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MTM - Interview with Mark Baumgartner · More Than Medicine

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Welcome to More Than Medicine, where Jesus is more than enough for the ills that plague our culture and hosted by author and physician Dr.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: Robert Jackson and his wife Carlotta and daughter Annabella.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: So listen up because the doctor is in.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: Welcome to More Than Medicine.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: I'm your host, Dr.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Robert Jackson, bringing to you biblical insights and stories from the Country Doctor's rusty, dusty scrapbook.
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm privileged today to have online Mark Baumgartner, who's from Columbia, South Carolina, and he's got some very interesting stories to share with us today.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: Mark, welcome to More Than Medicine.
• 0:45
  Speaker 3: Hello, Dr.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: Jackson.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: Well, I want you to start by telling my listening audience a little bit about yourself and about your family, and then I want you to tell them a little bit about the ministry that you're involved with down in Columbia, South Carolina.
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: Okay, yeah.
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: Um I'm married to Carrie.
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: We have six children, two of whom were adopted.
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: Um we've been married 27 years.
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: We live in Columbia.
• 1:11
  Speaker 3: I grew up in Ohio.
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: Uh we've lived in North Carolina, Florida, Texas, and now Columbia, South Carolina.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: My goodness, are y'all gypsies?
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: I just went where the work was.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: I hear you.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: I hear you.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Now I understand you used to be an airline pilot.
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: That's correct.
• 1:32
  Speaker 3: Um I've always loved aviation, and um one of my dreams was to be an airline pilot, and I worked my way up and actually flew for an airline for a couple years and realized uh it was hard being gone with a young family, and so I I switched gears and spent uh time as a corporate airline, a corporate pilot flying folks around in private uh business aircraft.
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: And while I was doing that, it afforded me uh the time and ability to start the ministry we're gonna talk about.
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: Well, I didn't tell you this when we were talking beforehand, but I'm jealous.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: I got my private pilot license when I was 17, and I flew for a number of years, so listening to you talk about flying uh corporate planes just turned me green within me.
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: We'll talk about that more later.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: So go ahead and tell us a little bit more about uh how you got started in the ministry that you're with.
• 2:31
  Speaker 3: So when we lived in uh Florida, we lived in Orlando, and our church was literally four doors down from an abortion clinic, and uh the pastor, the pastors said, you know, to the congregation, we really shouldn't ignore what's going on just four doors down.
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: We should try to we should try to talk to these moms and try to save some lives and share the gospel.
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: And so I signed up to do that, and um I would go there with uh one or two of the the pastors and we would try to talk to the mothers, we'd try to give them a Bible and just share the gospel.
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: And I met a lifelong friend there.
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: Um he's been a mentor to me since then.
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: He's 30 years old, uh, 30 years older than me, and uh he became like a uh like a father in many ways to me.
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: And so he was uh helping with the pro-life uh efforts down there uh to train folks and get them strategically involved on the sidewalk.
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: There were seven abortion clinics at the time, and so uh his name's Jerry Chase, and we became great friends.
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: And um anyway, my dream had been to fly for the airlines, and I finally uh in 2005 um got hired by a regional airline and moved to Houston to fly out of Intercontinental Air Airport and uh put put the uh work on the sidewalk out of my mind and never never thought more about it.
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: But years later, uh moved to Columbia, and when I was flying uh for the corporate job, I wanted to go on a trip to uh Minneapolis to hear Dr.
• 4:21
  Speaker 3: John Piper, who's a pastor up there, a ministry called Desiring God.
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: I wanted to go to his uh conference to hear the preaching.
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: And so um my friend Jerry that I met in Florida had retired.
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: He and his wife moved to Minneapolis, and so I called them up and said, Jerry, I'd like to go to this conference.
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: It's in your town.
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: Could I come and stay with you?
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: And of course, he welcomed me.
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: And uh every morning before the conference, we'd have breakfast and he'd pray, we'd pray together, and I'd go off to the conference.
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: And the very last day of the conference, he asked me, he said, Mark, have you ever considered going out to the abortion clinic in Colombia like you and I used to do in Orlando?
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: And I said, Jerry, I've never thought about it, but I'll pray about it.
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: Well, in my mind, I'm fighting against the idea.
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: I did not want to do it.
• 5:18
  Speaker 3: I didn't want to go out to the abortion clinic in Colombia like I did in Orlando just because I knew, you know, folks like that go out to abortion clinics, they're um, you know, there's a stereotype.
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: There's a people look down on you, they're mocking you, they're driving by, you know, they're giving you the one-finger salute, and I didn't want to do that.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: And it's a spiritual battlefield on top of that.
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so I'm thinking that in my mind, and I get to this conference, and John Piper preaches the final sermon on Hebrews 11, and he's talking about Moses being willing to suffer the reproach of Christ.
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: Right, right.
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: And I was like, wow, am I willing to suffer the reproach of Christ?
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: Am I willing to be identified with Christ and take the reproach for being out there like that?
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: And God convicted me.
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: I two weeks later, after that, I was out on the sidewalk in Columbia in front of the abortion clinic for the very first time.
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: And the very first woman I met, I had taken my aviation business card and on the back I wrote, It's not too late to change your mind.
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: There are caring people that want to help you.
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: And I put my cell phone number.
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: And a lady pulled in and rolled down her window and took the card, and she continued up into the parking lot and parked and went inside.
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: And a few minutes later, she came out holding a piece of paper and drove right past me and didn't stop this time.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: But when she got to the top of the hill, she put her brakes on and she turned around and came back down to me and rolled down her window, and she's holding back tears, and she said, Can you really help me?
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: And I looked down on the seat of her car and I saw a piece of paper from Planned Parenthood where she had scheduled an abortion for a Tuesday.
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: For Tuesday, like a couple days later.
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: This was a Saturday.
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: And I explained how I wanted to help her.
• 7:27
  Speaker 3: We we exchanged contact information, uh, cell phone numbers, and she was telling me some issues that were were driving her to have the abortion, like why she felt she needed it.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: So I went to work and and found people that could help her with those things, and um was texting her and she wasn't responding.
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: And finally, Thursday of that week, um she texted me back and she said, Mark, I just want to let you know I'm not gonna go through with the abortion.
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: Thank you for giving me a moment of hope.
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: And I thought, wow, that's amazing.
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: I'd love to have people out here every hour this place is open.
• 8:12
  Speaker 3: And so God kind of gave me a calling to uh do that, and so we formed a ministry and we called it a moment of hope after the very first mother's own words, and so that is so powerful, Martin.
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, fast forward, I get a text uh six and a half months later in the middle of the night, and it's a picture of a little newborn, and she said, Mark, I want you to meet Chloe.
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: This is my precious gift from God.
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: Thank you for being there at the base of the driveway that day, just to give me a sense of hope in my situation.
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: And so God seemed to really confirm what we were doing, and since then we've we've uh expanded to have coverage every hour that place is open.
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: We've now we now have a mobile medical RV, which which is staffed by RNs, and we've got an OBGYN uh overseeing that.
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: We do ultrasounds um for the for the mothers coming that'll come on board, show them their baby, the heartbeat, and then we have what's called pregnancy care teams, which are groups of people, couples, and uh ladies in local churches all around the state.
• 9:24
  Speaker 3: We've even had some in Georgia and in North Carolina where these mothers live, where we can love on them, plug them in with the church, they throw them a baby shower and help them, they agree to help them for an entire year.
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: And so that's kind of what I've been doing.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: Um how many years now?
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: Thirteen years.
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: Wow, Mark.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: That was totally awesome.
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: You can't see my face, but I'm I've got tears running down my face just listening to you tell this.
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: Oh it's amazing.
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: Well, the Lord's been uh the Lord's been amazing.
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: It's just a record of how many lives y'all actually touch?
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: We have uh it averages around uh forty-five to sixty a year, and we've been doing this thirteen years, so it's around five hundred.
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: You know, we we we do keep track, but we're not real huge on like touting the numbers, you know.
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: We're just um thankful for each one, the Lord.
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well that's amazing because every life you touch is a is a baby's life that's saved.
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: You know?
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: That's amazing, that's miraculous.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: And it all started with a uh with an older brother challenging you.
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: That's what I call the voice of a prophet.
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: You know?
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: Well, uh yes, and that's uh it it tells you the the power of encouragement, the power of a friend.
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you're right.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: You're exactly right.
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: And see, I've had I've had brothers in the Lord speak truth into my heart that that compelled me to be involved with evangelism or or a Christian ministry or just repenting or just doing the right thing.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: And all it took was a courageous voice of a of a prophet or somebody speaking to me truth and love.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: And uh sometimes they don't even know that they spoke the truth to me in love, and it compelled me to go and do the right thing.
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: And you know, you and I have a we should n uh as I told my listeners last week, we should never underestimate the power of of a prophet's voice that we may have in the life of another person.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: So it's a powerful thing.
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: Well now, let me let me ask you this.
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: I I know that you also spoke recently at the Senate Medical Affairs Subcommittee hearing on Senate Bill 323, uh which is Senator Richard Cash's bill.
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: That uh and the bill, if enacted as it's written now without changes, would basically uh eliminate abortion in our state.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: Um tell us a little bit about that bill and why you are speaking in favor of that bill.
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: Well, it's been my goal from day one to work myself out of a job here, and um as time has gone on and you know it I've I've seen that without legislation doing exactly what this bill wants to do, it's unlikely that I'm gonna be able to close close this abortion clinic down myself.
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: And so um I'm I'm really thankful for Senator Cash and groups like Personhood uh South Carolina that are behind this because, like you said, it will virtually eliminate abortion uh in South Carolina, and so um I'm in support of the bill, and I was happy to speak at the uh hearing I was asked to speak, and so I thought, you know, what could I offer, what could I say that others testifying wouldn't be able to say?
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: And so my remarks were centered around uh what I've seen on the abortion in front of that abortion clinic over the past 13 years, and I've added up my hours.
• 13:40
  Speaker 3: I've been out there over 5,000 hours myself, and my staff has been out there tens of thousands of hours out uh as well.
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: And so what I did is I asked my staff, please send me your stories from out there, and I went through all the stories and added some of my own and gave that testimony um to that committee.
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: So what was that?
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: What was y'all's testimony?
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: Well, my my uh my point was, you know, we've we've seen it all.
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: We've seen, you know, the people coming out vomiting in the parking lot, um, coming out in wheelchairs and ambulances showing up.
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: Um so there was that.
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: We see the boyfriends crying, you know, wishing they had a say in the in the life for the life of their child.
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: I've seen a mothers drag a mother drag her young child in for an abortion, and the child run outside, and the mother drag her back in, and the child came out again, and the mother dragged her back in.
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: I mean, we had um the people in the office above the abortion clinic, a guy came out and said, Mark, there's there's screaming coming from downstairs, right where they're he he was right above the abortion uh suite where they do the actual abortions.
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: And we were like, should we call the police?
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: Because, you know, what's going on in there?
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: And so there was that.
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: But then, you know, the notion that there's this notion in the in the pro-life community right now, it's politically incorrect to say that women are culpable for having any part in the the death of the child.
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: And so I wanted to speak against that and and say that no, they're also responsible.
• 15:34
  Speaker 3: And and here's some examples um why they're responsible, just just to show you, you know, the types of things I see.
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: And so I gave examples of of mothers, you know, uh saying they're they're glad they killed their baby and they would do it again, you know, and and how common it is for the mothers to flip us off as they're walking in the door, um, swerving their cars at us as they're leaving, you know, just showing that no, they're not all victims, you know.
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: Yes, there may be some that are coerced, but for the vast majority, they're doing this under their own volition.
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: And so I just wanted folks to hear that and and to know that, you know, we we want to share, you know, we're Christians, so we want to share the gospel.
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: On one hand, we're saying, you know, you're a sinner, and here's the Ten Commandments, and look at your life in in view of the commandments and see how you fall short.
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: And then how are you gonna solve that problem?
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: You're a sinner.
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: Well, there's the gospel, there's Christ, there's the cross, there's the blood.
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: But on the on the other hand, the pro-life, some in the pro-life community, I'd say the majority right now, would say, well, the mother's not we don't want to p punish the mother, is she's not She's not culpable.
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: She's not culpable.
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: And and then on one hand, we're saying that, but then we take we take them uh into church and we say, no, you're a sinner and you need the gospel.
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: So it it's illogical.
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: And uh double standard, isn't it?
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: It's a double standard, and that's why I appreciate uh Richard Cash uh having the courage to you know include include this because without without penalties there's really no deterrence.
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: And so that's why I'm I'm on board with this.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: Well, Mark, I I practice family medicine for forty-four years now.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: And for twenty-five years I practiced obstetrics as a part of my family practice.
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: And uh I counseled with literally hundreds of uh pregnant women who did not want to be pregnant and who fully intended to uh abort their unborn children.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: And many of them told me emphatically that they intended to get an abortion, they didn't care that it was an unborn child, they knew it was an unborn child and they intended to terminate their pregnancy.
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: I informed them fully of the humanity of their unborn child and they were calloused about that.
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: They didn't care that it was an unborn child and the circumstances of their life outweighed the humanity of their child and they didn't care one lick that the abortion was gonna kill or murder their unborn child.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: They knew full well that when they left the abortion clinic they would leave behind a dead baby.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: And you know, it it hurt my heart, it left me in tears, i it left me exhausted and I would go home sometimes and just uh fall on the couch and weep because of the spiritual battle that took place in my office, sometimes more than two times or three times in a single day at the beginnings of my medical career because i it just happened so often.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: And uh I i to think that women are victims and they're not accessories to the murder, accessories to the crime is foolishness and as you said, illogical.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: And I am thankful for uh legislators who see that clearly and are willing to ascribe uh criminal penalties, not to the just to the doctor, but also to the the mothers who are killing their unborn child for their own convenience.
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: And I appreciate you.
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: I listened to your testimony, I want you to know, and I appreciated the truthful things that you were willing to say, and I'm I'm praying that our senators who heard your testimony would allow that truth to sink deep into their hearts.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: And it's not just them, it it it's it's the people in South Carolina, the church people in South Carolina who need to be willing to accept the truthfulness of the things that you say and the things that you see every day at the abortion clinic.
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: And Mark, I want you to th to hear it from me.
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: I'm thankful for folks like yourself who are there right there on the front lines of the spiritual battle day in and day out at the abortion clinics.
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: I I I know that's a hard, hard battlefield to stand on uh day in and day out, year in and year out, and I want you to know I appreciate folks like yourself.
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: Thank you.
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: Thank you so much.
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: Because we we don't get we don't hear that a lot from the folks that are in our face out there.
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: Oh, I know you don't.
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: It's a thankless job, isn't it?
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: Until we hold those babies and and you know, we've got a long, long uh list of of lives that are here with us today because of the work we do, and that's helps us, uh encourages us along.
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I understand.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: I do.
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: Well, it only takes a few battles that are won to uh encourage you over the long haul, isn't that right?
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: And when you hold a few little babies in your arms that have who you've encouraged their moms to do the right thing, that it uh it carries you a long, long way, doesn't it?
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: Sure does.
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: Well listen, we're listening to more than medicine.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: My guest today is is Mark Bumgartner with Moment of Hope, which is a ministry uh that does sidewalk counseling at the abortion clinic down in Columbia, South Carolina.
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: Some of you know that there's only three abortion clinics in South Carolina now.
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: There used to be five or six, but now there's only three.
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: And we're praying every day that God would enable us to bring a complete end to both medical and surgical abortions in our state.
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: Now, this is what we want our listeners to do.
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: We want you to uh visit personhood.sc, visit their website so that you can find out more about this bill, Senate Bill 323, that Richard Cash, Senator Cash is promoting.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: And we want you to contact your senators and and have them lend their full support to the bill without amendments, no limiting amendments.
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: And I want you to to support uh uh Mark Baumgartner's Moment of Hope ministry there in South Carolina.
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: Now, Mark, how can they do that?
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: Well, thank you.
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: Um yeah, folks in uh in Bible believing churches, uh, if you're interested in in forming a care team in your in your church, we would love to plug one of these mothers that are from your area that that change their mind.
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: We'd love to plug her in with your church where you can love on her and support her through her pregnancy, throw her a baby shower and um and just uh share the gospel with her, invite her to church.
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: That's one way.
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: Another way is um we could always use help uh financially.
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: It's very expensive to run our mobile medical uh RV and staff it with um registered nurses.
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: And uh folks could go to our website, it's AMOH.
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: It stands for a moment of hope, amo-h.org.
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: Good, good, good, good.
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: AMOH.org is a moment of hope.
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: And uh lend them some financial support.
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: Of course, pray for them.
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: Maybe go by and visit them some Saturday at the abortion clinic.
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: What's the clin uh address for that abortion clinic in Columbia?
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: It's uh it's located at 2712 Middleburg Drive in Columbia.
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: Uh it's 29204.
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: And you'll always know our folks were wearing the green, we wear green um traffic vests just to differentiate ourselves from the the Planned Parenthood folks always wear the rainbow vests.
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: Um you know, take stealing that from from God and using it for their evil purposes.
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: But we always wear the green traffic vests, and uh folks will know they're talking with a uh Christian from a moment of hope.
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: Gotcha, gotcha.
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: All right, well, that's the end of our program, end of our time.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: Mark, thank you for for coming.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: My guest is Mark Baumgartner with A Moment of Hope down in Columbia.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: Until next week, you're listening to More Than Medicine.
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: I'm your host, Dr.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: Robert Jackson.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: Until next week, remember your doctor loves you, and may the Lord bless you real good.
• 24:55
  Speaker: Thank you for listening to this edition of More Than Medicine.
• 24:58
  Speaker: For more information about the Jackson Family Ministry or to schedule a speaking engagement, go to their Facebook page, Instagram, or webpage at JacksonFamily Ministry.com.
• 25:09
  Speaker: Also, don't forget to check out Dr.
• 25:11
  Speaker: Jackson's books that are available on Amazon, its third book, Turkey Tales and Bible trees, and his father's biography on Laughter Silver Wings: the story of a country doctor, a family man, a patriot, and a political activist.
• 25:27
  Speaker: This podcast is produced by Bob Slone Audio Productions.