Today's show is brought
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Speaker 2: gambling problem called one eight hundred gambler. Okay, I thought,
24:27
Speaker 2: I thought it was interesting. I read the Athletic and
24:30
Speaker 2: they were ranking rosters. They have a roster composition, and
24:35
Speaker 2: it was a it's an analytic formula based on I
24:40
Speaker 2: guess wins, and now rosters aren't even quarter. Obviously, you
24:47
Speaker 2: can have weak linebackers in Josh Allen, and you're going
24:50
Speaker 2: to rank very high. But the Bills ranked third in
24:54
Speaker 2: terms of roster composition, in terms of quality of roster.
25:00
Speaker 2: Rams Seahawks, I think it may have been rams Seahawks
25:04
Speaker 2: are up there Philadelphia, but the Bills were ahead of
25:10
Speaker 2: the Eagles. Again, Josh Allen's you know, it's like having
25:14
Speaker 2: Otani in the lineup, he's worth like three players. Is
25:18
Speaker 2: it possible? I always heard Brandon Bean was a cap
25:21
Speaker 2: guy first, not as much, not as much a scout guy,
25:25
Speaker 2: but a cap guy. But I do think there are
25:27
Speaker 2: people in the NFL that get overvalued or undervalued. I
25:31
Speaker 2: think we've gotten to a point with Brandon Bean because
25:34
Speaker 2: they haven't won a championship. He just gets smacked and
25:37
Speaker 2: he's a little defensive. He's had a couple of missteps
25:39
Speaker 2: with the media. But I told somebody the other day,
25:42
Speaker 2: I said, it's if I told you that a team
25:46
Speaker 2: was elite at quarterback, running back, left tackle, tight end,
25:50
Speaker 2: and made a really good wide receiver acquisition in the offseason,
25:55
Speaker 2: You'd be like, oh, that's a pretty well run unit.
25:57
Speaker 2: And I'm like, well, that's Brandon Bean in Buffalo. I
26:00
Speaker 2: think that the second or the third best team in
26:01
Speaker 2: the league. What do you make of the Brandon Bean
26:04
Speaker 2: and I thought they had a pretty good draft. They
26:07
Speaker 2: you know, they got an edge rusher, which they needed,
26:10
Speaker 2: They did a lot of defense. They got a wide
26:12
Speaker 2: receiver from Yukon who I actually watched a few times.
26:15
Speaker 2: I thought he was really clever. I thought it was
26:16
Speaker 2: a really clever like fourth round pick. How do you
26:19
Speaker 2: view Buffalo macro level and Brandon bean Well.
26:23
Speaker 3: I think he became polarizing because anytime the coach gets fired,
26:27
Speaker 3: and it felt like it was a package deal with
26:29
Speaker 3: the GM and the coach. Remember they came together from Carolina,
26:33
Speaker 3: they had worked hand in hand. Obviously they had butted
26:35
Speaker 3: heads over the years. I'm sure personnel wise, it feels
26:39
Speaker 3: like a backstabbing, you know. I think famously, John Harbaugh
26:42
Speaker 3: when he was introduced with the Giants, never brought up
26:44
Speaker 3: Eric to Costa's name, and I just think sometimes those
26:47
Speaker 3: relationships can be unique. Usually one guy sits with the
26:51
Speaker 3: owner during the game while the other guy's on the field.
26:53
Speaker 3: And the Bills have had, i mean, the most devastating
26:57
Speaker 3: losses in the history of sports over the course of
27:00
Speaker 3: thirty forty years. So I mean, clearly he's pretty good.
27:04
Speaker 3: And I always defended Sean McDermott. He wasn't perfect, but
27:07
Speaker 3: his resume speaks for itself. That franchise was dead, and
27:11
Speaker 3: you know, I think the defense consistently let him down.
27:13
Speaker 3: He was a defensive guy and that's why he got Ultimately,
27:16
Speaker 3: I think they turned on him, right because if you
27:18
Speaker 3: told me Sean McDermott was an offensive guy. I think
27:21
Speaker 3: he'd probably still be there. But it's like your background
27:24
Speaker 3: is defense, so it was easy to point out. Listen,
27:28
Speaker 3: they've invested in some players over the years. In its backfire,
27:31
Speaker 3: they paid von Miller a lot of money I didn't like,
27:34
Speaker 3: which is gonna happen to everything at all, because remember
27:36
Speaker 3: the Rams trade for him and he has a sack
27:39
Speaker 3: like every game in the playoffs, in the super Bowl,
27:41
Speaker 3: and then they gave him fifty and it blew up
27:43
Speaker 3: in their face. But they've also made a lot of
27:45
Speaker 3: good moves. Yeah, I mean, Shakir is an excellent player.
27:48
Speaker 3: Cook in the second round is one of the best
27:50
Speaker 3: running backs in the league. The tight ends are good.
27:54
Speaker 3: To me. A Josh Allen tight move is do you
27:57
Speaker 3: get a contract for life as a GM when you're
28:00
Speaker 3: part of the unit that trades up to land him
28:02
Speaker 3: at seven? Remember Sam, Darnold, Baker Mayfield went off the
28:05
Speaker 3: board before Josh Allen, so it wasn't like It's not
28:07
Speaker 3: like they drafted him two overall. So I think he's
28:11
Speaker 3: pretty good. I think sometimes listen to the NFL. You know,
28:15
Speaker 3: all these people can be a little insecure, and he's
28:19
Speaker 3: he's pretty tied in with the media and he has
28:22
Speaker 3: some media friends, so I think you can hear negative
28:25
Speaker 3: things said about him, but there's no disputing they've been
28:27
Speaker 3: I'm gonna pick him probably win the Super Bowl. So
28:30
Speaker 3: they do a really, really good job. When you have
28:32
Speaker 3: a quarterback that's that good, though, it's just hard to
28:35
Speaker 3: get the credit when we watch your team and Gods,
28:38
Speaker 3: I mean, whenever they beat the Ravens over the course
28:40
Speaker 3: the last couple of years, we are takeaway it was
28:42
Speaker 3: always like Ravens had way better players, you know how
28:44
Speaker 3: they pull that off? It was Josh And I think
28:48
Speaker 3: anytime you're in that scenario, it's hard to get credit
28:50
Speaker 3: as a GM. Like with the Eagles, sometimes they win
28:53
Speaker 3: despite the quarterback right right, and that's where he gets
28:55
Speaker 3: a lot of credit. You watched John Schneider the team
28:57
Speaker 3: he built over the last three or four years, elite
29:02
Speaker 3: impact player, like every position. You watch the Bills sometimes
29:05
Speaker 3: you're like, how many players would teams do everything? How
29:10
Speaker 3: many guys on their team? If you remove Josh, would
29:12
Speaker 3: teams trade a first round or to acquire And I
29:15
Speaker 3: think if we played that game, there'd be a lot
29:17
Speaker 3: of guys on a lot of the good teams there
29:19
Speaker 3: wouldn't be Look at the Chiefs they get rid of
29:21
Speaker 3: Ty McDuffie boom first rounder. How many players on the
29:24
Speaker 3: Bills not named Josh Allen? Would Sean mcvahan less need
29:27
Speaker 3: have traded pick twenty nine to.
29:28
Speaker 2: Acquire Dion Dawkins left tackle?
29:32
Speaker 3: Maybe older though older now though, you know?
29:35
Speaker 2: And maybe the tight end dalton Y Yeah, I.
29:38
Speaker 3: Mean a couple of years ago. Maybe Cook. I mean,
29:40
Speaker 3: you put Cook on their team, they would be pretty good.
29:43
Speaker 3: But not that many guys on defense, that's for damn sure.
29:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm gonna give you a couple over unders. Give
29:50
Speaker 2: me your strong opinion. New England Patriots only nine and
30:02
Speaker 2: a half. That's what the Jets and the Dolphins in
30:05
Speaker 2: their division. John, think about that now, I want you
30:09
Speaker 2: to think about that. That's two and zero against the Jets.
30:11
Speaker 2: That's two and oh against the Dolphins. Dolphins maybe the
30:13
Speaker 2: weakest roster in the league. They're four wins baked in Vegas.
30:18
Speaker 2: Doesn't think they have another six wins in them.
30:23
Speaker 3: I would say about the Jets, they've added a lot
30:27
Speaker 3: of good players in the draft. They just extended Breeste
30:29
Speaker 3: Hall if Gino Smith can just be capable in five
30:32
Speaker 3: or six games throughout the season, they could knock a
30:34
Speaker 3: random team off.
30:35
Speaker 2: Here or there.
30:36
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would take the New England Patriots as sitting
30:39
Speaker 3: here right now like a nine or ten win season.
30:42
Speaker 3: Just to be safe, I'd probably hammer the under. I
30:44
Speaker 3: do think the Vrabel thing is something that clearly just
30:46
Speaker 3: has not gone away. There is an element. I mean,
30:49
Speaker 3: I love golf. I think Tiger Woods, everyone's staring at you,
30:52
Speaker 3: not just because you're famous for a different reason. Can
30:55
Speaker 3: be a weird scenario. There are away games. Football is
30:58
Speaker 3: a little different basketball. They're not necessarily right on top
31:01
Speaker 3: of you, but they're gonna be a lot of things screamed.
31:04
Speaker 3: You know. It's it's gonna be uh. It's gonna be
31:06
Speaker 3: a unique environment for the Patriots from an off the
31:09
Speaker 3: field standpoint. Also, their schedule was easy last year and
31:14
Speaker 3: everyone's gunning for you now. I mean they just won
31:17
Speaker 3: the No one's taking you lightly. You just have a
31:20
Speaker 3: random game this year interconference or I mean out of
31:22
Speaker 3: conference they're play they get Seattle, you know, So it's
31:25
Speaker 3: strength of schedule. It adds up. So I'd go nine
31:28
Speaker 3: to ten wins now if you tell me Drake May
31:30
Speaker 3: takes another step and he becomes two point zero version
31:33
Speaker 3: of Josh Allen, then I believe you. But I I
31:36
Speaker 3: could see I could see them being better in the
31:38
Speaker 3: big picture and not winning as many.
31:40
Speaker 2: Games forty nine, ten and a half.
31:48
Speaker 3: Uh. Well, to see the way the schedule shakes out
31:51
Speaker 3: this year, I I i'd probably, if I was playing
31:53
Speaker 3: it safe, go ten and seven. So I take the under.
31:56
Speaker 3: They're their coaching staff. I mean, as long as you've
31:58
Speaker 3: got Kyle, they're going to be pretty dependent on last
32:01
Speaker 3: year's Remember they split with the Rams in Seattle, so
32:08
Speaker 3: it's not they have two of the best teams in
32:10
Speaker 3: their division. But they're comfortable playing them. I mean, they
32:13
Speaker 3: went down last year and beat the Rams on a
32:15
Speaker 3: Thursday night football game with Max Jones starting. Now, they
32:18
Speaker 3: got Seattle week one, which was clearly they played them
32:23
Speaker 3: late and it was a different ball game. But they
32:27
Speaker 3: it's not one of those. If you tell me the Bears,
32:29
Speaker 3: let's say Week one is the Bears at Seattle in Seattle,
32:32
Speaker 3: that's a tough spot for the Bears, right, super loud,
32:34
Speaker 3: great defense. Wouldn't shock you if the Bears won eleven
32:38
Speaker 3: games and lost that game by ten points. The Niners
32:41
Speaker 3: in that environment are used to playing it, so I
32:46
Speaker 3: feel pretty comfortable saying they'll be ten and seven.
32:49
Speaker 2: Pretty interesting in the best division in football. Based on
32:53
Speaker 2: record the last two years, despite the JJ McCarthy situation,
33:00
Speaker 2: the Vikings are eight and a half over under Bears
33:03
Speaker 2: are nine and a half with Ben Johnson and Caleb
33:06
Speaker 2: Williams eight and a half of the Vikings is that?
33:13
Speaker 2: Is that a tip of the cap to Kevin O'Connell,
33:17
Speaker 2: Kyler Murray. They just went and got Jawan Jennings from
33:20
Speaker 2: the Niners. What do you make of that? That number
33:23
Speaker 2: feels like if they were in the NFC South, in
33:26
Speaker 2: the NFC North, eight and a half of the Vikings?
33:29
Speaker 2: Is that the ultimate tip of the cap to Kevin O'Connell.
33:32
Speaker 3: Well, I mean two years ago they won fourteen, right
33:34
Speaker 3: and last year they won nine. I'm hammering that under.
33:38
Speaker 3: I think to me they got five six, seven wins
33:40
Speaker 3: written all over. They are to me, they're to me
33:43
Speaker 3: the last place team in that division. Now, like you said,
33:46
Speaker 3: it's a tough division. I think the Lions are going
33:49
Speaker 3: to be solid this year. They to me, both those
33:51
Speaker 3: two teams were nine and eight. I think the Lions
33:53
Speaker 3: were a better version than the Vikings. Right, there were
33:55
Speaker 3: two nine and eight teams. If I had to say
33:56
Speaker 3: which team was better last year, I'm taking the Lions
34:00
Speaker 3: are going to be playoff team again and the Packers
34:03
Speaker 3: sneaky have a lot of question marks. You look at
34:05
Speaker 3: their roster, they've lost a lot of the core guys
34:07
Speaker 3: last year, either through trades or in free agency. Before
34:10
Speaker 3: came out the owners meetings like, yeah, we had some
34:12
Speaker 3: internal locker room problems. Clearly some of the guys weren't
34:15
Speaker 3: all in the same thing, the youth movement. I think
34:20
Speaker 3: that some of the guys I think you might have
34:22
Speaker 3: been talking about the offensive guys because if you looked
34:24
Speaker 3: at it, they let Dobbs walk and they traded Wix
34:26
Speaker 3: the Eagles, I think they had people inside that wide
34:28
Speaker 3: receiver room that thought they were stars and wanted the
34:31
Speaker 3: ball more. When you look at the catches on the team.
34:34
Speaker 3: I looked the other day, Tucker Kraft led the team
34:37
Speaker 3: with like fifty five sixty. They did not have multiple
34:39
Speaker 3: guys like seventy eighty catches so wide receivers. You've always
34:42
Speaker 3: been saying this for a long time. The icing on
34:45
Speaker 3: the cake. These guys, no matter how high character they are,
34:48
Speaker 3: they still a little about mem Ii. And you start
34:52
Speaker 3: look at aj Brown, you start not getting the ball.
34:54
Speaker 3: You start. The offense was a little weird. They were
34:56
Speaker 3: winning games. They'd bring in Malik Willis to just be
34:59
Speaker 3: like run quarter back option all game long. And it
35:01
Speaker 3: was working, you know, because Laflour at Fairenos whatever we
35:04
Speaker 3: had to do to win the game. Wide receivers want
35:07
Speaker 3: to run go routes and post routes, and that's you know.
35:10
Speaker 3: I think Lafloor's. Laflour is much more like Kyle and McVeigh.
35:14
Speaker 3: I've always said this. McVeigh and Kevin O'Connell are more
35:17
Speaker 3: versions of like an Andy Reid where they want to throw.
35:20
Speaker 3: Lafleur is very comfortable. If Josh Jacobs was healthy, he
35:23
Speaker 3: would love to have a fifteen hundred yard runner, you know.
35:26
Speaker 3: He wants to run the ball, control of the clock.
35:28
Speaker 3: Not the most wide receiver friendly offense. So they're gonna
35:31
Speaker 3: be very I think Christian Watson is very content. Just
35:35
Speaker 3: pay me a little money, let me run go routes.
35:37
Speaker 3: They're gonna be very dependent on Golden you know, taking
35:39
Speaker 3: a huge step up this year, but their organization has
35:43
Speaker 3: kind of proven anytime you kind of bet against them,
35:45
Speaker 3: they're they're just always kind of in the mix. So
35:48
Speaker 3: to me, Bears Lions, then I have the Green Bay,
35:51
Speaker 3: then I have Minnesota. I got one for you.
35:54
Speaker 2: Though.
35:54
Speaker 3: I like this team a lot, and I thought the
35:56
Speaker 3: weekend they had was good. Is I think the Bengal
36:01
Speaker 3: they've taken a lot of shit.
36:02
Speaker 2: Last two years. They've upgraded that D line.
36:05
Speaker 3: You know, Burrow's got a little lebroad in him, right,
36:08
Speaker 3: He's telling these guys forcing their hands, and in fairness,
36:10
Speaker 3: he's not been wrong about some of the stuff. Right
36:12
Speaker 3: the indoor. You play in Ohio and we have an
36:16
Speaker 3: indoor practice facility. Listen, you invest that much into two
36:20
Speaker 3: wide receivers, it gets tough to economically build your team.
36:24
Speaker 3: But when they traded the tenth pick for Dexter Lawrence,
36:26
Speaker 3: I mean that was a ballsy, aggressive move and I
36:31
Speaker 3: just think that then they draft I think cashus Howel
36:34
Speaker 3: a lot like Ruben Bain if his arms were thirty
36:37
Speaker 3: three instead of twenty nine or thirty. Cash's Howel's going
36:41
Speaker 3: in the first round because you couldn't watch he was
36:43
Speaker 3: by far the best player on Texas and him every
36:45
Speaker 3: time you watched he had a little cutoff. You could
36:47
Speaker 3: see his abs and he's coming around the end like
36:49
Speaker 3: he's Von Miller fifteen years ago for that program. And
36:52
Speaker 3: they get him in the second round. They signed Mafay,
36:55
Speaker 3: who they have to overpay a little bit in Cincinnati,
36:58
Speaker 3: but you just get more bodies. Now, their defensive line
37:01
Speaker 3: is way better. We know their offense is good. They're
37:04
Speaker 3: to me that pick to win that division.
37:05
Speaker 2: I bot I just don't know if jesse mentor he
37:09
Speaker 2: could be, but he's never been a head coach.
37:11
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean Baltimore had a once they got out
37:14
Speaker 3: of the Crosby thing. Now you had hendrickson their draft.
37:17
Speaker 3: I mean they get a plug and play starter, Rick Guard,
37:20
Speaker 3: who's fantastic. Their second round pick, Zion from Missouri. Everyone
37:24
Speaker 3: liked him a lot, So I would based on their history,
37:27
Speaker 3: those players are going to be good. This is the
37:29
Speaker 3: coaching staff, and I would say Lamar's health. You know,
37:32
Speaker 3: Lamar last year, for the first time in his career,
37:35
Speaker 3: looked like a shell of himself. At times, it was like, look,
37:38
Speaker 3: he wasn't moving well, he wasn't. It was off.
37:42
Speaker 2: He looked like a pitcher who lost like five miles
37:44
Speaker 2: an hour off his fastball.
37:45
Speaker 3: He was lism like twenty twelve. He's thrown ninety eight,
37:48
Speaker 3: and then he was thrown eighty eight and balls were
37:49
Speaker 3: going out the park.
37:54
Speaker 2: All right, good stuff. John Middlecoff, M NFL Scout. See
37:59
Speaker 2: there you go, buddy.
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